NBA Opening Night Thrillers. Steph Stuns Lakers and OKC’s Double OT Victory

Summary

---

The Ringer NBA Show: "NBA Opening Night Thrillers. Steph Stuns Lakers and OKC’s Double OT Victory"

Date: October 22, 2025
Hosts: Logan Murdock & Howard Beck
Format: ‘Real Ones’ (No Raja Bell—sleeping in Miami!)

---

Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into the drama and meaning of the NBA’s much-anticipated Opening Night, with the Ringer NBA crew breaking down the Warriors’ statement win over the Lakers (fueled by classic Steph heroics), as well as the double-overtime slugfest between the champion Oklahoma City Thunder and the revamped Houston Rockets led by Kevin Durant. Logan and Howard provide real-time impressions from the games, insights on team futures, and candid reflections on old legends returning to the spotlight—like Michael Jordan’s new NBC segment. The pod is a blend of in-arena detail, inside media stories, and sharp basketball analysis.

---

Segment 1: Howard Beck Returns to Crypto (00:05–05:20)

Key Points:

• Howard’s first Lakers home opener since 2003; nostalgia and media memories.
• Praising Crypto Arena’s upgraded plaza and history-celebrating statues (“Multiple Kobe statues!” — Beck, 02:53).
• Logan jokes about Howard’s schmooze-level and legendary status in the press room.
• Touching check-in with Bill Plaschke (LA Times), who recently wrote a moving piece on his Parkinson’s diagnosis and fighting it via boxing.

Notable Quote

“Plaske… wrote an incredibly moving and incredibly soul-bearing and very brave, I thought, column... I hadn't seen him since that appeared and I really wanted to just kind of be able to touch base with him.”
– Howard Beck, 03:46

---

Segment 2: Lakers–Warriors Game Analysis (05:20–15:24)

Lakers Focus (05:20–12:11)

• Lakers’ Roster Issues:

  • Offense completely reliant on Luka Doncic—team stagnates without him.
  • Defensive liabilities (“Aiden couldn’t stop anyone. Reeves couldn’t stop anyone.” — Logan, 05:52).
  • New additions (Marcus Smart, DeAndre Ayton) underwhelm: “I don't think any of these guys are changing the Lakers.” — Howard, 09:24
  • LeBron James (injured) is a remote, stoic presence:

    “Every camera pan, he's like stoic as hell... there's just some stuff simmering”
    – Howard Beck, 06:42

  • Beckham and Logan discuss the backdrop of contract tensions and possible LeBron exit.
  • Pecking order in the West: OKC and Denver at the top; Lakers in a crowded “next tier.”

• Big Picture Concern:

  • Without LeBron and more playmakers, the Lakers could be in trouble:

    “It’s a tough proposition. I made the joke that the Lakers would probably want LeBron’s salary slot over LeBron at this point.”
    – Logan, 13:48

Warriors Focus (15:24–21:49)

• Jonathan Kuminga’s Impressive Second Half:
  • Bad first half (“terrible”), but turned it around for a huge plus in the third quarter.
  • 17 points, 9 rebounds, 6 assists, 4/6 from three.
  • Howard: “A night like tonight… That’s a good all-around game from Kuminga.” (16:55)
  • Team’s optimism about Kuminga as a valuable asset—either to keep or trade.
• Rotation & Roster Notes:
  • Draymond still starting at center; Al Horford on minutes restriction.
  • Potential need for another big man—possible trade talk looming.
• Jimmy Butler’s Impact:
  • 31 points (16/16 FT), 5 boards, 4 assists; changed the Warriors’ attack style since arrival late last year.
  • Howard: “This was an absolute continuation of how strong they look with Jimmy out there.” (20:29)
  • Warriors’ health the only real question mark; ceiling is “how long do these guys stay healthy.”

Notable Moment

“As soon as Steph made that shot… I was like, yeah, let's go, pod start. Let's get out of here. This game is over.”
– Logan, 15:11

---

Segment 3: OKC Thunder vs. Houston Rockets Double OT Thriller (23:55–39:36)

Broadcast & NBC’s Return (23:58–26:26)

• Double OT game led to TV schedule overlap (NBC/Peacock confusion), echoing old TNT nights.
• Early season games already competitive—’don’t buy the NBA Cup-only hype.’

Rockets Analysis (27:00–39:36)

• Raja Bell (via text) weighs in on Amen Thompson’s early tentativeness:

  “He's afraid to shoot. ZERO confidence in it tonight. Hopefully this isn't a season-long issue, but my gut says it will be.”
  (Read by Logan, 27:31)

• Kevin Durant’s Rocket debut:
  • Playing huge minutes (47 total) at age 37—concerns about sustainability.
  • Rockets forced into awkward lineups without Fred VanVleet; “Shengun is fucking playing point guard.”
  • Houston’s size and skill don’t always fit—defensive mismatches, especially with KD at guard.
• Team Concerns:
  • Button-push problem: Adding KD brings expectations, but stunts Amen’s organic development.
  • Point guard weaknesses, and concern whether Reed Sheppard is ready.
  • “There are some real flaws that I don't know can be rectified anytime soon.” — Logan, 32:08
• Defensive Matchup Problem:
  • Who does Durant guard? In the end, he gets isolated on SGA, fouls out—swing moment.
• Team Direction:
  • Howard: Rockets can't burn out KD in “exercise for the playoffs” year; may need to trade soon for a new point.
  • If Rockets hadn’t traded for KD and just let Amen run PG all year? “You could just use the year to develop that.”

Notable Exchange

Logan: “It has the potential… to set Amen Thompson's growth [back]. He's supposed to be your guy.”
Howard: “There's an urgency now to where, like, it fucking has to work… We've got a guy who's an all-time great in his twilight.”
(37:39–38:00)

---

Thunder Analysis (39:36–41:25)

• Chet Holmgren steps up:
  • “28 points, 7 rebounds, 2 assists… [Started] 6-for-6” (Logan, 39:42)
  • Defensive struggles with Sengun, but impressed by OKC finding a way to win shorthanded (no J-Dub).
• Thunder’s depth allows survival without J-Dub:
  • Kaysen Wallace effectively slides in: “14, 7 boards, 5 assists, 4 steals.” –Howard
• OKC’s Mood:
  • Resilience and composure on ring night. “I think OKC is in a fine place… Houston needed this game more than OKC.” – Logan (39:36)

---

Segment 4: The Complex Legacy of Kevin Durant in OKC (41:25–48:32)

• KD’s emotional return on OKC ring night; fanbase still boos
  • “KD having to watch a ring night as the visiting player in… a franchise he built.” – Howard, 41:09
  • Logan and Howard agree the relationship is scarred—crowd reaction is “deeper than just having fun booing,” per Logan (47:23).
  • “He’s really the reason why… [OKC’s] what it is now. And… after a national disaster… he helped that community… And then you boo him like that” (Logan, 43:45)
  • Speculation on if KD will ever be warmly welcomed or honored by team: “I think maybe the city won’t want it as much… I think the organization will do the right thing.” – Howard (48:32)

---

Segment 5: Michael Jordan’s NBC "Insights to Excellence" Segment (49:45–63:13)

• Jordan’s TV Return:

  • MJ’s brief NBC segment with Mike Tirico is emotional, reflective (about “paying the game forward”).
  • MJ’s unmistakable desire “to be part of something again”—after years of post-player aloofness.
  • Howard: “If there’s nothing else that I’ve learned… it’s that guys like Michael… are wired differently… Walking away is hard. Staying away is hard.” (55:17)

• Hosts’ Mixed Reactions:

  • Logan surprised at how heartfelt the segment was—but hopes future content won’t be the same "old man yells at cloud" story about load management.
  • Howard: “We don’t need anybody else from the 90s to talk about how players today should all play 82 games in 40 minutes a game.” (57:34)

• What should MJ TV segments be?

  • Genuine stories, reflective anecdotes; less “grumpy old man with hot takes.”
  • Both hosts want to hear thoughtful comparisons, insights about the modern game—style, international influence, guard play, the mental side.

Notable Quotes

“I want to hear Mike… He's the greatest player… The game needs him… I want to hear his ups and downs, his flaws… I don't want to hear a Disneyfication of it.”
– Logan, 57:35

“We got the 10 hours of Last Dance. We don’t need it to be old man shaking his fist at the cloud either. So, I’m curious to see where it goes.”
— Howard, 62:31

---

Closing Vibes & Friday Tease

• Logan and Beck reflect on pacing themselves for the season, teasing more heated debates and Raja Bell’s return on Friday.
• Shout-out to listeners and Ringer NBA family.

---

Transcript

[Announcer]

Foreign.

[Logan Murdoch]

Logan Murdoch here, Howard back there. Real ones. Yo, where's. Where's. Where's Roger? He texted us in the chat, by.

