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- [00:00]
A
There is this rise of explicit socialism, reclaiming that term on the left, which has been for a long time and with obvious good reason, a very dirty word. But I can understand the psychology, because if you are being told every single day that Donald Trump is this Hitler figure, he's the worst thing to happen in America, including slavery. And then you lose with the Kamala corporate hack party person. It's like, guys, we gotta double down. We gotta fight. Because otherwise, you know, in their mindset, you know, another term of Trump or Trump Jr. Would destroy America. So it's kind of, we're at a point where both political tribes genuinely think, maybe not incorrectly, that one more term of the opposing team is going to be the end of this country as we know it. They might be both wrong, they might be both right. But that's a scary place to be when you have this level of animus because things can quickly spiral out of control, both in a legal sense and in an extralegal sense.
- [01:13]
B
All right, it's June 29, 2026. I'm Dave Rubin, this is the Rubin Report. And I am joined by my old friend, host of yore. Welcome Michael Malice, the Willy Wonka of politics. That really should be the name of your show or it should be on your epitaph or something.
- [01:34]
A
Well, okay, first of all, I am an old friend because we're both turning 50 imminently. Let's not talk about epitaphs as we look at 50 years old, babe, I think that word is creeping in a little too soon to both of our consciousnesses.
- [01:49]
B
Fair enough. Fair enough. So we are. This is airing on Monday the 11th. Monday the 29th at 11am People know that it's a pre record because I am actually in D.C. right now. I went to see or I'm going to see as we tape this, depending on which side of the time continuum you're on. I'm going to see Bill Maher get the Kennedy Center Award, which I'm very excited about. But I did not realize that you also. I just turned 50 on the 26th. You are turning 50. What'd you tell me on July 11th? Is that what you said?
- [02:18]
A
July 12th, the day Hamilton died.
- [02:20]
B
Yes, July 12th. So we are of a certain age. We are Gen Xers. And why don't we maybe start there? Because we're just going to kind of shoot the, you know, what about the issues of the day? Have the Gen Xers failed us here? Just that the gerontocracy and the 80 year olds held on so long and now we seem to be handing everything to the young kids. Did our guys, did our generation with Elon and maybe a few exceptions, just not do what we were supposed to do to save the world?
- [02:50]
A
Well, what are you being supposed to do? I mean, I'm hostile body language. I think Gen X speaks pretty well for itself, I think. Certainly maybe not on the political side, but that's a mess across the board.
- [03:01]
B
Well, I'm talking about from the political side. I think Gen Xers in general, we put aside all the racist stuff, we put aside the homophobia, like we did all that stuff. We really were a very good special generation that grew up at the peak 80s America stuff. And there was so much newness all the time in music and creation and movies and video games and sports was great. But did we not do something along the way to grab some of the political part? But I'm happy to talk about it from a wider lens too.
- [03:28]
A
No, I think you're correct. I think it's kind of odd that politics is going from boomer to the generation after us. We're like the dad who left to get cigarettes and never came home. I think we're largely underrepresented. I think Jamie Vance might be one obviously prominent example to the contrary. I'm sure there's plenty of others that I can think of at the top of my head. But. But yeah, it did seem to.
- [03:48]
B
But I think he's Gen Y or millennial.
- [03:51]
A
Is he? Oh, so yeah, we're so. I can't think of one. I'm sure if I sat down, did the math, there's plenty of people. But it has been going from like 80, 70s and 80 year olds. Trump, Pelosi, Steny Hoyer, Mitch McConnell to the Donnie, the AOC types. I'm sure you saw on Tuesday where there were these sweeps of these Democratic socialists which seemed to be taking over the Democratic Party, which is something that the Democratic Brent Body party corporate hacks are none too happy with, despite what they might claim to the contrary publicly. So I mean, are we looking at a future between like 80 year old MAGA types and Mamdani types? I mean, this is. I feel like a boomer in this sense because I feel a lot of times when boomers look at contemporary politics, especially the boomers who don't like Trump's style and Persona, you know, they think it vulgar, whatever. And they're like, I don't have a horse in this race. I hate them both. I think sometimes those of us in Gen X, if you're looking at like you know, like the Mamdani people or the Kathy Hochul people. It's like, my God, like, what do you do?
- [04:55]
B
Right. So what do you make of where the Democrats are at right now? I mean, you've written a lot about authoritarian regimes, and you've been to North Korea and wrote a whole book about it. And you, you know, you know an awful lot about Soviet Russia and everything else. Like, what is going on with these Democrats right now?
