Martine Rose Is Breaking The Formula

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Martine Rose Is Breaking The Formula" – The Run-Through with Vogue

Release Date: July 31, 2025

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Introduction

In this special London-focused episode of The Run-Through with Vogue, host Cho Minardi steps in while regular hosts Chloe Kelly and Chioma Nnadi enjoy a well-deserved vacation. Cho engages in an insightful conversation with renowned fashion designer Tamara Rothstein, delving deep into her latest presentation of Martine Rose and exploring the vibrant intersection of fashion, culture, and community in London.

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Football Fun and Cultural Insights

00:00 – 03:55

The episode kicks off with a playful exchange about financial responsibility, setting a lighthearted tone. Cho then transitions to discussing recent events in London, particularly focusing on the excitement surrounding the women's UEFA Euros final in Basel.

Notable Quotes:

• Chairmanardi (Cho Minardi): “I didn’t know much about football, but attending the Euros final was an emotional rollercoaster that made me understand how deeply people can invest in the game.” (01:39)
• Daisy Jones: “I was up at 2 AM on Reddit, like, googling strategies and everything. My obsession reached fever pitch by the time we were in Basel.” (02:53)

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London Fashion Week Highlights

03:00 – 08:50

Cho and Daisy Jones discuss the upcoming London Fashion Week, highlighting the increased participation of designers and the role of the British Fashion Council in supporting emerging talents. They emphasize the dynamic trends shaping the season, particularly the resurgence of micro mini pleated skirts and the influence of iconic shows like Chipova Lawena and Roxanda's 20th anniversary celebration.

Notable Quotes:

• Daisy Jones: “I'm really excited to see Talia Burney's debut. Her designs are stripey and intersect sport with fashion in a way that’s incredibly popular.” (07:04)
• Chairmanardi: “Every girl in London under 30 is wearing a micro mini pleated skirt. It’s an actual fact.” (08:31)

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Spotlight on Tamara Rothstein and Martine Rose’s Latest Show

08:50 – 28:10

The heart of the episode centers on an in-depth interview with Tamara Rothstein, the creative force behind Martine Rose. She shares her vision for the latest collection, emphasizing themes of modern sexy aesthetics and the importance of authentic storytelling through fashion. Tamara discusses the innovative approach to her shows, aiming to create inclusive, community-centric events that break traditional fashion norms.

Notable Quotes:

• Tamara Rothstein: “I want my shows to be more than just a fashion event. They should be a safe space where people feel welcome and can commune.” (15:19)
• Tamara Rothstein: “Casting is crucial. We look for individuals who embody a nuanced, unconventional beauty, allowing them to express themselves authentically on the runway.” (24:19)

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Innovative Show Designs and Community Engagement

28:10 – 37:00

Tamara elaborates on the unique elements of her latest show, which transforms a traditional market space into an immersive experience. By integrating a makeshift salon and inviting local artisans and creators to participate, she fosters a sense of community and inclusivity. This approach not only showcases her designs but also celebrates the diverse cultural fabric of London.

Notable Quotes:

• Tamara Rothstein: “We invited different types of makers—jewelry makers, vintage sellers, record enthusiasts—to create a vibrant market atmosphere that preceded the show.” (19:36)
• Tamara Rothstein: “Everything from the hair to the clothing was designed to feel soft, fluffy, and alive, creating a transformative experience for the audience.” (29:10)

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Personal Inspirations and Future Directions

37:00 – 44:45

The conversation shifts to Tamara's personal inspirations, highlighting how everyday moments and diverse communities fuel her creativity. She reflects on the importance of authentic expression in fashion and shares her optimism about the future of the industry amidst cultural shifts and technological advancements.

Notable Quotes:

• Tamara Rothstein: “I find endless inspiration in how people express themselves daily—whether it's through personal style or small unique touches in their attire.” (30:54)
• Tamara Rothstein: “In these changing times, people crave meaningful connections and authentic expressions, which is what we strive to deliver through our fashion.” (43:05)

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Closing Remarks and Future Prospects

44:45 – 46:27

As the episode wraps up, Cho commends Tamara on her remarkable contributions to the fashion world. Tamara shares her excitement about upcoming projects and her commitment to fostering community and authenticity in future collections. The hosts encourage listeners to stay connected through the Vogue app for more updates and insights.

Notable Quotes:

• Chairmanardi: “You've created such an amazing brand with a clear point of view. Thank you for sharing your vision with us.” (39:09)
• Tamara Rothstein: “I’ll keep trying to connect people through fashion, ensuring that every collection resonates with authenticity and shared values.” (43:59)

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Conclusion

This episode of The Run-Through with Vogue provides a comprehensive look into Tamara Rothstein's innovative approach to fashion, her dedication to community engagement, and the vibrant cultural landscape of London. Through thoughtful dialogue and inspiring insights, listeners gain a deeper appreciation for the intersection of fashion, authenticity, and cultural expression.

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Production Credits

• Produced By: Chelsea, Daniel, Alex DePalma, and Stephanie Cariuki
• Engineered By: Pran Bandy and James Yost
• Mixed By: Mike Kutchman
• Guest Contributor: Chris Bannon, Conde Nast's Head of Global Audio

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Additional Resources:

• Follow The Run-Through with Vogue: Stay updated with the latest in fashion by downloading the Vogue app.
• Upcoming Episodes: Keep an eye out for future conversations with Vogue editors, creatives, and cover stars.

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This summary encapsulates the key discussions, insights, and conclusions from the "Martine Rose Is Breaking The Formula" episode, providing a rich and engaging overview for listeners and fashion enthusiasts alike.

Transcript

[Chloe Kelly]

She's made up her mind to live pretty smart Learn to budget responsibly right from the start she spends a little less, inputs more into savings Keeps her blood pressure low and credit score raises she's cutting debt right out of her life she tracks her cash flow on.

