The Rubin Report – "Dark Future Predictions & Exposing the Truth About Australia’s Past"

Guest: Tony Abbott (Former Prime Minister of Australia)
Host: Dave Rubin
Date: October 21, 2025

Episode Overview

In this episode, Dave Rubin sits down with former Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott to dive deep into the future of Western civilization, the political and cultural currents shaping Australia, and the real history of the nation as addressed in Abbott’s new book. Their wide-ranging discussion covers U.S.-Australia relations, immigration policy, national identity, the challenges of political correctness, and the importance of historical perspective.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Resilience of Western Civilization & the Danger of Self-Loathing

• Abbott opens the discussion by reflecting on Western societies' unique ability for self-criticism as a strength that’s risked mutating into self-loathing.
  • “I think that self critical capacity which has been so important to our survival and success up till now has to some extent mutated into a kind of self loathing. And this is very destructive...For nations, for cultures, for civilizations, as for individuals, almost nothing is worse than self loathing.”
    (Tony Abbott, 01:00 & 16:52)

2. The U.S.–Australia Alliance & Geopolitical Dynamics

• Rubin and Abbott discuss recent developments in the Australia–U.S. relationship, including the Aukus security pact and critical minerals deal.
  • Abbott emphasizes enduring ties based on shared interests, democratic values, and history.
  • He notes Australia’s consistent military support for the U.S.
  • “Of all the English speaking countries...we are linked by interests, by values, by history. I don’t believe we’re foreign countries to each other...The relationship is strong.”
    (Tony Abbott, 06:24)
  • Calls attention to the threat posed by China and the need for strong alliances: “Communist China is a more formidable competitor than the old Soviet Union ever was… we have to take the Beijing regime seriously when it says that it is determined to take Taiwan by force if necessary...”
    (Tony Abbott, 07:30)

3. Australia’s Political Culture & Recent Shifts

• They explore the analogy between Australia and the UK, both oscillating between center-right and center-left governments.
  • Abbott notes that strong conservative governance can moderate future left-leaning governments, while uninspiring right-leaning governments allow the left to push further:
    “It’s important for conservative governments to be strong because when you get a strong conservative government, the next center left labor government will be better than would otherwise be the case.”
    (Tony Abbott, 11:13)

4. National Identity, History, and Conflicted Narratives

• Rubin brings up Abbott’s new book, which tries to correct what Abbott sees as a growing sense of national malaise and shame about Australia’s past.
  • Abbott draws parallels to how America obsesses over slavery, Britain over empire, and Australia over indigenous dispossession.
  • He urges for a balanced view:
    • “The story of Aboriginal Australia was not just one of conflict with the settlers, it was also one of cooperation...We should judge our forebears not by modern stereotypes, but by the best standards of their day, not our day.”
      (Tony Abbott, 12:54)
  • On Western guilt: “Faith in institutions as well as religious faith… has declined… Self-critical capacity has mutated into a kind of self loathing… almost nothing is worse than self loathing.”
    (Tony Abbott, 16:52)

5. Immigration, Integration, and Multiculturalism

• The challenges and philosophy around immigration are discussed, with Abbott stating that while illegal immigration was tackled by his government, legal migration remains high, often subcontracted to education providers and businesses.

  • On national character:

    • “The three pillars upon which modern Australia rests: an Aboriginal heritage, a British foundation and an immigrant character. We are a fundamentally Anglo Celtic culture...with a profoundly Judeo Christian ethos.”
      (Tony Abbott, 22:02)

  • On policy and workfare:

    • Abbott defends the “Work for the Dole” program as both economically and morally important: “The something for nothing mindset is very, very corrosive and it breeds, I think, a destructive sense of entitlement. The world does not owe us a living.”
      (Tony Abbott, 28:18)

  • He warns against excessive multiculturalism, preferring integration over separatism:

    • “I think that 99.9% of migrants, even now, want to be as Australian as they can be, as quickly as they can be...But given governmental funding for ethnic activist organizations that have a vested interest in trying to perpetuate difference, there has been this rise of separatism.”
      (Tony Abbott, 29:51)

6. Ceremony, Values, and National Holidays

• Abbott laments moves away from having citizenship ceremonies on Australia Day, stressing the need for civic unity and pride.
  • “Some green left councils… have opted out of citizenship ceremonies on Australia Day because they don’t see Australia Day as the point when the modern world came wonderfully into an ancient land. They see it...as a day of embarrassment, even shame.”
    (Tony Abbott, 32:14)

7. History in Context: The Myall Creek Massacre Trial

• Abbott shares the historical example of the Myall Creek massacre and subsequent trial of stockmen for the murder of Aboriginal people, highlighting instances of justice and moral response even in 19th-century Australia.
  • “The jury did convict, and seven white men were hanged for the murder of black men back in 1838. Now ask yourself, did that happen in the United States at that time?...For all our errors, British justice did sometimes prevail.”
    (Tony Abbott, 34:03)

8. Australian Geography, Ethos, and Tourism

• Discussion turns lighter as Rubin seeks local advice for first-time visitors.

  • Abbott paints a vivid picture of Sydney:

    • “...Combine Yellowstone with LA and New York, the water of New York, the beaches of LA, with the beauty of Yellowstone, then you’ve got something like Sydney.”
      (Tony Abbott, 40:19)

  • On the Great Barrier Reef:

    • “Don’t believe the climate alarmists. The Barrier Reef waxes and wanes. In fact, the area of coral cover is at an all time record or certainly at its greatest since statistics were kept.”
      (Tony Abbott, 41:11)

  • Best places to surf: Manly Beach, especially North Stain, for an accepting community.

  • How to eat Vegemite: On toast, “a little bit of butter and then a bit of vegemite.”
    (Tony Abbott, 43:42)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Almost nothing is worse than self loathing.”
  (Tony Abbott, 01:00 & 16:52)
• “Of all the English speaking countries...we are linked by interests, by values, by history.”
  (Tony Abbott, 06:24)
• “If you want to destroy a country, it's much better to destroy the self belief of its citizens than it is to destroy its physical infrastructure.”
  (Tony Abbott, 19:34)
• “The three pillars upon which modern Australia rests: an Aboriginal heritage, a British foundation and an immigrant character.”
  (Tony Abbott, 22:02)
• “The story [Aboriginal Australians] was not just one of conflict… it was also one of cooperation and partnership.”
  (Tony Abbott, 12:54 & 34:03)
• “Don’t believe the climate alarmists. The Barrier Reef waxes and wanes.”
  (Tony Abbott, 41:11)
• On Vegemite: “I’m probably going to get expelled from the country, but I’m not a huge fan of veggie.”
  (Tony Abbott, 43:48)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• Introduction of major theme—Western self-criticism and self-loathing: 01:00
• Kickoff of main interview—U.S.–Australia relationship: 02:19–09:53
• Abbott discusses his new book and national historical narratives: 12:31–16:52
• Role of Cultural Marxism and decline of faith: 16:52–19:34
• Immigration, “Work for the Dole,” and multiculturalism: 22:02–32:08
• Australian history—Myall Creek Massacre: 34:03
• Australian geography, tourism tips, and the Great Barrier Reef: 40:19–41:50
• Vegemite debate: 43:42–end

Closing Notes

This episode delivers a rich, opinionated, and reflective take on what makes Australia tick—its history, people, challenges, and future outlook—through the lens of a veteran statesman. Listeners come away with a nuanced understanding of the strengths and tensions at play not just in Australia, but across the wider Western world. Abbott’s perspective on national pride, immigration, and history is both assertive and candid, offering much food for thought for audiences interested in geopolitics, culture, and identity.