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The Ringer Fantasy Football Show
Mike Tomlin Steps Down! Steelers' Next Steps, and Hottest Coaches Available.
01:12:24
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- [00:00]
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A
Welcome to the Ringer Fantasy Football Show. My name is Danny Heidfitz. I am joined by Danny Kelly and a crestfallen Craig Horlbeck. Let's just get right to it, Craig, you're a Steelers fan. Mike Tomlin, Steelers coach, has decided to step down. Craig, how do you feel about this?
- [01:45]
C
I feel conflicted because I think this is the right move and yet I'm really sad. I feel like Tomlin has become a punchline the last couple seasons and I actually think I want to pivot and go sincere here. I think I could have been like, yeah, man, like we can't win the big one, you know, nine, nine straight seasons without a losing record and zero playoff wins. There's all the stats if you can't miss one of them. On Twitter right now it is just filled with all the stats about how Tomlin has done in the playoffs the last nine years. But I don't know man. Tomlin didn't have a losing season for 19 years and I think that is one of the most, like if you just kind of pull back and think about that. Did not have a losing season for 19 years. Every year he was a head coach in the NFL, he did not have a losing record, which I think is absolutely incredible to me. He currently is and will forever be the coolest coach in the league. My favorite coach of all time. An unbelievable quote. A real old school coach Like a real motivator, a floor raiser, a mentor, a guy who like, cared about all the little stuff, like cared about the personal lives of all these athletes and players on his team. Tomlin is like what you think of when you look up what a coach is in the dictionary. Like, he is the quintessential coach coach. So look, do I think this was the right move? Yeah, probably. Things are going stale. The coordinators have not been good for a long time. You know, a lot of this can be. I feel like a lot of the discussion here is about personnel and coordinators and stuff like that. Because if you look at it kind of from a base level, it's like what Tomlin was able to do since the pandemic, basically with 39 year old Ben Roethlisberger, with Duck Hodges, with Mason Rudolph, with Kenny Pickett, with Russell Wilson, with Justin Fields, with 42 year old Aaron Rodgers. He never had a losing season with all those quarterbacks. Like, that is impressive and that he is a floor raiser.
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D
Right.
- [03:37]
C
And you could say the Steelers hung on too long. You could call the Steelers stubborn. You could also call them loyal and stable and steady. They've had three coaches since the moon landing and are now looking for their fourth, which is unbelievable. So, yeah, this is bittersweet for me because I think he is outside of Bill Belichick, he is more tied to his team than any coach of the 21st century.
- [04:04]
D
Well, how do you follow that up? I was supposed to be like making fun of this or something, but yeah.
- [04:08]
C
I was like, you know what? I'm going to start sincere because I think the jokes have gone. The jokes are funny and I've been doing them all year. And I said Thomas should be fired two months ago. But it was as recently as last week when they beat the Ravens in remarkable fashion. I was like swept back up and I was like, keep them. I love them.
- [04:26]
D
I'm guessing like Patriots fans can probably relate a little bit. When Belichick left, obviously Raven fans with Harbaugh, it reminds me a lot of when Pete Carroll left because it was like very much the same thing. And I think Craig, we went through a very similar process where I was alternating between, Pete's the best, Pete Carroll's the best. We got to keep him. He just raises the floor. It's. It was the same exact deal, like every year. He was competitive, didn't have a losing season for like 10 straight years or whatever. 13, 11 straight years. And, you know, there's a feeling, it's almost like a Father figure. It's like he's a guiding light figure for the city in a lot of ways, like guiding you through these wins and losses. The ups and downs, like, all the quotes are so funny. So I can very much relate to, like, the feelings you're having when I. I felt the exact same way, I think, when Pete left. But it was very much like, it's time, probably a good moment for new ideas to come in and, you know, just after a certain amount of time, what are you doing to get better? What are you doing to get over that hump? Obviously, like, I think he gives you the floor, but how do you. How do you get a little bit better so you can finally start winning some playoff games is kind of like the bottom line.
- [05:33]
C
I. I think Rogers provided almost like a nice natural period on this chapter where it's like he came in for Mike Tomlin. I don't think Rogers is going to come back. I didn't know. He's going to lose regardless. I don't think he. I mean, he wanted to be in Pittsburgh with Mike Tomlin. He could go to a different team still. But I definitely don't think he'll be back on the Steelers. And I. If I had to guess, I would. I think he's going to retire. Aikman, on the broadcast last night, seemed pretty sure that. That Rodgers was going to retire. I don't know if he has insider info on that or if it's just his gut as a former quarterback, but this did feel like kind of a natural ending point in a time for the Steelers to pull back. I mean, look, when they hired Tomlin in 2007, that was kind of an unexpected hire. He was not an internal hire. And he was. He had been a defensive coordinator for one year prior to that. He was the youngest coach. He was the youngest head coach in the league when he came to the Steelers and turned him into the longest tenured coach in the NFL. So I think this is a natural. Like, we should be absolutely celebrating this, and I do not. Time will eventually favor how we look back on Tomlin. I think there is a little bit of a punchline right now because of like the last four or five years. But we're going to look back on what Tomlin did, obviously, is incredible. He won a Super Bowl. He went to two of them. But yeah, I think this is a natural point. I like that the Steelers said that, you know, he is stepping down. It's not a firing. Even though it probably was a mutual parting of ways or I Don't know, you know, exactly how that went down. But I think this is right, I think this is right across the board.
- [06:53]
D
Yeah.
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A
I mean, the. And again, we're gonna get to what Mike Tomlin does next too, because Mike Tomlin is 53 years old.
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C
Yeah.
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A
And this is not the end for him unless he wants it.
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D
20 years younger than Pete Carroll.
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A
20 years younger than Pete Carroll. Mike Tomlin is 10 years younger than John Harbaugh. So you want to talk about having a second act or whatever you think about what Andy Reid did in Kansas City after leaving the Eagles, like, Mike Tomlin can go and have a 15 year coaching career somewhere else and that would not be weird by any stretch of the imagination. So.
- [07:20]
D
So I also heard, I think Mike Florio from Pro Football Talk said this last night on Twitter that there's. The word on the street is Tomlin has a TV deal in his back pocket.
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C
Let me tell you something, as somebody who produced, I mean, we, we've all been witness to Tomlin in a press conference. I did the podcast Flying Coach. Tomlin and Raheem Morris were guests with McVay and Peter Schrager back in 2021. There is no better quote in the world. And Tomlin would, would be the best broadcaster we have. They should double his salary compared to Tom Brady's because he would be immediately the best color guy, booth analyst, whatever you want to do, whether he's in the studio. He would be incredible.
- [07:57]
A
There's no word. Honestly, the best outcome for us is probably that Mike Tomlin does a year of media like Sean Payton, except actually says things on, like Sean Payton where he wouldn't really break stuff down. But Tomlin in the booth, Tomlin at studio would be great. And then he can kind of just pick his litter of the jobs, whatever job he wants. But I mean, it's such a big, I mean, it's hard to capture 19 years. I mean, it's 20. It's a couple decades. And I think, frankly, when we start to look forward at other jobs where he might go next, I think maybe we can get into some of the flaws. But I agree with Craig that I think it's the right move to start with. Tomlin was awesome and Tomlin was a, one of the towering figures I feel like in my adult life or my, my growing up, loving football. Tomlin was hired in what, 2007? I, I think 2000. Like he has been there for so long. He's like an institution. You know what I mean? It's like that line from the Grand Budapest Hotel. It's like, why do you want to work here? It's like, it's an institution. He was like larger than life, man. And it's like an era just ended. Like this Steelers Ravens rivalry that John Harbaugh leaving the Ravens, Tomlin leaving the Steelers, like an era is over. And frankly, that was the best rivalry of my. Of me growing up. I mean, the Steelers Ravens can't go through all of it, but, like, there was that game where the Steelers were hitting Willis McGee, the Steelers hit Willis McGahey so hard, and the Ravens and Steelers hit each other so hard, they changed all the rules in football of how you can tackle people because of how Mike Tomlin and the Ravens decided to play football. And so the, the mark is incredible. I mean, Tomlin's going to finish. He finishes with exactly as many wins in Steelers history as Chuck. No. Which is incredible.
- [09:23]
C
And he did it in 30 less games.
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A
It's, it's. It's amazing. And again, the, the 19 years without a losing. I know everyone knows this, but like.
- [09:31]
C
When you actually pause and think about that, think about the jets.
- [09:37]
D
Like, think about some of the teams that are yearning to have a fucking nine and eight season.
- [09:41]
C
Anything can happen. Bill Belichick had three or four losing records in his career. Tom Brady leaves, they collapse. Tom Brady, you know, it's like things happen. The fact that Tomlin, no matter what, through aging old sack of potatoes, Ben Roethlisberger all the way through the muck of the last five years to grind out 9, 10, 8, 9, 10 win seasons is remarkable.
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D
Yeah, it's hard to be competitive in the NFL. Honestly, it's. It is a huge accomplishment to be in, in the mix at least every year.
