England off to a flyer as Bellingham and Kane take centre stage

Summary

The Rest Is Football

Episode: England Off to a Flyer as Bellingham and Kane Take Centre Stage
Date: June 18, 2026
Hosts/Guests: Gary Lineker, Alan Shearer, Micah Richards, Joe Cole, Harry Maguire, Patrick Vieira

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Episode Overview

This episode dives into England's impressive start to the 2026 World Cup, with a focus on standout performances from Jude Bellingham and Harry Kane. The panel—joined by guest Patrick Vieira—unpacks England's tactical evolution under Thomas Tuchel, evaluates big-game mentality, compares England’s strengths to top international rivals, and explores the managerial dilemmas of handling legendary players like Cristiano Ronaldo.

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Highlights & Key Discussion Points

1. What It Feels Like to Win a World Cup

[02:32 – 03:03]

• Gary Lineker kicks off by asking Patrick Vieira about the feeling of winning a World Cup.
  • Patrick Vieira: “You’re never going to find out. You’re never going to know.” [02:35]
• Vieira reflects on the pride, especially as the win was on home soil in France—“It’s something really special.” [02:57]

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2. England’s World Cup Start – Positivity vs. Caution

[03:15 – 05:40]

• Gary Lineker: Cites the promising nature of England’s opening match.
• Harry Maguire: “Fabulous, fabulous. There were plenty of positives in the first half... and the changes the manager made were really positive.” [03:23]
• Micah Richards: Highlights Jude Bellingham’s leadership and big-game mentality: “Jude always delivers. I talked about the pressure of Real Madrid and then translating that to England—he always turns up.” [04:17]
• Patrick Vieira: Cautions against excess hype: “You don’t want to build too much excitement, but we always do that.” [05:36]
• Vieira places England’s performance on par with France and Argentina, but warns “there’s still a long way to go.” [05:40]

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3. France & England — Who’s Better Right Now?

[06:00 – 06:22]

• Vieira unequivocally picks France: “The team to beat is France. There’s no doubt about it. … England... can hurt France, yes. But not win it.” [06:03]

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4. Jude Bellingham – A Big-Game Player

[06:22 – 09:32]

• Jude sets a record as the youngest European player to appear at four major tournaments by age 22—emphasizing his history-making trajectory.
• Morgan Rogers: “You have to play him in games like this. … When you look over and see you’ve got Jude Bellingham, you know he’s going to produce something at some moment.” [06:54]
• The panel discusses the importance of Tuchel’s man-management and the selection challenges between Bellingham and Morgan Rogers.
• Harry Maguire: “I thought his [Tuchel’s] substitutions were at the right time… spot on.” [09:19]

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5. Tactical Analysis: Tuchel’s England

[09:32 – 13:14]

• Joe Cole: Praises the increased intensity after Tuchel’s halftime talk: “The second half, they went on and dominated the game. They could have won by a lot more.” [09:34]
• England’s high press and energetic transitions are highlighted; new tactical wrinkles such as Bellingham’s advanced runs when Kane drops deep.
• Patrick Vieira: “This is the reflect [of] the Premier League... the strength of these players is to play with the intensity, try to score goals going forward and win the ball as high as they can.” [11:55]
• Vieira notes if England can shore up defensively, “they will be quite a really difficult team to play against.” [13:06]

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6. The Bellingham Blueprint: Box-to-Box and Beyond

[13:37 – 14:41]

• Gary Lineker: Compares Jude Bellingham’s all-action style to Vieira’s own legacy: “He was playing as a 10, a 9, a 6—up and down like an 8.”
• Patrick Vieira: “He’s losing too much energy. … I think he can be more dangerous if he keeps controlling himself and gets into the last third.” [13:57]
  “Today, I think he’s part of the 2 or 3 best midfielders in the world.” [14:41]

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7. Harry Kane – England’s Greatest Striker?

[14:41 – 17:46]

• Kane’s mental strength is lauded, especially after a retaken penalty due to the goalkeeper moving early.
• Gary Lineker: “I have to say, in all seriousness, Harry Kane is, I think, the greatest English striker we’ve ever had. I genuinely think that now.” [16:41]
• Joe Cole notes Kane’s meticulous preparation: “He practices [penalties] every single day… his technique, his passing, he has absolute everything.” [17:33]
• Light-hearted banter about scoring records and membership in the "double figures club."

