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A
This episode is brought to you by Spectrum Business. Fast, reliable Internet means everything for your business and even this podcast. That's why I trust Spectrum Business. They keep companies of all sizes connected with Internet, advanced wi, fi, phone, tv, mobile services plus 24. 7 US based support. Millions of business owners already trust Spectrum business so visit spectrum.combusiness to learn more. Restrictions apply. Services not available in all areas. This episode is brought to you by Scout Motors. You don't change the game by standing on the sidelines. You do it by building something new. Iconic in the 70s and reimagined for today. The all new Scout Terra and Scout Traveler are engineered from the ground up with advanced capability and bold ingenuity. Build brand new for what's next. Opposing defense says take note. Join the waitlist@scoutmotors.com Concept vehicles not available for sale. Joining the waitlist does not guarantee purchase. Visit scoutmotors.com for details.
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B
Hello everyone. Logan Murdoch from Real Ones here. As you all know, this is a basketball podcast that tends to stick to basketball. With the current political landscape, we'd be remiss if we did not acknowledge what's transpiring in our country right now. Over the weekend, federal agents killed Alex Preddy in Minneapolis two weeks after federal agents shot and killed Renee Goode in Minneapolis. In this episode, myself, Howard Beck and Raja Bell explore how the NBA is responding to these killings. It's a very, very scary time in this country. And after the break, we'll try to make sense of how the basketball world is dealing with it and then we'll get to your mailbag questions. All that. Up next, all Real ones. Popping real ones. Logan Murdoch here, Roger Bell there. Howard Beck in the cut. It's gonna be a little somber first segment here with everything that's going on in Minneapolis in the wake of the killing of Alex Preddy at the hands of federal agents. Two weeks after federal agents killed Renee Goode sparked mass demonstrations in Minneapolis over the weekend after Saturday's killing. And a lot of those demonstrations ventured their way into Target center for the back to back for the first game of the back to back, excuse me, of the warriors and Minnesota Timberwolves over the weekend. And I just want to, you know, get right into it because Howard was in the middle of all of this. And let's get to that part first and then we'll talk about the ramifications of everything that has transpiring league wide, you know, kind of give our take on it in the most responsible way that we can. So, Howard, can you kind of Give us a play by play of your experiences from touching down in Minneapolis on Saturday and up until where you are right now back in New York over the last couple of hours and just what kind of transpired from the beginning until now. Yeah.
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C
So, guys, you. As you know, I was. I had a long planned trip to. To Minneapolis to catch up with the warriors because they were going to be there for three days, and it was going to be two games over three days, right. Saturday, Monday, so it was off day Sunday. Plenty of time for me to work on some things that I had arranged with them. Minneapolis is often a good market to go to, to. To, like, get teams that when they're in their home markets, especially a big market team like the warriors, it's a lot calmer on the road and especially in a, you know, a smaller market like Minneapolis. So at least that was the thought when I set this all up weeks ago, having no idea. And of course, the days leading into my flight Saturday with, like, the Renee Good had that, like, that incident had already happened. A lot had already happened. Protests had already happened. So I knew I was going into something. But I was on the plane Saturday morning. I took first flight out of jfk. My flight was landing right around the time that. On social media, as I'm following on Blue Sky, I start seeing things about, you know, a shooting another one. And, you know, because of the way our news environment works these days, like, my first thought was, like, all right, let's hope this is just chatter. This is not real. The details were really sketchy. I didn't even want to retweet what I saw initially, but this thing was literally unfolding as. As I was landing in Minneapolis and then watching it as on my way to the hotel. And then the details start to fill in, the videos start to come out, and it. Guys. It was just surreal to land in. In the middle of this and to have this awful juxtaposition of this. This struggle between the people of Minneapolis and these. These federal agents. As I'm coming in for the very trivial, relatively trivial assignment of. Of doing some. Some basketball reporting and writing, I was in a daze. Saturday, like, listen, like, everybody takes, you know, kind of a, you know, takes us in their own way. Everybody. I think the warriors felt that the Timberwolves felt it. As a visitor to town. I love Minneapolis. This all happened, by the way. It was, like, about a mile from. From the hotel I was staying at, and it's on, it's ongoing, and all you can do is sit there in disbelief and think like. Like, I can't. I just do not believe this is what's happening in our country and in this city that I just arrived in and following it in real time. I was in a day Saturday. I think everybody, you know, I think people all across the country probably were, and certainly people of Minneapolis were. I've only had a couple of times in nearly three decades of covering the NBA where events around us made me feel like what we do, the game, the league, my job is just fucking trivial. It's a different scale than say, 9 11. But like, when 911 happened two weeks later, I had to get on a plane to Honolulu for Laker training camp. And all I could think was, who gives a. Who cares? Who is Robert Ory still going to be starting at power forward or was he going to get supplanted? I think that was one of the themes in 2001. One who cares? And there are some moments where you're. It's. It's hard. And I talked to some other writers and some other basketball NBA people while I was there over the weekend about this is like, yeah, it's.
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B
It.
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C
There are moments where our.
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B
Our.
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C
Our jobs in this game and this league seem incredibly trivial and it. And it's hard to focus. And that's. That leads us to Sunday's game where really, you could see it in the Timberwolves, like they were carrying the burdens of that city. Steve Kerr flagged it immediately afterward. He said his quote was, their group was suffering. We could tell they were struggling with everything and. And just calling it a sad night. There was just, you know, we can get into it about what the arena was like, but it was just a really weird energy in the arena on Sunday. It became a back to back. So Monday was maybe a little bit closer to normal last night, but, you know, a lot of, you know, ice out or get ice out and those kinds of signs both days, both nights at the arena. Some, you know, there was the moment of silence Sunday night at the, you know, before the game. And as soon as the moment of silence was kind of coming to a close, you had people yelling fuck ice. And then it becoming kind of a chant and just a lot of, you know, a lot of. A lot of anger and a lot of. A lot of just frustrated energy. And, you know, the weird thing was it was also like a previously scheduled, like, city edition game night. So they had their Prince City Edition jerseys and a lot of Prince, you know, music as a soundtrack that. So, like, what's supposed to be in moments, festive and celebratory just fell flat. And I don't know, man, it was just, it was one of the strangest games I've ever attended. Just because of the atmosphere, like people's emotions were all over the place.
