Tom Haberstroh on Giannis-Bucks Drama continues, Spurs Push for NBA title, UNC hires Mike Malone | 04.08

Summary

---

Podcast Summary: The Right Time with Bomani Jones

Guest: Tom Haberstroh

Episode: Tom Haberstroh on Giannis-Bucks Drama continues, Spurs Push for NBA title, UNC hires Mike Malone | 04.08 (April 8, 2026)

---

Episode Overview

This episode of The Right Time features Bomani Jones and NBA analyst Tom Haberstroh in a lively, in-depth discussion centered on three main topics:

• The ongoing turmoil between Giannis Antetokounmpo and the Milwaukee Bucks
• The rapid ascent and championship hopes of the San Antonio Spurs
• North Carolina’s (UNC) headline-making hiring of NBA coach Mike Malone

Throughout, the pair break down NBA narratives, address league-wide issues like tanking and playoff parity, and provide insights into changing dynamics in college basketball coaching.

---

Key Topics & Discussion Points

1. Giannis and the Milwaukee Bucks: Prolonged Drama and Trade Tension

Timestamps: 01:22 – 17:20

• Shams Charania’s Report:
  A landmark story details Giannis’s ambiguous desires regarding a potential trade (especially to the Knicks), without ever stating an outright “demand” or “request.”

  "All of the stories, anecdotes that support the notion that Giannis Antetokounmpo wants out of there, but won’t be willing to say it."
  – Tom Haberstroh [02:37]

• Doc Rivers’ Tenure:
  • Rivers’ famous "Google me" moment, meant to rally the Bucks, becomes emblematic of a leadership disconnect.
  • Doc’s reputation as "the most passive aggressive man in basketball" clashes with Giannis’s reluctance to be the “bad guy.”

  "Doc Rivers has gotten in…but where Doc Rivers is really in the hall of fame is making your players not like you…because nothing is ever your fault.”
  – Bomani Jones [07:18]

• Complicated Tanking Math:
  Bucks’ pick entanglements with New Orleans and Atlanta actually incentivize them to lose, a nuance often missed in mainstream coverage.

  "If New Orleans is terrible, that means Milwaukee should also be terrible because that pick is going to go to Atlanta and then they're going to get whatever they are at."
  – Tom Haberstroh [08:35]

• Giannis’s Dilemma:
  • Poor supporting cast, the impact of Lillard’s injury, and the Bucks front office’s tanking direction.
  • Giannis’s contract situation: He must stay six months with a team for a supermax — creating tension in his trade calculus.

  "He should have been asking out immediately once Damian Lillard had his torn Achilles…the writing is on the wall."
  – Tom Haberstroh [09:58]

• Future Fit/Trade Value:
  Debate on what acquiring teams would really be getting with Giannis at age 32, after years of ultra-high usage, possible declining health, and the need for a new offensive role.

  “I don't know how exactly you drop that off onto something else. If you drop him onto the Knicks, you think that squad is all of a sudden going to give him 40% of the shots?”
  – Bomani Jones [12:16]

---

2. San Antonio Spurs: Twin Towers, Wemby’s Hunger, and Championship Window

Timestamps: 17:20 – 25:32

• Giannis-to-Spurs Scenario:
  • The Spurs’ young assets (Dylan Harper, Steph Castle, De’Aaron Fox) could form the core of an audacious Giannis trade, pairing him with Victor Wembanyama for a modern “Twin Towers.”

  “Imagine if they do the San Antonio Twin Towers, you got David Robinson, Tim Duncan 2.0 with Giannis and Wemby.”
  – Tom Haberstroh [19:28]

• Defensive Nightmare:
  • A Giannis-Wembanyama front line would represent perhaps the greatest interior deterrence ever.

  “You’re going to put [Giannis] with the best defensive player I’ve ever seen...we will see the first zero points in the paint game in NBA history if that happens.”
  – Bomani Jones & Tom Haberstroh [21:41]

• Wemby’s Ambition:
  • Wembanyama’s public embrace of stardom and team-building urgency could force Spurs’ management’s hand in accelerating the championship timeline.

  “If Wemby wants it and he wants it now...let’s end the NBA right now.”
  – Tom Haberstroh [23:05]

---

3. NBA Parity vs. Rivalries: What’s Best for the League?

Timestamps: 25:32 – 32:44

• Changing Playoff Landscape:
  • While traditional dynasties make for rich narratives, current league parity has made for unpredictable, compelling postseasons.
  • Bomani’s observation: Playoff experience traditionally vital, but with higher injury rates and player movement, postseason variance has increased.

  “In the 90s and early 2000s, [playoff experience] would matter a whole great deal. But because the game is so violent right now on the joints...there is just so much variance.”
  – Tom Haberstroh [31:18]

• Historical Context:
  • OKC and the Spurs buck past trends, winning without extended playoff grooming.
  • “I think the Spurs can win it this year and overcome that playoff inexperience.”
    – Tom Haberstroh [30:15]
• Desire for Rivalries:
  • A case is made for renewed OKC–Spurs rivalry as a headline driver, even in a parity-driven NBA.

  “As much as we said we want parody, I think we want story...Godzilla vs. King Kong...OKC and San Antonio.”
  – Tom Haberstroh [24:25]

---

4. Tanking, the “A League/B League” Split, and Gambling Pressures

Timestamps: 35:08 – 42:27

• Tanking Out in the Open:
  • Teams are now blatant about tanking, leading to an “A league/B league” split — half the teams chasing wins, half gunning for draft odds.

  “There’s 20 teams trying to win, 21 if you count the Pelicans...and then everybody else is like, 'alright, we’re not going to go for the play-in.'”
  – Tom Haberstroh [40:12]

• NBA’s Dilemma:
  • Adam Silver rails against tanking publicly, but actual proposals are seen as half-measures.

  “I don’t know how you solve tanking by maintaining the draft lottery...he’s saying one thing and then coming at us with a totally different thing.”
  – Tom Haberstroh [38:23]

• Gambling and Business Interests:
  • The rise of sports betting creates pressure for predictable lineups and player availability.

  “Does [Silver] care about this or the gambling aspect...people setting the lines…don’t know who’s playing?”
  – Tom Haberstroh [36:58]

---

5. College Basketball’s New Era: Mike Malone at UNC and the NBA Migration

Timestamps: 44:11 – end

• Mike Malone to UNC:
  • The NBA champion coach moves to the Tar Heels, signaling a pro-level shift in college basketball as NIL and portal recruiting reshape the landscape.

  “I think NBA coaches going to college may become more of a thing now that college is becoming a big bit more like the pros.”
  – Bomani Jones [44:13]

  • Malone’s temperament, teaching ability, and “old school” ethos are seen as a perfect fit for today’s college game.

  “Michael Malone...his disposition, his personality...I feel like he’s better suited for the college ranks than the NBA ranks…he’s more college oriented.”
  – Tom Haberstroh [44:52]

• Changing Hiring Dynamics:
  • Expect more former NBA front office execs and agents filtering into college roles as the system professionalizes.
  • The days of the recruiter/"roll the ball out" coach are likely over, increasing value for strategic, X-and-O focused coaches.

