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- [00:16]
A
Hello and welcome to Mess World, a podcast dedicated to discussing the highs and lows of pop culture every month. I'm Jessica Defino and I write the newsletter Flesh World.
- [00:26]
B
And I'm Emily Kirkpatrick and I write the newsletter I Heart Mass. Happy holidays.
- [00:31]
A
Happy holidays. It's like that weird in between. We're in the liminal space, emptiness between Christmas and New Year's. Yeah, I'm looking forward to a week of just nothing.
- [00:42]
B
Me too. And I've also been channeling it into like insane cleaning behavior. I'm doing the classic turning of the year apartment overhaul. I descaled a coffee machine yesterday. That's how crazy we're getting.
- [00:56]
A
What even is descaling a coffee machine?
- [00:59]
B
I don't know. It's something you're supposed to do semi regularly that I've never done in my life and I did yesterday. And much like you know everything that's good for you, I hate to report my coffee tastes better.
- [01:10]
A
Oh my gosh. Okay. You've inspired me.
- [01:12]
B
It's so annoying. It's like, it's like yes. It's like working out and then feeling happier. It's one of those like, God damn tragic. Of course it works.
- [01:21]
A
Realization that like, everyone's right.
- [01:23]
B
Everyone's right. Yeah, everyone's right. Descale your coffee machines. I guess.
- [01:27]
A
Okay. Prediction for 2026. Everyone will be desalining their coffee machines.
- [01:32]
B
I'm scared that everyone already is desalining.
- [01:34]
A
I know. I was just thinking we're gonna get comments being like, ew, you guys aren't descaling your coffee machine.
- [01:41]
B
Sorry. I learned. You live and you learn. Sometimes you live for a very long time before you learn.
- [01:48]
A
I know. I'm 36 years old. This is the first I'm hearing about it.
- [01:51]
B
There's new things every day, new wonders.
- [01:54]
A
And there will be many new wonders in 2026. And that's exactly what we're going to be talking about today. We're doing our big predictions, episode fashion predictions, beauty predictions. What's going to be happening in the upcoming year.
- [02:08]
B
What ideas will people be stealing and not crediting us for in the future? You're hearing it here first. Jot em down. Take note.
- [02:16]
A
That's why I love doing. I just posted on Flesh World a look back at my 2025 predictions. I love to do that to see like, was I accurate? And mostly yes, it's a really fun fact.
- [02:28]
B
Was reading that newsletter and I was like, this is so smart. Instead of like me complaining all year long about your weird ideas. Coming to fruition. Just save it till the end of the year and then point out cohesively, you know, a full every time. You're right. I like that. I might adopt that in the new year.
- [02:45]
A
You should. I think yours would be, like, annoy people less. It would have to be a series because it would just be so long. I feel like we need to come up with a nickname for you, like, something like the something Oracle. Like, what did prediction?
- [03:00]
B
Like, I have to look at my own website because Glamour called me something. Oh. Oh, yeah. Glamour. Glamour magazine called me a fashion soothsayer, which is good, but it's not, like, pithy. It's not, like, catchy, you know, style soothsayer. I guess it's just a little wordy. I'd like something a little more snappy, a little more to the point. The problem also is I feel like when I do hit it right, I hit it so crazy, right. That, like, people are screaming back to me from the Internet, and so it feels, like, rude not to address, you know, like, when I hit the merkin, I hit the merkin hard.
- [03:32]
A
I know.
- [03:33]
B
And so it feels weird to, like, wait to hold my tongue on the merkin until the end of the year when it's like, yeah. Or like when Bianca Censori went to the Grammys nude. It's like, that's. I can't wait till the end of the year to not. To not credit myself with that victory.
- [03:47]
A
No. And I don't wait either. I like. I'll. I'll put these little oh, I was right throughout the year in my newsletter, and then I'll just curate them. Yeah. I mean, it's an annoying thing that we do, but sometimes we're annoying.
- [03:59]
B
What can you say? Deal with it. Live with it.
- [04:03]
A
I think I want to embrace being a little annoying and even being a little bitchy in the coming year. I was making my vision board the other day. My brother and I were doing vision boards together, and I cut out a phrase from a magazine that was like, be a little bitchy. And I think I'm just gonna embrace it.
- [04:20]
B
I love that. I feel like I've been living that my whole life.
- [04:25]
A
You're an inspiration to me.
- [04:28]
B
I could be maybe a little less bitchy. Maybe it's my goal for 2026. Be a little kinder. Although I feel like every time I try to be kinder to celebrities, they do something that pisses me off so bad that I'm like, what a mistake. What? I. I gave you so much graciousness.
- [04:41]
A
I don't think we need to be kinder to celebrities.
- [04:44]
B
Okay, fair enough.
- [04:45]
A
Just in real life, I could be.
- [04:47]
B
I could be a little kinder to some of my trolls. Sometimes I dunk on them too hard. Yeah, I could be nice.
- [04:53]
A
I know I do the same thing. When I get a negative comment, a rage rises within me, and then you.
- [04:58]
B
Have to expel it.
- [04:59]
A
After I respond. Like, hours after I respond, I'm like, okay, I did too much.
- [05:02]
B
I did too much there.
- [05:03]
A
It wasn't necessary.
- [05:06]
B
Stop.
- [05:06]
A
Trigger improvement. Yeah.
- [05:08]
B
So stop rage baiting me. Should we get into these?
- [05:12]
A
Yes. I'm really excited to hear yours.
- [05:14]
B
Oh, boy. Okay, so I'm gonna start. So a lot of my trends, they are based on things that we saw come to fruition this year. And then I think they're just gonna kind of like evolve in the year. Such as the nature of fashion. Such as the nature of trends. So first I was thinking about this year and the rise of adult babies. Right. Like, we've really seen em. They've come in droves. They've come in a lot of different forms this year. And I do think that specific trend is going to come to an end. I think. I think the Epstein files might have a lot to do with that trend coming to. I don't think people want to look like an adult. I think it's a bad look to look like an adult baby at this particular juncture in time. It's pretty tasteless. But I do think this is kind of separate from the trend that I'm speaking about in this. But I do think the adult baby thing might evolve a little bit into more of like, twee, indie sleaze, American Apparel type baby. Baby. You know what I'm saying?
- [06:05]
A
Yes.
- [06:06]
B
Like, just a lot of hot pants and tights types. Well, we've already kind of seen in the adult baby world, but I think it might lean harder into, like, the rock, indie sleaze kind of version of it versus.
- [06:15]
A
You know what I was just thinking of? Remember when Mary Kay Olsen would wear just a big flannel shirt and tights and no pants?
- [06:22]
B
Yeah.
- [06:22]
A
I was just thinking of that the other day being like, we need to bring that back.
- [06:26]
B
Yeah.
- [06:27]
A
Or I don't know if that's exactly. That's not really adult baby, but it is a little indie sleaze.
- [06:32]
B
Well, it's a little baby, and that's like kind of a night shirt.
- [06:35]
A
Pantsless.
- [06:36]
B
Yeah, pantsless night shirt, I would say. Or you just made me think. I feel like it was like 2014-2016, the Kardashians were all wearing those like XXL tees with like a fishnet tight.
- [06:48]
A
Yes. Lampshade dressing.
- [06:50]
B
Oh, yes. Thank you so much for pulling that word out of the recesses of my brain. Lampshade dressing, Exactly. I think maybe something there is kind of the direction, like overgrown toddler type of stuff, I think is maybe what I'm talking about. But anyway, so I was thinking about the adult babies and I was thinking about the kind of celebrity foot fetish stuff of this year. You know, Lily Allen joining OnlyFans. We're getting Addison Rae's entire career, you know, and I just think we're in the year to come. We're going to see a lot more fetishes, I think, go mainstream. What those fetishes are? Not sure, Not. Not totally clear yet. But I do think they're going to have to get increasingly fringe, honestly, because we've kind of done what I would consider like kind of a tier fetishes, you know, like kind of the most generically popular ones, or at least the ones that are like, we know of as the most popular ones.
- [07:40]
A
Adult baby. There was a big, like furry fetish.
- [07:44]
B
We had a furry kind of push.
- [07:46]
A
Last year or this year.
- [07:47]
B
This year. This year actually adding to my. My fetish roundup. But yeah, we had some mythical beasts. We had some furry stuff this year. And. Yeah, I don't know. I don't. What fetishes do you. I guess let's. Let's throw it to you. What fetishes do you think will happen?
- [08:03]
A
I'm exposing myself as a prude. I'm like, what. What fetishes are there?
- [08:06]
B
What fetishes are there? Well, cause like S and M is like fully done, you know, latex we've seen. Although I think the latex stuff, we could get more extreme with it, like kind of. You. Have you ever seen them? They're not just latex suits, but they're like latex suit that's like embedded within a mattress and then you suck all the air out of it.
- [08:23]
A
Yes. Oh my God. I was just thinking of that.
- [08:25]
B
Something like that could be interesting. I'm not opposed to that kind. Remember when Sam Smith wore that inflatable latex outfit to like, I wanna say the baftas or something? Last year? Yes, I think it was last year. I think like a reverse one of those where it's like total air sucked out. But you're a big square. You're like a big square kind of sidestepping down the carpet. Or you have to be wheeled down the red carpet. I think maybe I'm also gesturing towards things that are, like, immobilizing, like things that you need aid of.
- [08:57]
A
Right, right. Like, sort of like, inherently submissive.
- [09:02]
B
Yeah.
- [09:03]
A
Like, around you.
- [09:04]
B
Yes. And, like, giving over control of your body to, like, others. I think it could be, like, whatever form that takes could be interesting, you know, and we saw maybe those, like.
- [09:17]
A
Vibrating panties with a controller or something. How could that. How could we make that fashion somebody else controls interesting an aspect of what you're wearing?
- [09:27]
B
I don't know. Interesting. Well, because that is also just, like, making a lot of dynamics, like, palpable. Like, as a famous person, as a woman in Hollywood, I don't know, I feel like giving over control of yourself in that way. And see, Addison, and I mean, Bianca Sensory is already kind of doing that just in her life. Like, she's already given over control of her identity and self to a man in a very. Again, I think Bianca Sensori. It never works because it's, like, very distasteful and very troubling and triggering. You know, like, it's not fun and playful. It's quite dark and serious, what she's doing. And so people can't respond to it the way it would be responsive. I think for a more fun celebrity who's in control of their own image, doing it. Yeah. Anyway, I. I don't know. Wait, let me. You know what? Let me Google top fetishes. Here we go. Top fetishes in America 2025. See? Oh, 10 fastest growing. Should we look at that?
- [10:25]
A
Yes.
- [10:26]
B
Well, what AI just told me is chastity play. Whoa. Which. That's very intriguing.
- [10:33]
A
That's very intriguing. I could see some chastity belt type fashion arising out of the adult diaper.
- [10:39]
B
Perhaps she'll remember. A super early example of vagina on the red carpet was actually Julia Fox in a chastity belt at the Pretty Little things Runway show. And I said at the time I really liked was really something. And I do think chastity belts, there's something there or kind of anything putting your body under lock and key. And we have already had this trend of, like, keys, like keychains, like. Yeah, it, like, dangling off the body as, like, accessory. Yeah. Interesting. Okay. They're saying foot worship is number 10, but I'm like, have we not already been there? Have we not been in this place? Belly buttons.