- [05:13]
A
I gotta tell you, maybe you're not gonna be too happy to hear this. I don't think Mamdani is a worse mayor than Bill de Blasio was. I mean, I think he talks a big game. And I. And you. And I think a lot of people were kind of nervous that when day one, he comes into office, he's gonna put his you know what on the desk and be like, this is my house now. He has no allegiance to Democratic Party apparatus as a whole. They fought him just like Trump had no allegiance to the Republican establishment. Certainly in 20 who did everything they could to keep him from getting the nomination were none too happy when he was the nominee and was certain to lose. But at the same time, in terms of being a mayor, maybe my standards are so low, you and I both fled the New York City area. I don't see anything he's doing that's largely outside the mainstream of Democratic Party history. And to the other side, he's in the White House shaking hands with Trump. Now, this is something that, you know, when Gretchen Whitmer was in that Oval Office, she was covering her face with a file folder somehow that would make her invisible. I think most Democrats, you know, Andrew Cuomo, when he was governor, was heavily criticized for praising Trump during COVID And it was a very. You know, Trump is poisoned. You can't say one positive thing about him. And he kind of broke that taboo. So it's a very weird situation. What's going on with the Democrats. I would be more concerned. One more point. If they didn't have such huge landslides in the New Jersey and Virginia gubernatorial races. So if either those candidates went down or if either those candidates didn't win as heavily as they did, then all signs would be like, all right, the Mamdani wing is the wing of the future. Like, that's where our electoral success will be. But they didn't have that. As the result, the Virginia, New Jersey wins were much bigger. So now they still have to have this crossroads.
- [07:08]
B
Right. You know, interestingly, for the record, my fear was never that it would be Day one with him where he'd slam it on the deck desk and here we go. I always felt, from months ago, I was saying what I think will happen is that for about a year they can kind of fake it and it'll sort of look good. And what I was worried about was then it'll start scaling. And I do think it's starting to scale right now. So even so, I'll go with you. That. Let's say his. Let's say his policies are just a little more. This isn't exactly what I think, but for the purpose of the argument, let's just say his policies are just a little more socialist and a little more communist than, say, Bill de Blasio. Let's go with that. My bigger issue would be that he. He's mixing a little Islamism or jihadism into it. And what's going on with radical Islam? What do you make of that?
- [07:53]
A
Well, I think the blueprint for that,
- [07:54]
B
like putting aside the economic part for a second.
- [07:57]
A
Right. I think the blueprint for that is Siddiq Khan, who was the mayor of London, who was the mayor after Boris Johnson, which is quite an odd pairing. And you see this also in the mayor of. Was it Seattle or Portland, I forget which one. Where this very young woman who's an open socialist, was elected somewhere in Austria. I'm blanking what city elected their first Communist mayor? Obviously, that's not in the United. So there is this rise of explicit socialism, reclaiming that term on the left, which has been for a long time and with obvious good reason, a very dirty word. But I can understand the psychology, because if you are being told every single day that Donald Trump is this Hitler figure, he's the worst thing to happen in America, including slavery. And then you lose with the Kamala corporate hack party person. It's like, guys, we gotta double down. We gotta fight. Because otherwise, you know, in their mindset, you know, another term of Trump or Trump Jr. Would destroy America. So it's kind of. We're at a point where both political tribes genuinely think, maybe not incorrectly, that one more term of the opposing team is going to be the end of this country as we know it. They might be both wrong, they might be both right. But that's a scary place to be when you have this level of animus, because things can quickly spiral out of control, both in a legal sense and in an extralegal sense.
- [09:27]
B
So what would you say, those of us broadly on the right, or at least that are not socialists, communists, part of that thing, are There better techniques that we should be doing to disconnect people from these bad ideas beyond mocking them. And we can call them out. We can say why capitalism's better and why socialism doesn't work. What are the better techniques? Because I think we all have to level up right now. Otherwise, I think you're right. We will end up in a cold civil war. There'll just be no way around it.
