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The Ringer NBA Show
Jimmy Butler to the Warriors, and Lakers Get a New Center. Plus, Winners and Losers From the Trade Deadline. | Real Ones
01:19:25
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- [00:00]
Rob Harvilla
Look, it's not that confusing. I'm Rob Harvilla, host of the podcast 60 songs that explain the 90s. Except we did 120 songs and now.
- [00:09]
Logan Murdoch
We'Re back with the 2000s.
- [00:11]
Rob Harvilla
I refuse to say aughts. 2000 to 2009. The strokes, rihanna, jlo, kanye. Sure. And now the show is called 60 songs that explain the nineties. Colon, the 2000s. Wow. That's too long a title for me to say anything else right now. Just trust me. That's 60 songs that explain the 90s. Cole in the 2000s. Preference, preferably on Spotify.
- [00:35]
Howard Beck
This episode is brought to you by Indeed. Slow and steady doesn't always win the race. One time I needed to hire a painter to paint the outside of my house. And I needed it quick because in Portland, I don't know if you guys know this, in the summer, everyone does everything outside and you have to get it all done before the rains come.
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Logan Murdoch
And so that's why I used Indeed.
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Howard Beck
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- [01:22]
Rob Harvilla
I love sports. I know you do, too. I also know that lots of you exercise.
- [01:26]
Howard Beck
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- [01:28]
Rob Harvilla
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Logan Murdoch
I listen to podcasts.
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Howard Beck
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Rob Harvilla
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Logan Murdoch
The best thing about Viori is you can lounge around in it, you can.
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Rob Harvilla
Work out in it, you can go outside, you can go shopping down in your local wherever, and you never feel like you're either underdressed or overdressed.
- [01:57]
Howard Beck
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Rob Harvilla
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Logan Murdoch
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Rob Harvilla
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- [02:27]
Logan Murdoch
You'Re talking about, bro. What you're talking about.
- [02:30]
Rob Harvilla
Keep that shit in real. And Logan Murdoch here, Roger Bell. They're in a rush. Howard Beck of the motherfucking Cut Ben Cruz on the call, so, you know, it's a big deal. And we have Isaiah Blakely on the boards. This is a special edition of Real Ones back in our own old time slot Thursday, just for a day, because it is the trade deadline extravaganza. You guys ready, man? How are we feeling? How. How you guys felt about this trade deadline? We're officially done. What's. How's everybody feeling?
- [03:02]
Howard Beck
I refilled my coffee, so I'm great.
- [03:05]
Logan Murdoch
Yeah, I'm dealing with, like, flu symptoms, so I'm not doing so good and I gotta find some week early.
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Howard Beck
Brother's ass.
- [03:13]
Logan Murdoch
Yeah. Not feeling great, but yeah.
- [03:16]
Rob Harvilla
Okay. Well, sure. I got my. My black tea from Trader Joe's. You know what I mean? Let's get it. TJ's. All right, we got a lot to talk about for this trade deadline extravaganza, but, like, we all know why y'all here. You know, let's just do that. Let's get it off the top. Jimmy Butler is a Golden State Warrior. After all of the posturing from both sides, he is now a Golden State warrior with a two year, 101 million dollar extension. $121 million extension. Excuse me. Let's just go through the timeline really quickly. Obviously, there were reports out there, and I had been hearing this, too, last month, that the warriors, staff, record label, and most of the crew didn't want Jimmy Butler in the building. If you talk to anyone within the organization, at least most of the people, there was definitely a divide on getting this guy into the building. And then you get to the trade deadline and you don't know what's. And Beck knows this. You don't know what's posturing and what's actual news at this point. There are a lot of just conflicting voices when you're around a team like this. But anyways, there was a. There was a. A sense that the warriors didn't want them, then didn't want Jimmy Butler. And then you get Jimmy, who goes through intermediary saying that he's not going to sign an extension. The warriors go pursue Kevin Durant. Kevin Durant says, kick rocks. I don't want to come back. Then Jimmy Butler somehow sees that no one else is going to pay him, and the warriors are like, well, we need a superstar. What's up? We'll pay you. Marriage of convenience. Did I get that right, Beck? Does that seem like how it all went down?
- [05:04]
Howard Beck
That sounds about right. That sounds about right. Although I'll just footnote it. And, you know, because I sent this to you yesterday morning. There was a moment that before Kevin Durant made it clear he was not interested in a big, happy, sentimental, sappy reunion in the Bay Area, that there were people around the league who thought that something was imminent, a three team trade minimum that was going to land Durant in San Francisco and send Jimmy Butler to Phoenix as. As part of the deal. Which is a weird downgrade for Phoenix, but whatever. I'll get into the details of that later in the show. But like that was in play. So that's the only other detail is that for a moment there's, there was buzz around the league Wednesday morning that that Durant was maybe Bay Area bound, that it looked like the deal there was. There was the parameters of a deal in place that could have landed him there. And yeah, you said it though, Logan, at the end of this all, we have a marriage of inconvenience here. Not quite like shotgun marriage, but it might as well have been it. It's like the warriors did this because they just kind of needed to do something to not waste another stretch of Steph's career and Jimmy was out of options. How many teams were knocking down the Heat's door willing to give up anything of substance at all? And you can see by what the Miami Heat accepted in return. This was just, basically just getting rid of the headache at this point that the warriors were on top of it, willing to give Jimmy Butler that extension. I guess you might as well once you're down that path. But yeah, this is a marriage of convenience. We'll see. We'll take our temperature on how we all feel about what the results might be. But it's an awkward situation, I think.
- [06:45]
Rob Harvilla
What'd you think of the deal, Ra?
- [06:48]
Logan Murdoch
I mean, you had to do something if you're Golden State, like we've talked about this on the pod, you know, until we're blue in the face. Like you're, you're in this situation with Steph that you, you owe him an opportunity to play for something. Like even your casual is, you know, you don't want to see Steph in the later years of his career with just with some tread left on the tire not having an opportunity to fight for something. So, you know, in the absence of getting what you really wanted, you wind up with Jimmy Butler. I honestly, you know, I think you guys summed it up like it's. I've, I've given you all my reservations about Jimmy Butler and what the bad version of Jimmy can do, you know, culturally to your building I mean, look at. Look at the Heat. It can be great for long stretches of time, but if. If. If he decides it's not great anymore, it can get toxic really quickly. And I would equally hate to see that happen to Golden State as Steph's time there runs out, if that makes sense. Right. As much as I want to see him fighting for something and playing and being viable, I equally hate to see it get really ugly and messy in a way that we've. We haven't really seen in Golden State to that degree. I mean, we've seen shit, but not, not, not like. Like, Jimmy can stir up some shit. Can you do those things, like, stir up some shit? So, I mean, hey, like, kind of win, win. I see it as. I mean, you could call it lose loop, a win, win. I think, like, yeah, you know, you get stuff. Something to work with. Jimmy's a good player. I think, you know, to get into the X's and O's of it. Style of play for Jimmy is a good fit, you know, like, he's a guy. The Heat did some very similar things to what Golden State has done when they've played really well, where there's a lot of movement, a lot of player movement, ball movement, you know, kind of flow to it, rather than just the pure ISO. Jimmy can also get you the ISO buckets, though, so, you know, I kind of do like him as a fit there offensively on the wing, you know, and the Heat just had. I mean, the writing was on the.
- [08:49]
Rob Harvilla
Wall there, I think. I think on paper, I'm trying to figure out how to do this because there's so many layers to this. I think adding a Jimmy Butler to your roster from a basketball standpoint is always a net positive, right? Because he is that good of a basketball player. The politics surrounding it, though, give me pause that this is going to work in the way that they would want it to work. Right. Remember somebody telling me in the lead up to this trade, right? And this is like before, this is probably about three weeks ago when the warriors were in pursuit of not only Jimmy Butler, but also Zach Levine and pretty much, you know, any superstar. I mean, Kevin Durant, they always wanted him as well, but they said if they get Jimmy Butler, the Warriors get Jimmy Butler. This is a Joe lacob call. And if they don't, then Joe Lacob is actually listening to his staff. And they pointed to the last few times that Joe lacob has had decision making use unilateral decision making to make a move. It was James Wiseman and drafting him and Kelly Oubre when they. I think, was it a trade? I think when they traded for Kelly Oubre and neither of those ended well. James Wiseman, obviously, because of injury, and Kelly Oubre because he just didn't fit within the ecosystem. Right. And I think this is a recurring thing that we have kind of seen over the last few years as the warriors have just tried to figure out things is. And I'm not trying to just sift blame, because I think there's some blame to go all around, but I think this one Lacob is getting isn't necessarily listening to the people that are actually coaching the team or actually the basketball people. He just wants to be in the show and make sure that they have a superstar. And on paper, like, yeah, I guess you have Jimmy Butler, but you're unwilling to actually reinvent yourself. And I said this in the last podcast, it felt like the warriors were flailing and just at a certain point and just trying to pick anybody that will come there. And it doesn't seem like there's necessarily a plan. Right. It's like, get an all star. What. What we've seen that makes good teams is deep, actual deep teams. What do. Even when you see Jimmy Butler, I think he's a great ISO guy. This team needed shooting. I don't know if he necessarily provides that. And if you were going to get a Jimmy Butler, could you get another shooter to help with Steph or Buddy Hill to kind of help spread the floor? Or can you do a. Maybe. And also another thing that the warriors have said, and this goes back to Joe lacob, you know, there were some whispers throughout this time that, you know, maybe Draymond Green and he. I think he alluded to this after the game last night, but that Draymond Green had kind of used a bit. A lot of his capital in terms of how the. The team would. His capital of how the team would tolerate his actions. Right. Like how much they would. How much they were fed up with him at this point that he might be dealt. Joe Lakoff was not going to let that happen. Right. And you've seen even throughout all these deals, the people that Joe Lakob wanted to stay on the team, Jonathan Kaminga and Draymond Green are still on the team despite reservations from a lot of different people. So I do think there is a disconnect within this front office. And if they're going to be good, even in salvage this Jimmy Butler situation, you know, Lakers are going to have to listen to the basketball people and I don't think that that's happening here. And I think that that's the thing that is.