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B
Yeah. I mean, for everybody that is out there, I implore you to read John Krasinski's piece in the Athletic. Very sad, very somber piece, but it really illustrates, you know, what people are going through in the city of Minneapolis and having to try to compartmentalize watching a basketball game during these, you know, honestly, dire straits that are. That that has been put upon the people of Minneapolis at this time. You know, talking about businesses who are losing businesses because. Losing business because of the presence of federal agents in the region. And then also just the human element of John being scared to take his kids to school. Right. And the fear that goes on right there. And you know what I always think about, you know, when people say, you know, keep my politics out of sports. I think you're taking away the humanity of a person's feelings and how they live their life and assume that they can put themselves around a bubble when everything that is going on, you can see on the way to the arena. And over the last few years, Minneapolis has been a, just a lot has been going on there, you know, from George Floyd on down in terms of the protest, in terms of, you know, the fight for social justice. And I just Raja, when I think about this, we often ask players and coaches to compartmentalize for a number of reasons. Right. You know, not just something that happens in a, in a time like this, but I just don't know how you do that. I don't know how you do that in a situation like this. Right. And I, I think you saw it on the floor when, in both games when the Timberwolves played. Right. There was trying to be some sense of normalcy, but I, I, I really don't. I think this is really going to affect the Timberwolves, and it's really trivial that we're talking about it from a basketball perspective. But, but that's just what the type of show that we are. But how do you even do that?
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D
Yeah, I'd say it's virtually impossible if you're a member of the Timberwolves. This isn't even a ice take or a now what's happening in the world take, but major catastrophes in your local market as a player or as a human being. Even sometimes when that's not your market, you don't live there. You're not like state adjacent or city adjacent to what just took place. It's easier to kind of look at it. While you might feel for it, you don't feel it the same way as if you were living in that catastrophe, right? But when your boots on the ground, and that is your market, that is your home, those things are affecting you. And the people that you see on a day to day, there's no compartmentalizing that. Like that's, that's life. You're driving through it. You are, you know, seeing it every time you leave your house. These are the people that you interact with on a day to day. Every human being has that network of people that is their world and their day to day. When those people are hurting and feeling a certain way and scared for their lives, like that's going to affect you. There's no running from that. Now, once you get into the building, typically an NBA player would be able to to whatever degree, treat their craft and their professionalism as such. For that moment of time that we're working, like we're in, I'm lifting weights. I don't know necessarily that my mind is reflecting on everything that happened, you know, this morning on my way, right. Once we get to playing, playing was always a safe haven for me. Once I could get on the court from anything that was going on in my world, like that was where I like to be because I could forget about all the bullshit that was happening over there, right? And so in that regard, there is a compartmentalization to a degree. But I mean, that is just for that fraction of time that I'm out there and that I'm doing it like full scale. If I sit my ass on the bench for a few minutes, my thoughts will wander. Do you understand what I'm saying? While I'm working, I'm consumed. But when I'm not working, I'm going, I'm not consumed anymore. My thoughts are going to go to everything that's happening locally and with the people in that area. And so it becomes almost impossible to really, truly compartmentalize and focus on your job. Now you are professionals, you're paid a lot of money and you try to do your best, but that's unrealistic. And anyone acting like it should be realistic is quite frankly an asshole. Like, because what's happening, what's like, it's just. Look, I'm not a political person by nature. Like, I've got people in my family that are way more political than I am. But I'm a human being and try to live by the. You know, at minimum, we're all human beings and I can see your side and you can see mine, and we'll try to figure this out. But, like, if you can't feel for some of the people that these things are happening to and you can't feel their pain, then, you know, I don't know what to say about that, how.
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B
Spilling on that, I want to go to Howard, since he was there. How much of that did you see while you were in the arena? Not just from the players and coaches, but even staff, security, guards, everything that was around them, trying to make it as normal as possible versus it not actually happening. Because what Raja is saying is very much mirrors what we saw on television, right, where, you know, there was a, an attempt of normalcy to go to this game, but it didn't seem like that attempt actually came to fruition because, you know, of the, the ice chance and everything that's going on outside and the signs. What was, how was, how did the attempt go and what was the result of that attempt in your mind?
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C
I mean, the entire spectrum of, of emotions was, was present. Right? But also, and even just in terms of fans intent and being there, I was standing pregame, usual deal, like, I'm on the court and I, I had kind of posted up baseline when Steph was doing his usual pregame routine. And, and as you guys know, Logan certainly knows, Steph's pregame routine is legendary. This is like must see, not must see tv. It's like, it's, it's. It's a show. It is. It is. If you are going to attend a game that Steph Curry is playing, and especially on the road, because you don't get the chance to see him most of the time, he comes to your town once or twice a year, you get there early to watch Steph do his routine with, with Bruce. With Bruce Fraser. And there's a whole. It's a, it's a set routine, and it's pretty much the same every time. And it ends with, you know, Bruce and Steph, you know, kicking the ball back and forth soccer style until Steph then catches it and in one, one fell swoop, catches, boom, hits it. And if he doesn't swish it, he does it again. So I've seen this so many times, and there are people there who are excited to be there because it's, it's, you know, Steph's one of his few times coming through. So I ended up in conversation with, as a father with his three kids, they driven like almost two hours from, from like the western side of the state, like closer to the, to the Dakotas. And they were really disappointed when the game got postponed, but they were glad they still were able to, to come on the next day. And it's a weekend and you know, his kids are all, they're all teenagers, like, like 14 to 18, and son and two daughters. They're really excited. They're all wearing their Anthony Edwards jerseys. And I'm explaining to him, like, keep an eye on Steph and what he's going to do now because this is really cool. This is a really fun part of it. And so, like, they're true. They're very much enjoying that one of these rare opportunities. They'd never, they'd never been able to see Steph in person before. They're obviously Timberwolves fans, but they wanted to see the show that, that Steph can put on both pre game and obviously during the game and, and, and pregame. Kerr had said that Steph was dealing with a little bit of a knee thing. And so I told them, I'm like, listen, I, I hope he plays, but like, if you watch, like, I think he's, he was, he was moving the little ginger leaving pre game. And I saw him bobble the ball a little bit more than I normally would in his pregame routine.
