C (3:35)

You. You said we weren't going to draw any conclusions, but that's a conclusion drawing question. The answer is no. Moving on, next team, I'll be boy. Vibe check bad. If we were trying to find, like, the right, like, physical manifestation of the vibes in la. You ever use an electric toothbrush, like, for, like.

B (4:04)

I use one every day. Every morning.

C (4:05)

All right, so, like, if you don't change the head out on some of these, like the Sonicare, especially the old school Sonicare and the water's been built

B (4:13)

and the new Sonicares as well.

C (4:15)

Yeah. No free ads on the other pod Sonicare. If you want to sponsor us, we're right here.

B (4:22)

The.

C (4:22)

The water buildup, like, then the, the, the. The calcium and all the, like, whatever, like all the stuff that's left behind. It's just if you don't clean that, if you don't change the head, it just gets all gunked up and then there is no vibe. You turn that thing on.

B (4:35)

They haven't changed their Sonicare head in like a year. So it's like the Lakers are a

C (4:40)

gunked up electric toothbrush. That is the vibe right now. A gunked up electric toothbrush that when you hit the button, it's just like going. It's not like, like vibrate. It can't get anything off your face. It's just like this, like, light hum. That's. That's the vibe in LA right now, at best. I don't know about the hot potato thing because, like, hot potato requires both guys passing it back and forth. And this was just like Luca going like, am I gonna shoot it? No, I'm not gonna shoot it. Oh, no. Oh, yeah. Yeah, there's just like. And then last night, like you can. I'm sorry, a team. Let's just sum up the. How bad this loss to Phoenix last night was. Luca, Luka Doncic, perennial MVP candidate. Luka Doncic, LeBron James, Perennial all time great. Austin Reeves, perennial now very, very, very good player. Lost to Colin Gillespie, Grayson Allen and Royce o'.

B (5:33)

Neill.

C (5:34)

That's essentially the sum of it. No, Devin Booker, not even a Dylan Brooks. Jalen Green played, but like had like nine points. LeBron, Luka, Austin Reeves, lost to Colin Gillespie, Grayson Allen, Royce O'.

B (5:45)

Neill.

C (5:46)

The Suns had scored 77 and 81 points in their last two games, which were both losses, and they've dropped 113 on the Lakers. This is not great. I agree with, I want to credit him, but I had the same feeling. But I agree with Tim McMahon, our buddy from ESPN, who earlier in the week basically said like, this just looks like a team that just already knows they're destined to not be together. And they're just kind of like. I don't know if he, I don't think he said it this way specifically, but I'll say it like, it's like they're playing out the string. It's kind of like they're just like, you know what, this is all temporary. Logan. They're caught between eras. They never intended to get Luka Doncic. We have to remember that 13 months ago, he was just gifted to them out of the blue. And they've done nothing since then to build around him. And lest we forget, Rich Paul issued a statement last June 30, July 1, whenever it was, saying, we respect that the Lakers want to build around Luca, but we kindly ask that they also consider LeBron's timeline, which is very short, they're caught between eras, and that they will not be uncaught until this season ends and LeBron possibly walks away and is off the books and they figure out how much to resign Austin Reeves for, and they figure out how to construct a roster around Luka Doncic. But for a year and a half, they've just been, you know, marking time. They don't have a functional rotation that is meant to maximize Luka Doncic, and certainly not a lineup that can play defense at any sort of level whatsoever.

B (7:15)

Yeah, and I mean, that was before the vibes were ass. And but like, to add to your point about them in a transitional phase, they're also in a transitional phase behind the scenes. And I think that that is another thing that we really don't discuss enough when we talk about what is Rob Pelinka going to be doing in six months? Right. Like, great question. Right. There have been a lot of, there's been little hires here and there around the margins. Right. Lon Rosen has been hired by the, by the team. There was an advisory role from the Virginia coach that has been taken on what else is happening behind the scenes and is that going to happen fast enough for the. When we get to the time around the off season when these things need to actually be put in place. Right. Like who is going to be, to be, to be driving this ship by the time we need some driving on this ship.

C (8:07)

Yeah. I mean it's been clear for some time, I think that this team was not a serious contender this season.

B (8:12)

Right.

C (8:12)

Like they'll be lucky to maybe win a playoff series at this point. They'll be lucky to stay out of the play in, you know, the Suns are barely in a position to pass them, but Booker's coming back soon. Like nothing.

B (8:24)

They're a game back. They're probably, they're not gonna their game back. Phoenix's warriors are three and a half games back. So like they're probably, if they fall, it'll probably some sort of like Lakers warriors playing, which isn't bad for the league. But it's talk about two teams that are just sad.

C (8:44)

Yeah, it's just, it's just. That's just a sad outcome.

B (8:47)

Yeah.

C (8:48)

So like the, in the short term again playing out the string. Maybe they make the playoffs as a six seed, maybe it's as a seven seed. Whatever it is, I don't expect them to be advancing very far around at best. And then. Yeah, I like low key. This is a huge, huge summer for the Lakers. I don't think enough has been said about it because we've been caught up in the day to day of, you know, LeBron's out. LeBron's back. Austin Reeves is out. Austin Reeves is back. How are the three of them coexisting? How are they doing? Like, there's just been a lot of just. I think we've been concentrating on the present, which is probably good as a, as a, a news judgment matter. We should try not to get too far ahead of ourselves. But in this league and with that team, you always have to think about what's next. And the Lakers are heading toward what might be the most consequential off season they've had since LeBron arrived or maybe since Anthony Davis arrived to join LeBron. At least as I said, they've done nothing to build around Luca and, like, you're on the clock. It's time. You better start building around this guy now. Or, you know, he may not want to stick around. Like, and I'm not saying that's any kind of intel. That's just like, that is the NBA in the 21st century. If you do not do right by your superstar, doesn't matter what contract they signed or how many extensions they signed or how much they're being paid, they will eventually get tired of things and ask to move on. So they're on the clock. And to your point about the front office and changes, yeah, it's been kind of like, you know, Lon Rosen is technically on the business side of this. But for those who don't know, Lon Rosen, longtime agent, advisor, conciliary, whatever, to Magic Johnson. Magic Johnson and Rob Polinka, who don't have the most glorious history together. And lan has been running the Dodgers and where Magic is a part owner along with Mark Walter, the new majority owner of the Lakers. So I, look, I'm not predicting anything. I don't know what will happen in the off season. Lon Rosen did give a press conference recently where he assured everyone that Rob Pelinka was going to remain as the head of basketball ops. That's fine. Those statements are made all the time in this league and in other professional sports leagues. I will believe it when I see the off season, whether or not they actually retain him. I don't like speculating on people's jobs, and I think I just did it. But it's. It's reasonable to wonder when a new owner comes in and has spent $10 billion. Even if Genie Buss is still the governor for the foreseeable future under the terms of their agreement, it's reasonable to wonder if the new owner, who just spent $10 billion is going to want to make substantial changes. And that front office, you know, has a lot riding. Whoever the front office is, the whole franchise has a lot riding on this summer. So it is something to keep an eye on, regardless. Oh, God, there's my famous last words again. Keep an eye on.

