← The Ringer NBA Show
The Ringer NBA Show
Houston Hasn’t Been a Problem for the Warriors. Plus, Do the Heat Need a Shift in Culture?
01:06:44
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- [00:00]
Logan Murdoch
You're listening to the Ringer NBA show presented by FanDuel. America's number one sportsbook is the best place to bet on the NBA because not only does FanDuel have all your favorite player props, but now you can even check out stats and recent performance trends right in the app before you make your picks. Just download the FanDuel sportsbook app today to get in on the action. The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and help lines available and listen to the end of the episode for additional details. Must be 21 plus and present in select states. Gambling problem. Call 1-800- GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com this episode is brought to you by Hyundai at the Hyundai Getaway Sales Event. Get deals so right it almost feels wrong. Now's the best time to get that Hyundai car or SUV you've always wanted. Like the bold and super stylish Elantra or the Tucson with next level tech and safety features. Plus, every new Hyundai comes with a America's best warranty and three years or 36,000 miles of limited complimentary maintenance. Don't think you can get away with all that? Think again. But don't wait. The Hyundai Getaway sales event is going on now. Visit your local Hyundai dealer today. It's a great day for a new Hyundai.
- [01:23]
Raja Bell
What's poppin? Real ones. Logan Murdoch here. Rogerville there. There's been a grand total of 35 minutes of troubleshooting to get this, this show on the road. And I don't even know if it's. We're going to be able to do it. Like, we'll see. We'll see how we can get through an hour of this. How you doing, Raja? Raja Bale's here. Yeah, he doesn't have his. He doesn't have his Bluetooth headphones. Like he's stuck in the stone age today. We were both late. What the hell?
- [01:49]
Ben Cruz
I don't know, man. It's just. Yeah, it's all good. I mean, I'm good sometimes, you know, you get off to a rocky start. Some of the best games come from those rocky starts. I, you know, I said this to you pre pod. I will just reiterate. The more people you have in your house, the more people you have in your house at a, at a younger age, the more things get fought over. And in this instance, in our house, we're in a. We're in a time frame of fighting over cubes, charging cubes. And it's become.
- [02:18]
Raja Bell
How many cubes did you have already? How many. How many cubes did you accumulate over the years in your house right now?
- [02:24]
Ben Cruz
Well, you know, they changed. So now they don't have. Now it's like, over the course of time, who knows? Hundreds. But, like, now it's the. They don't have the old USB one, right? Like, so it's like, what do they call it? The C or whatever. So, right. So now it's become like a cloak and dagger game of, like, you hear somebody. Like you think you hear somebody in the kitchen, and you turn around, you're like, yo, who's in there? Nobody's in there, right? Nothing's missing. To the naked eye, Fucking charges are all gone, right? So, like, I came in today, my charger was out of my computer in my office. Don't come in my office. Don't come in here. Yeah, do that all out in the kitchen. All you want. Go in each other's bedrooms. I don't give a. Don't come in my office and take my.
- [03:03]
Raja Bell
You know what that means, right? They're going to go in your office and take the. That's just. That's just. That's literally what's going to happen. Speaking of not taking any, the Golden State warriors, we got Ben Cruz on the call, so I gotta, you know, I gotta gas up the warriors right now. Warriors take a 31 lead over the Houston Rockets going back to Houston for Game 5. I don't know if you watched this game, the full extent of this game last night. I'm sure you watched this morning. It was so long. Raja, we need to, like, legislate some sort of time limit for reviews. There were so many reviews in the second quarter, it fucked up the flow. I feel like the second quarter of that game was like seven hours long and there was technical fouls of galore. It's got become a physical series. We're going to talk about the physicality to playoffs in a minute, but let's just talk this. Man, is this series over in your eyes or are we. Are we headed back to the Bay Area? Like, where do. Where do you see this series going? Because I feel like on one hand, the warriors have kind of figured the Rockets out, but they're old and so, you know, they could. I was talking to. Talking to Draymond after the game, and I asked him, I was like, yo, are. How important is it to, you know, get this Game five out of the way to, you know, to get you guys some rest? And he was like, it's not the end of the world if we lose. He said, you want to win a closeout game, it's not the end of the world. And I'm like, kind of want to get this done, but how do we feel? Where do you feel going back to Houston with this series?
- [04:37]
Ben Cruz
Yeah, I mean, I feel like it goes back to the Bay, personally. I do think, for all intents and purposes, the series is over, but I think it ends back in the bay in Game 6. I think Houston will. Will have a good shot, and I'm not guaranteeing it, but I think they'll have a good shot at getting, you know, game five on their home court. You know, they were. They were right there. They're just. They're, you know, they're the team that we thought they were in terms of, you know, their game. They scrap. They don't appear to be afraid, but they're very inconsistent offensively. They're missing an alpha or number one. I mean, Shangun's an alpha, but, like, you're missing a consistent number one that can. That can help you close games in a way. And they are getting beat by experience in a lot of instances. So, like, they're who we thought they were. The series, yes, over, but not in the next game, more than likely.
- [05:34]
Raja Bell
Every time I watch the Rockets, I love them for three and a half, maybe to three and three quarters of the game, but like you said, they just don't have a dude. They don't. I mean, even when Shanghun had the ball, which he got a great look, but, like, it was. It was like, it's probably not going in, you know, like, you just don't trust anyone. Down the stretch, you. There's a lot of role guys that are playing outsized roles in this series. But one of the things that I do want to ask you about, and this is not just for this series in particular, but just as a whole, what do you think of the physicality of this series and beyond in the playoffs? Because there's been a lot of complaints about physicality in this series. And also beyond talk about the Celtics and the Magic, where Jalen's talking about how if they don't get this corralled, we're going to have a real fight. And I'm just like, this seems like a throwback to the 2000s, and I kind of like it. Right. There was a place last night, Raj, that I think you'll appreciate. There was. There was a scuffle between. I think it was Dylan, Brooks, Eason and Draymond Green. And there was three texts. Oh, no. It was. It was. It was Dylan Brooks, Steph, and Draymond Green. And there was three technicals. It wasn't like. It was like, all right, go about your business. And then the two, like. I think it was a few possessions later, Draymond gets ripped, gets into it with Eason flagrant and technical. We're not kicking anybody out. You guys are going to have to live in this. In this. Live in this mud a little bit. But what have you thought about the physicality overall in these playoffs? Is it a pro pro, or is it. Are people going over the line right now?
- [07:11]
Ben Cruz
No. I mean, here's. Here's what happens. I. I like it.
- [07:15]
Raja Bell
I've.
- [07:15]
Ben Cruz
I've already told you, I like physical basketball. I think, you know, historically speaking, we all expect a more physical brand of basketball in the playoffs than we get in the regular season. But I'm here for physicality, you know, period. So where the problem comes in is you've stripped so much out of. So much of it out of the game in the regular season that guys aren't accustomed to that. Like, they're not used to playing in that. And throw. It throws them off of their spot to some of the guys that are the beneficiary of not being able to touch them most of the times. So, you know, that's all it is. It's what you become accustomed to versus what you're getting. And so now you're getting a much more physical brand of ball. They're allowing people to do and take a few more liberties than they did in the regular season or traditionally doing the regular season. And. And some people have been out of shape about it. But, you know, I think. Personally, I like it. I think that Houston, you know, interestingly, has gone overboard with it. You have. Your game plan clearly. Clearly was to come in, be physical, try to chop the legs out from an older, you know, Golden State team. Except now you're into the head games with the physicality. Now you're into Draymond space. He wins in that space Once. Once you cross the line. And it's like anything, right? There's a. There's a fine line you're walking. There's a. There's a real balance between, like, being really physical, being the aggressor, you know, taking a shot at Steph whenever you get a chance within the confines of the rules, and now. And now crossing that line. And I'm into some shit with Draymond.