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Logan Murdoch
So. So the other people. You're saying the other people wanted Zach Levine?
- [13:08]
Rob Harvilla
I think they would have been. I think they would have preferred him over Jimmy Butler if those are the two people. Right. Because, you know, Zach Levine doesn't play a league of defense, but he can spread the floor. He could be a secondary scoring option. Not to say that Jimmy Butler can't, but like a he. Zach Levine is a better scorer than Jimmy Butler. And also they didn't want the headache, you know. You think. Don't think so. No. You don't think so. Okay. Anyway, we're not going to get in.
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Logan Murdoch
A full in argument.
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Rob Harvilla
It's more of the headache too, than anything. Yeah, they would rather have lavine than the headache of Jimmy Butler. And that was. That was what you would hear all the time. And so, like, for them to pivot and get Jimmy Butler, despite all those reservations, is telling.
- [13:52]
Howard Beck
So, yeah, I mean, look, the intel I got was the same as Logan's when this was going down yesterday. That this was a Joe Lakob move. Like that was almost literally word for word what somebody had texted me about 10 minutes before the story finally broke. They said, this thing's happening. This was somebody outside of the organization. And the impression around the league is, yeah, this was a Joe Lakob move. And if people around the league are getting that impression, it's because they're being told that probably by people that they're talking to on the basketball side with the Warriors. That's how the gossip chain works in this league. Put all that aside for a minute. How, you know, process, decision making, who's making decision. At the end of the day, they made this commitment, right? They're in. They're in on Jimmy Butler. They're in the Jimmy Butler business for the next two seasons, plus the rest of this one, equaling the time that. That. That Steph Curry has left on his deal that Steve Kerr does. Like, this is it. This is the last phase of the Steph Curry era or the Steph and Draymond and Kerr era. And they have put everybody's fate, whatever's going to become of this last gasp of the dynasty in Jimmy Butler's hands. There's risk there for sure. But, like, if I'm gonna. I would focus on. On the glass half full for a moment here. Jimmy Butler at his best. We. We know what he can do. We know what the notch he can. He can turn it up or the several notches he turns it up in the playoffs. Jimmy Butler's a badass. They needed defense, they needed shot creation. They needed somebody else who could handle the ball. They needed somebody else who could be a high usage is score at times when necessary. I see Jimmy Butler in some ways as a more skilled version of what they had with Iguodala when he was there. Like, you know, a. You know, a bigger ball handler. You know, obviously Andre is like really long. It's like different. Different build, but like, Andre ran the offense off the bench. Andre was another leader on the floor. Iguodala could. Could initiate and create. Jimmy could do all those things at a much higher level. And for all of the. Just the angst of the last several months with Miami, which cannot be swept under the rug by any means, his first five years there, things were mostly fine. Now you'd hear things here and there. Jimmy's always a pain wherever he is. He's a. But it was a. It's. It wasn't like, to the extent that it was really messing things up. They got to the finals twice with lackluster rosters. They don't do that without Jimmy Butler getting them there. So lest we get too caught up in the drama and everything, that's. That Jimmy stirred up because he was pissed about his contract. In recent months, he had a nice long stretch there in Miami where things were mostly fine and they made two finals. And he's. This is the last stage of his career, too, and he can decide how much trouble he wants to stir up or whether he's going to try to conform to the culture that he's now joining, where he's got the best shot that he's going to have. I mean, again, he went to two finals, but if there's any shot for him to. To make that stage again in his career, it's going to have to be by playing by the warriors rules. I know. There's also this Draymond element, too. You've got these two really hardheaded dudes in the same locker room. Now. I'm not saying there's not risk. There is. On the. On the functional side of it, I'm more concerned just because Jimmy's not a knockdown three point shooter. Ideally you want to be playing, you know, especially at the end of the game, you want to play Steph with your best players. That's going to be Jimmy, Draymond, Kaminga, and a fifth person to be named. Jimmy's not a shooter. Draymond's Not a shooter, even though Draymond's having a pretty good shooting year by percentage, and Kaminga is not really a shooter. So you have some issues, right? Like, can you ever play Kavan Looney with any combination of these guys because he's not a shooter? Like, some of their best players just don't fit together in terms of spacing in today's NBA. On the other hand, Jimmy can manufacture scoring from a bunch of different places on the floor, and that's going to help them out, and it's going to be less wear and tear on. On Steph and less on Steph's shoulders. So on balance, if we put all the other stuff aside, all the drama aside, personality stuff aside, I do think this. This is a. This is a worthwhile gambler, especially when you could not. You couldn't get Kevin Durant to come back. You tried Paul, Georgia tried Larry Mark. Where else were you going to go? Is there a better option in the off season? Maybe, but, like, there's just so many rocks you can turn over.
- [18:26]
Logan Murdoch
Yeah, that's where that. Well, that's kind of where I'm at, Howard, and I'm. Look, I hope that you are correct. Hope. I'm hoping like hell that he does buy into the culture there, realizes that, you know, this is a real opportunity for them to do something and just kind of buys in and is the best version of himself there. Like, because when he is doing that, it's all systems go. Like, he's. I mean, I'm a huge Jimmy Butler hooping on the court fan. I would. I would honestly make the argument. And you guys know I love Zach Levine, too. Jimmy Butler is. There are a handful of players in the NBA that you could throw spacing out the window. And what they do to spacing. He's one of them. Like, just because he's so good when he's good that I don't. I don't think you account, like, you account spacing for somebody like me. Like, do you know what I mean? I'm not giving you shit else, so I better be able to space the floor and, like, defend, you know? But, like, he's one of those dudes that's just. He's got the ability, big shots, timely shots, carry you for stretches of games with shot making and creation that. That I wouldn't even really worry about the space in. And I think. I think that if him and Draymond are connected emotionally, like, you just went. You just got really. You just got really tough.
- [19:39]
Rob Harvilla
You.
- [19:39]
Logan Murdoch
You know what I mean? Like, you just got really grimy and really gritty, you know, in a way that might counter some of what you're talking about on offense, Logan and. You know what I mean, in the shooting and stuff like that. I'm just trying to make the argument because I do think it's a win, and I think it's a win for the reason you just stated, Howard. Like, they might have wanted Zach Levine. Was there any indication that they could have had him? Like, could they have had him if they wanted him? I don't know. I mean, I'm not locked in. Like, you know, there were reports that.
- [20:04]
Rob Harvilla
There were a deal in place and maybe they just didn't want vouch, but, like, there was reports that they could.
- [20:08]
Logan Murdoch
Have gotten, but something made it unpalatable. I mean, I guess my point is, like, if you're looking around and you had other targets that you wanted, I. E. Kevin Durant and stuff like that, and Paul George and like, those avenues are closed. I'm with Howard and that you had to do something. And I'm going to take Jimmy. We'll make Jimmy Butler work now. He got to be. He's got to be a good version of himself. That will always be the caveat for me. And I know what you're saying, Howard, about, like, for the years in Miami before recent events, like, he was good, but he wasn't. Right? Like, they were just keeping it under wraps because, like, everybody's winning, everybody's happy. But that doesn't mean he wasn't there ruffling feathers, right?
- [20:44]
Howard Beck
But he wasn't derailing things either.
- [20:46]
Logan Murdoch
Well, he wasn't derailing, but he's scary to me because, like, you would say logically, normally, right? Most people at their end of their career don't want it to, like, go completely sideways. They're like, no, I wouldn't do that. Jimmy's so wild cardish to me, and I don't know him. I'm just. I'm just watching him. Yeah, he's such a wild card that I wouldn't know, and that would scare me.
- [21:08]
Rob Harvilla
And another point to that, Raja. I have a couple points actually, to that one. One, I don't think that the warriors have the institutional infrastructure that the Heat do. To your point on that, right? So, like, where he can do all those things and there's a Udonis Haslam that's going to be like, hey, bro, chill behind the scenes. And also have a respected voice in that, right? Like, there's not an old head in that way, like Draymond is fiery, but he's not a Udonis Haslam type figure. That's an institutional figure.