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8. Building Around Harry Kane

[19:15 – 22:08]

• Gary Lineker: Emphasizes Tuchel’s tactical tweak—playing high-energy wingers to exploit Kane’s tendency to drop deep.
• Morgan Rogers: “Harry’s our best player, so [Tuchel’s] built the team around him… That’s probably why Foden and Palmer aren’t there—he needs Gordon, Rashford, Saka, and Madueke for that energy.” [19:47]
• Patrick Vieira: Considers Kane a superb team player but, if forced, “Mbappe. Mbappe with no doubt about it.” [20:37]
• Vieira notes France’s slightly stronger back line “because Harry’s not there.” [22:18]

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9. Portugal’s Struggles and The Ronaldo Problem

[22:46 – 28:30]

• The panel pivots to Portugal’s struggles, noting the difficulty of balancing Ronaldo’s legendary status with his declining impact.
• Gary Lineker: “He’s now gone ten consecutive games without scoring a goal at major tournaments for Portugal… Might end up a little bit sad if it all goes to pot.” [25:38]
• Patrick Vieira: “You need to build that mindset for him… that when he will get to the World Cup, he’s not going to be in the starting 11. … But you need to have a conversation with him and say, ‘I’m the Portugal manager.’” [26:31–27:16]
• Morgan Rogers (on what he would do): “I might start you a couple of games, then you might be on the bench. … We’ll do this together and make Portugal world champions. … If you don’t want it, I’ve got my flight booked.” [27:40]

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Notable Quotes (w/ Timestamps)

• Patrick Vieira: “You’re never going to find out [what it feels like to win a World Cup].” [02:35]
• Micah Richards (on Bellingham): “Jude always delivers… his work rate, his intensity was absolutely brilliant today.” [04:17]
• Patrick Vieira: “The teams to beat is France. … England… can hurt France, yes, but not win it.” [06:03]
• Morgan Rogers (on Bellingham): “When you look over and see you’ve got Jude Bellingham, you know he’s going to produce something at some moment.” [06:54]
• Alan Shearer (on Tuchel’s approach): “His substitutions were at the right time, were absolutely fantastic… That’s the way he’s going to go: ‘This is my way. I’m going to be really positive. You either like it or lump it.’” [09:19]
• Patrick Vieira (on Kane v Mbappe): “Mbappe. Mbappe with no doubt about it.” [20:37]
• Gary Lineker (on Kane): “Harry Kane is, I think, the greatest English striker we’ve ever had.” [16:41]
• Patrick Vieira (on Ronaldo dilemma): “You need to have a conversation with him and to say, listen, I can’t leave you at home… but you need to understand that I’m the Portugal manager.” [26:31]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Opening & World Cup Winning Feeling: [02:09 – 03:07]
• England’s Performance Analysis: [03:15 – 05:56]
• France vs England Discussion: [06:00 – 06:22]
• Jude Bellingham & Selection Debates: [06:22 – 09:32]
• England’s Tactical Approach / Tuchel’s Impact: [09:32 – 13:14]
• Bellingham Player Profile: [13:37 – 14:41]
• Kane Performance, Penalty, and Striker Debate: [14:41 – 17:46]
• Tuchel Tactics / Building Around Kane: [19:15 – 22:08]
• Portugal, Ronaldo, and Managerial Dilemma: [22:46 – 28:30]

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Final Thoughts

• Excitement is high for England, with optimism grounded in visible tactical improvements and the rise of big-game players like Bellingham and Kane.
• The panel—while upbeat—urges caution and realism, pointing to the quality and consistency of other giants like France.
• The ongoing challenge for elite managers: making bold calls on legendary but ageing stars, as with Ronaldo for Portugal.
• The chemistry, humor, and deep game insight from the panel make this an episode packed with substance for football fans seeking more than highlight reels.

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End of Summary.

Transcript

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[Gary Lineker]

Hello and welcome to the rest is

[Podcast Host]

football with me, Gary Lineker. In today's show, we're joined by not only Alan Shearer, Micah Richards, Joe Cole and Harry Maguire, but French World cup winner the great Patrick Vieira. We'll be discussing England's cracking start to the competition. And don't forget, if you'd like to watch the show, come just go to Netflix. We're on every day.

[Gary Lineker]

Can you tell us what it feels like to win a World Cup?

[Patrick Vieira]

I think you were never going to find out. You're never going to know.

[Alan Shearer]

Come on, Pat.

[Micah Richards]

Come on, tell us, please. As England fans, we just yearning for it so much.

