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The Ringer NBA Show
Free Agency Frenzy: Dame Waived, Turner to the Bucks, and LeBron’s Unhappy?
01:00:58
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- [00:00]
Logan Murdoch
Logan Murdoch here for another edition of Real Ones. Me and Raja Bell talk all things free agency. We get into the very fluid situation that's going on in Milwaukee. Carmelo Anthony said there's no loyalty in sports, and there's definitely no loyalty for Dame Willard in Milwaukee because they waived and stretched his contract to make a deal to get Myles Turner. We get into all of the ramifications of that. LeBron's legacy in Los Angeles. We're going to. We talk about what's going to happen with Kaminga. Then we get into a great mailbag discussion with the Ball Cliff where we answer your questions about discourse in the modern NBA. And who is going to be remembered as a Great player in 2040? Is it Kyrie going to be thought of as the greatest player of all time? Is Lamelo going to be thought of as the greatest player of all time? Maybe. We'll see. We discussed all of that, but for the moment, let's get to the intro. Music. Cliff played a theme spot. Real Ones. Logan Murdock here. Roger Bell there. The free agency edition of Real Ones is upon us. I got the sniffle sniffs. Raj is apparently 100% healthy, but we're going to do it anyway. Are you good, Raja? Before we get to the deals, I.
- [01:16]
Raja Bell
Mean, you know, parenthood is like playing an NBA season. Like, the Last time you're 100% healthy is the day before they're bored. So, like, I'm, I'm not 100% healthy, but I'm as close as I'm getting.
- [01:28]
Logan Murdoch
Okay. For 18 years, you're, it's, you're, you know, about the highest you're gonna be is like 92%. Right? Is that basically 92, 93?
- [01:35]
Raja Bell
Yeah, something like that.
- [01:37]
Logan Murdoch
Okay. Okay. Well, you know, I don't know. I have a segue for this. We're gonna go right into. Right before this program started, the Milwaukee Bucks agreed to a four year, $107 million deal with the. With Miles Turner. And that's cool, right? Yeah. But then the next tweet comes out that they are stretching and waving Damian Lillard, who tore his Achilles tendon during the postseason. And I think we're going to get to all the other deals that we like and that we don't like and see in a minute. But, like, this one is, like, there we're going to talk about in real time. And I have a lot of different emotions about this one. This is the reality of the new apron NBA. Right. Quick pivots. The Milwaukee Bucks have been trying to Build a team around Giannis on the fly and which was further complicated with Damian Lillard, which is one of the reasons why I think the NBA world thought that Giannis was going to leave at a point in time that there's some preliminary reporting right now without much context that Giannis is unhappy to with this move that came from Chris Haynes. But we don't know why or like what that's going to lead to necessarily. But this seems like an upgrade in some respects, right? Because you have a guy like Miles Turner who you essentially swap for because Brooke Lopez is gone. You got Bobby Port as a good, some front court depth. But on the other hand, I think your lead guard next year as of right now, because you know, Fred to see is a very fluid situation at the moment. But your lead guard right now is Kevin Porter Jr. With all the moving parts right now. What is your immediate reaction to the deal?
- [03:27]
Raja Bell
I was really excited for the Miles Turner pickup. I thought, you know, I thought that was a really, really good get. You know, obviously you're losing Brook Lopez. I thought, I thought Miles Turner now, now this is like, I'm not digging into like how much money he got or anything like that. I'm just talking about the pairing and what that makes you, especially when you're in an Eastern Conference, when you're looking around and we've said it before and you're looking at the landscape of it and you got the, you know, Jason Tatum not available next year. You know, the, the, the Halliburton and the Pacers. Even if, even if Miles Turner were still there, not going to be what they're supposed to be. So you have to be looking around when you have one of the best, if not the best player in the east thinking how can, how can we get to striking distance? Because it's, it's within reach, right? So, so I think Miles Turner, you know, the addition of, of another big that can stretch the floor and play alongside Giannis is a good move. Dame. I don't know how, you know, like he wasn't going to be available to them this year. Like I, no, I, I, I don't really know how to feel about that one. I guess if I'm being honest, this isn't going to be great podcast and I'm a Dame fan. It would be much nicer if they had Dame, but he wasn't going to be available to you next year anyway. And I don't know how many vehicles they had to get into that Miles Turner deal. Like in terms of pieces that they could move. Does Indiana do a sign and trade with you? Like I don't know how that works. So something was going to have to give and now it becomes like if they. I don't know what their books look like and what they have left. But you, you do need a veteran, tie it all together kind of pg. You're going to need to try to add that, you know, in the, in the, in the rest of free agency.
- [05:04]
Logan Murdoch
Well, they just signed Gary Harris. This is also fluid as well. They just signed Gary Harris to a two year deal. He's a good player but like he's not, he's not gonna replace Dame which I guess with the roster construction you can't really replace Dame. So what's up? Another thing that's. It's a weird end to the Dame Lillard era in Milwaukee, right? Because you know, you, you. He gets traded after all these years, will he, won't he out of Portland Molly is trying to do Milwaukee has that monster contract and it kind of ends with no titles. What you had the first round exit a year ago. I think the first round exit again this year. Like now he goes into this situation where like it's a weird ending to a career befitting of a future hall of Famer, right. And now like we don't know what's going to happen. He has his really tough road back to recovery. Does he come back on a mid level somewhere? Like I just don't know what the future of Dame Lillard holds in the NBA. And it's a weird end to a chapter of his career as he's trying to get a championship. The league is tough now and it's even more tough with this apron, right. Because you got to pivot and you got to make some really rash decisions at a given moment to help your team on a year by year basis. And that's what the NBA wanted with this hard cap. But it's really hitting teams like the Milwaukee Bus, who Bucks don't really have much assets, luckily didn't give up any picks for to make this move. But then you have to stretch a guy like Damian Lillard and you're going to have $20 million on your books for the, I think the next five years to, to pay off that 113 million a day in Willard. It's, it's, it's a lot of moving parts. But this is the new modern NBA raja.
- [06:50]
Raja Bell
Yeah, they're, I mean and it is unfortunate that this chapter, if you will, kind of has, has ended like this for Dame. But if I could just play the other side of it and look for a silver lining in it. If you're able to rehab this, because, you know, Achilles rehab's come a long way, but there you are at an advanced stage in your career. So if you're able to kind of navigate this and come back in a way that allows you to continue to be a viable piece in a winning. In a winning situation, if you're a Dame fan and legacy, legacy wise, for Damon, it could work out all right. Because you asked, like, what does he come back and play on at that point? He can play on whatever he wants to play on. He can look for fit. He can look for who needs a piece that is like right at the precipice of getting over the hump and he controls it. It's not. It's not who will trade for him or who wants, you know, it'll. It'll be, hey, if you have the space for me, I can. I can decide what I'm willing to play for and I'll come in there and hunt for this championship. So in a weird way, you know, just silver lining to it might be if he comes back and he's healthy and he rehabs, he might be able to plug in and catch on with somebody where he can get that chip.
