Scaling Online Q&A: Funnels, High Ticket, Ads & More - Part 1 | #Marketing - Ep. 114

Summary

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The Russell Brunson Show – Ep. 114

Scaling Online Q&A: Funnels, High Ticket, Ads & More – Part 1

Date: February 16, 2026
Host: Russell Brunson
Podcast by: YAP Media

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Episode Overview

In this special Q&A episode, Russell Brunson answers questions from entrepreneurs and business owners, focusing on challenges with scaling, online funnels, high-ticket offers, continuity programs, membership structure, regulated industries, and audience growth. Drawing from decades of marketing expertise, his approach blends tactical advice, mindset shifts, and behind-the-scenes examples from his own business and major launches like the One Comma Club Challenge. Whether you’re launching a new offer or struggling to scale, this episode is packed with actionable insights and Russell’s trademark storytelling.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Mission-Driven Scaling & Keeping Your Identity

[01:45–10:29]
Question from Sarah J.: How can a solo, mission-driven entrepreneur scale an online education certification (possibly by joining a mentor’s mastermind team) without losing their mission and identity?

• Certifications Are Easy to Sell: Russell notes, "Certification is one of the easiest things to sell... I love certifications." [02:28]
• Mindset Shift: Selling as Serving: Many hesitate to sell out of fear it conflicts with their mission, but Russell argues:

  “The way you actually serve people is you have to get them to make commitments.” —Russell [03:26]

  • He explains how true transformation requires both making and keeping commitments, often demonstrated through monetary investment.
• Financial Commitment as a Catalyst:

  “People who don’t pay don’t pay attention.” [04:28]

• Best Practices for Scaling With Mission:
  • Use financial commitments to drive engagement.
  • 5-day challenges are a great way to serve powerfully before pitching.
  • Model after successful certification funnels like the One Comma Club Challenge.
• On Joining Someone Else’s Team: Consider if you’re an "intrapreneur" (entrepreneurial inside someone else's business) or if you’re wired to build your own thing. Have open conversations about maintaining your values and autonomy.

2. Continuity vs. High-Ticket Coaching & Managing Churn

[10:32–14:19]
Question from Alaric: Should you prioritize a continuity (membership) offer for long-term growth, or stick to high-ticket coaching—especially given the problem of high churn in memberships?

• Hybrid Model for Coaching Offers:
  • Onboard clients with a high-ticket upfront fee (e.g., $10k onboarding), then transition to monthly continuity.
  • Reduces churn: “If they cancel and want to come back, they have to repay the $10,000.” —Russell [11:44]
• Covers Fixed Costs & Enables Compounding Revenue: Upfront capital helps fund operations/ad spend, while continuity builds predictable, compounding revenue.
• Real-World Example: Russell’s own 2CCX program is $25k/year or $2,500/month, giving best of both worlds.
• Recommended Resources: Books like Daniel Priestley’s Oversubscribed and teachings by Taylor Welch.

3. Creating a Strong MIFGE (Most Incredible Free Gift Ever) Without Owning the Product

[14:27–20:26]
Question from Deborah: Shifting from 1:1 blood analysis coaching to a tiered membership, without owning the lab/supplement lines—how to craft an irresistible MIFGE?

• Think ‘Useful But Incomplete’: MIFGEs should be attractive to your ideal customer and lead naturally to the purchase.
• Examples & Analogies:
  • Perry Belcher’s “cufflinks” for custom suit buyers.
  • Tony Robbins & Cardone’s use of blood/gene tests as front-end MIFGEs.
• Strategy:
  • Use info products, mini-challenges, or interviews that your ideal buyer finds irresistible.
  • The MIFGE can be a content bundle, mini-course, or low-cost test—something related but not the full offer.
• Upsell Path: Bring in with general supplements/info, upgrade them later to custom solutions.

4. Funnels for Regulated Industries & Staying Legal

[20:26–25:20]
Question from Ed: For capital-raising/investment-adjacent businesses, how can you use online funnels ethically without running afoul of regulations?

• Separation of Content and Sale:

  “You’ve got to figure out how to create something on the front end that doesn’t have the regulations, but your dream client would want.” —Russell [21:04]

  • Use books, podcasts, and educational front-ends to generate and nurture leads.
  • The actual regulated transaction happens offline.
• Tony Robbins Example: Money: Master the Game funneled millions in assets—by creating desire in unregulated info product, then referring to a separate, regulated entity.
• Key Takeaway: Marketing = plant and nurture desire; selling in regulated environments happens via compliant back-end hand-off.

5. Membership vs. High-Ticket First & Launching for an Existing Audience

[25:21–32:07]
Question from Leah: Should I launch with a $47/mo membership or a $2,997 high-ticket offer? Where to start if I’m stuck?

• Russell's 3-Level Continuity Ladder:
  • Level 1: Monthly (e.g., $47/mo).
  • Level 2: Annual (e.g., $500 upfront = 2 months free).
  • Level 3: High-ticket ($2,997 or higher).
• Immediate Action:

  “Go and launch your $47 a month thing immediately…get it out there.” —Russell [26:15]

  • Warm audience? Sell to them first, “grab the pile of cash in front of you.” [27:40]
• Scaling Order: Monetize your existing audience with lower-ticket offers; use those profits to fund high-ticket acquisition strategies (like running ads).
• Quote:

  “We always step over [the] pile of cash to go get the other cash. Why would you do that?” [27:40]

6. Generating $10k–$20k Quickly Without Paid Ads

[32:07–37:23]
Question from Nisha: How to secure 10 new customers (worth $10k–$20k) in 30 days with minimal ad spend?

• No Ads Needed Initially:

  “If I had to make 10 to 20k in the next 30 days, I would not use any ads. Not even one. We didn’t buy our first ad for ClickFunnels for two years.” —Russell [32:34]

• Leverage Dream 100 / Warm Partnerships:
  • Identify podcasts, YouTube channels, email lists serving your audience.
  • Request to be a guest, provide value, and mention your offer at the end.
• “Virtual Book Tour” Model: Do a blitz of interviews and appearances—directly reach nurture-rich audiences that trust the host.
• If access isn’t free, offer to pay for spots—still cheaper and more targeted than broad ads.
• LinkedIn/Organic Social: Co-host chimes in on the power of LinkedIn for networking with event/wedding planners.

7. Diagnosing Lead Flow vs. Conversion Bottlenecks in List Building

[37:54–End]
Question from Preeti: How to determine if the problem is not enough leads (top of funnel) or low conversions (mid-funnel)?

• Continual List Growth is Essential:

  “Lists wear out. They don’t last forever.” [38:47]

• Dramatic Demonstrations (e.g., challenges, webinars):
  • Great for both list-building and reactivating a dead/cold list.
• Metrics to Track:
  • Monitor daily new subscribers—this should be your main KPI.
  • Conversion events: Number of sales from list vs. external channels.
• "Law of Chaos":

  “Everything goes to chaos over time... You have a 4,000 person list today; tomorrow it’s less.”