- [10:07]
A
He was just so cool, man. Like, the quotes, like, everything. The vibe, like, I kind of miss him already. Like, I think. I don't think there's going to be a Belichick period where there's just like this immediate fall from grace. Like, we will get to tell our kids about, like. No, no, no. This guy's nothing like Mike Tomlin, though. So it's. I'm sad and like, it's weird though, because I, I don't know. We could talk about next, but before that, I don't know. Dk, I mean, dk, you went through this with Pete Carroll too. And like, I do think that is kind of what happened though, too. Where you look at Bill, New England, you look at Pete Carroll in Seattle, you look at John Harbo at the Ravens, which just happened you see this through line of. It's just time for change. Like 20 years. He's a long time. In any business, in any industry, 20 years is. It's closer to a, to a marriage at some point than it is to a business relationship after two decades. I think you do see some through lines. I think the. The Belichick not being able to replace Brady. Ben Roethlisberger is not Tom Brady. But the Steelers didn't really. They were not able to replace Ben Roethlisberger. I don't want to reduce it down to that, but I do think it's. Half is not really taking offense seriously. Like, they could have took a first round quarterback, put him behind Ben Roethlisberger. They took Mason Rudolph, who sucked. Like, they replaced Roethlisberger with Kenny Pickett, who you could scour the entire country for a quarterback. And they went with the guy who already worked in the building at the University of Pittsburgh, which is like kind of wild. That that's. They're like, no, no, he's already here. He works here. That's. The Kenny Pickett thing is insane. Rogers. I think that part. But also I think the Pete Carroll thing is right there too. And we're going to have to get into that when we talk about what you want to do with Mike Tomlin going forward. But I think the same way Pete Carroll just went to the Raiders and tried to implement this defense that Franklin was 10 years old, we can get into it. But like, you know, Tomlin, he didn't want to change. And I think that's part of what makes him awesome and made Mike Tomlin. Mike Tomlin made him cool, made him really successful. I think if Mike Tomlin wanted to change, probably would have had a losing season. But also I think that when it comes down to it, the Steelers were always competing for the playoffs, but the Steelers for 10 years just really they weren't competing for Super Bowl.
- [12:03]
C
Yeah, 100%. I mean, you can look at the coordinators are interesting. The coach obviously has a big say in that. The quarterback situation has been bad since Ben left. If you look at the coordinators for the Steelers, basically since like 2018, the offensive and defensive coordinators, none of them go on to coach anywhere else.
- [12:22]
D
Yeah. Where are they, dude? Let's like, where's Matt Canada doing?
- [12:25]
C
Matt Canada never coached again after the Steelers. Keith Butler, the defensive coordinator, never coached again after the Steelers. Offensive coordinator Todd Haley, who they had during a large stretch of the teens, coached the Browns for one year after that and then went to high School. And I bet Terrell Austin, the defensive coordinator right now, I don't think he's going to be back. And I bet you he is not a defensive coordinator next year on an NFL team. So the coordinators that the Steelers have hired over the last five to seven years have been very bad. And a lot of that falls on Tomlin.
- [12:51]
A
So. Well, this is the hard part of the conversation, which is I think getting into like, what kind of candidate is Tomlin and everything. Like, the reality is that the Steelers did not like Mike Tomlin's defenses, like, were not built to beat modern offenses and the Steelers have just decided to not run modern offenses and not do modern defenses. Like, I was looking at my notes of what I wrote down in the Steelers before the season began. The thing I wrote down is the Steelers are an outdated organization with a head coach running an outdated defense and a quarterback running an outdated offense. And Aaron Rodgers, can anyone evolve before this blows up? And the reality is that the Steelers went out not scoring a touchdown on offense and the defense can't stop the Texans running game, which, I mean, the Texans blew them out 30 to 6. But the reality is the.
- [13:31]
C
It was 10, 6 in the fourth.
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A
But yeah, 7 to 6 entering the fourth. I, the, the, the thing I would go to a Tom Tomlin. And I think in a nutshell, where you're like, the offense is obvious, right? It's like Aaron Rodgers is old, Ben Roethlisberg was old. They should have moved on. It's like Kenny Pickett was bad. That part everyone gets. The offenses have been terrible. People don't need to explain. Explain that part. I think what happened to Tomlin on defense, to me, is summarized by Julian Edelman, of all people who I wrote this down last year, last January, Julian Edelman was talking about this and he was talking about how easy it is to manipulate the Steelers defense and how much they would do it in New England. And he's talking about little things like putting a slot receiver on a linebacker, how much easier it was. And Julian Edelman said, and this is quoting him, the Steelers did what they did. You knew exactly what they were doing every time. And they still do what they do. They still do the same goddamn shit that they did when I was playing Tomlin's defense. He said that last year. Julian Edelman said that last year about something games from 2019. And like that is what it's about is football has changed a lot in the last five or six years and Tomlin decided to just not adapt. And the through line of that is from seven years of playoff exits. I think the last seven playoff games that Steelers had, they were down by 21 points at some point during the game.
- [14:46]
C
Not only that, so they've had six straight. One and done basically in the playoffs. And in those all, in all, six of those losses, they never, they've trailed on every single snap in the second half in all six of those.
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A
And down by 21 points in all six of those games. And so you see the through line of. They're not competing with the cutting edge offenses. And you see that even this season where it's like Jamar Chase, Joe Flacco gets traded to the Bengals. He's been there like five or six days. And then Jamar Chase gets 23 targets on Thursday football and the 23rd target of the game is wide open.
- [15:16]
C
It's funny because the style that you're talking about high Fitz with Tomlin is like how they lost last night because the Texans basically beat the Steelers doing what the Steelers and Mike Tomlin think that they're good at. Like the, the Texans are actually like the least disguised deal defense in the NFL because they have the talent. They just like line up man to man. They're like, let's go, you versus me, we'll win. And of course they did because their defense is awesome with Stingley and Lassiter and Will Anderson and Hunter and all these guys. And the Steelers are kind of still trying to do that. But they no longer have the Steel Curtain. They no longer have these players and the best personnel in the league. And that's why they get crushed half these. I mean, they give up big plays left and right. Christian Kirk had three 40 yard catches last night. They couldn't stop the run against a terrible, not good rushing offense like there, there's glaring issues on the defense.
- [16:03]
A
For a while now. This is what happened. Pete Carroll in Seattle too, where the plan is, your plan is we're going to outplay you because our players are better and then you're coaching up players, but you're not actually coaching players to deceive or disguise. Right. It's very similar to Pete Carroll.
- [16:17]
D
I mean it is. It's the exact same conversation we had in Seattle. It's like he's not adapting. He's just doing the same old thing that he's been doing for the last whatever years. And honestly, like from, from both Pete Carroll's point of view, Mike Tomlin's point of view, I, I do think it is a, it's a thin line between focusing on the things that are actually important in football and, but also at the same time being able to like adapt year in and year out. So basically, like I think Pete Carroll's whole philosophy, and I remember reading in his book, I think he said this in his book when forever. He was talking to Tom Osborne who was like the great coach at Nebraska back in the day. And there's a quote in there about how Osborne's like, look, the media and you know, the fans and everybody, they're going to try and get you to change year in and year out and, and try and do the newest thing and try and change, blah, blah, blah. He's like, but at the end of the day, like you have to adhere to what you believe gives you the best chance to win games every year, every week. And I think that was like with both Pete Carroll and Mike Tomlin. It was always just like, look, run the ball, play good defense, don't turn the ball over. These are the oldest things in football and they're still true. It just is a matter of fact that you have to get the best players too. You have to get very good players in order to win in the NFL consistently. I think that the Steelers had the thing where they had pretty good players across the board for a long time, but then attrition happens. Some, some of the hires on, on offense and defense probably didn't really work out that well. And that's just kind of like how it went.
- [17:47]
A
But it was the most expensive defense in the NFL and they were gashed by the Houston Texans for 164 yards, which was three yards off the most rushing yards they had all year.
- [17:56]
D
So I think at the end of the day, I can see where guys like Tomlin and some of the older school coaches come from in terms of like, this is what we believe in. This is the best way to win ultimately. At the end of the day, this is a proven championship formula. That's what Pete Carroll used to always say. But at the same time, you really do need to have some ability to adapt to the trends of the day and figure out how to best. And that's like right now, you see all the new coaches are scheme lord type guys that can kind of adapt on the fly to what's like working and what's not working. I mean, look at McVeigh. McVeigh I think right now is kind of the gold standard.
- [18:32]
A
You mean the second longest tenured coach in the NFL, 39 year old Sean McVeigh.
- [18:35]
D
But like when you think of the Sean McVeigh offense. What is it? Because it's been like three or four different things since he got hired. And that, I think, is what makes him so great. And that's why at the end of the day, again, I just kind of think you have to be able to while you have the same core philosophies. And I think McVeigh still has this where he's like, you know, play good defense, defend the run, run the ball, all that stuff. Kind of old school vibes.
- [19:00]
C
But McVeigh has a little bit of talent in him.
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D
Totally.
- [19:03]
C
McVeigh has that, like, he's a great quote motivator of men mentality to him blended with the guru play caller thing.
- [19:11]
D
He's just a.
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A
Hired really young too.
- [19:13]
C
Yes, hired really young. Like, he has that grittiness to him where, I mean, that's why he's the best coach in the league. And he would be my first pick because I believe he is Mike Tomlin and Kyle Shanahan mixed into one.
- [19:25]
A
And, you know, there's this video game called Ghost of Tsushima, which was really cool. It's kind of like Red Dead Redemption, but it's like you're a samurai in Japan and it's basically. I swear I'm going somewhere with this, but basically this guy's a samurai. And the Mongolians invade Japan and they have guns. And so the samurai way of fighting just they get slaughtered, like, because the samurai, there's this coat, but there's this. They cannot compete with cannons and guns and everything. And so there's this one samurai left who basically decides that he needs to break the samurai code. And like, we. He invents being a ninja, like, sneaking up and killing them, which is considered, like, crazy dishonorable. So there's this giant fight in Japan of just like, can we fight this way? Do we lose who we are? Would we rather lose and be who you are than do something we don't respect and maybe win? And that's like the game. And so the part of the game is you have to decide how you play. Do you want to fight them straight up and it's fucking hard or, like, and, you know, respect the code? Or do you want to be a ninja and sneak up and stab people you're not really and like, it. You. You can find a win, but it's kind of dishonorable and there's no, like, victory. It's just. You just make a decision of how you want to play. And I kept thinking of that when I thinking about Tomlin because, like, honestly, it's, it's not just an X's and O scheme thing. It's philosophical. And I think for someone who cares as much about football, for my Tomlin, it's like borderline moral of like, this is how you play football. This is how I coach players. Like we're going to line up and execute and he's the last of a dying breed and like Pete Carroll and all these guys are like all like the idea of you disguise stuff and everything that's going on, modern defense, that's things that happen, but that's not who they are. At their core, they're coaches, they're educators, they're telling people how to execute fundamentals. And I think these guys are getting wiped out.