- [08:50]
Raja Bell
Every five seconds, and it's in your head now. Because I used to Brooks a lot.
- [08:55]
Ben Cruz
Yeah, you've lost. You've lost composure now. But that's why I said Draymond wins in that. In that game. Like you. You've let him take your superpower and flip it on you.
- [09:05]
Raja Bell
And so, with all due respect, like, Draymond lives in the mud, and I say that so respectfully. You're not gonna, like, you're not gonna get in there with him. That's where. That's his domain.
- [09:14]
Ben Cruz
Experienced. And he's. Even if you're good at it, too, he's more experienced. He's won championships doing it. And so you want to stay out of that. You want to keep it clean. Teams. Teams that clean in terms of. We're going to be clean, but physical, and we are not going to get caught up in every single exchange with you guys. We're going to go about our business. If we hit you and you don't like it, you can bark and you can act a fool, but I'm not participating in that with you. I talk about bandwidth a lot and, you know, mental capacity. And it holds true when you are a younger team without experience. There is only so much bandwidth you have, cumulatively in these games. There's only so much concentration level you guys have as a collective in these games. And if you're spending as much of it as you are on fucking around with Draymond, you don't have enough to beat them.
- [10:07]
Raja Bell
I'm just like this. Even from personal experience, arguing with Draymond just even about anything is an exhausting task. Right? Because he's one of those guys that when he digs into a position, he is right in his mind, no matter what, and he's not going to let up. And it's. It's. It's very annoying and taxing. So I can only. And that's just. That's just innocent locker room conversation. So I can only imagine how it is on court, right, where he's totally in his element. And you, like, to your point, you have seen that a lot with this Rockets team. And I remember being in Houston right before the series, and it was very clearly like, with the Rockets, they had this air of confidence, but it was youthful confidence. And I feel old saying this, but it was youthful confidence where you look at them and you, like, you guys don't know what the hell you're getting in yourself into. Like, I appreciate it. I love it. I love the blind. Ignorance is bliss. Ignorance is bliss. Confidence. But you have no idea what you're about to face. And I feel like that the Rockets are learning that lesson over and over again as the series goes on. And it's a good lesson to learn, right? Like, I think they're doing a great job considering the circumstance. They could have won last night. It could. It could have been two. Two very easily.
- [11:25]
Ben Cruz
Very easily. And this is exactly where they should be. Like, you're learning these lessons on the fly. This is your first time as a group in this situation. Like, who better to teach you how to navigate these ropes than a Golden State team that's been through it over and over again? And so I'm not throwing any shade. This is purely, like, me looking at what they're doing and having some answers sitting here from behind my desk. But this is where they should be as a team. Like, despite the fact that they're in two and Golden State seven, you know, you're early to the party, so to speak, if you're Houston, you know, this is house money. You want. Sure, you want to win the series, but as much. As much as anything, you want the experience to bank so that the next time you're up to bat. And we've done a little work on the roster. Everyone's grown. We know what we're dealing with. You're in the ring right now with a. An old fighter that just knows how to, like, you know, pin your arm down and hit you with the rabbit punch. Like, they know all of the little things that are going to get you tilted in a way that you can't just, you know, manhandle them the way you want to. And they just. They need to come out in game five. Don't say shit. Continue to be physical. Continue to take. Take your. Take your opportunities, but don't. Don't get into the back and forth. Here's the other thing. I'll say. You talked about that play where they got all three got text, and then, like, two minutes later, Draymond and Eason are into it, and they give out a tech and a flagrant.
- [13:03]
Raja Bell
This very well could have been an ejection.
- [13:05]
Ben Cruz
I don't love that. I don't love when we start doing that. Right? Like, because while I don't want to see anyone kicked out of the game if they don't deserve to be, you can make a case that when you're into one of those, they always give double tax, and you just.
- [13:20]
Raja Bell
I'm not gonna lie, Most of press row was like, oh, fuck, Draymond's out of it, and he just fucked Up a whole game for them. And it honestly, going into the second half, we thought that Draymond mucked up the game enough to where, like, he fucked it up for everybody. He just fucked up the flow. Like, I think that's another conversation to have right there about, like, as the playoffs wear on, because I think me and you both agreed that the warriors are gonna move on in this series. So just assuming that that is the case, like, going forward. Draymond needs to get a handle on this, on his emotions right now. And I know that's a constant thing that we keep saying throughout his career, but I think it's even more pertinent in this postseason because he is over the line in a way that is very. He's over the line in a way that is scary. Sorry, Ben Cruz. But not even just that. His level of importance to this specific team is at an all time high. They need his passing. They need his defensive prowess, because they just don't have bodies like that in the front court. And I feel like he is toeing a line. Like that Easton play, he got ripped at a normal play. Just run back down the floor. Just go play some defense. No, he dragged him down.
- [14:32]
Ben Cruz
No, he's.
- [14:33]
Raja Bell
It was so egregious.
- [14:34]
Ben Cruz
That happens on every single play where he goes to the ground. Like, there. There's. I don't. Every play, like, yeah, bro, so. But I agree with you. And he's always walking that line. It's the line that we about all the time. Like. But that's his. That's what gives him that edge and that superpower. That's part of what gives that team an edge. So he's got to walk the line. What. What Houston doesn't have is the guy, right? And the guy commands a different level of treatment from the refs as it relates to his back and forth with Draymond. So when you have a bigger guy, a bigger personality, a bigger star than Draymond, now, those situations are way more precarious for him because.
- [15:21]
Raja Bell
Because Draymond's out here getting superstar treatment in the playoffs right now. Like, in this specific series, he's getting superstar treatment, and that's okay.
- [15:27]
Ben Cruz
But, like, that's how this works, right? So, like, not only. Not only the treatment of the star on the other team, but again, we're talking about Draymond walking this line the same way I talk about Houston walking this line and Houston allowing Draymond to take them over the line. Well, the better player, when Draymond can't get at him, with the antics when Draymond can't move him off of his spot with the bullshit, it typically would be way more likely that Draymond will cross the line at that point. Right? So he does have to. He. He knows it as well as anybody. Like, we, all of us that play that role know it. We got to get as close to the line as we can and pray we don't go over that mofo.
- [16:06]
Raja Bell
All I'm going to say before we get to the next segment is there is going to be a potential that the warriors play against Minnesota. Who has Rudy Gobert. Oh.
- [16:20]
Ben Cruz
I'm here for all of that. I'm here for every bit of what that is.
- [16:25]
Raja Bell
Hey, Roger, gonna pour some of that yak and want some hoops.
- [16:28]
Ben Cruz
Oh, but you're not even talking about. I mean, Rudy.
- [16:32]
Raja Bell
Ant.
- [16:33]
Ben Cruz
Ant. And let's give respect to the Lakers, Julius Randle. I mean, I know. I'm not saying that they're gonna beat them. I'm just saying, like, if that should come to fruition, the amount of people that would be willing to get into the shit with Draymond is.