[Howard Beck]

The way, tonight, where is Roger? Let's see. It is 1am Eastern time. You're asking me this question. I'm gonna guess Roger Bell is sound asleep, tucked away in sleepy time in Miami, Florida, man.

[Logan Murdoch]

We're live from Los Angeles.

[Sponsor Voice]

Live.

[Howard Beck]

Ish.

[Logan Murdoch]

We're live. Okay. What are we doing here? Okay, anyways, so we're talking to you guys minutes after the Golden State warriors beat the Los Angeles Lakers at Crypto Arena. First of all, we're going to talk about. We're going to talk about this game. We're going to talk about the Rockets, Oklahoma City. We're going to talk about Michael Jordan later. But first, I just want to talk about Howard Beck back at his old stomping grounds really quickly. It was a sight to behold, brother.

[Announcer]

You.

[Logan Murdoch]

I just want to set the stage here. I was trying to leave at the end of the third quarter, right? I wanted to see, you know, a lot of g. I wanted to people watch. I don't go to crypto that often. You know, Laker games are very great. People watching settings. It's a great atmosphere. And Howard wanted to leave at halftime, so I said, let's just get to halftime and figure it out, right? And then I was just like, you know what? Maybe I'll see my homies here and Spotify a little early. Maybe halftime is the way to go. Forget it. Let's just. Let's do. I did my schmoozing pregame. I saw the people I needed to see. Let's go. Let's go home. Right? The amount of people Beck went to go say, hold on, hold on, hold on. I want to say hi to this person. I'm going to go say hi to this person. I'm gonna go say hi to this person. Was astounding. Ladies and gentlemen, what was it like to be back in your old stomping grounds, your first home opener for the Lakers since 2003?

[Howard Beck]

Yeah, that's still fucking with my. My brain when I realized, like, oh, this is cool.

[Logan Murdoch]

You know, like, kids have gone all the way through college since your last.

[Howard Beck]

You're killing me, man. Yes, I know, but it hit me. I'm sitting in media seats next to Sam Amick and Malika, and we're sitting there, we're talking about stuff, and all of a sudden I said, you know what, Guys just hit me. I haven't been a Lakers home opener since 2000. Three Shakobi's last season. But that's because I live in New York now, Logan. I'm not usually at LA openers, but still, it is weird. That building has a lot of resonance. Like, I won't lie, every time I go down, there's a staircase, we go down through the media entrance to go down to the press room and you walk right across like the loading dock area where the players are coming in. And it's like I've made that walk I don't know how many hundreds of times. So yes, it's, it's, it's, it's different because the building feels different now. It's got a different name that I won't say. But yeah, it's, it's a thing. And also like they've built up the outside. Like they've done a really great job with that plaza outside we were walking by. That used to be an open street. It's now a plaza. Completely pedestrian oriented. They got all the statues out there. They got the, the Kobe statue, multiple Kobe statues. And it's like it. I love how much they have celebrated their history and obviously not just basketball. They've got statues for some of the other sports too. But no, it's good seeing people. And one of the reasons we stopped on the way out that I delayed us a little bit after. I was the one who pushed to leave at halftime because I wanted to get back so we could catch the end of the game here at Spotify Studios here in the. At the ringer before we. I wanted to be able to watch. I had to stop and say hey to my old, my old buddy Bill Plaske from the LA Times. And for those who don't know, Plaske, not only legend, of course, at the LA Times and legend from around the horn for people who know him from there. But like Bill wrote an incredibly moving column over the summer about how he has been diagnosed with Parkinson's and he has taken up boxing like in a boxing gym with a bunch of other mostly older people who are going through Parkinson's and this is a way to kind of keep it at bay. And Bill being Bill just wrote an incredibly moving and incredibly soul bearing and very brave I thought column and I hadn't seen him since that appeared and I really wanted to just kind of be able to touch base with him. So that's why I delayed us. I did say a few other hellos.

[Logan Murdoch]

Other people we probably won't name.

[Howard Beck]

I don't need to name drop all of them.

[Logan Murdoch]

No, not all of them. But, yeah, man, I will say that was like a. There was an annoyance, and I gave you a look when you were like, let's hold on. But then I saw you go up to Bill, who's a legend in the game, and. And you guys had a moment, and it was. It was pretty special. We won't get into full of details on this platform, but, like, it was. It was definitely, I would say, a very special moment. Also, by the way, you run that fucking building. Not even. Okay, so let me just feel like the curtain. I promise we'll get to the games and stuff, but before the game, I'll just say that Howard was. Didn't really know his place in the. In. In the business in a bad way. I had to tell him, like, yo, you're Howard Beck. And he's like, I don't know how they're gonna receive me. I don't know how this is gonna say. They put this motherfucker front row next to Sam Amick and Malika Andrews, friend of the two friends of the program. And you just were like, in your bag, bro. So it was just. It was dope to see you in your bag.

[Howard Beck]

Appreciate you. Laker pr. You know, I haven't been here in a while. They did take care of me. That was nice.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah, they put me and Marcus Thompson in the back of the bus. But it was cool to see that you guys were, you know, there on this. Great. Let's talk about the game before we, you know, get canceled. Um, it was a. This was. This was going to be an interesting game going into it, because I really wanted to see how these two teams played against each other because they're so identical in terms of age, in terms of stature in this league, in terms of what they want to prove in this Western Conference. Um, and they felt like they were on parallel tracks. But once the game started, it was very clear, at least from the Lakers standpoint, that this was Luca's offense. And when he's off the floor, they have a problem. And when he's on the floor, they have a very big defensive issue. DeAndre Aiden couldn't stop anyone. I don't think anyone could. Reeves couldn't stop anyone. I. It's a. It's. It's one game, but the Lakers should have some real concerns. And by the way, there were a lot of camera pannings to LeBron James, who did not seem animated in any way. Seemed like he was gonna. Cliff knows this very well. He was gonna do a. AJ Brown, like, tweet or something. It seemed like that was on the horizon. Maybe a subtweet in the next couple of weeks, but we'll see. What did you think of the Lakers performers? Let's start on that first. It didn't seem great, but I do want to get your take, by the.

[Howard Beck]

Way, LeBron with, like, the throne look there, right? He had, like, what. What am I calling.

[Logan Murdoch]

He looked like the top of Wizard Kelly, you know, not going to get that reference.

[Howard Beck]

He had one of. One of my colleagues called the Phil Jackson seat, right? Because Phil always had the extra padding there. LeBron just, like, looming. Like, even from across the court, you could just see him looming over everything. But, yeah, every camera pan, he's like, stoic as hell. Like, there's no expression.

[Logan Murdoch]

He's not getting up for, like, when one of his teammates scores. He's just stoic, right?

[Howard Beck]

And I'm not going to, like, let's not, like, get crazy about reading between the lines of whatever, but, like, we know the backdrop. We know the backdrop for this. Like, no extension. Rich Paul's statement in the. In. In late June about, you know, keep LeBron in mind. We know you're on Lucas timeline, but, like. Like, there's just some stuff simmering. Like LeBron's put on a good face in the preseason, immediate everything. But, like, that stuff is still simmering in the background. He's on the clock. This is his last season potentially with the Lakers. These certain. Certainly the last contract, the last year of his contract. So, like, something's going to give. I'm not saying there's going to be a blowup, but, like, I don't know. It's just one of those things. And then when you see him all stoic, you kind of just.

[Logan Murdoch]

It.

[Howard Beck]

It makes you wonder a little bit, like, we can't judge the Lakers too much until LeBron comes back. Maybe that's in a couple of weeks. Yeah, because, like. Like, he's not going to fix any defensive issues they have. Clearly, he might exacerbate them, but he does fix the playmaking issues. And the. And the whole point of the exercise of having LeBron and Luka together right now is you have still an elite playmaker for all 48 minutes. As long as you're staggering them for.

[Sponsor Voice]

Parts of the game, your ambition just met its match with Robinhood. You play for the win. Not just on game day, every day. Channel that drive into your money, Trade stocks and ETFs, options and futures all on one platform. You expect more from yourself. Expect more from your money. Get started [e-mail] yourmoney yourmoney. Your move investing is risky. Securities trading is offered through Robinhood Financial LLC member sipc, a registered broker dealer. Future trading is offered by Robinhood Derivatives, LLC and not SPIC or FDIC.

[Announcer]

Protected this episode is brought to you by Indeed. Slow and steady doesn't always win the race.

[Logan Murdoch]

Like when Phil Jackson really needed a shot in Game 2 of the NBA.

[Announcer]

Finals, he just gave the ball to.

[Logan Murdoch]

Kobe and let him cook. And that helped win the game.

[Announcer]

If you're looking to hire someone fast, use Indeed. Indeed. Sponsored jobs get 45% more applications than non sponsored jobs. Speed up your hiring process right now with a $75 sponsored job credit at indeed.comringermba that's indeed.comringermba Terms and conditions apply. Hiring Indeed is all you need.

