Domonique Foxworth on MLBPA's SHOCKING Scandal, Jesse Jackson's death, The KD Files | 02.18

Summary

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The Right Time with Bomani Jones:

Domonique Foxworth on MLBPA’s SHOCKING Scandal, Jesse Jackson’s Death, The KD Files

Date: February 18, 2026
Host: Bomani Jones
Guest: Domonique Foxworth

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Episode Overview

In this lively episode, Bomani Jones and recurring guest Domonique Foxworth wade into three headline stories: the Major League Baseball Players Association’s (MLBPA) explosive workplace scandal involving Tony Clark, the passing and complicated legacy of civil rights icon Jesse Jackson, and the latest wild chapter in NBA star Kevin Durant’s ongoing saga with social media leaks. The duo serve up sharp, candid analysis mixing sports, culture, and humor.

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Key Discussions and Insights

1. MLBPA Scandal: Tony Clark’s Downfall

[02:00–25:27]

• Scandal Overview: Tony Clark, MLBPA head and former MLB player, embroiled in two scandals—allegations of personal financial enrichment off the union and, more damningly, revelations of an inappropriate relationship with his sister-in-law, a colleague at the union.
• Which Sister-in-Law’s Worse?:
  • Bomani poses the viral question: Is it worse for the affair to involve your wife’s sister or your brother’s wife?
    • “I vote B.” (i.e., wife’s sister) — Bomani ([04:31])
    • Dominique leans toward the other but admits both are “losing situations,” jokingly comparing it to car brands and models.
    • “If sister-in-law means your wife’s sister... that makes your kids hate you even more.” — Bomani ([05:17])
• Workplace Affairs and “The Office” Rule:
  • The hosts riff on workplace relationships, noting “everyone always thinks their office romance is secret—but someone always knows." ([10:40])
  • Dominique: “Work can be boring... a little hint of something, that’s gonna be all we talk about.” ([10:50])
• Union Leader Integrity:
  • The duo stress the special bond and trust required in union leadership, drawing on Dominique’s own union experience.
  • “The union has to be more noble than the other side because the other side is not bound by principle.” — Bomani ([21:32])
  • They note the impact of leadership scandal: “It affects everything much larger... when you are at the top and get caught, it’s so much worse than when it’s the other people. Because for you, it is not about you.” ([22:49])
• State of MLBPA and U.S. Unionism:
  • Bomani recounts MLBPA’s history as “the gold standard for American unions,” but laments sagging solidarity and compensation gains.
  • Dominique warns of union “corporatization" leading to a loss of collective spirit, especially with young, rich, and inexperience-heavy pro sports rosters—“No union ever works unless it’s the members.” ([24:00])

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2. Jesse Jackson: Death and Legacy

[28:24–41:18]

• Legacy Points:
  • Bomani marks Jesse Jackson as the “cooler” younger man of the civil rights movement, both legendary and mythmaking (echoes Stanley Crouch quote: “Jesse was ultimately doomed by his need to mythologize himself. But he also lived a legendary life.” ([29:00]))
  • Jackson’s crucial role in making Barack Obama’s 2008 win structurally possible, by pressing for proportional delegate rules after his 1988 run.
  • Dominique: “The distance Jesse traveled and the environment in which he fought—the things he accomplished—you could argue…that was just as or more valuable than any other real success.” ([31:21])
• Rainbow Coalition and Working-Class Advocacy:
  • Bomani highlights Jackson as “perhaps the most impactful advocate for the broader working class in America” and the Rainbow Coalition as a precursor to today’s multiracial movements ([33:08]).
• Reputation Management and History:
  • Dominique reflects that history “is facts, but it’s selected stories… the prices [Jesse] paid for his issues is inconsistent with the way that we treat just about anybody else. Cause nobody feels perfect.” ([35:49])
• Trump’s Unexpected Statement:
  • Bomani and Dominique dissect Donald Trump’s surprisingly warm, yet backhanded, tribute to Jackson, noting Trump’s adeptness in sliding in a dig at Obama (“Jesse was a force of nature…He had much to do with the election—without acknowledgment or credit—of Barack Hussein Obama, a man Jesse could not stand…” — Trump, relayed by Bomani [37:40])
  • Dominique: “I don’t root for the team, but that was one hell of a play.” ([38:09])
• Jackson vs. Obama: Rivalries and Respect:
  • The hosts compare Jackson and Obama’s relationship to a “Jordan/Isiah Thomas soul of Chicago” dynamic ([39:31])
  • Bomani jokingly: “He ain’t say thank you to me one time…” referencing Jackson’s likely feelings ([40:26])

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3. NBA All-Star Weekend & The KD “Burner Files”

[44:04–59:38]

• All-Star Game Quick Hits:
  • Brief banter on the All-Star game’s competitive dynamics and a joke about “the Condor” raising the stakes ([44:07])
• The KD Burner Leak:
  • Major segment dives into the alleged leak of private tweets and DMs from Kevin Durant’s supposed burner account, “Get Off My Dickerson.”
  • Bomani: “Whoever this person is… I wish we could get a little more of him in front of the world… get off my Dickerson is hilarious.” ([46:22])
  • Notable KD “burner” lines:
    • “Get off my Dickerson.” (as username and refrain – [46:57])
    • “Since MJ punched Kerr, he don’t fuck with dark skins.” — on Steve Kerr ([47:03])
    • “I miss Ben Simmons. Least that n*** would pass me the ball.”*
    • “…called [Frank Vogel and Devin Booker] two dictators. Stalin and Hitler, Mussolini and Kim Jong Un.”
    • “…triple double cocaine bear…” — Durant apparently on Russell Westbrook ([48:36])
  • Dominique (cracking up): “That’s my favorite. That’s just good writing.” ([48:36])
  • Bomani explains the “Cocaine Bear” movie reference, which Dominique admits he hasn’t watched (“I respect myself too much to have watched it!” — [50:42])
• Interpersonal NBA Gossip:
  • The pair speculate on how much Durant says to teammates’ faces, with Bomani guessing he “might say this stuff to them all the time.”
  • Noting James Harden’s surprisingly strong reputation and ability to maintain friendships with ex-teammates.
  • Dominique: “He’s been a bunch of places…and his style could be annoying… but everybody loves him. He’s just a good dude, I guess.” ([53:09])
• Durant, Fame, and Social Media:
  • Discussion pivots to Durant’s deep online engagement and how NBA stardom warps personal development (“…these essentially child stars growing up protected, their main contact with the world is Twitter…” — [54:40]).
  • Dominique: “He might be the only player whose documentary actually gives a real look at who he is …he feels more real than a lot of players.” ([57:52])
  • Bomani: “He is more honest about the whack things about him.” ([58:32])
  • Both agree: everyone gossips about coworkers, but social media DMs and alt accounts can push things to "whack behavior" territory ([58:47]).
• NBA “Optimization” and Social Norms:
  • Dominique rails against tanking and “foul grifting” as normalized behaviors that used to be shamed, adding: “We’ve all turned into these tiny little GMs… there was a stronger incentive: you ain’t want to be called a bum.” ([61:38])
  • Bomani: “We gotta normalize calling people losers. When they’re losers.” ([61:38])