• Practical Strategy: Don’t stop the activity that built your list. If list isn’t converting, revive with special events, but focus on feeding more leads in.
• Quote:

  “New leads are the lifeblood of your business.” [42:10]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Selling and Mission:

  “The way you actually serve people is you have to get them to make commitments.” —Russell [03:26]

• On Financial Commitment:

  “People who don’t pay don’t pay attention.” —Russell [04:28]

• On Hybrid Offers:

  “If they cancel and want to come back, they’ve got to repay the $10,000. So there’s this whole like mental thing they have to go through.” —Russell [11:44]

• On Funnel Structure:

  “We always step over [the] pile of cash to go get the other cash. Why would you do that?” —Russell [27:40]

• On Lead Generation:

  “New leads are the lifeblood of your business. That should be your KPI you’re looking at every single day.” —Russell [42:10]

• On Early-Stage Traffic:

  “I think for most of you guys, you shouldn’t buy ads for the first two or three years of your business.” —Russell [36:23]

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [02:28] – Certification selling & mission-driven scaling
• [04:28] – The importance of financial commitments for transformation
• [08:38] – Should you join a mentor/mastermind team?
• [11:06] – Hybrid coaching offers: upfront + continuity
• [14:27] – Crafting a powerful MIFGE without product ownership
• [21:04] – Funnels in regulated industries, plus Tony Robbins example
• [26:00] – Membership vs. high ticket first—launch sequence
• [32:34] – How to generate $10k–$20k in 30 days without ads (Dream 100)
• [38:29] – Diagnosing list building versus conversion problems

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Episode Tone & Style

Russell's tone throughout is highly energetic, approachable, and packed with stories and analogies. He blends spiritual and personal insights (“where your money is, your heart is”) with direct marketing tactics, always challenging listeners to action and self-examination. The Q&A format keeps the pace quick, with the co-host providing context for each question and Russell building naturally from his own experience.

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For further depth, tune in to Part 2 of this Q&A in the next episode.

Transcript

[Russell Brunson]

Do you have a funnel? But it's not converting. The problem 99.9% of the time is that your funnel is good, but you suck at selling. If you want to learn how to sell so your funnels will actually convert, then get a ticket to my next selling online event by going to sellingonline.com podcast. That's sellingonline.com podcast. What's up, everybody?

This is Russell. I hope you're doing amazing. I've been having so much fun building funnels, launching new challenges, learning so much cool stuff. It's been a really fun season of my business for me last couple months. And anyway, having some fun, we just recently did a new event called Scaling Online. A lot of you guys were there for it. I hope you enjoyed it. And then at the end, I did some Q and A and it was really fun. Some unique questions for some really cool people. And so I thought it'd be fun to share some of Those Q&As with you guys here during the podcast. We're building out a new podcast studio. We have a lot of fun things happening. We'll be relaunching this here soon.

I've been talking about it for the.

Last little while, but we're getting closer and closer, closer to be able to do some really cool things here. And so just in the interim, while we're getting it all finalized and figured out, just going to share a couple more cool things. So what we're gonna do right now is share at the end of the Q and A's from the scaling online event. And I hope you love it. It's about 90 minutes long, so we're gonna break it into two episodes. This will be episode number one of my scaling Online question and answers.

This is the Russell Brunson show. Well, we had about a dozen of you guys who submitted questions. And so that's my plan for the next, I don't know, hour or so is to kind of go through Q and A's. We had people pre submit them because what happens a lot of times is we'll go live on this stuff with the questions and then sometimes people freeze and they kind of stress out. And so is that game plan. Stone, do you want to try pulling one up too?

[Co-host or Assistant]

Yeah, that is the game plan. So what we're going to do is they provided a little context about the their business and then I'm going to ask you the question once the context is provided. Okay, if that works for you. So our first question is from Sarah J. She said, I run A business helping educators entrepreneurs serve atypical kids who don't fit traditional school. I sell certification plus coaching and want to scale and impact fast. So the question is, I am a mission driven solo solopreneur scaling an education certification, possibly joining a mentors masterminds team. How do I scale the opportunity without losing my mission and identity?

[Russell Brunson]

