James Milner: Record Breaker

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Rest Is Football

Episode: James Milner: Record Breaker
Date: March 27, 2026
Host: Gary Lineker
Guest: James Milner

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Overview

This special episode celebrates James Milner’s historic achievement of breaking the record for most Premier League appearances, surpassing Gareth Barry. Gary Lineker leads a deep-dive conversation with Milner, reflecting on the latter’s extraordinary durability, his journey through the English football landscape, experiences with some of football’s greatest managers and teammates, and thoughts on the game’s evolution. The tone is warm, insightful, self-deprecating, and candid, with Milner offering honest perspectives on highs, lows, and what might lie ahead.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Milner’s Mindset on Breaking the Record

• On chasing the appearance record:
  • “It was never really something... it’s not the reason why I’m still playing or anything like that. I just want to contribute to the team I’m playing for.” (01:43)
• On returning from a major injury:
  • “Probably, yeah, 100%. I think everyone around me probably thought it was as well... That was probably what drove me on, the unlikelihood of coming back.” (02:11)
• On outlasting managers:
  • “You’re older than your manager... Is that a bit odd?”
  • “As soon as he had that first team meeting... it was never ever brought up since. It becomes an issue if you don’t have that authority or aren’t good enough at your job, but he’s brilliant.” (02:56)

Hard Work, Family Influence, and Attitude

• Work ethic roots:
  • “Probably my parents, I think... my dad knew how to get the best out of me... Even then I had the mindset: I’m going to prove you wrong.” (05:14)
• Handling ‘boring’ reputation with humor:
  • “I think being called boring means that I’ve kept a bit of my life and personality for myself and my family... That’s important under the spotlight.” (07:27)
• Self-discipline amid the changing game:
  • “When I started, it was like no phones on the bus, couldn’t imagine that now... Lads are using them for everything.” (08:24)

Sporting Versatility and Youth Sports

• Milner’s academic/athletic background:
  • “He’s got 11 GCSEs... School good at all sports as well. Cricket as well, weren’t you?”
  • Milner: “I loved cricket, yeah... in the summer, when there was no football.” (06:28)
• Endurance and speed:
  • “Cross-country champion, but you were also a sprinter... you always had both.”
  • Milner: “Yeah. I worked so hard without the ball... My dad was a pretty good cross country runner.” (10:19, 11:17)

Adapting With Age

• Physical changes and adapting roles:
  • “You’re not playing every game now... Now I’m playing the six and it’s a different type of running.” (11:17)
  • “But also you have your brain and experience, so you gain a yard in that.” (11:38)

On Being a Utility Player

• The ‘jack of all trades’ dilemma:
  • “Do you think perhaps you were so good in so many positions it’s worked against you a little?” (13:09)
  • Milner: “Both. It works to your advantage sometimes... But yeah, with England, it probably hampered me a bit.” (13:41)

England Career Reflections

• The decision to retire from international football:
  • “Did you get fed up with England?”
  • “I played 12 years in a row... I was always like maybe 12th man... Am I blocking a place for someone?... I’ve never regretted it once. That’s because it was my decision.” (14:04–15:16)
• Managers’ influence:
  • “If Gareth had been the manager... I think I’d have probably carried on playing.” (15:01)

The Changing Game, Youth Development, and Social Media

• Evolution of the football environment:
  • “When I started, no phones on the bus... it’s a different world now.” (08:27)
  • “The only player that spans the whole of social media’s history.” (08:24)
• Youth development:
  • “When you get to the first team, you’re just expected to know how to play.” (33:40, 34:08)

Early Career and Influential Managers

• Debut and rise at Leeds:
  • “Terry Venables had the belief to put a 16-year-old in the team, and gave me confidence to work on technique.” (30:34)
• Bobby Robson at Newcastle:
  • “Incredible. I just felt unfortunate for him and Terry not to work with them longer.” (33:00)
• Differences in coaching styles:
  • “Now, with videos and drones, they can freeze-frame decisions... But in real time, it’s split second.” (34:06)

Key Moments & Memorable Anecdotes

Milner’s Versatility and Determination

• On his best position:
  • “I’d probably say in the middle, just because... my energy and just being involved in the game.” (19:31)
• On penalties:
  • “It’s a mental thing... practice and a mental battle most of the time.” (20:43)
• On being an on- and off-field leader:
  • “You try to set examples... When you get older, you see your role and think more about the team than yourself.” (43:58)

Highs, Lows & Key Matches

• First City title and the Aguero moment:
  • “If you wrote a movie plot and said this is going to happen, you’d be like, nah... From that low to that high in three minutes, the feeling is indescribable.” (47:10–48:13)
• On the famous Liverpool comeback against Barcelona:
  • “That’s my favorite game I’ve been involved in... the quality of team, atmosphere, everything.” (58:48)

On VAR

• Blisteringly honest take:
  • “If you want me to be fully honest... I absolutely hate it. I hate it... Football’s an emotional game. Referees, players, managers—all make mistakes. Let it happen.” (48:47–49:31)

On Teammates and Managers

• Comic insight on Micah Richards:
  • “When he overlapped, it was unstoppable... I just filled in for his rest periods. He was great.” (40:19)
• About legends played with:
  • “David Silva, Carlos Tevez, Sergio Aguero. What a core we had.” (39:17–39:23)
• Praise from Manuel Pellegrini:
  • “Show me another who does all the things that Milner does. There isn’t one... an intelligent player with big balls and a massive heart.” (45:26)
• On Jurgen Klopp:
  • “However you think he is, he is. What you see is what you get. Big heart. Made you want to run through a brick wall.” (55:04)

On Grief and Football Family

• Discussing the loss of close friend and teammate Diogo Jota (in this imagined future):
  • “He was one of us... so well-loved... devastating, you can’t put into words.” (61:10–63:07)

What’s Next?

• Plans after football:
  • “At this moment in time, I’m just taking it game by game...”
  • “Would you fancy a game for Worley?”
    • “Yeah, if it’s a bleep test session, hopefully I’ll be able to do that.” (29:03)
  • “Coaching? There’s times I think: yeah... It has to be the right club, right manager, right owner...” (65:34)

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Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• “If you said when I was starting at 16, if you’d said I’d achieve an eighth of what I have, you’d be buzzing with it.” (04:20 – James Milner)
• “If you get there, great. But it wasn’t a big goal of mine.” (01:43 – James Milner)
• “As long as the people who know me know, you’ve got fun with it. I think being called boring means I’ve kept a bit for myself.” (07:27 – James Milner)
• “Do you regret it at all? – No, I’ve never regretted it once. And that’s because it was my decision.” (15:14 – 15:16)
• “If you want me to be fully honest, I absolutely hate [VAR]. I hate it.” (49:00 – James Milner)
• “Show me another who does all the things that Milner does. Well, there isn’t one. An intelligent player with big balls and a massive heart.” (45:26 – Manuel Pellegrini, as quoted by Gary Lineker)
• “What’s next? At this moment, I think I’m just taking it game by game.” (64:43 – James Milner)
• “You have to be the best... The best team always wins the league.” (47:15 – James Milner on importance of winning the Premier League)
• “Playing against Messi? He’s on a different planet... You know where he wants to go, you can’t stop him.” (52:20 – James Milner)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• 01:08 – Gary introduces Milner and discusses the record
• 05:07 – Milner talks about his upbringing and work ethic
• 07:11 – Milner on ‘boring’ jokes and keeping privacy
• 13:09 – Discussion of utility player role and international football
• 15:08 – Retiring from England: motivation and regrets
• 19:31 – Milner’s best position
• 21:21 – Thoughts on current England generation and tournament hopes
• 30:23 – Debut at Leeds and influence of Terry Venables
• 33:00 – Experiences under Bobby Robson at Newcastle
• 39:17 – Favourite teammates at Manchester City
• 47:10 – The Aguero moment and first City title
• 48:47 – Candid views on VAR
• 49:50 – Move to Liverpool and working under Klopp
• 52:20 – Playing against Messi
• 58:45 – Liverpool’s Champions League comeback vs. Barcelona
• 61:10 – On the loss of Diogo Jota and personal grief
• 64:43 – Future plans and possibility of management/coaching

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Final Notes

The episode is a portrait of an enduring footballer whose career was built on adaptability, leadership, and understated excellence. Milner’s humility, resilience, and humor shine as much as his football intelligence. His candid view on VAR, football’s changing culture, and experiences under managers like Klopp and Pellegrini provide rare, frank perspectives from inside the modern game. Whether discussing his next move or reflecting on those who shaped him, Milner remains true to himself: pragmatic, loyal, and ever ready for the next challenge.

Transcript

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[Gary Enicker]

Hello, and welcome to the rest is football with me, Gary Enicker. And today I've got a very special guest alongside me, someone who's just broken a long standing record that was previously held by Gareth Barry. I'm sure you've already worked out what it is of the most Premier League appearances by. By an individual player, but there's a lot more to the career of James Milner than just appearances. There's been a lot of trophies along the way as well. Thank you, James, for coming along.

[James Milner]

No, thanks for having me.

[Gary Enicker]

And congratulations on that remarkable achievement. It must have been something that was in your mind towards the latter stages.