- [07:54]
Logan Murdoch
Ultimately, yeah, it's going to be a lot of soul searching for him. And it's weird because you obviously have to have that when you have a big sense of rehab on an Achilles like that, but he's going to have to figure out his mind to a specific role change that's going to be vastly different than the one that he had when he. When he tore his Achilles. So on one hand he's going to have to rehab, but also he's going to have to figure out, how do I become. I don't know. Is Dame coming off the bench when he comes back? Like, I just don't know what the NBA is looking like in the adjustment period. I mean, there was an adjustment, even him playing alongside Giannis in the role that that had. Right. It was also fit very far. So. Also figuring out a new landscape when you're not the guy. So it's going to be not only a tough rehab process, but tough changing of the mind and how you play, how you see the game. So interesting. That's fluid. We'll see what Giannis thinks. I'm sure by the end of this pod, Cliff will show us something that Giannis said or maybe some innuendo. But let's get on to some other moves. One of the things that I've liked Raj and there, there was a survey that, the entrance survey that the ringer put out today or yesterday that I was a part of with, with with Michael Pena, Howard Beck and a host of our, our ringer NBA colleagues. And one of the questions was who would challenge the Oklahoma City Thunder next season. And there was a lot of Rockets talk which we'll get to in a second. One of the teams that I picked, and I forget a couple other people picked was Denver Nuggets, right. And just for the simple fact that they have Jokic and that they were the only team that took this, this Thunder team to seven games and this, this NBA is all about matchups as opposed to talent now. But they swapped Michael Porter Jr. And an unprotected first round pick to the Brooklyn next for Cam Johnson and they resigned free agent Bruce Brown to a one year deal. I kind of like what the Nuggets are doing right now, right. They didn't give him Christian Brown and they ha. They have Bruce Brown in the mix, they get a little bit more adept and Michael Porter Jr. Was great but he was always up and down. CAM Johnson makes $18 million less. So they, they get their books in order, the Nuggets do and they're still competing for a title. And I think they have team so far around jokers going into next season.
- [10:08]
Raja Bell
Yeah, they maneuvered well. I would agree with that. I. In terms of getting better, I mean Bruce Brown is going to help you with your depth, right? Like that's going to happen. But you know it's not always about that. To your point, it's, it's. We don't lose much and we, we can trim a lot in the process. So from that regard I'm fine. I would agree with you that they're going to be one of the teams. I don't know that they'd be my favorite to challenge OKC necessarily. But you are right. Anytime you have Jokic and the way that OKC struggled with, with guarding him in that series, they have to be considered, right? There's, there's still work to be done there. I think like I don't think that's, you know what they're going to look like as finished like from a coaching perspective, from a team perspective. But like so the jury would be out. But I'm not mad at what they're doing at all.
- [10:58]
Logan Murdoch
That 32 first round pick is pro is, is a tough pill to swallow though I will say that I Mean, I know the Nets are just stockpiling picks, but by that time, Jokic isn't going to be on the team unless he like has like a LeBron type surge in the next seven years. But they're, they, they're going to want to need that pick. So it's, it's tough, but they're going all in on, on championships right now and this is the window to do it right. And like, you have one guy, that's a tough thing, but it's all, it's.
- [11:24]
Raja Bell
Always, it's always like, it's always tough. And everybody wants to, everybody wants to protect the pick. Like, if you can protect it and have them and maximize your window, I mean, we're living in pie in the sky, having my cake and eating it to world. It just doesn't always work out like that. And so, you know, when you have jokic, not unlike LeBron or any of these guys that are premier players in this league, you have to be doing what you can within their window of time to try to chase these things. And you know, if it means giving up one down the road, like, maybe there's an avenue to recouping that in some way, shape or form before that, you know what I mean? But like, we've got to take the swings necessary.
- [12:03]
Logan Murdoch
Does this keep the ship afloat? Like, are, are you thinking, like, what do the, what do the Nuggets have to do to stay in contention even more? What, what more do you want to see in this, in this free agency from. What do they need? Because I think they have the depth. I think if they get a couple more pieces just around the margins, I think they're pretty much fine.
- [12:23]
Raja Bell
The new NBA, it's depth and, and, and competitive depth is a real, it's a real thing, right? Especially in that Western Conference wing, defensive pieces, three and D, if you will, guys that can knock down a jump shot but really get up and guard and then competitive depth. Not, not just, hey, we can throw this guy out there, but like real pieces coming off your bench that can play. So if you can find and pick those up and you know, I don't know how many. I don't, I don't know what their situation is financially right now. So I don't know how much money they have to spend, so on and so forth, but that was, that would be all that I think that they're missing for an opportunity with a piece like Jokic and what they already have in place to be, to be viable. And then it's just about you know, coach putting him in the position. Like, if. If it. If that's. If that's going to work, if we're going to be kind of this. We still have our mojo offensively the way they've had in the past between, you know, some of their pieces. If that still exists, I think you're fine.
- [13:14]
Logan Murdoch
What do you get when you swap a Cam Johnson for Michael Porter Jr.
- [13:19]
Raja Bell
You know, I like Michael Porter, but. But he was. He was basically just a spot shooter in that. Like, he's just catch and shoot, right, Run. I mean, he's got wing defensive ability, and he's long, and I guess I might undersell that a little bit. The bottom line is when you're. When you're. When you're on a roster, it doesn't matter what you do offensively or. Or don't do offensively or what your ceiling is offensively. When you play with Jokic, Jamal, Murray, Gordon. When you're in that mix, like, you're there to do a job, right? And that job.
- [13:50]
Logan Murdoch
I like it for the consistency, bro. Like, I do like it for the sense that Michael Porter Jr. Could be great. He could be like, oh, yo, is this the next. Is this Costco kd Or sometimes it's like he disappears, right? And I think you need a steadier force around this. This joker's team. When you do have the lack of depth, you do need guys that you can count on. And I think Cam Johnson is a steadier guy that you could count on. Maybe he's not averaging 25 a game and he doesn't have those highs, but he's not getting. You're not disappearing.
- [14:23]
Raja Bell
Oh, I. I'll take your word on it. I mean, listen, some of this again, I mean, we come on here and we talk basketball, but if I'm gonna. If I'm gonna sit here and tell you I watched all of Cam Johnson's games this year and. No, his entire body of work for Brooklyn, I'd be lying to you. I'm not in a habit of doing that. You know what I'm saying? So, like, if I have to take your word for that.
- [14:49]
Logan Murdoch
All right, man, let's talk about another team that I have enjoyed what they've done this off season, the Atlanta Hawks, who have traded for Christophs Porzingis and also gotten to kill Alexander Walker. I think that they have a chance to be the number two seed in the Eastern Conference, which is a weird turn of events considering what we've said about the fit under Trey Young and just Being Trey Young and have they hit a ceiling with Trey Young and the Atlanta Hawks are like, nah, we're going to stick with him and we're going to put pieces around him finally. So like I like it for them even if it's for a one year deal and see what we got. But this seems like a good off season for the Atlanta Hawks right now with the cap space that they have used and who the players that they have used it on. So I think I got to give them an A. They did a good job.