[Patrick Vieira]

It Will take too long to explain the feeling and the proudness. And. And we were lucky because it was in France.

[Joe Cole]

Yeah.

[Patrick Vieira]

You know, in your home country. In home country. So it's something quite, really special.

[Gary Lineker]

Yeah. Oh, well, I can only begin to imagine we got fairly close.

[Harry Maguire]

We were lucky that we got beat off Argentina on penalties or we might have won it as well.

[Patrick Vieira]

Yeah.

[Gary Lineker]

Well, if we.

[Harry Maguire]

Well, maybe not big ifs.

[Joe Cole]

Big ifs.

[Gary Lineker]

Big ifs. We'll talk about the other games today, but we've got to start. Got to start with England, haven't we? What a promising start.

[Harry Maguire]

Fabulous, fabulous. I thought there were plenty of positives in the first half, too, but there are also negatives in terms of the defending. But, yeah, I thought the second half was really, really encouraging. I thought the changes the manager made were really positive. Really, really positive. And I thought there were some very, very good performances and it was a brilliant start for England.

[Gary Lineker]

Yeah, Michael. I mean, obviously we all had concerns about selections and did it start to make sense, the way England played today? Perhaps some that have been admitted with.

[Alan Shearer]

I'm just saying, without the Essex.

[Harry Maguire]

Come on, let me pull that knife out there.

[Joe Cole]

Oh, my God.

[Alan Shearer]

You see what happens? You know what I mean? You'd be nice to me. That's what he does to you.

[Micah Richards]

That's me on the pod every single week. No, but in terms of Jude, I mean, come on. We had a debate, didn't we? And it wasn't a debate, but Morgan Rodgers, we talked about fantastic player, but big game players. Jude always delivers. I talked about the pressure of Real Madrid and then translating that to England. He always turns up. And it's not just his goal he scored. I think his work rate, his intensity was absolutely brilliant today. I like the fact that when Kane was coming really deep, Bellingham was going in behind Gordon, too. I thought Madweke was good as well on transition. I'm just absolutely buzzing because there's too much negativity.

[Alan Shearer]

Look at him, look at him, look at him. He can't help. He can't help it, can it?

[Micah Richards]

I'm not saying it's coming home yet, Pat, but in terms of.

[Gary Lineker]

How'd you say that in French? It's coming home.

[Patrick Vieira]

It's coming home. Il arrive a la maison.

[Gary Lineker]

La coupe, La maison in the house.

[Alan Shearer]

Excuse me. Is that it?

[Patrick Vieira]

La coupe, La coupe, la maison.

[Micah Richards]

Okay, but it was just positive, wasn't it?

[Patrick Vieira]

Was a really good performance. I think for the first game of the big tournament like that. You can say that it was a lot of question mark. On England, and they answered it quite well. But you don't want to build too much excitement, but we always do that.

[Gary Lineker]

Yeah,

[Patrick Vieira]

it is good and I don't want to take it away. It was a huge performance and it was a really good performance. I think it was one of the best performance so far in the World cup at the same level than the French teams, I would say than Argentina, but there's still a long way to go.

[Micah Richards]

So if England play France now, who do you think would win?

[Harry Maguire]

Cool.

[Patrick Vieira]

That's a real question.

[Micah Richards]

Of course it's a real question.

[Patrick Vieira]

The teams to beat is France. There's no doubt about it. I think there's the best team in the competition and I believe that they will go to the end and to win the World Cup. But I think that England, with what they showed to this first game, can hurt France, yes, but not win it.

[Gary Lineker]

A lot of the big players have started the tournament very quickly and you mentioned Jude Bellingham. So let's start with Jude. He became the youngest European player, European player in history to make an appearance at four different major tournaments. UEFA Euros, FIFA World cup, age 22 and 353 days. Indeed, 57% of his England goals have come at major tournaments. Four of seven. The highest ratio of any player with five plus goals for the three lines. He's a big game player, isn't he?

[Morgan Rogers]

I mean, he's got that mentality. We're talking about Morgan Rogers and, you know, do you play and do you not play him? You have to play him in games like this. And Pat will tell you the personality of the players. Like when you're going out there in a big game, you look over and you see you've got Jude Bellingham. You know, he's going to produce something at some moment. And for me, it was never even in doubt. And I think, like I said to you earlier, Meeks, if England do win the World Cup, Tuchel's going to go, yeah, I poked the bear there early on. I wound him up and then got a performance out of him.

