Logan Murdoch (2:57)

Clip better theme music. What's poppin Real ones. Logan Murdoch here, Roger Bel there. Cliff in the bubble. We are talking Western Conference hierarchy rankings, which Raja did not prepare for. So that means it's going to be a great show. That's the first segment. And then in the second segment, we're gonna just, we're gonna just throw some storylines out there. Cliff's gonna help us out. We're just gonna comment on them, okay? We're gonna comment on some Nico stuff, some Steph news, some other stuff. But Cliff, what's going on, buddy? How we doing? How's Philly?

Cliff (3:33)

What up, Loogie? What up, Raj? What's going on, man? Philly's good, you know what I'm saying? Sixers is rolling a little bit. The Eagles got a big one this weekend versus the Lions. So, you know, it's a little bit of hype out here in Philly, man. Got the Eve T shirt on, as you can see. So shout out to Philly, as always. Yeah, Raj, you listening to Eve back. You was listening to even the Rough Riders back in the day.

Raja Bell (3:51)

Yeah. You already know, man. Eve, one of like the coolest moments for me as a young player was, I think it was the BET Awards, like back in it. Maybe 2001, 2002, maybe. I don't know if it was Eve or somebody in her entourage on stage rocked my jersey. That was pretty cool for me. It was a pretty cool feather in the cap for a young player at the time. So, like, yeah, much respect for even.

Logan Murdoch (4:15)

That was a real Philly fan. And they was like, nah, I like him. They watched the finals and was Like, I like him. I need no, they.

Raja Bell (4:20)

Someone, someone. I don't remember who her dude was that was managing and handling that, but they came and requested a jersey.

Logan Murdoch (4:26)

Like, hey, bet that's hard.

Cliff (4:29)

That's hard. That's hard.

Sponsor/Ad Voice (4:30)

Really?

Cliff (4:31)

Let's get into it, man, the Western Conference hierarchy. Raj, I know you've been watching the games. I know you've been locked in. I know you've been locked into the Thunder Nuggets.

Raja Bell (4:37)

No, I'm an early season NBA. Yeah, come on, dog, you know how I get down.

Cliff (4:41)

Thunder Nuggets, Rockets first Lakers. You know, shout out to Jokic, Wemby. Those dudes looking like the AVP candidates, as you guys have predicted so far. But it looks like the Oklahoma City Thunder are rolling per usual, 12 and one on the season. Could they get that record? Maybe they might get that record, but they're rolling right now even without J Dub. They're all star forward as we speak on it here. And they're on a four game win streak. Have the highest net rating in NBA by two points. Ranked fourth in offensive efficiency, ranked number one in opponent scoring per game. Raj, man, are the Thunder prime to just run it back again.

Raja Bell (5:13)

They look like they could be. I think Denver has significantly kind of like closed that gap from last year. I think they look a lot better. They're going to need J Dub to be healthy and available and you know, they got to be at full strength to be able to do it. I do think they're the best team in the NBA right now. They look like they're just, they're rolling. It's a machine. They come at you in waves. You know, the way they defend, the way, you know, they got multiple. What's the kid's name? Mitchell. What's the, what's, what's his name? Like, watching him fill that role for J Dub has been pretty cool. I mean, they're relying on him to point produce. They, he has the green light. It's, it's a cool story in and of itself, but I do think they are the best team in the west right now. But I think that gap has closed a little bit from last year. I would, what I would say to them about that, chasing that record. Don't do it, don't do it. Like, I'm a little worried for how quickly they have come out of the gates after what they did last year, if that makes sense.

Logan Murdoch (6:16)

Right.

Raja Bell (6:16)

Like obviously you're a good team, so you're going to win games just because you do some things better than other teams, but I'm always leery of a team that has played that well all of last season and has come out of the gates already on fire this season. That's a hard thing to sustain for like two years straight, you know, so, like that. That's what I'm worried about with them. I don't. You can't predict it. It's just like, historically speaking, those teams that were really good the year before and then they come out and they got winning a, a championship plus breaking a record on their mind, and they're going after that, they look hot early and they're playing great. It's hard to sustain that.

Logan Murdoch (6:52)

Yeah, I agree with you, Roger, on the 74 wins thing, right? Because what ends up happening when you chase these types of records and you know, I was, I was in the area when Golden State was chasing the record and, you know, was a little younger when the Bulls were chasing the record. The problem with chasing these records is you end up getting to a position where you're playing bass playoff basketball for like four or five months straight, right? Because you're playing playoff basketball. What, when, when you start getting close to the record because you. We're not going to get Buzz, buzz about 74 wins until around the All Star break if they keep this up, right? And then you're going to get questions throughout the All Star break of like, are you guys going to do it? You guys going to do it? And then you're going to have to exert a lot of energy to maintain, to maintain that standard. And when everybody else is resting, especially in this day and age, right, when everybody else is resting up for the playoffs because Denver ain't chasing none of that shit. Denver is going to be laying in the weeds and they are going to just be waiting on the eventual matchup. No matter who has home court advantage or anything, they are just going to be waiting in the weeds. So by the time you win the record, you're already exhausted. You already feel like you have won some sort of title, right? Because no matter what they're going to put, if you win 74 games in a place like Oklahoma City or a place like that in general, they put in a banner up, right? So you have to, you have to. Then once you get to the postseason, you have to sustain that, right? Not only do you have to sustain the pressure of winning back to back, you have to sustain the pressure of finishing the job. And it's really, really hard to do that. I just think they need to play within themselves. I think you know, 65 to 68 wins is, is a PR, is a pretty good number, right? Like, I, I, you don't want to do that. And then this team is primed, especially the way it is right now, constructed not only to win back to back, but potentially do a three peat because of just the, the way that they've been able to develop players and the picks that are coming in. Right. This can be a very, very sustainable product and you don't want to mess that up with one with, with, with regular season nonsense, man. I mean, clearly it would be exciting for us. We would be juiced. It'd be a constant storyline. But I don't, I'm with you, Roger. I wouldn't, I wouldn't chase it either. But this is a really, I want to add to that though. This has been a really good team. I've seen them in person. They're just a well oiled machine and they are a team. Particularly when you see teams that win titles, when you see them the year after, it's really, really cool. Especially when they have everybody coming back because there's a calmness, right? No matter where they are in the game, they know each other. They know who to go to when it's, when it's tight, they know who to go to down the stretch. They know how to get themselves into a game and they know the energy required to either win it or steal it because those are two different types of things. And you see that calmness now and that confidence with them Dog. How they put the clamps on the Lakers was a sight to behold. Oh my God. That was a master class defensive pressure, man. And they can do it with so many guys, right? I was texting somebody and I was just like, you know, that was without.

Raja Bell (10:08)

Door, that was without, like, that was.

Logan Murdoch (10:10)

Without, without J Dub.

Raja Bell (10:12)

Yeah, that's crazy.

Logan Murdoch (10:13)

The other thing that I really like about them is they are one of the teams that is very rare. I was texting with somebody and they're one of the rare teams that have more than two playmakers on the roster, right, who can get their own shot and who can get it going. And you could see the difference between them and the Lakers, where the Lakers, if you, if you shut down the rest of the rosters, which is relatively easy to do because they do not have that many dynamic playmakers outside of AR and Luca and LeBron's coming on. But like as they presently stand right now, the, the Thunder just put the clamps on them and they can do that with every other team. Not Named Denver and maybe I think San Antonio and the Rockets. Right. But they have the defense, the defensive acumen to be able to do that, but also complement that with the offensive acumen with multiple playmakers. They're a super dangerous team, man. I don't want to play them.

