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The Ringer NBA Show
Denver Rides the Russ Roller Coaster, the Wolves Overwhelm the Lakers, and More Top-line Takeaways From Saturday’s Game 1s. | Group Chat
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- [00:00]
Justin Ferrier
This episode is brought to you by State Farm. Basketball fans know that a great assist can change the game. And there's no greater assist than one from State Farm. State Farm is here to help you navigate the right coverage for your home, car and more. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. State Farm, Bloomington, IL coverage options are selected by the customer. Availability and eligibility vary by state.
- [00:23]
Rob Mahoney
Today's episode is brought to you by Amazon Business. Every business starts with an idea. How can you go from daydreamer to industry leader? Amazon Business accelerates your journey with smart business buying. Get everything you need to grow in one familiar place. From office supplies to IT essentials to maintenance tools. Amazon Business takes the buying experience you know and love from Amazon plus tools that help you save costs and make insight based decisions. Ready to bring your business to life? Learn how and@AmazonBusiness.com you're listening to the.
- [00:55]
Justin Ferrier
Ringer NBA show presented by FanDuel. America's number one sportsbook is the best place to bet on the NBA because not only does FanDuel have all your favorite player props, but now you can even check out stats and recent performance trends right in the app. Before you make your picks, just download the FanDuel sportsbook app today to get in on the action. The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available and listen to the end of the episode for additional details. Must be 21 plus and present in select states. Gambling problem. Call 1-800- GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com hello and welcome to Group Chat. I am Justin Ferrier and joining me on the first night of the NBA playoffs. We got playoff. Rob Mahoney. We got playoff. Big Woz guys. We just watched what, 10 hours of NBA basketball back to back to back to back. How you feeling? Rob?
- [02:00]
Big Woz
Wonderful. I mean, should we be so lucky every day of the year? But at least we have these first two weekends, you know, wall to wall basketball. I'm. I'm a pig in shit. Justin. I gotta say, I feel like we.
- [02:12]
Justin Ferrier
Usually do the back to back nights where you do four and then four. But we're only doing this first night and I had to like I'm feeling spry. I'm ready to get after it.
- [02:21]
Isaiah Blakely
Yeah, I mean the game started at 10am local time over here. Almost reminded me of an NFL Sunday. You just wake up on Saturday or you know, it's a weekend day, get your breakfast going and just plop yourself on the couch and get Ready for a full day of NBA basketball?
- [02:40]
Big Woz
Yeah. What's your, what's your food technique? Was, are you snacked up? Are you like in my case, I have excavated the pantry. I've gotten rid of all the food in my house because I will eat it if it's present. Like what is your sustenance strategy was today?
- [02:56]
Isaiah Blakely
This is, this is slightly embarrassing, but at 11:30 I placed the DoorDash order for a four piece Popeyes meal.
- [03:04]
Big Woz
And so not, not an embarrassing thing about that.
- [03:07]
Isaiah Blakely
Bodied, bodied two pieces of chicken immediately upon arrival and then let the other two just chill. Then reheated it, bodied it about two and a half hours later. So yeah, that was basically my snack, the four piece Popeye.
- [03:20]
Big Woz
That's beautiful.
- [03:21]
Justin Ferrier
That's long term vision. That's like LeBron pacing himself out throughout the course of entire series. He's not just going to blow everything all at once in the game one, especially this game one that we saw for him tonight. I definitely had multiple versions of caffeine throughout my days. Like I started with the tea, then I had a cold brew, then I had coffee that, that just was in my fridge for like a week that had leftover that had to go to the reserves. Yeah, I think I had four different sources all coming into me at different times.
- [03:48]
Big Woz
Are your intestines okay?
- [03:51]
Justin Ferrier
No, like not usually. So it's all, it's always to build back from the deficit. I'm starting at negative five. I gotta get to zero in order to survive.
- [04:01]
Isaiah Blakely
Build back better.
- [04:02]
Justin Ferrier
There you go. So I would say we had four pretty good games. Even the last game, Lakers Wolves was interesting in its own right. Even though that was probably the lone blowout of the evening. Even the Bucks kind of climb back into it in the first game of the series. But we have to start with game number two on the docket. As we go through all four of these, we'll go through top line takeaways. We'll. We'll talk about first impressions on all of these. But Nuggets 1 12, Clippers 110 in overtime. I was trying to calculate do some long division based on whether or not Russ made more positive plays or more detrimental plays. I think if you carry the one Rob, I think he ultimately came on top. But what does your math say?
- [04:42]
Big Woz
I think absolutely, absolutely. The last deflection off of James Harden's hand tilted the ledger until then. As with Russell Westbrook, often it's anybody's game. You know, his, his angels or his demons could have the day, but in this case came up with some huge plays, was dared to come up with huge plays by the Clippers and absolutely delivered. And, you know, there's. There's kind of a corresponding Chris Dunn effect on the other side where guys and Ben Simmons sometimes where those guys are challenged to make plays. But that's what the playoffs are all about. Like, can your Russell Westbrooks deliver? And boy, did he tonight.
- [05:14]
Isaiah Blakely
And he had to. I thought, especially in the second half, Ty Lew and them decided that they were going to completely tilt their defense in ways that were going to dare Christian Brown and Russell Westbrook to beat them. And in a lot of ways, those guys came up with the plays that ultimately made the difference. And so, yeah, Russ tonight, he repeated his premature layup again. The same one that nearly blew the. That.
- [05:43]
Big Woz
That.
- [05:43]
Isaiah Blakely
That actually blew the Wolves result from a few weeks ago that he did that again with the Nuggets up wanting to burn clock and him just airballing a layup. Um, but he made just some incredible plays. Defensively, he was a menace on the offensive glass. Like, they got so many extra possessions because of Russ effort. He's one of the only guys, I guess, besides Nicola Jokic, who can run a fast break on that team. I don't know if you guys remember that play where y plotted through, sprinted on that fast break by himself.
- [06:17]
Big Woz
He was 39 minutes into the night at that point. Give the guy a break.
- [06:21]
Isaiah Blakely
It was crazy. But Russ, I thought, man, I thought he was a net positive man. Especially when you just consider the stuff. The stuff when he gets rolling that he's good at. They have no other way of generating that stuff. And that we got a decently good Russell night. It was amazing.
- [06:39]
Justin Ferrier
Well, you mentioned that they left him wide open like that. They tilted the defense away from him. I would say it was to the point where he almost felt like the Clippers pulled their goalie and completely left him so wide open that he had just a reservoir of space in front of him. But he made the shot to his credit. I also appreciated when that tip play happened, where it went off, hardened toward the end there you could see Russ celebrating, like, being really triumphant. And then if you go through the play enough, through the review, you see Adelman in the back being like, get back on defense.
- [07:09]
Isaiah Blakely
It's not over yet.
- [07:11]
Justin Ferrier
It was just such a crazy Russ experience. But we can get into some of the things that happened earlier. It seemed that the Clippers had a huge advantage offensively. I thought this game was going to be over quickly, but it really got pulled into the mud and you have to give the Nuggets credit because they made time and time again the tip plays, the hustle plays, brown diving on the floor that the Clippers just couldn't come up with.
- [07:33]
Big Woz
They made a ton of those plays. But also, I think if you want to sort of understand what happened in this game, you look at who was dictating the terms. The Nuggets come out in a funky like 1, 2, 2 zone, which is all but saying up front, we cannot guard these guys.
- [07:47]
Justin Ferrier
We.
- [07:47]
Big Woz
We do not know how to guard them. And guess what? They just did not guard them for a while. Then when the Nuggets had the ball, the Clippers were switching so much. They were throwing the Nuggets off their game and they were taking all these threes. The Nuggets are a team that was, I think 30th in three point rate this season, was settling for three after three after three. They just did not look like the Denver Nuggets on either side of things. They, they went to a simpler defense, they upped those effort plays you're talking about. Justin. They were flying around in rotation. They were flying around for loose balls, they're flying, flying around for rebounds. All of a sudden the intensity gets turned up. All of a sudden they get their pick and roll game locked in and they're able to kind of start exploiting some of those mismatches. And then you see the Clippers making changes where, oh, they, they have to get bigger lineups on the floor now in order to handle those switches to handle the, the Jokic Murray pick and roll, but as a trade off for that. Then the Clippers pick and roll game is clogged up and James Harden can't get to the basket the way he did anymore. And so you could see the Nuggets like resting control of it, but the only way they're able to do it is because overall, the effort and intensity just was not there in the first quarter. And I think by the end of the second, by the end of the second, they finally got there.