[Micah Richards]

Do you think he did it purposely, though?

[Morgan Rogers]

I do, yeah, I do. Because I know. I think the last. Remember the last Euros, there was talk about, you know, Jude was his personality, right? Was things like that. And I think what Tuchel's done is thought, let me just put him in his place a little bit and put the team first above Jude. And Jude's responded out. I thought he would, you know, you

[Micah Richards]

wanted Morgan Rodgers to start. Why? No, no, no, honestly,

[Alan Shearer]

Obviously, three minutes.

[Harry Maguire]

Was that.

[Micah Richards]

No, no, but I understand why, because he's a top quality player. But why would you pick him over Jude? What was your reasoning behind that?

[Harry Maguire]

I think it was because England had qualified or had played really well under Thomas Tuchel with Morgan Rogers in the side. And Thomas had always said he's going to be loyal to the players that have helped get England into this position. So that was the, that was the reason why I sort of said that. I'm not. I've never denied that he's a, he's an incredible player and I have no problem with him. With him starting ahead of Morgan, the, the good thing is, I thought, is that the way he sort of switched it and was really his, his, his substitutions were really refreshing for me because they were really positive. At a really sticky time of the game. He could have went all defensive, but he went, no, I'm not having none of that. And he made really positive substitutions and those played a huge part in England winning the game. Jed Spence came on, he could have scored other but for a really good save. Morgan Rogers came on more than played his part. Saka came on set, another sub up. Rashford, who came on, scored the wonderful goal. So I thought his substitutions were at the right time, were absolutely fantastic and can be really encouraging going forward because I think judging by what he said after the game and his attitude, I think that's the way he's going to go. He's going to say, this is my way. I'm going to be really positive. You either like it or lump it, whether I'll win this competition by being positive or not. And it'll, it'll, it'll. It'll backfire. But I thought everything he did today was spot on.

[Gary Lineker]

You can see there's a plan there.

[Joe Cole]

Yeah, definitely. I think I was really impressed with the second half. I thought the intensity. I think Croatia struggled to. To keep up with, keep up with England. And I think the first half, the first game of a World cup is always the most. I feel the most pressure, the most nervous of the lads will be. So I think five or six players in that team were playing the first World Cup. So I think the first half, I think you're seeing it a little bit with France as well. Like, you don't want to come out organs blazing and you do play with that tiny bit of fear. But what the manager said at half time in terms of, I think H said after the game about, he said, if we're going to lose, you lose our way. And I think that Took the fear away from the players and I think the second half they went on and dominated the game. They could have won by a lot more.

[Micah Richards]

Can I just ask you, tactically, Tuchel, what's it like? What does he want from the players? Because we've seen all this movement with Bellingham going in behind Kane going really deep. But how tactically astute is Thomas Tuchel?

[Joe Cole]

Yeah, I think tactically, I think a lot of people looked at the squad he picked and thought that we were going to sit in and play on the counter attack, but I thought it would be the opposite. I think we've got four lads in the back four who all want to build up. I think picks today was really calm, really, really calm under pressure. I think the two in centre midfield want to take the ball. I think the wide wingers is big on pressure and counter press. So I think we're going to build up. But I think the flip side of it, I think we're going to do high press and I think we're going to press in their half and I think you've seen that today. I thought the pressure and the intensity, I think it's the best we've seen in England recently.

[Morgan Rogers]

Harry, can I ask you early on, when Harry Kane was dropping deep and Bellingham was in the number nine position, do you think that was something that was worked on or something the boys just sought for?

[Joe Cole]

Yeah, definitely. I think it's worked. And I think, listen, H is our best player, so he's one of the best players in the world. So the team's got to. You've got to build your team around H. I think we've seen at the last Euros you had everyone coming to the ball and when H picks up that ball in the midfield, it scares defenders. Defenders don't know where the team goes.

[Gary Lineker]

That's H for Harry Kane, not the guy in line of duty.

[Joe Cole]

Sorry.

[Gary Lineker]

I want to ask you about England's in intensity because I was sitting next to you watching the game. You're quite impressed with that side of things. Playing to England's strengths.