- [21:15]
C
Yeah, it's hard.
- [21:17]
D
It's hard to. It's. Craig, you said it, I think a couple, a couple weeks ago. It's like hard to make a second show, you know, like a second hit it. I mean, they spend the 10, 15, 20 years learning a defense inside it out and being able to teach it and all the little nuances and intricacies that go into a defense and then you're like, do I wait? I gotta change this off season and learn some new defense? I know that there's, you know, it's a lot more complicated than that. It's not so simple, but it is, it is just like this. Very few people could kind of adjust on the fly. The other thing I want to throw out here is this is something John Schneider said when Pete Carroll was fired or they decided to part ways or whatever. And Schneider said basically Marty Schottenheimer back in the day told him that coaches shouldn't be in a job more than 10 years because just the, the message starts to get stale. Yeah, you know, you're doing the kind of the same thing every year. Like you just have to have some new stuff, new ideas, a new voice, new messaging, some freshness, some freshness to it. And I think that's like also part of this. Like you just don't see coaches last that long because ultimately stuff starts to get kind of stale.
- [22:27]
A
I feel like that's why Harbaugh went. I don't think Tomlin's message was stale. I think it was the X's and O's and the refusal to have an offense that looked anything resembling something from 2015. Like I, the. I think the most under discussed part of the Steelers Rogers Tomlin thing was that Aaron Rodgers beat Mike Tomlin in the super bowl, which we don't talk about enough as like, they're both kind of wanted it to be 2010, 2011 again, and they. You know what I mean? That's when they peaked. And it's. It's, you know, it's. You like music from, like, you know, probably whenever, you know, people in their teens, and you like what you like. And, like, honestly, the kind of football that they're like, that's my kind of football is from when they were on top, and it was a long time ago, and they didn't want to change. But I want to. I want to get to what Tomlin happens next, the Steelers do next. But I want to ask Craig a question before we move on here, which is I want to ask you about purgatory and football purgatory. Because implicit in this whole thing of, you know, look, it's simple. The argument against Tomlin is, you know, again, or, sorry, you want to keep them because Mike Tomlin never had a losing season. I understand why you would want to fire Tomlin or Tomlin might want to go, because I don't know if you guys know this. The last time the Steelers won a playoff game, Barack Obama was President.
- [23:32]
D
Wild.
- [23:33]
A
It was a long time ago. TikTok was not available in America when the last time Tomlin had a. Like, a playoff win.
- [23:42]
D
So what year?
- [23:44]
A
So it was like 2017, January 2017, but Trump had not even been inaugurated. The first time when the Steelers won a playoff game. But you have made the playoffs, you've been competitive, You've never had a losing season. So I understand, Craig, that it's frustrating to be in purgatory and you want to move on, but I want to give you a little bit of a warning from someone who is a Giants fan. You're in purgatory. I. I'm in hell. I've been in hell. DK jokes, but it's not a joke. I have basically never been rooting for the Giants to win games in December the entire time he's known me, because I want the Giants. The Giants have competed for the number one pick six times in the last eight years. They have not been competitive. The one year they made the playoffs was maybe the worst thing that's happened to them in the last eight years. And so I guess my question is to. Do you really want to be out here? Like, do you. Do you have any idea? Like, it's. In theory, it's nice to be like, when you're like, man, it'd be nice to win Super Bowls. I feel like you're just looking up because you're like, I want out of purgatory because I'll get to heaven. And my question for you is, are you actually prepared for the potential of the Steelers going to football hell?
- [24:49]
C
First of all, the Giants have more playoff wins than the Steelers do in the last 10 years. So I don't know what that tells me, but I feel like people who are currently fans of bad teams like yourself will not accept me being like, yeah, it might be fun to like, look for a new quarterback and have a, have a top 10 pick and, and, and care about the offseason because as a Steelers fan, usually the offseason is just nothing. It's great. I guess we're going to run it back with Kenny Pickett or Mason Rudolph. Tomlin's not going anywhere. Probably going to win nine games this year. We have the 23rd pick in the draft. What are we going to do? So naively, I am excited to like, I mean, I think we probably have the 23rd pick in the draft this year, but I'm like, naively, I'm kind of excited to be like, what can we do? Can we hire the next Tomlin? Can we find a 38 year old coach who's awesome? Or an offensive mind that's different? And I can see an offense be good for the first time in seven years.
- [25:44]
A
This is why I asked, because dk, how do we break it? Like, it's like the whole meme of how do we tell him? Everyone's been trying to do it for 20 years and no one's found them. There's like one every three years and you're going to get one of the ones that probably isn't. And it's the Dell Curry thing of the don't leave the woman of your dreams. Like, you don't want to be out here. Like, you want to be doing dates, charcoal ice cream. Like, you don't want to be out.
- [26:05]
C
Here, man, I agree with you. But like, it also feels as though this is a natural progress. This is the natural next step for the Steelers, and you got to trust them again. Three coaches since the moon landing. All of them were good. So I tr. I guess I have to trust them to find the fourth.
- [26:21]
D
Craig. What? During the. So and we'll get to the game. Game. But during the loss last night, basically, like, as you knew it was over. The. The life was slowly draining out of the Steelers chances in that game.
- [26:33]
C
Yeah.
- [26:33]
D
What was. What was the emotion like? Because when I, when we were talking, I know that's what this is. What I'm Getting at basically, like, you've been in purgatory for so long. I don't even. You just don't. It's like, why? What's the difference between rebuilding and what you have now?
- [26:47]
C
I know. I feel like I can't complain because it's like, you.
- [26:51]
D
You didn't even really care when they lost because you knew that was going to happen.
- [26:54]
C
Like, look, I can't complain against a Jets fan. That's fair. I understand that. Or a Giants fan or a Browns fan or whatever. However, the Steelers are the weirdest, most frustrating good team the last 10 years. And it's like, bar, I think you.
- [27:06]
D
Laid out literally the entire story of the season in September. You laid out exactly what was going to happen. You're like, they're going to go nine and eight. They're going to get their asses kicked in the first round.
- [27:16]
C
That's like, not even a crazy prediction because they do that every year.
- [27:19]
D
I know, but it was just funny how accurate it was.
- [27:21]
C
I mean, even to the point of week by week. Oh, they looked good last week against the Lions. They're going to lose this week against the Browns. Oh, they looked bad against the Browns. They're going to beat the Ravens. Oh, they beat the Ravens. They're going to lose to the Texans. Like, it is how it works and it's who the Steelers are. So, like, yeah, I'm excited to move on from that, but I understand. I'm also. I don't want to become the jets.
- [27:39]
A
So DK nailed it right there. And something that. So my fiance Jackie's also a Steelers fan, and we watched the Steelers game last night, shout out Muni in D.C. and we watched it at a bar. And I. The whole week I was like, how do you feel about the game? How do you feel about the game the last two weeks, the Ravens? She was just kind of like, ah. And I was kind of like, that's weird. And I realized. But it's exactly what Craig said, where they lost and she was upset. Like, she's room for the team, but she's like, this is always how it was going to go.
- [28:03]
C
Yeah.
- [28:03]
A
And I think you nailed it, dk, that, like, that's actually how a lot of Steelers fans feel. Like I'm in Pittsburgh. Like, all the. Like, they're all like, fans shouldn't feel so meh after a playoff loss. Like, they shouldn't. They've. They actually have seen so many one and dones. They don't feel anything in. More. More. That's actually a pretty Good bar.
- [28:22]
C
Like, I had friends texting me like, hey, man, sorry about the loss. And I. I'm like, doing like, the. I'm totally fine. And they probably think I'm coping and, like, hiding my wounds. And I'm like, no, no. This is just how it is. I'm tickled that they made the playoffs. They didn't even. You know what I mean?
- [28:35]
A
And honestly, that is probably the best encapsulation of what. Why Mike Tomlin did it go is like, what's the saying of all Mike Tomlin sayings? The standard is the standard. And the Steelers standards have lowered because I think Steelers fans don't expect to make a conference championship game anymore. They expect to maybe. Maybe get a playoff win, but they kind of expect to just lose a playoff game, which the standard got lowered.
- [29:00]
C
And it's like, it's not even that they. They make the playoffs. It's that they make the playoffs in the dumbest way possible. It's like they win in the most ridiculous grind out unearned half of it is lucky. Like, what was C.J. strouded three turnovers last night and they still lost by 25. Like, it's like.
- [29:17]
A
I mean, that's. That's incredible. I. So with that said, though, I want I spitting it forward. I think our feelings on how Tom is as a coach will come out very quickly because here's why. So Tomlin, he was not fired. He's stepping down. And look whether that's saving face. And they wanted to move on from Tomlin, but out of respect.
- [29:31]
C
Classy Steelers move.
- [29:32]
A
Yeah, it is. Classy Steelers move. Now, he's still under contract, so he could go to media, whatever. Let's say for a second, forget the contract. Just forget that that's a thing for a moment. And let's say Tomlin just can go work for. He wants to coach the teams who need a coach. I will read the nine. And I'm curious, decals to you, which of these teams do you think should be the most interested in Mike Tomlin? And going through the Steelers, the Ravens, which would be the owner. Did you see Steve Bishotti, the owner of the Ravens, got told about this during his press conference, like, it happened during it. And he was like, holy. He was like, really?
- [30:04]
C
Did somebody, like, whisper in his ear, like, the Bush meme?
- [30:07]
A
Yeah, yeah, yeah. No. A reporter asked him. He's like, really? Is that real? He's like, holy. And they were like, would you hire Mike? And he was like, I love Mike. He's like, man, only if the Steelers hire John, just do a little wife swap.
- [30:18]
D
Just as like a Yankee swap, but yeah.
