Biden Insider Turns on DNC, Exposes Biden Coverup & the Real Kamala | Lindy Li

Summary

The Rubin Report: Biden Insider Turns on DNC, Exposes Biden Coverup & the Real Kamala | Lindy Lee

Host: Dave Rubin
Guest: Lindy Lee
Release Date: April 5, 2025
Duration: Approximately 49 minutes
Knowledge Cutoff: October 2023

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Introduction

In this compelling episode of The Rubin Report, host Dave Rubin engages in a revealing conversation with Lindy Lee, a former Kamala Harris campaign advisor who has turned into a vocal critic of the Democratic Party. Lee provides insider insights into the inner workings of the Democratic National Committee (DNC), President Joe Biden’s administration, and her disillusionment with the party's direction.

Background of Lindy Lee

[02:28] Lindy Lee outlines her professional journey, transitioning from an investment banker at Morgan Stanley to a key figure within the DNC’s leadership. Her involvement with Biden’s campaign was driven by a shared commitment to cancer research, an area close to her heart. "I donated my time and my resources. I donated buildings to the campaign because I wanted to," Lee emphasizes her non-staffer role in the campaign.

Concerns Over Biden’s Cognitive Decline

[05:32] Lee divulges her early concerns about President Biden's cognitive decline, which she noticed around 2017-2019. She recounts her attempts to raise these concerns with DNC leaders, including Ken Martin, who dismissed her worries. "He made me feel ridiculous for bringing it up," she states, highlighting the resistance she faced within the party.

[06:23] Lee shares her frustration with the lack of responsiveness from party leaders like Jenna Maloney Dillon. Her repeated efforts to leak information to the press and Politico underscore her belief that Biden was unfit for leadership, culminating in her appearance on Fox News Sunday in July 2024 where she publicly called for Biden to step aside.

DNC Control and Unelected Leadership

[00:26] Lee asserts that the Democratic Party is effectively run by a council of unelected officials—Anita Dunn, M. Donnell, and Steve Richetti—rather than President Biden. "We didn’t have a president. We had a council of these unelected people that you've never even heard of," she explains, critiquing the centralized control within the DNC.

Biden’s Resignation and Party Dynamics

[08:21] Following her televised criticism, Lee describes the White House's reaction, including threats to her loyalty. This led to increased scrutiny and her eventual removal from major media platforms. "I was only on MSNBC once and that was it," she reveals, detailing the systematic efforts to silence her.

[16:53] Lee highlights the pivotal role of Congressman James Clyburn in maintaining Biden’s presidency, particularly his intervention during the South Carolina primary. She attributes Biden’s continued leadership to Clyburn’s influence rather than any inherent strength or capability of Biden himself.

Shift Towards Conservatism

[27:59] As the conversation progresses, Lee elaborates on her ideological shift from a lifetime Democrat to a staunch conservative. She discusses the emotional and psychological toll of leaving the Democratic Party, citing relentless harassment and defamation from both sides of the political spectrum. "These people aren’t just political figures to me. They were my friends," she confesses.

[30:18] Lee emphasizes her strong stance on immigration, environmental issues, and fiscal conservatism. "I don't want our country to be like China, where pollution is so intense you can slide your finger down the window and it’s black," she passionately advocates for clean air and water, aligning her views with Nixon-era environmental policies while rejecting the Green New Deal.

Critique of Kamala Harris and Democratic Leadership

[31:12] Turning her critique towards Vice President Kamala Harris, Lee expresses disappointment in Harris’s public persona versus her private interactions. "When she talks on stage, her brain completely melts," Lee asserts, questioning Harris’s capability to lead the nation effectively.

[18:30] Lee also discusses the manipulation within the DNC, particularly the swift endorsement of Kamala Harris influenced by James Clyburn. "The fact that Biden endorsed her so quickly afterwards was because of James," she explains, pointing to internal pressures that sidelined genuine leadership.

Personal Struggles and Public Perception

[28:01] Lee shares her personal struggles, including health issues exacerbated by political strife. She relates this to Dave Rubin’s own experiences, highlighting the physical and emotional burdens of political backlash. "This has been the worst period of my life," she admits, underscoring the human cost of her political awakening.

Future Directions and Closing Remarks

[47:05] Looking ahead, Lee mentions her plans to continue her activism and author a book that unveils the “entire truth” about the Democratic Party’s corruption and Biden’s incapacity. She emphasizes her commitment to preventing the current Democratic iteration from regaining power. "My goal is to prevent the current iteration of the Democratic Party from ever gaining power again," Lee declares.

[48:53] As the interview concludes, Lee expresses appreciation for the platform provided by The Rubin Report, anticipating a more significant impact post-interview. "Thank you so much for having me," she says, reflecting on the support she has received from newfound conservative allies.

Notable Quotes

• Lindy Lee on Party Control:
  "[00:26] We didn’t have a president. We had a council of these unelected people that you've never even heard of."

• On Biden’s Cognitive Decline:
  "[05:32] I really started redoubling my efforts about Biden's cognitive decline because it was so apparent to me that there was something wrong here."

• On Defamation and Harassment:
  "[34:02] They call me a slut, chink, whore, cunt, whatever, on a daily basis."

• On Environmental Concerns:
  "[43:37] I'm thinking about moving to Miami."
  "[44:56] Pollution is so intense where you can slide your finger down the window and it's black."

• On Kamala Harris’s Competence:
  "[31:12] When she talks on stage, her brain completely melts."

Conclusion

This episode provides a deep dive into the fractious dynamics within the Democratic Party, highlighting issues of leadership, cognitive competence, and ideological shifts. Lindy Lee’s narrative serves as a cautionary tale of internal party struggles and the personal cost of political dissent. Through her firsthand accounts and critical analysis, listeners gain an insider’s perspective on the tumultuous landscape of American politics.