[Martin Rose]

Her spreadsheet at night Boring money moves make kinda lame songs but they sound pretty sweet to your wallet brilliantly boring since 1865 foreign.

[Chairmanardi]

This is the run through. I'm Chairmanardi and this week our lovely Chloe is out on a much needed vacation. So I'm taking over with a London focused episode. This week I spoke to my friend, the lovely and talented Martin Rose. Martine had an incredible collection last month and I was so excited to have her back on the show. Her fashion show was just one of the highlights of the summer for me and just wanted to get her back to talk about where she's at with her brand and just how she's feeling. Her intuition is so great and she's always so plugged into the zeitgeist. So really excited to share that. But before we hear that interview, I have my colleague Daisy Jones, who is British Vogue's acting news and features editor. But before we discuss what's been happening in London, the big action was actually in Basel this week. It ended because we were both in Basel and Daisy, would you like to share why we were both there?

[Daisy Jones]

Yeah. Well, it was the Euros final which I was really, really excited about. The women's Euros final. I had a great time. Did you have a good time?

[Chairmanardi]

I had an amazing time and I have to say I don't know much about football. I mean, that's soccer to you guys. But I brought my brother with me who is an absolute expert and we were hosted by Nike, which was, was really great because they brought in all of these, these athletes and I, I knew who Megan Rapinoe was. But there were a lot of new gen football, international football stars that I didn't know, like Sue Carr, who's from Australia, who's kind of a legend and a legend in the making. She's quite young. I'm making out like she's, like she's young. But it was really, I just got so into it and I didn't think I'd get so emotional and I mean, it went to a penalty shootout. It was one of the most exciting games I'd seen in a long time. I thought Spain played amazingly and obviously it was really close, but it made me understand just how people can get, can live and die. By this game.

[Daisy Jones]

Yeah, completely. And for context, like, I was never into football before this Euros.

[Chairmanardi]

So you're the same as me, basically.

[Daisy Jones]

Yeah. But it sort of happened slowly and then all at once. Throughout the Euros, I felt my obsession building, and then it got. You know, I can never do things in half measures. I have to be, like, really obsessed with something or not into it at all. And by the time it got to the England Sweden game, I'd just fully gone down the rabbit hole of being, like, completely obsessed. And I was up at like, 2am on Reddit, like, Googling strategy and finding out everything to do with the players. Everything.

[Chairmanardi]

This doesn't surprise me, guys, because Daisy goes deep on everything.

[Daisy Jones]

Yeah, I got full, full tunnel vision. So by the time I ended up in Basel, my obsession had really reached fever pitch at that point. So I was just really, really excited and I felt like England were going to win, even though everyone told me they wouldn't.

[Chairmanardi]

I know, it was. I mean, let's talk about some of the players.

[Daisy Jones]

It's got to be Chloe Khloe K. Everybody loves Chloe K. Yeah, I just love her cockiness. I love her.

[Chairmanardi]

Tell our audience, like, what should they know about her, like, or what's. I did notice everybody has a high ponytail. It's just the look.

[Daisy Jones]

I know. It's weird, isn't it? Everyone has, like.

[Chairmanardi]

Everybody has a high ponytail.

[Daisy Jones]

Yeah. And I've got face blindness. I have written about that on the site before.

[Chairmanardi]

Ewan Lynn Yeager, OG fashion writer and Vogue editor.

[Daisy Jones]

What does she. She's also.

[Chairmanardi]

She has facial blindness. It took her. We've been friends for a while, and I remember in the beginning, she would never recognize me and I'd always be like. But we've seen each other many times.

[Daisy Jones]

Yeah, it's really bad. People think you're being really rude, even though you've met them multiple times and you don't care. But, yeah, it's a problem for me. When I was watching the football to begin with, we've all got blonde ponytails for the most part. So I was like, I'm never gonna be able to tell who all these people are. But obviously, as time went on, I started to recognize them more and more. Now I love them all. But, yeah, Chloe Kelly is sort of the. She did this excellent penalty against Italy, but she did this little smirk before she did it. Almost like to say, like, I've got this. And then she does this signature move. That's this little hop and it's so chee. And she did it again. In Basel. And when I saw her stand up to take the penalty, I was like, we're gonna be fine. We're gonna win this. And I like seeing on TikTok afterwards, lots of little girls and little boys are copying her signature move and stuff, which I think is quite fun.

[Chairmanardi]

I think for me, it was Anna Hampton, who's the goalie goalkeeper. She kind of went on a deep dive on her. And how she got to where she got. And the fact that she has. She had an eye condition that made it almost impossible for her to play football as a child. And she's just seemed like the kind of person who's been told no her whole life and has proved everybody wrong. She stepped into the shoes of a very legendary goalkeeper called Mary Earp's, who I think a lot of people weren't sure whether she was gonna be able to hold her own. And she saved the. She saved the match, literally. I mean, the penalty shootout was one of the most exciting ones I've ever seen. There was a victory parade that went down the mall and we sent a photographer to capture it. Cause I just thought this is such a big moment for the uk. And it was so lovely looking through the images and seeing, I mean, all of these amazing, like a cross section of, like, girls and young women. And there was one picture of a girl on her father's shoulders. And it just made me think, like, this is not just like a moment, it's like a bigger movement, I think. And I hope that there's more of this energy to come. I know that all eyes here are on the rugby team, because the English rugby women's team are incredible and they're. The World Cup's happening, I think, this September. So very excited about that. But I do feel like this is. It feels like there's a bigger shift. And I think we're going to be hearing much more. More about these women. I think people are just going to be more. More and more obsessed with them. So the London Fashion Week calendar dropped. Who are you excited to see?

[Daisy Jones]

Yeah, I had this morning. I'm really excited to see Talia Burney. She's doing her debut.

[Chairmanardi]

How would you describe her work to someone who hadn't seen it?

[Daisy Jones]

Oh, God, Stripey.