Raja Bell (11:07)

No. Nor should you want to. They're still like the best defensive team in the NBA. They're able to. They're able to do things. Flexibility and versatility on that roster. That. That makes it pretty cool to watch them play defensively. When you talk about, like, chasing those records, you're coming into an NBA season, their goals and their priorities, and you rarely get to achieve more than like one goal if you can achieve that. And then priorities like you have a shot at achieving, like, whatever that number one priority is. So if you're making 75 your priority, do you get to it? Maybe you chase it. Let's say you get it. There's a natural human letdown that happens once that's been achieved that makes it very hard then to turn around in a playoffs, because that's usually like, right abutting up to when the playoffs start. It's very hard to have that exhale and then turn around and be as sharp as you need to be for a playoff run. What they do have working for them uniquely in that space that maybe Golden State didn't necessarily have or the Bulls, is that they're pretty youthful. Like they, they. If anyone's got the legs to do it, it could be them. I just think that human element of, of, oh, we got it done right before going into the playoffs is a kiss of death. I just don't. I don't. I don't love the, the, the emotional letdown and the, and the, and the human element that plays in at that point. Yeah. As far as playmakers go, they are really interesting example because you mentioned LeBron coming back for the Lakers, and we spoke previously on the pod about when LeBron comes back. How much of LeBron, quote unquote, is he allowed to be within what they're doing now? Right. But they've got a bunch of guys that would be. And hopefully LeBron can be exactly what he's been forever, to whatever degree age has affected that. But, like, they give him the ball when he's supposed to have the ball. Hopefully they don't turn him into a glorified, you know, three and D guy. But what, What OKC has is the perfect complements to some of that SGA and Chet and J Dub, these are all guys that can spot, shoot and are fine being out of the way and can space the floor and defend, but can make plays with that ball in their hand. Like, they're not all great, great playmakers. You're not going to ask them to do that over the course of, like, any stretch of real time. But given small sample sizes and the need to do it because you've bottled up sga, they're more than capable of doing it. So they got a great complimentary cast, like, offensively, and they're just. I mean, they're the best defensive team in the league.

Logan Murdoch (13:43)

And they have the rare thing that you have from champions, which is a chip on their shoulder because a lot of analysts out there were talking about, you know, we didn't. We didn't like this. Probably, you know, similar to, I think the 1415 warriors, where they have to win another title. The warriors didn't do that in 2016. But that. I think that educates why they were going so hard for 73 is because they felt disrespected during the championship run, like, this wasn't a valid title, at least as it was they were in their head. I do feel like the Thunder are feeling that way as well. Right? It was like, oh, okay, you guys don't believe. You know, you think I'm a foul merchant. SGA is like, you think I'm a foul merchant? All right, bet. Let me show you this. Oh, you think I'm this. And I think that they are also going through the growing pains right now and which will educate why I think that they're going to. I don't know if they're going to go for it, but they're going to try to kick your ass every night because they are in the beginning stages of being an IT team. I think I've been telling people this all in my group chats and all this thing, but OKC is the team of the youth. People keep people trying to bash them and like, all their, you know, boring and all of these things now, man, the youth love them and they are going to.

Raja Bell (14:57)

Is that the. Is that that. Is that what the streets are saying about them at times?

Logan Murdoch (15:00)

Like, Riz, what? Cliff, back me up on this. Like, what. What am I trying to say on this? You know what I'm saying? You know what I'm saying on this, right? They. They. The kids love them, but I think the adults are just like, oh, man. Like, I don't know. They're just not. They're not fun because they don't drink after the games. And stuff like that, you know, like, it's just, it's. It's a, it's a, it's a, it's a culture war going on right here with Thunder.

Raja Bell (15:21)

I, That's a good, It's a good point though. And I, I also think that the roster makeup of guys that, you know, SGA was a high pick, but, you know, Clippers kind of gave up on him to a certain degree. He does have that probably chip on his shoulder from the foul merchanting as well. Chet was a. Chet was. I mean, they have some high picks, but they don't have guys that strike me as, as how do I want to put. They have guys that strike me as guys that feel like they have something to prove. Even though they might have been drafted where they were drafted, or they might have been a heralded recruit, they still seem to have this kind of organic, I have something to prove mentality about them across the roster, like even with their, their better players. And I do think you, you know, that going along with what you said in terms of having something to prove generally to the public puts them in a unique spot to continue to hunt in a way that, that, that is going to be important for them. I just, you know, it was interesting to watch that game against the Lakers because not only is there like a human element let down to chasing, you know, all of those wins if you're, if you're in the quest for 70, whatever the number is, and you mentioned you're basically playing playoff basketball for, for three months trying to, trying to do that. Well, what comes along with that is like burning the candle on both ends and having to play people deep stretches of time and not letting them bank that rest. When you're in, when you're in certain situations, it was cool to watch them play for, you know, SGA sat on the bench. I can't remember. It was the second quarter, I think it was the second quarter against the Lakers and he was able to get extended rest because they're so well built that the lead stretched the lead stretch and they're just sitting him over there and he's just like a light 30 ball with limited minutes. Now that's a blowout win. That's not every win that you come across. But if they have the ability to do that, they're able to kind of manage minutes at the same time, be a great team. That's a rare thing.

Logan Murdoch (17:21)

Yeah, they got him at about 34 minutes a game, so that's pretty good. You know, if you can get them around, keep around that you don't want them to get to like 37, 38. You know, if you're chasing something like this, that's a lot on. That's a lot on the Thunder but great. Oh one last stat on them. It lived like 20 points nine times this season out of 13 games. Yeah, that's crazy. The Ringer NBA show is brought to you by FanDuel. FanDuel is putting you in control right from tip off. That's right. You get to choose your reward, play it safe, go for it. Feeling bold. Thr that's your move. Whatever your style, you're in control. Let's take a look at the slate. NBA cup time Heat Knicks I think I'm going to take the heat on this one and I'm going to take the over at Madison Square Garden. Knicks Magic O I'm just going to stay away from that one. Sixers Pistons. The Pistons are rolling. I think I'm going to roll with Cade even though Maxi is balling. I think I'm going to take the overall points for Maxi but I think I'm going to take Pistons outright and I think I'm going to take the over on the game. Overall Blazers Rockets I'm going to take the over on Shangoon. Rebounds and points. I think he's going to ball out tonight. Warrior Spurs I think I'm going to take the warriors outright but I think I'm going to take the over on points and rebounds for Victor Wembanyama. No matter how you play, FanDuel is giving you the power to choose your reward and own your game this NBA season. Head to FanDuel.com ringernba to make your pick. Get in the game and play it your way. Must be 21 years and older and present in select states or 18 and older and present in DC, Kentucky or Wyoming. Opt in Required rewards are non withdrawable. Restrictions apply including bonus and token expiration leg requirements and max wager amount. See terms@sportsbook.fanduel.com Got a gambling problem? Call 1-800- gambler or visit rg-help.com Call 1-888-78-9-7777 or visit ccpg.org in Connecticut.

Sponsor/Ad Voice (19:11)

This episode is brought to you by Spectrum Business. Without Internet, you wouldn't be able to hear my beautiful voice right now and businesses wouldn't be able to stay connected the way they need. So what if I told you you can get free business Internet forever with Spectrum Business? Just add four mobile lines, get business Internet, advanced wifi and security shield for free for life. No contracts, no added fees. All you have to do to find out how you can get free Spectrum Business Internet forever@spectrum.com free for life. That's where you go. Restrictions apply. Service is not available in all areas. This episode is brought to you by Degree Original Cool Rush, the scent that's made a legendary comeback. See, Cool Rush isn't just a scent. It's the kind of fragrance that guys remember, ask for by name and rave about online. It's bold, it's fresh. Delivers all day sweat protection with that cool, crisp vibe that made it a legend. So if you haven't tried it yet, head to your local Walmart or Target and grab Degree Cool Rush, the fan favorite scent from the world's number one antiperspirant brand.

