Pacers Steal Game 1! Haliburton’s Confidence and OKC’s Tension With Tim Legler.

Summary

The Ryen Russillo Podcast – Detailed Summary

Episode Title: Pacers Steal Game 1! Haliburton’s Confidence and OKC’s Tension With Tim Legler
Release Date: June 6, 2025
Host: Ryan Rosillo
Guest: Tim Legler, former NBA player and analyst

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1. Game 1 Recap: Pacers Secure a Thrilling Victory in OKC

The episode kicks off with Ryan Rosillo and Tim Legler delving into the dramatic Game 1 of the series between the Indiana Pacers and the Oklahoma City Thunder. The Pacers emerged victorious on OKC's home court, marking a significant early advantage in the series.

Ryan Rosillo highlights the team's resilience:
"The Pacers keep this thing rolling once again. Just unstoppable in those clutch moments when you think they're out of the game, they are not."

2. Turnovers and Defensive Prowess: The Heartbeat of the Pacers' Win

Tim Legler emphasizes Indiana's exceptional ball security as a pivotal factor in their win. Despite committing 25 turnovers against a Thunder team renowned for capitalizing on every mistake, the Pacers limited OKC to merely 11 points from these errors.

Tim Legler explains:
"They survived that ridiculous display of ball security. Normally, Oklahoma City will take every turnover they get and convert it into a point or a point and a half... They turn the ball over 20 times and a half, and I think at halftime they only had nine points off of those."
[03:08]

He further notes the improbability of surviving such a high turnover rate against a top-tier defensive team:
"The most I think they ever had in a half in the franchise history in any game, and they survived that. You don't do that against Oklahoma City."
[05:40]

3. Team Effort and Shooting: Pacers' Balanced Offense Shines

The Pacers showcased a commendable team effort, with multiple players contributing crucial baskets in the fourth quarter. Tim highlights the collective performance without reliance on a single star, contrasting it with typical playoff scenarios where teams depend heavily on elite scorers.

Tim Legler comments on the team's depth:
"This was like, the full display. This is what the Pacers can be at their best when it feels like everybody's getting involved."
[10:15]

He praises their shooting efficiency, particularly in the second half, where Indiana shot 48% from the field:
"When they were getting shots, they're such a good shooting team, and they have so many guys that could make shots... they have to take care of this thing and make them work a little bit more."
[13:00]

4. Coaching Decisions: Rick Carlisle's Strategic Adjustments Under Scrutiny

The discussion shifts to Oklahoma City’s coach, Rick Carlisle, and his late-game decisions. Specifically, Carlisle’s choice not to call a timeout before a pivotal play allowed Halliburton to execute a game-winning shot. Tim questions the wisdom of Carlisle’s adjustments, suggesting that they displayed a lack of readiness to counter Indiana’s strategies.

Tim Legler critiques Carlisle’s approach:
"He decides not to call it. I thought it was a good idea to play it out... But you take away the defensive target because Toppin's more mobile and then Toppin hitting threes again."
[16:44]

Ryan adds skepticism about Carlisle’s lineup changes, pondering whether altering the starting lineup was a distraction rather than a solution:
"Maybe they're adjusting to us. Maybe this is my non-playing career speaking out, but it just reminds me of the high school coach where the team isn't as good."
[29:24]

5. Haliburton’s Performance: A Statistical Marvel

A significant portion of the conversation centers around Tyrese Haliburton’s exceptional performance. Tim acknowledges Haliburton’s unique ability to maintain high-level performance under pressure, likening his consistency to that of NBA greats.

Tim Legler remarks on Haliburton’s control and confidence:
"He's in complete control of how he wants to play... He has that rare ability to process things exactly the same way as if this is a game against the Wizards on a Wednesday night in November."
[38:21]

Ryan juxtaposes Haliburton’s usage rate against other top players, noting his surprisingly low 22% usage despite being the team's primary playmaker:
"Halliburton's usage rate for this Pacers team as they've now played in 17 playoff games, it's 22. 22 is a really low number for your guy that carries you."
[45:53]

Tim further highlights Haliburton’s clutch performance, showcasing his flawless shooting in critical moments: "In the NBA postseason this year, in a situation with 15 seconds or less to go in the game, shots to tie or take the lead... Tyrese Halliburton is 5 for 5."
[46:47]

6. Player Highlights: TJ McConnell’s Crucial Contributions

Beyond Haliburton, TJ McConnell's timely performances are commended for keeping the Pacers within striking distance during critical phases of the game.

Tim Legler praises McConnell:
"He keeps them in the game and he looked comfortable. And I just was like, man, I love this guy. How can you not love TJ McConnell?"
[52:16]

Ryan underscores McConnell’s ability to calm the team and contribute effectively under pressure: "He just comes in there and settles everybody down and does his thing. And it's a 12 point workable margin at halftime."
[54:11]

7. Implications for Game 2: Anticipating Adjustments and Strategies

Concluding their analysis, Ryan and Tim discuss potential strategies for Game 2. They anticipate OKC will address their defensive lapses and possibly adopt a more physical approach. Conversely, Indiana is expected to continue leveraging their balanced offense and ball security to exploit any weaknesses in OKC’s adjustments.

Tim Legler forecasts adjustments:
"I think Indiana probably, to use like, a boxing analogy, they went back to their corner, like, after the first round... they made the adjustment. And that's what Indiana did."
[32:10]

Ryan Rosillo adds anticipation:
"This is going to be a lot more drama in this series now because of that. And I think now we're getting a long one. We're getting a six or seven gamer. There's no question in my mind."
[46:47]

8. Audience Interaction and Light Banter

Towards the end of the episode, Ryan engages in lighter conversations, sharing anecdotes unrelated to the main sports discussion. These segments, featuring stories about personal confrontations and humorous exchanges, provide a relaxed close to the episode but are secondary to the core sports analysis.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• [03:08] Tim Legler: "They survived that ridiculous display of ball security."
• [05:40] Tim Legler: "The most I think they ever had in a half in the franchise history in any game, and they survived that."
• [10:15] Tim Legler: "This is what the Pacers can be at their best when it feels like everybody's getting involved."
• [38:21] Tim Legler: "He has that rare ability to process things exactly the same way as if this is a game against the Wizards."
• [46:47] Tim Legler: "Tyrese Halliburton is 5 for 5."
• [52:16] Tim Legler: "How can you not love TJ McConnell?"
• [54:11] Ryan Rosillo: "He just comes in there and settles everybody down and does his thing."

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Conclusion

The episode offers a comprehensive analysis of the Pacers' unexpected Game 1 victory over the Thunder, highlighting key strategic decisions, player performances, and statistical anomalies. Tim Legler provides in-depth insights into the game's turning points, emphasizing the significance of ball security and team depth. The conversation sets the stage for an intense and unpredictable continuation of the series, with both teams poised to make strategic adjustments in response to Game 1's outcomes.

For listeners seeking expert analysis and engaging discussions on pivotal sports moments, this episode of The Ryen Russillo Podcast delivers both depth and enthusiasm, making it a valuable resource for fans eager to understand the nuances of high-stakes basketball matchups.

Transcript

[Ryan Rosillo]

This episode is brought to you by the US Bank Smartly Visa Signature Card. With US Bank Smartly Visa Signature Card, you earn an unlimited 2% cash back on every purchase. That's right, every purchase. 2% cash back at restaurants, 2% cash back at the gym, groceries. Yep, you'll earn 2% cash back on those two new tires, new outfits, New York City getaway. All earn 2% cash back noticing a trend. So whether you're splurging on concert tickets, fueling up for your commute, or shopping for that purchase perfect birthday gift for the bestie, you'll be earning unlimited 2% cash back on every purchase. Visit usbank.com smartlycard to learn more. The creditor and issue of this card is U.S. bank National association pursuant to a license from Visa USA Inc. Some restrictions may apply well, we've never done this before, so we have because we have Legs. I didn't want to do an open today because I was going to just be repeating the same talking points from an open that was probably going to be too long and then get into it all over again with legs and then lay out. So believe it or not, we have different interview strategies based on the interviews here. So I just want to talk about hoops for the most part. Let Legs talk about the hoops with a game one for the books. The Pacers keep this thing rolling once again. Just unstoppable in those clutch moments when you think they're out of the game, they are not. So they take the first one in Oklahoma City. So we'll get to some of the coaching decisions in this one, some of the no shows on the Thunder side, and how the Pacers got back into this game after a very erratic first half for them. So Pacers take the 10 lead, we'll break it all down. And what's next with legs? You're listening to the Ryan Rosilla podcast presented by FanDuel. America's number one sportsbook has made it easier than ever to get in on the action during the NBA Finals. And with live betting, the tip off is just the beginning. Look for the live SGP tab on the FanDuel Sportsbook app and build your bet slip. Then sit back and enjoy the game as you track the outcome of your parlay right in the app. If you don't already have it, download the FanDuel app today to make every moment more the ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and help lines available in Little Listen to the end of this episode for additional details. Must be 21 and older and present in select states or 18 plus in present in DC, Kentucky or Wyoming. Gambling problem. Call 100 GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com the NBA Finals kick off last night in dramatic fashion. Pacers with the bucket from Halliburton coming back in this taking game one at okc and it's probably the best guy we get on right now. I listened on the pre game, I saw him with Van Pelt on the post game. It is Tim Legler, one of the many voices at ESPN on the NBA. Okay, leg, so the Pacers get this first one. I there's just so much stuff we both want to get into here. If you had to give us kind of a headline on how the Pacers did it, what's the thing that stood out to you?