[Howard Beck]

They don't have that. And when Luka was off the floor, to your point, yeah, the offense looks like garbage. Like the ball is not moving. Nobody can get an open shot.

[Logan Murdoch]

Marcus Aiden was pretty bad. Aiden was pretty bad. You're referencing Marcus Smart who like had a really nasty. Like, you almost took Steph's arm out of his socket. It was gross.

[Howard Beck]

I mean, this was, this is the problem, man. Like, I like this. Their off season was Marcus Smart, deandre Ayton and Jake Laravia. That was it. And losing Dorian Finney Smith in the process. Marcus Smart looks like he hasn't played in two years, which arguably he kind of hasn't. Larva was okay. Ayton was. I mean, I like, none of these guys are, are changing the Lakers and none of these guys are the missing pieces that when they first got Luka in February, like, oh, okay, now you just got to reformat around him. Like, this is what you got. Like, it wasn't, it wasn't great. Again, we're not going to overreact to one game, but I think what we saw from those guys tonight is the limitations that we already knew those players to have. And yes, Marcus Smart had an incredibly erratic game, including nearly yanking Steph's shoulder out of his socket for reasons I don't know, and then argued the point once he got called for the flagrant after they did the review and was very demonstrative with the refs after arguing his point. I don't, I don't know what Marcus Smart was doing.

[Logan Murdoch]

My favorite thing was a possession later or possession two later he gets fouled by his own teammate and then looks at the ref like, what the hell happened?

[Howard Beck]

Yeah, arms out like, going back down the market.

[Logan Murdoch]

Smart experience, ladies and gentlemen. I. It was. It was really a frustrating watch if you're a Lakers fan. There was a lot of frustrated fans in there. I don't know what the expectation was for them. I know there's Lakers exceptionalism out here, but, like, all they really got was their off season was basically in February when they got Luka Doncic. And the other addition that they got was Luka Donches. Losing weight. Yes. Right.

[Howard Beck]

Accurate.

[Logan Murdoch]

And. But it seemed like a very worse version of the worst supporting cast that he had in Dallas, where it's like, Luka, do everything, and then maybe we can just keep it at bay and maybe Luka can impose his will. But I. I don't think that the Lakers or the. Excuse me, the warriors aren't a necessarily great matchup for Luka Doncis in that way. Right. Because they have so many people that they can throw at them. And then they also had the anecdote of multiple scoring options on the other end that were just, like, punishing the Lakers defensively. Right. Like, there was so many pick and rolls where there was a mouse in the house, whether they'd have Aiden on a switch against Steph or they have Donches on a switch against Steph. And they weren't getting offensive rebounds. It was just. It was an ugly performance from the Lakers. And I don't know what they're gonna be, but they got a tough schedule coming up, man. They got it on Friday. You're gonna be at this game. But they got the Timberwolves coming up. They got a. A couple dates with the. The Portland Trailblazers are pretty hard out. Like, I. It could get ugly.

[Howard Beck]

I don't know if it'll get ugly early. I do think that even if they're just like 500 in the games that LeBron is out, there's gonna be some angst about it, right?

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah.

[Howard Beck]

And, like, there is a clear pecking order at the very top of the West. Right. Oklahoma's defending champs won tonight against the Rockets. I think Denver is the clear number two. And then the Rockets who wanted to be in that tier, I think right now are in that. That next tier, which is jumbled. Right. Like, it's Houston, it's both LA teams, it's the warriors, it's Minnesota.

[Logan Murdoch]

Right.

[Howard Beck]

Like, I think that is the group that's chasing Oklahoma and Denver. Like, somebody from that group that. That just massive teams. One of them might emerge to be the team that can break through and maybe make a conference finals run if they're the one to knock out Denver or Oklahoma somehow.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah.

[Howard Beck]

And you can make a case for some of them. Like, you can find, like, you go best case scenario, right? Oh, best case scenario for Minnesota, you know, at the. Edwards makes a leap. Julius Randall's a lot more comfortable in year two with them. Rudy Gobert has kind of a throwback year as a defensive anchor. You know, little Dante DiVincenzo, a little Terrence Shannon. Like, like you could like put it together. Like you can, you can create a case for all of these teams if you want to say they've got a chance to break through and at least get to the conference finals and have a puncher's chance. But some of those teams have a stronger case than others. I don't know the Lakers case is all that strong. And because it's so much reliant on the fact that LeBron is going to come back from some point from sciatica and then turn 41 and then try to get through a season playing at an all NBA level in year 20, whatever this is.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah, it's, it's. It's a tough proposition. Right. Like, I made the joke that the Lakers would probably want LeBron salary slot over LeBron at this point and, and tonight was a reason why they need.

[Howard Beck]

More playmaking, they need more shooting. They need like, like Luka just needs help. Like there's nobody. Like.

[Logan Murdoch]

It was funny. Also was very clear that this is Luca's organization from when you saw all the things that were on the Jumbotron and like the little Luca, a lot of Luca, like even like the games that are played during the timeout and stuff that you see from media day. It's very much Luca's organization and wherever he takes them is where they're gonna go. But it's just hard when you have the supporting cast. I don't want to like linger too much because it's just one game, but I do want to get quickly on the warriors point of view on this one. I. We left at halftime, so I didn't. I. I had a different impression of Jonathan Kaminga when I left the arena versus when I came back to the studio. He was terrible in the first half and I'm like, this is it. It was looking like, man, like this is the statement you want to make after you called all of that over the summer. And he just balled in third quarter and they're going to need that. He was great. Jimmy Butler was great. Went 16 of 16 from the line at 31. Made timely shots Steph made, like probably the shot of the night, which is what Steph does. We were watching, it was funny. We were watching in the, in the movie theater here at Spotify. And as soon as he made that there, I was like, yeah, let's go pod start. Let's, let's get out of here. This game is over with Warrior impressions.

[Howard Beck]

The warriors, first of all, Jonathan Kaminga, six assists tonight. Logan Murdoch, six.

[Logan Murdoch]

Six.

[Howard Beck]

How many times he had six assists last season?

[Logan Murdoch]

Once. He's on par for, you know, there we go.

[Howard Beck]

He's gotten his 160.

[Logan Murdoch]

There's no guarantee that that's gonna happen.

[Howard Beck]

No, listen, like the, the warriors, like I know, you know, you gotta take everything with a little bit of a grain of salt because of everything they've gone through with Kuminga. And they need his value to be up either because it's an asset to them or an asset to move and trade, which is what we expected from the moment they finally resolve the contract situation. But like this organization hasn't given up on him. Like there's still, there is some optimism about.

[Logan Murdoch]

I think there's one person that hasn't given up on him in the organization.

[Howard Beck]

Well, the most important person, the guy who pays the bills. But in general, I think that this team, they've kind of straddled the line and they've kind of been of two minds about him a lot and he frustrates them at times, but you can also see the potential. And I don't think anybody thinks he's a bad guy or a bad player or is not about the right things. It's just about trying to refine some of his habits on the court. And a night like tonight, look, 17 points on 6 of 11 shooting, 4 of 6 from 3. You and I have both had a conversation with someone from the warriors pregame who was talking about like our three point shooting is going to be a lot better this year. And it's not just because they added Al Horford and eventually D Anthony Melton when he gets healthy, but that they're expecting Kaminga to be a much more reliable three point shooter. Smallest of small sample sizes one game, but four of six, not a bad way to start. Nine rebounds, six assists. Like that's a good all around game from Kuminga.

[Announcer]

He was.

[Howard Beck]

And he was giving up the ball in the right moments. Right? Like he wasn't stalling it out. He wasn't. I don't feel like he was forcing things. And those are the things that have frustrated the warriors in the past with him. They want guys who make quick decisions with the ball and who are really intuitive players. And that's Steph for sure. That's Jimmy, That's Pajemski at his best. That's Draymond. And so, like, Kaminga plays like this, the fun conversation will be in a couple of months, depending on how things are going. Like, oh, wait, are they actually keeping him after all? Like, is he now too, too valuable to give up like that? They would love to have that conversation, I'm sure. Or for to have that quandary.

[Logan Murdoch]

Sure, sure. It's. There were a lot, There was a lot of optimism in the Bay Area, at least cautious optimism going into this training camp and during the training camp about Kaminga and, like, how good he was. Everybody raved about, you know, him at camp and like, on one hand, you know, we're. We're reporters by nature, so there's a skepticism that goes, like, really? Okay. Of course you're supposed to say that. Yeah, that should be the company line. He just came into training camp late, you know, and he had to get this contract thing situation. But, like, tonight kind of validates that point, at least for a night. Right. And he all. He tends to play really good against the Lakers. He played good last year, late season against the Lakers. So it's good, man. Like, it was, it was a good first start. They're still playing Draymond at center and starting him at center. He's probably going to start at center for most nights and then there's going to be, like, I think Steve Kerr said pregame that Al Horford's not going to be playing back to backs.