- [11:18]
A
Oh.
- [11:19]
B
I'm not sure how you could, like, emphasize the belly button more, but I'd be interested in seeing belly button enhancing I guess you could extend it. You could make it more pronounced.
- [11:28]
A
An Audi.
- [11:29]
B
An Audi, but like a mega Audi.
- [11:32]
A
Mega Audi.
- [11:33]
B
Yeah.
- [11:33]
A
Yeah.
- [11:34]
B
Or turn it into something else. I don't know. Another object. They're telling me pantyhose, which is like. Okay, I don't. Fine. We already have enough pantyhose in the mix. Chastity. Interesting. Some of these don't work into the fashion. Is the problem like cuckolding, pegging, you know, that's tough to translate. Nicole's. But again, I'm interested to see it farting. Interested to see it. Let's bottle up those farts.
- [11:58]
A
The bottles. Yeah. And the breath spray. The cat's eye.
- [12:01]
B
Exactly. Let's bottle it up and sell it. Let's sell. Yeah. Okay. See? And that's fetish. That's fetish stuff too. I guess it's like fetish prime work. I guess we'll also see a lot more of.
- [12:12]
A
Well, do we? Is clown a fetish? I don't know if I'm. I guess it could be a fetish, because clown could be. I'm jumping ahead here, but I think Pagliacci core is going mainstream this year. I think clowns have been, like, lightly trending for a while and I really do see this becoming bigger. So my brother was just in town for Christmas and he was telling me that more people are using clown makeup on their dating apps. Like, this is kind of an inescapable trope on the apps now, like, clowning. And his boyfriend had invited him to like a clown themed party the other night at a club. Like, it was like a rave night, but clown themed. So I really think that we are going to see more clown. I think clown is coming. I think it could be coming for makeup too. Like, I. We've already seen sort of clownish blush, but I think we could see more of like a very circular type blush.
- [13:07]
B
Yeah. Did we talk about this in the last podcast with like Chapel roan and stuff too? Like whiting out her face and.
- [13:13]
A
Exactly.
- [13:14]
B
And I'm mad now. I forgot to put clowns on. I'm gonna add clown to the bottom of my list for a future note. Cause I forgot to add clown. And you're so right about clowns.
- [13:21]
A
I know. I think powdered or whiter skin is going to happen too. Like, this is already happening in K Beauty and we're seeing it slowly come over to America. And I was thinking of that in terms of the pantone color of the year clout dancer white. And I sort of made a Joke at the time when that came out. Like, maybe we'll see like powdered faces or powdered wigs as a nod to when that was popular for, you know, sort of the elite to set themselves apart by making themselves whiter. So I think there are a couple ways that that could come in here.
- [13:55]
B
Including clown in history, when people were whiting their faces with. Didn't the face powder also have, like, lead in it?
- [14:02]
A
Yes, yes, it was highly toxic.
- [14:04]
B
Doesn't that feel also like a apt parallel?
- [14:08]
A
Yeah, well, especially as RFK juniors, FDA rolls back protections on asbestos. Like, they've just said, we are not going to test talc for asbestos before talc beauty products go to market. So there is a tie in there. And I could even see like harlequin clown eyeliner happening where it's a vertical eyeliner, rather the traditional horizontal eye. Like just flip that and it's a little clownish. And I think that's something we haven't really seen yet, but we could.
- [14:41]
B
That's very interesting. I agree with you so much. I mean, I think maybe it's the last podcast even I was talking about Natalie Portman's clown ruff that she had that like the loops of fabric around her neck, which is the Jonathan Anderson signature. And yeah, like depressed clowns, I think. I don't know, it's like, it's a. Almost feels too heavy handed because, like, that's how we all feel. Like we all feel. Buffoons, jesters.
- [15:07]
A
I feel I've said this before, but whenever I put my blush on in the mirror, I, you know, I put the little dot of liquid blush and I see the sadness in my own eyes and then I like slowly rub it in and I feel like Pagliacci every day I do that. So I think it does really reflect the general mood in America.
- [15:29]
B
If not, there's also something there to like, like, right, because it's like the way we apply the makeup and then not. I think maybe not blending is kind of what I'm picking up on. Like kind of laying bare. Right. Well, even just thinking, like makeup for so long has been about natural and looking like, you know, you're not wearing makeup makeup. And like, what if you just laid it bare, made super overt, like you drew the contour and the blush on and like, you didn't blend anything and you like really made like a graphic face. I guess I can see that. And that to me is very, well, clown. And it's also very Trixie Mattel. It's very drag.
- [16:06]
A
Very drag.
- [16:06]
B
Yeah, Just drawing stripes of color on your face. I can definitely see that.
- [16:11]
A
Yeah, I think it's coming. And then on the adult baby note. Yeah, I'll just throw this in now because we were just talking about babies, but I do think we're gonna see fetal skin care. And so there's two ways this can go. Like, we already have ingredients, like, that are inspired by, like, Vernix, the, like, waxy white substance that newborns are coated in. There's Mother Rebirth Vernix mask. Biologique Recherche has a Phoenix mask. And we have penis facials that use epidermal growth factors harvested from fetal foreskin.
- [16:47]
B
I was not aware of that.
- [16:48]
A
Oh, yeah, that was big. Like, a couple years ago, it was the.
- [16:52]
B
The.
- [16:52]
A
The celebrity loved penis facial.
- [16:54]
B
Scary.
- [16:55]
A
I'm thinking salmon sperm is part of this. The salmon sperm craze. Right now. I remember that stem cells from umbilical cords used in skin care. There's also a lot of, like, biomimetic placenta extracts in. In luxury skincare right now. So I think we're going to see more of that. But I also think this is going to combine with the baby skincare boom a la Shea Mitchell Endure. And we're going to see a greater focus on how mothers can modify their behavior or their lifestyle or their choices to give their baby the best skin possible while in utero or just out of the womb.
- [17:32]
B
Totally. I was literally just thinking, like, a prenatal vitamin or something like a supplement that promises that your baby will come out gorgeous somehow or, like, fortified in beauty.
- [17:42]
A
Yes. And there's, like, ways that you can turn your placenta into. Into skincare for yourself. But I wonder if we'll see the placenta being turned into skincare for the baby.
- [17:54]
B
Yeah. Wow. Yeah.
- [17:56]
A
And then I also feel like we're going to see more conversations about C sections and how a C section can affect a baby's skin microbiome. Because, I mean, this is, you know, studied. We have research that shows babies pick up most of their skin microbiome material from the birth canal as they're born. And. And C section babies can have, like, higher risk of future skin issues if they're not getting all of those bacteria from the birth canal.
- [18:26]
B
Okay.
- [18:27]
A
So I wonder if this is going to become part of, like, the motherhood discourse.
- [18:33]
B
Absolutely. Someone called Placenta University because we have a new business venture. Well, I was just thinking, like, the same way that a mom would take, like, dehydrated pills of her placenta to, like, fortify her own health I can see like some serum or something made from, like, vaginal secretions. I don't even know what it would be. Or like a swab of the mother's vagina to make a serum that, that would like, fortify the microbiome of the newborn.
- [19:00]
A
Vabbing for your baby.
- [19:05]
B
Vabbing for baby. That's exactly what's gonna. That's it. It's okay. Can we trademark that right now? Can we, like, lock that down?
- [19:12]
A
We're locking it in. Vabbing for babies. But the other thing that I was going to mention with this trend, I think a lot of it is like, also a little eugenics coded of like, I've got to engineer my, the best skin for my baby. And when I searched to see if this was a thing yet, when I searched like baby skincare in womb, how to give your baby good skin while you're pregnant, all the top results were lists of foods to eat so that your baby has lighter or fairer skin, which is really not real scary. There is no way this could possibly work. But that is what the Google search results populate and there are a lot of articles on that. So I think there is a very scary fascist element to this of like genetic manipulation of your child inside the womb or like trying your best to like, optimize your baby before it's born. So there, I mean, there's like little sprinklings of it already happening and I, I, I think it's going to get bigger, but I, I hope it's not.
- [20:15]
B
Well, that certainly fits with the clown makeup as well. Like. Right. I mean, you're just replacing skin bleaching with just like patting on white makeup.
- [20:24]
A
Exactly.
- [20:24]
B
You know, it's the same gesture towards whiteness, I think, even when it becomes clownish. Cartoonish completely, which obviously white supremacy is.
- [20:33]
A
Right? Yeah. I mean, just look at Trump. That is a, that is a clown cartoon character.
- [20:40]
B
Yeah. Look at David Duke. It's a melting wax figure.
- [20:43]
A
Oh, my God.
- [20:47]
B
Well, unrelated to white supremacy, maybe. Who knows? It could be, I guess this year I thought, you know, we've kind of hit maximum pleasers on the red carpet. In my opinion, they are the only shoe I am seeing on the red carpet. And they are all loose sight and they're all the like the base model, what I consider like pleaser 101. And so, I don't know, I was just thinking it's like, where do we go from? Like, I just don't think this is sustainable as like a, as a styling choice. And so I was like, but we, the obsession isn't even the shoe, right? Like the shoe is a means to an end. The shoe is a way to make celebrities tall. Height, because we want height. We want, for some reason, we want these women who are all teeny tiny, teeny, teeny tiny to be giantess tall. And so I was like, how do we get it? And I just think we're going to have to move beyond pleasers in the year to come because I don't, I actually don't think they're tall enough. I don't think five or six inches is enough.
- [21:49]
A
There's so much room for innovation in this.
- [21:51]
B
Yeah, there's, I've been saying that all of 2025.
- [21:54]
A
Pleaser.
- [21:55]
B
There's always been so much room for innovation. Like, first of all, just shop the rest of the pleasers website and there are alternatives available. You could do more interesting things than a loose sight one. But I don't know. We've just been doing this for a decade now. You know, starting with Yeezy. Really, we've had these like loose sight heel thing. It's enough. And I think we're gonna have to figure out a new way to elevate celebrities. I don't know what it is again, it might be like an apple crate for all I know. Like, I just think we're gonna have to be standing on top of platforms in a different way to achieve this height. And my real questions are one, who will be the first to wear stilts? Because I don't get why not?
- [22:29]
A
Clown. Clown.
- [22:30]
B
Clown. Which is clown. Yeah. Which is clown core. But like, why not?
- [22:34]
A
No, I could see Sabrina. Like, I'm, I'm, I'm thinking Sabrina Carpenter in her, like, ringleader outfit.
- [22:41]
B
Yes.
- [22:41]
A
From the Met gala. How much would have been better with stilts? With stilts? Yes.
- [22:45]
B
That outfit would have been a million times better with stilts. 100%. And that also goes back to my fetish point, because with stilts you need someone to help you down the red carpet because you will fall. And also falling is a built in PR stunt that will get you attention everywhere. Joe, sounds good enough for Lawrence. Make it the defining thing of your career. Wear stilts, fall down, get attention both ways. You can go no wrong. So that's my first question. Who will wear stilts first? My next question is, who will get the leg lengthening surgery? Who will do it? Someone's going to do it, right?
- [23:14]
A
Will someone admit it is a thing?