- [15:37]
Raja Bell
Yeah, I like what the Hawks did. I mean it started with, with Kristaps for sure. I like Nikhil Alexander Walker. Like I, you know, again you're talking about guy who can make a shot and looked like he had more than make a shot capability in the playoffs, but also will sit down and lock up. You already have some formidable pieces defensively there with Dyson Daniels. Like that gives you some elite backcourt, slash wing defensive prowess. You know what they also, they got Luke Canard. I saw him pick up who, who, who shoots the ball. You could space the floor 39 or 40% career three point shooter again. And, and this is what I said when the Kristaps thing happened for them. So I would, I would agree with you. When I said when Kristaps happened, I'm like, look, you're looking at yourself in the Eastern Conference now with the new landscape of it, with everything that's in flux and if you're within striking distance, you've got to see how close you can get. Like you know, when you have and Trey would fall into that category for me. And I know I've been at times, you know, curious, slash skeptical of like what the smaller guard with that style of play can represent, you know, on a championship winning team. I'm not saying it can't, but you got to get the recipe right around it. But he would fall into the level of player that if I had him on my team with all of the things that he can do and I had a little nucleus around him. I'm sitting in that Eastern Conference, I'm like, yo, let's take a, let's take a couple swings at that. Not to mention the pick that they fleeced out of like, like, like the pick next year, right? Like that they got in around the draft, what that could potentially be. I, I like what they've done this all season.
- [17:08]
Logan Murdoch
New Orleans is another case altogether. You don't got to rehash that. But damn, damn, I wanted to make it positive. But the what the hell are the New Orleans Pelicans doing right now? I. They have no plan whatsoever. They're just giving bags out. They're just. They're willing to. They're willing and dealing in the way that they don't know what the hell they're doing. They're just. Oh, here, here, I'll take this piece. I think this works. Maybe. I think there's a. There are. Roger, There are concepts of a plan that are happening.
- [17:40]
Raja Bell
They're like the. They're like the homie, you know him, so it's not a stranger. He pulls up to your crib and he's like, yo, dog, hop in. We're going to X, Y, and Z. And you look in the back and ain't no bags packed. There's nothing. You're like, nah, dawn, good. I'm not going with you, bro. I'm good.
- [17:54]
Logan Murdoch
There's no plan here.
- [17:55]
Raja Bell
There's no plan. There's no plan. No.
- [17:58]
Logan Murdoch
No. Why are we. Right now? You said we were going to Atlanta. Why are we going. What the hell? No.
- [18:04]
Raja Bell
Not getting in, dog. I'm going back to the college.
- [18:07]
Logan Murdoch
Doe. Doe. Let me out. Oh, my God. Geez. That also got. Got me thinking about the Kings, too, who are just. They have interest in Russell Westbrook right now.
- [18:21]
Raja Bell
They seem to be headed in the right direction, is what I will say to that.
- [18:25]
Logan Murdoch
No, they won't, because they're all. They're. They're talking also about trading Zach Levine or.
- [18:34]
Raja Bell
What do you like to say? The Kang's gonna Kang. Is that what you. Is that your thing?
- [18:37]
Logan Murdoch
The Kangs are gonna Kang?
- [18:39]
Raja Bell
Yeah.
- [18:40]
Logan Murdoch
They're talking about also moving Malik Monk. Remember, like the Beam era, It was so much fun, right? When. Even after they traded Tyrese Halliburton, then they had. You know, they had the Beam team, they had Sabonis, they had guys, they had excitement, they had Malik Monk making everybody excited in the building. They had the clutch player of the Year, de' Aaron Fox. They had Sabonis. They had. They just. They just. Now they're.
- [19:05]
Raja Bell
They traded State.
- [19:06]
Logan Murdoch
Steph. Steph did do. It wasn't Steph that ruined him. It was Vivek Ronald dve that ruined him. And now all of a sudden, they don't have the coach of the Year anymore. The Christie is the coach. There's one of the other things, though, that I want to talk to you about. Let's talk LeBron, man, and talk about the Lakers as a whole. Staff, record label, the crew, because the Houston Rockets got Dorian Finney Smith on A nice deal and, you know, which really helps out the Rockets. And I think they're going to be a really formidable team. They're Probably a top 33 team right now in the Western Conference, if I had to guess. But on the other side of that is the Los Angeles Lakers, who even with new ownership, still have to have the same old drama filled discussions on the. On the eve of free agency, LeBron James, he picks up his option, which seems great in theory. And then Rich Paul tells everyone in sight that LeBron isn't happy with the direction of the franchise. And I'm just not, not necessarily not happy, but he's not happy with the prospect. If you read between the tea leaves, that shit isn't running through him and they're not building around him anymore. Right? So Rich Paul tells the Athletic and ESPN, LeBron knows the Lakers are building for the future, and he also wants to compete for championships. We understand the difficulty in winning now while preparing for the future. We do want to evaluate what's best for LeBron at this stage of his life and career. He wants to make every season he has left count. The Lakers understand that. They're supportive of that and what's best for him. We're very appreciative of the partnership that we've had for eight years with Jeannie and Rob and consider the Lakers a critical part of his career. Now, this is one of those statements where they say everything and you got to read what they're actually saying, which is, we want to win a title right now. We want to do it. Obviously that is the Lakers goal. Obviously that's what they want to do. Right. But it's not going through LeBron anymore. And I feel like he's his. Him and his team are kind of flailing right now to find some sort of leverage elsewhere because they want to say, yeah, we'll leave to go chase a championship. And the Lakers are like, cool bet. You know, we want to win a championship. Yeah, so do we. Well, you know, we want to, you know, figure things out. Yeah, so do we. But we're going to do it around this other dude right now. When you look at what the Lakers situation is right now, where it feels like this manufactured Controversy happens when LeBron, but it doesn't hit the same. What would you see that? Is it hilarious to you? Is it informative? How do you feel when you see, you know, these, these LeBron leaks that don't hit the same.
- [21:46]
Raja Bell
I think the word I'd use to describe it would be inevitable. I think you were. It was always coming to this when, When a player like LeBron who, who has been the driving force, you know, on any team he's ever been on and been the reason why, you know, teams are held to the fire in some regards in terms of keeping a championship viable level team built around him because of the way he moves in free agency and contractually, like, he's just used to that. And when you go out and get Luca, you've clearly, you know, started the plan of the baton pass. Like, not in the AD way where you're wondering whether AD will ever take it and be that level player, but in the. In. In the way, like, no, dude, he's here now. We got him. There's no question. And so we're going to like, manage the two of you together and try to operate this window. But in the not so distant future, this is going to be built around Luka. And so this was always coming, right? Because that's a very, very difficult thing to do unless that roster is already in place. Like, it's. It's a very difficult thing to do and the roster isn't. It's not in place right now. How many vehicles they have to go out and, and, and complement these two in the way they need to be? Uh, I don't know. But I know that the Lakers priorities are going to have to be, you know, Luca, whenever that's up, and then protecting the flexibility that they have to make sure that that window is securely open around him.