Transcript

[Lindy Lee]

The White House called me the night before saying, we know that you're going to be loyal. You're President Biden's most loyal supporter. Which, like, is so reminiscent of something you'd hear from the Godfather. I really started redoubling my efforts about Biden's cognitive decline because it was so apparent to me that there was something wrong here. He was not like this in 2017 or even 2019. We are America second to none, and.

[Dave Rubin]

We own the finish line.

[Lindy Lee]

Dave, we didn't have a president.

[Dave Rubin]

Right?

[Lindy Lee]

Right. We had a council of these unelected people that you've never even heard of, and they're Anita Dunn, M. Donnell, and Steve Richetti. Three of them were running the country.

[Dave Rubin]

What led you to becoming a Kamala advisor?

[Lindy Lee]

When I speak to her on a one on one basis, she's not an idiot. But when she talks on stage, she just. Her brain completely melts, talking about the significance of the passage of time. So when you think about it, there is great significance to the passage of time. I am writing a book, and people should be scared. They should be scared because I know exactly where the bodies are buried.

[Dave Rubin]

Hey, I'm Dave Rubin. This is the Rubin Report. And joining me today is a former Kamala Harris campaign advisor turned critic of the Democratic Party, Lindy Lee. Lindy, welcome to the Rubin Report. What do you think of that intro? I had a couple different ways I could go to describe you in one sentence. Did that kind of captured Steve.

[Lindy Lee]

That was perfect. That was nice. That wasn't vitriolic. It was exactly what I needed. Thank you. And it's such an honor to join you. Everywhere I go, actually, people mention your name and hold you up as an example of someone who's really gained the loyalty and admiration of the entire party, including, by the way, Sean Spicer. He was just singing your praises the other day when I was on with his show.

[Dave Rubin]

Oh, well, I appreciate that. And, you know, I said to you right before we started, this is the first time we've ever spoke, but we did chat for about 30 seconds before the cameras rolled. I'm always interested in people who are evolving, who are thinking about things a little bit differently, and yours, especially to the backdrop of an election that was, you know, only five or six months ago, barely is particularly interesting. But before we get into the evolution and how that all happened, can you just. For people that don't know you, can you just give a bit of your background, what led you to becoming a Kamala advisor, and then we'll get into the politics of everything.

[Lindy Lee]

Well, I think in terms of what led me to help support her campaign, we all fell into it because we were all supporting Biden's campaign. And as by, as a member of DNC leadership, we had to do what we were told. There was no, no one asked for input or our feedback. As soon as he dropped out on July 21, all of us got shunted to Kamala Harris's team. So I just want to let you know that there was no room for outside mediation at all. It was what the party wanted. And she wants the media to think. I actually, I'm writing a book and laying out the entire truth of it. She wants the media to think that, oh, July 21, Biden dropped out. I just found out I was going to be the nominee. That's not true at all. She had been vetting VP nominees prior to July 21 and getting ready for this, getting ready for this sanction. But so in terms of why I supported her, it's because that's what the party told us to do. And I wanted to give her the benefit of the doubt, which I did, but then realized that she couldn't articulate a vision. She hid from the media for about a month. For a month in the middle of a 107 day campaign, which speaks volumes about the quality of candidate she is. And by the end of September, mid September, I just stopped fundraising. And by the way, I'm not a staffer. I was appointed to leadership. I did this in a volunteer capacity. I'm a mega donor. I donate my time and my resources. I donated buildings to the campaign because I wanted to. I'm not a staffer or consultant, just to be clear, because I feel like a lot of people don't realize that.

[Dave Rubin]

Yeah. And just tell me a little bit about your history before, even before you got involved in the Biden campaign and everything else. Just so people have a little backdrop to the sort of pre presidential politics.

[Lindy Lee]

Lyndy, I was an investment banker at Morgan Stanley and then actually, I've always wanted to run for Congress because, Dave, let me tell you, this is just the truth of it. If Republicans were my one issue, one of my major issues is clean air and clean water. I really care about that. I grew up, I was born in an authoritarian regime where pollution was so incredibly intense where you could slide your finger down the window and then look at it and it's black. Um, so I saw firsthand the environment is a huge issue to me. If, if Republicans were stronger on that issue, I would have been Republican like 15 years ago. I'm just gonna be very frank.

[Dave Rubin]

So you're an investment banker. You end up working in the administration. You were doing. And China, obviously is the country that you're from. You, you were doing outreach for Asian American community with Biden then. Was there a point before Biden stepped down that you realized things weren't going right either with his cognitive ability that, you know, many of us were talking about online, or just with the policies? I mean, were you feeling frustrations or was it all that on the day they flipped the switch that you suddenly started seeing things differently?

[Lindy Lee]

Absolutely, Dave. And I'm going to name names. They know who they are. Throughout 2023, I raised concerns actually before, but really, I really started redoubling my efforts about Biden's cognitive decline because it was so apparent to me that there was something wrong here. And I've known Biden for a long time. I've known him actually, not because of politics, but because I raised money for cancer research. Cancer research is something close to my heart. And I sat on the board of the American association for Cancer Research. We met through that, Through a non political arena. So I saw the marked decline in Biden. He was not like this in 2017 or even 2019. I think the stresses of the office really accelerated his decline. That's my. I'm not a medical doctor about that. That's just my guess because it was so obvious to me. And I brought it up to Ken Martin. And do you know who Ken Martin is? Does that name ring a bell?

[Dave Rubin]

Ken Martin was like, he's now the chair. Deputy chief. Oh, he's the chair.

[Lindy Lee]

He was the Democratic Party.

