← The Rest Is Politics: US
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- [00:07]
Katty Kay
Welcome to the rest is politics. Us with me, Catty Kay in Washington
- [00:11]
Gav
D.C. catty, good morning. I'm still here in the Cayman Islands getting ready for snow, unfortunately.
- [00:18]
Katty Kay
Yeah, you don't look like you're in a jail cell somewhere in the uk. So I guess that's an upgrade.
- [00:25]
Gav
No, no, not. Thank God, not that. But I mean, that is history breaking. So tell us what's going on this morning. I mean, I was shocked to, but go ahead.
- [00:32]
Katty Kay
Yeah. Not since 1647 has a member of the British royal family been arrested. That was Charles I, who ended up losing his head a couple of years later. That's unlikely to happen this time around. However, we are going to be talking about the arrest of former Prince Andrew over suspicions of misconduct in public office, all relating from the release of the Epstein files. We're going to talk about that, but we're really going to talk about that in the context of American politics and what by comparison is or isn't happening over here on this side of the Atlantic in terms of accountability. And then we are going to look at how the Trump administration has sort of fired the gun on the starting block for the midterm elections and has shifted into battle mode with a big meeting with members of the Cabinet and Republicans, trying to reassure Republicans that they really are focused on those messages of affordability. And Donald Trump is going to be straight on message and super disciplined and is going to campaign for Republicans. No, I'm just joking. They were anyway, talking with Republicans and trying to reassure them the White House, if not the President, is going to stay on message when it comes to the midterm elections. Let's start, Anthony, with this news that I woke up to here on the east coast, that Andrew, formerly Prince Andrew, has been arrested on suspicions of misconduct in public office. Searches are being carried out at his address at his two homes in the uk. The police raid, of course, follows the release of all of those emails from the doj. This has captivated attention on television channels here in America. I know because my phone is now ringing off the hook asking me if I'll go on and be a royal correspondent. I always try and pretend I'm not say to them, I'm not a royal correspondent, I know more about American politics. But there we go. I'll be talking about Andrew for the rest of today. But what I thought was interesting and it highlights Anthony for me is this, again, this kind of extraordinary discrepancy between what's happening in the UK and even in Norway, where you've had three people who are either under investigation or have had a cloud put over them or have had to leave their jobs. And the uk, where you've had three government officials impacted by this, you've had Andrew, of course, now arrested over the Epstein files and what's happening here in the US And I think it was particularly brought into relief this week because you had Les Wexner, who we spoke about when we did that little series on Epstein, who was really the sort of guy who made Jeffrey Epstein, who helped him with his finances, who bankrolled him at the beginning. Les Wexner was deposed by the House of Representatives, and none of the members of the Republican caucus on that committee bothered even to turn up for the deposition. All of the Democrats flew to Ohio to depose Les Wexner, who's now in his mid-80s. And they came out saying they were appalled, but particularly they were appalled by the fact that no Republicans showed up. And it's like here, there is accountability in the private sector, but if you are a Republican, you're effectively, it looks like being protected at the moment. That's what it looked like from the Ohio depositions. And that contrasts so much with the uk Whereas the King said today, the rule of the law is the rule of law. It doesn't matter whether you are a prince or a former prince or an ordinary civilian, the law still applies.
- [03:53]
Gav
Let me just ask a few questions, because I feel like when I read the case they're suggesting in his official capacity, he shared confidential information with Jeff Epstein. Governmental information when he was a trade
- [04:08]
Katty Kay
representative for the UK government.
- [04:10]
Gav
Exactly. When he's a trade representative. So in the United States, the pushback would be. Well, the principal co conspirator, Ghislaine Maxwell, is in jail. The principal where the allegations were made, Jeff Epstein is dead. And so the other stuff being in the flight log, having an email with him, not criminal. And then we'll talk a little bit about the 3 million documents that haven't been divulged and all the things that haven't been on redacted. But I guess my question to you, Katty, is they have him right in the gun sights. And tell us a little bit about the United Kingdom, the rule of law, the subordination of everybody, including the royal family, to that law. And how do you think that differs now in the age of Donald Trump?