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

• Bomani on Tony Clark’s scandal:
  “There’s an investigation I don’t fully understand…claims that he has used this union to enrich himself…But then we found out, no, it was because of an inappropriate relationship at the workplace with his sister-in-law who worked at the union.” ([03:01])
• On workplace affairs:
  “Somebody knows. And once one person knows, everybody’s gonna know.” — Bomani ([10:40])
• On Jesse Jackson’s legacy:
  “Jesse comes in as the younger man…by far cooler than everyone else…at every turn, he was crafting the legend of his life. But he managed to live a legendary life.” — Bomani ([28:27])
• On Donald Trump’s Jesse Jackson remarks:
  Trump via Bomani: “I provided office space for him and his Rainbow Coalition for years… Jesse was a force of nature… He had much to do with the election…of Barack Hussein Obama, a man Jesse could not stand…” ([37:40]) Dominique: “I don’t root for the team, but that was one hell of a play.” ([38:09])
• On the “Get Off My Dickerson” KD burner leaks:
  “Get off my Dickerson, which is the handle he uses, also hilarious.” — Bomani ([46:57]) “Since MJ punched Kerr, he don’t fuck with dark skins—that’s hilarious.” — Bomani ([47:03]) “The triple double cocaine bear.” — Bomani, [47:14] “That’s just good writing.” — Dominique ([48:36])
• On NBA culture and being ‘real’:
  Dominique: “Kevin Durant might be the one that gets to the point where he could actually give us, like, a real look at who he is…he feels a little bit more real than a lot of players.” ([57:52])
• On union leadership ethics:
  “It is imperative the person in charge of the union be upright, be moral…it is not about you—it’s about them over there.” — Bomani ([22:50])

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Notable Segments & Timestamps

• MLBPA/Tony Clark Scandal: [02:00–25:27]
• Jesse Jackson’s Legacy & Trump vs. Obama: [28:24–41:18]
• Kevin Durant’s Burner Saga, NBA Culture: [44:04–61:38]
• NBA “Optimization Culture,” Social Norms: [60:08–61:38]
• Playful banter about Dominique’s own show, Marcus Spears, and pro athlete parenting: [61:38–64:26]

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Tone & Style

• The episode is sharp, funny, and irreverent, with Bomani’s confident, direct analysis paired perfectly with Dominique’s witty, conversational style.
• Banter alternates between sports-insider specificity (union history, NBA gossip) and pop culture reference points, never shying away from smart, sometimes biting commentary.

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For Listeners Who Missed It

This episode brings together the perfect blend of scandal, social commentary, sports history, and hilarious one-liners. Even if you’re unfamiliar with MLBPA drama, Jesse Jackson’s presidential campaigns, or KD’s online antics, Bomani and Dominique keep things fresh, insightful, and always entertaining. Whether exploring the serious stakes of union leadership or clowning NBA social media, their chemistry is electric and the takes are not found anywhere else.

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Key Takeaway:
Leadership matters—whether in unions fighting for worker dignity, in the persistent struggle for equality, or on an NBA roster. And sometimes, the stories behind headlines reveal as much about culture as they do about sports.

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Transcript

[Dominique Foxworth]

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[Commercial Announcer]

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[Bomani Jones]

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Right Time a Wave original. My name is Bomani Jones. Thanks for listening wherever you get your podcast. Thanks for watching us on YouTube. Subscribe like, rate us, review us, give us five stars. You only give us four stars. I'm inclined to believe you are a hater. It is that time of week where we have a guest join us. But. But like I feel like I got on two left shoes when I say that. Because it is Hump days with Dominique Fosworth.

[Dominique Foxworth]

I love it. I'm happy to be here on any day. I feel like I talk to you so much away from the show now. I don't miss doing the show as much as I should. But then when I get here and you start it, I get excited cause it's hard.

[Bomani Jones]

I was about to say that last part was starting to hurt my feelings just a little bit. And then you brought your legs played, baby. You brought it back around.

[Dominique Foxworth]

You know, when the lights come on, it's something different. It's like you can play in the park, but with a game day. It's a little bit more fun.

[Bomani Jones]

You are absolutely 100 correct. My theory of course is that's why you should do the show more often. However, different discussion for a different day. I want to start off we gonna get to Kevin Durant and his situation and we're gonna talk about Jesse Jackson in a little bit. But on Tuesday, a story dropped that led to a question that I had never considered in my life. Right. And so the story is Tony Clark, who played baseball for a very long time, who's also like six, eight. That has nothing to do with anything but like he scored 40 points a game in high School in basketball.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Now, he's an imposing person. I think it matters when you see him. It's the bald head, the white beard, and he's six, eight.

[Bomani Jones]

Like.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah, he's an impressive dude to be around.

[Bomani Jones]

Oh, that's right. I keep forgetting you are a union man. So, like, this is not. Yeah, this is not a stranger to you. I met him. I met him. We did the. Bob Costa. We was doing the show with Bob Costa.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Oh, yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

And I met him there. So anyway, Tony had been. Is ensnared.

[Dominique Foxworth]

The right word.

[Bomani Jones]

Are we far enough for this to be ensnared? There's an investigation that I don't fully understand, but all you need to know about it is in. He runs a union and there's a claim that he has used this union to enrich himself.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Right.

[Bomani Jones]

You can look up the particulars. That's not really. It's not as important as we thought it was 24 hours ago. And this is what I mean. So word had come out that he would be resigning because of something. Right. And so we've known about this investigation. It's also got the NFLPA involved. And so I think there was an assumption from some people that this is what ultimately did him in was this scandal involving financial malfeasance. Right. Then we found out, no, it was because of an inappropriate relationship at the workplace with his sister in law who worked at the union. And that led to this question. And I saw people ask this on Twitter. I don't want to pretend like I made this up myself. You know, it's very important to me that you guys know I'm not stealing from you, but I saw it. What is worse? If sister in law means your brother's wife or sister in law means your wife's sister. Which one is worse? I vote B.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Your wife's sister. You think your wife's sister is worse?

[Bomani Jones]

Absolutely.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah. My instinct is to go the other way because at least my defense is I got brand loyalty. I like the vehicles that GM makes, man. I just wanted to try out a different gm. My dog.

[Bomani Jones]

Nah, I said you've been pushing the Accord, but that Civic was calling you. Is that what you say?

[Dominique Foxworth]

Man, that's what I see, man. Sometimes I got little small parking spaces in the street. I gotta navigate. See what this other thing doing? I gotta. I gotta carry some stuff.

[Bomani Jones]

You want the 5 series and the 3, huh? Or is it. Was it the. The. You want the drop? The six and the drop top? Okay. No, this is. This is my. My thing about the wife's. Sister is that makes your kids hate you even more.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Right. I guess that's because. I guess my argument was one about setting up an opportunity to make that quality joke. But the other. Argum, you only have offended one person.

[Bomani Jones]

Yes.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Whereas the other way, you've offended two people. But I guess if you throw the kids into it. But I guess the kids could be mad no matter what. Right?

[Bomani Jones]

Well, but, but, but, but, but. Yeah, yeah, yeah, you're right. Like, like, because I could call my.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Brother and be like, man, I really messed up.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah.

[Dominique Foxworth]

But if I'm with my brother's wife, then who am.

[Bomani Jones]

Well, I think, I think here's the. I think the problem we're having with this relative scale that we're trying to establish.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Right.

[Bomani Jones]

That is what hurts more. If you were to take a ax and go halfway through my arm.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

Or all the way through my arm. And what I say, I think it probably feels the same.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

Right. Like, it may be a little more jarring seeing that you don't have an arm. But just the feeling, the pain is close enough to be in the same that it's not really gonna matter. It's the bigger loss, obviously, if his wife's sister for Mrs. Clark. Cause now she ain't got nobody.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

You know, like, like, like, like, I hope you got other siblings if it's the case there.

