Time To Watches: Tsar Bomba

Summary

The Real Time Show – Episode Summary: Time To Watches: Tsar Bomba

Release Date: June 1, 2025
Hosts: Rob Nudds & Alon Ben Joseph
Guests: Mark and Paul from Tsar Bomba
Location: Villa Saracen, Time To Watches Event, Geneva

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1. Introduction to Tsar Bomba

[00:05] Rob Knudds:
"Watch fans and welcome to another edition of the Real Time show with me, your host, your friendly neighborhood watchmaker, Rob Knudds here on site at Villa Saracen at the Time To Watches event."

Rob welcomes listeners and introduces Mark and Paul from Tsar Bomba, setting the stage for an in-depth discussion about one of the most visually striking watch brands showcased in Geneva.

2. Exploring the Atomic Collection

[00:37] Mark:
"This piece here from Tsar Bomba is from our atomic collection. It does look like it's rather inspired by other famous brands. But this is all us."

Mark introduces the Atomic Collection, emphasizing its unique design despite apparent inspirations from established brands. He highlights the collection's accessible price point, quality movements, and exceptional finishing. A standout feature is the watch's interchangeability, allowing enthusiasts to customize straps, bezels, crowns, and more, making it versatile for building a diverse watch wardrobe from a single timepiece.

Notable Quote:
"For anybody looking to have just one watch and yet complete a watch wardrobe, this is fantastic because you can change out the strap, the buckle or the deployant." – Mark [00:37]

3. Interchangeable Features: Straps, Bezels, and Crowns

Rob probes deeper into the watch's interchangeable crown, addressing potential concerns about water resistance.

[01:36] Rob Knudds:
"You're gonna have to just explain to our listeners a little bit further about that crown because it'll be scaring people."

[01:44] Mark:
"The water resistance is 100 meters on these pieces. The movement in this piece is a Miyota and it's just a, it's not even a screw-down crown. It's not necessary. But what we have here with interchangeability, it's quite easy to remove the pieces."

Mark explains the functionality of the interchangeable crown, assuring listeners of the watch's reliability and ease of use. He describes the mechanism for swapping components, emphasizing the user-friendly design that appeals to both enthusiasts and retailers.

Notable Quote:
"Once you get the hang of it, it's super easy to use and it's kind of fun." – Mark [01:44]

4. Beyond the Atomic Collection: Diverse Offerings

[03:07] Mark:
"We have several other collections and across a range of prices. So if it's just a beginner collector, you can come in for as little as say US$220 up to about $400."

Mark outlines Tsar Bomba's diverse product range, catering to various market segments. Beyond the Atomic Collection, they offer:

• Elemental Collection
• Neutron Collection
• Reactor Collection
• Dark Matter Collection

Each collection varies in price and design, with the Dark Matter Collection being the latest addition featuring five iterations with either Salita or Miyota movements. This diversity ensures that Tsar Bomba appeals to a broad audience, from sport-fashion aficionados to high watchmaking enthusiasts.

Notable Quote:
"If you like a sporty fashion type watch, then we've got something for you." – Mark [03:07]

5. Rafa Marquez: Brand Ambassador

[03:31] Mark:
"Our brand ambassador is Rafa Marquez, the famous defender from Barca and Mexican. Yeah. And he's currently the assistant coach of the Mexican national selection."

Rafa Marquez's association with Tsar Bomba adds significant visibility and credibility to the brand, especially within the Mexican market. His influence underscores Tsar Bomba's commitment to merging sports excellence with high-quality watchmaking.

Notable Quote:
"He gives the brand definitely a lot more visibility and, and I think... played for Barca, so for Barcelona." – Mark [13:39]

6. Launch of the Dark Matter Collection

The Dark Matter Collection debuted in the previous year, aligning with Rob's Danish brand, Arkanor's "Dark" line, creating an interesting coincidence.

[04:21] Rob Knudds:
"How many languages do you speak?"

[04:24] Mark:
"Dark Matter came out when, Paul?"

[04:26] Rob Knudds:
"Last year."

[04:39] Rob Knudds:
"...we have a brand, a model line called Dark."

This synchronicity highlights the universal appeal and thematic resonance of the "Dark Matter" concept within the watchmaking industry.

7. Expansion into Latin America: Focus on Mexico

Mark discusses Tsar Bomba's strategic expansion into the Latin American market, particularly Mexico, leveraging his extensive experience and network in the region.