[James Milner]

It's a weird one, really. It was in my mind because every time I did any interviews and stuff, people asked me about it and things like that. But for me, it was never really something. You know, it was, if you get there, graduates, great. But it wasn't. It's not the reason why I'm still playing or anything like that. It wasn't a big goal of mine, if I'm honest. You know, my mindset's never really changed to that. I just want to contribute to the team I'm playing for. And, you know, after last year where I had that big injury and couldn't really lift my foot for six months,

[Gary Enicker]

did you think that was it?

[James Milner]

Probably, yeah, 100%. I think everyone around me probably thought it was as well, to be honest. The physio and the age I. I was at at that point and. And that injury, I think that was probably what drove me on, you know, that the unlikelihood of coming back, you know, the first thing was probably being able to walk normally again. And then, you know, the challenge at that age to come back from that and play Premier League football and then, yeah. So, I mean, it's nice to get there and be contributing this year, on the field after that for sure. And, you know, same worth achieving is not easy, I suppose.

[Gary Enicker]

So it's something of an iron man. I mean, you define. You define age, define logic in all sorts of ways. In your 40s, still playing Premier League football, you're older than your manager by some distance. Is that a bit odd?

[James Milner]

Do you know what? I think there was a lot of talk about it before he came in. He did his first team meeting within the dressing room. Then obviously there's a lot of interviews and talk in the media and stuff and questions after that. But as soon as he had that first team meeting, his plan, how he spoke, you know, never ever been brought up since about the boys and stuff. I suppose it becomes an issue if you don't have, you know, that authority. You're not, you're not, you know, if you're not good enough at your job, I suppose it's first thing you turn around and say, isn't it? Where's the weakness? All right, it's because he's young, but because of how good he is and how hard he works and the job he's doing.

[Gary Enicker]

Does he lean on you a little bit as an experience? I mean, must he be mad not to?

[James Milner]

I would have thought, yeah. He's brilliant with it, to be fair. We speak a lot. He asks a lot of stuff. He speaks to Wellbs and Dunkey and, you know, the senior boys as well. But, you know, he's in charge. He'll ask you a lot of things. He'll ask your opinion. He's not always going to take it. He'll make his own decisions and he uses the resources he has. And, yeah, I have a great relationship with him. We speak, speak a lot. And, you know, he knows I'll be completely honest with him and he knows that I've got the best interest of the team at heart. And, you know, I think that's a skill in itself. Obviously, it's to rely and speak to your players, but ultimately he's a manager and he'll always make the decision and I think he gets that balance right.

[Gary Enicker]

You've had a remarkable career, James. I mean, you've been around for, obviously a long time to do that record. You must be pretty proud of what you've achieved.

[James Milner]

I think when you're in it, you don't really think too much about it. I think you just neck, what's the next one? Next? What's the next one. What's the aim? I think it's one of those that you probably think about when you finish. But I think obviously if you said when I was first starting at 16, if you'd have said I'd achieve an eighth of what I have, you'd be buzzing with it. I think you know what it's like when you're a kid and you just dream of playing football for Leeds. It was for me as my team and playing in the Premier League and, you know, winning things and all this sort of stuff and playing for England. It's a, you know, it's a dream that you have and you hope it might happen at some point. But, yeah, I've been fortunate to achieve what I have and play with who I have and work with who I have. But, yeah, I mean, it's obviously a lot of luck on the way and a lot of hard work as well. But, yeah, I mean, you're obviously proud.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah, you're known for your hard work and your attitude. Where does that come from? I'll take you back to your childhood now. Grew up in Leeds, obviously.

[James Milner]

Yeah, probably my parents, I think, you know, my mum and dad.

[Gary Enicker]

And were they pushy parents or were they not really encouraging parents?

[James Milner]

Yeah, a bit of both. I think they knew when to do both. You know, obviously, you know how hard it is being at an academy and the amount of hours you have to put in. And remember my mum standing on the sideline watching me play for school in the hail. And you know, your dad rushing home from work to take you to games and watching you all over. But dad knew how to get the best out of me and you. Even then I had the mindset, I'm going to prove you wrong. So if he thought he'd have little digs and say, oh, you've got no chance of making it. You don't work hard enough, or, you know, you're not doing this, and that's

[Gary Enicker]

how I press your buttons.

[James Milner]

He knew. He knew he wasn't being horrible. He knew. Okay, then I was like, all right, then, we'll see that now. Yeah, And I think that's where it come from. When I've had it all the way through, I think, you know, you're always going to have doubters in football, whether it's fans, media, you know, managers, manager comes in and you have to prove yourself all over and again and you're not in the team. It's all right, I'll show you. And again, go back to the injury last year. Probably the same thing. It was like, you know, I think the physio said to me towards the end when I was getting closer to coming back, he was like, I expected you two weeks. And he'd be like, nah, no chance. This is it. Like, there's no. There's no way. So I think that was it a bit again as well. You know, I'm gonna. I'm gonna do something that I think is pretty tough to do.

[Gary Enicker]

You've also got something quite unusual for football. I saw down here. He's got 11 GCSEs. So you're obviously smart. School good at all sports as well. Cricket as well, weren't you?

[James Milner]

I love cricket, yeah.

[Gary Enicker]

You played Yorkshire schools, didn't you?

[James Milner]

I played Leicestershire schools. Oh, nice Y. Yeah, I loved it in. Yeah, in the summer, you know, when there was no football on to go and play.

[Gary Enicker]

Have you still played during your football career?

[James Milner]

Never played. The last time I played was, I think the week before I moved in. At Thor Arch Academy. I was a wicket keeper.

[Gary Enicker]

I was a basement, but with a bit of wicket keeper.

[James Milner]

I was probably the other way. I mean, I opened for my club and stuff, but I was like, I was a nerdler. I'd run it down a third man and, you know, run two too, where there was only one there and things like that. Yeah, yeah. Boring.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah. You say boring, you say boring. I really enjoyed. I mean, you've played to that image and poke fun at yourself. Self deprecating. I saw particularly during COVID You're doing things like cutting the grass with scissors and all that, which I think shows that you're not boring.

[James Milner]

You know, as long as the people who know me and stuff and the boys know you got fun with it. Oh, yeah. And I think that the original page was quite funny and yeah, in a way I think that's a good thing. I think, you know what it's like now with the media year and social media and the amount of interviews you do and the spotlights on you constantly. I think being called boring means that, you know, I've kept a bit of my life and personality from myself and my family and my friends. And I think that's important, you know, under the spotlight so much. I think everyone gets to see so much. I think it's quite nice that, you know, the people don't know absolutely everything about me because, you know, I think you have to retreat into that at times as well. So I think, I think that's quite important. So I've always tried to, you know, Be honest and stuff like that in terms of media and stuff. But I think there's a point where, you know, family, friends and part of your life is for you because obviously there's enough cameras out there now and then the tunnels now and tunnel club and social media around.

[Gary Enicker]

When you started, was it.

[James Milner]

No, not really. It started a long time ago.

[Gary Enicker]

The only player that spans the whole of social media's history.

[James Milner]

Yeah. And I think that's why it's changing it. I mean, when, when I started, it was like no phones on the bus whatsoever. You weren't allowed going to the ground. I mean, you couldn't imagine that now because lads are using it, you know, to watch videos or they might be listening to music, they might be messaging, speaking to the family like it's a different world really now.

[Gary Enicker]

This episode is powered by Fuse Energy. Before we kick off, a quick pre match warm up from Fuse one question, four options and two contestants. Today's question, chaps, which English goalkeeper has recorded the most clean sheets in Premier League history? Is it A, Nigel Martin? Is it B, David Seaman? Is it C, David James? Or is it D, Joe Hart?

[James Milner]

I would go David J. Just because the amount of games that

[Gary Enicker]

he's playing, Mike has gone David James.

[James Milner]

I'm gonna go David Seaman.

[Gary Enicker]

The answer is that David Seaman was indeed in second place. Oh, and the winner is Michael richards with Davy J's 169 clean sheets. The best sides don't give things away. It should be the same with your energy. Get more than just lower [e-mail] use the code football, all uppercase. When you sign up, save around £200 on your energy bill and get the chance to ask us your football questions on the pod. Full terms and [e-mail] wasn't the interesting thing when I was looking back, you, you were a cross country, bit of a cross country champion at school, which didn't surprise me. But you were also a sprinter as well. That, I mean that's an unusual to have both and that you could see that in your game because most people that what they call quick twitch or fast twitch, you know, sprinters that don't have stamina. But you always had both.

[James Milner]

Yeah. And you know, that'll surprise a lot of people. And at the start of my career, I remember, you know, I was never absolutely lining but I was quick and that was, I remember when I was 11, 12 being at Leeds and I was a winger and the coach said, you're gonna have to learn a few tricks because if you Come up someone as quick as you, you're gonna need that extra part to your game. Because I just used to knock it and run that quick. I feel like back then when you played on the wing, early parts of my career, you did so much distance running and you'd be tucked right next to the fullback and it was just up and back. I feel like you didn't really then have, you know, the freshness because I worked so hard without the ball and stuff, you didn't have the freshness to fully go into that top speed and you get into the pattern of doing more high speed. And I don't know if then from that point your pace maybe goes down a little, who knows really? But yeah, I was fortunate to have both, I suppose, and my dad was a pretty good cross country runner and I used to enjoy that when I was younger. And then obviously after sort of pick a line that year. Yeah.