[Dominique Foxworth]

I. I mean, I. When something like, obviously things like this happen, it's not completely unheard of. But I always, like, go back to, like, the quieter moments that aren't reported on or discussed is like, how do you find this out? Like, who. Who sent the feeler out there? Who, like, sit that trial balloon out there? It was like, hey, look, I really like the way that beard is sparkling. Right. Like, who is the one that says. And then how do you respond to it? That's the part. Because, I don't know, I feel like, especially like, as guys, it's kind of. We're kind of notorious for not being able to pick up on hints that are being dropped. Yeah. I feel like I would have missed those hints. Not only because we're oblivious to that stuff, but also because I don't expect it to come from there. Right. And I wouldn't have. I wouldn't have the gumption to shoot.

[Bomani Jones]

It even if there. Let's say the gumption is present. Present all of those things. Right. Not one of you, stop this. Said to yourself, a. This is the worst idea you've ever had. Right. Like, not, Not a single person looked at this Here and identified. Not like this. Not like this. It cannot be like this. No, nobody did this. And by the way, this is. Before we add in the office part, we're just talking about the general regular life situation. What a horrific idea.

[Dominique Foxworth]

What came first? Did you think like, of course this is all. None of this has been like, well, I don't want to get your podcast in trouble, but like the, the investigation is still underway for the, the financial stuff. Yes, I guess this other stuff seems like pretty solid. But I, my, my question is, what came first? The job or because. My guess is he. Because he's hired other people in his family.

[Bomani Jones]

Yes, he has. And that, that, by the way, has come up, man.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Unions, man, they, they, they are a place that have some nonsense happening. But that, that aside, what came first, I'm assuming the job came first. And then just being around each other or it's completely possible to be like laying up in bed, like, Tony, I need a job.

[Bomani Jones]

How do.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Or I need some money. How you going to get me some money? In a way that don't seem crazy.

[Bomani Jones]

All right. But that's exactly what I was trying to figure out was, did it start off with, hey, I think you might be qualified for this job that just came open at my office, or was it, oh, you need some bread, I got you, or was it in order to keep you quiet, I think I need to give you this job. Because one thing I also think that people who be getting down at the job don't realize is a BJ Chicago kid line for the Anderson pack joint. She swear she low key, but everybody know, right? Everybody that's doing this thing at the office, they all think nobody knows it, right? Like, did you watch? I don't know if you were much a law and order person, right? But for years there was the running thing with Jack McCoy and Claire Kincaid having a thing at the office, but it was never expected, explicitly stated that they had the thing at the office. Nobody ever said the word, but you just see a whole lot of them walking in the office together in the morning, right? Like, like all these things that were the sign to the viewer that this was going on. And the regular office is the exact same way. Somebody knows. And once one person knows, everybody's gonna know.

[Dominique Foxworth]

And that's how it works. We aren't as good at as high in things as we think, and I know that also.

[Bomani Jones]

And people are nosier than you'll ever imagine.

[Dominique Foxworth]

And work can be boring. And if you, whether it's true or not, if there is A little hint of something. What we going to talk about? We going to talk about that. And I know that of course, you can have platonic relationships and you can have friends at work that. Whatever, but you always eating lunch together.

[Bomani Jones]

Right?

[Dominique Foxworth]

Right. Always walking together.

[Bomani Jones]

And. And no one ever uses the nonsensical phrase work husband or work wife. Right. Like, if you throw that one out there, people might be like, oh, okay, this has been established. Right. Everybody knows about it, but if you're not giving it that cutesy name. Nope. Y' all just doing it.

[Dominique Foxworth]

That is pretty funny. You're right. If you throw that out there, it's like a misdirect. Like, oh, no, we all together because that's how we do it. Work. We work husband. Work, work wife. But if you don't do that, it's probably because maybe you're a little too close to be. To be playing with monikers like that.

[Bomani Jones]

Everybody knows. And. Oh, my God. Like, it's. So anyway, they did an investigation. They were doing an investigation about the money stuff, and somehow this came up in the investigation, and they were like, cool, we can go ahead and get this over with right now. Right? Let's just. Let's just go ahead, have this conversation. And now you are out of here. And. And now you gotta go home and be like, I lost my job today, and your sister lost her job today. And, you know, I wanted to be the one to tell you before anybody else did, but you gonna read some things in the newspaper, and, baby, they lies. They all lies. Like, you just got to ride that part out. Right? Just like they. You know. You know, they've been trying to. You know, they've been trying to take a brother down for 13 years. Yeah.

[Dominique Foxworth]

I mean, you got. You got to ride that out. But I assume that there is like a. They said that there were messages. Those messages gonna be. My guess is those messages are gonna be hard to deny.

[Bomani Jones]

They will be hard to deny. But that lie. That lie will continue.

[Dominique Foxworth]

That gotta be strong. I don't know what the. I mean, I'm in a, Like a defensive mood this morning, as you could probably tell from our group chat conversation. So if I were hired to be his defense attorney in this situation, I would point to the fact that the proximity was so close that it suggests that I really want to do this. Like, if I wanted to do this, I'd be in the streets. I had this, that, and other. Like, I slipped and fell in it.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah. Yeah. Or I mean, would you be so audacious as to say you know, she looks a lot like you.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah, I'm shooting all the shots, man. As his defense attorney, I'm rolling all the defenses that I possibly can. Which. First we're starting with the, the obvious one. Nah, they lying on me, man. They plant. They planted the messages. Yes.

[Bomani Jones]

Well, well, here's the, here's, here's. There are two things that we don't know here. We don't know anything about their marriage.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

And we don't know anything about their sisterhood.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

This could be part of a long tradition. This could be revenge. This, this, this could be. This could be anything like it. I know enough about this world. Is entirely possible that the wife has made peace with the Tony Clark of it. All. Right. And it's the sister that she never go speak to again. People, people do that one all the time.

[Commercial Announcer]

Yeah.

[Dominique Foxworth]

No, it could be a ton of different things. Like, I'm gonna hope that they had an understanding in an arrangement. That's what I'm gonna hope. We ain't heard nothing otherwise it can't.

[Bomani Jones]

Be that arrangement though. That, that the, the, the, the I, I, I ain't never heard of arrangement that didn't have an unspoken but. Not my sister.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah. I agree with you. But I said hope you, you don't imagine that there's somebody. There's. There's some group out there. Like I could google it. I'm sure there's some. Oh, yeah. I don't want to Google it. I probably come up with looking for. At the. On my search history, but I assume it's far fetched. It's probably not worth considering, but I threw it out there as a possibility that it's like, yeah, we cool with it? Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

Oh my God. This is. And it's the sister in law. I haven't seen it definitively said that it's wife sister. I've been told it was wife sister. And we're just mapping out that scenario. Brother's wife is just not nearly as much fun to explore or to consider. It's. It's. I can't believe this. Like, in front of, in front of everybody. Dominique.

[Dominique Foxworth]

That's bad, man. That's tough.

[Bomani Jones]

And he like, he took, he was at a tough. I didn't realize he'd had that job for that long. But he was in a tough situation because his predecessor was a beloved man who just had a brain tumor and died. You know, and so they went with Clark and look, this isn't. The union heads are often black in the black sports. Right. Like this One, you know, it's a bunch of people that couldn't wait to take him down. I would hate to see the group chats that involve the words try to tell you.

[Dominique Foxworth]

We'Ll see what happens at the next. I know they have an inter right now. We'll see what happens at their next election when they bring somebody new in. Is the thing is, unions are a. It's like a social movement organization. And there are some things about particular groups that find it, I think, a little bit more natural to find themselves in those social movement organizations. I think that plays something that plays some role in the reason why you're right about the black sports thing. But plenty of black athletes follow white coaches and their white people in places. I, I don't necessarily think that the black athletes are. Or having black athletes is the driving force. I often think that it's like the mindset when, when you're like, building a union, if you have, like, the proper perspective, it is like a social movement. It's organizing a disenfranchised group. Right.

