West All-Star Picks: Starters and Reserves | Group Chat

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Ringer NBA Show – "West All-Star Picks: Starters and Reserves | Group Chat"

Release Date: January 16, 2025

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Introduction

In this episode of The Ringer NBA Show, the hosts Justin Barrier, Rob Mahoney, and Big Waz engage in an in-depth discussion about their selections for the Western Conference All-Star starters and reserves. The conversation delves into player performances, team dynamics, and the evolving criteria for All-Star nominations, offering listeners comprehensive insights into the current NBA landscape.

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New Segment Introduction

The episode kicks off with Justin Barrier announcing a new competitive format for the podcast, aiming to challenge the hosts and provide fresh perspectives on NBA topics. Despite some initial miscommunication and resistance from Rob Mahoney, the trio commits to integrating this segment, focusing primarily on Western Conference All-Star picks for this episode.

Notable Quote:

• Justin Barrier [03:14]: "This podcast is gonna take on a different shape than we thought going into it, but we will still have the Western Conference All-Star pick, so yay for that."

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All-Star Backcourt Selections

The discussion begins with the selection of backcourt starters. Justin favors Anthony Edwards and Stephen Curry, highlighting Edwards' remarkable three-point shooting improvement and Curry's enduring excellence.

Notable Quotes:

• Justin Barrier [11:23]: "Anthony Edwards... he's progressing even from the model he was last year."
• Big Waz [13:06]: "Steph Curry is the NBA All-Star Game personified as far as I'm concerned."

Rob and Big Waz concur on selecting Curry, emphasizing his pivotal role and unmatched performance despite team challenges.

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Front Court Selections

Moving to the front court, Justin selects Nikola Jokić, Victor Wembanyama, and Kevin Durant. The debate centers around choosing between Anthony Davis and Kevin Durant.

Notable Quotes:

• Rob Mahoney [32:11]: "Do you want to go Ant or Steph in the backcourt or AD or KD in the front court? All perfectly worthy choices."
• Justin Barrier [32:38]: "Kevin Durant... he's an efficiency monster and... he is legit a big man despite his age."

Big Waz opts for Durant, citing his leadership and pivotal role despite teammates' underperformance. Rob supports Durant’s selection, acknowledging Durant's efficiency and the strategic importance of his contributions to the team.

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Reserves and Wild Card Selections

The hosts explore reserve and wild card spots, debating players like Ja Morant, Jaren Jackson, Luka Dončić, Kyrie Irving, and Desmond Bane. The conversation highlights differing opinions on player efficiency, team impact, and individual contributions.

Notable Quotes:

• Justin Barrier [24:30]: "Kyrie has a really strong case. The Mavericks have won 61% of their games with him in the lineup."
• Big Waz [27:07]: "John Morant... he is the most electrifying player in the NBA, bar none."

Rob advocates for Jaren Jackson’s defensive prowess and offensive contributions, while Big Waz champions Ja Morant’s explosive impact despite efficiency concerns. The debate underscores the balance between statistical performance and intangible qualities like leadership and energy.

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Team Performance and Player Impact

A significant portion of the discussion focuses on how selected players influence their teams' success. The hosts emphasize the importance of players being central to their team’s strategies and their ability to elevate the entire roster.

Notable Quotes:

• Big Waz [08:27]: "This just really gives you a snapshot of the league in a way that I think is important and easy to overlook."
• Rob Mahoney [09:33]: "The selection for the team is just more competitive than the actual game."

They explore how players like Steph Curry and Kevin Durant carry their teams, making critical differences in both offense and defense, and how these contributions are pivotal for All-Star consideration.

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Final Thoughts and Conclusions

As the episode wraps up, the hosts recap their selections, providing final justifications and reflecting on the importance of recognizing both statistical excellence and essential team roles. They express anticipation for the upcoming All-Star Weekend and the potential impact of their picks on the festivities.

Notable Quotes:

• Justin Barrier [58:16]: "What I think is the most impressive to me, man."
• Rob Mahoney [66:26]: "He is still the absolute best in class at what he does."

The hosts conclude with a consensus on the necessity of balancing empirical data with narrative-driven performances, ensuring a well-rounded All-Star roster that honors both individual brilliance and team synergy.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Justin Barrier [02:45]: "Just bring a take, no conventional wisdom. Think outside the box."
• Big Waz [06:23]: "I couldn’t do anything about my face. It’s like the male equivalent of resting bitch face."
• Rob Mahoney [32:38]: "Anthony Davis... he's been able to give the Lakers a stability that's been really important."
• Justin Barrier [48:53]: "While Luka deserves a wild card, Ja Morant's electric play makes him indispensable."
• Big Waz [67:15]: "Wemby is excellent and he's learning. He's picking this up all the time."

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Conclusion

This episode of The Ringer NBA Show offers a thorough analysis of the Western Conference All-Star selections, enriched by the hosts' diverse perspectives and expertise. By balancing statistical performance with narrative impact, Justin, Rob, and Big Waz provide listeners with a nuanced understanding of what it takes to be recognized as an NBA All-Star in today's competitive environment.

Transcript

[Logan Murdoch]

What's poppin everybody? Logan Murdoch here from Real Ones on the Ringer NBA show and I wanted to invite you to pull up and kick it with Raja Bell, Howard Beck and myself during All Star Weekend for our live podcast. We're going to be at the historic Punchline Comedy Club in San francisco on Saturday, February 15th at 2pm pregaming all the All Star festivities. And you never know who might stop by. Get your tickets now by heading over to ringer.com events. That's ringer.com events. Hope to see you there.

[Justin Barrier]

This episode is brought to you by GNC at gnc. Nutrition isn't just a department, it's the whole store. Nutrition for bigger gains. Sculpting that revenge body and to have you feeling like you're ready to go. GNC spent 90 years perfecting nutrition and protein that literally tastes like cake. So you can look like cake. You got goals. GNC has results. Visit your local GNC store or shop [e-mail] this episode is brought to you by Hyundai. Amazon's your go to for all things hoops, game gear, snacks for the late night, tip offs, you name it. And now you can shop for a Hyundai there too. Pick your model and trim from a local dealer, see transparent pricing up front and and knock out most of the paperwork online. Then just head to the dealership to finalize the deal. Visit HyundaiUSA.com or call 562-314-4603 for more details. Limited availability only through participating Hyundai dealers in select markets. This program is available for the purchase of new vehicles and is not currently available for lease. Hello and welcome to Group ch. I am Justin Barrier and joining me, Rob Mahoney, Big waz. Some of us have come to this podcast bringing takes, offering them up to the gods, the gods being, I guess, me. In this instance, some of us have not. And so this podcast is gonna take on a different shape than we thought going into it, but we will still have the Western Conference All Star pick, so yay for that.

[Rob Mahoney]

You're dramatically overstating what it is that happened to you. Me?

[Justin Barrier]

Dramatic? No.

[Rob Mahoney]

Justin, do you want to tell the listeners? I do. Justin wanted to introduce a new competitive format that we, you know, a segment that we could add to this podcast. I'm all for it. There was some miscommunication yesterday as was, and I kind of lobbied to delay it by one week. I thought that's what we say, what it is, because that's what we wanted. We agreed upon.

[Justin Barrier]

We wanted to do a takeoff in no Small part, in order to get you guys a little bit out of perhaps your comfort zone, I would say with some of the maybe conventional wisdom that could be offered on the pod from time to time. And so the one rule. Just bring a take, no conventional wisdom. Think outside the box. Like, join me on this psychedelic journey that I'm on. And Woz came prepared. Rob did not. Again, it's a shame.

[Rob Mahoney]

We literally said we weren't doing it today. So I don't know what to tell.

[Justin Barrier]

We did not say that.

[Big Waz]

We never really said that. Me and Rob. I'm checking the transcript, that we should keep it going the other way. And then Justin voice cypherously disagreed that we should delay it. But, you know, in defense of Rob, to be honest, I've been like this my entire life, and people who know me know this about me. Like, if you ask me to do something, I will always say yes. You might want it done in one day. I might have it in my head that it should be done in three days. If you start bitching, I'll get it done in a day and a half. Okay. That's just generally who I've been my entire life. And this takes thing was kind of the same thing. It's like, could we do it next week? And Justin's like, no, we need it tomorrow. And I was like, all right, have it ready by tomorrow.

[Justin Barrier]

You rose to the occasion.

[Rob Mahoney]

I'm gonna release the chat log to the public, and I'm gonna ask our listeners to vote on what they think happened here, if we were supposed to do this or not. Because as I'm reading it, Woz is asking, as you said, to kick the can a little bit. Delay this until next week. Justin says, quote, sure, comma, whatever.

[Justin Barrier]

I mean, you can read between the line there.

[Big Waz]

I can, but you said, sure. I read it in Justin's voice, and I was like, justin's annoyed.