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Logan Murdoch
Like that.
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Rob Harvilla
Right? Like, that's not. They don't have that. And also, like, there's no Pat Riley there. Right. There's no. It's just. So that would scare me as a. As someone in the warriors organization. Right? Because they're just somebody. They're. They're a. It's a hippie vibes type organization, man. They're. They're really cool. They're nice. But, like, they. What if everything that you see for the Golden State warriors is they try to deflect from confrontation Every time there's confrontation, they sweep that under the rug. Right.
- [22:17]
Logan Murdoch
You let a fox in the hen house.
- [22:20]
Rob Harvilla
Exactly.
- [22:22]
Logan Murdoch
Hey, come on in.
- [22:24]
Rob Harvilla
Yeah. On top of the fact that Howard and I got to push back on this, on top of the fact Jimmy Butler doesn't stay healthy. So, like, if they do all these things and he is in a perfect world, you know, really good alongside Steph, and I do think there's a world where he is where, you know, they're playing good defense and maybe they're not scoring 110 points, but they're winning by scoring 105 points. Right. Because they're playing lockdown defense. Another person that's really good on. On Gold State, Gary Payton, the second really good defender who also doesn't stay healthy, ironically. But this could go bad. Like, this could go really bad just for the. From the injury. Like, I. I am more. And I'm trying to shoot them bail and I'm trying to do glass half full, and you made a very good point. But I think the other side of it is. Is winning out here right now.
- [23:12]
Howard Beck
Beck, look there. There's downside with Jimmy's personality and all the stuff he can bring to the table if things aren't going well or if he's just in a mood to be a pain in the ass. There's downside on the health part of it for sure. Jimmy misses, like, whatever a quarter to a third of every season for the last however many years due to injury. You can't diminish any of that. You can't dismiss any of that. It's all real.
- [23:37]
Rob Harvilla
Also, one other thing really quickly from a strategic standpoint. And like, yes, the warriors do run similar offensive stretches as the Heat, but the warriors ain't got no shooters. There ain't no Duncan Robinson coming through that door. There's no Tyler hero going through that door. Right? Like, there's no. It's definitely A different type of roster. And Buddy Hield who's the second best shooter on the team has not been good this season shooting the basketball.
- [23:59]
Howard Beck
Yeah, I mean he. Heald's got to get, Heald's got to get his stroke back. Pajimski's got to get his stroke back. Moses Moody. Like they've got guys who we have seen be effective above average three point shooters for whatever reason. Some of them have just been out of sync this year. Pajemski with some sort of sophomore jinx and, and Buddy healed. I don't know what the heck's going on with Buddy healed but. And I think Wiggins was their, their second best volume three point shooter after Steph at the moment of the trade. So yeah, I mean all that's potentially concerning but they you at this stage of Steph's career arc, you maybe you have to figure out a different way to win and maybe that's by being a little bit more, as Raja said, grimy, more defensive minded, a little bit more mid range going on with, with Jimmy out there and some ISO with Jimmy at times. But like I like I'm not putting them in a, in the title conversation but my point has been all along and has been this way for the last five years or whatever with regard to LeBron and with regard to Steph and anybody else in their class. You owe it to them, you owe it to history, you owe it to your fans to do everything possible to make their final years as meaningful as possible. Especially when they're still playing at an all NBA level and Steph and LeBron are both going to be in the All Star Game. Steph might make the all NBA team, LeBron maybe not, but we'll see. But these guys are still playing at a really high level. So do whatever you've got to do. And if, and if, and if Jimmy Butler's the best you can pull out of this trade market, I'm fine with it because the clock's ticking and I don't, I don't, again, I don't know how many other avenues they really had or whether those things would have moved the needle any more than this does. So like, man, give it a shot. Like, I don't, I don't mind it. It is definitely a roll of the dice. I don't mind it. I think there's upside. I think they're better today than they were two days ago.
- [25:53]
Logan Murdoch
Yeah, no, I agree with that. I would also, I would also add a couple of things. Number like this isn't this isn't finished for, for what they're going to look like. You know, this is just what they look like. Now you've got the pillars now of what of, you know, you've got your foundation laid essentially. So now we're going to start, you know, putting up the walls and all the fringes and shit like that. That would be next summer. What type of pieces we're going to target to go around those guys and that's where obviously you're going to address some of the issues that you're talking about, Logan, as it relates to like the offense with the Heat and Golden State. They might not be the same offenses and they might not have the same weaponry. Right. But the biggest challenge for NBA players is going from a system where you are not used to running intricate shit and the ball is just basically with like a Luca ish team where you're in pick and roll and you're standing off the ball all the time to now you're in stuff where I need you moving and I need, I need the ball moving. And that's the biggest thing. It doesn't have to be exactly the same. Pieces can be interchanged. We might shoot better on this team or not. But just the fact that he's excelled on teams that would move people and move the ball and like operate in huge spurts of the game with action, I think makes him a fit for them when they want to do that.
- [27:10]
Howard Beck
By the way, can I just throw in one quick thing too? They got Jimmy for free. Basically. Like, no disrespect to Andrew Wiggins, but like, unless you were going to somehow be able to get the Andrew Wiggins of 2022 back, which doesn't seem like it's ever happening. You gave up a. An okay player and a bunch of role guys. Dennis Schroeder and Lindy Waters and like, you know, Kyle Anderson, like, and, and, and a pick this year that's going to be somewhere in the middle of the first round. You. You got a really good player.
- [27:41]
Rob Harvilla
You essentially flipped Klay Thompson for Jimmy Butler.
- [27:45]
Howard Beck
That's.
- [27:45]
Rob Harvilla
Yeah, well, along with Wiggins, then Wiggins.
- [27:49]
Howard Beck
Yeah, yeah. But, but it's. You're, you're getting a, you're getting like. Yes. You're having to pay him 110 or whatever. I've seen like 17 different versions of what his two year extension is. There's probably some incentives in there and stuff and people are probably, you know, inflating it a little bit. But whatever it is, it's a lot of money. To pay him, and you've tied your. Your fate to him for the next couple of seasons, but you basically got him for nothing. And he's one of the best players of his. Of. Of the era. You know, a perennial NBA candidate. When he's healthy, like, again, you got them for very little investment. Might as well.
- [28:23]
Rob Harvilla
Yeah, should be fine. One last thing on this. We started at the top with, like, clearly neither party wanted to have a partnership going into this trade deadline. And even, like, when I was watching the post game pressers, it didn't seem like anybody on the warriors was necessarily excited for this. Right. And granted, they were coming off of a collapse against the Utah Jazz, but Raja, with that being the case, is there. Do you. Do you anticipate any, like, awkward exchanges? Like, they. This is definitely a marriage of convenience. Do you. Or do you get over that pretty quickly in the locker room when Jimmy comes in? Right? When Jimmy knows that, like, I didn't want to be here and the team knows that, like, we didn't really want him a month ago, Is there going to be something residual from that or not?
- [29:16]
Logan Murdoch
Yeah, I mean, I don't know. Like, I. I think for the most part, they're going to be fine. I think a lot of it has to do with the culture you talked about within the building there. Like, they're just not. They don't seem to be built like that as an organization. Yeah, man. I. And I think, you know, the other thing is windows are very aligned there. Like, there's no time to be wasting on that dumb shit. You know what I mean? Like, we, We. We gotta get it cracking. We gotta get to work. We have to figure out in this last stretch of the season if we're viable this year, if. If we're not viable this year, what we. What we look like. Like, what do we do well as a group that's gonna be here moving forward, what has to go around that group? Because we do these things well to support that group. Like, there's a lot to do. So, yeah, I would. You know, as professional basketball players, I'd bet you're over that pretty quick. Let's get to work.
- [30:13]
Howard Beck
Let's add a couple of quick things here, Logan, before we move on. Just. Just in terms of the. The need. So The warriors are 25 and 25 as we sit here right now, right? They're ninth in the West. They're tied with. With the Kings and Suns there, but they're only a half game out of eighth, which is Dallas. We'll see what Dallas looks like with Anthony Davis, they're two and a half the warriors behind Minnesota for seventh. They're three games out of sixth. Like, they're really still right there. And the west is such a bizarre. Outside of Oklahoma, there's just feels like nothing is guaranteed. And the teams that are. A lot of the teams that are ahead of you, especially if you finish in the lower part of the bracket, if you're the warriors with Steph Draymond and Jimmy Butler going up against a Rockets team that's never been in the playoffs with a bunch of young guys.
- [30:58]
Logan Murdoch
Yeah.
- [30:59]
Howard Beck
Or even against the Grizzlies, bro.
- [31:01]
Rob Harvilla
Everybody is circling the wagons on the Rockets right now. They're like the Kings of a couple years ago. It's like, let's just get to the. Let's get the Rockets.