[04:58] Mark:
"I'm a Welshman with an American accent. I'm from Llaneshly... and I've been in Mexico for 32 years."

He details the partnership with local distributors and the decision to establish mono-brand boutiques to enhance brand visibility and consumer engagement. This approach aims to build a strong foundation before approaching independent jewelers and department stores.

Notable Quote:
"Mexico is an exceptional opportunity market for brands starting from sport fashion all the way through to mid-range and especially, I believe, for the high watchmaking." – Mark [12:45]

8. Mexico and India: Emerging Luxury Watch Markets

Rob and Mark delve into the burgeoning luxury watch markets in Mexico and India, attributing growth to cultural shifts and increasing affluence.

[10:35] Rob Knudds:
"...the two biggest emerging markets in the world right now were India and Mexico for luxury watches. Why is that happening?"

[11:13] Mark:
"I think the luxury market in Mexico has always been robust, but it's been discreet as well, because you don't really want to flaunt your wealth there."

Mark highlights Mexico's discreet appreciation for luxury goods and its 24% year-on-year growth in the Swiss watch sector. He emphasizes the importance of strategic investment and marketing to penetrate these markets effectively.

Notable Quote:
"If you want to come to Mexico, prepare yourselves to have a marketing budget because you need to give a little bit of love, you need to make some noise in the marketplace." – Mark [12:30]

9. Addressing Design Inspirations and Copycat Concerns

A significant portion of the episode addresses concerns about Tsar Bomba's designs resembling those of established brands like Richard Mille and Audemars Piguet.

[17:13] Mark:
"...our strategy to open the monobrand boutiques. And I think that's absolutely brilliant way to go."

[18:53] Paul:
"...these watches are inspired by forms that we've seen from other brands, most notably Richard Mille, and it's impossible to get away from that fact."

[21:09] Alan:
"...this is better than going to, I don't know what, Grand Bazaar in the world and buying fake copies."

Mark defends Tsar Bomba's designs by asserting their unique DNA and functional quality, differentiating them from mere replicas. Paul and Alan express initial skepticism but acknowledge the quality and market presence Tsar Bomba has achieved.

Notable Quote:
"We're not an emulator at all. It's entirely your own stuff. It's your way of doing things." – Mark [02:46]

10. New Product Launches: Ceramic and Carbon Fiber Editions

At the Time To Watches event, Tsar Bomba unveiled new editions within their existing collections, showcasing their continuous innovation.

[14:38] Mark:
"...for the Atomic Collection, we've come out with a full ceramic edition... and for the Dark Matter, we've come out with a full carbon fiber edition."

These new editions, priced around $2,000 USD, feature advanced materials and design cues that enhance both aesthetics and functionality. Mark encourages attendees to explore these novelties, highlighting their lightweight design and superior craftsmanship.

Notable Quote:
"It's an absolutely gorgeous watch. If you put it on your wrist, you'll be awestruck." – Mark [14:58]

11. Audience Engagement and Future Plans

Rob expresses enthusiasm for Tsar Bomba's offerings, noting the brand's interactive and customizable approach appeals to a wide audience. Plans for future collaborations and extended discussions on the brand's impact are hinted at, promising deeper dives into Tsar Bomba's strategies and product lines.

[17:43] Paul:
"...this is a testament to that fact. So let's pick up this conversation in the full hour long episode with the folks from Tsar Bomba."

12. Conclusion and Takeaways

The episode concludes with reflections on Tsar Bomba's innovative approach to watchmaking, balancing affordability with high-quality, customizable timepieces. Despite initial skepticism regarding design inspirations, Tsar Bomba's commitment to unique offerings and market expansion underscores their potential to make a significant mark in the luxury watch industry.

Key Insights:

• Customization: Tsar Bomba's interchangeable components set them apart, offering versatility and personalization.
• Market Strategy: Strategic expansion into emerging markets like Mexico and India leverages cultural appreciation for luxury goods.
• Design Ethics: Navigating the fine line between inspiration and imitation, Tsar Bomba maintains a unique brand identity.
• Innovation: Continuous product innovation, such as ceramic and carbon fiber editions, keeps the brand competitive and appealing.

Notable Final Quote:
"They're all available. But it's great because what happens is typically we sell the watch comes with a set... it's a nice way to start your collection." – Mark [16:37]

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This episode of The Real Time Show offers a comprehensive look into Tsar Bomba's strategies, product offerings, and market positioning, providing valuable insights for watch enthusiasts and industry observers alike.