- [16:50]
Raja Bell
I mean, the thing is, though, and I want to give respect to the Rockets, they do have people that will get in Draymond shit, like, but they just don't have the backing of the referees in that sense. Right. Like, they. Like, if they get into Draymond shit, like, he's it. It's Eason who is still trying to find his way into the league, right? I'm in Thompson who's trying to find his way in the league. Dylan Brooks, who is a crash out right now, and it's like. Is who he is at this point, so it's. He's not going to get the benefit of the doubt of calls, and it's going to be interesting, man. I don't know that. It's just. Even if the. Even if the Lakers make it, right, you're going to have Luca and LeBron, right? If the Lakers somehow, which I don't think. I just don't know if they have the legs on that one. We'll talk about Luca a second. But, yeah, man, I don't have a segue for this next one. It's just sad.
- [17:39]
Ben Cruz
No, but let me. Let me add to. Let me just add one thing to this series. If. If you. If you would allow me to go ahead. You know, Jalen Green, for as good as he can be at times, it's. It's not. It's not enough and this. And I'm not I'm not. It's not a blame thing. This is exactly where Houston would find themselves. This is what we were saying about them earlier in the season, coming into the playoffs. Like, they gotta have a guy that you can pencil in for 22 a night, like 23 a night, you know, and they need that. And it's glaring because Jalen just hasn't been able to find it consistently in this series. Right. And they need, and they need someone. Sengun is fantastic, but they need someone to go along with that.
- [18:27]
Raja Bell
I watched Jalen Green and I'm like, damn, he's going to be a great six man in about five years. Just incredible. You know, I like that.
- [18:35]
Ben Cruz
I like that a lot. I mean, I'm not trying to be disrespectful to his game in any way, shape or form, but, you know, when he's rocking, let go. You know, when he, when he's not rocking. We, we have, it's, it's.
- [18:48]
Raja Bell
No.
- [18:49]
Ben Cruz
Yeah, we have pretty much.
- [18:53]
Raja Bell
Going to go back to your neck of the woods, talk about the Miami Heat a little bit. Might pour out, pour out some liquor on the Miami Heat, yo. I know how it is on a national scale. I can only imagine how it is in South Florida. They are at Pat Riley's neck right now talking about is this the end of Heat culture? He's, he's lost the plot. What are they going to do this summer? There's no free agents that are, that are like, really appealing since Lucas, like, is. Is off the market now. And, and like maybe K is not as, like, isn't as fruitful as maybe people think just because of his age. All of these things, the draft picks, all of these things. And I'm going to steal. Because I'm about to go on a tape. Fraser show later today that we're taping. I think that's coming on Wednesday. And I was looking at the rundown and they said, is this the end of Heat culture as we know it? Rajabel. So I'm going to steal that. I'm going to ask you that question right now. Are we there?
- [19:51]
Ben Cruz
No. I mean, I don't believe that we have to be at the end of Heat culture. I think foundationally they laid that the right way. I think it can last if it's not driven into the ground right now. That makes sense. So you have people in that building who've been brought up in it. You have people in that building who have lived it, who were developed in it. It can continue to be, but now is a Critical juncture in. In whether or not that's possible or not. And by. By that, I mean, like, they need. They need a freshness of it. It can be heat culture, but there's got to be a fresh, new delivery of it in some way. Yeah, I don't. Pat Riley is on the Mount Rushmore of, like, you know, NBA basketball, Right? Like, to some degree, if we're going to not. I mean, like, he's just for everything that he's meant to the game. You know, I want to give him flowers. But you're. You're 80 years old. You still look fly sitting up in the. In the box dog.
- [20:59]
Raja Bell
Still dapper, still got that $5,000 suit on. Yeah.
- [21:03]
Ben Cruz
Still looking good and everything. But, like, this is, you know, we're at a spot now where they need a spark, they need an infusion, and it's just getting long in the tooth, like, no pun intended. But it can exist. It can continue to exist, Logan. Like, that foundation was laid solid, but now hand the baton to somebody.
- [21:26]
Raja Bell
Yeah. Cause there's just things that are happening that shouldn't necessarily be happening. And it's also. It's kind of poetic when that last night happened, right? Because you see the Heat get their ass kicked at the hands of the Cavs, and then on the same night, you see Jimmy Butler get the rebound of the night and probably one of the rebounds of the playoffs. So impressive. And, like, you see how good he's been. You know, The warriors are 26 and 8 with Jimmy, and then you've seen the free fall that Miami had post trade, and there's no shade on that. That happens with teams, right? But then you look at what could have been where clearly you and Jimmy are on the odds at the end of last season. Why drag this on and get this trade so late? You don't really get much for him. I guess you get Andrew Wiggins and some picks, but, like, it's not the haul that you would think that you would get, right? Maybe. And maybe in Hindsight is always 2020. Maybe you make that trade in the summertime, right? Just get that headache out of the way before training camp. Not even have to deal with this. And like, well, Jimmy. Jimmy Butler's great now, but, like, that was a really taxing time for Miami last. Last, last. Last summer.
- [22:43]
Ben Cruz
Yeah. And sorry to interrupt. I want you to continue because I just want to add to that I was in gyms last summer, and I'm pretty sure I said it on the pod where the writing was already on the wall.
- [22:52]
Raja Bell
For that, you said it on the pod. I'm pretty sure you said it on the pod.
- [22:55]
Ben Cruz
In the organization, we're like, that's not. That's not going to work. It's over. So you knew it back then.
- [23:01]
Raja Bell
Yeah. And then so on that he continues to say, we're going to make it work. After he said some really damning things. Not necessarily, like, from in front office standpoint, like, we love it. We would love to see the honesty and transparency that a front office feels towards their players. But, like, you put Jimmy in an awkward position where he's, like, trying to get a deal and you're like, whether it's fair or not, talking about him in his contract and alluding to that in public, that doesn't really go well for the NBA players. Right. Or athletes in general or honestly, employees in general when you talk about their money. Right. And so it very clearly was. Was doomed then. And then. Then you put yourself in a position now, like, where there aren't the free agents. And one thing that Miami Heat has been really able to do, and I think this is really a model on how to, like, sustain, is like, they never. They have a never say die attitude. They are going to. They're never going to rebuild. They're going to retool under Pat Riley. But now, like, I feel like this is. There's really no choice right now. Like, I don't. They. They kind of have to. The team is who it is right now. They have bam. Adebayo, they have. Who said there's going to be some major changes this summer. Um, and then you have Tyler Herro. But what else do you have? Is that like a. That's a 48 win team if everything goes right, right? Like, what do you do? Do you go try to get Giannis, but you don't have the assets to do that?
- [24:22]
Ben Cruz
That.
- [24:23]
Raja Bell
Right. I just don't know. Pat Riley for so long has been able to pull the rabbit out the hat, and I just don't know if the rabbit gonna come out right now.
- [24:32]
Ben Cruz
Yeah, well, I mean, I don't have their. Their contracts in front of me or what their draft capital looks like or anything like that. So this is just me. You know, let's. First, let's address, like, Pat Riley's bedside manner in terms of, you know, dealing with star players and what he will or will not air, you know, in what laundry he will or will not air, in the press and the way he treats stars. Right. Like, the whole Heat culture, you know, mantra is built on, you know, Accountability, discipline, things like that. Right. Draw a comparison to, like, parenting. You know, when we came up, you know, our parents were away, right? Like, you get your. You get your ass popped considerably. Like, there were ramifications for some of the transgressions. Right. When they came up, it was probably even wilder than that.
