"I'm More Afraid of What I Can't See" | Sage Steele Show | EP 86

Summary

Podcast Summary

The Sage Steele Show, EP 86
"I'm More Afraid of What I Can't See"
Guest: Samantha Ponder
Date: December 17, 2025

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Episode Overview

In this candid episode, Sage Steele reunites with her close friend and accomplished broadcaster Samantha Ponder for a deeply personal conversation. The two discuss life transitions, safety and parenting in New York City, the illusion of a “safe” suburb versus urban challenges, lessons from past adversities, evolving career pressures, and the importance of genuine friendship, love, and faith. Sage and Samantha offer a rare, behind-the-scenes look at vulnerability, resilience, and the unseen dangers that truly concern them as women and mothers.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Friendship, Socks, and the Vulnerability of Everyday Life

• Cashmere Sock Confessions: Sage shares her obsession with high-end socks and how this small luxury became a lifeline in cold weather after her years working NFL sidelines.
  • Quote: “My socks are like the majority of my budget” – Sage (02:08)
• Authentic Friendship: They reminisce about previous episodes, their genuine on-air chemistry, and fan feedback.
  • Quote: “We forgot we were on camera. But that's why... the feedback was and still is insane.” – Sage (05:06)

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2. Parenting and Urban Survival: Life in New York City

• Car Sickness & Why Walking Rules: Sage and Samantha bond over a mutual aversion to family road trips due to Sage’s severe car sickness.
  • Sage’s family maintains a 40-block walking radius as part of city life.
  • Quote: “If something is within 40 blocks, we'll walk.” – Sage (10:01)
• Rats, Rainstorms, and Reality: Sage recounts a nightmarish rat rescue scene at her home, epitomizing the gritty realities of NYC parenting.
  • Quote: “It was out of just a terrible movie you never want to watch.” – Sage (11:26)
• Safety on NYC Subways: Sage shares her “commandments” for subway safety, teaching her kids street smarts rather than fear (28:49).
  • They discuss balancing independence and vigilance, especially in unpredictable public spaces.

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3. Politics, Social Climate & the State of the City

[15:20–26:31]

• NYC Elections: Sage expresses dissatisfaction with recent mayoral choices, describing options as “garbage or hot garbage” (15:30), reflecting urban voters’ cynicism.
  • Quote: “Why are we trying this again?... Socialism never works, and your free whatever isn't actually free.” – Samantha (17:26)
• Weighing Leaving NYC: Sage admits her family considers leaving the city every winter due to harsh conditions, but emphasizes deeper motivations for staying, rooted in purpose, faith, and the unique growth her children experience in the city.
  • Quote: “I don't want to let a temporary politician dictate the adventure of our lives.” – Sage (18:21)
• Mental Health & Urban Safety: The escalating presence of untreated mental illness and escalating violence is cited as Sage’s biggest concern as a parent.
  • “These are aggressive, violent, able bodied men… every single day we encounter in some form of aggression.” – Sage (21:16)
  • Cops privately warn her to “get your kids out”—even as she weighs the nuanced reality versus overgeneralizations.

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4. The Myth of Safety: Urban vs. Suburban/Small Town Dangers

• “I'm More Afraid of What I Can't See”: Sage’s central thesis: she’d rather confront visible, overt dangers (like street violence or open drug use) than hidden threats, especially those enabled by technology or authority figures in “safe” environments.
  • Quote: “I’ll take a drug addict that I can see… I'm more comfortable with like physical danger than I am with like… Internet addiction… that is really hard to spot.” – Sage (35:03, 34:40)
  • She shares the shocking story of a respected coach in an idyllic town recently arrested for child exploitation, emphasizing evil can be better hidden in seemingly “safe” places.
• Raising Independent Kids: Both moms contrast “helicopter” parenting with giving kids real-world autonomy, referencing Jonathan Haidt’s ideas about gradually expanding independence (32:37).