Transcript

[Mark]

Foreign.

[Rob Knudds]

Watch fans and welcome to another edition of the Real Time show with me, your host, your friendly neighborhood watchmaker, Rob Knudds here on site at Villa Saracen at the time to watches event. I'm here with Mark and Paul from Tab Bomba to discuss one of the most bombastic brands that we have showing today in Geneva. Guys, welcome to the studio.

[Mark]

Thanks, Rob. Lovely to be here.

[Rob Knudds]

Now you have got one of the most visually arresting watches on your wrist that I've seen so far. Will you please talk us through the piece you have with you today?

[Mark]

Well, this piece here from Tsar Bomba is from our atomic collection. It does look like it's rather inspired by other famous brands. But this is all us. What makes this so fun and interesting, apart from the very accessible price point and the quality of the movement, the finishing and so forth, and is the interchangeability aspect. So for anybody looking to have just one watch and yet complete a watch wardrobe, this is fantastic because you can change out the strap, the buckle or the deployant. You can change out the bezels and they're everything from rubber to stainless steel to carbon fiber to ceramic. And you can even change out the crowns to sort of mix and match your socks. So, you know, whatever you want to do. So what's really nice for the, the watch enthusiast is that he's got a watch order with just one watch head. And from the retailer point of view, it's great because with the same brand you have your own cross sale or add on sale if you will.

[Rob Knudds]

You're gonna have to just explain to our listeners a little bit further about that crown because it'll be scaring people. So how does it work? How is it water resistant?

[Mark]

The water resistance is 100 meters on these pieces. The movement in this piece is a Miota and it's just a, it's not even a screw down crown. It's not necessary. But what we have here is with interchangeability, it's quite easy to remove the pieces. Two buttons pressed simultaneously release the bezel and then with the crown we just simply push in and turn toward ourselves and it quite easily unscrews and you can change those out. And there's a quick release button on the back of the straps which allows you to change them in and out of the, out of the watch head. So it's really, once you get the hang of it, it's super easy to use and it's kind of fun. And believe it or not, a lot of people, when I've worn this watch at Formula one, or the PGA Golf tournament. Despite the other sponsors, people have been reaching out and grabbing my wrist saying, hey, what is that you're wearing there and where can I buy it? So we've had a great response to it just organically. It's been a lot of fun to watch how people react to it.

[Rob Knudds]

Now you said earlier that to many people that might look like it's inspired by something, another brand which you didn't name, but let's name it for the sake of being open and transparent. Richard Mille is the brand that people might mention when they look at that watch. But you are far from a one trick pony. You're not an emulator at all. It's entirely your own stuff. It's your way of doing things. Tell us what else the brand offers.

[Mark]

Well, we have several other collections and across a range of prices. So if it's just a beginner collector, you can come in for as little as say US$220 up to about $400. But where the brand gets really interesting, I think and where it's most clever is when you enter into the range which is interchangeable and now you're talking about 650 to about US$1,500. The five collections include the Elemental, the Atomic, which you've seen here. We have the Neutron, the Reactor piece which I should have brought with me because you had to say that looks inspired as well. And our latest collection, which unique DNA is called the Dark Matter Collection. And there's five iterations, some of them with Salita movements and the others with the Miota movements. Noteworthy to say that our brand ambassador is Rafa Marquez, the famous defender from Barca and Mexican. Yeah. And he's currently the assistant coach of the Mexican national selection. So he's going to be with us for the next three years. And you know, his go to watch is the Dark Matter. So indeed we have five watches in the collection. We're not a one trick pony and I think we have something, if you like a sporty fashion type watch, then we've got something for you.

[Rob Knudds]

Interesting, interesting. When did you launch the Dark Matter collection?

[Mark]

Dark Matter came out when, Paul?

[Rob Knudds]

Last year? Yeah, middle of last year. It sounds very funny for me to say because I don't know if you know, I'm a co owner of a Danish brand called Arkanor and we have a brand, a model line called Dark.

[Paul]

Matter but it's spelled D arc.

[Rob Knudds]

It's the first letters of the brand. It's the first time I've ever actually said to Somebody else. When did you launch your Dark Matter model? So it sounds very, very on, but good to hear. There's more Dark Matter in the world. It's a wonderful, wonderful name and a wonderful idea. Rafa Marquez. So you must have some dealings with Mexico to be so close to one of the Mexican team's greatest ever players.