- [25:36]
Raja Bell
Like, the way when Pet came up, it was wild. Wild.
- [25:39]
Ben Cruz
But, like, I say that. To say that as we parent now, like, I do it differently. I still would like to think that I hold my kids accountable and there's discipline in our house and we're raising good people, but we don't do it the same way because the world has changed, people have changed. We've learned. So that's where I find the Heat organization and Pat Riley. Like, no one's saying that we can't lose our integrity as it relates to dealing with stars and bending over backwards and capitulating to their every demand and X, Y and Z. But there is a way that you do it with today's player that doesn't necessarily, like, fit all the time with the way Pat wants to do it. Right. And so let's just start there. Right. And then. And now, as you. As you get into, like, you know, their roster and the makeup of it and always wanting to be competitive, you know, I don't begrudge you that. All the time I'm on here saying, like, I kind of love it. Like, it's kind of. I kind of dig it, except it just puts you in a space where eventually it might not happen right now, it might not happen next year, but eventually you're screwed. Yeah, the noose just keeps tightening, dude. Like, if you're not wriggling out of that. And so that's kind of where we find ourselves. So, like, there is a point where you have to say, all right, we cannot do that like that. We've. We've. We've taken this road as far as it goes. And I'm not. This isn't a. I'm not talking about.
- [27:20]
Raja Bell
The Phoenix Suns, basically, so you subbing the Phoenix Suns, essentially. But let's.
- [27:26]
Ben Cruz
Like, we're. We're too far down this road and we. We see the dead end.
- [27:31]
Raja Bell
Yeah.
- [27:31]
Ben Cruz
Like, are we going to drive the car into it or off the cliff or are we going to, like, hey, let's get off the road right now.
- [27:37]
Raja Bell
Yeah, man. And that's what's the tough part, is about being ultra as competitive as Pat Riley is. Right. I ain't taking no Ls, I'm not taking any Ls I'd rather go to the playoffs after LeBron leaves than tear down the studs. And he did it, and it was very entertaining when he did do it.
- [27:56]
Ben Cruz
But like, you winning a lot of. You win in a lot of battles to lose wars, though, dog.
- [28:03]
Raja Bell
Yeah, but losing them battles to him is like, well, we got to the finals twice. Shit. We weren't supposed to, but we did it.
- [28:10]
Ben Cruz
Yeah. I mean, look, you know, some, some battles go down in history, some don't, right? So, like, you, you know, you want some. Today you won some nice battles, but, like, ultimately we're trying to win the war. And so, you know, like, there's, there's got to be a level of, like, there's got to a level of understanding. And, you know, quite frankly, from above, someone's going to have to figure out exactly what they want.
- [28:36]
Raja Bell
Yeah, it's. It's tough in Miami, but y'all got the weather. You'd be fine. You know, it'll be. I like. Because here's the thing, man. When you actually. Is he culture over with? No, because it never dies. The mindset never dies. It's just, you know, you got to switch it up. You know, you got to switch up in order to grow. You got to let go. I said it all the time.
- [28:58]
Ben Cruz
That's it. And again, he's raised, or the organization's raised, or however you want to say it, They've raised individuals within that building that will continue the legacy of heat culture. It's not even debatable they will, but at some point, you've raised them. Like, look, man, how old? I'm 48. How old's Alonzo now?
- [29:24]
Raja Bell
Like in the 50s. Has to be. Right. Older than you. Right.
- [29:27]
Ben Cruz
You don't think Lonzo's ready? I mean, maybe it's not Alonzo. Maybe it's. Maybe it's. I don't know what, I don't know what Alonzo's job ultimately is in that building, but there are people that have been by his side longer than Alonzo. Like, they're, they're right.
- [29:38]
Raja Bell
55.
- [29:40]
Ben Cruz
But you understand what I'm saying, right? It might not be Alonzo because maybe his job isn't, you know, full scope of general managing. Right? That's possible. So if it's not him, that's fine. But you can find other people within that organization that were raised, that have been right at his right hand the whole time with these decision making processes throughout them and the trades, and they've been privy to all of this. They were raised in the culture that are probably ready to take the helm.
- [30:07]
Raja Bell
Yeah.
- [30:10]
Ben Cruz
And if they decide not to, that's fine. But what I'm saying is eventually, that is it.
- [30:14]
Raja Bell
That's like maybe. Maybe is. Maybe is Andy Ellisberg, like, he's been. He's been the number two behind underneath Pat Riley. He has all the institutional knowledge. He's made the trades. He's been great. He's been the general manager for the past 28 years. I mean. Or has been in that organization for the last 28 years. Maybe it's him.
- [30:35]
Ben Cruz
Maybe.
- [30:36]
Raja Bell
I don't know. They got to find that answer.
- [30:38]
Ben Cruz
I don't know. Andy. Do you know Andy?
- [30:40]
Raja Bell
I don't know Andy.
- [30:41]
Ben Cruz
He's the numbers guy, though, right?
- [30:43]
Raja Bell
He's.
- [30:43]
Ben Cruz
That. Does he.
- [30:43]
Raja Bell
Yeah.
- [30:44]
Ben Cruz
Like, he might not have the.
- [30:45]
Raja Bell
The also. I'm gonna make it. I'm gonna make a comparison here. How it feels between Andy and Pat. It's like cash money. You know, the. You know, like how Baby and Slim are. He feels like the Slim of this organization. You know, Baby's the out. Out front guy. He's the. He got all the bread. He's the one that's making sure that you get the cash money messaging.
- [31:06]
Ben Cruz
Yeah.
- [31:07]
Raja Bell
Slim is more in the cut, chilling, making sure the business is handled. That's what it seems like 3,000 miles away.
- [31:14]
Ben Cruz
Well, that. Yeah, that's why I said Lonzo. Like, you know, just a heat state, like personality, charisma, you know, those. There are things like that that go along. And Andy, someone can always run, be the. Be the numbers guy and be the backbone of it, but, like, you got to have somebody out front that's got that.
- [31:33]
Raja Bell
Maybe it's both.
- [31:35]
Ben Cruz
Je ne sais quoi.
- [31:38]
Raja Bell
You on a sick bet. You're on a sick one, man.
- [31:40]
Ben Cruz
Is that a thing? It is a thing, isn't it?
- [31:43]
Raja Bell
Yeah.
- [31:43]
Ben Cruz
What does that mean?
- [31:44]
Raja Bell
I was. I don't know what it means, but I heard it on a Sergio Mendez song and it sounded beautiful. I gotta. I'm gonna. Hey, I'm gonna send you. Hey, bro, Frank the Tank.
- [31:53]
Ben Cruz
That was like.
- [31:53]
Raja Bell
Frank the Tank.
- [31:54]
Ben Cruz
You ever seen. You ever seen Old School?
- [31:56]
Raja Bell
Hell, yeah.
- [31:57]
Ben Cruz
Where he's up there against the raging Cajun and he just jumps into, like, this, the fucking. The economic debate, and then he snaps out of it. That was my Frank the Tank moment.