- [30:20]
A
So the Steelers need a coach, obviously. The Ravens are two. The Giants, the Raiders, the Titans, the Falcons, the Dolphins, the Cardinals, and then the Browns, which is not happening. So, dk, of those nine, which team do you think should be most interested in Mike Tomlin?
- [30:35]
D
All of them, I think. Yeah, I was going to say actually quite a few of them because he is like Craig laid out perfectly. A floor raiser, a stabilizer, an adult in the room type of coach. Of course, I said that same thing about Pete Carroll and Pete Carroll's 73 years old. 70.
- [30:51]
A
Mike Tomlin's 53. Matt was 46. Sure.
- [30:56]
D
But Pete Carroll has a lot of energy. I. I don't think that the reason he didn't win in Las Vegas is because he doesn't have enough energy or whatever. It's just like his. It's the same stuff we talk about. His ideas are the exact same as they were 20 years ago. I think Tom Tomlin's kind of having the same issue. So I don't really think the age is a big variable. That being said, I still see teams like the Giants, Raiders, Titans, maybe the Cardinals, maybe the Browns. I could see all those franchises being interested in a guy like Tomlin who is going to.
- [31:27]
C
He's not going to the Browns, I think.
- [31:28]
A
No, I think the Giants have to do this. I think the Giants have to do it. The. The Mera family.
- [31:33]
C
Can you imagine? Oh, my God.
- [31:35]
A
Rooney Mara, the actress. The. What was she? House of cards. And then was the girl with the dragon tattoo. She's Rooney Mara because she's literally a house of cards.
- [31:43]
C
Was Kate Mara.
- [31:44]
A
But yeah, sorry, whatever.
- [31:46]
C
It's social network. Was Rooney Mara. Dragon tattoo. Yeah.
- [31:49]
A
Boom.
- [31:49]
C
Her name is literally Rooney Mara. Steelers, Giants.
- [31:51]
A
Yeah, that's the point. The family that owns the Steelers and the family that owns the Giants are literally like they're married. And they are also, by the standards of the NFL, closer than other families, probably.
- [32:01]
D
It's like an old, like, aristocratic H.
- [32:04]
C
You and Jackie are kind of the modern version of that.
- [32:07]
A
There you go. There you go. There we ring the era Hes. But I'm just saying, I kind of think the Giants are going to fawn over themselves to get Tomlin. I said when Harbaugh got fired more than Harbaugh, probably just because I've got. Do you know our co Dude? Yeah, I kind of do. I kind of do. I would love to complain about the things. Complained about Harbaugh. I just think Harbaugh would go to Miami probably before the Giants. I think the Giants are a good destination. But I think Tomlin might want what the the Giants would crave to have a Mike Tomlin, to have a guy that be there some for like a long time. I, I don't know what Tomlin wants. I won't pretend he might want to go to the media and come back.
- [32:40]
D
But dude, if I was Tomlin I would take a year off, man.
- [32:42]
C
Just chill.
- [32:43]
D
I know, just relax. Go on vacation.
- [32:45]
C
53 years old. Take a year off, chill, do some TV, make a bunch of money.
- [32:49]
A
Here's the argument against that. And again he probably. I think it look lining the media deal up. I don't think that means anything other than obviously he would take a huge check to do it. I don't think that means he won't coach. I think the question becomes where is he most fit to succeed. And I think he has to have a quarterback. Obviously everyone does but he's not going to develop one. And frankly the people he's hired at offensive coordinator are like pathetic. Like it's his vision of offense. Like he, he did well when he Roethlisberger was handed to him. But like Jackson dart on the Giants, I think of the Raiders if you believe in Fernando Mendoza, like Cam Ward on the foul and the Titans, I think those situations he could make work. I don't like get a little. I mean the Browns obviously should do that but he wouldn't do that. But I mean ironically the Ravens would be really funny but I don't know. There are a lot of unusually good quarterback options. Lamar Jackson, who is a three time MVP theoretically still in his prime is available. I'm not saying the Ravens would go for it. No. But the.
- [33:46]
D
Well that's the thing be so weird.
- [33:48]
A
So here's my thing though. He's under contract, so should the Giants. Like I'm biased. Dk, would you. Do you think the Giants should give a first round pick for Mike Tomlin? No, I don't think so either. Especially with the one they have. No, I think Sean Payton ended up getting traded for two seconds. Do you think the Giants should trade two second round picks for Mike Tomlin?
- [34:10]
D
Wait, you're saying he's under contract for.
- [34:12]
A
One with the Steelers. So that's the thing, that's the point.
- [34:14]
D
He can't coach this year without being a trade.
- [34:16]
A
Yes, he has to get traded to.
- [34:17]
C
Coach basically by March they would have to extend him to pick up the 2027 and obviously that's not happening. So I think he's just under contract for one more year.
- [34:25]
A
But. But his right. If he doesn't do. If he does the media thing, they still have.
- [34:29]
D
Did you already see that, like that's been reported that they're not going to let him coach somewhere else?
- [34:34]
A
No, they're not. They absolutely.
- [34:35]
D
This is the same exact thing that happened Pete Carroll, they said we're mutually parting ways. In fact, when Pete Carroll was fired. Well, he, I say that when he was. When they mutually came to an agreement that he's not going to be the head coach anymore. He was actually. They described that he was going into a different role in the team and then they just locked him out. Like he just never came back. You know what I mean? Like he was technically supposed to be a part of the franchise, Jerry.
- [34:58]
C
They put him in the fake Ocean's eleven box.
- [35:01]
D
So my point is I don't, I don't. Maybe there's going to force a trade or what? Like, I just think it's silly to talk about a trade. He's. He could go. I think he's gonna work somewhere else next year.
- [35:11]
A
No, but I'm. No, but I'm saying if the. It's very much on the table because this is. Yes, it could be like the Seahawks where they just let him go. But also I think the difference is I don't know if people necessarily were going to trade for Pete Carroll because again, he would be the oldest coach in NFL history. Mike Tomlin's 53. It would be more like a Sean Payton situation where it's forgotten. But Sean Payton was traded to the Broncos. Yeah, like, like the Saints got second round picks for Sean Payton, so.
- [35:33]
C
But do you think the Steelers could basically just break the contract and allow him to go or do you think they would require a trade?
- [35:41]
A
I don't know. But that's the thing is I think it's one of those. I think it could absolutely be what DK is saying, where the Steelers, out of respect, let it happen. The flip side is they could also maybe say we're go and this is, I think, frankly, probably the most likely option. Maybe they take a conditional seventh or something or just they make it a trade or just a wink wink. But the idea that they're not letting go to Baltimore anymore, like I think the same way that coaches don't like to trade players in the division. Do you think they're going to let Mike Tomlin coach the Ravens? And so part of me is like they probably won't just let him go free. They'll probably be like if the Giants, maybe they let him walk and they just like let it happen and it's like a handshake deal, right? Not in writing, but I don't think they're going to just blindly let him out of the deal and then let him scour the market. And just for the off chance that he went to bolt. I don't think he would do that.
- [36:27]
C
But no, I mean maybe I'm too naive, but I, I don't, I don't think he would go to Baltimore.
- [36:33]
A
I don't think he would either. I think he's. But also, I don't know. So it could be one of the things. But that, that's the thing.
- [36:38]
C
I, Raiders, Giants and Raiders make the.
- [36:40]
A
Most sense to me. If the Giants could hire him without giving up a pick, I have no problem with that. And even if the Giants had to give up a second round pick, I don't think any second round player is worth not having. Mike Tomlin, I know that it's weird. I don't frankly. The beggars can't be choosers and I would love a competent coach like John Harbaugh, Mike Tomlin, flaws and all because I can't really think of a better option.
- [37:00]
C
Where do you guys think now that the Steelers rank among the top choices for a coach?
- [37:10]
D
That's a good question. Because they have no quarterback. We always talk about that. The big thing is quarterback. I think quarterback is still number one prior priority and then harmony between front office GM is a close second in terms of if you really have your pick of the litter in terms of where you want to go as a coach, you want to have, you want to be basically going to a place where the co. Where the, the ownership is not going to be like with you, you know what I mean? Or meddling in roster stuff. Same with gm. Gm, like who has power in this. So I think those are the two big things. The Steelers I assume will not be giving a new head coach power over the roster. Is that. Do you think that's right, Craig?
- [37:51]
C
I don't know. To me it's like the clear top option is Baltimore. You have a two time, three time mvp.
- [37:57]
D
Oh yeah.
- [37:58]
C
You win two, three. Lamar Jackson. I think the Giants are second. I think the Raiders are probably third. If you have the first overall pick. And then I think it's the Steelers, I guess then you have a conversation about like how good you think Cam Ward is. But I think the Steelers are above the Cardinals, above the Dolphins. I Probably would say they're above the Falcons, and I think they're right there. The Steelers have some good pieces.
- [38:17]
D
They have organizational stability.
- [38:19]
C
They have organizational stability. They are the. They are the Pittsburgh Steelers. The legacy of it all. They are like, good young pieces that you can build around guys like, you know, their center, Zach Frazier is really good. The right tackle is good. Derek Harmon's good. Joey Porter's had a great year. Like, there are pieces and stuff like that.
- [38:34]
D
Yeah.
- [38:35]
C
I mean, they literally have. Are they the most dire quarterback situation in the NFL right now?
- [38:40]
A
I. It's high up there because you got Rogers, you got nothing behind them. They don't have a draft pick to go get a quarterback, and they don't, you know, and then, I mean, you know, the quarterbacks, you know, you could trade for. Not going to trade for Tua. I don't think the Steelers are going to trade for Kyler. At least. At least I didn't think they would have. In a Tom.
- [38:55]
C
They're looking at a, like, a gap year. We're looking at like, a Mac Jones, a Kirk Cousins, or.
- [38:59]
A
Yeah, Kirk Cousins if he gets cut. Like, maybe Kirk Cousins, Geno Smith, a Joe Flacco. It's not a great market for quarterback, I think the Steelers. The problem with the Steelers is obviously the quarterback. And then, frankly, the issue is following up Mike Tomlin. You don't want to be the guy to follow the guy. And, like, that's not a deal.