- [04:57]
Katty Kay
Look, that's a great question, and actually I was asked about that on television this morning. We have to be very careful because obviously the rules in the UK and the rules in the US are very different when it comes to even reporting on cases like this. So these are all allegations. Nothing is proven. Andrew is innocent until found guilty. But the difference, it seems to me that is particularly stark. Well, there are two differences because somebody made the point to me a little bit what you've just said, that actually the co conspirators with Jeffrey Epstein either dead or in prison. And anyway, there are no senior government officials who have been implicated in the Epstein scandal in the US in the way that they were in the UK where you've had Peter Mandelson, the former British Ambassador to America, also under investigation. And the difference here in the US Is that it's private citizens, whether they're in business and whether they're in academia who have been implicated. But we haven't had government figures giving him documents that they shouldn't have been giving him in order to get favors from him. I don't know what that says about the two systems and whether there were Brits who wanted money more or something more or girls more from Epstein than there were in the U.S. but actually, I'm not sure that's quite true because if you look at it, I mean, you have got the Clintons implicated and being deposed by Congress. You've got Howard Lutnick, who is implicated not in the sense anyone has said that he did anything criminal, but he's now a senior government official who has lied about his relationship with Jeffrey Epstein. And obviously Donald Trump, who I spoke to a member of the Oversight Committee, a Democrat on the Oversight Committee this morning, who said to me that he'd reviewed the unredacted files, Suhas Subramanian, who's a Democrat from Virginia who's seen the files, and he said Donald Trump is all over those files. We don't know whether he has done anything criminal yet, but he is all over those files on the plane, at the parties. So it's not that there are people perhaps who should be facing more justice in the US who aren't facing justice. It's just I think we haven't got there yet. We haven't got the kind of full fallout of the files yet. I do think there is a difference in what this says about the justice system with the king very clearly saying, look, no one is above the law. And Republicans and Donald Trump seeming to protect Howard Lutnick and not even bothering to turn up to the deposition of Les Wexner.
- [07:30]
Gav
Yeah, I mean, listen. I mean, they've got the hammer down from Donald Trump. They control the House and the Senate. You're not going to prosecute anybody. Todd Blanch said we're not going to prosecute anybody. And then now the goal is to make sure that there's no smoking guns in any of the files, either redacted or unredacted.
- [07:48]
Katty Kay
And so far we haven't had the smoking guns. Right. I mean, we should be clear about that at the moment.
- [07:53]
Gav
There are allegations. And again, I'm bolding and highlighting allegations. Ted Lieu has made allegations. You and I have talked about this off the air that Trump was raping children. Now, again, I don't know if this is true or not, but he's suggesting that it's in the document. We'll have to see if that unfolds.
- [08:11]
Katty Kay
I did ask Congressman Subramaniam directly about that because he's seen the files and he said he has not seen any evidence of that. And he's a Democrat.
- [08:21]
Gav
You have another thing going on and this is important for UK listeners, people outside the United States. There was a non prosecution agreement that was rendered in 2008 by Alex Acosta, who was the U.S. attorney in Florida that negotiated and criminally prosecuted Epstein. And in the case, there were co conspirators that came to him with evidence related to Epstein and he sort of signed an omnibus to protect unnamed co conspirators. So there's a lot of people taking cover related to that as well. And remember Acosta, we heard in the news reports, he subsequently denied it, but Acosta was told, he said, to go lenient on Epstein because there was some intelligence related matters associated with him. And you know, it's the craziest story about Epstein. He does this stuff. He pleads to a minor situation, he goes to jail for a very limited period of time. He comes out, he tells the New York community that he was completely exonerated in BS case, which is probably why all these people continued to cling to him. And then he continues his nefarious behavior. So it's an interesting situation that we're all in because we all know there's stench everywhere. But now are you going to be able to take the criminal procedure processes in the United States and are you going to be able to use them to put people in jail? And I think the short answer to that is no. Katty and I have said this to you. For six months, you and I have been talking about this. You and I did a special on Jeff Epstein. I said with Donald Trump in the position that he's in, nothing is going to happen. Now the big irony of all this is When Joe Biden was in the position that Donald Trump was in, nothing happened. Caddy. So try to, if you can, square that for me, why we're enraged now. But when Biden had the files, there was no enragement.