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5. Real Consequences, Resilience, and Faith

[46:39–65:51]

• Marriage, Divorce, and Second Chances: Sage and Samantha reflect on the growth and gratitude that comes through hardship—career upheaval, divorce, and finding new love.
  • Quote: "You never think... Like you don’t go into a marriage planning to get divorced. And... all those years... I wouldn’t change a thing." – Sage (43:40)
  • On what it means to feel safe in a relationship: “He makes me feel safe enough to say whatever. And that is the thing… our communication is incredible.” – Sage (46:54)
• Faith as an Anchor: Both credit their Christian faith with providing perspective, peace, and the ability to release fear while modeling resilience for their children.
  • Quote: “I think it might be the thing that’s said in the Bible more than anything else–‘do not fear.’” – Sage (31:19)
  • Quote: “Anything good that ever happened to me came out of something hard. And yet we spend our whole lives trying to avoid the hard stuff.” – Samantha (66:23)

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6. The Challenge & Joy of Post-ESPN Life

• Career Transitions: Sage and Samantha discuss the new anxieties and freedoms of creating independently, the loss of strict structure, and the responsibility (and stress) of building their own brands.
  • Quote: “I could never ever go back to that kind of structure and control where you truly cannot be yourself…” – Samantha (54:33)
• Impact on Family: Samantha reflects on embracing this new, unpredictable life phase, prioritizing her children’s observation of her resilience and joy.
  • Quote: “What they remember is how you lived… not what you said.” – Sage (70:12)

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7. Social Media Detox & Finding What’s Real

• Stepping Away: Sage reveals she’s left social media, feeling liberated from the self-comparison cycle.
  • Quote: "Now that I’m just comparing myself to real people, I’m really grateful for my life." – Sage (74:35)
• Simplifying for Joy: Both discuss finding fulfillment in small daily pleasures, like dancing with their kids or walking in Central Park.
  • Quote: “The good stuff is... dancing with your kids, going on a bike ride… so good.” – Sage (77:13)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Hidden Dangers:
  “I’m more comfortable with physical danger than I am with the private Internet addiction... that is really hard to spot because I don’t know what you do with that.”  – Sage (34:40)

• On Parenting and Independence:
  “My kids know all the rules; we have a whole list of our commandments of riding the train.” – Sage (28:49)

• On Resilience After Cancellation:
  “Anything good that ever happened to me came out of something hard.” – Sage (66:23)

• On Grace and Second Acts:
  “Do you genuinely feel safe? …I didn’t realize I never had in my life, like in any way.” – Sage (46:54)

• On Joy in Simplicity:
  “Pure fun… that’s the stuff I’m gonna miss when they’re out of the house.” – Sage (77:17)

• On Avoiding Comparison Traps:
  “On social media, I was comparing my life to a conglomerate of hundreds, sometimes thousands of people. …That’s like an AI version of life.” – Sage (74:23)

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Important Timestamps

• 02:08: Sage’s cashmere sock obsession
• 10:01: Sage explains her walking lifestyle, avoiding cars due to motion sickness
• 11:26: Sage’s NYC rat rescue story
• 15:30 – 18:21: Discussion of NYC’s political landscape and living with tough mayoral choices
• 21:16 – 26:31: The escalating mental health crisis and its impact on urban safety and parenting
• 28:49: Sage’s subway safety rules for her children
• 34:40: “I’m more afraid of what I can’t see”—why suburbia can mask deeper threats
• 43:40: Sage on second marriages and embracing change
• 46:54: The necessity of safety and openness in relationships
• 54:33: The stress and liberation of post-ESPN entrepreneurship
• 66:23: The value of hardship and adversity in producing real growth
• 74:23 – 74:35: Embracing life offline; real-life comparison versus curated social feeds
• 77:13: Sage’s “good stuff” philosophy – joy in simple, daily family moments

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Episode Tone

• Warm, Authentic, Vulnerable, and Sincere.
• The conversation flows like a private catch-up between two close friends, marked by humor, candid admissions, thoughtful skepticism, and encouragement. Faith and motherhood are consistent undercurrents.

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Takeaway for Listeners

This episode is a masterclass in honest, fearless conversation about parenting, city living, faith, recovery from public adversity, and navigating life’s unpredictable turns. Sage and Samantha remind us that real security is less about the “safest” zip code and more about resilience, faith, open communication, and valuing visible reality over hidden threats. The ultimate message: Find gratitude in adversity, seek genuine connection, and—most of all—hug your loved ones and dance in the kitchen whenever you can.

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End of summary.

Transcript

[Kimberly]

Guys, thanks for helping me carry my Christmas tree.

[Drew]

Zoe, this thing weighs a ton.

[Sage Steele]

Drew Ski, live with your legs, man.

[Samantha Ponder]

Santa.

[Sage Steele]

Santa, did you get my letter?

[Drew]

He's talking to you britches.

[Sage Steele]

I'm not.

[Kimberly]

Of course he did.