[Howard Beck]

Al Horford's not playing back to backs. And he also said they're limiting him to probably like 20 to 24 minutes. And the, the quandary that Steve out, you know, mentioned there was if, if you're only going to play a guy 20 minutes and you want to finish games with him and they do, then it's hard to start games with him because what do you. You're going to have, like this massive period in the middle of the game where he's not playing at all.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah.

[Howard Beck]

So you, you almost can't start him. It's not like. Yeah, like the, the quest, the perpetual quest of the warriors to find somebody other than Draymond to start at center all the time. They don't want him to be the full time center. Draymond played 28 minutes tonight. He started at center. I don't know how many minutes Were actually technically at center, but, yeah, between Horford, Quentin, Post got some run tonight. You would like to have one more body there, right? Like, can. Can. Can Trace Jackson, Davis, give them something. Like, it's. It's still a quandary for them.

[Logan Murdoch]

They're still also, like, it's gonna be. It's gonna be interesting to see what happens with them, like, especially with other teams, right. Like, I could see a world, and I can see a world where, like, maybe Atlanta doesn't get off to a start and maybe Brzing is, you know, is available and maybe they kick the tires on that. Or a Big is like, you know, like a. Maybe they can make like, an ancillary type of trade for a Big. I don't know if the roster is set at this point, you know, like, especially, like, if the Kaminga thing goes bad, maybe they try to flip him. They have to get his value up because, I mean, they've basically told everyone given the impression that they don't like him and that they've benched him for a reason and that he could be a problem, and the rest of the league sees that. So they got to get his value up. But I could definitely see them making a move for somebody, especially if they're. If they win at the pace that they want to win and they just kind of, you know, one of those trades where you're going into the postseason, like, let's just make a move to fortify our roster. So we'll see.

[Howard Beck]

But it's. I will just say, like, this was the thing I was curious about, and we'll remain curious about for a while here because, again, small sample size. They played at such a high level after they got Jimmy late last season. And it's like, you can't judge too much based on the last, like, two months of the regular season. They were strong in the playoffs, too, until Steph got hurt. But, like, tonight was an absolute continuation of how strong they look with Jimmy out there. Butler ends up with 31 points tonight, 16 of 16 from the line. Like, they have nobody else who can generate that kind of scoring from the line. And he just. The guy just makes things happen. 31 points, 5 rebounds, 4 assists, steal. Just. Just like a really great, efficient, typical Jimmy Butler performance. And I think that's who they are now. Like, I think like. Like there is this version of the warriors is going to be. The ceiling is only how long do these guys stay healthy. That's it. Like, I don't. For every single team. Most teams aside from, like, Oklahoma you can always find, ah, they need another three point shot. Ah, they could use a big like yeah, there's, there's stuff but like I don't find too many faults with the warriors other than can all these guys stay healthy because Jimmy Draymond and Steph are all pretty old as well as Al Horford. If they're healthy, there's nobody in the west wants to see these guys in the spring.

[Logan Murdoch]

Here he goes. Howard Beck falling in love with the warriors again. Ben Cruz is in here also, just egging them on. Let's take a quick break and we're going to talk Rockets.

[Announcer]

Okay, this episode is brought to you by Indeed. A successful season starts with picking the right players for your team. If I were picking a team, I picked some of the greatest players of all time. Maybe I get Kareem at the 5, maybe I get Tim Duncan at the 4, LeBron at the 3, Jordan at the 2 and Kobe at the 1. Or maybe I will get Steph at the 1. Step at the 1 will be pretty cool too. If you want to hire the best players for your business and quickly, you need Indeed. Their sponsor jobs help you stand out and reach relevant candidates faster. Plus, with Indeed sponsored jobs, there are no monthly subscriptions, no long term contracts, and you pay for the results. There's no need to wait any longer. Speed up your hiring right now with Indeed. Listeners of this show will get a $75 sponsored job credit to get your jobs more visibility@ Indeed.com RingerMBA that's Indeed. Right now and support our show by saying you heard about Indeed on this podcast. Indeed.comringermba Terms and conditions apply. Hiring Indeed is all you need.

[Sponsor Voice]

This podcast is brought to you by Carvana. Carvana lets you buy your next car on your terms, explore a massive inventory online filter for what matters and find your perfect match. Then choose delivery to your home or pick it up at one of Carvana's iconic car car vending machines. Every car also comes with a seven day money back guarantee so you can make sure it's the right fit. Buy your car on Carvana. Deliver your pickup fees may apply. Limitations and exclusions may apply. See our 7 day return [e-mail] Carvana.

This episode is brought to you by Nordstrom. Oh what fun. Nordstrom has tons of gifts under $100 for all your favorite people all in one place like beauty and grooming sets, Ugg Gifts, jewelry and toys. Need ideas? Check out gifts from Ugg, Skims, Diptyque, Free People, Stanley and more. Plus Explore their amazing gift shop in stores and online. Free gift finding help, free shipping and order pickup. Make it all easy. Ordstrom.

[Logan Murdoch]

And we are back.

[Howard Beck]

Yo.

[Logan Murdoch]

This OKC game versus the Rockets was, was very fun. Two overtimes. Beck is very nervous about this segment. Because we were at crypto.com arena, we.

[Howard Beck]

Were not watching as much of this game as we normally would.

[Logan Murdoch]

Let's just stipulate it was a fun game. It was a fun game to watch during. Like, we had the second screen up while watching down the stretch. This game took forever. I feel like, I feel like they didn't end until like midway through the second quarter. This Lakers game that we were at, it felt like it. Maybe it was. What did you think?

[Howard Beck]

Great game, but like, unfortunate start for NBC after all these years and all the celebrations.

[Logan Murdoch]

It was an unfortunate start because of.

[Howard Beck]

The fact that going double overtime on the first game meant they couldn't hold up the second game. You had to, like, you just had to go, what's unfortunate? It's not unfortunate. Like, they had two really good games. Like, even though the Warriors Lakers game was pretty entertaining and you know, like, they had a great opening night. NBC, like, props to NBC. Everything that we saw again in our limited time because we were bouncing around the arena, but like, NBC had a good night and getting a double overtime game with the defending champs against a Rockets team with Kevin Durant, a legend, like, all good. But having the games overlap so that now the audience is split between NBC and Peacock. Like, not ideal. Yeah, it's not great. And when it was all on Turner, like Turner would sometimes do that thing where we're going to hold up the second game and then there's a breaking point where it's like, we'll throw it on tbs. We'll put on tbs. We'll put on true. We'll put on true tv.

[Logan Murdoch]

I ain't watch. I ain't watch TBS in five years, but I'm gonna put it on, right? I'm gonna put it on for this. Just watch the start of Mavericks, Celtics and then.

[Howard Beck]

And then a Castle rerun or, you know.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah, charm.

[Howard Beck]

Charmed or something.

[Logan Murdoch]

I don't watch tvs. Never. I haven't watched in a long time.

[Howard Beck]

So that was unfortunate. But they did get a great game. And, you know, you can't, you can't argue with that. By the way, quick aside, as I was, I was thinking about this with these two really good games. Everybody please take a mental note of this so that when people start coming with the propaganda about how everybody all the great games are in the NBA cup and they play harder for NBA cup nights. Just remember that the early parts of the season are not just all guys going through the motions. These were two really entertaining games tonight where guys were playing their butts off. Yeah, there are good games that are not NBA cup games. I just. Before the propaganda campaigns begin, I just.

[Logan Murdoch]

Want to note that we got a mini rouser. We got a mini back rant. I'm curious.

[Howard Beck]

That was nothing.

[Logan Murdoch]

That was a mini one. We'll see how I see if I can rile them up tonight. But this game had everything you could want in an opening night and how you open a new channel and a new league partner and the marriage with that. But it also showed me like everything that, everything that I thought about. Excuse me, Everything that I thought about the Rockets good and bad appeared tonight. Right where Changoon is fucking playing point guard. We got a text from Raja that I want to, that I want to read on.

[Howard Beck]

Nice for Raja to kind of like contribute to the show tonight even though he had to like go to bed early, you know. Sweet dreams, Raja.

[Logan Murdoch]

This was at, this was at 8:40 Eastern, bro. Is Amen this reluctant of a shooter? This is wild. And I'm saying this is, this is, this is what my response. It's really hard when one of your idols joins your team at this stage of your career. You know, he's a young guy. KD is going to probably take the lion's share of the shots. He's definitely going to defer to kd, right?

[Howard Beck]

Yeah.