[Chairmanardi]

It definitely has an intersection. I feel like I actually wore one of her shirts too. Cause I didn't know what to wear. We did an event at Wembley Stadium for one of the lioness friendly games. And it was England v Portugal. And they won like 6:1 or something. And I didn't know what to wear? Cause I was like, I kind of. It's an event, and I wore one of Talia's tops. Cause I think she's sort of at the intersection of sport and fashion a little bit. Would you agree?

[Daisy Jones]

Yeah. I mean, rarely a day goes by when I don't come into the Vogue office and someone's not wearing one of her rugby shirts. They're, like, very popular. I feel like that happens every single day.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah.

[Daisy Jones]

So, yeah, definitely.

[Chairmanardi]

Yeah. I think I'm really excited to see Chipova Lawena come back. They generally show once a year, and it's always a big event. And they have such a wonderful casting. They tend to invite their friends to walk the Runway. And it feels. It just feels. It just has such a community feel to it. Connor Ives is showing. Roxanda's celebrating her 20th anniversary. So it feels like it's gonna be quite a vibrant a week.

[Daisy Jones]

Yeah, I heard that it was 18% more designers this week than. So it's very robust and.

[Chairmanardi]

Yeah, yeah. No. And the British Fashion Council has a new CEO, Laura Weir, who's really great. And she actually announced that she would be cutting the fees for designers to show on the week. So I think there's, like, a real. I think there's a lot of momentum around that and a lot of goodwill around that, because I think the designers need as much support as they can.

[Daisy Jones]

Mm. Yeah.

[Chairmanardi]

I'm actually sitting with the sensei of summer London style trends. Every time Daisy writes about a summer trend, it pops off on the website, and then I start seeing it everywhere. I have to say, literally every girl in London is wearing a micro mini under the age of 30 is wearing a mic. Micro mini pleated skirt. It is an actual fact.

[Daisy Jones]

Yeah. Because we throw. You know, obviously people throw around the word. Everyone is wearing quite a lot, but I think the miniskirts, everyone is wearing them. I feel like in the future, people will remember this as the summer of the miniskirt.

[Chairmanardi]

I think your. I put money on your proclamations, and I think you're actually right.

[Daisy Jones]

And I remember going to see Charlie earlier this summer.

[Chairmanardi]

There's a uniform at the show. What do people wear at Charlie show?

[Daisy Jones]

It's funny because I saw. Obviously, I saw Charlie in June. Then I saw Lana Del Rey. I think that was earlier this month at Wembley. And for Charlie, everyone was wearing little black miniskirts and, like, some biker boots. But, I mean, everyone was in miniskirts to the point that it was like they were barely there. Just like a strip of, like a strip of fabric. And actually everyone was in mini skirts for Lana, but they were sort of white, floaty rara skirts. So it was like, it was almost like same vibe, different color. Obviously for Lana, there was a lot more cowboy boots and sort of more of a boho vibe to the crowd. But the main thing putting it all together was everyone apart from me probably was in a mini skirt or a mini dress.

[Chairmanardi]

Has it inspired you to get on this trend?

[Daisy Jones]

I live in my Levi jeans. I'm not. And also, you know, every day the office is blasted with aircons, so I don't think I could even sit.

[Chairmanardi]

I mostly see Daisy wandering around the office with a scarf wrapped around her head. That's quite chic.

[Daisy Jones]

I know. And that's not even an exaggeration. I'm always in a woolen scarf, literally. So that's what I'm wearing for summer.

[Tamara Rothstein]

I do.

[Chairmanardi]

I also think you're like the sensei for trait. Like, you know, when. Well, when we say trainers, we mean sneakers. Yeah. So what is the look in London? Like, what are the. What are the sort of more obscure brands? Like, what are the ones that people are going back to? What are the retro ones? Like, what survive?

[Daisy Jones]

I keep seeing trainers getting smaller and smaller and smaller to the point that they're practically plimp soles. So everyone's got to explain what a thin, slimline, barely even sneaker sneakers around. Harry Styles loves them, which means that everyone loves them.

[Chairmanardi]

True, true, true.

[Daisy Jones]

And you know, he finally hung up his sambas. I don't think he wears them anymore. He wears these like little Prada trainers. So I think we're finally, finally over the samba.

[Chairmanardi]

I know. I think the fact the sambas are. We've moved on, we've moved on. I do think that maybe there's also the one big concert we haven't really registered is Oasis the concert tour. And I do think two Vogue staffers showed up today with the Oasis Adidas Mertz, which is actually really brilliant.

[Daisy Jones]

It's so cool.

[Chairmanardi]

Yeah. And it feels like throwback to late 90s early aughts in such a good way. Do you think there's gonna be a knock on effect of the Oasis look or are you seeing any of that on the street?

[Daisy Jones]

Yeah, definitely. I feel like Brit pop style has been huge. I don't know if it is huge across the board or if it's just a UK thing, but certainly over here that is still huge. You know, people wearing football shirts in all sorts of styles, bucket hats, like anything like that. And I Almost feel like with the Euros and the Oasis shows back to back, it sort of has kept that Britpop style alive throughout the summer.

[Chairmanardi]

Oh, I think we have one last piece of important news. How do you feel about dogs? Because Doge is back.

[Daisy Jones]

I'm so excited. I'm so excited.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah.

[Chairmanardi]

They're looking for the next cover star.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah.

[Daisy Jones]

You know who I want to be the next cover star?

[Tamara Rothstein]

Who?

[Daisy Jones]

The dog from Too Much.

[Chairmanardi]

Oh, my God.

[Daisy Jones]

Mia is her real name. Oh, my God.

[Chairmanardi]

Such a good idea. Cause I've also been loving too much.

[Daisy Jones]

Yeah, Yeah. I love Too much. I thought it was laugh out loud. Funny.