- [23:16]
B
I think they're going to have to. Well, that's what I've Always said about Kim, Kim wants it desperately. She wants it so, so bad. But she would have to cop to it immediately because everyone's going to notice that your legs are like.
- [23:28]
A
We're too. Like, in a crazy way, proportionally. Will that look odd?
- [23:32]
B
Yeah, it does look odd. We've seen it. I don't know if you've looked. I don't know if you've looked at the. The people, the individuals who have gotten the surgery. It's. Yeah, you're out of proportion. It looks weird because it's like you've added now 4 inches where 4 inches weren't supposed to be. Yeah. Yeah, it looks odd. People will notice. I mean, but people always notice with plastic surgery, and they still pretend they didn't get it anyway. So I don't know. But I've always thought if Kim thought she could get away with it, she'd get it. But I'm wondering who will get it? And I'm surprised no male celebrities have gotten it. I'm surprised, though. Well, true. I guess I do think I would notice.
- [24:08]
A
Yeah.
- [24:09]
B
I don't. Pedro Pascal, to make that film a reality. Break his legs and elongate them. I don't know. The problem, I think, is also it takes you out of work for too long.
- [24:20]
A
Yeah.
- [24:21]
B
It takes you out of the public's imagination, and it takes you out of the movie theater for too long. So it's like. It's a hard one to sneak in there. But I. I just think somebody wants it. Somebody want.
- [24:31]
A
It has to be like a stunt where you're like, I'm doing this, and then you sort of like, live stream yourself or you're still on social media as you're recovering or something. Who would do it? Marc Jacobs? Does he need. Is he tall?
- [24:46]
B
No, he's very. He's petite.
- [24:47]
A
He does the same thing with his facelift.
- [24:49]
B
He's petite, but I don't think he's obsessed with height in the right way to make this of interest to him. I'm not. I mean. And he's also making the right kind of shoes that you don't need to get leg lengthening surgery. You know, he can just wear his own mega platforms, and I think he gets the height he needs, but I don't think he. He doesn't seem obsessed with his height in the way that I need someone to be obsessed their height. Like Kim Kardashian is obsessed with being small. Yeah, she is, because she wants to wear Runway samples, and Runway samples were put on women who are 5, 10, and up. It limits you. It's the same way that her body bothered her because she couldn't fit in any Runway samples. That's why she got her butt removed. That's why she got all her body reshaped.
- [25:28]
A
Yes.
- [25:28]
B
That's why we've seen this whole.
- [25:30]
A
An influencer turned celebrity who did not get famous because their body already fit the mold.
- [25:39]
B
Yeah. Interesting. Anyway, just putting it out there. Everyone, look, everyone watch out for those extra inches on the thigh. Let me know if you spot any. I do think it's coming, and it's coming soon.
- [25:49]
A
I agree. My next trend prediction is death, which. Let me explain. It's coming, baby. But no. So this is a small thing that I've started noticing trickling in this year, and I think it's going to be bigger next year. But people describing their favorite beauty products not in terms of, like, my desert island picks, but literally, like, my. My death pics. So the first time I noticed it was with Feed Me interviewed Cassandra Gray or Violet Gray, and they asked, what's your death row meal? But for beauty products. Like, what would be the final beauty products you put on basically before you die as a way to be like, what are your favorites? And then in the.
- [26:38]
B
Why am I putting on beauty products before I die?
- [26:40]
A
Well, and why are you using beauty products on a desert island? You know, none of it makes sense. And then in the newsletter sample sluts, Eliza McLam was interviewed, and they framed her. Her favorite perfume as her casket scent. Like, what would you spray over your casket? And then I was thinking of this. We were talking about this a couple days ago, texting about the Business Insider report that people are using cadaver fat for plastic surgery and injections now. So I think there's just gonna be, like, a. A general air of death about beauty in many little ways. Yeah.
- [27:20]
B
It's fairy. Death becomes her, obviously.
- [27:22]
A
Yes. Death becomes.
- [27:23]
B
And also, I mean, Frankenstein. Well timed. Mm. Completely interesting. Yeah. Death makes a lot of sense to me. Also, why is. No one's faking their own death anymore. I'd like to see that in the year to come. That's a good PR stunt that we don't do.
- [27:40]
A
Yeah.
- [27:41]
B
I mean, I know it's hard, but it's. It's good. It's good pr. It's very interesting. It's very fun. Yeah. People are invested. And also, I do think. I don't know, Death is just very. I always think about the stuff from, like, attention. From, like, the attention economy and, like, PR it generates and, like. Cause that's I don't know. That's how famous people think, and that's how fashion works for famous people. But, like, death is definitely a very powerful. People are triggered. You know, it like, gets attention because I'm just thinking about. I literally wore. I have a T shirt that says Death. Because I like the band, the punk band Death. And so I went to see them probably a decade ago, and I bought this T shirt at their show. And I wore it in one of my YouTube videos the other month. And I don't. I mean, I don't even think twice about the T shirt at this point, but people were comment, like, so upset, like, so triggered by this T shirt, thinking I'm, like, just promoting the concept, I guess. And I'm like, even if I was just promoting the concept, like, it is just. I don't know, like, what difference does it make? It's just true.
- [28:41]
A
It's gonna happen.
- [28:43]
B
It's like wearing a T shirt that says life. I don't know. I don't know. But I was so interested in the response that I was like, wow, this is, like, so riling to people. Like, it's so.
- [28:53]
A
Well, I think death feels nearer than ever. I think, like, the state of the world is very. Okay. Oh, trust me, I already have. No, I just mean, like, the state of the world is kind of scary and there are a lot of people, you know, dying untimely and unjust. And I mean, even just thinking of, like, climate change, you know, I harbor the thought. I always think, like, I'm going to die in a climate disaster. That's my prediction for myself. But, I mean, I don't know. I think people are thinking about it more just because of the state of the world and the state of news and how we're just, like, consumed by all of this devastating news all of the time. I feel like maybe it's a little bit more top of mind than it has been. And that's why we're conceiving of, like, okay, when you die, what are you putting on?
- [29:49]
B
Yeah, yeah. It's much more at the forefront. Maybe. Also, you were just making me think I've accidentally fallen into a Mad Men rewatch.
- [29:58]
A
Me too.
- [29:59]
B
Really?
- [29:59]
A
Yes. I'm already on season three.
- [30:01]
B
Oh, me too. It's like it's fully spiraled out of my control so quickly. I did not intend to rewatch the show, but in the beginning seasons, there was doing some ad. I think it's for Lucky Strike and they, like, bring in the. The psychologist and she's like, oh, yeah, the death drive, Freud, blah, blah, blah. And it does feel like kind of that pulled to the surface, like it's not masking our death drive. It's like fully operating from the place of. You love to die. Like you are hasty. You want to die. You want to die, don't you? What beauty products will you use when you're doing it? I don't know, it just feels like much more overt, you know, Freud's death drive in this type of.
- [30:39]
A
Oh, that's a great reference.
- [30:42]
B
Thank you. Two that I have. I mean. Well, this one did not come to fruition. This was one of my guesses for this year. And I just want it. I'm just going to say it again because I want it to come fruition, which is more. I want those time based outfits, the things that degrade and dissolve and the foam and the. Yeah. Things that evolve over time. The Andy Goldsworthy type of installation pieces. Things that are temporal. Yeah. Things that kind of. You have to be there to experience. Which also I think is something. I didn't put this on my list because it's more of a, like a cultural trend that I think is happening. But I think we're radically shifting offline, is my personal opinion.
- [31:24]
A
Interesting.
- [31:25]
B
I think people are becoming more and more disgruntled and repulsed by like their experiences on the Internet, especially social media. And I think we're going to see a backlash from that and a movement into more like community, in person, live events and I think likewise, I think a powerful thing with that would be an outfit that really like can't be captured or accurately captured in images and spread across the Internet. Because that's what we've been catering to for so long and to kind of push against that where it's like, oh, no, you literally have to see this outfit not only in person, but in the exact moment or else you're not gonna like understand it or like get to really witness it.
- [32:03]
A
I love that.
- [32:04]
B
Thank you.
- [32:05]
A
I. Yeah, I think that needs to happen. And what it's making me skincare wise is I'm thinking of all the probiotic infused athleisure that we've been seeing this year. There was like a small movement. I think Copernic was like the most famous option. But now I'm thinking like, okay, if the clothes are infused with probiotics, what are those bacteria? Are they not eating the clothes?
- [32:30]
B
Because that's great question. That's what they do. And also you can't wash the clothes.
- [32:33]
A
Right. That's what they do to Us, like our bacteria consume us.
- [32:37]
B
Right.
- [32:37]
A
And you know, to bring it all back to death when we die, that we disintegrate because the bacteria are just going to town. So I wonder if there's like a. I wonder if there's a time based element to a probiotic. Maybe not the caperni probiotic athleisure, but in general, I don't know.
- [32:56]
B
Or. Yeah. Or even that just makes me think of the bacteria we found that like eats plastic.
- [33:02]
A
Yes.
- [33:03]
B
I barely know about this, but I was just thinking it's like even something like that where it's like the bacteria is actively eating away the clothing as you're wearing it. That is very interesting to me. I think that's very interesting. I don't know.
- [33:15]
A
I would love to see that.
- [33:16]
B
Yeah. And I guess that's also kind of a death thing. Like just more gestures towards degradation or more gestures towards like impermanence. Impermanence, yeah, that's it.
- [33:25]
A
Because we're living in a state of permanence right now. The state of the image. The image never disintegrates.
- [33:31]
B
The image. And what is, what is more Internet than the impermanent. Like we've seen the Internet, the churn of it all and like how quickly you have to wear 50 outfits a day to get the same amount of attention. Brain rot link. Yeah, is I. And to kind of counteract that of like, I don't know, this can't be spread around. This can't, you know, this is in a moment, in a way that can't be turned into an Internet moment, I guess. Anyway, that's one of my thoughts. And then this one is more your wheelhouse. But just thinking with the year of like radical quote unquote plastic surgery transparency we have, I think we're going to see a lot more of in the year to come and a lot more of it, I guess imminently. Like, you know, these ones that we've heard are kind of like a decade after the fact, a year after the fact. I think we're going to get like, I'm just coming out of surgery, you know, like a Instagram story. Like here I am being rolled out of surgery. Like I just had a deep plain facelift or whatever. Like, and then like a documenting of the recovery process. And also I think along with that we're gonna get a lot more super high profile celebrities. Not kind of the ones that we've always thought of doing, like sponcon for their plastic surgeons to get a good deal. And also. And then kind of like A branding moment where it's like you have to go. I don't know any. The first thought I just have was Dr. Kevorkian. So sorry for that. But like you have to go to Dr. Kevorkian to get the like Nicole Kidman nose and like, you know what I mean? Like a branding of the surgery as the specific celebrities surgery which we sort.
- [35:03]
A
Of saw with like Dr. Levine and Kris Jenner. Yeah, so this is.
- [35:08]
B
Yes, exactly. A Dr. Levine, Kris Jenner facelift type of situation. And. And similarly to that, like the celebrity themselves getting a kickback for every person who gets the surgery from their promotion. Because I don't know if people know that Chris is getting a cut.
- [35:25]
A
Oh, is she?