- [39:14]
C
The best, especially a guy who's so good in a press conference, like Mike Tomlin, wherever he goes next, his, like, first meeting with the team, everyone's going to be running through a wall for him, walking in the Steelers building and be like, all right, I know that guy was the coolest guy you've ever seen in your life for 20 years, but listen to me now.
- [39:30]
A
It's like, if a standup comic, if the opener went after the opening act for the band, went after the band, it's like, imagine if the Heim sisters went after Taylor Swift. Like, it doesn't matter how good you are, you're not her. And like, outside of, like, the Niners transitioning from, like, you know, Bill Walsh to, you know, George Cipher taking over, and you just get a dynasty. The best transition you could ask for is, like, what happened Mike Rabel, where you take over the Patriots and you were there, you won rings as a player like you. The identity you have. Drake Mays, an incredible quarterback. You have experience, but you didn't actually have to follow Belichick. You got to hire Gerard May. You get to follow Gerard Mayo. Like, that's the best way. I don't. The pressure of firing Tomlin is huge. None of that takes over, like the. The legacy of being like Chuck. No, Bill Cower, Mike Tomlin, and you, like, overrides that when they offer you the job of the phone. Like, they're like humans too. Like any coach candidate, your mind goes blank. You're like, holy crap, I could be the head coach of the Steelers. But that is most of the allure because if you took that out of it, it's not one of the better jobs. It's a better job because the allure of being the Steelers coach and like, knowing that they're not. You're not going to be a one and done. The Steelers are not going to fire a coach or a year or two. Like, they're going to try to give you Runway, but it's a hard place to succeed. Like, like, like you take the Steelersness out of it. I think the Giants are a better job. Like, I think the Titans are a better job. I think that the guys who have talented quarterbacks have to be better spots.
- [40:50]
C
I think that's probably right.
- [40:52]
D
Who. Who do you like? Do you have a wish list yet? Have you looked at it?
- [40:57]
C
I automatically shift towards, like, offensive minds just because of what the Steelers have been rolling out for the last however many years. So, like, I don't know.
- [41:07]
D
Schefter just tweeted that the last four head coaches that the Sealers have hired were 38 or younger.
- [41:15]
C
Well, yeah, that's like, it's going to be weird. I. The Steelers. The idea of the Steelers bringing in a coach older than Mike Tomlin, like Kurt Signetti, the coach of Indiana, that. Guess where was. Where was he born? Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. But I'm like, he's 64 years old. That feels kind of weird to bring in him to start the new era of the Steelers. He's 11 years older than Mike Tomlin. Somebody like Mike McDaniel because of their offensive play calling ability, like, sounds attractive to me. I don't know if I want him to be the leader of the Pittsburgh Steelers. I don't. I think that's a weird follow up to Mike Tomlin.
- [41:47]
A
That's more like a music festival. I went to this festival once and we weren't there to see an EDM act, but the guy before the EDM act was like Stergil Simpson. Like the country singer.
- [41:55]
C
Yeah.
- [41:55]
A
And like the crowds mixed and it was like, weird. And like, that's Tomlin and Mike McDaniel. It's like you can't show the same group of people, those two guys back to back.
- [42:02]
C
Like, there, there is. To me, there is no Liam Cohen. There is no Ben Johnson this year. So I can't tell if I'm leaning towards, like, maybe they try to get a quote unquote culture guy and then hire a good coordinator, whoever that is.
- [42:15]
A
Well, let me spin this on you. Let me the same question is whether the Giants should hire Mike Tomlinson. Because let me ask you guys this. Is it smart or dumb to look at the Giants and say, of course I want Mike Tomlin. Like, this is easy. Don't overthink it. And then part of me is like, we get competent, but like, I mean, start to go through the actual resume with Tomlin and you're like, okay, let me see here. Ben Glicksman, who here at the Ringer, who is a huge Dealers fan, he wrote a column about Tomlin. Like, in December, the Steelers are 04 and 1 in their last five games against opponents, which that were eight games below.500. Eight games below 500. They're, oh, they're winless in the last five games, which is an NFL record. Steelers are 16 and 1 in their last six, eight games in Cleveland where the Browns quarterbacks were to Rod Taylor, Baker Mayfield, Jacoby Brissette, Dorian Thompson, Robinson, James Winston and Shooter Sanders. Like, and you just go through all these Tomlin things again, they didn't want a playoff game since Barack Obama was president. Like, you go through all this and I have a quarter. Like, Jackson Dart is the guy and Matt. Mike Tomlin has hired Matt Canada and like, like basically punted on modern passing games. And should the Giants actually hire a Mike McDaniel who clearly maximized Tua? And I know Mike, but part of me is like a little worried that Mike McDaniel will wilt under the pressure and wilt under the lights in the New York Post is going to make fun of him and like, that will be affect him and whereas Tomlin is going to be like instantly respected in content. It'll be fun. But part of me is also like, is it obviously better to get an offensive guy for Jackson Dart? And like, is it weird to like just basically Steelers leftovers is rude. But is it weird to basically say the game has passed this guy by, he's been there too long, but we'll take him because we have no interest in the future of the game? Like, isn't that a weird thing to kind of invite for the Future your team.
- [44:00]
C
How much do you trust at the Giants front office?
- [44:03]
A
Zero.
- [44:04]
C
Okay. I was going to say, like, I think bringing in Tomlin would easily handle New York would immediately come in and motivate everybody on the team. The floor would be raised immediately. But Joe, Shane and the Maras would have to, like, convince Tomlin or bring in a guy who they think is the right play caller because you can't trust Tomlin to do that. And how would that relationship work? Who do you trust to win that argument? Who gets to say, this is our coordinator? It's the Sirianni Eagles thing. Like, who is the one saying, all right, yeah, we're actually going to go get the guy who was with Liam Cohen in Jacksonville this year. He's going to come in and be our play caller. Do you, like, can Shane and the Mares do that? If Tomlin's the head coach, I don't.
- [44:44]
A
Think you could pitch him on that and get. He would get the job. I think that he would. I mean, Tom would. I mean. Dk what do you think?
- [44:49]
D
DK I mean, I don't know.
- [44:52]
A
It.
- [44:53]
C
I. I'm.
- [44:53]
D
My lean, and this is like, kind of going in the other direction on a tangent, but my lean is he's just not going to cook coach this year, so it's kind of moot. But if he really is motivated to coach this year, he might not have as much leverage on getting full control over everything. You know what I mean?
- [45:11]
C
To get full control, he would have to go to a worse situation.
- [45:13]
D
Right, Exactly. That's what. That's kind of. That's what I'm saying.
- [45:16]
C
Like, like the Cardinals might be like, we'll give you anything you want. You can own Phoenix.
- [45:20]
D
And he's like, I don't want to.
- [45:21]
C
Work for the car.
- [45:22]
A
And it's weird. Like, the Falcons have a consulting firm they just hire. If, like, the Falcons have a consulting firm they just hired. But, like, they also just hired Matt Ryan as the president of football ops. Matt Ryan is obviously going to be younger than Mike Tomlin, so he's going to be in control. The Titans have this guy, Chad Brinker, who, like, for whatever reason just is, like, runs that team, which is a whole other thing. But I don't know. I don't. And again, you're right. Maybe, D.K. you're right that Tomlin isn't going to coach this year. I mean, in that case, I mean, if Tom didn't coach this year and the Giants don't get John Harbaugh, then I'm Suddenly, like, if John Harbaugh, like who. Now it's like there's nine openings and all these teams are firing coaches. You're like, if Thoma doesn't coach, then you're like, so the best candidates are what, John Harbaugh, Kevin Stefanski and Mike McDaniel. And then six other jobs.
- [46:06]
D
Jesse Minter, Chris Shula, Jeff Halfley, some of these younger.
- [46:09]
C
A lot of these younger defensive guys.
- [46:11]
A
The short version is all the offensive coaches that just got head coaching jobs. This is the wave of defensive coordinators that caught up on offense and now they get to interview for jobs. And then which one of these are.
- [46:21]
D
Those three names are who I think the Steelers are going to look at because Shula's 39. Minter, I believe is 42. So like younger guys. Heffley's 40. What is Halfley? He's like, he's older.
- [46:33]
C
He's old. Anthony Campanile in, in Jacksonville.
- [46:36]
A
I think the crystal. I, I gotta say, I don't. This doesn't happen to me very much, but I read a coach interview thing and my jaw dropped. Chris Shul interviewed for the Miami Dolphins job, which is incredible because his grand. You know, his, his grandfather's Don Shula.
- [46:48]
D
Yeah.
- [46:48]
A
And like, like the winning coach in the history.
- [46:51]
C
Like that probably.
- [46:52]
D
I know the pedigree. Like. Yeah.
- [46:54]
A
You look at what the Rams did, the name power. I, I know the.
- [46:57]
C
You.
- [46:58]
A
You could look at it seriously like the Rams, they almost lost the Panthers in the playoffs. The Rams defense of what Chris Sheila's done with the rims defense, where they are so out of cornerback talent. They're playing Emmanuel Forbes, who was like released by Washington. Washington released a first round pick because it was such a bad choice because he's so small. He's like the smallest player. He's probably the last sub 170 pound defensive player we might see drafted at his frame. We called him Flat Stanley. He's like playing for the Rams and he's getting something out of him.
- [47:25]
D
This is what they do. Yeah. And they, and they've got, they've done this for a little bit here where they find these random guys. They've been really good at integrating the draft into like their roster and utilizing those guys in the right. In the right ways is exactly what you want from the top down in terms of like marrying the scouting process with getting these guys on the field. It's. It's been really incredible.
- [47:46]
C
Chris Shula is also just like Sean McVeigh's buddy. Like they went to college together. They've Been friends since, like, 2004. So it's like a little bit of me of, like, man, McVeigh just hired his friend, and it's going really well right now. And I've, you know, he's. He's been on the Rams for, like, seven, eight years now. Chris Shula.