- [32:08]
Raja Bell
I'm gonna send you some Sergio Mendez so you can get a glass of wine. Just like, you know, just look at the. At the Florida sun and just chill, man. Listen to some Brazilian bossa nova there we go. You know what I mean? Say a quick break. The Ringer NBA show was brought to you by FanDuel. The NBA playoffs are finally here and if you think you know how it's all gonna go down, then make those predictions pay off with FanDuel and their same game parlay profit boost. Just build your per perfect parlay, activate the boost, lock in your bet and if it hits, there's a bigger payout for you at no extra cost. Let's take a look at the slates. I am going to go with the Pacers to close out the series against the Bucs. Going to take Tyrese Halliburton over on assist and rebounds but under on points. Let's look at the Pistons. Knicks. I think I'm going to take the Pistons out right on that one. I'm going to take the over on Cade Cunningham, points, assist and rebounds. Magic Celtics I'm going to take the over on fouls and we're going to take the over on points for Jason Tatum and I think I'm going to take the Celtics to clinch that series. Clippers Nuggets I'm going to take the Nuggets on this one and I'm going to take the over on Nicole Yokin's points, rebounds and assists. Does that sound good? Well, you can score an even bigger dub because fanduel's giving you a profit boost for all of tonight's action. Don't just be a spectator this Postseason. Head to FanDuel.com Ringer NBA to download America's number one sports book and make every moment More make every moment more with FanDuel. Official sports betting partner of the NBA must be 21 years and older and present in select states or 18 and older and present in DC. Opt in required minimum 3 leg parlay required Bonus issued as non withdrawable Profit boost tokens Restrictions apply including any token expiration and max wager amount. Seek terms@sportsbook.fanduel.com Gambling problem. Call 1-800-gambler or visit rg-help.com this message.
- [34:01]
Cliff
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- [34:37]
Raja Bell
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- [35:05]
Cliff
This episode is brought to you by the Home Depot. It's starting to look like spring. And spring starts with savings. At the Home Depot, there are savings for every project, whether you're starting with a queen slate with convenient cordless power like a new pressure washer or leaf blower, or starting to love the art again with colorful flowers and fresh mulch. Start your spring with early savings at the Home Depot.
- [35:26]
Raja Bell
Shop now@homedepot.com somebody else is getting slander in these streets. One Luka Doncic, who down the stretch of game four played less defense than me, which is saying a lot, right? And I think part of that can be we could talk about the semantics of JJ Redick playing his starters a whole 24 minutes of the second half, which is nuts. Didn't even get him a blow at the, like a two minute blow between quarters. But everybody's saying right now that I know Kendrick Perkins, friend of the show, you know, he's going to go out on a limb, said that Nico Harrison is somewhere smiling right now because Luca is proving everything he said, right? Where are we, Luka Doncic right now? Are we, is it time to do our yearly crash out on Luka Doncic right now? Is that what we're supposed to be? I mean, he's getting targeted down the stretch of games. Again, defensively, I think it's a bit more nuanced than that. But, you know, hey, let's, let's, let's, let's indulge the timeline. What do we think of lucid Luka Doncic at this moment in time? And should the blame of this series go on him after game 4 if they lose, if the Lakers lose?
- [36:49]
Ben Cruz
No, no, the blame, the blame shouldn't go to Luca. And I'm not, I'm not taking the bait. I'm not crashing out on Luka. This is Luca. What are we, what are we witnessing from Luca that wasn't already known? He's fantastic offensively. He's, he's as good in the league as there is at orchestrating. I mean, you, you're up there with a very few amount of people that can, I've said This before, just move all of the puppet strings. Like he's got his own puppet show going on out there. That's phenomenal and it's brilliant. There are other things that, when you couple with that would leave you wanting more sometimes. Defense is certainly one of them. But I mean, we've had phenomenal players in the league before that weren't great defensive players. You know, shape. Shape is another one. Like, what type of fitness level do you have? And that I think is the most important one because that affects your ability to do, you know, an adequate job on defense. But I'm not blaming Luca for that. Like, you know, this is to some degree what Nico was talking about. It's exactly what he was talking about. Now, that doesn't mean that he was right for pulling the trigger on the trade. But like, this, this is what he was saying and we all knew this and we all, you know, we all said, yeah, we got that, but that trade's still done. Like, so I'm not blaming Luca for that. Like, they, they were right there. They had a chance to win the game. You know, I watched get up this morning and, and I saw my buddies J. Will and Booze up there. And when posed the question about J.J. redick, they hop, skipped and jumped around it. Like, you know, and those are my dogs. But like, yes, dude. Like, JJ made the call and he probably, you know, any, any coaching call is a roll of the dice. You don't know whether that's going to work or not work. And then you've got to be responsible for it at the end of it. Whether you're getting the praise for the outcome because you won and bore fruit, or if it doesn't work and you lose, you got to take the criticism for it. And he's got to take the medicine. He's got to take the criticism. That's unheard of. Not giving them rest at any point in time. That's. It's unheard of. And so I could understand your logic. I mean, I haven't spoken to jj. Like, there's a world where if you explain to me like, you know, I.
- [39:23]
Raja Bell
You couldn't give, you couldn't give him a two minute blow though, Raja, like, come on.
- [39:27]
Ben Cruz
No, no, no, no, listen, I'm not, I'm not excusing it because what I'm saying to you is I could understand where you were coming from. Like, because my basketball mind is open where you could make an argument for that. And I would still, at the end of that argument, say, I'm not Co signing on that.
- [39:40]
Raja Bell
Yeah, no, I agree with you. I think also another thing, right, with JJ's decision making. And I want to preface this by saying like JJ has been really, really good this season. So good to the point where you don't really like, kind of hides the fact that he's still a first year coach in the postseason. Right. So he's just going to try stuff and it's going to not work and he's going to figure it out. I trust that in him. He's shown us enough to do that. But when you, when you play your guys that much and you play a guy like Luka that much, and I know he's getting huge criticism from his defensive. Whatever happened defensively, including on programs on this site, and rightfully so. But I think this time the defensive effort, at least where he sits now, conditionally. And I'm not trying to post him too much, Bill, because he do need to get his conditioning together. But I feel like that's a symptom of being dog tired at the end of a playoff game, which is after your Coach plays you 24 straight minutes, right. Like you're going to be tired.
- [40:47]
Ben Cruz
You're taking a less than average defensive player, running him into the mud when he is in shape, mind you.
- [40:54]
Raja Bell
Yeah.
- [40:55]
Ben Cruz
You're taking one who isn't known for defense when in condition, who is currently not in great condition and then playing him until the rubber meets the road. No, he's not going to be a stand up defender late in the game. That's just not going to happen.
- [41:11]
Raja Bell
Yeah. And so do. I mean like, so that's what I think about the criticism. He was not put in a good position to, you know, even be, even be a below average defender in this game. So that's that. I do want to give some.
- [41:29]
Ben Cruz
You.
