What’s Next for the Warriors? Plus, Players and Politics. | Real Ones

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Ringer NBA Show – "What’s Next for the Warriors? Plus, Players and Politics." | Real Ones

Release Date: January 21, 2025
Host/Participants: Logan Murdoch, Raja Bell, Howard Beck, Bomani Jones

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Introduction

In this episode of "Real Ones" on The Ringer NBA Show, host Logan Murdoch, alongside former NBA player Raja Bell, journalist Howard Beck, and special guest Bomani Jones, dive deep into the current state of the Golden State Warriors, discuss All-Star selections, and explore the evolving role of NBA players in social and political spheres.

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Warriors' Season Analysis

Logan Murdoch kickstarts the conversation by expressing his disappointment with the Warriors' recent performances. Having attended multiple home games, Logan describes the Warriors' play as dismal, likening them to an "AAU team" and noting significant fan dissatisfaction.

• Logan Murdoch [04:20]: "The overall vibe is a dejected fan base right now. There's very fake optimism from the front office and players."

Raja Bell concurs, highlighting the team's reliance on aging stars and the lack of impactful contributions from younger players.

• Raja Bell [06:22]: "We're still absolutely dependent on Steph being offensively elite and Draymond being defensively elite. If there's slippage from either, there's nothing to lean on."

The discussion emphasizes the Warriors' depth issues, injuries, and questionable personnel decisions that have led to a decline from their previous dominance.

• Logan Murdoch [06:43]: "The team is just the worst you can be in the middle with Steph Curry nearing 37. It's all bad."

All-Star Selections and Voting

Transitioning to All-Star discussions, Raja Bell shares his ballot choices, revealing his support for players like Jalen Brunson and Donovan Mitchell over more popular figures like LaMelo Ball.

• Raja Bell [39:09]: "In the east, at guard, I had Jalen Brunson, Lamelo, and Donovan Mitchell."

Logan Murdoch probes Raja's selections, questioning why Lamelo Ball wasn't chosen despite his popularity.

• Logan Murdoch [40:35]: "What's the point of making All Star picks if you can't promote them on your podcast?"

The hosts debate the criteria for All-Star selections, balancing popularity with individual performance and team success.

• Raja Bell [41:55]: "LaMelo is putting up empty stats, but watching him play is a joy. He's not a winning formula."

Players and Politics

The conversation shifts to the role of NBA players in social and political issues, especially in the context of recent elections and societal movements.

Bomani Jones discusses the fatigue and evolution of athletes' involvement in activism, noting a decline in vocal participation compared to the height of movements in 2020.

• Bomani Jones [75:53]: "There was a brief glimmer during that summer of 2020... It was a moment, not a movement."

Logan Murdoch and Bomani Jones explore the challenges leagues like the NBA face when athletes express political opinions, especially under changing administrations.

• Logan Murdoch [84:35]: "How do the NBA mitigate distractions when a player aligns with controversial figures like Trump?"

Bomani Jones emphasizes the complexity of balancing athlete expression with organizational interests, suggesting that leagues must navigate these issues carefully without alienating players or fans.

• Bomani Jones [86:20]: "The role of the athlete is very dependent upon who the athlete is himself."

Trivia Segment

Injecting some fun into the episode, the hosts engage in an NBA trivia challenge focusing on historical block statistics.

• Raja Bell [48:40]: "Only nine other players in history have averaged four blocks a game since 1973–74."

Logan Murdoch attempts to name these players, leading to a lighthearted exchange filled with playful banter and educational insights on legendary defenders.

• Logan Murdoch [50:27]: "Can you see? If you let me."

Mailbag: Listener Questions

The hosts address listener-submitted questions, including topics like the San Antonio Spurs' performance and potential mid-season moves.

Trevor from Sacramento inquires about the Spurs' strategies given their struggles and the rising competition.

• Trevor's Question [64:31]: "Are there a move they can make at the deadline to make a mini leap?"

Raja Bell advises patience, suggesting that the Spurs focus on developing young talent like Victor Wembanyama before making significant trades.

• Raja Bell [66:33]: "They don't have to make the playoffs this year. If they do, it's great experience for the young guys."

Logan Murdoch and Raja Bell discuss the nuances of team-building, emphasizing organic growth over forced acquisitions.

Special Guest: Bomani Jones

Bomani Jones joins the conversation to discuss the intersection of NBA culture with broader societal issues, including political activism and league perceptions.

• Bomani Jones [92:50]: "The NBA needs their breakthrough. Like, Caitlin Clark broke through."

He critiques the commodification of protest and explores how league policies have evolved in response to player activism and public sentiment.

• Bomani Jones [96:14]: "I think a lot of the coverage is kind of based on the way that these algorithms work, generally giving you more of what we know you already like."

Conclusion

Wrapping up, Logan Murdoch reflects on the episode's discussions, highlighting the Warriors' predicament, the complexities of All-Star voting, and the changing landscape of player activism. The hosts express anticipation for future episodes and live shows, promising continued deep dives into NBA dynamics.

• Logan Murdoch [109:54]: "Shout out Howard, MF and Beck. Shout out Raja. We'll see you Friday."

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Notable Quotes

1. Logan Murdoch [04:20]: "The overall vibe is a dejected fan base right now. There's very fake optimism from the front office and players."
2. Raja Bell [06:22]: "We're still absolutely dependent on Steph being offensively elite and Draymond being defensively elite. If there's slippage from either, there's nothing to lean on."
3. Raja Bell [39:09]: "In the east, at guard, I had Jalen Brunson, Lamelo, and Donovan Mitchell."
4. Bomani Jones [75:53]: "There was a brief glimmer during that summer of 2020... It was a moment, not a movement."
5. Raja Bell [66:33]: "They don't have to make the playoffs this year. If they do, it's great experience for the young guys."

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Final Thoughts

This episode of "Real Ones" offers a comprehensive analysis of the Golden State Warriors' struggles, insightful debates on All-Star selections, and thoughtful discussions on the role of NBA players in societal issues. The dynamic interplay between seasoned analysts and former players provides listeners with a multifaceted understanding of current NBA narratives.

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Tune in next Friday for more in-depth discussions, expert analyses, and engaging conversations on The Ringer NBA Show's "Real Ones."

Transcript

[Logan Murdoch]

What's poppin everybody? Logan Murdoch here from Real Ones on the Ringer NBA show and I wanted to invite you to pull up and kick it with Raja Bell, Howard Beck and myself during All Star Weekend for our live podcast. We're going to be at the historic Punchline Comedy Club in San francisco on Saturday, February 15th at 2pm pregaming all the All Star festivities and you never know who might stop by. Get your tickets now by heading over to ringer.com events. That's ringer.com events. Hope to see you there.

[Howard Beck]

This episode is brought to you by Hyundai. Amazon's your go to for all things hoops, game gear, snacks for the late night tip offs, you name it. And now you can shop for a Hyundai there too. Pick your model and trim from a local dealer, see transparent pricing up front and knock out most of the paperwork online. Then just head to the dealership to finalize the deal. Visit HyundaiUSA.com or call 562-314-4603 for more details. Limited availability only through participating Hyundai dealers in select markets. This program is available for the purchase of new vehicles and is not currently available for lease. This episode is brought to you by Smucker's Uncrustables. There's nothing like a snack that comes in clutch. So who's the real mvp? Uncrustables. The best part of the sandwich. It's a round crimped sandwich made with soft pillowy bread filled with peanut butter and jelly. It goes straight from the freezer to your lunchbox, making it easier to pack lunch and sprint out the door. Now that's a morning win. You'll find Smucker's Uncrustables in the freezer aisle.

[Logan Murdoch]

Foreign what's poppin? Real ones. Logan Murdoch here. Howard mother effing Beck over there. Raja is somewhere. He's not here though. So we're going to talk a little Warriors All Star. Get some curmudgeon takes out of Howard, who was definitely built up a reputation, a bit of a reputation on this podcast for, for having such takes. How do you feel about that, Howard? You're like that. It used to be Raja was the resident curmudgeon and now like I think you've just the mandal and just ran with it. This is, this is your, this is your bag right now. How do you feel this?

[Raja Bell]

I feel like this is blatant ageism. Raja was considered the curmudgeon because he was the oldest person on the pod and now I'm the oldest person on the Pod by. By some measure, I feel like this is. This is just blatant ageism by. By you and certain part of our audience of listeners who are. Who are cranky about me being cranky. I guess. I don't know. I don't. I don't know. Those are curmudgeonly takes of like.

[Logan Murdoch]

Like, I don't know, Like, I. I was obviously out the loop for a long time, but like Everest, for the last two weeks, all I've been getting is like. And we'll talk more about this, obviously, during the all Star segment of this podcast. But, like, all I've been hearing is Roger's lamello, not Roz. Excuse me, Howard's Lamelo takes are crazy. Howard's Lamelo takes this or like, Howard, Jeez, like, just. It's just, you know, maybe it is ageism from, like, our real ones crowd as a whole.

[Raja Bell]

Well, there's definitely, like a generation gap, I think, on, like, Lamelo in general. I think the younger you are, the more likely you are to really love Lamelo and overlook all of his flaws and make him the leading vote getter among the Eastern Conference guards. But to be clear, until last week, when we started talking about all star starters and voting and all that, I don't think I'd ever mention Lamelo Ball's name on this podcast. So it's not like I've had some, like, ongoing Lamelo slander agenda. It was like, the dude is inexplicably number one. I guess it's explicable, but it's explainable. It was. It was. It's a thing. It was a thing. A thing that may or may not be rectified when the media and players do their part on the voting. We'll see.

[Logan Murdoch]

We'll see. All right, let's talk about the Warriors. Man, I was at the game, and I just want to say I was at the game yesterday against Boston, and now I've been going the last few warriors home games, and it is about as dismal as it has ever been or not ever been, because, I mean, me and you have both seen some dismal, like, warriors seasons.

[Raja Bell]

Decades worth.

[Logan Murdoch]

Decades worth. The Cohan warriors weren't great. You know, there's some level of optimism here just for the simple fact they got 30 on the team. But, I mean, it was pretty dark yesterday. Like, it was like. It was like an, like a very bad AAU team playing against a. A professional basketball team. And the warriors were not a professional basketball team. You haven't been at Chase in a while. And I, I don't know. And I'm sure you're going to be there for All Star, but like, you ain't seen it like this. Howard. It's. It's pretty, it's pretty dark, buddy.

[Raja Bell]

It's been a while since I've been there for a regular season or even playoff game. Yeah. Is it just dead. Are they just in stunned disbelief? Like, what's the. Are they just resigned to, like, okay, maybe this thing is just over? Like, what's the vibe?

[Logan Murdoch]

The fans, fans, I think in section 128 were booing profusely throughout the whole second half. Like, it was pretty bad. Like it got. And then they started leaving around the fourth quarter. I think the overall vibe is. It's a dejected fan base right now. I think that there is, there is like a very fake optimism out of the warriors front office and the warriors players. If you hear their quotes right, where they're saying, hey, there's some comparison to 2022. And by the way, this is not 2022 by any stretch of the imagination. If you were just even to go on vibes alone, this is like, I don't know, man. This must be like what Cliff feels like with the Sixers. I'm sorry to give you a straight bro, but this must be like. It must. It's. It's not. It's not great. And then when you see it, it's just like you're going to awake every time you see them play. And then the injuries haven't made it much better. Right. And they, this was a fine team. Like, I think their ceiling even before the season was like a six seed. And I think they're holding like they're the 21st ranked offense with Steph Curry on the team.

[Raja Bell]

Yeah, it's just wrong.

[Logan Murdoch]

It's insane. And so I just. They have a lot to figure out, but a lot of the moves it feels like they should have made, they should be making should have happened years ago. And this team is just the worst you can be in the middle is this Lee in this league and they're perpetually in the middle, but they're having like Steph Curry on the team who's about to turn 37, so it's just kind of all bad.

[Raja Bell]

Can I just, like, I don't want to get Pollyannish about this and I don't want to be delusional about this, but I just want to note at least where it regards the last few weeks, right? No. Kuminga, who's one of their, you know, their lone bright spots among their young players. Obviously, Pajemski, you know, has had a disappointing second season, and I think he's been banged up. Draymond is out right now, like, to whatever extent that the warriors can and maybe should be better than this. It's at least due in part to having, like, some really key players out. Right. Steph is not the step of old, but Steph is still absolutely an impact player. I've got some stats I'll refer to in a second here, but Steph is still a very impactful player despite his age. And Draymond is 2, but he's not playing right now, and. And those are your backbone. So if Draymond's out and then your best young player, Kuminga, is out. I know we started the season talking about a lot of all their depth, and I wrote a whole piece about how they had such incredible depth that Kerr couldn't even decide which players to play. So he's playing 12, 13 guys a night. It was nice while it lasted. I wasn't really that optimistic it was going to last forever because it's hard for guys to play short minutes in a deep rotation all the time. But I did think that they had enough good players, Logan, that they'd be able to withstand some. Some dips here and there or injuries here and there. And I just think what we're seeing is that they absolutely still in year, whatever we are of this, they're still absolutely, completely dependent on Steph being offensively elite, Draymond being defensively elite and their best playmaker in a lot of ways. And then if there's at least even a little bit of slippage from either of them or both of them, there's just nothing to lean on anymore. And you said it 2022, not forget, like, Clay was not only still there, but playing at a good enough level, especially in the playoffs, that. That he could make an impact most nights. Jordan Poole was having the season of his life, and Andrew Wiggins was having the season of his life. Well, Jordan Pool's gone, and it's questionable whether he was ever going to be able to sustain that. Anyway, Clay is gone and was not going to be able to sustain it because of age and injury, and Wiggins, for whatever reasons, has never been able to replicate what he did that season. And I said this a year ago at this time, if Wiggins just could play like he did in their last championship run, consistently, everything looks different. And obviously, look, there's a bunch of other. Everything looks different. Qualifications or qualifiers, too. If they drafted somebody instead of James Weissman, right? If they, you know, somebody else, if they had taken Wagner instead of, I think, Kuming or what, like, we could go on and on with draft if.