B (11:42)

Yeah, there you go. There you go. Go get it segregated and get trouble. But I. But I like the point that you say about Magic and Lon Rosen. Like, I'd be really scared if I was Rob. Rob Polinka at this point. Right. Because you're what you need when you're in a position like Rob Polinka. You need allies, and he is increasingly, increasingly losing allies. As we speak. Right. And, you know, to be honest, before he got Luka a gift from two of Luca, he was kind of like, how long is Rob Lincoln going to be here? Because he hasn't had, like, a great, great track record of building teams other than, you know, players and agencies gifting him stuff. Like Klutz. Just gifting him Anthony Davis and LeBron James, two generational talents at the time. And then now he just has, you know, just friends that just give him stuff and agents that give him stuff. And like. And just like, here. Here is a lifeline, charmed existence. Geez. But I would be scared if I. If I was Roblink. I want to ask a question just about Luca, though. For, like, he has been rake over the coals this week by everyone. It's one of those things where it's like, his flaws were all there, but when things go bad, people just eek at your flaws. Like, I'm just looking right now. Stephen A. Is like, Austin Reeves and Luca Doncic are getting called out for being defensive liabilities. And I'm like, have you not watched the Lakers this whole season? Have you not watched Luca and Austin Reeves their entire career? But there is something to be said about. One of the things with Luca is it. It felt like over the summer there was a very concerted effort for him to change the narrative of what we think about him, right? He's going to lose the weight. He's going to play better defensively and be better on that side of the ball. He's. He's going to be an MVP candidate, if not mvp. We got the stats on that for him. Like, he has played really, really well. And it's. It. I think it's a. It's two things. One, the roster just isn't great around him, right? Like, there's no real big. There's a big to speak of, but he doesn't want to play within the confines of the office that they. They. They need him to do. They don't want him. He doesn't want to play the role that they need him to play. And then you have an aging LeBron and all these things, and you have Austin Reeves, who's been injured. Where do you fall on the criticism of Luka Doncic? And is it kind of overblown this week, or is it right where it needs to be for where what his season has been so far?

C (14:25)

It's fair, and it's not really that different from some of the criticism that was leveled at him during his time in Dallas. The difference There being the Mavericks are never quite as, you know, the spotlight's not as bright on them as is on the Lakers, because, no, there is no brighter spotlight than the Lakers and especially a Laker team that still has LeBron on it as well. So I think some of this stuff, it's not that it was overlooked in Dallas, it was flagged at times, but really, like, the most criticism you heard about Luca was the source stuff after the Mavericks traded him and they were leaking all the behind the scenes reasons why they had concerns about him, right? His weight, his conditioning, his commitment, his defense. Da da da da da. I think a lot of the backlash this week, why it's sparking again, not, it's not just that the Lakers are struggling. It's that, you know, Luca has, you know, after starting the season in incredible shape, looks like he's backslid a little bit on the physical side of things they're losing and that it's going to highlight everything. But also, like, he's right back to as, as Zach was noting earlier in the week, as everyone has noted, he's right back to being as bad as he's ever been with every single call and every single non call, chewing out the refs and then not getting back on defense as a result. And those are fair observations. Those are fair criticisms. I saw some, like, pushback by some fans out there who are like, oh, the media is being so mean to him and why are they picking it? Like, because you're a perennial MVP candidate. That's the scrutiny you get when you're a pretty MVP candidate. They all get it. And, and especially when you carry yourself this way, like even the greatest players in the NBA will have their, their low moments, right? Bad shooting game, bad defensive game, whatever. But it's how you respond to it and it's also the way you carry yourself. And where Luka makes himself a lightning rod is by also being the biggest complainer in the entire NBA. And, and it, what it projects is like this almost sense of entitlement, like, how dare you not call that foul? Or how dare you call that that foul on me. And it's, it's a really unattractive quality. You and I talked about this with Tyler Parker when we did our show a few weeks back at All Star Week. It, it just makes him a lot less likable. He's super fun to watch and he's incredibly talented and he's had a lot of incredible moments in the league. But at some point it becomes, but you haven't won yet. Right. You've been to a Finals. Cool. You got to get back there. And I don't. Look, let's be fair here. It's not Luca's fault that the Lakers roster kind of blows. And it's not his fault that, that the Lakers are caught between eras because they still had LeBron and didn't expect to get Luca. So that's not on Luca. That's on the front office. And they've had multiple cycles here to address that part of it. Right. Like LeBron was going to be there regardless, taking up a huge amount of cap room and is an anchor. That does make it tough. But you got Luca well before the trade deadline in 2025, and you didn't do anything else except trade for and then rescind the trade for Mark Williams. You got to the off season. You didn't do anything around the draft or the off season itself to really markedly improve the roster. Ayton Marcus Smart, Jake Laravia. Eh, eh, eh. And then you just had another trade deadline come and go. And the stories that came out afterward were, oh, they're, they're holding their powder, you know, keeping their powder dry for the off season. Cool, fair. But that's like three cycles that you've had go by without really actually improving the roster or restructuring it around Luca. So Luca is, is bringing a lot of this on himself, but the bigger picture of the Lakers not being good enough is on the Lakers.

B (17:54)

Yeah, I mean, I, I think, I mean, and there's President for even Rob Pelinka building around the margins for LeBron in order to get it in time for a stretch run. Like, I think about 23, when, you know, they traded for Rui Hachimura and you know, they, they, they just, they made moves going down the stretch. There just haven't been those types of, of moves at the deadline. I think another thing that is would be scary for me at this point, and I'll leave it at this with Luca. When he was with the Mavs, it was one of those things where you would have that fear that no matter who was on Luca's roster, he's going to bring them up to heights that they've never seen or he's going to elevate this team. He hasn't really elevated this Lakers team in the way that we thought that, that he was supposed to. Right. Or at least, you know, recent history would suggest he should. Right? Roster be damned. You put the ball in Lucas hands, he is going to elevate. And that's why we, you know, There was always a take. Maybe he's better than Ant. He's better than all of these guys because, you know, he had such great success early in his career by lifting teams that wouldn't otherwise be where they are without him. Similar, like, you know, that's why I got the early LeBron comparisons, because he was able to do that, and you haven't seen that. I saw a stat recently that basically he hasn't been, you know, getting it done in the clutch. It's usually been Austin Reeves or LeBron that have been doing that, and he hasn't really been taking over games in the way that you would like to. I wish I had the stat in front of me. I should have put that in the rundown, but I did not. But it was a very interesting stat about his clutch play, and that's really illustrative of where we are right now, because usually it's, let's keep it close, Luka's gonna bring us home or keep it close, and LeBron's gonna break us home. But the vibes have been so terrible, bringing this all the way back, that, you know, they're just trying to keep it together. Everything right now on the court is just trying to keep it together, not winning games. And, you know, that's where we are right now. We spent 18 minutes on the Lakers, which, you know, is not gonna. Was not gonna keep us from the allegations that we only talk about them, even though we don't. So, anyway, let's. Let's talk about another interesting vibe check in the Western Conference. The Denver Nuggets, who. They had the off season. I spent some time with them over the weekend. They had the offseason, you know where they go, and they. They flip MPJ for Cam Johnson, then they get Bruce Brown and they get Tim Hardaway Jr. They really round out that roster around their core of Jamal Murray, Aaron Gordon, and. And Nicola Jokic. They get off to a great start, 12 and 3. And it seems like they are going to push OKC for their throne. And just injuries after injuries after injuries have happened to them, but they've kind. They've stayed afloat a lot because, you know, Adelman and his staff has done really, really well, and they have been able to develop players as the injuries have. Have accumulated. You know, you talk about Spencer Jones, who's done really, really well, Peyton Watson coming into form even though he's injured right now, but right now they are in a weird place where during a stretch run, they have to both find a rhythm and implement new Pieces back into the fold and like Aaron Gordon. Right. And that is a tough balance to have. I on the way this morning I thought of two teams that are, that are comps, that are like kind of cops. I thought about the OH1 Lakers which you talked about like his best, which, which you covered. Excuse me. And I thought about the 0809 Boston Celtics. And the Lakers are the best case scenario in this situation because they were injured for most of that year, stayed afloat, went through a lot of like LA bs, but they stayed afloat and then went on the best run in NBA history. And then you think about the 0809 Celtics where they're off, off of a title and they're just chronically injured. And we could also make this case for the next team we were to talk about, but I don't know what they're going to be right now, but I know if they're fully healthy I'm really scared of them. And if they're not healthy, that really sucks for basketball. What's your vibe check on the Nuggets? That's mine. What is yours?