  “Your ability to get players is not going to be enough to sustain your job anymore...the strategic element of college basketball is then going to go up.”
  – Bomani Jones [47:58]

• UNC Coach Tree & Candidate Pool:
  • UNC, like Duke, finds itself with fewer “family” options for the top job, which contributed to seeking Malone.
  • Notables like Jerry Stackhouse and Billy Donovan are discussed as alternate possibilities.

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Doc Rivers’ “Google Me” Legend:
  “There’s at least one—‘yeah, he said that shit’…And the Google me was…‘I do this. But what about y’all?’”
  – Bomani Jones [04:25]
• The Bucks’ Dysfunction:
  “Now you’ve got Giannis, who doesn't want to be the bad guy, with Doc Rivers, who never wants to be the responsible guy. It sounds like it's no fun to be anybody on that team this year.”
  – Bomani Jones [07:18]
• On Wemby & Giannis Defending Together:
  “We will, we will see the first zero points in the paint game in NBA history if that happens.”
  – Tom Haberstroh [21:55]
• On Parity vs. Rivalries:
  “As much as we want to say parity is the North Star of the NBA…I think we want story.”
  – Tom Haberstroh [24:25]
• Adam Silver’s Tanking Problem:
  “You can’t flatly tell the paying customers we’re trying to lose…What has made it terrible for him though, is that the paying customers have been so conditioned to think this is cool they’re…begging for losses.”
  – Bomani Jones [39:25]
• College Basketball Professionalization:
  “It’s going to be a lot more NBA-type coaches come down there. Because…the ability to get players is going to be about money in the front office.”
  – Bomani Jones [47:58]

---

Conclusion

This engrossing episode blends league gossip, strategic insight, and big-picture vision for both the NBA and college basketball. Bomani and Tom dive into the uncomfortable truths behind star movement, the tanking pandemic, the new realities for franchises in both the NBA and NCAA, and why the upcoming postseason could be a turning point for how we understand “winning” in basketball.

For fans who missed the episode:

• You’ll get an appreciation for why the Bucks/Doc/Giannis drama is so messy,
• Why Wemby’s Spurs could reshape the league overnight (especially with Giannis),
• And what Mike Malone’s UNC hiring says about hoops’ rapidly changing power structures.

---

For Full Context:

• Giannis-Bucks drama: 01:22–17:20
• Spurs’ title window with Giannis possibility: 17:20–25:32
• Parity vs. dynasty narrative: 25:32–32:44
• Tanking’s impact and gambling links: 35:08–42:27
• Mike Malone/college basketball evolution: 44:11 to end

Check out Tom Haberstroh’s “Tom the Finder” newsletter and Bomani’s weekly podcasts for more deep-dive NBA coverage.

Transcript

[A]

Toogood and Co Coffee Creamers are made with farm fresh cream, real milk and contain 3 grams of sugar per serving. That's 40% less than the 5 grams per serving in leading traditional coffee creamers for a rich, delicious experience. Whether you enjoy your coffee hot, cold, bold or frothy, two good coffee creamers make every sip a good one. Two good coffee creamers Real goodness in every sip. Find them at your local Kroger in the creamer aisle. Hey, whatcha doin'? Are you doomscrolling other people's vacations? Miami San Diego With Expedia, your trip can earn rewards which you can use towards your next eligible stay. Soon people will doomscroll you. Expedia, the one place you go to go places terms apply. Wave.

[B]

Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to the Right Time, a Wave original. My name is Bomani Jones. Thanks for listening wherever you get your podcast. Thanks for watching us on YouTube. Subscribe like, rate us, review us, give us five stars. You only give us four stars. I'm inclined to believe you are a hater. It is that time of week where we have a guest join us. Check him out on Yahoo. Sports and many other places, including Tom the Finder. Great newsletter to which I subscribe. Tom Haberstrough what's going on man?

[C]

Not a whole lot, Bomani Glad to be here.

[B]

Hey man, I'll get to the Mike Malone of things perhaps a little bit later as I realize you as a Wake Forest guy may have some interest in that. But we gotta start with what is going on in Milwaukee where Shamsradia, and it should be noted, Shams is the guy to get you information. Shams is not the guy to write a 4,000 word rundown of what's been going on with a team. I don't say that as a judgment. That's just not really typically like what he does. Maybe it's because people acted like he was lying, but he said that Giannis has said that he wanted to go to the Knicks, but he sure was like I told y' all he wanted to go to the Knicks. But it was a long rundown of a chaotic situation with the Bucks that added all right, so it's Giannis who keeps telling us in public he doesn't want to be traded, but we all know he wants to be traded. And then you add that with a dollop of the most passive aggressive man in basketball, passive aggressive hall of Famer Doc Rivers. You put all that together. That sounds like a terrible situation that is now boiling over in part because the Bucks just want to tank. And Giannis just wants to play, but he doesn't want to play for them. But they can't find a trade. What? What? What you got?

[C]

What you got, man? There's so many ways we can tackle this story, but I want to start with Doc Rivers saying, Google me in a meeting in a. And and Shabs Tarani in the story. And I'm glad you picked up the fact that he wrote like a 4,000 word missive about this, because that's not typically what the newsbreakers do in this day and age. So Shams essentially was like, I got the CVS receipt right here. And all of the stories, anecdotes that support the notion that Giannis Antetokounmpo wants out of there, but won't be willing to say it. He doesn't want to be the guy to say, I want to trade, demand, I want to trade request. And remember when Woj Adrian Mojanrowski on draft night, he would come up with like 18 different synonyms for they're going to select this player. Remember that? Shops Torani. If you read his story, it's similar, except there's no mention of a trade quote, unquote, demand or trade request. And it's very interesting how everybody in the room knows what's going on, but they're not willing to say that word demand, request. And it's just, they're all dancing around this thing that Giannis doesn't want to be the bad guy and Doc Rivers doesn't want to be there. Day one, Doc Rivers said, I don't know why they hired me. I told them not to hire me. This makes no sense. But, man, $40 million is 4. $40 million. And when that contract is on the table, I understand why Doc Rivers left ESPN to go take that job. But when he says Google me and Shams Charania in the story isn't just saying multiple sources told me. He said, six sources told me

[B]

that

[C]

was like, I got six people in that room telling me that this went down. So if you don't believe that I have receipts on this story, check that.

[B]

I want to know exactly what the six people said, right? Because the first person was probably like, hey, check this out. You never gonna believe this, right? And then he starts calling other people for confirmation. There's at least one. Yeah, he said that shit. Another, oh, you know about bruh or bro. That's how they say it now, bro. And the Google me was. What was it that he was saying? He's like, you guys can look me Up. I've taken teens to the playoffs that weren't supposed to go to the playoffs because he was trying to rally them into the play in game. And the long and the short was I, I do this. But what about y'? All?