[Tim Legler]

Okay, so I think it would be first, I would have to just say they survived that ridiculous display of ball security. Okay, that's really to me what, what we're talking about here. Because normally, Ryan, Oklahoma City in general on average will take every turnover they get and convert it into a point or a point and a half. That's what they do every single night. I mean typically you turn the ball over like even say 18 times in a game against Oklahoma City, you're going to get anywhere from 20 to 25 points, somewhere in that range converted the other direction. They turn the ball over 20 times and a half and I think at halftime they only had nine points off of those. So a very, very strange thing happened in the first half of that game that should have been by Oklahoma city standards, a 25 point lead at halftime from which Indiana is not recovering. So to me that was the story of the game. The fact that they were still standing right at the end of that, you know, you certainly obviously the fourth quarter still played out in a very strange way. The way that they were able to, you know, just cut that lead and then end up winning the game. They're not even close to position to do that if they don't survive that. And some of it was Oklahoma City not converting them. Like they had numbers and they missed layups, they missed threes in transition. But a lot of it. If you go back and look at the first half again, look at the effort and the commitment from Indiana to get back, as simple as that, like sprint after the turnover to cut the ball off, force them then to reset on a possession in which they don't score. I thought it was really to me the biggest story in the game, because no one survives that against Oklahoma City. Not. And first of all, we don't even see that to that extent. That's absurd. It's the most I think they ever had in a half in the franchise history in any game, and they survived that. You don't do that against Oklahoma City. And so that, to me, is the biggest storyline from the game that kept them in it to keep throwing punches and eventually they start making some threes. I thought Oklahoma City started to look very tentative. They were waiting for the clock to run out. I thought the last three minutes of the game and Indiana just keeps playing, and then here you go. But to me, the storyline is the first half. Just the fact that they didn't get buried for an avalanche of points off of the. Off of those turnovers.

[Ryan Rosillo]

This is a possession sport, you know, like anything. And you sit there and you look at, like, how are you handling your possessions? And then what is your field goal attempt advantage off of these turnovers? And you're absolutely right. Like, I remember looking at it and going, okay, it's not just 19 turnovers in the first half. It was 18 more shot attempts from the Thunder. And. And you're. You're supposed to be down 25, the total number on this, which again, is, to your point, 25 total total turnovers by the Pacers. So they clean that part of it up in the second half, and it's only 11 points. You give up only 11 points to this Thunder team on the 25 turnovers. And, you know, you're right, too, at the start of this game. You know, one of the great things about trying to figure out this series is, okay, the Pacers are great with the basketball. They don't turn it over. But actually the Thunder even better in that regard, at least for this playoffs, for the season. And you're watching this happen. And maybe it was because the turnovers were. It was pretty clear that they were. I don't know, that they were uncomfortable. I don't know if the Pacers were uncomfortable. I think RJ had a good line during the broadcast where he was like, they actually, as fast as they want to go, they need to slow down a little bit. Like, they're going a little too fast. It's leading to just some of this carelessness that you don't expect from the Spacers team. But the fact they're down, what, at the half, 12 points?

[Tim Legler]

12 points, right?

[Ryan Rosillo]

Then you're going, how are they only up 12? The way the Pacers play, I Saw.

[Tim Legler]

When I watch a game how much I'm writing, I'm doing and taking notes. Literally at every trip off the floor, I'm writing something so I can remember it later to break it down. And I'm telling you, I don't know how many times last night I either said out loud or wrote, how is this eight point game? How are we in a nine point game right now? Like, I just kept saying it because none of it added up, none of the measurables added up. To think that Indiana just won a game in which they turn a ball over that many times against the number one team in the league at converting those into points and didn't have anybody go off. This wasn't like a 40 pointer out of Seattle. This wasn't Neesmith in game one against the Knicks. This wasn't Halliburton. Game four of that series. None of those guys went off. They played a very mediocre offensive game and they turned the ball over 25 times and they won. It's, it's one of the most improbable things you're going to watch because of their opponent and what we've been watching all year. I mean, Ryan, I called probably, I don't even know probably five or six OKC games this year. I think four in that building. And in every one of those games, at some point, it's a barrage of conversion off of your mistakes that you don't recover from and they hit you with these things. And to your point, in the first half, I'm watching Indiana and I literally was going, man, I don't know if this is a situation where, okay, this is the finals and we're just not. Our brains aren't processing stuff. Was it a matter of, okay, maybe we can't throw pocket passes against this team after the fourth one got stolen. Maybe they're really good at their guards, at getting their hands low when, when, when we come off ball screen and try to throw that little pocket pass to the slip guy. They're so good at having their hands low already. It's almost like they're taught it or their instincts are that good collectively. At least four of those they threw away. Maybe we can't just force the ball into Siakam if he's got a smaller guy on him and they're fronting. That was two or three of those. And I saw that repeatedly in the Minnesota series. Like Randall couldn't catch the ball because they were fronting him and he'd end up on the sideline, like pinning A guy still calling for the ball, and it's like, dude, get out of there. Like, you're not going to get it against a team this quick. They had two or three of those, and so I don't know if it was just, wow, man. This is actually. We saw this on film. We played against this a couple of times this year, but, wow, this is even faster than we remembered it being. So now we gotta be much more careful with the ball placement on where we're going with it. And they adjusted to it, cleaned it up in the second half. When this team gets shots, this is one of the toughest offenses in the league to guard. I don't care who you are. And that's really what. What happened the second half. They got shots and. And particularly in the fourth quarter. And then Oklahoma City contributed to it by getting. I thought it's just a little bit. I don't know. Just. They slowed down so much that they got out of their own rhythm.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Offensively, there's definitely some stuff on OKC that I want to do here offensively, but staying on the Pacers with this, I think. I think you're right. Like, when you're not ready for OKC's defense or the opponent thinks they have some sort of mismatch, but it's a very predictable entry pass or it's a very predictable first thing, I think they invite that. They're like, great, I agree with you. You think you have this advantage, like, great. Now we. We know exactly how to determine help and where so many teams just go, all right, you know, we got the switch we wanted. Okay, now we're doing this, and now we're going to throw it over here and you're going to let us get into it. OKC is like, cool. We know exactly what you want to do, but to your point about no one necessarily going off, that's what I loved about this fourth quarter from the Pacers. This was like, the full display. This is what the Pacers can be at their best when it feels like everybody's getting involved. Mather has a couple early makes in the fourth quarter. You have the Nismith 3 in the right corner. That was an insane make. The Nemhardt 3, where he just works SGA. And then Nemhardt takes another one. Airball and Siakam, like, the second time he's in place, he actually, on the airball one, he beat SJ to the spot. And then you had the Turner bank shot. So this was like, before, full display of the team effort with Halliburton. Closing it out, which speaks to, you know, at times we're like, what does depth actually mean in the playoffs? You know, I think we've gone in circles on that one a lot, but this was like, a showcase of who the Pacers have been all season, because you're not quite sure who you're going to get it from. And I also think, for the most part, I mean, other than Nemhardt getting the ISO and kind of working it against sga, trying to figure out how. How to get space, they were really quick. And also not, you know, the last possession, it's like, we're just going. We're going. And that had to be at least a great learning experience for Carlisle in this group, at least after game one. Okay, now we understand the speed. Now we understand what they're. What they're just. That's always the reminder of the Thunder. You cannot dick around. You have to make a decision and you have to be committed to it on offense.

[Tim Legler]

That's very true. I think Indiana probably, you know, to use like, a boxing analogy, they went back to their corner, like, after, like, the first round. They're like, oh, all right, all right. This guy's pretty quick. Like, he's faster than he looks on film. And then you make the adjustment. And that's what Indiana did. They got shots, and they're as lethal as anybody if they get that, you know, it's crazy. And so here's Oklahoma City, and they're forcing all these turnovers, and everybody's, you know, just like, oh, my, look at this defense. I never seen anything like it, you know, And I'm thinking to myself, yes, some of that's true in the first half. Some of it is that. Some of it is just Indiana, like, what the hell are you doing? What are you looking at? Like, I could see from where I'm sitting on this sofa in the green room watching this game, I could see that there's no angle to make that pass. So it was a combination of the two things. And then I think, what.

[Kyle]

What.