[Rob Mahoney]

Oh, I knew he was annoyed. I just thought he was saying, sure, whatever.

[Justin Barrier]

Although, to Rob, in Rob's defense, when. When Woz replied back, forgive us, Dad.

[Rob Mahoney]

I did give the.

[Justin Barrier]

Crying emoji. And so perhaps you thought that was, like, the end of it, that I waved my hands at it.

[Rob Mahoney]

I did. And I was very thankful for Waz in that moment, because, Justin, I would say you're the king of the. Like, is this guy pissed at me? In response to every message I sent him? It's just really your lane. It's where you excel, and I have no choice but to drop the cap.

[Big Waz]

That's his entire vibe, bro. Is this guy really just pissed right now. That's his entire thing.

[Justin Barrier]

I have many, many years as an editor. I know how to wage the psychological warfare. I love that slack message.

[Rob Mahoney]

You really do.

[Big Waz]

I'm reminded of Justin's legendary Core Week presentation up there. He gave a great present but acted like he was too good for it the entire time.

[Justin Barrier]

Well, I actually don't know this. When I was giving it, I think I was more just nervous because I don't like talking in front of people.

[Big Waz]

Yeah, I don't think that's what the audience. The audience is like, this is good information, but this guy is above this stupid exercise.

[Justin Barrier]

That's just my general vibe. That's my whole. My whole oeuvre, I guess. Unfortunately. But I can't do anything about my face. You know, it's like. It's like the male equivalent of resting bitch face. It's just I guess being a bitch at a certain point.

[Rob Mahoney]

But you could do something about your whole personality, you know, that's really something. That's more malleable.

[Justin Barrier]

I am what I am. And that's why we have such a brilliant, well outlined podcast on a day to day basis.

[Rob Mahoney]

It's true.

[Justin Barrier]

I think it's working out for us.

[Rob Mahoney]

I think so too. I don't know why you tried to mess with the formula by getting Woz and I to create content when clearly this is your calling.

[Big Waz]

He said.

[Justin Barrier]

I guess so.

[Rob Mahoney]

Yeah.

[Big Waz]

Yeah.

[Justin Barrier]

Do work for you guys. There you go. Well, we'll all participate in today's segment. Just the one segment, unfortunately. But it is a pretty robust segment because we're gonna get into the Western Conference All Star picks. We'll do west this week. We're off on Monday for Martin Luther King Day. We'll be back next Thursday with the Eastern Conference picks and I. I think a take off. Yeah, Rob, absolutely.

[Rob Mahoney]

That's what we agreed upon.

[Justin Barrier]

What's going to happen now is there's going to be like a trade and we won't be able to do either of the segments that we're getting the.

[Big Waz]

Takeoff in no matter what. Because my.

[Justin Barrier]

I think it's a good idea.

[Big Waz]

Is Evergreen and everlasting. So I'm ready.

[Rob Mahoney]

I like that.

[Justin Barrier]

More duels.

[Rob Mahoney]

You know me and was Pistols at dawn. Let's go.

[Justin Barrier]

Let's do it. Yeah. So west picks. We're going to go through starters reserves. Just to remind everyone, because I have to be reminded regularly. We're back to East. West as the format in terms of picking the All Stars, which was always the case.

[Rob Mahoney]

Yeah, yeah. In terms of the selection, that was the case.

[Justin Barrier]

That was always the case. And then they drafted them. And now this year, we're going into a new format where four teams are dueling. One of those teams, I believe, gets catapulted in from the Rising Stars game or the G League team.

[Rob Mahoney]

I think it's a composite of the two.

[Justin Barrier]

Great, great. We're just doing a lot of stuff yet again. I can't imagine people will be interested, but I guess we'll find out. I find this exercise, though, to be important. I think all NBA, super important. This just like. I don't know, it just like, really gives you a snapshot of the league in a way that I think is important and easy to overlook. But, like, this is the stuff. Like, this is what we are all doing all the time in order to just like, say, these are the guys that are deciding the fate of the league.

[Big Waz]

And this is. And this is, you know, an official stamp. And most importantly, this is something that the players absolutely give a damn about whether if they don't give a damn about the game itself, the validation of being selected, that shows that you were one of the top people in the league that, you know, your whole life you've been dreaming about this. You remember watching Kobe, you remember watching LeBron, you remember watching, you know, all of our great stars from yesteryear playing in the All Star Game. It's a rite of passage. And so, yeah, it's still really, really important. Even if the past few years, the actual game itself hasn't felt that way. Being selected, you know, being part of the crew that, you know, goes about selling the league to the sponsors basically all damn weekend. And being chosen is like, you guys are the ambassadors. You guys are the, you know, the torchbearers of this league that's been around for 70 plus years now. And all the legacy and the history that comes with that. So, yeah, I agree with Justin. This is major, major stuff.

[Rob Mahoney]

I think a huge part of it too, is the selection for the team is just more competitive than the actual game. And so the. The inner competitor in these guys, if they do get left off the team, are like, what the fuck? You picked that guy instead of me? You valued his accomplishments over mine. Like, that's where you get some of the actual juice. And you're right. Like, we've seen guys be really, really miffed they've been left off a team for any number of reasons when they actually show up. It's kind of, who cares at this point? And we're all waiting for the All Star game to be saved. But the process of distinguishing the class of the league. Totally agree. Is an important one and is important to these guys, too.

[Justin Barrier]

I'm curious how you guys approach this, though, in contrast to all NBA, because I found myself, as I was going through the exercise, caring more about team representation than I typically would with all NBA, which I feel like is top 15 players in the league. Doesn't matter who has like one player versus two. Like the Cavs deserve to, because they are this. It's all about who is the best player. This time I'm a little bit more squishy when it comes to, like, Rockets are the second best team in the West. Like, we're not going to put somebody in there. And so they don't think about that at all.

[Rob Mahoney]

Well, guys, don't tip the cap.

[Justin Barrier]

Okay, we'll get to it.

[Rob Mahoney]

I do think that's a worthy debate. And for me, one of the other distinguishing factors, in addition to like, does a team deserve a representative? Which is always a conversation we have around All Star time. As we've gotten sort of a codified rule about games played for all the major awards in all NBA, I find myself caring a little less about that for All Star. Like, you need to meet a certain threshold. And obviously, if you have a great body of work and have been largely healthy this season, maybe you get a tie break or maybe you get a sort of an edge. But I'm going to be honest, like, it's not the most important thing to me so long as you've been really, really good. And I think that'll reflect in my ballot certainly in one spot.

[Justin Barrier]

Okay, so obviously five starters, two back court, three front court, and then in the bench, two more backcourt, three more front court spots, and then two wild card at the end. Let's start with the backcourt starters. I have Shea Gildrs, Alexander, and I have Anthony Edwards. Who do you guys have?

[Rob Mahoney]

I got Shay and Steph.

[Justin Barrier]

Okay.

[Big Waz]

I got Shay and Steph. Yeah.

[Justin Barrier]

Okay.

[Rob Mahoney]

What. What's the ant case?

[Justin Barrier]

He plays every single game practically. I have Ding st this year, both in our top 100 and now in this All Star exercise, because he isn't really playing back to backs at this point. And it's a small thing, but it's a noticeable thing when you're trying to like, dictate who are like the absolute best players. It's a small margin of. Of of error pretty much in order to decide these sorts of things. And the. I also feel like ant gets saddled with the fact that he isn't the number one MVP best player in the league, but in terms of like an Ant season, I think he's been pretty rock solid. He's been pretty great. He's definitely a top 10 player in the league. Also, his three point shooting development this year has been miraculous. He's literally the best three point pull up shooter in the league. That's even better than Steph Curry at this point. He had 193 point makes all of last year in 79 games. He already has 167 in basically half amount of time. So it's like he's, he's progressing even from the model he was last year. And so if anything I actually think he just gets dinged from the fact that like the expectations are so high. I think he's been great.

[Big Waz]

I agree. Ant was definitely my, he was the sixth man, if you will, of my, of my starters. However, you guys know my policy by now. We've been doing this for years. If you're pretty close to a guy who's a legend, I'm picking the legend every time. Sorry, get to the back of the bus. Steph Curry is, he is the NBA all star. NBA all star game personified as far as I'm concerned. And Ant just hasn't been that much better than him in order to take his spot. And you know, I will note like there's a couple of people in my life, you know, daily fantasy players that do a lot of complaining about Steph. It's like, man, Steph has a couple of stinkers every now and again. Nobody talks about this. It's like, well, because Steph Curry's Teflon, sorry. And when it comes to his all star case, he's Teflon for me too. Like he's, he's, he's still having a whale of a year, man, to be 35, 36 years old and carrying Golden State's offense with absolutely zero help the way that he is right now. Like it's gotta be Steph Curry for me.