- [31:08]
Logan Murdoch
I think, quite frankly, I think that people got the Rockets messed up in that regard, but I do too. But I'm with Howard in that, like, if I were on a team like, that's the way I'd be looking at it. Like, if I was playing them, I'd be looking at it.
- [31:19]
Rob Harvilla
Because I think the Rockets are going to surprise a lot of people in the postseason. I think people are going to come with that attitude and get up, they're.
- [31:24]
Logan Murdoch
Going to get right. But that's what you're supposed to feel.
- [31:27]
Howard Beck
But, but they're also vulnerable and we've seen them like, dude, I. I just watched them lose to the Nets twice in a three, four day span or whatever. And they gagged the second one in Brooklyn just badly.
- [31:37]
Rob Harvilla
And.
- [31:38]
Howard Beck
And Fred Van Bleet didn't play that game. And like, if he's out there, things probably execute a little differently down the stretch. But still, like, I'm just saying there's opportunity for the warriors here. Are they going to win a championship? Probably not. Are they knocking out the Oklahoma City Thunder? Probably not. Is the west just a wild jumble of just mystery boxes? Yeah. And so you know, our guys, that Cram people should go check out his piece about the Jimmy Butler deal on on the ringer.com but you know, Cram's got some good stats about just how much the offense falls off when Steph's not on the court. Also a great Jimmy stat. Jimmy Butler over the last three seasons. This is from CRAM. Jimmy Butler ranks fourth in true shooting percentage among the 71 players with a usage rate of 24 or higher. So among high volume or high usage guys, he's behind only like two recent MVPs and Kevin Durant in in true shooting percentage. So like he's, he's still really valuable and there is opportunity here. So yeah, again I I'm, I got no problem with it Sometimes in basketball, 30 points could be worth more than 30 points and now you can get a 30% profit boost from the ringer with Fan Duels 30 on 30 during Friday's NBA action. That's right, the Ringer is teaming up with America's number one sportsbook to give you a 30% profit boost when you either pick a player to score more than 30 points or bet on our new exclusive 30 on 30 special markets. For instance, pick a game to have both teams score more than 30 points in the first quarter. Just looking at the Friday slate, there's a lot to like. I'm looking at Chae Gilgis Alexander playing against the Raptors. Shay's averaging 40 points over his last seven games and scored 50 plus three times in that span. I think he's a pretty good bet to clear 30 again. So whether you want to ride with my picks or make your own, just look for 30 on 30 in the FanDuel Sports app or head to FanDuel.com RingernBA for your chance to score a bigger payout this Friday. Don't miss your chance to find out how much 30 can be worth with FanDuel's 30 on 30 must be 21 and over and present in select states or 18 and over and present in DC. Opt in required bonus issued as non withdrawable profit boost tokens. Restrictions apply including any token expiration and max wager amount. See terms@sportsbook.fanduel.com gambling problem. Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com youm want.
- [34:09]
Logan Murdoch
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Rob Harvilla
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Rob Harvilla
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- [34:49]
Logan Murdoch
$15 a month, of course, if you enjoy overpaying. No judgments.
- [34:52]
Rob Harvilla
But that's Weird.
- [34:53]
Logan Murdoch
Okay, one judgment anyway, give it a try.
- [34:57]
Howard Beck
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- [35:11]
Rob Harvilla
The Lakers made another move, guys. Yeah, they got.
- [35:18]
Logan Murdoch
I'm sorry, guys. I can't stop coughing. I'm sorry.
- [35:22]
Howard Beck
Someone hit Roger some cough drops.
- [35:24]
Logan Murdoch
Christ, bro, I'm on blue game.
- [35:26]
Rob Harvilla
Ross, blue game. Roz is here, bro.
- [35:28]
Logan Murdoch
We're out here. Let's go.
- [35:31]
Rob Harvilla
Lakers received Mark Williams from the Charlotte Hornets. They traded Dalton cam reddish, a 2031 unprotected first round pick and have a 2030 pick swap with the Charlotte Hornets. Thoughts? Beck, how do you feel? How does this, how does this round out the quest for a championship in Los Angeles this year?
- [35:57]
Howard Beck
It's funny because we're just talking about like, well, Jimmy, as long as he's healthy. Mark Williams is 23 years old and is only in his third NBA season and he's missed a shit ton of games. He played 17 games. Or, excuse me, he played 43 games as a rookie, 19 last season and he's played in 23 this year. Mark Williams misses a lot of games. That said, very good scorer. But that highlight tape though, very good scorer and rebounder. He's not your classic rim protector type among bigs. Like I think I was reading it was Kevin Pelton or somebody had it earlier where like guy's field goal percentage against him at the rim is, is pretty decent. It's. It's not like he's not a great rim protector. At least with the Hornets he wasn't. Maybe he'll be better in a context of this Laker team. So they didn't just go out and get Rudy Gobert or even Walker Kessler, but they badly needed a good center. Somebody who's also, by the way, going to be on Lucas. Timeline. Again, this is not about LeBron, it's about Luca at this stage. But they got a big body to put in the middle. They filled out their roster. I feel better about the Lakers today than I did before they got Mark Williams, put it that way.
- [37:10]
Rob Harvilla
We'll see. I mean, for all the things that you said, like he could get you 15 to 7, but like if he ain't on the court and yeah, this is. The fact of the matter is with the Lakers is this is a two, three year process, man. You know, like this is. We talked about the warriors and I don't want to spend too much time on the Lakers because there's other deals that we need to talk about. We still need winners and losers, right? But like, they're going to be, they're going to be. We got to figure out what's going to happen this summer, and we got to figure out what's going to happen next summer. They still need to get a level of shooting. They still need to figure out what their identity is. They're still going to figure out, have to figure out the partnership between LeBron and Luka and how long, how that's going to last. And it's a weird time. And I think I've finally gotten to the point where I am used to seeing Luka in a Lakers jersey, but like, Luka is like the Don Dada right now, which is wild on a team with LeBron, and they're going to have to make up this team in his vision in a way. So it's weird, but this is a good pickup. I don't think it's going to make much of a difference this year. They just needed a center. They needed a, they needed a functioning starting center that is living and breathing. That's literally what they needed.
- [38:26]
Howard Beck
Roger, how much Mark Williams have you watched?
- [38:28]
Logan Murdoch
Not much.
- [38:30]
Rob Harvilla
Were you aware of his existence pre trade?
- [38:35]
Logan Murdoch
Yeah, but I hadn't watched him a lot. And honestly I had, I looked him up like when I saw the trade, just to see, you know, what he was as a player and shit like that. But, but I, this one, for me, there are two things. Like, guys, I mean, people know this. I'm not like deep dive in everybody's roster. Like, that's not my, that's not my jam. I would say this. The two things that are striking out, like sticking out the most are. One is what Howard said, which is everything moving forward that the Lakers do, how, how Luca centric the deal is, and the focus is on that as they move going forward. And then secondly, like you said, Logan, like, you just, I, I think it's a good deal because you needed a big body and you got it.
- [39:17]
Howard Beck
Yeah.
- [39:17]
Rob Harvilla
And he could do some pick and roll. He can do some good things with the ball. Like it's, yeah, if he's on the.
- [39:21]
Logan Murdoch
Court, like, you know, but like, you know, ifs was a fifth.
- [39:24]
Howard Beck
I mean, I, I, I do wonder about cost. Right. Like the, the, in their desperation to backfill Anthony Davis and they just didn't have any other serviceable, serviceable bigs to put out there. Like, is this the, the deal that they would have made in the summer when they had a full range of options and when they're not dealing with the desperation of, of a trade deadline coming down and trying to figure out how to, to make sure that this season goes the way they want it to, like Dalton connect, you know, decent, you know, decent young player Cam Reddish, whatever. But they gave up an unprotected first rounder in 2031. It's like their last chip that they could really spend and a pick swap in 2030, that almost certainly won't happen because the Hornets are in perpetual purgatory. You're never going to have to swap with them.
- [40:09]
Rob Harvilla
Hey, man, pick swaps are dope on the table. That's all that is.
- [40:12]
Howard Beck
But the 2031 pick, like, that was their last, you know, like, and you know there'll be more coming as they get past the draft and all that. But, like, I don't know, man. Like, is, is that, was that the right guy to, to fire your last chip on and is that, you know, like, like, how much, how much more do you have to do still this summer as you, as you kind of shift toward Lucas timeline and try to build around him? I don't know. I don't, I don't know. I, I, I would just say this. I hope the Lakers medical staff can figure out something that the Hornets medical staff has not with Mark Williams, because, you know, it's, even though the financial commitment isn't, isn't big, he's, I think, still in his rookie deal. The, you did send out some of the only good assets you had available, and that means you're not using them down the road.
- [41:04]
Rob Harvilla
Yeah, I mean, I wouldn't, I wouldn't have been mad. I mean, the only thing that's, that you're mad at is this first round pick. But they're expecting, no matter what they do, and I know it's in the interim that they're, they're mad at. You can't maybe make a trade or something like that. But they do have other assets that they could trade on this roster. But they gave away Cam Reddis and Dalton, who were rotational players at best. You know, like I, Cam Reddish, I don't even. He's not a factor on that roster whatsoever.