Sponsor/Ad Voice (20:16)

This episode is brought to you by Happy Egg. The recipe for a better egg starts with how the hen lives. Happy Egg Hens spend their days outside on pasture, running, stretching and flapping their wings in the sunshine. That freedom leads to rich, tasty orange yolks and a difference you can see and taste. Happy Egg makes every plate happier. The proof it's inside the shell. Visit happyag.com Spotify to crack open Happy.

Logan Murdoch (20:45)

What'S next?

Cliff (20:46)

Cliff, real quick, can I just add to the SGA point that you made, Roger? He's second in the NBA scoring 32.5 points per game and he's only played in the fourth quarter six times this season.

Raja Bell (20:56)

Oh, that's wild.

Logan Murdoch (20:56)

Shout out to Kier.

Cliff (20:57)

Thickening on that one. Keir, Thicker shout out to you.

Logan Murdoch (21:00)

Yeah, also fucking, he's just been killing in the third quarter as well. Like he, he's, I was, I remember seeing him in Sacramento and he was like, yo, I'm making a point to, to be a third quarter scorer. And the reason why, I think one of the reporters asked him, you know, how, why does it take so long for you to just get into the game? And he's like, you know, I'm just feeling my way out through it. And usually around the third quarter is like when I see the defense and I see what they're doing and then I can go right there and exploit it. Right. But when you compliment that with the defense that they have, all he need is this one big push and then it's like, yo, I'm going to the bench in the fourth quarter. That's really what the seated has been.

Raja Bell (21:34)

Yeah, yeah, he's, he's. And it, what it allows his teammates to do is is find a real rhythm. We've I've, you know, I've oftentimes on this show mentioned what it was like as a role player on a really good offensive team to get hot early and to get touches early and what that allowed then when I start making shots, the space that it, that, that it allowed, you know, Steve to operate in or Amari or Sean Marion or our focal points offensively. Because once I'm hot, you kind of got to stay home, right? And so that just provides them more space. So when they want to cook, like they've got the space and they have the supplementation offensively. So it's. If you have the team that's built to be able to do that like it, I mean it's a win, win, win.

Cliff (22:16)

Let's get to the second team in the Western Conference and that is the Denver Nuggets who have been absolutely rolling the season. Nikola Jokic, 55 points, 12 rebounds the other night and guess what? He had 50 points on the Clippers in three quarters, came back in the fourth quarter, added three more points and yeah, they rolled the Clippers. They packed them up pretty good. 113, 116. Just some quick numbers on the Denver Nuggets this season. Right now they're on a six game win streak. Second in that rating at 113, just behind Oklahoma City, first in offensive efficiency and ranked third in opponents scoring per game. The Denver Nuggets rash, they are rolling, they are loaded, jokers is dropping 50 balls like it's nothing and they are just smacking up on opponents by that net rating. How do you feel about the Nuggets and Jokic and your and your MVP pick in Nikola Jokic?

Raja Bell (23:04)

I mean like I, like I said before, I think they have closed the gap on the OKC Thunder and Nikola Jokic, we all know his brilliance offensively. He hasn't missed a beat. You know, I think Aaron Gordon's playing awesome. Like they've, they supplemented that bench. Jamal, Jamal Murray, you know, is kind of what he is. But where they've really closed the gap is defensively like they are now defending like a top tier NBA team. And when you are a problem offensively and you have a matchup nightmare like the Joker that would X out anybody else's top tier defense. Like you could do everything right as an excellent defense and Nikola Jokic still might torch you. But if you pair that with what you can do offensively and what he can do with your own elite level defense now, you're a nightmare. You become a real problem for people and that's that's where I see them really having made strides this year, which it's in their bench and supporting cast for sure. Offensively, more importantly, in what they're doing collectively as a defense.

Logan Murdoch (24:16)

I think to your point about that, I mean, and Jokic in previous seasons had. Has had to expend so much energy just. And it would, you know, you think about even was the 2024 postseason. Large reason why they didn't get to the finals or even the conference finals is because they were just gassed after that Minnesota series. And a lot of that has to do with. If you don't have an elite defense around Jokic, he has to overcompensate. And now his overcompensation is different than a lot of people. Right? Like, he's. He is a walking offensive machine. And I always kind of made this point and I want to get your take on this project. The Nuggets with Jokic seeing, like, the spurs with Tim, where, like, they're always in the weeds because he's there, you know, you. Like, I think last year was such a perfect example of this, right? Where they have the infighting. The Nuggets do. They kind of didn't end the season the way they wanted to, right? Where it was just such up and down, and they would always ebb and flow. And that was one of the concerns that I had in the beginning of the season. Are they going to ebb and flow like they typically do and just, like, get bored with the season and lose some games that they're not supposed to? But then you see them against OKC and you get reminded, oh, yeah, they're right up there with the best of them because they have that one person. It felt like the same thing with. With the spurs and Timmy where you're like, oh, yeah, the spurs are here. Like, lost in the. The 2015, 2016 lawyers was like the. The spurs won like, damn near 70 games. Right? And that's just an example of, like, they're always in the weeds. And I know they had Kawhi and they had other players, but the Nuggets seem like the spurs of, like, the. Without the titles, with just the fact that they're always just in the mix because of one person. And he seems to be just a great equalizer in Yogic.

Raja Bell (26:05)

Yeah. When he. When you have a player like that who's on the floor, that not only can just destroy you and whatever you bring to the table defensively as a game plan, but also can equally make the people around him that much better. Your Floor is really, really high. As a team, you're always going to be viable because there are so many ways that that guy affects winning games that it's hard to figure out as a defense what fire to put out. Do we put him out and extinguish his scoring ability, or do we cut off his. His. His avenues to getting support by making him score and not letting him distribute the ball? Like, it becomes an impossible kind of quandary, like, as someone trying to scheme a defense for how you're going to stop them. And so. And so, yeah, I would. I would agree with you in that, like. And not to mention, like, the stature of said player. I always say that I don't love the percent chances of winning a championship for teams whose focal point is a small guard all the time, that's got to be on the ball. If it's Steph, it's a little different because he's running off of so much shit and now he's in your paint. But if it's just a guy you're going to give the ball to and say, hey, Cook, I don't always love that. I don't. I mean, it's just a me thing, but I don't always love that.

Sponsor/Ad Voice (27:21)

But.

Raja Bell (27:21)

But when that guy's 7 change and as big as he is and big as Timmy was, I mean, that. That's scary. It's a.

Sponsor/Ad Voice (27:28)

It's a.

Raja Bell (27:28)

It's a tough thing to. It's a tough thing to always account for when you're the other team.

Logan Murdoch (27:33)

So it's just so funny when you just pass the ball to somebody and say, go do something. It's like there's only like a handful of people in the world that can fucking just get the ball to post and say, oh, yeah, I got it. It's like it's Jokic in the league right now. Like, go, give me the ball and you go do something. It's like it's Jokic. It's kd. Like Luka Wimby, I guess. Is Giannis in that. In that tier? Just going through something in terms of Biggs. Biggs. Biggs, yeah. Is he.

Raja Bell (28:00)

Yeah, Giannis.

Logan Murdoch (28:02)

Giannis is in that different aesthetics, but yes, for sure. But I feel like on that level, it's like maybe like 10, 11 guys. The other thing that the Nuggets have for them now is just a supporting cast. They have a deeper team. What, like the. The addition of Tim Hardaway Jr. Has been. Has paid great dividends. Right. And not. Maybe Cam Johnson isn't the Wild card that MPJ was. But like, I think that that's kind of what they needed right now. They need, like, they need adults in the room. They need people that are going to keep the consistency. And I love that Cliff put a, a number in the chat. That was really good. Y on off number is seven points higher than it was last year, which means they're not losing nearly as much as they did last year when he's off the floor. And so, yeah, it's a big deal.