[Logan Murdoch]

And this was, this was Roger's response maybe, but that isn't why he's not shooting. He's afraid to shoot in all caps. Zero confidence in it tonight. Hopefully this isn't a season long issue, but my gut says it will be. He is turning down easy jumpers and that's fascinating to me. Right. Because that was one of the fears that I had and one of the things that I said on our season preview pod where you want a guy like Amen to grow organically into what we think. He's going to be a great player. But you have an all timer that plays, maybe not your position, but definitely is going to cover up a lot of your spots on the floor. Right. And that's something that Udoka is going to have to figure out. But then there's the psyche part of it where in a big moment he's going to defer to one of the players he grew up watching. It would seem like. Right. What is the tension there? Do you think? And is that something that we're going to have to look at throughout the season?

[Howard Beck]

I can't wait. Raj will be back with us, of course, on Friday for that show. Because I want to go deeper on this with Raja because he, you know, as a former player, Raja is seeing the game differently than you are. I.

[Logan Murdoch]

Are he for sure more basketball than we could ever know.

[Howard Beck]

All of it. Right. But like, he's so strong in that, like, that text to us, to the whole chain with like, very definitive. It, it wasn't just an observation of like, oh, he seems a little bit, like, tentative. It was like, no, he's afraid and it's gonna be a problem all season. And I'm like, wow, you're basing. Like this was in the first half.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah.

[Howard Beck]

Like, there was a lot of game to go and we still got a lot of season to go. So I. That Raja feels that strongly about it. Raja's not like, just like firing off crazy hot takes and like, like, he's thoughtful about this stuff with us. So I'm very curious why his interpretation of that was so strong, by the way. Like, I don't think it was like that passive of a performance by the end of it all because he took 17 shots. Thompson, and he didn't play in the overtimes because he had some cramping issues. And I think he'd had a knee to knee thing too.

[Logan Murdoch]

Gotta drink your water, man. Gotta drink your water.

[Howard Beck]

Hydrate. So I, I, I don't, like I say, I, I am curious to go a little deeper on that with Raj on, on Friday. I do think Amend Thompson's in a interesting spot because partially what you said, right? Like, Kevin Durant's coming in. Like, you're gonna be a little differential, even if you're not intending to be. Cause that's Kevin freaking Durant. Yeah, you don't have Fred Van Vliet. There were moments in this game it was, I can't remember, it was like late regulation or early first overtime where the balls in Jabari Smith's hands and he comes across half court and he just like stopped, picked up his dribble. Now he's just stuck. He's pivoting. Timeout. They like, had to burn a timeout because he just didn't know where to go. And I'm thinking, like, again, not to get crazy with this, but that's one of those moments where you go, oh, Fred Van Vliet. That's where you miss Fred Van Vliet right there.

[Logan Murdoch]

Or like, when you have Shangoon, who was phenomenal tonight. I'm not going to say he was incredible, but you have him doing what he did last year where he has to take the ball full court and it just literally backed down a player. I'm not sure you can even do that. There's like a 5 second violation Charles Barkley rule, right? And he was doing that throughout the overtimes. But like that is not sustainable. And that was the, that was the thing that really was scary for me because honestly, like OKC could have lost this game. It really wouldn't have meant anything. I know, like tomorrow if they would have lost the NBA, the days of the world. Everybody we talk, we talked about this pregame. Honestly, I think it was with, I think it was with Malika and Amic where it was like, what do you think the reaction is going to be tomorrow if this situation happened, right? And we were going to, if OKC lost, we're going to have the talking heads talking da da da, what's wrong with them? But honestly, it wasn't that big of a deal. But okc, there were some real, I mean, excuse me, Houston. There were some real flaws there that like, I don't know can be rectified anytime soon, right? Like your preseason MVP, Reed shepherd was 3 of 11 tonight, right? Like not my preseason. I don't know. I heard you guys really going in on him. I rolled my eyes. The last you got in the season pre. You guys see Reed shepherd at the preseason, I'm like, yo, chill, calm down. He hasn't played anything.

[Howard Beck]

All we said was he had one good game.

[Logan Murdoch]

He did everybody within the Rockets. I remember hearing it all through the playoffs last year, man, hey, Reed, when he's time, when it's his time, you know, he, at this point in his career, he was the, you know, the pregame warm up all star who's like hitting everything and you're like, man, if he just gets a shot, we'll see what happens. But like he's not the answer, at least at this point as a full time point guard there, right? So that means that's going to mean is you're probably going to have to put KD as a point guard. I think he is probably the most experienced out of all of them two leading offense. But that takes away from what you want him to be. The reason why they were bringing Shangoon in there was to make sure that, that Kevin could get post ups. But again, that's just such a weird, wonky lineup. Like I know everybody was. I remember Pregame, everybody's like, yo, did you see the Houston Rockets opening lineup? How tall it is, how big it is? That doesn't. It's not NBA 2K, bro. Like, it doesn't work together, and they're going to have to figure that out.

[Howard Beck]

Well, first of all, flashbacks, like PJ Carlissimo was, like, roundly just ridiculed for deciding to make Kevin Durant a shooting guard as a rookie.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah.

[Howard Beck]

And here we are all these years later at the back end of his career, and we're rolling out a box score with the lineup where it says, Kevin Durant guard. Like, Kevin Durant, shooting guard. It's fine, right? Like, the labels don't matter nearly as much today as they did when Katie started his career. We are in a positionally fluid era of the NBA, and that's all fine, but, like, someone has to guard the other team's guards.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah.

[Howard Beck]

Amend Thompson's always going to guard the team's best perimeter player, and he can guard one through five.

[Announcer]

That's great.

[Howard Beck]

Jabari Smith can take on just about anybody, but Sengun is only going to guard other bigs.

[Logan Murdoch]

Sorry, Michael Pina. Stephen, I'm sorry, where's my camera? Is my camera right here for Michael P. I'm sorry, buddy. You know I rock with you, but you got a little bit too much dip on your chip.

[Howard Beck]

Steven Adams is only guarding the opposing center. Who's Kevin Durant guard? Like, who's guard. The other team will have two actual guards.

[Logan Murdoch]

Like, this is a defensive conundrum with Kevin Durant at this stage, bro. Where in the. In the. In the postseason, they're either going to try to have him guard a big. Or he's going to switch on to Shay Gilgis Alexander, which literally lost him the game tonight where he fouls out two free throws for Shay.

[Howard Beck]

Got up in the air.

[Logan Murdoch]

Got up. Got him up in the air. And you knew it was going to happen, right?

[Announcer]

He.

[Logan Murdoch]

He jumped at the first pump fake. But that's something that they're gonna have to deal with because he's. They're gonna attack him defensively.

[Howard Beck]

I'm also just worried about the fact that Kevin. Not overly concerned, but, like, Kevin Durant had to play 47 minutes tonight, and that's double overtime. Yes, but it was 37 in regulation. That's even high for him at this stage of his career. And the point of the exercise for the Rockets, and I know we've got this now debate about, like. All right, is it about, like, the youth and their long future together? Because They've got this great young core to which I still say, no, you got Kevin Durant for now. And that's why I still think they need to go out and get a Fred Van Vliet replacement at some point. Like you. You don't want to. You cannot burn out Kevin Durant in the early parts of a season in which the whole point of the exercise was to have him for the playoffs.

[Logan Murdoch]

Well, this is the thing that. About Kevin Durant, like, and the Kevin Durant move that would have. That would concern me. Right. And we always talk about this on the podcast when it's time to push the. But. And what I mean by that is like, OKC was. Was faced with this a couple of years ago. Remember when they were really good? I think it was. It was either. It was two years ago when everybody was like, do they make a move at the deadline? Should they trade somebody? And like okc. If you talk to anybody around okc, they were like, no, we're standing back. We like the group that we have. And it paid off.

[Announcer]

Right.

[Howard Beck]

Yeah.

[Logan Murdoch]

And I think we talk about the Warriors. Andre Iguodala was a move that pushed the button. Right. But you don't want to do that too early. You want to do it at the right time. You push the button on Kevin Durant, you're putting championship expectations on a roster that still needs to grow in a lot of areas.

[Howard Beck]

Yeah.

[Logan Murdoch]

And that's what's concerning to me, because you're going to. It. It has the potential. This is one game, but it has the potential to set Amin Thompson's growth. And he's supposed to be your guy. Right. You don't have a point guard, so you're not able to really maximize what KD can do on your offense. And then you have real issues, like down the stretch, I think, you know, of a season when you're playing against the Yokoji, when you're playing against the OKC and you don't have a defensive anchor at all. And so we'll see. Right. But these were the concerns that I had for the Rockets preseason. And it's one game, but it really. There was some real concern. And look, they. They put up points on the board. They put up points. They had 124. But they have to really. This is a going to be a real big task for Ma Udoka now. Like, he can get people in line, and I know he's great on X's and O's, but he's going to have to figure out how to have this roster adjust to a system that's going to be sustainable because this was. There were a lot of flaws in this iteration of them right now, to your point.