- [41:30]
Howard Beck
No, he's just a guy.
- [41:32]
Rob Harvilla
He's just a guy. A really good basketball player compared to me, but, you know, it's just fine. All right, enough Laker talk, guys. Jesus. We just find a way to put him on. Put them on. Much to Roger's chagrin Anybody see the Darien Fox first game against the Hawks? Geez, this could turn out pretty good, guys.
- [41:57]
Howard Beck
He looked, he looked great. He looked really happy, didn't he?
- [42:00]
Rob Harvilla
It was like one of those things where like you forget because the Kings operate in relative obscurity in. For such a long time, you forget like when they do have good players and when good players are happy and how they play when they're happy. I remember that I was the first step back three that Fox had was just butter. Looked like he was playing in the park. It was great to watch. I'm happy for him.
- [42:27]
Logan Murdoch
Yeah. Sometimes you need just a fresh start, a breath of fresh air, just. And it doesn't even have to be as much shade as we throw at Sacramento, and rightfully so. Sometimes it doesn't even have to be because they screwed anything up. It could just be, you know, you've overstayed your welcome. There's a. You're past the expiration date on that and, and getting somebody with talent and, and real legs under them and a real skill set and like in another situation now his is going to be like really crazy because you're with Wemby and, and you're with an organization like the spurs and all of the, all of the great things that are. Are there waiting for him. But just generally speaking, getting a guy out of something and into something new can be. Can be kind of rejuvenating for him.
- [43:11]
Rob Harvilla
I also love Howard. The, the three point guard lineup that they have going with Chris Paul, Castle and Fox, like that could be something. I'm really like excited to see what this team can do. Right. I mean, they're also in the play in mix as well. That'll be fun to watch down the stretch. Right. Is see if Wimby can. I want to see if he can like galvanize his team enough to at least get into a play in and like skip Wimby in the playoffs. Why not?
- [43:39]
Howard Beck
I mean, I'm right in the mix, dude. I'm look. So the spurs back to the standings two games behind the warriors right now. So the spurs are in 12th. But you know, even if the warriors rise, the Suns are teetering. I think the Kings are teetering. You never know about the Timberwolves. Like, I don't know how many spots the spurs can move up, but I think they're at least getting into the play in. And do you want to be facing Wemby Dear and Fox, Stefan Castle, Chris Paul, Devin Vassell, Keldon Johnson, like that's a Frisky team like Chris Paul is not. Is no longer frisky, but the rest of the team's really frisky. And Chris Paul's still really good and really effective.
- [44:19]
Rob Harvilla
You know what the streets need, Howard? We need. We need Houston versus San Antonio. That's what we need. First round. That would be amazing. I.
- [44:27]
Howard Beck
Look, I'll just say it now. The spurs are making the playoffs. I don't know which position they'll be in.
- [44:32]
Rob Harvilla
Let's go. Let's go.
- [44:33]
Logan Murdoch
Okay.
- [44:34]
Howard Beck
I love Dear and Fox there. I love what I saw. Overreaction theater one game. They look awesome. They look great. I mean, and. And not. Not to overstate it, they were awesome at times and not so awesome other moments last night. But they. It looks like it's going to fit really easily. Like, Dear and Fox looked like. Like he's just slipping right into place there, finding a rhythm with. With Wemby throwing lobs to him at the rim. Seem. Seems like the easiest job in the world. And I, I think this was a great move for the spurs. And I'm, you know, we'll get to winners and losers and Sacramento might land on my list, but, like, the Kings did not get enough back and I don't know why they had to make this deal when they made it.
- [45:16]
Rob Harvilla
I will say I'm just gonna. I gotta. You know, we gotta play all sides on real ones. Right? I will just say this about Fox. I think he's a really great player. I think the criticism of him in Sacramento is sometimes he can disappear in games, and sometimes when he's not mad, he can just be out in the corner. And that would piss a lot of people off within the fan base and also some people in the organization where, you know, he's standing in the corner letting, like, Malik, Monk and other guys carry the offense down the stretch of a game even though he was in the running. Did he win Clutch Player of the Year a couple years ago?
- [45:53]
Howard Beck
He won the very first one.
- [45:54]
Rob Harvilla
He won the very first one. Right. He can be clutch, but sometimes he can disappear within games. I don't know if that was necessarily because it was a function of Sacramento and what they were doing, but that can't fly when you're on this stage and the lights are on you in San Antonio because that will get exposed. So that's one. That's the. The other caveat I would have on the De'Aaron Fox deal.
- [46:15]
Logan Murdoch
No doubt.
- [46:16]
Rob Harvilla
You don't like. Sorry, you don't like the. Huh?
- [46:18]
Logan Murdoch
I said no doubt. Yeah, I'm Just fucking go. Sorry.
- [46:22]
Rob Harvilla
You go, buddy. Yo.
- [46:23]
Logan Murdoch
Good.
- [46:24]
Rob Harvilla
I don't know how we're going to edit this, but I just want to say early ruin of the week candidate right now is Raja Bell, who's like really just fucking fighting through this pod. Who's like really getting through it. Crazy because he said, let's hurry this shit up because I have a flag football game to catch. And the fact that he's going to score three touchdowns in this flag football game.
- [46:44]
Howard Beck
You're playing in this thing, Roger?
- [46:45]
Logan Murdoch
What? No. Hell no.
- [46:46]
Rob Harvilla
Oh, okay. All right. Yeah.
- [46:48]
Logan Murdoch
Zen's playing. Listen, man, I'm going to tell. I was in the bed. You ever had to like I was so cold in this bed. I had a down. We're in Miami, man.
- [46:58]
Rob Harvilla
That's what I'm saying. What's the weather right now?
- [46:59]
Logan Murdoch
It's 82 degrees, man. I'm under this blanket, like sweating for hours, but I couldn't even sleep. It's the wildest, but I'm, you know, I'm struggling now, but I feel better than that. I just got this damn hacking cough in. My head's killing me.
- [47:12]
Rob Harvilla
But did you win or lose the trade deadline?
- [47:16]
Logan Murdoch
I lost that shit unequivocally, bro.
- [47:17]
Rob Harvilla
I'm out first.
- [47:20]
Logan Murdoch
Not even question back.
- [47:21]
Rob Harvilla
Anything else on the. On the, like, anything else on the Deer and Fox? Also, one other thing question that I do have that we haven't really like spoken of right here, like about the San Antonio spurs that I think is something I don't think is being talked about enough. Like where's Pop? You know, and how does that. That also throws a wrench into the future of whatever the spurs are going to be. It's going to be a huge wrench. We haven't really heard much about him. We know what the spurs are really tight lipped about such things. I heard a little bit that he's recovering, but not much because again, it's the Spurs. He had a stroke. This is a tough, tough terrain to deal with in this time. But how do they navigate this right now? Because that's a huge, huge piece to what they're trying to build.
- [48:11]
Howard Beck
Yeah, I mean, I haven't really checked in with them in a while. I have heard some things about, about Pop from folks around the league, but, you know, I think at this stage of the season, do you. Do you expect him. He's going to come back? You know, probably not. Is he going to coach next season? I don't like. I think there's a lot of unknown there. I'm not reporting that. I'm just saying like, I think it's just the obvious. It's the logical thing. But you know, Mitch Johnson's done a really nice job. It seems like they're in good hands and they still got a lot of, you know, you know, R.C. buford's still around. They've got a lot of people who have been steering this franchise for a long time who are still in place. Like, I don't worry about the spurs in that regard.
- [48:50]
Rob Harvilla
Okay. I mean I just think that like that would. Even if they do get a new coach or if the current coaches in place, that's going to be. It's going to be a huge difference going forward. Like that's going to be at least some sort of identity turnover, right? I mean, not necessarily from the organizational standpoint, but like having a new coach after having a stall wars like that for so long is going to be an adjustment. I mean, we'll see. But it's just interesting because you're going to have, you have this generational town in Wimby and you know, you want to be delicate with that. So we'll see. Who's your big. Who are, who are winners? I'm gonna start with. I'm gonna start with Raja. Who are our winners? Your winner of this trade deadline.
- [49:34]
Logan Murdoch
Who's a winner? I mean, I mean the Lakers are a winner, right? Like you got fucking Luka Doncic their winners. But I think DeAndre Hunter, big winner, huge winner, like, and you're now on the number one team in the league. Are they still number one in the league? I mean, look at the state. There's number one in the league, right?
- [50:05]
Howard Beck
Yes.
- [50:06]
Rob Harvilla
Yeah.
- [50:08]
Logan Murdoch
No, no.
- [50:09]
Howard Beck
Slightly behind Oklahoma, number one in the East. Yeah. So yeah. But the other hand under the Cavs, like the Cavs are a big winner there too. Like they're. The other hand is a winner. The Cavs are a winner for getting him.
- [50:19]
Logan Murdoch
That was phenomenal move for sure.