- [09:59]
A
I don't know that I know what those better techniques are. First of all, I think a lot of this is follow the money, like with any situation like this. Where are the Mamdani types getting their funding? Who's paying for the social media? Also, you know, AOC is not exactly a rocket scientist, right? And her social media game is second to none. So it would behoove Republicans to reverse engineer, figure out, okay, what is she doing that's working for her? So, well, there's what, 40. Let's suppose people in the House whose names people know off the top of their heads. And even that's being generous. The fact that everyone in America knows this broad's name isn't due to any bills she's passed. It's simply due to her social media game. And because she's kind of cute, but that has a limited shelf life, as you and I are both well aware as we approach 50 and have reached 50. But that is something where.
- [10:50]
B
That's not why they're coming to the show.
- [10:51]
A
Come on.
- [10:52]
B
Come on.
- [10:53]
A
But I mean, you and I, to that point, you and I are both old enough to remember during Obama, the media were creaming themselves because Obama's social media game is so great.
- [11:05]
B
The.
- [11:05]
A
And they've leveraged Facebook and the Republicans are cavemen. And they're never going to be elected because the social media game is just on lock. And then Donald Trump, who was never elected at anything, who was regarded politically as a joke, tweeted his way into the White House. So all these tools or techniques that either team uses are public. And it just takes enough young people, I would think, to be like, all right. But the thing is, I don't think Mitch McConnell and Mitch McConnell types are listening to their grandkids to be like, this is what you need to do on Instagram. This is what you need to do in TikTok and so on.
- [11:39]
B
I'm pretty sure they have Mitch McConnell with the air thing in his mouth right now, forcing him to watch this show every day. So we'll see. Maybe some of this will get through. I don't know. You know, they prop him up once a day. It's like Dracula. They open up the thing they put so ridiculous that he's still in office. Let me ask you this. What. What do you. Do you think that it is, in some sense just a function of our freedom and the beauty of this country and all it was set up upon, that we are now allowing these terrible ideas to flourish, that because we put freedom at such a high place in the hierarchy here, that it's going to allow terrible people to come in and quite literally take our freedoms away from us?
- [12:21]
A
Yes and no. I think it's also because people on the right don't understand as well as people on the left that human beings aren't truth seek animals. We are narrative seeking animals. So you can give me all the stats and statistics about rent control and, you know, hunger in communist countries. I don't care if you're telling me a story that I can't put food on the table because Elon Musk just became a trillionaire. And that rings true in my mind. You've got my support. So it's entirely a function of telling the right stories that reach people. And when you have nothing or you are at the bottom of the totem pole and have little to lose and someone's like, screw both of them. I'm your guy, that's going to resonate with a lot of people. And I think we're at a point across the political spectrum where people feel this sense of hopelessness and this sense of this is politics is crazy. Where are we going? So anyone who speaks with an air of certainty, even if they're blowing smoke out of their ass, is still going to come off as a leader, because just on an emotional level, it feels like this guy knows what he's talking about.
- [13:30]
B
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- [15:36]
A
Well, you're not gonna find anyone who loves this country more than I do, especially being an immigrant. I am very conscious of how much I love America as we reach our 250th birthday. But I always say I hate the government because I love my country. Right? So I think the upsetness that people have is because the politics seem to be completely incoherent and broken. It seems that there's absolutely no ability on virtually any issue to find a majority consensus and coherence. Part of this is due to the fact that the House is basically, there is no majority. The Republicans have one or two seats, but there's at least three or four Republicans that Trump can't rely on, so you're not getting legislation through. So when there is this stalemate and people seem to be just running for reelection, a Lot of people are upset because I think inflation, especially in prices, is something that hits everybody, especially the poorest of the poor. And you're going to blame the President, you're going to blame politics in general. And yeah, I think that's a very fair reason for people to be distraught. And listen, just because we're the best country in the world doesn't mean everything's fine. You're not saying everything's fine, certainly, but I think there's this sense of where are we going as a country? That. That seems to be pervasive. And when people have that sense of wandering in the desert, that's not good psychologically for them.
- [16:54]
B
So what would you do if you were advising Trump right now, if you got the call and they were like malice, you understand, some of the underbelly of the Internet stuff. We need some help messaging. We gotta fix some of this. We get this ascendant socialist, communist thing. What do we do to inspire the right people to get out there and wake up and vote and talk to their neighbors and everything else?