- [35:25]
B
I think she said that. Yeah, I think she. I'm pretty sure she said that. That she gets a little. She gets a little kickback for every recommendation.
- [35:34]
A
An accurate prediction. And I think it's really interesting too because it's kind of celebrities taking inspiration from regular people.
- [35:42]
B
Yeah.
- [35:43]
A
Because if you've been paying attention to any of the like, plastic surgery, particularly facelift articles that have come out in the past six or so months, regular people are very willing to give their in progress healing pictures to news outlets. Like there are some pretty like, honestly, like alarming and even grotesque images that on the Guardian, on the cut of like these in process of healing. Like people are willing to do that now. So I think it'd be interesting to see celebrities take that cue from just like the normies.
- [36:18]
B
Absolutely. And I mean, I think that's what we've seen ever since the rise of social media is celebrities increasingly following influencers and normies and like what they're doing and how they're using the platform because they're relating to people, because they're doing something authentic. And that feels one to one of like this is, you know, you and I are the same. So like, here's the real Girl's Guide or whatever to do. And. And celebrities are always trying to mimic that and capitalize it because they see that it works for them, but like seemingly missing the point of why it works for them, I think every time.
- [36:46]
A
Yeah.
- [36:46]
B
But so again, yeah, we have seen regular influencers, like really take you through the whole experience and people like that, you know, because they feel like, oh, this is the truth. Like, I'm really learning something from this. Like, this mimics my own experience. And I think celebrities are gonna capitalize on that for sure.
- [37:03]
A
I do too. I think also on the plastic surgery note, the next big thing in skincare is going to Be a blef in a bottle. We've seen like Botox in a bottle.
- [37:16]
B
Be a really good.
- [37:19]
A
Well, Botox in a bottle has been a huge marketing line for any sort of anti aging skin care for years and years and years now and then, you know, filler in a bottle. We've even had like skin care packaging modeled after syringes and things like that. And I think we're gonna see with the rise of the blepharoplasty, upper and lower, a lot more skin care, eye creams, even face tape marketed as. This is a bleph without the bleph. This is a bluff in a bottle.
- [37:48]
B
What? Yeah, I agree with you. But like, what?
- [37:51]
A
It won't be.
- [37:52]
B
I know, I'm just trying to think. I'm like, what would a bluff in a bottle do? Like, what would it be? Like, how would that even operate? Like, face tape is one thing. I can see face tape being a bluff in a ball. But like a lotion, like, how the hell is that gonna get rid of a chunk of my eyelid skin?
- [38:06]
A
No, it's not. There are. I've seen drops that open your eyes. I wish I had this saved. I know I have it saved on Instagram, but I have. I don't know the brand, but I saw someone promoting eye drops and doing one eye drop at a time to show you how much their eyes open with the drop. So I don't. It might not even be traditional skincare. I've also seen a lot of like lower eyelid creams and stuff where you do one side and it's like, watch the bag disappear. So that's kind of like lower bluff in a bottle.
- [38:37]
B
Yes.
- [38:38]
A
So I don't think necessarily these things will be effective, but I will be. I do think it's how they're going to be marketed.
- [38:43]
B
The lower. I know, exactly, because that was like a big TikTok craze, I want to say, even during the pandemic that like Philip Thomas Roth stuff that like freezes your face. And there's some. I'm not gonna remember the name of it right now, but there's an infomercial one too that they're always selling. That's basically like putting a layer of plastic panicure. Yeah, I think it's that one.
- [39:03]
A
Yeah.
- [39:03]
B
But it plays all the time.
- [39:06]
A
But yeah, that's. That's my small little marketing prediction for bluffs.
- [39:12]
B
I like it. I want maximum bluff in 2026.
- [39:16]
A
I do not. But. Oh, you mean like maximum eyelid.
- [39:20]
B
Yeah, I want max eyelid I thought.
- [39:22]
A
You meant maximum blepharoplasty surgeries.
- [39:24]
B
And I was like, I want full bluff. I want bluff, plus I want added.
- [39:29]
A
Skin to my next it girl. The next it girl that comes out of nowhere is going to have an extremely heavy bluff.
- [39:36]
B
Heavy bluff. I think that's. See, because when everyone's bluffs are gone, you're going to really stand out for your heavy bluff. And then everyone's going to have to add it back in. Or. I mean, and also, what if you just put a little filler in your eyelid? Made them heavy.
- [39:52]
A
Oh, oh.
- [39:54]
B
Thick and heavy.
- [39:55]
A
I'm writing that down. I think that's. That is coming, like, kind of.
- [40:00]
B
What's that cartoon like Hang Dog? You know what I'm talking about? Like the.
- [40:05]
A
Yeah. When you overdo it on the bluff, you add the filler back in to sort of get a little heaviness. Get a little heaviness, genius.
- [40:12]
B
Get a little expansion. I do remember what I was going to say before, though, which is the eye drops that make your eyes bigger. That seems bad.
- [40:19]
A
I know, right?
- [40:21]
B
What's in that that's causing your.
- [40:22]
A
I have no idea.
- [40:23]
B
To be more open. I just can't imagine that anything good comes of that.
- [40:28]
A
I don't want to circulate. I'll look for it in the show notes.
- [40:31]
B
The eye super open. Also, remember, reminds me, I have a friend who's obsessed with simpaku. Do you know about simpaku?
- [40:37]
A
No.
- [40:38]
B
Oh, my God. Senpaku is like when you can see the whites of the eye above or below?
- [40:45]
A
I love seeing it below. I love a celebrity where you see the whites below.
- [40:49]
B
Apparently, if you can see it above, I believe that's like a hallmark of being a serial killer. And if you go back and, like, look at the mug shots of like, all famous serial killers, they all have senpaku. Anyway, I don't know about. Don't come for me, anyone. This is what my friend's special interest tells me.
- [41:06]
A
Physiognomy.
- [41:08]
B
Yeah. This is what my friends special interests tell me that is happening. I don't. I have no confirmation of this, but the eye drops just made me think that you're like going after a senpaku vibe, which is. Can be a sign of a. A socio or a psychopath as well. So I just think that's funny.
- [41:23]
A
That is very fun.
- [41:24]
B
And again, apartment an apt aesthetic for a modern era to want to look like a little bit of a sociopath.
- [41:32]
A
But naturally, I love riffing. You know, so many new ideas are coming to us, this is fun.
- [41:40]
B
This is how we learn in our dismiss information bubble. Speaking of psychopaths, I do think this is going to be the year that Lauren Sanchez and Jeff Bezos really come to the fore of the fashion industry in the way that they've always wanted, and they finally gained the semblance of popularity that they think they deserve. Of course, I'm thinking about the fact that they are sponsoring the Met Gala. Obviously, we're already hearing blind item rumors that Lauren is sent. Lauren is really in control, and she's sending over, like, long lists of guests that she wants, like, personally invited to the Met Gala and stuff.
- [42:13]
A
She's in control. I cannot picture Jeff Bezos, like, really caring.
- [42:17]
B
I know, it's just. Well, of course. But it's so funny to imagine Anna Wintour just, like, cashing the check and being like, whatever you want, guys. Like, happy to just take your money and, like, let you make this the tackiest affair of all. I mean, the Met Gala to be real is already a tacky affair. It's grotesque wealth, you know, with badly dressed people. But, like, the what the level they're going to bring to it, I think is going to be a new, true Americana, nouveau riche tackiness that's going to feel. I think, going to feel appropriate to the event.
- [42:47]
A
It's going to be an accurate reflection of, like, lay bare.
- [42:50]
B
Yeah. What the Met Gala really is and how this whole system really operates. But anyway, I think they're really going to come to the fore. You know, we've already seen them all over couture week. I think they're going to continue to send the. They're gonna continue to be dressed in, like, insane, horrible couture fashions. And, of course, culminating, as I've said before, in a fashion show in space.
- [43:12]
A
Yes. Yes.
- [43:14]
B
Who will be the first to do it? I don't know. But I do think we'll get a fashion. I do think it makes sense for Chanel, to be quite honest, after Matthew Blasi's debut at Chanel, which was all space themed, obviously he was referencing kind of, like, the universe of Chanel and his place within it. And that was kind of the symbol. But I could see. And also in the. In the legacy of Karl Lagerfeld. Karl loved a stunt. He loved a big, expensive, dramatic stunt Runway show. I mean, this is the man who literally had, like, a fake rocket go off in the middle of his couture show. Like, he loved a set. He loved a stunt.
- [43:49]
A
Oh, yes.
- [43:50]
B
And so I do think a fashion show in space makes a lot of sense for them and if they do that, they do need to invite me. Not that I'll go. That's my worst nightmare. But no, you need a. Of dying. No, dying in a rock in space with a bunch of losers is literally my worst nightmare. I will not. I have no interest in space. I cannot stress this enough. Anyway, I think that will happen. I also think we'll get some sort of spa luxury experience type of thing orbiting the planet. Because I don't think it's enough just to go up in space, to be quite honest with you. No. Now that Katy Perry's done it, this.
- [44:22]
A
Piggybacks on a prediction I had for last year that did not come to fruition. But I do think it will come to fruition this year.
- [44:29]
B
Oh yeah.
- [44:29]
A
Considering the Bezos Met Gala of it all, which is either SpaceX backed beauty or Blue Origin backed beauty products in the vein of NASA backed beauty. We have so many beauty products that are made with like NASA technology. People love to use that as a marketing thing. And I definitely think that we are going to see either SpaceX or Blue Origin or both lend their research or whatever to the beauty industry. And I think that could be a good Met Galatai in too.
- [45:03]
B
Oh, what a great time to launch. What a great. What a great plug. Absolutely. Oh my God. And they can. I shouldn't give them this idea, but because magazines in the lead up to the Met Gala always do those like, get ready with me things. If you sponsored like a Katy Perry going to space to get her like makeup done and her glam done and then you launched her back to Earth to go to the Met Gala. Done.
- [45:25]
A
Oh my gosh.
- [45:26]
B
Done. Deal.
- [45:27]
A
I've been flipping through, as we're talking, I've been flipping through my copy of Simulacrum Simulation because I'm rereading it. I'm rereading it in preparation for our book club, which is tonight. It'll be, you know, it'll be long, long over by the time this episode comes out. But I'm rereading the part about space and I highlighted so many sections because I was like, oh my gosh, this makes so much sense re Jeff Bezos and Blue Origin and all of that. But he describes like space as a universe purged of all threat of meaning. It is this very perfection that is fascinating. Every principle of meaning is absorbed. Every deployment of the real is impossible. I don't know. There's some really interesting stuff in this book about space and I really want to Reread this section in particular in relation to all of these space themed predictions that we have.
- [46:23]
B
Yeah, totally. It's also just like manifest destiny stuff continued. You know, move to a new infinite frontier. A new infinite frontier, which is like the most important part of it is it is ultimately like unconquerable and endless. And so we can project this like, fantasy of the American dream and our destiny and all that onto this. Onto what's literally a void.
- [46:45]
A
Yeah.
- [46:46]
B
You know, that just swallows it whole and gives nothing back. Pretty good. Pretty good stuff. I also think you're right about them, the like Blue Origin or whatever sponsored products, because we've also seen towards the end of this year, like a real uptick in kind of like venture capital merch. I'm thinking about like Palantir started like making T shirts and sweatshirts and stuff and we're seeing a lot of that. It's like, okay, so like all of our most evil corporations are now like getting into the merch game. Beauty can't be far behind.