- [41:29]
Raja Bell
Know, I just feel bad for. I just feel bad for LeBron, bro. Like, this is tough. I think about the game three performance that was wasted and a lot of that had to do. And another thing like Lucas coming off food poisoning or whatever he had, right. He had some sort of sickness. I think it was food poison. I think that's what it was. But I don't want to stomach thing. Right. His stomach thing. And so like. And they were still in the game, the Lakers. It's one of those really rough series that when you play really well in a game, you're in every single game and you lose in five, that's the toughest series to lose because you could, you very well could have been in the series Every game. But I feel bad for LeBron because he's, it seems like now as he's getting older, every game that you get from him, like game three, it feels like a waste if you lose it more so than ever. Right. And I feel bad because there was a world in this where, I mean, I, I had the Lakers going to the finals. What was I thinking? But there is a world where they could get out of the series, play the Lakers or play the warriors. Probably get through that, I think, because I think they would be favored and rightfully so, and get to the conference finals again. And then anything happens, we'll see what happens. But now, like, I think about LeBron's tenure in Los Angeles, and it's been for the most part, play in first round exit. You know, it was a conference finals that was good when they were the seventh seed, but they had to go to a play in to get to that. It's been tough for him and I just, I feel bad for him in this series, especially after game four.
- [43:16]
Ben Cruz
Yeah, it's tough. And I'm fascinated. I mean, did. What did LeBron Co sign. You have to imagine LeBron Co signed at some point on. I wonder if that was a, a Saturday conversation. Hey, Bron. Cause. Cause. Cause LeBron had another worldly performance on Friday night. This was a short turnaround. Like, you talked about Luca's stomach, but like, I'm wondering if Saturday JJ said, hey, Bron, I'm toying with the idea of, of not. Or if that was just on the fly. Like, I'm fascinated by it because everything I know about LeBron, I mean, I know he does whatever he has to do to, to win a game, but he's also very, very conscious of making sure he gets the rest that he needs and that he's taking care of himself so he can be productive in the biggest moments. And so, I mean, that's just a fascinating one to me. You're not wrong in that those are brutal series where you're just. You could look back at a five game series and say seven points cost us this entire series. Like, those are, those are tough to stomach. Those are physical. And Golden State is a better fight style for the Lakers, even if it was a second round, right? They're a better fight style. Like Minnesota's big, physical, young.
- [44:34]
Raja Bell
They're big and they're long. Like they, they have. And they have athleticism. Like they're, they're young.
- [44:40]
Ben Cruz
They have. I mean, relatively speaking, right? Like your alpha is young. And so that is a tougher I think matchup for the Lakers and you know, the question, I think. But when they made the trade, most of us acknowledged that, yeah, they could. They had a puncher's chance, but next year was going to be where they, where they have to get it right.
- [45:03]
Raja Bell
I think we said this, and I think I got caught up in a moment in the back stretch of the season because I thought they were playing so well. But I think when the trade went down, I think we thought about this. We said this with the warriors too. If they get to the second round, that's a win. Like, I think that's a win for the trade. I think that's a win for what they were doing because, I mean, we had Howard on. He was like, I don't know what this Lakers team is going to be like. Are they going to be good? Are they going to make the playoffs? Are they going to figure it out? Like, I don't. I don't know. We were like. And I just was like, lebron, Luca, yeah, I gotta trust him. But we'll see what happens. But I do think that they, they have, relative to expectations, have done pretty well. It's just like LeBron is just getting a year older. I just don't know how many more years he has left in the tank.
- [45:44]
Ben Cruz
No, they have to get it. They have to get it right next year.
- [45:47]
Raja Bell
Like, have to.
- [45:48]
Ben Cruz
They have to get it right next year.
- [45:51]
Raja Bell
I want to talk about the Minnesota Timberwolves. Even if it's for five to ten minutes really quickly. The maturation of Anthony Edwards has just been astounding. Like, one of the things that I was really concerned about going into this series was how he's going to manage a game, you know, And I think that it takes, no matter how great you are to start your career, it takes a minute to be able to, you know, unless like you're Luca. It takes a while to find your. Both your individual game and then the individual game of others and then also quarterback the whole thing. And I feel like Ann is turning a corner on that man. And like he's getting the scoring opportunities and he's also getting other guys involved. He's also passing out a double teams. He's also making the right shots. You could tell that he, like the difference between Ant right now and say a jaw is you can tell that Ant has been working on his game in different scenarios in the off season. I wrote a story on him last, last summer and it really talked about how he matured as a worker. Right. And it wasn't that he doesn't work and hard. It was that, like, you kind of just have to figure out how to do it, right? Doing it to a days in the off season, making sure that it's not just like, you're fucking around and just shooting threes and like, oh, I'm done. But, like, being very intentional. And you see that, how methodical that he has been in the postseason because he's been very intentional with his workouts and work habits. And I'm really happy to see him on the other side of that right now. Rob.
- [47:27]
Ben Cruz
Yeah, you hit. You. You stole my thunder on that. But good for you, because that's the word. It's being. It's intentional work. Right. Detailed work, purposeful work. And it's. It's. It's understanding why, like, that's, you know, the combination of those things is. Is in large part the biggest part of someone's development. Right. Like going back and seeing where we struggled, where we fell short, what was happening to us. Like, how were they able to do this to me? Okay. Understand that. How do I need to work and what skills do I need to work on so that that doesn't happen again? And then, you know, really figuring out how you deploy them. And. And to the point about Luka being. Luka had pro experience coming in. Yeah, Luka had been working those things in a way that our college kids don't really work them for a while before he got into the NBA. So he was advanced. He had a head start on that. But it is cool to see Ant continuing to grow and develop, and he's looking fantastic. But that's what. We live in a society now where. And maybe I was so young back then that I just wasn't paying attention to the type of criticism that the MJ's of the world were getting. And some of those players before they were able to win championships. But I feel like back then, it wasn't always a narrative on someone's career if they didn't succeed right away, like in the way that it is today. We just. It's an indictment if you can't get it done the first time on. On what your career will ultimately be. Your legacy is defined because you ain't win it in year two or three. And real realistically, that's not realistic.
- [49:17]
Raja Bell
Jordan didn't win until year eight, I think, or he was 28 when he won it.
- [49:20]
Ben Cruz
Yeah, it takes some time, bro. It takes some. It takes some getting over the hump. It takes falling on your face. It takes failing it takes the trial and the error. It takes the embarrassment. All those things go into your. Into your, you know, being. And they fuel that intentional work you're talking about. Right. And so, yeah, it is cool to watch, man give him his flowers. They need to close this shit out, though.
- [49:41]
Raja Bell
That's going to be the big test. That's going to be. And also another thing that I'm, like, really impressed with Ant, and I think that's going to at least give him not an edge in the. In the conversation between him and Luca, because I think that's going to be the next great rivalry that we have, especially if they stay in the same conference. But, like, a notch under your belt early in your career to not only beat LeBron, early in your career to beat LeBron and Luka, like, that's something that Ja can't say. That's something that Luka can't say. He's never beat LeBron.
- [50:10]
Ben Cruz
Yeah.
- [50:11]
Raja Bell
I mean, not to say Luca hasn't beaten dudes, but he's beaten KD. He's beaten LeBron. If he wins, this beats LeBron and Luca, that's a stripe on his belt, bro. Like, and then if he goes and beat Steph next, Next round, like, this can be. This could be a little run going on here. This might be premature talking about this, but, like, this is. This could be really impressive from Ant, and even if he doesn't win a championship, a real, like, early notch, like, oh, okay, this dude is serious. Like, really serious.
- [50:41]
Ben Cruz
Both things can be true. It can be premature. Right. But it could also be true that if it should shake down like that. Yeah, absolutely. You're knocking off Luca, LeBron and Jimmy and Steph, and we're again. Yeah.
- [50:54]
Raja Bell
A year after you just knocked out kd.