- [17:18]
A
Honestly, I don't think it would be that hard. I think it would be a matter of doing just a lot of focus groups, figuring out, okay, what messages resonate with people, what messages don't. I think Trump as a leader is a very, very visceral figure. He flies off his mouth all the time. I think that's overwhelmingly a positive for him, but sometimes it's a negative. I also think that internationally he is fumbling the ball more than he needs to. I think he's often making enem, where he could be making just people who are scared of him as opposed, like Giorgio Meloni, who's the Prime Minister of Italy. You know, he recently said, oh, she was begging me for a photo. And she's like, you're lying. I never said that. That's the kind of thing where, like, even if she was, she wasn't. You're picking a fight you didn't need to pick. So I think a lot of times his bravado and his antagonism is an issue locally. He doesn't have the majority. And I think the Democrats have been very smart. And I'm kind of shocked. Maybe it was Pelosi, who I think is the smartest strategic thinker that they have, who told them, sit down and shut up and let the Republicans have a circular firing squad. And we have a binary political system, so when the Republicans all destroy themselves, we're going to pick up the slack. And that seems to have been their strategy. And it's working wonders for them, in my opinion.
- [18:43]
B
You know, I'm not a black pill guy, but. And you did write a book called the White Pill, and you've got the. It's right behind you. I mean, so are you very black pilled in that sense when it, when it comes to midterms and which way this thing's gonna go?
- [18:56]
A
Well, I'm not a Republican at all. I'm not black.
- [18:58]
B
No, I know you're not a Republican, but in that your idea set, I know you're an anarchist. Okay, fine, but like your idea set is more friendly, let's say, to people on the right than on the left. Fair to say.
- [19:11]
A
Yeah, but I don't know that the. So I hate it to you, but I don't think the budget has grown smaller under Trump and the Republicans than it did under Biden. And I think Trump with the Democratic Congress is in fight mode and that's him at his best. I think people Forget that in 2018, the first Trump midterms, it was a given that they were going to lose the Senate, and then they started pulling that Kavanaugh BS and they blew their shot at the Senate. So I know a lot of people on the right correctly think the Republicans can't take a win, that when they have the chance to just shoot themselves in the foot. And they forget how often the Democrats do that as well and blow good opportunities because at the end of the day, they have their own crazy base. And it's really hard for the Pelosi sometimes to tell them to sit down and shut up, because you're spooking Karen. And Karen is the swing vote that decides elections in this country.
- [20:05]
B
Yeah, listen, I'm completely with you on that. I mean, I keep saying it. It's like in a weird way, the best thing that could have happened is this craz result out of New York City. Let three more of these people appear, let them all go in on Democrat socialism, communism, bust out all the jihad stuff, the endlessly scream free Palestine. And then come November, the average person, the average person who maybe isn't a hardcore Republican or Democrat, might just walk into the booth and be like, ah, one more time for America, as opposed to going all in on the other
- [20:35]
A
stuff in the Virginia race. Abigail. What's her last name? I'm blanking her last name.
- [20:39]
B
Spamberger.
- [20:40]
A
Spamberger. I'm thinking Schellenberger. She was asked during the campaign about trans kids and she goes, huh, that's an interesting issue. What I want to talk about how my opponent has no economic plan. It was a seamless transition. Ha ha. But point being, she knew how to stick to the issue that would win. Even though governing, she's gonna govern from the left, so they have the discipline. And I think a lot of Republicans in Congress really don't like each other and they don't like the direction the party is going. It's being ripped in half and that the Democrats are the ones who are going to pick up that slack. But it also depends on the candidates in different races. You're not beating Klobuchar in Minnesota for the gubernatorial race. It looks like Michigan might elect a Muslim senator for the first time in history. So I'd be looking at Georgia. You know, I'd be looking at Ohio, which I think if Vake loses, he's probably the Senate seat might be lost as well. And of course, Maine is the big question. Can you. Here's the big thing that drives me crazy. People have this delusion that moderates are more electable than ideologues. Well, Romney and McCain lost and Trump won two or three times, depending on who you ask. So the idea that a moderate Republican with a big history behind her huge vote getter is a shoo in over a radical. I think he's actually literally mentally ill person. I don't think he's actually not crazy.
- [22:06]
B
Right. Platner you're talking about.
- [22:07]
A
Of course, yeah, Platner. I mean, at the same time, the last time she was up, which is what, 2022? 2020, she was down in every single poll. And then she won by like nine points. So don't count Susan Collins out, but it could. We also remember, like, I feel like an octopus with all the different hands. On the other hand, the red wave never happened, too. So, you know, under. Under Biden. So who 2022. So who knows?