[Gary Enicker]

Can I ask, do you feel you're a bit older now? Can you tell any difference? Because most of us, it happens certainly in my day, in your early 30s, and you suddenly go, oh, someone run past me. I'm not as quick as I was. And then, and then it all ends. But can you feel a difference yet or. I mean, I think gradual difference.

[James Milner]

Yeah, I think because you, I was

[Gary Enicker]

always, you know, you're not playing every game now because five years ago you're in this team, you'd be playing every game, wouldn't you?

[James Milner]

Yeah, I have a thing like, you know, Ellie McCree, you'd be covering, you know, 13 and a half K in a game and stuff like that, and playing in the eight. Now I'm playing the six and it's a lot different type of running. I think the weekend maybe covered 12k and you're like, that's poor. Yeah, I mean, it's a different position. But yeah, you know, it's things in the game. But also you have your brain, don't you? And experience. So you gain a yard in that. So I think depending on position, if you're asking me to play on the wing or eight, you know, I'd probably notice it more. But as a 6, you know, you're plugging gaps, you're reacting off other people and one game a week, you know, I definitely couldn't play every three days like you used to, you know, that's definitely, that's where you feel it most, I think, recovering after a game. You know, when you're playing Champions League and stuff, it's Saturday, Tuesday, Saturday, like there's no Break, then you're international football, whereas now, yeah, you definitely failed. You know, it used to be two days was the worst day and, you know, then it just gets a bit longer.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah, you mentioned there you play up to 6 player now you play on wide. I mean, the thing with you is you can play multiple positions. You started obviously playing on the right mostly. I mean, I, I did a thing years ago, you possibly remember, where I actually apologized to you because I said, and I phrased it very badly, I said, I'm not quite sure what James Milner is, and I meant positionally. But it got read as, As a player, as a footballer and stuff like that, so.

[James Milner]

And you killed me a bit.

[Gary Enicker]

Apologize once again for that. But do you think perhaps that you're so good in so many positions that in some way it's worked against you a little bit in terms of. You mentioned the international break in terms of perhaps England and international football, because, you know, Jack of all trades, master of none. I would say you're master of many trades personally, but it perhaps works against you. I've seen it with other players like Gary Mabbert in my time that he could play anywhere and then he ends up with 17 England caps and he was a better player.

[James Milner]

Yeah, I think both. I think there's times obviously where it works. Your advantage because you can play different positions, you're including the squads and, and you may be on the pitch and. Because you can play different roles and if the manager needs to tweak tactics in a game, you know, you can do that without making a substitute. So I think it works in your advantage sometimes. But yeah, I think probably with England as well, for sure. I feel that probably hampered me a bit.

[Gary Enicker]

And did you get fed up with England? Were you getting a bit disillusioned or.

[James Milner]

I played under 21's football from very young and then went straight to the

[Gary Enicker]

seniors, still the record holders, the most under 21.

[James Milner]

So I've done, I think, 12 years without missing very few games. 12 years in a row, 21s and seniors. I did two World Cups, two Euros, played at the first World cup and first Euros and didn't really feature the next two. And. And Roy was manager and he left and Big Sam came in and I was thinking about it because, you know, I was going, I was going to be involved and stuff, but I was always like, you know, maybe 12th man, things like that, and, you know, a good tourist and that's, that's fine. But am I blocking a place for someone who is going to come through and play. So I had a conversation with Sarah and said, look, I'm. No one guarantees that, you know, did

[Gary Enicker]

you have another conversation with the next manager a month later or.

[James Milner]

I had a. I had a phone call. Yeah. Yeah. So that was the thing. So obviously, Sam come in, and I was like, all right, I'll retire. And then Gareth rang me, said, you know. You know, I'd like you to be involved and be good for us. And it was. If he'd have said that the months before and he'd have been the manager, I think I'd have probably carried on playing.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah.

[James Milner]

But once I've sort of made my mind up, that was sort of it. And I thought, right, well done it.

[Gary Enicker]

Do you regret it at all or not?

[James Milner]

No, I've never regretted it once. And I think that's because it was my decision. And I think other players, you know, you play for England and then, you know, you get phased out and you get left out, and that's maybe taken away from you. Whereas, because it was my decision and maybe because I had that second chance and I stuck to doing the decision I'd met, maybe that's why I haven't missed it. And, you know, because I was fortunate enough to my decision, and for sure I wouldn't be playing now if I carried on with England, I don't think, because obviously that's prolonged my club career. So, you know, it's not an easy decision, for sure. But I don't think I. I don't think I regretted it once, really. Even when England were flying and doing well. You want them to do well. But I didn't feel. You know, I wish I was part of that.

[Gary Enicker]

It was just.

[James Milner]

Yeah, it's just a decision I made, which I thought was right for me and right for the team, really.

[Gary Enicker]

You talked about England there. We'll stick on England for a bit, and then I'll go to your club career, which is obviously exceptional. Your debut was given to you by Capello.

[James Milner]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Gary Enicker]

What was he like? Because he was a bit slightly controversial around that World cup in 2010. There was before. Everyone said it was in a boring camp, and.

[James Milner]

Yeah, I mean. I mean, that was.

[Gary Enicker]

Who would like that.

[James Milner]

Yeah. That was my first World Cup. I mean, if you golfed, you're all right. And, you know, I was like, I'm at a World Cup, I don't really care. Like, we're gonna play football. That was. That was my mindset around it. And, you know, the fa, how they set things up. They do unbelievable things. And I think they've gone to the next level again. And you see how St. George's was set up for the tournament and the things the players had to do. Basketball, you know, golf sims and stuff. But maybe because I'd done under 21's tournaments and stuff, I did three cycles of going with the under 21s, trying to qualify and we lost in the final and the semi final. So I was used to doing tournaments and that's what England youth is about, to get used to that. So when hopefully get through.

[Gary Enicker]

Why do you think it took such a long time to be caught up for England? Because obviously you were breaking records in terms of appearances at age you was 16 when you made your first team debut for Leeds was Terry Venables.

[James Milner]

Yeah, Terry Venables.

[Gary Enicker]

Could love Terry. And then it was quite a few years later until you called up.

[James Milner]

I think it was because generally my age probably went against me in terms of I could play for the 21. So there's quite a few times I was one or the other and they said, all right, we'll pick him and you go with the 21s.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah.

[James Milner]

And that's what kept happening. I remember when I met my debut, Stuart Pierce, I think was assistant at the time and he'd had me at the 21s and he called me down from the line, he said, hurry up and get your kit off before he changes his mind. Because he knew how long I'd waited to make my debut. I think it was Holland. Holland away.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah. What was it like when you get that. Did you get that call from Capello or how did it come about?

[James Milner]

To the senior, to the first time with a. I think I'd been on standby a couple times or I'd traveled. I think we traveled Kazakhstan away or something. I wasn't on the bench, so it wasn't my first time in the squad, but it was the first time getting on. Yeah. And obviously you played me, the 21s for so long and playing in the Premier League. And like you say, you see some players come through now in the play, six, seven, eight games and they're in the England squad. And I think I was seven years.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah, six.

[James Milner]

Six years. Seven years in when I met my England debut. Which you feel if someone had played in the Premier League that long now, it may be different. But yeah, obviously it was just, you know, is it ever going to happen really? And then eventually managed to make my debut and make an impact in that game. I think I set Jermaine Defoe up for a goal and we came back from Lewes being behind and then from that point I was in England squad really and managed to go to the World cup the next year.

[Gary Enicker]

What was Capello like? Because he wasn't everyone's cup of tea, was he?

[James Milner]

No, I mean he was intense. He was quite strict with rules and things like that. You know the odd explosion out of nowhere in of motion and stuff. But you know I think it made players wear not, not wary but you know you need that bit that fear factor as a manager, don't you? Yeah, I think and you know he gave me my England debut and you know very. I think he wanted to convert me into a fullback quite early. I remember him saying to me one time, yeah he said I think you'd be a world class fullback. And at that point I was zero interest in that.

[Gary Enicker]

But at that point if I ask you now what do you think, what do you think is the best if you had one position to play, what do you think your best position would be? If you were starting again now knew everything that you knew now and you say one position and that you probably played a million games for England, what would it be?

[James Milner]

I'd probably say in the middle just because I'd say if you look at my individual season, my best season was probably when I was at Villa and scored most goals and assisted in my career. That year I won PFA young player of the year, got me into the England squad, moved to city times when I played at Liverpool in the middle consistently as well. You know I had a lot of assists in the Europa League one year, I had a lot of assists in the Champions League another year. So I think like my energy and just being involved in the game and I think that's probably why I can play different positions and I think that helps your understanding of the game. And it's probably the middle of a three, you know, probably not as a two getting on the ball but making runs and like when you look at some of the players I've been forced to play with like you likes of David Silver and stuff, you can make the most ridiculous run ever and he'll find a way of fighting for you, you know but I've just think been that energy and I don't think anyone ever really thinks of me as creative but my crossing was always okay awareness, wasn't really bothered about scoring myself. So you played quite.

[Gary Enicker]

You're on the right way. If I remember rightly in Ukraine, Poland when we yeah, don't beat Italy and you whipped some Great balls in. I remember joining those few games. That was unfortunate. Losing the penalty shootout, wasn't it though?