[Mark]

Well, I'll tell you about that and how that works out. First of all, I'm a Welshman with an American accent. I'm from Llaneshly, my friend. Yeah. And I've been in Mexico for 32 years. 20 in Cozumel and 12 in Mexico City. But I have a watch distribution company there and I met the CEO of Tsar Bomba, Stephen lan, a couple of years ago. A good friend and an ex colleague of mine is a distributor for the Caribbean and travel retail. So he's worked very well over the last couple years to develop the Caribbean island penetration as well as the cruise ship market, which is quite strong, especially for North American travelers. And through Andrew Jones, I met Steven and we've talked a little bit. I provided some market intel about Mexico and Latin America in general. We went back and forth. I invited them to Mexico City to the big Watch Expo, the cr and they asked me if I'd be interested to work with a company. At the time I couldn't because I had a temporal conflict. But then they said, well, would you be interested to work with us as a consultant in terms of running our business development for the region, for Latin America? And that's how I came into it. But yes, I've been in the Latin American market for, since 1991 actually. So it's been a while and I've had time to build a nice portfolio of contacts and some market insight, cultural sensitivity, and that's how we, we came together. So we're launching in the region now. Our strategy for Mexico is to launch mono brand boutiques. And there's a solid reason behind that. It gives the brand more immediate visibility, a place for watch enthusiasts to interact with the brand and kind of enjoy that whole aspect of interchangeability, which is really our DNA. And it obviously will put us at a future date in a better negotiation position. So when we do go to independent jewelers, when we go to the department stores, we're coming with a known brand that has recognition, acceptance, demand and obviously that works out in terms of our business much better.

[Rob Knudds]

Incredible, incredible story. I'm still perplexed by the American accent. Where did that come from?

[Mark]

My father got a job with General Motors in 1963. And we packed up and shipped across the pond, as they say.

[Rob Knudds]

So where were you working up in Detroit or.

[Mark]

No, first Toronto and then north of Buffalo, New York.

[Rob Knudds]

Wow. Okay. Do you get back to Wales very often?

[Mark]

Once a year.

[Rob Knudds]

Once a year, yeah. Oh, beautiful. Very nice.

[Mark]

Yeah.

[Rob Knudds]

Are you going to do a Welsh inspired Sabombur as well? You can do like a dragon.

[Mark]

Yeah. We'd like to do the Drago, but I don't know if we're going to put out the Red Dragon or not yet.

[Rob Knudds]

How many languages do you speak?

[Mark]

Several.

[Rob Knudds]

I picked up on that. You pronounce every word in its native language. It would seem like it was interesting your pronunciation of Myota, as I would say, was a native.

[Mark]

Well, well, thanks for that. I don't know, I just, you know, always. My father was quite a traveler and regaled us with stories of travel, adventure, bar fights and women. All the rest of that.

[Rob Knudds]

Oh, yeah.

[Mark]

And I thought I'd reason why we.

[Rob Knudds]

All got into watchmaking.

[Mark]

Yeah, right. I thought to myself, I'd like to be a man of the world myself. So I, I just had that curiosity about different places and cultures and maybe assimilated those intonations.

[Rob Knudds]

You must have found your place in Mexico, though, to have stayed in that region for so long.

[Mark]

It's a brilliant place, to tell you the truth. I mean, there's so much to see and do there. But Mexico City itself, apart from being the largest city in the Western hemisphere, it's just a great international city. It's filled with digital nomads and expats now, a lot of hip, older neighborhoods. A lot of people say that it reminds them of Madrid, for example. I live in a neighborhood called the Colonia Roma, and every block you walk there's beautiful architecture, shops, cafes, restaurants. It's fascinating and it's lively and you can never be bored in that city. So I would say it's a top spot. Generally when people come for the first time, they're a little bit wary because they watch too much of those series on Netflix and whatnot. But once they come, I mean, they're basically slack jawed and they're like, I had no idea how sophisticated this place was. So apart from being a place that's just culturally fascinating in terms of start with the food, the history, the culture, the architecture, design, it's all stellar. But what people don't know also is that we have a very important watch enthusiast market. And despite the relative poor performance of some markets last year, Mexico enjoyed, I believe, a 24% year on year growth in terms of Swiss 24%. It was massive. It was massive. And you know, it's just, it's always been a great opportunity market. But what I tell to people that haven't been there yet, you don't know what you don't know. You've got to come and see it. I highly recommend the cr, which is the Salon International de Alta Reloceria. It would be the equivalent of the SIHH in French. And they do it every year in the middle of October at the St. Regis, Mexico City. It hosts between about 50 to 60 brands. And what makes it unique is that there's a confluence. The press, the brands, subsidiaries, distributors, retailers and all of their VIP customers. And so it's quite a unique experience. It's for three days, it's a scintillating place to be. It's where everything's moving and shaking. And they do a smaller edition in June at the Four Seasons Hotel called the Summer cr. And that's just for the independent distributors. So none of the big groups are there in the summer. It gives a chance for the smaller brands to get a bit more exposure and attention.