[Rob Mahoney]

I would say two things about that. One, as far as two players, two stars of teams with pretty comparable records, it's not even close which one has the superior supporting cast and more help and more structure around them. And Ant is the driver of Minnesota's offense. Like I don't want to take anything away from him, but there's a reason was why Steph can have a game that for a daily fantasy sports player might ring as bad like 13 points in a game. And the Warriors Win because of all of the action he generates. Like, Ant very much is a guy where the box score will more or less tell you what he's contributing on offense. The defense can be a different story. Steph is just a dramatically different kind of player, and he has dragged a team to 500 that has no business being 500. Like, there's probably a larger conversation to be had about what Steph is now saying about that and kind of puffing his chest out and telling people to stop making fake trades. About the warriors, which I respect the competitive spirit.

[Big Waz]

I respect the leg. I respect the leverage. You know, sort of talking in the press, like, negotiating in the press.

[Rob Mahoney]

Sure.

[Big Waz]

Him and Draymond did the other day.

[Rob Mahoney]

They're. They're doing their part. But, like, he said that after a game where Guy Santos started. So my guy, you need more help.

[Justin Barrier]

So wise. You thought that was an attempt to manipulate the situation a little bit publicly?

[Big Waz]

100%. Like, if you know anything about Draymond and stuff, these guys are insanely competitive people. The idea that they don't want better teammates in order to win bigger is insane. Like, we know these guys are maniacs when it comes to how competitive they are and how badly they want to put a competitive product on the floor. So for both of them to be singing the same tune, which, you know, conveniently helps the warriors in terms of their negotiation position with the teams that they're trying to, you know, get better players from, like, I'm not stupid.

[Justin Barrier]

Yeah. They made a big show earlier in the season about putting Kaminga in the starting lineup, and then Draymond was going to bow out. That lasted, like, a couple days.

[Rob Mahoney]

Yeah.

[Justin Barrier]

Maybe even a couple hours.

[Rob Mahoney]

I feel like they've done more or less that exact thing, like, three times.

[Justin Barrier]

Yeah. And the fact that they all had the same story, like, the same verbiage that they were all using was quite curious here. I just assumed, like, maybe there was, like, some sort of backdoor deal where it's like, you're gonna get the Dirk treatment, like, down the road. Like, obviously, Steph was always probably going to get that. Kerr seems like he's practically year to year at this point or when he's gonna ride off into the sunset. But I was like, oh, Draymond is up more than anyone else. Probably is the most susceptible because you look at what just happened to Clay, like, there's a possibility if he just doesn't show up next year, like, they get his ass out of there, and he's the contract ballast in order to make Something work. I just thought that, like, maybe they just, like, satisfied them. And in the back rooms, like, where it was like, you know, we got a cushy little job for you as a scout. After this is all done, you just make this. Make this a nice little transition here.

[Rob Mahoney]

I don't think any of it's quite that explicit when you're talking about some of the best players in the history of the franchise. Steph was, I would think, probably always going to be taken care of. Although with the way Joe Lakoff conceptualizes the organization and envisions himself as the visionary of it, maybe not. You know, crazier things have happened than someone like Steph getting kind of pushed, pushed out the door, thrown to the wind at some point late in their career. Draymond's case is different. And maybe this is a touch of self awareness from a guy who has not exhibited a lot of it throughout his career to say, yeah, if there is a trade, he could very well be a part of it. If there is a change in the tide or the wind of this team, he could be out the door. And just the way you're describing Justin. But also, yeah, it's good negotiation tactics. It's. It also suits the kind of bluster that Draymond likes to participate in and that Steph, from time to time, likes to participate in as, like, we can beat anybody. Let us figure it out. Like, it. It fits into their usual talking points in such a convenient way.

[Big Waz]

Why not try it Also with Draymond especially, he likes when people knows how smart he is about everything basketball related, so.

[Rob Mahoney]

Well, don't we all? Was, says three guys talking on a podcast.

[Big Waz]

For sure, I'm as guilty as anybody else. But, like, Draymond wants you to know. Like, I'm aware of what the second apron is and, you know, Kaplan implications and why you shouldn't leverage your future and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You know, I was reading Zach Cram's Memphis Grizzlies piece where Draymond's like, look, I know every single offense in and out like the back of my hand. What the Grizzlies are doing is different. I've never seen that before. He wants y'all to know, like, I'm a scout, I'm a coach, I'm a gm, I'm all of it. And that. That's part of it too.

[Justin Barrier]

The crazy thing is, I agree with their assessment.

[Big Waz]

Yes.

[Justin Barrier]

Like, all the nerds on podcasts are like, actually, that makes sense. Like, why would you just, like, throw away all the Draft picks and whatever for Zach Levine, for, for Jimmy Butler. I am for them needing an upgrade. That's, that's apparent.

[Rob Mahoney]

Right.

[Justin Barrier]

Everyone. But I think one of these mid level moves isn't going to change a ton. Maybe Zach Levine gets them into the playoffs, but long term, what they need is as another superstar next to Stephen. And so if that's not on the table, then, then don't go make that move.

[Rob Mahoney]

Clock's ticking.

[Big Waz]

The clock is ticking. I think they do need to make a move. I think what they would want to do in an ideal world, if you guys remember LeBron's first year returning to the Cavs where it was just misery and then they did the Timo Mozgov and they brought in Iman Shumpert and they brought in Junior Smith and then like changed the team completely. I don't think those kinds of deals do that anymore. You know, like, I don't think like getting a bunch of ancillary guys, even if they're plugging holes, are going to.

[Justin Barrier]

Buddy Heald and Kyle Anderson and Anthony Melton.

[Big Waz]

I don't think they're going to make some crazy difference for this team. So maybe I'm wrong, but I don't see it.

[Rob Mahoney]

I think the counterpoint to that would be the Mavericks last season, like P.J. washington, Daniel Gaffer that transformed that team. I'm with you that it's a hard process to sort out because you're right. That what they ultimately need is something that they don't have the resources to get right now. And so do you wait long enough to you get another draft pick? Year over year, you get a little bit more in the door to trade out and to work with. But every, every year that you try to do that is a year that you're taking off of. Steph's now post prime. Right. He's, he is not getting any better. As you said. He's not playing back to backs. Like you're having to ration what Steph Curry is today. And so if you're not going to be able to make the kind of big swing you want to make within the next calendar year, you got to do something. And that's where I think I disagree a little bit. I do see a sense of urgency for the, for the Lakers and the warriors both just as far as like you need. You deserve to give Steph Curry a chance to compete with more than this. Like LeBron deserves to have a chance to compete with more than this. And I think on an organizational level, at some point it's just a responsibility that you have to accept that you're going to have to trade some future picks, that you have to swallow something that you don't want to trade for the sake of something that may not even solve all your problems now but makes things at least slightly better.

[Justin Barrier]

I think they'll end up doing both. They'll probably trade for like a vuch at the deadline just to give them a better shot this season and then they'll save their big powder for the off season. Like, I'm not expecting them to wait like two to three years. I if anything, I think they're just going to kick it to the off season because it's just easier to make deals in the off season than in season because everybody's over at the second apron at this point. Point. But yeah, so I had Steph clearly on my bench. Do you want to just go through the guards at this point? Let's do it because we're in that range. I have Steph on the bench and then I also have Luca, who brings up the question of how many games is too few because Luca has played 22. There's talk of him maybe coming back before the All Star break, but probably we're getting around low 20s for him.

[Big Waz]

What if he doesn't come back before the All Star break?

[Justin Barrier]

Do games played matter to you guys? And how many games is too few, I think is the question.

[Rob Mahoney]

That's really cutting it close, dude. I think if he wasn't Luca, I would say it's just not enough. And this is the case for someone like, spoiler alert. Like, I don't have Ja Morant on my list who I think in addition to missing a lot of games, just hasn't quite been at the level of some of these other stars. So I don't have Jaw on my list. But I do have Luca later down as a wild card. I'm Steph and SGA up top. I have Ant and Kyrie as my next two guards. So I think we're in. We have a consensus like top three between Ant, Steph and Shay. It sounds like.

[Big Waz]

Yeah, yeah, that was my consensus top three. My fourth guard non wild card edition was De'Aaron Fox.

[Rob Mahoney]

Really?

[Big Waz]

Yeah, yeah. I had De'Aaron Fox as my fourth guard and again, like, I think he's having probably his best season again and I think he's deserving. I really do. Obviously they've had like a mini turnaround since the coach got killed. We won't say, you know, who put the shiv in his Back, but I.

[Rob Mahoney]

Think you might need to. If this is your pick.

[Big Waz]

De'Aaron Fox might have fingerprints, but there might be other fingerprints on the freaking knife. Who knows?

[Justin Barrier]

Also, was he wrong? Turns out he might have been right.

