Chloe Cole Says Doctors Abandoned Her After Detransition | The Riley Gaines Show - The Riley Gaines Show

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[00:01]
A
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[00:23]
B
no child can consent to this. By blocking a child's puberty, by giving them cross sex hormones, by removing their sex organs, you are stopping the only problem process through which they can psychologically, emotionally, physically, and of course, reproductively become adults.
[00:44]
A
We're talking to Chloe Cole. She is probably the most famous, the most renowned, the most credible d transitioner that this nation has really heard from. I would imagine many of you know her testimony. You know that she started puberty blockers and testosterone when she was 13 years old. Then at 15 years old, she had her breasts removed. Then at 16 years old, she decided she actually did want to be a mom one day. So she decided to de transition her doctors. Her doctors who initially led her down the path of transitioning, abandoned her, leaving her for. For dead, essentially, as she describes it. We're talking to her today about the current state of the gender ideology movement. We're talking to her about the legal action that she has taken against Kaiser, which I'm so excited about. We're talking about Planned Parenthood's role in all this. And we're talking about how faith has evolved in the process and how initially she didn't necessarily believe in God. She didn't think there was a God. She describes herself as an atheist, but after seeing the pure evil that is running rampant in today's culture, it allowed her to understand that there is something bigger, something bigger for herself and for our salvation. Well, Chloe, thank you for joining the Riley Gaines Show. I know you've told your story no fewer than like 10,000 times online and on social media and before Congress and on campuses and all over the world. But can you just take a very brief second and tell us a little bit about you?
[02:12]
B
Well, Riley, thank you so much for having me on your show. I mean, I really feel the same way about your work. And you're one of the bravest souls I know, using your testimony for the greater good. And I feel like we're kindred spirits and using these unfair things we've been through to help protect future generations of young girls and children. So I am speaking on the other side of the gender subject, not from a sports perspective, but as somebody who has actually Gone through the process of a so called medical gender transition. And this all happened when I was a child. I believe that I was a young man rather than a woman because of things that I now have realized were completely normal experiences. I was going through puberty, albeit a little bit early, but I had all of the normal feelings that pretty much all women go through when they're experiencing that really confusing part of life, when you're having to grapple with the fact that there's a lot of responsibilities, a lot of hardships that come with growing from a girl into a young woman and the changes of puberty. I hated how rapidly my body was growing. I hated the fact that people were commenting on things like my breast and my growing curves. And I just wanted to shrink. I didn't want anybody to see that part of me. And I was also quite a bit of a tomboy, you know? But these normal experiences I was going through, my doctors took it as something that meant that I actually was the opposite sex. And rather than challenging this view I had that I was a young boy, they went with it, and they allowed it to determine pretty much the entire course of my adolescence. So from 13 to 16 years old, I was going through the medical pathway, starting with puberty, blockers, testosterone. And I went through surgery at 15 to remove my breasts when very shortly afterward, I learned I wanted to become a mother one day. I'm a very feminine woman, and I want to go through these beautiful parts of life that I've never thought of before. I didn't know I wanted to become married. I didn't know I wanted to become a wife or to have children. All it took for me to wake up from this was just growing up a little bit, and that was how I learned. That is the antidote. And I have since been determined to use my story to help other children, to create laws and create change in the culture that will ensure that future generations will never know the pain that comes with living through the life of transgenderism. And I brought my message on campus and across the country, across the world. And I believe that one day we are going to be a world that will value children as they are dignified from conception all the way throughout their lives.
[04:59]
A
I long await the day, and I know you do, too. You said you went through this surgery at 15 years old, clearly not yet an adult. But the other side, even still, I mean, insists that this isn't really happening. Kids aren't really getting these surgeries. But you're proof that what they're saying is not the case. And it is happening, right?
[05:21]
B
Yes. And this argument is so tired because first of all, it's obviously untrue. I have gone through this. I have extensive medical records for anybody who doesn't believe that it's happening. Because I'm currently in a lawsuit, actually, against my doctors who did this to me, every single one of them. But I know of hundreds of other people personally who have gone through this at different stages of their lives, including some of them earlier than me. I know a woman in my area who had some of the same Doctors who was 13 years old when they removed her breasts. And when they see people like us, many of them will then start to admit, okay, this is something that happened, but it's actually a good thing because they got the care that they asked for and it might not have worked out for them. They say, well, things like knee surgery, right? They have a lower recorded regret rate, which is very. Obviously, it's very obvious which of these surgeries is more easy to regret, because one of them isn't even addressing a physical health issue. It's entirely mental. But it's. They. They will say, well, there. There are other. There are other children who greatly benefit from this who don't regret it. But I think that the. What is making. What makes it so evil is not just the regret, the lifelong regret that it makes these children who grow into an adults and lack these very adult parts of life later on feel the. The harm is in the treatment itself.
[06:54]
A
Do you feel like you had proper informed consent to make these decisions at, you know, 13, 14, 15? As you said, you went through this until you were 16 years old. Do you feel like you had proper informed consent?
[07:07]
B
No child can consent to this. We've determined that children are not considered adults until they are 18 years of age. And to do this to anybody below that age is stripping them of their human rights, their right to one day to fully become adults in the realest sense. Because by blocking a child's puberty, by giving them cross sex hormones, by removing their sex organs, you are stopping the only process through which they can psychologically, emotionally, physically, and of course, reproductively become adults. But if you're not yet at an age where you have the maturity or worldly experience to be able to know just how important these things in life, that all this affects your future fertility, your ability to have children one day and to experience a healthy marriage, is
[08:09]
A
there part of you now that's concerned about your fertility because of the different chemicals and hormones that you were putting in your body. Are these concerns for you as well?
[08:20]
B
What led to my detransition was me realizing that this could have taken away my fertility because of how young I was when I was going through this. And that is a very real fear for me to this day. It's something that I've had to grapple with for over five years now. But I naively thought at 13, I'm never going to want to have kids, right? Because I was 13 years old, I was still very much a child myself. I couldn't think about those parts of life yet. But Preesha and so many of my friends who have gone through this process, some of them even younger than me, have managed to come out of it with their fertility intact, with the ability to still give life with their bodies and to. And to safely give birth to perfectly healthy, beautiful, happy children. And that gives me hope one day. But my faith that has been developing over the years has. It's given me the courage to say, no matter what happens, whether I am able to get pregnant and give birth or if I am going to have to take the option of adopting, I'm going to be very happy with motherhood, whatever form it comes in.
[09:36]
A
I love that. Do you take issue with the verbiage of gender affirming care? Because in talking to you and knowing your story and now mentioning Preesha, it doesn't feel like what happened to you guys at all was care. Neither was it gender affirming, really. It was sex denying or even how it's described as. As healthcare. Do you take issue with that verbiage at all?
[10:03]
B