[C]

Yeah, and, and Doc Rivers, man, we could do a whole 90 minutes about the Doc Rivers story. But that, that Boston team, it wasn't like they came out of nowhere to win the NBA title in 2008. I think they started out like 24 and three that season. So it wasn't like nobody believed us. You can't play that card with the championship year. And after that it's a, it's a mixed bag. You know, he's like exactly 500 in the postseason as a NBA head coach. And when you look at all the 31 leads, which I have a contrarian take on that. But Doc Rivers, if you go to Google me, he has been such a Punchline in the NBA that Gemini or ChatGPT or any of these AI apps are probably going to put stuff at the very top of Doc Rivers Google search that he doesn't want to be in there.

[B]

Okay. Doc's first year in Orlando, I recall as being a magic trick. Like he, ah, Magic. But he took a team very. He took a team to the playoffs that people did not think was going to go to the playoffs. You have to remember that that was the period of time where they kept thinking Grant Hill might play this year and then Grant Hill would be hurt again. Right. He also had that year after the Clippers traded Chris Paul where they absolutely exceeded expectation. I am also with you. I think the 3:1 thing is a bit overstated.

[C]

One of those is like the Orlando, Orlando went up 31 against. I think it was Detroit. Detroit as an eight seed against the number one seed. I'm sorry, I don't count that as a blown lead when you're the eight seed about to upset a number one seed. I just say, man, that's crazy that he got to a 31 lead in that series. Yes, they lost it, but it was a 1 8. Like there's a couple of those where you're just like, all right, I get it, but go on.

[B]

Yeah, the, there's also in that 3:1, the weird one against the Rockets where they had the lead in game six. And then I think it was Kevin McHale was coaching the team at the time and somehow he got the bright idea maybe we should take James Harden out of the game and just see what happens. And next thing you know, they didn't do it. But those teams were deep enough. Like, the Clippers would wind up just simply not having enough gas. Like, I think Doc Rivers is a good coach. I think Doc Rivers in the hall of Fame, which just happened, is preposterous because they don't really put coaches in the hall of Fame. Like, that is a. Eric Spouser you're in now. Like, I had been prepared to make a. Like there's a. There's a. Could go either way. Nope, nope, nope. You're going in, and Doc Rivers has gotten in. But where Doc Rivers is really in the hall of Fame is making your players not like you, like your. Your team not liking you, in part because nothing is ever your fault. And so now you've got Giannis, who doesn't want to be the bad guy, with Doc Rivers, who never wants to be the responsible guy. It sounds like it's no fun to be anybody on that team through the course of this year. Like none. And as I recall, do they not have control of their pick this year?

[C]

So this is how it works. They have the lesser of the New Orleans pick.

[B]

That's right. Because one of them goes to Atlanta.

[C]

Exactly. So the number one.

[B]

The.

[C]

If it goes number one, they don't get it. But if, let's say New Orleans lands the number one overall pick, they send it to Atlanta and then Milwaukee will basically get whatever they end up with, like the Milwaukee team. So they have incentive to tank. This is one of the biggest misnomers in the NBA season that I've just. It's been a pet peeve of mine where they're like, they don't even own their own pick. They have no incentive to tank.

[B]

And.

[C]

And I'm like, yes, they do, because New Orleans is terrible. If New Orleans is terrible, that means Milwaukee should also be terrible because that pick is going to go to Atlanta and then they're going to get whatever they are at. And so this is the math for the Milwaukee Bucks is as long as New Orleans is terrible, they have every reason to be as bad as possible. So New Orleans is 26 and 54 right now, and Milwaukee's 31 and 48. They should be way lower than that, because as long as that Pelicans team is in the basement, they have all the tanking potential. And so Giannis, this whole thing, I, I said from the beginning, this is the worst supporting cast for an MVP candidate we have ever seen. You can say all you want about Miles Turner, but that roster, with Kyle Kuzma being your third best player is awful. And so for those people who are like, man, this is a tough situation for Giannis, I'm like, he should have been asking out immediately once Damian Lillard had his torn Achilles and just said, look, the writing is on the wall. We had a good run, we won a championship, I'm out. But instead, like you point out, he wanted to be the whole Dwight Howard in this situation and not really be transparent. And so it just seems like everyone in this situation is not being honest about what's really happening here. The, the front office is tanking, wants to tank the Doc Rivers wants his paycheck and Giannis Anadokounmpo wants out of there. And I just wish everyone would stop this just two faced dealings with each other because it's just, it's nauseating. This has been 10 months of this and I'm so tired of Giannis just trying to be the good guy. His players are his, his, his brothers are on the roster. He's, he wants to play with them. And so he doesn't really have the leverage that he thinks he does because he, the Bucks know Bomani, the Bucks know he doesn't want to say it. And so they're calling his bluff and they're saying, Bomani, we got $275 million coming at you this summer. Are you really going to walk away with from that? Because this is the weird thing. If Giannis walks away and makes a trade demand, he will not get the maximum bag because it has to be with a team that he's been with for over six months. And so when you're asking for a trade, you cannot sign that super max extension with your new team if it's the Knicks or if it's the Miami Heat. And so the Milwaukee Bucks are like, you don't want to say that word trade, demand or that phrase. And you also got a big bag here that if you resign here, that's the only place you can get it. And we'll see how much that money and that trade demand loyalty really matters to you.

[B]

What he needed to learn from Dwight. And I've been making the Dwight comparison through all of this and you never want to go the full Dwight, right? Like, like unless you're trying to block a shot, you never want to go the full Dwight. And people like good guys the try to be a good guy. Nobody likes that guy or they like it at first and then they realize, ugh, I'm not sure about this. Like, this is not a guy beloved by his peers. I don't know so much how his teammates feel about him, but they I am certain that Bobby Portis has not enjoyed this at all. In fact, that story has something in there about Bobby Portis getting sick of it. And the person I don't want mad at me is the guy that broke Miro Titch's face that one time, and witnesses said it didn't even look like he hit him that hard. That is not that. That's not the guy I want to be in this situation with. My question for you, though, is if you do make a trade and you get Giannis at this point, what exactly are you getting? Right? Because this is Giannis after 13 years in the NBA. He has still put up excellent numbers, but I'm not sure any player has been more heliocentric offensively than he has been a guy that's putting up 35, 36, 37, 38 usage year after year after year. You start building around that. I don't know how exactly you drop that off onto something else. Like if you drop him off onto the Knicks, you think that squad is all of a sudden going to give him 40% of the shots?