[Bomani Jones]

Well, I want to be clear. I did not mean to imply that the driving force for the black union heads is the black membership. What I was implying is that having a white membership. Yeah. Does not. It's a, It's a bumpier road to black leadership. Right. In that regard.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah, I think that's fair. I think. But yeah, I mean, ultimately is when you, if you get the opportunity to talk to the. To talk to the guys, it's the people, the person who you believe you can follow, which is. Yeah, I mean, that could be anybody. But you're right. Like the, the membership, I think, is a little bit more open to black leadership when the membership is black. That's fair.

[Bomani Jones]

But I also think this is, this is a little trickier on the baseball side because, I mean, this has always been what I've read and understood, and I will trust you to verify or not. But I mean, historically speaking, the gold standard for American unions has been the Major League Baseball Players Association. Like, they went out time after time after time and won every single time, basically until the 21st century. Right. Even the strike of 90, they came out more winners than they had losers. Now we're in a time where nationally, you know, the way that we view unions as a country is like union membership has fallen to some, I think something like 6% or something like this. Some incredibly low number. The assault on unions by associating them with communism and everything else from the, from the capitalist industrialist side, it won. They battered them and the baseball union, the steroid thing, kind of broke it to a degree. Like, they wound up at an impasse with their membership, in part because they couldn't quite figure out how they wanted to feel together about the steroids. From there, the owners got to take more and more. They reached this place where revenues explode. In baseball, wage growth has not, just like the rest of America has not ticked up in any place. We see these years where everybody gets offered the same free agent contract. All of these things have happened. And now this union that I want. I don't want to say is teetering, that feels a little unfair, but they're coming up with a CBA negotiation where a lockout is expected to take place. And this dude does this right, And I don't ever want to be the guy to be like, that's why they don't trust y', all, because it's not why they don't trust y'. All. And by y', all, I mean unions, just to be clear. However, this is not why they do trust y'.

[Dominique Foxworth]

All. I think your point about the, like, deterioration of, like, union support. And it's. It's not a mistake. Like, it's a concerted effort. And when you talk to certain unions, of course, hold on to, like, the fundamental core ideals of what it means to be a union. But I also, like, you talk to some unions and you hear them speaking the language of the ownership class, and, like, you saw it in the last executive director for the nflpa, they go hire somebody who is from that world and doesn't fundamentally understand what it means to be a part of a union. And they try and try to build up their union in the same model as, like, the corporate structure. And they believe that what we need to do to compete is to be more like them. We can't beat them at being them. And, like, that's why I said it's like a social organization. Like, it's a. It's about collective power. And I think the reason why some of this stuff is so hurtful is because all you really have is, like, your legacy and your responsibility to the people before you and the people who come after you. If you have scandal and nonsense, you know, what ends up happening is the people in the union feel less and less like a part of the union and feel like the union is something separate from who they are. And in that case, when shit gets hard, if you're with family, you'll stand. You'll survive a lockout. If you are standing with your family and you Believe that what I'm doing is fighting for the future generation and protecting the sacrifices made by the previous generation. But if you turn the union into some corporate, when it gets hard, everybody's going to be like, oh, whatever, I got to get mine. Let's sign this deal. Oh, we're going back a couple percentage points. It sucks. But let's sign this deal because I got to get this money. And every successive group does the same thing until we get to a place where shit is so bad that people come together again and say, we got to fight to get our shit back. You could just fight right now and never have to get to that point. Sorry about my little soapbox.

[Bomani Jones]

No, no, no. But it's. But it's important because it's very important to understand. And everything. I think everything that you said was 100% correct because it was always interested seeing how Marvin Miller, the first president of the Baseball Players association, would talk about every successful movement. He was just all, like, gone soft, right? Because this thing is. We fight on everything. This is what you have to do. And when nobody that I know of accused Marvin Miller doing is getting over on that union, right? The truth is the union has to be more noble than the other side because the other side is not bound by a principle, right? The union has to be grounded in a shared ethos, right? It has to be grounded in a shared belief. And the person that is in charge of the union, it is imperative that that person be upright, immoral, right? Because it is imperative. And it becomes very. It's very important because any failing in that regard in the whole thing falls apart. And the only way that you can truly and properly sell yourself to run a union or to be in those positions in a union is to say, I'm doing this for y'. All. And it makes it even more heartbreaking. No matter what the accusation of malfeasance is, no matter what the transgression, especially if it's legit, like once they find out that you got your hand in the pot, man. Come on, dog. Right? Like. Like it. It. It affects your membership in a much different way, and it affects everything much larger. And that is why when you are at the top and you get caught, it's so much worse than when it is the other people. Because for you, it is not about you, right? We understand. It's about them over there on this. It is never about you.

[Dominique Foxworth]

And I'd put in there the dynamic that makes it a little bit more difficult for sports unions is a disproportionately young membership, which also doesn't have a whole bunch of traditionally professional experience, but they do have a huge responsibility. And, like, the history of, like, successful union actions in general, like, outside of the court, it comes from, like, the actual members being the leadership. And it's really hard when you're doing just fine and money's coming in and you're worried about your next contract to, like, get your hands dirty. Like, I think that's the challenging thing for the modern, modern sports unions is as. And I'm not someone who, who would argue that, like, making more money is bad, but as the money gets better, the players become less engaged. And as the players become less engaged, you understand that they're going to be less likely to sacrifice because while the executive director of the union is, like, considered the head of the union, no union ever works unless it's the members. And all other, like, professional unions are different. Like, often you work in, you work and you exist in this professional union for decades. You understand everything that goes on in there and you take responsibility. You have your whole 20s and 30s to figure this out. Because the guys who are working in your industry that are in their mid-30s to 40s to 50s, they know they've been here, they fighting. And you don't have that in sports, particularly football, where it's like, all right, you got till 24 to figure this shit out. Because when you're 27, you're going to be the president of the union, or when you're 30, you're going to be on the executive committee of the union. And then you'll have someone who is the executive director who is making the decisions, which I, I get it. But I don't ever think that's healthy for a union. The decisions have to be made by the people who are going to like, we're gonna experience the results of the decision. All right?

[Bomani Jones]

And coming up next, I'm a land the plane on this.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Uh.

[Bomani Jones]

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[Bomani Jones]

All right, we're back with Dominique Foxworth. And I was making the point earlier about if you're going to be up top in one of these organizations like a union, it's gotta be about the union. Like it can't be about you. That's how this goes. The trick bag with that is of course it takes a pretty significant ego to be the person who decides that you're going to lead a union. And look, we were talking about this with Tony Clark, the early Tony Clark, big old six eight dude, you know, major league baseball player. He rich before he showed up. That ain't nobody with no shortage of ego. Okay? Like that's how that's going to go. But the guy that's going to be in charge, you're not going to get that person generally without there being some measure of ego. And that almost always becomes counterproductive to the larger aims of what that person is doing. And that brings us to Jesse Jackson.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Well done.