- [50:57]
Ben Cruz
Premature for sure. But, like, yeah, now you're starting. Now you're starting to, like, now you're starting to solidify that hey, face. Face of the league type of conversation right now. You're starting to really put your stamp on stuff like that. Here's the other thing. It came, you know, perk, friend of the show. Like, I did hear some of what he said. I, you know, like, like, anybody. I agree with some stuff. I don't fully agree with other stuff, but one of his points about what Ant does and doesn't get credit for on the D all the time, the defensive side of the floor is a real separator. Like, it's a. It's a real separator because we often just acknowledge how brilliant someone is offensively and I get it. Like, you got to score points to win. Like, that's what everybody wants to see and stuff like that. But, man, when one of those dudes who are that brilliant on the offensive side of the floor couples it with being a gangster on the. On the defensive side of the floor, like Shay and Ant, like, that's. That's really cool.
- [51:51]
Raja Bell
That's why. And we probably won't have enough time to talk about it, but we'll talk about it on Friday. But that's what makes Kawhi so fucking potent when he's great. Like, yeah, I'll just say this. We haven't talked much, Kawhi in, like, about a week, but, man, it's been great to see him back. And it's also, like, we're getting the series between the Nuggets and the. And the Clippers that we've always wanted. Even though both Nuggets wins have been on some wild fluke shit. Like, wild fluke shit. Still a fun series, man. Like, it's still been. Let's do it.
- [52:25]
Ben Cruz
I want to talk. No, not necessarily. No, I don't want to. I wanted to talk about. I didn't know if you were going to take me to this, but, like. And I don't really have a rant, but I just find it interesting how many. How many late game either fouls or you kind of teed me up. Last time we were on about the Detroit backcourt type of foul. And then their next game comes down to a no call on Timmy Hardaway.
- [52:49]
Raja Bell
Let's talk to the no call real quick. I haven't talked to you about it yet. So, like, I was. I. When I first saw it. I don't know. Would you want to talk about that or just like.
- [52:56]
Ben Cruz
No, just over. We could talk about that. But even then, LeBron like that. Out of bounds. The out of bounds. And when it was happening, I was sitting there with my man and our wives. We were out. We were out having sushi. We were kind of watching it on the phone because I'll come back and watch it the next morning. And I said to him, because he's kind of a Lakers fan, and I was like. He said something I'll definitely off of. I said, yeah, man, but they can actually now go back and call a foul on that shit. I was like, watch them call a fucking foul. Why Called the foul?
- [53:22]
Raja Bell
Like, I don't like that shit, bro. I'm gonna be real with you. I'm gonna be real with you. I don't like that shit. And like the, the. The challenges. To call a foul like that don't feel like hoop to me, Roger. And I know that's probably like cool. I know that, like growing the game. But also you got to think last night I fucking sat through like four reviews in a quarter. Like, we need to figure out this review shit. We need to figure it out because we still getting the shit wrong too, right? Like, we're. We're getting the call. Like the foul calls, right? But like, I don't like that. I don't like that.
- [53:56]
Ben Cruz
Was Jimmy. Was. Was Jimmy Butler's. Like, again, was Jimmy Butler's. Did Dylan Brooks foul him on the three?
- [54:04]
Raja Bell
Was that it? I don't know. They're just like so many questionable time though. It didn't like any. And that's with the. So when the Jimmy thing happened, we were all sure that was going to get overturned. Like. Like that didn't look like a foul in real time on the. The call. There's so many other things. Me and Cliff talked it through for a little bit. Cliff, come on real quick. Let's talk about the call. And I do want to talk about Dame real quick and pour out some liquor for him before we get out of here. But let's talk through with. With. With Cliff. So on the final play of the Detroit game, the Detroit Knicks game, I think me and you were texting. Me and Cliff be texting all the time now, Razo. Like, I'd be like sitting in fucking west coast like G funk all the time at like 2 in the morning and shit. And then we just talk through all the games. But like in the moment, I think we were texting through that last finish and I was like, kind of cool with the ending in Detroit. Like, I was fine with it because I was just like all my life growing up like you. The refs never put it in the ref's hands. And it felt like bro from Detroit jumped into the. Into Josh Hardaway. And I was cool. Tim Hardaway Jr. And I was like, I mean, I'm fine with that. It's cool. But the more NBA players that I've talked to be like, Logan, you're full of shit. That was a fucking foul. They should have called it. Stop fucking playing. So I'm bringing that to the panel and my. I'm full of shit, right? Like, I should just.
- [55:27]
Ben Cruz
Unquestionable foul. Unquestionable foul.
- [55:30]
Victoria
Yes.
- [55:31]
Raja Bell
So what I thought was like, hey, man, you don't put it in the ref's hands, especially back.
- [55:35]
Ben Cruz
You're. You're right. You're right. Like Jason Hart. I mean, not Jason Hart, but Josh Hart should have definitely not put it in the ref's hands by jumping his ass over there and fouling.
- [55:45]
Raja Bell
He did.
- [55:46]
Victoria
He flew like Superman, right, Roz didn't. He flew like Superman in the air like that. Left his feet. Tim Hardaway Jr. Up hit the up fake and clearly Josh Hart body hit Tim Hardaway Jr. S shooting side. And it should have been three shots. And then the refs walked off. JB Bickerstaff looked like he was about to socks one of the refs.
- [56:04]
Raja Bell
Detroit came out of the. Detroit came out of the truck. Yeah.
- [56:06]
Victoria
Yo, that security holding up against. Yo, you know how at the end of the game the refs get the security walk out back to their locker room to get dressing and leave and all that? That Detroit security got there so fast, man, them refs had to get right out of there. And then the stupid two minute report came out which validated.
- [56:21]
Raja Bell
That's what I hate, Cliff. Cliff. That's what I hate. I hate the two minute report. I hate it.
- [56:26]
Victoria
It validated what I thought and it's like, bro, it's now pointless because it's like, what does Detroit do with that information? Yeah, we lost the game. Now what am I going to do with that?
- [56:36]
Ben Cruz
We're going to.
- [56:36]
Victoria
We're even more mad. Yeah, you can't make that up.
- [56:39]
Ben Cruz
You can't miss that call.
- [56:40]
Victoria
Yeah, you can't miss that call. And now Detroit, there's nothing they could do about it. They just lose the game. They should have.
- [56:45]
Raja Bell
Now they're down 3:1.
- [56:47]
Ben Cruz
This is, this is. First of all, that ref is standing four feet away from that on that baseline, like standing right there. Those are the best refs on the planet. As much shit as I give them, they have the best trained eye of anyone reffing basketball anywhere. They're fantastic with what they. There's no way you missed that call. And here is my ultimate beef. If we can go back on an out of bounds play and retroactively call a foul, there's no recourse for you guys missing that at that point in the game. That to me doesn't make sense.
- [57:24]
Victoria
And the reason why it wasn't reviewed is because it wasn't called a foul. He should have just called a foul just to protect his ass. I don't know why he didn't do that.
- [57:30]
Ben Cruz
Yeah, that doesn't. But I'm not even. Like, the system then doesn't make sense to me. If I can find myself In a situation where a loose ball will retroactively get me screwed or rewarded on. On a subjective like barely touch foul and you guys are going to not be able to review an end of the game foul like that. I don't have the answer. Not that smart. But there's got. That system seems broken and real quick.