- [48:02]
A
They're out of offensive guys that Sean McVeigh knows, so now we're just doing defensive guys that Sean McVeigh knows.
- [48:06]
D
It's literally anyone Sean McVeigh. McVeigh knows. Craig, are you getting any calls?
- [48:10]
C
Should I text Sean and be like, hey, where's Chris going?
- [48:12]
A
Yeah, yeah, you should text him when he takes a different job and be like, hey, I heard you hire your friends. Can I be the defensive coordinator?
- [48:18]
C
Yeah.
- [48:19]
A
Or actually, no. You say, hey, interviewing for the Steelers head coach job. Can I say that I'm Sean McFace friend? That's what you got to do.
- [48:25]
C
Do you think Tomlin will do a podcast with the ringer? That'd be sweet.
- [48:29]
A
It'd be funny if we had this whole conversation, and then Mikey just does a show on Netflix.
- [48:33]
C
I mean, it's not possible. I have no insider information on that. He's been on a ringer pod before.
- [48:40]
A
Anything else on Tomlin before we move on?
- [48:43]
D
I'm just excited for Craig.
- [48:44]
C
New, new era, brother. Yeah.
- [48:46]
A
Mike Tomlin, thank you for your service. While this was all happening, the Eagles fired Kevin Patulo, their offensive coordinator, which is so funny. They just news dumping. They were like, tomlin's out. Like, let's let everyone know now.
- [48:57]
D
Yeah, I respect it.
- [48:59]
A
Half of Pennsylvania's distracted. Like, move, move, move.
- [49:03]
C
Throw out all of his shit. Hurry. Yeah. We knew this was going to. We knew this was coming.
- [49:08]
A
There's nothing to say, like, the Eagles are an abomination and Nick Sirianni should not be allowed to hire his coordinators. He's a baseball manager, and they should just tell him who is on his staff and then easily. Charge of hives.
- [49:17]
C
So quickly, how attractive is the Eagles job? As for a coordinator position, let's say AJ Browns may be gone. The offensive line is in a different situation. You have Saquon, who's still at the end of his prime. You have Jalen Hurts, who's this kind of quagmire situation? Are the. Would you say right now the Eagles are the top coordinator landing spot for any team in the NFL? For any coach in the NFL.
- [49:38]
D
I don't know about top, but it's up there. I mean, look at what Kellen Moore did.
- [49:42]
A
I mean, the last Two guys who had the job before Kevin Pitullo got had coaching jobs.
- [49:45]
C
I think it is Super Bowl. Yeah.
- [49:47]
A
So part of me especially look at the defense. Like, frankly, the bar is pretty low to succeed there. You have literally, like Jalen hurts is obviously the limit. Sorry, Eagle fans, but Hertz is the limiting factor in terms of what you can run and execute. Yeah, but you. Saquon Barkley, A.J. brown, if he ends up staying, which, I mean, I think that it can calm down. If they change you, hire a new coach and we'll see what happens there. You have Devontae Smith, you have an incredible offensive line. You have Jeff Stoutland, like, yeah, I. You have a pretty incredible infrastructure there. You have an amazing defense.
- [50:11]
C
Dude, if, if, if Mike McDaniel goes to Philly, we're all.
- [50:14]
A
You keep saying this and everyone keeps saying, as a coordinator, do you serious. Do you think nine head coaches will be hired and Mike McDaniel. Do you think Mike McDaniel is actually not going to get one of the nine head coaching jobs?
- [50:27]
C
Well, it's eight because one of them is Miami. Oh, yeah.
- [50:29]
A
Fair.
- [50:31]
D
Yeah, I think it's possible. There's a lot of good candidates right now, or at least interesting candidates. I, I think it is really just a personality point of view. That's a big question. Like, we said this when he was hired by the Dolphins. He's like very awkward and like the call with Tua from the airplane and all that stuff is just like, oh, God, I can't even watch this. I think when you get fired like that teams are going to be a little bit careful about like, okay, what kind of personality does this guy have? We like his. We like his schematics and his play calling. But is he going to. I personally think he had the team playing pretty hard right before the season ended, so that was like a good sign, especially after benching Tua. But I, I would say there's some doubt there that teams will see him as a head coach type of guy.
- [51:19]
A
I am genuinely worried that the Giants won't hire him because they're going to worry about him with the media. Meanwhile, I just think that he would be the best coach for Jackson Dart and I feel like Tomlin or Harbaugh.
- [51:28]
C
I feel like you have said you want Tomlin, Harbaugh and McDaniel. Which is it?
- [51:32]
A
I said all that because I said I wanted Mike McDaniel. Then John Harbaugh get fired and then I said I want John Harbaugh and then Mike Tomlin got so rank.
- [51:39]
C
Rank him Right now you can pick.
- [51:43]
A
If I can pick, I want, man, I, there's no way I'm get off the fence, pal. No, I see this is easy. I want Mike Tomlin, man. I want Mike Tomlin. And like there's a world where I look back, Mike McDaniel goes to Tennessee and they just are incredible. Kim Ward and I regret not having Mike McDaniel, but I gotta tell you, my life would get so much better so quickly if Mike Tomlin was the coach of the Giants that I just, I do want to go from hell to purgatory. And I would love 10 years of not of making the playoffs and losing anything, any like nine and eight wild card appearances and then we lose one and done. I would love that. Tomlin, first, I am not in position to turn down John Harbaugh and then I would actually Rather have Mike McDaniel.
- [52:26]
D
Have you seen me? I'm not in any position to turn him down.
- [52:29]
A
Beggars can't be choosers, dude. If it turns out that John Harbaugh is not able to succeed outside the Ravens infrastructure, then like the Giants and we can hard learn that the hard way. Then I would take, I would take Mike McDaniel. I think that what he did in Miami is underrated. I think that I, I, I think there was more innovation from him. He's not a one trick pony where it's like, look, you had all the fast people. I think the quarterback was a, a limited point guard with a noodle arm and a lot of injuries. A hip, ankle injuries limited his arm strength. He's 2, I don't explain 2 of people. The offensive line sucked. I think Mike McDaniel maximized that thing. And I think Mike McDaniel could do crazy stuff with neighbors and Jackson Dart. And then I would take Kevin Stefanski. I, I'm, I'm fine with that. Or Chris Shula. I actually like Chris Shula. If I not a former head coach. Chris Schula is the candidate and then Jeff Halfley. If all those guys went elsewhere.
- [53:14]
C
All right, well, you're, you're probably going to get one of those five.
- [53:18]
A
I would like to think so.
- [53:19]
D
Craig, you asked, you asked what's the best offensive coordinator job right now? I was just looking through the list and I might have missed a one because I think the Commanders hired a guy just from Internal. So getting to work with Jaden Daniels, that I think that would be really attractive to a lot of offensive play callers. The other two here that are really, really, really interesting are the Lions who Don't have an offensive coordinator right now. And the Chargers who just fired Greg Roman getting to work with Justin Herbert. So I think there's actually quite a, there's a handful of teams here with extremely, you know, if you're a, if you're an offensive play caller type guy trying to rise in the ranks, like these guys could be the meal ticket to head coaching job. You know what I mean? Getting to play with these coaches or these court quarterbacks is, is huge.
- [54:03]
A
If you want to skate to where the puck is heading. You would take the Chargers job because it's like if, obviously the Eagles job, it's like you can clear it but you're at the end of the day you are limited by what Jalen Hurts does. Justin Herbert is actually the Mr. Unlimited, like the Russell Wilson freaking nickname is.
- [54:19]
D
He's going to get someone hired as a head coach.
- [54:21]
C
Right. The Chargers need to throw as much money as possible at Mike McDaniel and if you have Harbaugh McDaniel running Justin.
- [54:27]
A
Herbert and the Chargers, it would be unbelievable because the thing is Greg Roman, it's under like I, I, the whole thing. Oh, I went to Raven's camp and like I asked Greg Roman to describe. This is back when I know, right? Yes.
- [54:38]
C
Flex.
- [54:40]
A
He. I can't keep track of what level of hair Greg Roman was at at the time. It's, it's fluctuated over the years. But he, I asked him like to describe the word the, his offense in one word. It was like kids day. So I was like, how would you explain it to all the kids? And he was like, you're just in.
- [54:57]
D
That group of kids.
- [54:58]
A
Yeah. Well they were like, you're not an adult. You can't go with all the adult.
- [55:01]
D
I'm just hanging out with the big group of kids. Big child just sitting like cross legged in a circle around the coach. Sorry, go ahead.
- [55:12]
A
Closer than you think.
- [55:13]
D
Like, like Happy or Billy Madison asking Ms. Lippy a question.
- [55:17]
C
Yeah, you the tall one.
- [55:19]
D
What?
- [55:22]
A
I was like one word and he was like the offense is medieval. And that is a different era of the Ravens volleyball with Lamar. But like the last year with the charges, 2023, like it still was medieval. Like they were trying to run the ball. Like the, like this was the first year Greg Roman offense has had modern passing concepts and like trying and running, throwing on first down. But like if you took Herbert with like what Mike McDaniel's done or one of the Kubiax or just any of these offenses where like Kellen Moore like all These guys that are getting production and shuck and everything. The Chargers with healthier offensive line and able to do stuff, I think that is like, that is the higher ceiling.
- [55:55]
D
It's going to be exciting because they're going to have a more healthy offensive line in theory, although they are cursed. So who knows?
- [56:00]
C
And then, right.
- [56:01]
D
You get, you know, better run game in theory. With Amari and Hampton being healthy, coming back next year.
- [56:06]
C
Well, it's just a question of, like, what would you rather do? Take a job with the, the Cardinals as a head coach? If you're Mike McDaniel and you get a head coaching job and that's what. That's the ultimate goal, right? To be a head coach or it's.
- [56:20]
D
A lot more money.