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E
But.
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C
So there was an excitement, right? But it was a muted excitement and we didn't get into the politics of it. They sat in the very back section of that baseline area, and just like two rows in front of them were three of the folks who had the ice out now signs, which I took a photo of, which I, which I had posted on Blue sky and some other places. So within that, within that section, like there was the contrast right there. Excitement. Outrageous. And people wanted to come out to support their team, but also wanting to make a statement. They know the cameras are there and especially the next night. So Monday night, it's a peacock game, national game. And I think there were more signs last night that I saw. And certainly when, when, when anybody's shooting free throws at the, at the baseline near where I was sitting, they were holding them up because they knew the camera shots were going to catch their signs in the background. So I, I think people were trying to, like, not everybody, obviously, everybody's different. Who's in the arena? 19, 000 people, whatever, but they're people trying to check every box, right? I want to go. I want to see Steph Curry play. Obviously, unfortunately, he didn't play Monday night. I want to see Anthony Edwards. Unfortunately, he didn't play Monday night. I want to root for my team. I want to make it clear also to anybody who's watching this and to anybody who's in the arena and to anybody who's listening that what's happening in my city is not okay. And I, people were channeling all of that, you know, I feel like simultaneously and, you know, I don't know when things are going to feel normal again for, for folks in Minneapolis and St. Paul. I do know that, you know, I, you know, took, you know, Lyft to and from the airport, and both my drivers was all they could talk about. And both my drivers were hyper conscious of this because they both looked like people that ice might be targeting. And I could just feel it in, in, in the way, like they, you know, they bring it up immediately. You know, how they're feeling. Like, I didn't, I'm not prompting it. You know, you sometimes do that, especially as a reporter in town, like, well, what's going on in your city? Kind of stuff. This is just like the, this is the, this is the only conversation because everybody's feeling it and living it every day. They're, they're, you know, as citizens of, of that area, they are under siege. And the woman who drove me back to the airport this morning, she's Somali and she's Muslim. And, you know, we, we talked, you know, the entire way there about this. She, you know, she had a great energy about her. She had this really kind of, I think, the kind of positive vibe of like, kind of like, we're getting through this. And I had a neighbor who was suspicious of me. And when I first moved in, this is, you know, several years ago, and before all this stuff was going on and talking about how they kind of finally connected. And he realized, like, she's like, just because she's Muslim and from somewhere else, she's not a threat. She's lived here since she, since she was 11, she said, and fled some extreme violence in her country. Like, awful things happened to her family to push them to move here in the first place. And she was just very open about it all. And I just have so much sympathy and empathy for what folks that are going through. I hope this nightmare ends soon.
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D
I just had a thought, Logan. I want to be careful because I don't want to marginalize anything that's going on, but as it related to. You asked about a basketball player and how they compartmentalize that. And since so many of us are in, in the NBA are young black men. While it's hard, it's hard to say, it's sad to say. It makes me want to tear up. But like, this is not, not a reality for us on the regular. Like, I talk to my boys who are mixed about being out and protecting themselves from the people that are supposed to protect them at times, just as awareness, not to try to pit them against law enforcement or anything like that, but if I don't arm them with my experiences, then I could get a call from someone one day saying that they have done something wrong in a traffic stop. And sorry, but like, you asked how it affects NBA players, like, it's not that far from what we grew up dealing with from time to time. And that's sad and it's unfortunate that. Well, fortunate or unfortunate, depending on how you look at it. I'm sorry, but, like, this is what people have been yelling about in our community for a long time.
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B
Yeah.
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D
And, you know, I'd be remiss if I didn't say that. Like, it's just, it's unfortunate, it's terrifying. It's, it's, you know, but like, an NBA player may, in a weird way, be able to cope better because they've dealt with that in the past.
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B
And not only have they dealt with it in the past, it's an omnipresent thing, right? It's an omnipresent feeling of everything that people are going through right now. It's an omnipresent feeling. Like I, I mean, over the last, you know, year or so, I mean, every time I go out, you know, going, you know, you go on pick the little homie up from the daycare and then you go on your little afternoon walk and, you know, you see what's going on on television and you don't know, like, make sure you bring your ID and make sure you have this cool experience of just walking around with the fam, but you don't know what's going to happen every given moment. And that is. That feeling is omnipresent. Right. You know, and players, they're in a bubble, but their friends aren't. You know, the people that are around them aren't. You know, the people that aren't as famous as they are but are in their bubble aren't. So it's a lot to deal with. Now, one of the other things I want to talk about before we get out of this segment, you know, I know it's a heavy segment, but it is something that I think that we need to address, you know, as a, as a basketball podcast in the world that we live in. But, you know, the response to all of this. Right. And, you know, one of the, the biggest things that I, I think, I don't know if disappointed is the right word, but I think surprised is definitely the right word about the response, about the things that have been going on over the last couple of years from the players and how it's changed since 2020. Right. You know, I think that around 2020 and even in the years before that, anytime something that would go on socially, you would expect a, you know, something to be said from, you know, players and some kind of pushback. Right. Players, coaches. You know, I think even during the pandemic, organizations would make forceful statements against what they felt were wrong. Right. And even when it was going on during the pandemic, when I, you know, saw corporations doing that, I kind of looked at it as like a side eye because I didn't necessarily, you know, I could, I wouldn't put my hope into, you know, them, you know, pushing back against everything that people felt they were wrong. But it, but the reason why they did do that is because of the pressure of players and team employees and things like that. And I don't feel like that pressure has been put over the last year. Right. I think about, you know, Jalen Brown talked last night about, you know, the goings on in Minneapolis, but I hadn't heard him talk about anything socially. And I don't know how long. Right. Probably since there was a shooting in Memphis in 2023 when I think he had said something. But he's been largely silent on the types of issues that he, you know, purports to speak up against. Right. And now I know that he put out, you know, the MBPA put out a statement and Carl Towns put out a statement, but the MBPA statement, it felt like a lot of players were, you know, treading this line of fear and we have to say something, so we're going to say it in an individual statement. And another person that, you know, that I expect to hear from who purports himself to talk in these situations is LeBron James, who during, over the last few years has, you know, pushed back on the notion that players should shut up and dribble and, you know, has done initiatives like More than a Vote. But over the last few years, you know, he hasn't really used his voice to speak on these types of issues. Even in the last presidential election, he didn't make an endorsement. Until days before, he wasn't as politically active. And then I talk about the more than a vote, you know, before last election he ceded that off to Neko. And if you're going to as a player, and I'm not saying all players, but I'm saying if you are purporting that as a thing that you are trying to be, you have to stand on that. Not only when it's easy to speak out, but also when it's harder to speak out. And. And I'm not. This is an NBA podcast, so I can keep it to NBA. But across sports, every. Every player that has said that they are pushing back against the notion of I'm not somebody that shuts up in dribbles have been largely silent over the last year or two. When know the masses have said that know they have been wronged and they purport themselves to be the mouthpiece of the masses and the minorities they had. They. I think that they have dropped the ball on that. And then also, you know, the NBA has definitely retreated. I know the NBA, Pennsylvania has put out a statement, but has the NBA put out a statement? Haven't heard anything from them. They've been silent. Adam Silver has been silent on this. The same person that, you know, when he got pressure put on him by the players, put Black Lives Matter on the floor. And I know the NBA got pushed as a liberal league afterwards, but quiet is kept. He was the first person to take that off of the floor. NFL is still doing it. And you start to see, you're starting to see a lot of subtle changes. And I get it. It's a very scary time right now. Very scary time for a lot of us, chief among them black NBA players. It's a scary time. And you know, players from marginalized groups, it's a scary time. But I guess I don't have a question for this, but I would like to get to, you know, how the panel feels about it. But I just feel like, you know, the NBA or at least the people that have reported themselves to be people that speak up during times like this, have been largely silent. And I think that that has been a surprise. I don't know if it's a disappointment because I don't know all these people personally, but it's definitely been a surprise based on everything that they said during 2020 that they were about. So I don't know. Howard, you want to. You got anything on that for the league? As the league dropped the ball?