[Dave Rubin]

Oh, wow.

[Lindy Lee]

Yeah. So he was vice chair at the time that I brought it up. I said, don't you think there's something wrong here? Don't you think maybe we need a new candidate? And I said this to him in Chicago in 2023. I remember Wendell Pierce, the guy from the Wire, the actor was standing next to me. My brother was standing next to me. So I said this in front of other people too. I was like. And he. He completely poo pooed my concerns. Like I was crazy. Like I was some insane woman for bringing it up. I really felt like I was being. I definitely. I felt crazy. He made me feel ridiculous for bringing it up. And then I realized I was being gaslit, you know, and basically told I shouldn't believe my lying eyes. I approached him, I told Jenna Malley Dillon, the chair who ended up being the chair of the Biden Harris campaign, about my concerns. She wrote down my contact info. Never got back to me. So I made cons. I made repeated attempts. I leaked to the press. I leaked to Politico saying that Biden couldn't run. I reached out to party chieftains. I genuinely thought. Dave, I really wanted to. I thought that the Democratic Party would be the vehicle to save our country. I know there's going to be people who criticize me for saying that, but I tried so hard because I wanted someone who was actually capable of being Commander in Chief. And finally, sorry for talking your ear off.

[Dave Rubin]

Hey, it's an interview.

[Lindy Lee]

In July 2024, I went on Fox News Sunday, and I said it on air. Oh. Before I did, they threatened me because they print the Fox News Sunday. Guess the night form Politico, as you probably know. And so the White House called me the night before, saying, we know that you're going to be loyal. You're the. But you're President Biden's most loyal supporter. Which, like, is so reminiscent of something you'd hear from the Godfather.

[Dave Rubin]

Mm.

[Lindy Lee]

So they threatened me, and then I went on and said my piece anyway, that Biden should step aside. I got two to three angry phone calls on July 21st after my appearance on Fox News Sunday saying that Biden was too old. And then what do you know that day, he steps down. Yeah.

[Dave Rubin]

Do you think that the people that you were talking to that were gaslighting you or ignoring you or saying everything was fine, do you think that they genuinely felt that, or was everyone just kind of in on the unsaid thing? It sort of reminds me of the ridiculous right now. Whereas, I'm sure, you know, about a month ago, Jake Tapper announced he has a book about the scandal around Biden's health. It's like, dude, you were running cover for it three years while some of us were talking about it literally four or five years ago. So do you think it was, like, part people just protecting their turf, protecting their job, going with the system, part people that were manipulating him, part people just going along with the flow? Do you think it's just, like, multiple layers of everything?

[Lindy Lee]

I think you're totally right, Dave. And Jake Tapper in particular, pisses me off so much because he's the one who went on air and repeatedly attacked people for bringing it up. Lara Trump, like, making me feel crazy, but I will be. I do will say, his cognitive decline notwithstanding, he was always kind to me. I do want to make that clear. This is very hard for me to do. Biden was always kind to me. But that doesn't negate the fact that he was wrong for America. And I can only apologize as it took me a while to see it because I knew him, you know, in a private capacity through the cancer research. He treated me and my parents so well. And I kind of like, please forgive me, but I judge people kind of according to how they treat my parents, whom I love. Like they were just so good. And my parents, parents are immigrants. So for them to meet the United States President was just such an overwhelming experience. And I'm so glad that President Biden was gracious, but he was just completely wrong. He shouldn't have been there, he shouldn't have run. He certainly shouldn't have run a second time. But with Jake Tapper, he, he wasn't in the room and any, I'd never seen him at any events. So every, all the intel from his book is secondhand. And he was one of the foremost proponents of the lie. Dave, let's be honest what it was, it was an outright lie. Yeah, that he was cognitively flipped, that he was basically a genius behind closed doors. His book basically is like a slap in the face to those of us who are punished for bringing it up. And I mentioned the White House, but I also got booted off of MSNBC and cnn. I used to be on it all the time. I was a regular after I raised the age issue. I was only on MSNBC once and that was it. And every time some somebody would book me, I would find out like five minutes before the hit that Ian Sams, the White House spokesperson, would be replacing me. And the first time it happened, I was like, okay, that sucks. Yes, I got my hair ready and everything. That sucks. But life happens. But then it happened again and again and again. I was like, okay, this is clearly something's up is here. Something's up here. Subtle results still you, but with fewer lines. Botox Cosmetic Outobotulinum toxinae is a prescription medicine used to temporarily make moderate to severe frown lines, crow's feet and forehead lines look better in adults.

[Dave Rubin]

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[Lindy Lee]

Exactly.

[Dave Rubin]

Were you hearing, you kind of implied this before, but were you hearing grumblings about how it was going to go down or when it was going to go down, or were there different factions in the White House that, you know, there was. It sort of seemed like, okay, maybe Joe didn't know exactly what to do or wasn't aware, but Jill kind of wanted him to stay versus some of the people that just wanted him to just get into the office of the presidency so then he could step down because people kind of thought Kamala was no good. Like what, what level or what did you see in all of that?

[Lindy Lee]

Dave, you're right over target. I will adjust what you said, though. Jill didn't kind of want him to stay. Jill desperately wanted him to stay. And please bear in mind that during this time, Biden had Covid and Hunter was basically sitting in on White House meetings, high level meetings that require security clearances. This guy is a. Honestly, I'm not even entirely sure if he's a recovering drug addict.

[Dave Rubin]

They did find cocaine at the White House in an area that he was one of the few people that was in.