[Logan Murdoch]

Draymond didn't punch his teammate in the.

[Raja Bell]

Face, if Draymond didn't punch Jordan pool, like, we could go on and on with that stuff. But. But there have been some personnel misfires. There's been all kinds of stuff. But I still say, I'm not saying that this makes them a contender, but if they just were healthy right now, things wouldn't be quite as bleak. That's not a glass half full take. That's a glass like a quarter full take.

[Logan Murdoch]

I just say, I think the classic. The classic. We're saying different things that basically say the same thing. Like if they had all of their. Like, if Buddy Hield, who, like, I don't know who trusts Buddy Hield to play a full season at the level he was playing at for the first couple of weeks, right? For that consistency, you were trusting Buddy Hill to be that consistent in a way he's never been. You were trusting Kaminga, who's been had spurts, but also another guy that has struggled with consistency. And then you're also trusting Pozemski, who is having a very big sophomore slump in a major way. And then you're trusting Draymond Green, who I think believe is 34 years old. And if Draymond Green is your second best player on a team, I don't know if you're going that far, right? No disrespect, but even at his best, he was about the third or fourth best guy on a given. On a given team with the warriors, right? So you bring all of that together and then we're not even talking about the chemistry issues that have happened or the front office missteps that have happened. Whether you talk about Mike Dunleavy not necessarily getting the autonomy or knowing what it's like to not get the autonomy when you're the warriors gm, when you have an owner like Joe Lacob, who's all constantly meddling on every single deal, who is pushing you to sign Kaminga to a big deal when you know, the coaches keep telling you, hey, I don't think he's that. I don't know if he's that consistent. I don't know is that consistent or just a myriad of things, right? Or you have Steph, who is a guy that probably, if he had a little bit more if he wasn't as passive when he in his conversations to the front office, maybe like there'd be more sense of urgency to get things done. But I mean, you're seeing quotes out there where they're talking about the future. You know, we got to also plan for the future. While planning. There's no future after step you shouldn't think about like that without what a guy like Steph, right? Like he's one of the top 10 players and one of the ever arguably. And also the one of the faces of his generation, bro. Like, you're not going to find somebody like that. So you put all that together. Even if this team was good, like it wouldn't. They would still be somewhat in the middle. And in a lot of ways it feels like wasting another because of their lack of aggression, wasting another year of steps. Twilight at this point. Effective Twilight.

[Raja Bell]

Yeah. I mean, you know, you know where I am on, on this particular issue. Like, I have been very consistent about this. Where it regards Steph, where it regards LeBron, anybody? If you've got a star of that caliber, not just one of the best of his era, but one of the best of all time. But even if it was just one of the best of his era, as long as that star is still performing at an elite level, top 10, top 15, even top 20, you owe it to them and to, and to, to basketball history, to posterity, to the fans, to everybody. You owe it to them to be all in at all times. And so I never really liked the two timeline thing. I was always kind of skeptical of that. I, I admired the audacity of it and the ambition of it. To say we can be great in the present and still be reloading and investing in the future. Like, great. Like, try to thread that needle. Cool. But it's rarely been done. It's not easy. It probably won't work. It didn't work. And if Stefan Draymond retire tomorrow, whatever the ceiling of Kuminga, Pajemski, Moody is that. Sorry, it's. It's just. You're still, you're still coming down a really far away. So it was never a great idea, the two timeline plan. And I think by sticking to it as long as they did, by not trading or being even willing to trade the picks that eventually became Kuminga and Moody or Weissman, by, by taking that approach, they cut off their ability to make the last years of Steph more meaningful. And yes, they won a title anyway. Like they got away with it for one year. Everything broke right not diminishing, not asterisking. Just saying things broke right. They win A championship in 2022. For the moment, it looks like you can get away with being great in the present and plan for the future at the same time. But they would have been better off in getting other veterans who could continue to extend this era instead of clinging to those picks and then the players who they took with those picks. And now Logan. We're at this really interesting moment where Steph's that much closer to the end. He's turning 37 in March. 37. Still playing like an All Star, but he's gonna be 37 in March. We don't know when the last day or the last season is of him still being at this level. And Steph himself is now saying, and I found this absolutely fascinating. I mean, this. All these quotes were for like a week ago, but it came, I think, after the last time you and I potted together. Absolutely fascinating that Steph is saying that the front office should now exercise caution and restraint when it regards trades. They did go all out. To be clear, they did go all out last summer to try to get Lowry Mark, and they couldn't make a deal. They did go all out to try to get Paul George. That couldn't make a deal. So they were trying. But now Steph is saying this quote, desperate trades or desperate moves that deplete the future. There is a responsibility on keeping the franchise in a good space parentheses long term and a good spot when it comes to where we leave this thing when we're done. Doesn't mean that you're not trying to get better. Doesn't mean that you're not active in any type of search. If you have an opportunity where a trade makes sense or in the summer where free agency makes sense. You want to continue to get better, but it doesn't mean you're desperate and flinging assets all around just because you want to do something. And then Kerr weighs in, I think within a day or maybe the same night or day or two after that, and he's saying, you have to mind what's coming ahead in the future. I probably won't be around, but I would tell you, if this organization gave away the next six or seven drafts for a wild swing, that would be the most irresponsible thing that they could do. And then Draymond tells our buddy Vinnie Goodwill at Yahoo, basically the same quote. The beautiful part about being in the space that we're in is Steve Kerr, Steph Curry, myself, all disagree with Mortgaging off the future of this organization and saying that we're going for it right now. Logan's just fascinating.

[Logan Murdoch]

I'm gonna be real with you, bro. You can read the quotes, but look at these people when they're saying the quotes. It looks like they're reading hostage letters. I don't believe them when they say that. I don't really. I don't. Like. I mean, I. I believe that that's the company. Company lying. I also don't. I also believe the reality of it is there's no one to trade for other than Giannis, and he's not going anywhere. So it's cool. It's convenient to say that right now. And also, another thing while you were talking, we can't underestimate this punch. Like, honestly, the punch that happened between Draymond and Jordan Poole catastrophically destroyed anything that they were building. Because if you think about it going into that 2022, 2023 season, like, there was a legitimate shot at repeating. Like, there was. They. They had the same team. They were bringing a team back, and they had. They got Dante DiVincenzo. They had a good. They had a good. They had a good off season, right? And they were primed in doing that even after the punch. Like, I remember the first game they beat the Lakers handily that opening night, right? Like, and it even saw, like, oh, this team has talent. Could we do something? But they were constantly having to manage and mitigate and try to smooth out the relationship between Poole and Draymond, and that took so much out of the team in general. It basically killed any momentum that they had for the two timeline plan for the. You know, even if you wanted to, like, even for the asset building, right? Because your two biggest assets, you couldn't trade Draymond on a. You couldn't really trade Draymond on a expiring deal because his value was shot, and it's kind of still shot after he signed that extension. And then you couldn't trade pool because of what was going on. Like, you've seen. You've seen how his value diminished to a point where they had to trade a pick alongside him to get him to Washington, right? And so. But that. That. When we look back, I mean, you could say all the things about trading, you know, trading the picks for. For. For. For veteran players and things like that, but for real. For real, that punch was, I think, the turning point in this whole thing. It just was.

[Raja Bell]

I don't want to diminish that, Logan, but I do think, like, again, if they had not clung to this. The arrogance of the two timeline plan. Let's call that what it is. Like, it's a really arrogant approach to take in this league where superstar talent is so determinative of whether you're a contender or not and whether you can be a contender for years, for an entire era. You don't get those guys very often. And sometimes you got to be a little bit lucky. And they were with Stephen.

[Logan Murdoch]

The thing, you know where it came from, though? It came from them wanting to be the spurs and wanting them. But they were just arrogant enough to think, oh yeah, we could just, you know, we can make Kaminga into a Kawhi, no problem. Right? And I think. And that's right. And I think their arrogance and I think they still kind of have that sort of arrogance. Even when you hear the quotes about like, oh yeah, we're gonna put this. It's just tone deaf, honestly, from all. That's why I think it's. That's why I think it's. It's breeds like all of those breeds like a hostage letter. Because it's just unbelievable to hear, right? Like, why would you even say that? Why would you say that to your fan base who live through the 90s, right? Like, and. And who live through all. I mean, we're both Bay Area kids. We both. I. Who was rooting for the warriors in like 96? No one.

[Raja Bell]

I've tried to explain this to people. Again, here we go with back in my day, old man being the old man here. No, dude. Growing up in the Bay Area. Shout out San Jose. Growing up in the Bay area in the 70s and 80s, like, the warriors were barely on the radar. I know they won a championship in the 70s. I know that, you know, some decent players passed through for a brief period of time, but the Niners, the Raiders, because they were still there, hadn't left for the one of their 17 times of abandoning the Bay Area. The Niners, the Raiders, the A's, the Giants, Stanford and Cal, even depending on on the year, football and basketball, like all of these teams were. Had a greater following and were more in the zeitgeist. Were more covered in the San Jose Mercury News, my hometown paper.

[Logan Murdoch]

How many?

[Raja Bell]

Real quick, the warriors were not on the radar? Nobody.

[Logan Murdoch]

How many Laker fans did you grow up with, Howard?

[Raja Bell]

There were some. My buddy Wes was like a huge, like, he was a Laker fan and a Rams fan, despite also being a San Jose native like me, like one of my best friends in high school.

[Logan Murdoch]

I was saying like, there were a lot more of those than, like.

[Raja Bell]

Yeah, because it was Showtime in the 80s, right?

[Logan Murdoch]

Magic, I got a quick story for you. I got a quick story for you. So my first ever basketball video game was NBA Live 2000. And I remember seeing this team called the Golden State warriors on there and not knowing where they were from because it said Golden State. And not knowing until like three or four months later, before I actually went to my first warriors game at like 6 and was like, oh, oh, this team is in my backyard. Oh, okay.

[Raja Bell]

Oh, we're Golden State.

[Logan Murdoch]

Oh, the warriors are Golden State. Oh, okay, cool. I had no idea. Like, I promise you, as a six year old, I had no idea they even existed.

[Raja Bell]

No one was walking around with warriors jerseys in the 70s and 80s, or probably a lot of the 90s for that matter.

[Logan Murdoch]

But all that to say, like, it. That's what I'm saying. Like, for, For. For this group, the arrogance to say, like, hey, oh man, you know, we're going to set up this franchise for four years to come. And like, that's so. That doesn't. It doesn't work that way.

[Raja Bell]

So. So here's the thing, like, the punch notwithstanding, and I don't think you're wrong on that, but again, everything is in the context of they were screwing up their decision making in the process anyway. So even if the punch happens, but you had made better picks with what, what became Wiseman, Kaminga, Moody, or if you had traded those picks, which is what I always thought they should have done, and gotten veteran help, you would have. You can withstand more stuff if you've got better players or veteran players who are ready to win.

[Logan Murdoch]

If you would have just bit the bullet and traded one of your institutional guys, like, I mean, that's.

[Raja Bell]

But okay, but I respect that. Like, I, I get them wanting to extend as far as they can with Steph, Clay, Draymond.

[Bomani Jones]

Right.

[Raja Bell]

That makes sense. But they need. The older they get, the more support they need. And the support was not going to be coming from a bunch of rookies who needed time to develop. And, you know, like, if the punch never happens, I still don't think we're seeing, like, he's not going to be All Star Jordan Poole, and we're not seeing All Star Kuminga or Moody or anybody else either. You need to replenish your All Star level talent. That's the thing. 2 timeline means we're planning for a future when Steph and Clay and Draymond are gone, but we're still really good to Great. Well, that requires all star level talent and they don't have it after their veterans. None of the young guys have shown that they, that they can do that. Not, not, not the current ones, not the ones that they've already parted with. So listen, I do think, like Steph is, Steph is like Tim Duncan in the sense that like, he's always been this low maintenance superstar, right? He's not LeBron or Kobe or Shaq or other guys who have pressured their front office. Make this move, make that move. So I get your hostage reading take. I think that there's some genuineness to this with Steph in particular in that he's always been of the mindset of like, you know, obviously I want to win at a high level, but it's not, he's not, he's not geared to be one who's going to tell the front office, make demands, do this, make this deal. I do think you're right too, that there's not a deal to make. Like Jimmy Butler was the one that seemed like the most logical until things really started to melt down in Miami. And then all of a sudden the warriors are signaling, you know, through, through the media that we're not interested. I still think Jimmy Butler actually could help them. There's risk.