- [08:51]
Isaiah Blakely
Yeah, that first quarter was, I'm not gonna lie, pretty disheartening. Cause it's not that the Clippers were scoring. It seemed like they were just walking in for layups. The Nuggets, like, you know, they basically traded baskets, but the Nuggets were like running their offense, getting like system buckets, but like they were working to generate these shots they happen to be making early. Whereas the Clippers, especially Harden and Zubacc, who I thought was excellent, both had great phenomenal Zubacc came in. Yeah, Harden, to me, there was at times where he felt like the best player on the floor, which I haven't felt that way about James Harden in a playoff game in probably five years, if I'm being honest. And so, yeah, the lack of resistance, the lack of, you know, making the Clippers feel them was so tangible and obvious. And then, you know, they came out of that timeout after going down 15, and the intensity and physicality just ratcheted up. They ended up cutting it down to something like five or something before halftime, and it was like, okay, we have a game on our hands.
- [09:53]
Justin Ferrier
I mean, even Jeff Van Gundy was getting in on the intensity, just ripping that ball away from. I think the trainer was even involved in that one. But, yeah, I think you're right. It was so simple for the Clippers early on. It was like just a dump pass into Zubotch, cut from the backside, and they got it over and over and over again. But it felt like once that gunked up, once the Nuggets switched things around in order to account for that, it almost felt like the Clippers froze to a certain extent. And it almost felt like their lack of dynamic play offensively started to come to bear, where it's like there was no route to easy buckets. And the one thing that the Nuggets do well is that they have so much size that they can crowd around the basket and force you into those push shots, into a lot of floaters. And it just wasn't falling for Harden. Didn't feel like a lot of the pushes from Zubotz were even going in. And so you were looking around, and that's typically where you would want Kawhi to save you. And Kawhi was decent in this game, but he just did have the pop. He was. He was okay. I think overall, he made a couple of buckets, but overall, I thought, like, they needed him to be supernova and to take over as he has throughout this second half, and he just wasn't there, and they didn't really know where else to go to.
- [10:56]
Big Woz
Yeah, I thought this was a pretty anonymous game from Kawhi, and if anything, his biggest play of the night was the play where he absolutely botched that ISO attempt against Jamal Murray, and the ball went off his hip out of bounds, where Jeff Van Gundy seized it and refused to give it up. All. All due respect to Jeff Van Gundy, uh, I. I think they just needed more from him. Like, they got what they needed from Harden ultimately, which was big time. Shot making, great playmaking as usual. The, the floater game was on point. The step backs were largely on point. Yeah. Later in the later stages of the game, I think it was a little more spotty, but he also hit some huge runners down the stretch, so I don't want to take those away from him. And Zhu was cleaning up everything inside like it was a huge part of their second chance offense early in the game. And then Kawhi, it's like sometimes he's there, sometimes he's not, sometimes he has the mismatches, but he's not quite delivering. I, I just didn't think it was a, like Kawhi Leonard superstar kind of performance. And they, they, maybe they didn't need that, but they needed clearly two more baskets from him than he was able to give.
- [11:51]
Isaiah Blakely
Yeah. I think even in the best of times though, it's not as if Kawhi is like playing within the flow of some offense. He's getting the ball and he's getting to his spot and you know, when he's at the top of his game, there's literally nothing anybody could do about it. Like, he's muscling people. He's muscling his way into 16ft from the basket, creating space and just canning mid range after mid range. I thought what the Nuggets did a good job of against Kawhi is when he did try to turn the corner, sending that late help where that's Kawhi's like the glaring weakness of his game is his sort of playmaking or passing or seeing the floor, you know, when, when extra defensive help comes his way. I thought they did a great job of that on Kawhi, but again, their best offense was James Harden and Zubac in the pick and roll. Definitely it seemed unstoppable at times and Harden had to step back at times. He's finally convinced himself that he's allowed to take spot up jump shots, which is nice. Also, the floater game was just, it was incredible. I don't remember the last time James Harden seemed this dominant, where he was dictating terms of the game. There was a couple of times in OT where he, where it's like, you know, he's trying to get Jamal Murray on a switch and so like the offense takes like 14 minutes into like, all right, set the screen for him and then he comes at the screen and finally I got Murray or whatever. But Harden was incredible.
- [13:19]
Justin Ferrier
Yeah, see, that's where I would like to see guys other than Leonard get involved. I agree that Leonard Wasn't just nails in this game. I thought he was ultimately fine, but, like, where is Norm Powell in order to provide that electricity? Where's Bogam Bogdanovic? He got brought in specifically for that. It just seemed like they were defaulting to a lot of the old, including Nick Batum, who only compounds the issue that you're a little just creaky getting into things, and that's actually where you don't want to be with Denver, because then it becomes a game of execution. And Jokic is probably going to win that battle 10 times out of 10.
- [13:49]
Big Woz
I didn't really have a problem with the Batum minutes. I mean, he had made some big threes.
- [13:53]
Justin Ferrier
I'm not saying that he was bad. I'm just saying that, like, you. You weren't getting the athletic pop that ultimately the Nuggets got from a guy like Russ. Like, the surge jolting through this game toward the end was Russia.
- [14:06]
Big Woz
I was not expecting a big bench scoring advantage for the Denver Nuggets, like, against a pretty deep Clippers team. And that is because, as you said, Bogey was not just mia, but might be unplayable in this series. It's become very clear that they attacked him relentlessly, everybody. It was just like whoever has the ball and wherever Bogey is on the floor, you're going directly at that guy. Ben Simmons is Ben Simmons, although now braided up. So congratulations to him, I guess. And other than that, it really was just Batum, and I thought Derek Jones Jr. Was gave them pop defeats offensively, but it's very limited on offense. And I think part of why ultimately they had to move away from the pick and roll game down the stretch was Derrick Jones Jr's defender was clogging things up and, you know, taking away some of making hard and settle for some of those floaters versus getting all the way to the rim. Taking away some of the, like, Godzilla versus Tokyo roles that Zubots had during, like, the bulk of this game. Like, they were just able to get bodies in the way in a way that really threw the Clippers off their game.
- [15:04]
Justin Ferrier
Yeah, part of why I think the bench advantage showed up for the Nuggets is because they didn't really play a bench. It was Russell Westbrook, it was some Peyton Watson and then like a sprinkling of Jaden Pickett. And so that was pretty much five minutes, and that included benching Michael Porter Jr. Down the stretch in a game.
- [15:22]
Isaiah Blakely
Talk about awful. He was awful in every facet of the game, bro.
- [15:28]
Justin Ferrier
And they asked Jokic about this after the game about like, you know, why wasn't he engaged? Yada, yada. And Jokic's quote is, if you're not going to be engaged right now, then you're not supposed to be playing this sport.
- [15:40]
Big Woz
He's not wrong.
- [15:41]
Justin Ferrier
Like, can't disagree.
- [15:43]
Big Woz
I mean, there's, there's a couple things happening. One, basically every other starter had to play 45 plus minutes as a result of this rotation, like problem fundamentally. And the fact that Michael Porter wasn't able to give you more than 26 minutes period, but also those 26 minutes had zero impact and zero force to them whatsoever. That's a huge issue because not every Russ Knight is going to be like this, you know, as we're kind of circling around the fundamental give and take of the Russell Westbrook experience. Every game that Russ plays and he's going to have to play a lot for this team because they don't have alternatives. Becomes about Russell Westbrook, becomes about his limitations. Becomes about his give and take. Like it's the only way he can be on the floor is either the Nuggets are having to make it about him or the Clippers are targeting him or exploiting him or challenging him to make plays. And it worked great for the Nuggets here. Like they, they were able to ride that experience to a really important. But it might not in Game 2. It might not for the rest of the series. We're just gonna have to see how it goes with him.