Raja Bell (28:47)

I agree with you. And you brought in defensive minded adults in the room. You brought in guys that can keep, you know, even if it's not top end offense at all times, like they can keep you viable defensively in a way that doesn't, doesn't make you lose that much ground when he's off the floor. They've got like nine players playing over 20 minutes a game. You know, I don't know what that number was for them at this point last year, but, but the depth is certainly there. I got to apologize to David Adelman. Like we remember, we'd argue last year about whether or not you make that, make that, you know, firing at the time. And I, and I argued that I didn't think it gave them the best chance to win in the immediate, you know, playoff run that they were on. Yeah. Hey, brother. My bad, my bad.

Logan Murdoch (29:35)

Because I'll just say this, I'll say this. I'll catch it this way. He's doing a great job. I still contend that you don't make that move.

Raja Bell (29:43)

No, I mean, for that. Both things can be true.

Logan Murdoch (29:45)

Yeah, yeah. For specifically, like the Nuggets do their team and that's what you do. I mean, it's just also like, it's, it's not, it's. It's still scary in the moment, right?

Raja Bell (29:55)

Well, it is. But if I'm being fair, they were like one game away from fucking around and being in the finals. So. So like he, he did a good job then and, and he's doing an.

Logan Murdoch (30:06)

Excellent job that has a chance to win 74 games this year.

Raja Bell (30:10)

Yeah, I was, I mean, I was wrong and good for them for having good ownership and whoever decided to make that, make that call at the time, do we know, like, forgive me because I'm not in arenas and super familiar with the whole staffs. Is he the architect of the defense? Is what is. Does he have someone on staff that that is that is doing that? Like, is that or is that his baby? You. Does anyone know?

Logan Murdoch (30:35)

Not sure.

Sponsor/Ad Voice (30:36)

No.

Raja Bell (30:37)

Well, either way, congrats My bad.

Logan Murdoch (30:40)

Shout out to the staff. I'm sure somebody's gonna be an. Be like, well, you guys should know. And then send us a link. So we'll, you know, we'll add that next time we talk about the next. What's. What's the next. Sorry, man. You know, I got beef with my.

Raja Bell (30:52)

A link. A link about what, though? I missed that. A link about what?

Logan Murdoch (30:54)

I don't know. They're gonna send us a link. Like, oh, man, if you would have looked at this on this side, you would have known that this is the defensive architect, you know.

Raja Bell (31:02)

Oh, my bad.

Logan Murdoch (31:05)

Sorry.

Raja Bell (31:08)

There's a link out there somewhere. I missed it.

Logan Murdoch (31:09)

Sorry. I don't know. Anyway, Cliff, what's the next one?

Cliff (31:12)

Let's go to the spurs, who are third in the Western Conference right now at 8 and 3. We talk about Wimy all the time. Logan's MVP, preseason MVP pick looks looking pretty good as we, as we speak. But we got to talk about another guy, man. Stefan Castle. I want to talk about the NBA rookie of the year from last year, jumping up four points, four points per game. Damn near four points and assists. And is shooting better this season at 49.7%. However, his three point percentage is down just a little bit, but he's also not shooting a lot of threes per game. He's only shooting about four per game. I mean, Stefan Castle in his production with Dylan Harper out, de' Aaron Fox coming back into the fold, we got Wimby there being a offensive and defensive leader for the Spurs. I mean, realistically speaking, what are their chances of achieving the Western Conference ground as seasons end?

Logan Murdoch (32:00)

I mean, they got a chance because everybody got a chance, but they, you know, there's going to be a lot of maneuvering to get this done. You know, like they would have to. You know, you have to be on the other side of the bracket from Dallas, from, excuse me, from Denver and OKC somehow and, you know, avoid them. Hopefully they, you know, beat up on each other and then try to get them into the Western Conference finals. Honestly, I know I posed the question, but I'm also, like, responding to myself. It ain't even about that right now. Right? It's not even about trying to get the Western Conference crown. It's about vibes and figuring yourself out. They're okc like two years ago. I really believe that. I've watched them quite a few times just because I love watching Wimby. One of the. And Stefan Castle has done a great job. I think one of the things. One of the things whenever I watch them that I keep coming back to is like, they need a calming presence. And offensively or when things get kind of weird. I was watching their game against Chicago and Stefan Castle, I think was really good with them. But I was watching their game against Chicago and they were so scattered down the stretch. They were not down the stretch. They were so scattered like in the third quarter and like just hoisting up bad shots. And eventually Wimby turned into MVP mode and won them the game. And maybe he's that calming presence, but I saw Stefan Castle like throw up some shots early in the shot clock. The Aaron Fox is also. He's just a get up and go type player. He's not somebody that's just going to be like, hey, relax, everybody calm the fuck down. When be going to post, I'm going to throw you to rock. Like they need something like that. And Stefan Castle, I think the next maturation for him is doing that. It's just like, hold on, wait, wait. There was a play, I can't remember down the stretch, but there was a play where he got an offensive rebound against Chicago. Could have waited it out and just said, everybody come back. But he immediately shot and missed a layup. And it was like, ah, if you guys just, you guys were on a roll, if you would have just, just held the offense up and just make sure when he gets into the fold, throw him the ball. That's an easier shot than what you threw up. There's a, there's. Whenever I see the spurs, there are moments like that where I'm like, yo, you just need to mature into that. Just like, know your personnel, know the time of the game, know what you're doing and then kind of rev up your offense. I think that's the thing that they need to mature at. I do like them. You know, I love watching Wimby. He was amazing in that game. He's just a, he's a killer, Roger. He's a fucking killer. But they just need that maturation and I think that just comes with time because they're, they're, they're finding their groove in a lot of ways.

Raja Bell (34:33)

Yeah, I would agree with most of that. I think. Could, could they win the West? Yeah, I don't. I think that those two teams we just talked about are clearly, I think, I mean, record wise, it might suggest. What are they one loss behind, one loss behind Denver right now. Right. But, but I think they are in a tier just below Denver. From my naked eye, just watching There's. It's a great. It's a great kind of point, Logan, about them being OKC a couple of years ago. I mean, you're. You've raised this team, you know, you've. You've drafted it or acquired it really early for the most part. And you've raised it and you've developed it, and you're starting to see, you know, starting to see the vision of the team. I think that they are a year away from really battling for that. And I agree with everything you said. I think situational awareness and just situational basketball is something that you develop over reps and time and that seasoning, that understanding of what's required in those moments, not just from a scoring perspective. Like, Wemby has the ability to ice games with the ball in his hand and just go crazy in the fourth like he did in that game and bring them home and then, you know, hit the tween. Tween, you know, has he pulled from the top of the key to go up three. Like, he's got that ability. But there's so much more that goes into it than just getting the buckets at those times. You know, it's the execution. How do we get to you having the opportunity to get to that bucket? It's the pace of play at that time. It's knowing when to go to your point and when to pull the reins a little bit. It's. It's knowing how to drill down defensively on a stop. You know, there are a lot of things that go into that maturation of a team, that development of winning, you know, tough games in crunch time. And I think they're developing into that. They have the potential, like, if anyone slips up, Denver, OKC in that tier above them, they have full potential to be there. But I, too, believe they're a year away from us saying, yeah, I think that they could legitimately be picked as a favorite to win the west, just for purely seasoning purposes.

Logan Murdoch (36:50)

Yeah. And other thing, I'm curious to see the maturation of Mitch Johnson, Right? Like, he's somebody that also has to mature into that role. Right. And not to say he has. He's done a great job with it, but, like, you can't prepare for what you haven't seen yet. Right. That's why I keep making the OKC comparisons. Right. Like, Coach Dagnall is a great coach, but he still had to mature into the guy that can, you know, be a guy trusted to pull the levers in a finals or pull the levers as you get going and you only get that with experience. So I'm excited to see. Have you liked what you've seen from him, Raj? Yo. Absolutely.