[Lindy Lee]

Exactly. And it's undeniable that he peddled his influence to enrich himself in the Big Guy, quote, unquote. So this is a guy sitting in the Oval Office listening in on top level White House meetings throughout this time, throughout the month of July. And I know because my friends are senior aides and you know, to like Steve Ruschetti and Nina Dunn. So Biden was like incapacitated this entire time because he was really sick. And remember that a few days before Trump suffered the assassination attempt. So people were freaking out. They, they rightly thought that the election was over. How do you beat a guy like that? And the way that he handled that with such self possession, I would have been freaking out. I would have been hysterical on stage.

[Dave Rubin]

No, no, it was. No, no. It was incredible watching him, that moment of composure and everything else.

[Lindy Lee]

Yeah, right. I mentioned that Because Democrats were in complete disarray would be putting it mildly. And this is the thing that people don't understand or they don't even know, and it hasn't been reported. There was no money coming in other than the monthly recurring ActBlue donations that they trick you into giving, obviously. But this is not an exaggeration. There was no money coming in after the debate. Like, I mean, zero.

[Dave Rubin]

Right.

[Lindy Lee]

There were staffers who I would just be, like, shooting shit with on the sofa because they had nothing to do. And we would just be commiserating because everybody lost faith. So Biden kind of markets his decision as an act of patriotism. It wasn't. There was no money coming in, so there was no way he would have continued. There's just no way.

[Dave Rubin]

Do you have any. Putting the money part aside. And everyone knows he was having huge fundraisers with George Clooney and Obama not too long before. Not too long. Right. Not too long before the debate. But putting the money part aside, do you have any insider info as to what the day or two before he stepped down was like? I mean, we keep hearing that Chuck Schumer and Nancy Pelosi, you know, basically got him behind closed doors. There's that other story about how he. They would hide him from people that were trying to get in. Mike Johnson told Barry Weiss that story about how for months they kept delaying meetings, and it was just sort of becoming obvious. But do you have any. Any insider stuff on those few days before? Like, what was it like when they finally got him to do that, if Jill was really pushing him to keep going?

[Lindy Lee]

Yeah, and I want to say I first hinted at this on the Shawn Ryan show, and then suddenly that new book that's coming out, Fight, I hate mentioning. I don't want to give them free advertising, but they were repeating something that I already said two months ago, like it's some new intel. I will expand on that. The role of Congressman James Clyburn has been seriously underestimated in the public sphere. He played such a huge role in so many instances of Biden's recent life, starting with his 2020 campaign. If it hadn't been James Clyburn, there would have been no Biden presidency. I want to be extremely clear about, because he came in fifth in New Hampshire. He was done. And he bombed in Iowa, too. Dave, do you remember this?

[Dave Rubin]

Yeah. Well, I remember they were basically trying to push him out and bring Mike Bloomberg in, and then that thing blew up.

[Lindy Lee]

Exactly how many delegates did he win? That was. Anyway, so James Clyburn saved his butt by endorsing him and allowing him to win the South Carolina primary. If it hadn't been his intervention, Biden would have been done. And that was the point at which Amy Klobuchar, Pete Buttigieg, and everyone, Theodore O'Rourke or rally around him. That was Clyburn. Clyburn is also the person that made him appoint Kentanji Brown Jackson. The woman. The woman who can't say what. Who a woman is. Yeah, right.

[Dave Rubin]

Hired because she. Or nominated because she was a woman. Just doesn't know what a woman is.

[Lindy Lee]

Exactly. And let's just be very clear. All these people are DEI candidates. Oh, and I forgot to mention that Kamala Harris is picked also, largely because of James Clyburn and James Clyburn. The reason why I'm bringing it up now is that Biden's original intention, which Biden's original intention, was to not endorse Kamala that day at all. And he would just roll it out at his own leisurely pace. He wanted this stage to himself, to make base, basically make a victory lap and, you know, luxuriate in all the love and admiration that he thought he deserved. But James Clyburn insisted, actually, he wanted Biden to endorse him in the first tweet. There were two tweets, and separated by half an hour. But the fact that Biden endorsed her so quickly afterwards was because of James.

[Dave Rubin]

So. So what is the influence that James had over Biden?

[Lindy Lee]

That Clyburn, South Carolina, that salvation? Because there would be no presidency were it not for Clyburn. And he kind of flies under the radar. But Clyburn is at every major fundraiser. I always see him at VIP events. He has his youngest looking wife. I forget her name. And the two of them would just be there, like, meandering the crowd. They're always there. I hosted Biden Harris here in Philadelphia in February 2023. Clyburn is there. I raised half a million for them in September, right after the debate in D.C. and Clyburn is there. He's there everywhere, just exerting a quiet influence. And I'm just. I'm genuinely shocked that the public hasn't caught on.

[Dave Rubin]

So. So what's the connection between Clyburn and. What more what most people seem to think, or at least the people who are talking about this, which. That it was this Pelosi Schumer game. What's. What's the connection there?

[Lindy Lee]

Clyburn was a Biden loyalist to the last. I bring up the Clyburn Thing is, because he is a source of a lot of the DEI that came out of the Biden administration. He. He wield a tremendous power. The people who most. You're right in that. Pelosi and actually Adam Schiff, another person who really wanted Biden out. They worked hand in hand. And honestly, I wanted Biden out. And I'm gonna be honest with you. I checked in, I texted Adam Schiff right before I went on Fox News Sunday. Just like saying, here's a heads up. I'm gonna ask that the president step down. Are you okay with that? You know, at that time, you know, I can't really, as a member of the party, you don't just freelance. Okay. I had a duty to make sure that everyone on the team knew what I was doing.

[Dave Rubin]

So did Clyburn have something to do with ultimately pushing him out in the most specific way I can possibly ask that.