[Sage Steele]

Right, Santa, you know my elf, Drew Ski here. He handles the nice list.

[Drew]

And elf. I'm six' three. What everyone wants is iPhone 17 and at T Mobile, you can get it on them. That center stage front camera is amazing for group selfies, right, Mrs. Claus?

[Kimberly]

I'm Mrs. Claus. Claus much younger sister. And AT T Mobile, there's no trade in needed when you switch, so you can keep your old phone or give.

[Sage Steele]

It as a gift.

[Kimberly]

And the best part, you can make the switch to T Mobile from your phone in just 15 minutes.

[Sage Steele]

Nice.

[Drew]

My side of the tree is slipping. Kimber, the holidays are better. AT T Mobile, switch in just 15 minutes and get iPhone 17 on us with no trade in needed. And now T Mobile is available in U.S. cellular stores with sweeper.

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[Sage Steele]

Kelly Clarkson with Wayfair. My favorite thing about the holidays, Decking out my whole house. And it's not a competition, but, like, if it was, I would totally win the season with Wayfair. Giant outdoor inflatable Santa.

[Samantha Ponder]

Got it on Wayfair.

[Sage Steele]

Trees, lights, and ornaments in every style and color. Yep, got those on Wayfair. Garland, accent pillows, cozy throws, nutcrackers. Wayfair, Wayfair, Wayfair. When it comes to hosting, Wayfair's got me covered there, too. I got a brand new dining table set that fits the whole family. Sheets and towels for extra guests, and even the cutest holiday bed sheets for the kiddos. All thanks to Wayfair. And the best part, I got it all shipped fast and free. It's a Wayfair holiday miracle, y'.

[Samantha Ponder]

All.

[Sage Steele]

I'm not saying there's a champion of.

[Samantha Ponder]

Christmas or anything, but if there was, it'd be the lady with the year.

[Sage Steele]

Round Christmas village who shops at Wayfair.

[Samantha Ponder]

That would be me.

[Sage Steele]

For everything festive and just your style, all delivered with fast and free shipping. Visit Wayfair.com or download the Wayfair app to totally win this season. But again, it's not A competition. Wayfair. Every style, every home, September to April. Oh, I only wear cashmere socks.

[Samantha Ponder]

Hello.

[Sage Steele]

I am the weirdest. Christian made so much fun of me. I will wear, like, a $5 t shirt, but my socks are, like, the majority of my budget. You're kidding me. It's changed.

[Samantha Ponder]

Is it because of the weather?

[Sage Steele]

I became a different person in the cold when I changed my sock life. I am. I feel like this is a testimonial.

[Kimberly]

You're a nicer person.

[Samantha Ponder]

I am.

[Sage Steele]

It is. I will not wear any socks that are not wool or cashmere. Like, literally will not wear them.

[Samantha Ponder]

I thought I knew everything about you.

[Sage Steele]

My kids are the one thing that. Cause my girls now want to just be in my closet and, like, taking my stuff. The one thing. They could take some suit from a Super bowl, and I'm like, whatever. If they take my socks, it is like, oh, my gosh.

[Samantha Ponder]

I get very.

[Sage Steele]

I love this upset. These are just plain. But they're.

[Samantha Ponder]

They are. I'm gonna touch her feet. This is really inappropriate.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah. Now. Yeah. I walked, so they're. Yeah, all of them. And I can. Mine don't feel like that I have a problem. It's like a serious.

[Samantha Ponder]

Well, here's the thing. The first step to recovery is what?

[Sage Steele]

Admitting.

[Samantha Ponder]

Admitting of a problem.

[Sage Steele]

That's all I do.

[Samantha Ponder]

So we're making progress already today. Yes.

[Sage Steele]

Somebody asked Christian, like, what I spend my money on.

[Samantha Ponder]

It sucks. But I as a total wuss now, and I have been for years. You know what ruined me with the cold is living in your hometown of Phoenix, Arizona.

[Sage Steele]

That's why I had to get like this. I had to find a solution.

[Samantha Ponder]

Yes.

[Sage Steele]

Because I walk everywhere. I'm outside all day, every day. It was not sustainable. What makes me mad is I didn't know about this when I did sidelines. Because I would be at Penn State in December, just dying, counting the number of hits I had to do, where I had to get out of the tent. I'm like, shoot, I have to do another one.

[Samantha Ponder]

Somebody's gonna say something if I don't.

[Sage Steele]

Talk the entire second half.