- [28:26]
C
I want to hear from Raja first on this because he's got a perspective that I don't as a former player. And I do have thoughts on this. But yeah, Raja, I'm curious how you've seen this unfold.
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D
Yeah, I don't really know exactly what my thought is on that. I have always tried to take the approach of understanding as it came to when people felt like it was necessary to use their voice and what they wanted to use it for. So I, I rarely get involved or concern myself when, with. With when and why they should be doing that. I would agree with you though, Logan, wholeheartedly, in that if you are a company, NBA or players who in the past have stood on certain things as it relates to, like, social awareness and, and that's kind of your lane, because not every player's lane is that lane, but if that is your lane, then yeah, I probably would side with you in that we expect to see and hear from you now more than ever. This is, this is scary shit. Regardless of who you are or what color you are or this is scary on a human level. And if you are and have in the past use your platform to raise awareness for things that are even minutely close in category to this, then we should be hearing from you. I would agree with you on that, Logan. I typically, as a player, though, and as a, as a person, try not to count other people's money or tell other people what they need to be standing up and speaking out on. Right. So that's difficult for me. But if you've made a habit of it in the past, that's kind of who you are as a brand. You've pushed back when people have, have challenged your right to do so. But then I, then I would expect that we should be hearing something and it's interesting.
- [30:42]
C
So, you know, I'll admit that in real time, in the 1990s, when I was not covering the NBA yet, I started coming to the NBA 97. But earlier in the 90s, when the whole issue of controversy came up about Michael Jordan not endorsing, there was a black Democrat running against Jesse Helms, the white ultra conservative Republican in North Carolina. And Jordan sat out because at that time it wasn't. It wasn't common for players to be injecting themselves into politics. And that was around the time of the, you know, infamous line of. Of Republicans buy sneakers too. Right. So I'll admit that personally in real time at that time, I was among those who was disappointed that, you know, Michael wouldn't get involved. Like, you've got such incredible Influence. You're the most most popular athlete in the country, maybe the world, one of the most influential. Like, why not use your platform? You knew where he stood. Even if he wasn't going to say it, it was kind of, it was kind of understood. But I've, I've evolved in my thinking over time in covering this league and just growing up, which is that it's not my place as a journalist and certainly as a middle aged white guy to be telling, you know, young black athletes what they should be doing with their, their wealth, their influence, their platform. That's not my place. I'm not sure it's anybody's place, frankly, but it's definitely not mine. Can I still be, on some level personally disappointed or, or wishing that there was more? Yeah, I, I admit that. I'll be honest. And, you know, for the sake of this conversation and in the context of what we're talking about and what's just happened, what is still happening in this country right now, there's a part of me that's like, yeah, where did, where did 2020 go? Where did that go? But I had this conversation with somebody else in the league some months ago before all this stuff was going on, but just generally about this, this curiosity about like, where did it go? And the feeling was like there was just kind of a, A, a, a, A fatigue and a fear. And those are the two things that I think are, are kind of tamping down everything right now. There's a fatigue from having done all this and been out front and taking all, all the, the backlash that comes with it and all the stress and the spotlight and, and then, yeah, it's difficult. And not everybody's cut out to be an activist and a political leader. Right. And just because you have a platform, just because you're a celebrity, just because you have influence, doesn't necessarily mean that you're comfortable injecting yourself in that or that you want to expose yourself and your family and your friends and your business partners and whoever, like, you know, you, you still do have to protect yourself too. And, and so, you know, I, I get that, but there's also a fear, and that fear comes without getting into it. Like, the fear comes from the, the, the way the political climate has changed since 2020. And so I do think that is at least a partial explanation to Logan's question about why things are a little bit different now. A lot of players have, as they've been interviewed in various markets, spoken like dear and Fox said something. And of course, Tyrese Halliburton had by response of any of the players with his tweet, Carl Anthony Towns. You know, people were like, oh, that was kind of, you know, a bland statement. But he, he made it very clear. He stood with the people of Minneapolis. He took a side. You, you could say that the language was tame, but, or, or measured, but he took a side. And the players association statement, which, when I posted it, I said strong statement from the Players association. And a bunch of people hit me back on blue sky saying like, that's not strong. What. And I think it's because they wanted it to be stronger. But like again, they took aside the players association representing all 450 plus all the two way guys, whatever, it's 480 something now, whatever that the number is. Their statement says now more than ever we must defend the right of freedom of speech and stand in solidarity with the people in Minnesota protesting and risking their lives to demand justice. That is not, that is unequivocal. That is, that is not ambiguous. They are saying we are with them. If you wanted them to say more, I get it. There's other words they could have used about what's happening and, and you know, but they made it very clear who they stood with. And so it's there. But yeah, the tenor is different, but the tenor of our country right now is different.