- [50:21]
Rob Harvilla
Kyle Kuzma got the hell out of Washington one. I don't know if the Bucks necessarily. I didn't say the Bucks were definitely.
- [50:29]
Howard Beck
I will say this about the Bucks, about that move. The word around the league is that Chris Middleton is just kind of toast. I hate to say it. And if that's the case, if you traded a Chris Middleton who's not really functional anymore or won't be for very much longer for a much younger Kyle Kuzma, you know, fit aside, that's a.
- [50:48]
Rob Harvilla
Really good deal for this. Right? Has a descending deal.
- [50:50]
Howard Beck
Yeah, yeah.
- [50:52]
Rob Harvilla
Kyle Guzman, like, yeah. I mean, it's a good. It's a decent move. I just. I've seen a lot of Kyle Kuzma this season, and a lot of it has been.
- [50:59]
Logan Murdoch
Well, he.
- [50:59]
Rob Harvilla
Yeah. Not caring whatsoever.
- [51:02]
Logan Murdoch
That's another. That's another one. Right? Like, in fairness to Kyle. I should have been fairer to Kyle when. When I said. I didn't say the Bucks won. You're in a bad situation. It brings out. It brings out, like, you can only be in those so long before they start bringing out bad habits in you. Right? So, you know, you get somewhere and there's a breath of fresh air and there's an opportunity. Like, who knows. Who knows what kind of services he provides for. For Milwaukee.
- [51:25]
Howard Beck
He was a good, responsible role player on that Lakers championship team. Right. Like, you put him in the right situation with stars around him and where he knows his role and his place and is not trying to say, like, I'm the guy now. You're not. You're not doing that when you're playing next to Giannis and Dame. So, yeah, Raj is right. Like you, it's easy to get caught up in yourself when you're in a no. No situation where the team's tanking and you just start thinking about your own stats. Now he's got to think about something else. So, like, there's a good chance that the Bucks get the best version of Kuzma.
- [52:00]
Rob Harvilla
Not for nothing, though, Kyle Kuzma, I don't know if he was clairvoyant or what, but that. That decision not to go to Dallas is looking really good right now.
- [52:08]
Logan Murdoch
He knew something. It was a third eye. My winner. To your point, my winners are going to be the Cleveland Cavs and DeAndre Hunter. Like, I think I'll just distill it down to those two.
- [52:20]
Rob Harvilla
Show Beck who are your winners.
- [52:22]
Howard Beck
We don't. We don't have to get cute about this. Right? Like, the Lakers won the trade deadline, right? Like they. They just did. They got Luca done.
- [52:30]
Rob Harvilla
You said that. While we have it, while we have a Celtics fan on the line and we have a Warriors fan just. And Ben Cruz just. I'm surprised he hasn't cried right now because he was looking really disheveled coming onto this call.
- [52:44]
Howard Beck
The Lakers won the trade deadline by a mile. That's just. That's just the truth of it. But I want to say this, too. You know what else won the trade deadline? The NBA won the trade deadline. Because after. After. Listen, after all this stuff about second aprons and the market's going to be really tight and it's like a hard cap and nobody can move anything. And everybody's. The whole system's locked up. We saw a ton of activity in the last several days, including Luca, only an MVP candidate. Jimmy Butler, only, you know, multiple time all NBA guy. Darren Fox, really good young player. Brandon Ingram, Zach Levine, like, these are not, you know, the. The tenth men on rosters. Like, these are significant players that just got moved and. And on top of that, yeah, DeAndre Hunter to Cleveland. Like, the Cavaliers having a historically great season for them who look like they're in a position to possibly challenge the Celtics, not possibly to challenge the Celtics. And they just filled like the one potential weak spot in their starting five by getting DeAndre Hunter. You know, Clippers picked up Bogdanovich. There's been a bunch of moves. Like, at that level, there was a shit ton of activity. And here we are super bowl week and a ton of people are talking about, like, you know, Luka Doncic and Jimmy Butler getting traded and all this other stuff. The NBA like, like give them their props for this. Like, whatever we thought about the CBA, shit's still getting done. Again, like the. The GMs win too, by the way. The GMs in a. In a system that is tighter, that.
- [54:12]
Rob Harvilla
Is harder to make, almost all of them do.
- [54:14]
Howard Beck
Well. Yeah, a lot of.
- [54:16]
Rob Harvilla
We'll get to that in the loser section.
- [54:18]
Howard Beck
Yeah, some of them made a lot of moves and maybe we shouldn't be praising them for it, but I'm just saying the creativity of front offices is still winning out. Even in a. The system is tighter, it is harder to make deals. But these guys just got a ton of business done in the last several days. And so, like, that is a good sign for the league. Not just because transactions are fun for everybody and great content and fans love it, but because you do need enough flexibility in the system to make roster adjustments. And it's still there. So the NBA won.
- [54:52]
Rob Harvilla
Well, you guys took all my stuff and then made your own points and made the points I was going to make on the winners.
- [54:58]
Howard Beck
There's still other winners.
- [55:01]
Rob Harvilla
I just want to say I'm going to start. The biggest loser of this all is Rob Pelinka's jacket. Jesus Christ. It's pretty bad.
- [55:13]
Howard Beck
No, we all win because there's been so many great Rob Pelinka jacket jokes. So.
- [55:19]
Rob Harvilla
Rob Pelinka one though I do want to. Like, we could say the Lakers, right? Obviously we could say the Lakers as a whole one. The deadline they did. But I do. We do. Should give special props to Rob Pelinka and in a lot of ways has transformed his reputation league wide. Right like he is. There's a reason why he took that picture after Luca got off the private jet in the, in the sprinter van with Luca like, yeah, I did this. That's the reason why he wore that hideous leather jacket because he did this. And. And the special roley because he did this. So I think that Rob Pelinka definitely wins it. I want to do. Want to give a great shout out to that. I want to give a. Let's go to the losers really quickly and I think we should start off. I have other losers that I want to get to. Obviously. Nico Harrison, no matter how you ever spend this is just a loser. We have talked about him in depth. I want to ask this question.
- [56:10]
Logan Murdoch
No, no, no, no, we ain't gonna do that.
- [56:13]
Rob Harvilla
You. You wanna. He lost the trade deadline though, did he not?
- [56:17]
Logan Murdoch
I guess. That's my guy.
- [56:19]
Rob Harvilla
He came.
- [56:19]
Howard Beck
The Lakers are the biggest winner of the trade deadline. Then the Mavericks are the biggest loser of the trade deadline.
- [56:23]
Rob Harvilla
Roger. No, but here's the thing though. I get it because Roger's a great friend and this is what Roger. This is. This is like the, this is like the 2020 Russell Westbrook slander award for like, you don't slander him, but I don't have a reason why you can right now, but you better not fucking slander him in my presence. And I respect it. I respect it. I just want to use this as a question and I was thinking it, but Isaiah Blakely just brought it up in the, in the pre pod meeting and I agree with him. What the hell are the Toronto Raptors doing, ladies and gentlemen? What are they doing? What plan do they have? What is Versailles Jerry doing? He traded for Brandon Ingram. That means he's going to have to pay Brandon Ingram. They're building around Scotty Barnes, who I'm not sure is a. He's a decent player, but I'm not sure he's better than decent. He gets good stats, but doesn't necessarily elevate that team. What is the. What is the goal here, Beck? What the hell are the Raptors doing?
- [57:19]
Howard Beck
It seems to me like they haven't picked like first they didn't pick a direction once Kawhi left, right. It was, well, we're going to try to meander along with what's left of the championship team. And that didn't work so well. They belatedly start tearing it apart. They trade Siakam they trade OG Anunoby. They lost Van Vliet along the way for nothing. And I thought like, the Anunoby trade brought back, you know, quickly and Barrett and it looked like, all right, like there's, you know, the outline of something here. But the, in their, not in fairness, the context of this is that no team that doesn't have a clear franchise star ever completely have a clear direction. Right? Like, if you think Scotty Barnes is going to actually be a perennial NBA player who you can build around, that gives you clarity, you know exactly what you need to do. But when Scotty Barnes is. Sometimes looks like a franchise star and sometimes looks like it's just a really good, like, complimentary type star, like more of a Lamar Odom type or something, like, then it's harder to, to, to pick a direction because you don't have, you don't have that North Star for that to, to, to provide that clarity. And so what they're doing instead right now is being opportunistic, right? Oh, Brandon Ingram's available for practically nothing. We got a Bruce Brown contract. We need to move anyway. Yeah, why not? But yeah, he's coming up on free agency. And then what are they willing to pay him? And do they, do they already have a sense of what that will be? Are they actually keeping him? And if they're not, then what was the point of this exercise? So, you know, and I haven't checked in with people in the wake of that one to see if there's a specific, you know, narrative around that trade about what the intentions are. But like, yeah, the Raptors are confusing.
- [59:04]
Rob Harvilla
Got another loser here. It's a, it's a brief loser. Danny Ainge, for anything that he, he messed around and helped a team that he hated. You know, you hate, you hate helping out your ops, help facilitating the deal to get Luka Doncic to the lake.