- [10:27]
Katty Kay
I think that comes from the fact that this started as largely a MAGA issue, right? It was MAGA pushing for the release of the files and Donald Trump adding his voice to that push for the release of the files when he was out of office. So there was not a big call from Democrats, because I actually think that you're right. This is so partisan. And Democrats were probably worried about what this would say about Bill Clinton. And so they didn't particularly push for the release of files. The voices pushing for the release of the files during Joe Biden's presidency were coming overwhelmingly from the right. And then Donald Trump gets into office and decides, actually, you know what? I don't want to release these files. And so the MAGA base keeps on pushing. But there is an element, I think what you're saying is so true, of what it has exposed, and you said this a few weeks ago, was that the damage of the Epstein issue is what Jon Ossoff in Georgia called for, which is the labeling of this as the Epstein class. The idea that there is a group of powerful people who will protect other powerful people. And at the moment, the spotlight is on Republicans because it's Republicans who are in office, it's a Republican who is in the White House, and it's Republicans who are being seen to protect other powerful Republicans who might get caught off in the Epstein file. So, for example, that hearing I was talking about, that happened this week with Les Wexner, who was the sort of guy who kind of got Jeffrey Epstein started, he helped finance him as members of Congress, said, you wouldn't have Jeffrey Epstein without Les Wexner. Last October, les Wexner donated $250,000 to the Republican National Committee. A couple of weeks before, Republican Ohio Senator John Husted voted to block the release of the files. Guess what happens? Les Wexner donates $116,000 to his Senate campaign. So you've got senior Republicans taking money from a guy who is potentially very implicated with Jeffrey Epstein, even though now he says, oh, well, actually, I was just conned and I was naive, but they're taking money from Les Wexner. Of course they're not going to try and do the maximum now to get this guy held accountable or to push harder or to get his name unredacted in the files. Or to see if there is any criminality. They've just taken $116,000 from him or $250,000 from him. So you're right. This started. I mean, this started under Biden, but it did start as a Magritch. And one thing I was wondering today was, and I want to get your take on this now that it's become a sort of Democratic issue and you've got Democrats flying to Ohio to depose Les Wexner, and it's coding in this weird, cultural, tribal world that we live in, it's coding as a Democrat issue. Does that mean MAGA kind of drops it or do they keep their foot on the pedal?
- [13:33]
Gav
You see, I think it's priced in for maga. So I think when he said that Epstein was a great guy and he liked women, some of them on the younger side and all this sort of stuff, maga's like, no problem. That's Donald Trump. He's our guy. And that's fine. But I'm just wondering out loud if I'm Donald Trump, the former prince has information related to me, and if he goes on trial and there is testimony and there is evidence that has to get forced into the the domain. I don't think the United States and the Congress and the FBI are the only people in the world that have the Epstein files. I'm just not naive enough to believe that. And so how do we know that these files don't go on the public record in a UK court? And some of that is, like, really damaging to President Trump. The other thing he's doing, which I would tell him to stop doing, is he's going after Mandelson. You see all these attacks on former Ambassador Mandelson. I'd be like, hey, you know, you're trying to score points against Starmer in labor and you're trying to help your buddy Nigel Farage. I get that. But you're keeping the drama of Epstein in everybody's crosshairs, if you will. Caddy. And then, you know, what about Ghislaine Maxwell? What about all of the things that are going on in that dynamic? Okay, she's in a low security prison now. She's literally out there saying, I've got goods that are going to exonerate Donald Trump. That is, please pardon me. I don't know, maybe his advisors aren't thinking this thing through, or there's something going wrong in the equation where this could blow back on Trump. And again, three, four, five, Republicans get a spine, then he's in Trouble. You see what I mean, Marjorie? Taylor Greene left, and Massie's the only one that's standing up to him. But you get three or four of them, then he's in trouble.