[James Milner]

Yeah, yeah. I'd been brought off at that point so I didn't get a chance to take one.

[Gary Enicker]

Of course you'd definitely been a penalty take because you've taken quite a few.

[James Milner]

Yeah, yeah. I probably started. I mean I took them at the. Under England, under 21s and then at Villa. Used to take them. Bit harder to get on them at City. I think I took a few there. But obviously when you've got your Agueros and your Yaya Torres and stuff, there's a bit of a pecking order and Yaya's a bit bigger than me, so I think I managed to take one or two there and then Liverpool took quite a few. So. Yeah, I think it's, you know, it's a mental thing. You know what it's like. It's practice and. And mental battle most of the time.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah, it is. It wasn't one we won on that occasion and you were on the bench unfortunately by that stage. So you bring it forward.

[James Milner]

Really.

[Gary Enicker]

Just ask your opinion on the. The current England setup and I mean there's a hell of a lot of talented young footballers at the moment. Where do you think England are? Do you think? Can. Can they possibly do well in this World Cup?

[James Milner]

I mean we.

[Gary Enicker]

We're long overdue Car.

[James Milner]

I mean, of course we can be.

[Gary Enicker]

Nice to see it happen in our lifetime.

[James Milner]

Yeah. That really want to be chucking out, you know, big, big bold predictions and things like that. Adding more pressure. Well, you can't be the World Cup. Yeah. And you know what it's like in terms of anyone says anything and people jump on it and the pressure builds even more. There's enough pressure on the boys, but you look at the quality of players we have throughout the squad, it's great to see. And you look at how good the youth levels. That's normally a good gauge of, you know, the groups that are coming through and they've won trophies as well. So the more, I think the more trophies you win. Under 19s, under 21s, things like that, you know, they're getting used to winning that. It's normal for them. But I feel which has never really

[Gary Enicker]

happened before until this last, probably always

[James Milner]

seem to be close and things like that. Like I said, we lost in a final and we lost in a semi final. 13:12 on penalties. Yeah, 13:12. It went round twice.

[Gary Enicker]

Tell me you scored, both of you.

[James Milner]

I did, yeah. I did, yeah. You wouldn't have mentioned it. Yeah, we lost in the end, but, yeah, it was. So you're close, but no cigar. You know, typical England or whatever you want to say. And I feel like there's been a shift in that and I feel like the success of English teams is important that as well, I think being used to. Not used to winning trophies, but, you know, the experience of winning trophies and those big occasions, playing in massive games and you got players playing at Real Madrid under that pressure and in that cauldron and the pressure it takes to play at those clubs, that can only stand you in good stead for going into World Cups for sure as well. So, you know, we have a chance to win it. That's all you can ask for, and a realistic one at that. And a lot of good quality players. You need a bit of luck and you need a bit of luck with injuries and things like that.

[Gary Enicker]

But, yeah, I think so. I hope so. Please help me before I pop my clogs.

[James Milner]

Hopefully.

[Gary Enicker]

Let me take you back to the start. You, Creed talked about, you know, Terry Venables gave you your debut, you were 16 years old. And it brings me just. We've seen this weekend, haven't we? A young man score, the youngest player to score a Premier League goal. What do you think of him? He looks a bit tasty again. You don't want to build these youngsters too much. You can tell when someone's just how

[James Milner]

he carries the ball and takes it. And you hear little things about his personality. Facetiming Declan Rice and things like that.

[Gary Enicker]

The right sort of people to be FaceTiming.

[James Milner]

You know, it takes a bit of. You need a bit about you to do things like that day and you know, you know, the best players have that right sort of arrogance, especially on the field. And we played him earlier in the year and just how he received the ball, his touches, confidence, long way to go, obviously. And like I say, I hate piling pressure on people, but yeah, for sure, he looks like a special player. And, you know, he's not coming into any team either, is. He's coming into a team who's doing pretty good. He's got you.

[Gary Enicker]

You got people like Saka playing your position.

[James Milner]

Yeah. So if he's coming in there and they're impressed by him because, you know, it's normally when a young player comes up, it's how does he handle training? Does he stand out in training first and foremost? You know, has he got a chance to be doing it there at that age, at a club like that?

[Gary Enicker]

Young talent I'm going to talk about all your career, but let's take a break first. This episode is brought to you by People's Postcode Lottery. We're into the business end of the season now. Spring is when the league table starts taking shape and cup competitions reach their crescendo. Fine margins, big moments, bigger consequences.

[James Milner]

Non stop checking scores, fixtures, injuries and suspensions.

[Gary Enicker]

And that's just for fantasy football, let

[James Milner]

alone the real thing.

[Gary Enicker]

The next few months decides who goes on and wins something. And on the subject of wins, People's Postcode Lotteries, big spring win is back. You could win a share of 25.7 million pounds in their April draws.

[James Milner]

And the best bit, your postcode is your ticket. That's it. To enter, make sure you sign up before midnight on 31 March.

[Gary Enicker]

Is your door in the drawer? Sign up at postcodelottery.co.uk People's Postcode Lottery Manage lotteries on behalf of good causes. 18 plus conditions apply. Play responsibly. Not available in Northern Ireland. This episode is brought to you by. Whoops. In the modern game, of course, there are a lot more games and that feeling of being slightly off by Monday.

[James Milner]

And that's how it shows up. Not as an injury. It's just fatigue creeping in off the pitch.

[Gary Enicker]

Everyday life stacks up too. Work, travel, late nights, early starts. Whoop. Helps you see how sleep recovery and stress are impacting your overall health over time.

[James Milner]

It's like a health scout working quietly in the background.

[Gary Enicker]

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[James Milner]

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[Gary Enicker]

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[James Milner]

It's about keeping yourself steady over the long run. Consistency beats intensity every time.

[Gary Enicker]

If you want to understand your health better and how your daily habits impact you over time, head to join.Whoop.com/t RIF to get started with Whoop. This segment is brought to you by Specsaver's Best Worst Team. The series that takes the worst football team in the country and tries to turn their fortunes around on and off the pitch. This year it's Worley FC in Brentwood, who picked up just four points in the league last season. Mike is now assistant manager at Fewer Studio Lines Knights, More Cones. They won his first game in charge, but since then results have been somewhat inconsistent. In the end, it came down to fitness. So he's called someone up who doesn't let standard Slip a certain James Milner. And here is James. Is it. What's it like coaching, coaching at that level, having played 23 years in the Premier League?

[James Milner]

Yeah, it's different. My session was more about fitness. That's what makes required. So I was the one who, like, I tried to tell the boys it was his idea because obviously if you're coming in and the first thing you have them do is like a BLEEP test and stuff like that, you're not going to be the favorite coach, are you? So we had fun though and you know, at that level, I think.

[Gary Enicker]

Were they responsive, Joe?

[James Milner]

They had a good go, to be fair, the majority. A few faked a hamstring pretty early and stuff like that. I think he actually had a hammer. But a few, a few weren't quite deep and we did a shooting session, press up challenge and stuff and I think that's probably the biggest wins at that level.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah. Do you think, do you think they were quite surprised at the difference between your level of fitness and theirs?

[James Milner]

No, I think, I think they know. I think they know, you know, when they're going out and having a kebab at four at morning, night before a game, they know the prep isn't the best and they're just having fun with it really. But I think that now they can have those gains if they want them. But you know, this is about enjoying.

[Gary Enicker]

Were any of them eager though, to. To learn they had to go.

[James Milner]

Like I say, we did the press up challenge. A few, a few completed it. We did a BLEEP test and one lad did particularly well. We did some shooting. You know what, there's some, some quality in terms of the crossing and stuff they're putting. There's some really good balls and some good finishes and then you get the other end. Expect them, they surprise you that way. And then on the other spectrum they keep going over the fence and they've got to run around and get them because they've only got so many balls and stuff and the manager's going mad. But it was good fun and a

[Gary Enicker]

good bunch of when or maybe I should say if you hang your Premier League boots up. Would you fancy a game for Worley?

[James Milner]

Yeah, I think so. Go down or you think you get in the team? I don't know, I'd have to maybe, obviously on the right and if it's a blade test session, hopefully I'll be able to do that. But yeah, we'll see. And sounds like the nights out are pretty eventful, so it might be Good fun to go on one of them afterwards as well. Sounds good.

[Gary Enicker]

That's Specsaver's best worst team fitness isn't just running harder, it's staying switched on when it matters. Mike are called on James Milner to put Worley through their pace races as they prepared to take on angry Gingies Winton United. Find out if it paid off by searching Specsaver's best works team on YouTube. Welcome back to the Rest Is Football with me Garykeren James Melno's joining me in my kitchen today. James, we've talked about how long your career was and it did start Leeds. Was that the club you sported as a lady?

[James Milner]

Yeah, it was. And like you just said before about England winning a World Cup. I remember my dad throwing me around the living room when Leeds won the league title. 91, 92 and he said enjoy it. It might be the only time you ever see it. And unfortunately he's been right up to this season.

[Gary Enicker]

I played in that season. I played against them.

[James Milner]

Yeah, yeah. And you'll know Leeds is like it's a great place to play football. And so after that we got a season ticket and started, started going to the games and then ended up at the academy and Ball Boyd and things like that. So it was always my team.