- [16:38]
Isaiah Blakely
Here's the thing about Porter Jr 2023 in the playoffs. He definitely finally, for the first time in his career, consistently brought it on defense. And it's not, he's not the quickest footed guy, but he is legitimately like 6 10, 6, 11. And when he plays his size, he can be a defensive asset. When, you know, Jokic is essentially meeting Harden at the level on the pick and roll, they're dumping it off to Zube at the, you know, the foul line extended. That guy on the back line has to be Michael Porter Jr. He has to be some level of resistance in order for everybody to scramble from behind where Zubac catches it. But instead it was just like, ah, you know, it was a Sunday run at the Y for this kid today. And I'm glad they benched his ass because quite frankly, man, with Russ and also Aaron Gordon had monster fucking game. Monster game. What this dude, first of all, killing people on the offensive glass as well, whenever, like they tried to put some little guy on him, he was like, I am attacking you to the basket. I think he got to the line ten times today, made a huge three pointer, no hesitation.
- [17:56]
Justin Ferrier
A brawl before the game. Like, what happened to his face?
- [17:59]
Isaiah Blakely
My home group chat was. Was swearing, like, pick it. Or somebody punched him in the face at practice. But I'm not spending that rumor. But I'm just like, I don't. I don't know.
- [18:09]
Justin Ferrier
You're not. Not spreading it. Yeah, not.
- [18:11]
Isaiah Blakely
Not spreading it, you know, but he was. He. He was a junkyard dog today, man. And without his relentlessness on both sides, he was a lot of the times providing the resistance when we're like, oh, Kawhi didn't have his best game. That's Aaron Gordon's work right there, man. I can't say enough about him. You compare and contrast, especially the pedigree and the sort of reputation of Porter Jr. And Aaron Gordon and what those guys contributed. You know what I mean? Today it's night and day, man.
- [18:48]
Justin Ferrier
What I like about the playoffs, especially in game ones, is that you really do kind of cut through the noise of everything that we've been hearing leading up to the playoffs at the very least, if not the entire regular season. And one of the main discourses of the Booth v. Malone thing was like, oh, you're playing Russ too much instead of the young guys. Like, why aren't you doing it? And I think what we found out in this game, that maybe Malone was at the very least right in the now. And that, like, maybe Border Jr. Not as, like, impactful as Russ when he's fully engaged in this. And also that a lot of the young guys, maybe they don't. They don't deserve minutes right now.
- [19:20]
Big Woz
Yeah, I don't even know that MPJ was a part of that debate per se, although clearly he can be when he plays to this level. And I think there's. There's A Michael Porter vs. Russ part of this conversation. There's also a, do the Nuggets need shooting or do they need cutting right now? Part of this conversation. And Russ is cutting. And his offensive rebounding like you zeroed in on was that stuff was huge. And MPJ is not usually giving you that stuff. He's had great rebounding.
- [19:44]
Isaiah Blakely
He doesn't like his nose dirty. That's not his lane.
- [19:47]
Big Woz
It's really not. And yeah, zero Julian Strother minutes certainly notable. The Jalen Pickett minutes did not go well. And that kills me to say because I actually do kind of think. I don't know that he's playoff ready yet, but I like his skill Set. And I like, I like some things about him. I also think if you're going to play him, you do not play him with Russell Westbrook. You play him with Jamal Murray and, or Nikola Jokic and try to steal minutes that way. But David Adelman, I gotta say, for being a week and a half on the job, benching one of your highest paid players to play Russell Westbrook in his place and cashing in on that bet, that's, that's a ballsy coaching move.
- [20:21]
Isaiah Blakely
Stones from his father, brother. That's what it really did.
- [20:25]
Justin Ferrier
I think that's one of two things that means Alan probably not coming back or that Michael Porter Jr. Probably not coming back would be my guess.
- [20:32]
Big Woz
It's possible.
- [20:33]
Justin Ferrier
But was if you're the Clippers right now, if you're Ty Lou just sitting in, in the hot tub with, with the assistant coaches going over this game, you saying like, damn, we let one slip away in Denver. This one's going to hurt us because this is going to be a back and forth series. Or are you like they played motherfuckers 45 minutes, basically all five of their main guys and that's going to catch up to them down the road.
- [20:55]
Big Woz
Do we think that Tyloon is deaf are chilling in the hot tub post game?
- [20:59]
Isaiah Blakely
Because why not?
- [21:00]
Big Woz
I mean, I have no argument against trying to get the logistics down.
- [21:04]
Justin Ferrier
Do you want to do that after rewinding the tape?
- [21:06]
Big Woz
I love this tradition for us. Group chat, hot tubbing, post pod. Let's fucking go.
- [21:10]
Isaiah Blakely
Does Denver have a Ritz Carlton? I'm sure there's gotta be a sweep with a, with a hot tub in it. Um, if I'm the Clipper and Ty Lewa, I, I, I'm not gonna lie, he's one of my favorite coaches. Um, he just exudes such a confidence. Like some people would say he's hubris. Like he was like, look man, it's game one, I'm not playing Zube. 40 minutes, bro. You know, Jokic came back and he was kind of abusing that non big lineup. You can't go non big against Jokic. I'm sorry but like, well then Zoo's.
- [21:43]
Big Woz
Gonna have to play 40 plus minutes.
- [21:45]
Isaiah Blakely
Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
- [21:46]
Justin Ferrier
So I don't think he's that bad against Gordon at the five minutes. But as soon as like Jokic comes in, like you can get away a couple minutes.
- [21:53]
Isaiah Blakely
Yeah, you have to, I think you have to match Zoom's minutes with Jokic's.
- [21:58]
Justin Ferrier
Yeah, I mean he kind of did.
- [21:59]
Big Woz
He played 39, but yogic played 46.
- [22:03]
Isaiah Blakely
You know what I mean?
- [22:04]
Justin Ferrier
Well, math says that there were seven unaccounted for.
- [22:06]
Isaiah Blakely
Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
- [22:07]
Justin Ferrier
I guess we have to drill down on the plus minus of that.
- [22:10]
Isaiah Blakely
I think Ty Lue has to like what they were getting out of the hard and pick and roll.
- [22:16]
Big Woz
Yep.
- [22:17]
Isaiah Blakely
I think he has to like the amount that Zube will make Jokic work in the one on one. And look, bro, Christian Brown and Westbrook, y'all gotta beat me. I, I still like my odds if I'm Ty Lue there now. Jamal Murray missed a bunch of good plum looks, bro. In the mid range, couple of threes. Some of these were barely freaking close. Just clanging off the back iron. Um, and I would expect him to make some more plays. He made some big threes in the fourth, but throughout the course of that game he was looking bad. Some bad turnovers. I thought Kawhi guarding him down the edge of the game, that was like. That felt like a sort of like a trump card, almost like, yeah, bro, we. We're going to put the freaking monster on you.
- [23:08]
Justin Ferrier
And I think that one quick.
- [23:10]
Isaiah Blakely
Yeah, a positive effect. Exactly. I think Ty Lu still feels like he has advantages to press, but you know, the Nuggets are only going to gain in confidence from this win.
- [23:20]
Big Woz
The Clippers were right there. Yeah. I think if they clean up a couple of the rotation things doing otherwise, I think either the Ben Simmons or Bogey minutes probably need to go, not be at least minimized to whatever extent you can minimize them.
- [23:32]
Isaiah Blakely
So who's coming in with when. When Zoop sits?
- [23:35]
Big Woz
I would just play batum at the five. Yeah, it's not ideal, but it's better than playing Ben Simmons and they just zone up the floor like no one has to guard him. It's like. It's a huge problem.
- [23:47]
Justin Ferrier
I thought the Simmons minutes were passable.
- [23:49]
Isaiah Blakely
I don't know.
- [23:50]
Justin Ferrier
I didn't. Didn't strike me as some like total chasm in terms of.
- [23:54]
Isaiah Blakely
I agree.
- [23:55]
Big Woz
He just caught the ball at the free throw line and there's no one within eight feet of him and he's just pivoting around looking who to pass to. Like, what are you accomplishing in those minutes?
- [24:04]
Justin Ferrier
If you, if you start from the baseline of any other backup center in the NBA who could just like get you by. By like playing defense, then he's a totally passable NBA.
- [24:13]
Isaiah Blakely
If you start from the baseline of the last three games against Atlanta in 2021, and this was I guess so.