- [47:15]
A
I feel like we could see some sort of Palantir skincare where it's like a, like a surveillance state for your skin thing of like you get these biomarkers of what's happening on your skin through the skincare molecules or whatever. I don't know how that would work.
- [47:32]
B
Yeah, but I believe it. No, but yeah, like, as a new, A new frontier again of like data collection on, on the individual. Totally. Because we already have like these aura rings and stuff like monitoring our sleep and our, our wakefulness and our health and whatever and selling that data back to the company and to others. Like, why not something with like our actual microbiome and health and appearance and. Yeah, I just always assume we're trending towards like a minority report situation. So.
- [47:59]
A
Completely. Completely.
- [48:03]
B
I was just gonna say this one everybody knows all too well at this point. But the hyperreal body, I think is really taking off in the year to come. We're just kind of, we're still skirting around, I think just the beginning kind of rumblings of it. Obviously we have the skims, everything. The fake nipples, the fake bush, the fake hips, the fake butt. We're seeing the bodies printed on top of bodies. We're seeing multiple arms and legs. Yeah. I think we're going to consider, continue to see representations of bodies placed upon the bodies and the bodies multiplied and just like both in terms of it being like a malleable object, like our bodies are no longer limited to their human form. They're kind of infinite and Infinitely changeable at any time. And also it's like, I don't know, I was just talking to someone on TikTok about this today because in a video I posted today, I said that this trend is also like, I think we talked about this last time, but a gesture towards the divine. And he's like, I don't see anything divine about this. And I was like, well, let me explain. I do think there's something divine about beyond it being multi armed, multi legged, which we see it in a lot of depictions of gods and goddesses. It's like it's humans like seizing control over the image of their own body, like extending it beyond the physical limitations of like what a body has traditionally done and making it in their own idealized image. Like that to me is playing the role of like a, a demigod or something completely. And then of course AI is like, AI is also just an extension that.
- [49:35]
A
Like just gonna say the whole look.
- [49:37]
B
Is very AI rendered, you know, with the multiple fingers or whatever. Like kind of the way it fucks up, but whatever. Yeah. But me is also like a gesture towards divinity because it's like a way of transcending the mortal, becoming immortal, like kind of sand, juniper, all knowing source. Yeah. Or uploading your consciousness in a way that transcends the physical form. I think all of that is kind of wrapped up in this. In this hyperreal body.
- [50:07]
A
Yeah, completely. Plus when you look at just like divinity as what you worship, your God is what you worship and your worship as sacrifice, where what are you sacrificing your time to? What are you sacrificing your money to your body to? It's tech, it's social media.
- [50:26]
B
We already talk about the very real ways we've sacrificed our bodies to tech. Like we talk about tech neck. Or the way all our shoulders are rounding over and we're all kind of hunching over and hunching down, like that's a very real physical consequence of our technological use.
- [50:38]
A
Even just like the standard of skin today of what it should look like and ageless. That is a screen.
- [50:46]
B
Yes.
- [50:47]
A
That is not skin. Yeah. We sacrifice so much.
- [50:52]
B
Yeah. So I think we're going to continue to see that in ways that I can't even predict at the moment. And I'm also interested. I mean, we'll talk about it in the book club tonight, but more of kind of bringing Baudrillard's perspective on the hyperreal and like the hyperreal replacing the real entirely. Um, I think that's very apt and true. And then as like kind of an offshoot of the hyperreal body is just like padded bodies I think is also part of that where it's not necessarily about creating. How do I put this? Because it's like in the hyperreal we see things like extended breasts or extended hips, but in the padded out bodies it's like fully the whole body. It's like being wrapped in a sumo suit or something like it. And there is no concern with kind of extending the parts of the real parts that are already extended. It's like the whole body can be padded or built out. You know, like even I'm thinking about a super early example of this. Before I even knew what it was going to become. I started calling it bumper cars because like Meg thee stallion wore this dress that just had a big round bolster around her waist and around her boobs. But like when I say around her boobs like a circular, like a, like a pillow, like a bolster that goes all the way around. Not trying to like make her boobs look more voluptuous or whatever, like a separate object on top of them. And yeah, that's kind of the vibes of the padded out body. It feels very drag inspired to me. Like kind of the way drag artists like artificially build and enhance their shape and their body using padding foam.
- [52:28]
A
Yeah, completely.
- [52:29]
B
And we've seen this. I mean, honestly, it's been a lot of Duran Land Tank. My. My frenemy Duran Lyntink has been doing a lot of this padded stuff. Like we have Emily Ratajkowski had like a padded out like winged shoulder from his Jean Paul Gaultier collection. And Jody Turner Smith also had a jumpsuit that had big distended breasts that were padded out. Obviously a little more hyper real than my full padded body trim. But yeah, I don't know. I think there's something interesting there and it. And it makes me feel like. I don't know, my first thought always seeing these outfits is like bracing for impact.
- [53:05]
A
Yeah. It feels like a little protective.
- [53:07]
B
It feels protective.
- [53:09]
A
Like a different take on the chainmail medieval clothing as protection sort of thing.
- [53:16]
B
Yeah. And also kind of in that like if chainmail felt like a gesture to a pre capitalist past or the birth of capitalist past. Like the padding feels like a gesture to the future to me.
- [53:29]
A
You have your futuristic.
- [53:30]
B
Yeah. And like a, like a preparation for what's to come. It feels like more fifth element or something.
- [53:37]
A
Yes, completely. I'm thinking like tubing. I don't know why.
- [53:42]
B
Yeah, that feels future. Totally. It Always reminds me of if you've ever played, if you've ever gone bowling with like the bumper lanes. Yeah, it's very. That.
- [53:52]
A
Yes.
- [53:53]
B
Yeah.
- [53:54]
A
I mean, I, my beauty prediction that kind of piggybacks on that is, I'm calling it hypergender. And it's a continuation of what we're already seeing happening with gender performance and specifically cisgender gender performance. And I think it's like, you know, very exaggerated femininity, very exaggerated masculinity, all of which is dependent on the tools of the cosmetic industry to, to, to build these exaggerations. It's obviously like a response to what's happening in the political sphere as like Trump and his inner circle are like policing gender. I think the pressure to adopt traditionally feminine or traditionally masculine aesthetics, whether it's because you agree with these policies or you need protection from these policies, like, only increases. So I think we're going to see women continuing to use surgery and hormones to exaggerate their, these so called feminine traits and men continuing to use surgery and hormones to exaggerate these so called masculine traits, all while the government polices the use of these same tools for trans people, making it harder for them to like, one, access health care and two, harder for them to you know, pass when they can access these tools. Because the, the ideal of femininity and masculinity are just becoming more and more and more exaggerated and more and more and more unreal or hyperreal. And again, I was reading the simulacra and simulation and I was thinking of this in terms of what Baudrillard says about Disneyland and like how society actually needs the hyperreal in order to justify the real, sort of. So like he says, like Disneyland is presented as imaginary to make us believe that the rest is real.
- [55:48]
B
Right.
- [55:49]
A
And I think hypergender will be the same way. It will be presented as this exaggerated thing in order to make us believe that regular everyday presentations of gender are real, are fixed, are biological, when they are in fact gender just as much constructed. You know, they're conscious constructions or subconscious constructions, but they're not necessarily fixed or biological or real. And in, in a certain sense of.
- [56:18]
B
The word, real, I think you see that too in the, in the fashion version of the hyperreal body trend where it's like, right, enhancing women's breasts, enhancing women's hips and you know, like exaggerating to the extremes these like gender markers. Or even I was thinking about like Duran's debut at Jean Paul Gaultier with the bodysuits that are like sex Swapped where it's almost, it's like hyper real but making those bodies a joke or a punchline as though those bodies don't exist or they can't happen. You know what I mean? Does that make sense completely?
- [56:56]
A
Yes. I don't think I'm like quite smart enough to fully grasp the BIAN concept I am trying to apply to a thousand percent. We'll be doing more research on this before I write my actual friend report. But there is something like very compelling to me there about this idea of the hyper real being needed in order for society to justify the regular bullshit that's happening on a day to day basis and say, see, look, this is the real thing. Because this exaggerated thing over here is not real.
- [57:32]
B
Right?
- [57:33]
A
I don't know. I don't know.
- [57:34]
B
Yeah, no, I'm with you. I'm not smart enough to figure it out, but I know there's something there and eventually I'm going to get to the bottom of it. Eventually I'm going to understand what this man is saying. Even if I have to look at the word aleatory a thousand times because he uses it a thousand times. And every single time I'm like, what's that?
- [57:51]
A
I couldn't tell you. I couldn't tell you what it means right now.
- [57:53]
B
A roll of the dice. I finally remembered it. Chance. I know, it's so useful. That's also what pisses me off. Every time I look at it I'm like, oh, I could actually use that word aleatory by chance. A roll of the dice. The other word he taught me is alterity. Do you know what that one is?
- [58:09]
A
No, no I don't.
- [58:10]
B
Otherness.
- [58:11]
A
Oh yeah, like alter.
- [58:13]
B
Yeah. That's the only reason I remember it is because I'm like, right, the word alter is in there.
- [58:18]
A
Perfect.
- [58:18]
B
Anyway, those are two vocab words I learned from poetry art this month. My next trend prediction is like celebs going mask off politically for attention. We already kind of saw this with Sydney Sweeney, right?
- [58:34]
A
Who then tried to put the mask on.
- [58:37]
B
Right? Well, she's doing, she's waffling. Which is couldn't be a worse suggestion. As I wrote on Substack, like, what is her team doing? You gotta go hard one way or the other. You can't waffle back and forth. Nobody respects that you've lost both sides of the political spectrum that way. But I do think we're gonna see more celebs kind of like lean into MAGA as a way to get attention because we've kind of always Seen this throughout the Trump presidency. I mean, Joy Villa is my number one enemy of mess who's been. Do you know her?
- [59:08]
A
No.
- [59:08]
B
She's been doing this since the dawn of Trump.
- [59:10]
A
She is just like, oh, oh, yes, okay, I remember.
- [59:13]
B
Terrible musical artist that nobody listens to and nobody cares about. And she knows that, too, which is why she made Trump her entire identity. And she goes to the Grammys every year wearing some inflammatory, insane ball gown that's like, Make America Great again. Or she made one about building the wall. She made another one about abortion is murder. She does a different little one every year that's just like, disgusting and insane, but it gets her so much more attention than she's ever gotten in her life, which is why she keeps doing it. It's not worked as well in the second term. I will say.
- [59:44]
A
No, I don't.
- [59:45]
B
It worked a lot better for her in the first season.
- [59:47]
A
Not as, like, novel.