[Big Waz]

Yeah. I mean, maybe no judgment. If, if the message was just not resonating with the guys anymore and people felt like there were better ways to do things, then, you know, he might have had the right idea. And yeah, De'Aaron Fox is my, was my fourth guard. But Kyrie, again, I don't know. Are we getting into our wild card picks? But like, Kyrie was right in the mix too, just because of the burden he shouldered. And like, with some of these other guys, man, like, nobody really has the usage and efficiency combo that he's bringing to the table as well as like, if you look at some of Kyrie's impact metrics, it's like, it's kind of shocking how good is like, impact metrics are like. And Kyrie, I feel like throughout his career those numbers never really liked Kyrie that much. But this year it's like, no, like he's having a major impact on the floor. And, you know, Kyrie was right there. But I did pick De'Aaron Fox, but Kyrie's on my team too.

[Rob Mahoney]

I think there's a reason the numbers didn't always, like, in terms of some of the on off splits and some of the more advanced measures didn't always favor Kyrie in that way. And it's frankly because he was a different kind of player. He was, he was so much more. A little bit come and go, a little bit more curial. Not just in terms of what he's doing off the court, but his style on the court. I think he's become just absolutely rock steady for the Mavs in a way that makes his like bulging disc situation right now that much more of a bummer because we'll have to see kind of what he's capable of and how he manages that over the course of the year. But the all around scoring, the kind of like functional calm that he brings to that group, the sense of the moment, the defensive effort, which is not something he's always brought to the table in his career, I think have been really, really sensational to the point that he, he needs to be an all star. To me, he has to be included in here in some form or fashion. The Mavs have won 61% of their games with him in the lineup, and that's including some of this skid without Luka, too. I just think he. He has brought so much to that team, specifically in the way that they've needed. And the Luka conversation gets a little more complicated because of the games played. And that's where your mileage may vary. But I think Kyrie has a really strong case.

[Justin Barrier]

I didn't have him on my team. I hear all those points. I also love, like, how he's been able to vacillate between being the guy when Luca is out versus just like, playing a complimentary role. He's just gotten even better at that. And the efficiency has risen as a result of that the past few seasons. Just like games played. And ultimately this comes down to a representation thing for me. Again, like the.

[Rob Mahoney]

You're such an electoral college guy.

[Justin Barrier]

I guess. I guess so.

[Big Waz]

I don't. I don't have Luke on my team because I don't think he's going to play more than 22 games by the break.

[Rob Mahoney]

Yeah, that's fair.

[Big Waz]

22 is like, damn, this has been.

[Justin Barrier]

A poor Luca season. I mean, he's.

[Rob Mahoney]

Well, even by his standards. Not his own insane standards, but guess what? He's still Luka Doncic.

[Justin Barrier]

Exactly.

[Rob Mahoney]

This is. This is where, like, whether you want to put him as a guard or a wild card, potentially for me, I had him as more of a wild card because of the games played. But then I ran into. I'm comparing Luka against guys who are second and third options on their teams, and he's just. The gap is so wide at that point when you get to that level of the all Star team that it felt silly to me to leave him off. But everyone has their different thresholds for the games played stuff. And as I was saying, for me, because all NBA is baked in now, I kind of want to give a little more leeway to All Star.

[Justin Barrier]

Am I reading this right that you guys both have guards as your wild card spots?

[Rob Mahoney]

Yes, I have a big as well.

[Justin Barrier]

Oh, interesting. Okay. All right.

[Big Waz]

I didn't even consider a big for my wild card spot.

[Rob Mahoney]

Backcourt bias is off the charts. Unacceptable.

[Justin Barrier]

Yeah. If anything, my first two out are our guards, but really, we could circle back to it.

[Rob Mahoney]

Okay.

[Justin Barrier]

Yeah. Yeah. Sometimes in basketball, 30 points could be worth more than 30 points. And now you can get a 30% profit boost from the ringer with FanDuel's 30 on 30 during Friday's NBA action. That's right. The ringer is teaming up with America's number one sportsbook to give you a 30% profit. Profit boost when you either pick a player to score more than 30 points or bet on our new exclusive 30 on 30 special markets like any game to have both teams to score 30 plus points in the first quarter. Just looking at the Friday slate, there's a lot to like, including how about Anthony Edwards kind of on a mission. This weird Minnesota Timberwolves starting lineup hasn't been doing too well, but Ant tends to put up points regardless. Playing the Knicks at Madison Square Garden. Not the best place, but superstars tend to rise to the occasion on that stage. And also the Knicks defense is awful. So let's go with Ant 30 + in MSG on Friday. Lock it in. And whether you want to ride with my picks or make your own, just look for 30 on 30 in the FanDuel Sportsbook app. Or head to FanDuel.com Ringer MBA for your chance to score a bigger payout this Friday. Don't miss your chance to find out how much 30 can be worth with FanDuel's 30 on 30 must be 21 + in present in select states or 18 + in present in DC. Opt in required bonus issued as non withdrawable profit boost tokens. Restrictions apply including any token expiration and max wager amount. See [e-mail] Gambling problem. Call 1-800- Gambler or visit rg-help this episode is brought to you by Smucker's Uncrustables there's nothing like a snack that comes in clutch, so who's the real mvp? Uncrustables the best part of the sandwich. It's a round, crimped sandwich made with soft, pillowy bread filled with peanut butter and jelly. It goes straight from the freezer to your lunchbox, making it easier to pack lunch and sprint out the door. Now that's a morning win. You'll find Smucker's Uncrustables in the freezer aisle.

[Logan Murdoch]

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[Justin Barrier]

Successful season starts with picking the right players for your team. Like with the Boston Celtics, they've been able to put together a pretty good roster, pretty deep superstar driven two way players. They've got it right. And so if you want to hire the best players for your business and quickly, you need Indeed. Their sponsored jobs help you stand out and reach relevant candidates faster. Plus with Indeed sponsored jobs there are no monthly subscriptions, no long term contracts, and you only pay for results. There's no need to wait any longer. Speed up your hiring right now with Indeed. Listeners of the show will get a $75 sponsored job credit to get your jobs more visibility@ Indeed.com RingerMBA that's Indeed.com Ringer MBA right now and support our show by saying you heard about Indeed on this podcast indeed.com Ringer MBA terms and conditions apply. Hiring Indeed is all you need. All right, Starting front court. Nikola Jokic playing pretty well these days. Yeah. Victor Webanyama, Kevin Durant.

[Big Waz]

Yep, same chalk.

[Rob Mahoney]

So this was the first I would say like big decision point for me in the front court was AD or kd. For the last front court spot I went AD leaning a little bit towards the defense obviously, but also just the stability that he's been able to give the Lakers this season has been really important. So again it's another case where whether you want to go Ant or Steph in the back court or AD or Katie in the front court, all perfectly worthy choices. Eileen AD a little bit here.

[Big Waz]

Yeah, I leaned KD just cause the utter lack of, you know, umph that's been provided from his co stars, Devin Booker, one of my favorite players in the league. He's just had a bad year by Devin Booker standards specifically. And so to me, KD has just been so like number one with the bullet on that team. And so yeah, I put him over AD and it's like, you know, the rest of my front court guys, it just, it seemed pretty obvious and I didn't have too much trepidation between starter and bench guy. So yeah, I went kd.

[Justin Barrier]

Yeah, talk about essential personnel, like with Steph and some of these other guys. The Suns are worse than the Blazers, perhaps if they don't have Kevin Durant in that lineup. I think they're 1 and 9 without Kevin Durant playing this year. And that's with Booker. That's with Beal coming off the benches. Whatever version they want to put out there. He's an efficiency monster and then he's like also busting his ass over the past like five years now defensively, like he is their best big man and now the drop off between him and everybody else is significant, but still like he is legitimately a big man despite like all the likeness, despite the fact that he is his age. It's incredible the fact that he's been able to be this efficient, be as much of an offensive weapon that he is even as he gets later into his career. But they do have a center coming via trade. Finally. They swapped a couple seconds for Nick Richards. In a second, Rob, shout out to.

[Rob Mahoney]

Joshua Kogi, future Charlotte Hornet.

[Justin Barrier]

We'll see how long non guaranteed on the second year. But he's getting paid nonetheless. What do you think about Richards in that deal?

[Rob Mahoney]

I like it. I think there's kind of two big questions you have to ask with a deal like this. 1. Does this actually move the needle in a meaningful way? Probably not. It would be my answer. The second question is, is it worth the opportunity cost of the three second round picks? Because Phoenix does not have a lot of draft assets at its disposal, so they have to choose their spots very, very carefully. I think this is probably enough of a positive roll of the dice to try it. And the lim the options at center are so limited given what they can do with the second apron, that Nick Richards is actually one of the better choices available. So I both think they should have done it and I'm glad for the sun's sake that they did. But also don't think, I don't think it's going to change their fate in a, in a hugely meaningful way.