- [24:22]
Big Woz
But yeah, getting Norm, getting Norm Powell more activated. As you said, Justin, they gotta be able to get him more in the flow. They like, I think they have to figure out how to make a more sustainable pick and roll attack that isn't gonna be mucked up to this degree. And this has been, to be fair, a Clipper struggle for the vast majority of the season. Like it got iron, it got kind of papered over when Kawhi got back. And they've been good enough offensively because of other factors, but they do like they have. They hit the skids pretty bad in, in even in their better games. Like there'll be a third quarter stretch where they just go scoreless for four straight minutes or at least can't get field goals to go. It's just part of the Clippers experience.
- [24:57]
Justin Ferrier
All right, let's flip to the other end of LA here for.
- [25:01]
Big Woz
Can we say one more thing? Nicola Jokic at 29:12 9 in this game, we literally didn't even mention it.
- [25:06]
Isaiah Blakely
I mean, it's just what he does.
- [25:07]
Justin Ferrier
He talked around him.
- [25:08]
Big Woz
I'm just saying it's like it's taken as a fact of life that that's who he's going to be.
- [25:13]
Isaiah Blakely
That's what he's going to be.
- [25:13]
Justin Ferrier
He's the foundation of every conversation we're going to have about this series.
- [25:17]
Big Woz
I just want it noted for the record.
- [25:18]
Justin Ferrier
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- [25:56]
Rob Mahoney
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- [26:52]
Justin Ferrier
Okay, so Lakers, Wolves. A game that wasn't much of a game for about three quarters there. I'll be honest, I was pretty stunned by this outcome. Was we all picked the Lakers to win this series. I think we all had inklings that the Wolves might have some advantages that they could press on. I didn't expect them to press on. Every single one of them to the point where they could pretty much blew the Lakers off the court before halftime. What stands out to you about this.
- [27:17]
Isaiah Blakely
One was the Lakers are just not an obviously better team than these guys. This is. They're more than their equal. And you know, I think it bears remembering that, remember when they made the LUCA trade, everybody was like, yo, this is not a trade for this year. They're probably kind of worse because they're way less well balanced now after the LUCA deal. And now somehow we've psyched ourselves into thinking like the Lakers are world beaters. I, I just think they did not execute at a high level. You know, just like conceding switches with Luka Doncic. Like just. No, go ahead. Yes, let's switch Luka on to Anthony freaking Edwards who does like three crossovers and dudes are falling on the freaking floor. Like literally. And that was the Lakers response to just simple pick and rolls 40ft from the basket. I'm. I couldn't understand that. But I, I don't know, man. The way Ant is like getting the ball out of his hands on these drives or when they send too really early up top above the three point line, he looks different in terms of how he's seeing the floor right now. And then, you know, just let me just tick off some of these three point shooting that the Lakers. Excuse me, that the Lakers got happened to them today. Julius Randle, famous playoff flop in terms of shooting threes, specifically any kind of jump shot. 4 for 6 from 3. Jaden McDaniels, 3 for 3 from 3. Mike Conley, 2 for 3. Ant Edwards 4 for 9. Nas Reed 6 for 9 from 3. Like he's Dirk Nowitzki. Guys like I don't know that Dirk.
- [29:01]
Big Woz
Nowitzki had many six of nine, three games if any.
- [29:05]
Isaiah Blakely
And so yeah, like you get that kind of shoot. If the Wolves are going to shoot like this, pack them up. The Lakers are done. But you have to feel more confident that like Julius Randle and Jaden McDaniels are not going to be the freaking Splash brothers going forward.
- [29:21]
Big Woz
But what if they are?
- [29:23]
Isaiah Blakely
This series is done.
- [29:24]
Big Woz
Yeah, if the shooting cash is like this, it's a, it's just a monumental problem for the Lakers. I don't think it will every timeout. I think some of these guys are fluky enough. Nas is a great consistent three point shooter. Jaden McDaniels is certainly going to ebb and flow a bit, among others. I think the bigger problem, as you alluded to Oz, is the playmaking and the crispness of ants decision making. I don't know that I, I didn't, I haven't looked this up. I'm going to guess we have not seen a nine assist, one turnover game from Anthony Edwards maybe ever given the level of pressure that he was getting under under these circumstances from a legit quality playoff caliber opponent. Just a tremendous game from Ant. I mean he had it in full control basically from the, after the first quarter. I thought the first quarter it was the Lakers playmaking and overall their like control of the game in particular Luka that was driving everything that was happening from that point on. It was athleticism and length and guess which these teams has dramatically more than the other. It's, it's, it's your Minnesota Timberwolves led by Anthony Edwards who has both in spades.
- [30:25]
Justin Ferrier
I think when they made the Carl Anthony town trade, they probably were envisioning a performance like this where it's like, oh yeah, you're going to load up on Ant or we're going to shoot fucking 30 threes. Like, like have fun with that or 50 threes. And they just were bombing away the entire time. The ball movement was pinging and I think Julius Randle deserves a lot of credit for that now. By the end of the game he was starting to spin out. I think he had seven turnovers. He was like nailing LeBron in the face. He got a technical. But this is about what you want from Randall where it's just like he's defaulting more to pass Julius rather than score first. Julius, you basically have played an eight man rotation most of the season until you had to literally play other players because it wasn't working out. You had to work in a Clark. You actually had to play your talented rookies that you traded draft picks for. But you have the muscle memory of this eight man rotation. So it's not like you have to really change anything about that. And then you're just hoping to get more from all these other guys that still have more in them. Jaden McDaniels being the prime candidate of that. He played probably the best game I've ever seen him play. Like, he's been good for a good stretch now, but he was just confident and like just ripping things away from them on the boards and just scoring in a way that I haven't seen him probably ever.
- [31:38]
Big Woz
This was a great sort of like culmination game for Jaden McDaniels. We've seen him have good shooting games before and we know what that alone can do if Ant's already drawing so much attention. I think over the back part of the season he was so aggressive getting into the paint and sort of hitting, hitting little runners. Leveraging the fact that he is bigger than almost every player who ends up guarding him because teams don't take him seriously. And the Wolves clearly identified that as. This is a pressure point that can work for us. Right? Like we need to get Jaden the ball. He needs to get it inside where he actually is big and use it in a way that if you flash across the court, Rui Hachimura is being guarded by basically every small guy that the Timberwolves have and he's mostly shooting threes. And we'll see if that's. That's kind of a lever that the Lakers end up pulling in future games. Are we going to post Rui Moore? Are we going to use him in more in Duck in situations like that's. Those are the kinds of matchups you have to exploit to win a series like this. And for the record, I still think this is going to be a long series. I still think this is going to be more competitive once the shooting equalizes a little bit. I don't think the Lakers defense is always going to look this bad. But the Wolves are here and this is an incredible announcement in terms of their entrance to the series.
- [32:44]
Justin Ferrier
I'm a little worried though, if I'm the Lakers, if only because I think the one thing that we targeted going into this was the rim protection and that you had to basically build it in the aggregate. Well, they sold out trying to stop Ant who despite having a pretty awesome performance, he went out in that, what is it, third quarter with the ham or the calf? He had a calf thing. Yeah. And then. But he came back but he wasn't really meteoric scoring. So you still have to account for that like when he's on, when he's powering through some of these like three man fronts that he's going through. But like I don't know how they ever changed the calculus because yeah the, the Wolves shot over their heads but like Dante DiVincenzo didn't shoot that well. Like he's going to have a game like that. Nikhil Alexander Walker, he could shoot like that. So I think it's like repeatable in a way that if I'm the Lakers, yeah like Luca and LeBron and Reeves they're going to have so much juice to overwhelm. But like the Wolves have the balance of defense offense that I think is going to be scary for anyone for sure.
- [33:40]
Big Woz
Yeah they're like offensive minded lineups are still really good defensive lineups just, just by the nature of their personnel, just by who they're going to throw out there. And so this is going to be a lot for the Lakers to handle and I think in particular, you know, Jackson Hayes just kind of like got wiped off the floor because they needed to score so many points to try to make up for the deficit once it built very quietly. The Dorian Finney Smith minutes did not go very well. And this, this does happen with Dorian. It hasn't happened lately during his Lakers tenure because he's been kind of like a plus minus monster for them. But he'll have games where he just isn't really shooting well and thus isn't an offensive threat and is he isn't the best finisher especially when contested around the basket. And if, if Jackson Hayes isn't that playable and Dorian Finney Smith isn't that good. Your, your list of live bodies is dwindling quickly. If you're the Lakers.