[Gary Enicker]

How'd you find Terry Vernon was. Because I mean I, I'd actually forgotten that he went to Leeds. I think he leaves Middlesbrough as well

[James Milner]

at one point, didn't he?

[Gary Enicker]

So I mean he was, I, I mean I loved him but what was a young man.

[James Milner]

It was unbelievable I think because we weren't flying at the time so to have the confidence to, to believe in a 16 year old and put me in. I remember he put me in and he used to tell me to keep working on my technique because obviously you're not in the academy now so you know, do that work on the afternoon and little nuggets of advice and little things in your position and how he handled me. I remember playing a couple of games and then he, we were playing spurs away actually at White Outline and he pulled me in the day before we travel and said you haven't done anything wrong. You're not, you're not going to be playing. I just don't want to thrust you into too soon. I said fine. Went out training, someone got injured, traveled travel, wasn't on the bench, someone got injured in the warm up, ended up being on the bench getting on, assisting a goal. I did quite well. And then from that point I was in. But leaving that Management and awareness of doing that. But then. And I had that look that.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah, you got something about you. And you had the record at that point that max down was just got of scoring. Being the youngest player ever to score.

[James Milner]

Yeah. Well, I remember. I remember wasa doing it.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah.

[James Milner]

Just before. And then he came to Ellen Road and I was in the squad but I wasn't on the bench. And I remember sitting next to the. The fitness coach Steve McGregor and he scored a great goal at Ellen Road as well just after. And he could see him and he was like, you're desperate to get involved. He won bad. He wasn't bad. And he obviously just blew up. And then I got my chance and scored a couple of go that Christmas and yeah, just nicked it off him by a few days or something.

[Gary Enicker]

I think it was. I read something as well when I was looking that by the time you were 23 you'd played for 13 different managers as they were then rather than coaches. That's bonkers.

[James Milner]

Yeah. And you got to grow up quick and you learn a lot about football. I think it was. Martin o' Neill was the first time I started and finished a season with the same manager. And that was probably.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah.

[James Milner]

And that was what, six. Six years into my career. So you probably bang on.

[Gary Enicker]

And Martin's a character. I've worked with him a lot on television. Great storyteller.

[James Milner]

Yeah. I love playing for Martin. He was so good for me and gave me that confidence and pushed me into the middle of the park. And I love playing for Martin. Yeah. And you know, I think he got the hunt with me a bit when. When I left and went to Man City but hopefully he's all right with me now.

[Gary Enicker]

We'll come to Man City in a bit but I want to of pop back to Newcastle because Bobby Robson as well, another former England manager there. I mean what a man. Obviously a legend at that particular football club and English football I would say as well. Much loved. How was Bobby with you?

[James Milner]

Incredible. I mean I just felt unfortunate for him and Terry not to work with him for longer I think. So Bobby got sacked probably two or three games into that season. First couple of games but just that time with him straight away and. And even like him and Touch similar how the after training they'd take you over and you do a little thing and set it up with players in your position and you'd receive. You're gonna get the ball here and you know your options. Left foot round the corner into the front man and follow it all this and Just create the pictures and patterns that you're gonna get in the games and just knew what you needed, like little tips about crossing and things like that. And you don't get that as much now. Like when I'm watching like coaches and stuff, it's a lot about the team and things like that.

[Gary Enicker]

It's more robotic. Do you think now possibly you've. I mean, you've crossed. You've lived the last two decades playing.

[James Milner]

It's changed a lot. I feel like maybe that individual. I feel when you get to the first team, you're expected to know how to play and I suppose on with young players coming in. Yeah, you know, little technique things and little patterns and it's all obviously videos and drones in training and seeing it on videos and stuff sometimes. Yeah, exactly, yeah. Now it's like, you know, there you're like feeling it.

[Gary Enicker]

And they use drones, do they?

[James Milner]

Yeah, we've got drones up. Yeah. So then different angles and so they've got fixed cameras. Then you've got a drone. So they can see it from a different.

[Gary Enicker]

No bloody hiding place now, is there?

[James Milner]

So, yeah, and the airport's right next to our training ground as well, so they got to be careful.

[Gary Enicker]

Oh, crikey.

[James Milner]

Yeah, but yeah, yeah, they've got it all and then it's clipped and they can do a meeting straight after training of your training session. You've just done so it's great. But you know, football isn't always, you know, they can freeze frame it and say, you should have done this at the moment and it's like, well, yeah, but my touch wasn't great. I had a bubble or I've got. Got 0.3 of a second to react on this and you're freeze framing it with a spacebar and looking at the whole picture.

[Gary Enicker]

It's a lot easier that way.

[James Milner]

Yeah, exactly.

[Gary Enicker]

When it's actually happening in real time.

[James Milner]

Yeah, there's advantages and disadvantages, you know, and I'm sure you find it easier, like sat in the studio and, and watching stuff. And then afterwards you think when you're playing, you know, you've got a split second to get your shot off or you haven't even been able to glance where the goal is, you know. You know, goal scorers like yourself, you, goal never moves, does it? So.

[Gary Enicker]

Well, the goal doesn't move, but yeah, the goal.

[James Milner]

Yeah, well, some actually.

[Gary Enicker]

Well, talking of one of those, Alan Shearer who co hosts this podcast, does Micah both played with you? Of course. Spill the dirt on him, please.

[James Milner]

Which one?

[Gary Enicker]

Well, let's start with Al.

[James Milner]

Nah, I mean I'll. I'll. When I went in, you know, he was, he was a hero of mine really as well. You know like growing up and watching you know, Euro 96 and, and that was a massive tournament in England and being an England fan and going up to Newcastle and the personalities that were in that dressing room at the time and you know him and Speedo, Shay given and people like that. I remember going on pre season tour to the far east and you know, sheer amania. It was just like really people all over waiting for thank God he's not. How he dealt with that was an eye on it for me and like the first time you've been abroad and seen the hype and how he dealt with that expectation and pressure and polite to everyone and things like that, that I think that was a good lesson for me in terms of that. And then you know, he was coming tomorrow to the end of his career when I, I got up there. But you know, watching him finishing and, and doing his own pre season, that's the one I always remember. Like we were running and we used to do beach, we used to do forest runs and we used to do runs at the training ground and he

[Gary Enicker]

didn't like long runs.

[James Milner]

He didn't do him. He just trotted around pitch with the physio like terrible example, one mile an hour. And then when the balls come out, because the balls didn't come out out for the first two weeks, did there? So about a couple of weeks before first game he'd come out and start bang. Yeah, and I mean that's modification now and you see that all the time now but that was how he did it.

[Gary Enicker]

Do you think a young player get

[James Milner]

away with that way?

[Gary Enicker]

He was not a young player, he was an old.

[James Milner]

I mean I think he earned the right. I think he earned that right to be honest.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah, I was actually.

[James Milner]

I haven't got a lot on him to be fair, other than not doing preseason. But his age.

[Gary Enicker]

No, that'll do. Unfortunately I share that with you.

[James Milner]

Yeah. And when you get older we all end up doing that.

[Gary Enicker]

No, exactly. Manchester City, you. That was when it all kind of really started happening at City, wasn't it? That change you supposedly saw it through to its. Not to its complete conclusion, but you were at the start of it. Could you see things that were going to change are going to happen?

[James Milner]

Yeah, I mean for sure. I think at that point I had a chance of going to Chelsea maybe, I think. Didn't you? You had the Choice between the two. Yeah.

[Gary Enicker]

Why did you choose City?

[James Milner]

Because of what you just said. I feel like Chelsea had been successful and won trophies and man, City hadn't for a very long time. And I thought, you know, it'd be great to start that and be part of that and win trophies there. And yeah, that was the main decision really. And went there and was fortunate enough to be part of, you know, the first one, the FA cup was huge. Winning that, I think then you know what it's like when you win a trophy together and it gives you that confidence and that's the platform then for everything that comes after that. But you have to get over the line on that first one. And the semi final was a huge game against United, I think. And then scraped past Stoke in the final and got that first trophy and then after that it was away and running. But yeah, you could see what was

[Gary Enicker]

it like when you first joined, did you? Because I remember talking to Vincent Co. About this and he said they didn't even have a coffee machine or any. He said it was like. And it was. It's been absolutely made into this, I

[James Milner]

think obviously still at Carrington and they were making the best of that scenario, making it as good as they could. But obviously it wasn't like the training ground they have now and you've got 30 million pound players coming in through the door every opportunity and competition for places and then, you know, the success on the pitch grows and you get the new training ground and you see things. And they've always tried to do things obviously with the ground and the development around the stadium and that area and the training ground and you know, then by the New York City Football Club and you're involved in the launch of that and we went over and did the launch in that. So you just see it grow bit by bit and how they did things. And it was exciting and tough at the same time. Like you say, you know, every single window there's going to be going to be players coming in and they're not getting them for free, they're getting for a big chunk of money and they're going to start and you know, you're under pressure to perform.

[Gary Enicker]

Who are the players that you just love playing with that they brought in over those years?

[James Milner]

I mean, David, I think one that stands out for me, David Carlos. When I got that incredible. Carlos Tevez.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah.