[Tim Legler]

What happens over time, you realize, like, okay, we're turning the ball over. But you know what else? They shot 48% for the game. Like, so it's like when they were getting shots, they're such a good shooting team, and they have so many guys that could make shots. If they just get one up, very good chance it's going in. So that's the one thing. You look at this game and go, wow. As good as Oklahoma City was defensively in the first Half as sloppy as Indiana was. When Indiana got shots, they were still making shots. And so it's just a matter of, man, let's just, let's just take care of this thing and let's make them work a little bit more. And they did. And it was fascinating to watch this shift in swagger right before our eyes from about the nine minute mark to about like the three minute mark. A complete shift in certainty. And you saw it, you could just tangibly see it at okc. They were slowing down possessions too much. They were, they were, it was very one dimensional. I mean, you know, they listen, they had super quiet nights out of jail. And Chad Holmgren, I don't think I said his name the entire game. I don't know if I wrote his name down on one card that I was making notes for this game. Not once. So they had some guys really underperform. It was all Shea. And Indiana was just like, man, we're going to roll the dice. Like this one dude is not going to get enough to beat us tonight if we hang around. And I saw that shift in the look in their eyes was just different in that moment in Indiana. Once they get to that point, man, they just feel like. Now look to your point, Ryan. Any one of those three or four things you mentioned go different, they win the game. You know, Siakam doesn't crash the boards on that play. On the airball and he was in the corner. Shay goes to Salexander, was face guarding him and tried to block him out with a face guard blockout. Siakam chucked him to the side, caught it, laid in. What if, what if Siakam goes like half heartedly toward the rim and starts to like get back on defense? They lose the game. If, hell, if he doesn't get the extra free throw in the lane violation, they might lose the game. You know, if, if Turner doesn't bank in a three from the left wing, they lose the game. So a lot of things still went perfectly for them. But it all started with the fact that they, they got shots and their offense is formidable when they do it.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Okay, let's talk about the Thunder in the fourth quarter. You're absolutely right. Right. You know, I watched the fourth quarter again this morning and it was another one of those games where you're watching it going. They lost this game and you're thinking if just one of these threes goes down. So they were 05 from three in the fourth quarter. All five threes are great looks. Yeah, there was the Jalen Williams Stretch where you could tell from the last regular season game, like, he's not afraid of Neesmith, but they were hunting Thomas Bryant, which you're going to try to do no matter who you like. Anytime he's out there, it's like, okay, let's try to get this guy. And then it was a lot of hunting Turner. The Pacers brought Halliburton back in at 9:42. Because I want to talk about Degnalt and his decisions last night. Obviously with you. SGA comes back in at 7:44. And you know, one of the things that I think we, we all admired what the Celtics were offensively but knew they became really hunt happy and that was their downfall. Did you see too much of. Because like you think of, all right, you want to get Halliburton the action. You want to get Turner in the action. Granted it sucks when no one's making a three around you for the entire quarter, but I would agree with you that then those possessions, once it went from a 12 point game to like a 4 point game, it felt like there was a lot more tension for OKC in those moments.

[Tim Legler]

There definitely was. And I'm just telling you, even, you know, this is how it kind of works in the building that place, they blew the roof off that place. It's as good an environment as there is in the league right now. When they roll people, you know that that anxiety in the stands is transferred onto the court. And you could feel that start to happen too in the fourth quarter and that kind of affects you the way you think. And there was one guy that looked kind of like normal in terms of his approach to the moment, and that was Shea. Nobody else looked that way for okc, which is surprising on a team that going into last night had won 80 games this year. And but you know, they, they weren't in as many of these kind of moments as most teams are going into the finals to that point. And it just, it felt like there was this like shift in their confidence level and next thing you know, man, they're very stagnant offensively. On those last possessions, even the last look, Shea got a great look. A great look. That's his bread and butter. Mid range, lean back, probably 18ft. And Halliburton, he had separation. It wasn't like hand on hand contest. He got a clean look. He makes that again, probably win the game. But it was like the whole possession and it's two prior. It just didn't feel like Oklahoma City was taking the approach like we are going to knock you out on this possession, it was a little bit too much hoping, not enough certainty. And I think that, to me, is what I felt, and that's what really shifted this. And when he misses it, they're not calling timeouts. Carlisle getting a lot of praise for that. Listen, I'm a. I am a guy, and it's very circumstantial if I'm going to call that or not. If I'm coaching in that situation. I really believe this because I think Rick Carlisle was this smart, because I feel like I'm standing on silent. I think I would pick up on this. When the ball came off the rim, Oklahoma City had four defenders on the opposite side of the floor from Halliburton and in the backcourt, meaning there was this clear space and ability to get him the ball. If that's jammed up or muddled or guys are like, spread out and Halliburton's kind of crowded up when that. I bet you Carlisle would have called timeout because it would have been like, what, you know, he's going to have to run back and get it. And like, the fact that he could see, like, we have a good. We have good spacing here to go up the floor, he decides not to call it. I thought in that situation, it worked. You know, you go back to the playoff loss Boston had against the Knicks early when. When. After the free throw and. And Missoula doesn't call it. You remember that game? He go, well, we just ran this action and we got a layup out of Jason Tatum. I'm like, yeah, right. Think the Knicks are going to allow that to happen again? You're going to go length of the court, 11 seconds with a timeout. He doesn't call it. I would have absolutely called that. After the free throw. Live ball situation, totally different than a made basket or a dead ball. It's just totally different the way you process it as a coach. So I thought it was a good idea to play it out. Halliburton comes up the court. They don't force him to his left hand. Three different times, he stopped, went right. Stop. Went right. Stop, went right. The third time, he finally got to an open space and went up over the top of the one guy. Of the five perimeter defenders they have, he would have picked to play against, and he got it. And he got the. He got the shot knocked down.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yeah. And I was watching Caruso on that play again, and Caruso's caught in the middle, and I still think Caruso made the right play. Because he probably wasn't going to get into the contest once Halliburton got into it. And then I thought what Caruso did was actually really smart. Because you're talking about Halliburton, who's still available to make the pass really late in the possession. We know how he is. He can jump. And look, chances are he's still pulling up. So it's easy for all of us to say sell out and double and have Caruso crash into it. But he tries to get back to Siakam because Siakam's going to be wide open if Halliburton decides, like last second, do it. And Halliburton certainly capable of doing that. I love the no timeout. I love the no timeout against okc. And there's another thing that happened here because I had a couple different things on this, because, you know, the offense with the Thunder, they score. They still scored 25 points in the fourth quarter. There's a lot of free throws in there. But I just. Even if you have the MVP and you're thinking about, like, what you want to do and what you want to attack, I think that stuff, a lot of that high screen that this league is in love with, it just feels that it can become a little predictable. And then it also, you know, I think the human nature of basketball is that when you know, you're only there for spacing, like, that's such a credit to Siakam. And I'm glad you made that point. There's a lot of guys, even in the NBA Finals that would be in the corner that'd be like, I'm not running all the way in there just in case it's. It's. It's a loose ball that's a winning play. And. But I think over the course of, like, a game, there's just guys that are still thinking about getting back on defense. Especially when you're talking about two teams that want to play at this kind of pace. But you're so right about Chad. I didn't notice him at all last night. Doesn't mean he's going to have a bad finals. He had a bad game one, but the Thunder went small at 3:24. And then I imagine Carlisle was probably like, cool if you want to go small, because they take Turner out at 3:07. So this game closes the last three minutes smaller and ultimately, like, kind of removes the Turner hunting part of this. And at least Toppin is more active. And then Toppin, we even throw his name in there. Considering all the threes that he made as far as the offensive team balance part of it. So on the small decision, I mean it's easy to know the result here. But how did you feel about that from the Thunder?

[Tim Legler]

I like, I completely agree with you. Rick Carlisle saying to myself himself, if you got, if you guys want to play small versus our small, I'm going to take that because I think overall he feels like his five he'll have on there are better collectively offensively than Oklahoma City's guys. I think that's what he believes. The advantage, one advantage for Oklahoma City. And again, I know it's hard because of Miles Turner and his ability to shoot the three and it's a long recovery and run out for one of your bigs. Their advantage is that when they've played two bigs against most teams like those two guys have great chemistry. They're both versatile defensively. Holmgren and Hartenstein can both hedge hard on ball screen. They could switch occasionally. They track guys to the rim. They're very good at interior passing and throwing lobs to each other once the ball goes in the middle of the floor. And you took that off the table really. At least last night they got beat by 17 on the glass. It's an, you know, and this was a problem for OKC last year. They were getting thrown all over the place and we're like that's, that's the one thing that they don't have is a little bit more beef up front. And you're thinking with Hunt, with Hartenstein added to the mix, what that does is let Chet roam more defensively to collect rebounds because then he's probably matched up against a small forward and Harenstein's doing a lot of the heavy lifting like in the banging with some of the bigger guys, you know, the Jokic's of the world who they, they got him for probably, you know, the Anthony Davises of the world. Like guys like that. And now check can run loose, go in, collect rebounds, check can roam more defensively as a, as a rim protector. They took that off the table last night. There was no differentiating factor with their two bigs at all. And as a result Indiana is like that. This is fine. We like this because what Indiana is going to do to you is. And it was even more apparent when they had five guards on the floor or four wings and one big. They over commit like to the drive to such an extent. And it's listen, it's shell defense one on one and it's like as good as it Gets and helping recover. But they are so on their toes, man, ready to go on any penetration on the weak side of the floor. Indiana took advantage of that with their. And that's how really they got back in the game. The threes they get like later were shots that you shouldn't be getting when you're trying to protect the lead if you're Oklahoma City. And they gave up because their instincts are flood the lane on any dribble penetration. And now some of those closeouts are not going to get there in time in Indiana. I said going in, they had to have a plus 3 or plus 4 made 3 point margin per game to win. They have to do that. They have to shoot the ball like that. What was it last night? Plus seven. So they're plus 21 from the threes is even better than I said. And it really is the reason they were able to be positioned to win the game. I thought Oklahoma City making that adjustment right off the bat, like, oh, we're going to adjust to you guys. Wait a minute. You're the 68 win team. You're the, you have home court advantage. You're the favorite, prohibitive favorite to win this series. Why are you already going in saying I need to adjust to Indiana? I think it should have been the other way around. Knowing that you're not going to play those two guys together as much as you normally do. I just thought the approach was we can't play them together against you guys. I thought it was a bad approach. And Dagnal is one of the smartest guys I've ever met in basketball. I don't think he had a great game because of that.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Okay, so there's a lot on that part of it that I want to dig into here because again, referencing that March game. Chet didn't play. Hartenstein was the primary focus of the Pacers attack. He left, didn't come back in the second half because of hip soreness, but he played two days later and I was like, okay, well, you know, if anything, I don't know how much of this is relevant. You know, they really went after Hartenstein. I thought Hartenstein's minutes clearly were better than Chet's last night. But you're, you've noticed the game log here that they're more comfortable with chat as these playoffs have built to close. They like that better than Hartenstein. So then Wallace comes in and Wallace actually starts on Halliburton. So the only thing I could think of is is there something they felt like with the attack, with the Pacers or are they messing with them? Being like, hey, Dort's not on you right away. And granted, door ends up with Halliburton a ton. I was trying to figure that part of it. But then you add in, like, Wiggins gets his nine minutes. I was legitimately shocked. A.J. mitchell was in the game.