- [34:26]
Isaiah Blakely
I'm not that worried about the Lakers offense. I think they'll be fine in a half court off like they'll find ways to generate good looks consistently. But they do not have an Anthony Edwards matchup. They just don't because like do you.
- [34:44]
Big Woz
Know anyone who does?
- [34:47]
Isaiah Blakely
Boston, I guess, I guess.
- [34:50]
Big Woz
Yeah. Those might be the only answers teams in the world.
- [34:54]
Isaiah Blakely
Yeah. Like the way he feels so confident man even you know they're targeting Luka but it's like LeBron, you can't stick with me. I think even the Lebron of the Bubble championship was just a like, way more athletic defensive player in terms of doing defensive slides. Right. Like every now and again he could load up and get a nice chase down block.
- [35:19]
Big Woz
He got one tonight.
- [35:20]
Isaiah Blakely
Yeah, yeah. But like the quick twitch stuff that you need and anticipation that you need in order to stay in front of Ant with any level of credibility, like, LeBron don't got that.
- [35:32]
Big Woz
He did have the one possession tonight where he switched on Ant and did the like happy feet. Let me show you. I am engaged. It's like the LeBron equivalent of slapping the floor is basically what happened.
- [35:42]
Isaiah Blakely
He gets the choppy feet.
- [35:44]
Justin Ferrier
Yeah, we're glad that he did because otherwise I might not have remembered that he played in this game. This is one of the quietest LeBron playoff games I've seen in a very long time.
- [35:52]
Big Woz
Very true. And I would expect that to change. I don't know what was going on today. He was not in the rhythm of this game. He was not making much of a mark on it.
- [35:59]
Isaiah Blakely
LeBron, man, he's at the point where he has to match up Hunt. He's not going to just smoke Nas Reed off the dribble on a switch. He's just not. He's going to take the Akron step back and make it one out of every four times. Like he's. He's got to find the smaller guys and beat them up. Okay. That's how he's going to make an impact on this series. He hasn't really been a one on one kind of killer. Yeah, I would, yeah, I'm telling you, I would say since probably 2020, to be honest.
- [36:30]
Big Woz
I also thought low key Julius Randle did a pretty good job one on one in his matchups with LeBron.
- [36:36]
Isaiah Blakely
I guess he needs to stop trying to challenge LeBron with his one on one scoring. He's like, bro, like LeBron's just as strong as you. You can't do your bully ball shit with him. Yeah, but I, I think LeBron has to match up Hunt. He has to try to get the Nikhil Alexander Walkers, the Mike Conleys. He's got to target those guys, you know, Divincenzo. Those is who he gotta target. Cause I, I don't think he's just gonna be able to like, you know, when he. Cause usually when you try to guard LeBron on the pick and roll conventionally, like, that shit just doesn't work. Teams have figured it out years ago, like, yo, we just gotta switch the big onto him. He's not as quick as he Used to be he has to be stronger than the guy that he's going up against to score efficiently. And he just wasn't, you know, hunting those matchups today.
- [37:24]
Justin Ferrier
Thought this was also a, like, oh, Austin Reaves, you're a future all Star. Let's see it, man.
- [37:30]
Big Woz
We might yet. We haven't yet.
- [37:32]
Justin Ferrier
He's the most improved player in the world. Like, oh, yeah, let's see this. Because he looked pretty pedestrian.
- [37:38]
Big Woz
Well, some of that is the function of who is. Who is starting the possessions. Right. And if you're. If you're going against a defense that's switching as much as Minnesota is switching right now, and Luka has the ball in his hands, Luka's gonna work that mismatch game like we're telling LeBron that he should with some of the smaller defenders. And you see it in the box score. Exactly what happened. 37 points for Luka. Doncic did incredible heavy lifting in the first quarter in particular. One assist like, this is what the switching gets you, is you're gonna leave Rudy Gobert on an island sometimes and he's gonna get in foul trouble. You're gonna hang Nas Reed out to drive once and again. But you're taking away some of these spot threes for other guys. You're taking away the momentum that guys like Austin Reaves feed off of. Like, he's such a second side attacker. And if there's no second side to exploit, where. Where is Austin Reaves this production going to come from? We're going to have to find that out over the course of the series.
- [38:25]
Justin Ferrier
Quote Austin Reaves, I think they just physically beat us from the get go. Yeah, pretty much.
- [38:30]
Big Woz
Certainly did.
- [38:31]
Justin Ferrier
Anything else from this game you guys have?
- [38:35]
Isaiah Blakely
I got nothing. Looking forward to Game 2, though?
- [38:37]
Big Woz
Absolutely.
- [38:38]
Isaiah Blakely
Also, we got a playoff series because the home team lost the game.
- [38:41]
Big Woz
It has begun.
- [38:43]
Justin Ferrier
The Ringer NBA show is brought to you by FanDuel. The NBA playoffs are finally here, and there's no better way to be a part of the action than with FanDuel, America's number one sports book. After another competitive season, the top teams are ready to battle their way through the playoff bracket in hopes of taking home the championship. And if you think you know how it's all going to go down, then make those predictions pay off. With FanDuel and NBA profit boosts. Simply make your bet, activate your boost, and go for even bigger winnings. So we're looking at Sunday's game one slates. A lot of big lines out there. So I'm going to Go to Warriors at Rockets Game one in Houston. It's basically a pick em. It's plus one for the Warriors. I kind of like the Rockets just to win Game one. I don't know, the warriors had to play the extra games, but older I wonder if they're going to be shocked by the defensive attention of Amend Thompson and some of the dogs that they have out there in Houston just to maybe recalibrate it. I kind of still like the warriors in this series, but give me the home team in Game one at least to start with and then we'll go from there and just don't be a spectator this postseason. Overall head to FanDuel.com RingerMBA to download America's number one sportsbook and make every moment more must be 21 + and present in select states or 18 + in present in DC. Opt in required bonus issued as non withdrawable profit boost tokens. Restrictions apply including any token expiration and max wager amount. See terms@sportsbook fanduel.com gambling problem. Call 1-800- GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com all right Knicks Pistons this one was very much a telltale sign of the Pistons being in their first playoff series where it almost felt like they used up all their nervous energy in the first half and then everything just came crumbling down. Like all the young mistakes I think Jalen Dern had. I counted at least two to three, like three second violations. I don't know what the fuck was going on there.
- [40:40]
Big Woz
It was really bad.
- [40:41]
Justin Ferrier
The Knicks went on a 21 to.
- [40:44]
Isaiah Blakely
Nothing run in the fourth quarter.
- [40:46]
Big Woz
Fourth quarter. Yeah.
- [40:47]
Justin Ferrier
That's brutal.
- [40:48]
Isaiah Blakely
That's bad. Yeah, Producer Zay said it, you know, at the top of the call he's like it's a young team. What are you going to do? Like they're going to run up against a wall in the playoffs. Like for three quarters they look like, hey we're the Knicks is equal, you know, but let's face it, their offense isn't that dynamic. And OG Anunoby looked like an all world defender against Cade Cunningham. Like he was crowding him. He was making all of his stuff tough. The only time Cade had some like good possessions was when OG got switched off of him. He fish filleted Mikhail Bridges. Cause of course this guy went from all NBA candidate to literally paper mache. At this point they're gonna have to figure out ways to free him up. Like get OG Anunoby the hell up off of me if that guy's going to be able to be the engine for the offense. But yeah, it just felt like they hit a young team wall in that fourth quarter. And of course, you know, the Knicks had the home crowd and all of that, but I, I'm, I'm not, I don't think they're like, this is indicative of some series that they're just going to get blown out of the water. But that fourth quarter was tough to watch from them.