[Bomani Jones]

Right? Because look, Jesse Jackson died on Tuesday morning. You said you'd never been in a room with Jesse, right? Jesse a bad man. Like there's, there's sometimes there's some people. That's the only way to put it. When I was did the reading with Howard or the Q, the fireside chat with Howard for his book at the Jackie Robinson foundation. And I heard a gas, bro. I saw my Paul Robeson and I was just like, look, man, that's bad right there. Like, look, man, that's the, that's only if you guys, you don't understand what I'm talking about here, right? Some people that just simply fits that description. And the thing with Jesse was, what makes Jesse interesting to me is Jesse comes in as the younger man, right? With that whole crew over there with, you know, with Dr. King and Abernathy and all those dudes, right? He's the younger cat. And he is also by far cooler than everybody else in the crew, right? Like, he's pulling up with the leather jacket and the sweaters and you know, just like, he's that guy. He is absolutely next and he knew it at every turn. And it's a great quote here from Stanley Crouch that was used in the New York Times obituary. And I'll paraphrase it because I can't find it right now, but I'll paraphrase it. He said Jesse was ultimately doomed by his need to mythologize himself. Right? At every turn. There was a, A, A, a decision that what he was going to do is to create the legend of his life. Right. He also managed to live a legendary life. Right. Like, I don't, I think people need to understand that a lot of you don't know that much about the good of Jesse. And some of that is because of his own, own goals, but also because there was work done to do it that way. Right. He was the last of the titans of the civil rights movement. We don't pay enough homage to his runs for president in the 80s, right. Talking to Ta Nehisi about this, this is very important. Jesse Jackson is one of the biggest reasons Obama could have won in 08. Because his campaign in 88 after it was done and Dukakis needed to bring his supporters into the fold. The trade Jesse made was okay, but you guys have to change the way that you do primaries. Instead of them being winner take all, there's got to be some proportional distribution of the delegates, which is what made it possible for Obama to win in 08. Like, this isn't just a Jesse Jackson walk so Obama could run kind of situation. Right? Jesse is tangibly responsible for what happened later on top of the Jesse Rand Jesse walk so that Obama could run situation you have.

[Dominique Foxworth]

I think that's all very well said. And I think the, this relates to sports in so many ways where it's like the, the history is Always kind of like so much colored by whether you won or lost. And I think there's an underappreciation for the progress made. And one of my friends from school would say this all the time. Incredibly smart guy. A lot of really advanced, impressive degrees. And he wouldn't go to class and he wouldn't study and he would get the equivalent of a B. And then someone else will work their ass off and get an A. And he'd be like, well, the distance I traveled this morning to when we had the test in the grade that I got was much more impressive. It's not a perfect corollary to what Jesse has done, but like the distance that Jesse traveled and, and the environment in which he fought, the things that he accomplished, like, you could argue, despite the fact that it's not going to. There's not going to. The W for win is not going to be next to his name. You could make the argument that that was just as or more valuable than any other, like, real success because, like, in a time when there's a significant backlash, to have somebody who's willing to fight that backlash. And of course, you're not winning the fight against the backlash, but you are giving somebody.

[Bomani Jones]

It's the.

[Dominique Foxworth]

It's the equivalent of getting a. Forcing them to punt at midfield. Like you're giving yourself a better field position or you're giving the next generation a better field position than they would have otherwise. But nobody is going to write a piece the next day of the game about the third down stop in the middle of the third quarter. You're going to write the piece about the touchdown scored on the subsequent drive. And I think there's something to be said for breaking up that pass on third and sixth.

[Bomani Jones]

I think there's also the biggest thing with Jesse that I think can easily be lost by people who were but so aware of him is he has been perhaps the most impactful advocate for the broader working class of America that there has been. Like, this is not. Jesse's work was not simply the work of black people. It was a broad co. Like the idea of the Rainbow Coalition was a. It's. It's much more in line with the Fred Hampton type of situation or as much as anybody else, right? Same Chicago sort of roots. It's the. Very similar to the Harold Washington coalition of 1983 that you put together. But it is working class people of all races and stripes, right, Fighting for them like Operation Breadbasket, okay? Operation Push. It eventually became that Wall street project, which is where it got a Little weird for Jesse because that's when you started having cronyism concerns and everything else is when it went over there, Jesse's argument was, this is the next frontier of the fight. We got to be over there too. But once you go play and once you start playing them reindeer games, right. You know, it's real easy for people to get caught up in that. But the idea that Jesse was the fighting man for the working class. The 1988 campaign for Jesse Jackson is in large part the template of the Bernie Sanders campaigns that you saw later. If you go back and look at what he was Talking about in 88, a lot of it sticks through. And he was going out and winning like he won primaries in 88. Making that happen now, you know, America ain't what it America don't live his raps with a little sh. Man, Michael Dukakis was like this big. Ain't no way in the world in America, man, this big run against a man this big, and the man this big wins. That's just not how we do things ordinarily. Right. That like basically longer to short. Being white is like being a foot taller than you really are.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah. The impact and I, I so the funny thing is when you get older and read and learn more about it, like I feel like growing up the Rainbow Coalition and Jesse Jackson's run was almost kind of a joke. Yeah. And I didn't re. Like, it was a joke for me. Like I'm born in 83. So like what I did hear about it was like how ridiculous and absurd it was and the idea that a black person could ever be president and how Jesse and that was also. We started to learn more and more about his, his off the field issues like those like it all coalesced to make that all feel like a joke. And now like going back and reading about all that stuff, like recognizing the impact that he had is not something that's going to be the like title of a chapter in a history book. But the things that came afterwards couldn't have been possible without it.

[Bomani Jones]

And it's.

[Dominique Foxworth]

It's funny that we history, we like to think about history as fact, but it is like, I mean it is fact, but it's selected stories and we select people. And the choices that were made around Jesse Jackson and the prices that he paid for his issues is inconsistent with the way that we treat just about anybody else. Because nobody, I mean nobody really feels perfect. Like Obama don't got nothing on his jacket. Everybody else got something pretty significant on their jacket.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah. Obama. Obama was thinking. Obama started playing the long game before anybody else. Like, yeah, let me tell you who was not about to get caught up sleeping with his wife's sister at the office.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Oh, hell no.

[Bomani Jones]

No, no. Obama's not getting anywhere near that. I, I am going to point this out, by the way, because if you haven't seen it, this is the funniest thing that happened after. After Jesse Jackson died, the most incredible statement. I provided office space for him and his rainbow coalition for years in the Trump building at 40 Wall street, responded to his request for help in getting criminal justice reform passed and signed when no other president would even try. Single handedly pushed along and passed long term funding for historically black colleges and universities, which Jesse loved, but also which other presidents would not do. Responded to Jesse's support for opportunities, all as the single most a successful economic development package yet approved for black businessmen and women and much more. I am fascinated by the idea that Trump's people were ready for this, right? They were like, the last thing anybody had on their bingo card is positive. They tried to act like black History Month ain't going on. And Trump was like, nah, that Jesse dude is all right with me. Hold on, hold on. Here's where he hit it. Jesse was a force of nature. Like few others before him, he had much to do with the election. Without acknowledgment or credit of Barack Hussein Obama, a man who Jesse could not stand. He loved his family greatly. And to them I said my deepest sympathies and condolences. Jesse will be missed. And the thing about that last part is not one lie was told.

[Dominique Foxworth]

I don't root for the team, but that was one hell of a play. One hell of a play. Like, it was, it was the, the surprise of it. And then like the accuracy and execution because like there's. Trump has not written or put out like a respectful eulogy of anybody.

[Bomani Jones]

No.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Like he burns everybody, even people that were like, oh, like, I feel like he went after McCain like this. He's on your side, man. And in this case, the shock that it was like a favorable one combined with the slights at the end. It's a well executed play, man. It's well designed, well executed.