[Tim Legler]

I didn't believe it.

[Ryan Rosillo]

You're thinking, dag Melt's like, is he just fucking with everybody?

[Tim Legler]

Listen, Ryan, at one point, I'm sitting there watching the game, and I kind of, you know, so. So I'm like. I take notes, I turn my head for a second, I look down, I look back up, and I literally was like, who is that? I'm like, oh, A.J. mitchell. Okay, interesting, interesting. You know, whatever. Four minutes. I mean, you know.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yeah, that's not the game.

[Tim Legler]

Swing the game or anything, but it's like. But four minutes. Hey, listen, I do respect this. Four minutes, get three up. That's. They just. You're preaching to the choir.

[Ryan Rosillo]

I think he got his three up in, like, 30 seconds, by the way.

[Tim Legler]

Because they were all, get yours up. That's all I got to say. You're in the finals, young man. You get four minutes, get three up. Good for you. It didn't turn the game, but it was. But it still. It was like, what the hell? It's. It's like. It's like Dagnall just found like, some loose change in his car. Like, oh, what's this? I don't know. I haven't seen A.J. mitchell, man. And I like A.J. mitchell, by the way.

[Kyle]

I think.

[Tim Legler]

I think the kid's gonna have a nice career in a league. I was like, whoa, okay, this is interesting.

[Ryan Rosillo]

He's played in three playoff games. I mean, real playoff games, like, real minutes. He's played in more.

[Tim Legler]

I don't understand. I don't. A.J. mitchell probably was like, huh? When he heard his name. Really?

[Ryan Rosillo]

Okay, so let. Let me get back to this. Cause I do know that, like, whenever it's brought up, players hate this. RJ brings it up last night, like, what are you doing? You're starting with Wallace. And this is not the reason they lost the game last, I don't think. But, you know, RJ's basically saying, if you're in the locker room and then, you know that they decided to change up everything that they've done. It's like, look, they're adjusting to us. Maybe this is my non playing career speaking out, but it just reminds me of, like, the high school coach where it's. The team isn't as good. And he's just trying to come up. He's like, we. They're at our place in our history. You know, it's all this stuff. Then you run out of the tunnel and you're like, yeah, it doesn't really matter. These guys are a lot better than us. What if OKC just said, because of all the ball handlers that the Pacers have, because of the way they attacked Hartenstein, because of our comfort with Chet here and because Wallace is a really good player, we actually want to prioritize these minutes and maybe give them a different look. Is it really the mental edge? I guess I push back on a mental edge that I feel like the former players feel like is a much bigger deal than I do.

[Tim Legler]

I just think that. No, look, the mental edge component probably is not even really what I'm talking about. As much I think it. You have this team that's operated a certain way, and certainly most of the postseason have operated a certain way with certain lineups, particularly the start of the game, start of the second half, like, this is what we do. And I just think the fact that you're addressing your team and you're, okay, we're going to go with this right off the bat, no one's expecting that. And it's kind of like, oh, okay. So right off the bat, you just kind of like, you're, like, thinking a little bit more than you should be, rather than just like, okay, this is what we do. And all coaches are going to say, it's more about us than them. If we do what we do and do it well, that's all that really matters. There is some truth in that, and I think that it just kind of just makes you take. Give a pause a little bit like, okay, that's interesting. Like, you know, thinking about the reaction to those guys, like, processing that, all right, we're going to change up our starting lineup for these guys because we're worried about something with them. And I'm going, okay. I think Chet could guard Siakam reasonably well, started the game, and I wanted to see what would it look like against their. Against their lineup, getting on the offensive glass and attacking them, where you get the pick, the dot, the dive, hit the guy in the middle, and here comes the other big slashing along the baseline. And how does Indiana defend that? Like, that's. That's a problem. For a lot of teams, it's been a problem. They break you down and collapse you because the ball gets into the floor and you still have another Big running the baseline or under the basketball. They didn't really have to deal with that really, at all. So the game became more of our strength. Now you guys are putting a lineup out on the floor that's better for us. That's how Indiana viewed it. Now, look, listen. Despite all of that, they turn the ball over 20 times in the first half. Okay, so something was working for okc. I get it. I thought that had more to do with Indiana and Oklahoma City, to be honest. Those turnovers and the way they were playing offensively, it was just like, what. What are you guys looking at right now? Calm down. Once they did, and certainly during the comeback, like, this is very comfortable for us if this is what you want to roll out there. And I'm very curious to see what Dagnalt does in game two a little bit differently, because first of all, you're going to feel Chet. I think Chet probably went home last night, and he's a very competitive guy. And I think he's probably. He looked himself in the mirror, was very disgusted with. With the fact that he did that. No presence in that game. So he's going to be more of a force. And I think maybe Dagnal gives him more of an opportunity to do that. And one way you would do that, you play two bigs together, I think you'll feel Chad Holmgren more. Let's see, though. Let's see. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe they just don't feel like that works against this Pacers team.

[Ryan Rosillo]

32 rebounds between Siakam, Halliburton and Nismith.

[Tim Legler]

Yeah.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Last night, let's. Let's talk about how Halliburton and Nemhar, which is something that I noticed. I noticed in that regular season game, it's something that I think is so simple, coaches don't do enough. And, yeah, a bit of a rant. It's just, hey, that regular season, our best player is awesome. We want him to have that ball in his hands the most because the points for possession tells us when he has the ball, that this is who we are on offense. So let's just run more of that. I think the analytic influence has then, you know, kind of changed. Like, this is a longer thing, but there are single offensive seasons that we look at historically and go, holy shit. And then I would argue, yeah, but the game has also evolved, good or bad, into prioritizing your best player having the ball more, which sounds like really simple. Like, of course, if this is our best player and this is what the math says, then he should have the ball all the time. However, I think there are very clear examples of how that approach is completely disrupted once you get to the playoffs. And if I'm another player or if I'm a coach on the other side being like, okay, he's awesome, but if I always know what the fuck it's going to look like, like I'm just going to get more and more comfortable over the course of a game, over the course of the series. Something as simple as Halliburton, and in this case, Rick Carlisle, trusting to have Halliburton off the ball so much more at the start of the offensive possessions because of the trust in Nemhardt. That is one of my favorite things from last night. I'd like you to talk more about kind of like how that works.

[Tim Legler]

Well, then, though, that. And that was an obvious, tangible thing that they changed in the fourth quarter because, look, Halliburton is a guy that I feel like you have to impede his. His forward progress. And in some cases that means when the ball comes off the glass and Indiana secures the defensive rebound. I think Tyrese Halliburton is better than any player I've seen since Steve Nash at catching the ball up, moving forward, up the floor on the outlet pass. And it's. It's not. It's not an easy thing to do because there's all kinds of traffic. You've got to find a way. And also if you do it too late, it doesn't matter. So it's got to be timed perfectly as the ball's coming off. You kind of are already surveying what angle can I take to give myself the best path, to give the outlet guy the best way to find me while I'm moving up the floor. Oklahoma City is going to take that away from you. They're going to jam you up. They're not allowing those outlet passes to come up the floor. They're also not going to allow him to do what he did in, for most part, the entire Knicks series, which is when he does get the outlet. Now, first guy he sees in resistance is over half court because now he's coming at you fast. He gets a little brush screen downhill to his right hand. Owning you. Owning you. And they're not going to let you do that either. And it's going to wear you out. Look, he's not a. He's not a. He's not big. He's very slightly built. He's not a physical player. It's really handsy in the playoffs. OKC's got more handsy guys than anybody in the league. They're all over you with touchy feely stuff, getting you, jamming you up. And I think Rick Carlisle was like, this is going to be like running in mud if this is what we're going to force the issue with this. Nemhardt can handle the ball more than capable. He's actually a very good decision maker and he's. And he's got. Look, he's got some pop to his game offensively, as you saw with that step back. He hit like he can also do that if that's what the situation requires. I thought it freed up their offense to the extent it needed to be in that moment to allow them more possessions quicker, shorter possessions with quality shots, because if they have to eat up 18 seconds with Halliburton coming up, he's feeling pressure, gives it up, nothing happens. He runs and gets it back. And okay, now you're down to six on the clock. You're not going to have enough time to pull off what they did. Nemhardt allowed them to get into that stuff quicker with Halliburton off the ball. And I thought it was a great adjustment in the moment and in this series. It's going to be important that he has a major ball hand responsibility because of the number of guys you could put on Halliburton that affect your forward progress and get you playing more sideline to sideline. And that's a win for okc. And in that stretch of the game, Indiana was able to get up the floor into the teeth a little bit and then spread you out and make threes. And it's how they erase that deficit.