[C]

Not with Jalen Brunson around. I don't think so. You saw what happened to Carl Anthony Towns this year, and when Mike Brown took over, he was saying, hey, I don't know about this offense. Like right out the gate, Carl Anthony Towns was saying, I don't know about this offense. And the reason is because Mike Brown was like, we're giving Jalen Brunson the ball and we're going to make sure that we're going to not have all of Carl Anthony Towns histrionics and weird stuff on offensively and they're going to run through, you know, him and Mikel Bridges, OG Anunoby and try to get the offense a little bit more reoriented away from Karl Anthony Town. So for Giannis, look, Giannis entering the season had been top four in MVP in each of the last seven seasons. Seven years in a row he has been that durable. And I know he's had his injuries. This year it's gotten way worse. But seven years in a row he's been top four in MVP. He's one MVP. He's also defensive player of the year, finals MVP. And you're gonna have a guy who's turning 32 in December. What do you do with that? What do you do with that? With the calf injuries, the hyperextended knee, and also in the Finals when he hyper extended his knee and then magically it didn't seem to matter. There's a, there's a lot of history here that if you're at the acquiring team, I think you're gonna have to have a Jalen Brunson or someone else to essentially tell Giannis, hey, it's okay. You don't have to go out and get 30 for us tonight, maybe 25 is fine. But if, if we're going to win in the postseason, we need Giannis to focus on the defense and we need him to just be a fast break phenom like he normally is, where he can just create dunks out of fast breaks like no one we've ever seen in NBA history. So for Giannis, it's a guy that, if you're looking at this at the back nine of his career, with his athleticism, he hasn't had that major injury yet. But with the way that the NBA is trending with the high speed tempo, with the, you have to, if you're going to win an NBA title, you got to be guaranteed that you're going to be ready for a hundred games. And he simply hasn't done that. A deep playoff run. Giannis has been a first round out or not doing anything in the postseason for four years now. So we haven't seen whether Giannis's body is equipped at this age to make a deep playoff run. You know, the Miami Heat are going to take a chance. You know, the New York Knicks are going to take a chance. But I can understand why other teams might be a little nervous about acquiring Giannis at this stage of his career.

[B]

He, he has one of the great postseason performances of all time. Game six, 20, 21, to bring it home. He also has been one of the great postseason under performers of his time. And in a way that is interesting. So I think that we could say at various points, so Kevin Garnett is an interesting guy for his career because Kevin Garnett needed to get to a place where he could be the leader, but not the guy that had to take the last shot. Right? And yes, he's got game seven against Sacramento in 04 where he carried them on his back, but that's not a guy who wanted that shot. We've seen it. You could pull up clips of it that wasn't him. Right. But the difference is Kevin Garnett was not a 38 usage guy. Right. Giannis had the free throw issue, though. I always gave him credit. He'd go to the line and take them. Right. He was not afraid of being embarrassed and taking those shots, but he'd go and he'd take them. However, I can't think of a player that was ever as good as him that we just saw those teams come up short like they did. He's been on the wrong side of an 81 loss. Right when they took that loss in the bubble that year, that was another one. The two old lead that they blew to Toronto in 2019, where most of us thought that that was going to be a series that they were going to walk to because that was before we told ourselves Nick Nurse was a good coach because it looked like him and Booten Holzer were just trying to. Trying to lose to each other in the course of that. But we've had all these years where he hasn't been the guy to get this done. He's not a take us to a championship guy at this point. I don't think. I think he can be a very significant part of you going to a championship. But I don't know what he thinks of himself in all of this. I don't know what happens when you drop him off after being on a franchise that is catered to him as you should cater to a guy that's made first team all NBA seven times in a row. What happens when he goes to this next place? Miami, to me seems like the obvious place for him to go because he is a Pat Riley, air Expostra sort of dude. Because if nothing else, he is going to go hard. He is going to be in shape if you put him out there with bam. I don't know how other teams are supposed to score any points. Like, I think they still need to get a guy to get the shot. But that, that to me has got to be the place that I would want to wind up if I were him. Not anymore.

[C]

I, I feel the same way with the Miami Heat, with, with Giannis. You know, that the coach is ready, the organization is ready for that guy. They. They look, they took Jimmy Butler to the NBA finals twice. You know, they, they won the number

[B]

one overall or, or Jimmy Butler took them to the NBA finals twice. It all depends on your perspective.

[C]

That's right. You know, my point is that they, they older guy.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

And morph him into a championship contender like that. And so what we saw with Jimmy Butler, where I was in this camp where he's too old and way too many miles on those tires, those Tom Thibodeau tires, for me to believe that they're going to actually get to a finals with Jimmy Butler. And they proved me Wrong. Multiple times. And so I, I look, I got my career started in Miami. I know that organization very well, and that is exactly the type of dude that they want in that organization. A guy who's defensive mind, who is a Hooper, a grinder, a guy who lives in the gym, will play for the Greek national team, even though it's probably not the best idea for him physically to have to endure another year of. Of international play on a team that, look, let's be honest, they're not. They're not vying for a gold medal.

[B]

They. The Milwaukee. They. The Milwaukee Bucks of Europe.

[C]

And I'm Greek, so, like, I, I feel a lot of national pride when I watch him playing for. For the Greek team. But I also know, hey, if Giannis. Senator Cooper wants to win another title or maximize his career, I kind of feel like he should probably take the summer off. Now. The other thing is, Miami Heat is one team. The other team that I'm. I'm wondering about San Antonio. San Antonio with Victor Wembanyama, Cancel Christmas and Stefan Castle, Andy, Aaron, Fox, you can, you can get Giannis, I'm sure, for Dylan Harper. Dylan Harper is one of the best young players in the league, and he's still at 20 years old. So if you're looking for young like, like superstar, potential James Harden 2.0, Milwaukee Bucks can do a lot worse than Dylan Harper as the centerpiece of a Giannis trade. And if the spurs get Yanis and they got Wemby and Fox and Stefan Castle, that's why the glut of amazing young guards there of San Antonio is so terrify. It's not because, hey, they can have James Harden 2.0 and Shay Gildrus Alexander and basically all in the same, you know, team, it's that they can parlay one of those players into a win. Now, guy like Giannis. And imagine if they do the San Antonio Twin Towers, you got David Robinson, Tim Duncan 2.0 with Giannis and Wemby. That's why I'm like, hey, if San Antonio wins this whole thing, I think maybe the rest of the league is going to have a breath of fresh air because they're not going to go out and try to upgrade. But if they lose early in this postseason and Wemby's like, yo, get me a guy. The Giannis trade is fascinating.

[B]

Okay. I had never considered this as a possibility. Throw something out here at you. I had a buddy, he's from la, right? Kind of like LA Private School World. And he always talked about how he was friends with somebody who was cool with the Collins twins, Jason and Jaren Collins. And he said the day was so long that they slept in they room. Each of them slept on two beds that went the long way, right? That's how tall they were that you had to put another bed at the foot of the bed for them dudes to be able to lay in the bed. And I thought about that. These two guys were on the same high school team, right? Like, this is like Brook and Robin Lopez. It's one thing to have like super sized twins, but super sized twins who are like five star recruits and you have to play against them in high school. And what you're telling me is that the spurs could potentially recreate this because my brother's 13 years older than me, I know what it's like to never feel like you're open, right? Like at every turn you just feel like somebody might spot pitch your into the stands. They got two of those. Like, Giannis has an argument for being the best defensive player of his generation, right. Like he's up there with Kawhi Leonard. It's a different thing because he's so much taller, but absolutely as an interior, interior defender who could also step out and all of those things. And then you're going to put him with the best defensive player I've ever seen. Yeah. Yeah. Ouch.