[Big Waz]

Yeah, I don't know. Sometimes going from below average to average, like, can be a meaningful, you know, improvement, especially when you consider the position. You know, obviously centers get de emphasized on offense a lot, but like defensively, this stuff matters, man. And if this guy can give them, you know, average to even slightly above average defensive play at that five position and it's a huge deal. Like just think about the stretch that Thunder had when you know, they couldn't. They didn't have Hartenstein or Chet. It was like Jesus Christ, man. And obviously Hartenstein is above average defender. But it made such a difference for a team that we already considered to be top of the top at defense. Right. And so I think this will be, you know, maybe, maybe not that pronounced but. But I think it will have a profound impact and maybe it doesn't show up in terms of, you know, they rip off like, you know, 10 out of 12 wins in a row, but they, they're just going to be meaningfully better by not playing zeros and negatives. 48 minutes a game center, like that's crazy, dude.

[Justin Barrier]

Yeah. I do wonder what the impact of having a rotation caliber center on the roster playing minutes will do because they just need a stabilizer at this point. They just need someone who won't everything up because they are currently starting Mason Plumlee who after this might not even get minutes. Like I think they might just go Richard Ogadaro at this point they should play a little bit smaller. And they should. Yes. And so like I think Richards is fine. I think he's like a totally solid, young, athletic, big strong guy who will do a little bit of everything. I don't think he's great at anything in particular. He's like, if you were to look at league average in, in the textbook like it would be Nick Richards because he's just a solid center.

[Rob Mahoney]

I would say he does one thing at a pretty high level, which is rebound. The ever living hell out of the ball. And the Suns are a terrible rebounding team. The bigs that they've had, like Iguidar is a great example, like pretty good, switchable active big who I think has a real future in the league and I'm excited to see what the Suns can do with him long term. But not the biggest body and not the biggest rebounder. And certainly Yousef Nurkic when he was playing, not a plus rebounder. Mason Plumlee at this stage too limited to be a meaningful rebounding presence. Like he'll get some of his own just because of how big he is. But not an active presence on the boards. And I think Nick Richards, especially with how small the Suns play, the rebounding is a big deal. Like that is something that can actually prop them up in a meaningful way. And so, yeah, if you're getting kind of league ag league average contributions from him in other areas and you're getting an actual boon to the rebounding game, that is a solidifying element that the Suns really need. The question is like, does it take them up a tier? Does it take them into a different class of competition? I think it'll make their lives all much better. I think Kevin Durant is going to have some easier nights ahead of him as a result of stuff like this, but I don't know that it's making the Suns threatened for anything they weren't really threatening for.

[Justin Barrier]

I think at this point they're just trying to get out of the danger zone. They're right now the 11th best team in the Western Conference. And so I think they're just trying to make it into the play in to save face. And that's honestly what I think they're doing with Jimmy as well. Like, just come give us something to care about. So Kevin Durant doesn't motion toward the door, just so Devin Booker doesn't throw up his hands and it's like, why the fuck am I doing everything that nobody wants to do on this team? So.

[Big Waz]

Tough cookies.

[Rob Mahoney]

One more thing on the Kevin Durant front, as we kind of laud him in his case for all star, he's averaging 27 a game this season. Great. Wonderful. For Kevin Durant, that is barely in the top 10 of season scoring seasons that he's had. And for context, Kawhi Leonard has done that one time, right? Like there's elite hall of Fame level players who never averaged 27 a game. And this is just like he rolls out and does this. He is still the absolute best in class at what he does, which is hit mid Rangers over people, create shots that no one else can create and convert at basically the highest levels of efficiency that a score reasonably can, given his volume.

[Justin Barrier]

Do you have Kevin Kawhi Leonard on your ballot?

[Rob Mahoney]

I do not. He just, you know, just didn't quite make it this year.

[Justin Barrier]

Okay. So was. And I obviously have AD in the front court on the bench. So here's where it gets dicey. I have Jalen Williams. I assume you guys do too.

[Rob Mahoney]

I do not.

[Big Waz]

I do not. No, I thought I would. I thought I would, but then I looked in. He just does way less than the guys he's competing against.

[Justin Barrier]

Sure.

[Big Waz]

Like, way less.

[Justin Barrier]

Okay, so you don't even have him at wild card spots?

[Big Waz]

No.

[Justin Barrier]

Whoa.

[Big Waz]

He's a forward. Jalen Williams.

[Justin Barrier]

Yeah. And so at this, they're so far and away the best team in the Western Conference.

[Big Waz]

It's true. That's true.

[Justin Barrier]

I got to give them two. And like, this guy. I know the numbers are down a little bit, the efficiency down a little bit as he's getting more and more to do. I. I've knocked him a few times on this podcast, basically saying, like, the fact that he isn't more of an offensive threat, it's kind of the next level that the Thunder need to get to. He played center for, like a month, and it's just like, he. He's so essential to, like, their entire, entire identity. It's like, it's hard to extricate, like, what he does with, like, what, the success of the team pretty much. And so I have him there, and if anything, like, I had him as my next spot, and then I gave the next spot to Alpern Shingoon. Oh, yeah. Another nod to. To the standings because I don't love it. I'll be honest. I just. How do we not have a Rocket as an All Star? This team has been incredible.

[Big Waz]

No, because that's just not how the team operates.

[Rob Mahoney]

How does the team operate?

[Big Waz]

I mean, like, yo. To be honest, like, Fred Van Vliet probably has no ownership of that offense as Alpine was. No, I'm not saying Fred Vlan Vliet's an All Star. That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying, like, Alperin Shangon, Fred Van.

[Rob Mahoney]

Fleet is hugely important to the Rockets in terms of the way that they. The way that they execute, the way they get into their stuff. Like, there isn't really a replacement for him on that roster. So, yeah, he's important. Alpert Shangoon produces like a star, is of structural importance to everything they do successfully on offense, and I think has acquitted himself actually quite well to being more of a rover on defense this season. He's not a great stopper, but he's a participant in an elite level defense. That's where, for me, Sengun is a little bit more in wild card territory. I didn't have him in one of my front court spots, and it came down for me between J Dub and Shengun. And I'm looking at the secondary. A killer secondary creator on maybe the best team in basketball or a guy that is the structure of the Rockets, a team that has been amazing this season. Has won as many games as they have. Has been elite in the Western Conference basically all year. I just didn't have it in me to shirk a dude who is that critical to a 2712 team. And I don't see that as a representation issue. I see it as a. An issue of structural importance.

[Big Waz]

Yeah. N. That's not. He's not on my all star team.

[Rob Mahoney]

But. But Jdub is also not on your all star team. Was Jdub?

[Big Waz]

No. J. J Dub is the person that like I most strongly consider especially in my wild card. But I don't know why I was thinking of him as a guard because he handles the rock so much. But I guess he is a forward inside, he's a wing and. And who he guards positionally. Um, I had Triple J and LeBron James. Those are my two front court guys along with A.D. like again, Sengun. Like I get it. Especially on offense. What he's doing is so important structurally between him and Van Vliet. Like these guys, like literally would not have an offensive structure without these guys. I just don't think he's that level of impact player all around as Triple J and LeBron James. I just, I just, I just don't see it. And in terms of my wild cards, I definitely went with guards who just have the ball all the freaking time.

[Rob Mahoney]

Oh really? I was. See, I was going to think you were going to try to squeeze Norm Powell in here.

[Big Waz]

I was, I was going to. We going to get into it. Norm was literally my last season really good.

[Justin Barrier]

Okay.

[Big Waz]

He's like my last one out. But I definitely considered Norm for wild card over Shangon for sure. Just like what he. Yeah, I did for sure. Just on an efficiency level. It's insane.

[Rob Mahoney]

He's been great.

[Big Waz]

You know, this dude has a higher usage than Kyrie. Like he's basically like Devin Booker. Like, like huge offensive burden right now at insane efficiency stats. Like this is nuts what he's doing in that.

[Rob Mahoney]

He's been an awesome score. Dot, dot, dot. I'm not going to comment on many of the other elements of his.

[Big Waz]

Yeah, he don't really be doing the rest of it.

[Justin Barrier]

Has Norm been like holding like private media mixers or something? There's just like Norm contingent amongst. Amongst our media cohort and I was like, did I miss the party? Invite this?

[Big Waz]

Miraculous though. He's like 31 years old or whatever the hell he is and he's having the best year of his life. We've never seen somebody do this before and So I definitely ranked him in. Like, look, you guys have definitely convinced me. Like, you know, like, Sengun definitely deserves a look. Especially again the Rockets, I don't think they would have competent offense without him. And Fred, I remember the days before Fred got there and Shengun was literally the only person who understood what a functional offensive basketball was supposed to look like. Like, I understand that. I. I truly do. It's just. I don't know, like this just. Just spiritually, he just doesn't feel like an All Star this year.