[Patrick Vieira]

Yeah, because I think this is the reflect the Premier League, you know, I think the strength of those group of players is to play with the intensity, try to score goals going forward and try to win the ball as high as they can. And then I think that with the quality of players that they, they have with Gordon and Madueke on the right hand side, I believe this is a transition players, so they need space to express themselves. So of course going to try to win the ball higher. When they win it though, the teams are not have time to really reorganize themselves defensively. So there will be situation where they will be in the 1v1 and this is the strength of England and the profile of the players that they had. I think that is refreshing, like Alan was saying earlier, to see England with positive attitude and try to dictate the tempo of the game and to win the game. And I think the tempo was so higher and Croatia was quite really good on the board in the first half but the intensity was so higher that I think in the second half physically they drop and then England went to dominate and create those situations and score those goals. But if they manage to improve that defensive side, I think that will be quite a really difficult teams to play against.

[Gary Lineker]

I think it's quite notable that England adapted around the way that Harry Kane plays. Did you do something similar to that when you won the World cup? Maybe with Zinedine Zidane? Did you?

[Alan Shearer]

Yeah.

[Patrick Vieira]

You have to win the World Cup. Your best player has to play at the best. And we talk about Bellingham. He has to. England will not win the World cup if Bellingham is not at the top of his.

[Gary Lineker]

I'll ask you a bit about Jude because obviously you were a box to box midfield player. I mean Jude, I think I watched him today. At times he was playing as a 10, which is where he's put in. At times he was a nine, he played as a six. At times you saw him tacking his own box, he was up and down like an eight. He's got that all round sort of game that you had yourself to a degree.

[Patrick Vieira]

Yeah, I think he's got this. This kind of power and fitness to really get running all around the pitch. But sometimes I have the feeling that he's losing too much energy and sometimes I have the feeling that he can choose when is the best time to make those kind of run or to run with the ball. And I think like one or twice he get the ball on his feet and he run and I think he's losing too much energy. I think he can be more dangerous if he keep controlling himself and to control his energy and get into the last third. I think he's somebody who can score more goals and make more assist and have more impact in the England games. But today I think he's part of the 2, 3, best midfielder in the world.

[Harry Maguire]

You know, I thought today one of, if not the biggest thing because England have sat for six or seven days watching everyone else play long Wait.

[Gary Lineker]

Long wait.

[Harry Maguire]

Harry Kane is so messy. He saw Mbappe Haaland all come on and go straight away and go, Boof. Get their goals. So for him to come in and get the goals, as he has done. I know there's the talk about the first one, the penalty miss. Keeper did come off your line, so it had to be retaken. But then from a mental side of things, there are a million things going through your mind on that second penalty. Trying to second guess what the goalkeeper's gonna think. But for him to stay so strong and think, no, I'm going to the same side here as the keeper saved. It was really strong. And he's obviously been listening to you because you asked him to keep this guy relevant and he's now honest, he's now revel. And it's only a matter of time before he breaks.

[Alan Shearer]

Let's get the stats up, please. I want to see the stats. Come on, H, run the stats, please. Where's the camera? I'm talking to H. Thank you so much. Just one more to go, please. And then this guy becomes so irrelevant. Thank you.

[Gary Lineker]

Can I make a little point on this? I'm absolutely delighted that Kane's.

[Alan Shearer]

Oh, my.

[Micah Richards]

You stop the nonsense, Gary.

[Gary Lineker]

There it is.

[Alan Shearer]

Look at your celebration.

[Gary Lineker]

I'm still ahead on alphabetical order

[Joe Cole]

and

[Gary Lineker]

that's all that matters.

[Micah Richards]

I know we have a laugh and joke of it, but that is amazing

[Alan Shearer]

for you, Gary, to be fair, it's amazing for Harry. No, no,

[Gary Lineker]

Serious note. I mean, welcome to the. Welcome to the double figures club. It's great. I mean, it may have taken him a World cup more.

[Alan Shearer]

You see, this is why we don't give him praise on the show. This is why.

[Gary Lineker]

I mean, I have to say in all seriousness, Harry Kane is, I think, the greatest English striker we've ever had. I genuinely think that now. I mean, 80 goals, Alan's not even in the.

[Alan Shearer]

Are you sick? Anyway, did you see Alan in that top 10 anywhere?

[Harry Maguire]

Look at the numbers. Look at the numbers. Is he scored in the Euros.

[Gary Lineker]

Harry, you know him well, obviously. What, did they not call you H as well?

[Joe Cole]

Yeah, we're both confusing. Honestly, you can't speak hard enough of it because on the pitch he's unbelievable, but off the pitch, he's a massive leader. Even little things about his penalty, what he missed today, I know that he'd have studied that keeper and knows that if you stutter, he'll come off his line. Little things like that. H will.