Mission driven solo entrepreneur scaling an online education certification program, possibly joining a big kuh. Cool. Well, what I would do is, I mean, if you look at the one common club challenge, we are selling a certification program. By the way, I think certification is one of the easiest things to sell. I told you guys, mifkey or continuity is the hardest thing to sell. And live event's the hardest thing to sell. Certification is the easiest thing to sell. So I love certifications. So if you look at the one comic club challenge, it was a dramatic demonstration that sold a $5,500 certification program at the end of it. And so the key is like, it was interesting because of the question, without losing my mission and my identity, I think the biggest thing is like, I think sometimes people get this confusion of like, if I am selling something, then I'm not helping people, right? It's just the mindset, shift of understanding. It's like the way you sell people. Sorry. The way you actually serve people is you have to get them to make commitments, right? I served a mission for my church, man, 20 something, 25 years ago. Crazy. And one thing that I learned on the mission was like, is that there's two types of people. There's people that will make commitments and there's people that will keep commitments, right? And so for me to change someone's life, I'd find people who will both make and keep commitments. So this was the process. We would knock on someone's door, we would talk to them, we'd share with them some scriptures, and I would ask them to make a commitment. I'm like, hey, will you read this thing? Right? And I'm gonna come back in two days from now and see if you read it. Now, what's interesting is most everyone like, oh, yeah, I'll read it. Most people will make the commitment. Like, oh, yeah, I'll do it. I'll totally do it. Then I come back two days later, and 99% of people didn't keep the commitment. They made the commitment, didn't keep the commitment. Now there's the 2%, 1% who actually made the commitment and kept the commitment. And people who make and they keep commitments are people who progress. So that's interesting. So it's like they make and they keep commitments, okay? And so this is true on a lot of different levels. Number one, for you guys who are listening, a lot of you guys will make commitments, but you don't keep them. That's why you're struggling, okay? In any area of your life, it could be your health, could be your business, could be like, everyone's like, oh, yeah, I'm gonna do it. I think about this event. Like, how many people registered for this event, they made the commitment, I'm come to this event, and how many kept the commitment and actually showed up and showed up for all the days and did all the things. The number's very small. It's like the bottom of the funnel. Okay? And so first off, you want to be successful in life, you gotta be someone who makes and keeps commitments. Okay? This goes back to your certification and like your mission driven. You want to change somebody's life. So I'm guessing based on the question, Sarah, I'm guessing that you're probably someone who's very mission driven. Like, you love people, you want to change their lives, and you feel guilty selling them because you're like, I don't want to lose my mission or my identity because I don't want to sell these people, but I want to change their lives. Like, if you don't get them to do something, they will not change. Okay? Again, you have to get them to make and keep commitments. That's the only way to progress. Somebody in any area of life is getting them to make them and keeping commitments, ways to do that. One of my mentors used to tell me, like, people who don't pay, don't pay attention. Like, we have to get people to make a commitment. And the best way to make a commitment is with somebody's wallet, with their credit card. They pull it out, they make a financial commitment. Okay? Because me making a commitment to opt into a challenge, low barrier of entry, easy for me to blow off the commitment, right? But for me, if I pull out a credit card to put in for, you know, what I asked you guys to do two days ago? 2,500 bucks a month. Oh, that's a commitment, right? What's going to happen by you pouring your credit card, actually putting the money in, what's going to happen? You're either going to like, freak out and cancel like two days later, or you're like, I made a commitment. I made a financial commitment. It hurts a little bit, right? I could have shown. We could have sold two ccx for a hundred bucks, right? But then like you're less likely to show up, right? The more expensive something is, the more likely you are to actually do something, right? The people who pay me 50 grand in your inner circle, guess what? They show up and they do the thing. People pay me 150 grand for category keys. They show up new things people. 250 grand for Alice. They, they show up and they do things. They've made a financial commitment. So the best way you can serve someone, like getting them to actually make a financial commitment, okay. Cause where you put your money is where your heart's at, right? You see this with people all the time. This is like scriptural, like where our money is where our hearts are, right? Like where do you spend your money at? Where do people spend their money at if they're not willing to spend money for the thing you're trying to get them to do? They're not actually bought in, they're not actually invested in this, right? And so the best way you can do it is by getting them to come over that loop and actually invest money, right? And so how to scale without losing your mission and your identity is understanding that the way that you actually fulfill your mission, you actually fulfill your identity is by getting them to take the steps, getting them make commitments and keep commitments. If you look at the selling online or sorry, not selling online, the 1 comma Club Challenge, I'm asking them to make commitment, register and show up. And then I'm like on thank you page, I'm like, all right, become a VIP. It's free. You have 14 day trial, but you gotta go find your credit card. Like I'm actually making another commitment. It's a little bit scarier. You can find your credit card and actually put in the digits, right? Okay. Then they go through the challenge each day I'm serving them, serving them. Then day through make an offer for the certification program. So that'd be kind of the things I'd be looking at. Also if you look at, if you wanna be a service based person, doing a five day challenge is a great way to serve someone like crazy for five days before you ever ask them for any money too. So if I was you, I would go back through. When the 1 comma club event goes live again, should be the next couple days. We'll have the evergreen version live is go and funnel hack that like go through the process slowly. Download the barnampt.com Chrome extension. Take a screenshot of every single page as you're going through, watching what we're doing again, that funnel, unless I'm insane, should make $100 million this year. Right. That's what I'm pushing towards. And. And so. And it's selling a certification program. So for you, model the whole thing. Right. We had people who went through a certification program and were getting results by that weekend. We did the thing two weeks later with everybody who went through, and we had tons of results. So for me, it's like, man, I was able to do that when I was having so much success in my results. Like, the community's fired up. I'm able to lead those people. It'll shift everything. So, anyway, I hope that works. Any other things from this question that I think we're missing?

[Co-host or Assistant]

I don't think part of it was she's worried that she's going to lose her drive and mission as she joins another team. So she's got an offer to join a mastermind team, and part of it is she's worried she's going to lose her mission by joining the team as well.

[Russell Brunson]

Gotcha. Oh, because I see what you're saying. So you're going to be joining their team, so it's their offer. Well, I think there's a couple things. It's like understanding who you are at the core. Like, are you someone who can be an intrapreneur and be an entrepreneur inside of somebody else's business? If you can, you can thrive in that kind of thing. And I look at my team, I'd say half of my staff are very intramural. They're entrepreneur people who are working inside of my company, but each of them have their own departments, their own things, and they're able to create their own opportunities inside of what we're doing. I think for most of them are.

[Co-host or Assistant]

Having a good time, hopefully having a great time.

[Russell Brunson]

I try to create an environment where they can be very intrapreneurial. They use their entrepreneur talents inside of our business. But there's other people who have come here that I love them, and they came for a week, six weeks, a year, two years, but they couldn't handle it. They wanted their own thing. For me, it would be very difficult for me to go into another business where I'm an intrapreneur. It'd be very hard for me. Other people, they fit in that role great. So I'd be looking at yourself like, are you someone who thinks they can be an intrapreneur inside of somebody else's business? If so, that can be an amazing opportunity. It takes away so Much risk and so many fears. But if you can't and you know that, then I would say don't do that. Right. Or maybe have a conversation with your mentor. Like, this is my fear. Like, I'm very entrepreneurial. I want to be able to grow and scale and there's not that opportunity or that structure here inside this. It's not going to be a good fit for me. Right. And have that conversation now before you decide to take that team or not. And just even say, like, these are the things that are important to me. I want to make sure I'm still able to do these things with my mission, with my identity. I want to be able to do these things as well and make sure they're in alignment with that. And if they're not, like, figure that out right now. Don't. You know, I'd rather like, if it was me, I'd rather, I'd rather like make less money or take a lot longer by myself figuring things out than plugging to something else if I'm not able to actually, you know, get to my end goal, my end values that I want to pursue. So, yeah, have those conversations ahead of time and it should help. Cool.

[Co-host or Assistant]

Perfect.

[Russell Brunson]

Great question.

[Co-host or Assistant]

All right, you ready to move on to the next one?

[Russell Brunson]

Let's do it. Who do we got next?

[Co-host or Assistant]

All right, so next one is from Alaric. And the context behind his question is I do marketing, branding and sales coaching. I tried selling software in 2023 through 2024, but hated the tech support side. So I'm focusing on coaching again. And I've noticed a lot of coaching continuity programs seem to have high churn. So the question is, do I actually need a continuity offer to grow long term or is it smarter to stick with a high tick or to stick with high ticket coaching? And if continuity is needed for what's the best way to structure to avoid high churn?