- [41:59]
Big Woz
Just full deer in the headlights stuff and way too casual and like, in terms of their execution. And this is the problem with what you're saying was as far as, like, they got a free up Cade from OG and that was a big change from the regular season where Cade just destroyed Mikhail Bridges in those matchups. You put OG on him. Now when they were able to get Cade free, they were prying him loose. They had to run this preliminary action to screen for Cade off ball to get OG off him with 14 seconds on the shot clock. Kate is a really methodical player on his own. He's kind of taking his time, waiting for the next screen, doing his thing. All of a sudden there's three seconds on the shot clock and like Malik Beasley's tossing up like a one armed, like shot put three pointer because the possession didn't go anywhere. And so you just have to execute with more purpose than these guys did. I just don't think they knew the urgency of playoff basketball. Like, they were not quite familiar with the brief as of yet. And so now that they've seen it, we'll see how they respond to it. We'll see kind of who's ready for this stuff and who isn't. Jalen Duran, who's 21 years old, just might not be ready for this yet. And that's okay. Like, that's, that's the learning curve of this stuff. And you have to go through your paces. You have to have your Jared Allen, the lights were pretty bright sort of moment sometimes. That's just what it is.
- [43:12]
Justin Ferrier
I know, perfect podcast guest.
- [43:14]
Big Woz
You, you, you come up in the world. But like, I thought Beef stew was just a much more effective big. And I thought Jalen Duran, this is a tough matchup for him to begin with. They already have to basically have him guarding Josh Hart so that, you know, Tobias Harris can guard towns. Like, they're already trying to navigate around him. And there are a few too many guys like that on the pistons right now who are just like too young to know what to do implicitly. And so you have to coach them up to do every single thing.
- [43:38]
Justin Ferrier
Are you guys Jalen Dern guys?
- [43:41]
Big Woz
I like, I like the energy. I just don't know that it's always focused in a constructive way.
- [43:46]
Isaiah Blakely
Talent, you know, the speed at the position. Strong as hell. Clearly has some like level of ball skills, but basketball iq, it's tough.
- [44:00]
Justin Ferrier
I almost feel like he accidentally put on the wrong jersey one day. Like he's actually a football rush end and that he just somehow got mixed up.
- [44:08]
Big Woz
I mean, he'd be a phenomenal volleyball player. We got to get him on the Olympic volleyball team. He'd be tremendous up there.
- [44:14]
Justin Ferrier
He's a weird combination where he's like such a supreme athlete, but not in a way that totally translates to basketball. Like he just moves with like a weird gait and he's just strong as a goddamn bull, but like almost too strong. He looks like he could just like spot for, for Schwarzenegger in some role or something like that. It's just like almost too muscle bound where it's like you need more functional athleticism to get around. But to put that on top of some of like the dunderheaded mistakes that he's typical to make, it just. Yeah, just. He always rubs me the wrong way. But I will say this about the Pistons. For most of the game, or at least the first half going into the third quarter, they managed to drag them into the mud, the Knicks, in a way that I think will behoove them down the road because there was a real like Sixers, Knicks energy from last season to this game. And that's not where the Knicks want to be. Particularly because Jalen Brunson, I noticed a lot of hobbling post making a bucket or he would make a dynamic move and all of a sudden he would not pull up lame, but just be a little bit slower coming out of there. He ultimately ended up with an awesome performance. He had 34 points in this game. So you can't ask more for him. But that's something I'm tracking here because it just. He never really had enough time post injury coming back to really get right. It just doesn't seem like he's there yet.
- [45:24]
Big Woz
I mean, just look like he jammed that foot a couple of times in this game off of just like weird kind of missteps. And he's already someone who takes a lot of falls to begin with, but a gutsy ass performance who, you know, I would say Brunson early in this game, his word shots, they were. His shots were not going. He wasn't getting the calls that he wanted. He's Got a Sar Thompson all over him, which God bless anyone who's trying. And I thought the way he put it together in the second half was damn heroic in the way that we expect Jalen Brunson to be damn heroic. And I think your point stands, Justin, as far as the comparison to that Sixers series. That is what it felt like. Ugly, chaotic. And then here's Jalen Brunson to save the day. Like it really played out exactly that way.
- [46:02]
Isaiah Blakely
Second half was definitely some never underestimate the heart of a champion kind of stuff. And in the first half, just to bring it back to an anobi, he was the one carrying the offense like not only just guarding the hell out of Cade, but like he was the Knicks half court offense, man, splashing, jump shots, getting to the cup. He was great in that first half. So hats off to, to an Anoby. And you know, I would expect Brunson, man, he's smart enough to like know where the spots are coming from. He did have a lot of his foul drawing behavior that was just straight up not rewarded, especially in the first half. But you know, like Justin said, he eventually came around and ended up, you know, take picking up the offensive burden. I thought Bridges had some nice. I think there's something nice about what he provides with that mid range game. Definitely where it's like, it feels like all right, when we're not generating some fantastic look, we can have this guy come off of a drag screen and just, just curl into a beautiful mid range jump shot. He had a few of those this game that I think like sort of serves as a pressure release valve almost for the Knicks offense at times. So it was a nice, well balanced performance from the Knicks. But you know, the Pistons look their age.
- [47:21]
Big Woz
Well, if the Pistons had a pressure release, it would be our friend Tobias Harris who balled out in this game.
- [47:27]
Isaiah Blakely
Clyde Frazier. Cause I was listening to the Knicks broadcast. Yeah, Clyde Fraz could not believe his lion eyes.
- [47:33]
Big Woz
Boy, he should have been locked in on basketball this season because Tobias Harris has played well for the Pistons all year. But in these moments, as we've been talking about, with such a young team and an inexperienced team overall, just a lot of guys who either have not been here or have not been here in the roles they're now asked to play. Tobias Harris is the steady hand by comparison and I thought was just their most poise and maybe honestly their best player in this game. Cade had such like a weird up and down, inefficient sort of night. His, his role is very different than what Tobias Harris is asked to do. But Tobias carrying the Pistons in the minutes without Cade, that was a really positive development and overall part of a great night for him overall.
- [48:15]
Justin Ferrier
If it wasn't Tobias, it might have been Malik Beasley, who, not on top of just like hitting every goddamn three he's taking these days, is now kind of like the emotional ballast of the sixth best team in the Eastern Conference all of a sudden.
- [48:27]
Big Woz
But if your emotional ballast is shimmying, like, don't you want your ballast to be solid and sturdy?
- [48:32]
Justin Ferrier
He's naturally off balance. You're right.
- [48:34]
Big Woz
I'm just saying.
- [48:36]
Justin Ferrier
I just can't stop from marveling. And I know we've been watching the Pistons for at least half a year at this point. All of us have been watching full season, but they caught on at midpoint of the season that, like, the core of this team includes Tim Hardaway, Jr. Tobias Harris, Malik Beasley and Dennis Shooter, who if you had told me that was like a team's pickup over the course of like an off season and a trade deadline, I'd be like, oh, the Nets had to reach the salary floor. Guys that just trade teams like every two to three years, they're all over the place. And yet this is the guts of one of the best teams in the East. Like, I'll never get over that.
- [49:12]
Big Woz
It's been remarkable the way that they've just kind of filled out the rotation. And again, those are guys who have particular skill sets that matter. And at certain stakes of play, what Tobias can't do is a problem. Right. If you're the Sixers trying to contend. Tobias's limitations are more of an issue in this context, where you just need him to be a fill in the gaps creator, where you need his turnaround mid range game and not just to put him in the corner. All of a sudden he becomes a dramatically more important and more valuable player. And I think you see versions of that with all those guys, right? With Beasley coming off the bench being like a pure sharpshooter and being a movement shooter in a way that say he wasn't in Milwaukee where he was kind of standing still waiting for the kick out from Giannis is such an important thing. And Dennis Schroeder overall, I think has been like, just really, really good for this team. We had an email from Wes who was asking us about why teams in the NBA continuously undervalue players like Dennis Schroeder. I think it's a fair question. I think if anything, there's Sort of a market quirk for the like low end starting point guard, high end, reserve point guard. Where it's like, do we really want to spend our money there when we already have these stars, when we already have point guards? But someone like Schroeder who's a backup point guard, who can play with Cade Cunningham, that's all of a sudden a very valuable thing. And frankly on their side too, campaign showing up in the campaign game of the early stages of the playoffs and kind of providing a similar lift.