[Gary Lineker]

He sort of went straight away, didn't he? Appealed.

[Joe Cole]

I Think he would know that straight away? Because I know what he does with his penalties. I don't want to give too much away, but he practices them every single day. But he's finishing his technique, his passing. He has absolute everything.

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[Gary Lineker]

The one thing I noticed talking about Harry because we know he drops deep and we had a lot of conversations in the Euros two years ago about the fact that we didn't really adapt to that because when he dropped, so did everybody else and we couldn't get out. And I don't think Harry was anything like the condition he is in for this World Cup. I think he was carrying a back injury but Tuchel seems to he's worked that out and that's obviously why he's played these high paced, high up energy wingers to run past him and Jude Bellingham to go past him as well when he drops deep.

[Morgan Rogers]

Yeah, all the things you wanted to see from the game you saw from Thomas and I think Thomas has gone and gone right. Harry Kane's our best player and then he's built the team around him. You know managers sometimes some managers want to build it From. From the back four or the goalie and that he's gone right. Harry's my best player. What does he need? He's gone to Bayern Munich, scored 61 goals, he's got runners all around him and he's gone right. And that's probably why Foden and Palmer are not there, because he's thinking, I need Gordon, I need Rashford, I need Saka and Madueke. One's going to start. One's going to start the game, the other two are going to finish the game. But Harry Kane, the only problem we've got is if Harry gets injured. If Harry gets injured, I don't think he'll go with Watkins or Tony. I think he'll go with.

[Gary Lineker]

Say that about all the big teams, they lost their absolute star bet, but maybe possibly with the exception of France. I was going to ask you, I just want to ask you, Pat. Harry Kane or Mbappe?

[Patrick Vieira]

Mbappe. Mbappe with no doubt about it. I don't want to take away Ari's quality because what I love about him is that he's a team player. When I say a team player, is that out of possession. I've seen him running, chasing and make it really difficult for the back four and I think you're right, he has to build the team around the best player on the field.

[Gary Lineker]

And are you saying perhaps that Mbappe is not a team player?

[Patrick Vieira]

No, but Mbappe, we want him to do more out of possession to help the team more when they are in the defensive side. But on the other side, he scored two, three goals per game, so you don't want to take that away as well. So that's why I think Deschamps has this flexibility to play with two really holding midfielder who will stay in front of the back four. But Kin, when he's dropping, you have those two wingers who make the run in behind and that's why I think there was quite a lot of question about Phil Foden, about Palmer, who have quality, but different quality from what the manager want for the England national team. So today we saw really good England team going forward with Harvey Keane coming really deep getting the ball and dictate the tempo of the game. And. And he's so clever and he's seen the pass, he plays some passes forward for Madueke, who Gordon on the other side. So that make it quite.

[Gary Lineker]

Do you see similarities between England and France in terms of the way the transition, etc.

[Patrick Vieira]

Yeah, I think.

[Alan Shearer]

Oh, here we go. You got it, Al?

[Patrick Vieira]

No, but I think that England and France are transition teams who need space because the profile of the players that they have. I seen two really physical, strong teams with a lot of mobility, a lot of pace. And I think France a little bit more stronger behind because Harry is not there.

[Gary Lineker]

He was just getting over it. Let's talk about Portugal, because I think we were all looking forward to seeing them and obviously one of the favorites in the competition, Joe. And they struggled today.

[Morgan Rogers]

They've got all of the ability. You've got Bernardo Silva, Fernandez. You've got so many players.

[Micah Richards]

Joao Neves, Bettina.

[Patrick Vieira]

Yeah, they've got so champions leagues.

[Morgan Rogers]

They've got so much players. Cristiano. I think we've seen two players today that might. One was pulled off. Luka Modric. I think his manager pulled him off six minutes. Luka Modric, I think, has been the

[Gary Lineker]

best two players in their 40s.

[Morgan Rogers]

Exactly. It's been the best midfielder in the last 10 years. He's been brilliant. Cristiano Ronaldo's. Cristiano Ronaldo. But what benefit is he going to be trying to play every minute of every game for eight games? Portugal's when Portugal have a chance. But he needs to be used sparingly. Ronaldo, he can't be starting every moment of every game. And the manager's got to be strong enough to go.

[Harry Maguire]

You mean the reaction that Luka Modric was not happy to be taken off,

[Gary Lineker]

but he got it.