[Rob Knudds]

Incredible stuff. It's recently dropped on my radar because of Arkonaut, the brand that I own in Denmark because I co own in Denmark because someone came to us from Sierra and asked us if we'd like to partake. And I'd heard whisperings, not to the level of 24% growth year on year, but I'd heard that the two biggest emerging markets in the world right now were India and Mexico for luxury watches. Why is that happening? What's happening in Mexico socioeconomically that's facilitating that? Or is it a cultural shift? People becoming more comfortable with buying expensive objects? Tell us what's going on.

[Mark]

I think the luxury market in Mexico has always been robust, but it's been discreet as well, because you don't really want to flaunt your wealth there. It's better to keep it on the down low. But even before the phenomenon of near shoring and so forth, there's always been a lot of affluent consumers. If you come to Mexico City and walk the high street, which is called Avenida Masarik, you will see all of the tony Marquis brands from around the world. And there's always been recognition and appreciation for those fine things. So it's not surprising to me. But again, I've been there for a long time and for those who haven't ever been, as I said, you don't know what you don't know, but anybody should come and will be pleasantly surprised by everything they do see. So, coming full circle to the Mexico question, you asked me earlier about Rafa Marquez. As it turns out that one of our investment partners from Mexico is the owner of about 20 car agencies, or car dealerships, as you'd call them in the uk and he became a big fan of the brand and turns out that he's a friend and golf partner with Rafa Marquez rubs elbows with Checo Perez, who we hope comes back next season to Formula One. But he was able to leverage his contacts and his financial strength to join forces with us and employ this strategy to open the monobrand boutiques. And I think that's absolutely brilliant way to go. Because to be honest with you, and what I'll tell any brand is if you want to come to Mexico, prepare yourselves to have a marketing budget because you need to give a little bit of love, you need to make some noise in the marketplace. Why? Obviously, you want to educate the consumer, excite them a bit about what's going on, but you also need to demonstrate confidence to the retailers in the country and that will, you know, later bring them along to also invest in your brand. But, you know, to just think you're going to come into Mexico even though you've got a great brand and you're going to drop it into a pretty vitrine and a pretty store, it's just not the formula. It's very difficult and you've got to be able to invest. It's that simple. But if you do, Mexico is an exceptional opportunity market for brands starting from sport fashion all the way through to mid range and especially, I believe, for the, you know, the high watchmaking, for the auto lingerie.

[Rob Knudds]

Are you going to do a Rafa Manka special edition?

[Mark]

We already have, actually. It's the Dark Matter four. Exactly.

[Rob Knudds]

I was going to say you used to wear number four, didn't.

[Mark]

Yeah, it was one of my favorite.

[Rob Knudds]

Plays when I was a kid.

[Mark]

Is he really? Well, that's great.

[Rob Knudds]

Well, because he's an absolute brute. My favorite player of all time was Roy Keane. Just to give you an idea of the kind of player.

[Mark]

Oh, like.

[Rob Knudds]

Oh, you know, so like these tough, defensive enforcers. No nonsense, ponytail flowing behind him. Yeah, right in the air. Brilliant player. Love you.

[Mark]

Yeah, no, we're, I think we're really excited. It gives the brand definitely a lot more visibility and, and I think, you know, global irrelevance because, you know, you know, played for Barca, so for Barcelona. And I think people Take note of that. They're like, oh, I didn't know. Especially when the Mexican press comes by or Mexican retailers and they see that, they're very pleasantly surprised. So it was a great score. We're really pleased to have.