[Russell Brunson]

Cool. Great question. There's two guys that teach this really well. Daniel Priestley, he's got a book called Oversubscribed and he's got another one. I can't remember the name of it off top of my head. And then Taylor Welch also teaches us. He calls it, he's got, he's got a fancy name for it. It's basically a very similar thing, but it's about how to structure your coaching offers. Have continuity. And so I don't. Again, I'm probably going to mess this up. But the gist is very similar with the way they structure their high ticket coaching programs is someone will pay let's say it's $10,000 for the initial onboarding. So it's $10,000. We onboard you, da, da, da. Here's what's going to happen. And then after that it rolls into a $697 a month continuity or a 997 continuity, whatever the thing might be, right? And so what happens is a couple things. Number one is you get the high ticket revenue up front very, very quickly, but then within 30 days you rolled into continuity. But then the churn, it solves the churn problem because somebody's already invested the 10 grand for this onboarding stuff to be part of it. Right now they're paying the monthly and if they cancel and they want to come back, they've got to repay the 10,000. So there's this whole like mental thing they have to go through of just like, man, I lose my $10,000 investment if I disassociate, if I unplug from this. But if I, but if I, if I stay, you know, if I, if I stay in it, then we've got this thing and we have a long, we stick long term with it, right? And so it's been really fascinating. A lot of the guys in my inner circle went to Taylor Welch's trading and then they started implement that in their high ticket. And it's really fascinating watching it because it gets rid of most of the churn problems. It gets people where they're, you're getting a bunch of money up front. So it's nice because it covers ad spend and covers like all those, the fixed costs, but then gets people plugged in this continuity and that's kind of where it goes from there. So my recommendation would be looking at some of that again. Daniel Priest, the oversubscribed book may be the one that talks about this, but if not, there's another book he wrote that goes deeper on it and Taylor Welch has gotten a bunch of stuff on it as well. But that's kind of the way I would structure it. I would always like, I have so many friends that are all just high ticket people and I love it, but I just look at their business because typically what happens is you close, you crush a bunch of high ticket sales and you're like, man, I got 200k in the bank, I'm gonna go fly on a private jet. And you do that and then within like six weeks, like it's gone and you're like, ah. And you start to go do it again. And it's like they're never Building towards something right. There's never. And for me it's like when I shifted my mindset from high ticket to compounding continuity. How can I do these things? That yes, will give me a high ticket, but at the same time it's also building more continuity into it. You look at the 2ccx offer that I made to you guys two days ago that I make right now. For me, there's a high ticket $25,000 a year, but people pay 2,500 bucks a month. So for me it's like, yes, I get the high ticket, $25,000 thing and I get people on the continuity, $2,500 a month. So I'm kind of getting the best of both worlds. And so I would just structure that way. And, and yes, there is churn. People leave, but at the same time it's like that's better than someone paid me. I spent the money and now I gotta find more people all the time to keep pushing into it. Does that make sense? So hopefully that helps some of the kind of reframes I look at that. Look at how those guys are structuring the higher ticket programs. I haven't structured mine that way yet. I've looked at that or thought about that I may restructure Inner Circle in the future to be something more similar to that. I just haven't decided yet. So yeah, hope that helps.

[Co-host or Assistant]

Awesome. All right, nice job, Russell. You kind of know what you're talking about. All right, we're going to move to the next question. This is from Deborah.

[Russell Brunson]

Deborah.

[Co-host or Assistant]

The context Deborah provided is I'm moving from one to one blood analysis, nutrition coaching to a tiered membership, three to four tiers. Higher tiers include comprehensive blood draws plus custom supplement plans through a partner lab supplement provider. I'll sell via webinar and lead funnel and want to stop daily one on one, go location independent and scale across North America. So the question is, what's a strong mifke for this if I don't own the lab or supplements lines so I can't give away tests or products.

[Russell Brunson]

Cool. Well, first off, what's her name again?

[Co-host or Assistant]

Debra.

[Russell Brunson]

Debra. So first off, optimal health and Doug's who I use. So you're selling an insanely good product that's we do our blood draws every 90 days, my wife and I. It's been in probably of all the biohacks I've done probably the best biohack and I've done mostly everything. So that's a great product you're selling, which is Great. So it's a good question. I did a promo with Doug as well, where it's like we were selling the back end blood and certification, all that kind of stuff as well. We were selling the high ticket version of it. And so we did a webinar, we did a chat, we did a bunch of different things in front of it. The biggest thing is just understanding. It's like, hey, when all said and done, the end thing you're selling is custom blood work, custom supplements, things like that, right? So when I'm creating a Mifka, I'm thinking like, okay, what's something that my dream client would go crazy for, right? Something that's useful but incomplete, that will get that person to raise their hand so I know who they are, that then I can then push them into something later, right? And so good example, this Perry Belcher, back in the day, he had a suit company. I don't know if he bought or invested in it, but they did custom suits, right? And so he was thinking, he's like, I can't do a Mifke. I can't do a free plus ship. There's nothing I can do for like a suit company. But how do I get people who are likely to buy custom suits? He's like, okay, well, let me think about this. Custom suit people. What do custom suit people? Like, what are other things we know about them, right? Well, people wear custom suits, they wear custom shirts, they wear custom ties, they wear, you know, they do different things. He's like, oh, people that buy custom suits, traditionally they're getting French cuff shirts, right? And they've got what? They've got cufflinks. Oh, anybody who's going to buy a cufflink is likely the same person who's going to eventually buy a custom suit. And so Perry went and he found these cufflinks. They call them cuff cuff. I can't remember. I have a picture of the funnel. Back in the day, it was really cool, but basically it was like free plus shipping cufflinks. And there was really cool, sick cufflinks. And so you buy that free plus shipping. And then from there he knew like, okay, people who just bought this free plus shipping cufflinks, they're likely. And then from there he would send them and upsell them and to buy in the suits. Now, he didn't have continuity and all these things built into it, but that's the, that's the mindset I want you to be thinking about. What's something that my dream client who's going to be Buying custom supplements is also going to buy earlier in the journey. It could be all sorts of things. It could be, you go and you find five cool biohackers and you interview them. You put together a package and it's like, all right, here's the biohacking super conference or summit or whatever. And you pull people together. So it could be that. It could be. If you look at the way that Cardone blew up TEDX Health, he created a MIFKE for the blood test. Him and Breca put it together. It was like it was a blood test for the gene test that Breca does, right? So it's like it was an expensive Mifke, but it was like, I think 500 bucks, 600 bucks for this Mifke. And that was the test, right? And so they would just sell this test like crazy. You look at Breca, he was on Joe Rogan, he was on everywhere selling this test or blood. I think it was a blood test for 600 bucks. But that gave them the data, and then from there they would do something. The blood test could be the mifge. And I don't know what Doug and those guys charged for that. The initial. That's what it could be, right? Or it could be you could create an info product that's going through, like, based on blood test results. Like, hey, if your blood test this and this, it means you need more iron, you know, whatever. You create an offer like that, and then it's like, now someone buys that and like, this is amazing, but I actually need my blood test to find out what mine actually is, right? And so then you can upsell a blood test. And so those are things I would be. I would be looking at, right? It's like, just what are the things that someone who is eventually going to want to buy the supplements would be interested in, right? And creating something based on that. So, like, for example, when we did ours initially, it wasn't for the blood test one, but we had a bone broth that we were doing, right? So I'm trying to sell bone broth to people, but I'm like, how do I get someone to think that bone broth is sexy? I'm like, well, it's not sexy by itself, but I'm like, if I get them to understand the value of the protein that the bone broth gives them, then it could be really sexy. So we did a webinar where I basically taught this whole structure on protein, how it works, how do you eat the protein, how do you lose weight on and did that. And also it created desire. Now for protein, I was like, you can buy all sorts of protein that's going to give you gas because it's all whey based or you know, collagen protein. That's way better. Right. We push people into that and it converted like crazy. So it's just thinking through those things, right? It's just like we're always looking for like a dotted line, but it's not that way. It's just thinking like, here's the end customer. What are things that they would be excited for? They get them to geek out and then from there then it's like that's what you create. You know, Mifkes again are something that's useful but incomplete. So it's like, what's this thing that's very, very useful? It's exciting, it's cool, but it's incomplete. Right. And you put that together, that becomes the mifge to bring somebody in. And maybe it's not going to be directly into. Well, actually it's kind of interesting. So Doug and I did the deal back in the day and then we stopped doing it just because we were selling 10,000 our thing. And anyway it didn't work because a lot of people didn't see the value of custom supplements. If and when I do the deal with Doug again in the future, our Mifkey will not be the custom supplements. It would be some sexy Mifkey thing that puts them on the, what's it called, the natural supplements, the non synthetic supplements which he sells. Right. It would be something that gets someone on that because you can do the default supplements that aren't customized for whatever it is. And that would be my Mifke. And then after they're on the mifke getting the regular supplements in a box every single month, then my job, my goal would be to send them from, from regular supplements up into custom supplements. And so that's how I'd restructure the offer if and when I do that again with Doug in the future. So hopefully that's helpful.