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B
Yeah, absolutely. How do you think. This is the last question on this segment. How do you think? I'll start with Howard, back to you, and I'll go to Roger. How do you think this, this weekend will shape the league going forward? Forward, if at all?
- [35:16]
C
I, I'm, I really struggled with this one because of everything we just discussed, like the league postponed. They didn't cancel. That was another reaction over the course of the weekend. Well, they shouldn't play at all. Players should, should, should actually tell the league we're not playing. You know, there was a lot of that. Again, easy for everybody on the outside to say what the league should do, what the players should do. You know, the, the world moves on. Right? Like businesses around Minneapolis and St. Paul are, you know, still open. Um, and everybody else is like, there, you, you, you move on and you keep, you keep doing what you can do in the course of the day while still running a business and tending to your family and, and school and all these other things. From an MBA standpoint, I don't think anything that happened this weekend is going to change anything on its own. I mean, God forbid we have anything more like this happening, whether in Minneapolis or elsewhere. In this country in the months and years ahead. But I don't know this was any kind of catalyzing event. I, I'm curious if it sparked more conversations in locker rooms, maybe if players might start to use this as a, as a impetus to, to my maybe move more in a direction of where they were in 2020. But I don't know. I don't know. I think like a lot of things in this country and in this world, you know, something flares up and we react and then we move on to the next thing. And so a lot of the question, I think your question, Logan, like it's a good question. Like, I think the answer sort of depends on what else happens, you know, what else happens elsewhere and the things that are outside of the NBA's control.
- [37:00]
D
Yeah, I would agree with that 100%. It's big business. It's going, it's going to keep moving. It's not, you know, like.
- [37:12]
B
If, if.
- [37:13]
D
If what we have that has already happened is all that really happens, it will not change a single thing moving forward in the NBA. That's just, that's just what it is. I can't speak for if we continue to, to see more and more tragedies and so on and so forth, I'd have a different answer. But like if that's what we're deal the events that have already transpired and, and we're not assuming that there's going to be more, you know, destruction, then yeah, I don't think it really changes the NBA in any way shape or two. Too big a business, too many, too many checks that, you know, have to be made or cashed or paid. It's just, it just keeps moving.
- [37:56]
B
Man. I don't have any more thing much more to say on that. It's just, it's a tragedy for everybody in Minneapolis. And be safe, please, please be safe out there. Take a quick break and we're going to finally get to your mailbag questions.
- [38:14]
A
This episode is brought to you by AMC plus you do not want to miss Rise of the 49ers, the limited series event premiering February 1st and 2nd exclusively on AMC and AMC. Plus executive produced by Tom Brady. The docuseries charts the legendary rise of the San Francisco 49ers from underdogs to five time Super bowl champions in the 80s and 90s. It features interviews with Joe Montana, Jerry Rice and Ronnie Lott as well as never be seen archival footage. Rise of the 49ers premiering February 1st and 2nd. Visit amcplus.com to start your free trial now. This episode is brought to you by one of my favorites, Coca Cola. Every sip of Coca Cola brings you closer to the excitement of the FIFA World Cup. 26. You could win one of thousands of prizes and a trip to see three matches. So grab a Coke and drink in the FIFA World Cup. 26. No purchase necessary. 13 plus in 50 US states in DC with a web enabled device. Ends March 1 with eight entry periods. Rules@cokeurl.com SoccerRules this episode is brought to you by Taxaction. Like an expert coach, TaxAct offers step by step guidance and guaranteed accuracy when filing taxes. Get tips along the way. Add expert assist to talk to tax experts and let our experts do your taxes for you. With Expert full service, TaxAct helps you find the deductions and credits you deserve so you can get them over with. Visit taxact.com to learn more. Conditions apply. See taxact.com for details.
- [39:49]
B
All right, and we back. We got Cliff in the building. What's happening, brother?
- [39:53]
E
Logan, Raj, Howard, man, how y' all feeling today?
- [39:55]
B
You know better since we've seen your face.
- [39:59]
E
Tough subject to get through, but we'll get through it. And prayers for everybody involved. Let's just jump right into the mailbag here. Howard actually responded to me about this one specifically in this trade, so let's get you guys thoughts on this one. This is from Sean Carroll. The subject line is warriors, salvage, trade. What up Beck and shout out to Logan and Raja. Y' all are the best. Hope you can wax poetic about this topic. I can't figure out all the CBA machinations or more accurately, I'm too lazy to try and understand it. But I want the warriors to shake it up. We will absolutely bottom feeding trash pandas as a franchise in the near future. Just a matter of how soon. So could there be a deal out there to Hail Mary this season? The dubs have been linked to the Pels for Trey Murphy or Herb Jones. Great ideas, but this Jimmy Butler injury flipped the equation. Why not ship Draymond to the Pelicans and bring back Jordan Poole? That'd be the main piece movement. Then add players to match salaries and hopefully we get Looney back. We'd further be destroying the Dynasty continuity, but in a way it's a fair swap with the former champs coming back home. What do you think? Pull back the Golden State might work. If Draymond is gone, we need offense and if the defense suffers and we suck, it's just a different version of this shitty team. Steph deserves a Lot something creative to be tried. I know trades are hard, but damn, so is being so mid. Love the show. Keep up the great work and please do some more live shows. Sean Carroll. It's a lot there. A lot to impact.
- [41:25]
C
We would love to do more live shows.
- [41:27]
E
Basically. Bottom line is he just wants to trade. He wants to trade Draymond Jordan.
- [41:32]
B
That says a lot about Draymond standing in the building bay right now and how it's kind of eroded over the last.
- [41:38]
C
Yeah. Producer Ben just said screw it. Sure. In the comments here.
- [41:42]
D
So, Ben, that's where I was kind of at. I'm gonna let you guys do your thing, but. But that's kind of where I was at. I mean, I. I kind of agree with what. What was his name? What was his name? Sorry, Howard.