- [22:31]
B
Let me just ask you one thing on the racehour side and then we can hit just some cultural stuff. You know, in the last week or so, Tucker basically said he'll never vote for a again. He said he's not going to vote for a Democrat. He obviously, you know, every. Every lefty he has on his show now, he just, you know, he has a love fest with everyone on the right. He goes after relentlessly. What do you think is going on in this, Tucker?
- [22:54]
A
He said he's not going to vote for a Republican or a Democrat.
- [22:58]
B
Yeah, he said, I'm not a Republican anymore and I'll never support the Republicans again. And then his next sentence was something like that doesn't mean I'm going to vote Democrat, but to me. Well, in effect, I think what he basically is saying is I'm here to peel away as many Republican voters from Trump so that the Democrats take power. Like that would be the real version of what he said. It's not what, it's not literally what he said, but it's actually what he said. How about that? Well, like if your goal is. If your goal as someone on the right, as an influencer on the right is to say, I'm not gonna vote for people on the right anymore, well, then you will usher in. These are razor thin margins. You're gonna usher in communism.
- [23:37]
A
Well, has he had Platner on his show yet?
- [23:40]
B
I don't think he had Platner on, but I think he said he wanted to.
- [23:43]
A
I'm sure it's going to happen at some point.
- [23:45]
B
Yeah, no, of course it's gonna happen. Of course it's gonna happen. But, you know, he'll have Cenk or, you know, some of these guys on, on the left, and as long as you hate Israel, then he loves you and he'll put aside all your other differences. But if you're on the right, then he'll just go after you relentlessly for everything. So it seems to me he wants to fracture the Republican Party.
- [24:03]
A
I think the thing that he doesn't understand is that if you or I or anybody have an issue and you care about that issue more than anything, let's suppose trans rights. Even if people agree with you, they might not care about that issue as much as you do. Right. So abortion's an easy example. Even If America was 50, 50, right. On abortion, if the pro life people really, really, really, really care and the pro choice people have it as the fourth or fifth issue, the pro life people are gonna win because of intensity of support. If you care about this issue a lot, I don't know how many people think foreign policy is their primary voting thing right now. I think it's clearly by every poll I've seen all the rhetoric, economics, putting food on the table, inflation and things like that. So I don't vote as you know. So I don't know what I think his strategy is. Okay, if you withhold the support, this has been done historically with the progressive movement. If you withhold support, force that party to come to negotiate and come around to your point of view. I don't know how much clout he has with the Republicans, certainly not with the Republican establishment. And I think politically it's kind of Dangerous. When you start going after a party, it's really rare for them to want to sit down and shake hands with you and break bread and be like, how can we work together?
- [25:26]
B
It just also seems so immature to me. It's like, okay, so fine, you didn't like the war and you can say it didn't go well or it did go well or whatever else, but you're, you already made the point. Like most people don't think of it in their top five of most important things. But even that aside, you have one massive disagreement with Trump. So is your answer you're going to abandon the guy who closed the borders and redid the trade deals and got wokeness out of the institutions and all of those things. That just seems like 6 year old mentality like, oh, that's my toy and if you play with it, I'm going to break it.
- [25:57]
A
Well, no, I think when you're a one issue voter, if you're pro life, is it people who are often one issue voter, if you are of the belief that everything in America that's bad is a function of Israel and or Zionism, it's not one issue. It's like, okay, the reason Gavin Newsom is transing kids is somehow Netanyahu's fault. If that is your thought process, which he's certainly entitled to, I don't think that's literally his thought process. Then it's not just one issue. This is the issue that pervades everything.
- [26:23]
B
Yeah. Do you think there's just too much of an impulse around that in general? That there's just too much of a revolutionary impulse Right now everyone's just like, yeah, revolution again.
- [26:36]
A
You're talking to an anarchist here. I think it's really easy for him or for you or for me to sit here in front of our cameras and be like, I want this, this and this tomorrow. At the same time, Washington is a swamp. You don't have a majority. The idea that even when Obama had his super majorities, he could control Congress with decrees, basically the Republicans had no voice. What'd he do with it? Obamacare now Obamacare was a disaster. It's a mess. I don't think it was this revolutionary restructuring of our healthcare system and the Canada model or the England model. So even in situations like that, you're not having this whole big remaking of America or remaking of foreign policy. So I think it's easy for us on the sidelines to shake our fists and demand massive change, but where are the numbers to deliver it? And you could always blame the other guy. It's always somebody else's fault. Every time I talk to conservatives about how Republicans haven't even tried to shrink down the budget, oh, it's because the Democrats. It's like, you're never gonna have a Democrat free Congress. So what is your plan to reduce the size of government? Just put them all in jail. It's, it's not happening.