[Co-host or Assistant]

Wonderful. We're going to move on to the next question. This one is from Ed and here's the context. So since 1997, ED's helped companies raise capital by matching early stage investments up to three times and de risking investors via diversification and hedging. He's currently selling offline via networks and referrals and he wants to go online, but he's cautious about regulatory boundaries. So the question you like legal stuff. So as clickfunnels Work with regulated investment adjacent businesses. And how can I use funnels to market ethically without crossing lines?

[Russell Brunson]

Yes. Good, good. Yeah. First off, I'm sorry, I. It's like this weird annoying loophole that like there's a dozen industries that have to do it. We've got people successfully on click funnels doing that. And so it comes down to like, you've got to figure out how to create something on the front end that doesn't have the regulations but your dream client would want, right? A lot of times that's a book, right? So like I see people who like, they have funds for accredited investors, right? And so it's like, how do you get those people? You know? And so like there's all sorts of rules you have to do. And so what they do is they create a book or an offer something on the front end that's teaching like the strategy behind the thing, but it's not selling the services, right? Because that has to happen separately through regulations, stuff like that. So I use, like, if it was me doing it, I'd be using funnels and stuff to get the potential dream clients to come into my world and to position myself as an authority. But then all of the regulative selling stuff would be happening separately externally from the online funnel. Does that make sense? Because there's usually got to be that arm's distance length because there are so many rules and so many things in so many different businesses, right. In insurance stuff, there's issues in capital raising 100%, right? Credited versus unaccredited versus like there's all sorts of different things. And so it's coming down to like, what can you create on the front end that's gonna get someone who potentially wanna do that in the future to raise their hand? You can bring them in, right? And a book is a great way. I've seen a lot of people do this with book offers where you can sell a book on information about how investment strategies of the rich, right? I watched Tony Robbins did this. Tony Robbins, he is so smart. So he did a thing where he interviewed the top 50 greatest investors in the history of all time. And he made the book Money Master the Game. And he launched this book and he was on Today Show, CNN everywhere pitching this book. And he sold, you know, we ran part of the funnel for it for a while, but like he, I mean, he sold, I don't know, millions of copies of this book, right? And Tony's not, he can't say anything, he can't do anything. But he had a Partner on the back end, who. When someone read the book and they're like, oh, I need somebody with fiduciary, blah, blah, whatever. Tony talked about in this big old fat book, and he just told people this is where they should go. And I think that, like, year one, he put like $8 billion in assets on the back end of the book, right? And so, like, very heavily regulated, but he didn't. He was just interviewing people about the topic, and everyone read the book, they're excited, and it's like, oh, like what? He created a concern and a desire. And all of Alvin's like, well, I don't know who to invest with. Then, oh, what do I do? And Tony's like, oh, just talk to these guys over here. And then they could put him over there, right? But Tony didn't have to have the regulations and the rules and all kind of stuff, because he wasn't asking people for money up front. He wasn't doing those kind of things. He was just sharing information from the greatest traders in the world and brought people in. That'll happen here and then separate transaction over here. But he had all the leads and he created all marketing really is. Is like hooking somebody to get their attention. And then you're planting a seed of desire and you're watering that seed to make that desire grow, right? I mean, think about this. When I started a decade ago teaching funnels, nobody had desire for funnels. Nobody cared about funnels. So what was my job? My job was plant seeds of desire and then water that. Austin's like, oh, I need a funnel. I need a book funnel. I have to have a funnel, right? And then. And by me planting seeds for a decade, that's how my business has grown, this huge thing. So I'm planting seeds of desire. So think about that as like, you're bringing somebody in. Similar concept, but something that's not regulated. Planting seeds of desire. You're going to water them through podcasts, through YouTube videos, through trainings, through the education, through the books, all this kind of thing, right? It blossoms in something. Now they have this, like, pain because you've created this desire. It's gotten bigger and bigger and bigger. And they're like, oh, over here I run an investment firm or I run a thing over here or whatever that might be. And then you can push them to something externally through the regulations, but it's just separating those two things and understanding what can you say and not say over here that's separate, or even creating a whole separate business that does, like, Tony's business that sells the books. Robin's research is completely different from the investment fund that Tony's an investor in over here. That then takes all the money and does that make sense? So hopefully that kind of helps a little bit. But yeah, in terms of regulation stuff, obviously there's a lot of rules you got to follow, but for the most part, it's understanding these are two separate businesses. One's for lead gen and bringing people in and like educating, creating desire and then separately is where you push somebody over there. Hope that helps. Thank you, Ed Swain.

[Co-host or Assistant]

Yeah, thank you, Ed Swain.

[Russell Brunson]

I think that was very helpful.

[Co-host or Assistant]

And we have a handful of folks in inner circle who deal with that same stuff, do investments. I won't list off a bunch of names, but there's a ton of people who have found how to do those types of things without crossing boundaries. So. All right, next question we have is from Leah and the context is that she helps burned out homeschool mom and kids love learning. Again, she keeps hearing start high ticket, but linchpin seems to place high ticket later. So she's stuck and hasn't launched. So the question is, should she start with a $47 a month membership or a 2997 high ticket offer? And how do I decide so I can finally move forward?