[Harry Maguire]

I didn't play that well. And I'll just. Whereas if. If Roberto had attempted to take Cristiano off, it'll going to be a big show, isn't it?

[Morgan Rogers]

Yeah.

[Gary Lineker]

The Fed. Yeah.

[Morgan Rogers]

The federation will be on him.

[Micah Richards]

Can I just ask you, from a manager's point of view, you. You've been in the hot seat. Patrick Alan has been, but, you know,

[Alan Shearer]

briefly, it didn't add that worth.

[Micah Richards]

You've been in the hot seat and you have a conundrum of Ronaldo. He's still scoring goals in Saudi. His movement in the box is very good, but he's limiting the way that they really want to play. So put yourself in Roberto Martinez's shoes. I've worked with him. He's tactically, he's amazing. But has he got a problem with solving Ronaldo? And what he needs to do with

[Patrick Vieira]

that, of course, is a huge problem for the manager. But as a manager, how do you want to sit down with Ronaldo and tell him, listen, you're going to be on the bench. You're not going to start today. He will never going to understand it because he never been in that situation. So difficult. He will not going to understand because the player is. He doesn't understand how Ronaldo me are not starting the game. It's not possible. He's never been in that situation. So of course it's a difficult situation for the manager because he has to think about the team. And he is a Portugal manager, not Ronaldo's manager. So he has to think about the team first before thinking about Ronaldo. So he will have to make some really strong decision not to start him. If the team is better without him,

[Morgan Rogers]

how would you do it?

[Alan Shearer]

But what would you do?

[Micah Richards]

Would you bench him then or.

[Patrick Vieira]

No, you bench him or you select

[Gary Lineker]

him before you answer that. He's now gone 10 consecutive games without scoring a goal at major tournaments for Portugal. 10 FIFA World Cups and Euros, the longest run of his international career. His last strike in either of the two competitions was against Ghana on match day one of the 2022 World Cup. I worry for him a little bit that his legacy will be spoilt a little bit if he kicks off and he gets taken off and then he has a strop and all that, because he has been for two decades an extraordinarily wonderful footballer. And it seems to me might end up a little bit sad if it all goes to pot.

[Harry Maguire]

Roberto's not leaving him.

[Gary Lineker]

No, I don't think you will either.

[Alan Shearer]

Would you leave him out?

[Micah Richards]

As a manager? You've been in that situation. Would you leave him out? We've got Gonzalo Ramos to come in.

[Patrick Vieira]

We're talking about Cristiano Ronaldo in Portugal, he's more than just a player. So for me, it's about you need to build that mindset for him to start to know that when he's going to get to the World cup, he will play. He's not going to play. He's going to come from the bench, and he has to. You have to find a way to make him understand that. So for me, it's about how do you prepare him mentally to know that when he will get to the World cup, he's not going to be in the starting 11. You have to prepare him for that, but you need to have a conversation with him and to say, listen, I can't leave you at home. I have to take you to the World cup because of who you are. But you need to understand that I'm the Portugal manager.

[Micah Richards]

So would you leave him out or are you just going to sit on that?

[Patrick Vieira]

You have to make him understand if as a manager, you strongly believe that Portugal are better without Ronaldo. You have to make a decision, and then you're not going to start him, but you have to accept that after.

[Micah Richards]

You need to. Joe, you're aspiring coach.

[Morgan Rogers]

Would you leave him if I'm Portugal manager?

[Micah Richards]

If you're a Portugal manager, six months

[Morgan Rogers]

ago, I'd have gone to his house in Saudi and said, listen, Cristiano, this is what I'm thinking. Eight games. I don't think you can play them all, but I need you with me like this. The offer at the table is, come with me. I might start you a couple of games, then you might be on the bench. I'm going to need you to finish games because games will go to 120 minutes and a penalty shootout. I need you for a penalty shootout. Do you want to be with me? And we will do this together and we'll make Portugal world champions. If you want that, come with me. If you don't want it, I've got my flight booked. I hope I've still got a contract in the morning, but I think it needed to be done six months ago. And you need to be strong because he's such a. Listen, I think he's the second best player of all time behind Messi. I think he's amazing, but he's 41.

[Podcast Host]

That's it for this episode of the Rest Is Football. After a great start for England, we're

[Gary Lineker]

all very excited, but let's not get too carried away.

[Podcast Host]

Or maybe we should. Don't forget we're on every day on Netflix.