[Rob Mahoney]

So who. Who are the guards you have was that have the ball in their hands all the time?

[Big Waz]

Okay. So like I said, Kyrie, Kyrie Irving is my first wild card and my second wild card. So you guys probably don't listen to this podcast is one of ours, the Boys at Stadio. It's our soccer podcast. They have this saying that they say when a guy gets calls for offsides in a big moment, they say, well, the guy was spiritually on side, even if Var had him like by a quarter of an inch. Offside, like, he was spiritually offside. He wasn't cherry picking. He shouldn't have been called for that. And that's what I feel about John Morant. He is spiritually an All Star straight up. And you know, I went and dug into the numbers. Like, his numbers just are not there in terms of empirically. They just aren't like whatever you want to look at. Like, just his efficiency hasn't been there.

[Rob Mahoney]

He's the least efficient of any guard that I actually considered.

[Big Waz]

Yes, the impact stuff just isn't there. But I'm sorry, when you watch the Grizzlies, you can't tell me this guy isn't the engine that makes this thing go. And more importantly, he's the most electrifying player in the NBA, bar none, by far. I don't even think it's close in terms of on a given night, who's doing. That's just like. Makes my head explode the way he dunked on Wemby's head for no freaking reason last night. You telling me this guy is not an All Star? Like, I get it. It's just for Ja, like, there's just a special exemption and it is called the wild card. And as my last pick for the team, he's at 24 games right now. He'll probably. He should get to 30, you know, before the All Star break. Is. Is. Is here more than 30, you know, God. God willing. And so that's why I gave it over Luke I don't think Luke is going to be back before the all star game and Ja is playing right now and I just think you just have to watch Memphis, man. And I'm sort of falling in love with Memphis as they're getting Gigi Jackson back and like they're actually getting W wing defenders back. Like this team is something, something to be keeping your eye on going forward. And John Morant to me, man, like I could not leave this guy off my team. And maybe it's recency bias and all of that stuff, but like, man, how could John Moran not be an all Star?

[Justin Barrier]

The vibes case, just off the charts.

[Big Waz]

The vibe.

[Rob Mahoney]

It's a great vibes case though.

[Justin Barrier]

I think it comes down to whether or not you want to reward Jackson, who's been intergoal but like isn't the superstar of that team, versus Ja, who's just like the most electric NBA player in probably basketball. And so I agree with everything was saying he only has two more games played at this point after playing last night than Luca. And so he practically has the same case as Luca. Hasn't been nearly as efficient, hasn't been nearly as productive, but he really is the engine and he's the player who is going to vault them from being pretty good to great. And so I reward that because Jackson honestly hasn't had a standout season. He's been good by his terms.

[Rob Mahoney]

You have Ja, but not Jaren 100%.

[Justin Barrier]

What, what is happening? We're not rewarding like quality defense in like 20 points a game here.

[Big Waz]

And by the way, you guys have talked me into it, sometimes you gotta abandon your priors. I'm gonna move Shangun up, okay, and take Triple J off. He's gonna be the sacrificial lamb.

[Rob Mahoney]

Okay. I don't like, I don't like that.

[Big Waz]

Case on my battle like that at all. Him and Shang, him. Excuse me, him and Norm are my last people off. I looked at Devin Booker, I just couldn't get there. I just could not get there. Just like when you look at the efficiency, what he's been doing, like defensively, like, it's just, it's just not there. It's not what we thought Booker was going to do coming off the Olympics, you know, obviously being one of the best guys in the league, he just hasn't been there for me. So book I definitely considered. So yeah, my last two wild cards will be Kyrie Irving and John Moran.

[Rob Mahoney]

So I. I've got KD, LeBron and Jaren for front court and then Luka and Shangun are my wild cards. Uh, so, yeah, for me, like the, the Ja case is very persuasive and you literally watch him play and the case is very persuasive. I also think because of the quality of his team, he is allowed to have down games in ways that other players aren't. And that's some of what contributes to the efficiency. Also, I hear everything you're saying was about how he is the Grizzlies and what you were saying, Justin, about he is the piece that elevates them from quite good to potentially excellent or great or, you know, finals caliber or conference finals caliber. The Grizzlies are a winning team. Without him this season, they would be fifth place in the west based on their winning percentage in games in which he did not play. And the reason for that, if you, if you had to pick one, I would say it's elite defense. If you had to pick one player, I would say it's Jaren Jackson. And it's frankly not just that Jackson is a incredible transformational defender. He's scoring well. He's creating more than he ever has before, honestly has having the kind of season we have not talked about enough. Because I think becoming the kind of big who can punish teams off the dribble has been one of the most meaningful developments in Memphis's entire offense this year. So that's a big deal to me. I think Jaren Jackson is not just worthy of being on this team, but if you're going to pick a Grizzlies representative, I think he's the guy top five on defense.

[Justin Barrier]

But they're not like they're top five.

[Rob Mahoney]

On both sides of the ball, which is crazy.

[Big Waz]

Sure, that's crazy.

[Justin Barrier]

Yeah. But it's not like we have to give the defensive represent representative the case because they're the Thunder level of defense, you know.

[Rob Mahoney]

No, but he's been their best offensive player.

[Justin Barrier]

I don't, I don't agree with that. No. He's been their steadiest offensive player.

[Big Waz]

Jackson has been the Grizzlies best offensive.

[Rob Mahoney]

Over the course of the full season.

[Justin Barrier]

Yeah, most consistent. I would say some of us value.

[Rob Mahoney]

Consistency and steadiness doesn't get the people going.

[Justin Barrier]

And John, fortunately, it does not.

[Rob Mahoney]

I can't argue with that.

[Big Waz]

I can't get there with you. And I think Jaren Jackson definitely on offense, he's. He's made a better case. It's just, you know, and when I was picking these teams, I was reminded of this Stephon Marbury quote and I Can't remember if it was Steve Nash or Jason G. I'm pretty sure it was Steve Nash. After having gone to the Suns and like, they basically turned their whole season around. This is very early on in the Nash and Sons thing. And New York media being New York media, they're giving Stephon Marbury. They're giving Stephon Marbury a lot of guff for how the teams had turned around. And Steph was like, look, here's the thing. You put us both on a basketball court. You take. You ripped the name off the back of my jersey. You ripped the name off the back of his jersey. You ripped the name off the front of both of our jerseys. People watch us play, they gonna say, I'm a better player. And that's how I feel about Ja and Triple J.

[Justin Barrier]

That's good.

[Rob Mahoney]

Guess what, Guess what. Like, Steph Mar was wrong. He was extremely wrong.

[Justin Barrier]

You guys know he's like still at every Knicks game.

[Big Waz]

Like he's been re reintegrated into the fold. Because it's true, once a nick, always a nick. It's actually, it's like as corny and stupid as it sounds, it's actually true.

[Justin Barrier]

It's like the entire cast of the Sopranos and then Stefan Marbury are just at every fucking game. It's great. My last wild card spots went down to jaw and then I gave it to LeBron. I know that LeBron isn't going to be there. Like, he's going to be there. Like, there's no case that he will not be at this All Star Game. But I think it actually is probably, if we were to just look at the, the resumes here for, for this season, it actually is probably closer than we think. Like, I actually think if we're just like stripping the names Stephon Marbury style for the great prophet of our time for the, for the All Star. I do think like he and Darren Fox for instance, or even Kyrie Irving have similar case where it's like it's all offense but. And their teams are pretty similar in the standings. Lakers are a little bit better right now, obviously LeBron better playmaker and all the other stuff. So I gave it to LeBron. But I, I think Fox is actually pretty close. If we were just to look at this more empirically.

[Rob Mahoney]

Fox has been good. I thought he got bumped out a little bit for me based on a couple of things. I mean, one, the Kings have had such a weird season and in particular, like, they've been a losing team with him in the lineup and I know that they're kind of on the verge of that anyway, but it's the kind of thing that makes my ears perk up a little bit. The individual performance is kind of unimpeachable. He's one of the, like the. I think he's top, basically on the edge of top five in scoring for the year, which for De'Aaron Fox is phenomenal. A great creator, a great mid range threat. Like, I love the way De'Aaron Fox plays. I just, I don't know how to warrant his inclusion as a. Like, for me, he was more of a wild card consideration. For you, it's over LeBron. For me, it's over. Someone like Shangun or Luca, like, those guys are just playing at a different level this season relative to what they were contributing to winning.

[Justin Barrier]

Anybody else that you guys considered. I had James Harden.

[Rob Mahoney]

Yeah.

[Justin Barrier]

As a name that no one threw out. He's a consideration, unfortunately, shooting percentage wise. Absolutely.

[Big Waz]

It was just absolutely no way he was making my team.

[Justin Barrier]

But he's organizing that team in a way that I think is significant for a pretty good.