[Samantha Ponder]

Oh, my God. Well, that's when once your toes go. Or your fingertips, for me, it's over. And then I'm. Hand warmers never work miserable until you at home, and they burn you. Are you. Are you. Yes. You're good. I am. Yes. So, like, yeah, keep your cashmere. Thanks. These aren't cute, but they're also from TJ Maxx. But they are from TJ Maxx. So you would Approve. Or maybe it's home goods Marshalls. It's the same thing. This is our decor in our hotel room here in New York City. 4. I usually don't do this, but, like, a special episode, because what I. Okay. I have, as you know, gotten to sit down and meet so many awesome people. And my favorite episodes are with friends. Like, true friends. Yours, my dear, was, like, the best. Because we just shared so much.

[Sage Steele]

And you forgot we were on camera. We forgot we were on camera.

[Samantha Ponder]

For people who've been on camera their whole lives, we forgot we were on camera. But. But that's why, like, the feedback was and still is insane. David. I believe she's my top performing, like, top two or three ever. Top two. For a long time.

[Sage Steele]

It was like, let's beat the Sam Ponder episode. Wow. I want to hear who's my competition?

[Samantha Ponder]

You just got beaten by James. Oh, well, formerly Project America.

[Sage Steele]

Vile like Knowledge, so. So he had that over you.

[Samantha Ponder]

So Epstein is the only reason why you were bumped out of the top.

[Sage Steele]

I was gonna say. I feel like James would keep. I was gonna say something negative about whoever was beating me, but not that guy. Because I'm scared. I'm scared. I don't want him digging in my life. I know.

[Samantha Ponder]

I know. He's, oh, my gosh. And fascinating. And even when we were sitting with James, I was like, wow, this is super interesting. But felt so different because I had met him. I had not met him before. And hours, like, if I see clips, I get emotional again.

[Sage Steele]

So thank you every time. Well, thank you. Because you've connected me with so many people because of that. That episode. Cause people will come up to me and be like, oh, I watched your.

[Samantha Ponder]

But the.

[Sage Steele]

You can always tell. And I know this is a generalization, but the difference between men and women, because women will be like, oh, my gosh. I listened to the whole thing. I loved your thing with Sage. And the guys are always like, no, I didn't listen to the whole three hours, but I saw some clips and it was great. But I have connected with so many people from that. And now that this is the second time, I feel like people regularly ask me, what are you doing now? And I normally say, well, I'm a homeschool mom. And now I'm gonna say, I'm a homeschool mom. And I go on Sage Steele's podcast.

[Samantha Ponder]

And that's all you need in life. It's actually all you need. And we have had a lot of people tell us, like, we need to do something together. Officially, I mean, when you say a.

[Sage Steele]

Lot of people, you mean me? Yeah, me and my mom.

[Samantha Ponder]

And my mom is what I was gonna say. And my hu. Would your husband want you around me that often, though?

[Sage Steele]

Forget me. If he means I'm leaving, he's like, go be without Sage.

[Samantha Ponder]

Well, okay. If not him, fine. Christian, the kids. The kids would like it, but only if I bring my kid.

[Sage Steele]

Only if they're allowed to come along. Because the worst is when I tell them ahead of time, I'm going to do something with Sage. And they're like, getting their shoes on. I'm like, no, no, you're not. You're not coming.

[Samantha Ponder]

They're the cutest. Well, no, I just. So today is so different because I'm like, we're gonna wing it and talk about things that we care about and, I don't know, try to make it more regular. What the hell? Excuse me. Sorry, mom. What the heck? Sorry, mom. Cause my mom is the only person that definitely watches every single episode. I'm kidding. All my Patreon followers. Here's the other funny thing. This happened last second, long story that I won't bore you guys with. And I'm so grateful that you could say yes. And so I was like, okay, good. I'll send a car for you. Sam's response. Ha ha ha. Just imagine your walk on the beach, except with rats and crackheads.

[Sage Steele]

I like to walk, okay? This is part of the reason that we live in New York City. The walking life is the life for me. The problem that you might not know about is that, like my three children, I get insanely car sick.

[Samantha Ponder]

I mean, I didn't know that either.

[Sage Steele]

The side doors of my car are filled with those blue circular throw up bags. Because not only do my kids puke every time they get in a car, but I do too.

[Samantha Ponder]

What are you talking about?

[Sage Steele]

Being in a cab or. I can't unless I'm driving. I'm puking or I'm driving.

[Samantha Ponder]

Sage.