- [27:46]
B
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- [29:09]
A
I think I'm going to use the old term because we're old men. I think it feels more like wwf where you get on the mic.
- [29:16]
B
Kayfabe.
- [29:17]
A
Yeah, it's kayfabe. And the reason, you know, Hulk Hogan has that belt is because he cheated. And when I'm the champion, blah blah, blah, blah. And the people, the artist like, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then Hulk Hogan, you know, got the steel chair. It's like Turn around. Turn around. It's like.
- [29:30]
B
It's.
- [29:30]
A
It's. I feel like it's a farce, and it makes me sad how many people buy into this farce. And if people ask me for political advice, which I don't like to give advice to people I don't know, the advice I'd give is make your life the best it can be because you are in the best country on earth with infinite opportunities. And if you are going to be fixated on whatever out group you have in your head, you are doing yourself a disservice. This isn't a dress rehearsal. You got one shot to make your life as great as it is. There will always be a team that doesn't like you. And the Serenity Prayer from AA is key. God, give me, you know, the courage. You know what it is. Look it up.
- [30:12]
B
I'm like, well, I don't know that I know that full one, but I do know Frank Costanza from Seinfeld. Serenity Now.
- [30:17]
A
Well, that doesn't work. It's a Serenity now and Sandy later.
- [30:20]
B
Oh, but it.
- [30:21]
A
That's the part that's the problem. Dave, right?
- [30:23]
B
What's his name ends up in the mental institution. Who's his friend, who's George's childhood friend that ends up in the mental institution? He sells computers. Come on, what's his name? We're working on it. We're working on it. What's his name? What's his name? Under three seconds, his name is Lloyd Braun. Thank you.
- [30:40]
A
Look up.
- [30:40]
B
I have a prayer.
- [30:41]
A
Have him read the Serenity Prayer, because I think everyone needs to know.
- [30:44]
B
Can you read me the Serenity Prayer? Also not from Seinfeld. The actual Serenity Prayer. All right, they're going to get. I'm taxing these people beyond imagination over here. It's incredible. I just have seven monkeys that are constantly typing away, trying to fill in the blanks. Let me ask you something, okay, Away from politics for a little bit, Michael, in that you and I are like, veterans of this online world and the culture wars and all of these things. What do you make of this kind of relative state of that right now, just watching people go off the deep end and so many people have kind of gone crazy flip sides. Like, there's just so much drama around all of it. I try not to participate in it, but we all do get sucked in to some degree. What do you make of that?
- [31:21]
A
It makes me really sad. And, I mean, two years ago, it was widely understood that if you are at Thanksgiving dinner and you're yelling at Grandma because Grandma said, you know, I don't think President Trump is the worst president ever. It was regarded as unconscionable, and there's something fundamentally wrong with you. And now that's become the norm across the board. And I think people need to appreciate, and it's very hard to keep this in mind, how little social media is like real life, because normies, and I don't use this term in a pejorative sense in this moment, have bigger things to worry about then which podcaster hates which podcaster, and this guy's a jerk, and this one's a grifter, this one's controlled opposition, this one's Mossad. I'm all of those things. I will tell you that freely right now. But the point being, if you're this invested in online drama, I mean, just on a psychological level, you're making yourself crazy. One point I really want to make, and it was one of the biggest realizations I had, is during COVID people like Zuckerberg, even Elon, whoever ran these social media outlets, saw what worked to keep people on their screens. I'm Mark Zuckerberg. I want you on Facebook 24 7. The COVID regime went away, but that data did not. And I think that these algorithms or whatever systems they have in place are used to keep people in a state of constant agitation, because that's where we all were. Everyone. No matter where you stood in the COVID issue, you were like, what's the latest nonsense? Like, every day it was some new drama, some new insanity, some new eye roll, some new either attack on your freedom or some crazy people didn't want to take this amazing miracle cure. So I think that mindset is still with a lot of people, and I think it's really an unhealthy place to be. Why do you want to be in a place where you're always upset when we live in a place where you could be, if not always happy, certainly a lot happier than you are now.