[Logan Murdoch]

I don't think he could. I don't think he can.

[Raja Bell]

I think he can. I do.

[Logan Murdoch]

I think that. I think that he will clash with that locker room. And also, like, Jimmy has to. Jimmy has to be an alpha. Wherever he is, he has to. And no, he doesn't.

[Raja Bell]

No, he doesn't. I'm a, I'm a. Can I just like, stop you and say no? And I'll tell you why.

[Logan Murdoch]

Okay?

[Raja Bell]

He's never been a high usage guy. One of the, one of the things that I've always loved about Jimmy as a player, all of his other nonsense notwithstanding, is that he doesn't need to dominate the ball. He doesn't have to have a 35 usage rate. He's not a Harden Westbrook type who's heliocentric. He's always actually been. He was great with Joel Embiid. He's alpha in that you need to do things the way Jimmy does them. You need to bring it every day. You need to play your ass off, you need to defend, you need to not be soft. But he's never needed to dominate an offense. He's actually the ideal one. A or, or one. Excuse me, ideal one B or two to a one like, like step. Because he doesn't need the Ball in his hands all the time, but he can run the offense when needed. He's. He knows he's not a great shooter, but he's going to create offense by getting to the line and just by, by forcing things here and there. I, I think he's, he's a great complimentary star, especially at this stage of his career. He's 35 and he knows he's getting close to the horizon here. I'm not, so I think there's risk for sure, though.

[Logan Murdoch]

When I said Alpha, I didn't mean on court alpha. I didn't mean he was going to take shots.

[Raja Bell]

Oh, you mean just locker room.

[Logan Murdoch]

I meant locker room stuff. And like, in every, in every situation suggests that, like, he's similar to Russell Westbrook in that, in that way, but not necessarily. Like, he doesn't crash. Like, I don't believe that Westbrook crash and burns locker rooms. Like, and he doesn't, he doesn't leave carnage when he leaves. Right? Like, there's, It's, I think whenever Westbrook leaves people, like, in the locker room say what you want about. It's like reverse. Say what you want about him on court. But, like, people in the locker room tend to love Westbrook even when he. But like, with Jimmy, he always leaves like, a fire of some sort. Right. And, like, you can't. And that works when he's maybe 28 to 31, but not when he's 35 and a team needs to win. Right? Like, I don't think that. And, and he's also going to be somebody that's going to want a new deal coming into your building. That's like.

[Raja Bell]

That's the problem.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Like, I'm not talking about the encore stuff. I'm talking about in the locker room and day to day. And then you do that mid season. Like, I don't, I don't think that that's necessarily a good idea for a guy like that, for this team specifically. Now, I do think if Jimmy were to go anywhere, I would love for him to go to Phoenix for that. I think that that would actually help Phoenix. I think that Phoenix actually needs a fire under their ass. But, like, I don't think that this is. I don't think what you want to do with this Golden State locker room is put a guy like that, who needs to be an Alpha in the locker room and all things revolve around his orbit. Like, I don't, I don't think that that's a good idea.

[Raja Bell]

Yeah, I just. I don't know how. I don't know how you're getting Jimmy to Phoenix. And I understand why the warriors would be hesitant to maybe even oppose to acquiring him. But. But who else can you possibly get in the next. Whether it's the next few weeks, the next few months before next season. Steph again, 37 in March. He's got what, maybe another season of this, Two seasons of this at most. And when I say of this, I mean still playing at elite level. So there are 43 guys, which is astounding, by the way. 43 players right now are averaging at least 20 points a game. Of that 43, Steph is 13th in true shooting percentage. Not, not great by his standards in true shooting, but he's still elite. He's. He's got a better true shooting percentage than LeBron, Kyrie, Anthony Davis, Jason Tatum, Anthony Edwards, by a lot.

[Logan Murdoch]

Which is why multiple teamed like, no one is, like, with no second options, no one is paying attention to anyone else on the court. It's, it's, it's like, it's very ugly to watch the warriors right now because it's good stuff the ball, but like the entire team, like all the whole Boston Celtics, they didn't. We don't care about Santos, we don't care about such and such. We don't care about Dennis Schroeder. That's fine. Leave them open. We're gonna go for 30. Like, it's, it's, it's really an ugly offer because there's nobody else. There's no other option.

[Raja Bell]

Yeah. And he's still got one of the best true shooting percentages in the league. Again, better than Booker, better than Luca, better than Donovan Mitchell. So that being the case, like, I just don't want to watch that season go by and this impact of him go by without it meaning anything but I don't know, like, short of a Jimmy Butler, like, like, can you get Cam Johnson? Seems like the Nets are holding out for a lot of picks for Cam Johnson. Is. Is Cam Johnson enough? I think actually he'd be really great fit, but I think, is Jeremy Grant fit? Like I'm looking? Like, can you get a two way guy who can shoot, who can do a little offensively, who can defend wings?

[Logan Murdoch]

If I'm the Warriors right now, if I'm the Warriors right now, and I know Brooklyn has interest in Kaminga. If I'm the Warriors right now, I trade Kaminga right now for Cam Jackson. No, bro, just go ahead and do it.

[Raja Bell]

I agree.

[Logan Murdoch]

Why Not.

[Raja Bell]

Yeah, like, I agree.

[Logan Murdoch]

And another thing. Like, this is another thing. The warriors are, like, in big swing mode. But also, like, if we've known anything about, you know, I'm sorry to like, on Cliff Sixers, but I'm gonna do it anyway. Like, it's not all about gratuitous. It's not all about getting the star. Right. You also need ancillary pieces. So, like, if you can't get a star right now, build up on ancillary pieces and figure it out then. Right. Because the most important thing is it's really hard to get from, like, ass to great. You have to get from, like, ass to solid to really good to great, no matter what. You know, like, we've seen time and time again, we've seen it with Phoenix trying to get great overnight. Like, it's. It's a gradual process. And like, I know, and I. And I'm. And I know that Steph doesn't have, like, time. Time like that, but, like, if there's someone out there really good that you can just go get real quick, just go get them. Put them in your locker room.

[Raja Bell]

Yeah. And two other. Two other quick thoughts, by the way, on this. When, when people push back on, like, oh, you. You know, being all in, like, this is a mistake because you're sacrificing the future and all this stuff. There's no one move that or even two moves, it's going to make them a contender. Logan, I think it's enough with Steph at age 36, soon to be 37. It's enough just to, say, give him the best chance to at least be in the playoffs, win a round or two, and not have it be this depressing. Like, let's, you know, get knocked out in the plane. Yes. Like, it's. It's fine. Like, you don't have to be contending to make the trade worthwhile. You don't have to. It doesn't have to be a home run trademark. It's just about making these last couple of seasons as meaningful as possible. And if there's an outside chance at a title, great. But it's. But there's that. The second thing is, like, again, there's no future to sacrifice because whatever you do with Kaminga, maybe he makes a couple All Star teams in the future. He was not going to anchor your team for 10 to 15 years the way that Steph did. Nobody that you have is like, there's nobody on your roster who should be untouchable. Just. And again, easy for me to say. It's hard to make trades in this league, especially now under the CBA with aprons and shit, but do whatever you can to at least make this team fun, interesting again. Give Steph that stage in the. In the spring to do what he does.

[Logan Murdoch]

Last thing, though, on this, and I. And I'm going to add on to what you just said. I just think it's BS when people say, like, we're not going to mortgage our future, bro. Trades get traded every day, B. You can get them back. Like, it always happens. Brooklyn is a great example of this. Brooklyn. No, I'm just saying, like, people are like, you know, we don't want to mortgage our future trades for other people. Like, you see now, Brooklyn just traded away hella picks to get Durant and then. Or not Durant, but, like, they traded a lot of picks and then they. To get Durant, Harden and all these. They got all these. They're getting picks back. They're. That's how you build. Like, you're gonna. You're gonna get it back. It's fine. You'll figure it out. If you have a good, good front office, front offices trade players and picks every day. It's all in this league. Nothing is sacred. Like, I just hate when people say, like, oh, we have a. We have a pick here. Trade them picks. You want to win or not. You have Steph Curry. You ain't never going to have them again.

[Raja Bell]

Yeah, occasionally it backfires. Like the, The.

[Bomani Jones]

The.

[Raja Bell]

The. You know, the Pierce Garnett deal for the Nets obviously was. Was a huge misfire, and it helped build the Celtics back into a championship team, but those are rare. And the mistakes there were, you know, not protecting the picks, being a little too desperate. And besides that, that was to graft guys onto a team led by Darren Williams and Joe Johnson or Brook Lopez, not a team led by Steph Curry.

[Logan Murdoch]

It's huge difference, bro. You're gonna suck regardless when Steph retires. So, like, who cares? Just let it go all in.

[Raja Bell]

Just deal. Yeah. Yeah. Rely on your front office to make good picks with the picks that you still have, because you're not trading all of them. You can't.

[Bomani Jones]

You.

[Raja Bell]

You literally cannot trade all of them because of the Ted Stepien rule. So, like, you'll, you know, rely on your front office to figure out a.

[Logan Murdoch]

Way to rebuild the other thing, though. And I guess this is the last. Last thing. Mike Dunleavy has a lot to prove. We need some, like, you know, like, we just need some savvy moves here or there. We haven't seen those. Like, I mean, no matter what happens. And I've heard like a lot of people, you know, shoot some bail for Mike Dunleavy that I believe, but will not share on this particular platform yet. But no matter what, like the deals that could have happened, the two things that have happened on your watch is that you traded Jordan Poole and literally got nothing back for it, right? Like you didn't even. You got Chris Paul like for a few games and then let him walk for nothing. And then you let a fan favorite walk, an all time fan favorite in Klay Thompson. You know, whether you, whether like the basketball of it all doesn't matter. Like if you're gonna, you like every, every goal that you have set has gone up in flames. First you said two timeline, then you went, oh yeah, we're gonna keep the band together. Couldn't even do that right. It's really dark right now in Bay Area right now. Dark.

[Raja Bell]

Yeah.

[Logan Murdoch]

You'll see when you get here. You'll see how depressing it is.

[Raja Bell]

It's All Star weekend. It's not the same crowds, it'll be a little different. But yeah, I get what you're saying.

[Logan Murdoch]

All right. Wait till, wait till the real ones live show comes on. They're going to show you like, oh.

[Raja Bell]

My God, that's going to be that. That crowd will be interesting for sure.

[Logan Murdoch]

Let's take a quick break and we're going to talk about Howard's curmudgeon All star picks. If you're in need of a midweek boost, FanDuel, America's number one sportsbook has you covered with the NBA Hump Day Parlay profit boost. Now every Wednesday you can get a parlay profit boost. Everything from spreads to over unders and even player props. Okay, let's look at the slate today. We got Knicks, Nets. What am I going to pick on that? I think I'm going to take the over. I'm take the Knicks. What am I going to do on Blazers, heat, Jimmy Butler. What am I going to do? Go pick the Heat, take the over. Magic, Raptors. I'm going to bet that there's going to be no defense in that game by the Raptors, but I'm still going to pick them to win. Sixers, Nuggets, I am going to bet that Jokic has a huge game. Wizards, Lakers. I'm going to pick the Lakers and I'm going to pick the over on points for Jordan Poole. So don't let the weekend have all the fun. Take advantage of the Hump Day Parlays Reward Stack who knows, it might just become your favorite day. Look for the Hump Day parlay in the FanDuel app to find your profit boost or visit FanDuel.com RingerMBA that's FanDuel.com RingermBA make every moment more with FanDuel an official sportsbook partner of the NBA must be 21 years and older and present in select states or 18 and older and present in DC. Opt in required bonus issued as non withdrawable Profit Boost Tokens. Restrictions apply including any token expiration. See [e-mail] Gambling problem. Call 1-800-gambler or visit rg-help.com this episode.

[Raja Bell]

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[Logan Murdoch]

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[Raja Bell]

Yes, yes. I, I've, I've. I've confirmed through official channels.

[Logan Murdoch]

Here's another thing. What's the point of making All Star picks if you can't promote them on your podcast, first of all? All right, Cliff, put this in post. Drum roll, please.

[Raja Bell]

So the media accounts for 25% of the vote on All Star starters. I was among that pool of, I think probably 100 people. Turn in my ballot yesterday, Monday. And here we go. In the east, at guard, I had Jalen Brunson, Lamelo.

[Logan Murdoch]

No.