[Ryan Rosillo]

After the Knicks series. Well, let me, let me give you two parts. I voted Halliburton, all NBA, right? Adam, third team. I've never thought about him as a top 10 player in the NBA. This Pacer story, you know, Bill and I had talked a little bit about like, if you look at this Pacers roster, is this the roster that you want in the east the next five years? And I was like, wow, look, I still kind of default back to what I've always accepted as like the primary rule in the NBA. If you don't have one of those top five guys, if you don't have like number one and, and number seven, maybe in the new financial world it'll be different. The Pacers are the first test of this. Or maybe this is just a really, really great team that is tough, is improved defensively, they have a great coach and, and maybe this Is kind of an aberration and roster building and all this kind of stuff. But as you bring it back to Halliburton, I was thinking about it more because then after the Knicks series it was like, hey, this guy's probably a top 10 player. Especially after that brilliant 30 point game with zero turnovers and just, I mean just like a flawless basketball game. Is there something about Halliburton that we have to understand that's beyond just. He's not getting you 30 every night. Okay. It's just not the way that he plays. But they're 81 in clutch games and it's not just about the game winner, but there is this control of the game. Certainly there's a confidence in his game that is everything you would want in a special basketball player. But is there more to him quarterbacking a team offensively that is more of a benefit than maybe the other stats we always attribute to the top 10 players in this sport?

[Tim Legler]

Definitely. And I've adjusted my analysis of him as a result. I don't have a choice. I used to be, you know, like even last year he had his meteoric rise right in front of our eyes.

[Ryan Rosillo]

The first half of last year before.

[Tim Legler]

He mid season last year. Oh yeah, exactly, exactly. It was became literally he was the biggest talking point in the league in like December, right? You're like, man, I knew this guy was nice, but this is absurd what he's doing right now all through the in season tournament and like all that, right? And then, and then like so now you're watching him a little bit differently. The ceiling's been moved. So you're like, clearly, okay, so now my expectation level and the ceiling on this guy is different. So I'm judging them by that standard. And you're like, okay, there's some uneven nights in here. Which is why again, the level that you give guys and whatever adjective you want to use, there are levels to this thing. And the guys that are truly reserved for that really top special place, they have that because they do it every night, literally every night. Doesn't mean they have great shooting nights every night. But it always looks the same. It looks the same. And usually they do get to their number one way or another. And you're like, that's why that guy's a superstar. That's why that's a franchise player. Because hell or high water, no matter what the circumstances, what the defense or what kind of night they're having, somehow they get to their number and they do it every night and it always looks the Same Halliburton. I'd watch him some nights, man, and I'd be like, I just. He looks so passive. I don't understand it. And what I've come to learn about him is what I now probably was overreacting to his passivity. And I do still think there's some of that is true, particularly game five of the Knicks series. After that game he had when he basically, like you said it was, if that was a quarterback, it's a 158.3 QBR. That's what he did that night in game four. Okay. And at game five, he comes out and it's almost like he anticipated to himself. He's having an inner voice saying, well, there's no way in hell they're going to let me do that again. So I'm just going to come out and let other guys do it. Because I was like, they're not really up in you, like, to that extent. So there's. Some of it is still true. But what I've learned, Ryan, is this. It's more. This dude is in complete control of kind of like ultimately how he wants to play and how things are about to go. And he has this incredible quality during pressure moments of being able to maintain the exact same muscle memory, which is what derails a lot of players. In high stress moments, your muscle memory fails you because you're overanalyzing, you're going too fast. Something breaks down mechanically, you're just not processing things the way you normally do the rest of the game. He has that rare ability to process things exactly the same way as if this is a game against the Wizards on a Wednesday night in November. Last night, in that moment, that's how he's processing it. That's how his muscle memory works on the big shots. And that's why now I'm going to analyze him a little bit differently. When he looks a little bit quiet or you don't notice him for stretches of games. I'm still expecting there to be a splashy finish to this, or at some point, he's putting his fingerprints all over this. Even if he hasn't to that point in the game where I used to, like the next day, I talk about the game, like Halliburton last night, and I just kind of go in on him a little bit like, I don't get this guy. I think I'm going to pump the brakes on that stuff a little bit with him because he's earned that right.

[Ryan Rosillo]

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[Tim Legler]

I love the number. I, I didn't. I have that number and I'm going to absolutely steal it. So just giving you a warning, you're going to hear that shit on other places. Speaking of usage rate, mine's up, Mine's up heavily in the NBA Finals. My own personal usage rate soars during this time of the year and I'm all about it, so I'm going to steal that one. I actually heard another great number last night. I don't know if you heard this one. So in the NBA postseason this year, in a situation with 15 seconds or less to go in the game, shots to tie or take the lead in that situation, last 15 seconds of regulation or overtime, the rest of the league Shooting individual shooting percentages in those situations. 4 for 27. Tyrese Halliburton is 5 for 5.

[Ryan Rosillo]

That's. That's just not supposed. Yeah, it's not supposed to happen.

[Tim Legler]

That's one of the most incredible stats I've ever heard. I actually had to get the. Stephen A. Actually said it on the segment I do with Scott last night. Somebody researcher had given him that number before he came out there. And I was like. So we went to commercial. I'm like, give me that number again because I'm going to be all over that, all, all over that the next 48 hours with all the different hits I'm doing. I just think that's one of the most incredible statistical anomalies you've ever seen. Or is it an anomaly? Is it just what this guy is about? Like, he clearly feels super comfortable, man, releasing the basketball from his fingertips with heavy consequences. And not many guys are, man. They just aren't not where you feel exactly the same as you do in an. In an. In an inconsequential game during the regular season. And so it's actually like his, his senses are heightened and he's still able to just maintain what he needs to, to make sure that ball is soft, it travels the right distance, he gets to the spot on the floor that he's comfortable, and he makes magic happen for this team. And it's like, I'm still sitting here, Ryan. You know, we're the next morning, halfway through the morning, and I'm still kind of in a state of shock that they won that game. And maybe I shouldn't be anymore. But Oklahoma City has been so much better than the rest of the league this year that it's just really kind of incredible what Indiana was able to pull off last night. And it's great for all of us because this is going to be a lot more drama in this series now because of that. And I think now we're getting a long one. We're getting a six or seven gamer. There's no question in my mind.

[Ryan Rosillo]

For the record, Bird had two eight point games in the finals against Houston there in 81.

[Tim Legler]

Don't you ever, don't you ever, ever blaspheme Larry Bird.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Just 164 playoff games. As I said, I was like, there's probably a dud or two in there, scoring wise.

[Tim Legler]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Ryan Rosillo]

But I mean, but it's all right. All right. So what are you looking for? What's the first thing you're looking for? To understand how both sides Just dissected the film from game one.

[Tim Legler]

Well, I actually think you're going to, you're going to see, I think a more physical effort on the part of Oklahoma City because I think they're going to watch the film and be like particularly the fourth quarter of that game and not recognize themselves on either end of the floor. And typically what I've seen at Oklahoma City is when they have one like that, the very start of the next game, the level to which they're up in you, the level to which you're feeling them defensively, you're going to see that at the very beginning of the game. And I certainly Indiana can't turn the ball over to that extent. I don't think they could try and do that that many times in the first half. So they'll be better than they were in terms of ball security. I think Oklahoma City's overall defense and contest rate and challenging you and what they do on the glass and on the offensive glass, I think it's going to be a different approach. It's interesting how one 9 minute stretch can completely shift the desperation, right? It has because Indiana wasn't necessarily feeling desperate last night, but you did feel like, man, if they, if they lose both of these games in okc, this is probably a five game series. That's how I felt about it. And now they've already gotten one. Do you have any idea like the amount of pressure in the building going into game two and what Oklahoma City typically has done when they feel some of that, that's how they come out and start the game. And just it's almost like this just like reminder to everybody in this building. This is what this shit looks like when we, when we are at our best. And I don't know that they feel any part of that game was them at their best. The turnover is great. Not converting them, that's not, that's a team. I didn't recognize that they didn't turn that into cash money the other way. I didn't recognize their lack of certainty offensively in like when the game on the line, they definitely look like they were stagnant and they just wanted the clock to run out. I think you're going to see a different mental approach at him now. Will he adjust? Go back to the two bigs, see what Indiana does about that. I wouldn't be surprised. And if I were him, I never would have gone that way he did last night in the first place. Truthfully. Not the start of the game. Yeah.

[Ryan Rosillo]

And if it's Tight. Will he choose to go small? Because I. We're totally aligned on that. I think Carlisle and those guys are like fine because now we're taking away the defensive target because toppins more mobile and then toppins hitting threes again. I think the Pacers love their small center lineup and would probably be afraid to bring it out, especially if they're playing two bigs. You know, maybe there's some advantages in the possession of movement and having two guys having to chase it around. I mean, basketball can be funny that way, but over the long stretch, I'm sure Carlisle was happy about that. So we'll see if that happens again. But I'm with you, man. At 94 79, McConnell inbounds the pass on the baseline. It's a turnover. J Will goes the other way. They're up 15 points. Granted, it's 9, 27 left. And the Pacers find another way to close out one of these games. And you're right, 25 turnovers, 11 points. Only 11 points. That's hard to do to only score 11 points off of 25 turnover. So credit the Pacers defense.