C (22:13)

It's a, it's a much newer, cleaner electric toothbrush. I'm not going to make electric toothbrush jokes for the entire pot, I swear. I promise. So they're fourth in the Western Conference at 37 and 22, half game behind Houston for third half game up on Minnesota. So like it's really tight in that, in that stretch of the Western Conference and they're, they've all been kind of up and down. The Nuggets still have the number one offense by by rating in the NBA, their 20th in defensive rating for net rating of seventh. But over their last 17 they have a losing record eight and nine with the fifth best offense, the 15th best defense, net rating of 10th. So the Nuggets have been kind of meh recently. Jokic hasn't quite been as sharp since coming back from injury himself. And yeah, no Aaron Gordon, no Peyton Watson.

B (23:03)

Hey, he hasn't been as sharp but he had 30 something 20 and 12 on Sunday. But he hasn't been as sharp.

C (23:09)

He's getting there.

B (23:10)

Well, that's getting there.

C (23:11)

You know, he's been the entire stretch of it, not just the most recent. He's getting there. He'll be fine. Yeah, but yeah, this like this team at their best was never a great defensive team, but they became respectable when they won the championship and they've been able to maintain that more or less for the last few years when they've got the Right. Personnel out there and when they're healthy. And Aaron Gordon is huge for them. He's so important. And Peyton Watson has become incredibly important as well. So you're not going to be a respectable defense with those two out. David Adelman has hinted recently that those guys are going to come back sometime with maybe around 20 games to go. So that's soon. We'll see. They both have hamstring injuries, and those are tough.

B (23:54)

Aaron Gordon, by the way, who's, like, had. He had one in the finals, playoffs last year.

C (24:00)

Yeah, yeah, but not, not both legs last year, but, like, in both legs, like, he's gone back and forth. He has had hamstring injuries in both legs, chronic, which is. Yeah, it's really scary. But if we assume good health, if we assume that Gordon and Peyton Watson are back soon. Yeah, I'm not, I'm not particularly worried about the Nuggets. The vibes will be fine. The games, the wins will be fine. It'll all follow. But, you know, they're, you know, they're in a little bit of a delicate spot here. There's not much room for error. You know, the good news is, like I say, that's that zone they're in in the Western Conference. Everybody's a little wonky right now. So they are one of those teams as a veteran team, as a team that's won a championship, as a team that's made many deep playoff runs. I think they're one of those teams where you don't worry about their playoff seating. Right. Like, there could be the two, the three, the four, you know, even the five. And as long as they're healthy, they're going to be a threat to make a deep run. But, you know, you, you, you do, like, health is. Is the first priority. Just get there.

B (25:04)

I mean, last year they were a four seed, and then they played OKC and probably pushed it to the brink. And they're probably. Aaron Gordon, hamstring away from going to the conference finals. To your point. I want to read you a quote really quickly. This is from. This is from David. David Adelman over the weekend. He said you have to play a different style sometimes. And he's talking about, you know, guys coming in and out of the lineup. You have to play a different style sometimes when you have certain people out, but I think we get people back. It's hard for people that have taken on more responsibility to fall back in their role. It's human nature, and they're trying to do it, but they also know that. Let's say over two weeks stress. They had the ball in their hands constantly and now someone comes back and, and that changes. So there's these little incremental stretches where you just have to be a little bit more patient with the group. Even when Nicola coming back, it's just not him coming back, it's him getting back into rhythm. It's guys understanding that the style of play on both ends is very different Now. I saw them in Golden State when they came over the weekend and you could see, and granted this is the third game in four days they had. It was a vaunted 12:30 start, which you love Howard Beck as a beat writer, but players and teams don't necessarily love that. Right. So it was the last game, last game of a, of a three game road trip. And then they had to, you know, play through that and you could see the ups and downs with Gold against Golden State where they came out flat. The Anthony Melton had a game and then they get back into rhythm, get back in the flow. And then you would see just stupid turnovers from Nicola where Nikola, as great as he is, just sometimes just has brain farts where he'll airball a layup and just wide open in transition or he'll just throw a lazy pass into the post. And both of those things were catastrophic on Sunday. But then you know that you have a. They have a day off and they have a big game against Boston and they just kind of wipe the floor with him in the second half. Right. And we'll talk about Boston later on. But you're starting to see those, okay, we can get there. We see the light. And on the other hand, we're our own worst enemy. And I think that that's just going to be the push and pull for this team because if I'm in the Western Conference, I don't want to face Denver fully healthy. I think that they can go into the finals and, and win the championship. I think anybody who is coming out of the the west is winning a title this season. But if the Nuggets get to anybody, they match up with everyone. We'll talk about this a little bit later when we get back in person in LA this season. But they're going to be right there in the mix. They just need to figure themselves out and just figure out this. Like that's the other thing. How many times have you had to see a team just as great as they've been still have to figure out themselves in real time? I feel like that's a thing that you. You tend to see even with the great teams.

C (27:57)

Yeah. I mean, the Nuggets have a fairly consistent identity, but they do have, like, significant new pieces this year. Right. Like Bruce Brown coming back. You know, actually, like, that's, that's a kind of a seam at kind of stabilizes them. Yeah. But like, Peyton Watson's taken on a bigger role, but he's been around for a while. You know, Cam Johnson, you know, has not been quite as impactful, I think, as, as they hoped or as he had hoped. But it's mostly the same crew. Right. You know, it's, it's Jokic and Jamal Murray and a healthier. And Gordon when he's back. And Christian Brown, Bruce Brown. So, like, I don't worry too much about their identity or them finding themselves. They just got to kind of get healthy and catch their stride again. They're at, they're at Oklahoma tonight. Right. We're recording this, you know, midday and Friday. So that's a huge one. Shay's coming back, so the Thunder will be closer. You know, they're not at full strength either. J Dub is still out, but like, they're closer to full strength. Getting Shea back. The Nuggets are, you know, getting there. You know, none of these games are, you know, necessarily like the gauge, but that's going to be a fun one to watch. And yeah, it's like we're getting to that point of the season where all these teams got to get their guys back out on the court and start tuning up for the playoffs.