[Bomani Jones]

He hates Obama so much. It is so dedicated to hating Obama that he was, he, he wasn't missing any opportunity, right? He was like, oh, this is a perfect time. And I will note, I hope Obama's people, when he put that out, I was like, ooh, boy, Obama better step to the plate because you can't let Trump outdo you now, dog. It's not an option. And by the way, he just set.

[Dominique Foxworth]

A fairly high bar and he preemptively cut off any credit that you was going to give him. Like, you ain't give him no credit before, essentially. Like, he ain't even like you and.

[Bomani Jones]

You didn't like him.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Dirty move. Dirty move, man.

[Bomani Jones]

And that. That was. I mean, I will say, though I will Never forget in 08, watching Jesse, who, like I say, them two men had their issues, right? It's. It's very. It's a very similar situation to, like, Jordan and Isaiah Thomas fighting for the soul of Chicago, right? Like. Like Isaiah being like, yo, I made it so that Mike could walk these streets. Perfect. Mike don't give me no credit, right? Very similar, right?

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah, it's a perfect analogy. I think that your. Your point is, like, Obama was, like, much more. I don't want to say Dr. King, because Dr. King was different, but, like, Obama was grew up in a world and separate from the experience that Jesse had. Like, Jesse Jackson had a much more like, I guess stereotypical might be the word. Like, stereotypical, like, challenging black upbringing. That wasn't. Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

And this motherfucker ain't said thank you one time. That's like. That's. That's. That's Jesse's situation, right? He's like. And he's not the only person who feels this way. He's like, he ain't say thank you to me one time. Obama's people. Hey, man, y' all better get that statement cracking. Hey, hey, hey. You might wanna. No, not one of your Harvard. Like, if it was me.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

Not one of your Harvard partners. You need. You need to. You need to get on the phone with somebody you ain't talked to in a while.

[Dominique Foxworth]

On your team.

[Bomani Jones]

Like, you and I both, we read that from Trump and were like, yo, I can't believe this happened.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Oh, it was tough. You can't. It's a. It's a tough comeback from that one, man. Sometimes.

[Bomani Jones]

You know what that was? They put that one in the coffin corner.

[Dominique Foxworth]

No return. There's no return. There's no return. You gotta run your back up, run it out.

[Bomani Jones]

You can't fair catch it, right? Like, you gotta.

[Dominique Foxworth]

You got to. I don't think that there's a. Yeah, yeah. You gotta fair catch it and wait till the next one. We gotta get you the next.

[Bomani Jones]

The next Trump put that down and was like, now you go, your turn. What you got? What you got to say about that? Who in the office was like, no, we, we. I think we got a winner here. You know what I'm saying? Like, I think. No, no, I think, I think we can win on this issue. Right. And also I get the feeling that Trump did like Jesse Jackson.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, yeah, far be it for me to try to pretend like I can understand him, but like, yeah, that, yeah, there, there was some. Yeah, it was unexpected and I think that there was some, like, mutual 80s celebrity.

[Bomani Jones]

Yes.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

Like, yeah, they might have met backstage at Saturday Night Live.

[Dominique Foxworth]

For sure.

[Bomani Jones]

Have you ever seen the clip? Because Jesse was. Jesse's relationship with Saturday Night Live is interesting. Like there was this self awareness. Maybe part of this was also ego. But if you've ever, if you've never seen Jesse Jackson read. After Dr. Seuss died, they had Jesse Jackson come on Weekend Update and read Green Eggs and Ham. And he never breaks Jesse Jackson character. Like, he reads it like, like you imagine a comedian being like, can you imagine Jesse Jackson reading Sam I Am? Except it's not a comedian, it's Jesse Jackson. Right. And then there's the Eddie Murphy sketch that I don't think I can say the title to, but it's Don't Let me Down. If you Google Jesse Jackson. I mean, Eddie Murphy, Don't Let Me Down. You'll, you'll, you'll get it. You'll get a great time. Rest in peace. Jesse Jackson. Oh, you, you, you. You've not seen that one.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Uh, I saw the Weekend Update. Oh, oh, oh.

[Bomani Jones]

Ryan. We're going to do a two minute pause in the record so that Jesse. So that Dominique can watch Don't Let Me Down. And then we will cut it back in with Dominique's reaction. Don't let me Down.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Oh, man. Oh, gosh. It reminds me a little bit of the like Black Jeopardy sketch where it's like all the connections and the obvious points that no one else realizes until you put it in a sketch. It is pretty, pretty impressive. Eddie Murphy.

[Bomani Jones]

Hey, man, we both got big noses, gold chains on our chest.

[Dominique Foxworth]

It's my favorite part.

[Bomani Jones]

That's what he said. That's what he's.

[Dominique Foxworth]

So many other lines that I, I feel like I can't repeat. I'm not going to take the risk.

[Bomani Jones]

Oh, yeah, no, no, my favorite one was right. The one right at the end when he's called out the brothers and sisters. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, man, I will. I ain't risking my career, all this.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Not on that one. It was, it was funny for Eddie back in Those days.

[Bomani Jones]

Yep, yep, yep, yep, yep, yep. No need for me, no need for me to repeat that which is known need not be said. And now with the transition to take us home, I was not around for the All Star Game. I don't. It's President's Day, we like to take a weekend. It's not a great content time, so I typically go away, but at least this time where I went somewhere that was in reasonable time zone situation. So I watched a little bit of the All Star Game and it is amazing that the biggest thing from a very good All Star Game, it was two things. One, nobody wants to get they shit pitched on television. And the idea that the one guy taking this seriously is the Condor, that'll make everybody take it seriously. Just because like a six foot one guy could not dictate the terms of this the way the guy that could pitch everybody's shit could dictate the terms. But obviously the biggest thing about the All Star weekend is every clip of Kevin Durant under siege on his phone because somebody decided to allegedly leak his various burner tweets and direct messages and the likes. Okay, I am operating on the premise that those things are true. I cannot say whether or not they are true. I am operating on the premise that they are true because it sure sounds like they are.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Has he denied it yet?

[Bomani Jones]

I have. No, I don't think so. Because he hasn't had to do any media.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah, but I mean, why? When has Kevin Durant ever waited for media to make his opinion known? Like, that was the thing. I had Jay Kang on my show and we talked a little bit about this and Jay pointed out at the time that it had been 48 hours, more than 48 hours since Kevin Durant had tweeted, which was the longest period of. Of him not tweeting since, I think 2019. Yeah, and like this, the behavior certainly is the behavior of somebody who is uncomfortable with what's happening in the world around him. It's not like I imagine that if it was a hoax, which is not fair. Completely fair to say, but like, wouldn't your first thing be like, hey, I'm a tweet out, hey, guys, that ain't me. That's some bullshit.

[Bomani Jones]

Well, I mean, look, we could just simply say that boy was under siege. Yeah, right, he was under siege. And you could perhaps extrapolate that he is still under siege from the fact that we have not heard anything from him. And I just have to say this, this guy is hilarious. Whoever, whoever this person is that is Sending these things. I wish we could get a little bit more of him in front of the world because, I mean, I felt like, get off my Dickerson.

[Dominique Foxworth]

That's a great start.

[Bomani Jones]

Heat that also get off my Dickerson, which is the handle that he uses. Also hilarious.

[Dominique Foxworth]

It's a great start. And the cocaine bear, I think was the pinnacle of. Was a perfect description. Is the man's a writer. Whoever it is, if it's him or not, he has the ability of a writer.

[Bomani Jones]

And well, also there was like what he said about Steve Kerr get off by Dickerson. That is where he says, since MJ Punch Kerr, he don't fuck with dark skins. That's hilarious.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Good joke.