I think when you really look at these phrases that this ideology and this practice uses, you'll notice that they're all euphemisms from top surgery referring to either breast implants or radical double mastectomies, or bottom surgery referring to the removal of genitalia. And even the phrase gender affirming care itself, it's affirming nothing but a mental illness. Because the problem is not these people's bodies. It's not their gender, really, their sex, or the fact that they're male or female. It's something that has to do oftentimes with underlying trauma or mental health issues. If you believe that you are somebody, you are not, if you believe as a man that you are a woman and vice versa, what you are dealing with is a mental health issue, and you're not dealing within the bounds of reality. And that's what these doctors should be looking at first, not the body.
[11:04]
A
When you decided to de transition And I imagine you told your doctors this. Were those same doctors who treated you while you were transitioning, Were they still there for you during the detransition process?
[11:18]
B
I felt completely abandoned when I detransitioned, and I was shocked about that. I kind of figured that my friends in the transgender community are probably going to see me as a traitor. But for my own doctors who first put me on the pipeline and pushed me through it to abandon me, every single one of them almost had this attitude of complacence, of not really wanting to look at the mistake that they had made with me. Even my endocrinologist, who put me on hormones, and my surgeon, when I went to them for help, they gave me absolutely no guidance. I asked my endocrinologist and is there any way that my hormone levels are going to get back to normal? Do I need to be on supplementary hormones? How do I even stop taking them? I was given no guidance. So I had to do. I had to figure it out all my own. And I went off testosterone cold turkey, which is not the way I would recommend doing it. And I lost about 30 pounds in the span of two months. My surgeon gave me advice that actually gave me a skin infection on my scars. And the woman who referred me to surgery a year later told me, well, I noticed that you have some symptoms of autism that maybe we should have evaluated earlier. But it's okay that you're going through this, because this is basically another transition. You might as well be non binary or something. Maybe you're not a woman. You're just going through another part of your gender journey, which is a total slap in the face to everything that I was experiencing. The fact that I was 16 years old, realizing I may be infertile for the rest of my life.
[12:46]
A
You think it's money that's behind a lot of it?
[12:50]
B
I think that overall, this is a very fiscally motivated industry, but when it comes to the individuals who are involved in it, I think it's a lot more complicated than that. I don't think that my doctors necessarily were evil, but instead were motivated by an ideology, because the training for pretty much everybody in the healthcare industry is this. You see a patient who was confused about their gender and you affirm them in basically whatever they say they are, because that's who they say they are. Transgender people are the identity they claim to be on some level. That is who they fundamentally are. And if you don't affirm that, you're actually denying them, stripping them of their right to health care. You are doing them harm, and you are potentially pushing them closer to suicide by trying to make them disassociate from this identity that they cannot control. And when you believe that there are children out there who are struggling with suicidality, if they do not get the health care they supposedly need, then as a health, as a healthcare professional, you're obviously going to feel inclined to, to go with your training.
[13:59]
A
Does the suicide rate actually decrease among those who, who go through the process of transitioning, meaning taking the drugs, cutting off body parts? Does that suicide rate actually end up decreasing based on what research and history and real life lived experiences tell us it does not?
[14:19]
B
Actually, there are quite a few studies that have been conducted in a very, in a very biased and a very flawed way, and we could pull apart those studies, but the bottom line is the, the more unbiased ones, the most comprehensive ones, show that this treatment does not make suicidal ideation decrease. In some cases, especially after surgery, it actually worsens it.
[14:41]
A
What is Planned Parenthood's role in all of this? Because I think a lot of people know Planned Parenthood as the abortion provider. But as you and I know, and I think as people are beginning to learn, if they don't know at this point, Planned Parenthood definitely has a role in all the gender ideology stuff as well. So, so what's, what part do they play here?
[15:04]
B
So unfortunately, they, like many other providers, have decided to go all in on the transgender industry and start providing these treatments, specifically the hormonal treatments and the use of different drugs, to young people who are confused about their sex. And with Planned Parenthood, I mean, I've had friends who have been able to get prescriptions in as little as 30 minute calls with them without any evaluations, without anything other than a phone call or a visit or even just a zoom call. And this is something that they also have provided to children at least of 16 years old of age. I wouldn't be surprised if they went younger with parents involved, but they have been one of the biggest providers in the country for this treatment for both men and women.
[16:06]
A
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[18:18]
B
So I think that there are a few big ways that this industry is going to be stopped and part of that is going to be legislation to ban it entirely for children. But I think that for the victims who are already harmed by this, they're going to need compensation, they are going to need justice because many of us are. We've been left for dead by the same providers who pushed us into this treatment. And these doctors need to be held accountable because this is criminal. This is something that leaves children and young people believing that they have no other option but to become medical experiments for life when there is truly nothing wrong with their bodies. So when I was 18 years old, I decided to file a lawsuit against Kaiser Permanente, which is my healthcare provider as a whole. I've sued the hospital where I had surgery and the surgeon, the endocrinologist and the woman who referred me to these treatments. Because even though I have chosen to forgive them, in my heart I still believe that there needs to be an answer to everything I have been through. And they need to understand that this is criminal and they need to pay for it. And that goes for every single child, every single family who has been harmed by this industry. I want to create a precedent for every single one of them to ensure that this is something that these doctors and these providers will see is it's going to, if they continue, if they choose to continue to make the cowardly decision to do this, it's going to hurt them where it hurts most. Plan B is a backup birth control option that's there for you when things don't go according to plan. It specifically works after unprotected sex and before pregnancy occurs by temporarily delaying ovulation. Plan B is available nationwide at all all major retailers and through delivery apps like DoorDash, no ID, prescription or age requirement. It's the number one OB GYN recommended brand of emergency contraception and it won't impact your future fertility. That's freedom to be use as directed.
[20:29]
A
I know you know Scott Wiener. He's probably the most far left pro transgender. He's openly gay. He's a lawmaker in the state of California, of course, your home state. He represents the San Francisco area. He's also a Jew, which is important to mention given that he was just chased out of the San Francisco Trans March for not parroting the pro Palestine talking points.
[20:57]
B
The genocide in Gaza. And I think your policy on the genocide in Gaza, it's terrible.
[21:04]
A
I think belong here. You do not belong here. The moment you started supporting Israel, you piece of. What does this tell you about the current state of the movement? Again, this is one of the most, if not the most pro trans, anti reality lawmakers in the entire country who was ambushed by that same crowd that he's in California representing.
[21:32]
B
I mean, that video was pretty crazy to watch for a lot of different reasons, but one of them being that the guy heckling him behind the camera said, I really appreciate your law that reduces the penalty for basically committing statutory rape with children, but you don't do enough for the children who are in Gaza. You don't do enough for Palestinian children. It doesn't matter how Much. You think you align with other people on the left because the left will eat their own. They're constantly shifting the cold post. There's always going to be something that they're unhappy with. And I think he's getting exactly what he deserved for not only associating with such a radical movement, but pushing forward these policies that have harmed so many children in our state, including myself.
[22:21]
A
The University of Washington, they canceled your event, what, Just a few months ago for alleged threats. So I guess the question for you is, what is it that they are so scared of? Because as I know you, Chloe, you're like this little, tiny, beautiful. I mean, like, little girl. I know you're an adult and you're. But to me, in my eyes, like, you're the most like. Like, feminine little girl, it seems. And they're so scared of you. What is it that they're scared of?
[22:50]
B