- [50:32]
Isaiah Blakely
There's just not a lot of guards who will play like solid defense and actually have things that they're going to contribute offensively both on the ball and offense. Schruder's not anybody's idea of a sharpshooter, but you can't leave him alone when he's out there. Like he will burn you and you know, he's a credible on ball defender. Like that's just not as common a skill as you would think. Like, think about someone like Gabe Vincent who's considered the Lakers, like sort of, you know, head of the snake, pit bull kind of guy on the ball. He's nowhere near as good on offense as dead.
- [51:10]
Big Woz
And Schroeder, well, that pit bull got pacified too. They just like threw a stake to the side and he went and chased it. It didn't, didn't work out tonight.
- [51:17]
Justin Ferrier
I think with Schroeder and also players, player type, I think there's a pretty stark difference between the on paper version and the practical implications of them. Whereas like shooter, the shot comes and goes and for a while it was down pretty bad. And also it took him a while to kind of round into form defensively to be the type of guy he was on the second time around with the Lakers. And so what you're really asking like looking for with him is basically a score first guard who typically is pretty strong headed and could be a little bit mercurial if he's not getting the right role for him. I think like, yeah, he phased out of Golden State, maybe not because of locker room stuff, because he wasn't hitting.
- [51:53]
Isaiah Blakely
And they needed a shot and they.
- [51:55]
Justin Ferrier
Really needed something out of those minutes immediately. Well, when you go to Detroit where the bar is a little bit lower, what they need is someone to basically be the guy hand holding the younger guy in order to provide foundational, just like stability. And so I think that's why someone like him keeps knocking around because like you almost phase out of needing him. But he is so valuable for so many teams specifically that have young guys like Kate.
- [52:18]
Big Woz
But think about that line you're trying to walk with guys like him. And again, like, I think campaign is another instructive example here where you need someone who is confident enough in what they do to come in guns a blazing when the situation calls for it, but not so overconfident that when you play them two minutes or you bench them, it's a huge issue and it becomes like a problem for your team. Like, it's a really difficult balance to strike with some of these guys. And that's why it usually happens to be more veteran types who fill it. Because early in your career, you're gunning for a contract. Like you're trying to prove yourself in a different way. These guys are trying to win and they're trying to fill a role and they're trying to figure out how they can contribute to this team. I'm not saying there's never ego involved, but the ego kind of shows itself a little bit differently.
- [53:00]
Justin Ferrier
Campaign just back from the dead.
- [53:04]
Isaiah Blakely
Every other season with this guy.
- [53:06]
Big Woz
He's had huge moments for them this season, though, where they. They just desperately needed a campaign type and sure enough, they turned to him on the bench. The SP spotlight comes to Cam, and it's his night.
- [53:16]
Justin Ferrier
I just.
- [53:17]
Big Woz
I don't even know how it works, but it keeps working.
- [53:20]
Justin Ferrier
He's definitely more reliable than Deuce McBride at this point, who's gone through a bit of a journey over the second half of the season. Yeah, I thought the Mitchell Robinson minutes were pretty good. They gave him a little bit of a different look. He definitely, like, his physicality had an impact of the game, so there's still more here to play there. I just want to go back to OG just briefly because the come up for OG kind of almost supplanting Bridges as the third guy on this team has been a little bit surprising to me. I think we all assumed OG would settle into the same role. He's kind of always been, is like havoc wreaker defensively and then he'll just get his own offensively just to kind of almost mollify him in order for him to just sit in the corner and take his shots. But, like, it almost feels like he called his shot by wanting to do more in Toronto and everyone was like, okay, yeah, he's doing more in New York and it almost feels like completely recalibrated things.
- [54:05]
Isaiah Blakely
Yeah, yeah, his jump shot is as reliable as it's ever been. I'm not gonna lie. I was always skeptical that, that he could Ever become this kind of shooter. Like, you just can't leave him all alone. Like, he's a dangerous shooter now. Like, which is just crazy to say, especially when we first started watching this guy in Toronto. Like, I never thought we would get to this day. And you know, his drive game has gotten better and he's good at the ducking stuff and he's good in the dunker spot. Like, he's, you know, he's rounded off his game quite nicely. But at the same time, like, bro, you get paid 20 more million dollars than Mikhail Bridges does. So, like, yeah, I'm not gonna, you know, pat the guy on his ass and give him a gold star.
- [54:48]
Big Woz
I think we're just glad that he got here, you know?
- [54:50]
Isaiah Blakely
Yeah, no, for sure.
- [54:51]
Big Woz
We talk all the time about the Jonathan Kuminga types who think themselves to be something they are not. And for, for a while, OG has never been Jonathan Kuminga, but he thought he was more than a straight line driver and a three point shooter and he was right. You can, you can run an OG and an OBI pick and roll and you're not going to embarrass yourself. And better than that, you're going to survive some of these stretches when Brunson's on the bench or when he's out with injury, as we saw over the last couple months because of his ability to do that.
- [55:16]
Isaiah Blakely
Do we know if Suni Lee or Anne Hathaway were at the game today?
- [55:19]
Big Woz
We don't know for sure. Maybe both.
- [55:21]
Justin Ferrier
I think Anne Hathaway was. I was also a question.
- [55:23]
Isaiah Blakely
Nice, nice.
- [55:25]
Big Woz
You saw her at the game though. I know she was at some kind of public event recently, but I don't know if it was at msg.
- [55:30]
Justin Ferrier
Well, I just saw her.
- [55:33]
Isaiah Blakely
Josh Hart said that they need Suni Lee and Anna Hathaway at every game because OG seems to play better when attractive celebrity women are, you know, sitting courtside at the Garden.
- [55:43]
Big Woz
Jim Dolan, open your wallet, let's go. This is, this is a fixable problem.
- [55:48]
Isaiah Blakely
Let's go.
- [55:49]
Justin Ferrier
I think this just shows you don't have to have graduated from Villanova to succeed on the New York Knicks. And in fact, like it turns out, maybe that isn't the key to success. Unless you're Jalen Brunson, because isn't going well for anybody else.
- [56:01]
Big Woz
I also want to say shout out to. To Carl Town. So I thought when Brunson was struggling in the first half, he had a bunch of like really tough shot making, like off balance runners.
- [56:11]
Justin Ferrier
Either.
- [56:11]
Big Woz
Yeah. Their offense Was not in rhythm, and they desperately needed points to sort of like, hang around in this game and keep competitive. And he was. He was the vehicle for doing that as much as OG was.
- [56:20]
Isaiah Blakely
But I still gotta dock him points for using his Barry White voice in the post game interview.
- [56:25]
Big Woz
I didn't even get.
- [56:26]
Isaiah Blakely
He did the heavy bass in his voice voice thing. I was like, bro, I told you.
- [56:30]
Big Woz
With the Pistons, like, it's gonna bring it out of him even more.
- [56:34]
Justin Ferrier
All right, last one on the board here. Pacers beating the Bucks. We were talking on our group chat. Group chat before the game. The Pacers showed up in these yes Sirs shirts.
- [56:46]
Big Woz
Yeah. Can you spell that out?
- [56:49]
Justin Ferrier
Yes. I hope, comma, we'll see if that grammar played out. And then Sirs was apostrophe C E R S, which, you know, I'm not a Pacers, like, fan per se, but that's the type of corniness that's going to get me back in.
- [57:03]
Isaiah Blakely
I like it. I like it.
- [57:05]
Justin Ferrier
I think if I didn't see what the buck slogan was, but they might have defaulted to something along the lines of, man, we're just. We're doing our best out here. We're trying as hard as possible because they worked their way back into this game, but good Lord, did they look.
- [57:18]
Big Woz
Just out Class question on that front, Were they trying their best?
- [57:22]
Justin Ferrier
Some of them were.
- [57:23]
Big Woz
The. Were the non. Bucks, I got to say, was trying.
- [57:27]
Isaiah Blakely
I got to say the Collector was the Kuzma of the last 10 days. Jesus. Good God Almighty, does he not listen to the Bill Simmons podcast? I put my neck on the line for this kid, and he was just horrific. At one point, I looked up. When I finally looked at the box score for the Bucks game, they were two for 16 from three. Two for that first 16, bro.