- [56:21]
C
Yes. Or you go to the Chargers and you have one or two awesome seasons with the Chargers and then you have a bit more freedom and flexibility in terms of where you could go next. Where you could then kind of be a Ben Johnson type where you're turning down teams and turning planes around rather than. I'm going to take what I can get in whatever, Tennessee or Arizona or Cleveland.
- [56:42]
A
Depends on the guy, like, what kind of person you are.
- [56:44]
D
I personally. Yeah. I mean, obviously, when I'm not looking.
- [56:47]
C
At the money, be a coordinator.
- [56:50]
D
No one's ever offered me like $20 million. So I don't know. But like, I think the more logical move for McDaniel rather than taking the Cardinals job would be to go do like, be an offensive coordinator for a couple years, do that route, be the, be the bell of the ball in the coaching cycle in two years.
- [57:06]
C
He'd be great in la.
- [57:08]
D
Man, that would be a lot of fun.
- [57:11]
A
Sure.
- [57:11]
D
Yeah.
- [57:12]
A
I, I just.
- [57:12]
C
He's.
- [57:13]
A
Why would you, the Titans not hire him? That's the thing is like, yeah, cool. It's easy to say Mike McDaniel should run the Chargers. I'm like, the Titans should have Mike McDaniel play with Cam Ward or coach with Cam Ward. I'm like, the idea that nine coaches are gonna.
- [57:24]
D
Have you seen the guys that they've interviewed, though? Like a bunch of old school guys.
- [57:28]
A
Yeah, you're maybe right. Maybe I'm Jason.
- [57:30]
C
They interviewed Arthur Smith.
- [57:32]
D
Didn't they interview Jason Garrett?
- [57:34]
A
Oh, my God, I forgot the Garrett. You're probably right that I'm underrating how much the, the being in the room factor where just people don't. People think he's weird and cannot command the respect of very large men. Just. Yeah, yeah, you're probably right.
- [57:46]
D
And they've interviewed Jason Garrett, like McCarthy, it just. I don't know, maybe. Maybe they're just doing that as a red herring or whatever, but it feels like the Titans are going for like an old school, you know, one of those guys.
- [57:59]
A
All right, so since Craig made me do that before we get out of here, Craig, I'm making you do it. Who are the head coaches you want? Do you want John Harbaugh? If he wanted the job through back channels?
- [58:07]
C
No, I don't want the Ravens coach. Just like I don't want LeBron on the Warriors. I just won't do it. I don't want John Harbaugh. I'm not going down like that. Answer of who's available? I kind of want. I kind of want Mike McDaniel.
- [58:22]
D
What's your heart say?
- [58:23]
A
Yeah.
- [58:26]
C
Kenneth Tomlin. I don't want Harbaugh. After that, I guess. Kevin Stefanski. I don't want him either. I don't want a division guy. Minter would be cool. Yeah, The Minter Shula, 38 year old defensive coordinator guru is okay. That's fine. And I would be happy with that. But for something about getting somebody who is truly at the cutting edge of offensive play calling, feels nice and refreshing.
- [58:52]
D
Yeah, I'm thinking I'm excited for you.
- [58:54]
A
Monday night versus Steelers.
- [58:56]
C
Yeah.
- [58:57]
D
Yeah. I'm thinking back to the Seahawks two years ago when my two top choices and it was actually like pretty legit possibility for both of these guys. It came down to Mike McDonald and Ben Johnson and I was like, I really wanted Ben Johnson and then, I mean, it worked out great for the Seahawks, but hopefully you guys will land. Land somebody cool and it'll be they need to be young era for both of you.
- [59:18]
C
If this person's over 50 years old, I'm going to be upset.
- [59:22]
D
Well, history would tell us that he's not going to be.
- [59:24]
C
Yeah.
- [59:25]
D
So that's interesting.
- [59:27]
A
All three examples going back to 1969. Yeah.
- [59:30]
D
Yeah.
- [59:30]
A
Okay. I think that's all we got. You guys want to do like just a couple emails and get out of here?
- [59:35]
C
Sure.
- [59:36]
A
All right, so we're going to have. And again, we'll have a preview episode this week and we're going to do. We're still doing three episodes a week during the playoffs. So we're recapping, you know, Sunday night, I guess, early Monday morning, all the playoff games, everything. Even after the super bowl. We're going to have two episodes a week leading up to the draft trades, free agency, the draft. DK is a draft expert here. We're going to have a draft guide and everything and talk about players offseason, all this stuff. Talk about all nine openings when they get hired, and then we still do an episode a week during. After the draft, all summer. So if you're. Wherever you're listening for watching us, please stick with us. And yeah, with that said, I have an email here. So we were talking on Sunday about. Also, thank you to everyone emailed in. They were awesome emails. Ringer, fancy football, gmail.com. thank you. If you're watching us on Netflix, and I don't know if you guys heard, but Trey Young got traded to the Wizards. Yeah. Anyone who, you know, wanted to check us out on Netflix, you may have seen that.
- [60:23]
C
It was big news.
- [60:24]
A
It was huge news.
- [60:25]
C
Yeah. Dk, did you know that?
- [60:27]
D
I. I heard about it, yeah. I don't really know anything.
- [60:30]
C
Did you know what team Trey Young got traded to the Wizards from?
- [60:33]
D
No.
- [60:34]
C
It's all right.
- [60:37]
A
That's why Howard and Logan had to talk about it.
- [60:41]
D
Who?
- [60:41]
A
Who?
- [60:42]
D
The Hawks. The Hawks.
- [60:43]
A
Yeah.
- [60:43]
D
Yeah, yeah, that sounds right.
- [60:44]
A
No, if you're going to forget a pro team, that's fine.
- [60:46]
D
That's.
- [60:47]
A
Even the Hawks fans.
- [60:47]
D
It's.
- [60:48]
A
They're like, yeah, yeah, no, but thank you to everyone who went to Netflix and saw a basketball show and then, like, came back and watched the real one. So thank you. That's up now. On Sunday's episode, we talked about all the side effects of drug commercials.
- [60:59]
D
Yeah, the. The bleeding between the anus and. Wait, what was it?
- [61:04]
C
What was the genitals? The bleeding.
- [61:05]
D
Genitals.
- [61:06]
C
The bleeding taint.
- [61:07]
D
There was no grundle.
- [61:09]
A
Talk.
- [61:09]
C
Again, I'm. I'm unsure how one can bleed from that.
- [61:13]
A
Why do you want. Don't ask questions you don't want the answer to. Anyway, so a lot of. Lot of emails about the drugs, but I wanted to shout out, this is an email sent to us by Ryan, our boy. And this could not be more perfect right now because Craig also watched Lord of the Rings over the holidays. He had never seen Lord of the Rings.
- [61:30]
C
That episode's on Netflix, Right. You can hear us talk about Lord of the Rings.
- [61:33]
D
Yes.
- [61:34]
A
Friday. That was fun. The back half of The Friday Week 18 preview was Craig admitting to us that he watched Lord of the Rings.
- [61:40]
C
I surprised. I regaled you fair.
- [61:45]
D
That's the most fun I've had in years.
- [61:47]
A
It was great.
- [61:47]
D
So, anyway, by the way, I wanted to apologize. I got the. I think I said, raising of the Shire. We were talking about the last chapter of the book and, like, how they left it out of the movie. It's the Scouring of the Shire.
- [61:57]
C
Right, right, right. I didn't want to say anything.
- [62:00]
D
That's so embarrassing. That was embarrassing for me.
- [62:02]
A
So, anyway, Ryan sent us an email. There's a website called Anti Depress. Anti depressant or tolkien.com. and it's. Is it a Tolkien JRR Tolkien character or an anti.
- [62:12]
D
Hell, yeah. O. This is fun.
- [62:15]
C
Dk.
- [62:15]
D
This is our corner.
- [62:16]
C
I'm leaning on you, dk.
- [62:18]
A
I'm gonna play it. Should I share my screen or should I just read it to you?
- [62:21]
C
Just read it.
- [62:22]
A
All right, First. Dude, this is so funny. All right, the first one here. Antidepressant or Lord of the Rings character.
- [62:28]
C
Okay.
- [62:28]
A
Luvox, L, U, V, O, X. Luvox.
- [62:33]
C
I feel like there's a lot of X's in pharmaceutical drugs.
- [62:36]
D
I think it's a drug.
- [62:37]
A
I think it's a drug. Okay, we're saying antidepressant. We're correct.
- [62:39]
C
Bang.
- [62:40]
D
Yeah.
- [62:41]
A
Okay, next one here is Cladiol, and there's an accent over the E. That's got to be Lord of the Rings, right?
- [62:45]
C
They're not throwing an accent on a pharmaceutical drug.
- [62:47]
A
No.
- [62:47]
C
No way.
- [62:48]
D
I would not think. Yeah.
- [62:49]
A
Oh, nope, that's wrong. Okay.
- [62:50]
C
What?
- [62:51]
A
Metafoxamine, previously sold under the brand name Klediol, and Jerdaxyl, with an accent.
- [62:56]
C
They're throwing accents on drugs?
- [62:58]
A
Yeah.
- [62:59]
D
Well, it must be big in Latin America.
- [63:00]
A
It's in France and Spain.
- [63:02]
D
Okay.
- [63:04]
A
Cymbalta.
- [63:06]
C
I think that's a drug.
- [63:06]
D
That's a.
- [63:07]
A
That's a drug that's in my head.
- [63:08]
C
I've heard that drug before.
- [63:09]
A
All right.
- [63:09]
D
I take that all the time on, like, when I want to get a little crazy.
- [63:13]
A
Burgill Lord.
- [63:15]
D
That's got the Rings, by the way.
- [63:17]
C
Is it. Is it Tolkien or just Tolkien?
- [63:20]
A
I don't know. I've never known. I've gotten this far in life. Lean.
- [63:24]
D
Tolkien.
- [63:25]
A
Tolkien.
- [63:26]
D
Tolkien.
- [63:27]
A
It's like 30 years.