- [59:48]
B
Exactly. And the fashion's bad also, you know, so people don't want to look at it. But I do think we're going to see, I don't know. With Sydney Sweeney. I just think they're realizing that we're in a, like, a woke backlash period, because for a long time, celebrities thought that being woke would get them attention, right? And so they'd post messages and things that they like. Maybe they believe it, maybe they don't. It's clearly just like they were reading the room and like, what was expected of them and the vibe was right, you know? And so I think they're going to kind of do that again, but in a inflammatory, gross way where you realize just how little values they personally hold or stand behind. And I also think we're going to see that more in advertising because we've already started to see, I mean, American Eagle. We've spoken about the Sydney Sweeney thing. That's intentional. That's fully intentional. Like I said before, they lied about Kendrick Lamar's jeans at the super bowl for no reason. Like, nobody checked that. Nobody care. Like, just flagrantly lied days after the fact. We already had a credit that they were Celine. They said they were American Eagle. To what end, God only knows. But I do think they're just going to keep rage baiting like that. We saw with Sephora too, you know, like, basically calling us poor. We can't buy Sephora products for Christmas. I think we're going to see a lot more kind of antagonistic stuff like that. And I actually, I saw a TikTok recently that I thought really explained it well. And got to the core of, like, what feels like is happening with. With both these corporations and kind of just like, I don't know, in capitalism at large, where she was saying that it feels like these brands are mad at us that they have to go through us to get our money. Like, we are the only obstacle in the way towards getting our money. And they're, like, angry at us and, like, disgusted with us. And someone said that that's the same way that jobs treat our labor. Like our employers are disgusted about this and angry with us that they have to go through us to get our labor. I just thought that was so well put and so apt. And that is what these rage bait ads feel like too. It's like that they're mad at us that they have to, like, tow a line or like BPC or come up with interesting, innovative ideas and products in order to get us to spend our money on them. Even though she also said that we've gone from customers to consumers and, like. And that difference is kind of everything.
- [62:15]
A
Yeah.
- [62:16]
B
Yeah. I don't know. I was really blown away by that. I think there's. That's. That's really the vibe.
- [62:21]
A
Yes. Yeah. Really. From citizens to customers.
- [62:25]
B
From citizens to customers to consumers. Right. To the point where. Because she was saying about, like, you know, like, they're knowingly putting toxic chemicals in our products that, like, give us cancer and kill us. Like, they're disgusted with us. Like, why should they make safe products for us? Like, just buy it. Shut up and buy it. Kind of the vibe. Or like you were saying. I think she even brought up this point in the video itself about, like, hair care products having, like, chemicals in them that, like, give young black girls, like, lifelong health conditions. And they're kind of just like, shut up. Yeah, shut up and buy it.
- [62:57]
A
This is the only way it works.
- [62:59]
B
Yeah. Deal with it.
- [62:59]
A
It's a way. I think it's like a consequence of prioritizing product over person.
- [63:06]
B
Yeah.
- [63:08]
A
And even with, like, relatively safe ingredients, we see this all of the time. Like, I'm thinking of, like, the debate over silicones in skincare and hair care products. Like, most of these silicones are benign in terms of, like, safety for. For humans at least. Like, there's some data on bioaccumulating in the environment, blah, blah, blah. But the reason I am, like, we don't need. Silicones are great for corporations and they're great for products. They're cheap. They make for a smooth consistency. They make a texture that consumers really like. They offer, like, no benefit to hair or skin in terms of, like, health and functioning. These are really great ingredients because they're great for corporations, and we have been made to be like, oh, well, if it's great for the product, I want it because you, like, I don't know. I don't know. Yeah, yeah, there's a lot there. That was a real tangent that, I don't know, I just went off.
- [64:08]
B
But no, it's true. And plus, with, like, RFK rolling back all of the, like, FDA guidelines and stuff, and, like, any type of, like, monitoring or policing of, like, what's in our food, our products, anything we consume and use on our bodies, it's like. Yeah, it feels like they're. Well, they're punishing us for daring not to.
- [64:25]
A
Daring to have some concern, not believing their industry science that says this is totally, totally fine.
- [64:32]
B
And it's like, it's taken like. Like, I feel like in advertising, there's always kind of this assumption that, like, the consumer is stupid, but it's kind of taken that to a new level of, like, not only are you stupid, like, you don't know anything. Like, we know bet. Like, don't even question this. Just spend your money. Shut up.
- [64:48]
A
Yeah, it's offensive.
- [64:50]
B
Yeah, it's offensive that you think you could question us.
- [64:52]
A
Question a brand. Yeah. Okay, my next prediction is a big Americana aesthetics boom timed to the 250th anniversary of 1776, the birth of American independence. But, yeah, I think just, like, around this, we're going to see a lot of Americana aesthetics. For some reason, what's jumping out to me is, like, Dolly parton classic bombshell, like,'50s bombshell housewife, reimagined, very Sydney Sweeney. 80s excess Americana.
- [65:34]
B
Yeah, we're already in 80s.
- [65:35]
A
Yeah. Red, white, blue, white skin, red lipstick, you know, blonde, blonde, blonde, blue eyes. Yeah, of course. Of course. Yeah. I don't really have much to add there, except that I think there's going to be a little. Little Americana.
- [65:51]
B
Yeah. I mean, the time feels ripe. I hope it's a anti Americana movement. I don't know. It's interesting because the way people already feel about the American flag is so tainted. I don't know. I'd be interested in seeing what, like, a subversive Americana aesthetic looks like.
- [66:12]
A
Yeah, yeah.
- [66:14]
B
I don't know really what that would be. It's funny because it's Americana is a weird one because it, like, absorbs everything. Like, you know, to me, once upon a time, I would have said an anti Americana aesthetic is like, Alana del Rey where she's, like, taking these tropes and, like, subverting them and making them dark. But, like, Americana is so powerful. It just, like, reabsorbs everything back into itself. So it's, like, kind of impossible to have a.
- [66:36]
A
Well, Americana Bizarro American is its own sort of, like, hyper reality. It's an imagined.
- [66:43]
B
It's already kind of like absorbing the dark. Yeah.
- [66:46]
A
That is completely erasing the actual history of. Of America and its origins. Completely. Yeah.
- [66:56]
B
Yeah. I don't know. I have a couple that are linked, basically. You know, this was my year of big shapes. Big, giant geometric gowns on the red carpet. And so out of that, I think we're going to see, like, a couple things emerge. Like, one, I think we're just gonna go into the 2D. Like, we've been in the 3D, and I think we're gonna start seeing, like, large flat shapes. We've already kind of started seeing them, like, kind of, like large, flat circles applied to the body. I think we'll see squares. I think we'll see Trines. Time is a flat circle. We're entering flatlands, you know, that lovely Victorian novella. And, Yeah, I don't know, I think we're gonna see kind of those shapes compressed and flattened and. Yeah, and also, in a way, kind of like taking up less space, I think, in the year to come than they have been. Although, I don't know, I'd be interested to see how that melds with kind of what we said about fetish wear and, like, rendering the user, like, unable to move themselves and, like, artificially hindering their body's functionality. I think 2D shapes will be a part of that. And also out of the 2D shapes, we're also seeing. I've said this a lot in my newsletter, but we're seeing a lot of stuff going on with shoulders. Yeah, shoulders are getting pretty funky. This popped up maybe two years ago. We first got what I was calling crone shoulders from Rick Owens, which was a really pronounced, kind of bony protrusion up and out of the shoulder. Really kind of what you would expect from a fairy tale witch, a crone. And yeah, it was a little sinister. It was pretty dark, as Rick Owens tends to be. And also kind of a gesture death, in a way. A death gesture, like mortality, aging. Yeah, And I think we're going to continue to see. We're seeing a lot more of that. Just weird stuff going on Shoulder. Like we're extending them super wide or we're building them up from the shoulder straight to the jawline. So it's kind of a triangular shape or. Yeah. All sorts of different accentuations and emphasis I'm thinking about. Also, Cynthia Erivo wore a Schiaparelli dress that just had like, two round donuts, kind of like patent leather donuts setting atop the shoulder. Kind of like an epaulette situation. And I think there's something there too. Just basically anything that isn't a normal shoulder shape, we're embracing. And that too, to me, feels like hyper, real adjacent, like, kind of just pressing. It feels like all these attempts to, like, press against the, like, literal physical boundaries of our body and extend them or morph them. And also, like, very. I mean, I guess I'll just get to my next one, which is. I think there's something going on with proportions also, which I cannot. I keep saying this, and I know that it's, like, super vague and no one really understands what I'm talking about because no one has my, like, sick freak mind. But there's just something going on with, like, shapes and sizing and. And all of these gestures towards, like, things that are intentionally unflattering and, like, manipulate the body in a way that's, like, not. I don't know. Celebrity fashion is usually so focused on being sexy. Like, sexy and tight and revealing and exposing. And all of these clothes gesture towards, like, obscuring, hiding, manipulating, extending in a way that's like, decidedly unflattering.
- [70:19]
A
I think, okay, this might be. This is just coming to me now. And I. I don't know if there's anything there.
- [70:29]
B
Yeah.
- [70:30]
A
But the idea of, like, unflattering and obscuring, to me, what it brings up is, like, typical behavior of anorexics or bulimics. And I'm thinking of disordered eating. I'm thinking of the focus on thinness.
- [70:48]
B
Yeah.
- [70:49]
A
Where this focus on thinness, you know, is more about control than sexiness.
- [70:55]
B
Interesting.
- [70:55]
A
And a lot of people who lose weight rapidly or in the midst of disorder are not showing off their bodies. They're not like, look how skinny I am. There's like, a lot of obscuring and protectiveness that goes on there. So I wonder. I don't know, I wonder if there's.
- [71:14]
B
Yeah, that's. That's a very interesting point. I hadn't considered that before, but I. They're definitely. I mean, after the year of ozempic we've had. I can certainly see. And even the year of discourse we've had around celebrities bodies and celebrities eating through and projecting whether they are not Having them. I can. I can see this type of fashion even being kind of like a protective layer of, like, don't look at my body, don't perceive my body. Like, don't speculate. You know, whether you do have disordered eating or not. You know, I can see that it's similar in the padded bodies trend, is that there's just gesture towards creating distance almost between yourself and the viewer and, like, obscuring the body so that it can't be.
- [71:53]
A
Or even, like, a justification where it's like, look, I'm not trying to have the perfect body. I'm not trying to be standard perfect. Yeah, I'm doing. I'm really thin, but I'm doing weird things and weird shapes and weird shoulders and padding. And, like, this isn't. I'm not trying to be aspirational, sort of. I don't know.
- [72:13]
B
Yeah, no, that's very interesting. I guess I'll. I'll give my two kind of the two most concrete examples that come to mind for me of. Of this trend that I've seen recently. One is Jennifer Lawrence in this Lee. The brand is LII Lee, I believe, skirt that just has, like, a. A giant flap of fabric coming off the front of it. I will. In the video, you'll be looking at it currently. We'll link out to it in the show notes, I guess, as well. But it's like. It's like a kangaroo. It's like a distended kangaroo pouch. Like, she is wearing a black miniskirt, but then it's like a half circle of fabric kind of coming off the front and dangling loosely as though it's like a giant distended pocket that you could fit things in. Oh.
- [72:58]
A
Oh, yes. I like this.
- [73:01]
B
You did find it? Yeah.
- [73:02]
A
Yes, I found it.