Raja Bell (37:24)

A really good young coach. Clearly has a great, a great rapport with the team. He's got a great, you know, vibe about him. I watch him in the timeouts and kind of the exchanges, you know, the X's and O's kind of speak for themselves, but I'm watching how the, how the players respond to him, how he interacts with them, and I like everything about what he's doing. I would add to the overall team like Wemby, you know, OKC is ready to take that step when you can't do anything to stop sga.

Logan Murdoch (37:53)

Yeah.

Raja Bell (37:53)

Denver takes that step when you can't do anything to stop Jokic. No matter what you do defensively, you're not stopping them from bagging 30. You know, Wemby, now all the rest of the stuff has to be in place too, right? Like the roster that supports them, the defense, like all of that. But you have to have the guy that's ready to say, don't give a damn what you do. This is a 30 ball and WEMBY's quickly approaching that. But there still have been games, there still will be games where somebody gets up under him, somebody's able to like, knock him off of his spot, throw the double at him where he's figuring out in real time he's a, he's a super young player. But when he's that, that's when we're. That. That's what we're talking about. He's showing, he's showing signs of it all the time, but when he's consistently that. That's when. That's when that team takes that step.

Logan Murdoch (38:40)

Yeah, I mean, he has also, you know, I think Mitch, just going back to Mitch real quick. He has also has institutional support as well. When you were talking about just like the roster setup, I'm just like, did they have to make the de' Aaron Fox trade? Because clearly Castle is making this his team. They have so many guards. Did they have to do it?

Raja Bell (38:57)

Like, what they give. I don't even remember what that trade would they give up for.

Logan Murdoch (39:00)

They got a 2027 first round pick from San Antonio. They got it from. I'm talking about from the San Antonio perspective. They got that 2027 first round pick, which honestly, like, again, like, did you have to give a pick and you gave him a max deal? Like, that's the other thing, right? For somebody, if you, because Stefan Castle is definitely making this his team. And you know how point guards are, right? Like you, you. Once you make it your team and then you, and then you draft Dylan Harper after you give him a max, after you give Fox the max, it just seems like an unnecessary move. I don't think it's going to hurt him in the long run because at the end of the day I think the area is an asset. And then a lot of people need point guards at this point. We'll talk about Houston in a second. I'm just like, why? Anyways, what's the next Cliff?

Cliff (39:45)

The next team is the Houston Rockets, who started off the season 02, but they have won seven of their last eight games. Alperin Shangoon has been looked absolutely great alongside, along alongside Kevin Durant, just making bounds and leaps without Jalen Green there to kind of mess up the flow. Averaging 22 points per game, seven assists. He's shooting 42% from three point this season. Fellas, the Houston Rockets without a true, true point guard. But you know, they got the Thompson twin over there who's getting some buckets. KD looks like KD dropping 25 a game. Raj, how we feel about the Rockets?

Raja Bell (40:22)

I like the Rockets. I like the Rockets a lot. Again, I, I would say maybe I owe them a little bit of an apology or I was maybe less than an apology. I was maybe wrong, at least early in the season about how badly I thought they needed a replacement for Fred Van Vliet to orchestrate and make sure that that thing ran well. Gotta give a lot of credit to, to, to their, their, their personnel's versatility in that regard and ability to kind of do that to the coaching staff for being able to have the kind of vision to figure out how that was going to work in his absence. I put them in the category and the tier with the Spurs. I think if you made me pick between them and the spurs in a series, I'd probably take Houston. And I think it's because of what I talked about when we were referencing San Antonio. I, I like some of the seasoning there a little bit better. In terms of KD specifically, they're a problem defensively. They're, they're, they're a problem on the glass offensively. I mean, this might mean I'm not great at my job, but I don't, I don't know how there's like offensively as good as they are without that PG like that. I mean, they're, they just shoot the ball really. They've been shooting it really well and they really pummel you on that offensive glass like they are. They're a nightmare on that offensive glass. They're like, they. You wake up the next morning after you play them and you're probably black and blue because you've just been beat up trying to rebound the ball and they're getting second shots and they're, you know, they're. I don't know where they are in the league in terms of second chance points and stuff like that. They have to be one of the best offensive rebounded teams in the league. But yeah, I like them a lot because they can defend. They have multiple shot creators. Like just get a bucket guy. Shangun is, you know, watching him. I might even throw him. Lightweight in the category just below those bigs that we talked about earlier. Logan, it's weird looking, but like you could give him the ball and something, something's gonna happen.

Logan Murdoch (42:31)

He got some shit about his offensive game, bro. He hits the spin, move into the Euro, step into like, it's just funky. It's.

Raja Bell (42:39)

It's aki as shit, but it's like, it's, it's productive, it's efficient, it's kind of lethal.

Logan Murdoch (42:45)

They're.

Raja Bell (42:45)

They're really long, really disruptive with that length and they really use it, you know, the way it's supposed to be used, which is they put up a shot and if they miss and I, you know, they're not missing a ton, but when they do, they go get it. They go get it and put it back. And that's a, that's a problem.

Cliff (43:03)

I just looked at Araj. They are first in offensive rebounds per game.

Raja Bell (43:06)

Yeah, yeah, they, they, they really get after that ball. And it's a.

Cliff (43:09)

And it's by a full rebound too. It's by a full rebound too.

Raja Bell (43:12)

Yeah.

Cliff (43:13)

So that's a lot after it.

Logan Murdoch (43:14)

Yeah, I think that they need a point guard for sure. You know, I think one of the things that you can, especially in a playoff setting. Right. I still put them a tier below Denver and Oklahoma City just because even how good their bigs are, I still don't think they can match up from a size perspective with both of those teams in terms of skill and also in terms of like. And no one's matching up with Jokic ne. But I think that, you know, they are going to have a hard time more than a lot of people because you're, you're going to be put in a position where you're putting Katie on Jokic and that has not Been fruitful in a lot of, in a lot of times, especially the last few years. That's been the demise of the Phoenix Suns. When he was on the Phoenix Suns. But. And then with okc, they just have. So they have sga, who was a guy that can calm down in offense. The biggest thing about the Houston Rockets now is they're so scattered. Their offense is just chaos. It's beautiful chaos, but it's chaos nonetheless. Right? Because you're like, oh, Shan Shangoon is, is. Is. Is just backing the guy down 90ft and just. I didn't even know that was still. I didn't know that was legal anymore, but apparently he could still do it. And that's one possession. Then you pass the ball to kd. He's just going straight to the rack, right? Or he's, he's. It's just so chaotic. And everybody in the league for the last couple of years around Houston has been trying to make Reed Shepherd a thing like as a superstar talent. He is. And he's made great strides and I think he's done a good job in spurs. He had a 20 point game against the Wizards. But I, I don't see it necessarily. And if there are still rumors that you need to get a point guard and Reed shepherd is somebody that's supposed to have star potential, there's a disconnect there. And I think that, you know, they don't need a point guard that's necessarily a star like you. I don't say trade for Trey Young, but maybe go trade, try to get like kick the tires on Derrick White. I think he would be perfect for this. You know, somebody that is not a guy that wants the ball or needs the ball all the time, but can like really settle you down as an offense because eventually they are going to need something like that. They're going to need a calming presence. And I don't think Reed shepherd is that. I think he is a good. He would be. And he would also be a really good backup point guard in that, in that scenario. Right, where, you know, he can go and do his thing but don't necessarily have to worry about, you know, pulling the strings of an offense. And I think that that would be really good for what they need at this time. But I mean, they're beautiful chaos. They're a beautiful, chaotic team.

Raja Bell (45:48)

Yeah, that's a, That's a good way to put it because like I was saying, like, maybe I'm not good because I don't know exactly what they're doing. Like, I don't I. I don't know.

Logan Murdoch (45:54)

Exactly what they're winning games because they're.

Raja Bell (45:56)

In this great offensive team, but that.