- [23:14]
Logan Murdoch
It's always. It's also funny to see this, this leak or these comments that are vague in, in words, but also very direct in spirit from the LeBron James cat, because Luke has an extension, I think it was. I believe it's coming up August 2nd that he needs to decide on. And the Lakers are doing everything in their power to be like, yo, man, we will give you everything that you want and we will give you. And we will do whatever you need for whatever you need from us. It's all good, Luca. Don't even trip. It's good. And.
- [23:42]
Raja Bell
Oh, so he's. So he's up this summer. I mean, he can, he can, he can opt.
- [23:45]
Logan Murdoch
He can sign it. He can sign a new extension. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And, and it could be a short term one just so he can get the recoup all the money that Nico Harrison took from him when he, when he traded him. Nico Harrison always getting strays, but it's a new world order and, and yeah, you're the only one, bro.
- [24:04]
Raja Bell
Just go Listen to the files, bro. I abstain from all of that. I don't get into that, bro. I'll get into that. Nico.
- [24:13]
Logan Murdoch
The Lakers and LeBron both have reputations to uphold in this situation, right? LeBron really doesn't want to leave Los Angeles, and he's not going to leave Los Angeles, but he wants to. He wants to feel good about, you know, you know, just do right by me, I guess, in a certain way. And the Lakers are saying, well, you know, doing right by you is much different. Was much different a year ago than it is right now. And they're saying, yeah, just chill out for a second. We'll. We'll take care of you. Because on their end, they are a franchise that purports itself on taking care of stars, and they're in a bit of a transitional period, but they still have to do that. While in a perfect world, it'll be like, Yo, LeBron, can you take this 20 mil real quick? And so we can round out this roster? But he's not going to. He's not going to take any less than Max. What are we going to say?
- [25:02]
Raja Bell
Yeah, but. Well, in fairness, they were a franchise that pride. Prided themselves on taking care of stars. We don't really know how new ownership, right? Like, you don't know what their.
- [25:12]
Logan Murdoch
Or with the new apron era, if you can actually do that, right? Like. Like you're seeing that with Dame in Milwaukee, right? And so it's going to be a tough balance for them to do. So LeBron is just wants to. He's using old tactics for a new environment, and that tends to happen when you're, you know, older in the league.
- [25:33]
Raja Bell
So it's interesting, right, because I talk about older players and them having to kind of reinvent themselves as players to kind of. To kind of gracefully approach the end of their career in a way where they can still be competitive and part of a winning culture and all of that, because it's rare that, like, the number one guy at 41 is the number one guy on a championship team. That doesn't happen, right? So you got to kind of reinvent yourself as a player so that you can fit around pieces. And I think LeBron actually did an admirable job of kind of letting that happen with Luka this year, right? Like, kind of, hey, dude, this is going to be yours. I'll figure out how to play around that. It also requires. It's going to require him to do that off the floor in terms of. In terms of trying to move the chess pieces on the board within the organization to, to an area that is more desirable for him. Like when you, when you have, you have to seed some of that too. So it's not just like the physical. It's both of those things. You have to be willing to take a step back and kind of reinvent the way you play and reinvent the way you move and expect an organization to move around you.
- [26:35]
Logan Murdoch
Yeah. Which is like a hard thing to do when you're the greatest player of all time and everything is catered to you. Right. Like, it's like asking Micha Jordan to like take a pay cut towards the back, even though he kind of did with the Wizards. But you know what I'm saying? I'm talking about like at the end of his Bulls run where he's playing great basketball. Maybe not good enough basketball to help you win a championship as the number one guy. But you're telling LeBron James to take a role shift, which is. We said this around at the trade. That's just going to be a hard thing to ask him because he still thinks, oh, I'm LeBron James, I can still, I can still do this. I'm fine.
- [27:11]
Raja Bell
Yeah, it's, it's one of those things. It's, it's almost like be careful what you wish for. Right. If you're LeBron, in an effort to chase that championship and get the type of player that you think you needed a la Luca to help you do that, you've lost the marquee. And so you've lost, you've lost the ability to do the things. And so now you are in that situation that you're describing, Logan, which is if I got a pick, while every other time, 99.9% of the time, it's always been when there's a Choice, we're choosing LeBron, no brainer. Yeah, well, in your effort to get over the hump to the championship, you lost that.
- [27:46]
Logan Murdoch
And also he's doing it in an environment where like Rob Pelinka, who I guess reportedly is now the Lakers are only taking two year contracts. Cause they're still trying to get their book straight and they want to have max salaries for max salary slots for 20, 27. And I don't know necessarily like if that's going to. In the new NBA era, if that approach is going to work. Talking about ancient approaches to a modern time, I just, I don't know how that's going to work in two years. But that's what they're trying to do. They're trying to get their books back together, and they're not being as aggressive in the free agency market. But that's also coming at a time with new ownership, which means by definition, like, everybody's auditioning right now, including Rob Polinka, where there's so many different moving parts in this organization. And LeBron is just like the cherry on top of that. I, I don't know what's going to happen in the next few weeks for that, because I think Lucas, 26 years old, he wants to have a contending title. And like, and I see this even, and we could talk about my backyard in a second. But, like, you're seeing a team that is saying they want to win a championship, and then you see all these other moving parts. You see Miles Turner is going here, right? Brook Lopez is going to the Clippers, um, when you need a front court guy and your fan base is like, well, what the hell are we doing right now? Like, how are we not aggressive in this aggressive free agency market to get our players? So there's so many things moving parts within the Lakers orbit right now that it's always interesting.
- [29:21]
Raja Bell
Yeah, they're, they're. I mean, the brand itself is interesting. And I should, I should say the jury's out on whether or not LeBron can still do it, because who knows, maybe. Maybe at the end of the day, he's still able to pull off the LeBron kind of magic in terms of. Of getting an organization to do what he wants. So, so. Or to do what he thinks they need. But it is going to be fascinating. And with new ownership, to your point, comes a lot of. Comes a lot of uncertainty. Right? Like, philosophically, how are they going to approach a lot of things? So we'll just have to wait and see. I did hear that, that, I mean, somebody said it, so this isn't my, My own thought, but I heard that they were in the DeAndre Ayton race with. With Milwaukee, so they might, you know, that might fill the need for the center. Like they things might. Just because they didn't happen on night one or the first 12 hours doesn't mean they're not percolating and they're not about to happen. Right. But we'll just have to wait and see.
- [30:11]
Logan Murdoch
Deandre Aiden. We don't talk much Portland on this podcast for obvious reasons, but deandra Aiden getting the buyout and entering the free agency market, if I'm a championship team, I don't know if, like, he's going to be. Hopefully he changes his. Change his mindset since the last time he was on a team competing for titles. But like, that's a scary proposition. But the price should be fine. But he just seems like a guy that doesn't necessarily uplift a sport and a roster for it and championship aspiration. But we'll see, we'll see.
- [30:44]
Raja Bell
No, but I'm, I mean, I don't know that I can disagree with that. But I guess the, you know, who, who would in the center market? I mean, that was affordable for the Lakers. I don't know.