[Russell Brunson]

All right, Leah. They say her name, Leah?

[Co-host or Assistant]

I think so. I would say yes.

[Russell Brunson]

We're going to get you unstuck right now and you are going to be in it and we're going to start playing and it's time to party. Okay. All right. It comes back down to levels of continuity, right? Level one, level two, level three. So you got $47 a month is your level one continuity, right. Traditionally level two is like a year access to that, right? So you're looking at $47 a month times 12, minus two months for free. So usually times 10, right? Usually we do. So usually when we're moving someone from level one to level two, we. We're going from this mine's $97 a month to $997. So they get two months for free, right. So if you go $47 a month here, you're at basically 500 bucks. So 500 bucks is this. And then 2,997 is your high ticket offer. Okay? So boom, boom, boom, you got all three of them. So this is simple because level one, level two is the exact same thing. They're just prepaying for a year, right? The click funnels off. We built click funnels $97 a month. Click Funnels. And then we prepaid for a year and then moved them to level two. And then back here is now 2ccx Prime Mover. All the other things happen at level three, right? So these are your first two things. So what I would say is right now, just to get unstuck, like go and launch your $47 a month thing immediately. That's your MIFD. The upsell becomes, hey, when you upgrade, you get two months for free and it's 500 bucks. And that gives you level one. Level two, I would get that done today. Go get that done, get it launched, get it out there. Send emails to your existing list and your people and get them into motion. Right? And that's what's gonna happen. And I would spend a little while doing this. I would keep doing this until you're like, man, I can't. I'm assuming you said you have an audience. I burned out Help Moms. Right. So you have an existing audience. I'm assuming. So I would say existing audience is great. So it's your warm traffic and just start hitting there fast. Okay. Typically people say start high ticket because high ticket, it's gonna be harder for you to run profitable ads to a $47 a month continuity. Right. It's just the math is harder to make work. But in the short term, it's like I always tell. This is one of the conversations I have literally every three months with the inner circle when they come here to Boise, and I've been doing it for a decade or more now, is that everyone's like, okay, I want to scale this business. And so I have this idea. And so what's happening is there's a big pile of cash right here. And they're like, they see it, but they're like, okay, but I want to scale it. So they step over the big pile of cash and they walk over here and they're trying to figure out these other things. Okay? So sorry, Brad. And Brad's got to like follow me on this stage as I'm running around. Okay? So what I do first is I come down here, I'm like, okay, there's a big pile of cash right here. I'm going to grab that pile of cash first and then I'll go get the other cash. But we always step over this pile of cash to go get the other cash. Right? Why would you do that? If you look at every single funnel we've ever launched, including this one right now, depending when you're watching this Right. Most of you guys are watching this live, but this eventually will be an evergreen thing, Right? But the live version, you guess what I did. I just emailed my own existing audience. I'm just grabbing the pile of cash. I didn't buy any ads. None. Like, we just bought. Like, just grab the pile of cash now, and then we'll go and we'll figure out how to scale it. So for you, it's like, yes, a 297 to offer is gonna be the thing. You're gonna want to be able to scale in the future. Cause you need that profit margin for you to be able to grow and scale. But if you've got an existing audience right now and they love you and they know you, like, make the $47 thing, upsell $500 thing, and email, post on social tweets, spam, everything you got to your warm audience and get them to come in here and grab that pile of cash right now and pull all that cash off the table and. And now you got some reserves. Okay. I was able to pull off 1,000, 10,000. I don't know how big your audience is. $50,000 of money, right? You pull that cash off, and now let's plug in your level three continuity, your 2,997. And now you can take the money again. You're betting house money like you already pulled. Your warm market is going to finance. Now you coming back and doing an offer that sells your 297 that you got to go buy ads for. Does that make sense? Like, we did the One Comic Club Challenge. Everyone's like, why aren't you buying ads on this? I'm like, I play the game where I have the lowest amount of risk possible. So the first thing I do. We launched 1 comma Club Challenge. Email our existing list. We did the challenge. We got 1200 people on Mifke. We had a $5500 offer, 600 sales for that. So I grabbed a pile of cash. So what happens if you look at the math on what, 600 times 5500, it's like $3 million. So we got $3 million in cash. Now I'm playing with house money. Okay? I'm not investing money to buy ads. I've got $3 million in cash that we collected. Now I go out and say, okay, let's start spending money here. Does that make sense? So my warm audience funds the growth for everything else. Too many of you guys are risking and trying and hoping and praying for stuff. It's like, if you have an audience right now, get them to finance it all. So again, I would launch $47 a month thing immediately with a $500 upsell for yearly. That gives us two things. And then spend the next month, two months, three months, however long he works profitably, keep promoting, keep pitching. It keeps getting stuff. Just pull that money, pull that money, pull that money off, and then you got a pile of money. Don't go spend on your new car. Don't go spend it on whatever the thing is. An entrepreneur's the worst of that. We got excited. We go buy a new watch. We buy something that we don't need. Keep that money. And so, like this, like, I'm using house money. So my audience is financing this for me now. I'm taking this money and now we're going to sell my $2,000 offer. I'm going to Evergreen or I'm buying ads. And that money then goes back into ads. Does that make sense, you guys? All right, cool, cool, cool. Awesome. Dave said that's amazing. Okay. That's how we start growing things and scaling things without risking our own money, right? My hot audience, my existing audience right here, they are funding and financing this for me. I get the money off the table and I reinvest. Now to get the warm audience, we start scaling and going from there. Now, most of you guys are never going to get spot where you have to get the cold audience. Most guys can build good eight figure year businesses off going hot and warm. Cold's when you're trying to get to $100 million a year. So a lot of you guys will never have to worry about this. So hot. Again, every new offer, put it out there, get the hot audience, pull the money out of it. Then you reinvest that into the warm audience, start buying ads and be able to go to the next level. So that'd be my recommendation for you. Again, the reason why everyone's saying lead high ticket is because most people saying that they don't have an audience yet. It's like I have no audience. I got to sell $10,000 things. I can pay for ad spend. But if you've already got homeschool moms who know who you are, who are paying there, grab the pile of cash in front of you and then go to the next phase. That help. Cool, cool, cool. All right, who's up next?

[Co-host or Assistant]

All right, up next is Nisha or Nisha. I apologize for mispronouncing it. The context is Nisha helps small businesses and wedding pros with strategy, marketing systems. She has a goal of 10 new paying customers per month. So the question is, if you need to generate 10 to 20,000 in 30 days with minimal ad spend, what acquisition strategy would you prioritize first?