Logan Murdoch (45:58)

Bucs game was exhilarating. That finish for that Bucs game, like, what the fuck is going on? And it's like, oh, okay, yeah, yeah. All right. This is.

Raja Bell (46:04)

We got. We did it.

Logan Murdoch (46:05)

We did it.

Raja Bell (46:07)

I think that you're watching if you're in their front office when you lost Fred Van Vliet, the conversations obviously pivot to like, what are we going to do there? And ultimately, I think you're like, let's see what we look like. Let's see what this looks like. If it's terrible without him, maybe even in this world where it's not going to match exactly with Katie's window, but maybe we just let Reed develop into that and. Or whatever this looks like from, like trying to figure out the point guard position, but it's not really going to affect winning and losing because this didn't work out great anyway because you didn't know what you were going to look like with. With KD in the mix. Like, you didn't know coming into the season, all hopes were there, but we were still going to find out. But now you see it, right? And so now maybe it's like, hey, man, if we're that close to it, maybe that incentivizes us and it kind of spurs us on to think about making that move, you know, in the next couple of months or, you know, if we're still viable by this date and it still looks like we have an opportunity to be really fighting for the Western Conference, maybe we make that move then. You know what I mean? Like, that's. I'm just trying to think about what those conversations look like in the office because I do agree with you, Logan. As great as it's been right now, and I put them in the tier and I said I'd pick them over San Antonio for reasons of physicality, you know, they're really going to be pummeling them on the glass. But also, you know, the KD of it all, in that space of winning time, late crunch, understanding how to do it, get to spots, giving you buckets, they also defend in a way that's going to expose maybe San Antonio's youth in that area. Well, when you do see that next level team, not having that PG is going to bite you in the ass. Like, not over the course of. Of six or seven, you might get away with it for a night, but over the course of six or seven, when Someone can drill down on what you want to do. They can really get into your tendencies, really get into the spots that you want to be in as an offense and. And try to take those away and devise game plans to do that. That's when that lack of point guard is going to bite you in the ass. So, you know, maybe. Maybe they're sitting there watching and trying to figure out just who they are in this mix and waiting to make the right move. Because I agree with you, there are people out there. Derek White's a great name of people that would. That would. What's the bull's name from Chicago? I heard somebody mention the other day, Kobe White. Like I'd like Derek White better, but like their names out there of people that could come in and have experience. Experience in kind of setting the table and running a show.

Logan Murdoch (48:44)

Yup. What's next? You got the Lakers.

Cliff (48:47)

Yes, indeed we do. Got the Los Angeles LeBron list. Lakers. As it sits right now, LeBron James has still not played a game for the Lakers, but this is now.

Logan Murdoch (48:55)

I'm just sciatica. Raja.

Cliff (48:59)

Sucks.

Raja Bell (49:03)

No joke, bro. Until you're dealing with back issues, it's all fun and games. I used to judge. I used to judge. Ooh. I used to judge back. What you mean, bro? Back. Okay, 40. Yeah. What's LeBron right now? Is he 40?

Logan Murdoch (49:19)

41?

Cliff (49:20)

41. Yeah.

Raja Bell (49:21)

That back starts talking to you right around 40, 41, 42. That back starts talking to you.

Cliff (49:26)

Well, back to the Lakers. As it sits right now, they are currently 8 and 4. They got smacked up by OKC the other night. Luka Doncic is averaging 35, 9 and 8 on the season right now. The Lakers still haven't played with LeBron James this season. Look, are they a tier below that Texas two step tier, that San Antonio, Houston Rockets tier, Or are the Lakers in that tier? Can they compete in this Western Conference when LeBron eventually comes back? Logan, let me, let me start off with you this time. Bradley.

Logan Murdoch (50:00)

Nah, man. They're a fun story. They're fun, but there's a lot of questions, man. I think that OKC game was a very good look into what the Lakers are in the midst. Not only the Western Conference, but the league at large. They have at this very moment. They do have two playmakers in AR and, and Luka, who's been amazing 35, 9 and 8, but they've needed every bit of that 30, 35, 9 and 8 this season. And they have two playmakers and they have three. When LeBron comes back but neither one of them play defense, which is going to be a problem when you go against these younger teams and they can get clamped defensively. Right. Like they. There was a blueprint. And I know OKC is an anomaly because they're a team that is deeper, probably the deepest team in the league while also having some of the best players in the league. But when you're talking about that type of tier they are going, as the season wears on, I think, you know, they're going to be a fun story and they're going to have fun moments that are Lakers, but I just don't see them in that tier. And also, you know, Aiden did, I will say Aiden did played really well against Wimby about last week, but I just don't know how sustainable that is. Right. I know he's in a contract year, but this is a lot of questions. I think we just. They're a vibes team too, you know, let's just see where the vibes take them. Going to be a fun year. They still got a lot of building to do.

Cliff (51:28)

Yeah, I.

Raja Bell (51:29)

To answer your question about whether they're in a tier right below the Texas duo, I would say yes to that. I think they have the potential if LeBron comes back and it fills some of the holes that Logan just kind of talked about. I think they have the potential to creep into that category with those two teams, but that's going to be dependent on what that fit looks like when he comes back. Luca has taken full command of what this looks like and yeah, he did last year, but not the way that it is this year. Can we agree to that? Like, LeBron was sharing it, but LeBron was still like, yo, I'm. Some of this is mine. Well, in his absence, it's all, you know, like, it's Lucas and then AR has stepped in to be like, yo, I'll take the rest of it. Right. So how that dynamic works out is going to depend on whether they can creep into that. That next category of team. They're a middle of the pack offensive team right now. Like Luke has been brilliant. They're a, they're a bottom third in the league defensive team right now. I don't know if LeBron solves that problem for you, but I could see a world where adding a third playmaker out there, you know, he's going to board, ignite your break, you're out more, more effectively in transition, could help with your offense. But I too would have them in a tier just below that pending LeBron's reinsertion into the lineup and me having an opportunity to see what that does.

Logan Murdoch (52:57)

What it looks like, I'll say this, man. All that firepower in the Western Conference, they're going to be targeting LeBron defensively, especially during the regular season, to get wins. Right? Like, yo games down the stretch. Ayo, come here.

Raja Bell (53:09)

But all three. All three of them, though, all three of their best offensive players are all targets.

Logan Murdoch (53:15)

Yeah. And like, I will say, like, Luca has got better because he's lost the weight, but, like, even then, even when he was at shape, he's still like a below average, average defender at best. At absolute best.

Raja Bell (53:26)

Those are. I mean, yeah, I mean, that. That makes it tough. Makes my argument tougher to be able to support because you're right. I hadn't even thought of it in that way, but you're already a pretty poor defensive team and your three best players, because Austin Reeves, like, people will search for him, too. Oh, they're.

Logan Murdoch (53:48)

They're. Yes, absolutely.

Raja Bell (53:49)

Right. So, like, Luca Braun and Austin Reaves are all searchable for. For, like, that's.

Cliff (53:55)

It's tough.

Raja Bell (53:55)

It's tough to be a really good defensive team. And I don't care what you are offensively, if. If you can't defend adequately, you know, there's a ceiling. Right. Like, you can be fun. We can watch some pretty brilliant offense performances like this. The star power of LeBron and Luca is going to be, you know, great to watch on TV and like that. But, like, whether you can consistently win games largely depends on whether you can consistently get stops.

Logan Murdoch (54:20)

Yeah, I mean, like, Luca and AR are going to try defensively, there are going to be games when LeBron comes back that he's not even going to try. I mean, it has nothing to do with. He's just 42 years old. You know how he is. Like, he's not. He's just going to. They're going to hide him.

Sponsor/Ad Voice (54:35)

He's.