Well, they're not scared of my obviously rippling muscles and brute strength. Right. It's the fact that I'm just. I'm. I have a testimony that goes against everything their ideology stands for. The existence of detransitioners completely dismantles some of the biggest tenets of transgender ideology. And it's that gender identity is something that exists, that is something that is fixed throughout life. And even though it can be anything, it can be fluid, it's also something that cannot be controlled or grown out of. But, yeah, so what. What happened last month was that was actually going to be my final event of the semester. I was supposed to be. It was supposed to be the final note that I was ending off of, to end a really incredible series events with. With turning points. But there was a murder of a transgender student that had happened just a few days. I think just a day before it was scheduled to happen. And there we already had a lot of tensions at that campus. It's a very radical campus. It's in the Seattle area. And so there's a big antifa presence. There's a lot of transgender people there, and we're already starting to see some threats. But after this happened, people were connecting me to this crime, this horrific crime that I had absolutely nothing to do with. Telling me, like, the blood is on your hands. This is your fault that this transphobic attack happened. And if we see you there, you are in for a massive threat. I had threats of all sorts of different kinds of violence, including people calling for my death, calling for me to be. To be martyred in the way that Charlie was saying. People saying, I hope you get Kirk, protect your neck. And these are comments that I already get on campus. And it's been for the past. The past school year. It's been horrific to deal with after Charlie's death. But, I mean, the security team determined that this is something that we need to postpone this. This is going to happen. This is not going to happen today. And it has been, unfortunately, this has been something that I have been through before on campus with these. These threats being leveraged against me and against speakers like you, too, just for talking about the truth. Talking about the truth of biological reality, that men can only be mental, women can only be women, and talking about the institutional infection of this ideology and the harm that it brings to not just the individuals who are suffering from it, but also the people around them. But they don't want the truth of that to come today. They don't want that to come to light because it destroys basically their entire reason for living. These people believe that they cannot, or transgender people cannot live without transitioning. It's a powerful ideology, and it's.
[25:49]
A
It's such a lie. It's such a deceitful, destructive, discouraging, harmful lie at that. And, yeah, University of Washington, I think last time I was there, I had human feces like. Like a human literally defecated in his hand and threw it at me. Imagine being a conservative student on that campus. You and I were just there for a few hours to attend and to deliver a speech to the students there. Imagine being that student there, a proud member of Turning Point usa, on a campus like University of Washington or the university in Portland, Oregon. I have had horrible experiences there. Or San Francisco State University. Is that why you think it's so important to keep showing up to these hostile environments is to almost provide cover to those students who are conservatives, whether they're closeted conservatives or openly conservative.
[26:50]
B
Absolutely. I mean, I first started speaking on campus because I felt like college campuses were inundated with transgender ideology. And. And there was really only one side of the picture that was being given to students and that was being allowed even to be spoken about. But then I realized it's so much bigger than that. There is a massive political and spiritual divide on campus that is going largely unaddressed. But students. There are so many students out there who are closeted conservatives who are willing to change their minds, who are just sick of. They are sick of the divide. And regardless of wherever you stand, I don't care whether you're left or right, we all need to be at a point in our culture where we can come together and have these difficult discussions. It's that lack of difficult discussions that is driving this vitriol between both sides and primarily from the left that is leading to this violence. I think that Charlie put it best when these conversations stop, that is when the violence begins. And we have seen the consequences of that so very clearly. Like with the cancellation that happened last month and all these instances of on campus violence.
[28:08]
A
One last thing for you, and it's been one of my favorite evolutions to just watch from afar and online, and you mentioned it briefly, was how you've evolved in your faith and how your faith has grown. Can you expand on that just, just a tad bit? Because again, I've seen a little online, but I would just love to hear what that has looked like for you.
[28:30]
B
So I grew up pretty much being an atheist. I didn't believe for almost all 20 years of my life, 21 years of my life that there was a God even. I was, I mean, my mom was raised in the Catholic Church, my dad was raised Christian, but we just, we stopped going to church as a family. And I never, I was never really. Even though they imparted those values on me in different ways and the way that they raised me, I didn't have those lessons to take with me. And I think that is in large part what led to my confusion around my identity, around my body, and just what my role in the world would be. From a young age, I felt isolated from other people. I was somebody who didn't always fit in, especially with other women. I didn't always get along with them. And there was so much loneliness that came with the different difficulties that I had in my life that I think that could have been answered by the fact that there was above all things, a God shaped hole in my heart. Everything that I was chasing in my transition from a sense of identity, a sense of purpose, a sense of belonging was all eventually found in my faith. When I first started speaking, I was still an atheist. I, even though I felt this calling that I couldn't really explain, I didn't really quite understand what it meant until later. I thought that I was simply entering a national conversation around medical ethics, around good versus bad science, around. And then I came to learn I am being called to enter into a ministry, into a spiritual battle, the battle between ultimate good and pure unadulterated evil. And I think that this is one of the, this is one of the few instances in history where the line between good and evil has been so clear. And it became clear to me that this is so much bigger than just transgenderism. And I am one part of challenging these cultural narratives that have allowed, I think, the spirit of Satan to infect so much of our country, so much of our world, from our institutions down into so many American families. And it was through having experiences with true evil of people, just for the fact that I was speaking to the truth of what happened to me and thousands of other children, people spitting on me, people assaulting me, people chasing me down, people threatening my life and my family to realize that evil is not just a human concept that we came up with ourselves. It's something that is, that truly exists in the world. But thank God that we have the answer to it. We have an antidote to that. And that is the God above us who created every single one of us, who made all of creation and made us fearfully and wonderfully as we are. That has been the biggest fuel of my journey for the past four years.
[31:50]
A
You know, that is honestly like just one of the most beautiful testimonies to hear someone like you who has, who has lived the other side of it to now say, like, look, I'm intentionally and purposefully and uniquely created in his perfect image. And how amazing is it that we have a creator who doesn't make mistakes? Oh, it just is. Is one of the most amazing testimonies. And so God bless you, Chloe, for everything that you do, for everything that you're going to continue to do. Just know that, that I'm praying for you and for your effectiveness and for your future and for everything that you've got going on. Because as I started this episode and as I will end it, you are really one of the most brave and forward facing voices in the fight. But even broader than that, I think in making cultural change, despite what the issue is, you have been one of the most important figures in it all. So thank you very, very much.
[32:50]
B
Riley, thank you so much for having me. And I am very blessed to call you a friend of mine. I feel very similarly about what you are doing and the fight that. I mean, it's been so wonderful to work alongside you on this issue and it's been so humbling to see the change that has happened just from a few voices coming together to show that this is something that is an infection on our culture. We are not helping these people. We need to tell the truth.
[33:20]
A
Thank you guys for watching the Riley Gaines Show. You can subscribe right here. We have new episodes every single Tuesday and Friday at 10:00am Eastern Time. And we are covering everything from pop culture to politics to deep dives to motherhood, sports, all of that and more. We want to hear from you, though. What is it that you want to hear? Comment down below. We can't wait to see you next time,
[33:43]
B
Sam.