[Sage Steele]

It's a problem. I made the mistake of getting a nice car once. I bought a nice car.

[Samantha Ponder]

I remember that car.

[Sage Steele]

It was a mistake.

[Samantha Ponder]

Don't do it.

[Sage Steele]

Especially if you have kids. But the first time we drove in it, not only did one of my kids in the back throw up, but then when they threw up, I threw up. And we made the mistake because these fancy cars had like the air vents through the seats. Yeah, it's like, oh, you get an air conditioned butt. I don't know why we need that. But now it's filled with Puke. You cannot get it out. So I'm like, here's my fancy puke car. You want to come sit? It's disgusting.

[Samantha Ponder]

What's wrong with you? A lot. So much. I literally thought I knew, like, the most important things. Like, first of all, I am afraid of vomit. I'm afraid. Oh, okay. That's not in the car.

[Sage Steele]

You just can't be in the car together.

[Samantha Ponder]

No, never. And I guess we probably haven't been in cars together. We've walked a lot and met places.

[Sage Steele]

Yes.

[Samantha Ponder]

Like, I almost didn't have kids because I was like, someday they'll puke on me. I can't do this. Then they puke on you, and somehow you don't put them back in. Like, you keep them. But, like, no, I. That is so weird.

[Sage Steele]

That's why I walk. That's why I walk. I walk everywhere we have in our family. It's kind of like a 40 block radius. If something is within 40 blocks, we'll walk. So. Yeah.

[Samantha Ponder]

How far is 40 blocks?

[Sage Steele]

That is.

[Samantha Ponder]

I don't know, like, a couple miles. Yeah, yeah, yeah. A few miles here in New York. And so you don't mind rats and crackheads? I don't.

[Sage Steele]

We had a rat problem. We have, like, a little tiny backyard. We had a rat problem when we first moved in. You want to hear something crazy?

[Samantha Ponder]

Do I?

[Sage Steele]

It rained one day, like, torrential downpour. Okay. This is the stuff of nightmares. You thought throw up and rats. This is what I'm bringing to the table right now. It rained like crazy. And I was home with my daughter in the morning, and she comes running because her room is right by the back and she has a window she could see. And she goes, mom, there's a rat in the backyard. So I come running to look out the back window. And I mean, pouring rain. We have, like, a little flower bed where it's, like, on the ground, though. And all of a sudden I see rats. I mean, totally. More than 30, carrying babies in their mouths, coming out of holes in the dirt because they were drowning. Oh, they were rescued.

[Samantha Ponder]

Mamas rescuing their babies.

[Sage Steele]

So my daughter was like, oh, it's kind of cute, but disgusting. What is happening right now? It was out of just a terrible movie you never want to watch. It was the stuff of nightmares. So I stood in my house watching at least 30 rats carrying their baby. And then they would go back and get more babies. They just kept coming. They're saving their lives. But yeah.

[Samantha Ponder]

And you love this city. I do.

[Sage Steele]

So we love New York. We love Living here. Yeah, that was a rough time. That was, yeah, that wasn't great. But we got rid of that problem. So you know what they do.

[Samantha Ponder]

I hate to admit it, but I'm no stranger to bloating and general gut discomfort. So I've spoken to doctors. They all say the same thing. Eat slower, take a walk after a meal, avoid processed foods. And I swear I do all of that, but sometimes I still feel kind of gross. Recently though, I learned a little bit more about colostrum, which is the very first milk that babies receive from their mothers after birth. And I remember hearing all about it when all of my three kids were born. And I called it liquid gold because it's packed with proteins, natural growth factors and peptides that work together to help your immune system. It also reduces inflammation and bloating. That's a big deal. And that is why I'm excited about today's spot sponsor. It is called Cowboy Colostrum. Here it is. It offers the highest quality bovine colostrum. Bovine is cow colostrum and it's the highest quality available in the United States. Cowboy colostrum is always made in America from 100% American grass fed cows. And they don't over process or strip their colostrum like other brands do. Cowboy leaves it whole, full fat, high protein for ultimate nutrient density, making it the highest quality cow colostrum that you can buy. Say it again. Cow colostrum you can buy by the way. It's easy to drink and it is made with delicious natural ingredients. No artificial flavors. You just add a scoop into your coffee or into your smoothies. The flavors are actually good. Organic chocolate, Madagascar vanilla. That's what this one is. Or strawberry made with organic freeze dried strawberries. As an added bonus, your hair, your skin will look amazing because of the natural growth factors and and peptides in Cowboy Colostrum. So for a limited time our listeners get up to 25% off their entire order. Just head to cowboycolostrum.com sage and use code sage at checkout. That's 25% off when you use code [e-mail] sage and after you buy it, they're going to ask where you heard about them. Please support the Sage Steel show and tell them we sent you.