[Rob Knudds]

Yeah, I mean, I. I don't know a huge amount about the Mexican national team, but I would wager that if he is not the most capped player, he must be one of the most capped players of all time, because he, for ages, wasn't he? He's a icon in Mexico.

[Mark]

So, yeah, he's definitely a big hero for us.

[Rob Knudds]

And congratulations.

[Mark]

Thanks.

[Rob Knudds]

Tell us a little bit more about what's coming on the watch side of things.

[Mark]

Well, here at Time to Watches at the Villa Saracen, we have launched some novelties. We've launched the. And Paul, you're going to correct me here if I'm. If I make a mistake, but we've come out with. For the Atomic Collection, we've come out with a full ceramic. And the full ceramic edition, correct?

[Rob Knudds]

Yeah, yeah.

[Mark]

And for the dark matter, we've come out with a full carbon fiber edition. Both of those retailing ats.

[Rob Knudds]

Yeah. This service is called the Electron.

[Mark]

The Electron. I'm sorry, that's correct. The Electron in the full carbon fiber. Beautiful design cues from the Dark Matter, but it's a featherweight Miyota movement. It's an absolutely gorgeous watch. If you put it on your wrist, you'll be awestruck. And the U.S. retail on both of those is 2,000. Yeah, 2,000 U.S. yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So definitely stop by the stand if you have a chance, you're more than welcome and come and have a peek. I know for sure you'll be pleasantly surprised and you'll enjoy playing around with the watches. As a side note, you know, I'm a veteran, let's just say I'm a veteran in the industry, been around for a long time, over 30 years in the business, and I've got a fairly nice watch collection. I have three children that have absolutely no interest whatever in watches. And so I have no one to bequeath them to. And as a consequence, I have no reason whatever to acquire more watches. But I can't help myself, you know, and when I walked into the Tsar Bomba boutique in Puebla in Mexico, the first thing I was attracted to was a display of about 80 different interchangeable bezels. And again, I felt like a child in a toy store, left alone myself to hospital and whatnot. And I couldn't make up my mind, you know, I finally ended up going with the red carbon fiber bezel. But it was a gleeful experience. It just took me right back to my youth and no conscientiousness of the fact that I don't need more watches, but indeed I did. I bought another bezel.

[Rob Knudds]

Incredible. Can you buy the bezels and the crowns and everything separately?

[Mark]

Yes, you can. They're all available. But it's great because what happens is typically we sell the watch comes with a set, so inside it you'll have the watch had two different bezels, two different color crowns, and two straps along with the deployant buckle. Sometimes there's a standard buckle, but typically with a deployant buckle. And it's a nice way to start your collection. So you get the watch wardrobe in the box and yeah, I think you'll get a lot of compliments on it. As I told you with Formula One PGA Tours, people walking up to me that I've never met before asking me, hey, what's that watch you're wearing and where can I buy one?

[Rob Knudds]

Yeah, well, they certainly are striking. And I will take you up on the offer to visit the stand because I also enjoy this choice. I don't suffer from analysis paralysis as some people do. You know, I like to have as many options as possible and I can't wait to see what those options are. Guys, thank you for sitting down with me. Thank you for explaining a little bit about the brands and give us an insight into how it operates. It's been a real pleasure and we'll get you back on the show in the future for a full hour long episode to talk more about Sal Bomba.

[Mark]

We'll look forward to that. Thanks to you. Thanks so much.

[Rob Knudds]

Thank you.

[Paul]

Thanks, guys. Are you Mr. Doozy here?

[Mark]

Alan. Why?

[Paul]

Tsar Bomba. Strange one. Absolutely bonkers. But interesting. Extremely interesting. I mean, firstly, the team, great characters, easy to talk to, fully convinced by the product that they're creating. But it's a product that I think, from afar at least, will raise some eyebrows. I remember prior to us establishing this meeting, one that you unfortunately didn't get to sit in on. You were very skeptical about the watches and whether or not they were something that our audience would be interested in. And I was, to be honest, just curious, very, very curious about what we were seeing here because quite openly, these watches are inspired by forms that we've seen from other brands, most notably Richard Millennial, and it's impossible to get away from that fact. What we've got basically is an ultra affordable copycat. And people can like it people can absolutely loathe it, people can be perplexed by it. But what are your thoughts on it from afar?