Summary7 min read

The Riley Gaines Show – Episode Summary

Episode Title: Chloe Cole Says Doctors Abandoned Her After Detransition
Date: July 10, 2026
Host: Riley Gaines
Guest: Chloe Cole

Overview

This episode of The Riley Gaines Show features an in-depth conversation with Chloe Cole, a prominent detransitioner and activist, who shares her experiences with childhood gender transition, her subsequent detransition, and the aftermath—including legal action against her doctors. The discussion explores the realities of "gender affirming care," the sense of abandonment faced by detransitioners, faith, and activism in the face of opposition. The conversation is candid and impassioned, rooted in both personal testimony and broader cultural critique.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Chloe’s Background and Story (02:11–04:58)

Chloe recounts her early adolescence: experiencing discomfort during puberty, feeling like a boy due to normal but confusing feelings, and being a tomboy.

“I was going through puberty… I hated the fact that people were commenting on things like my breast and my growing curves. And I just wanted to shrink.” — Chloe Cole (02:37)

Her doctors interpreted these feelings as a sign of gender dysphoria and started her on the path of medical transition—puberty blockers at 13, testosterone shortly after, and double mastectomy at 15.
Chloe describes realizing at 16 that she wanted experiences like motherhood, and this insight catalyzed her decision to detransition.

“All it took for me to wake up from this was just growing up a little bit, and that was how I learned. That is the antidote.” — Chloe Cole (04:21)

2. Medicalization & Informed Consent (04:58–08:09)

Riley Gaines highlights that Chloe's story counters claims that surgeries aren't happening for minors.
Chloe addresses the “tired argument” that child transition surgeries don’t happen by emphasizing her own and others' medical records and firsthand experiences.

“First of all, it's obviously untrue. I have gone through this. I have extensive medical records… I know of hundreds of other people…” — Chloe Cole (05:22)

Informed consent is explored; Chloe is unequivocal that children cannot truly consent to these procedures.

“No child can consent to this.” — Chloe Cole (07:07)

She discusses her ongoing fears about fertility and her realization that concerns like parenthood develop with maturity, which children lack.

“What led to my detransition was me realizing that this could have taken away my fertility because of how young I was…” — Chloe Cole (08:20)

3. Language & Framing of Gender Care (09:35–11:04)

Riley and Chloe dissect the terminology of "gender affirming care," with Chloe calling it misleading and a euphemism for procedures that could be more accurately described as "sex-denying."

“Even the phrase 'gender affirming care' itself, it's affirming nothing but a mental illness…” — Chloe Cole (10:22)

Chloe believes that the medical establishment is focusing on affirming identities rather than treating underlying trauma or mental health concerns.

4. Abandonment After Detransition (11:04–12:46)

Chloe describes feeling “completely abandoned” by her doctors when she detransitioned. She outlines lack of medical support, improper treatment, and dismissive attitudes.

“I felt completely abandoned when I detransitioned, and I was shocked about that…every single one of them almost had this attitude of complacence…” — Chloe Cole (11:18)

Her medical professionals provided no guidance for stopping hormones; she had to self-navigate her health, leading to adverse effects.

5. Motivations Behind the Transgender Medical Industry (12:46–13:59)

Riley asks if financial incentives drive the industry.
Chloe says the “industry” is fiscally motivated, but individual practitioners are often driven by ideology and professional training rooted in affirming gender identity to avoid accusations of harm.

“I don't think that my doctors necessarily were evil, but instead were motivated by an ideology…” — Chloe Cole (12:52)

6. Mental Health Outcomes & Suicide Rates (13:59–14:40)

The two discuss whether transitioning actually lowers suicide rates.
Chloe argues that the most comprehensive, unbiased studies indicate that transition does not reduce—and may worsen—suicidal ideation after surgery.

“…the more unbiased ones, the most comprehensive ones, show that this treatment does not make suicidal ideation decrease. In some cases… it actually worsens it.” — Chloe Cole (14:26)

7. Planned Parenthood’s Role (14:40–16:06)

Riley asks about Planned Parenthood’s involvement. Chloe asserts that Planned Parenthood is a major provider of hormone treatments for minors, sometimes with little to no psychological assessment.