[Sage Steele]

Well, no anything.

[Samantha Ponder]

Is it legal?

[Sage Steele]

Mayor Adams, to his credit they, they put together like a rat council. Did you hear about this? They had like a. It sounds like a joke but it was serious because during COVID it got really bad. We live close to the park so we would get all the rat or the park rats, too, that would come over, you know, like, looking for housing, I guess. I don't know. People are housing. They had. I can't even remember what it's called. Like a commissioner of rats. I'm dead serious. You're gonna have to look it up. They had, like, a formal press conference, everything. And it actually, there's still a lot in the park, but we don't have them in our house anymore, so. I didn't tell you that the first time you came over. No, you did not.

[Samantha Ponder]

Between the rats and the vomit. I don't know.

[Sage Steele]

Aren't you so glad we're friends? Oh, my goodness, yes.

[Samantha Ponder]

She's saving it all.

[Sage Steele]

Yes.

[Samantha Ponder]

So that is. That segues nicely into one of the things that I saw on social media. Like, I guess it was a month ago. Yeah, it was a month ago. At election time was. First of all, the first thing you put on your Instagram story, I believe, was you sitting on a train. Subway. Sorry, I don't have my lingo right here.

[Sage Steele]

Sorry.

[Samantha Ponder]

You're doing all right. Subway. And you're heading out to vote.

[Sage Steele]

Oh, yeah.

[Samantha Ponder]

And what did you say it was about the not so great options you had here in the city for.

[Sage Steele]

It was like garbage or hot garbage, I think. Said something like that always settles. Strangely, it didn't go over well. My DMs were super fun that day. Yeah, it was. It was a rough choice. I mean, look, in general, and I have never been a super political person. I don't align myself with one party, and that's never really been my thing. But when I saw that the option for a city that we've lived in now for nine years, I've been here 2012 years altogether, was gonna elect a socialist mayor. I mean, that sends off to anyone who studied, you know, even the smallest amount of history that should, you know, spark some concern. Yeah, so I had some concerns. And then the other option was like, a sexual harasser who sent a bunch of old people to their deaths in nursing homes during COVID So I was like, what. What are our options here? I think a lot of New Yorkers felt that way. In the end, I get the Mamdani thing because it's so expensive. It is. So I. I've lived here rich, and I've lived here poor. When I first moved here when I was 18, I had literally nothing. Like, I was eating at Wendy's because my mom had sent me Wendy's coupons for my birthday. And that is how I Survived. We walked by a Jamba Juice, like, a couple years ago, and I told my kids, like, that was if I ever really felt like I was doing something big, like I got paid that day or something, I would take myself to Jamba Juice. So I get the affordability issue. And that you're thinking, hey, if this young guy, who. He may say he's a socialist, but if he's gonna help this city be cheaper and me to be able to afford rent and basic groceries. I don't know, I get it. I get that you're looking for any help you can find in a city like this, but I just personally don't think that has ever worked out well before.

[Samantha Ponder]

That's the point.

[Sage Steele]

Why are we trying this again?

[Samantha Ponder]

That's the point is if you, you know, 30 seconds of research, a quick Google search, even use ChatGPT, although it isn't always honest. I've learned there's censoring on that too. You know, socialism never works, and your free whatever isn't actually free.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah.

[Samantha Ponder]

So I think that's the part that was so confusing for those of us on the outside, where you're like, wait, there's a lot of highly educated people in this city who've got to know better.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah.

[Samantha Ponder]

And shocking in many ways. So with you having done that homework and knowing what the potential future is here in the city, Mandani takes over on January 1st. Have you guys considered saying, okay, I'm good? 12 years in the city, and you're from beautiful Phoenix, Arizona. You have a lot of options where you could go with the three kids. Have you considered leaving?