[Chairmanardi]

I still haven't finished it, but I need to. And I've loved it. Can you describe for those who haven't seen the dog Too much?

[Daisy Jones]

Yeah. Well, she's a Chinese crested dog. I think that's the name of her breed.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Right.

[Chairmanardi]

Very peculiar looking.

[Daisy Jones]

Yeah. She's 13 years old. I know that.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Damn.

[Daisy Jones]

And whispers that I've heard around and about is that this is her first role.

[Chairmanardi]

Oh, my gosh.

[Daisy Jones]

Yeah. But maybe she's wanted to roll for a while and she finally got her big moment.

[Chairmanardi]

To be fair, she might not make it through the application process because she actually, I had a shoot in Vogue already.

[Daisy Jones]

Of course.

[Chairmanardi]

Yes. So to apply, you have to do it via the app. You submit a photo. So stay tuned because the winner will be announced on August 19.

[Daisy Jones]

Not many people know this about me, but I actually have a frog. I own a frog.

[Chairmanardi]

Daisy. Why am I not surprised?

[Daisy Jones]

That's what everyone says. And I said, what's giving frog mother about me? So maybe frog can come next.

[Chairmanardi]

Frogue. Frog has to come next. I mean, every time I talk to you, I feel like I discover something weird and weird and unexpected just for context, like, go and read Daisy's stories because she's done so many things in the name of Vogue in the name of a great story. Thank you so much for coming on Daisy.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Thank you.

[Daisy Jones]

Thanks so much for asking me.

[Chairmanardi]

We'll be back in just a moment.

[Chloe Kelly]

She's made up her mind to live pretty smart Learn to budget responsibly right from the start she spends a little less and puts more into savings Keeps her blood pressure low and credit score raising she's cutting debt right out of her life she tracks her cash flow.

[Martin Rose]

On her spreadsheet at night Money moves make kind of lame songs but they sound pretty sweet to your wallet BNC bank brilliantly boring since 1865.

[Chairmanardi]

Let's talk about your most recent show, which usually when I Go into Fashion Week, I always feel a bit of anxiety.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Oh, yeah, me too.

[Chairmanardi]

But you managed to make it a space where people feel welcome, where it's a place where you stay.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah.

[Chairmanardi]

Where it's a place where people commune. It's like talk about the setting for the show. I mean, you know.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Oh, thank you for saying that.

[Chairmanardi]

It feels like such a warm place. Thank you. And so I think this idea of home is really like.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah, yeah. Thank you again for saying it, because it is something that I take really, really seriously. And all of my. The, you know, the team that. Tam, Polly, everyone. Everyone that contributes towards.

[Chairmanardi]

So, Tam, who's your amazing stylist. Yeah.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Tamara Rothstein, who's my amazing stylist and dear friend. It's a real focus. It's a real focus. It's like so much time is spent on, like, people's experience, where they sit, how it feels when they sit, the angles, the environment, how we want people to feel. And that goes with every single environment that we create or that we go into is we really, really focus on. On that feeling. But I just want to create. Always wanted to create a bit of a pause, a bit of a minute to sort of bring it all down a bit and that. I mean, I have the luxury of that. Cause I always show off seasons. So now I know. Or I'm the Last Late show. So I try and choose slots where people are not rushing off to something else. So there's an opportunity to pause. And I do think that that is from my nan's house. Yeah.

[Chairmanardi]

I mean, I'd never been to a Martin Rose show. I'd only seen them from afar.

[Tamara Rothstein]

I must.

[Chairmanardi]

I lost my Martin Rose virginity that day.

[Tamara Rothstein]

That's. That is so surprising, isn't it? Yeah, it's surprising. I've always had you there.

[Chairmanardi]

I know. I've been there in spirit.

[Tamara Rothstein]

You have.

[Chairmanardi]

I've always been there in spirit, in fact, and it was lovely because I ran into so many people. And not just fashion people, there's photographers. It's like quite a community.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah.

[Chairmanardi]

I want to break. Your loving daughter Valentine is there, you know.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah, I know. So I. From first doing shows, I really wanted to cut through that sort of, like, the fashion edge, I think, of shows. And I really wanted to make it. To sort of, like, break it. Because the thing with, you know, fashion audiences is they're very spoiled and sort of jaded and very fluent in that, you know, in that sort of thing. And it can become just a little bit repetitive. And I sort of realized that There was a formula that I needed to break. When I did my first show in the. My first proper show in the market in Tottenham. And we got all of the stall holders in, and they would. So it was in an indoor market. We asked the storeholders to still keep their hair appointments. But it was more than an indoor market. It was like a community. It had an immigration lawyer in there. It had, like, you could go in on Saturday morning, get your hair done, get your nails done, get your shopping done. Your husband can watch the telly. The kids would be running around. It was a real safe space. And so we asked them to keep their appointments and serve food and all of that sort of stuff, which they did. And so we invited them to the show, and they were whooping and cheering and it just bought something else. And I was like, that is how I want my shows to be. I want that, you know, I want people to be excited, to really feel like they're going to a show, you know, to feel like that. And you can't get that with just a fashion crowd anymore. You have to cut through it. And so that has been something that I've sort of been really interested in building and all of that stuff. And then this last show was another example of that, I guess. But when we actually had a market, we invited people underneath, you know, to sort of like, have the floor underneath. And it's just. It's just fun. It's just fun to invite everyone.

[Chairmanardi]

Yeah, no, no, I love that. I mean, so you had a. I mean, you could shop there the day of. The next day, too. There was a whole market of vendors of designers. I know that the likes of Jawara Elaine were there.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Beautiful Jawara talent. I'm so honored. So honored that I was. I mean, I was honored that everyone. Everyone participated. But how it happened is we obviously. We had the job center. It was a massive space.