Logan Murdoch (54:35)

He's going to do them fucking LeBron contests that he's famous for. Like, they're going to be games like that. And, you know, it's. It's. It's. It's going to be. It's going to be a journey, but, you know, they're playing well. They've had some fun moments, and we'll all be watching. All right, Cliff, what's next?

Cliff (54:50)

Let's get to the Los Angeles Clippers, and they have some bad injury news. And no, it's not Kawhi Leonard this time. It is Bradley Bill who is averaging career lows and practically across the board, 8.2 points per game, 1.7 assists per game. And he's only played in six games this season. He will have season ending hip surgery. The Clippers are 3 and 8. They are only better than the Mavericks, the Pelicans and the Grizzlies. As it stands in the Western Conference.

Logan Murdoch (55:17)

The Kings are better than the Clippers.

Cliff (55:20)

I mean this, this is just all around bad. Kawhi Leonard, we've barely seen him play. You know, who knows what's going on with him and aspiration and all those guys over there in LA and Steve Ballmer in hot water. Guys. What do we make of the Los Angeles Clippers and just their rapid demise? Here is the oldest team in the NBA.

Logan Murdoch (55:38)

They're basically the Pelicans with better weather, bro. In a nicer arena at this point. That's where we're at. They don't got their picks going forward. I don't know why they, they, they resigned Kawhi. Probably because they didn't have any picks. And they're like it. Why not, right? We need to be some sort of competitive. It would have just gone bad even if they would have kept PG. Like, this is just what we see. PG's history that like Norm Powell leaving has been a big, A big loss. And then Bradley Beal who honestly hasn't played great basketball over the last three years, even before this, this hip surgery. It's unfortunate, also unfortunate that I keep. Yo, what they're doing to Bradley Beal on the Internet is just so disrespectful. They're bringing up all his old clips. Of what? There was one, I think where I saw where he was talking to the camp. It was like, you gonna have to play me.

Raja Bell (56:29)

That's terrible.

Logan Murdoch (56:30)

It's just been terrible, bro. Like he was like, he told the cameras, you're gonna have to play me. And then they was like, no, we not. It's. Yeah, it's. It's been tough. It's been tough. What's the correction, Cliff? You put it in the chat. What's the correction, buddy?

Cliff (56:41)

The correction is. I'm sorry, they are not. The Grizzlies are better than by a game. It is the Kings. In fact, Logan who are actually worse than the Grizzlies.

Logan Murdoch (56:49)

There we go.

Raja Bell (56:51)

What do you want me to say? What are we going to say about the Clippers? There's nothing to add to the Clippers. Like, I don't listen. I mean we. What are you going to do, man? They're old. They look old. They are Old.

Logan Murdoch (57:05)

So forward thinking. You think, you think, you think they're waiting out for Giannis? You think Giannis is going to come to a team like this? Stop it.

Raja Bell (57:13)

Negative. Listen, I just said how hard it was for a team to be good on one end and, and bad on the other end. Or average. Right, because the Lakers are average on offense. They just have some like. Right, because the Lakers, offensively, they're probably middle of the pack in the league right now. They're bottom third defensively. Well, and I'm saying that's hard to be a viable threat with, with, with, with those type of efforts. The Clippers are bottom third in both. Like, they're, they're bad offensively and defensively. Like, that's how. What are you going to do with that? I don't know. I don't, I don't even like, man, just go to.

Logan Murdoch (57:52)

Into a dome to watch the other team play. Also, it's hella hard to get to Inglewood anyway. Sorry. It's.

Cliff (57:58)

Sorry.

Logan Murdoch (57:58)

Sorry.

Raja Bell (57:59)

So it's. It's a tough spot. It's a tough spot. And, and yeah, I don't know, man. That's a big. It's a big conversation of how they got here. Not to, not to mention all the other stuff that's going on around them, distraction wise and every. Yeah, it's. It's. That's kind of ugly.

Logan Murdoch (58:14)

All right, we're. What's.

Raja Bell (58:16)

And we're out.

Logan Murdoch (58:16)

One more.

Sponsor/Ad Voice (58:16)

What?

Logan Murdoch (58:17)

No, we got one more. We got one more. We got one more. We got one more. We got one more. Okay, what's. What's next? Cliff?

Cliff (58:23)

Let's get to Stephen Curry parting ways with his Under Armour with the Under Armour brand and moving forward with the Curry brand. As we know, Steph Curry revitalized the Under Armour brand and he is now branching off into his own quote here from Kevin Plank, the founder and CEO of Under Armour. It's been an incredible privilege to work with. Stefan, who is president of Curry Brand, has been much more than an ambassador. He's become a thoughtful and strategic business leader. Together with our teammates, he helped build something rare. A rare brand with credibility, community impact and product that performs at the highest level. Rondo Armor, this moment is about discipline and focus on the core Under Armour brand during a critical stage of, of our turnaround. And for Stefan, it's the right moment to let what we created evolve on his terms. We'll always be grateful for what he's brought to the Under Armour team. Now Steph has another colorway. Releasing in February 2026 and some final products to be released in October of 2026. So there is, you know, still some time here with this relationship. But what do you make of this whole ordeal that Steph is no longer with Under Armour and moving forward with his brand, the Curry brand.

Logan Murdoch (59:27)

A few things on this. Wait, did you want to go, Roger?

Raja Bell (59:30)

Well, I'm going to let you go because you, you're clearly more plugged in than me. I would just say it sucks for one Ty Bell, because he's an Under Armour kid right now and he liked going to the Curry camp. It was a great experience. So that's.

Logan Murdoch (59:40)

He can still go to the Curry camp. Okay. You can still go to the.

Raja Bell (59:43)

No, no, no.

Logan Murdoch (59:44)

Yeah, it could be.

Raja Bell (59:45)

Could be. But like, it was, it was a, it was just tied into the pro, the program he was in. So, like, that's going to suck. But anyway, continue.

Logan Murdoch (59:51)

I can, I could, I have a good, good authority to say he'll be invited to a Curry camp. Yeah, he'll be there. No matter what the affiliation, he will be at a Curry camp. I'm, I'm pretty sure of it. Yeah. Like, it's, it's, it's an interesting thing, right? Like the relationship between Steph and Under Armour has always kind of had a bit of tension to it. Right. Because, I mean, I think it's started if, if I got my things right is when Kevin Plank, who was, you know, made that statement, had also made a statement in support of Donald Trump a few years back and, and Steph did not agree with that. It's very well documented. And had to make Kevin Plank walk back his comments about, oh, Donald Trump, I think it was 2017 or 2016 in that, in that, in that area. And then also they just have never been able to make a real dent in the shoe market. Right. And that's an all time fumble from Under Armour. Right. And it's. This is also a strategy play. Right. Because they're losing money on basketball. They haven't been able to, no matter what they've given Steph. Steph is the basketball anchor of that. Kelsey Plum also has a shoe. But I don't know if Steph leaves. I don't know how long, how much longer she's going to be there.

Raja Bell (61:17)

Fox has a shoe too.