[Russell Brunson]

Cool. Alright, Nisha, I'm going to give you some good news. If I had to make 10 to 20k in the next 30 days, I would not use any ads. Not even one. A lot of you may not know this. We didn't buy our first ad for click funnels for two years because ads, as much as we love them for scaling, they suck for profit initially. And we didn't have money to buy ads initially, number one. But number two, it's like there's so many ways to get free traffic that are way better, right? So again, talk about this. If you have your own hot audience, right? This is your best. Your hot audience loves you, they're gonna forgive you, they're gonna sign for stuff if your funnel doesn't convert very well. So that's the best. If you got your own audience, I would just market to my own audience if I need pull 10, 20k out, like that's what I do. If you don't have your own audience, that's okay. My next phase would be like, hey, I'm going to go down to my warm audience and I could go buy ads and give Zuckerberg money. Or what if instead I find people who already have a list? That list is hot for them, right? They're warm to me, but they're hot to them. So I'm going to leverage that relationship and get them to promote something that then I can sell. Okay? So that's kind of the strategy. So conceptually how it would work, what I would do is I would figure out what is the thing I'm trying to sell. Let's say if it's going to be a. Again, I'm not sure what price point you're selling. So attending paying clients. So you're probably selling something thousands, $2,000 or so. So that's what it is, right? So what I do is I would go and I would create a way to some funnel to sell that, right? It could be a webinar, could be a coaching app, whatever that is. Like we figure out what it is, right? And then I would say, okay, if you're helping business like wedding pros, I would say, okay, who are 100 people that have a podcast speaking to wedding pros? Maybe you can find 100, maybe you want to find two podcasts. What are the YouTube channels they're speaking to wedding pros, I say, what are the email lists speaking to wedding pros? This is like, out of my book Traffic seekers. Step number one is building Dream 100. I figure out who are the people that are already speaking to my audience. Who has a warm audience, speaking to my dream customer or hot audience? They're warm to me, but it's hot to them. And I would go to those people and say, hey, I love your podcast. You're speaking to wedding pros all the time. I have a really unique way that I help wedding pros, help them do it by blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. It's completely different. Would you be like, could I come on your podcast and share the strategy with your audience? They were going to love it. Person would say, yeah, right? As long as you pitch it and present it correctly, okay. And I would go to the YouTube channel and say, hey, you got this YouTube channel. I love what you're doing. I have a unique way that I help wedding pros that's different than what you're talking about. Now. Can I come on and do an interview and share this way? Like, yeah. And I start getting on other people's lists, other people's audiences to go and do that. Does that make sense? So that's what I would do. I would focus 100% of time out of that. If you look at, like, when movies come out, right? And nowadays movies are kind of lame, but you remember back in the day when. When Marvel was still awesome, and you look at the cycle, like, each of the Marvel movies would come out, right? I used to love watching this because Iron Man, Iron Man Part two, Thor. Like, did all other movies come out before the movie come out? The very first thing that they would do is they send all the actors out on. On a tour, right? A TV tour. They'd be on Today show, Tonight Show, Good Morning America, cnn. Like, they'd hit all the different talk shows, and they'd come and they talk about the movie, and they show a clip from the movie, then go, go, this weekend, we're going live. And they would just blitz the media for two weeks, lead into movie, and then they would go and get everyone live, right? And that's how they were. They would promote it. I was like, in a perfect world, if I was launching a book or a coaching program, webinar, I'd be on today's show, tonight's show. I can't get on those things, right? But I can do the same thing. I can do a virtual book tour. So for me, I'm Looking at this, if I have an offer, I need to make some money. I'm going to go on a virtual book tour. I'm going to try to get every podcast, every YouTube channel, everyone's email list and get that way. And then they have me on there. I provide content to their audience for free. And then from there, at the end of. It normally happens at the end of every interview is like, hey, if you want more information, where do they go? I'm like, oh, cool. There's actually an application. If you want me to help you implement this in your business, go to russellbrunson.com coolkidsgohere.com, whatever it is, you know. And then now you're getting all this audience, warm audience for someone else to hear your message. Now they become hot. Sorry, hot audience to someone else. Now they become hot to you, and you push them to a thing. But that's what I would do. I think for most of you guys, you shouldn't buy ads for the first two or three years of your business. You should be just doing that strategy. If you want to understand it. Go read Traffic Secrets and then go listen. Like, that's the whole thing. I'm like, dream 100. Focus on that. Do that first. Anyway, so that's why I'd focus. So that'd be what I was gonna do. If you're like, I need 10k or I need it quick, what's the best way to spend ads? I would then go, if the people say no, be like, cool, Can I pay you 1000 bucks to be on your podcast instead? They're like, sure. I have podcasts. I go on now. I have YouTube channels. We had a guy the other day, he's got a huge YouTube channel. And I was like, hey, put him out for free. He's like, no. I'm like, cool. How much would you charge? And like, I think, like, 10 grand. I'm like, done. And so, 10 grand. He flew out here, filmed me, posted up. We got like, I don't know, a million views on it. I was like, that's the cheapest ads ever, right? So asking them for free. If they say no, ask them how much cost to be on it and then just pay them. That's way cheaper ads and way better ads because you're going directly to the hot audience, to somebody else. They're giving you a personal recommendation versus you buying ads on Facebook and hoping find somebody. It's like, yeah, so that'd be my recommendation. Good luck, Nisha. I hope that that Helps for you. Yeah.

[Co-host or Assistant]

You mind if I add one thing, Russell?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, please do.

[Co-host or Assistant]

Oh, really cool.

[Russell Brunson]

LinkedIn.

[Co-host or Assistant]

She said she helps like wedding pros and, you know, business planners, events planners. Like they're on LinkedIn trying to get insights from other people in the industry all the time. And we're posting our wins or there's our struggles and you'd be surprised how many connections or people will come to you for help. So I mean, that's while you're trying to get on those podcasts or YouTube channels, just to post on LinkedIn could probably do the trick. Make sure you use the right hashtags and utilize that.

[Russell Brunson]

So very cool.

[Co-host or Assistant]

Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

There you go. For Miles. Miles himself.

[Co-host or Assistant]

I love LinkedIn. Love LinkedIn. All right, so our next question is from Preeti. And again, I apologize, I'm not good at pronouncing names, but here's the context. So Preeti sells an eight week live cohort strength longevity program for women 40 years and over. She has 4,000 email subscribers, but most buyers come from local Facebook groups. I want to scale reach. So the question is, how do I diagnose whether my bottleneck is top funnel, not enough leads or mid funnel leads not converting? And what metrics should I check?

[Russell Brunson]

So they have a 4,000 person list, but their sales coming from Facebook groups. So they're saying the list isn't buying, Is that what they're saying?

[Co-host or Assistant]

I think, I guess trying to find the diagnosis. Is the bottleneck not enough leads coming in or the leads that she's getting, are they not converting?