[Raja Bell]

And Donovan Mitchell. We'll get back to Lamello, I'm sure. In the front court, I had Giannis, Jason Tatum and Carl Anthony Towns. In the west, the guards were Shea Gilgis, Alexander. Are there any other Shays? I don't think so. And Steph Curry.

[Logan Murdoch]

Shea Moisture and Shea Butter.

[Raja Bell]

Phenomenal things to have in your medicine cabinet.

[Logan Murdoch]

Who are probably first over Shea, Gilgis, Alexander.

[Raja Bell]

In my household, SGA and Steph were my. Were my back court on the ballot. Front court of Jokic, Wembanyama and lebron. There you go. You got any issues, any concerns, any questions? Logan, that's. That's my ballot. That was my official ballot that I turned in yesterday. This Thursday we will find out. I believe Thursday probably on tnt. That's the usual approach. We'll find out who the. The starters are based on the 50% fan vote, 25% media vote, and player. 25% player vote.

[Logan Murdoch]

What made you pick Jalen Brunson? What was your Jalen Brunson pick? Explain that pick for me. I mean, other than the fact that you watched Severance over this weekend. No, I just want to say I'm looking at the guards right now. I knew you weren't going to pick Lamelo. Right. Obviously.

[Raja Bell]

Obviously.

[Logan Murdoch]

Was the Dame. Lillard get any consideration from you?

[Raja Bell]

No, not much. I wouldn't say no, just not much. I mean, I considered just about everybody who was within the top 8 to 10 guards in performance and. Or even on like I always look at who the fans are picking just to see like, you know, and which is, which is wild because like Jordan Poole is ninth in the fan voting as of last Thursday, but Lillard was third. And so like, I'm at least going to look at it based on. On the fans being enthused about him and based on performance. But, like, Jalen Brunson's having a much better season than Damian Lillard, a much more consistent season, I think. And the Knicks overall, like, the All Star Game is not necessarily like, just about, like, pick the guys who are on the winning teams, but, like, in case of tie or even close by a few percentage points. Yeah, I'm going to lean toward the guy who's. Who's having the better season and whose team is then having the better season. Like, I think that's fair.

[Logan Murdoch]

What's.

[Raja Bell]

But what.

[Logan Murdoch]

What's. The.

[Raja Bell]

Brunson was the easy one. Mitchell was the harder one.

[Logan Murdoch]

Which one was what made it. What made it hard? What. What came to the. What made you pick Donovan Mitchell in the long run? Like, what was the one that was. What was hard about that one in your eyes?

[Raja Bell]

What was hard was that I think Darius Garland, by some measures, is having the better overall season. But Donovan Mitchell is clearly their lead guard and their lead playmaker. The lead scorer, like, Garland's got a high. Like, his efficiency is. Is just overall at a higher level. But I think part of that is because he has the. The benefit of playing alongside Donovan Mitchell, who's. Who's kind of got to be the driving force of the show every night. But I considered Garland over Mitchell and I went with Mitchell, but I did not really consider anybody else that seriously. Like, I wasn't gonna go. It's a pretty big drop off. Like, Lillard's worth considering, but like, Trey Young, maybe.

[Logan Murdoch]

Trey Young. Trey Young.

[Raja Bell]

Ish.

[Logan Murdoch]

Not as a starter. I'm sure Trey Young will get, like, picked as a. As a reserve. He. There's a chance he could get picked as a reserve.

[Raja Bell]

Our buddy Vinnie Goodwill went hard for Cade Cunningham when I chatted with him on his pod last week. And Cade's having a fight for Detroit.

[Logan Murdoch]

Are you saying if anyone harm for Detroit.

[Raja Bell]

I know. It's. I know.

[Logan Murdoch]

Is that something that you're telling me right now? I don't believe that. No evidence suggests that that's actually a thing that he does.

[Raja Bell]

Cade's worthy. Like, if anybody wants to make a case for Cade as a starter, I'm not going to dispute it. Like, I feel comfortable that Brunson and Mitchell are the two best choices there. But Cade's got a case.

[Logan Murdoch]

What was the hardest. What was the hardest decision? Because I feel like the guard, at least from public perception and what we've got the most scrutinized quadrant has been the Eastern Conference guards. I think everything else is pretty straightforward. I think the fans did a pretty good job otherwise. I don't think that there was like any drop off. Is there any. Anything that gave you pause in any of the other quadrants?

[Raja Bell]

Yeah, like the fans went in the front court. In the, in the east they went Giannis, Tatum and Towns, which is exactly what I did. There wasn't much to debate there, you know, oh, is Evan Mobley worthwhile? Like most of most of the front court guys in the east who you normally would consider are either banged up or have other stuff going on. Like Palo and Wagner are hurt and Embiid's hurt and Paul George hasn't played enough of the season and he hasn't played all that well. And Jimmy Butler is doing Jimmy Butler things. So like there weren't like it almost made it easy in the east on the front court because so many guys are just. You just had to put a line through them. The west, like Curry. Curry over Anthony Edwards was. Was my final decision there.

[Logan Murdoch]

But like, what made you do that? Because that's pretty. That is hard because like Curry's had a hard season, man. Like, and I get why he's number two in guards. But like there's been, there's been some really good performances. But like based on what we talked about in the previous, in the previous section, like, there's been some duds too over the simple fact that like he's getting quintuple teamed.

[Raja Bell]

Yeah, look, I don't know.

[Logan Murdoch]

Like, it's hard but he has to be there because it's the Bay. And I get why people want to stuff the ballot for Curry, but like he hasn't had a great season. By Steph standard.

[Raja Bell]

By Steph standards, no. But by other guard standards, like so first of all, this, this would be Shea and Luka easily if Luka hadn't been hurt for the last month. So let's be clear there, that that second guard spot should I should be Luka in a season where he's healthy, but he's not healthy after that. Like, look at the fan vote, right? So Steph is as of last Thursday was. Was second in the fan vote. Luca, despite the injury, is third. And then it's Kyrie who's had a decent season. But like not spectacular popularity. That's a popularity thing. But. And then Anthony Edwards is fifth. James Harden, John Morant again, Jaws missed a ton of games. Darren Fox, Devin Booker, Norm Powell, like that's the top 10 in the fan vote. It's not like there were a ton of great choices there when you. When you're weighing everything. So to me, it came down to Steph and Anthony Edwards. Steph's had a. A better season. I. I think by. By pretty good measure statistically. And again, especially when it comes to efficiency, true shooting percentage, effective field goal percentage, and any other measure you want to apply, I think Steph's having the better overall season, and it's not like the Timberwolves are blowing anybody's doors off either. So this was not a vote for him because the All Star Games in the bay or anything like that. This is like, I think Steph's legitimately given this field right now, and given Luca being out, Steph's legitimately the second best to Shay.

[Logan Murdoch]

Question for you. If Luca was, like, played all the games, right, and Luka gets voted in as a starter, do you think that means Steph is coming off the bench in his home? Like, in this home region? You think somebody would have gave him a starting spot?

[Raja Bell]

I know we don't want to go to. We don't want to veer into this discussion yet, but the fact is there's going to be three All Star teams of eight players each, plus the rookie software.

[Logan Murdoch]

Oh, God, you're right. Sorry.

[Raja Bell]

Which means that Steph is still going to start for one of those three teams. But I know you don't want to. We're.

[Logan Murdoch]

I'm gonna hold it. I'm gonna hold off myself for a couple weeks. I'm gonna just start it by saying.

[Raja Bell]

Yeah, we're gonna fight. We're gonna fight over that. We're gonna fight over that one.

[Logan Murdoch]

Anyways, Western Conference, front court. What were your thoughts on that?

[Raja Bell]

So, all right, so Jokic was an obvious shoe in, right? Wembanyama is obvious at this point, too, by the way. Like, yes, there's, like, the only knock on Wembanyama. The only potential knock could be either their record. They're, like, three games under.500 at the moment, or, I don't know. He shoots too many threes for a guy who's 7 4.

[Logan Murdoch]

Like, fine with these 1970 takes. Like, yeah, exactly.

[Raja Bell]

Enough already, people.

[Logan Murdoch]

Victor Wembanyama can do whatever the hell he wants.

[Raja Bell]

Wemby is just right. Literally, Wemby can do whatever he want. Do you know he's. I looked at the greatest player of.

[Logan Murdoch]

All time through two years. Yes, I'm aware.

[Raja Bell]

He's averaging four blocks a game. Do you know who the last player and year to average four blocks a game? In the NBA.

[Logan Murdoch]

Dennis Rodman, 1990.

[Raja Bell]

Right. Or actually.

[Logan Murdoch]

Oh, is it a Kim Olajuwon?

[Raja Bell]

No.

[Logan Murdoch]

Dikembe Mutombo.

[Raja Bell]

There you go. Billy Legend in 95. 96. Only nine other players in history have averaged four blocks a game. And of course, that. That only goes back to 73. 74, because that's when they started tracking blocks.

[Logan Murdoch]

Can I pick those ones? Can I try to pick those ones? You get the other ones.

[Raja Bell]

Oh, all right.

[Logan Murdoch]

Can you see? If you let me.

[Raja Bell]

It's. It's on my. It's on my screen right now. So name the other players who have averaged. Again, it's only since 1973. 74, when the league.

[Logan Murdoch]

So the last one to do it was recording blocks was Dikembe Mutombo in 96.

[Raja Bell]

That's correct. He also did it in 93. 94. So when I say only nine others, I mean none other players. Not. Not seasons, because some guys did it multiple times.

[Logan Murdoch]

Okay, Can I. Can I. Can I guess? I don't really. I just like this extra NBA history. All right? Bill Russell was. Was. He was retired by 73, so that doesn't count.

[Raja Bell]

Well, also, they weren't tracking blocks in Bill Russell's time, so if they did.

[Logan Murdoch]

It would start nuts. Kareem.

[Raja Bell]

Kareem makes the list twice. He averaged four blocks a game in 78, 79, and again. Or excuse me, 78, 79, and also in 75, 76. So, yeah, Kareem did it twice.

[Logan Murdoch]

Manute Bowl.

[Raja Bell]

Manute Bowl. Great call. Manute Bowl. Averaged 4.3 for your Golden State warriors in 1988-89 before Logan Murdoch.

[Logan Murdoch]

My goal is day warriors before.

[Raja Bell]

Before Logan Murdoch was born.

[Logan Murdoch]

I'm feeling lucky right now. You see me, Cliff? I'm out here shining, bro.

[E]

We need more trivia on here, man.

[Bomani Jones]

Oh, wait.

[Logan Murdoch]

We need more trivia.

[E]

We need more trivia.

[Raja Bell]

Bull also did it twice, by the way. He also averaged five blocks a game in 85. 86.

[Logan Murdoch]

Okay, how about. Okay, okay, okay, okay, okay. How about. How about Ralph Sampson?

[Raja Bell]

Ralph Sampson does not make the list.

[Logan Murdoch]

Damn it. Damn it. Damn it. That was. Okay, all right. Let me get, like, a couple more to see how I'm doing. Okay, so that's the first one. And I haven't got.

[Raja Bell]

You named one of them earlier by accident.

[Logan Murdoch]

Dennis. Robin. No, he wasn't a shot blocker, though.

[E]

Is it Dream? Is it Dream?

[Logan Murdoch]

Akeem. Okay, okay.

[Raja Bell]

Akeem did it three times. 89.90919.

[Logan Murdoch]

How many did I have? Do I have, like, four? How many do. I do. I've got Kareem.

[Raja Bell]

You've got Kareem. Manute, Dikembe and Akeem have been named so far. There are still 1, 2, 3, 4 others.

[Logan Murdoch]

4. Cliff. You can also help if you want to chime in on this one, Howard.

[E]

All right, I got two in mind. Are they white guys?

[Raja Bell]

Are they white guys?

[Logan Murdoch]

One is Sean Bradley.

[Raja Bell]

No. Great guess, but no.

[E]

Wait, is it. Is it Lambert?

[Raja Bell]

No.

[E]

Damn.

[Logan Murdoch]

Hold on. Is it? Hold on, hold on. One more. I'm thinking white guys right now. I'm trying to go white guy. Is it? Who's the dude from the Grizzlies? Big country. Was it? Big country?

[Raja Bell]

No, it was not, Brian.

[Logan Murdoch]

Okay.

[Raja Bell]

You're gonna kick yourself, guys.

[Logan Murdoch]

All right, who is it? Steve Oster.

[Bomani Jones]

Tag.

[E]

Is it Oster Tech?

[Logan Murdoch]

God, no.

[Raja Bell]

Shaq would kill you just for. Just for even saying that. Mark Eaton, fellas. Mark Eaton.

[E]

I was going to get that. I was.

[Raja Bell]

Four times.

[E]

Yeah. I wouldn't have gotten that.

[Raja Bell]

Mark Eaton averaged 5.6 blocks per game in the 1984 season.

[Logan Murdoch]

That's like that. How many.

[E]

How many games did he play?

[Raja Bell]

82.

[E]

Oh, he played the whole stand.

[Logan Murdoch]

That is like when you tell people that Scott Skiles at the assist record, it's just like, oh, yeah, right. For sure. Okay.