[Bomani Jones]

I swear, I miss Ben Simmons. Least that N word would pass me to ball. That is hilarious. He compared Frank Vogel and Devin Booker. He called them two dictators, Stalin and Hitler, Mussolini and Kim Jong Un.

[Dominique Foxworth]

The face for. For trying to critique Steph during film session. Like, everybody looked at him like.

[Bomani Jones]

But see, I think the Phoenix stuff is the one where like, let's talk about this a little more because the question with that team always was about the relationship between Durant and Booker, which also had a lot to do with the relationship between Durant and the people around Booker. Like, there was a lot going on there. Kevin Durant, or Excuse me, get off by Dickerson clearly believes that Kevin Durant frequently is asked to compete with his teammates, including he felt get off my Dickerson believes that Kyrie wasn't competing with him. Yeah, he was just a little cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs. But that light skin that I would assume get off by Dickerson is referring to Steph Curry and that triple double cocaine band.

[Dominique Foxworth]

That's my favorite. That's just good writing.

[Bomani Jones]

I'm assuming get off by Dickerson is referring to Russell Westbrook.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

Oh, okay. Like, the mildest things, though one might think the most impactful are the things that he says about his own team. Excuse me, get off my Dickerson says about the Rockets that he refers to as this shitty ass team.

[Dominique Foxworth]

The best part, they're second in the way.

[Bomani Jones]

Or the third in the West, I think. Or fourth. Something like that. Wow.

[Dominique Foxworth]

The. I'm realizing this the first time that I'm realizing that all of the things that have gotten a lot of traction have been, like, obvious insults, with the exception of the one that I find the most amusing. Like triple double cocaine bear. Hey, I mean, it ain't clearly a shot. Like, I mean, say your man play like a cocaine bear. Like, it ain't. It ain't necessarily a compliment, but. But it ain't calling them Stalin saying he get a bunch of triple dollars.

[Bomani Jones]

No, it's not.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah, it ain't. It ain't quite the same as saying that you don't with dark skins like this is. This is the nice Cocaine Bear.

[Bomani Jones]

I did not know that there was recently a movie called Cocaine Bear that, that was based on an actual cocaine bear. Y I, I, I triple double. I mean Cocaine Bear. Let me, let me make sure I get this right about Cocaine Bear, which came out in 2023. I don't be paying attention to movies, but I really ain't paying attention to a movie called Cocaine Bear starring Kerry Russell. Kerry Russell O' Shea Jackson Jr. And it's got the late great Isaiah Whitlock Jr. Aka she in the movie. And it is based on an actual factual cocaine bear. A bear that ate 75, 175 pound bear that fatally overdosed on cocaine. Cause it came across a brick and it ate it up. £75 worth of coke. And they was like, what's up?

[Dominique Foxworth]

I remember the movie and I remember hearing it's based on a true story. I respect myself too much to have watched it. I don't know if it was a good time or not, but I didn't know Keri Russell was in it. And I enjoy the show on Netflix called the Diplomat where she is in there.

[Bomani Jones]

Oh, that's who she is.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah. Acted her ass off and being all profound and important. She ain't Cocaine Bear. How do you make these choices?

[Bomani Jones]

That's not a good sign right there. Somebody do something like say they in the Cocaine Bear movie and they been in other stuff. That's when you start being like, let me see your. You be gambling. Let me get a look up that nose. Why you always going to the bathroom?

[Dominique Foxworth]

I had to double check, make sure that Kerry Russell is who I think she was. Because I do get confused sometimes. Like a lot of the stars be they follow the same template and I, I just get confused. Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

But you know, so here's the thing about Durant. Durant's going to survive this for a couple of reasons. One, there's a big gap between the All Star game and when anybody has to like come across him. So it's not going to come up. Number two, we know we know him. You know what I'm saying? Like this is, this is always on the board.

[Dominique Foxworth]

The only challenge is like he got to go back into that workplace. It's not just all previous people, it's current people too.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah, but, you know, it wouldn't surprise me if he says those things to them all the time. You know what I mean? Like. Like, this is. This is, this is. What I don't know is these are only problems if he doesn't say these things to them out loud. I also want to point out something that's very interesting. He said he loved James Harden. He said he's slightly delusional, but I understand him. James stay cool with everybody, except apparently for Kyrie. With Kyrie, But James stay cool with Russell. After they went and played together in Houston and it didn't go well. They still super cool. He's still super cool with Durant. And where I my favorite James Harden quote of all time. Because they truly aren't that many. Well, aside from Daryl More is a liar, and I'll never play for a team that he works for. I repeat. Or I said Daryl Morey is a liar. Is. I'll give him the shot myself. He was so bad at Kyrie. He was the only one that was like, don't you see what the problem is here? I'll give him the shot myself if I have to. But James Harden seemed to be cooler than we realize.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Did you watch James Harden on the, like, Netflix basketball show? I didn't, but, like, yeah, I feel like maybe that we could get some insight because you're right there. He's been a bunch of different places, and he behaves in a way that I think turns off a lot of us in media and. And fans who are not the fan of the team that he is on or the team that he's trying to get to. But you're right, routinely there's. I can't really think of other guys that are that big a star and move around that much. It have a distinct style that could. The style of play that could be annoying to teammates and opponents. But everybody love him. He a good dude, I guess. Capacity. Oh, they a mess with him in Philly.

[Bomani Jones]

They didn't love him. They didn't love him so much in Philly.

[Dominique Foxworth]

It's my understanding that or the team.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah. But here's the thing about Harden, though. He a good time. Yeah. I hear James Harden parties be cracking.

[Dominique Foxworth]

That's all we know about him, man. That's all we know. He liked to step back and yeah, he liked to shake us.

[Bomani Jones]

He does like to shake.

[Dominique Foxworth]

That's all we know about him. Those two things. And he got a beard.

[Bomani Jones]

He loves to shake. Durant, he's so addicted to the telephone, man. Yeah, like that was my thought. It's the All Star game and I get that you under siege, but you could, I guess it would be hard to put down the phone under those circumstances. But like, he is, he is on the phone. It is your reminder. NBA players got a lot more time than one might think. Practice the same time, games the same time, rest of the time, it's on you. It's not that much different from being a professional podcaster.

[Dominique Foxworth]

I don't know what. Yeah, it's a lot fun to have this conversation, but I think that there is something a little bit deeper, more interesting about the idea of these essentially child stars growing up in this like, very different type of environment where they're kind of protected. And like a lot of the issues that a lot of the immaturities and behaviors that other of us have, like those get sanded off because we just ain't great enough to tell people to shut up and mind their business. It's like interesting combining that with like social media and someone who's obviously a little bit like unique and super talented. Like, who do you become in your 30s and 40s if that's the life that you led? And your major, like, contact with the outside world is through the Twitter. Like, I don't know, I'm not pretending to be to like psychoanalyze anybody, but I think that that has something to do with the.

[Bomani Jones]

Hey, man, that man got takes. It is amazing that he's the one guy that doesn't have a podcast like that. Yeah, right. Like, I would check his podcast out. Yeah, he clearly has like, he's not the guy that we like. Yo, when he retires, he's going to be on television. Sounds to me like he would be excellent.

[Dominique Foxworth]

He would be. I would enjoy it.