[Russell Brunson]

Okay. Oh, they just posted. Yes, the list isn't buying. Okay, cool. So list isn't buying. So a couple things I would say is number one is it's like if you think about lists, like the list is the lifeblood of every single business. Okay. And so for me, it's like I have to continually be adding people to lists because lists wear out. They don't last forever. Right. I think if I was to look back the last 10 years, we probably had, I don't 10, 15 million people that have optimized list at one time or another. And there's like they're flowing through, they stay for a while, they fall off and like new people. So like there's always going to be new things coming. And so a lot of it's like, okay, you have 4,000 person list, but it's like you've got to like, yes. Stimulate growth. That's why dramatic demonstrations we talked about are so great, because dramatic demonstrations, like I had a list, I Got to give them something exciting. Because if I'm just like, buy this thing, buy this thing. It's not. It's hard, right? If I'm like, I'm going to Dan K's basement, it's going to be amazing. Like, they'll reengage a cold dead list, right? So it's like re engaging them to be excited. So that's number one. But number two, it's like when we do a dramatic demonstration, one of the reasons why we do that is because it's the best list building tool we have, right? The dramatic demonstration is a lead magnet, right. If you look at the Dan Kennedy business, right? Like Dan challenge, that challenge is the lead magnet. And so like we're promoting it, they're registering and that's how the list is growing. Okay. For the 1 comma club challenge, my goal when we get evergreen is get 10,000 people a day to opt in. Okay. Like that's the number. That's the metric really we're sprinting towards, right? So that's adding 10,000 people a day to the list. So you have 4,000 person list. Cool. Do something like that to try to reengage them, number one. But then number two, it's like, okay, now you have the drag demonstration. Now start putting new leads in there. Have them, have them start coming in now. If you're saying that the conversions are all coming from Facebook groups, it's like, hey, for us it's very similar. Like we like when we do challenges, we did the lone common club challenge, we put them all into a backstage pass group, right? Which is kind of like a Facebook group. Put them in there. And so that like in the community, like we're dropping things. It's the social proof. It's the networking that gets people to buy eventually. So it's like using these strategies in tandem. So it's like with Facebook group or sorry, email list and a Facebook group promotes a demonstration, they register for that. We put them into a Facebook group to have the conversation, get them excited about what's happening. Like we're communicating with there, right? And we keep going back and back and forth from there. Okay, they're posting on here. So the list is from Facebook ads. Could it not be my ideal audience? I don't know. There's so many things to be hard to know unless, you know, like if that list was 100% off Facebook ads, they're not buying at all. So maybe just tell us that is nobody buying at all from that list and they never have. And did you Gather that list from just all Facebook ads. I mean, there is definitely. There definitely is. You know, you could have a list that's just dead or it's not working, or they came in under different pref. You know, they signed it for one thing, and then you're trying to sell is completely different. So it's disconnects. They're not going to buy from that. Those things are all possible. But I think my initial thing, if I had that, I'd be like, okay, how do we revive that list? In fact. Oh, Yana golden has a training called the subscriber reviver that she teaches people how to subscribe and get people back. Right. And so that's like an option is like following that. But, okay, my program's eight weeks is two grand. Three people bought it. Three people from 4,000 person list or three people from the local Facebook groups. I think the biggest thing is just like, okay, three people list. Okay, so that's not bad. Four thousand person list. Three people paid you two grand. Two, four, six. I mean, that's not bad. Now it's just like, hey, how do we keep selling to that list and how do we build the list bigger? Right? I mean, I think about this like, you know. Yeah. I mean, it's all a math and a numbers game, right? So if you wrote the 4,000 person list, like, do a webinar, do a challenge, keep doing things, but it's like, hey, just know, like, that's a stagnant number that's gonna. It's atrophying over time. What's Einstein's law of thermodynamics? Like, things deteriorate over time or, I don't know, acting smart. I don't know what I'm talking about, but it's true. Like, you put an apple outside in the sun, it just deteriorates and it disintegrates over time. Right? The chaos theory. Everything goes to chaos over time. Same list. You have 4,000 person list today, tomorrow it's less and it's less and it goes to chaos. It gets worse and worse and worse over time, right? So dramatic demonstrations, reinvigorate a list, but also understand that that list is stagnant. It's always going to be shrinking and growing. So the question I'd be asking is, how do I add 4,000 people a week to that list? Because If I add 4,000 people a week to the list, right? And you come back to there and it's like, hey, you got three people to buy from the list so far, it's like, hey, if I had 4,000 more people. So that's $6,000, right? Three people bought 2,000 off. Two, four, six. You made six grand off 4,000 person list. So it's like, how do we keep replicating? How do we get more people in the list? Keep selling them. So I'd be like, if you have a webinar that's selling your $2,000 offer, okay, you got the webinar. It's a dramatic demonstration. Buy ads, keep buying ads. Keep buying ads. And keep doing that. You got the things in place that it just feels like you're not putting more people into the process, into the funnel. I think you're thinking, nobody bought it for 4,000 personals except for three people. Three people bought. You made six grand. That's great. There's probably another three people you could get from that if you just keep following up, keep doing stuff. Keep doing stuff. Now you're at, you know, six grand, 12 grand. I made 12 grand. A 4,000 person list. Cool. Now it's going like, let's get another 4,000 people on our list. How do I add another 4,000 people today or this week or this month? Right. So, yeah, I hope that's helpful. It's just understanding. It's just like this is a numbers game. So you got to keep putting more people in. I see people all the time. This is one of the. I see this in a circle a lot, actually, is where people will spend a period of their business growing a list. The list grows to be whatever, 5,000, 10,000 people big. And then they stop the activity that built the list, right? So they have 10,000 people on the list and they sell something. They're making money, making money. What happens is that that list now, it starts deteriorating and deteriorating. And so, like, they come in their circle and they're like, man, I made way more last year than this year, and I can't figure out why. And like, I'm still in the same webinar, same challenge, like, but less people are buying. It's like, it's because you stop growing. So the list is shrinking and atrophying over time. Law of chaos gets smaller and smaller and smaller, right? And then they can't figure it out. And then we're trying to figure out, like, maybe the presentation, the hook's not right. And we keep looking at stuff, and eventually we're like, oh, it's because you stopped getting new leads in. Like, new leads are the lifeblood of your business. Like, that's, that's why it's holding structure that way. Everything's pushing into a dramatic demonstration. They have to register Dramatic demonstration. They have to register for mifke that there's low ticket free plus shipping. They're coming in to get. You know, we're just trying to always be bringing new blood in. Okay, so the question that I'd be asking yourself every single day is how many people join my list today? That should be your KPI you're looking at every single day. Because as that grows, the rest of your business will grow with it. Okay? It's figuring out how to get 4,000 people list to. Like, how do I add 4,000 people a month to my list? That's the mindset shift and start focusing on getting new leads into the funnel, into the thing. That's the game plan. Hope that helps. But it's just volume. Increasing the volume. People coming into your world.