- [15:23]
Katty Kay
You can't imagine what kind of security Massie now has to have to withstand all the threats he must be getting from Trump supporters, which he has, by the way, spoken about. One of the things that's happened here is that the accountability has been much more in the private sector than it has been around any government officials or elected officials or even some of the top people that were with Epstein. So you have had people. You've had the chairman of Paul Weiss, Brad Karp has stepped down. You've had Larry Summers, of course, step down from his positions. This just today, the news came that Bill Gates has pulled out of a keynote speech at an AI summit in India because of all the Epstein stuff. Thomas Pritzker has retired as the head of Hyatt Hotels. So you've had government accountability, but because none of those people are being deposed in a court of law, they're not spilling any beans. They're just quitting. Right. That keeps them quiet. So I guess they don't present much of a threat to Donald Trump unless they chose to came out and say something.
- [16:29]
Gav
Could I throw, like, a wild card in there? Okay. Because I'm now acting as Ghislaine Maxwell's defense attorney.
- [16:37]
Katty Kay
Oh, golly, poor you.
- [16:38]
Gav
She has a First Amendment right to free speech. And so I'm now going to play former Prince Andrew's defense attorney and Ghislaine Maxwell. Hello. Hey. We would like Ghislaine to testify here in Great Britain. We're going to do it over Zoom, and we're going to get her to swear on the Bible that it's nothing but the truth. Oh, that's wonderful. Let me call Todd. Blanche. Hey, Toddy, how are you? Ghislaine is going to testify by Zoom in the British court. So in other words, if I am the defense attorney for Ghislaine Maxwell, I'm going to put pressure on Blanche and the DOJ to get my client pardoned. And so then my client can say, plead the Fifth, or say, hey, I'm not available for this testimony, but she has a First Amendment right to provide testimony in that court case, either for or against Andrew. So, Gav, what's your reaction to that? Just throwing that out there. I mean, this is stuff that they've gotta be thinking about that they're probably not thinking about right now.
- [17:43]
Katty Kay
Yeah, I think they would Rather, Ghislaine Maxwell not say very much. That's why they moved her from her high security prison that she was in to what's known as the prison summer camp down in Texas after Todd Blanche had been down there to talk to her. So I think it is an element of buying her silence and her cooperation. But one question you said, it's baked in about Donald Trump, and I think you're right. And a lot of people think, oh, well, he was the Access Hollywood tape. We know what Donald Trump is. But I wonder if it's even more than that, that in 2024, he kind of ran as a sort of backlash against accountability, right around gender or race. He ran against the whole Me Too, Black Lives Matter movement. And a kind of accountability almost became woke. It's all kind of for wusses. So I wonder whether actually Donald Trump's supporters in the same way that he probably will never hold his supporters accountable, and he released all of the January 6th people who were in prison who had had the riot up on Capitol Hill. They don't really want him or expect him to be held accountable. They don't need him to be held accountable. Even if it came out, even if what Congressman Subramanian is looking for, to see if there is a smoking gun around Donald Trump, that some kind of crime was committed, maybe Donald Trump supporters never want him to be held accountable. Maybe they don't really want this stuff to come out either.
- [19:14]
Gav
Yeah, of course they don't. I mean, they want it to go away. That's why, you know, even though they
- [19:19]
Katty Kay
were the ones that pushed for it, even they were the ones that were pushing for it for so long.
- [19:22]
Gav
That's what Trump does to you. When you and I first met, I said, donald Trump moves the goalposts on everybody. It's a loyalty test. It's forever a loyalty test. Listen to me. I am such a narcissist caddy. I'm gonna say one thing, and I want your allegiance to it. You have to. Yeah, okay. Now I'm going to say a different thing totally juxtaposed to that thing. But I still need your allegiance, Cad. Oh, no, no. Now I'm going to move it again. Okay, so he's always moving the goalpost on supporters, family members, friends, cabinet members. That's what he does. Because he needs to prove to everybody, or at least in his own febrile mind, that he's numero uno and that he can do anything and he can get away with anything. And that's what's going on here. But I will say this because I think this is tied into the second part of this conversation because the Congress is now saying, wow, this is really bad for us. We're going to likely contain this damage. But you're out there saying you're going to invade Greenland, you're now moving ships to Iran. You're going to really hurt us. Okay, we'll leave it there. On that topic, Addie, we're going to go to a break now. When we come back, we'll talk about the White House deputies heading up to the Capitol to talk to the congressional leaders and their campaign strategists on the midterm elections.