- [57:54]
Big Woz
It was tough. Who could have possibly seen this coming? Regarding Kyle Kuzma, though, you know, just.
- [58:00]
Justin Ferrier
To put a bow on this, Kuzma had a trillion, which is. He played 22 minutes. He did not produce anything, but I believe two fouls.
- [58:08]
Big Woz
A 22 trillion. That's Tony Snellion, to say the least. Like, we're in rarefied air here.
- [58:16]
Justin Ferrier
Tony Snellion. So this was the 6 trillion in playoff history. Oh, and frankly, Taurean Prince wasn't that much better. Yeah, they did find something a little bit late where it was Giannis, plus the bench guys gave him a little bit more of a pop. I would assume they'd go to that. Unless Dame comes back miraculously in game two. We still don't know the status of this as we're recording this Saturday night. So there's like some silver linings there, Rob, but overall there's just a lot of blood on this box score here.
- [58:47]
Big Woz
Well, there's a lot of blood because it was a comprehensive beat down from a Pacers team that is the better, more complete team. Yeah, I don't know that it's that much more complicated than that. And not having Dame exacerbates all of these problems. Right? Like the things that the Pacers do well, especially on defense, they will close out to you on three and they'll take away your easy threes and they will bust ass back in transition. They're going to take away all the easy points on the table. And if you take the easy points away from the Bucs, you are left with this. Giannis being Giannis, more or less unstoppable, like, cannot contain that guy. I thought the combination of Pascal and Miles Turner and switches and Aaron Neesmith here and designated X factor Jairus Wallace did their damnedest to contain Giannis.
- [59:30]
Justin Ferrier
Jairus Wallace, Jairus Walker. You're not even getting your guy's name right.
- [59:36]
Big Woz
I'm, I'm a broken man. I'm sorry, Jairus Walker. I apologize to Jairus Walker who I thought actually came in and did his honorary, like, filled the Ben Shepard minutes, you know, with, with in an admirable way. But all of which is to say this is what Giannis is going to be in this series. Like, you're not going to stop him from getting to the rim. You're not going to stop him from getting to the line. But if the Bucks are this predictable otherwise, as they often are, especially when Dame isn't out there, this is what it looks like. It looks like a Taurean prince stands still overnight. A Kyle Kuzma over like, like you have. You just have to play better if you're Kyle Kuzma. Like that's, that's an important adjustment that we have to crank up the dial on Kyle Kuzma doing things. They just don't have a lot of options once you take away the low hanging fruit that they can't rely on. Stop. Stop.
- [60:23]
Justin Ferrier
Just Dame have more of an impact on this game by standing up to Halliburton and getting a tech than playing 22 minutes and doing nothing.
- [60:32]
Isaiah Blakely
Yes, Damon Halliburton have a thing that goes back to. I love it last season's NBA in season tournament.
- [60:44]
Big Woz
It's been kind of a one sided thing, I gotta say.
- [60:46]
Isaiah Blakely
Halliburton is going to chirp. That's just what he does, no matter what. And, you know, I'm looking forward to some overly physical fouls at the Cup. I'm ready for game two. I just. I hope Dame comes back. I hope he's. He's healthy and winded enough to make some kind of impact, because if he's not coming back, they're getting swept, guys.
- [61:09]
Big Woz
Yeah, you can even swept quarter to quarter, the Pacers were already figuring out, oh, this is exactly how much we can cheat off of these other guys to muck up things with Giannis. And I thought Andrew Nemhard in particular, which is like flying in from the weak side, blowing up plays left and right, they're just going to get better at that team. He is absolutely the heart and soul of the team. They're going to get better and better at that, so long as Dame doesn't play.
- [61:32]
Justin Ferrier
I think Halliburton feels confident enough to chirp when he knows that he has Andrew Nemhardt on his side covering his ass in every possible way because he. I think he might be the actual star guard of this team. No, no. Putting a little too much mustard on it, but no. I think we've now had enough of a sample to suggest that Nemhardt is a crucial aspect of providing the balance that this team has found since this Iakam trade. It's not just Siakam, who was also very good in this game. Just Nem hurt, just so many defensive plays, like jumping passing lanes and like poking his hand in there and getting everything started there. Plus the balance on offense where he's a good. He didn't really have like a standout game, but it just does enough in order to round out this team in a way that they managed to be successful now for season and a half.
- [62:20]
Big Woz
He was also just turning the, like, borderline kind of fast break possessions into actual fast breaks. Like, he would just push it harder and then body through Brook Lopez and then finish with the layup. Like, it's crazy stuff from Andrew Nemhard, but I want. I want to zero in on Pascal for a second because I love watching Pascal Siakam play in particular in the playoffs. He has such an awesome whatever it takes kind of game. Like you need a pick and roll. He can play any side of it. If you need to dig up a loose ball, he's going to be there. If you need someone to, like, work in the mid range and hit a turnaround jumper, he's your guy. And the Pacers need that because Tyrese Halliburton is in some cases not those things, right? Like he is not, not a definitive one on one player. It's not his skill set. And so having someone like Pascal to fall back on is so important for Indiana and really is what gives them the lifeblood in terms of their half court offense. Like when the system doesn't work, when Halliburton's movement and shooting don't work, Pascal's your guy or Nemhard's your guy. And their ability to kind of toggle between them I think is what makes this team so effective.
- [63:20]
Justin Ferrier
What do you think was basically Dame or Bus at this point?
- [63:23]
Isaiah Blakely
Pretty much I don't know how and I like, I think I might have probably picked the Pacers to win this series anyway. Obviously a longer series, but if Dame misses the next game, it's going to be 2 0. And now we're expecting these guys to win four out of five games against this Pacers team. I don't, I don't see how you could reasonably come to that conclusion. I hate to do the game one jump out of the window, oh, this is over, like kind of thing, but from what I watched today, the Bucks can't beat this team unless they have their other all Star on the floor.
- [64:04]
Big Woz
It just can't be this stale. I think, you know, if, whether Dame plays or not, I think Doc needs to seriously look at bringing Tore and Prince off the bench and putting I would say AJ Green in the starting lineup if you can. The reason those like Giannis and Ben sky lineups worked as well as they did was they were a little more random and they were a little less stale. And some of that is the difference between Taurean Prince standstill shooter versus AJ Green movement shooter. And he was the only guy who could consistently get off threes against his Pacers defense. And so if you can tap into some of that in the starting group with Giannis, maybe you have something going. I think you're going to need Dame to make it matter regardless, but you got to start somewhere.
- [64:42]
Justin Ferrier
I think the good thing that they have going for them is that all of these guys are all around the same level, which is unfortunately replacement level, but you can cycle through things a little bit more quickly. So you're right, you can't be as precious about benching Kuzma even or Prince just to get some of these guys in the mix there.
- [64:57]
Big Woz
I think Kuzma's got to be there because you need, you need, you need someone to play better than they did and he at least can do that. Like, you can expect that he will play better than a 20.
- [65:07]
Isaiah Blakely
He's going to play better than what he did today, but it has to be way better.
- [65:12]
Justin Ferrier
I mean, he literally cannot play worse than he plays today. He did not contribute anything.
- [65:16]
Big Woz
I don't even know that he got cardio. Like, it just, he didn't even get his steps in out there. It just wasn't a good Kyle Kuzma game.
- [65:23]
Justin Ferrier
All right, why don't we wrap it there, because everyone has a full day of playoff basketball to get to tomorrow on Sunday. Also, Easter. So happy Easter to all those.
- [65:32]
Isaiah Blakely
Happy Easter. He is risen.
- [65:33]
Big Woz
Yeah. Kyle Kuzma will be risen again.
- [65:36]
Justin Ferrier
I hope so. For the fuck's sake.
- [65:38]
Isaiah Blakely
We hope so.
- [65:40]
Justin Ferrier
Thank you to Isaiah Blakely for staying up late with us. We'll be back on Wednesday night going into Thursday, so check us out then. We will talk to you then. Must be 21 plus and present in select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18 plus in present in D.C. gambling problem. Call 1-800- GAMBLER or visit rg help.com call 1-888-7777 or visit ccpg.org chat in Connecticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gamblinghelplinema.org or 800-327-5050 for 24. 7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8-HOPE NY or text HOPE NY in New York.