[Lindy Lee]

Yes. In that he made his wishes known before Biden dropped out. That he wanted Kamala Harris. That was very telling. And Clyburn, unlike Biden, is in full control of his mental faculties. He wouldn't say something just to say something. He picks his words very carefully. And the fact that he came out and said, if Biden drops out, I would support Kamala, the fact that he said that at all was a huge tell. And we all heard it. And that provided the quote, unquote permission structure. The rest of us. He wasn't as obvious as the Schumers and the Pelosi's of the world. Of course not. But he definitely, at that point, we were all so fed up, so angry at Biden. And the only people who honestly wanted him to stay were those on his payroll and those with the last name Biden.

[Dave Rubin]

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[Lindy Lee]

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[Lindy Lee]

That day, I don't think Pelosi was in person with him. I think Schumer had visited him days before and it was much to his consternation. It basically failed. Biden was stubborn, AF as always, and he was sick throughout this time. So mind you, there weren't many people visiting him. He had Covid also. That was a convenient excuse for him to hunker down. What I will say is people were kept in the dark about the timing of the announcement, including the highest echelons of the United States government. For example, Anita Dunn, whom I worked in close concert with, had no idea. She did a conference call that morning telling people that we would stay the course, that they would stay the course. And so she had only like a minute heads up that the announcement was coming. And I had to. I can't stress enough how high up Anita Dunn was. She was basically part of the council. Presidents, Dave. We didn't have a president in the past. We had a council of these unelected people that you've never even heard of. And they're Anita Dunn, Mike Donnell and Steve Richetti. Three of them were running the country. Most Americans, I would say maybe like 1%, if that have heard of them. Right.

[Dave Rubin]

So just to be clear, you don't know who was in the room when he made that final decision. If we're to believe Steve Rachetti, Mike.

[Lindy Lee]

Donnell and his family.

[Dave Rubin]

Oh, so you do know.

[Lindy Lee]

Yeah, I'm just saying that Nancy Pelosi wasn't there on that day. Yeah, got it. And by the time they hated her so much, they continue to hate her so much. It's just. I don't think it's something that can be amended at this point. There's so much animosity. And I also want to mention that Team Harris and Team Biden hated each other, like, throughout, not just the final year, but throughout.

[Dave Rubin]

So they make the decision now, she becomes the nominee. In some sense. You're saying you were probably relieved because you didn't think he had the mental capacity to be president and in essence, wasn't the president. It was president by committee. Now it's Kamala. Just a couple days later. Were your initial feelings like, okay, this will be better, Dave?

[Lindy Lee]

I wanted to give her the benefit of the doubt. I. That's just my attitude towards people in general. Um, you have to. You know, my assumption is that you're not an asshole, that you're not a idiot. But that quickly, Maybe you haven't spent.

[Dave Rubin]

Enough time in D.C. yeah, yeah, that's true.

[Lindy Lee]

I mean, the default in D.C. is asshole, self interested, backstabber. Right. But now I know. I mean, after everything that I've been through this these last couple months. But with Kamala, I came here to be fully transparent and honest with you. Okay. Kamala Harris has always been extremely kind to me as a human being, so I really wanted to give her the benefit of the doubt. I've been to her holiday parties. I've been to so many things at the Naval Observatory, every time there's a major event, I would be there. I know. Doug, too. I really wanted to give my friends the benefit of the doubt. And people ask me why I didn't leave sooner. Do you know how hard it is to leave your entire world? Like, these people aren't just like political figures to me. They were my friends. They were my entire universe. You know, I just quickly realized that this is not someone who can lead the most powerful nation on the face of the earth. I also didn't want to cause a mess by saying that I was leaving. By, like, it's kind of like, this is an airport. You don't have to declare your departure. I kind of just stopped fundraising in the middle of September. She had a good debate, frankly, but a lot of the things that were going on in the party, I just couldn't stand for. It completely shook me that they didn't respond to the gender affirming surgery ad. I'm very much against that. I've always been against that. I've. You know, I fought against the leftists in the party five years ago, people think that I just jumped out of nowhere. And I've been a conservative. No, I've been fighting the left flank for, like, half of my life. AOC called me out on Twitter saying that I would rather. At that time, it was Twitter because I hinted that I would rather vote for Trump than Bernie Sanders. And so she crucified me over that. And I remember crying so hard that I broke the blood vessels underneath my eyes. At that time, I didn't have experience getting canceled. Now I'M canceled every week and I'm like, cancelable. But at that time, it was my first cancellation, so to speak. And because I dared to question the leftist narrative and because I said, we need to move back to the center. And actually, five years ago, Ben Shapiro provided me a home because I had no home. And so for me, this is not something. It's not overnight. I've been. Frankly, I've been occupying the middle ground for all my life, and they've been lurching the left, and I've been moving, shifting to the right, because as you get older, you get wiser.

[Dave Rubin]

I know a little bit about that.

[Lindy Lee]

I know Dave stuff. You are the embodiment of that, as I mentioned. Like, I read as many comments as I can, and everyone's like, you should learn from Dave. Like, watch his incredibly inspiring story. And one thing I do want to say about you, Dave, I've had a number of health issues because of this. We don't have to go into that, but somebody mentioned. Actually a number of people mentioned you. When you first left the party, you were under so much physical strain. Like, not even just psychological, emotional, but physical strain. Like, it was really hard on you.

[Dave Rubin]

No, I developed. People know I did that.

[Lindy Lee]

You look so handsome nowadays. Like, just read my comments. You should just Google, like, well, indylearubin. There's so many people saying how remarkable you look now, how healthy you look, how, you know you are thriving. It takes a while, but, you know, first you were beaten down because they were just brutal to you, but look at you now.