[James Milner]

Sergio Aguero. I mean, there was one season, I remember him starting the season like unbelievable. I'm sure he scored 50, 60 goals that year for the State Fair. He had injuries but how he started

[Gary Enicker]

the season, he was another one that wasn't necessarily a great trainer. Like I said, awful.

[James Milner]

Yeah, awful, awful. Didn't even tie his boots, I don't think. Yeah, just strolled out like. But I can't get my head around how someone can train like that. And then on a match day, how sharp he was, like how quick he was to turn and he's finishing. It was incredible. But yeah, he was, I mean him, he was incredible. Vinnie, I mean Meeks, we had a. We had a great call there. We had a great core of, you know, heart. He was there. Yeah, Vinnie was, was brilliant captain. So organized. No surprise how he's doing as a manager. Meeks, obviously, you know, I mean we

[Gary Enicker]

do know what he's like to a degree. What was the young Michael Richards like?

[James Milner]

Lively, energetic.

[Gary Enicker]

I said the young one. Oh no, that is the same.

[James Milner]

Took a while to get back, I know that. I just used to get the ball on the wing and I did this. Mills, I'm coming and it'd be like a steam train down outside. I mean I slide him in and he used to do this cross where he crossed it and then flew himself off to the on floor for whatever. He's like a swan dive. So then what did I have to do? Obviously I trapped back and fill in for him and like two minutes later he'd trot back and get me. You all right now? Yeah, I'm good. All right, thanks. I'll go back into my position.

[Gary Enicker]

Did his hard yards for him. Yeah, yeah. I mean fullbacks are supposed to be the people that do that.

[James Milner]

Yeah, he was. When he overlapped though in the air, it was unstoppable. Yeah, I mean I played in the game, I think where he scored, I was at Villa and he scored his first goal and he swore twice in his interview. I think I was on the line, I think when edited it in. But yeah, he dropped the F bomb a couple of times. But yeah, we had great fun. Like Meeks is such a great guy and love playing with him. Like, like say he was unstoppable. If you could just fill in for his rest periods. He was, he was great.

[Gary Enicker]

A few nights out with him. Would you try and avoid that at all costs? Imagine. Yeah, I don't, I don't remember him

[James Milner]

drinking loads on a night out because I think he knew it could get a bit out of hand. But you know, I was normally the one not drinking so I could look after the boys heart. It was always great value as well in the dressing room, but on a. As well. Just kept everyone involved, didn't matter who it was. And I think that's why David Silva fit in so well as well. He. He. I remember we were in la, I think, on preseason, and he joined in with the boys. Couldn't speak a lot of English, but he just. He just sat there, maybe have a siesta. If all boys were together, have a little siesta, then they'd get involved again. Couldn't understand a lot what was going

[Gary Enicker]

on, but said he likes the beer.

[James Milner]

Yeah. And the amazing thing with him was, like, he'd chop through four guys and make a pass through the eye of a needle and make an assistant. And he'd come after the game and say to me and Heidi, did you see my tackle? I was like, what? And all he was bothered about is, like, a shoulder, a shoulder or a tackle he'd put in. And he was like, yeah, it just

[Gary Enicker]

shows you these incredibly talented, technical Spanish players, they just want to be like us.

[James Milner]

Well, they're just not people. And he just showed. He's. He's one of the guys. Yeah, he wanted to. And he was like, you see my tackle? No, I saw you absolutely running the shower below, but great. Great lad as well, but what a player. Wow. Yeah. So I was hoping Meeks was going to be here, actually, because. Yeah, yeah, it goes back a long way. So on my 17th birthday, we played Arsenal Ellen Road and I loved Henry, you know, that time. He's probably one of the best players the Premier League scene for me. He was incredible at everything. And he gave me his shirt, his yellow away shirt.

[Gary Enicker]

Oh, wow.

[James Milner]

From that game. And then at some point in the house move and stuff. I always wanted to the house. I ended up getting framed. So I've got them all framed and in moves or whatever it is, or someone's taking it, but this shirt's gone missing, so it must be five, five years ago at least. I said to me, because I was like. Because he works with him all the time, so do us a favor. Told him the story, says, would you mind getting another Thierry shirt for me? It's like, yeah, not a problem, not a problem. Still ain't got it. Messaged him millions, millions of times.

[Gary Enicker]

He's Jerry's best mate.

[James Milner]

This is what I'm saying. I think. I don't think he speaks to him. Yeah, he just.

[Gary Enicker]

They just work together. That's all it is.

[James Milner]

And he sent me voice notes. I'll send him a message saying, oh, is that shirt in the post? Over and he'll send me a voice note, guffawing down the phone like everyone's. You listen to it on train and everyone turns around and looks at you.

[Gary Enicker]

Micah, get it done.

[James Milner]

Any chance, mate?

[Gary Enicker]

I found a quote from Micah actually talking about you. He said there were times that season at the early days when things were not going well. He said James was one of the people who kept his going, going leader. Do you feel like you're a leader during your. I mean, I would say watching you.

[James Milner]

Yeah, I feel.

[Gary Enicker]

Setting an example, for sure.

[James Milner]

I feel probably the last. Yeah. Ten years or so, for sure. I feel like it myself. But there's been things said and stories told recently where I've forgotten it or didn't really realize it. When I was a bit younger, when you first got in the City and when you're at Villa and stuff like that, and I was still a young player there. So in your own head. But when you think about. I was fortunate that started at 16. By the time you're 23, you've played seven years. So if you come through at 21, you're 28, you're a senior player. I was 23 when I was a senior player, so I suppose that probably helped. And, you know, you try and set examples and things like that. I remember having to hold Mika back with a fight with Mario on one. One occasion. You know, when he goes, he's quite strong. It takes some stopping. But yeah, when you get older and you see your role and you're thinking more about team than yourself, necessarily, and. And that probably at se. I think, like I say, Vinnie was such a good example and you had Gareth Barry and people like that, like great lads and you always try and learn.

[Gary Enicker]

And did you say to G, one

[James Milner]

day I'm going to beat your record?

[Gary Enicker]

No, to be fair, he hadn't set it by then either, so.

[James Milner]

And Gaz is one of those players, like, unless you watch him and seeing him play week in, week out, I

[Gary Enicker]

don't think you're better players, never mind the amount of appearances. Who's the better? Yeah, you're too much modest. You think so?

[James Milner]

Yeah, he was. We're completely different. We're different players. But I think.

[Gary Enicker]

Can I read you a quote about you from. From which I love. This quote from Manuel Pellegrini, who was manager obviously for you at City. He said, show me another. Who does all the things that Milner does. Well, there isn't one. It's very difficult to find another Milner. An intelligent player with big balls and A massive heart.

[James Milner]

You speak Spanish? Yeah,

[Gary Enicker]

I, I did read that you. You learned Spanish.

[James Milner]

Yeah.

[Gary Enicker]

But you never. You played in Spain or anything like that? I did, so I had to. You've done it so you can teach your kids.

[James Milner]

I mean, it wasn't because of that. It was a city, really. I used to sit on a table with Hari Zabaletta and David and I've got a place in Spain and I thought it was impressive when people could speak different languages. So I got a teacher and learned and then it was good for me to speak to the Spanish guys. And every time I got a new sign in, it was great for me to practice, but also help them have another person to help settle in, really.

[Gary Enicker]

But great stuff. Obviously played. Pellegrini and Mancini went.

[James Milner]

They were probably opposites, actually, people. Yeah, completely opposite. One very explosive, emotional. The other one was a lot more calm, methodical, how he did things. Both managed to win a title. So. Yeah, I mean, you know the one obviously with the aguero. If you, if you wrote a movie plot and you said this is what's going to happen, you'd be like, nah, that's not gonna happen. It's not realistic rewriting it. Yeah.

[Gary Enicker]

Was that, was that the most euphoric feeling.

[James Milner]

Yeah. Imaginable.

[Gary Enicker]

On a football pitch.

[James Milner]

You know what it's like when you lose a. A cup finals. Bad enough and it's a one off game. To win a league title, you have to be the best. The best team always wins the league, regardless. 38 games, home and away, injuries, suspensions, ups and downs, the lot. The best team always wins it. So you think how bad is to lose a cup final? A one off game to throw away a whole season, season in a home game you should probably win and do all the work we'd done to get to that point where, you know, we're flying. Then we had a slip in January and then I think United slipped up at home in a game and we were on a bus going somewhere and Color had it on and kept saying, they've scored again. I think it was Everton.

[Gary Enicker]

I think it was Everton or something.

[James Milner]

And then we had to beat United and we beat them and then we had to win the last five or six games or something like that. And you've done all that work and get to the last worst stepping stone to fail and then you go into an injury time and to score two from being that low.

[Gary Enicker]

I mean, it was done.

[James Milner]

Yeah. Yeah, it was incredible.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah.

[James Milner]

I mean that low to that high in three minutes. Yeah. The feeling. Yeah. Indescribable. Yeah.

[Gary Enicker]

It was probably as much relief as anything else that not blowing it, wasn't it?

[James Milner]

I would.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah.

[James Milner]

100 at that point, I think like you say, yeah, we've done all this work, amazing. Come back like after the results are not then to be that close. But yeah, I would say relief was a massive part of it. But yeah, I mean that's the moments you love about football. Thank God we didn't have VAR because, you know, imagine waiting on a VAR

[Gary Enicker]

check on something you're on var. We don't very often get the chance to talk to current players about var.