[C]

It's possible, man. It's. It's possible. It's possible. We will, we will see the first zero points in the paint game in NBA history if that happens, you know, like, like, like no one's going in. There's no one going into that house. There's no one going inside of the arc. If you got Wemby and Giannis on the floor, because Giannis, he's not the greatest shot blocker, but he's also the greatest threat. Like, he's all. Just him lurking there is going to terrify people from going into the paint. And you got, you got Wemby too. So they have picks. They got, they got Dylan Harper, they got Steph Castle, they've got Dear and Fox. They've got a lot of interesting pieces here that Milwaukee or any other team. Houston could have done this when they had Fred Van Vliet and Stephen Adams healthy. That they have some young players that they could put into a trade. Now, I'm not so sure they can do that. But San Antonio, I think that's what the most interesting dynamic is it because Wemby wants it, right? Wemby wants it and he wants it now. If there's one thing we know about Wemby, it's. He's all about this life. He wants. He wants the. The All Star Game mvp. He wants to win All Star. He wants the mvp. He wants to be the goat. And he's willing to say it. So if he's willing to say he's the MVP out to the public, to the media, at the press conference, and if they lose in the second round because de' Aaron Fox has a bad series or Stefan Castle, Dylan Harper aren't ready yet, you know he's going to make his voice heard. And the San Antonio spurs with Victor Wembanyama that good right now, I can understand where they're like, you know what? Let's end the NBA right now. Oklahoma City, your time is up. We're going to go get Giannis and we're going to end this right now.

[B]

But, you know, Sam got everything he need to make a move, too, though. Like, man, the arms race with two of the four smallest markets in America, baby, it's on. Well, not America, but, you know.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, it. This is. This is Bomani what the NBA needs. Because as much as Adam Silver wants to say he loves parody and he wants parody, I. I don't. I don't truly believe that. I think he is in the David Stern school of thought of what's better than Lakers. Knicks. Give me Lakers. Lakers. Yes, Right? We had. We had J. J Donde on the pod yesterday. Basketball Illuminati. You should check it out every. Every Wednesday. We dropped that podcast with Amino Hass and Anthony Mays and I. And we had Jay Adande. We were talking David Stern and Adam Silver were. And this league of parody where seven different titles, seven different teams have won titles over the last seven years. And I'm sitting here like, I Bomani, I kind of want the rivalries back. I want teams going at it every season and having that story build. Because as much as we said we want parody, I think we want story. I think we want David versus Goliath. I think we want Godzilla versus King Kong, where it's like, I want these two juggernauts, OKC and San Antonio, to meet up in the playoffs, and I want them to hate each other. And we're already there, except for the playoff thing. And I want that to happen. I want this rivalry. I want a Sam Presti and RC Buford, Giannis Anetokubo bidding war. Because I. I feel like the NBA needs this. They need these rivalries. Because as much as we want to say parody is the North Star of the NBA. I think that's a a euphemism for another economic goal for the NBA owners rather than true parody. I think the NBA needs this in a way that I don't think people appreciate is San Antonio and okc. We need that rivalry in the Western Conference.

[B]

All right, so coming up next, I want to talk about this exact thing because I have long felt that way, but I've wavered a little bit. I'm explaining why. Coming up next, you can predict the playoff action all the way to the finals. With FanDuel predicts, all you have to do is sign up to get you a $25 bonus. Follow all the playoff dishes, swishes, wishes and misses. Every move is a potential plot twist. Predict the spread, the total points and even the game winning moments that make the playoffs where one run, one rebound, one shot changes everything from opening tip to the final buzzer. Stay locked in with every pass, every play and every moment that moves us closer to crowning a champion. Sign up now for your $25 bonus on FanDuel Predicts offered by FanDuel Prediction Markets LLC, a registered futures commissions merchant. 18 plus bonus is non withdrawable and expires 7 days after receipt. Trading derivatives involves significant risk and may not be suitable for all investors. Manage your activity with our consumer protection tools. Restrictions apply. See [e-mail] predicts bonusofferterms right now at

[D]

the Home Depot Shop Spring Black Friday Savings and get up to 40% off plus up to $500 off select appliances from top brands like Samsung. Get a fridge with zero clearance hinges so the doors open fully even in tighter spaces in your kitchen and laundry. That saves you time like an all in one washer dryer that can run a full load in just 668 minutes. Shop spring black Friday savings plus get free delivery on appliance purchases of $998 or more at the Home Depot offer about April 9 through April 29 US only C store online for details the

[E]

right window treatments change everything. Your sleep, your privacy, the way every room looks and feels. @blinds.com We've spent 30 years making it surprisingly simple to get exactly what your home needs. We've covered over 25 million windows and have 50,000 five star reviews to prove. Prove we deliver. Whether you DIY it or want a pro to handle everything from measure to install, we have you covered. Real Design professionals free samples. Zero pressure right now get up to 45% off with minimum purchase plus get a free professional [e-mail] rules and restrictions apply.

[C]

Offered by FanDuel Prediction Market, LLC, a registered future commission merchant. 18 plus 1 per user. Minimum $10 deposit required. Trading derivatives involve significant risk and may not be suitable for all investors. Manage your activity with our consumer protection tools.

[B]

All right, we are back with Tom Haberstro and I am just like you. I felt that dynasty saga is the best narrative form for the NBA, right? Like with San Antonio, I think people have missed a point where there's like, oh, you just saying they can't win because they just don't have experience. It's like, no, it's that playoff basketball is not the same same kind of basketball as the regular season. And we have not seen what they will do in playoff basketball. And literally every other team we've seen pretty much has needed to figure out playoff basketball, including the Oklahoma City juggernaut that exists now went in and lost in the second round. That first year that they got there is the number one seed because it's a matter of learning what it is. Right? And so there's something to that where a team gets a little farther, gets a little farther, typically having somebody that they have to run up against a couple of times before they manage to get by, that is how I prefer it. However, I have to say I am totally fascinated by what the west is. Right. Like, I love the idea that this year these games are going to matter all the way until the end how those matchups go matter. And it's sizing up such that I think Denver would rather be in the four than be in the three. But the Lakers having their injury situation basically locks Denver into the three. But what that means is we're going to get Jokic and the spurs in the second round and as we just saw on Saturday, that'll be a slobber knocker. Right. And as good as Victor is, the best player in the NBA is still number 15. We're going to have to see that Oklahoma City getting matched up with Hu. That one stinks because Oklahoma City is going to walk over whoever they get in the second round if it stays Lakers Rockets in that round. But I liked the idea that I didn't really have a great handle on who was going to win the West. Right. Like I look at the east that I feel very similarly where there's no team that I think you could look at just because we don't know what Jason Tatum is going to look like with the pounding of playing in the postseason. Right. I think they've gotten more out of the parody than I expected for them to get. Like, I think this is going to be pretty broadly an interesting postseason, but you're right, it might be the last one, because those teams at the top are going to have to ramp up.