- [30:55]
Logan Murdoch
The warriors are probably going to keep coming. A good, good move or bad move?
- [30:59]
Raja Bell
I'm okay. I like, I'm okay with that.
- [31:01]
Logan Murdoch
I think it's more because it's not a mark. It seems like it's another marriage of convenience. Right. I don't think the market is as, is as sweet as Kaminga thought he was going to be. Right.
- [31:12]
Raja Bell
Yeah, that could be the reason for it. But he is a, he is a talented player and he's got unique athleticism and size. This is all desirable stuff. So just because his mind's not right and we kind of went in on him a pot ago for that doesn't mean we can't get him to see the light and have him, you know, mature and turn into what we hope he can be. Right. So like, if the market's not right for the move, I'm okay with that. Like, I, I'd like to think that, you know, I was a young guy that thought I knew a lot and then every day I realized I didn't know as much as I thought I did. So if he's, if he can learn and mature and get better and learn how to play in that system and use it for what it should be for him in terms of experience and tutelage, like, he's very tantalizing as a talent. I don't know that his upside is what he thinks his upside is as a player, but he's tantalizing nonetheless.
- [32:11]
Logan Murdoch
I think that I could see them doing maybe it may, maybe like a two or three year deal, but he's going to sign a very tradable contract is what I think is going to happen. And if it doesn't work out in the beginning of the season, I think they'll look to trade him again. But this should be a humbling for him. So like in a best case scenario it's a humbling for him and he goes out there, says, I'm going to play my role to the best of my ability and maybe makes an All Star in that way, but we'll see. See, but I think he's going to be back. All signs point to him being back. I don't know how much more free agency stuff we got for you guys right now. So we're going to go to Mr. Cliff Augustine, who has. Have you figured out a name for the new Philly WNBA team yet?
- [32:54]
Cliff Augustine
The Philly Bells is one that, that, that's going around right now.
- [32:58]
Logan Murdoch
That's Fire.
- [32:59]
Cliff Augustine
The Baddies on Broad is another. Is another name that I put. Put out there. You know what I'm saying?
- [33:04]
Logan Murdoch
The Broad street.
- [33:05]
Cliff Augustine
Something, something like that.
- [33:08]
Logan Murdoch
It's not gonna, it's not happening. That part's not.
- [33:10]
Raja Bell
Isn't that New Jersey? Isn't that an A. That's like an aaut. Isn't that like the.
- [33:15]
Cliff Augustine
You know what? It might be a AAU team actually, Raj, I think you might be right.
- [33:18]
Raja Bell
Yeah, I think so. Like a, A women's eybl. I think.
- [33:22]
Cliff Augustine
Yeah.
- [33:22]
Raja Bell
Bells exist.
- [33:23]
Cliff Augustine
Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, you. I do think you're right, actually. Thinking about.
- [33:26]
Logan Murdoch
I think yo, Ryan's locked in.
- [33:27]
Cliff Augustine
Girl might have played on that team back in.
- [33:29]
Raja Bell
Yeah, yeah, I think I, I think my, my, my, My niece played on that team. I think I went to watch them play in Dallas. They. They were hooping. Hooping?
- [33:37]
Cliff Augustine
Yeah.
- [33:37]
Logan Murdoch
What's the, what's the legality of taking the. An AAU team's name? I don't know.
- [33:41]
Cliff Augustine
Probably gotta give him a little check, you know what I'm saying?
- [33:45]
Logan Murdoch
Or, or it's a great branding opportunity, right? Like, you know, get the W team and then, you know, merge. Merge them into your AAU teams. The pipeline. I don't know how illegal that is, but you know, hey, let's do it.
- [33:56]
Cliff Augustine
Definitely right about that. Are you ready to get this first one going?
- [33:59]
Logan Murdoch
Let's get it popping.
- [34:00]
Cliff Augustine
This is from Noah. This is actually speaking of Kaminga. Noah went in on Kaminga here. So just brace yourselves here. Why does Lake of like a player who can't shoot never ever passes, doesn't fit in the motion offense. Lowest IQ player I've ever seen. Below average defender, ball watch on rebounds. Self absorbed. Why the hell is Kaminga value so much with this organization? That is from Noah.
- [34:22]
Logan Murdoch
Was that, was that Roger's burner? Well, I mean I've written about this. Lake of wants stars and he sees Kaminga as a star and he's very scared of a prospect of not having stars post Steph Curry. So anybody that he sees that can fill up seats. I don't know if Kaminga is necessarily someone that's going to fill up seats, but he is. He is going to push for guys like that. And also there's another wrinkle to this, which is ever since I believe the 2020 draft, Lake of has had a firme grip on the front office and you know, started with the Wiseman pick. It's turned into him having say on a lot of the personnel moves in a way that he just didn't during the early part of his tenure with Golden State and now that he has Bob Myers isn't in the building to kind of massage that and kind of like convince him, no, hey, this isn't what we should do. You have a different front office dynamic. Right. And that's not to say that Mike Dunleavy hasn't, you know, done good things. But Laob's imprint is on a lot of these types of moves. And you saw it like when, after the season when it was kind of clear Kaminga and the coaching staff was at odds, there was a bit of a Lake of Power move at the Valkyries game where he puts Kaminga front row with him as like a. And they're watching the game together and they're looked at on the Jumbotron and it was a very much of a sense of like, oh, okay, we see who's making the decisions here and we see how much Lake of is going to put his influence on there. And there are all those red flags that Noah put out there, but it's more of a, it's more of a vanity play than anything. Lakob wants a star and he thinks that could star can be one. He's always felt that way and he doesn't want to be wrong with his picks. So he's going to pay all that money to, to try to convince people he isn't wrong.
- [36:31]
Cliff Augustine
Sounds like a bold strategy.
- [36:35]
Raja Bell
Let me, let me just double. I would just double down on what I said a few minutes ago about talent and what the combination of that and measurables and athleticism can do to anyone. I'm not saying it's the Golden State's front office. It might be like a. But like when you, when you see things that don't look all the way like other things, I mean, we can agree when you roll up Logan, you've seen him in person more than me. That's an impressive build, right? Like that's an impression.
- [37:02]
Logan Murdoch
He does things like, he does things like fucking put his chin on the rim, you know, like that's really cool. To see get dunk on people, right?
- [37:11]
Raja Bell
And that's why I said, like, that's why even me, when I'm watching them play and I see the athleticism or lack thereof overall on that roster, and then you put him in and he's able to, like, just get to the rim whenever he wants. Like, that's intoxicating. Sometimes it's hard to get. It's hard to give up on that, quite frankly, sometimes. And it's not just. It's not just a Golden State issue. It's not just an NBA issue. This is life.