B (29:08)

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C (30:20)

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B (30:28)

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B (31:04)

let's talk about OKC. Kind of the same better record, but kind of the same problems that Denver is having, right? Just has to their rhythm is all messed up because of all the injuries. It's so funny because at the beginning of the season they were like, is this going to be the greatest team we've ever seen? And now they're just a really, you know, good team that's on track for 60 wins. But San Antonio might catch him as a is a real possibility that San Antonio could finish after all this has happened, after all the injuries that have happened with San Antonio, they could catch and have the best record in the Western Conference. What's your vibe check on on Oklahoma City right now? I think, I think it's pretty straightforward. They've been injured for a long time and yeah, they're just, they, they have to just kind of figure out this new identity on the a good test for them.

C (31:52)

I would say that yeah, it is wild to think back to when they were 24 and 1 and we're talking about are they gonna like, you know, break the warriors record. They're gonna be one of the all time great teams. You know, they're going for 73, 74, 75, 78 wins. Whatever it was. They were 24 and one. Like it was fun to get carried away for a bit. Since then they're 21 and 14 which is still very, very good. But that's like a 49 to 50 win pace. 49 as opposed to 70 something. So you know SGA's missed the last nine games. They were five and four in that stretch. Jalen Williams has missed the last five and 15 of the last 17. He's only played in 26 games out of 60 this season. So they haven't been themselves like literally, like literally. They just haven't had their group on the court enough. They are 45 and 15 still first in the Western Conference. Game and a half up on the spurs, one in the lost column. Six. Best offense in the NBA number one defense number one net by a lot. Their, their net is 11.2 per 100 which is three better three points per 100 better than than Detroit. But last 15 games, Thunder are eight and seven, 10th in offense, seventh in defense for a net of ninth. So they've been kind of eh. Also like everybody. I mean we talk about the dog days of the NBA season for a reason. Logan. In this era it's often because guys are just all banged up. In the past it was more just like that January lull. Everybody comes out hot at the start. Season's new, everyone's fresh. January, you know those weeks leading to all star break, you're just kind of like dragging through this. Goes for beat writers too, by the way. January is always the part of the year where I was always like, oh my God, why do we do this? Especially when you're like back when we always had like four games and five nights and you're like somewhere in the middle of a road trip and like Cleveland or somewhere and it's one in the morning and you got to get up five hours later to catch another plane. Like, you know, it'll, it'll wear on you. And if it wears on us, you can only imagine how much more it's wearing on players who actually are doing all the physical exertion, albeit they get to fly on private jets while we're catching commercial planes. But whatever, we're, we're getting through the end of the dog days here. And like all these teams we're talking about today, like the records especially of the teams that are supposed to be great and everybody's kind of like hovering around.500 over like 15 or 20 or 30 games. Yeah, there's a little bit of that mid season lull. But you expect a team like the Thunder, as with the Nuggets, when healthy. I think they're going to be fine.

B (34:24)

I Think from a human level, though, I feel for J Dub, right, because this is supposed to be, you know, he had a breakout season last year. It was an All Star, but this was supposed to be the season that he capitalizes on that, right, where he's supposed to be a really certified dude in the league. And, you know, it started last. It's. It's all of what's happening right now, Gaza's roots. Last year when he played through that ugly hand injury. Did you. Have you seen that? There's footage on it. On. On that hand injury. Like, he. The. The Gen Z thing now is, like, filming everything. And so, like, he. He, like filmed what his. What his X rays look like and stuff. And I've been locked in on YouTube, on his YouTube channel, and it. He had to have surgery on that, you know, that pushed him out. He wasn't able to work out in the way that he's supposed to, and didn't really. Didn't really get to really work on his game this summer, and now is trying to find his way, then pulls his hamstring, which is like a. An injury that you get when you're not really working out that much and have to ramp up. And so he's about to come back. Seems like it. He spent a lot of time in the Bay Area over the All Star break, but I feel for him, right? Like, I feel for guys like that because that's what this, This. A season like this for a team like that is supposed to have. Guys that are really just trying to find themselves, and hopefully they find themselves within the playoffs. I just. One of the things whenever I watch them, it's just. I'm happy to see the young guys do well, and I'm happy to see, you know, the A.J. mitchells of the world and the, you know, the Isaiah Joes of the world kind of come into form. But when I watch them, I. I just. I do feel like there is a ceiling. They're not as good as their records suggest, I don't think. When they, like, look, when we go to the playoffs, I'm going to be really curious to see how they match up with the San Antonios and the Nuggets of the world. And that's what I'm. I'm kind of curious about. I think they can beat the Houstons and the Minnesotas, but it's. It's going to be really tough sledding. It's not going to be easy for them in the postseason. It's not going to be a cakewalk by Any means for the Thunder, no matter how good and talented that they are and where they can reach, there's going to be be some question marks.

C (36:33)

In June, we were saying they're champions and my gosh, they just might be the next dynasty in a league that had forgotten dynasties because of all the parody of the last seven, eight years. And they go out to 24. 124 and one start. And it's wow. Yep. Like, oh, here we go here. Yeah, here we go. They're not only going to go back to back, not only going to become the next dynasty, they're going to set records along the way. They're just going to set the entire league on fire. And here we are. We have like a legit race. We have a legit race partially for the wrong reasons, partially for the right reasons. Right. Like, injuries are a big part of why it's suddenly suspenseful in the West. And I always say, like, give me suspense, give me an open race, give me mystery going into the postseason. It sucks that it's often because. Or in this case, it's largely because of injury, but it's also because the San Antonio spurs, who I think even internally, they were just here in Brooklyn last night. In fact, they are still here. They're here for like five days. Good for sent. The spurs should send a big fucking gift basket to Evan Wash at NBA headquarters for the scheduling. They've got five days in New York and they've actually got a nice five days. Right. Like the snow is melting, it's sunny out right now. It's kind of actually semi pleasant for a late February day. And the spurs have five days here. We'll see what kind of shape they're in by the time you live there.

B (37:49)

And you're jealous.

C (37:53)

I'm just saying it's a gift. They were, they were granted, like, Pete, like, Spurs officials, like, all brought their spouses on this trip.

B (38:00)

This is definitely a spouse trip.

C (38:02)

There.

B (38:02)

There are people like, I'm going, I'm going. I'm going to this one. I'm on the plane, dude.

C (38:07)

There are people in the spurs front office who I saw at Barclays center last night who don't normally travel, but they're on this trip.

B (38:14)

Yeah, I haven't seen you in five years. What are you doing here?

C (38:18)

Literally, at least five years for some of them. So, yeah, they're, they're enjoying this. But the spurs are, you know, again, conversations I had with some of them, they did not expect to be here at this point in second in the Western Conference. Shouting distance of the Thunder with a chance to catch them and having manhandled them during the regular season so far with all the reason the world to think that they can knock them out in the playoffs. This was. They're so far ahead of schedule and I think ahead of even their internal expectations. Being a playoff team, a solid playoff team, not a play in, but even a playoff team would have been the ceiling or just the reasonable expectation this season. Their young guys have just taken such big leaps. De' Aaron Fox has been fantastic for them, you know, on the, on the veteran side of things. Right. We don't think of them as a veteran team, but they do have Dear and Fox and Harrison Barnes kind of anchoring and Luke Cornett anchoring around that young core with Wemby and Steph Castle, Dylan Harper. Vassella is kind of like even like a, you know, early vet at this stage. So they're young and they have no playoff experience so far as a group. But I think they're actually built to do this.