[Dave Rubin]

Well, that's very kind of you to mention. And it's weird because, you know, it's funny because when I was leaving the left, or whatever you want to call it, my career started exploding, and yet I was dealing with so much hate. And then I developed this crazy autoimmune disease and I lost huge amounts of my hair and I was taking all this medication. So I look back on those videos that so many people remind me of all the time. Why I left the left on Prageru. It's been seen like 40 million times or something. And I look at the video and I'm like, it's hard for me to even look at myself. So it's a weird dichotomy between, like, success and then also that I was going through something that. And by the way, when you tell me that that you've gone through some health things as it relates to all this, I've heard that a lot from people that go through this, because suddenly your side Hates you. And that is so. That is such a slap in the face. It is so at odds with everything that you want to believe as a liberal. That the liberal side will be acting illiberal. That it. That it puts you in this.

[Lindy Lee]

Exactly. Position. Suddenly the party of Di. Actually some fringe actors on the right also have. I don't even, you know, the Streisand effect. You shouldn't really amplify lies.

[Dave Rubin]

Yeah. It's not worth it.

[Lindy Lee]

Heinous. Heinous stuff. Heinous stuff. And yeah. This has been the worst period of my life. No. No contest. No.

[Dave Rubin]

So. Well, you know what? You're gonna have a whole bunch of new people finding you from this. That. That have been through that journey. So that. That's the beautiful thing, right. Like you tell the truth and then new people find you. That. That just is it. But so as you were breaking now and you're starting to realize, boy, she is not ready to do this. Did you feel that. That the subtext to that was that this was the final move of the Democrats going completely crazy to the left. Like, it wasn't just about that maybe she was incompetent, but that whatever you were issuing concerns about for years about that the left was no longer acting liberally, that this was the final step for them to do that.

[Lindy Lee]

She was. You bring up a really good point, Dave. The. The. Yeah, I just. She was pretending to be a moderate when I distinctly remember her praising woke on stage. I think she said it's good to be woke, everyone. Oh, of course.

[Dave Rubin]

I mean, there's a million examples. Yeah, yeah.

[Lindy Lee]

Right. And she lambasted someone too, for I have no. Like she would just say this crazy stuff. And then I just don't understand because when I speak to her on a one on one basis, she's not an idiot, I don't think. Or unless my. My powers discernment are completely off. But when she talks on stage, she's just. Her brain completely melts. And it occurred to me that we don't just have one leader in cognitive decline. We had two. And I just don't trust her to be handling our nuclear arsenal. I mean, this is no joke here, okay? This isn't some playground political thing. This was our nation at stake. So at the end of it, as you. Because the left had gotten so crazy and doubled down on identity politics and the chair of the party who continues to attack me to this day for calling him out for lying about Biden's cognitive decline, he called me a narcissist for Pointing that out, by the way. I don't know what that has to do with me. I was talking about him. But these people who love identity politics were running the show. I couldn't bring myself to vote for Kamala. I left it blank. And I'm gonna be honest with you. At that time, I couldn't bring myself to vote for Trump either. And that's the honest truth of it.

[Dave Rubin]

Right. So let's pick up there, because I think that'll kind of get us to the rest of the evolution, let's say. So, okay, you don't vote for Kamala, you don't vote for Trump, but now.

[Lindy Lee]

I did vote for my senator.

[Dave Rubin]

You did vote for your senator. Who's your. Wait. Oh, you voted for Fetterman. You're in Philadelphia.

[Lindy Lee]

Fetterman ran four years ago. Three years ago, I voted for Bob Casey because.

[Dave Rubin]

Ah, yes.

[Lindy Lee]

Yeah. Who actually lost. He was one. He's one of the most moderate. He was one of the most moderate members of the Senate. And also, I knew him personally. He's a pro life. Very, very few pro life Democrats out there.

[Dave Rubin]

Yeah, boss.

[Lindy Lee]

Decent guy.

[Dave Rubin]

That's a dime a dozen these days. But. Okay, so you. You officially. Did you. If. Did you make an official announcement that you were leaving the party or. You basically just said, I'm not. I'm not part of this anymore. Like, I'm not fundraising for you people. I'm not advising anymore. Was there, like, an announcement that was made?

[Lindy Lee]

Dave? I love how people think. There's this grand plan, and I have a PR team, and all that was orchestrated.

[Dave Rubin]

Right.

[Lindy Lee]

I literally survived day by day. I have no team. It's just me. I don't have an entourage. This is. I. I don't have an assistant. Every day, I just speak my truth, and it leads to something else. I never planned on leaving the party, but. How do you stay? How could you ask someone to stay in an abusive relationship? I don't. Am I allowed to use profanity on here? And I'm not using it.

[Dave Rubin]

This is the Internet. Do your thing.

[Lindy Lee]

They would come into. Even today. Go look at my comments. I'm speaking out on immigration, which is something I really care about. They call me a slut, chink, whore, cunt, whatever, on a daily basis. And all that is fine. I mean, it's not fine, but I can survive it. But when you attack my family and you find their address, you find again with my parents. When you attack my parents, who have, frankly, had nothing at all to do with this. It just. It's not. It's like, beyond Crossing the Line. And then when you defame me to the point where a member of the Trump team has to offer me a lawyer, I now have Tim Politori, who represents Pete Hegseth. We share the same lawyer because people are defaming me on both the right and the left. You can call me whatever, but you cannot defame my character and call me a traitor to this country. I love my country. I love America. I would do everything for my country. I would go to war. I would fly a bomber jet and drop bombs on our enemies. For this country, I would do anything. I've condemned our enemies, Communist China, more times than I can count throughout my life. They killed my great grandfather. I hate that regime. Xi Jinping is a piece of shit. So you can call me whatever you want, but you cannot defame me maliciously. You just can't. And so that is what bothers me. It's not the name calling. It's not the harassing. It's when you maliciously make things up about me that you know not to be true. And then there's one person who did, and I gave her an hour and a half to prove it, and she couldn't. I was just sitting there on her show. I don't want to name names here. She's. She's gonna. She's gonna come after me again. But it's just. It's just so ridiculous. Mandy, if it's just so bad.