[Raja Bell]

Except. Except, except Scott sky has like a one time, almost fluky one game record, and Mark Eaton averaged better than four blocks a game four times in his career.

[Logan Murdoch]

I'm talking about what the streets think of as trivia, man. Nobody was ever going to get that in the barbershop, my guy. That's not going to.

[Raja Bell]

You're. You're missing. Wait, you're still missing four guys who made the list of at least four blocks a game in a. In a season.

[Logan Murdoch]

Tim Kawakami on Twitter.

[Raja Bell]

He's well exceeding four blocks.

[E]

Yo, Dave Robinson.

[Raja Bell]

David Robinson did it. Four and a half blocks a game. In 91, 92, you were still missing three. Three other players, one of whom you absolutely should get. The other two, little tough.

[E]

Absolutely should get.

[Logan Murdoch]

Dennis Rodney Parish, Robert Parrish.

[Raja Bell]

No. Great guess, but no. Are you gonna tell you?

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah, go ahead. Go ahead. All right, Go ahead.

[Raja Bell]

Patrick Ewing is the one you should have gotten four blocks a game in 1989-90.

[E]

Yeah.

[Raja Bell]

Tree Rollins in 1982-83, 4.3 blocks a game for Atlanta. And Elmore Smith, 4.9 blocks a game. We weren't getting that.

[Logan Murdoch]

One. When did you do that? What? Did he do that one? I didn't even know he played for the Lakers. What year was that?

[Raja Bell]

73.74.

[Logan Murdoch]

Oh, they were doing tape delay. That was tape delay years. We were not even.

[Raja Bell]

Also the first year of recorded blocks.

[Logan Murdoch]

Okay, we weren't. We weren't watching. I don't think anyone was watching. Did CBS have the rights? Games were playing at 1 in the morning. Right.

[Raja Bell]

Even I wasn't watching back then. I was in kindergarten garden or something.

[Logan Murdoch]

That was fun, man. Speaking. That was good. Okay, speaking of trivia, let's. Cliff, mailbag time. Let's.

[E]

Let's mailbag time.

[Logan Murdoch]

Are there. Wait. Question before we get to anything because. Because let me just. Let me just dip behind the curtain a little bit about who. How we like our questions. I personally do not like questions given to me beforehand and Howard does, which is something that we figured out pre pod. But what I would like to know is, is there any. Because. So Cliff sent because of Howard's preference, which I get. We. We have. We have nipped that in the bud. Howard will just get the questions beforehand. I don't want anything to do with him. My question though, I like to prepare.

[Raja Bell]

Because Cliff tell you.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah, because Cliff, I like spontaneity. But are there any questions that you haven't sent it to or have you only sent us all the questions that.

[E]

Yeah, I've sent all the questions that were worth it. There. There hasn't been any new ones since the show began, since we started recording here. So I didn't have.

[Logan Murdoch]

I have read all three of them like, so I don't really remember. So let's, let's. Let's get to it.

[E]

You want to do this first one by Ben Hayes got really inspired for some reason. At least four of these are good. I think this. No, no.

[Logan Murdoch]

So here's.

[E]

So here's the subject bar.

[Logan Murdoch]

Read the whole thing.

[E]

All right, here's the subject bar. Top 10 reasons LaMelo Ball should be an All Star game. And so he gives the 10 reasons. So he gives the 10 reasons, right? Ben Hayes gives us 10 reasons and then he'll. He goes from 10 to 1. So here's 10 tweaker will be in this year's All Star game theme song. LaVar Ball might do something crazy enough to take the focus off the game. Number eight is it means the fans aren't voting for Bronny James. Number seven. Now we know who artificial intelligence is ideal for a basketball player. Looks like number six. Sneak preview of San Antonio eventually swindling the Hornets for a by low on LaMelo to throw lobs to Wimby I'm a Spurs fan. Number five, it's actually the players getting bots to vote as a passive aggressive dig at Adam's silver. Number four, it's the fans who are frustrated with the exit players saying, back in my day we hung files on our clotheslines. Number three, someone has a vendetta against Steve Clifford. Number two, LaMelo is actually the platonic ideal of a player in a modern All Star game. And number one, most players D up in real games then half asset in the all star game. The NBA is hoping LaMelo zags and brings the defensive intensity and competitiveness back.

[Logan Murdoch]

That's great. That's awesome. What do you have to say?

[E]

Shout out to Ben Hayes.

[Logan Murdoch]

That was really good, Howard. That was really good.

[Raja Bell]

All right.

[Logan Murdoch]

I have no notes on that one. What was your favorite one though? Because I have the email. What was your favorite reason?

[Raja Bell]

My favorite reason was Lavar Ball will be there then distract everybody from the actual game. That's by far the best one.

[Logan Murdoch]

I think the most Howard centric one is someone has a vendetta against Steve Clifford because I just replaced that with Howard Beck. I can't wait to sit next to Howard Beck at the fucking All Star game. I hope Lamelo gets in. I just forgot for that. Just to see the face. Ah, this is terrible.

[Raja Bell]

I don't think Lamello is going to make it as a starter, but I am curious to see if the coaches choose him. He's only made one other all star team, which actually I was surprised to see. Like I like those in 22.

[E]

He's been hurt all the time though, so that's probably why he's been.

[Raja Bell]

He's been hurt a bunch. And yeah, the fact the Hornets have not been good probably has hurt him a bit and there's always been a lot of good guards but. But I was trying to do the math earlier to see like where it's going to fall. I think he might make it, but I'm not sure if he will assuming he doesn't make it as a starter. I'm not sure if the coaches are choosing.

[Logan Murdoch]

I think that the bots one is hilarious and it's also. Players would be petty enough to do that shit. They have enough money to like. It's nothing to give bots to go just to.

[Raja Bell]

Dude. The players can't even get their own fucking ballots right. They don't. They're not putting any time There is. The bots will do a better job than the players. The players do it. The players. Players voting is a show.

[Logan Murdoch]

Howard there's one super nerd in every locker room that could do this. There's one at least in every locker room that could run.

[E]

Running up All Star votes like, like music artists do streams is crazy. Like, that's actually insane.

[Logan Murdoch]

If there was any locker room that would do it, though, Howard. I think it's the Charlotte Hornets. If there was any locker room, that would be like, yo, bro. Because they got two rappers on the team. All right, anyways, what's the next question?

[Raja Bell]

That was good. That was great. Well done.

[E]

All right, so ran against stats by Ethan. He says, hey, guys, love the pod. Been a listener since day one. Shot the Logan dad mode. Raja and Howard held it down, but we've been missing. You stat nerds are taking the L this season. Specifically Howard's rant against Lamelo as an All Star. Everyone knows that he's not the best guard in Eastern Conference, but Lamelo is for the people all caps. He's young and putting up empty stats, but watching him play is a joy. And the creativity he brings with his passing and dribbling package add to the sport of basketball as an art. And like Raja said, averaging 29 Ain't nothing to sneeze at, even if he's chucking. As for whether he's a winning player, let him expand his game to its limits so he can naturally learn where to pull back. No one says a thing when we all pretend like Wimby's 74 shooting three, it's a smart shot. Say the full thing.

[Logan Murdoch]

What do you say? No, what do you say? Say the full thing.

[E]

I'm reading. All right. No one says a thing when we all pretend like Wemby's 74 ass shooting a 3 is the smartest choice because we know if he can, that will benefit him later. If the entire All Star roster was like this, then yeah, that would suck. But it's not. And having him on the team would be indicative of the culture of basketball this year. The NBA is a star driven league, and there should be no problem with allowing one of its most fun stars to be on a big stage. Shout out to the group. Love you guys. Keep doing what you're doing, E. Shout.

[Logan Murdoch]

Out to Howard for getting cooked, for being right.

[Raja Bell]

I mean, he opened by basically saying he's I'm right. He said, quote, everyone knows he's not the best guard in the Eastern Conference. That was the problem. He's number one in voting as of last week. That was why I started the ramp.

[Logan Murdoch]

The best part of this is, Bruh said the Wimby part.

[E]

Wemby74 Ash, because he's, he's also.

[Raja Bell]

What the fuck does Wimby have anything to do with Lamelo Ball?

[E]

I think, I think what he's trying to reference, I was just like, the. Stylistically, it doesn't look normal, right? Like, Lamelo is just kind of all over the place with his dribbling and kind of playing and one basketball in the NBA, whereas Wimby's 74 should be in the paint all the damn time. Probably get a bucket every time, right?

[Raja Bell]

That's not today's NBA. So, like, you want to go on set and, like, replace Shaq and Charles with your rants about, oh, seven footers got to get their butts down in the post. Great, guys. That's phenomenal. We got plenty of that shit already.

[Logan Murdoch]

Wait, wait, what's your, what's your, what, is that your Shaq impression or is that your.

[Raja Bell]

I don't even know.

[Logan Murdoch]

That was like some sort of Shaq Barkley, like, European hybrid.

[Raja Bell]

I, I, I, I think I somehow, like, merged them for a moment there unintentionally.

[Logan Murdoch]

You need to get your ass out there in the post.

[Raja Bell]

Like, that's not, that's just. It ain't today's NBA. I'm sorry. Wimby's allowed to shoot threes. Does he shoot too many? Yes. But guess what? He's still not shooting nearly as many as Lamelo is. And Wemby's actually impacting winning by playing defense and leading the league in block shots. Of being the first guy since the Kim Mutombo in 1995. 96, averaging four game. Like, let's not even start comparing Wimy's value versus Lamelos. Come on.

[Logan Murdoch]

Phenomenal voice control from Howard Bank. Yo, the other thing is, I was watching the, the Warriors Boston game yesterday. Boston put up like, 48 threes, and that wasn't even the highest on the, on the of the night. Warriors put up 53. Jesus.

[Raja Bell]

Welcome to 2025. People, like, get used to it. All right, Listen, I don't, I don't, I don't know what our. What's our, what's our guy's name again? Ethan. The letter? Yeah, yeah, the email.

[Logan Murdoch]

I'm not gonna lie. I kind of got scared when I saw Ethan. I was like, oh, this dude. Jesus. I was like, I was so scared when I saw this email. I was like, I got it at 6am and I'm like, oh, I'm finishing the peloton ride. And I see, See, this is, this is why?

[Raja Bell]

This is why Logan can't get. This is why Logan doesn't need. Doesn't want preview. It might scare him unnecessarily. Appreciate the. Appreciate the email, Ethan. Appreciate the thought.

[Logan Murdoch]

Other Ethan.

[Raja Bell]

Other Ethan, appreciate you actually acknowledging right off the top that Lamello is not the best guard in the Eastern Conference. I don't know what him being quote for the people means. If it's about being entertaining.

[Logan Murdoch]

Cool.

[Raja Bell]

Sure. Great. Yes, valid take. All Star games are there for entertainment purposes, among other things. But it is also for posterity and resume building. And like it matters who starts in the All Star Game and it matters.

[Logan Murdoch]

Who racks up All Stars popularity contest, man. And he's one of the most popular dudes there.

[Raja Bell]

If it were truly just that, Logan, the fans would still have 100% of the vote and they don't. So look, I'm. I'm much more. I would just. But I credit Ethan for making this point in that there's a much more compelling argument for Lamelo being a good All Star choice based on his entertainment value and the fact that he's fun. He is fun. I'm not arguing that. But that's a much better argument than some of the stupidity that I've been getting on social media since last week's show about people trying to make the case for why Lamelo is actually better than I'm giving him credit for or it's really just all his teammates fault or what. Like there's no excuse for shooting 24 times a game and 13 threes a game when you're not that good of a shooter. Like. Like at some point you got to reel it in. Especially when you're the point guard and you're the best player on the team. You are supposed to help facilitate and create for other guys. Like I just. It's not a winning formula. And it's not to say he never will will be a better player or more winning player or will have better teammates that will enable him to do that. I didn't bury them. The guy I just said this is not a winning formula and he's not playing a winning style and he's not a deserving All Star starter. So all of which I stand by.

[Logan Murdoch]

You hear that? Do you hear that in the distance? That's a call. That's a siren from the fun police that is out. Wait.

[Raja Bell]

Fine. Put him in the All Star Game. I don't care. Hey yo, I'm barely going to watch anyway.

[Logan Murdoch]

God forbid he gets MVP of the All Star Game because Roger's Howard's head is going to fucking explode. Yo.

[Raja Bell]

I won't. I won't care.

[Logan Murdoch]

This is comparable, though, honestly. Like, if this was a full game, we'll get my full thoughts again, you know, a few weeks. This is a full game. This is comparable to like 2014 Kyrie Irving all Star pick where, like, he's just, like, just cooking people because he's perfect. He's a perfect All Star game player. He's going to shake the shit out of. He was going to throw some lobs. He's going to, like, do the eye goggles. He's going to like, you go do a Harlem shake in the middle of.

[E]

The court and not play a lick of defense either. Yeah, like he is.

[Logan Murdoch]

You are right.

[E]

You are absolutely right.