[Tim Legler]

And last thing I want to, I'm going to mention because we haven't mentioned his name. You just did. And I have to say I have to give TJ McConnell a shout out for this reason. I thought in the first half he was the only guy that looked normal, like TJ McConnell looks exactly like he looks every night. And the way he continues to impact the game, like as a scorer still amazes me. I mean, this guy just comes in there and he still finds he gets buckets in such a short period of time. If TJ McConnell does not have that little mini run he had, they're down 16 to 20 points at halftime and this is a different outcome. So it's little things like that that you don't even notice. It's so innocuous and buried in the play by play in the line of the game. He had a seven point run at a time in the game that they weren't doing anything and they were turning ball over possession. And he hits a three, he gets a short little jumper. He gets another layup in early offense. And I remember if his other bucket was in the first or second half because he had nine points.

[Ryan Rosillo]

He didn't have a bucket, he didn't have a point in. Well, he may have had a free throw. I don't, I don't. He doesn't have a make. He doesn't have a field goal make in the second half.

[Tim Legler]

That. That he had all nine points in the first half. I thought it. I knew it was seven at least because it was in a very short period of time. So he had another basket. Two hit nine points. He doesn't do that. They're down, I'm telling you, they're down 16. They're out 12 as it was. They're down 16, 20 points, and I don't know, they're coming back from 20. So he kept him in the game and he looked comfortable. And I just was like, man, I love this guy. How can you not love T.J. mcConnell? Like, you know, he comes out there and like, dude, guys, this is how it's done. Like, what's the deal? You know, everybody else is, like, looking like the ball is 400 degrees. They can't wait to get rid of it. And it's like he just comes in there and settles everybody down and does his thing. And it's a 12 point workable margin at halftime. It's funny, that play you mentioned, when he threw the out of bounds play away to Thomas Bryant, because that was totally Bryant's fault. Bryant didn't release to the ball. He was sealing the guy and he was like, had his hand up. McConnell throwing the ball from the baseline out toward, like, the top of the key, and he's like, yeah, release now and go get it.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yeah, he sealed it like he was getting a post entry. That's what I'm saying. Release.

[Tim Legler]

And when he, when he. When Jalen Williams picked that ball up, was going in for the dunk. I'm already looking at McConnell and he's. And actually, like, George Sedano told me, because he was doing sideline for radio. He was in the huddle. McConnell was like, basically ready to fight Thomas Bryant, like, and I'm going. I had to play. I remember in a game one time where dude did that to me and I threw the ball at him. It was in practice. I threw the ball at the guy after because of this, like, you know, sometimes you get so frustrated with the lack of, like, IQ in the moment. Like, dude, do what you're supposed to do. So that's kind of McConnell's fiery personality. They. They needed it last night. They needed every one of his nine points in the first half. As. As innocuous as they seemed at the time. I'm telling you, it kept them within striking distance and set up what happened later in the game. So I wanted to give a mad shout out to TJ McConnell for the way he played last night and settling those guys down. When he came into the game, was it Joe Wolf? I'd rather not say the name because I never know. Kick it back to these guys and I don't know what. You never know. Some of these guys could have done time and they're. I don't want now.

[Ryan Rosillo]

I. Yeah, right. You know, leave me out of it. I don't need.

[Tim Legler]

I don't. Yeah, I don't. I don't. I don't need that. So I don't. You never know where these guys. And it was not. I will say it was not Joe Wolf.

[Ryan Rosillo]

All right, good. I'm glad we were able to clear his name.

[Tim Legler]

Wolf reference. Out of nowhere. You're the best. Yeah.

[Ryan Rosillo]

TJ didn't have any free throws, so. All nine. You're right. In that first half, this was everything I wanted it to be. You've been everywhere. Thank you for giving us some time and promo. Anything you got. Cause I know you're. You're working literally every hour.

[Tim Legler]

I'm literally got five minutes from now, I'll be going on All City NBA podcast, doing my thing with Adam Orez. We do that four days a week. So we were, of course, just breaking down everything you saw last night, looking ahead to game two. And then this time of year, there's no telling where I'm going to be. Every day I get hit up a new request. And of course, obviously, I'm always going to make time for you, man. So I love coming on.

[Ryan Rosillo]

All right, good stuff. Enjoy the finals. This episode is brought to you by UberEats. Summer is here and you can now get almost anything you need for your sunny days delivered with UberEats. What do I mean by almost? Well, you can't get a well groomed lawn delivered, but you can get chicken parmesan delivered a day in the sun. No. A bottle of rum. Yes, UberEats can definitely get you that. Get almost. Almost anything delivered with UberEats. Order now for alcohol. You must be legal drinking age. Please enjoy responsibly. Product availability varies by region. See app for details.

[Tim Legler]

This episode is brought to you by Amazon Prime. Ever finish a movie and the next thing you know, you're totally obsessed? Like, I'm talking about ordering a book about 70s film lighting or buying the soundtrack on vinyl. Kind of obsessed. Whatever it is, prime helps you get more out of whatever passions you're into or getting into. Head to Amazon.com prime and follow your obsession wherever it goes. You want details? Bye.

[Kyle]

I drive a Ferrari 355 Cabriolet.

[Ryan Rosillo]

What's up?

[Kyle]

I Have a ridiculous house in the South Fork.

[Tim Legler]

I have every toy you can possibly imagine.

[Kyle]

And best of all, kids, I am liquid. So now you know what's possible.

[Tim Legler]

Let me tell you what's required.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Lifeadvicermail.com. that's the email to get in touch with Wargon or Kyle directly. What an amazing opportunity. You thought you were having a bad week. Did you know that little fact? All right, let's see. Man, the six minute mile thing will not end. People are all over the place. People either upset with me or saying people are confusing it with pace. It is fast because I might be confusing it with pace.

[Kyle]

I don't know. Eight minutes is fast. Are we saying six now? I feel like the number's changing and the context is changing.

[Ryan Rosillo]

I don't even know.

[Oregon]

I did ask our guy, Jonathan Frias, who's our video guy. He's like a real runner here in the LA marathon couple months ago, he said under five is very good. So he's taking it one step further.

[Ryan Rosillo]

That's insane. That's not what we're talking about here. Do we read one more of these? Oh, man. Fine. I don't know. I don't know.

[Kyle]

Runners or Raptors fans, who you got more beef with these days? Probably runners rise in the ranks.

[Ryan Rosillo]

No, I, I don't, I don't think so. Because it's all over the place. It's either you're totally right and then there's other people. Like, do you understand how fast a six minute mile is? And I did double check because again, I used to try to run a 10, you know, 10 miles an hour, I think, or whatever it is. Like a 10 on a treadmill. I would see how long I could do that before I just felt like I was going to die.

[Kyle]

You're in the danger zone.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yeah. And I, I don't know that I ever could get the full mile. I usually could get it like at 0.8 and I would just be like, all right, you're gonna, you're gonna collapse. And I was always afraid because the treadmill, you know, if the treadmill's going, it's not really up to you.

[Oregon]

Yeah, it's easier on a treadmill too. Take some longer strides. The belt goes a little more.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yeah, you can cheat the belt. Yeah, see, that's something I don't know because now I don't use it anymore, that's for sure. I don't know, maybe I don't want to read a ton of these. So let's just get to. Let's Just get to one of them. Or two. All right. A kid tried to steal my golf brush. What's up, guys? Love the pod six two, 240, 27 year old male, no notable gym stats player comp Boris DL below the rim post finisher who can knock down a three and feed my teammates. And Boris could really pass. I went to the driving range yesterday. I was hitting out of a practice bunker and went back to my bag to clean my clubs off with my brush and it was missing from my bag, but the clip I had on it was still there. Retraced my steps, but no brush. I scanned the area and sure enough, I saw the exact same brush hanging from a kid's bag. I confronted the kid's dad, with whom he was there asking, did you guys find a brush laying over there? The dad said, no. Well, I lost the exact same brush that is hanging from your son's bag. I replied, oh, well, we picked one up, but that is ours.

[Kyle]

What?

[Ryan Rosillo]

Further context, it's a quality 25 brush and I'm pretty confident the dad is better off financially than I am. I had about 2 inches and 40 pounds on the dad, though I would never let it escalate physically. The kid, approximately 8 years old, had no coarse etiquette as he almost hit me with several errant chips before I had even realized my brush was missing.

[Kyle]

How old did he say the kid was? I just missed that part.

[Ryan Rosillo]

8. I was chipping the other day and a kid started chipping off of the green. But he was like 11.

[Kyle]

Big.

[Ryan Rosillo]

No, no, right, right before phase. So he was pre. He was, he was the introduction of a book to shithead. And so I said something. I was like, dude, are you gonna chip on the green? Ran off and then his dad was over there. His dad was looking at me and you know, I wasn't like outrageous about it, but I mean, it's just such an obvious thing, like don't hit your wedge on the green. And the kid was nasty too, so maybe he just was like, I can pick it right up off of this and not damage the green whatsoever. But I think most golfers would frown upon that and something need to be said. And I was really nice about it. I was like, are you really going to do that? Maybe I could.

[Kyle]

You were really nice about it.

[Ryan Rosillo]

To me, that's being really nice about it. I don't. I mean, what would you. What's a nicer way to do it? Hey, man, it seems you're a shithead.

[Oregon]

Hey, buddy, come, come take a seat.

[Kyle]

Over here.

[Oregon]

Let me talk to you about this.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yeah, yeah. So the dad and I argued, causing a scene around the practice screens and drawing attention from bystanders. I was embarrassed, almost caving. The dad was loudly dropping F bombs left and right. His story didn't make sense, though, so I stuck to my guns. The dad's main argument that purchased the brush a year ago, lost it around the same time, but somehow picked it up over by where my bag had been. I mean, this guy's crazy. Yeah, the story. You busted him, and then he just decided to try to go over the top, you know, which is. Isn't it great when you're catching somebody in a lie? Because a lot of times people have that surprised face.