Logan Murdoch (61:18)

Yeah, he has a shoe. He's still going to be signed with Under Armour, but it's through the Curry brand. So I don't know how long he's going to be there. So it was basically a play where Steph Brings him into Under Armour under the Curry brand. So I don't know how much of an incentive Under Armour is going to have to even keep him. And then on the Steph side of it, there's a lot of comparisons to 2002 when Kobe left Adidas and ended up signing with Nike. But steps towards the end of his career. Right. Where it's going to be hard say if he went to. Back to Nike. Right. I'm just saying just like just throwing that out there. I don't have any reporters where he's going to go, but say he went back to Nike. There is no history there beyond like legacy wise. Like what are they going to sell? They can't really sell any retros because they don't got no retros on them. Right. Right. There's he. They could give him a new shoe but like that's undercutting already the market that they already have. Right. Um, and so my thing is he's probably going to go like a Tiger woods angle where he's just selling shoes. Curry brand standalone. Maybe he has some investment somewhere else or maybe invested with someone, maybe a Chinese company or a company that will invest in his Curry brand and to make it into something. But I just. It would be hard because Under Armour still is going to sell retros off of, off of Stephen. Right. And they're always going to be locked in with him. Right. Whenever. Like similar to how Adidas is still not locked in with Kobe by name, but they still sell the retros on the back end and it's wink, wink. It's not Kobe but it is a Kobe silhouette. I, I see that happening maybe 10, 20 years from now. But I think the play here for him is just try to push out the, the Curry brand as a Kobe Curry brand standalone, similar to how Tiger woods is doing it just because of where he is at his career and the viability of if he wants a Reebok or somewhere else. Like they don't really have a pure relationship, a long standing relationship. It was a catch 22 for them. Like Nike should have kept Steph. But because he went with Under Armour and had such a history and so many moments in Under Armour, they're always going to be tied together. It's just. This is just hard timing for everybody involved. It was, you know, they. Under Armor has to restructure and Curry was always frustrated I think in the later years, specifically with Under Armour. And it's just, it's. It's a tough situation. But I think he goes to Tiger Woods Route. If I had to guess where, he just does his own brand and he tries to sell Curry brand as a standalone entity with funding from somewhere else.

Raja Bell (63:58)

I don't have anything to add to that. Yeah, you, you. I mean, you got way more plugged into that situation than I am, so.

Logan Murdoch (64:05)

Yeah. Yeah.

Raja Bell (64:06)

I mean, I, I, you know, I would just say this because my. One of my. My youngest son said to me, he needs to go to Nike. And for all the reasons you just stay. I was like, yeah, I don't. I don't think that that happens at this point in the career. I, I would nostalgically speaking, like, it was a good ride. You know, I remember when he dropped his first curries with. They had like that. They had that like kind of ankle sock on them. It was like kind of running shoeish at the bottom with the ankle socks. Like, both of my boys, we. We waited in line at Foot Locker to get those joints or wherever it was they were being sold. Like, they, they both love those. Like, so, like everything you remember would be Steph with, with. With Under Armour. I just. There's a part of me that would always wish and hope to have seen what Nike would have done with him had they. Had they been able to get him. But it was meant to be what it was. You know, it was a good run.

Logan Murdoch (65:04)

If not, if he stayed with Nike, they would have a building named after him on a Nike campus at this point. It'd be crazy.

Raja Bell (65:10)

Like, what. Where. What is Nike? Like, what is Nike Basketball?

Logan Murdoch (65:13)

Yeah.

Raja Bell (65:15)

If they had got him, it would be.

Logan Murdoch (65:17)

It would have been crazy, bro. Nico Harrison. Nico Harrison. All comes full circle, baby. I will be. What I am curious to see though is like how he plays the sneaker free agency, bro. Because like when Kobe did the sneaker free agency, he got PEs from all these companies. Like, if Curry gets like PEs from Nike just to like that they see to him and like from Reebok that they see to him and like, you know, if he's wearing Angel Reese's, if he's wearing the Asia Wilsons or he's wearing some like bronze or something or like the Nike GTS or something like that, that'll be icy, you know? Like, I would love to see that. So we'll see. I don't. It's new, but this is.

Raja Bell (65:58)

When is the relation. The relationship has dissolved. Like, we are done with this. This relationship is over.

Logan Murdoch (66:03)

Well, Cliff alluded he's gonna. I think he's gonna wear like a version of his shoes maybe to Sell them or whatever. Right. But, like, he. Okay, I think he can wear whatever he wants for right now at the time being, so. But they're going to officially be done. Done, like, October 26th.

Raja Bell (66:20)

That's going to be. Because you're right. Like, that was. Yeah, yeah. Some of Kobe's, like, I've seen some. They do it lately with, like, you know, on Insta or Twitter or some shit like that, where they show Kobe's footwear when he was going through those things, like. And that was when he had the question locked in. Yeah, I wasn't locked in at the time, but. But going back and looking at it now is like, oh, bro, that's pretty. That, that's pretty damn dope. So I would be very interested to see what Steph's running around in.

Logan Murdoch (66:44)

Yeah, bro, that's going to be. I see. Stepping some Jordans. Stop. What? Come on, bro. Oh. All right, let's get to it. It's Friday, so you know what time it is? It's time for real. One of the week. I don't know if Roger's prepared or not, but he's going to go first. He's gonna go first.

Raja Bell (67:02)

I'll just, I'll. I'll go off the top of my dome because two MVPs were recently announced for, for National American League MVPs. Right? Shohei Ohtani and Aaron Judge. So what? That was Aaron Judge's third, I think. Like, I'm making this up as I come kind. I don't really know this. I didn't do research, but it's his third. Ohtani's. What? Third or fourth? Is it really?

Cliff (67:22)

So this is his fourth, and out of five years, he's won the mvp.

Raja Bell (67:26)

Jesus Christ. So, yeah, for those reasons, like, I'm not locked in on baseball through the regular season. I was there for some of the playoffs fireworks, but real ones of the week. Two. Two MVPs, multiple times.

Logan Murdoch (67:38)

Yo, man, Joe Hayes, fucking crazy dog. Like, I don't got no team right now but the Dodgers. Like, I fell in love with this team. I even bought a hat. Like, I, I'm so fake up here in the bay, bro. But, like, I, I, I copped a Dodgers hat, bro. Cause it's Shohei. I ain't never seen nobody that I was this excited to watch. Just like Barry Bob, where he comes up to the plate and I'm scared to death for the fucking pitcher, bro. And I don't even watch baseball like that. But I was just like, yo, bro, how you get on base? 9 times in a game.

Raja Bell (68:14)

I don't know.

Logan Murdoch (68:15)

Very rare baseball talk on the real ones. But maybe fall in love with Ohtani and his Dodgers team, bro. If they. Hey, if that ownership from the Dodgers does what they did with the Dodgers to the Lakers, the league is in trouble. In trouble. Anyways, my ruin of the week. I gotta go, man. For me and Vivi, man. I know me. Vivi is gonna feel me on this one. Summer Walker, we finally got the album. Okay. It's called Finally over it because we was finally over waiting for that very appropriate title. I listened to it a little bit. It is jamming. It's all the scent music. You ain't never gonna listen to it, but maybe, maybe somebody in your orbit is going to listen to it. Raja. But it's jamming. It got some jams. I listened to the first half already. They got a joint with Doja Catal. That's fire. Cliff. Cliff listening to it. He bought the simp this weekend. So you know what I mean. We out here shout out to Summer Walker. We needed the album. We needed the trilogy. Also. I guess we got to do this Meek Mill drop today as well. Yes, yes, Cliff. Yes. Yes, drop. But Real One of the week is. My role of the week is Summer Walker, because I'm about to be jamming this album for the next four years because that's the next time we're gonna get out from her ass. But shout out to her one of my faves. One of VV's faves. I think Cece's fave, too, but, you know, we'll see Summer Walker. Anyways, that has been another edition of Real Ones, the R B Real Ones. We. We do this every Tuesday and Friday. Tap in with us. Make sure you tap into the mailbags. We weren't able to do one earlier this this week. We're going to do one on Tuesday with Howard beck. Room with mailbag gmail.com rulesmail b gmail.com rules mailbag gmail.com Roger wants to get the hell out of here. We've done this for an hour. Six minutes that has passed this time. Talk to you all on Tuesday. Ah, all this. Bye. Must be 21 years and older and present in select states for Kansas and affiliation with the Kansas Star Casino or 18 and older and present in D.C. kentucky or Wyoming. Gambling problem. Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit rghelp.com call 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org backslash chat in Connecticut or visit mdg.com in Maryland. Hope is here. Visit gamblinghelplinema.org or call 1-800-327-5050 for 24. 7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-78-HOPE NY or text HOPE NY in New York.