[Logan Murdoch]

Never mind, man. Let's go to the next question, dog.

[E]

All right, let's get to this last question here from Trevor, fellas. Spurs have not been great since around Christmas after a promising start to the season. However, thanks to the Warriors, Suns and Wolves all kind of sucking, they remain firmly in the play. And Hunt, considering how good and competitive Wemby already is, not to mention CP3's competitiveness, is there a move they can make at the deadline to make a mini leap? Cam Johnson maybe feels like Wemby is already too good to just sit tight for the rest of the season. Trevor in Sacramento. Shout out to UC Davis.

[Raja Bell]

Oh, yeah.

[Logan Murdoch]

Go Eggs. Go Eggs.

[Raja Bell]

Nice. Nice.

[Logan Murdoch]

Hey, say F. Sac State right here on the pod. Say FX State right here on the pod. Right here on the pod. Shout out to my people in Sacramento. Shout out to all my people in Sacramento. You know what I mean? You know what it is? Shout out. Shout out. Oak Park. Shout out West Sac. Shout out. Day Thomas. Shout out to.

[E]

Shout out to Grant High School as an East Coaster. Before we get into that question about the spurs, like, what's the beef between UC Davis and Sac State? Like, is that a thing?

[Logan Murdoch]

It's called the Causeway Classic.

[Raja Bell]

We're rivals. We're rivals. It's UC Davis is on one side of the causeway that's a section of I 80. Sac State or Sacramento's on the other side of it. They were once way back in the dark ages, when I was in college. Sac State and UC Davis were briefly in the same conference together when they were both Division 2. And they're just. They're like, reach. It's a regional rivalry. And the football, when they play each other in football, it's called the Causeway classic. UC Davis beat Sac State. Like, I don't know, 25 years in a row or something, so it wasn't even really a rivalry.

[Logan Murdoch]

Also, let's be real, man. UC Davis had the better party. So shout out UC Davis when we go out there.

[E]

For all of us, it's gonna be our first time in the bay, so I'm excited to see what it's crack. What's cracking out there.

[Logan Murdoch]

It's gonna be all right, man. You know, it's gonna be chill. It's gonna be fine.

[E]

You gotta show me something. You gotta show me something while I'm out there, bro.

[Logan Murdoch]

I'll pull up. I'll show you all that. What the hell? Anyways, what was the question? Spurs, right?

[E]

Yeah.

[Logan Murdoch]

No, no, no, I got the Spurs.

[E]

Okay.

[Logan Murdoch]

I'll say. Okay, so me and Howard talked about this briefly, like, before the pod, I think, Cliff. I think it was the free pod meeting, so.

[E]

Yes.

[Logan Murdoch]

No, they shouldn't. They shouldn't make a deal right now. They should just, like, let it happen a little bit more organically right now. Like, me and Raja and Howard always talk about pushing the button and also pushing the button too early. That's a thing. And by pushing the button, I mean trading for a veteran, trading for somebody to play alongside them, kind of let it happen naturally. Let's see what. I think we're in the. In the stage where. Let's just see what Wimby does by himself right now. Let's just see what he does. There's no other guy, really. I feel like if you trade for somebody, right, it's kind of forcing it right now. If you trade for, like, a star, like, you're not going to put Jimmy Butler on this team. Let it kind of happen organically. You're seeing that happen with Houston. Like, I think there was a. Speaking of Sam Amick, like, you know, he picked an okay school, but he's a better reporter than, you know, would suggest for a school. Damn. No, I'm just playing shout out. Ryan Coogler, who is also a SAC State grad, but he had an interview Amig did with. With Ma Udoka that was really good. Where he basically. Where Ma talked about the pursuit of James Harden, and he told James Harden, like, go pursue a championship. We're not ready for it right now. Essentially. I'm paraphrasing, but that's essentially what Ma told Amy. And I see that right here with the San Antonio Spurs. Like, they're not. They're not ready to contend right now. They're learning how to do that right now, and so is Wimby. And I think that like if any, any button pressing would kind of mess up that process that's organically already happening.

[Raja Bell]

I don't think it'll mess it up Logan, but I'm with you. Like I don't think they should make a move but it's mostly because Wimby's only in his second year. He's 21. He's still kind of learning what his, his abilities are. And yeah, if you threw another, if you threw an all star like a veteran mid career veteran right next to him right now, would it secure the spurs as if not a top six playoff team at least like a play in team that has a chance to, to grab one of the last two playoffs. Like yeah, they might get that anyway by the way but you don't have to hit the gas right now. Like he's, he's only in his second year. You've got all the time in the world and you don't want to play that card forever. You don't want to be overly patient but like you can be patient right now. Stefan Castle Rookie point cards looking pretty damn good in spots but he's not quite ready yet. They've got like interesting pieces like Bissell and Sohan and Keldon Johnson. Like I don't know what this is all going to become but they don't have to make the playoffs this year. If they do, it's great, it's great experience for all the young guys but there's no desperation to like prove to Wemby that we can build a contender around you when he's only in year two. So no, by the way, the spurs had, I was looking this up earlier because they, they, they broke this streak but they had like a 10 year streak or something of like never making an in season trade. They're not a mid season trade team. They're not a like let's go get a guy at the deadline team. They have made some minor moves in the last few years. Nothing overly dramatic. I don't expect they're going to make some big dramatic move in the middle of this season either. I think you let this go, let this ride, see where it falls, see if you make the play in or maybe make the playoffs when we get some postseason experience. You reevaluate where you are in the summer. Maybe Chris Paul is retiring and you're now trying to figure out like is Stefan Castle ready to like take this over? Who else can you add? They've got, I think they're top three for most picks. I Think it's them, the Thunder and the Nets who have the most picks to work with. So like when the spurs are ready, they got a lot of tools to make a deal, but they don't, they don't need to do it right now.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah, we're in agreeance here. We're in agreement. What do you think? Cliff.

[Raja Bell]

Thinks they should trade Wendy to the Sixers?

[Logan Murdoch]

No, but forget Wemby. I got questions for you. How are you doing after this weekend, buddy?

[E]

Look, my birds, man, fly, Eagles fly, you know, NFC championship game, getting it cracking. I don't know about that.

[Logan Murdoch]

That was a little stressful though, brother. That was really stressful.

[E]

I was at the game, I was at the game, it was freezing cold. I had my shiesty on. I mean, they said I was bad luck going into the game, but we came out victorious. It was a little bit more stressful than it had to be.

[Logan Murdoch]

Were you living up to all the Philly stereotypes at that game?

[E]

No, I don't live up to the Philly stereotypes. Cause that's dangerous. That's dangerous. Philly stereotypes is. They beat people a lot. They beat people up, you know what I mean? They harass people. None of that was happening. I was outside in 20 degree weather kicking it with some friends and family. A lot of fans of the Philly Special Pop, which everybody should be listening to. Pulled up, you know, we had fun, shook some hands.

[Logan Murdoch]

Are you scared of Jaden Daniels, sir?

[E]

No, not one bit. We got Jalen Hurts. We got Saquon Barkley. We got our stout defense. We ready to rock, baby. We ready to go back to the bowl. Can't wait.

[Logan Murdoch]

Hey, Cliff the producer. Clip that and keep that for next week. All right?

[E]

So if there's a famous last words.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah, yeah, famous last words. We're gonna, we're gonna, we're gonna start the pod with that one if everything goes awry. Because hey, the commandos are out here anyways. The Kabomani Jones in a second.

[Howard Beck]

This episode is brought to you by. Indeed, the successful season starts with picking the right players for your team. Like with the Boston Celtics, they've been able to put together a pretty good roster. Pretty deep superstar driven, two way players. They've got it right. And so if you want to hire the best players for your business and quickly, you need indeed, their sponsored jobs help you stand out and reach relevant candidates faster. Plus, with indeed sponsored jobs, there are no monthly subscriptions, no long term contracts, and you only pay for results. There's no need to wait any longer. Speed up your Hiring right now with Indeed. Listeners of the show will get a $75 sponsored job credit to get your jobs more visibility@ Indeed.com RingerMBA that's Indeed.com RingerMBA right now and support our show by saying you heard about Indeed on this podcast. Indeed.comringer MBA terms and conditions apply. Hiring Indeed is all you need.

[Logan Murdoch]

This episode is supported by State Farm. Man, I remember when I first got into a car accident, it was pure frustration because I did not have State Farm. And now that I do have State Farm, it is an exclamation of pure joy. But the only words that you need to remember are like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. State Farm has options to fit your unique insurance needs, meaning you can talk to your agent to choose the coverage you need, have coverage options to protect the things you value most, file a claim right on the State Farm mobile app, and even reach a real person when you need to talk to someone. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there. Learn more@state farm.com Bomani Jones of the Right Time with Bomani Jones Fame I wanted to get you in here because we're recording this a few days before the inauguration and I wanted to get you in here to talk about just the evolution of how players use their voice in on social issues. And I guess we'll start there, right? Like, what has been the biggest difference you've seen from players? I'm using this in air quotes, by the way, using their voice from the first Trump administration to now as we're going into the second one. What are the differences and similarities in the pros and cons?

[Bomani Jones]

I mean, I think the difference is stark. I don't really be hearing it that much no more. Like maybe I'm not hanging out in the right places anymore. That's entirely possible. Like, I try to be very careful about using absolutes and saying things like ain't nobody talking about it no more. But at least not anywhere that I've seen. I don't it hasn't been that loud from athletes. But the point that I've always made about this that I think gets lost is rarely, if ever, is the athlete moving out of step with the larger society. And I don't think the largest society has the same sustained energy for pushback against Trump that it had eight years ago. You know, but like, in terms of what the players are going to do, I guess it's also fair to say, let's see what happens as an administration goes. Like, it's one thing when you're talking about this during an election. But as the administration went with Trump, the pressure stayed on Trump the last go round. This time the administration is about to start. Now, I don't think that it's going to be pressure, anything close to what it was from anybody the last time that we did this. But now is kind of when the clock starts. And if somebody's going to do something like what. What would be a precipitating factor to make people jump up again to see if people can come anywhere near, like, having the energy that they had before.

[Logan Murdoch]

That's the interesting part that I always think about is the fatigue level, right. I think, I don't think people realize people see the slogans, the chants and the marches and a lot of things that go into this, but they don't see the energy that is exerted when you are talking about a movement, especially a movement the size of what happened in the summer of 2020. Right. And these are athletes with day jobs and things like that. And I don't believe that people realize the sacrifice that is going that that really goes on when you're talking about a grassroots level movement. Do you think that these players just got up and were like, man, I dipped my toe in this in 2020 and even beyond that, right? Because you talk about the Colin Kaepernick, you talk about what happened in the NFL, but do you think there's a fatigue level of like, I went through this and I dipped my toe into this and I just don't want to exert that energy anymore in the way that I did in 2020?

[Bomani Jones]

Well, I mean, that's certainly possible, but I think it probably comes more down to I don't feel the way that I felt then. Right. Like 2020. The question that I had always, as 2020 went, and I think the answer has become clear, but the question was whether it was a movement or a moment. And it is very clear that it was a moment, it was not a movement. And there were things that were done and there was some furniture that was moved around, but a whole lot of that right back where it was in the first place now, isn't it? Right. Like, it was like the ability to keep that going wasn't there. But it was a mo. A moment that had to do with the social circumstances, but also a nation that was largely under the restrictions of a burgeoning pandemic. People who couldn't go places. Like, it was so tight and people were so mad that white people was on the team for like a good six to Eight weeks. Like they was there, they stuck around like, like it was a, it was like a short term lease, but they was in the neighborhood. Like they was living there for a little bit. That time itself, I think was so special. Or, and I say, I mean special in the sense of unique and then carried over into an election and then we went from there. I don't think that things are landing with people the same way. I think a lot of the things that we talked about keep it in mind that 2020, I would make the argument was really kind of the culmination, not just of what the pushback was against Trump, but Trayvon Martin is killed in February of 2012, and Mike Brown, I believe that's August of 2014. Like this, the sustained energy of all of that stuff went. And it would make sense if after eight years of that, people were just a little bit tired. Right. Like, it's not like the police stopped killing black people, but we did before or about it international. Yeah, but, but we did stop talking about it, you know, in a national way. And I'm not judging people for the fact that they stopped talking about it. I'm just pointing out that sometimes you just lose the energy of those things.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah, yeah. And I think we've seen that. But also I think that even on the other side of it, right, like on 2020, the, it was interesting because you started seeing the commodification of protest in a lot of ways, right. Especially with leagues, you saw that, you know, NBA was basically like, yeah, we'll do whatever it takes for y'all to get back on this court and let's make this money real quick, right? We'll put anything you want on there that's largely not there anymore. You know, talk about political pressure. You talk about things that have, that have gone on in the administration. This administration right now. You even talk about, you see Trump right now where he is just going at the Amazons and these other places and they're like, you know what? You were right. We're going to be on your side now. It's not the same political climate as it was. So like, I guess I'm thinking about, you know, maybe months and years down the line, but like, what, what do you think is going to happen if, say, Trump goes at a league again, like he does in the NFL, or he specifically goes at the NBA, which is looked at as such this liberal league, even though they took away the slogans before the NFL did, Like, where, where are we? Where is, what's, what's going to happen when there is a inevitable Trump. I'm going at a league, I'm going at these players are, do you think the leagues are going to have the players backs in the way that they at least showed that they did outwardly back in 2016 and 2017?