[Chairmanardi]

I don't think people in the US might know what a job center is. I was trying to explain this.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah, that's true. I don't. Yeah, I don't know, because someone else. We were talking about the definition of what job centers are. And in the uk, basically, they are where you go to find jobs, usually, and all different types of jobs. And apparently the job center that we use is where the Clash met. No way. Yeah. So I think, like, in popular culture, job centers have become, you know, they have paid a plot a part in popular culture as well. You, before you did a very famous song called I Can't Remember. It was about a gyro Slip, the song was about. And it was about the Job Center. Cause it's like. It's sort of the front line of where government policy sort of like impacts real people and all of that sort of stuff. So, you know, there have been lots of sort of punk and reggae songs about it in the past. But anyway, so we did the Job center, derelict job center where the Clash met. And we had the backstage on the top floor and we had the. Built the show in the second floor. And then we just had a spare floor. And we were like, well, we cut you down. You just can't have a spare floor. You can't waste a floor. So we invited all different types of makers, jewelry makers, magazine people that make magazines, vintage sellers, records, you know, that have contributed for the past. Over the past half a century to culture. And we invited them to. Yeah, to show. To actually set up a market. And so then before the show, we had. When we had Havana Club sponsoring the drinks, which was amazing because it lubricated everyone to spend money. We love that.

[Chairmanardi]

We love that. Shopping drunk is it?

[Tamara Rothstein]

Shopping drunk is. Yeah. I got a few texts going, I can't bloody believe how much money I spent at your market yesterday. But it was amazing. The market was open the next day, so I didn't have. Obviously post show is always really hard, you know, there's always so much going on. But then I went back the next day to do some shopping myself.

[Chairmanardi]

Did you find stuff?

[Tamara Rothstein]

Oh, loads of stuff. I spent a fortune.

[Chairmanardi]

Yeah. Yeah, I would love to see that unboxing. Yeah.

[Tamara Rothstein]

So now I loved it. I've already unboxed it, sadly.

[Chairmanardi]

But, well, we need to talk about the collection, which I thought was so great. And I think I love this kind of what you call modern sexy. It had everybody on the edge of their seats. It was like, so cool to be there because, you know when people get excited and they like, you're giving them something so fresh and new. Talk to me about how it all came about or what your starting point was.

[Tamara Rothstein]

What was my starting point? I think it was a desire. It's always really hard to sort of pin down because it's never like, right, okay, this is. Sometimes it's not clear. Sometimes it's just this sort of feeling that I want to create. And it was just. It was like this feeling of. I could see it. I could see almost like a crow, almost like this sort of like too tight, too short, too sort of sexy. It was just. It was very much a sort of silhouette that I could see. And I Could see this hunch figure with hands in pockets, and everything was just a bit. Just a bit too short, a bit too tight. But somehow finding the sexiness in that and the sort of. I'm always interested in this sort of, like, the edges. People on the edges, but also the edges of where it can be real. It can still be real, still. You don't know where the line between sort of sexiness and, like, reality is, you know, but it's just that point. It's a little bit. You're dancing on the edge of everything, but it's still. It's still cool, you know, you don't know why he's cool. You don't know why it's cool. You don't know why you like it, but you just do, you know? And that also comes from the people that embody it. You know, the people that sort of embody it. On the.

[Chairmanardi]

Yeah, tell me. Cause for me, I'm always attracted to the casting of your shows. I mean, we didn't even get to talk about the hair, the accessories. I mean, there are like. There's so many shoes I want from that show. I love the kind of. I know, sort of like kitten heel that had a bit of a. Almost like a trainer. Kitten heel.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's it.

[Chairmanardi]

So we should talk about the people first, because I think I know the casting is so important.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah, it is. It is. You know, I sort of figured out quite recently that everything sort of the reason that I do what I do is sort of to get close to people. Actually. I just really love people and I'm really nosy about them. And I sort of figured out that actually the medium is closed, but it's just a tool to sort of get close to people and to tell stories about them and to tell stories about the people that are in the clothes and. But stories about other types of people. Types of people, you know, or. I don't know. I don't know what it is, but I find the casting is really, really important. They're really part of the storytelling and, you know, the way that we choose people, it's like. It's a sort of a quality that you can't. It really transcends beauty, physical beauty, although they are all physically beautiful, but it's not. Not. It's sort of in. Often in a very nuanced, unconventional way. And sometimes the beauty is a beauty that you've pulled out of them because they absolutely can't see it themselves. So you're getting people that have never walked before. Never done any modeling before. Never even considered themselves, for whatever reason, particularly beautiful. Then you're getting them into an environment that is quite like, you know, overwhelming. But then you're. Again, can you put on these really long shoes, this wig, and these really short shorts? So that's a leap that gives you.

[Chairmanardi]

A sense of what the collection, the sort of. Yes, yeah.

[Tamara Rothstein]

The silhouette. The mix.

[Chairmanardi]

The mix. The mix.

[Tamara Rothstein]

But then you sort of. It's trust, isn't it? And then you. You build up, because you do it over time. You know, you find someone in, like, they have this quality, and it's like a curiosity, but they can't. And they're like. They sort of nervous, but they're curious enough. And they're curious about what it is you see in them sometimes. So they're unsure, but they still go with you. And then you build up and they go with you. And then you. As you're layering more onto the character, they start to see it themselves, and they start to see that they're part of this bigger thing, and they start to look at the other people around and you sometimes. And honestly, I can't tell you the moving stories that we've had of people that have got. I've come with you. Like, they've gone and they've overcome it and how proud they feel of themselves afterwards.

[Chairmanardi]

Because it wasn't lightning to, like, walk out terrified.

[Tamara Rothstein]

I tell you what, we were full of fashion. So we were doing. And we're asking people that have never walked before in, like, difficult clothes, in, you know, in complicated. You know what I mean? Fashion, you know, and that is fashion. Like, fashion with capital F. Yeah. And it's hard. So to go back to the casting. They were impressive. You know, they're really impressive. They really overcome huge hurdles to do it, and they. It's really worth it, you know, they're really proud of themselves. It's amazing. So they. It's all part of it, you know? And I think. And I think the people in the audience can feel it as well.