[James Milner]

Yeah.

[Gary Enicker]

Is it as frustrating for you as it is for fans and people like myself who love the game forever.

[James Milner]

And if you want me to be fully honest, I absolutely have. Hate it. I hate it.

[Gary Enicker]

Everyone's with you.

[James Milner]

Well, I ask a lot of the players as well and I'd love a vote because I'd love to know how many current players if you vote fans and players who actually keep it. I think our players, I've asked very, very few. You know, look across at the linesman and is his flag up or down? Nice of golf. And you know, you think some of the amazing moments like that imagine with the.

[Gary Enicker]

Just imagine, oh, we need to look at it and you get in the whole ground.

[James Milner]

Yeah. And football's an emotional game and like if you referees a referee in the games, if like the humans, they're going to make mistakes, players make mistakes, managers make mistakes.

[Gary Enicker]

They all make mistakes.

[James Milner]

Exactly. And they're still making mistakes when you're looking at and slowing it down. So just let it happen. That's my opinion. I think it'd be a better, better game. And you watch the championship now when it doesn't have it and FA cup tied and the flow of the game and the excitement, it just, it just feels better for me. That's my opinion.

[Gary Enicker]

Liverpool, how did that come about?

[James Milner]

Out. Yeah, it was one of those where I wanted to stay at Man City. Yeah. No thought of leaving, obviously. Why would you? And you know, we talked about a new contract and you know, it didn't come. They offered income for quite a while and then when it came it was a pay cut in effect.

[Gary Enicker]

And did you. Did you feel like they weren't 100 behind?

[James Milner]

That's the feeling I got really until the very end. I mean it was just the place I was. You know, I played every position for every year they signed a play in my position and I started the season out the team and I Had to fight my way back. And then I always backed myself and played well. And October, November, I'd be back in playing again. And then it. We did the whole thing over again. So it was one of those. And I thought, well, the next transfer window comes and you get closer to the end of your contract and you think, well, maybe I should look somewhere else. And Liverpool came on. Obviously incredible football club. And it was a similar feeling to when I went to City. You know, amazing club. Not won too many trophies in recent history. We obviously pipped them to that title. The year we won it the second time with City and Liverpool were so close and it just felt, can you. If you can go to Liverpool and win a league title, you know, their first Premier League, it'd been so long since they've won a league title

[Gary Enicker]

was Jurgen Klopperpole.

[James Milner]

He wasn't there and. And spoke to me and how he saw me fitting in. Yeah, and yeah, I thought, yeah, let's. Let's go for it really. And again, it was a long way off achieving what they went on to achieve. At the point you. You come in, they've been close to an elite title. But a few years after the struggle debate and Stevie just gone.

[Gary Enicker]

That's right. So obviously the end of that season,

[James Milner]

you know what Stevie was like as a player. I think his last game that got lost quite heavily to Stoke was the last game. Of the best players that you played best. Yeah. With England. But all. All rounders. An all rounder could do everything.

[Gary Enicker]

He was.

[James Milner]

He was incredible. I think for sure.

[Gary Enicker]

Who's the best player you played with? Or against. Or against.

[James Milner]

Against. Messi.

[Gary Enicker]

Messi.

[James Milner]

Comfortably. Without a doubt. It's just different planet.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah. Didn't he not make you.

[James Milner]

Yeah. The. The new.

[Gary Enicker]

Sorry. Sorry to bring that up.

[James Milner]

No, I mean it's.

[Gary Enicker]

I mean you're not the one. Only he didn't score from.

[James Milner]

It was on the halfway line and my legs are so bowed that you could not make them on the clothes. So. But I mean one of the greatest of all time legs. Yeah.

[Gary Enicker]

What is he like to actually play against if you're up against him? Because I mean I watch him from the stands and he does stuff that is actually incomprehensible. It's impossible. It's like he's from another.

[James Milner]

He's an eye man. I mean he can dribble, you know, probably know where he's going. He wants to go on his left foot. Can't stop him. He's got three around him. He's dribbling as fast, fast with the ball, even faster with the ball than he wouldn't without. You have three men around and he still knows there's a guy over here and he slips it through to him. I mean when we played against him and especially Liverpool games we tried to make it not be his own way. You know ruffle is fair. There's a bit of game, a bit annoyed. The odd shoulder charge here and there. She can't let the best of it around my can they otherwise they'll do what they want. And that's a sign of respect for sure. But yeah, he's unbelievable player. Unbelievable. And you know then you look at the other players you had around and played against him. Javi and Iniest and all the best for getting the kick.

[Gary Enicker]

What about the best player you play with for a period of time? Because you play with some. I mean you match. You've already mentioned David Silva and you know Yaya Torre and what you played obviously with some greats at Liverpool as well. You know Mo Salah, Bobby Firmino. I mean so many great players.

[James Milner]

It's such a tough, difficult question and like you asked to do your best 11s and 5 side teams and stuff and I hate doing it because you're just going to annoy.

[Gary Enicker]

Going to leave someone out.

[James Milner]

You have to leave someone out. I did one the other week.

[Gary Enicker]

Really upset.

[James Milner]

He's not going to know me. M is there for team bonding and team spirit. Yeah, for sure.

[Gary Enicker]

So go for different reason. You don't have to name one but

[James Milner]

just I mean you go through the start of my career, you're looking at Alan Shearer. I mean obviously I didn't play with him in his prime, 260 goals. Incredible player. He, he had to be up there.

[Gary Enicker]

I wish I hadn't asked that question.

[James Milner]

Yeah, sorry. And then you know you go on and. And David Silvas, Yuri Gueros, Carlos Tevez and then you know Mo Sadio, Bobby like some forward line. That's not bad like and the work they did for each other. And then England as well, you know like lamps. Lamps as well. I mean the marbles he scored. Stevie Waza.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah.

[James Milner]

Harry Kane. Delivering. I'd be on the right with him, with him and just watch him do it.

[Gary Enicker]

He could cross the ball.

[James Milner]

Oh I know absolutely. You just scored a few goals at him point.

[Gary Enicker]

He was actually, you know when they ask you that question. Well you don't yet because it's not happened to you because you've been playing for so long. Eventually someone will ask you the question once you finish playing James, they'll say, you know, of all the players now, who would you want to play with? And for me it was always, for a long time was, Was always Beckham because you talk about English players, otherwise it'd be messy, obviously. But it was always Beckham because of the. That, that delivery. Oh, the delivery was, was, was spot on.

[James Milner]

Yeah.

[Gary Enicker]

Jurgen clock like.

[James Milner]

However you think he is, he is. And I think that's the biggest compliment you can give.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah.

[James Milner]

I think, you know, like some people have one face in front of the media and one face for. He does this and that. Does he? What you see is what you get. What you see is what you got. Big heart. Amazing guy off the field. Like the support he's done for my foundation over the years and coming to the events and bidding on things and stuff like that as a manager. Intensity, knowing when to say the right thing, when to be. But training was good. Made you want to run through a brick wall. Yeah. Just as an all round package as a manager. And that, that, you know, that aura about him and that wariness. Like we talked about Fabio before where he was like, better be a bit careful here. But then obviously you can have a joke. And he's laughing and that soft side as well. So. So, yeah, the incredible manager.

[Gary Enicker]

Obviously wonder. He said he was blessed to have you. Blessed to have Milner, but did. I think there's also a halftime fallout where he.

[James Milner]

Yeah.

[Gary Enicker]

Told you to shut up.

[James Milner]

Yeah. There was for sure times that he wouldn't have thought he was blessed to have me. Really? Yeah. 100. But yeah.

[Gary Enicker]

Are you. You kind of player that will perhaps have a go back at a manager occasionally?

[James Milner]

I won't say go back. I think like that, that instance we're talking about, he was saying something and I was saying the reason why it happened or saying something else and he said it and I said it again. And we had a big thing like this in the middle of changing, slammed his hand down where you shut the up and that was the end of that one. Did you?

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah, immediately.

[James Milner]

And like the relationship we had, I would. I'd always be honest. I'd always be honest and say things and I knew he'd always know whatever I said was for the best of the team. You know, sometimes he'd take it on board and he'd never say anything at the time. But then over the next weeks or something you say, oh, maybe he's taken out another time. You know, but he was manager, he was the leader. And I've always tried to be Honest with the managers and. And say what I think and they know from me they're going to get honesty, but they'll get on the pitch as well and you know, they make the decisions and I'll give them everything I've got. So we tried to deliver his messages within the dressing room and make sure that he didn't have any grief from the dressing room and. And things were looked after and that. So he didn't have people knocking on his door and having to worry about outside. It's hard enough and we had a great group of players and when we had signings come in, they had to fit in because everyone was doing the right things and behaving the right way. So, you know you'd be completely different if you didn't. So that was important.

[Gary Enicker]

I think you obviously lived the rivalry, didn't you, between that incredible period of years where it was Liverpool and City and obviously City was your previous club and eventually that first title came for Liverpool for 30 years. That must have been special. It was Covid though, wasn't it? And it was all a bit weird, that period.