- [33:18]
B
You know, it's quite literally why I say to my guys at the end of every show, they know I'm happy. I say, how did the show go? Or I asked their opinion or their something, so just tell me. But to me, it's like, if I was funny in that hour and people watch it and felt a little bit better, I didn't give you all the answers, but you felt a little bit better about the nonsense, right? Because it's not like, check out of it altogether, but it's like, be part of it and participate it in some way, and hopefully you pilfered some joy out of it or something funny or whatever, and then. And then go on with your life. You ever get off the grid, Malice? You know, I'm about to roll into my 10th. I think it's my 10th, maybe 11th. I have to change. Check off the grid. August, you're a very online creature. Do you ever put the phone away and go to nature? Small house under a covering or.
- [34:00]
A
I hate nature. I hate it violently. I'm a Brooklyn kid. Like, to me, like a Japanese Zen garden as hell on earth. I'm not even kidding. No, I don't know. That's interesting. I am online a lot more than I should, but at the same time, I'm not some. I'm online like. Like messing around. I'm not online invested, being like, oh, my God, I need to know what's going on here. So, for me, it's a form of recreation. I think a lot of, like, TV shows and movies are awful, so I'll be spending time on YouTube watching, like, Police body cam videos, something like that. But I think that's the issue. When people get this invested in people, they don't. And you get. I'm sure you get it more, even more than I do. Where people are invested in you personally, they feel like they know you and. And this, this and that, and it's like we've never met. I get breakup letters all the time. I'm sure you do, too. I used to think you were this, and now I think you're that. I'm like, I don't know who you are, and you're breaking up with me and you think this is normal. It's every single time. I'm a little shook by it. Cause I'm like, do you hear yourself?
- [35:00]
B
Well, it's the catch 22 of all of this, in some sense. Cause it's like, you know, there's a ton of love, right? Like, and love just comes, and people watch you and say nice things about you. And then there's this, like, I have a very dedicated crew of people that relentlessly hate and clip things out of context and whatever. And I always think it's like, man, if you're walking around going, I've gotta get Dave Rubin. Like, I gotta just take out Dave Rubin.
- [35:25]
A
In all fairness, Dave, it makes me a lot of money. So you can't really blame me.
- [35:31]
B
I thought that was you. I thought that was you. Malice. Malice. I have one more thing for you. Wait.
- [35:35]
A
The Serenity Prayer before you get to that, read the Serenity Prayer.
- [35:38]
B
The Serenity Prayer. Here we have it. We have it. God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, courage to change the things I can, and wisdom to know the difference.
- [35:49]
A
Right. I think it's.
- [35:52]
B
Now that would be a fitting way to end the show with you. However, I want to end the show discussing barbecue for one second because you left Brooklyn.
- [35:58]
A
I did.
- [35:58]
B
You moved to Austin.
- [35:59]
A
Yes.
- [36:00]
B
And I called you when I was in Austin. I said, malice, let's have lunch. Let's go to Terry Black's, which is in Austin. And it's a little commercial, but everyone basically says it's the best barbecue. And you said to me, let's go somewhere else. We don't have to mention the name of the place because I did not think it was. It was pretty much the worst barbecue I ever had and should have been condemned by the Board of Health. But I just want to know about your choicing skills. It was terrible. It was terrible.
- [36:30]
A
You're out of your mind. I'm so glad I have that.
- [36:34]
B
Dave Rubin's place, Phoenix, got a communicable disease. I haven't seen him in a year.
- [36:38]
A
He got it from you. Don't you guys? He got it from you. You are diseased. And your.
- [36:43]
B
And your brain was dry and gross and my foot was stuck to the floor and the bathroom had a soda machine in it. Everything was wrong.
- [36:52]
A
I'm sorry, princess. When I think of barbecue, I think of lace gloves and, you know, frilly skirts and parasols.
- [36:59]
B
No, no. I went to Terry Black's the next day and it was nice and clean and the meat was moist and delicious.
- [37:08]
A
Why do you.
- [37:09]
B
If you.
- [37:09]
A
If you're looking for a barbecue place and your metric is cleanliness, I don't even know where to begin to help you.
- [37:17]
B
I'm just saying it wasn't condemned by the Board of Health. And I'm pretty sure you just took me to a homeless shelter with a guy holding a bone.
- [37:25]
A
Well, maybe that's where you belong. You're from la. You wouldn't know the difference.
- [37:31]
B
End communication.
- [37:33]
A
It.