“I've had friends who have been able to get prescriptions in as little as 30 minute calls with them without any evaluations…” — Chloe Cole (15:13)

8. Lawsuits and Legislative Change (18:17–20:29)

Chloe has filed suit against Kaiser Permanente and all doctors involved in her care, seeking justice and precedent for other detransitioners.

“…they need to understand that this is criminal and they need to pay for it… I want to create a precedent for every single one of them…” — Chloe Cole (18:53)

She stresses the need for legislation and legal recompense for those harmed by these treatments.

9. Ideological Conflicts and Political Movements (20:29–22:21)

Riley and Chloe discuss political fractures within progressive movements using the example of California lawmaker Scott Wiener facing backlash despite his pro-trans stance.

“It doesn't matter how much you think you align with other people on the left because the left will eat their own. They're constantly shifting the cold post…” — Chloe Cole (21:36)

10. Detransitioners’ Visibility and Activism on Campus (22:21–28:07)

Riley asks why campus groups are so hostile to Chloe, who notes that her existence as a detransitioner “dismantles” core ideological beliefs around gender.

“It's the fact that I'm just… I have a testimony that goes against everything their ideology stands for. The existence of detransitioners completely dismantles some of the biggest tenets of transgender ideology…” — Chloe Cole (22:55)

Chloe recounts cancellations and threats at events, connecting these to a broader political and spiritual divide on campuses.
Both agree that showing up in hostile environments offers support to isolated or closeted conservative students.

“When these conversations stop, that is when the violence begins.” — Chloe Cole quoting "Charlie" (27:16)

11. Evolving Faith and Spiritual Perspective (28:07–31:50)

Riley asks about Chloe’s faith journey. Chloe recounts her atheistic upbringing and credits a “God-shaped hole” for her early confusion, saying her faith now gives her belonging and purpose.

“Everything that I was chasing in my transition… was all eventually found in my faith.” — Chloe Cole (28:53)

She frames her activism as part of a spiritual battle between good and evil.

“I am being called to enter into a ministry, into a spiritual battle, the battle between ultimate good and pure unadulterated evil…” — Chloe Cole (29:28)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

“No child can consent to this.” — Chloe Cole (07:07)
“There needs to be an answer to everything I have been through. And they need to understand that this is criminal and they need to pay for it.” — Chloe Cole (18:53)
“The existence of detransitioners completely dismantles some of the biggest tenets of transgender ideology.” — Chloe Cole (22:55)
“Everything that I was chasing in my transition… was all eventually found in my faith.” — Chloe Cole (28:53)
“We have an antidote to [evil]. And that is the God above us who created every single one of us, who made all of creation and made us fearfully and wonderfully as we are.” — Chloe Cole (31:24)

Timestamps for Key Segments

[02:11] – Chloe’s background and story
[05:20] – Evidence and experiences of childhood medical transition
[07:07] – On consent and irreversible consequences
[09:35] – Language: "Gender affirming care" critique
[11:18] – Medical abandonment after detransition
[12:52] – Industry motivations: Money, ideology, training
[14:18] – Suicide statistics and outcomes
[15:04] – Planned Parenthood’s role in hormone provision
[18:17] – Lawsuits and legal precedent for detransitioners
[21:32] – Political fracturing in progressive/trans activism
[22:49] – Hostility on campuses, visibility, and activism
[28:30] – Chloe’s journey from atheism to faith

Conclusion

This episode offers an unapologetic exploration of Chloe Cole’s personal and political journey, the complexities of medical transition and detransition, and the challenges facing those who speak out publicly. It highlights the power of testimony in shaping both cultural and legislative change, and closes with Chloe’s faith journey as a sustaining force amid adversity.

For listeners seeking direct testimony, advocacy, and raw critique of current cultural and medical practices surrounding gender, this installment is essential. Chloe’s honesty and resolve, paired with Riley’s supportive and probing questions, create a powerful and moving episode.