- [73:03]
B
But to me, that's. There's something there going on with, like, the proportion and the extension and dramatism. So that's one. And then I guess the kind of simpler one that I've been thinking about a lot lately is Chloe Sevigny wore this Saint Laurent dress. I have no idea where she was, but it's like a bright green kind of mini dress, long sleeve, and it comes with these cranberry leather gloves. And then Kourtney Kardashian wore it for Christmas because it is extremely a Christmas dress. But there's something about the way it's cut where looks too big. Like, it's, like, intentionally designed to be, like, oversized in, like, a super unflattering way. Like, it makes the body look very Cylindrical, Not. I wouldn't even say in like a cool way, like a kind of like an unflattering way. And I don't know, I think that's very interesting, especially from a brand like Saint Laurent, that for the past couple years, Anthony Basarello has been like so revealing, so focused on exposing the body. I mean, he was absolutely at the forefront of like the super nude year we had in 2023. Like, all of his dresses were completely see through, worn with thongs. Like, if the tits are out, it is because of Anthony Vassar El. And I just think it's so interesting that he pivoted from kind of like super sexy to this year kind of doing adult babies, hardcore, like big grown up toddlers. And then these dresses that are kind of. Yeah. Unflattering to the body. Even when you see it on the Runway, on like a. A model's body, it's unflattering. It's like that's tough to do, to be quite honest with you. It's tough to make a hanger look a bat, you know, like a professional good looking person is looking bad in your clothes. Like you're doing it on purpose, you know?
- [74:45]
A
Yeah, that's the intention. Yeah.
- [74:48]
B
Anyway, so there's something going on with proportions and I can't put my finger on it more specifically than that, but I will. It will develop in the year to come and hopefully I come up with a little buzzword for you for it.
- [74:59]
A
Okay, speaking of buzzword, I'm still trying to come up with what I want to call this, but I think the trend and a lot of people have been predicting this, but not in the way that I want to talk about it. So it's like a backlash to the clean girl. We're seeing the messy girl. People are calling it the messy girl, but my influence. I know, but okay. With beauty. This, it's not mess. It's not mess. It's not real. It's curated chaos. It's like meticulous mess. Make believe mess. It is. I don't know, we're going to adjacent.
- [75:39]
B
To the proportion thing where it's like old ugliness or something.
- [75:43]
A
Yes. So it's like we're going to see messier or grungier aesthetics as a backlash to the clean girl. But they won't actually be messy or grungy. They will be meticulous, carefully curated to look messy. I mean, it's the same thing as like effortlessness that you. That requires effort or high maintenance to be low maintenance. But just with Like, a slightly different aesthetic outcome. So people are going to be, like, very carefully curating this image of the anti Clean Girl. In effect. Really, we've completely absorbed all of the lessons of Clean Girl, and we're just putting a different aesthetic spin on it. So I just, like, I don't see people feeling free to be messy. And I'll put it in the show notes. I just saw a really interesting Instagram video of this of someone who's like, I'm sick of Clean Girl. I want to be a mess. And they're putting all their makeup on in a really messy way, but then blending it in perfectly and. And making it like, you still get the same contour and highlight and blah, blah, blah. It's just like, okay, you're making it look messy, but this is right very. To get a clean result, very intentionally done. You're not allowing the mess to manifest as mess.
- [76:55]
B
The first thing that I thought of. Maybe you can tell me if this is in line with your vision or not. But the first thing I thought about was Sydney Sweeney, once again at the GQ Men of the Year party, where she, like, did hair and makeup that was like, you could tell that it was supposed to be grunge. Like, that was the vibe of it, but it was so controlled and perfect that I'm like, grunge doesn't look like that.
- [77:21]
A
Yes.
- [77:22]
B
Like, she, like, put a bunch of gel in her hair so it's like crispy, crunchy. And then she, like, tight dyed her roots, dark roots. She tight lined her eyes with black eyeliner. But it's like, not smudged at all. It's just, like, perfect. And I was like. And there's no blush to be. She's just so. So white and pale. And it's like, I get what you're going after, but, like, you kind of. The grunge had, like a chaos and a reality to it, you know? Yes.
- [77:47]
A
This is my next prediction is politically coded aesthetics devoid of politics. Like grunge, like punk, like goth, a lot of these.
- [77:55]
B
So as I wrote about that Sydney Sweeney look, it's very Nancy Grace. It's very Jenny McCarthy, which is a. Which is a Republican coded aesthetic.
- [78:05]
A
Yeah. Yes. Oh, yeah. That's so true. But yeah, I think we're gonna see a lot of mimicking these, like, older aesthetics that grew out of political movements that grew out of, like, values based movements. And we're just adopting the aesthetic of it because it looks cool with none of the associated politics. It's like a very individualistic take on this rather than community signaling, which is how these aesthetics originally took off. Like, you're not going to be able to look at someone who's doing the grunge makeup that Sydney Sweeney was doing in that look and be like, oh, we have something in common. I'm going to gravitate to you. We're part of the same movement. There's not going to be like a shared value set associated with the aesthetic.
- [78:52]
B
That's very interesting. That's definitely something that I've. I've thought about before in relationship to Vivian Westwood, especially after her death, you know, and the way that her brand has been, I don't know, Gen Z loves her pearl necklaces. I don't know the way that they've embraced her without kind of understanding who she was or the, the position that she held and her values and stuff and like what made her brand what it is. Or even knowing that she like literally invented the punk aesthetic. Like punks dress the way they dress because of Vivienne Westwood. That was like a lifestyle, you know, I don't know. And her environmentalism and all of that has been completely divorced from her product. And yeah, as a luxury good, like she is of fully consumed as a luxury good now minus any kind of the, the trappings that she brought along with it. And I think that's gestures towards what you're talking about.
- [79:44]
A
Totally. I love, I love the word divorce there too. That's exactly. It's like divorced from meaning. Devoid of meaning.
- [79:51]
B
Yeah. Also, I'm not going to remember, but something happened after she died where I don't remember the brand collaborated with another brand or a particular person wore it or something. But it was just like the most, I don't know, the most anti climate change situation where you're just like she is rolling over in her grave right now. Like this is everything she stood against and it's like being, I don't know, co opted in this way. Yeah. I mean that such is the nature of movements like that any sort of youth movement, any sort of like countercultural thing has to be reabsorbed. And talk about Baudrillard.
- [80:32]
A
Very Baudrillardian.
- [80:33]
B
One has to exist for the other to exist, you know, in an endless loop. My last trend prediction is just, I think we're going to continue to see face. Obscuring techniques is kind of the best I can put it. And I think it's gonna take a couple of different forms. I was already thinking about it, obviously, because I've been egging Kim Kardashian on into hiding her face for God. Years now. Years and years. And she's finally started to listen. And it's like, not only in the traditional kind of way of the Margiela masks, although I could see those coming back now that I feel like they've been long enough since Kanye kind of brought them into the mainstream in the Yeezy Yeezus era, that I think people could kind of return to those in a way that's divorced from him, because I think he kind of ruined them for a lot of people for a long time. But they are incredibly beautiful, so I could see those coming back. But also likewise, Kim has been wearing these huge, huge Rick Owens like, shield sunglasses that truly cover three fourths of her face. And I can see that, too, being used as kind of like an obscuring tactic. And likewise, what we talked about, I think it was last month with Addison Rae's blindfold.
- [81:50]
A
Yeah.
- [81:51]
B
Or this kind of denial of sight. This kind of denial of. Of her sight being laid upon you as, like, a valuable object. I can see, like, even a celebrity's appearance becoming like you're denied even their appearance in public, because that's something that's like they get paid for, you know, like that's something only for a paying customer or a magazine or a brand or whatever. And so it's kind of. Yeah. Creating exclusivity out of kind of the most common moments. And then I also was thinking about this extra hard the other day because Instagram served me this ad for this guy, Tomikono Wigs. Incredible, incredible wig artist that I'm now super into, apparently. So Tomikono, apparently they worked with supreme when supreme did that Margiela collab and they released all those blonde wigs. I don't know if you recall.
- [82:44]
A
Don't remember.
- [82:45]
B
A blonde wig is like a signature of Margiela, has long been. And so when they collabed with supreme, they sold these blonde wigs in, like, the branded plastic Margiela by Supreme bags. And apparently Tomo Kono is the one who made those wigs, according to their Instagram. Yeah. And so I was. But I was thinking about him specifically in terms of this trend because he created these wigs that. That have bangs that go over almost the whole face. And then on top of the bangs is, like, airbrushed anime eyes.
- [83:20]
A
Oh, whoa. Oh, you've been talking about that. I feel.
- [83:24]
B
Yes. And so I include a picture in the video version. We'll link out to it in the show notes. But because it's very. It's kind of hard to imagine until you see it, but it truly looks like an airbrush face on top of the hair.
- [83:36]
A
Cool.
- [83:37]
B
And so it's like wearing a mask. But you could also, like, brush it to the side and there's your real face. And I think there's something about, again, a little hyperreal in there. And yeah. Kind of the like, re establishing exclusivity artificially, I think, as part of the face obscuring thing.
- [83:56]
A
That's interesting.
- [83:57]
B
Yeah.
- [83:59]
A
My next one is not necessarily obscuring, but sort of related. I think we're going to see a big comeback of oil blotting sheets.
- [84:07]
B
They're long overdue. I got to tell you, as a girl who grew up on them, I can't believe they're not more popular than they.
- [84:13]
A
I think we're going to get them.
- [84:14]
B
They used to rule over middle school with an iron fist. I don't know if people understand so many of them. Every girl in the world had them in her backpack, was using them in the middle of class. Like you had to be blotting. Anyone who was anyone was blotting.
- [84:30]
A
Always be.
- [84:30]
B
And you had to look at it after too, because you wanted to see that they were like, see through much oil.
- [84:34]
A
Oil, yes.
- [84:35]
B
And the paper goes from opaque to see through with your oils. That was like a very important part of it.
- [84:41]
A
So important. I think this hits on so many little trends that are coming up that I would be so shocked if we didn't see a big oil blotting sheet come back. I'm thinking maybe from Starface, maybe from Road.
- [84:54]
B
You're so right.
- [84:55]
A
There's so many potential for accessories here, which were huge this year. Carrying cases. Even like a little card case, like a girl bossy card case for your oil blotting sheets.
- [85:05]
B
Put it on the back of the phone chains.
- [85:07]
A
Yes. Put it on the back of the phone. Put it on a keychain. Huge. I also think it'll be part of the transition, the slow transition from glazed skin, porcelain doll skin, to matte mannequin skin over the next couple years. I don't think we're going to see glazed go anywhere necessarily, but we're going to start seeing a little bit of backlash from too much shine, too much oil, too much wet. And the oil blotting sheet is going to be a big part of this.
- [85:34]
B
I agree with you so much. And especially as everyone becomes like. What's the word for it? Like, in front of camera? Entertainment. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, as everyone becomes like the star of their own little show on the Internet. I see blotting being more important than ever. You can't be shiny on screen.
- [85:53]
A
Yes, yes, yes, yes. That's such a great point. And then my last little prediction is pet nail care.
- [86:01]
B
Oh, yeah.
- [86:02]
A
There was a huge pet beauty boom this year. I just wrote about it for CNN the other week. The year the beauty industry made you its bitch. And I think we're gonna get more of that. Thank you. I think we're gonna expand outside of dogs and outside of shampoo and conditioner, and we're gonna see pet nail care come to the fore. So strengthening treatments for the nails or even, like a pet mani pedi set that has, like, nail clippers or nail files, Especially for dogs or cat nails.