[Dave Rubin]

So you. Okay, so you have this evolution, this wake up, all of these things. Now it's post election. You're talking about what some of the corruption that you've seen that you've laid out here, and you've now gotten sort of welcomed into the more conservative world. You've been on a lot of the shows. You've talked to a lot of these people. Has any of that been surprising to you? I mean, if I go back 10 years, I remember when I started doing it, the thing that I really was surprised by was that everyone was nice, conservatives were kind and decent and loved to agree to disagree and would break bread with you after. And that they were fun and smiley and happy and generous of spirit, and they weren't just concerned about money and war. And as sort of ridiculous as that sounds, I think a lot of people go through that period, and yours obviously not too. Not in the too distant future. If you agree that that's fair to say.

[Lindy Lee]

I totally agree with you. And I totally agree with you. I've gotten thousands of emails from people around the world. Even, like, American expatriates in Australia saying, you know, we're so proud of you. We know how hard it is. I will say, though, Dave, again, I'm here to be fully transparent and honest. 99% of conservatives are amazing. I would say actually 99.5%. Like, very, very high. Like, basically everybody. But there's a small segment of influencers, sure. Influencers in particular, who are so pissed off they think that you're after their, like, income or whatever. Here I am. I don't want a job. I'm good. Look at me. I'm like, I'm good. I'm here in a, you know, I. Penthouse. I'm good. I don't need anything. I'm not after a job in the Trump administration, which is another allegation. You couldn't even pay me to work for the government. But there are some influencers out there who are so bad that I jumped the line. And so they tar me as a communist. Someone called me a communist ass, whatever that means, Even though my family was killed by the communist regime, even though I went to war with the communists in the Democratic Party for all my life. And so, yes, conservatives as a whole are the best people. I love them. It's the mercenary influencers who do this for a living. They think that it's a zero sum game, and if you win, they. If you win, they can't win, too. And it's just such a. It's just such a deeply hurtful mentality because I just. I'm not here to take anything from anyone. I just want to talk like it's.

[Dave Rubin]

I think mercenary influencer is a. Is a good way to put it. I try not to, you know, play in that pool with.

[Lindy Lee]

You're not that. I wouldn't have approached your team had I. You are one of the shining stars in this conservative ecosystem constellation. One of the best people. And when I was on Piers Morgan with you, before we had even spoken, I could see the kindness in your eyes. You should go back. Our clip went viral. I don't know if you know that. The clip of me talking on Pierce, you were in the back, just nodding.

[Dave Rubin]

Yeah, we'll throw some B roll so people can watch it while you and I are talking.

[Lindy Lee]

Yeah. But I could just tell. I think I can read body cues. Really? You just. You were so embracing of me, and I so desperately needed it at that time.

[Dave Rubin]

It's funny. Well, the way that show works, you're, you know, you're in these four boxes, and you don't always know who the other person is. In this case, I knew who you were, but I didn't know you in any way. But you know, you hear something decent and great, it's like, okay, we're on the same team now. Let's see what happens. Plus, we had a former boss of mine screaming at me like a lunatic. So it didn't take much to push us together. But tell me a little bit more about do you feel that your politics have now evolved, let's say post election, so you get welcomed into this new world. You're with a lot of these conservatives now. These are people who you were about to vote against, you know, six months ago. Do you feel that you've shifted in any way ideologically or do you still think that you're kind of the same and the party's gone, which obviously a lot of people say that sort of thing.

[Lindy Lee]

Dave, I'm going to tell you one thing. There's a managing editor at Fox and I reached, reached out to him about a year ago saying that I don't belong here anymore. A year ago. And so he's going around telling people, I trust Lindy. The thing is she wasn't, she's not faking now. She was faking then and I'm sorry that I faked because the party just shifted, right? Shifted beneath my feet. I started as a Democrat when I was 13 and this whole time the party under Obama, it just went so extreme. It became this woke monster and I never signed up for that. But this entire time they were my entire world. I grew up in Philadelphia. It's an extremely liberal city. I went to an extremely liberal university as well. I continue to live in extremely liberal city. I ran for Congress as a Democrat. People have to understand that I wasn't just a rank and file Democrat. I was part of leadership. It's almost impossible to leave. It was so hard for Tulsi to leave and who I actually know. It just, it's so hard. So it's not that my views have changed, it's that my views have been revealed and I can finally talk about it. The person who I love the most in the world actually was teasing me the other day. He's like, I used to be so embarrassed because you would just go off on your right wing tangents in Ubers and lifts. And everyone over here, he's like, now you don't have to whisper.

[Dave Rubin]

Yeah, or you can move down to Florida. You never have to whisper about anything.

[Lindy Lee]

That's true. I'm actually thinking about Moving to Miami.

[Dave Rubin]

But surprise, surprise, I will show you. I'll show you all the cool spots.

[Lindy Lee]

Thank you. Yeah. It's so good to finally be myself. It's so good to vocalize my views on immigration. I'm a naturalized immigrant. We came here the right way. It pisses me off to no end that Democrats worship migrants at the expense of the American people. It's frankly, it disgusts me. And these are views that I could never say before when I voiced my opposition to affirmative action years ago. They call me a bigot and a racist. And what people don't understand is that, oh, and Democrats are now attacking me as a DEI hire. First of all, number one, I'm unhirable. Thank you very much. There's nothing you can do to make me.