- [37:32]
Logan Murdoch
Yeah. One thing that, like, is out of the Golden State era that I just. Just am annoyed about when I see them is, like, in an era where you have to pivot, like, quickly and you see all these. This action happening, there's so much. They're so slow to the punch, right? Like, I mean, not to say they. I thought the Jimmy Butler trade was, you know, they didn't really give up much for him. They just put two extra years on his contract, but there isn't any wheeling and dealing going on. It's a lot of. A lot of patience. And I, like, Miles Turner was out there. Was. Was to be had, right? Like, at a point in time, Pascal Siakam was there to be had, right? And he was a very effective piece in a. For a Finals team. But they're, like, sitting on their thumbs not getting guys, and a lot of that has to do with the fact that they won't part with Kaminga. And it's just like, dude, come on. Like, I get it with talent, and I know we had career highs, and there are times, like, you know, Tuesday in January and even at this point, Tuesday in April, where you're like, damn, this dude is something. But on the Tuesday in April, even though he balled out, they still lost that game, right? That's. That's what is not adding up right now.
- [38:44]
Cliff Augustine
The math isn't math, is what you're saying, Logan. The math isn't math.
- [38:47]
Logan Murdoch
You know what I mean? It's not mathing right now.
- [38:49]
Cliff Augustine
The math.
- [38:49]
Logan Murdoch
Seeing that roll.
- [38:51]
Cliff Augustine
All right, this is from Reza Tahiri. How will the next generation talk about us? Every 15 years, the kids have to tear down the retired superstars. Old people won't stop talking about what will be the hottest take of 2040, for example, LeBron and KD were hired guns who jumped to better teams to stay competitive. From 2015 to 2025, the warriors were the only quality championship team because everyone else beat injured teams. Kobe put A Mamba hex on the Kings. And that's why it's 2040 and they still haven't won a playoff series. I hope Howard Beck enjoys this one. Reezer from Sacramento.
- [39:23]
Logan Murdoch
Ah, shout out to sack, though. What's on? Let's get creative here. Oh, the Lamelo ball takes are going to be nuts in 2040. They're going to be crazy where they're going to just be like, yo, man, if he was just on a champion some, the whole league was stupid because they didn't see him and put him in the right situation. He was there to be had. And we didn't just give him the right opportunity or something like that. Or like, he should have been an mvp. He was an mvp, but y' all third eye wasn't open. I feel like lamello ball is gonna.
- [39:54]
Cliff Augustine
You know what the hottest takes are gonna be? Yo, Paul George really was the goat, but he just always was just hurt. You know how the young boys love Paul Georgia.
- [40:01]
Logan Murdoch
They do. I don't know what that says about Gen Z, but, like, they love those of Paul George.
- [40:06]
Cliff Augustine
They love them. Surprise. They. These kids idolize Paul George. Every tick tock, every video you see. Yo, Paul George Logan. Am I lying?
- [40:15]
Logan Murdoch
You're not lying, bro. You're not. They loved him some Paul George.
- [40:18]
Raja Bell
No, no disrespect to Paul George. I guess I haven't seen that. I am not tapped in like that.
- [40:22]
Logan Murdoch
Also, like, facts are just not going to matter. So because of that, we're going to be in a space where we're going to like, as old heads are going to be. Are you fucking serious, Roger, what was the take that. That pisses you off from the last generation that we have said? I'm sure it took you a long time to get around to the fact that LeBron was like, the greatest player of all time or like, at least no over Jordan.
- [40:47]
Raja Bell
Yeah, I don't. I don't love that. But I mean, I've experienced LeBron and I lived through that. So I could. I can have that conversation with you.
- [40:54]
Logan Murdoch
I know the Plumbers conversation got you pissed off. I know, like, people just like plumbers when they're.
- [41:00]
Raja Bell
When they're saying old Jordan Plumbers, you know, touching, touching, touching Jordan in any way, shape or form. Like some of the times when we get to the Kobe better than Jordan and stuff like that. Like that. That bothers me a little bit. No disrespect to Kobe, but like. But yeah, I don't know. I generally, you know, I don't get into that shit, bro. I won't be bothered with that.
- [41:18]
Cliff Augustine
The one, you know, the one that irks people's soul. The James Harden vs. D. Wade 1 that James.
- [41:22]
Logan Murdoch
Oh, stop, stop.
- [41:25]
Cliff Augustine
That irks people.
- [41:27]
Logan Murdoch
But that's not even a. Okay, did they say that James Harden is better than Dwayne Wade?
- [41:31]
Cliff Augustine
Bro, Jeff Tegan was on the pod, like, screaming and crying that James Harden was better than D. Wade.
- [41:37]
Logan Murdoch
What did. What did James Harden do after May in his career?
- [41:41]
Cliff Augustine
Fam, don't look. I listen. I've seen it firsthand. I will never.
- [41:44]
Logan Murdoch
Dwayne Wade got three of them things.
- [41:46]
Raja Bell
So this is interesting to me though.
- [41:48]
Logan Murdoch
This.
- [41:48]
Raja Bell
This is interesting to me because it's. No. Yeah, but it's because it's not. I'm not going to weigh in on who's better or not. Like, I don't. I don't love doing that, but I think, you know, this is where Howard and I come to a disconnect sometimes when we talk about players, right? And this often happens when you're talking to ex players. They're talking to you about, from a Hooper's eye, skill level, what they can do, who's a better player. And a lot of times fan and meteor are coming at it from like, who won championships and Hoopers. That's why Michael Beasley will stand there and straight up tell you, like, I am better than X, Y and Z, even though his career didn't pan out. Because a lot of times Hoopers are coming of it purely from a hoop standpoint. Like, if I had to guard him or him, who would I pick?
- [42:32]
Logan Murdoch
Like, or I can see that if you're guarding James Harden like on a. As a one on one player, it's. He's one of the greatest to ever do it, right? Like, especially drawing fouls even though Dwyane Wade through his sheriff. Yeah, I guess I could see it, but like.
- [42:49]
Raja Bell
Yeah, and I'm not even weighing in on it. I'm just saying that's the interesting part to me because, like, the, the debate is often a disconnected debate because you're like, you're almost debating two different things, right? Like the, the Ex Hooper is talking about purely skill level and appreciation and.
- [43:06]
Logan Murdoch
Who we had to guard.
- [43:07]
Raja Bell
Craft. Yeah, and there's the craft itself where, like, you know, you can act in a bad movie and be a phenomenal actor. The movie might be bad, but your performance could have been outrageously good.
- [43:18]
Logan Murdoch
Denzel has done that a couple times and made a lot of bad movies solid.
- [43:21]
Raja Bell
And another actor might say, like, you might Just walk away as a general fan and be a shit movie. And another actor might appreciate that performance in a way. Like, dude, you just. That was it. And so I think you get. You run into that sometimes when athlete or like former pro pros are talking about, like, who their favorite is versus, you know, us on this side sometimes or. Or like just, you know, media or fans, so on and so forth.
- [43:44]
Logan Murdoch
Cliff, you know who else I think is going to be history is going to, like, love on maybe a little bit too much? Kyrie.
- [43:52]
Cliff Augustine
Oh, yeah.
- [43:53]
Logan Murdoch
I think. I think that they are going to like. And I love Kyrie's game. I think we're.