[Big Waz]

He's the, he's the point guard of, you know, that competence that I certainly didn't see coming. They just smoked the freaking nets by 80 last night, which is crazy.

[Justin Barrier]

Unbelievable. I've never seen a score like that. I was going to text you guys, it was like 38 to 90. When I. When I looked at the score last night, they ultimately won by like, I think 67. Unbelievable.

[Rob Mahoney]

Justin, if you were to pick a Clipper, would you go Harden or would you go Norm?

[Justin Barrier]

I would go Harden.

[Rob Mahoney]

I think I would too.

[Justin Barrier]

Nah, I think Norm's more efficient. He's the scorer. But things are starting. They're generating from Harden's playmaking.

[Big Waz]

I think the reason Norm does not have assists. No, no, he does not. He does not rebound you to rock defense, defense. But boy, does he fill it up, man. He will fill it up.

[Rob Mahoney]

He gets fucking points. I love watching Norm score. I love watching his evolution as a scorer. But again, if you're distilling things down to singular reasons, the Clippers are not a potent offense by any stretch of the imagination. But Harden's passing is the central reason why they can tread water at all. And so if you were going to pick a Clipper, I think it would be him. I think, yeah, Harden's had a super weird season. But relative to what the Clippers have been and what they've asked him to do is worthy of some note, if not actual honorable mention.

[Justin Barrier]

I think also Honorable mention. We have to say it. Damonis a bonus.

[Rob Mahoney]

Sure.

[Justin Barrier]

Who is actually not only leading the league in rebounding, leading the league in three point percentage. So your three point percentage leaders right now, Demonic Sabonis, Nikola Jokic. The Balkans are putting it up as.

[Rob Mahoney]

We, you know, confront our priors was. I'm, I'm coming to, I'm coming to the, you know, the revelation on this podcast as I'm leaning through all these either ors, like do I pick J Dub or Shangoon? Do I pick in this case, like I like if I was going to pick a king, I think I would pick demon as Sabonus over Deer and Fox.

[Big Waz]

Never. Never ever. I think I would in my life. Is demonic Sabonis going on my all Star ballot over De'Aaron Foxx. You must be out your monkey ass mind. Rob Mahoney. You are crazy.

[Rob Mahoney]

He's quite good. He's quite important.

[Big Waz]

No shot.

[Rob Mahoney]

I think he's bro.

[Big Waz]

For one of these bigs man to be getting my considerate like bro, we giving y'all five spots already for the damn All Star game. Okay. Five slots. Like no, excuse me, six slots for the All Star team. Like, relax, you're good. It's a bonus fall back. You don't, you don't, you don't dictate the movement of what's going on. I actually disagree.

[Rob Mahoney]

He dictates a lot of the movement of what's going on in Sacramento.

[Big Waz]

Sets good screen. One of the league's best screen setters.

[Justin Barrier]

Yeah.

[Rob Mahoney]

Yeah.

[Justin Barrier]

He gets overlooked. I don't think it's a particularly great Sabonis season though.

[Rob Mahoney]

It's been okay. It's always confusing because he's always going to be very efficient. He's always going to reflect very well in a lot of like the big bucket 1 number metrics in ways that are hard to just look straight past. Again, I think it would be a bit of a coin toss between Fox or Sabonis for me if I was going to pick a king. Even with their recent success, I don't see a lot of like, I don't feel particularly moved to pick a king.

[Justin Barrier]

No. And he is. I mean if you want to get down to the nuts and bolts of it, probably holding them back is defensive issues from ever sure getting to the upper echelon again.

[Big Waz]

And so are you saying the quiet part out loud?

[Rob Mahoney]

We should, we should say it quite.

[Big Waz]

Loud of why, why, why can't. Why is it Sacramento taken off? Why is it. Why isn't it happening? Company for Sacramento is It because they start a center with the reach of a 6 foot 8 guy.

[Justin Barrier]

He does have some tier rex arms, that's for sure.

[Big Waz]

Is it? Is it? Maybe.

[Justin Barrier]

Maybe.

[Big Waz]

I don't know. Maybe. Could be.

[Justin Barrier]

But Netflix told me he's like a dutiful husband with kids.

[Big Waz]

A sweet guy. I would love to be. I'm sure he's a great guy to grab a beer with. He seems like a sweet guy. I'm sure. I would absolutely love finding him delightful and love him as a dude for sure.

[Justin Barrier]

IPA guy.

[Big Waz]

But God damn.

[Justin Barrier]

You think IPA wouldn't be.

[Big Waz]

I think we're typ casting him because of the beard, but I wouldn't be surprised.

[Rob Mahoney]

One guy we mentioned earlier who maybe we should talk about a little bit more is Devin Booker. Just because he, I mean, one of the most accomplished players, one of the highest scoring players to not make it. And I'm going to be honest, for me, I. I didn't feel super torn about leaving him off or even kind of not having him in the next up group. What I want to confront is I'm not trying to punish Devin Booker for not living up to his own standards. I want to take this season on its own for what it is. His performance on its own for what it is. I'm trying not to be weighed down by how good Devin Booker has been, but I just don't think he's been that exceptional this season. Still good. Still Devin Booker just not exceptional.

[Justin Barrier]

He's probably on the Fox tier where he's like on that level as a scorer, does a little bit of everything. The efficiency isn't particularly compelling this year. And then the Suns have just been awful. It's like at a certain point, like you cannot reward like one of the five worst teams in the west and one of the worst teams in basketball. If we're going by thirds with two guys like you get one and you're capped. That's it.

[Big Waz]

Yeah. The 11th seed. Sorry guys.

[Justin Barrier]

Anybody else that we're not considering? Maybe Bryce Sensibaugh.

[Rob Mahoney]

Sure.

[Justin Barrier]

From Utah Jazz.

[Rob Mahoney]

I took a, I took a quick look at Desmond Bain just to like knock, knock on the case, check if it was watertight. He's just not on the level of these other guys.

[Justin Barrier]

Is he still making the leap? I was told he was going to make the leap like seven seasons ago.

[Big Waz]

He made the leap last year with, with all. With the added burden and all of that.

[Rob Mahoney]

He's quite good.

[Justin Barrier]

Still not an all star.

[Rob Mahoney]

Well, I think, you know what, man?

[Big Waz]

What I respect, I think he's solid.

[Rob Mahoney]

Yeah.

[Big Waz]

What I respect about Bane is that like his role has been greatly diminished this year. And he's not bitching about it.

[Rob Mahoney]

Yeah.

[Big Waz]

He's just doing what he has to do and I think it's making this team so much more dangerous because of it. So shout out to him for that.

[Justin Barrier]

He also has a good player.

[Rob Mahoney]

Yeah. He has one of those really scalable games where.

[Justin Barrier]

Yeah.

[Rob Mahoney]

In a season like last year, you can ratchet up his usage. He can do more, he can create more. You pull him back into this role and not only will he not bitch about it, the efficiency is going to go back up through the roof. And he's. He's just such a good shooter and such a good presence for them in movement. It's like the case for Bane, if there was one, is team success plus that kind of efficiency. I just, it gets drowned out when you're talking about Dear and Fox and Devin Booker and this caliber of player. He's just. I just don't think he's quite in that group.

[Justin Barrier]

I think that's what I'm saying. I think it was a cool like column topic like three years ago. It's like Desmond Bane, future all Star. It's like, I don't think that's going to happen actually.

[Rob Mahoney]

We need cool column topics. Don't. Don't poo poo though.

[Justin Barrier]

We definitely do need that. I would agree to Wemby just quickly because we kind of breeze past that. Well, two things actually. With Jokic, it was funny. We were doing one of those top 100 meetings yesterday and like two of our participants were like, oh, SGA is the MVP. And I was like, what world am I living in this civilized society where there's like this free exchange of different ideas. I was like, no, no. Where are we?

[Big Waz]

I gotta respect the narrative case because SGA is like, he is the clear cut number two and it's closer than it's been all season right now. But if we're just doing it on nerdy empirical data is the reality.

[Rob Mahoney]

Nerdy sure is the day to day existence of our I do think feelings.

[Big Waz]

And telling the story and you know, this like narrative thrust behind what OKC is doing in their number one seed and the, you know, the group post game interviews and I think that stuff comes into play. But if we're just looking objectively, Jokic is still the mvp. But goddamn, like SGA is damn close. Come on.

[Rob Mahoney]

I didn't think we'd ever get to a day where Nikola Jokic would be averaging 30 a game, but we're here.

[Big Waz]

Yeah. And by the way, a lot of that is Russell Westbrook, believe it or.

[Rob Mahoney]

Not, Russ is, tell you, is with.

[Justin Barrier]

My favorite player in the NBA right now. I've never been much of a Russ guy. Like, I was always kind of somewhere in the middle. Like, obviously fun, electric, really dynamic player, but, like, you know. Yeah. Openly would, like, like, bark at media members. And I was just like, that's kind of mean.