- [86:32]
B
Totally.
- [86:33]
A
Maybe even nail polish if we're getting a little crazy.
- [86:36]
B
Well, they already have. Have you ever seen the nail caps that you can put on?
- [86:40]
A
Yes, yes.
- [86:40]
B
That are, like, colored so it looks like your dog has little. But it protects their nails, I guess, from clawing or whatever. I don't know. I don't know what they say they do, but totally.
- [86:49]
A
I think we're gonna get, like, a luxury version of all of that.
- [86:52]
B
Yes.
- [86:53]
A
And, yeah, those are my predictions so far.
- [86:57]
B
I would like them to expand outside of traditional pets. Like, it's always cats and dogs, but it's never like a parrot or like a ferret or something, because there's not.
- [87:05]
A
There's just not enough money in it, you know?
- [87:08]
B
But the people are out there. The people who own those are out there. And they, like, crave beauty for their pets. And I think we need to look at the full spectrum of pet realness.
- [87:17]
A
Yeah.
- [87:17]
B
Glamour.
- [87:18]
A
There's not a lot for cats. There is not a lot.
- [87:20]
B
There isn't as much for cats. Well, because they know that cats don't tolerate it.
- [87:25]
A
Cats will not tolerate a bath.
- [87:26]
B
Right. They fight back on all of the beauty care. You need a submissive dog just accepting the beauty.
- [87:33]
A
Cats are kind of like an. An anti beauty industry icon. An anti grooming icon.
- [87:39]
B
Absolutely. Also inspiration for your year of being bitchier cats.
- [87:42]
A
Yes.
- [87:45]
B
They don't put up a shit.
- [87:47]
A
I love this. I'm going to embody the cat. Yeah. Okay. I think that's. That's all of our predictions thus far. Right.
- [87:57]
B
Thus far. But I'm always, you know, new ones will develop as the year unfolds and my. And my brain unfolds and begins working again post holidays.
- [88:05]
A
Yeah. I mean, I do feel like the beginning of the year is a bit of a corny and not very useful time to be doing all these predictions, but it's what one does. But of course, predictions come throughout the.
- [88:17]
B
Year and we bring them predictions. What can you do?
- [88:21]
A
We love making them.
- [88:22]
B
We love to give them.
- [88:24]
A
Should we do mess of the month? It's. I mean, it's been a long episode, but I will. I love to end with a little mess.
- [88:30]
B
Squeeze a little mess in there. My mess of the month is once again Tom Brady, my king. He is so funny. His use of Instagram is so funny to me. I just can never get over it. You might recall that he was previously my mess of the month because after news broke in the tabloids that his ex wife, Gisele Bundchen, was pregnant by her, like, what is he, her jiu jitsu trainer?
- [88:56]
A
Trainer, yeah.
- [88:57]
B
Yes. And they were expecting their child, he posted the most divorced man Instagram story I've ever seen in my life, which was a beautiful sunset, which he set to the Fleetwood Mac song Landslide. And then he typed the lyrics, can the child within my heart rise above with like a. With like three hearts. Which is just the most divorced behavior I've ever seen in my life. And I. I'm obsessed. It's so funny. I love when celebrities just like, like genuinely use their. Like they genuinely are posting through it. Like, it's not pr. It's not to sell you anything. They are just using it like an instant messenger away message from like 2006. You know, like, they are posting lyrics and their heart is breaking. And I love it. You might also recall Orlando Bloom did a fake version of this kind of recently when he broke.
- [89:47]
A
He was spawn conning.
- [89:48]
B
He was spawn conning me for his Amazon miniseries or whatever the hell. Anyway, Tom did it again. He did it again. And I cannot believe that this is true. But basically, I think over the holidays we found out that Giselle got married to her instructor. Oh, I can't even get through this. She got married to her jiu jitsu instructor. And on the day that we found out that she got married to her jiu jitsu instructor, Tom again is posts a selfie of himself in a sweatshirt that says forever young.
- [90:23]
A
Okay, okay.
- [90:25]
B
It's not so bad. But he said it to the song. 1-800-273-8255 by Logic, which everyone knows is the suicide song because that's the suicide hotline number. And of course, the song is about not. Not committing suicide, but it is a song.
- [90:42]
A
Okay, we need to safety check Tom Brady, everyone.
- [90:45]
B
Safety check Tom Brady. Make sure he's Okay.
- [90:49]
A
I wonder if he got reported on Instagram for that.
- [90:52]
B
In. It's just such a wild choice because.
- [90:54]
A
There'S a way to be like, I think this person.
- [90:57]
B
This person might self harm. Like, I need to report. He surely got reported a million times that day because that is crazy work. That song isn't even like new or popular at this point. Like, it's just. It's so strange and it has nothing to do clearly, with anything that he's posting. Like, he was just posting a weird selfie of his sweatshirt. Like, tom, buddy, get into therapy, my dude. Like, stop using your Instagram as a way of like, catharsis. Like, like, please just seek professional help. And it's like you're also acting like you played no part in the demise of your marriage. After Giselle specifically asked you to quit football. You quit football and then you went right back to football and then you just to quit a year later. You did this. You were part of this.
- [91:41]
A
He knows it. He knows.
- [91:43]
B
He knows it.
- [91:44]
A
He regrets it.
- [91:45]
B
He regrets it. Yeah, clearly. He really regrets.
- [91:47]
A
He really does. He knows he messed up.
- [91:50]
B
I just. I love it. I. That's just such a rarity to get content like this from a celebr celebrity. That just feels so true and sad. I don't know. I. I appreciate his vulnerability on the web. This is actually turning me. I've grown up as a lifelong Tom Brady hater, and this is actually turning me towards him. So I guess it's good pr. Well done, Tom. You've made me like you. I've hated you my whole life. And this. And the needed a little vulnerability. Yeah. This in the document and the docu series where you're like, so weird with your kids is honestly turning me into a fan.
- [92:25]
A
I have to start paying attention. I do follow him. You inspired me to start following him on Instagram.
- [92:29]
B
It's a fun follow.
- [92:30]
A
His stuff never comes up for me. I guess I'm not on Instagram that often, so I haven't check in, trained the algorithm to show me, but yeah.
- [92:37]
B
You got to check in on that guy.
- [92:38]
A
I know this is stuff that I can't be missing. My mess of the month is a little conspiracy theory of mine about the Jenner Kardashians.
- [92:50]
B
Please.
- [92:51]
A
So Kris Jenner is in the midst of a press cycle right now where she's saying her nose is probably the only thing on my face that's real. So it's like, it's cosmetic transparency of. I've changed everything about my face except my nose. My nose Is real.
- [93:08]
B
It's the ship of Theseus. Like, it's like the great philosophical question of, like, if you replace every part of your face, is it still your face? I'm obsessed. I think about it. Wake up thinking about this every day.
- [93:20]
A
I need an essay from you on this. I need a deep dive into this question.
- [93:24]
B
It's amazing.
- [93:26]
A
My conspiracy theory, though, is that Chris's insistence on the reality of her nose is related to Kim's historic insistence on the reality of her nose, which I think is far more questionable. I think if you just look at pictures of Kim over the years, her nose seems to have shape shifted over time. Two specifically have more of a resemblance to her mother's.
- [93:52]
B
Interesting.
- [93:53]
A
But she's consistently denied having any sort of surgery. She's even said things like, you'll see, when I have kids, they're gonna have the same nose as me. My nose is real. My nose is real. And I cannot for the life of me find this online. But I swear, if anybody remembers this, maybe you remember it, let me know.
- [94:12]
B
Possible.
- [94:12]
A
I swear at one point she was like, there's just a weird thing about all the women in my family. Our noses get smaller as we age. I swear she said that.
- [94:22]
B
I don't remember that, but that sounds.
- [94:24]
A
Now I'm thinking. And now I'm thinking, was that something she said while I was working at Whale Rock on the apps on the Kardashian apps? Was that, like, that's all been wiped from the information and it's just not out there? Because I heard it in a private conversation or something. But I'm scouring the Internet for this. So if anyone remembers this, I would love to hear. But I feel like, yeah, I feel like Kim's nose adjustments have been specifically to look more like Chris's in order to have this sort of, like, genetic component that she can lean back on and be like, no, my nose is totally real. And Chris's insistence that her nose is the only real thing on her face is part of this. This demand of kiss.
- [95:04]
B
That's very interesting. I'd also just like to point out that a classic Kardashian, like, what do I even call it? A piece of wordplay, I suppose, or like a trick, a sleight of hand that they use often is, I never had a surgery on my nose. There are non surgical nose jobs, and they don't count that as having a surgery on. They do a lot of that kind of technical language where they're like, oh, well, I've never had Botox. Yes, I've never had liposuction. It's like, right, you had fat grafting. It's like, technically the procedure was something different. And so she. You get to say, like, well, I never did that. And to normal people who aren't, like, deep in the plastic surgery world in the lingo and the vernacular, they're like, oh, so she's natural. She never had. No, they're not natural. They just specifically did not have that exact surgery done. So when Kim says that she's never had surgery, maybe she hasn't. Maybe technically she hasn't. But maybe it's filler. Maybe it's right. Maybe it's something else. And also, to me, the nose thing is interesting because I've also. I feel like that's a common thing that people point out on Chloe as well as her old nose as proof that O.J. was her father.
- [96:16]
A
Yeah.
- [96:16]
B
So it feels like racially coded as well.
- [96:19]
A
Definitely.
- [96:20]
B
And weird. I don't know. And Chloe specifically has had a non surgical nose job and documented it for something.
- [96:27]
A
Right. And I think she's had a regular old nose job too, I'm sure.
- [96:30]
B
Whatever.
- [96:31]
A
Yeah.
- [96:31]
B
But I specifically, for some reason, remember her documenting her non surgical nose job and telling us about it.
- [96:37]
A
Yeah.
- [96:39]
B
Interesting.
- [96:39]
A
Yeah. I don't know, maybe this is inappropriate speculation on my end.
- [96:43]
B
They certainly invite it.
- [96:46]
A
Something happening.
- [96:47]
B
They certainly leave the door wide open to such speculation. So. And they love to be talked about, so I don't think they'd be mad about it.
- [96:54]
A
No, they're fine. They're fine. But, yeah, I guess. I guess that's the end of the app.
- [97:01]
B
Yeah. People out there, please let me know if you think Kris Jenner gets to call it her face when nothing about her face is original. I'd love to hear your thoughts on that.
- [97:09]
A
Yeah.
- [97:11]
B
And what a weird, mental, I don't know, disconnect.
- [97:15]
A
Yeah. Yeah.
- [97:16]
B
To have a face that you've never had your entire life and. And to wake up every day as though that's your own. I don't know. This is very interesting to me.
- [97:23]
A
Clearly it is. And I want to hear your thoughts. I want to hear the people's thoughts. If you liked this episode, chime in, give us a nice review on Apple podcasts or whatever and. Yeah, we'll see you. We'll see you next month.
- [97:42]
B
Yeah, see you. As our many predictions unfold in the new year.
- [97:47]
A
All right, bye.
- [97:48]
B
Bye. Hotel.