[C]

Yeah, I think, I think, I think the spurs can win it this year. I think the spurs can win it this year and overcome that playoff inexperience. Because if there's one thing we've seen over the last few years in the league is that injuries are creating more parody. Injuries like the Indiana Pacers getting all the way to the conference finals two years ago and the NBA Finals last year is much of a story as it is of Tyrese Halliburton and his amazing clutch play and Siakam and the. And just the balling out that Andrew Nemhard and Aaron Neesmith do. It's. It's certainly a story, but it's also that these injuries in the Eastern Conference have paved way for the New York Knicks and the Indiana Pacers to go deeper into the postseason than we ever imagined. And I think, I think that if there was going to be a year in which the San Antonio spurs are an era where a team with no playoff experience. I'm not counting Harrison Barnes in this equation. Right. The playoff inexperience, that variable. I think in the 90s and early 2000s, it would matter a whole great deal. But because the game is so violent right now on the joints and because the pace is so high, I'm wondering if we're not taking that into account enough that there is just so much variance in the postseason now because the game is taking out so many star players that we, I mean, OKC went to two game sevens last year. Bomani.

[B]

Yeah.

[C]

You know, and so it's. And if Aaron Gordon is healthy in that series, you could say that, that, that Denver wins that series against okc. So I, I, part of me says, yeah, the spurs have to go by the tradition, the ritual of it is in the NBA that you cannot just come out of the gate without any postseason runs and win the whole damn thing. We've never seen that happen. But I kind of feel like we need to rewrite the history books with this injuries that we're seeing among star players in, in the NBA where star players this year are playing only 60% of their games. SGA, Chad Holgren, Jaylen. Jaylen Williams, J Dub. They've only played 26 games together this season. And so if they're not healthy. Yeah, I can see the San Antonio Spurs Upsetting them in the postseason. And after that, all bets are off. I kind of feel like the San Antonio spurs can win a title this year and not. And not lay down to the history of all of those teams that needed a playoff run before they, they won it all.

[B]

Well, this series that I think would be interesting for the spurs to kind of chart the course of what happens is if the Clippers beat the suns in that 7, 8 play in game, assuming that's going to be the game, I think the Clippers will win two of those because the version of Kawhi Leonard that currently exists and has been playing this year, he'll get you one at least. Right? Like that. That is an all time great postseason performer. Right. Like he's not young anymore. I want to say this is 15th year in the NBA, but I think they'll knock the spurs around a little bit. Right? They'll, they'll, they'll give them. Because look, we just saw Victor catch a rib contusion that felt like a very skinny man injury. Right? Like we, we, we, we. We just saw that thing go down. The attrition for the spurs, like that one will. That one will be entering. Interesting for us to see how this ends up going. But also let us not forget it's entirely possible that the legend killer Anthony Edwards could come out here and take Denver out in the first round himself.

[C]

Yeah, the, the west is, the west is going to be a bloodbath. And Kawhi Leonard, by the way, he's number five on my mvp. Valid. Mvp. Valid. Let's just count Luca in there for, for now. But he's going to get first team all NBA. He deserves to get first team all NBA. Aspiration scandal aside, imagine the other owners if Kawhi is winning a playoff series, you know, a 18 series. If the Clippers somehow pull that off and one of the most all time biggest upsets. Steve Ballmer is just going to be laughing his way to that next round if that happens.

[B]

But the GMs might care. The owners do not care at all.

[C]

What that Steve Ballmer is getting away with this.

[B]

I firmly believe that once this investigation is done and whatever they come back with, because I'm not sure, I'm not sold that he's getting away with anything. I have not been convinced of that yet. Okay, I'm just telling you, don't nobody really care. A colleague of mine made a very good point about this aspiration situation and this is the truth. The NBA's problem right now is teams trying to lose it is not teams trying to win. Nobody really cares.

[C]

I can get on with the teams trying to lose thing. Did you see the piece that I did last week about the A league and the B league?

[B]

I did.

[C]

It is unbelievable, Bomani, how this league just morphed into two separate leagues. And I absolutely agree with you that Adam Silver on the list of things that he has to care about is the integrity of the game and that that teams are throwing games strategically with coaching decisions. Where I saw the coach of the Washington Wizards argue that Alex Sar and Bilal Koulibaly and Keyshawn George, I think Trey Johnson that they were on minutes restrictions due to their medical situations and that's why they had to sit in the fourth quarter in these close games. Bub Carrington had to sit in the fourth quarter of these games even though he played the first 12 minutes of the game. Bomani and he said, yeah, we got minutes restrictions on these guys.

[B]

It's Tom Tuesday night the Golden State warriors are trailing the Sacramento Kings by a point. And the Kings intentionally fouled to put the warriors on the line. They intentionally filed Steph Curry.

[C]

Come on,

[B]

what are we doing? Right? Like I feel like the one, the one maybe benefit of makes it feel like every team in the playoffs is coming in on a run, right? Because they get to play enough games against these bums. Like I'm looking at the top half of the, the top six teams in the east right now. The Pistons have won 7 out of 10. The Celtics have won 8 out of 10. The Knicks have won 7 out of 10. The Cavs have won 8 out of 10. The Hawks have won 7 out of 10. Everybody feeling good? Go down to the West. Thunder 9 out of 10. Spurs 9 out of 10. Nuggets 9 out of 10. Keeping in mind the one loss for the spurs was to the Nuggets. Rockets 8 out of 10. Hey man, all these Bubs got everybody else feeling good.

[C]

Well, I, I wonder Bomani, do you think Adam Silver cares about this or does he care about the gambling aspect of it? Of A lot of. A lot of people who are setting the lines on this game don't know who's playing or how much they're going to be playing and where to set these lines at? Because we just saw the Oklahoma City Thunder. I think they were favored by a record 24 points in a game and they won by 35. And so these lines makers, they're not really sure where to put them because they don't know like how much these teams are actually trying to win and play their best players. And so I'm wondering if, if Adam Silver, the reason why he's so publicly strident in saying we are going to end this now, full stop, you're going to see the end of tanking. Is that because the owners want this or is that because his business partners want this at the other gambling companies? Because it does seem like to me he is out here saying a lot about how he is going to end tanking. And the proposals that I'm seeing, Bomani, these seem like half measures. I don't, I, we, we talked about it last time I was on the show. I don't know how you salt quote unquote solve tanking by maintaining the draft lottery. I just don't see how that's possible because he's saying one thing and then what he's coming at with us is a totally different thing. A much more water diluted version of we're going to abolish tanking. We're going to get rid of it. And so I'm wondering if Adam Silver is just not up for this task of trying to get rid of tanking because I think we all know what that would, what, what that would take. And it doesn't seem like he's willing to get rid of the draft lottery, which is incentivizing teams to be as bad as possible to get the players they're as good as possible on the best financial construct in the rookie scale contract.

[B]

Yeah. Or, you know, and you and I have talked about this because they flat, by flattening the lottery odds, it's now made it more advantageous for teams that don't have to be terrible to lose more games. Right. Because they, they then have a greater chance in order to win. But I think for Silver, part of it is definitely what's going on with the gambling companies. Right. But I also think the other part of it is, and probably the biggest part is it's become shameful to a point of disrespect. They're playing so obviously in our faces as a collective and directly in his face as a commissioner in a way that they never would have done to David Stern. Right. Like, it's just the, the measures that teams are taking in the ways that they're going about it. You can't flatly tell the paying customers we're trying to lose here. What has made it terrible for him though, is that the paying customers have been so conditioned to think this is cool that they're in many cases begging for losses. Yeah. Like I I don't know how exactly he fixes it, but you're right. The presence of a lottery throws all this off. The presence of a draft, honestly, you know, you and I have talked about this. The presence of a draft throws this thing off. But he does have to do something about this. But at the same time, it has been a very interesting close to the season. Right. Which is something that we haven't always been able to say. You just can't have people playing in your face like that. Yeah, yeah.