[Dave Rubin]

And Asians definitely don't fit into that calculator.

[Lindy Lee]

Exactly. So I'm not a de. A higher. Because Asian American women in particular are the Highest scores, exams, SATs, ACTs. So they don't know. They just don't know enough about that. But yeah, so I lost. Original question.

[Dave Rubin]

So do you consider yourself a Republican? I mean, I always say to people, look, I wrote a book, it was the best, it might be the best selling book in American history about defending classical liberalism. So it's not that I don't have my classically liberal beliefs anymore. I still do. I've shifted a little bit, I would say, right economically, probably, but I still have the same beliefs. And I just feel like I'm on the, let's say, slightly more liberal wing of a wide tent Republican Party. I'm not. I'm not a traditional conservative Republican, obviously, but I think in the MAGA movement there's plenty of room. It seems to me you're kind of in the same spot as me, but do you consider yourself a Republican now? Do you walk around going, I'm a laminated card Republican. It's in my pocket?

[Lindy Lee]

I would say I am. Dave, you would be surprised to hear that I am so far right on immigration that I think I'm off the charts. You'll be surprised. Like my.

[Dave Rubin]

Are you going to round up some people after this interview? Keep the camera. Are you going to round up some people after this interview? We could keep the camera rolling.

[Lindy Lee]

I'm happy to be the Asian Christine. Om I. If it were up to me, we'd stop immigration today and make sure that only geniuses and people couldn't actually contribute to American society. Like my father, he ended up at Harvard Medical Medical School. He saved lives and he switched to Real estate created hundreds of American jobs. These are the people we should bring into the country. We shouldn't bring in parasites, people who are a drain on the United States Treasury. I feel strongly about that. I'm also very conservative socially and very conservative fiscally. I grew up with nothing and built. We built something amazing through hard work and determination. Didn't take a handout from anybody. So all these experiences shaped my worldview. Again, okay, I'm extremely far right on these issues. However, I'm also a strong environmentalist. I'm sorry, I can't ever relinquish that. I'm very Nixonian in that regard, in that I love what he did with what Nixon originally did with the EPA and the Clean Air act and Clean Water Act. What I don't like is a Green New Deal and the fact that Democrats have used my issue, loving the environment, loving our heritage, as a chance to impose these Marxist and Communist ideas on the country. That's not what I signed up for. I signed up for clean air.

[Dave Rubin]

And are you seeing Trump or this administration go after the environment in a way that you're not happy with? I mean, I know Lee Zeldin, who's heading EPA right now. He's cut a lot what seems like blatant waste and a lot of DEI stuff with Doge out of DEI stuff. Right. So have they done anything that you know of as far as the environment that you're not happy with yet? I mean, is there something there?

[Lindy Lee]

Not yet. I'm watching very carefully. All right, I'm sitting on the edge of my seat. I really. I have to tell you, this is going to sound really gross, but I want to give people a graphic understanding of what pollution is. I spent three years in China. I was born there. Unfortunately, I would give anything to rewrite my history to be born as something else. By the way, that's a story for another day. It's. It's hard not to hate yourself when other people hate you for something that you can't change. But that's a different story. So China is so polluted that when you sneeze, your mucus is black. Do people know that? So I've experienced that myself, and that really traumatized me, and that scarred me for life. And I don't want our country to be like that, too. And so for me, it's really just a matter of pollution. I'm also a runner. I run outside every day. I love nature. I love the woods. I just want to. I'm like, very tr. I just want to Protect. I think America is the most beautiful country on earth. We got to protect our heritage for our generation, for the next generation. Yeah. I don't like what AOC is doing. She's trying to couple this environmental issue, what Greta Thunberg and her people are doing it. The environment should not be a political thing. Right. Everyone should be able to get behind it.

[Dave Rubin]

Not only do I think Lee Zeldin's a good guy, but look, Trump's got, you know, Bobby Kennedy, now he's at hhs. But this is a guy who has spent his life protecting wildlife and talking about our national parks and forests and everything else. I think you're going to be pleasantly surprised on that front. What's next for you, Lindy, besides moving to Miami?

[Lindy Lee]

I really.

[Dave Rubin]

We're almost out of room, so you got to get moving quick.

[Lindy Lee]

I, I, I. You know, I was at in Miami for PBD's podcast. It really changes your entire mental health. It's like an entire different universe. It's like 30 degrees up here, but sun, it's paradise down there. Willow. So I'm very happy for you. I am just gonna keep living my life. I told you, I am writing a book. And people should be scared. People in the Democratic Party from Biden on down, I remember everything. I have a very strong hippocampus. And everybody, they should be scared because I know exactly where the bodies are buried. And also the people who abandoned me after I told the truth and the people who bought into the lies about me, I remember it all. And I'm sorry. I'm a. I'm. I just. I don't know. I'm not going to protect them. I protected them for so much of my life. I'm not going to offer that protection anymore. And my goal is to prevent the current iteration of the Democratic Party from ever gaining power again. I feel like it's my duty and responsibility. I know Pete Buttigieg. I know Kamala Harris. I've met Gavin Newsom. They are not equipped to run our country. And all of them are going to run for some office again.

[Dave Rubin]

Our work is cut out for us. I have thoroughly enjoyed this. I told you before I started. These are the conversations I enjoy the most, watching someone go through it. And you can feel the. You can feel the passion and, and the pain and the, and the hope, and it's all, it's all there. So we will do this in person next time in Miami. What do you say?

[Lindy Lee]

I. That would be the honor of a lifetime. Dave. Everyone that I've spoken to you. Everyone that I've spoken to about you was completely right. Completely right. You are a gem. Thank you so much for having me.

[Dave Rubin]

It was my pleasure. Thank.