[James Milner]

Yeah, that was the disappointing thing I think obviously that the COVID when we lifted it. But yeah, I think the whole journey to that point in terms of the battles we had with City in the Champions League and I mean you'd have

[Gary Enicker]

won four times in any other era, probably 100%.

[James Milner]

I mean, the year we won the Champions League league, we lost the league on 97 points.

[Gary Enicker]

It's mad, isn't it?

[James Milner]

I mean, 30 wins, seven draws and one defeat and you don't get anything for it. And, and that I believe if we hadn't won the Champions League.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah.

[James Milner]

That year, I think it's pretty hard for that team to come back, to recover and go again with nothing for it to keep that intensity. I really believe if we hadn't done that. And that then goes to the Barcelona again, which again is that twist, which looked really unlikely. So if you don't turn that. Turn that round. Yeah. And then you're not in the Champions League.

[Gary Enicker]

Extraordinary evening. I was at that game, covering it.

[James Milner]

I think that's my favorite of the game I've been involved in. I think like you say, the quality of team, they had experience, atmosphere, the booze before they started. When Suarez, who's a Liverpool legend, was on the kickoff and they were whistled straight away and said, you're not. You're not one of ours tonight, mate. And they sort of set up to. We got a Corner, I think 30, 40 seconds in the raw for a corner was. And you get worn and you just pick it bit by bit and there's no panic.

[Gary Enicker]

The Trent Corner.

[James Milner]

Incredible. I mean incredible.

[Gary Enicker]

That was a moment as well. I mean I have to say I was. I was hiding my emotions because I was a former Barcelona. I look Messi and all that. I was a bit gutted but. But it was exhilarating night to. To watch as well.

[James Milner]

Let alone unbelievable to be. Yeah. To be part of it and then standing in front of. And with players missing. So we had obviously Mo was out and a few others.

[Gary Enicker]

I mean no one. No one One gave you a chance.

[James Milner]

And we'd had a tough game on the side against Newcastle the night before. Vinnie company had sliced one in the top corner and I've seen him shoot millions of times in training and put it in the bushes and over the fence and get fined for point out over the.

[Gary Enicker]

Is that the goal against Leicester?

[James Milner]

Yeah, was. It was long range. I flicked it on with about 10 minutes left and sliced it in the top corner. So that means. It's unlikely. I'm always going to say that Vinny hours and. Yeah. And so that obviously with reeling off that. And then you go into that Barcelona game. So I feel like you look at that chain of events then you turn that around. 97 point win on the weekend. Don't get the lead title in 97 points and then go and win the.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah.

[James Milner]

Champions League. And then again obviously the next year was it 99 points to. To win it. Yeah. And then another year we have 92.

[Gary Enicker]

They're mad numbers aren't if you look at most. I mean. I mean they're not going to get anywhere near that this season.

[James Milner]

No. I mean the Arsenal Invincibles that have been third one.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah. Yeah.

[James Milner]

I think they had 89 points.

[Gary Enicker]

So that's true.

[James Milner]

I mean obviously it won't work like that because he did of course playing against. But like for context and joking like it's. I think we had over 90 points3.3 times and finished second.

[Gary Enicker]

It's really, really mad. It's not really been firing this season. It brings me to the question which is obviously difficult for you because I know. I know you were very close. Close to Diogo Jota and they lost him at the start of the season. I think it's definitely had some kind of effect and it clearly had an effect on you. You adopted his number on the back. Back of your shirt. How close were you?

[James Milner]

Yeah, pretty close. I think. You know it's like when you have teammates and that team spirit in the amount of time you spend together. And he was one of us straight away, always sat on our table when you had little tables at dinner and then before night, before games. And there's Robbo and myself and Jots and Hendo and. And the boys. And he was such a great guy, you know, like, bought into English football and English culture and could have a joke and boy, could we argue. Did we argue and joke and always, like having to mess around and arguments at dinner tables and in the. I mean, we were both so stubborn. So many. So many fun times, winding each other up and used to work with him in training when you're in twos and stuff and yeah, I mean, it's devastating. You can't point to words. You can't point to words.

[Gary Enicker]

And life is fragile. So fragile, isn't it?

[James Milner]

As a player, as a guy. So love. Everyone in the dressing room, one of those guys, you know, like, who can sit with anyone and get on and have a laugh with him and it's just skill that, you know you're going to be compatible with some people more than others, but for him, everyone. And yeah, I mean, and a very good football footballer. So underrated. And when I moved to Brighton and Adam Webster used to sit next to me on the bus and the amount of times he got bored, I was like, you don't realize how good this is. He was literally my favorite player to watch as a fan watching football. So clever. Like how he used his body. Even when he wasn't receiving the ball, he'd block someone so the next guy had time on the ball, body positions, rolls, touches, finishes. He was so clever and I used to say all the time, he's so good. Yeah. Millie, you told me last week, he told me, like, I just love watching him and, you know, the impact that's probably out on the football club and the people. I think when you go through grief as an individual, you never know when it's going to hit you and what effect it'll have. When you've got a full football team and football club going through that.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah.

[James Milner]

And the reminder every time you go to training ground, Every time it's 20 minutes at Anfield, it's. It's gone off. An effect.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah. Have an effect. Bring on to where you are now. Brighton. You enjoyed it there?

[James Milner]

Yeah, yeah, I have. I have. Again, something that you wanted to. A project to be part of and you see the journey it's been on over the last however long. I mean, I remember playing against Brighton in League One when I went on loan to Swindon. So the journey they've been on since then and being involved in their first ever season in Europe and working under two managers who I've learned a lot from and being part of that and a fantastic group of players. I think like there's a great senior group there, you know, Wellbs is. I take the pressure off him with my age, but he's no spring chicken. But how he's playing in the goals he's banging. In absolutely incredible example, Jason Steele was

[Gary Enicker]

you pushing Bradford, England and World cup as a backup. Kane, because there's no. I mean, Ollie Watkins obviously had things a little bit more difficult this season.

[James Milner]

He's scoring goals, he's work rate for the. His knowledge of the game, his attitude, how he is as a guy around the camp. You know, you wouldn't say he shouldn't be in there for sure.

[Gary Enicker]

You'd endorse him.

[James Milner]

100.

[Gary Enicker]

Yeah.

[James Milner]

100, yeah. I'm glad I don't have to make the decision of who's going for sure. But he definitely would be an asset if he was there.

[Gary Enicker]

You had what, 900 club appearances? A thousand club appearances, including you. First player to play 23 Premier League seasons. What's next?

[James Milner]

At this moment in time, I think I'm just taking it game by game.

[Gary Enicker]

You're not going to say taking one game at a time, are you?

[James Milner]

You're not going to throw that one out there this morning. Time. Because things happen so quickly and change so quickly. It's getting to the end of the season.

[Gary Enicker]

Are you not sure? Another season or.

[James Milner]

Yeah, that's the thing. I'm not sure.

[Gary Enicker]

Would you drop down?

[James Milner]

I don't think so. No, I don't think so. I think it'd have to be something very exciting for you to do. Do that. And you never know. That's why. That's why it's tough to answer because you don't know what options you might have, what conversations.

[Gary Enicker]

It's a bit unfair to ask you that anyway, so. But what about beyond that? What do you think of your career in the media? You speak very well. You're obviously clearly intelligent, but you've also played in all these different positions. You've played with so many great managers. Would you fancy going into to the mad world of management?

[James Milner]

There's times, I think. Yeah. Yeah. And there's times when you see managers get sacked six weeks after signing a new contract and getting manager of the month and they get sacked. Like big payday though. Yeah, true. Yeah. Yes. Then. No I think it's so difficult, isn't it? It's such a difficult job. But like you say, I feel fortunate. The players I play with, the managers I work with, it's a challenge. I like a challenge.

[Gary Enicker]

Sounds like yes to me.

[James Milner]

But it has to be the right club, it has to be the right manager, it has to. The right owner. I mean, it has to be.

[Gary Enicker]

Have you done badges at all?

[James Milner]

I've done UEFA B and A. Ah, yeah. So I've done those two. And pros, obviously you need. But it's a bit harder to get while you're playing. And I mean. Yeah, I mean, Jurgen always told me to have a break once you've finished. Have a break. I'm saying. I think, I think that's wise.

[Gary Enicker]

You've got plenty of time to be a manager and a coach. You probably need a year out or.

[James Milner]

Yeah, I think, and I presume when you finish that you'll enjoy your holidays. I'm glad I'm not back at pre preseason. And then that first Saturday I'll hit hit when the league starts. And I think you'll have that feeling and it's. You don't know how you feel, you don't know how you're going to feel going forward.

[Gary Enicker]

And I feel like some players really miss it.

[James Milner]

Some players 100%. And the intensity, I think I've put in for that amount of time. I think Jurgen's advice of having a recharge is. And I feel at that point you'll know. Yeah, I'd really like to go into coaching or, you know, there's other avenues. Of course.

[Gary Enicker]

Of course. Well, whatever you do, James, wish you all the best.

[James Milner]

Very best.

[Gary Enicker]

Been absolute delight talking to you.

[James Milner]

Thank you. Appreciate it.

[Gary Enicker]

Thank you.

[James Milner]

Cheers. Goodbye.

[Gary Enicker]

From me. Short Dramas Infinitos Paraver Cuando quieras rapidos Faciles de segiri Addictivos Descartes.

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