- [59:18]
Howard Beck
He picked up more second round picks. He's just stockpiling stuff, trying to figure out he's stockpiling.
- [59:22]
Rob Harvilla
But, you know, it's like you're still bad that you, that you helped an op when you didn't know you were going to help. It's always some, always bad.
- [59:29]
Howard Beck
Laker fans are having a field day with that part of it. I will say that, yes, they are.
- [59:35]
Rob Harvilla
You brought up the Kings and I know those are one of your losers back.
- [59:38]
Howard Beck
Kings with an A. Kings.
- [59:41]
Rob Harvilla
Kangs or Kangs. Kings are kings. Kings. Okay.
- [59:44]
Howard Beck
No, they're back to being the Kangs. I'm sorry. I like a lot of People there. But it. They're back to being Kangs. They got no direction.
- [59:50]
Rob Harvilla
Are they acting like SAC State right now?
- [59:53]
Howard Beck
Stop that. You got me in trouble with Sam Amick already once in the last couple of weeks with your SAC State slander, which he just then blames me for, even though both times you're the one to bring him up. Go Aggies. Anyway, see, that's.
- [60:04]
Rob Harvilla
That's what's cool about not. Not going to college and not. You can slander everyone's college. I can slander UC Davis if I wanted to. Don't you dare.
- [60:13]
Howard Beck
Don't you dare. No, the. The Kings man. I understand difficult situation here where Dear and Fox has basically indicated I'm not signing the extension. And I probably would like to go somewhere else and it would probably prefer it to be San Antonio. They didn't get enough back. They should have gotten there. There was the one first round pick that the spurs owned from the Hawks, I think in this year's draft. Like that would have been a nice piece to get. Maybe you were never going to get Stefan Castle or, or V or somebody else, but like, my gosh, you had to get more for Dear and Fox. He's your franchise star. He's the best thing that had happened to you in a long time. And you're. You're now like the number of ways in which this has just gone wrong. And then Monty McNair, the GM has to sit there the other day, has to sit there. He finally does a press conference, right? The Kings never put anybody out there to talk about why they fired Mike Brown. Like not unheard of, but incredibly rare and very bad form by any pro sports franchise to not address why you fired your coach at the time that you did it. And so here he's having a press conference to talk about trading Dear and Fox for Zach lavine. And the very first question, as it should be, I don't know who asked it, but props to them for doing it. Tell us why you fired Mike Brown a month and a half or whatever it was ago and didn't talk about it. Why. Why'd you fire him? And why didn't you. Why didn't you address it? And Monty McNair with weeks for them to decide what the message would be. Basically said we were too busy. Like that was the basic thing. Like we had a lot. We. There was a lot going on and I'm sorry, that's not it. You owe it to your fans to. To explain the decision that why you fired the. Not so long ago Coach of the year led you to your best, your franchise's best season in 20 years. And so like, it. It just feels like the battle days with the Kings again.
- [62:09]
Rob Harvilla
Your.
- [62:09]
Howard Beck
Your franchise player has been traded for. For an insufficient return. You fired the coach of the year.
- [62:16]
Rob Harvilla
You have a lame duck head coach right now, right?
- [62:19]
Howard Beck
Like, I mean, who knows, maybe Doug Christie becomes the guy. But like, I just. Again, you want to know where a franchise is heading? Where are they heading? What is their direction? Like, Zach Levine's a really good player, but you were better off with De'Aaron Fox and Sabonis and company than Zach Levine and DeMar DeRozan reenacting their Chicago Bulls mediocre teams from a couple of years ago. Like, so where is this going other than just like spinning your wheels? And like, I, again, I feel for Kings fans, like, this is a really frustrating team and they just. Just had some good vibes and good and feeling like everything was in the right direction. Light the beam, all of it, just a year and a half ago, and it's just all dissipated.
- [63:02]
Rob Harvilla
I mean, I think it. It's from ownership on down. I mean, I.
- [63:05]
Howard Beck
It's ownership. Let's be clear.
- [63:07]
Rob Harvilla
It's definitely ownership. Vivek run a dve and like, just from a standpoint of even, like, you didn't get a good return on it. But like, I think Vivek more than anything, more than he wants to win, I think he just wants to be relevant, right? And he wants to be on tv. He wants to say, hey, I got Zach Levine. Hey, you know, I'm surprised I didn't get Kuzma at the. At the trade deadline because they love, like, they just love random. He. Whoever the Kings get is just like a random love because of a random love affair that Vivek has with said player, right? Or even from a politics standpoint, behind the scenes, like, you say you empower Monty McNair, but then you have Lottie Divock sitting next to you in the courtside, right? Like, completely. Even from, like, even from a. Even if Vladi is not doing anything, like, that's just bad optics. You have your former GM right there by your side as Monty mc. And I get that Vladi Divock is a former, Is a great in Sacramento, but this is just a weird thing that they have going. And that's just the politics right there and how you're undermine. You continue to undermine your head coaches. Everybody is scared to become a head coach there because they thought that they already knew that Doug Christie was going to be in the wings. If you ever got on Vivek's bad side and he fired you, like, that was. There was no trust anywhere within that organization because there's just so much innuendo, there's so much backstabbing, as you can see. Like, it's just not. And it starts with the face of that is the owner of that Granadive. And they're not going to get right until they get out of their own way.
- [64:49]
Howard Beck
Vlade, by the way, who was the one who passed on Luca to take Marvin Bagley, who got traded again today. So they, they passed on Luca and took Marvin Bagley instead, obviously.
- [65:02]
Rob Harvilla
And that might have been some like, some, like, European, like, beef.
- [65:05]
Howard Beck
Yeah. Some intel or whatever. Who knows, but whatever. So that happens. Right? And the, and part of the excuse for, for not drafting Luca was, well, we have Deer and Fox. We didn't think that they would fit together. Then they eventually make a really savvy draft pick of Tyrese Halliburton. But Halliburton and Fox don't seem altogether compatible. So you trade Halliburton for Sabonis, then you have the best season you've had in 20 years with Fox and Sabonis as your pillars, and now Dear and Fox is gone. So you passed on Luca because of Deer and Fox, and then you traded away Tyrese Halliburton because of Dear and Fox, and now you don't have Deer and Fox. Like, this is just, you know, this is different front offices along the way, and it's different decision points, and these things aren't all necessarily related, but they kind of are also. And it's just a bad sequence of events that.
- [65:52]
Rob Harvilla
Well, it's a pattern, right? Like, it's not only that's just like the draft stuff. Right. But then you talk about how Mike Brown was fired. That happened with Mike Malone a decade ago. With this, with the people that are in place, there's just so much turnover. And so much turnover. God, I feel for the fans, but the fans don't even actually criticize this team locally. Like, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, I get it, but it's just give the.
- [66:20]
Howard Beck
Media credit, though, that I watched that. Media does good. They went hard at it yesterday.
- [66:26]
Rob Harvilla
I get it. No, no, no, they did a good job. I, I, I'm not talking about the media. I'm talking about the fan base. Because, I mean, they're still, they're happy to have a basketball team right now. Right? And it's it's tough to. For a fan base to. I think so. I mean, they're happy to be. Have you been to a Kings game lately? Yes, they are happy to have a basketball team anyways. I feel like we bashed the Kings and I feel bad that we always go. We go hard on the Kings on the real ones pod. But, you know, it is what it is. Any other moves that tickled anyone's fancy before we get out of here? Any, any moves that we needed that, that you like back, Any moves that you like Raja, that were savvy?
- [67:01]
Logan Murdoch
Go ahead, Howard.
- [67:02]
Howard Beck
No, I was just gonna say one more loser. Like the Suns lost too. Like, they, they wanted Jimmy Butler. They couldn't get him. They couldn't get Bradley Bezo, no trade clause. They at least, you know, looked around on, on Katie trades, I think, and they're just, they did, you know, they, they, they offloaded Nurkic and I think it caused.
- [67:18]
Rob Harvilla
Hold on. Also, they talked themselves briefly into trading Kevin Durant for Jimmy Butler.
- [67:23]
Howard Beck
Yeah. Right.
- [67:25]
Rob Harvilla
So for what, though? Like, it was like, for no reason at all. Just said, hey, we're. They could have just said, no, no, it's. We're not getting there. Somebody's untouchable.
- [67:34]
Howard Beck
Yeah. I don't understand what that. Where that would have gotten them or, or why they even entertained that. But at one point, what I had heard yesterday was it was going to be Durant to the Warriors. The Suns would have landed Jimmy Butler and Kuminga and a first, I think that was coming from the warriors, and then Wiggins, Schroeder and Picks would have gone to Miami. So that was the outline of a, of a deal that I heard was on the table up until Katie made it clear that he wasn't going to participate. And, and maybe that wasn't the full thing, but that, that was the outline that somebody had provided to me yesterday morning. But, but the Suns are kind of dead in the water and they've got a, they've got a lot to figure out. And it certainly seems clear at this point that they have rightly concluded that this is not going anywhere. And so like, I'll be shocked if they don't trade Durant this summer. And who knows, maybe it'll be even more extensive than that. Maybe they find somebody. Maybe Bradley Beal will waive his no trade clause and they'll, they'll offload him too. And, but the, the Suns are heading for a reckoning because this, this season is, is, is rapidly getting away from.