- [20:47]
Dominic Sambrook
Hello, everybody, and welcome to the Book Club, a new podcast from Goal Hanger, hosted by me, Dominic Sambrook and me, Tabitha Syrett.
- [20:55]
Tabitha Syrett
As some of you may know, I've been Dominic producer on the Rest Is History, and we even did a miniseries last year about all things books.
- [21:03]
Dominic Sambrook
And since we enjoyed that so much, we have decided to roll it out as its own show. So it'll be coming out every Tuesday. We'll be doing a different book each time and digging into all the stories behind them.
- [21:15]
Tabitha Syrett
And we are going to be talking about the historical contexts behind some of the greatest and most famous books of all time. We're going to be digging into the remarkable people behind them, the unexpected stories behind the stories, and also unraveling the plot of each book a bit and delving into the depths of the story.
- [21:33]
Dominic Sambrook
Now, you don't have to have read the books to listen to the show, but we hope that by the end of each episode you will be able to pretend to people that you've read them. That is the key thing. And either way, whether you read them or not, we hope that you'll learn lots of fascinating facts, you'll do lots of great stories, and maybe Tabby, the old odd laugh.
- [21:50]
Tabitha Syrett
We will be looking at thrilling gothic bodice rippers like Wuthering Heights and Frankenstein, as well as iconic stories like the Great Gatsby or Little Women and then also some more modern stuff. So Game of Thrones, normal people, the Hunger Games, Hamnet, all manner of exciting stories.
- [22:09]
Dominic Sambrook
So please join us on our journey into all things books. Wherever you get your podcasts, just search for the Book Club every Tuesday and hopefully we will see you there.
- [22:30]
Gav
Welcome back to the Rest IS Politics us. Katty, tell us about this strategy meeting that took place.
- [22:36]
Katty Kay
The White House this week has been trying to reassure members of Congress, Republican members of Congress, that, yes, they get the message. They do actually need to help them try and win in the midterms and that they have a plan for how they're going to do that. And it was interesting. They held the White House's top political team with a whole bunch of Cabinet members. Scott Bessant was there. Howard Lutnick was there. Kennedy was there. Sean Duffy, the Transport Secretary, was there. Susie Wiles was there. Trump's pollster, Tony Fabrizio was there. His political advisor, James Blair, was there. And a whole bunch of members of Congress, Republican members of Congress, had this meeting on Capitol Hill at the Capitol Hill Club. I think they wanted this to leak out because they didn't do it in a very private room, the Capitol Hill Club. Everyone knows what's going on there. And it was the White House's bid, I think, to reassure Republican members of Congress that, yes, we are focused on your issues. We understand that your constituents are very focused on affordability, prices, the economy. They want us to keep coming back to those issues. They want us to be driven by the data. We just happen to have a president. I'm sorry, guys. We have to have a president who is bored of the issue of affordability. And he's going to talk about Iran or Greenland or anything else apart from the issues that your constituents are particularly interested in. I thought it was interesting that the White House even felt they had to have that meeting that I suspect you're right. Members of Congress are starting. Republican members of Congress are feeling a little angsty, right? They can see the polls, they can see the unpopularity of the president. And it used to be that all politics is local. Now all politics is national. And they need to know from the White House that the White House has a plan. I'm just not sure that whatever Susie Wiles presents to them as a plan or James Blair earnestly presents to them as a plan, with lots of polls from Tony Fabrizio, Donald Trump's not very manageable. Is he going to stay on message? Is he going to spend the next 10 months campaigning on the issue of affordability and prices? That didn't last very long, did it? My memory was that we were meant to be doing that, but it didn't seem to have lasted very long. More fun to take Greenland.