[Howard Beck]

In a world where they don't trade for Kevin Durant and obviously, you know, now. Now Jalen Green and Dylan Brooks are still probably on the roster and it's in. The whole rotation looks a little different. Jalen Green, you have the whole struggle of like, how much should the ball be in his hands because those possessions sometimes go awry. But in a world where they did not push the button, if you and Fred Van Vliet still goes down in the off season, what are we gonna do? Well, we got no mandate to win anything now. We don't have to make a deep run now. Yeah, you know what, let's just. You know, Amend Thompson's played point guard in his past, like amendment. It's. It's yours, man. Like, we've got a whole year to experiment with you there and see how much you can grow to that role at this level, at the NBA level. And if. If Van Vliet backs healthy next year, maybe he plugs back in. In the meantime, Amends now developed those skills that much more.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah.

[Howard Beck]

And you could just use the year to develop that. But there's an urgency now to where like it fucking has to work.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah.

[Howard Beck]

Because we need. We projected out as a top two three team in the west and we've got a guy who's an all time great in his twilight. This might be his last great season. Or maybe there's one more.

[Logan Murdoch]

And it was tough too, man. Cause he was dealing like there was a. I saw Katie where he did the old school, two crossovers and just hit a shot. I was like, damn, he still had. He was sick, right?

[Howard Beck]

Yeah, it's still there.

[Logan Murdoch]

But you could just see how dejected he was when he fouled out. That was. That was really tough to watch.

[Howard Beck]

He looked dejected and he looked tired. Yeah. Then after 47 minutes, at that age, with the miles he's got on him, he should be for sure.

[Logan Murdoch]

Let's talk about OKC real quick. I was impressed with the opening that Chet had, but there are still some deficiency defensive walls that he has to kind of overcome. Right. Like Shangoon was taking his lunch, just bullying him. But I was impressed by how they finished. They like ring nights are really hard for the team that is getting the ring.

[Announcer]

Right. Yeah.

[Logan Murdoch]

And KD typically plays really good when he goes back to okc. He really thrives in that environment. So you have all These things kind of coming at you. I was impressed that they were able to win in the way that they won. And they're going to have to slug out a lot of games with J Dub out and really kind of figure out, you know, from what I've heard, I think the OKC is kind of bringing him along slowly from that wrist up data. He wants to play, but they're kind of bringing him along and figuring that out. So he'll be back at some point in the future, in the very near future, but I think they can sustain. Like, I think Chad has to continue to continue to, to play well offensively, but he has to get back great defensively. We'll see what happens. But I think OKC is in a fine place. I was. They. I think Houston needed this game more than OKC.

[Howard Beck]

Yeah, I mean, for sure. Chad Holmgren, 28.7 rebounds, 2 assists, started.

[Logan Murdoch]

Like 6 of 6. I gotta, I gotta. I got a slack from my editor. Isaac was like, yo, Chad is cooking.

[Howard Beck]

He's cooking. But that's what you're gonna need from him with. With J Dub out, right?

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah.

[Howard Beck]

For however much longer it's going to be. Case and Wallace filled in well, like, yeah, case in 14, seven rebounds, five assists, four steals. You know, like, you, you know, he's a great defensive player. You know, there's a little bit of offensive pop there, some development still to go there, but like, like, they've got so much great depth. Like, you're not. I don't worry about the Thunder in general. Certainly not defensively at all. Offensively, if there's at least one other guy who pops on a given night tonight, it was Chet Holmgren. They're fine. I was actually thinking about the emotions of a ring night from the opposite side, which is, you know, a very young Kevin Durant with Russell Westbrook and James Harden and Sergi Baka got to the finals and lost. And then Harden gets traded and the Thunder, you know, blow a 3 to 1 lead against the warriors and the next, and then KD leaves for the war, whatever. And KD is now there, like, cruel twist of fate of the schedule. Like, you know, they should have just.

[Logan Murdoch]

Started for kd, bro. They should have did. They should have did that. Netflix. Netflix. Hey, watch real ones on Netflix. Starting.

[Howard Beck]

We know how much. We know how much KD loves to be psychoanalyzed, especially by you. No, I mean, listen, like KD having to watch a ring night as the.

[Logan Murdoch]

Visiting player in for a franchise he.

[Howard Beck]

Built in a lot of ways. Yeah, I Mean, that's, that's. And, and, and where he's getting booed. And you saw, like, you know, the cameras caught him booing back at them. Which of your career, like, you don't, you know, I mean, you don't need to boo back. That's like telling him you don't need to tweet back either.

[Logan Murdoch]

But I, I think that, like, it's like, like the relationship between KD and Oklahoma City is just. It's really just. It's a lot, man. Like, I remember going to games when he. His. I wasn't at his return game, but I remember going to games where he returned to okc. And just the way that, like, I think that's a, That's a scar that's. I don't never. I don't think that's never going to fully heal because of. I mean, there's a lot of different things that are, you know, nuanced. And, you know, he did leave, like, for the, the, the, the. The. I got, I got Ben here, so I'm, I'm, I'm trying. I know that, like, he left for the team that everybody hated. Right. Like, and I get it, but I know in his mind, he's like, yo, man, like this. They. That was a home that really rejected him. Yeah. And from a human level, that's a tough pill to swallow. Right? And I get the, I get that. And I know that we've talked about this where just like, he, he felt. He still feels he deserves to have his, his jersey retired in okc, and he does, but I don't think it'll ever be the same. Right? Like, how do you, like, from a. It's weird to see somebody, like, boo you like that when you have. He's really the reason why that. And he had help, right? Sam Presti, Russell Westbrook, James Harden had help building that, but he was the face of that, of growing basketball in Oklahoma City. Right? And not even just like, growing the game of basketball there. Like, he helped that community after a tornado, after a really bad national disaster. And then, like, you boo him like that, you burned a man's jersey. Like, that's gotta be tough. And then the league's trolling ass is gonna put him. Make him see that on ring night. On ring night. That's so wild, right? I get it for the ratings, right. I get it for NBC. People gotta get paid. But that is really.

[Howard Beck]

That's right. Like, you couldn't have sent Denver there.

[Logan Murdoch]

That's so fucked up that he got to see that like, he couldn't make it happen. And I know, like, of all of the places I think he wanted, and this is me talking, I think he wanted to win a ring for them the most at the time. Right. Because that was the biggest attachment that he had. And at the end of the day, it's just a game, you know what I mean? And for them to like, do that, I thought was kind of whack. I get it. But like, it's still kind of whack.

[Howard Beck]

I don't know if the league was consciously thinking of like having Katie there be there for ring night and, and the, the, the emotions and, and how difficult that would be. I think it's more just like we need somebody on opening night who is going to be an intriguing matchup for the Thunder. You've got a couple choices. You could go with like Denver and Houston at the time, like before Van Vliet goes down, they were like co favorites to be the number two team, the biggest challenger to the Thunder. So picking from one of those two made sense. Yeah, right. It's not gonna conference team, most likely. You already decided like Steph and LeBron were going to play each other. LeBron obviously was out tonight, but Steph and Luca playing each other like you had that matchup set, like, I get it. You could get there just as a scheduling decision without it having to be like, ooh, Evan Durant, like he has to go watch some like, Adam S.

[Logan Murdoch]

Just couldn't help himself, bro. I get it. It's, it's wrestling.

[Howard Beck]

I, I, I do think it's like, I've thought about this too. Like, I don't know that Katie gives a crap about this the way that we do, but the fact that he is kind of like a superstar without a home, right? Like Oklahoma rejects him and boos him still. He rejected the warriors after winning two championships with them. Brooklyn was a disaster, Phoenix was a disaster. Now he's in Houston. Like, it, it, it really is one of those strange things where like, yeah, LeBron moves around, but like, and we probably will always think about LeBron as more of a cavalier than anything, right? Two separate stints, plus their first championship in a bazillion years. And you know, there were some sore feelings with Miami, but Miami, I think, I think Miami still loves LeBron. LA clearly loves LeBron. Cleveland absolutely adores LeBron despite burning his jersey way back in the day.

[Logan Murdoch]

You know what I think it is though? Their difference. LeBron has done a way better job, I would say. How do I, how do I Phrase this. I think he's done a way better job of promoting the mythology of himself. Well, just managing and managing and then managing as well. But I think specific, and I get what you're saying about Phoenix, and he's had a weird career, and I know it. I've seen it firsthand. You've seen it firsthand. But, like, last year or two years ago, whenever it was when he made his first return back to the Bay Area, and he, like, again, he. He had a weird exit and a terrible exit for some fans in Golden State, and they still gave him a standing ovation, right? Yeah.

[Howard Beck]

And because he brought him to championship.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah. But there was still class there, man. And that was just. It was just disappointing that after all these years, they still, like that OKC crowd did that to him. I would.