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah, I do because I don't know how much there is that Trump could really do to the leagues. Like what he could do to Amazon or Facebook is, or Meta, sorry, meta. But companies of that scope and that operate in many ways somewhat monopolistically. There's a lot that a president can do to make their lives hard. Right. It's a little bit different I think, when you start talking about these leagues. So I don't, I do believe that they'll have the, that they will have the players backs if such a thing happens. That hasn't been the culture war though, that Trump has been fighting this go round. Like, I don't know if this is, I don't know if he comes back to this, if this is one of the hits that's going to go over the same way that it did before. Like with one thing people talk about very often with middle, they say about generals is that generals are always fighting the last war. Right. I'm not sure how much the last war is going to prove itself to be reflective of what the direction is of this next war. I don't know that I do agree with you though that there is a fair question to ask about how tall people go stand in the face of what might happen with Trump. But I, I, I don't think that sports leagues are nearly as vulnerable as some of these other operations. Now the question becomes the individual interest of the owners themselves, whether that makes them want to stay on board with Trump or how this goes. But I don't, I don't know. I think there's arguments on both sides of this, but I don't think, I don't think that the leagues can afford to truly sell the players out.

[Logan Murdoch]

I do wonder though, right, because specifically with the NBA, like if a, there is a, if there is a Nick Bosa in the NBA somehow, right, who was very outspoken or with the current administration, even though, you know, we don't know what the political alignment of every single NBA player is. But I'm sure there's some that aligns with Trump in his policies. I mean, I'm sure there's more than one and it might be growing based on the exit polls of the last election. But how does the NBA mitigate that distraction? Because it's on one thing, it is cool to put your support behind maybe a protest that everyone in your league is supporting. But what about if it's on the other side where they have to mitigate that? Like someone. Oh, someone is just straight maga. How do they mitigate that part?

[Bomani Jones]

You can't do anything about that. Like, that is a mainstream political opinion. You're not really. There are ways in which you could deconstruct the platform, and somebody goes too far in one direction on a thing, and you can say that that thing is the issue. But, I mean, the majority of voters in America voted on that platform. It's very difficult to make the argument that you could go and, you know, tamp that down. Like, I don't know specifically how he feels about Trump, but I think somebody whose political platform kind of fits the description that you've offered is Jonathan Isaac. He over there being Jonathan Isaac. Don't nobody really care. You know what I mean? Like. Like, there's no. I don't think there's. I don't.

[Logan Murdoch]

I.

[Bomani Jones]

First of all, what. What a league can't do is ever appear that is shutting down someone's politics. Like, you can shut somebody down for being indecent. You can shut somebody down from committing one of many isms. You can do. You know, you have to kind of keep it on a level of principle in that way. But if it feels like that you're shutting down politics, you're in the wrong. You absolutely cannot win that.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah. Were you surprised at, like, the lack of support or at lack of endorsement on either side from the NBA during this last presidential election? Like, LeBron did it, but I was kind of curious when he was going to throw. I mean, I knew he kind of. His politics aligned with Kamala, but, like, I was really surprised that it took him that long to. To endorse her. And, you know, I know Kamala wasn't. She's not Obama in terms of just mass appeal. Right. She just wasn't that. I mean, the numbers suggest that, too. But were you surprised that a lot of players who seem to have their politics aligned her didn't really speak out, or at least a league that did, didn't by and large kind of rally around her?

[Bomani Jones]

That's interesting. I don't. I'm not sure. I think it's the difficulty for me in coming up with the answer on that is how little I care about who any of these people are going to endorse in the direction of voting. Right. And I hadn't really thought about it. Until you asked that question. Something I do find to be interesting is that, like, this was a pop culture phenomenon of an election also, like, normally that is the sort of thing that encourages famous people, if they just want to be part of the conversation, to jump into it. Right. And that didn't happen this go round. Like, I don't think that they were not as vocal as a league or anybody else, really. See, that's the thing. All of these things we're talking about, specific to them, I don't think are that much different than. No, I can't say that about the Harris thing though, because, I mean, people were definitely having something to say. Yeah, I guess I was surprised by that. Like, I, I, I hadn't really given it a whole lot of thought in the moment, but I guess it is a little bit surprising. And I don't know who had truly what to lose in that, you know, at that point. I don't like the league itself. Like the NBA, like Park Avenue, they kind of need to be separate from this. But what I, what I did find interesting, or at least it felt like, because I know when I've said these things, I'll hear from the NBA and they'll tell me about the things they've actually done. But you heard a lot more or it felt a lot louder around voter registration from the NBA in 2020 than it did in 2024. Right. Because, like, just the mere, the mere act of encouraging people to register and to vote serves every purpose that you're talking about with having. Without having to be explicitly partisan. And we had seen in, you know, in 2020, we're using arenas as election sites and all of those things. You just didn't hear as much about that this time. I don't know what did. I truly don't know what of that platform stuck around, you know, into 2024. I just know I didn't hear that much about it.

[Logan Murdoch]

You know, it's, you were talking about just the, even the voting. And the first thing that comes to mind is, is LeBron and that, you know, he was the face of more than a vote. He's not the face of it as I don't even think he's, he's leading the charge anymore. I think they, he, they see that Tineca. But he's kind of evolved in like, where he dips his toe in, in social issues now. Right. And I know there's a lot it has to do with the fact that he's a businessman and, you know, and things like that. He's kind of always been this sort of capitalist. But like where, where do you see his role in all of this, you know, going forward right now, right, because he is now him and Steph Curry, who has kind of used his voice, but they are kind of now the two voices, but they're getting older, right? Like, so, like where do they, where do they fit in all of this right now in terms of their voice.

[Bomani Jones]

You think, well, I mean, being older should be the point of giving them more gravity. Like, I mean, I personally don't care what a 25 year old thinks about any of this stuff. That'd be silly. Now maybe I would care about that if I was 18, but I would think that with some age that the point of you having something to say, you may not be as cool as you used to be, but your reach is probably as big, if not bigger than it ever had been. And your boys got a little more base to it. Like I would think that, that there would be the case. I don't like. LeBron's always tried to be a businessman. So I don't think any of that is different at this point. Like, to me that's not a, that's not a change if, you know, with LeBron ending up there. But I don't know what their place is because again, I'm the. I don't care. Like, I don't, I don't, I don't, I'm not, I'm not that interested in what either of them think about these things. So the role of the athlete to me is, is very dependent upon who the athlete is himself. Right. Like to me it's not just a general idea. You got to be a particular person with a particular insight and a particular set of cares, you know, particular set of concerns. I would say to get here, like, it is helpful for people, particularly on the left, who want athletes to have views because they feel like they can then get things that there's a whole bunch of people that wouldn't or wouldn't otherwise have to listen to it. And now if LeBron James says it now they do, right? But LeBron James also a lightning rod sort of figure who knows what happens after he gets out there and he does it, right? So I don't think there's any clear, easy answers about where either of those sorts, either of those do stand in this.

[Logan Murdoch]

It's just interesting how we like, we see athletes talking about, you know, these social issues, at least in this day and age. Because, you know, I don't know if there is A comparison to like, a lot of people like, to compare, you know, LeBron to, like, he's having his Muhammad Ali moment or he's having his Bill Russell moment or he's having all these moments. And I'm just like, well, them dudes really had something to lose. Like, they wasn't getting. They didn't have like this generational wealth. I think there's like a, there's a flowery, A flowery, like, way we, we, we pit them doing that. Like, and I feels like we're getting, you know, with a lot of the. When I talk about the commodification of protest, I feel like these guys are like, it's. I always see like these press releases in my email, like, well, you know, he's doing this social justice angle as well, right? Like, it seems like it's been that way. How do we get to, like, the grassroots of it all in a more organic way that I feel like we actually are doing it?

[Bomani Jones]

Well, I think. But I think it's silly to expect rich people to do grassroots things. Like, if you want to, like, if you want to speak to a major difference between this LeBron and LeBron of however many years ago is he's a lot richer now. Like, the things that he's thinking about are perhaps just a little bit different because his station in life is different. The people who typically do the grassroots stuff, one tend to be young, right? Like, when you look at the people that really kick the doors in and everything else, that's, that's the behavior of people in their 20s, old head supposed to be out here just kind of like giving you game. Like what LeBron James and cats like him at this point in their lives are supposed to be doing to help movements like these is giving people money. That is what they do. That's not the guy that's going to be marching in the streets. It's not going to be the guy that's setting things on fire. No, no, no. He's 40 years old. He's out of that window. You give people some bread to help him make some moves that, that would be a perfectly appropriate thing for a man like him to do, you know, But I don't. Very few people approach these things the same way that they did call it 10 or 15 years ago, no matter who they are.

[Logan Murdoch]

It's, it's funny though, because LeBron, like, like, he, he. I think he legitimately wants to be that face. Like when he hears the Muhammad Ali comparisons, I'm sure he's really, really excited I mean, I know he wants it.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah. I'm. I. I mean, it would serve the ego of anybody if you felt like the world was really saying that you're a Muhammad Ali now. What Muhammad Ali was doing at that time was just so much more of a revolutionary thing that, like, a public alignment with the Nation of Islam is something that LeBron James, no analog of that, would he ever do.

[Logan Murdoch]

No.

[Bomani Jones]

Period. And I say that with no judgment. That's not something he would ever do. The dynamics of a war and an actual defiance of the federal government, Right. Like, it's hard to have a true comparison to that right now. Okay. Honestly, with the defiance of the federal government like that. The closest Ali comp. Quietly is Bill Walton, who had to stave off the FBI being all up in his shit over who his friends were and those sorts of things. But with LeBron, nah, it's okay that he wasn't Muhammad Ali, but he was not Muhammad Ali. That is a very. That is a very superficial understanding of what Muhammad Ali meant in his time.

[Logan Murdoch]

What did you think of the LeBron, Kareem, and I say this in air quotes beef, right? Because I think that's a really good. Like, a really good look into generational ways of looking at the way the world is, right? Like, say what you want about Kareem, he's still in the streets. These subtexts are still coming. He is still talking that stuff that he was talking back in the day, right? But, like, what did you think about those two kind of clashing, even if it was for a few weeks, right? Like, what. What did you think of. Of those two and those two entities colliding?

[Bomani Jones]

Don't everybody like each other? And the world is not short on people who don't like Kareem Abdul Jabbar. I'm not saying it should or should not be that way. Like, Kareem dialed it up at the end when it was time, and LeBron passed him and he put on the good face or whatever. But that, I think, in both directions, one is not the other's kind of dude. I don't think that's necessarily generational. You know, Like, I think Kareem is his own kind of dude. LeBron is his own kind of dude. And they are coming from different spaces and times.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah, yeah. And I guess. And then go back to the league's point, right, where we talk about, you know, 2020 and the league's response to it. Do you think that the NBA has lived up to what, I guess the Internet would call itself or call it as like this woke left leaning progressive league. Because I think there's a lot of holes in that. Right. Like, I think there's a lot of. They were the first ones to kind of. They put the branding on, but they also were the first ones to take it off and be like, hey, we're going to kind of sit down the middle.

[Raja Bell]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

But I mean, so for me, to be fair, like, I thought that was a very smart thing for them to do was to take that stuff off because it had become distracting. Like, once people are thinking more about what's on the court than they are what's happening on the court, you got a bit of a problem. And that was a fair qu. That was a fair concern for them to have. They. They went a little over the top in their response, and that was because the players had them over a barrel. You were holding them hostage in Orlando and making them play basketball, and now they really mad and they say they ain't going out there. They. They had all the cards.

[Logan Murdoch]

You got to put the Kofies on and take that knee.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah. You got to do whatever it takes to get them dudes out there on the basketball court. Right. So, I mean, they had them in that time, but I don't. There's never been a time where it would be appropriate or actually true. This characterization of the left, the league is being like anything approaching being far left. Too many billions of dollars for that thing that would be far left. Those owners aren't terribly different than the NFL's owners. The only difference is the nature of a basketball roster gives the players, especially the really good players, more power than any players will ever have in football. And as a result, they can flex on the NBA a little bit about certain things and make things happen. Like the NBA. The culture of football is not black. The culture of basketball is like, you can't change that around. The tolerance of the fact that the culture of basketball is black leads people to see it as being this far left league. And I do think that there are some, what many will call progressive sensibilities that the league has publicly adopted, but I don't think that those progressive sensibilities that the league has adopted adopted are any different than the sensibilities of any major corporation of its time. Right. It's the same stuff. The NFL in its actual offices probably has a lot of the same stuff that they would say or they would employ, you know, employ. It's just that the football is not culturally black and basketball is.