- [24:47]
Gav
There's a couple things here, though. And so the first one is he could be a political liability going in, in the midterms. His people, his staff are saying, and I'm using their words, he's an ungovernable campaign asset. Right? That's what his staff is saying. And the Congress knows that. And so I guess what would have to happen caddy for them to go from protection mode on him to attack mode on him. Remember, he is a waning, he's a waning political asset. So what would have to happen? Go ahead, give me your analysis.
- [25:28]
Katty Kay
I think the sky would have to fall on our heads at this point. I mean, we have been waiting for over a decade now to see Republicans find a reason to decide that they're going to stand up to Donald Trump. And apart from Thomas Massie who mentioned earlier, and the odd Republican senator, they just don't seem to do it. I had a really good conversation with a Republican strategist who's pretty plugged in, has spent a lot of time with Trump and is pretty plugged into MAGA world. And what he said is that until this primary season, remember that all of these members of Congress are in the primaries before they get to run in the general election in November. And while they're in the primary season, they're not going to say anything about Donald Trump. They're going to get themselves locked in step with Donald Trump because what are they, they're terrified of Donald Trump weighing in on their primary and them not even getting a chance to run. So you're not going to hear any, any of them distance themselves from Donald Trump at least until June when the primary season is over. But I wonder even then, the mystery of, the kind of enduring mystery of this president ever since he kind of won the nomination back in 2016 and won the election back in 2016, has been the way that he controls his party. I don't, yes, some of them peel away. We've seen some of them peeling away over Epstein. We saw some of them peel away over Greenland. But I don't see a big rush for the exits, do you?
- [27:04]
Gav
I don't. But let me tell you the problems and then I'll make a prediction on this program. So number one, Trump has a $300 million war chest for these congressional midterms. He's got 437 million overall that he's raised for different issues, America first, et cetera. So he's done something very interesting that future presidents will do. They will continue to fundraise in their lame duck years. Obama didn't do it and George W. Bush didn't do it, but Trump did it. And it's an interesting thing. You have to give him credit for that. Cuz he has some political power because of the money. Right. But here's the thing. They're gaslighting people, I'm going to go to Marjorie Taylor Greene who said, and I'm going to quote from her. She said, if you had put America first from the start instead of your rich donor class and foreign policy, you wouldn't have to strategize on how to gaslight Americans. Katty K. And all of a sudden, she's the truth teller. Okay. And she is basically their most vocal, what I would describe as MAGA loyalist. Okay. So it's interesting that her and Massie see themselves as MAGA loyalists, which is different from being a Trump loyalist. Right. But I just want to make this point to you. I think they're going to get slayed in the midterms, and I think they're going to turn on him after a catastrophic midterm loss. Moreover, if there's an economic collapse which is undeniable and attributable to the president's policies, they're also going to turn on him. But they're not going to turn on him before the midterms.
- [28:38]
Katty Kay
You think they would turn on him if there's a big midterm loss. And I guess you're putting that at like 30 to 50 seats, right. That the Republicans lose a big, a big loss. They turn on Donald Trump because they feel he's a lame duck. And because whoever is going to take over from Donald Trump, let's say it's J.D. vance, they know that that person doesn't have the same kind of fear factor that Trump seems to have over his party, that those members of Congress aren't turning on him because they're afraid of him. And I guess that what, they wouldn't be afraid of whoever was Trump's successor?
- [29:13]
Gav
Yeah, I think. Yes, and I agree, and I think that that's accurate. But just hear me out for a second. This is a broader macro sentiment, and you may agree with it or not, but I feel like we are in a throw the bums out moment in America. Meaning if you went to the average American and said you could jettison every Democrat in the Congress and you could jettison every Republican in the Congress and you could start anew and you could pick the local baker or you could pick the local librarian to go into the Congress for you, I would say most Americans would say, yeah, we would want that. So we're in a throw the bums out mentality. And let me just go over this.
- [29:51]
Dominic Sambrook
The.
- [29:52]
Gav
The Democrats, Obama 2016, it flips to the Republicans, Trump gets it, then Trump loses it, it flips back to the Democrats, and then the Democrats lose it. If it flips back to Trump and the gop, I think the next flip is back to the Democrats, meaning in the last several elections, the Americans are like, throw the bums out.