[Howard Beck]

I would guess if, like, if KD had announced before the season is my last run, and, like, he'd have one more game in Oklahoma. Right. Cause, you know, two home, two road against every Western Conference team. But, like, if. If this were farewell, I think he would have gotten some sort of tribute video and they'd be cheering for him. You know, maybe. Like, I. I think they.

[Logan Murdoch]

But, like, I don't know, man, because they did the.

[Howard Beck]

I think.

[Logan Murdoch]

You know what I mean? They did.

[Howard Beck]

I know that's. But that's. That's years ago.

[Logan Murdoch]

But. No, no, but I'm saying I think.

[Howard Beck]

They boo because it's fun to boo.

[Logan Murdoch]

No, I think it's. I think it's deeper than. Very much so. I mean, like, it was like that when you're, like, telling someone that when you're covering the warriors at the time that you're from California, covering this team in an Uber on the. In Oklahoma City, it was a treacherous task. It's deeper than that, and it runs deeper than that. It was. I just thought it was. I. I just really thought. And me and Kevin have had, like, our spats, obviously. I'm just. But I'm just calling a spade a spade, you know? And I just thought it was just whack. And I. I. That's just what I thought from the whole thing. Like, yo, man, he's Kevin Durant.

[Howard Beck]

I hope it works in Houston.

[Logan Murdoch]

I really do. I really do, too.

[Howard Beck]

The guy's been an amazing player to watch. He's had a complicated career, but an incredible career, and this should absolutely be the final chapter. So, you know, I don't. I don't know what it ultimately looks like. I don't know if they've got what it takes in the next year or two to beat Oklahoma. I'm not sure anybody does.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah.

[Howard Beck]

But I, but I hope, I hope.

[Logan Murdoch]

It'S, you know, I, I hope that. I don't think it's gonna happen, but I hope OKC makes that right. They should. Like they will. I don't, I don't think that's a guarantee.

[Howard Beck]

I think, I think maybe the city won't want it as much as the organization. I think the organization is a classy organization. They'll do the right thing and, and whenever is it. He calls it a, you know, a career. I think they'll honor him.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah. One can only hope. Speaking of complicated careers, let's talk about MJ's budding television career in the next segment.

[Sponsor Voice]

Used to describe an individual whose spirit is unyielding, unconstrained. One who navigates life on their own terms effortlessly. They do not all always show up on time, but when they arrive, you notice an individual confident in their contradictions. They know the rules, but behave as if they do not exist. New Teen, the new fragrance by Miu Miu defined by. You start the season with Etsy and make your holiday traditions extra special.

On Etsy.

You'll discover original pieces from small shops that will help you celebrate.

Shop Etsy for holiday decor that makes you feel seen. Special starts on Etsy.

Tap the banner to shop now.

[Logan Murdoch]

And we are back. Last segment. Cause me and bed gotta go to sleep, bro. It's been a long ass day.

[Howard Beck]

Raja Bell has already been in bed for like five hours.

[Logan Murdoch]

He's sleeping great. He's sleeping. I went to the Chance show yesterday and I know I'm getting older because I was kept looking at the time like, damn, bro, I could really get eight hours right now. And I didn't get home till like one and only got like six hours. I'm looking forward to sleeping in. But speaking of Chicago and one of Chicago's greats, let's talk about Michael Jordan. So he did the. So it was funny. We came into the theater after the game or after we left the Lakers game. And Cliff, I think it was Cliff who brought up the Michael Jordan segment. Or maybe you deal with the. One of the articles. And immediately I was just like, this can't be good, right? Like, this is like, what is Michael doing? What the hell is going on? So I wanted to watch it because I wanted to talk about it before we got here. And you put it on a laptop right there. And I was ready to hate so bad. I was like, yo, this is terrible. And I watched. It was a three minute segment with Tarico, and it was brilliant. He was talking about the reason why he came back. He wanted to pay it forward to the league. They asked him. Tarico asked Mike about the last time he played a shot of basketball. It was a legendary story because Mike always want to tell you how much motherfucking money he got. And he was like, you know, I rented a. Rented a mansion and the owner wanted his kids to come over. And he was like, the writer code. It felt like a weird Space Jam sequel, right? Like, yo, he gave me a ball. And I was really nervous to shoot.

[Howard Beck]

Do you think he was actually nervous? Or is he like, is this like, fake modesty, like?

[Logan Murdoch]

Or is he.

[Howard Beck]

Is he so far?

[Logan Murdoch]

Because we just talked about it in the last segment. You're a superstar when you know how to be great with your own mythology. Yeah, LeBron was good at it. Kobe was amazing at it. LeBron is. Was amazing at it. And, like, it's a little on the fence right now, right? But it was a great interview. He talked about how much he missed the game. He talked about, like, it was very emotional. And it feels like I came away thinking after watching that clip after all these years, like, it feels like Mike wants to be a part of something again, right? Like, for years he's been. He's been with the league, but he's kind of hovered, pun intended, over the league. He doesn't really go to games that much. Um, he does. He's kind. Doesn't really do many interviews like that. You can kind of see him sometimes at a Hornets game, but, like, he's just closed off. And it felt like a guy that still, like, you could kind of see it at the 75th anniversary. I'm sure somebody's going to do a profile on Mike, hopefully is Wright Thompson, who can like, kind of give us some context to all of this stuff that's going on. But from what I see, it felt like after that 75th anniversary, when he's like, around the guys, it felt like a beginning of like, oh, I love the camaraderie here. And then you see him at the hall of Fame recently, like, he's fucking chiming it up with Doug Collins, right, Who's in a walker, right? And he's seeing like, hey, Michael Cooper, hey, such and such. And he's like, kind of being part of the game again and again. I wanted to come into this and be like, what is Mike doing? Is he having this, like, crisis or something? But it felt like he just wanted to be back a part of the game. You don't need the bread.

[Howard Beck]

Yeah.

[Logan Murdoch]

It felt like he wanted to be part of the family again.

[Howard Beck]

It's easy to be cynical about it and wonder like what does MJ possibly need with this? And considering that he has for most of his post playing career stayed out of the limelight.

[Logan Murdoch]

And by the way, during his post, during his playing career he still hovered above the league. Like I think about even an anecdote. He wasn't even in video games until I think 2012 when he did NBA 2K12 where he had his own licensing agreement aside from the players. And he just wouldn't, you know, like forgot about that. You would have. I would have to create Michael Jordan on NBA Live, bro. Or he would be like that random dude on the bulls. I like 99 overall. But it wasn't Mike. Like he would always try to. It was the league and Michael Jordan.

[Howard Beck]

He spent years as the Hornets owner without ever doing local media. Right. Like, like not even the perfunctory. Like I think there was like one.

[Logan Murdoch]

Time he like Oprah like once. Yeah.

[Howard Beck]

He would occasionally like have some little quick round table with like 20 people at it or whatever. Like and that's it. But it was. He's been very, very, very rarely heard from since retiring. Since his famous slash, infamous hall of Fame speech when he was inducted. Like there hasn't been a lot. We obviously we had the last dance. But that was a completely, you know, Jordan controlled. You know, I don't want to say completely Jordan controlled. It was a brilliant problem.

[Logan Murdoch]

It was, it was brilliant propaganda. It was riveting.

[Howard Beck]

I loved the series. No, no, I love, I loved the series. It was great. But we know that Michael obviously was able to just tell things the way he wanted to. Yeah, let's leave it at that. He has very rarely been heard from and certainly not in a setting where it's an interviewer and him sitting down and you can hear a back and forth and you can hear follow ups and not just something that is completely controlled. And so I, I don't know where this goes from here. Logan. Like I'm really curious to see what their use of Michael is. How many of these segments are they going to do? They're calling it MJ Insights to Excellence and it's these taped segments with him and Tariko. I assume it's going to be Tariko the whole time.

[Logan Murdoch]

I think they probably just do. They just canned one.

[Howard Beck]

They probably just like at one like hour session. They'll just keep cutting it up into these three minute segments. They could last the whole season. Right. Like, do the math. I'm sure that works. I, I, I don't know where else they go with this. I'm with you. As we watched it here tonight, before we started taping, we both were like, oh man, that's like, this seems really heartfelt.

[Logan Murdoch]

Right.

[Howard Beck]

Like he's saying, I've got an obligation to the game of basketball and paying it forward.

[Logan Murdoch]

Okay.

[Howard Beck]

I think I kind of buy that. Like maybe he's missing it. And I do think, actually the one thing that struck me most, if there's nothing else that I think I have learned in a very long time now covering this league, just started season 29 for me tonight, it's that guys like Michael are, and, and Kobe was this way too. Are wired differently than about 98% of the players in the NBA where when he says how much he misses the game. Yeah, that's, that shit's genuine. And you can see it in his, in his face. You can hear it in his voice. There are some guys that it is so embedded in them that walking away is hard. Staying away is hard. Not picking up the ball is hard. Just like I think part of his distance is maybe just because he, like, he can't be in it the way he wants to be in it.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah.