[C]

It's. It's something that I, I think has happened increasingly is the separation with the play in tournament like that. You have 10 teams that are postseason eligible now. But it's created this split in ways we have never seen that there's 20 teams that are trying to win 21 if you count the Pelicans. Cause they don't have the rights to their first round pick. And then everybody else is like, all right, well if we're not going to go for the play in. And by the way, the T. The 10 seed in the play in ain't all it's cracked up to be. One team has made it out of the play in, in 10 times that they've. They've had this one team has made it out of the play in as the number 10 seed. And it was the Miami Heat last year and they got embarrassed BTA in that. In that series against the Cleveland Cavaliers. And so if you're a number 10 seed or a team that's on the fringe of competing, I can understand why Chicago was like, all right, finally we're going to pull, pull the, pull the court. Right. I can understand why, why Memphis, Dallas, Milwaukee is like, as long as we're just kind of like in that 9, 10, 11 range. We just saw the Atlanta Hawks jump to number one. We just saw the Dallas Mavericks get Cooper flag at number 11. So it's created this separation between the two leagues and the teams are being as brave about this and as bold and emboldened about this as they've ever had, like tanking outright from the start of the season. And you're right, it's. It's not really worth it for those teams in that 11 range, like in the 11th of the. Of the playoff standings to try to go for it and get that number 10 seed. So I just think that the NBA has to figure this out. But ultimately, yeah, I'm excited for the postseason to get here. So we can get rid of that talk. We just can talk about how good OKC in San Antonio and Denver, it is going to be a absolute bloodbath. And I wonder if Omani. I think the best story for the NBA would be San Antonio winning it all. Victor Wembanyama as fully empowered and winning a championship. But I also can't discount the, the idea of Victor Wembanyama pissed as all hell and getting out in like the second round and being like, we gotta ramp up.

[B]

Yeah. No, no, no. A Game 7 loss, whether it be to Oklahoma City or to Denver, I, I think is the best long run NBA situation because, look, he took a leap this year. The first two years were the potential years from him now where he's taking guys to the elbow and in operating in space and they are terrified of what might happen next. On top of everything that happens with defense, like now he's out here flexing in people's faces and everything else like, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no. This. But if it goes. Look, I was talking to somebody about this the other day and they were asking me, are the French the favorites to win the gold medal in 2028? And I think the answer is unequivocally yes. He tasted, he. He tasted his own blood at the crib in 2024. Now he gets the chance to return the favor in Los Angeles. It's going to be terrifying now if you give yourself somehow an NBA analog to that situation.

[C]

I can't wait. I can't wait. It's the guy. The guy is. Offensively, he's developed in a way that was way faster than many imagined. But he's 22. Bomani, like, this is, this is the worst he's ever going to be. Yeah, the worst he's ever going to be. So if you have a guy who's figured out, oh, wait, no one can stop me once I, once I get downhill or once I get the ball in the post and I'm going to be watching Jokic and how he's been able to master that, that block and figure out how to play chess, you know, and literally the guy's a chess master or want an aspiring chess master, Victor Wembanyama. There's just going to be a time in the not so distant future where he's as good offensively as he is defensively. And that's a scary thought.

[B]

I do want to ask you before we get out of here if you had thoughts on this Mike Malone hire, because I think NBA coaches going to college may become more of a thing now that college is becoming a big bit more like the pros. Like now that you don't really have to go on the road and go get these guys, I think this will be interesting. But I think the Malone thing, it sounds like they're going to get him a legitimate staff, go get some players. He seems to. And of this I did not give him enough credit for. He understands the assignment when it comes to the soft stuff of being a college basketball coach. Right. Like, he knows how to talk that about how much he loves Carolina and the. In the. All of those things. This could work.

[C]

I'm for it, man. I'm for it. Like when they, when they announced that Michael Malone got that job. I've always felt Michael Malone is more of a college coach. His disposition, his personality, he has gotten, he's been ejected from games where he gets his Dan Hurley on and he gets in front of an official, an NBA official, makes contact and is so irate that he has to get ejected. Like, Jokic has multiple times had to step in front of Michael Malone because he just, he loses his temper, just absolutely loses it on guys. And you, you saw Nikola Jokic in the press conference the other day when asked about this, he's like, hey, I think he's going to have a really good opportunity here. I'm happy for him because he can actually teach and get players to play the right way. AKA he's more of a college coach than he is an NBA coach. And I do feel like Michael Malone, just the vibe I get from him is way more college oriented than it is. And he's won an NBA championship, which is crazy to say that. I feel like Michael Malone, the way he talks about the game, he's more old school. I feel like he's better suited for the college ranks than the NBA ranks. And look, man, I think it was the ad. Someone at Chapel Hill said we wanted to go out and get the best available coach, professional or otherwise. And I said, wait, college sports is professional? Like, let's not, let's not, let's not mix it up. That this is an era where you have to think that college sports is professional, getting Michael Malone. I think you're right. There's going to be a lot of guys in the NBA that feel like, oh, I can get just as much money by playing, doing the college game and I don't have to go out in the road and recruit. Didn't Dusty May talk about this is like, I haven't stepped foot in any of these houses. This is great. I love this era.

[B]

Yeah, but there's also. You're going to see. I was talking to an agent who works with college players about this a couple weeks ago, and I asked him, I was like, so how is dealing with, I guess what we'll now call a front office in college different than dealing with the front office and the pros? He's like, it's not going to be that much different because it's going to be a bunch of guys from the pros. Like, if you were somehow a washout for whatever reason in the front office in the NBA, there's a world for you now down here. Like, I think you're gonna start seeing that in football, that there's just another. There's a class of guys who maybe could not move themselves up to being a VP of player personnel or GM or anything like that. Well, maybe you just go down. Like, all those stories we got of, like, for example, Adrian Wojnowski is the GM at St. Bonaventure. For example, Master P was the GM at the University of New Orleans. Shaq's the gm. Somewhere that's about to be out the window. Like, not even so much talking about Adrian, because I think that he's probably up to that task. But the idea of a ceremonial general manager, no, no, no. I think that's about to be gone. And you're about to see a lot of guys who used to work in the pros. Just like you're going to see a lot of agents who maybe weren't that great at it in the pro ranks. They're going to start moving down into college, and those are going to be the guys that then traffic in that space. Which I then think is going to mean you're going to see a lot more NBA type coaches come down there. Because what I think is about to go extinct. Curious what you think about this. We all know college basketball, and it's a lot of guys with a lot of success. And what they did was they went and got really good players and then they rolled the ball out there. And that's all it had to be. All of us have in our mind that guy that's got all the wins and all they did was roll the ball out there. Those guys are about to be cooked. Because your ability to get players is not going to be enough to sustain your job anymore. Because the ability to get players is going to be about money in the front office. Which means, I think, the strategic element of college basketball is then going to go up, which is then going to increase demand for a guy like Malone. Because when Carolina fans were like, I don't know about this. Let me tell you what. You weren't going to find a better basketball coach. Now it's possible you might have found a better steward for your program. And maybe you thought that Tommy Lloyd, because of his time at Gonzaga and with his success at Arizona, would have been the guy for you. Tommy Lloyd is not a better basketball coach than Mike Malone is. Mike Malone, I don't think. I think we've actually undersold how good a job he did while he was in Denver.