[Chairmanardi]

Thousand percent.

[Tamara Rothstein]

They're not blank. They're not blank.

[Chairmanardi]

No, not at all.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Do you see what I mean? And that, you know, that it's imperfect, and that's what we tell them. Like, don't. You know, it is not perfection that we're looking for. We're looking for all of your quirks and nuances. Cause I want people to see themselves in the people that. In some way, even if we're putting prosthetics and wigs and all, you know what I Mean. And all of it, all of that just doesn't feel relatable. But somehow it has to be. Cause otherwise, what are we doing? You have to be able to connect with a person. And you connect with people generally. Because they're flawed, because they're not. You can sort of imagine themselves. The wobble is a bit. You know what I mean? That's what makes them human and stutter and beautiful. Exactly. It's beauty. So it's always the beauty and the.

[Chairmanardi]

Flaws that really came through. It really came through. I mean, one thing I wanted to ask you was about the hair.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Cause I love the hair.

[Chairmanardi]

What was the reference? Like, what were you thinking about?

[Tamara Rothstein]

Oh, you know what it was? It was. You know, we'd already had this idea. So we wanted this feeling when you went into the market. Cause that's where you came in first. And we were like, oh, yeah. We wanted people to think, yeah, it's a Martin Rose show. A bit grungy, a bit like, blah, blah, I know what I'm gonna get. And then we wanted to transform. We wanted to take you somewhere else. So it was our version of a salon. So we completely, completely. It was a kilometer of fabric we used. And I don't know if the US listeners are gonna know what Mills and Boone is. No. So Mills and Boone is like romantic novels. A very. The biggest selling romantic.

[Chairmanardi]

Huge.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Huge.

[Chairmanardi]

Huge. Huge.

[Tamara Rothstein]

But it was so. It was almost like very sort of like 80s, soft focus, sort of sexy, you know, very feminine sex, wasn't it? Like very draped curtains. It was like completely, completely transformed. So we had this grungy market that you sort of went into. And then you got went up a level to the show and you were sort of transported into this softness. It was really enveloping.

[Chairmanardi]

It was like wall to wall softness.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Wall to wall softness. And that's what we wanted. This sort of like. And we wanted everything to feel fluffy and light. And so that was the feeling for the hair. We wanted it to like, to almost like pulse. Yeah.

[Chairmanardi]

And those prints, the fringe. Amazing.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Just everything to feel really soft and just to move with the clothes. I think just to have its own life. Yeah. So that was it. And I mean, obviously Gary is just a master.

[Chairmanardi]

Well, it worked so well with the clothes. I thought it was.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Thank you.

[Chairmanardi]

It was really great. And it gave, like you said, this lightness, this fluffiness, this kind of like they were floating.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah.

[Chloe Kelly]

She's made up her mind to live Pretty smart. Learn to budget responsibly. Right from the start. She spends a Little less and puts more into savings. Keeps her blood pressure fresh are low and credit score raising. She's curtained it right out of her life. She tracks her cash flow on her spreadsheet at night.

[Martin Rose]

Boring money moves make kinda lame songs but they sound pretty sweet to your wallet. BNC bank brilliantly boring since 1865.

[Chairmanardi]

I mean I feel like your work always taps into real life communities, you know, often very close to you.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah.

[Chairmanardi]

Are there people who are inspiring you lately? How are you like?

[Tamara Rothstein]

I mean I get asked this a lot, like. And it's honestly as straightforward as seeing people on the bus. You know, I took a picture of a guy the other day, a bit like a creep but I couldn't help it. I sort of like zoomed in and I was. Because I've seen him a few times and he is. His personal style is unbelievable. Sometimes I see him on the straggling road and he's like, oh, he must be in his 60s. But it's completely, completely considered the color code. You know, everything is so perfect. It's perfect. His hat, he's got the way he like the tilt of his hat. I mean I can't even tell you. And I saw him at football the other day and I never get the chance to take a picture and I was like, there he is creeping through the bar. Yeah. But I just, I really respect it. I really respect it and I really enjoy how people express themselves and it's just endless. So like it is literally, you know, people on the bus, it is groups, it is people coming out of church, it is kids coming out of school. It's the flourish that people put add to their scene. You know, how kids, a little personal flourish, they add to their uniform or something to just identify themselves slightly. I find that endlessly inspiring what people choose to show.

[Chairmanardi]

Agreed.

[Tamara Rothstein]

You know what I mean? Agreed. That I find that in all communities, I find that every. Across the board, it is just so fun.

[Chairmanardi]

I know, it's so funny because we recently interviewed A$AP Rocky and he was saying that Harlem is the best dressed.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Area in the world for exactly the same reason, I'm sure.

[Chairmanardi]

Yeah. But I think that there was something about London. I mean, and I think people were very excited that you were showing in London because you've showed in Paris. Why was it important for you to show in London?

[Tamara Rothstein]

Because London just needs a bit of love at the moment. And I just feel, I just feel like I will always, like a boomerang, always come back to London because I find, I honestly find the way people interact in London. So inspiring. It's not. There is just this fluidity between people and this cross pollination that is very unique and this particular. And there's a culture here in England, I would say in England, it's not a London thing, it's an English thing. It's an English being that how people pass through and influence each other and what that creates, how that has created and influenced culture and music and all of that sort of stuff. And I find that is really is, as you know, I find it really inspiring. I really do. So it's fun to go off to other cities and show and sit by like, oh, how will I show up in Paris? Or how will I show up in Milan? Or whatever.