- [43:58]
Cliff Augustine
He's.
- [43:58]
Logan Murdoch
We're. He's amazing. And like, watching him play on a nightly basis has been great, but I think that they're going to inflate, like, his value to what it a team like, or what he should have been like. He was injured all them years. He didn't really do great in Brooklyn. But like, the bag, right? His highlight. His highlight tape is nuts.
- [44:19]
Cliff Augustine
Rise. You know we're talking about the bag, right?
- [44:21]
Raja Bell
Bag.
- [44:22]
Logan Murdoch
They're gonna talk about the bag.
- [44:23]
Raja Bell
I'm hip, I'm hypocritical on this one because you know how. You know how the bag irks me. You know how that gets me.
- [44:28]
Logan Murdoch
Like, they're going to call him better than Steph. They're already doing it right now.
- [44:32]
Raja Bell
Yeah. So again, this is the interesting part of this conversation. What are we talking about being better at? Are we talking about being a. A better overall winner in the NBA? Well, not even a comparison. Are we talking about a more skilled, better. Like a. When a basketball player talks about who's a basketball better. Basketball player. They're talking about skill level.
- [44:54]
Logan Murdoch
Yeah.
- [44:54]
Raja Bell
They're talking about drop us on a court who's got better skills. They're rarely talking about, like, it's about.
- [45:00]
Logan Murdoch
Who they have to guard.
- [45:02]
Raja Bell
Yeah. So, like, if you make me say who's better between those two, we can have a real conversation about that. Now, if you ask me who was the better pro and who had the better career, I'm not even question, like, who was. Whose skill set was better for a team to win a championship? I don't think about not a question either. But like, if you said to somebody who's a just a better player, skill wise, I'm not weighing in again, but we can have the conversation.
- [45:27]
Logan Murdoch
You're gonna have a lot of guys that didn't win shit talking about. But you don't listen, listen, you know, hey, yeah, it's gonna be a lot of rewriting of history in 24. That's a great question.
- [45:36]
Cliff Augustine
100. We see it. We see it now, man. These discussions carry basketball now. They don't even talk about the game no more, Rod. They don't talk about the game no more. They talk about Kobe was better in tmac.
- [45:47]
Logan Murdoch
I want to hear that.
- [45:49]
Raja Bell
You ain't never lied though, because I'm in the car with Zen and Zen's probably the one that's in it the most. Now, who likes to ask me, yo, dad, who is better, X or Z? And I'm like, oh, my God, Zen, I love you, bro, but I fucking hate the conversation.
- [46:04]
Cliff Augustine
I hate it. I see some young boys, so.
- [46:06]
Raja Bell
You're right, bro.
- [46:07]
Cliff Augustine
I see some young boys on TikTok talking about, yo, Magic Johnson would just be Ben Simmons today. I'm just like, all right, man. Like, we lost the plot. This is. We've gotten carried away.
- [46:16]
Logan Murdoch
We've lost text at like fudgeing one in the morning. Like, do you see this shit? Are you serious right now? We will see each other.
- [46:25]
Cliff Augustine
And mind you, it's from the shows of respectable former Hoopers too. So we. I mean, we're not going best judgment on nobody, but a lot of times they just get in way and getting.
- [46:32]
Logan Murdoch
Their feelings and the egos are there. It's nuts road. Oh, my God. I appreciate you, Roger, because you are a former player, but you don't be letting your ego get in the way, make you say some bullshit. Because there's a lot of former players that let their ego get in the way and they say some wild.
- [46:50]
Raja Bell
Well, I mean, we. There's a point with us all where the ego takes over, right? Like, I. I'd like to think that I'd push my point further and further back as I've gotten older. Less testosterone maybe. But yeah, I mean, look, I don't. I don't know. We all have buttons. Like, you find the right button to hit with somebody. Like, I've been hot on here before. I'm not. I'm not. I'm not.
- [47:09]
Logan Murdoch
More last episode. The fuck?
- [47:11]
Cliff Augustine
Just say Russell Westbrook and you gonna be right back.
- [47:15]
Logan Murdoch
Oh, speaking of which, Russell Westbrook is going to be in 2040 is going to be.
- [47:24]
Cliff Augustine
Yo, the Russ versus Shay discussion. That's going to be crazy, right?
- [47:27]
Logan Murdoch
Oh, my God. Oh, my God.
- [47:29]
Raja Bell
I think Russ loses. I think Russ loses. Russ loses a little bit every. Every year that Shay's. Every year. Yeah, because it's just so much. And there's just so much Talked about Russ now, like, I. I've covered this at nauseam.
- [47:43]
Logan Murdoch
I.
- [47:43]
Raja Bell
But, like, he gets slandered so much that that next generation is not going to have any appreciation for Russ. In my mind, they'll just think he was a.
- [47:50]
Logan Murdoch
He might get a race. You think?
- [47:51]
Raja Bell
I think. I know. I think that the. The narrative on Russ, and maybe this is why I'm so protective and I get so angry, is eventually that he was a bump, that it was all.
- [47:59]
Cliff Augustine
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's coming. That is for sure. For sure coming. Don't worry. That is coming. All right, you want to get to the last one?
- [48:07]
Logan Murdoch
Let's do it.
- [48:08]
Cliff Augustine
This is from Will Chaney. LeBron trade. I'm a Lakers fan, when meant to say, wouldn't mind trading LeBron for pieces to surround Luca. Be the best of both worlds. The team that gets LeBron gets to sell tickets, jerseys, and have the retirement tour. Lakers get some needed pieces and can compete. I think he goes to the Cavs or the Knicks. What do y' all think?
- [48:28]
Raja Bell
I don't. I don't think there's in a market for LeBron.
- [48:33]
Logan Murdoch
Not at the salary that he wants to command, bro. Like, it's just not gonna happen. Yeah, I mean, I. I put in the. I put in an entrance survey. Like, just put him with fucking yoke Jokic, and like, let's just see them ball out this one year, you know? But that's the problem with LeBron. He don't really got a home like that. I mean, I guess he has one with the Lakers, but he hasn't embraced that home. And I think that that's been. It's been a gift and a curse for him. He need to just take the bag with LA and just take the retirement tour with the Lakers, bro. Like, if you went back to Cleveland, I don't think Cleveland necessarily wants him in that way. Right. Like, it doesn't really make sense. They're trying to compete for titles right now, and I don't think LeBron in a farewell tour, is going to be good for that. And the Knicks are in the same boat, Right. But also, he doesn't have any attachments to the Knicks. Imagine he went to Madison Square Garden and at this stage, and all them people who he d. That fan base that he dubbed twice. Right? You saw how fucking sad Ben was when he was on the pot. We asked him about LeBron James. Imagine he comes back and he's like, yo, man, what. Yo, man, New York, you New York, the Burrows. And they're like, bro, you fucking dubbed us twice, like, and now we're. Now, now we're trying to go compete. And, like, you want to take all the oxygen for your ass. Like, no, you're not even a Nick Kick rocks.
- [49:54]
Cliff Augustine
Just stay in LA, LeBron for OG and Anobi. Who says no?