[Alan]

So, full disclosure, we got the request for them to come on the show because we're media partner for time to watch this. So I said to Rob, what do we do? A Do our listeners want to hear this? But Rob was very quick to answer, and rightfully so. We cover everything in the watchmaking ecosystem, the good, the bad and the ugly. And then I said, wait, but what about ip? These are copycats. He's like, so let's ask them. So I freaking regret not being there. I am very eager to wait and listen to the interview you've conducted, to hear what you've said. Now the first question I would have is, how can you produce solo? Because you can have a Richard Mille copycat as low as €200. And the second question I would ask them is, who actually buys these watches? And the third question would be, why are you coming to Time to watches? Whereas I'm quite sure hands down, they're the lowest priced brand there.

[Paul]

Well, I believe they're massive in Mexico to start with. So that's, that's a market, one of the bigger and more emerging markets in the world actually, along with India. India and Mexico are really up and coming ecosystems for watches. This is, yeah, a strange one. It takes the piss of it, doesn't it really? I mean, when you sort of, when you see like what you can get for €200, you're like, what the what, what? Why am I buying watches that cost anything over a thousand quid, where you can get something that wild and arresting and so on and so forth. And of course there's lots of very good answers to that question, but your mind does sort of go there, like, how is it possible, how is it like literally possible for this to be in any way profitable for them to produce a watch like that? Because as much of a copycat as it is, it's not made of imagination or air. It's made of materials that you can hold and wear on your wrist. And it's robust enough to stand up to the rigors of daily life. It functions, it's mechanical, it's bonkers. Like it.

[Alan]

I and I stand corrected. I scrolled down on the website, now you have a AP Royal Concept watch copy. 163 Euros and 95 cents.

[Paul]

I quite like that one.

[Alan]

Well, so as long as they didn't get sued or not going to get sued by Richard Mille ap. And they have also A Roger Dubuis hybrid Bezel married and Royal Oak concept case if they didn't get sued. And these brands don't have issues with these models existing. And that being said, as a disclaimer, I think this is better than going to, I don't know what, Grand Bazaar in the world and buying fake copies.

[Paul]

Yeah, you know, but it's mad, isn't it? Like, that's a. That's a tough intellectual exercise to put yourself through. He's like, well, what constitutes a fake, right? Is it a one for one replica that has the brand's name on it?

[Mark]

Yeah.

[Rob Knudds]

Okay.

[Paul]

I think we'd say that's a fake. This isn't like you say, it's not a fake. Audemars Piguet Royal Oak concept watch.

[Alan]

If they change seven things, technically, they could get away in an IP lawsuit.

[Paul]

I guess there are seven things different about it. The subtle things. I mean, the reference material is Peyton. But this is the funny thing, right? So I had this meeting with Mark and I was thinking, okay, really nice dude. He believes in this brand and he's been in the game a long time, so if he believes in it, it's got to be something. So this was one of the only times that I raced out of the glass igloo immediately after having the meeting and went to the stand to look at all the watches. I wanted to get them on my wrist. I wanted to feel the material quality, or lack thereof of these pieces that are retailing for, yeah, between 160 and 1500, €2,000. And I have to say that they're pretty well made. Like, there's some stuff that they're doing that is extremely. Like one high end is maybe, but technologically advanced and you get them on the wrist and you. Again, like, your brain doesn't really know what to do with what you're seeing. I. I think we could have multiple hour long episodes about the question of what constitutes fakes or imitations or homages or pieces that honor the history or existence of another style. But all we can say is try and get one of these on your wrist. And if you've got no way of picking one up at a retailer, then maybe just take a flyer on one of the APs for 163 quid. I mean, it's that or another G shock, isn't it, really?

[Alan]

Indeed. And this begs an article by David Voucher, because this is indeed an interesting topic. And did you by any chance ask him what the name means? Because the name is bombastic. And an actually cool sounding, but what does it mean?

[Paul]

Honestly, I'm not sure if I did. I think I was too distracted by the product and trying to get my head around what I was seeing and hearing, because it's certainly one that we should we pore over a little more. So let's get them on the show for a full episode because they're open and communicative. They're not trying to hide anything. I think if they were trying to get away with something, they wouldn't be quite so blatant about the style of the watches themselves. And I mean, it's a broad church watchmaking, isn't there? There's space for all sorts of people and all sorts of watches, and I think this is a testament to that fact. So let's pick up this conversation in the full hour long episode with the folks from Saab.

[Rob Knudds]

Sam.