[Big Waz]

Not nice.

[Justin Barrier]

But you think.

[Rob Mahoney]

You think he's mean.

[Big Waz]

Oh, he's not mean to me.

[Justin Barrier]

Way meaner than me, as I'm saying.

[Rob Mahoney]

I'm just like, there's levels to this media.

[Justin Barrier]

I mean, silently I simmer, he barks.

[Rob Mahoney]

That's very different.

[Justin Barrier]

But, like, watching Jokic breathe life back into this guy is one of the best stories we've had in years. And so, like, even if you look at the empirical stuff, which, first of all, Jokic is better statistically than he's ever been. And so I agree with you guys, shockingly, that, like, Jokic's case is far and away better than Chase, but, like, just the fact that he called his shot on Russ when nobody, it seemed like, would want to do that and then was right about it. And not only that, like, Russ might be their second best player this year. Maybe not in, like, the broader sense, but, like, based on the results of this year, Russ is probably their second most.

[Big Waz]

When Jokic is on the floor, their second best player has been Russ.

[Justin Barrier]

That's true. Yes. There's still some Russ minutes where it's like, what are you doing out there? But it doesn't matter. I also say to Russ's defense, his whole thing was always like, oh, they don't know how to use me. And like, that's bullshit for a lot of reasons. But he's kind of right because to bring out the best in Russ, you kind of need to play through the mistakes. And that was the case when he was MVP Russ in Oklahoma City. Like, you need him to throw a bunch of dumb passes to get the brilliant one that you never saw, or to just play so goddamn hard that he's willing to. To almost do the mistakes with all the brilliant stuff. And so it's been great. I love watching him.

[Rob Mahoney]

I want to say this in defense of Russ, too, who it's very hard for players who are that entrenched in a signature style of play to dramatically shift it and to become more of an off ball threat, more of a cutter, you know, get the ball out of their hands and become someone completely different. From not only who they were, but what. What made them so wildly successful in the first place if there was going to be a place to do it. It's with Nikola Jokic. And that's not just because he's a great passer, but specifically because he's a big. Like the difference in James Harden and Russ trying to make it work together and Harden trying to dime up Russ running pick and roll or cutting is so different than Jokic looking over the top of the defense from the elbow and just whipping no looks over his head. Like, the dynamics work in Russ's favor in a way that makes total sense. And that clearly suits Nikola too. Like, their pairing has been electric and I can't wait to see what they do with it the rest of the year. I can't wait to see what it could mean for the Nuggets as we approach the trade deadline now that they know they have one more kind of solid piece of the rotation.

[Big Waz]

And Murray showing some damn spunk. Finally. My God. Jesus, he's showing it though.

[Justin Barrier]

One thing I will say though, in James Harden's defense, there is. It did feel like they recontextualize Russ in a way that the Nuggets are now taking advantage of, where he's like more of an off ball cutter who. Who's basically your center on the floor. Like, maybe that's more of a Mori thing than a Harden thing, but that kind of is the blueprint that Jokic is. Is now just making better.

[Rob Mahoney]

Frankly, you can see the like four or five year trajectory for Russ of starting to become that kind of player. And I think quite crucially, being humbled a couple times by really destructive, disappointing circumstances like situations that just did not work. And it became really clear very, very quickly that he can't fill this kind of role. He can't fill that kind of role. So you look around the landscape of the league and what is the situation that makes sense for us? It's clearly this, this, this is the kind of thing that could play very well for him.

[Justin Barrier]

We didn't know that he was basically just good Ben Simmons all along for you.

[Rob Mahoney]

Is it Ben Simmons good Ben Simmons, Justin?

[Justin Barrier]

It depends on the night. It really depends. Last thing I just want to mention here because we didn't really talk much about wembanyama. We didn't pass pods though. But he's up to four blocks a game.

[Rob Mahoney]

Yep.

[Justin Barrier]

At this point. So there's been 15 instances in which a player has logged a season of four blocks or more. Can you guys. Do you remember the most recent one.

[Rob Mahoney]

I don't think Gobert ever got there.

[Big Waz]

Was it Dwight Howard?

[Justin Barrier]

Nope, it was in the 90s.

[Rob Mahoney]

Wow.

[Justin Barrier]

Mutumbo, Mutumbo. 95, 96. 30 years practically since we've seen this.

[Rob Mahoney]

95, 96. Is that Atlanta for him?

[Justin Barrier]

I think so.

[Big Waz]

What I love last night, homer ass. Spurs broadcasters were complaining when Wemby wasn't getting credited with a block. They're like, that should have been the eighth block.

[Justin Barrier]

Hit eight in the first half.

[Rob Mahoney]

If you whip the air strongly enough that it alters the trajectory of the ball, maybe it should be a block. You know, corporeal blocks.

[Justin Barrier]

Mutumbo was in Denver that year. Next year, Denver, he was in Atlanta.

[Rob Mahoney]

On, on the Wemby front too. I think he's make. Starting to like, make a case for himself. You know, we. We were just talking about this. With the top 100. Justin clearly elevating his class within the league, jumping a tier into now he's. He's kind of firmly a top 10 player. Not really threatening. Yeah, not, not necessarily threatening. The Jokic, Shai, Luka, Giannis kind of class just yet. Tatum class kind of yet included. But I think he's making a case as having the single biggest impact of any player in the league. And I don't mean he's the best player. What I mean is what he does is so singular and so irreplaceable.

[Big Waz]

Spurs just should not be this competitive.

[Rob Mahoney]

They should.

[Big Waz]

Like they got Chris Paul at 50.

[Rob Mahoney]

Running point and quite successfully.

[Big Waz]

Yes. And a bunch of dudes who like, they're shooting it with confidence because teams feel like they can't leave Wemby with the lob thread. Like the second they leave this guy on the pick and roll, it's, it's, you know, whenever I like pick up something and throw it in my trash can, that's what it looks like when Wemby's catching a lob. It's just the most easiest, effortless. Nothing really happened. What he's doing with his, like, sort of setup game where he just knows where guys are going to be and is spraying it out quickly. That thing is just picking up on a game by game basis. And last night, what I thought was cool was Zach Edie clearly circled the date on this calendar. Came out three quick buckets. One of them, he dunked it on Wimy's head. I was like, oh, Zach E. Two things happened. One, Zack Edy was tired as afterwards exerting himself that way on three straight possessions. And the second thing that happened was Like, Wemby just made adjustments. Like, he made adjustments on how he was positioning, when he would decide to try to block, when he would decide to try to strip, when he would like, actually see the position. Like, he just was making the adjustments on the fly and his teammates are noticing it and giving him the props. That's the thing that again, that I think is the dopest thing about Wimy. Like, yes, the freaking 28 foot threes. Everybody gets excited about that. Like these little things about getting off of the ball quickly and making defensive adjustments, all the winning things. That doesn't get you girls. Wemby is excellent at excellent and he's learning. He's picking this up all the time. That's what I think is the most impressive to me, man.

[Rob Mahoney]

How much of the John Moran all Star case was minted when he absolutely yammed on Victor Webb and yam?

[Big Waz]

Oh, at least 40%.

[Rob Mahoney]

I was about to say. I. I feel like he wasn't on your page. And then that dunk happened. Like. Oh, he's. He's one of the backups.

[Big Waz]

Yeah. John Moran is a revelation, y'all. Just telling y'all, man. Keep an eye on the Grizzlies.

[Justin Barrier]

Things that get you girls. I have to shout out Ryan west, who was the guy at. At Bellwether Bar the other night who. Who helped your brother out. He.

[Rob Mahoney]

You heard. You heard from him?

[Big Waz]

Ryan West. Oh, and also my guy at the MGM bar did reach out to me. I gotta go find him on Insta.

[Rob Mahoney]

We're just doing shout outs to a guy.

[Big Waz]

Yeah, it's the shout out portion. What the hell? My boy Matthew. Matthew from Denver. We appreciate the shout. Appreciate the love, man. Shouts to my Denver faithful out there.

[Justin Barrier]

TT2 Ts W or my boy. You. Yeah, okay. Or. Or maybe an O like a Louisiana. I. I noticed you guys didn't have Scoot Anderson on your short list.

[Rob Mahoney]

Well, nor Denny Abdi. I know that must have been a tough cut for you then.

[Justin Barrier]

He's good. Best player on the Blazers. I'm just saying. All right, why don't we wrap it right there? Thank you. To Ben Cruz on production, off on Monday, back next Thursday with your East All Stars and hopefully, hopefully some takes. We'll talk to you. Must be 21 plus and present in select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18/ plus and present in D.C. gambling problem. Call 1-800- gambler or visit rg-help.com, call 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org chat in Connecticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gamblinghelplinema.org or call 800-327-5050 for 24. 7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY in New York.