[Howard Beck]

And like they're not all wired that way. I guarantee you folks, not every professional basketball player is wired that way. There is a, a sliver of them who are so married to the game, so passionate about it, who are so driven by it that they cannot extricate it from the rest of their being. And that is Michael. And so I, I do think there was value in like kind of hearing and seeing him talk about that tonight. Like, that hit me. But the but is that I don't know where else they go with this. And we, we pulled up awful announcing their summation of this. And the very last line was where, where I just went, oh no. After the segment, NBC teased more from the Jordan sit down. During next week's telecast, the network plans to air MJ's. MJ's opinions unload management. Oh man, we don't need it. We don't. Like we have heard every 90s and early 2000s player to the like, every single one of them is checked in already on load management and modern ways of like, you know, managing minutes. We don't need it. We don't need any more. We don't need anybody else from the 90s to talk about how players today should all play 82 games in 40 minutes a game. We were manly or back in the day. I don't. We don't need that. We don't.

[Logan Murdoch]

How. But how does this.

[Howard Beck]

How do we.

[Logan Murdoch]

How do we. How do we do it right then? Like, what. What is the right way to do this? Because I do want to. Like, the thing is also I want to hear from Mike, you know, I do want to hear what he has to say. Like, that's the other thing about this. Like, I want to hear his ups and downs, his flaws. Like, I don't want to. I don't want to hear, like, a Disneyfication of it. I want to hear Mike. He's the greatest player. I don't know, man. There's a lot of people that are going to say, look at LeBron and all these things, right? But, like, consensusly, like, from a certain generation, he is the greatest player, right? And Kareem is accessible. More accessible than Mike is, right?

[Howard Beck]

Kareem wasn't for a very long time, and then he became more so.

[Logan Murdoch]

Sure. I'm talking about at the stage that Michael is in right now, you could actually, like, feel you could touch Kareem, right?

[Howard Beck]

Yeah.

[Logan Murdoch]

And even in the video, like, I was like, damn, is this AI. Like, Jordan? Is this really Jordan talking on this?

[Howard Beck]

I know it looked.

[Logan Murdoch]

It looked.

[Howard Beck]

It looked somehow strange.

[Logan Murdoch]

It looked wild because, like, he doesn't talk, right? And I get it, man. Like, you look at the last dance where he was a guy, like, he was so famous, like, could not come out of his dressing room at all, right? There was always somebody that wanted something from him, and he's been able to live a quiet life, but I think the game needs him. I don't really. I don't really if it's produced like that. And I know we was hating because we had this conversation before this podcast, the pre pod, and I was like, I don't know if I want to hear, but maybe I do want to hear Michael Jordan just talk. I think I want to Hear him in 2025 just talk and maybe be an old man. It was really cool. It was really compelling. For 10 hours during the pandemic. Why not?

[Howard Beck]

Why not? It depends on what they do with it, right? Like, you know, if. If you and I got the chance to sit down with Michael right now, like, what would we.

[Logan Murdoch]

I'm trying to do it like the cigar aficionado dude. Like, he was hella good. I want to interview like that from Mike in 2025.

[Howard Beck]

But, like, all right, I want to Hear his thoughts on Anthony Edwards who gets so many comparisons to him. Yeah, but I don't want to just hear like, oh, I see similarities in style or whatever. I want to hear what it takes to actually be able to live up to that.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah.

[Howard Beck]

And, and listen, there was, you know, a decade and a half at least of everybody asking who was going to be the next Michael. It was starting when Michael was still in his prime.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah.

[Howard Beck]

And we did the whole Air Jordan, H E I R Jordan.

[Logan Murdoch]

Right.

[Howard Beck]

And you know, it was Kobe and Harold Minor and T Mac and Vince and Grant Hill and all these people and nobody could ever live up to it. And Kobe come, you know, came closest. But like, I don't know how often Michael talked about it back then. He probably did at times. It's been a long time since anybody brought up the like, hey, listen, we start doing this thing and it's, it's un, it's understandable for us to do it. Right. Oh man, Anthony Edwards sometimes looks like it. Anthony Edwards even embraces it. I want to know what Michael thinks of like attempting that. And does, does he think that's even a good idea? And how difficult does he think that is? And how difficult was it for you being compared to Dr. J or Elgin Baylor, whoever it might have been during his time? Like, I want, I want to hear that. I want to hear. I don't want to hear him on load management. I want to, I'm a. I don't necessarily want to hear him about the three point proliferation either because it's another one that old men from the 90s. This is, by the way, it's my generation's fault.

[Logan Murdoch]

Right.

[Howard Beck]

It's Gen X who are like clinging to the fucking 90s and a different brand of basketball and being all, you're.

[Logan Murdoch]

Not the only one. I wanted NBC to get the rights again for that same reason.

[Howard Beck]

I mean, but, but the crankiness is from people holding on to the basketball that we grew up on and that includes the players as well as the fans.

[Logan Murdoch]

So.

[Howard Beck]

But I, I do want to hear his thoughts on like the style of play. Right. Like, rather than hear him bitch about load management. I listen, I don't want to prejudge because we haven't heard it yet, but I'd rather hear, like, listen, the re. The rationale for a lot of this is the game is played at a much higher pace now than in your day, Michael. It has played a much more spread out than in your day, Michael, because of the three point game and guys have to cover a lot More ground, and they're running more miles per game. Also. They're coming in really specialized. I want to hear his thoughts on what it is. Like, would it be like to try to guard in today's game because he was an elite defender? How much harder would it have been for you, knowing how much ground you got to cover? Also, by the way, how do you feel about all the specialization that are that, like, as Baxter Holmes wrote very well several years ago, it's the specialization early on and all the minutes the guys are logging before they get to the NBA that are causing the injuries in the NBA. Like, I want to hear.

[Logan Murdoch]

Or did you see, like, this. This onslaught of European basketball coming when you played in the Olympics? Yeah. Hey, let's get to Rico on a plane and back to Florida.

[Howard Beck]

But, like, listen, for all we know, Mike has asked him a lot of these things.

[Logan Murdoch]

He's. I mean, he's a great interviewer. Like, even, like, that's another thing that.

[Howard Beck]

I love that Tariq was back on the NBA.

[Logan Murdoch]

Fuck yeah, man. Like, I. I don't. I. I think there's a. I would just say, like, from everything I've heard pregame and, like, talking to folks, like, I think there's a real excitement for Tarico to be just involved in this. I think you saw that, at least personally, during the Olympics when you saw the. The NBC apparatus and the storytelling and all of that. But there was just a calmness with those two. It was a real dance. So I do trust to Rico to be able to guide the ship and acts the right.

[Sponsor Voice]

Right.

[Howard Beck]

We don't need it to be more mythologizing. We got the 10 hours of the last last dance. We don't need it to be old man shaking his fist at the cloud either. So, like, I do. I'm curious to see where it goes. I was a little skeptical of, like, what is this all about? Why are they bringing Michael back with NBC? Is this just a nostalgia play? Because it's NBC and we got John Tesh and Round Ball Rock, so we'll bring in Michael, too. It has to be more than that.

[Logan Murdoch]

And, you know, like, Michael has, like, a special relationship with NBC. Right. Especially with Dick Eversole. So, like, he. I think he would only come back for NBC, and there's a. There's a nostalgia there because he basically, like, made NBC as a. As a. And helped grow them into what we. And what we think it was and reason why we wanted it back so much. A lot of that had to do with Michael.

[Announcer]

Yeah.

[Logan Murdoch]

And so there's a. There's a symmetry there. I. I like it. I. I just can't. I'm really curious to see how this plays out, because, like I said, I want to hear what Michael has to say, and I trust Tarico to be able to do that for sure. So we'll see what happens. Man. I don't know what timing is because I don't have the. The clock near me, but I know that V and. And. And C got a lot of work to do, and I want to go to sleep. So. That has been another edition. Real ones. I'm Logan Murdoch, AKA Logie Bu. Not the two. That is Howard Beck. Shout out. Joanne, she was really friend of the show Joanne, she was really pissed that I didn't.

[Howard Beck]

She was concerned.

[Logan Murdoch]

She was concerned that I didn't motherfuck Beck. And I was just like, it's a season preview. I didn't want to come in too hot.

[Howard Beck]

So nobody heard from you for two months. You've been off and, like, you came back and you were like, kind of just like.

[Logan Murdoch]

I was just. I was trying to ease my way in. I wanted to quit, like, 25. Five and five, you know? Now, you know, maybe I'll give you 41 of these times. But anyways, that was. We'll be back on Friday with. With Raja, and, you know, we'll see you guys soon, man. Real ones. All this shit's by.