[Chairmanardi]

I know you've done. I forgot that you've done Milan and a little bit.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah, and Pitt and Florence now I can't really believe it either. Yeah, it's fun. So it's fun to do it and it's challenging. And then I come home and I'm like, oh, thank God. It's lovely to be home. And London, you know, it's a shame that we, you know, I also wanted to tell a story about. Well, not just, you know, as institutions sort of fail and classic ways of sort of supporting people sort of no longer exist, which can feel sort of depressing and sort of frustrating and upsetting. But what I found, and part of the storytelling of the market is that in London in particular, and I don't know so much in other cities, but in London the creative community is so strong and they find each other. Do you know what I mean? I mean, I'm only doing what Nasir has been doing. That was a tiny example. Nasir has been doing fantastic toiles on all of the designers in that first for years. Do you know what I mean? And because they f. You know, you're just like, well, I'll just do it myself. Is that there's a make. There's a sort of a make doing men to find a sort of like cheesy phrase to try and encapsulate it. That happens in London. That is this real people group together. And it's sort of what I tell students as well. Like, you know, when I got a doctorate recently. Anyway, that wasn't the story.

[Chairmanardi]

Tell me about that.

[Tamara Rothstein]

That's amazing. But when I did my speech, I was like, what do I. What do I really want to. What's an important thing to tell people? And, and, and part of it is like, find your thing and do it together. Yeah. It's really hard to do it on your own and also celebrate the successes of your friends and your sort of, you know, people that. You know people on the course because you want them to celebrate your success. And it makes us all better. We're all better for it. So it really is.

[Chairmanardi]

I mean, I think that was one of the most. Coming back to the uk, that has been one of the most inspiring things.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Oh, really? Yeah.

[Chairmanardi]

Because people make it happen. Yeah, they do make it happen. They're scrappy, they get together, they figure it out. You know, there's no. And I love that energy and I love so much creativity here. And like you said, I think. I think London, I think the UK in general, it needs that and we need to be celebrating ourselves a little bit more.

[Tamara Rothstein]

I think that that's the thing, I think sort of confidence knock of like.

[Chairmanardi]

I know I'm Brexit. Name it.

[Tamara Rothstein]

You name it. Over the past few years. And the sort of, like, embarrassment of that, sort of the way the chips fell for that bloody thing and how embarrassed you feel looking at your sort of European counterparts and being like, it wasn't me. I'm just so sorry. I'm just so mortified. You know what I mean? And it does have an impact, but actually that people are just sort of, like, carrying on.

[Chairmanardi]

I'm. I feel embarrassed that I forgot doctorate. Tell me, like, oh, no, when did this happen? Sorry.

[Tamara Rothstein]

It was. No, do you know what? It was like a real. Mom and dad were so pleased.

[Chairmanardi]

So where was it? I should know this.

[Tamara Rothstein]

No, you should not know it. No. Why would you know? No, why would you? Why would you know that? No, my university gave me my Middlesex University.

[Chairmanardi]

Oh, my God. Wow.

[Tamara Rothstein]

My lovely friend Lucy Fine put me forward for it.

[Chairmanardi]

Oh, that's so cool.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah. So it was really nice. And it was so moving. It was moving. Not for my own doctorate, but because you sit through watching all the kids get their degrees and it's so sweet. I was just at the point. I was on stage and I was just at the point where the students get their, you know, get handed a piece of paper from the dean and their little faces, you know, it's just. And their families whooping school. It's very sweet. And you know that they're just this point in the. Where it's just all about to open up.

[Chairmanardi]

Yeah.

[Tamara Rothstein]

So it's also thinking about that time in your life and what you want to say. But it was nice. It was really. It's really nice to see. To revisit people at that Point right at the beginning, and you're like, oh, it's all about to open up for you, the possibilities.

[Chairmanardi]

I just remember thinking that when I.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Was like, just all of it. What I can do. I can do anything.

[Chairmanardi]

Yeah. The sky's the limit.

[Tamara Rothstein]

And you do want to encourage that feeling because that's a magic feeling, knowing that there's, you know, that all the other sort of tough stuff that they're gonna face. It's hard graduating as well. But also the feeling. I really wanted to let them know that it's an illusion, this feeling that you're in competition with other people, that there's sort of space for everyone. Cause I don't know if. I don't know if you sort of feel that you feel like you need to get your elbows out and sort of. And that's just not. I just don't think that's the reality.

[Chairmanardi]

I agree. I agree.

[Tamara Rothstein]

It's not.

[Chairmanardi]

And I think it kind of holds you back. It really constantly worry about that. It can be very limiting. Lim.

[Tamara Rothstein]

It is. It's limiting. And anyway, yeah. So it was nice.

[Chairmanardi]

I love that. I mean, I think. I know you don't congratulate yourself or pat yourself on the back ever, but I want to do it. And I think. Incredible. You've created such an amazing brand. Thank you. A clear point of view. Always looking forward and surprising us. Always.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Oh.

[Chairmanardi]

So I think we're also grateful that you exist and we get to wear your clothes.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Oh, wow.

[Chairmanardi]

Thank you so much. Like, congratulations to you. Because it's not easy. It's such low. And you have to keep. I know that, like, just keeping going and, like, keeping that flame alive.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah.

[Chairmanardi]

Is, like, a constant.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah. No, I mean, I love it. I really, really love it. I have to say, I've had the opportunity to work with. When I was sort of thinking about my, like, my jobs as well. Like, I've worked in sort of, like, bars, worked in plastic people, and I've worked in plastic people. Yeah. I used to go there. Oh, my God, stop it. So, I mean, we've definitely crossed paths.

[Chairmanardi]

Fun. Very fun club.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Very amazing, amazing club.

[Chairmanardi]

Back in the 2000s.