B (39:31)

They have a weird like roster in that. You know, we don't talk about this but Dearra Fox was a number one option on a playoff team. That was his team. That was a four seat and, and

C (39:41)

he's just one of the guys here.

B (39:42)

He's just one of the guys like yeah, what a great come up for him.

C (39:46)

Yeah. And they're so much fun to watch and they seem like such a great group. It's like it like the spurs are really easy to pull for and I think too for anybody who like, you know, you know, if you're looking for real rivalries and just real competition and, and don't necessarily want the Thunder to just like roll everybody for the next five years like the spurs are, are I think your best hope.

B (40:07)

There's.

C (40:09)

But yeah, we've got a race. Spurs, Nuggets, Thunder at minimum, Rockets maybe Rockets. I don't have a lot of face to them. Minnesota. Minnesota would I think be the other one too. Zach and Michael Pino talked about this the other day on the pod and I agree. Like I think the next team after that top group would be the Timberwolves.

B (40:29)

Yeah. The story of OKC season and we, we talk about them and inevitably the spurs come out and come up and just. Yeah, we don't want to talk about you no more Thunder. It's fine, it's fine. I'm gonna talk about the darlings of the league instead. The new darlings. Yeah, it's always funny to an NBA. It's just always Funny how, like, anytime we have plans for something, you know, the NBA gods just take it away, right? Like, I think about 2014 when it was supposed to be the LeBron's league and San Antonio spurs league. And the war is like, nope, stop. OKC is like, hey, man, we're gonna be a dynasty. You know, it's our second time. We're gonna push the warriors record and the Bulls record. Sanito is like, yeah, not, not so fast. Yeah, relax.

C (41:16)

Yeah, it's good for the league, though. It's fun.

B (41:18)

Yeah. The Pistons were like in the 80s. Lakers, Celtics. Hold on. We're gonna get our titles. Just one second. Yeah, it's funny how the league works.

C (41:28)

Minor interruption.

B (41:29)

Yeah, yeah. Speaking of the Celtics, let's talk about the Celtics. Currently second in the East, 8 and 2 in the last 10. Jason Tatum might be coming back. I don't know. Can they win the East? Jalen Brown, mvp. They gotta, they gotta. They got a great office. Here's the other thing that I think about with the Celtics is they're great as an Eastern Conference team. And the Pistons also found this out. Whenever they go to the west, they get pummeled. Right? Like it's, it's a weird barometer in this Easter conference because you do have legitimately really good teams. Until they see Debo or they see the Western Conference and it's like the gap is still there. What do you think about the Celtics?

C (42:16)

They're the rare team on this list, Logan. And by the way, they had a pretty good Western Conference swing, right? Like they, they beat the warriors, they win at LA against the Lakers, the Suns, like not like the, the toughest teams in the world, but still they went what, like three and one on the road trip. Finished with the, the loss at Denver.

B (42:33)

Played against. They played against the warriors without Steph, that played against the Lakers, who we just said was a dumpster fire.

C (42:39)

The Lakers without Vibes.

B (42:41)

Without Vibes. And they played against the Suns without Booker or anybody. Right. And then they played the Nuggets, who, you know, at home in Denver, which was a real measuring stick. And they got dog walked.

C (42:54)

Yeah, you know, happens. They are Celtics 38 and 22nd in the Eastern Conference with a two game lead in the lost column on the Knicks second overall offense, seventh defensively. And the net rating of their third in that rating behind only the Thunder and Pistons. Pretty nice. Their last 19 games are 14 and 5. So they're the rare team we're talking about today that has not gone into one of these luls. Joe Mazula won't let them.

B (43:23)

Jalen Brown won't let him.

C (43:26)

Joe Missoula's stare alone is scaring them into being professional every night. Last 19 games, eighth overall offense, third overall defense, net rating of fifth. So they're, they're consistently just competitive and really good. And yeah, now we've got this Tatum thing looming. The reports are that he's been going five on five. So this feels like an any day now kind of moment. Right? Like any day now we're going to hear he's been cleared and he's out on the court and it's going to be super interesting. There's no analog for this, I don't think. Logan, you, you mentioned a couple teams earlier and I think these are great examples. A Laker team that was banged up in 01 and they go on to win the championship. Celtics, the year that KG got hurt after their championship. Like, there's some other plate, some other moments where guys would come back, but Jason Tatum is a perennial MVP candidate, perennial NBA player who was even. With Jalen Brown having won Finals mvp, Jason Tatum is the guy we think of as their number one. And we. Nobody thought he'd be back this season. Everybody said gap year. They're number two in the East. They're in position to actually contend. They're a position to actually win the east and their best player has not even played a game yet. I don't think there's any analog for this. I don't think there's any precedent. I don't think. And because of that, I'm. It's absolutely fascinating because in his absence, their number two has become a clear number one. Like Jalen Brown was on my fake straw poll MVP ballot to Bon Temps a couple weeks ago. Right. Like, I think I had him fourth. He doesn't have the dominant stats of the top guys. He doesn't have the, the gaudy box score numbers of Shea and Jokic or Cade. He doesn't have the, the advanced stats. In fact, some of the advanced stats kind of, you know, are, are kind of weirdly uninspiring for him.

B (45:17)

Yeah. Yeah.

C (45:18)

This is where, like, sometimes we just have to throw the stats out the window. This. And that applies with Jalen Brown. The Celtics have been amazing and they're amazing because of him. It's. It's like Derek White's great, Peyton Pritchard's great. They got some nice role players, yada, yada, yada. They are where they are because of Jaylen Brown. And so somewhere in there, without any of the. The numbers advanced, traditional or otherwise, we have to just acknowledge that the Celtics have been great because of Jalen Brown is therefore worthy of MVP discussion. I'm not saying put him at the top of the ballot. I, I probably will not. But he's been fantastic. And now Jason Tatum is coming back. So we get all these questions like what will he look like? How will they reintegrate him? How will Joe Missoula play this? How much can they really expect out of Jason Tatum? And. And all of that is super fascinating with 20 something games to go and then and the Celtics in a position to actually try to make a run to the Finals. So I, I can't wait to see this. It's. It's absolutely fascinating.