[C]

Well, yeah, and, and that wasn't his first stop. Right. So he has the respect like LeBron loves Michael Malone.

[B]

Buggy. Yeah.

[C]

Like this, this dude. I think he's, I think it was a great hire. I thought Billy Donovan. The interesting part about the Billy Donovan story is that in a weird way, Chicago cleaning house with the front office, the Bulls and deciding to get rid of Cornish office and Eversley empowered Billy Donovan in a weird way that they're now saying the gm, the incoming front office exec has to essentially be okay with Billy Donovan as the head coach. And Billy Donovan, I, I don't know if he's, if he played his cards right here because he could have been the head coach of the, of the University of North Carolina Tar Heels and now he's got the Chicago Bulls with the same ownership. You'll get paid nicely. But I, I feel like Billy Donovan would have been a lot happier if he was at Carolina than if he was at the Chicago Bulls because I just have no faith in that ownership with Chicago has any. As any professional franchise fumbled the bag more than the Chicago bulls after the 90s bulls.

[B]

Well, that's why I would love if somebody could really get to the bottom of it with Billy in getting an understanding of why he did this. And I say that because my understanding is that he never talked to anybody beyond the search firm with Carolina. Like he was never really in it. He never really got to a point of truly pursuing this. And, and I would imagine that you would be trying to get the hell out of Dodge for what the Bulls have been like. Why would you want to continue doing this? He must really just be like, I'm done with this college thing. Even though I would feel like at this point all the things he probably didn't like about coaching college basketball, he doesn't have to deal with anymore. That being said, after working with actual factual NBA players, I can't really imagine what it's like working with college basketball players. Like this is like you going, you've taken a lot of You've taken a pretty decent level of high level math. You know how them cats don't remember how to add? Yeah. Like they get in there like two plus three. But if you ask them to take a fourth order derivative of something, they might be able to do it off the top of their heads. Maybe that's it. Like Billy Donovan is not trying to show you motherfuckers how to add. He's just not trying to do it.

[C]

Well, I, I think, I think the, the analogy of this is Bill Belichick 2.0 is way off. I think Mike Malone is way more in tune with what works in 2026 on the basketball floor and the economics and just the, the basketball talent and all the pipelines and everything. I feel like he's more in tune with this. And I think it's, I think it's lazy to say this is Belichick all over again. Way different situation with Michael Malone, who's in his prime as a coach, who just won a couple years ago, who still everyone really, really likes. And it's that that Denver Nuggets organization has been in flux. And so I wouldn't hold it against Michael Malone that he was run out right before the playoffs last year. But this is it. I'm, I'm, I'm bummed because Juke Harris, I feel like Wake's best player last year is probably going to be in Chapel Hill because Michael Malone is there now. And it feels like this is not a great situation for me at Wake Forest because I think Mike's gonna do a great job. I think he's, he's got the right tools. It's just very odd to me. We've talked about this before, Bamani, how the NBA products like the, the Chapel UNC has not produced an All Star since. I think it's Jameson, I want to say.

[B]

Well, Jameson, Jameson, I think is the last All Star. Yes, yes, yes. Well, I mean, he invents. That's the same, that's the same class.

[C]

It's been a long time, but co. The coaching tree too. You would imagine that they'd have more people who would be in the, the, the Chapel Hill fraternity, so to speak. And the Duke calls it a brotherhood. I'm surprised there aren't more candidates here. So that's another reason why Michael Malone got hired. Because if you're out here looking at other candidates and they weren't enthused with Sean May or anybody internally, I can understand why Mike Malone got that job.

[B]

I mean, to be fair, Shashevsky didn't really have a lot of candidates to take over for him. Carolina, there were some guys that got sent away from home to see if it would work out, and it didn't. Wes Miller was a guy that I think they thought may turn out to be that guy. And then he went to Cincinnati and you saw that that did not work out. For example, like, bottom line is finding the guy to be coach is really, really hard. And every now and then you wind up with an example of there's the guy that's out there in the market and then you need a coach the exact same year and you go get that guy. Right. Ohio State cutting bait on Jim Trestle because they knew Urban Meyer was going to be there in a year. Florida cutting bait on their guy and Urban Meyer was out there that year. You know what I mean? Like, if there's a guy and you're the program that you could go jump in and you can go get that guy. And this was not a year. If it's two years ago, you go get Dusty maybe, right? Dusty May takes Ford Atlantic to the Final Four and then you go get him like Michigan just did. And then now you're the one that's out here making this happen. But, whoo, this is. It's going to be an interesting season.

[C]

What about Stack? What about Stack? Do you have thoughts on him as a. As a head coach? Because it didn't work out at the college level, but now he's with the Golden State warriors. And I kind of hope that Stack would have gotten that job.

[B]

Yeah, I don't know exactly why it did not work at Vanderbilt. Right. Because Vanderbilt's not a place that everybody's going to win. It's before they got the huge influx of money. Because let me tell you, one way to get money for your college basketball program or college football, whatever, get that black dude in there, fire his black ass and watch the money pile up. That'll. That, that happens just about every single time. And that at Vanderbilt, I guarantee you, Stack is out there like, well, what do you think would have happened if you'd have gave me that money? What would concern me about Stack at Carolina is everybody wants to play a certain type of basketball and win a certain type of way. And Jerry Stackhouse was a scorer, but he wants to coach intense defensive basketball. And I don't know if that way is the way that Carolina wants to play. But I think this, if he had not gotten that Vanderbilt job, I think he might have had a better chance of getting this job. I think it would have been on the board. But I also don't think the people that were hiring cared about that. And I think Roy got to make the Hubert hire, and Roy was not going to get to make another hire. That's, that's what I think from here. But they got, they got a really, really, really good coach. Right? Like State's mad because they lost Will Wade. And I feel very confident that Mike Malone is a better basketball coach than Will Wade is, you know, but that Tom Haberstrough, check out Tom the Finder. Great newsletter for you to check out. Also check him out. Yahoo Sports. Shout out to the folks in Portland. Check them out. Talking about basketball there, too, my brother. I appreciate you.

[C]

Hey, anytime, Imani. Appreciate it.

[B]

All right, man. And ladies and gentlemen, thanks so much for joining us here on the Right Time. We do this four times a week. Ryan Brumley handling everything behind the scenes. Thank you, sir. Hit the voicemail line. 323-596-7767. Remember, follow the Right Time. Subscribe like, rate us, review us, give us five stars. You only give us four stars. I'm inclined to believe you are a hater. We'll talk to you guys in a couple of days. Take it easy.