[Kyle]

I can't wait to see what you're going to say to this. I can't. Even if they break out, this moment is worth it.

[Ryan Rosillo]

There's somebody I'm thinking of in particular that I know. When this person is lying, they do, like a big eye surprise. And then the lies start to happen.

[Kyle]

Just gotta tell, like.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yeah, it's a terrible, terrible tell. But I can always just be like, all right, let's see where this goes. Of course, he declined with the excuse. Wait a minute. I told him he was setting a poor example for his son and asked to see his receipt for the brush. Plenty of concede the argument if he could prove he purchased it. I don't know. I'm not carrying receipts around. Come on, man.

[Kyle]

Yeah, unless you get audited, I don't know.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yeah, he declined with the excuse that he bought it a year ago. Then he asked to see my receipt, of which I mentioned I'd gladly provide a digital copy. I even asked the kid. Yeah, I guess you could argue that. Hey, you know, don't delete the emails. I even asked the kid directly if the brush was his, and he shyly gave no response. See, I think that's the thing. Even though you're right, when you start asking the son, who's 8 in front of the dad, now the dad thinks he has license to, like, do whatever he wants because now you're talking to his kid. I mean, you've seen that transaction enough. Like, leave my kid out of this. Although I can't remember any time I was caught up in a situation where I would. Yeah, I don't know. Clearly you knew they stole your brush, so I. I don't blame you for that part of it. I guess you just. I don't know. I would refrain from. I would try to keep the kid out of it as much as possible. The dad stormed into the pro shop with this poor kid demanding to speak with the manager. I followed behind assertively, though trying hard not to scare the kid any more than he already was. Dad was still swearing, causing a scene. I calmly pulled my case and pulled out my receipt from the dicks app. The kid finally chimed in, well, mine has clear water in it, and his has soapy water. Oh, dun, dun, dun. I caught the kid in a lie. Given there was no way he could have known that I had soapy water in my mind, in my brush. If he never picked it up, the dad slammed the brush on the counter. This is finally an opportunity to reclaim my brush. So I did and took it back to my car. After they left the shop, I went back in to apologize to staff. I got a beer in the clubhouse to cool down. When I saw the dad storming back in with his kid, I quickly exited and drove away to avoid further confrontation. Could have I handled the situation better and charged it to the game. Is there any chance a dad's son may have been telling the truth?

[Kyle]

Oh, no, no, no, no. I.

[Ryan Rosillo]

No chance.

[Kyle]

It sounds like at first I was like, you know, it sucks when you think you're like. You think you've got a kid doing something wrong, and you're like, oh, I'll just tell his parent and this will be fine. And then you realize, like, whoa, this is a totally different game plan. They're running wildcat offense. I don't know how the fuck to deal with this.

[Ryan Rosillo]

The dad's in on it.

[Kyle]

And now I'm thinking the dad grabbed it up and was like, here, son. This is how we do this. Like, I think. I don't think it was like a. Like, hey, the kid grabbed this thing and put it on. I think the dad may have saw it and be like, look at this. Just got you a new brush. What kind of cool dad I am. So I think. I think this was totally the. I don't think this is the dad just, like, going to bat for his kid no matter what. I think this is. Maybe the dad did something wrong, you know, and can't. And can't just be like, all right, yeah, we don't take stuff we find on the ground. It's not a teachable moment because the dad probably did it right in front of the kid. That's what I think happened. I don't think this kid grabbed it. I think the dad did it, hung it on his bag, and, like, got you a new thing today, huh? How about that. So I don't know. This is messy. It's certainly messy. You'd like to think when there's an adult in the situation that they could keep things within a certain parallel. And it sounds like this guy was not doing that. I'm not sure what I would have done. Might have let it go. I don't really know.

[Oregon]

This is $25 brush. You're letting that go.

[Kyle]

I don't know. I mean, the guy's saying no, and now it's like him and his kid against me. And when I feel the tides turning, where maybe people are gonna be like, just because we don't like the situation, you're the bad guy. We're not gonna blame the kid. Like, just because, like, you know, golf courses are supposed to be kind of like there's a certain amount of etiquette. Right. People aren't supposed to be yelling for the most part. You hear the occasional fuck when somebody hits a bad drive. But for the most part, there's like, people are supposed to be on a little bit on their good behavior. And whenever there's like, if there's like an argument, you guys are screaming. I think everyone just wants it to stop. The guys on the putting green wanted to stop the guys waiting for the two. They all want it to stop. The pro shot people. And if there, there's a chance that this might whole thing might just get turned around and be like, all right, dude, you don't have the brush. Possessions is 9, 10. We're not pulling up security. I might just be like, I could see all this coming and I'm just gonna, I'll bow out. So kudos to you. I'd be thinking about not saying anything once it got to a certain point. I'm glad, I'm glad you got the brush and left at what cost? But you won't.

[Oregon]

I don't know what you're supposed to do differently. This is insane behavior from the dad. We need to bring, we need to bring back shame. People just don't feel shame anymore. And it's absolutely outrageous.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yeah.

[Oregon]

Like, can you imagine teaching your 8 year old son that, like doing things like this is okay and like we're believing our guy and like same clip, soapy water. Like we're giving him the benefit of the doubt here. I. I can't even believe it. Right. Soapy Watergate. I can't believe that the dad is just okay with, with this political humor.

[Ryan Rosillo]

What do you feel shame about, Oregon?

[Oregon]

Try to do it for everything, you.

[Kyle]

Know, really try to Feel shame for everything.

[Oregon]

Yeah.

[Ryan Rosillo]

You okay, dude? How would a jury feel about the Crocs cross examination of the eight year old? I mean, the eight year old's testimony is pretty damning here, but would they go. I mean, the fact that honestly, the way it's phrased based on what the emailer's telling us, the kid is describing what his brush was like, that's kind of it. If it's a movie, there's noise in the courthouse.

[Kyle]

That's the glasses scene in My Cousin Vinny.

[Ryan Rosillo]

The other thing is this dad obviously is pretty like tuned up intensity wise. Why did he relent? Why did he give up the brush? So really what I'm here to figure out is sure there's a. There's a small chance the emailer's completely wrong. I mean, I had, and I still remember it, it was 20 years ago and I'd had a couple basketball stolen at this nice gym that I belong to because people steal. Like, there's a gym here that has a basketball court where I like to have like, you know, a bag, a little duffel bag when I work out because of some bands and all that kind of stuff or whatever. So, like, if I want to get some shots up, you can't bring the duffel bag in. And it sucks. I got like yelled at one day. I was like, what are you doing with your bag in here? I was like, I'm not. What I'm doing with my bag is not stealing basketball balls. And the guy's like, you got to put it in a locker. I was like, okay. So I went put it in a locker. And then you start to think like, this is another one of those things in society where those of us that have no intention of stealing are inconvenienced by the people that steal shit. And so I had had a couple balls stolen that I would like, leave behind in a locker. Yes, they were stolen. It's my. I guess some of you would say that's your fault for leaving a basketball in a locker and not locking it up. But, you know, I would still think the person that steals is more to blame. But I had lost a couple. And then I saw a guy with a ball and I didn't like him for a while anyway. And I was like, hey, can I. Like, I opened the wrong locker and it was empty. And then I saw somebody with these. I was like, here we go again. And I was like, can I see that ball a little bit or something? You know? And he was like, what? Yeah, I was like, Can I see that ball? And he was like, yeah, sure. And then I looked at it, was like, fuck, this isn't mine. And I was like, hey, here you go.

[Oregon]

He's like, let me see that.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yeah. I was like, I don't know. I've had a couple stolen. He's like, so you thought this one was yours? I was like, yeah, I did. I was like, I thought it was mine, and it isn't. He's like, yeah, who. Who could ever imagine two orange balls named Wilson in the same area?

[Oregon]

Great comeback from him.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yeah. He just. He just let me have it, and I deserved it. And then I found, like, the right locker, and I went up, here's my ball. Here's my stuff. But I was already pre. You were tuned up, like, ready to go because of. Of past historical events. So really, what this is about is, sure, there's a chance you're totally wrong. There's a lot of evidence that tells you you're not wrong. And the fact the guy got so crazy about it usually means, like, my experience is that person is, like, going so overboard, they're compensating for the lie. In this case, granted, somebody could just completely lose it because they're accused of being a thief when the guy bought the brush. But the fact that this guy was so incensed about it the whole time and then gave up the brush tells me you were in the right. That's just a guess, though.

[Kyle]

Yeah, I had a. I had a similar thing like this. I was in 9th or 10th grade, I think, and I was going to Crunch Crush Fitness right next to Arlington High School, and I brought this guy who I kind of knew as a guest pass. So not Crunch Crush Fitness. Yeah, Crush. Not Crunch. However, there is a. There is a Crunch in Poughkeepsie now, too, but place is blowing up. Yeah. And then so we're. We go in the locker. I bring him in the guest pass. I think it was, like, after school one day, and he spends, like, 20 minutes in the locker room while I'm outside. This is before I was, like, you know, doing my GPS thing. This guy steals from multiple people in the locker room. There's, like, on camera, us being in there and then me leaving, but I guess there's no camera of whoever was going through this locker. Anyway, the cops are involved. This guy who had his wallet stolen is, like, yelling at me. I don't know what the fuck's going. This guy didn't even tell me that he stole it. He wasn't, like, trying to split it with me. He just used my guest pass. Just robbed a bunch of guys in the locker room, like, robbed lockers and then worked out like nothing happened.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Then he worked out what a great alibi.