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Transcript36 lines

[00:01]
A
Lululemon's airy, fast drying tennis gear keeps you cool when the court gets hot. Breathing out as you breathe in, wicking away distractions with every reach, every return, drying as fast as you volley. So even after match point, you'll feel like you want to do it all again. Shop tennis gear in stores and online@lululemon.com
[00:23]
B
no child can consent to this. By blocking a child's puberty, by giving them cross sex hormones, by removing their sex organs, you are stopping the only problem process through which they can psychologically, emotionally, physically, and of course, reproductively become adults.
[00:44]
A
We're talking to Chloe Cole. She is probably the most famous, the most renowned, the most credible d transitioner that this nation has really heard from. I would imagine many of you know her testimony. You know that she started puberty blockers and testosterone when she was 13 years old. Then at 15 years old, she had her breasts removed. Then at 16 years old, she decided she actually did want to be a mom one day. So she decided to de transition her doctors. Her doctors who initially led her down the path of transitioning, abandoned her, leaving her for. For dead, essentially, as she describes it. We're talking to her today about the current state of the gender ideology movement. We're talking to her about the legal action that she has taken against Kaiser, which I'm so excited about. We're talking about Planned Parenthood's role in all this. And we're talking about how faith has evolved in the process and how initially she didn't necessarily believe in God. She didn't think there was a God. She describes herself as an atheist, but after seeing the pure evil that is running rampant in today's culture, it allowed her to understand that there is something bigger, something bigger for herself and for our salvation. Well, Chloe, thank you for joining the Riley Gaines Show. I know you've told your story no fewer than like 10,000 times online and on social media and before Congress and on campuses and all over the world. But can you just take a very brief second and tell us a little bit about you?
[02:12]
B
Well, Riley, thank you so much for having me on your show. I mean, I really feel the same way about your work. And you're one of the bravest souls I know, using your testimony for the greater good. And I feel like we're kindred spirits and using these unfair things we've been through to help protect future generations of young girls and children. So I am speaking on the other side of the gender subject, not from a sports perspective, but as somebody who has actually Gone through the process of a so called medical gender transition. And this all happened when I was a child. I believe that I was a young man rather than a woman because of things that I now have realized were completely normal experiences. I was going through puberty, albeit a little bit early, but I had all of the normal feelings that pretty much all women go through when they're experiencing that really confusing part of life, when you're having to grapple with the fact that there's a lot of responsibilities, a lot of hardships that come with growing from a girl into a young woman and the changes of puberty. I hated how rapidly my body was growing. I hated the fact that people were commenting on things like my breast and my growing curves. And I just wanted to shrink. I didn't want anybody to see that part of me. And I was also quite a bit of a tomboy, you know? But these normal experiences I was going through, my doctors took it as something that meant that I actually was the opposite sex. And rather than challenging this view I had that I was a young boy, they went with it, and they allowed it to determine pretty much the entire course of my adolescence. So from 13 to 16 years old, I was going through the medical pathway, starting with puberty, blockers, testosterone. And I went through surgery at 15 to remove my breasts when very shortly afterward, I learned I wanted to become a mother one day. I'm a very feminine woman, and I want to go through these beautiful parts of life that I've never thought of before. I didn't know I wanted to become married. I didn't know I wanted to become a wife or to have children. All it took for me to wake up from this was just growing up a little bit, and that was how I learned. That is the antidote. And I have since been determined to use my story to help other children, to create laws and create change in the culture that will ensure that future generations will never know the pain that comes with living through the life of transgenderism. And I brought my message on campus and across the country, across the world. And I believe that one day we are going to be a world that will value children as they are dignified from conception all the way throughout their lives.
[04:59]
A
I long await the day, and I know you do, too. You said you went through this surgery at 15 years old, clearly not yet an adult. But the other side, even still, I mean, insists that this isn't really happening. Kids aren't really getting these surgeries. But you're proof that what they're saying is not the case. And it is happening, right?
[05:21]
B
Yes. And this argument is so tired because first of all, it's obviously untrue. I have gone through this. I have extensive medical records for anybody who doesn't believe that it's happening. Because I'm currently in a lawsuit, actually, against my doctors who did this to me, every single one of them. But I know of hundreds of other people personally who have gone through this at different stages of their lives, including some of them earlier than me. I know a woman in my area who had some of the same Doctors who was 13 years old when they removed her breasts. And when they see people like us, many of them will then start to admit, okay, this is something that happened, but it's actually a good thing because they got the care that they asked for and it might not have worked out for them. They say, well, things like knee surgery, right? They have a lower recorded regret rate, which is very. Obviously, it's very obvious which of these surgeries is more easy to regret, because one of them isn't even addressing a physical health issue. It's entirely mental. But it's. They. They will say, well, there. There are other. There are other children who greatly benefit from this who don't regret it. But I think that the. What is making. What makes it so evil is not just the regret, the lifelong regret that it makes these children who grow into an adults and lack these very adult parts of life later on feel the. The harm is in the treatment itself.
[06:54]
A
Do you feel like you had proper informed consent to make these decisions at, you know, 13, 14, 15? As you said, you went through this until you were 16 years old. Do you feel like you had proper informed consent?
[07:07]
B
No child can consent to this. We've determined that children are not considered adults until they are 18 years of age. And to do this to anybody below that age is stripping them of their human rights, their right to one day to fully become adults in the realest sense. Because by blocking a child's puberty, by giving them cross sex hormones, by removing their sex organs, you are stopping the only process through which they can psychologically, emotionally, physically, and of course, reproductively become adults. But if you're not yet at an age where you have the maturity or worldly experience to be able to know just how important these things in life, that all this affects your future fertility, your ability to have children one day and to experience a healthy marriage, is
[08:09]
A
there part of you now that's concerned about your fertility because of the different chemicals and hormones that you were putting in your body. Are these concerns for you as well?
[08:20]
B
What led to my detransition was me realizing that this could have taken away my fertility because of how young I was when I was going through this. And that is a very real fear for me to this day. It's something that I've had to grapple with for over five years now. But I naively thought at 13, I'm never going to want to have kids, right? Because I was 13 years old, I was still very much a child myself. I couldn't think about those parts of life yet. But Preesha and so many of my friends who have gone through this process, some of them even younger than me, have managed to come out of it with their fertility intact, with the ability to still give life with their bodies and to. And to safely give birth to perfectly healthy, beautiful, happy children. And that gives me hope one day. But my faith that has been developing over the years has. It's given me the courage to say, no matter what happens, whether I am able to get pregnant and give birth or if I am going to have to take the option of adopting, I'm going to be very happy with motherhood, whatever form it comes in.
[09:36]
A
I love that. Do you take issue with the verbiage of gender affirming care? Because in talking to you and knowing your story and now mentioning Preesha, it doesn't feel like what happened to you guys at all was care. Neither was it gender affirming, really. It was sex denying or even how it's described as. As healthcare. Do you take issue with that verbiage at all?
[10:03]
B