[Logan Murdoch]

Well, is that the. Why there's such a difference in perception between the both leagues. Right. Because like NFL still has races end racism on their end zones. Right. And like be like, why is there such a difference in perception when one league doesn't have the insignia?

[Bomani Jones]

There's a, there's a, there's a difference between the court saying Black Lives Matter and the field saying it takes all of us.

[Logan Murdoch]

And racism too.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah, but yeah, those are, I mean they're, they're very anodyne statement this. Right. They're, they're, they're, they're, they're benign. They're not, they're not shaking the table. Okay. The NBA put Black Lives Matter on the floor. Because what you have to remember is there was a brief glimmer during that summer of 2020 where the phrase Black Lives Matter was polling positively over 50%.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

So they was riding a wave. The problem was that wave did not last as long as the bubble did. And after like if they had just done it for a couple of days, right. You know, a couple of games and then taking it down, it probably would have gone over better. But they couldn't do that. People was mad, right? Like it wasn't, that wasn't going to be enough. And for a brief, there's a brief moment in time where people thought that everything had changed. Lol.

[Logan Murdoch]

Where do you fall on the line of people saying like, oh, you know, that wokeness has killed the NBA rating. I think personally it's stupid. But like, where, why, why do, why does that even, why have, has that been able to grow so many legs with this particular league?

[Bomani Jones]

I mean, because it always is. The, the people who dislike the NBA are always looking for an excuse. So like it's going to be something you can only, you can only pay so much credence to when people try to ascribe those sorts of things because I mean, look around that league, man. I don't like, who are these people that we're talking about now? Like, start naming them. It's hard to come up with somebody that truly fits the description in a public way that would be offending these people who theoretically, who in, in the theory that you offer do that? Nah, to me, the problem with the NBA's ratings is it's two, it's twofold. Well, maybe three. One, America is becoming to football as Canada is to hockey, where every bit of news and every bit of coverage, like, we're becoming a one sport country with a lot of like other smaller sports that people enjoy. But like this idea of a big three because we always say big four. Hockey is not considered to be big in that way. But the idea of a big three. No, no, no, no, no. This is going to be the big three. Like when LeBron was in Miami, like, keep it real big, dog. It was LeBron and then it was the mother two. Like that is a big thing. I think that's happening with the NBA. I think, number two, people's consumption patterns on a lot of things got thrown off by the pandemic and they wound up off the calendar and all kinds of stuff, you know, happening there. And I think that that in the margins, if nothing else, had an effect on people jump. People just didn't quite jump back to the habit when it came to basketball. And number three to me is, I think that this is a rejection of the current style of basketball that is being played. And there are tweaks that they need to make in the rules to encourage a different style of play. Because what you have now is just incentivize people to stand behind a three point line and shoot way more three pointers than I personally would like to watch. Now, maybe not everybody's like me, but I believe that the league needs to do something about this because I don't find this to be a delightful brand of basketball.

[Logan Murdoch]

And it's not just them shooting threes every possession. It's your best teams doing. It's your marquee teams doing it. The Boston Celtics do it all the time. Like 23 seconds left of the shot clock. I'm going to chuck this three. And it's, it's, it's the, it's not only. It's the teams that are on TV the most that are.

[Bomani Jones]

Right.

[Logan Murdoch]

So even when it's casual fan season, it's like, I don't want to see that. I want to go back to your first, the first point that you made when you were talking about the NFL and football in general. Because I want to put college football in that as well. Becoming the nation's sports, the sport right now. Right. And the NBA's M.O. throughout at least my entire life was, we are the most global sport out there. Everybody got a basketball court. There's one in China, there's one in Rio. There's one that if that was the case, how did they fumble that bag? Is style of play, Is it, is it wokeness? Like, what, what is that? Because they, that's what they always prided themselves on as a league.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah. And I don't know what the numbers look like around the globe. Like maybe they're staying high there. I don't have a great answer for that. I just know the American, you know, the, the American appetite for the game. I can speak to. I don't really know what's going on around the world, but it is just generally speaking, there aren't that many games that people play everywhere. And really it's basketball and, and footy soccer. Those are the two games that people play literally everywhere in America. Really love sports that we really just kind of just play in America. Really, really, really into those.

[Logan Murdoch]

But it's crazy though, because the NFL, what I, what I kind of like respect about the NFL right now is they just on some gangster shit, they're just like, you know, yeah, we're gonna, we're gonna play on Christmas Day, so what? We're also going to go to Berlin, you know, we're also going to go to Brazil and play a regular season game. Right. Like, there just seems that audacity there when it seems like the NBA is a little fidgety right now in terms of growth. Right. Like, I feel like they're letting these narratives kind of like consume them as a league. Right. Adam Silver's over here. Ask. Answering questions about ratings all the time. Right. Like, I don't, I don't know where we are right now, but I just know the NFL is just on some gangster shit and the NBA seems to not be.

[Bomani Jones]

But I'll tell you this, if they get a true superstar player, like if Victor Wembayama, for example, becomes that sort of force, now we're talking about something different. Like what. But the thing though is often what is what is what is often the seismic change for basketball is the emergence of that guy. And you're saying, yes, he is, he's 20 years old, he just got here. Like, people are still getting to know that guy. It doesn't have to happen immediately, but like what happens when you get, if you get a deep playoff run from him in the next, call it, couple of years and that begins to start highlighting stars that are around. Like, basically the NBA needs, it's needs, its Caitlin Clark. And cyclically there have been those players. Yeah, yeah, but I mean, but I mean that's the same person though, right? Like cyclically you've had this, you had the emergence of Dr. J, you had the emergence of Jordan. Shaq, in a lot of ways became that player, the next one that really just kind of became the center of our attention universe in basketball. We had LeBron James, we added some other. Now it hasn't quite been one like LeBron. But Steph Curry, much to our surprise, became that person, Right?

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

Who's going to be the next one?

[Logan Murdoch]

It does feel like we're in a bit of the late 90s all over again. You know, like that lockout year going into the Lakers 3 peat, right. Where people were just trying to find stars. I mean, I. I love Ant. I know you love Ant. I do believe that Wimby is going to be that guy. It just feels like we're not promoting Wimby. It's as crazy as it may seem, as much as we could as a league. I don't know, I just. It just seems like he's just mashing right now. And I don't know if that's market, but also he's like this. He's from Paris. He is a world name already. I just. I don't know. Maybe. Maybe you're right. Maybe he does have to get to a point where they're going into playoffs each and every time, Right?

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah. I don't know how much. I mean, market. I think the emergences of LeBron James and Kevin Durant from Cleveland and Oklahoma City indicates that the, the market size thing doesn't really hold. Like, Russell Westbrook, they. They were holding. They were still doing television numbers for the Thunder after Durant left in that first year. Right. So, like, I don't know how much the market part helps. I do think a lot of the coverage is kind of based on the way that these algorithms work, generally giving you more of what we know you already like. And they know that you like LeBron James, they know that you like Steph Curry, so they keep giving you back what you like. I don't know exactly how anything breaks through, though, whether that be in music or anything else. Like, I don't know how these things break through, but the NBA needs their breakthrough. Like, Caitlin Clark broke through.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

For whatever reason, she broke through. So who's gonna be the next NBA player to really break through? Like, I really like Anthony Edwards. He's my guy. But he may be the level of star that is truly. He's a lot of people's favorite player. But that doesn't mean you're gonna be Michael Jordan. Like you think. No, no. He is not there because that was so singular. Like, that's like, that was a natural born star. Right. Like, you have to do nothing to make the star out of Allen Iverson. Like, it was right there as he was. That was what made that so fascinating, so special in a lot of ways. Anthony Edwards has That. But he doesn't quite have. He has like a silly, defiant streak, the one that cusses in interviews and stuff like that. Iverson wasn't doing that childish stuff. He was terrifying people in a whole different sort of way. Anthony Edwards we just kind of chuckle at, you know, but in the late 90s, they.

[Logan Murdoch]

The.

[Bomani Jones]

The mistake with the late 90s was it wasn't simply that everybody was looking for the next Jordan. Is that a big part of what they ascribe to being the next Jordan was being inoffensive and what they misunderstood about being Jordan. And why you couldn't find anybody that fit that archetype so particularly is that he was inoffensive, but he wasn't like, benign.

[Logan Murdoch]

Right.

[Bomani Jones]

Like, Grant Hill didn't really make you feel anything. He seemed like a very nice man, but he didn't really make you feel anything. Jordan was cool as hell. Jordan had edge. Jordan had, like a street quality to him. Jordan had all of those things. He just didn't say nothing stupid.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah.

[Bomani Jones]

But it wasn't a matter of like, oh, you. You know, we just need somebody that's also clean cut. No, that was a secondary thing of it with Jordan. The primary part was that he was cool than a motherfucker. And a. And Edwards could be that maybe. Right. Who's going to be the one to cut through?

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah. And. And even with the WIMBY stuff, right. Like, I see, like, even if he is a big star, right. Is he going to be a big star. Star like that in America? America, right. Because he could go the Giannis way, where Giannis is a huge star, I think, all over the world. But I don't think he's. Is he the biggest star in the NBA right now? Anything. Like, I don't. I can't. I don't think so.

[Bomani Jones]

I think, I mean, biggest star in.

[Logan Murdoch]

The NBA is LeBron James or LeBron.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah, biggest starting. Yeah, biggest start in the area is LeBron James. But I do. I think what would be interesting about Victor is that Victor will be fascinating to children. Like, it's one thing when you have the big man like Shaq, and that is the. That gives you Goliath, like Will Chamberlain gave you Goliath and those people. I mean, Shaq became a giant star. But, you know, there's a different quality to that. There's something about the super tall skinny dude like him that can contort his body in all those ways. And like, they call him an alien. Kids love that stuff. You know what I mean? Like, he is Ready made for a young generation that could come up and then him be their goat.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah. And he's, he has like. It's funny because, like, he has like Kareem. He's like, his body style is like Kareem. Remember seeing him in summer league, he has a lot more charisma than Kareem did. So we'll, we'll see. We'll see what happens. Like, I, I just. I don't know. And also, like, what do you think that says about the evolution of the big man and where we're going with it if he's the one? What, what do you think? Because he's like, he's Durant, he's Kareem, he's all these different types of big.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah, he doesn't, he doesn't. He doesn't have anything to do with anything else that's ever happened. Yeah, like, there's one of one, the closest. And you go look at what Ralph Sampson could have been. Maybe that's what we're talking about. A 7 foot 4, face the basket, handle the ball, power forward. That's the closest example that we've had. But, like, what does this say about the evolution of the big man? This is so far off the charts and like, such an outlier. I don't know what to say this says about anything.

[Logan Murdoch]

It's, it's, it's crazy. Like, when I saw him play last year against Durant and he just, like, there were streaks where he like, dominated Durant, but, like, he just, it felt like he didn't know how good he could be at that particular point, but he still had, like, moments of domination. It was, it was, it was really wild to see. I can't wait. Who do you are. Who are you thinking about right now? If I were going to ask you, like, who was. Who is in pole position? I know, obviously, out of the two player. Out of the two teams in Cleveland and okc, like, who is one. One of those, those, those guys, those teams right now that you trust the most at this point to get further.

[Bomani Jones]

I mean, I would, I would probably say I trust Oklahoma City because my thing with that Cleveland team has always been they got two tall dudes who ain't very big. And at the very least, Hartenstein gave Oklahoma City somebody with some size. Right? Like, with some mass that you can't just move around. And I guess Chad will be back at some point. We'll see how those two things go together. But out of those two, I would trust Oklahoma City more. Like, look, we're in this. We're in the NBA era now where anybody can win it any given year. I don't like that quality, but that's where we are.

[Logan Murdoch]

Yeah. I just don't also like to add on that point. I don't. I don't know what was wrong with dynasties in the NBA. I think, like, the NBA was what was diet.

[Bomani Jones]

Well, it was raw. What was wrong with a dynasty is that if you own a team, you want a champion, too. And instead of making them go out there and earn it, they just decided to figure out ways to make it less random. Like a follower of mine said many, many years ago, they are eliminating the comparative advantage of competence.

[Logan Murdoch]

That part, it's. It's. It's. It's insane. Well, I really appreciate you coming on, buddy. This. This was really a treat, man. We got to get on pretty soon. That was Bomani Jones of the Right Time with Bomani Jones. We'll see you again at some point, right? Yeah, you. Come on.

[Bomani Jones]

Yeah, man. I. I appreciate you, brother.

[Logan Murdoch]

And that was Bomani Jones. You can catch him at the right time every day on YouTube. That has been another edition of real ones. Shout out Howard, MF and Beck. Shout out Raja. Raja Bell, who is somewhere in the world doing dope shit that only lives in the group chat right now. We'll see Howard, I think, next week, but you know who? Never know. We'll see you Friday. I don't know who's gonna be here. I know I'll be here, but I'll just. I might be Will Smith on the last episode of Fresh Princess looking around for a co host. We'll see. All right, talk to y'all soon. Ah, all the shits by.

[Bomani Jones]

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