B (46:17)

It's so fascinating. I think the biggest thing that is fascinating is Jalen Brown because he's. On one hand he's gotten every single thing that he wanted and on the other hand he may have to either seed that control of the offense depending on how Tatum looks. But, but he also could. It's just going to be a big test for him. Right. Because he's going to have to seed spotlight no matter what happens or Jason Tatum just falls in line. But again, that's really hard. It's easy for me and you to say or do, but it's really hard when you're talking about somebody that's in an NBA and has wanted this as much as Jalen Brown has really wanted this. I can't emphasize how much he has wanted everything that he is getting this year and then to be validated that this team could be a winner or any team for that matter could be a winner with him leading the helm has been really cool for him and it's really been honestly just been really cool to see and so on the back end for that to at least be potentially taking that all away because there, that, that's the growing pains that me, you and Raja have talked about. That's going to be really hard. And what makes it so fascinating and also part of the reason why at least I don't want Tatum to come back this soon because he's just messing a lot of things up. But it could go really well. Chances are I don't. It could go really bad, which is that what where I lean to. Because it could go bad for Tatum's health, it could go bad for team chemistry and not necessarily people not liking each other, but trying to figure stuff out like what we just talked about with Denver right now and integrating a piece like Aaron Gordon into the fold and guys having to figure out their roles on the fly, right? Celtics have had to deal with this in the 1718 season, or, excuse me, the 1819 season with Kyrie and having to figure out their roles on the fly, and that didn't work out very well. Jalen Brown was also on that team, but it's so fascinating for all those things. But the biggest test is going to be how does Jalen Brown respond to this and how does he figure this out on the fly? Because he's going to have to seed something after getting everything he wanted.

C (48:30)

It's, It's. It's strange to say this, but I, I think the fact that Tatum is coming back from one of the toughest injuries in sports and certainly in the NBA, the Achilles, I think, actually puts everybody in a position to. To not have to strain to make this work. I agree with you. There's still a lot on Jaylen Brown to kind of like empower Jason Tatum and make him, you know, feel comfortable coming back after missing, you know, 2/3, 3/4 of the season. And Jalen has gotten to enjoy being the number one that he kind of always envisioned himself as for all this time. But those guys have a ton of. Of history together already. They know how to work together and play off of each other. I think the mystery is how to play off of each other when one of you is not 100%, because there's two definitions of these percentages, right? And I want to make very clear what I'm saying. Jason Tatum will be 100% when he comes back. I have absolute confidence that he will be 100% in terms of healed from his Achilles and 100% ready to play in an NBA game. The medical staff and the organization will not allow it otherwise. He will be 100%, but he will not necessarily be 100% of himself because the history of Achilles injuries is pretty clear on this. Some guys who, especially all Stars, never get back to all star level after an Achilles tear. Now, he's young enough that I expect, in my professional medical opinion, that he will. But you don't get there on day one when you come back. It's been 10 months or whatever since the Achilles. Like, chances are if Tatum gets back to exactly as explosive and mobile and effective as he was before the injury, that moment will still be down the line. That may be in October. So when he comes back now, he's probably going to have to ease in a little bit and probably can't expect to be 100% of himself. And that's the biggest, I think challenge for him to deal with Logan is that this is a matter of psyche as much as anything else. You have to be. You have to find a comfort again to trust your body and then you have to find a comfort in playing knowing you cannot be as awesome as you have become accustomed to being. But because of means that I think he has to lean on Jaylen Brown more and Jaylen Brown doesn't have to worry about ceding anything or like, oh, what's the power sharing arrangement? No, like Jason Tatum has the luxury of Jalen Brown playing at a, at a number one level and he can lean on that and Jaylen Brown can do everything possible to empower Jason Tatum and help bring him along again. But I don't think this is a case where you have this tug of war or something or you know, just that, that, that ego battle we sometimes see with co number ones or uneasy star alignments like these two, I think are going to be fine. And Tatum needing to get him his, his legs back under him I think actually helps that process.

B (51:19)

Yeah, that sounds great in theory. We'll see how it is in practice. Yeah, like, you know, and I think you brought up a really, a lot of great points. Another point on that Achilles injury, the surgery of Achilles and has been just light years better than it has when, you know, we first started really getting Achilles injuries and how it could just be a death blow to your career. Right. Like, yeah, you know, just the, the heights that we've seen in the medical field over the last few years has just been astounding. But let's, let's move on. We, let's go. We're staying in the Eastern Conference. Let's go to the Cavs. They're 5 and 1 since acquiring James Harden who has a fracture in, in his hand. Still gonna play through it. That's going to be a fascinating thing to see. James Harden, you know, trying to play through injuries because he has so much on the line in this postseason. He want that, he wants a new deal and we'll see what happens on that one. But again, James Harden's on and off numbers defensively are the worst in the NBA according to Clean the Glass as opponents have been 21 points per 100 possessions. Better on offense when Harden is on the floor. Not very great, was it? It was about the same when he was on the Clippers. We'll my. I think their vibes are great right now. I don't know how long this is going to last. Howard Beck what do you think? Because. In part because of the. The stat that I just gave you.

C (52:44)

Yeah.

B (52:44)

I mean, it's not like. It's not like Donovan Mitchell is much better defensively.

C (52:49)

There's always been skepticism about this iteration of the Cavs, and there's always skepticism about James Harden wherever he is, and especially when it comes to the postseason on both counts, Harden and the Cavs, and now we have them together. So. Yeah, I get it.

B (53:01)

However.

C (53:02)

However, the Cavs are like the sneaky, best vibes team we might be discussing today in the bigger picture. I listen.

B (53:11)

They had that great honeymoon phase right now.

C (53:14)

Not. I'm not. Not so even predating the hardened thing. So here we go.

B (53:17)

Yeah. Yeah.

C (53:18)

They started the season 17 and 16 and we're all like, oh, my God. And there's speculation about Kenny Atkinson's job security and all this other stuff. They're 20 and seven since then. They have not lost two straight games since late December, six and one in games that Harden has actually played since the trade. He's missed a couple of them last 27 games in which they've gone 20 and seven in that span. They have the second best offense in the NBA, eighth best defense for a net rating of fifth. They have been sneaky, really good over that span since the really rough start. And that was pre Harden and that's with Harden. And Harden definitely makes them better. Right. Like, we'll see what happens in the postseason. But James Harden is a. A better player still than Darius Garland. He's certainly better than a Darius Garland who's constantly injured and as. As. As of this recording still remains out for the Clippers. So I. I like where the Cavs are at right now. Harden seems to have. And it. Like Harden, Donovan Mitchell alignment seems to have been almost seamless. Right. Two guys who are both used to having the ball in their hands a ton and high usage rates historically, but both of whom have had partnerships that they've had to manage before. Right. Like Donovan Mitchell did a pretty damn good job of it in Cleveland the last few years with Darius Garland. Pardon's done it in the past with, you know, Chris Paul, with Kawhi Paul, George with whoever. Like, I. I feel like, you know, that part of it. I'm not worried about whether they can come through in the postseason and in big moments and in clutch moments. That's the real question. And this team has had a lot of injury issues as well. By the way. Quick footnote. Cavs at Detroit tonight. Another big game.

B (55:09)

Yeah. Also, Cavs are of the Fourth easiest schedule according to Tank Thou. So their vibes are going to be continuing to be great, I think.

C (55:20)

And, and yeah. And they can still. They're, you know, look, they're one loss behind the Knicks in the standings.

B (55:25)

Another, but also another team that's in the Western Conference. I would say they played against OKC without any of their starters and like it couldn't pull it out. Like there's, there's also those. Yeah. Tea leaves that are there as well.

C (55:37)

Little alarming moments along the way. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

B (55:40)

But the honeymoon is great. It was great. It's great. A lot of great alley oops. A lot of great pick and rolls. I love the, the Mobley Harden big and roll. It's, it's, it's vibes. Detroit, what's your vibe? Check on Detroit.