[Sage Steele]

We consider leaving every January through March or April, literally every year. Just completely unrelated to whoever's running the city at the time. Because every year when it gets cold, we're like, what are we doing? Why are we living here? Look, it's hard in some ways to live here. In my opinion, life in New York makes good things better and bad things worse. It's a lot like having kids, you know, like, hard experiences with kids are even harder, but good experiences with kids are even greater. Like, to share, enjoy. That's kind of how I feel about living in the city. I don't want to let a temporary politician dictate, like, the adventure of our lives. You know, I want to have some purpose in where we're living that's beyond that. Like, I've got to believe that God is so much bigger than any political person that gets appointed. I mean, the Bible says that he sets one up and another down. Like he, he is well aware. He's not like surprised, like, oh, Mamdani got elected. What are we gonna do? There are real world implications, I'll say. For me, just as a mom in the city, my number one concern is the mentally ill. On the streets here, we deal with it every single day. My kids and I ride the subway four or five times every single day. And it is a serious problem. So if he doesn't address that eventually, if that continues to get worse, just from a safety perspective, I think we would probably have to leave because it has gotten really aggressive recently. I could tell you stories for days.

[Samantha Ponder]

Give me one.

[Sage Steele]

Trying to think of stories that I could actually tell what happened because it's been so alarming and vulgar, the things that have been said to my children. I had a guy a couple weeks ago, you know those big metal trash cans we have here? We're just walking down the street and he comes up and pushes it right in front of us, goes to the next street, pushes that screaming. I mean, these aren't like there's a level of compassion because these people need serious help, but they are dangerous. It's not the same homeless crisis or homeless issue that was visible the first time I lived here back in the early 2000s where you had homeless people. It's a big city, of course there's going to be drug issues and all that. Whatever's going on now is different. And I've talked to so many people who live here. I don't know if it's a difference in the drugs and the fentanyl issues and all that, but these are aggressive, violent, able bodied men for everyone who.

[Drew]

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[Sage Steele]

I am not talking about like old veterans or people that are just like down on their luck. These are very angry, violent, like middle aged, too young, I would say 20s to through 40s, that every single day we encounter in some form of aggression. Even if you just see it from across the street screaming in people's faces. We've got to find a place to put these people where they can get real help. So when you ask about mom Donnie, that's the first thing I think of is like, what are we going to do about this problem? Because any honest New Yorker who's actually in the streets, if you're just Taking Ubers and cabs all over the city, I can see how maybe you don't notice, but if you are taking the subway in Manhattan and regularly walking around, you know what I'm saying is true, because we see it literally every day. So that's the issue for me. That's like, we gotta figure this out quickly. I've had a friend that got punched in the head just walking down the street by a stranger, walk by her mentally ill man. And of course, he didn't go to jail. She found out later that he had been arrested, like, 14 times. You know, it's just. And you talk to the cops about it. Actually, some of the most interesting conversations I've had are with minority cops in the city that are saying, like, get your kids out. Literally, we'll say to you, I don't bring my kids into the city. They're obviously seeing the worst of the worst. They're like, our hands are tied. Like, we. This is not.

[Samantha Ponder]

Why are there hands?

[Sage Steele]

Something. Because they'll get let out immediately. One time I was talking to a cop about a situation that was happening, and it was a violent guy, and he was like, look, by the time I get the paperwork in, he's already out. Like, there's no point anymore. They're so demoralized. So then to elect a mayor who has made it clear from his own tweets, and if he says he's changed his mind, like, look, everyone reserves the right to change their mind on things, and you can learn more. And I'm sure, as I think he's only 33.

[Samantha Ponder]

Yeah.

[Sage Steele]

Like, he's about to learn a whole lot more about, one, the corruption of our government in general and just all the moving parts in managing a city of this size. But he's been really clear about his disdain.

[Samantha Ponder]

Yes.

[Sage Steele]

For police officers, which always feels so weird to me, because if you're in the city, you know, the majority of the cops you see every day are minorities, and it's not like they're rich. Like, why wouldn't you be supportive of these men and women who are trying to keep our city safe and put food on the table for their families? And I understand that the. The police stuff is complicated, but from the officers I've talked to recently, they're just so discouraged about the lack of support that they get from government officials, from the ag, from. You know, it's just, like, you get to the point where you're thinking, what's the point?

[Samantha Ponder]

Exactly? And when you hire, they can't do their job right.