- [68:43]
Rob Harvilla
Them and we're already Getting reports that the. Sorry, Raja about your son's buddy. We're already getting reports that the locker room dynamic is getting toxic after this. It's from Ramona Shelburne of espn. It's. It's tough. And also, like, the trade for what golden stated in. In Phoenix for Durant, seemed like everybody was making plans and no one asked Durant. What he wanted to do was like, hey, we got this deal in place, just in case you try to go. He's like, nah, I'll pass. I'm good. What? Yikes. Anyways, that has been our trade deadline extravaganza. Before we go, though, this is a rare time that we have Howard here for this, but we're gonna do it. It's time for real. One of the week. I can go first, and you guys can think of your ruins the week gonna go first. This hits dear to. This hits near and dear to my heart. I'm not sure how much it hits to Beck, but it might moving my ruin of the week to Dennis Richmond of KTVU Fox News here in the Bay Area. He passed away this week. For my whole childhood, he was a stalwart on the 10 o'clock news. He was like, the cool. It was. Him and Barry White Roger were like two of the coolest black dudes that I had ever seen growing up. You know what I mean? He was like. He would say, welcome to the 10:00 news. This is Dennis Richmond, and he was the shit. And if you go look at. Every once in a while, I go on YouTube and look up archival footage of Dennis Richmond. There's him in 85 with fires behind him, but he has the cleanest Afro with the cleanest suit. Just giving you the news old school style, talking about everything that's dope and not dope about what's going on in the Bay Area, but he was always dope. Shout out Dennis Richmond. My role of the week, no doubt.
- [70:33]
Howard Beck
I haven't lived in the Bay area in, like, 30 years or whatever it is, but, yeah, like, I just. I had to look him up because, like, the name didn't quite. And I, as soon as I saw him, like, yep, I grew up watching that guy, too. Like, that's how long and that's how much of an institution Dennis Richmond was is that Logan and I, who are separated by about a half century of years on this earth, both grew up watching this guy deliver the News on Channel 2. So, yeah, shout out and rest in peace to Dennis Richmond.
- [71:02]
Logan Murdoch
Go ahead, Howard. You did.
- [71:03]
Howard Beck
You got yours yeah, so this is a little. A little off the wall, but my real one of the week is I'm not gonna use his last name, just Carlos. Carlos is a die hard Mavericks fan and Luca fan who last spring had sent me very unkind tweet. He wasn't the only one. I got a bunch of them after I wrote that piece about Luca, which we discussed a little bit on the POD earlier this week. And I don't usually, you know, respond to people, but I responded to him because of something specific that he said. He felt so bad about it that he apologized. I had that little tip jar thing going on Twitter at the time. And so he sent me like 20, 20 bucks via Venmo. And I went and I messaged him back. I'm like, thank you, but like, that's not necessary. Just like donate to charity or something. And he's like, he's like, listen, you can donate to charity. So I, I upped it to like, whatever. I sent 50 bucks to like the food bank in New York or whatever. And so partially with. With the money that, that Carlos sent. And that was really nice. It was like this rare moment of. Of. Of kindness and just human kind of understanding on a platform, social media, where things can get really toxic and really impersonal and really mean spirited very quickly. And so he, he, you know, he apologized, he makes this, this, this donation and this, this nice gesture. And the reason I bring him up now is he was listening to our pod earlier this week after the Luca trade, and he messaged me again. I think it was over, over Venmo, because that's where we're now connected. He says, I was listening to real ones. It reminded me of this unfortunate interaction from last year. At the time, I was upset with even the notion that anyone would think Luca was not as valuable as I thought he was. Looking back at it, it's not a crazy premise for an article. And it seems like Nico Harrison was grappling with the conundrum too. All good things come to an end. I just thought there was more time. And so I bring that up just because I just feel like, thank you, Carlos. I really appreciate that. I appreciate that you're listening to the pod. I appreciate the follow up. I did send him a note back also earlier today, but just again, there's so much negativity and so much toxicity on social media, and people will treat any of us who are even semi in the public sphere very, you know, like, like we're. We're just another thing to bash sometimes. And it's rare that we see that, bro.
- [73:24]
Rob Harvilla
We got feelings too, man. That hurts, but. I'm gonna lie.
- [73:27]
Howard Beck
But. And you learn to kind of brush it off and you learn it just kind of comes with it. But like, people, especially on that story, I would. They were just like, you know, kicking the crap out of me. And it gets really. It's not even about the story anymore or about Luca or about basketball. It gets, you know, really personal and obnoxious. So, you know, you appreciate when you actually have the human reaction where it breaks through and you act like people and it's like, you know what? Didn't need to go there. Appreciate it. So appreciate the follow up. Thank you, Carlos. Thank you for listening. And he's my real one of the week.
- [73:58]
Rob Harvilla
Thanks, Carlos. Thanks for listening to the pod too, bro. And thanks to everybody for listening to.
- [74:02]
Logan Murdoch
Your real one, two real good, real ones. So I'm going to make mine simple. It's going to be a joke, but it's going to be real. It's going to be my wife for this fucking theraflu.
- [74:09]
Rob Harvilla
She's about to give me shout out, Sin.
- [74:13]
Logan Murdoch
Yeah, thanks for the run to cvs because the boy's struggling.
- [74:16]
Howard Beck
Hope she's got some.
- [74:17]
Rob Harvilla
Are you gonna make it out of the house?
- [74:19]
Logan Murdoch
I'm gonna have to go sit off to the side on a fence, like, away from everybody. But I owe Zen. I gotta go to the game. I can't miss it.
- [74:25]
Rob Harvilla
Are you gonna. Are you gonna be like, on the side, like, looking fake, hungover with the glasses on, like. Yeah.
- [74:31]
Logan Murdoch
Oh, yeah. I'll just be sitting there minding my business. So I don't get nobody sick. But. But she's my real one, so I.
- [74:35]
Rob Harvilla
Need that shout out, Sin. Obviously ruin of the week every week, but shout out to you, Roger, bro. Cause, like, I don't think people. Maybe they will see if there's the. No, stop. Because I'm giving me.
- [74:46]
Logan Murdoch
Please don't put no viral clips. Don't put nothing up on me on that shit. That's what you was about to say. Don't bend whoever does.
- [74:53]
Rob Harvilla
No shit. Nope, nope. Leave it in because I want to give him his flowers. Can I give my big bro his flowers?
- [74:58]
Logan Murdoch
Oh, this part I'm saying don't put me up there looking sick as a dog on no viral shit is what I'm saying.
- [75:03]
Rob Harvilla
Oh, okay, okay. I mean, you might. We might be on YouTube, but he might just, like, do a two shot with me and Howard. But, like, damn, let me get my big bro some flowers, dog.
- [75:11]
Logan Murdoch
I wasn't trying to stop you from that.
- [75:13]
Rob Harvilla
Oh, okay. Here. Hey. Anyways, Raja ruin is also a real one of the week, bro. Because, like, y'all can't hear and they're probably going to edit all the damn coughs. But, like, Raja held it down today. Raja held it down today.
- [75:29]
Logan Murdoch
Some of that can't be edited out, I'm sure. Like, Howard, like, you can't edit all of that out.
- [75:35]
Rob Harvilla
No, no, no, you can because they're separate tracks. But, like, yeah, Roger held it down and he was looking rough.
- [75:43]
Logan Murdoch
I'm sorry if my content was poor today, guys. I really.
- [75:45]
Rob Harvilla
And he. We did it. We did a different time change. Raja held it down. This is like almost to when he didn't golf with Michael Jordan and came to go claim to go do the.
- [75:55]
Logan Murdoch
Not even close. That's still. To this day, I'm still like, what were you, bro? What were you thinking?
- [76:01]
Rob Harvilla
Oh, man. Anyways, before we get out of here, real onesmailbackgmail.com realonesmailback gmail.com realwithsmailback gmail.com what's that email, Howard?
- [76:08]
Howard Beck
Real onesmailback gmail.com what'S the.
- [76:11]
Rob Harvilla
What's the. What is it again, Raja? What's the email@gmail.com? also, make sure you get your tickets. We're almost sold out. So if you're trying to go to the if you're trying to go to the punchline on February 15, you better get your tickets now. Stop catting off.
- [76:26]
Logan Murdoch
I might pop out and give me something new, bro. I might get a fit dog.
- [76:29]
Rob Harvilla
Who knows?
- [76:31]
Logan Murdoch
You just got me rolling.
- [76:32]
Rob Harvilla
Oh, Roger might hit the Nike rep for the Jordan one. Jesus Rogers. Keep that in. Hey, keep that in. All right, all this. See y'all Tuesday. Bye.
- [76:54]
Logan Murdoch
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