- [41:53]
E
Sean. Sean Carroll.
- [41:54]
D
I'm kind of with him. Like, hey, bro, you're gonna. We could get more exciting offensively. Keeps us pretty much in the same situation we're in right now. Maybe. Maybe we get a little more electric offensively. We're a little better. I don't know. I'm not.
- [42:08]
C
Yes. Define exciting. Rush. No, but listen.
- [42:12]
D
Jordan, Jordan, Jordan. Pool for whatever. I will. Howard for whatever. Jordan Pool can do some shit with a basketball. I've said this to you before. There are very few people that I look at, and as I watch them go through, you know, you can see what's going on in most people's basketball brain as they maneuver around a court. He's got a weird, beautiful mind as it comes to some of the shit he will try to do. And when he gets hot, like, it's crazy. That's. That's fun for me to watch at times. I'm not guaranteeing it's going to win games or anything like that, but that's how I describe that.
- [42:47]
C
Yeah, I mean, it's. It's kind of like when we've talked about Lamelo, right? Like, Jordan Poole is not Lamelo by any stretch, but it's a similar kind of thing where it's like, there's a creativity and an audacity and. And yes, as you said, like, entertaining, exciting, maybe not actually impactful for winning, but, like. Okay, look, the reality here is that as long as you still have Steph and they do, the. The obligation is to try to win, not to just be entertaining. Steph will provide plenty of fireworks himself and good fireworks and fireworks that do lead to winning. I think. I think the warriors have seen enough of Jordan Pool in their own time, and in the years since they traded him to know that. That he's not helping them in this era or the next one. And by the way, his numbers in New Orleans, like, he started to have, like, a little bit, like, he showed some, like, growth in Washington, and it's just, like, total backsliding in New Orleans. Like, it's. His efficiency is in the toilet is like. Jordan, I don't know what the question is, but Jordan Poole is not the answer. And if you're gonna decide it's time to finally move on from Draymond, that's not the return. You. I do appreciate Sean's suggestion in the sense of, like, the symmetry there and just kind of like, you know, going back to the incident and all of it, but, like, no, I don't. This is not helping anybody.
- [44:04]
B
I could tell you that Jordan Poole will never play another game in Golden State. Yeah. As a home player, he's never gonna play. He's never gonna set foot into that home locker room.
- [44:18]
D
Well, let me ask you a question. Let me ask you a question, though. Real talk. Like, I understand everything you guys are saying. I get it.
- [44:23]
B
I get it.
- [44:23]
D
I think.
- [44:24]
B
I think the sentiment.
- [44:25]
D
Sean gets it, too.
- [44:26]
B
But.
- [44:29]
D
At face value, would you rather watch a team that we're going to be. We're going to be a 600 ball club either way. Would you rather watch one that's got a lot of cool shit to see and fireworks, or would you rather watch one that's like. And I'm not talking about the Golden State in general or necessarily, but, like, if we're going to be a 600 ball club that can't win a championship, I want to see some cool shit.
- [44:55]
B
I know. No, I feel you on that now. I feel you on that. I think the sentiment is there. What I will say is, you know, if they were going to make that deal for Draymond, this is. It's not. They should have did that three years ago, because I don't think the market is there for him if I'm going to. And I feel like this is depressing, like, answer for your, you know, trying to have an optimistic point of view about the future of the Golden State wars. And I really appreciate that. But if I were going to give you some optimism, Jimmy Butler's on an expiring contract next year with a high salary slot. Maybe something can happen from there. I don't think anything is going to happen that's actually going to change the direct to trajectory of the franchise, necessarily alongside Steph, but it's something, you know, it's Something, I don't know who's going to take on Draymond in any capacity at this point based on the production and everything that comes along with Draymond on the court and off the court. But you got a salary slot for Jimmy. It's better than nothing.
- [46:15]
E
Logan. I sounded very somber there.
- [46:19]
B
It's tough out here, bro.
- [46:20]
E
Let's get to the.
- [46:21]
B
Just had Ben Cruz in the chat talking about, screw it, let's trade for Jordan Poole and Kavon Mooney and.
- [46:27]
D
And Raja was not in the chat saying that. Facebook.
- [46:33]
E
Let's bring it back to 2022. All right, this is from. Obviously this is not as Josh. This is from Josh says yo. Let's say the aliens have attacked Earth and have the death beam pointed at us. They give us an offer. They'll spare us if we can beat them in the best of seven series in basketball. These aliens are so much more talented, quicker, stronger, etc. Than humans, but lack communication and chemistry. Your job is to create an all time 12 man lineup and coach to beat them. In this scenario. This team has a month to train together, meaning real life relationships and personalities also matter, I. E. Kobe, beefing with Shaq, etc. Which 12 are you choosing? Thank you for answering my question. Best Josh man.
- [47:12]
B
That is a great question, Howard. I take issue with the premise for this.
- [47:15]
C
Clearly, I'm not. No, I was going to say I take issue with the premise entirely because maybe. Maybe the aliens should just destroy us, frankly. Let's not put us a fight. We don't know. I went to a dark place.
- [47:30]
B
I don't know.
- [47:31]
C
Are we Clifford? You getting the impression he means like all time? Like we could like pick from all eras.
- [47:37]
E
Yeah, that's why he said like 12 players, Jordan.
- [47:39]
C
That's why I mentioned we need more talent and chemistry. Right. So we need great team guys.
- [47:44]
E
Yeah.
- [47:45]
B
Right? Yeah. Yeah.
- [47:46]
C
All right.
- [47:47]
B
Yeah. All right.
- [47:48]
C
Well, we just go around like just. I'll just. I'll just start. Let's. Let's start with. With the original. Let's put Bill Russell in the middle and go from there.
- [47:56]
B
Yep. Bill Russell, all time chemistry guy. I mean, you gotta have Mike on there. And I think Bill will pull Mike aside and be like, yo, you know.
- [48:06]
C
All right, it'll be mid career Mike, not early Mike, who was just jacking him.
- [48:18]
B
I don't normally do this, but I wish you would have said the question beforehand.
- [48:24]
D
We're gonna have to go pg. We're gonna have to go PG before. Yeah, that's a tough question. Yeah, you gotta go PG or Steph gonna play the one.
- [48:31]
B
We can.