C (55:54)

I mean immaculate or is as immaculate as we're going to get in a league where everybody goes through like some awful little lull and like for them it's just, you know, they had the scuffle with the Hornets. They lost Stu and Duran for a while there. 43 and 14 first in the Eastern Conference. Five and a half game lead on the Celtics. They're going to be the number one seed in the east, no question, since they had. The only lull the Pistons had was they lost three of four in late December to early January. Since then they're 18 and five with the fifth best offense, the number one defense and the number one net rating, number two in net rating. So in that span, last 23 games, Pistons number one rating. Number one net rating in the NBA. Can you guess who is number two?

B (56:41)

Is it the Thunder?

C (56:43)

It is not. They are the like sixth or something in that span.

B (56:48)

Is it the Celtics?

C (56:50)

No, they were just ahead of the Thunder.

B (56:54)

Okay, go ahead.

C (56:55)

The second best net rating over the last 23 games during which the Pistons

B (56:59)

have been numbers Spurs.

C (57:02)

They're third behind the Hornets. Charlotte a plus 10.7.

B (57:09)

I just wish. I wish Charlotte was just. I just thought. Wish they were like a 5C so I can really be excited, you know.

C (57:15)

I know it's. They're still climbing and they've got a sustained. But still. Still wild man. Wild shit.

B (57:22)

Yeah. Yeah.

C (57:24)

The Pistons also haven't lost two straight since late December. Like they just keep chugging along. They're great. They're really fun to watch. Kate is getting legitimate MVP chatter. This MVP race could break any number of ways, especially once the 65 game rule comes into play. We'll see if, if Jokic makes it, we'll See if Wemby makes it.

B (57:45)

I'm holding on. I think Wemby has to. He can only miss, like, two more games. But I'm holding on to my pick. I'm holding on.

C (57:51)

Oh, that's right. That's right. Yeah. So I, I got, like, nothing. Like, we could nitpick the Pistons about shooting, and we did, in fact, nitpick the Pistons earlier in the week about shooting and play secondary, playmaking, shot creation and, you know, or they're.

B (58:08)

They're very bad. Loss to the spurs at home. Home. We could, you know, we could pick that, you know, all. Or, you know, just barely beating OKC without any of their starters.

C (58:17)

But, I mean, all fair, but still, that. Dude, they're the number one team in the Eastern Conference. I can't believe we're still having discussions of should they be the favorites in the East? Like, all right, they may not win the east, but yes, they are the fucking favorites in the East. They are number one in the east by five and a half games, I think, have been the most.

B (58:36)

I think it's too many. Three. Three team race. It's. It's. It's the Pistons, it's the Celtics, and I guess I could put the Cavs in there, but I don't believe. I. I. With the caveat that I don't believe in the Cavs, but I think it's a. It's three team race.

C (58:48)

If I'm ranking them in terms of confidence in them, it's probably like if the, if the Celtics were a whole. And. And they may be soon. And again, asterisk upon asterisk because we don't know what Tatum will look like.

B (59:00)

I think even without Tatum, I think I'm. I think I could. I would pick Boston.

C (59:04)

I have high confidence in the Celtics because of who they are, what they've shown in the past, even though they're, you know, it's not the same team. Right. It's not just Tatum. It's, you know, no Horford Porzingis, Drew Holiday, Luke Cornett. Like, there's a lot of new pieces in the rotation in the. In place of those guys. But, like, Boston and Detroit, in one order or another, are the two teams I have the most confidence in. And then it's down a couple notches to. To the Knicks and Cavs in whatever order. Right. But the Pistons are the favorites in the East. Like, we gotta stop doing this. Are they actually, like, there's no favorite? No, they're the favorites in the east by definition.

B (59:34)

I mean, we haven't seen. But here's the thing, though. We haven't really seen them do anything right like last year. They had a good year and they lost in the first round. Right. We don't have any proof of concept,

C (59:41)

but they were a six seed that had never been in the playoffs before.

B (59:44)

So I'm saying that's fair. I'm giving you the other side of it, though. We they haven't won a playoff series in this current iteration, and before that they won this playoff series. They were terrible. So we just, we have to keep that in mind that we don't have any real proof of concept other than winning a lot of regular season games this year.

C (59:58)

They may not win the east, but they should be favorites as of this moment for sure, based on everything we've seen.

B (60:04)

Yeah, and that's going to be a, that's going to be a interesting dynamic because I think San Antonio is going through this as well where it's it's one thing to get there, but the mindset to get through is going to be so much harder and something it's always the practice of trying to prepare something for something that you've never done before. And we'll see what the Pistons do. It's gonna be, it's gonna be fun. I can't wait to see them.

C (60:32)

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C (61:01)

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B (61:33)

Friday. You know what time it is? Time for Real One of the Week. Howard, do you have a real One of the week? Did you come prepared for this or are you aware that it was a Friday.

C (61:41)

Of course I did.

B (61:41)

Okay. I didn't know. I mean, I don't know. I didn't know. So go ahead.

C (61:45)

A professional. Logan, I know what I'm doing.

B (61:47)

Okay.

C (61:47)

Yeah, yeah.

B (61:48)

I've been doing this for a while.

C (61:50)

A little bit. You alluded to this earlier, but we did not get into it. The real one of the week for me, Clint Capella, like, yes.

B (62:01)

Can we talk about that really quickly? Because you had some thoughts over the phone then, and I thought that. I thought that what Aiden did was insane. I just thought, just even to say that whatever context it was in to say that in front of a group of journalists with our messy asses knew he was gonna write about that. Like. All right, let's.

C (62:18)

We'll start with a quote and then we'll get into it. So, David Menamon, great story that published yesterday, right?

B (62:26)

Yeah.

C (62:27)

About deandre Ayton and just kind of the enigma that is deandre Ayton and his time with the Lakers so far. And it gets into the highs and the lows and everything in between. And some really fun and occasionally wacky anecdotes about deandre Ayton and his time with the leg cartwheels. Everybody go.

B (62:42)

Just making everybody scared in the building. Just come on cartwheels.