[Tamara Rothstein]

An amazing man. Ade and Bernard. But I was thinking about that. I was like. And then I worked in Soho in members clubs there. And I was thinking, I've been really lucky enough because I've learned from those as well. They were feeding my practice, but they were also run by men with such integrity. Integrity was absolutely unshakable. You know, it would. On Saturdays when all the Other clubs in Shoreditch are playing, you know, absolutely. Like, easy sort of like hits, you know, pop hits that would just get the crowds in. Ade would be doing balance, which was him playing his own records, which would be, you know, Ethiopian jazz, to, like, you know, to be completely wild. But it was. The only requirement was that it was quality music, and he was unflinching in that. And he. You know, it was. It was amazing. It was. He just was so consistent. He didn't cave. He did what he believed in. And that's really influenced me. Same with Giuseppe. When we, you know, who run Blacks. Blacks was run. It was so affordable. It was really uncompromising. So uncompromising. So you work for people that show you something, you don't even know that you're. You don't even realize they're influencing you, but they really. They really are. And it's not that I'm, you know, such. Have such integrity. It's not. That's not what I'm sort of saying.

[Chairmanardi]

I'm.

[Tamara Rothstein]

What I'm saying is that I'm. It's just this unflinching. You can do it your way. You can find it. And actually, people. People recognize that somehow. Yeah, you know, it does. It does. If you've got the stamina. So keep doing it. It does work.

[Chairmanardi]

I think it does. And I think it's what rises to the top and what people and what resonates with people. Y. I mean, I know you don't want to use that word, but. Authentic.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah. Truly authentic.

[Chairmanardi]

That just feels like a real expression of, like, a trump thing. Yeah, like a true expression. Not something that is, I don't know, convoluted or watered down.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Chairmanardi]

You know, pandering to an algorithm, which I think is, like, what a lot of the culture ends up being because we're so afraid to break out and do something new.

[Tamara Rothstein]

No, totally.

[Chairmanardi]

You know, because that might not work. You know, and I could talk to you all day, and I don't want to keep. You know, it's not just me and you here, unfortunately. But I wanted to ask you before we go, like, what. What. What's next? Like, what do you. I mean, I. I think you always get this question, too, but this is a good closer, so don't.

[Tamara Rothstein]

No, no, no. I'm not going to poo poo it. No, I won't.

[Chairmanardi]

But, like. Yeah, what's. Where do you feel yourself going? Because it does feel like a big. I mean, like. Like fashion. We keep talking about this, like, big Fashion, you know, fashion's in a moment of transition and. Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Well, that's true. That I adhere to. That I think is true, I think. But I think culture is in a. Wider culture is in a moment of like shifting, changing. Who knows what's next with, you know, all the sort of like existential fears of AI or. You know what I mean? Or all these other conversations that I don't even really know what they are or like the sort of like the breakdown of institutions.

[Chairmanardi]

Like, it's so true.

[Tamara Rothstein]

This sort of like weird. I don't know, it's a weird moment.

[Chairmanardi]

Will we be just dressing our avatars.

[Tamara Rothstein]

And not leaving the house, please? That cannot happen. That absolutely can't happen. But that's the sort of fear, isn't it? You know what I mean?

[Chairmanardi]

Yeah.

[Tamara Rothstein]

I think in a moment like this, people are sort of striving for something more. They want something more. Because consuming, mindless, consuming is not enough, is it? Because it's not enough. It can't be enough. Otherwise we're all doomed.

[Chairmanardi]

Agreed.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Mindless. Yeah. You know, I just. Consuming is fine. But I don't know, you, I. You want to sort of invest in something or buy something that has some. That you think reflects your values in some ways, you know what I mean? And then you feel so proud of it or something. I don't know that that's what I. That's what I feel. How I feel people are going to. Doing, which is. Which is good. Which is good, I think.

[Chairmanardi]

And it will shape the way things go. I think people, as much as we think we can, you know, or corporations think that they can game the system. They can't. When people, when there's fatigue around certain things, when people are not sold or.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Don'T buy just switching off. They're totally switching off. And then what happens? Well, you have to connect to people and that they think that's. I think that's where it's going. So that's what I want to keep trying to do without, you know. You know that I'm not a planner. Really.

[Chairmanardi]

No.

[Tamara Rothstein]

But you're in sort of house always.

[Chairmanardi]

Take you to amazing places.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah. Well, I'll keep trying to follow that then.

[Chairmanardi]

Yeah. Yeah. And I just hope you have the best time in Jamaica.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Oh my God, me too. Yeah. I'm excited.

[Chairmanardi]

Well deserved break.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Thank you very much. Yeah. I can't wait to switch off and eat jerk chicken.

[Chairmanardi]

Yum. I'm so jealous. I love. Portland's one of my favorite places in the world.

[Tamara Rothstein]

I know. It is. It's magic.

[Chairmanardi]

Yeah. If anyone hasn't been go guys recommend it enough.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Yeah. Thank you, Chairman. It's always lovely.

[Chairmanardi]

Yeah. Same, same.

[Daisy Jones]

The Run through is produced by Chelsea.

[Tamara Rothstein]

Daniel, Alex DePalma and Stephanie Cariuki.

[Daisy Jones]

It's engineered by Pran Bandy and James Yost. It is mixed by Mike Kutchman. Chris Bannon is Conde Nast's head of Global Audio.

[Chairmanardi]

Hi, it's Cho Minardi. If you're not on the Vogue app yet, what the hell are you doing? You can follow along with me and other editors as we talk about everything happening in fashion. Think you're already a fashion expert? Well, find out how your Runway IQ stacks up against the Vogue community with an all new Runway genius leaderboard. So download the Vogue app today and you'll never miss a moment.

[Chloe Kelly]

She's made up her mind to live pretty smart Learn to budget responsibly right from the start she spends a little less, inputs more into savings Keeps her blood pressure low and credit score raises she's cutting debt right out of her.

[Martin Rose]

Life she tracks her cash, boring money moves make kind of lame songs but they sound pretty sweet to your wallet BNC bank brilliantly boring since 1865.

[Chairmanardi]

From PRX.