- [49:58]
Logan Murdoch
The Streets.
- [49:59]
Cliff Augustine
Yo, And a reunion. Possible reunion with Mike Brown, too. Come on, man. It's all written there. It's all written there.
- [50:07]
Logan Murdoch
Do you remember how they ended with him and Mike Brown, right?
- [50:10]
Cliff Augustine
I do.
- [50:11]
Logan Murdoch
Okay.
- [50:12]
Cliff Augustine
Mike Brown got bounced up out of there.
- [50:14]
Logan Murdoch
He got freed. Oh, man. LeBron. LeBron.
- [50:20]
Cliff Augustine
Just.
- [50:20]
Logan Murdoch
Let's let a fan base love you for once. Like, let it happen, dog.
- [50:25]
Cliff Augustine
Cleveland, this is for you. What you mean?
- [50:27]
Logan Murdoch
Right? Yeah, that was. That wasn't manufactured at all. What happened before that? What happened before that? Did they level all right?
- [50:35]
Cliff Augustine
The. All right. They burned his jersey, but he went out. Sorry for them, though.
- [50:38]
Logan Murdoch
All right?
- [50:39]
Cliff Augustine
I mean, bro.
- [50:39]
Logan Murdoch
And then he left him again.
- [50:41]
Cliff Augustine
You play. Imagine you playing in your hometown and you go on national TV and say, yo, I'm out. I'm cool off, y' all. I don't want to ever be around y' all.
- [50:47]
Logan Murdoch
I. I get it. I get it. Well, I'm talking about with the results of that. It's a complicated relationship. He has a series of complicated relationships.
- [50:59]
Cliff Augustine
He brought a chip back to Cleveland. He good. He good. In a book. That's it. That's it.
- [51:04]
Logan Murdoch
Yeah, but they still don't. They're like, Yo, LeBron, can you take a pay cut, bro? If he wants to go back, he's not gonna make as much money nowhere else but Los Angeles. Like, he just needs to just, you know, she'll go build that big ass house. Yeah.
- [51:17]
Raja Bell
This falls into the category of just look, it rarely ends the way you want it to end. You know what I mean? Like, you don't get to. You don't. Very few people get to script the way it ends, and most people are. Are slightly disappointed with the way it ends, if you see.
- [51:32]
Logan Murdoch
But I don't know if he even knows how he wants it to end. He's just playing now at this point. Like, I don't know. Like.
- [51:37]
Raja Bell
No, I mean, he wants.
- [51:39]
Logan Murdoch
At the stage where he has everything.
- [51:40]
Raja Bell
But he wants it to end with a championship. Like, he wants it to end with the Lakers just moving heaven and earth to get him everything he thinks that he needs, whether it winds up in a championship or not. That's the way he wants that to end. And it's just not going to probably end like, that.
- [51:56]
Logan Murdoch
But it ain't your team no more, bro. You should have. You should have. You should have retired maybe after the 2020 season, but he can't do that because he, you know, it wasn't outside and he didn't get to, you know, he didn't get to have his celebration. Right? But I mean, that's just. It's tough for LeBron, man. I mean, he just doesn't want to be loved, and he's for the streets, and this is kind of what it is.
- [52:20]
Raja Bell
He is LeBron. Nah, dawn, now, I ain't gonna do that. I'm not doing that.
- [52:28]
Logan Murdoch
Like, it's his fault.
- [52:29]
Raja Bell
If you want to. You want to co sign that, you could co sign it, but, like, I'm not co signing that.
- [52:33]
Logan Murdoch
It's true.
- [52:33]
Raja Bell
Nah, but listen, I am not.
- [52:36]
Logan Murdoch
And it's not nobody's fault but his. If he wanted the love that he so desperately desires and he wanted all these things and he wanted a franchise to, like, move heaven and earth for him, he should.
- [52:48]
Raja Bell
He.
- [52:49]
Logan Murdoch
He should have stayed where or at least a couple of teams, he should have stayed longer than he did and just went through shit. But he was like, nah. And that, to his credit, that's fine. Miami, you guys are getting old. I need to bounce to go to this young team and, you know, get this. This narrative story. Right, right. This storybook ending. Right? Okay. Bet it's. It's gone everywhere. It's supposed to go in Cleveland for the second time, I'm going to go to the Lakers. Right? And then he didn't fully embrace it, but Money Jones said something really good on his podcast the other day where it was like, when he went to the Lakers, he should have just went full Mr. Laker. I am taking the baton after Kobe, and I am going to be the standard bearer of what a Lakers should be. And then I would recruit for them. I will have a home here. But no, he didn't do that. He was in the business of LeBron. And every year it was, I'm going to use the leverage points that have worked in every other state or every other team that I've been on, and it's going to work out. But, like, now we see the end of that right now. Now the Lakers are like, huh, we're still the Lakers and we're getting Luca.
- [53:55]
Raja Bell
Multiple things, right? Number one, I don't. I don't think that makes you for the streets because he navigated his career. Franchises do that all the time. It's their modus operandi, right? Like they use you until, until they don't think they can use you to win anymore and then they keep it moving. So like a player having the, having the structure of a CBA and the ability to maneuver in, in, in that CBA in that way to, to allow himself to stay viable for championships, I, I've got no beef with that. Also, if you operating within an organization the way you have for your entire career has resulted in chasing championships in every destination you've been, why would you think that it wouldn't be the same way in la? So I don't begrudge anybody doing that. Like, that's, that there's a track record there. We got proof of concept with that. All I'm saying is like, at the end of it, like, it's just not going to end. Like you've, it's now not going to end. And I don't think he's looking for, like, wanting to be loved by like, anybody. All what he wants is what he always gets. Take this roster and move whatever you need to move to put the best potential team around me to try to win this championship and whatever this little window is. And they're just not going to be able to do that at this point. And if that's the love you're talking about, then that is what he's looking for. But I don't think he's looking for any kind of like, I don't, I don't think he needs a farewell tour. I don't, I don't think he needs to be loved by nine fan bases necessarily. Like, I think, you know, he, just, what he wants at the end, for this to be a successful end to the, to the career for him is for them to move the pieces and expend all of the capital in a, in a, in a one year, one and a half, two year window and they're just not going to do that.
- [55:30]
Logan Murdoch
Yeah, you can't have it both ways. And I will push back on the thing that I do think that he does want the physical farewell tour. I do think he wants that. I absolutely do. Right. And I think like, especially if he could do it in a Laker uniform and get celebrated, even though it's probably not going to hit the same as other farewell tours. But I, I, I think he's going to be, I'll give you, you know what I mean? Like, but I do think that. Anyway, I don't know how the hell we got an hour of a podcast. Congratulations to everyone involved. Good job, Cliff. Good job, Victoria. Good job, Roger. We will see you guys next week. That has been another edition of Real Ones. We will see you all next week. Let me look at the notifications and see if there was a big trade that has happened. I don't believe so. So we are going to see y' all next week. Ah, all the Shits by.
- [56:24]
Raja Bell
Sam.