C (62:46)

Seven footer doing cartwheels. Like, he's a playful dude. Like, that's part of his Persona and that's fine. But it's also part of why we all look at him and think he's not a serious person. So he gives, you know, his post game interview after a win the other night and. Or maybe it was a loss, but he had a good game. And then as he's walking away, he shouts out to no one in particular, I guess they're trying to make me Clint Capella, referring to the Rockets now backup center who a decade ago made his impact as a lob catching room, running big on a team that made it two conference finals. Quote, I'm not no Clint Capella. So Clint Capella is my. My real one of the week because Capella on his Instagram story screen grabbed the quote that Ayton had about not being no Clint Capella. And Capella writes over it. You got two of the best, by the way, letter U number two, shout out to Prince. You got two of the best floor general in the game. My dog lock in. And then he adds two laughing face emojis. Love this for Clint Capella. Like he's. Here's a guy who. He's not taking it as an insult. Clint Capella knows what he's done in this league and what deandre Ayton has done or not done in this league. And Clint Capella knows the the great luxury as a big of having guys like Luca or LeBron or in Capella's case back in the past, James Harden to throw lobs and make you look good, give you easy baskets. So that Capella decided to actually meet this head on was really cool. The funny thing is, if you click through his Instagram story, the next slides after that are highlights from Capella that night, blocking Tristan Da Silva twice in a row on one possession and then taking off on the fast break and then, and then getting his fourth block of the game finishes the fast break with a dunk from from a Reed shepherd lob. Clint Capella making an impact for the Rockets and for the season. By the way, Clint Capella has 43 blocks. DeAndre Ayton has 46. However, Clint Capella has played 616 minutes and DeAndre played 1406. So they have almost the same number of blocks and Capella has in in less than half the minutes. Clint Capella has been a really good player in this league. He was not the number one overall pick like DeAndre Ayton. He does not have all the glory and the riches that come with that. But Capella's had a damn good career, people. Go look at Tom Ziller's newsletter this morning if you haven't read it. He's got a great comparison and contrast of everything that Capella has done that deandre Ayton has not. This was a, a silly, ridiculous thing for Capella or for deandre Ayton to say and I love the clapback by it wasn't really, really a clapback. It was more Capella being like, look, dude, realize where you are and who you've got there and take advantage of them. It's okay. It's okay to be me. You can, you can make a really good living this way. You don't have to be the center of the offense or of the universe.

B (65:45)

You're right, deandre Aiden, you're not Clint Capella. You're absolutely right.

C (65:51)

You're not. And most teams would rather have if you took in their prime, they'd rather have Capella than Ayton, so.

B (65:57)

Or maybe right now they might rather have Capella than Aiden at this very moment. My quick aside on that, like, one thing about just athletes in general and also just like as a life lesson, if you do what you're supposed to do, you're gonna get everything you want. Like if Aiden just did what he was supposed to do and what he was asked to do on that roster and not do everything that he's been doing on previous rosters, like looking out for self and also like just having the. Not maturing, he'd get everything he wants. Now he's going to have to exercise his player option next year and maybe get traded. But it's just an interesting guy that is. It's a very best thing guy.

C (66:38)

The best thing Aiden has going for him in this context is that he has the same agent as Luca.

B (66:43)

Yep. Yep, exactly. That was just nuts. And I. You just don't say stuff like that, especially like when. No, and I know you have. I. What were you gonna say? Because we had a phone conversation yesterday and you were. You were a little pushing back on. On the quote. And let's talk through that really quickly.

C (67:04)

So only because. So when we talked on the phone yesterday, like, what had happened was McMenamin's story comes out and it's, you know, I don't know, maybe, you know, 1200, 1400 words or whatever, all these interesting anecdotes, a lot of nuance, highs and lows, as I said. But that quote immediately got aggregated by others and then that becomes the big thing. The story wasn't about deandre Ayton not wanting to be. No. Clint Capella. It was about all the other stuff. Yes, that was the spiciest quote. No, it was not a specific, like interview quote also. And so just to give people a

B (67:37)

sense, if I'm not mistaken, wasn't interviewed for the story. That was his only quote that he yelled into a lot.

C (67:42)

Right there was the group session, it looks like, where McManaman drew some quotes from there. And then as Ayton's walking away and he says that. So that, that's. That's the other quote. You and I both been in a lot of locker rooms over the years. I was a beat writer for, you know, for 16 years, you know, Lakers and Knicks. And so you have these situations where you're talking to a guy in a group session or even one on one in the locker room or whatever it is, but it's kind of understood. And deandre Ayton's been in the league long enough to. To know this. If you've just been talking to a scrum of reporters, then you walk away and then you shout something, say something, or to. Even to a teammate, if it's loud enough. And it's. It's clearly meant for the, the, the ears of everybody in the room. It's on the record. Like, it's not part of the interview, but it's on the record. I don't know if if like, and I'm only pointing this out like Ayton hasn't, hasn't denied anything or tried to push away from that or say like, oh, that was not supposed to be for the story. And he probably wouldn't, he probably thinks it was just fine despite the backlash he's now getting deservedly. But it's kind of understood in these contexts. Right? If you are in a room full of reporters and you say something out loud that is for the whole room to hear, that, that, that is all, of course, fair game. And you know, I've been in plenty of situations myself in the past, but it's, it, it's interesting to put it in that context. And the reason I pointed out is if anybody thinks like is taking it as something where, like DeAndreyton's in an interview where he says this, it is a little bit different. The off the cuff remark as he's walking away puts it in a little bit different light. But it also tells you something about how he's thinking about this because he's just given an interview to the, to the group where he's talking about, I can do all these things. I can, I can be a 20 in 10 guy. I can do all this if I've got the opportunity.

B (69:26)

Well, you had your opportunity to show that. That's the other thing. Sorry, go ahead, finish your point. I apologize.

C (69:31)

Two teams gave him that opportunity, you know, before this, and one of them bought him out and told him to go away.

B (69:38)

A team, by the way, that wasn't expected to do anything, nor wanted to do anything in the, in the Portland Trailblazers who had no expectations, you know, they were like, you are not going to be good for our development of our young guys. We're good. I feel you. I understand. But I think that also, like to your point, and I think you just made the point, you just don't say that in the scrum. You just don't say that. You don't say that. And there's been plenty.

C (70:04)

Or as you're walking away from it,

B (70:05)

or as you're walking away from it, there have been plenty of times, even when he's in the scrum where he'll say some stuff like, why would you even say that? Like when J.J. redick said that they were going to have the, the tough practice and he just rolls his eyes. The day after was like, y' all fell for that? Come on, come on, come on. Anyways, my room of the week is Chris Bosh. Just want to shout out, make sure he's doing okay, man. Like, he had a. He had a bit of a health scare that he said on social media, where he woke up covered in his own blood. That was. Brian Woodhorse reached out to him, and Bosch wouldn't get into specifics, but he's dealt with blood clot issues over the last few years, and I just want him to get healthy, man. I feel like we were. He was, you know, was robbed of the rest of his career because of these blood clots out of nowhere and then has had to continually deal with them. And I feel for him, and I think, you know, he was robbed personally, but, you know, we were all robbed as a basketball community because Chris Bosch, one of the. One of the greats of his generation, and it's just really tough. And I hope that I'm just giving him rumor of the week just to say, man, I hope everything works out, and I hope that you get better, and I hope that you're getting better, but whatever you're going through. So my role of the week is Chris Bosh. And, you know, that has been another for sure. That has been another edition of Real Ones Tuesday. Real Ones on the way. Realms, mailbag, gmail.com real onesmailback gmail.com real onesmailbag gmail.com will be answering all of your questions. Man, dog days for everybody. Dog days of the podcast. We still making it happen. We not. We're not. We're not letting up. All right, tap in. See y' all Tuesday. Ah, all the shits. Bye. Must be 21 years and older and present in select states for Kansas and an affiliation with the Kansas Star Casino or 18 and older and present in D.C. kentucky, Wyoming. Gambling problem. Call 1-800-G GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com, call 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org in Connecticut or visit MD Gambling Help in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gamblinghelplinema.org or call 1-800-327-5050 for 24. 7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8-HOPE NY or text HOPE NY NEW YORK. For Louisiana, call 1-877-770-7867.