- [48:32]
C
Sure.
- [48:33]
B
It's the real one's 12. So he can, you know, you have votes.
- [48:37]
D
I know, but if he's playing the one, then I gotta have a four. So much of what he does is off the ball.
- [48:42]
B
Right?
- [48:42]
D
Like, so he's on the one. Then you need a four that can. How about kind of like.
- [48:49]
B
How about Magic Johnson at the 1. At the 1. You have Steph running off of screenshots.
- [48:58]
D
At the 2 then, but puts MJ at the 3.
- [49:01]
C
That's fine.
- [49:02]
B
That's okay with that.
- [49:05]
C
He wanted a 12 man roster. If we do this whole thing, we're gonna have to have.
- [49:08]
D
Yeah, that's right. We're gonna need. I Forgot it was 12. I'm thinking 5 just for. For the sake of time. Yeah, I like magic and stuff. LeBron, you gotta have Bron. I mean, what are we talking about? Yeah, he's half alien anyway.
- [49:22]
B
Okay. Yes, he is. That's okay. That's our starting five. Bill Russell, Michael Jordan, Steph Curry, Magic Johnson, LeBron. Can I. Can I say who's coming off the bench real quick? Yeah, I. First off the bench. Kevin Durant coming off the bench.
- [49:39]
C
Oh, sure.
- [49:40]
B
Yeah, right. That's easy.
- [49:42]
C
The ultimate plug and play superstar. Is that what we always said?
- [49:45]
B
Yep. And then he has enough guys. I mean, it's only a month, bro. Like, it's fine. What's the worst that could happen in a month?
- [49:52]
D
I mean, you got. You. Yeah, you got to have the diesel. No. Prime.
- [49:58]
B
Diesel.
- [49:58]
C
Check.
- [49:58]
B
Might.
- [49:59]
C
Shaq might be a little pouty about coming off the bench behind Bill Russell.
- [50:02]
B
He's talking about.
- [50:04]
C
He does have respect for the legends.
- [50:06]
B
What about Tim Duncan? What about Tim Duncan? Because Tim Duncan, you're not going to get any problem with.
- [50:11]
D
You're not going to get anything.
- [50:12]
B
There might be a little problem with Shaq coming off the bench. Well, Tim Duncan's not going to give you any problem.
- [50:19]
D
So I'm having a long, hard talk with Shaq.
- [50:22]
B
Okay. It's only a month.
- [50:24]
D
But in his prime, bro. In his prime. Prime shack.
- [50:27]
B
Yeah.
- [50:28]
D
He was lifting human beings off the floor.
- [50:30]
B
And also, it's only a month and we need to save civilization. I'm gonna take Shaq because, like, I'm gonna take Shaq.
- [50:37]
C
Shaq should be in there. Duncan should be in there. What are we up to? 7.
- [50:41]
D
That's 8. That was 8 with KD, right.
- [50:46]
C
You know what? I think Scotty's got to be in there, too. I mean, Scotty like the ultimate wingman and can guard everywhere and can do a lot with the bottom fires.
- [50:59]
B
Yeah.
- [50:59]
D
Puts out a lot of fires, Howard.
- [51:01]
C
Yeah.
- [51:01]
B
Okay. I have a question for you, Raja. What do we think about Mutombo coming off the bench as another. Is that too redundant?
- [51:10]
C
I'd go Akeem before. Before Mutombo, though.
- [51:13]
B
Yeah, I go Hakeem. Okay, I. I can agree with that. Okay. Okay, Hakeem. Because he could also. I'm thinking of a big off the bench that is defensive minded and defensive focused.
- [51:23]
D
All right, how many bigs are we carrying? Because that's three. We got three bigs.
- [51:27]
B
We.
- [51:27]
D
We need a four counting.
- [51:29]
C
Four counting Duncan, but he's at the. We're putting him at the four.
- [51:31]
B
Right. Do we need a. Okay, how about this? What about a point guard off the bench? What about like Isaiah Thomas? Yes. Quick guy off Isaiah Thomas. Yes.
- [51:39]
D
Oh, no, I was kicking around the.
- [51:42]
C
Possibly like, like maybe Jason Kidd or even even Steve Nash. Like. All right, defensive liability. Steve. Sorry, Steve. But like, but he's coming off the bench. He's come off the bench. Yeah. Kid or Nash, I think would be the guy. I'd want. No disrespect to Zeke, who I.
- [51:58]
B
Who are we picking out? A kid in Nashville. Nash can shoot better early in his career overall because I know Jason Kidd could be a great spot up shooter, but Nash can do what J Kid can do and can hit you and can be efficient from the three point line.
- [52:14]
D
I have no gonna stand from this one. I'm out.
- [52:17]
C
J Kid's got the advantage on defense and not to mention just those, like, amazing, like, hit ahead passes and lobs and all that. But like, Steve does more with the ball in his hands, I think, doesn't he?
- [52:29]
B
Yeah, he.
- [52:29]
D
Or he.
- [52:30]
B
Yeah, I don't.
- [52:30]
D
I don't know.
- [52:30]
B
I don't know. It's fine. Steve ain't never coming on this podcast ever. Even though he'd be lying. So we're gonna go with J Kid. Yeah. You Steve. What's that?
- [52:39]
D
10?
- [52:39]
B
1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10. I. I just want to say I think we need a vibes guy. We need a vibes guy on the bench. He's not necessarily playing, but he's throw. He's throwing. He's twirling a towel. You know, he's. He could get in there if need be, but he's twirling a towel. We need a guy on the bench that's kind of like just, you know.
- [53:01]
D
But listen, do we.
- [53:02]
B
All right.
- [53:03]
D
I don't mean any. Yeah, he's probably not a Vibes guy, but like, do you go prime Larry Bird?
- [53:09]
B
Prime Larry Bird as your tenth guy? Fuck it.
- [53:13]
D
No, but I'm not even slotting anybody. I'm just talking about like we'll, we'll figure this shit out next week when we roll the ball out and play a little bit. But, but like as a skill set. Give me a bucket, I'll beat your ass with my left hand. I don't know. I'm asking, I'm not saying he's got to be.
- [53:29]
B
I think just for the sake of.
- [53:30]
D
You know, do you agree Howard or no.