I think when you really look at these phrases that this ideology and this practice uses, you'll notice that they're all euphemisms from top surgery referring to either breast implants or radical double mastectomies, or bottom surgery referring to the removal of genitalia. And even the phrase gender affirming care itself, it's affirming nothing but a mental illness. Because the problem is not these people's bodies. It's not their gender, really, their sex, or the fact that they're male or female. It's something that has to do oftentimes with underlying trauma or mental health issues. If you believe that you are somebody, you are not, if you believe as a man that you are a woman and vice versa, what you are dealing with is a mental health issue, and you're not dealing within the bounds of reality. And that's what these doctors should be looking at first, not the body.
[11:04]
A
When you decided to de transition And I imagine you told your doctors this. Were those same doctors who treated you while you were transitioning, Were they still there for you during the detransition process?
[11:18]
B
I felt completely abandoned when I detransitioned, and I was shocked about that. I kind of figured that my friends in the transgender community are probably going to see me as a traitor. But for my own doctors who first put me on the pipeline and pushed me through it to abandon me, every single one of them almost had this attitude of complacence, of not really wanting to look at the mistake that they had made with me. Even my endocrinologist, who put me on hormones, and my surgeon, when I went to them for help, they gave me absolutely no guidance. I asked my endocrinologist and is there any way that my hormone levels are going to get back to normal? Do I need to be on supplementary hormones? How do I even stop taking them? I was given no guidance. So I had to do. I had to figure it out all my own. And I went off testosterone cold turkey, which is not the way I would recommend doing it. And I lost about 30 pounds in the span of two months. My surgeon gave me advice that actually gave me a skin infection on my scars. And the woman who referred me to surgery a year later told me, well, I noticed that you have some symptoms of autism that maybe we should have evaluated earlier. But it's okay that you're going through this, because this is basically another transition. You might as well be non binary or something. Maybe you're not a woman. You're just going through another part of your gender journey, which is a total slap in the face to everything that I was experiencing. The fact that I was 16 years old, realizing I may be infertile for the rest of my life.
[12:46]
A
You think it's money that's behind a lot of it?
[12:50]
B
I think that overall, this is a very fiscally motivated industry, but when it comes to the individuals who are involved in it, I think it's a lot more complicated than that. I don't think that my doctors necessarily were evil, but instead were motivated by an ideology, because the training for pretty much everybody in the healthcare industry is this. You see a patient who was confused about their gender and you affirm them in basically whatever they say they are, because that's who they say they are. Transgender people are the identity they claim to be on some level. That is who they fundamentally are. And if you don't affirm that, you're actually denying them, stripping them of their right to health care. You are doing them harm, and you are potentially pushing them closer to suicide by trying to make them disassociate from this identity that they cannot control. And when you believe that there are children out there who are struggling with suicidality, if they do not get the health care they supposedly need, then as a health, as a healthcare professional, you're obviously going to feel inclined to, to go with your training.
[13:59]
A
Does the suicide rate actually decrease among those who, who go through the process of transitioning, meaning taking the drugs, cutting off body parts? Does that suicide rate actually end up decreasing based on what research and history and real life lived experiences tell us it does not?
[14:19]
B
Actually, there are quite a few studies that have been conducted in a very, in a very biased and a very flawed way, and we could pull apart those studies, but the bottom line is the, the more unbiased ones, the most comprehensive ones, show that this treatment does not make suicidal ideation decrease. In some cases, especially after surgery, it actually worsens it.
[14:41]
A
What is Planned Parenthood's role in all of this? Because I think a lot of people know Planned Parenthood as the abortion provider. But as you and I know, and I think as people are beginning to learn, if they don't know at this point, Planned Parenthood definitely has a role in all the gender ideology stuff as well. So, so what's, what part do they play here?
[15:04]
B
So unfortunately, they, like many other providers, have decided to go all in on the transgender industry and start providing these treatments, specifically the hormonal treatments and the use of different drugs, to young people who are confused about their sex. And with Planned Parenthood, I mean, I've had friends who have been able to get prescriptions in as little as 30 minute calls with them without any evaluations, without anything other than a phone call or a visit or even just a zoom call. And this is something that they also have provided to children at least of 16 years old of age. I wouldn't be surprised if they went younger with parents involved, but they have been one of the biggest providers in the country for this treatment for both men and women.
[16:06]
A
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[18:18]
B
So I think that there are a few big ways that this industry is going to be stopped and part of that is going to be legislation to ban it entirely for children. But I think that for the victims who are already harmed by this, they're going to need compensation, they are going to need justice because many of us are. We've been left for dead by the same providers who pushed us into this treatment. And these doctors need to be held accountable because this is criminal. This is something that leaves children and young people believing that they have no other option but to become medical experiments for life when there is truly nothing wrong with their bodies. So when I was 18 years old, I decided to file a lawsuit against Kaiser Permanente, which is my healthcare provider as a whole. I've sued the hospital where I had surgery and the surgeon, the endocrinologist and the woman who referred me to these treatments. Because even though I have chosen to forgive them, in my heart I still believe that there needs to be an answer to everything I have been through. And they need to understand that this is criminal and they need to pay for it. And that goes for every single child, every single family who has been harmed by this industry. I want to create a precedent for every single one of them to ensure that this is something that these doctors and these providers will see is it's going to, if they continue, if they choose to continue to make the cowardly decision to do this, it's going to hurt them where it hurts most. Plan B is a backup birth control option that's there for you when things don't go according to plan. It specifically works after unprotected sex and before pregnancy occurs by temporarily delaying ovulation. Plan B is available nationwide at all all major retailers and through delivery apps like DoorDash, no ID, prescription or age requirement. It's the number one OB GYN recommended brand of emergency contraception and it won't impact your future fertility. That's freedom to be use as directed.
[20:29]
A
I know you know Scott Wiener. He's probably the most far left pro transgender. He's openly gay. He's a lawmaker in the state of California, of course, your home state. He represents the San Francisco area. He's also a Jew, which is important to mention given that he was just chased out of the San Francisco Trans March for not parroting the pro Palestine talking points.
[20:57]
B
The genocide in Gaza. And I think your policy on the genocide in Gaza, it's terrible.
[21:04]
A
I think belong here. You do not belong here. The moment you started supporting Israel, you piece of. What does this tell you about the current state of the movement? Again, this is one of the most, if not the most pro trans, anti reality lawmakers in the entire country who was ambushed by that same crowd that he's in California representing.
[21:32]
B
I mean, that video was pretty crazy to watch for a lot of different reasons, but one of them being that the guy heckling him behind the camera said, I really appreciate your law that reduces the penalty for basically committing statutory rape with children, but you don't do enough for the children who are in Gaza. You don't do enough for Palestinian children. It doesn't matter how Much. You think you align with other people on the left because the left will eat their own. They're constantly shifting the cold post. There's always going to be something that they're unhappy with. And I think he's getting exactly what he deserved for not only associating with such a radical movement, but pushing forward these policies that have harmed so many children in our state, including myself.
[22:21]
A
The University of Washington, they canceled your event, what, Just a few months ago for alleged threats. So I guess the question for you is, what is it that they are so scared of? Because as I know you, Chloe, you're like this little, tiny, beautiful. I mean, like, little girl. I know you're an adult and you're. But to me, in my eyes, like, you're the most like. Like, feminine little girl, it seems. And they're so scared of you. What is it that they're scared of?
[22:50]
B