- [30:16]
Katty Kay
If you're in, there's no loyalty. Yeah, exactly. You're in. You're the problem.
- [30:21]
Gav
And by the, and by the way, let me stipulate Caddy. They would like to throw them all out. Okay?
- [30:25]
Katty Kay
They would.
- [30:25]
Gav
I mean, it wouldn't just be the Democrats or the Republicans on that given day, it'd be all of them. And so there's the vulnerability for the current crop of GOP. Like, again, if I was J.D. vance, assuming he gets the nomination, I still predict he won't. But, but, but the, you know, the, the, the odds are that he will, because most every vice president has gotten the nomination. Richard Nixon, George Herbert Walker Bush, et cetera. Even Walter Mondale got it from Jimmy Carter's vice president. But I'm just saying to you, if he is sitting there thinking about the nomination, he's vulnerable. He's vulnerable. He's not a popular guy, number one. Maybe he gets the nomination anyway, but he's vulnerable. And you can sit around and have a pow wow about this, but it's not really gonna do you any good. The bold move would be to break from Trump. They're on defense in Georgia. He won Georgia by, like, 24 points.
- [31:22]
Katty Kay
They have good news here because you look at the Democrats. There was a great new poll out from AP Nork Poll showing that the Democrats view of the Democratic Party is super low at the moment. Seven in 10 Democrats have a positive view. I mean, it's like, you know, they don't even Democrat rank and file doesn't love their party. I think the problem Trump is in at the moment is that. And this takes me back to that series that you and I are recording for our founding members on Donald Trump. Donald Trump has always had this belief that if you tell people a lie often enough, they will believe it. You know, I'm the most successful businessman in the world. I am the best real estate mogul in the world. I am the best playboy there has ever been. I have the biggest crowds at my inauguration that there's ever been, and people will believe it. The big difference now, a Republican pointed out to me, is that he's telling them lies about how they feel, not about how he feels. So he's not telling them Donald Trump is rich. He's telling them they are rich. And they're like, I'm not rich. I don't believe this lie you're peddling to me because I don't feel it. I feel that prices are too high. I feel the economy is bad. And I think it kind of exposes a disconnect between Trump and his supporters. And because he is so desperate not to believe that people don't like him and that they don't like his policies, he's not kind of waking up to that enough. And maybe he can turn the economy around. It's a long way till November. We, we get all of those caveats. The election is not being held today. It's being held in whatever it is, eight months time. But I do think he's kind of got away with. He thinks I can just tell people the economy is great and they feel rich because that has always worked for me.
- [33:15]
Gav
I like the role play. K. Let's role play. Okay. I'm Senator John Cornyn. I'm waking up to prediction markets that say that there's a 40% chance now, up from 20%. There's a 40% chance now the Democrats take the Senate. I wasn't in a vulnerable position. I'm a incumbent senator from a red state. But I've got a challenger nipping at me now. And I'm now calling you. You're my campaign strategist. And I say, hey, Donald Trump has not approved a plan, a spending plan for the 300 million. Why do you think he hasn't approved that spending plan? And am I here in the great state of Texas going to receive any of that money from Donald Trump? And you say what?
- [34:04]
Katty Kay
I say Donald Trump is probably going to put his support behind your challenger, who's a MAGA devotee, although he's been smeared in a scandal, Ken Paxton, including allegations of bribery that led to him being impeached by the Texas state house in 2023. All round, not particularly popular guy. But Ken Paxton loves Donald Trump. And Donald Trump thinks that John Cornyn has opposed him one too many times. And as we are seeing with New York and as we are seeing with D.C. donald Trump is not above using budgets as weapons against people who have opposed him. So I suspect that's what's going to happen in Texas. I mean, Texas, we should have a longer conversation about Texas at some point because it is a super interesting Senate RA that has just kicked off this week. Early voting started in the primaries in that Senate race. And on the Republican side, you got Cornyn, who is a conservative Republican, just not as MAGA as Donald Trump would like him to be being challenged by Ken Paxton, who's probably going to win for the Republican as the Republican nominee for the Senate seat.