[Bomani Jones]

He's incredibly knowledgeable, right? He's very famous, funny, trying to get a cut every week, right? Like that's. That becomes his own thing. But I mean, he seems like the takes are the hard thing to come by, right? Like all these cats that have decided that they're going to be podcasters, that's what they've learned. The hard part is actually having opinions about stuff. He has so many opinions that he argues with strangers. Like a lot of this. Get off my Dickerson guy, a lot of this appears to be arguing with strangers. The last thing that I want to point out, and it's been a while now, so we haven't talked about this, but I can tell you something right now that's real, okay. I've only been in like up Close with Kevin Durant, like, a couple of times. One of them was at the office at the Seaport. The other was at a wedding. And I don't know how exactly to refer to people that I like who also really like Drake. Cause, like, it's not appropriate to say OV ho about people, you know, you understand what I'm saying? And people you like. However, this wedding was very much so. People firmly planted on the Drake in the Drake camp and not in the Drake camp just because they like the music. But people who knew Drake and you wasn't hearing no, no to no Kendrick anywhere there. Those people who were in proximity of that beef, it was real to them, right? Like, they picked their sides and they got on their army. And Kevin Durant was clearly on the Drake side because we had a dude put out his DMs that seemed very clearly to be from Kevin Durant. And it's just all him going in about this beef. You talked to Kendrick today? Why you want. Stop ignoring me, bro. I'm wondering if your daddy Kendrick knows you exist. Like, he, He. He was a infantryman in the great beef of 2024.

[Dominique Foxworth]

He's incredibly interesting. You're right. Like, inside look like a Kevin Durant. He might be the only player because as we get all these, like, documentaries from players that they put out that most people find a little boring because they're, like, sanitized and controlled by the players. Kevin Durant might be the one that gets to the point where he could actually give us, like, a real look at who he is. That gets really interesting because he doesn't seem, even though he hasn't owned up to this, whether it's him or not, he doesn't seem as, like, concerned about protecting his, like, air quotes, brand, or image as so many other players are. Like, he feels a little bit more real than a lot of players, which is now.

[Bomani Jones]

I mean, he is more honest about the whack things about him.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

Cause I mean, it's. As someone who used to argue with a lot of people on the Internet, never under a fake name.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Right.

[Bomani Jones]

Get off my Dickerson is engaging in whack behavior. I mean, it's kind of hard to. It's kind of hard to ignore that. Right?

[Dominique Foxworth]

Isn't it just. Isn't it just talking shit about your co workers, which is like everybody does.

[Bomani Jones]

To your friends your name.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah, like, that's.

[Bomani Jones]

That's my thing is I have never trapped that there existed in an Internet space that was in anything other than my name.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

Like, if you're not gonna put your name on it. Then it tramples. It goes into the whack place.

[Dominique Foxworth]

The only reason why I would defend that is because they were DMs. Like, he wasn't like, trying to, like, propagate these rumors about players publicly without putting his name on it. Like, my understanding is while these people may not be his actual, like, close friends, the people in the chat knew who he was and they're essentially. And he just talking shit about his co workers to his friends.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah, yeah, that is fair. Like, that was one thing when I did game theory that I recognized was I have no idea what these people are saying about me when I'm not around, but they are because I'm the boss now, right? Like, all these shows that I've done is like, somebody got some shit to say about me when I'm not around because I know I got some shit to say about them when they not around. And only because it would hurt their feelings if they were around. It's not because I am afraid. It's that it is bad for business. But sometimes you just gotta get it out.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah, there's some things that just aren't that are, like, not socially acceptable. Which, I mean, to be fair, part of the problem with the NBA is things that should not be socially acceptable have become socially acceptable. Like fucking tanking and foul grifting and all the other bullshit that makes the NBA a little annoying. I can't wait to the playoffs. That shit be fun as hell.

[Bomani Jones]

Oh, my God. I also love that you deem that those things are socially unacceptable. And this is why I love you, because I'm right there with you. Like, I had to save these. They're not y' all for Friday, right?

[Dominique Foxworth]

They're not anymore, is the thing. I wish they were. Because, like, that's the thing that when we try to change all these things to incentivize players to do this, incentivize teams. Let's change the draft, let's change this. Incentivize. Like, there was one thing that always worked for incentives in the past was you knew you would be shamed. And we dove into this on my show. But that's one of the big, like, results of, like, our optimization culture is that we. We've all turned into these tiny little GMs, which is something that I've heard you talk about before, where we're like, well, it's the. It's the best way to win. Why don't you stink? Like, there was a time when you would at least pretend not to be cheating. Like, you had enough self respect to like put out a product that you could respect. But now we've all defended them as like saying, this is the incentives. This is the incentives are. No, those incentives were there in the past, but there was a stronger incentive. You ain't want to be called a. A bum.

[Bomani Jones]

We gotta normalize calling people losers. Yeah, like when they're actually losers. We gotta, like normalize calling people losers. I'm with that, bro. Boy, we'd be here another hour talking about this. This is Dominique Foxworth. Check him out on the Dominique Foxworth show, available with all five podcasts and giving away for free. My man had a live show. He even did the whole thanks to my audience sort of thing. You getting a little proud of what you built there. Got your little community, got your tribe over there. You know what I'm saying? I will note this. When Charlie Kravitz did not know if I was going to be there or not, he sent me an in, told me I could get in for free, but wasn't having me on the show. Okay, y' all don't got big over. There ain't no room for your boy no more.

[Dominique Foxworth]

That is absolutely false. There's always room for you. I.

[Bomani Jones]

But seriously though, I, I think. Was that on your show where Marcus Spears said that he's afraid of cats because you don't want nothing walking around his house. They can sneak up on him and he can't hear it.

[Dominique Foxworth]

It was a good point.

[Bomani Jones]

It was a great point.

[Dominique Foxworth]

I got a cat and I. And I. And I had to go ahead and give him that one. You're right. That's. That's weird. He's.

[Bomani Jones]

Ain't nobody, Ain't nobody tiptoeing it. Mark, first of all, there's no way anybody's tiptoeing in that house.

[Dominique Foxworth]

No, no, no, no. They all big and amazing.

[Bomani Jones]

You don't want to get in no 404, 505 contest of any sort with the Spears. Like, I met his wife once because people don't know Marcus White played in the wnba. I met her at the office once and it was, you know, the couple that J. The couple that Jays together stays together, right? They both got their J's on. She damn near his height. And their kids like, what the. I know their daughter was like top volleyball player in America in high school or something like that. Yeah, a top 10 basketball playing son.

[Dominique Foxworth]

The younger daughter better at volleyball. Like, the younger daughter is also better. I went to see Marcus's son play a little while ago, and it was in one of those, like, tournaments where it's all these future NBA players. And that boy is special. And also I put on top of it, there's something about when we've talked about this before and like, the professionalization of youth sports and how a lot of these kids are, they're like, trying to get themselves in the right position to do that and trying to protect and work on this part of the game. And of course, all that stuff is true of Marcus's son also. But Marcus is a football player and Marcus talks to his son like a football player, which I fucking love. Marcus on the sideline. I'm sitting courtside with Marcus and his, his, everyone else is like, yeah, run the floor, get in position, set a screen. Marcus is like, put his little ass in the basket. That's the type of man they raising. So I think, I think he gonna be all right.

[Bomani Jones]

Also, keep in mind Marcus Kahoot.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Oh, yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

Marcus was a really good high school basketball player. I loved it.

[Dominique Foxworth]

Yeah, man.

[Bomani Jones]

Brother, I appreciate you. And ladies and gentlemen, thanks so much for joining us here on the Right Time. We do this four times a week. Brian Brumley handles everything behind the scenes. Thank you, sir. Remember, follow the right time. Subscribe like, rate us, review us, give us five stars. You only give us four stars, I'm inclined to believe you're a hater. Talk to you guys in a couple of days. Take it easy.

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[Bomani Jones]

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