Well, they're not scared of my obviously rippling muscles and brute strength. Right. It's the fact that I'm just. I'm. I have a testimony that goes against everything their ideology stands for. The existence of detransitioners completely dismantles some of the biggest tenets of transgender ideology. And it's that gender identity is something that exists, that is something that is fixed throughout life. And even though it can be anything, it can be fluid, it's also something that cannot be controlled or grown out of. But, yeah, so what. What happened last month was that was actually going to be my final event of the semester. I was supposed to be. It was supposed to be the final note that I was ending off of, to end a really incredible series events with. With turning points. But there was a murder of a transgender student that had happened just a few days. I think just a day before it was scheduled to happen. And there we already had a lot of tensions at that campus. It's a very radical campus. It's in the Seattle area. And so there's a big antifa presence. There's a lot of transgender people there, and we're already starting to see some threats. But after this happened, people were connecting me to this crime, this horrific crime that I had absolutely nothing to do with. Telling me, like, the blood is on your hands. This is your fault that this transphobic attack happened. And if we see you there, you are in for a massive threat. I had threats of all sorts of different kinds of violence, including people calling for my death, calling for me to be. To be martyred in the way that Charlie was saying. People saying, I hope you get Kirk, protect your neck. And these are comments that I already get on campus. And it's been for the past. The past school year. It's been horrific to deal with after Charlie's death. But, I mean, the security team determined that this is something that we need to postpone this. This is going to happen. This is not going to happen today. And it has been, unfortunately, this has been something that I have been through before on campus with these. These threats being leveraged against me and against speakers like you, too, just for talking about the truth. Talking about the truth of biological reality, that men can only be mental, women can only be women, and talking about the institutional infection of this ideology and the harm that it brings to not just the individuals who are suffering from it, but also the people around them. But they don't want the truth of that to come today. They don't want that to come to light because it destroys basically their entire reason for living. These people believe that they cannot, or transgender people cannot live without transitioning. It's a powerful ideology, and it's.
[25:49]
A
It's such a lie. It's such a deceitful, destructive, discouraging, harmful lie at that. And, yeah, University of Washington, I think last time I was there, I had human feces like. Like a human literally defecated in his hand and threw it at me. Imagine being a conservative student on that campus. You and I were just there for a few hours to attend and to deliver a speech to the students there. Imagine being that student there, a proud member of Turning Point usa, on a campus like University of Washington or the university in Portland, Oregon. I have had horrible experiences there. Or San Francisco State University. Is that why you think it's so important to keep showing up to these hostile environments is to almost provide cover to those students who are conservatives, whether they're closeted conservatives or openly conservative.
[26:50]
B
Absolutely. I mean, I first started speaking on campus because I felt like college campuses were inundated with transgender ideology. And. And there was really only one side of the picture that was being given to students and that was being allowed even to be spoken about. But then I realized it's so much bigger than that. There is a massive political and spiritual divide on campus that is going largely unaddressed. But students. There are so many students out there who are closeted conservatives who are willing to change their minds, who are just sick of. They are sick of the divide. And regardless of wherever you stand, I don't care whether you're left or right, we all need to be at a point in our culture where we can come together and have these difficult discussions. It's that lack of difficult discussions that is driving this vitriol between both sides and primarily from the left that is leading to this violence. I think that Charlie put it best when these conversations stop, that is when the violence begins. And we have seen the consequences of that so very clearly. Like with the cancellation that happened last month and all these instances of on campus violence.
[28:08]
A
One last thing for you, and it's been one of my favorite evolutions to just watch from afar and online, and you mentioned it briefly, was how you've evolved in your faith and how your faith has grown. Can you expand on that just, just a tad bit? Because again, I've seen a little online, but I would just love to hear what that has looked like for you.
[28:30]
B
So I grew up pretty much being an atheist. I didn't believe for almost all 20 years of my life, 21 years of my life that there was a God even. I was, I mean, my mom was raised in the Catholic Church, my dad was raised Christian, but we just, we stopped going to church as a family. And I never, I was never really. Even though they imparted those values on me in different ways and the way that they raised me, I didn't have those lessons to take with me. And I think that is in large part what led to my confusion around my identity, around my body, and just what my role in the world would be. From a young age, I felt isolated from other people. I was somebody who didn't always fit in, especially with other women. I didn't always get along with them. And there was so much loneliness that came with the different difficulties that I had in my life that I think that could have been answered by the fact that there was above all things, a God shaped hole in my heart. Everything that I was chasing in my transition from a sense of identity, a sense of purpose, a sense of belonging was all eventually found in my faith. When I first started speaking, I was still an atheist. I, even though I felt this calling that I couldn't really explain, I didn't really quite understand what it meant until later. I thought that I was simply entering a national conversation around medical ethics, around good versus bad science, around. And then I came to learn I am being called to enter into a ministry, into a spiritual battle, the battle between ultimate good and pure unadulterated evil. And I think that this is one of the, this is one of the few instances in history where the line between good and evil has been so clear. And it became clear to me that this is so much bigger than just transgenderism. And I am one part of challenging these cultural narratives that have allowed, I think, the spirit of Satan to infect so much of our country, so much of our world, from our institutions down into so many American families. And it was through having experiences with true evil of people, just for the fact that I was speaking to the truth of what happened to me and thousands of other children, people spitting on me, people assaulting me, people chasing me down, people threatening my life and my family to realize that evil is not just a human concept that we came up with ourselves. It's something that is, that truly exists in the world. But thank God that we have the answer to it. We have an antidote to that. And that is the God above us who created every single one of us, who made all of creation and made us fearfully and wonderfully as we are. That has been the biggest fuel of my journey for the past four years.
[31:50]
A
You know, that is honestly like just one of the most beautiful testimonies to hear someone like you who has, who has lived the other side of it to now say, like, look, I'm intentionally and purposefully and uniquely created in his perfect image. And how amazing is it that we have a creator who doesn't make mistakes? Oh, it just is. Is one of the most amazing testimonies. And so God bless you, Chloe, for everything that you do, for everything that you're going to continue to do. Just know that, that I'm praying for you and for your effectiveness and for your future and for everything that you've got going on. Because as I started this episode and as I will end it, you are really one of the most brave and forward facing voices in the fight. But even broader than that, I think in making cultural change, despite what the issue is, you have been one of the most important figures in it all. So thank you very, very much.
[32:50]
B
Riley, thank you so much for having me. And I am very blessed to call you a friend of mine. I feel very similarly about what you are doing and the fight that. I mean, it's been so wonderful to work alongside you on this issue and it's been so humbling to see the change that has happened just from a few voices coming together to show that this is something that is an infection on our culture. We are not helping these people. We need to tell the truth.
[33:20]
A
Thank you guys for watching the Riley Gaines Show. You can subscribe right here. We have new episodes every single Tuesday and Friday at 10:00am Eastern Time. And we are covering everything from pop culture to politics to deep dives to motherhood, sports, all of that and more. We want to hear from you, though. What is it that you want to hear? Comment down below. We can't wait to see you next time,
[33:43]
B
Sam.