- [53:33]
B
You know, we gotta, we gotta have, we gotta have Larry Legend in there some kind of way, you know, we're all getting overall.
- [53:38]
C
Getting fired. Is that what you're saying?
- [53:39]
B
Look, no, I'm just saying no. So I'm praying we're all getting two Celtics. How many Lakers do we have on this? We have 1, 2, 3, 3 Lakers on here. We only have one Celtic.
- [53:55]
C
I'm not, I'm not worried about balancing coasts or cities or franchises with multiple bands. Larry Legend should be on there because like we are. The, the premise was about chemistry and like you want team guys and like I think Larry Bird, in addition to being obviously one of the all time greats, definitely a great teammate.
- [54:12]
B
Also his dream team Larry too. Like if it was dream team Larry, also know 84 Larry or you know, 86 Larry would do as well. We have one last person on the list. Who would you do? What will we get? And we still have to pick a coach.
- [54:25]
C
Coach is an interesting question there too. Right? Because you want somebody who can manage them all, but you don't necessarily want like taskmaster type or too old school like, because again, we want Vibes, right? We want. The chemistry part of this was going to matter.
- [54:37]
B
Let's do the last player first and then we'll go to the coach who's the last player on the team.
- [54:45]
C
Why is this so hard?
- [54:48]
B
I just thought of Vibes guy, you know, but I mean, I guess we have a. Larry is, could be a Vibes guy. But I, I, I, there's a, there's a lot of great NBA players who were Vibes guys who everyone liked. Right?
- [55:01]
C
Pre, Pre ankles. Grant Hill.
- [55:04]
B
Oo, I like that. I like that.
- [55:07]
D
I do like that too.
- [55:10]
B
Yeah, because everybody loves Grant, right?
- [55:12]
C
You know, plus he could, he could double as, he could double as the manager because he's like head of USA Basketball. Like he can run the. So, you know.
- [55:19]
B
Yeah, okay, Pop Who.
- [55:22]
D
Pop is my coach.
- [55:23]
B
I was. Okay, Pops. What about Chuck Daly? He literally with the 92 dream team. Like, we don't need. Like, not to say Pop is great, but we don't need. We don't need Ski. Respect it. But I think Chuck, the way he did such a great job with that dream team, I think he is the archetype for what we want here.
- [55:43]
D
Chuck is good.
- [55:44]
B
But what scared me, like, Pops also.
- [55:45]
D
Scared me about what scared me about Chuck. My bad was when Howard said we don't want too old school. That was a long time ago. And I don't know. I can't remember offensively. Like, I can't remember his.
- [55:56]
B
His. His style necessarily.
- [55:59]
D
You know what I mean? I've seen what. I've seen Pop evolve and. And I got another. That's why Eileen.
- [56:05]
B
Pop. This is. This is in your backyard. Roger. What about Eric Spolster?
- [56:09]
D
Thought about him.
- [56:11]
B
Thought about him anyway, huh?
- [56:14]
C
What about Dan Tony?
- [56:16]
B
Dan Tony would. His Yo.
- [56:19]
D
Offensively, they would be a mother fumble.
- [56:22]
B
No, I think I'm gonna put SPO over Dantoni on this because I think SPO provides the necessary amount of vibes, the scheme.
- [56:28]
D
And also the SPO is doing what SPO is. SPO has expounded on what Mike was doing. I will give you that. But, like. Like, that was like. I don't. Yeah, I don't know. Mike just hasn't been doing it for a while. There's no telling what Mike would be looking like at this point.
- [56:44]
B
But is. Is Dan. Tony going. What is. Okay, when LeBron is doing, like, his little, like, weird subtweeting thing before the game, what is. Who is going to help with that? You know, who is going to. Is Bill Russell more likely to help with that? Yeah, I don't think that was actually. Yeah. Yeah.
- [56:58]
D
The same way it was Pat Riley here in Miami. I don't know that that was a SPO. I don't think SPO was in charge of handling that as much as Pat and the culture was.
- [57:07]
C
But I might actually take Showtime Riles as the coach of this team, you know?
- [57:13]
B
Yeah, it's only a month. But no, that's why I push back on that. Is why I push back on that. I'm still scared and, like, kind of triggered by the 89 Lakers when he took that. When he just ran them into the ground before the biggest game or biggest series of the season where he. Where was it? Was it 89 or was it 90? I think it was 91. When. When magic pulled his hamstring like, I don't know. You know, we kind of need Magic.
- [57:40]
C
And B. Scott both. Yeah.
- [57:41]
B
Yeah. We kind of need to have a.
- [57:42]
C
Balance Mini camp in Santa Barbara, I think is the. Is the way that goes. Yeah.
- [57:46]
D
Don Nelson.
- [57:48]
B
Don Nelson.
- [57:49]
D
I like Don Nelson. Is vibes, bro.
- [57:52]
B
Who we got?
- [57:53]
D
You got a lot of beer drinking, cigar smoking, golfing. Like, they're super talented Hoopers, but there's some. They're going to need cigar.
- [58:02]
C
All they're smoking.
- [58:03]
B
Yeah. With Nelly, they're smoking everything with. With Nelly, they're smoking all of that.
- [58:07]
C
They'll be a very relaxed team.
- [58:09]
D
They'll be the most.
- [58:10]
C
The most chill superstar team trying to save the world ever assembled.
- [58:14]
B
I think we. Or, okay, so we have Don Nelson, Chuck Daly. Do we spoke or do we spoke? Make that or no, let's just make it a staff. Like.
- [58:27]
D
Yeah, make it. Yeah, make your staff, Spo.
- [58:30]
B
Okay, I'm gonna make my staff. All right, I'll make your staff, and then we'll go from there. Okay.
- [58:35]
C
No, everybody we just mentioned, that's the staff.
- [58:37]
B
Okay. There we go. Yep.
- [58:39]
C
It's. It's. It's Chuck, it's Riles, it's spo, It's d'. Antoni. And Nelly is bringing the goodies for everybody.
- [58:48]
B
He's bringing the party favors.
- [58:49]
D
It's a stat.
- [58:52]
B
All right, man. That has been another edition of Real Ones. What a great ending to the Real Ones. This is how we started. Tap in with us, man. Me and Roger on Friday. Tap in all the shits. Bye.