- [57:55]
Victoria
It'S only reviewable if you have the review. And JD Biggerstaff used to review in like the first quarter on some stupid, well, I don't know, like, question.
- [58:02]
Raja Bell
If they gonna copy the NFL, they're gonna copy the NFL, then why don't we just have like mandatory reviews in the last minute?
- [58:10]
Victoria
The last thing you want to see is what happened that second quarter to.
- [58:13]
Raja Bell
That warriors win this game in the fourth quarter. I know. I just don't, I don't have. I don't have a true. Like, I just know I don't like it. I don't know. I don't like the current. Yeah, so we're in right now.
- [58:22]
Ben Cruz
So again, if we're going to be in the world where we can't, we can't, there's no recourse for what happened to Tim Hardaway Jr. Okay, I'll live in that world. But then let's not, let's not have the other ones either though. Like, let's not have what happened and, and let's. Let's hoop.
- [58:37]
Raja Bell
Let's hoop.
- [58:38]
Ben Cruz
You know what I mean?
- [58:38]
Raja Bell
Let's. That's my argument with like how I felt initially. I was just like, it's hoop, bro. Like last five seconds of a game. If it didn't, if they didn't call it, then like, that's just what it is, bro. Cause that's typically how refs, they typically just put it in the player's hands. That's silent.
- [58:56]
Victoria
But to me, the whistle stays silent for like boxing out and maybe a little bit of a hip check or something like that. But not you flying in the air, you affecting my shot.
- [59:04]
Ben Cruz
I don't, I also. Yeah, and I also don't like. I mean like I didn't know we were going all the way here, but I don't, I don't like the review on fouls in general.
- [59:12]
Raja Bell
And I don't like that like LeBron call on Aunt Edwards. I hated that that shit got called a foul as. Oh, we. Oh, I guess we just found a foul in the playoffs. You're going to find that in every fucking play.
- [59:23]
Ben Cruz
Almost every clip you break down like out of bounds plays. I get it. Cut and dry your ball. Our Ball. But like, anything you slow down that involves two people in an NBA game, you know, not anything, but most things, it's slow motion. Are going. You could, if you want to say, oh, yeah, that was a foul. He just, you know, that was contact. Like, you could rationalize giving a foul. And so once you start getting into the weeds, I don't know where you stop. So that's my point. Like, play ball. Like, let's not. Let's. Let's less with the fouls and debating over, like, you know, and, like, let's clean it up. Loose balls, ball out of bounds, and let's keep it moving.
- [59:59]
Raja Bell
Yeah. Yeah. All right. Um. I was really sad.
- [60:05]
Victoria
Still Detroit, though. Shout out to Detroit, three, one, three. You gonna make this comeback. Still Detroit.
- [60:08]
Ben Cruz
Another team exactly where. Exactly where they probably should be in this. Right?
- [60:13]
Raja Bell
Like, it's just funny that, like, somehow fucking Cliff is from Philly, but went to, like, Cass Tech or some shit in Detroit. He out here just repping. It's wild.
- [60:24]
Ben Cruz
He has. He has lately claimed Detroit.
- [60:26]
Raja Bell
He's claiming Detroit.
- [60:27]
Ben Cruz
Real talk.
- [60:28]
Raja Bell
Victoria out here fucking claiming all teams in California. It's just ridiculous, this fandom here. Like, she's over here. She said, I'm a Step fan and a LeBron fan and a Luca fan, Laker fan and UCLA fan and USC fan all in the same sentence. It's ridiculous. It's nuts. It is nuts. She's not going to talk on this podcast, but you. We got to take her to task in front of the real ones. Anyways. I was really sad last. Last night, man. Like, the damage we just really got me in my feelings, dog. Not gonna lie. And a lot of it, I'm gonna say is just being from Oakland and being from the Bay, but that hurt really, like, a lot. And there's gonna. We're gonna talk about the ramifications and what's to come for Milwaukee, but that just felt like one of those things that just shitty for the game, you know? Like, in all ways, it just. It hurts raw. It just hurts. I don't have anything else to say other than that, but it just. It just. That shit hurt to watch that.
- [61:29]
Ben Cruz
Yeah, I mean, I'm with. I'm with you. I don't have a lot to add to that. Like, for. For someone who's. Who's been as good as Dame has for as long as he's been at this point in the career, too, to, like, with an injury like that. Yeah, that was. That was hard to watch.
- [61:46]
Raja Bell
Yeah. Let's pour out a little Liquor for dame, man. You know, play some dame Dollar and Rex life. Raj, I don't have anything much to say. Just I wanted to acknowledge that it sucks that he's heard and just a sad season from the Milwaukee Bucks all the way around. But on a happier note, the Raiders got a really good pick, and I think they really had a really great draft. So, you know, that was.
- [62:13]
Ben Cruz
Yeah, that was. That. That was interesting.
- [62:15]
Raja Bell
You got any thoughts? Quick, quickly, quickly. No, no.
- [62:20]
Ben Cruz
It was an interesting weekend.
- [62:22]
Raja Bell
You have no. You have no Shador thoughts. You have absolutely no Shador thoughts.
- [62:26]
Ben Cruz
I am happy for every single person that got to live a lifelong dream of getting drafted into the NFL and for all of those who signed as free agents, like, I had to. Hey, kudos to y'all, man. Make the most of those opportunities.
- [62:37]
Raja Bell
Aha. Sorry. Real Ones. Me and me, Victoria, Ben and Cliff are gonna get the real tea after the pod. Haha. We'll get Roger's real feelings on this.
- [62:48]
Ben Cruz
No tea. There's no tea. It was like. I mean, hey, bro. All right.
- [62:52]
Raja Bell
Shout out. Shout out Cam Ward, though. Shout out Cam Ward.
- [62:56]
Ben Cruz
No doubt hurricanes, you know what I mean?
- [62:57]
Raja Bell
All right, that's been another edition of Real Ones. We got to an hour. We got Raj. Raja said, by the way, he's only going to do 20 minutes of this podcast because he was so fucking fed up. He doesn't have his Bluetooth headphones, ladies and gentlemen. He's fed up. I finally got him on the wave and he can't connect his shits.
- [63:12]
Ben Cruz
I mean, I have him. I just couldn't get him to connect. Now I don't even. Like. I actually got in a good mood podding with you today, bro. You about to send me back off the pod.
- [63:20]
Raja Bell
Love you, buddy. I got love for you. Never mind. All right, all right, all right, all right, all right. That's been another edition of Real. It's Tuesday Vibes. Me and Rah Rah, man, I've been listening to a lot of Philly shit, you know, low, low in the place to be. And I got what it takes to rock the mic right, yeah. Ooh, Better watch as you say to me, Trick. Cause I got what it takes to rock the mic right, yeah. All right. That was Roger Bell. I'm Lolo, Cliff on the boards, Victoria on the video. We will see you guys with Howard mother fucking Beck on Friday. The curmudgeon himself is back in the building. Let's fucking go. Talk to y'all soon. All this shit's must be 21 years and older and Present in select states For Kansas and affiliation with the Kansas Star Casino or 18 and older and present in D.C. gambling problem call 1-800- gambler or visit rghelp.com, call 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org chat in Connecticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gamblinghelplinema.org or call 1-800-327-5050 for 24. 7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-87-7-8, Hope NY or text Hopeny in New York.