[Kyle]

The guy is screaming at me, Turns out the kid who actually robbed it, his dad's a cop, a detective there now, like, he's like. I don't know if he's, like, on the case against me or something, but the kid's dad is a cop. And it was just. I remember it was so screwed up, and I couldn't believe. I think his dad came to my house and was like. Like, I don't. It was just. It was crazy. But that was another example of like, a kid who's maybe stealing and a dad who is fucking insane just protecting his kid. I don't think I. I don't think I ever went to court. I think the kid maybe eventually admitted and gave the shit back, but it was like months of like, the cops are against me. What the fuck? This kid's crazy dad who's a detective was just like, admit it.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Admit it.

[Tim Legler]

I was like, what the fuck?

[Ryan Rosillo]

What's going on?

[Kyle]

I brought your. Brought your kid into. Into crush just to try to get his. Get him on his fitness routine, and he ended up robbing lockers. And now I'm mixed up in it. So I don't know exactly how that translates. I just thought that was a good story.

[Ryan Rosillo]

I don't care if it translates or not. I just love that you were caught up in it. Yeah, like, not. Not this. I didn't even. I love that you mentioned that. It wasn't even a plan, and there was no plan to split any of the proceeds with you. All right, Speaking of confrontation, need an update on the office guy fighting the old guy in the roof over a desk. You're right. We do need an update on that. So if you're listening.

[Kyle]

Was I going for that one?

[Ryan Rosillo]

Potentially, yeah, it might have been.

[Kyle]

Wow, that's a good one.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yeah, it's a real power. Power play dynamic in an office. The guy would. It was kind of like open seating, so the guy would get to his spot earlier or his desk. Was his office being renovated. So the other part, lower level employees, had open seating. There was a place where the emailer always sat and the other guy sat there. And then he would go in earlier and then he'd be like, get out of my seat. And then it got to the point where the guy was like, meet me on the roof. Boxing gloves or bare knuckle sounded like bare knuckle. It also sounded like nobody was going to fight anybody, to be honest with you. It sounded like the thing you say.

[Kyle]

Maybe. Yeah, it's like, I'm not how you do it. You don't really want an answer.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yeah, I don't know, maybe he. Maybe the emailer got his ass handled.

[Kyle]

That's the end of that.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yeah, just. Hey guys. Checking in. Went. Met him at the roof. Guy's a badass. Just got out of the hospital.

[Oregon]

Sitting at a different desk now.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yeah, looking for new work. Also may be able to retire at 27. Right. Okay, this is for Kyle. This is a good one. Student exchange in LA. Hey lads. Oh, an international listener. Thank you. 611 55. Biggest I've ever been. I'm on the bulk and it's been a grind. Why is gaining weight so hard? There's a lot of people listening to that sentence hating your guts right now. Look, everybody's got a different ladder going on inside of us, so I think you should be happier that you're on that side of it. Although, hey man, I get it. It was really frustrating for a long time. Couldn't put it on weight comp. JJ Redick if he wasn't an all time great shooter. I'm writing this because I need advice from the LA locals who aren't going to BS me. I'm a 22 year old uni student headed over to LA from Sydney, Australia for 6 weeks on a short uni exchange program doing sports, business and media. I'm obviously really excited and I've always wanted to travel to la, given it's basically a cultural touchstone of everything I love, sports, media and film. I'll be studying for around two days a week, so I've got some decent flexible. Two days a week?

[Kyle]

Yeah, you do. Geez.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yeah. Look out. How did you get this approved? Although when I had roommates that went to Australia, it was like, what kind of work did you do over there? Like, I did nothing.

[Kyle]

It's more about the intangibles, you know.

[Ryan Rosillo]

I think one guy failed two classes like going into his senior year too. And wow, then he ended up having like, he got to walk for graduation. Graduation. But I was like, how mad are you? Your parents? And he was like, they're so fucking mad. Like, at least I'm walking. But as soon as I get back to New Jersey, I have to take two community college courses that UV to.

[Kyle]

Get this thing under the wire.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yeah, I was like, so what do they hand you? Like it's empty.

[Kyle]

It's just like a leather book thing. Give back.

[Ryan Rosillo]

He's like, all because of Australia. I was like, what did you think you were going to be able to do? Just like pull it off is what I thought I was going to be able to do. He's like, next thing you know you're in New Zealand and being like, what's going on? I got to hand in something. So guys were all over the map. It sounded like it was just a big. I don't know. One of our friends went to Ireland, which you don't hear a lot about. I think he got his nose broken. Actually. That's 100% true. I don't think. I know he did, but I think he got all of his credits, so I don't know. You tell me who won. Anyway, so here's the deal. Everyone I've talked to in Australia is pretty polarized views about la. I either think it's the best place to live or the worst. So I'm coming to the experts to ask what I should know, where I should go, any tips on LA culture? I'm obviously keen to go out and socialize, network and meet as many people as possible, but I'd appreciate some guidance on how and where to do, including tipping stuff. I've also heard LA is unlike most cities where instead of a city center or district that everyone goes to hang out, there are pockets or smaller areas that all spread out from each other. I also don't have a driver's license, so I'd imagine I'll be ubering everywhere since LA is so huge and there's no public transport. Any particular. All right, all right. So Kyle, why don't you take this one because I think you're better armed and more informed as a local than I am. Not really.

[Kyle]

I'm kind of set in my ways. I think you're probably have, you know, larger horizons than I do. I kind of. It's amazing how much things. How many things. I don't know, just that are bumping right up against my little pocket that we're talking about here. So I don't.

[Ryan Rosillo]

That's true. There's so much stuff I see, like tourism ads for California. I'm like, where the. Is that? Like, oh, it's two hours away. Would you look at that? Yeah. My God. I'm gonna check to see if my passport's updated, actually. Just get on the highway. I don't know. Well, look, I don't know that I'm gonna relate to a 22 year old all that much. I like the beach towns. Other people don't. And then some people are more like me. And like, if you're going to live out here, but if you're a student, you're 22. Come on, Kyle, you got to be able to come up with something. What was the train thing? Let's start there.

[Kyle]

Well, the trade. Get the red line. That'll bring you like, basically between downtown and Hollywood, and then there's a few stops in between. I don't know why you'd be there, but you could totally do that. Yeah, definitely. Uber. I'd stay off the bus if you could. Did that. Did that for a while.

[Ryan Rosillo]

As a bus vet.

[Kyle]

As a bus. Yeah. As a bus vet, I'd say stay off the bus and just don't do the scooter, man. Especially if you're new. You're riding on the road. What side of the road do they ride? Melbourne. Over there.

[Oregon]

Opposite.

[Kyle]

Opposite. Okay. I'd maybe stay off the scooters. People hate you. You're only here for a short time. You know, you want to be liked. I mean, there's Hollywood. I'd say West Hollywood's pretty sick. You probably like West Hollywood or the Wilshire area. Fairfax. There's just a bunch of. There's a bunch of pockets. You probably. Probably going to have to see the Frolic Room once. But you know, you're going to see. That's not your. That's not going to be your daily. So I don't want to push that on you. I don't. I'm really kind of. My weeks are like, all right, when can I squeeze in a golf at Roosevelt? You know?

[Ryan Rosillo]

Could this guy meet you with Frolic?

[Kyle]

Could he?

[Ryan Rosillo]

Yes.

[Kyle]

Yeah. I don't give him my number or anything, but, yeah, he could.

[Ryan Rosillo]

All right, so how about you do that when you're getting close, man? Just email the show again and put like, bold Alert, whatever, Kyle. Australia. And maybe he can meet up and do a Troy at Frolic.

[Kyle]

Troy will know what to tell you.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Okay. That was a black dude behind the bar. We didn't do this. But honestly, that's kind of it. Everybody knows their little neighborhood and that's it. I. I would tell you, the people that have watched LA coverage on tv, I thought this place was like the worst. And then I came to visit and I was like, I can't wait to move here. So don't let people telling you. Don't people. The people that are just, like, looking at certain footage going, that place is the worst. Don't let them trick you into it. By the way, Wargon, quickly with the left side of the road. Japan, quick. Where do they drive, left or right?

[Oregon]

Don't know. Wish I did. Don't know.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Right side in Germany.

[Oregon]

I've been to Australia, so I know.

[Ryan Rosillo]

I thought maybe this was something, a gift. Another gift from Oregon. But you know what he's great at? He knows every side instinctively. No right. Like Brazil. Here you go. All right, That'll do it for the show today. Thanks to Oregon, thanks to Kyle, thanks to Jonathan Frius. If you want to hit us up with some Friday feedback, It's Friday feedback. RR gmail.com we'll do a YouTube only on that. Subscribe to that page and check out our video pod now on the Spotify app. Ryan was still a podcast ringer. Spotify.

[Oregon]

They were gonna name me Michael Jordan. My dad was like, I don't think he can live up to it. So they named me Michael.

[Ryan Rosillo]

Jared must be 21 and older and present in select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18/ plus and present in D.C. kentucky or Wyoming. Gambling problem. Call 1-800-GAMBLER or visit rg-help.com, call 1-888-789-7777 or visit ccpg.org chat in Connecticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in Maryland. Hope is there. Visit gamblinghelplinema.org or call 800-327-5050 for 24. 7 support in Massachusetts or call 1-877-8-HOPE NY or text HOPE NY in New York.