- [35:13]
Gav
Let me interrupt, Katty, because you're my campaign strategist and I'm Senator Cornyn, and I've been on the public records saying that if Ken Paxton is at the top of the ticket, we're going to have an Election Day massacre. You mean to tell me that Donald Trump doesn't see that? KATTY K. And you're telling me he's not going to help me?
- [35:30]
Katty Kay
KATTY K. No, he's not going to help you, Senator Cornyn, because you've opposed him one too many times. He thinks that a MAGA candidate can be elected because you know what? He'll endorse Ken Paxton. He'll put his weight behind Ken Paxton, and he is convinced that whatever Donald Trump wants, the MAGA faithful will vote for. But I spoke to somebody who's a political scientist down in Texas this week who told me that even his father, who is a Trump supporter and loves Donald Trump, will not vote for Ken Paxton. I think Donald Trump's reading. I think he's reading the Republican race all wrong down in Texas, okay?
- [36:07]
Gav
So I'm bringing this up for a specific reason. I think this was a very big part of that strategy session. I think that they've gone to Trump's staff and said, this SOB Is uncontrollable, but he's got to support Cornyn. If he doesn't support Cornyn, there's going to be a cascade effect here that's going to be very, very damaging, not just in the Senate, but also in all of these down races and all these congressional races in Texas. And Texas is not due to demography and demographic changes, is not as red as it once was. KATTY and so I'm just bringing this up because this is an example of what the congressional leaders and their political strategists are trying to do with the White House. But can I help these guys out? Because, see, I know the Trumpster, okay? So let me help these guys out. Forget it. And by the way, the $300 million, he's not giving it to you. Look, I'm scratching my nose for you people on YouTube, okay? He's not gonna give it to you, okay? Can I tell you why he's not going to give it to you? Because he doesn't give a shit about you. He cares about Donald Trump and that money he's looking at, he's saying, hey, I may be able to use that money to fly around in I may have to renovate Mar a Lago. And I can figure out a way to get that money shoveled into some other account to help me with that. And I guarantee as we're sitting here, there will be minimal amounts of that money used in these races. Yeah, there'll be ceremonial amounts. If he goes full jihad and decides to back Paxton, will he send him a $5 million check? Sure. But this guy is not going to help you. He wants you to lose. He wants you to be nobodies after he leaves, which is a sign of his narcissistic greatness in his freebrile old man's mind. And so those are the facts, Caddy. So just let these guys know. You're barking up the wrong tree, fellas. So keep it up.
- [38:02]
Katty Kay
Okay, that's all we have time for this week, but if you would like more, you can get it on our Founding members episode where we are joined by a very special visitor who had a question about Jeffrey Epstein that you had a chance to answer. Anthony, I'm going to leave it there. That's called a cliffhanger.
- [38:18]
Gav
I mean, I mean, it's another great sales pitch by Caddy. Please become a founding member and go to Therese is politicsus.com. it's a lot of fun on those programs. And we'll see you guys next week. Thanks again.
- [38:36]
Anita Anand
To some, he is the revolutionary hero who restored China to its rightful place on the global stage.
- [38:42]
Dominic Sambrook
To others, he's a brutal despot accused of presiding over more civilian deaths than either Stalin or Hitler.
- [38:48]
Anita Anand
Mao Zedong has one of the most recognizable faces in the world, yet he started life in a muddy provincial village.
- [38:55]
Dominic Sambrook
A rebel son who hated his father survived a 6,000 mile walk across China and rose to become a figure of
- [39:02]
Anita Anand
titanic proportions from Empire, the Goal Hanger World History Show. I'm Anita Anand.
- [39:08]
Dominic Sambrook
And I'm William Duranpool.
- [39:10]
Anita Anand
In this six part series, we're joined by world renowned experts Rana Mitta to explore the life of the father of communist China, Mao Zedong.
- [39:20]
Dominic Sambrook
We'll track his rise from a bookstore owner to a guerrilla commander. And we'll witness his ruthless elimination to secure total power. And we'll descend into the dark experiment of the Cultural Revolution. A time when ancient temples were burnt, children denounced their parents, and a nation worshipped a mango as a sacred relic.
- [39:41]
Anita Anand
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