- [63:28]
C
I hope we get destroyed.
- [63:30]
D
I don't know. I don't.
- [63:31]
A
I don't know. Is JRR Tolkien.
- [63:33]
D
Tolkien.
- [63:33]
A
Tolkien. Just like Token with an L. Tolkien.
- [63:37]
D
You know what is what the JRR stands for? John, Rick. Randy. Tolkien.
- [63:43]
C
It's not JR. Is it JRR?
- [63:45]
A
Are you thinking JR's? Two R's.
- [63:46]
C
So there's George R.R. martin and J.R.R. tolkien. I actually never thought J.R. tolkien.
- [63:51]
D
Yes. No, it's J.R.R. it's John Ronald Ruel Tolkien.
- [63:55]
C
What's up with the. We got R.R. tolkien and R.R. martin.
- [63:58]
D
I think that maybe he was, like, drifting on that.
- [64:01]
C
Oh, is it?
- [64:02]
A
I never thought about that.
- [64:04]
C
But probably George, Raymond, Richard, Martin.
- [64:09]
D
Maybe they just had JRR names.
- [64:11]
C
Is.
- [64:11]
D
It's kind of weird.
- [64:13]
A
Antidepressants or Tolkien. Nar.
- [64:15]
C
Gotta be a drug.
- [64:17]
D
I think that sounds like a name from Tolkien.
- [64:21]
A
I'm going Tolkien, too. We're correct. The 17th king of Gondor.
- [64:26]
D
Of course. Of course.
- [64:28]
A
Amantadine.
- [64:29]
C
Drug.
- [64:30]
D
Drug.
- [64:30]
C
They all sound like drugs to me.
- [64:32]
A
That's correct. We're doing pretty great. Finn. Finnar. Finn.
- [64:38]
D
That's a. He's. That's a J.R.R.
- [64:39]
C
Tolkien guy.
- [64:40]
A
Okay. All right. We're kind of nailing it. Deseril.
- [64:44]
D
Another king of Gondor.
- [64:47]
A
No, that's a drug.
- [64:48]
C
Oh, I gotta shout out Ryan, because these are really good suggestions.
- [64:51]
A
Yeah, Deserel is. This is antidepressants or Tolkien Versal app. It's actually a website. Someone made that.
- [64:59]
D
I think.
- [65:01]
A
The common side effects, dry mouth, feeling fate, vomiting and headache. For Deserel, celebrion. It's like celebration.
- [65:08]
D
Caleb.
- [65:09]
A
Caleb.
- [65:12]
C
Tolkien.
- [65:13]
A
There's an accent on the eye.
- [65:14]
D
Yeah.
- [65:15]
C
Tolkien.
- [65:16]
D
Tolkien.
- [65:17]
A
Okay. That's right. She was the wife of Elrond. Escal.
- [65:23]
D
Remember Elrond from the movie?
- [65:24]
C
Just from Scientology.
- [65:27]
D
Oh, God damn it.
- [65:29]
A
Oh, my God. I, I. Okay, wait.
- [65:32]
D
Elrond was Hugo Weaving.
- [65:35]
C
Remember?
- [65:35]
D
From the movies? Greg. Who? Hugo Weaving.
- [65:38]
C
Remind me.
- [65:39]
D
The guy, you know, he's in, like. He's. He's in the Matrix. He's the bad guy in the Matrix.
- [65:46]
C
Who is he? Like, what does he look like in Lord of the Rings?
- [65:48]
D
He's an elf. He's like the King Legolas.
- [65:52]
A
Is that or something?
- [65:53]
D
No. Oh, he's Arwen's dad, dude.
- [65:56]
C
You know what blew my mind is I didn't realize until after watching Lord of the Rings, the guy who plays Gimli is the same guy who plays Salah in Indiana Jones. John Rhys Davies. I did not realize that was the same person.
- [66:07]
A
Wow. Which guy in Indiana Jones?
- [66:11]
C
He plays. He plays Salah in Indiana Jones.
- [66:14]
A
That happens to me all the time. When I realized that an actor is British, like, like, I think I know now. This is, like, super well known, but at the time in the Wire, Idris Elba was not like, that well known. And when, like, there was a point learning that Idris Elba was British was mind blowing. All these actors in the Wire are British and have, like, these specific Baltimore accents. Like when Game of Thrones happened, Littlefinger was British. I couldn't fucking believe it.
- [66:37]
D
Craig. By the way, he also, I. This is What? I thought he also voiced Treebeard, the main and the big tree Gimli was Treebeard? Yeah.
- [66:45]
C
Oh, the same actor did John Rhys Davies. That's.
- [66:47]
A
Dude, I love trees.
- [66:48]
C
I was going to say Succession is another show where I like everyone in it. Like Matthew McFaddy, Tom Wambsgans. The second I heard him have a British accent, I was blown away. Brian Cox, who plays the dad, is Scottish. Shiv Roy, Australian. Like, all of them have the most crazy accents.
- [67:04]
A
Why are you so much better at this?
- [67:05]
D
It says here John Rhys Davies voice was the original voice of man Ray in SpongeBob SquarePants. Wow. I don't know what that means.
- [67:14]
C
Man Ray.
- [67:15]
D
Yeah.
- [67:15]
C
Was John Rhys Davies.
- [67:17]
A
That's wild.
- [67:18]
D
According to this. Yeah.
- [67:20]
C
Whoa.
- [67:20]
D
That means it was recast. He didn't do it for the whole time.
- [67:23]
C
Well, so the original Man Ray was John Rhys Davies. Wow. That's like top five spongebob episode.
- [67:29]
A
Drawing a line between Indiana Jones and spongebob for Craig is. Is about as good as it gets.
- [67:34]
C
The orb of confusion. Dk, are you even familiar with that?
- [67:37]
D
I'm not.
- [67:40]
A
Craig, watch Lord of the rings. I think DK's got to watch some Spongebob. I think that's the deal.
- [67:43]
D
I feel like I have to.
- [67:44]
C
You have a six year old kid. I'll throw. I'll give you a five SpongeBob episodes you can watch with him.
- [67:48]
A
Yeah. Make your kid dumb.
- [67:49]
D
Want him to be watching SpongeBob.
- [67:51]
A
Yes.
- [67:52]
C
SpongeBob is very smart. Okay.
- [67:54]
D
Maybe I finally would understand all the memes.
- [67:56]
A
All right. Thank you, tk. Thank you, Craig. Thank you, Cam. Thank you, Carlos. Thank you, Kai. Thank you, Austin. Thank you ever for listening. Thank you, Mike Tomlin for the 2019 seasons.
- [68:06]
C
Oh, I'm gonna miss you, buddy.
- [68:09]
A
Take the Giants job, Mike. Fox News.
- [68:12]
D
Fox, yes.
- [68:14]
C
Do TV for a year.
- [68:15]
A
TV will always be there. Go to the Giant. Do you actually not want days off?
- [68:19]
C
I would like to see him take a year off so I can kind of just hang out with him on television. Yeah, that's what I would like.
- [68:24]
A
I'd like to hang out with him as the coach of the New York Giants.
- [68:26]
D
You're going to produce his new podcast?
- [68:27]
C
That's right.
- [68:28]
A
Mike told me you could come work, you know, fantasy football show. Maybe he'll join.
- [68:33]
D
Okay. Yeah.
- [68:33]
A
Thank you, Lord.
- [68:35]
D
Lord. Thank you, Olivia Dean.
- [68:37]
A
Bam.
- [68:38]
C
So nice.
- [68:39]
D
All right, tell me what you guys think.
- [68:41]
C
I think the NFL stole my tweet about her.
- [68:43]
A
I know we had the same.
- [68:45]
C
Not that it was like the most creative comment But I literally put on our Instagram, breeze Hall, the jets running back, tweeted, olivia Dean, or Olivia Dean album is great or whatever. And so I put that on our Instagram and said, breeze hall knows ball. And then 20 minutes later, the NFL account said, Breeze hall knows ball and posted, olivia Dean conspiracy. She's great. Dk, Are you familiar with her work?
- [69:08]
D
I'm not really familiar. I mean, I bet you I'd recognize it, but off the top of my head, I don't know.
- [69:14]
A
She's phenomenal.
- [69:15]
D
What's like, one of her songs, man.
- [69:17]
C
I need is her. The big one.
- [69:20]
D
Sing it.
- [69:26]
C
I want it. I kind of like it when you call me wonderful. She makes. I mean this in the most complimentary way possible. She makes music that sounds like. It's like. Like would be the best montage played under, like, a really good montage in a rom com. Like, it's just like When Harry Met Sally music or something. I don't know. It just feel. Makes you feel good.
- [69:47]
A
She's very fall, winter. Like, she's.
- [69:48]
D
She.
- [69:49]
A
She's really like November, December music, which I can't explain. And I think she got a little. She lost a little. Not luster is the wrong word, but she got. I think she Spotify wrapped. Only goes to, like, December. Like. Like December 4th, 1st or December 5th or something. And I think she's a big, like, December, January artist.
- [70:06]
C
Sure. Yeah.
- [70:07]
A
But, yeah, man, I need so easy, nice to each other.
- [70:11]
C
Sure. Yeah. Like our guy. Dk, I think you really like Olivia Dean. It's. It's hard not to. It's like such easy, fun listening.
- [70:16]
D
Right.
- [70:17]
C
She's good.
- [70:18]
D
I'll check it out.
- [70:18]
C
I think. I hope she wins best new artist at the Grammys.
- [70:22]
A
Yeah. She's phenomenal. Olivia Dean. If you play fantasy football, you can come on the show whenever you want.
- [70:26]
C
Whenever you want.
- [70:28]
D
We.
- [70:28]
C
We'll. We'll boot Mike Tomlin for you.
- [70:30]
A
Yeah. Dude can't see my mirrors, then I can't see you.
- [70:36]
C
My windshield is bigger than my rear view.
- [70:40]
A
Goat can't eat super forks. Goodbye, everyone. Sa.