[Sage Steele]

And then they're saying they're going to have. I forget what, like community affairs. People, people come out to. I'm sorry, anybody who's met in the subway when somebody's mentally ill. You're telling me that someone who's just like trained in mental health is going to walk up like, no, many of these people have weapons, are clearly violent. I just, I hope we don't have to be guinea pigs for a bad experiment. That sounds really good in a fancy college classroom when you're not actually impacted by the day to day stuff. So I have friends here that are trying to get concealed carry licenses. And that's tricky here in New York. That is very tricky here. It's an interesting time, but that was a really long winded way of answering the question, will we stay? We stay for now. I'm trusting that God's gonna make it clear one way or the other. That's what I'm praying for, is just like, make it obvious. And I know for some people who value safety above all else, it is obvious to them, like, get your kids out. We hear this all the time.

[Samantha Ponder]

But if the cops are telling you that. Yes.

[Sage Steele]

And, and I also have to assess, like they are seeing the worst of the worst. It's like if you talk to someone who works in, you know, dealing with child trafficking, predators and stuff, they're gonna tell you, never go on the Internet. Never let your children on the Internet. Like, which I totally get. Cause they're seeing the darkest of the darkest stuff. And so I respect the opinions of these men and women, but also, like, I want to do what I'm supposed to do, not just like, what other people see as this would be a good life. My kids are thriving here, like truly thriving. And that doesn't mean there aren't problems. There are, but the things I see in them that I really hope and believe lead to them becoming purposeful, God fearing, content adults. Which is really my ultimate goal for them is not just to have a great childhood. Like, yeah, we want that. But it doesn't end like when they leave the house. We want them to be awesome adults. I'm seeing a lot of good here from that. So I don't know. I don't have a for sure answer right now.

[Samantha Ponder]

I think the subway part scares me. It's funny because I'm not here, but then you hear the horror stories and the last few times I've been in New York, I've always taken pride in going to figure out the subway system because I don't get it. I don't live here. And then I'm like, look what I just did. I'm tucking my high heels. I can do it. I'm a New Yorker. And now I'm like, never mind. Why do you continue to take the subway? As I've gotten older and as life has gotten busier, I've become very, very particular about what I put into my body. I want things that actually work, that I can feel, that genuinely support me in showing up as my best every single day. That's why I'm such a fan of RO nutrition. RO makes liquid vitamins. And thank goodness, because I hate pills. And they use liposomal delivery, which basically means the nutrients are wrapped in tiny protective bubbles so your body can actually absorb them. I am telling you, I can genuinely feel the difference. This isn't one of those maybe it's doing something supplements with ro. It's immediate, it's noticeable, and it's become a non negotiable part of my routine. Okay, I have a couple of my favorites right here. You can see them. Liposomal creatine is number one. This blue bottle, I take it right after my workouts. And listen, creatine is not just for bodybuilders. Obviously women should be using it too, especially as we age. It supports strength, it supports recovery, lean muscle. And I really notice a huge difference in how quickly my muscles bounce back. There's no bloating, no chalky powders, just a clean liquid shot that absorbs the way it should. So there's the creatine one and then there is also the curcumin and resveratrol. This is my go to for healthy aging. Curcumin helps support a healthy inflammatory response. And pairing it with resveratrol is such a smart. It's kind of a brilliant combo daily staple for me, keeping me feeling balanced and energized. So if you want to try roe for yourself, whether it's these two or any of their liposomal formulas, go to rhonutrition.com discount sage for 20% off. And honestly, if you're trying to take your health more seriously and you want supplements that actually do something, roe is it. Again, that's code SAGE for 20% off at ro nutrition rhodrition.com discount sage.

[Sage Steele]

Look, you have to be smart. Like, my kids know all the rules like that we have a whole list of like our commandments of riding the train. They know you never get on an empty train or a train where there's only a couple people there's always a reason for that. Like if there's someone screaming or clearly mentally ill, as soon as the train stops, you get off and get on the next car. They know to stand back against the wall. I mean, these are the kind of like real life things because we had people getting pushed into the tracks.

[Samantha Ponder]

That's what I'm saying. It scares me.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah. And I totally get that. But I also wasn't raised with like a fearful mentality. I mean, my parents live in Palestine in the west bank part time. And I grew up with my parents doing inner city ministry in South Phoenix. And you know, we had players that played for my dad that I would stand there hearing them saying they're going to go get a gun and come back and shoot him. You know, like crazy stuff that I experienced as a kid. And I also saw the faith of my dad, who knew that God was in control. Be smart. Don't be an idiot. You know, don't put yourself in situations where, you know, like my kids don't. It's not like my 11 year old is taking the train at night on her own, but she can take the train to her basketball practice during the middle of the day because she feels confident with that. And I know that she's prepared to know what to do. You stay where the people are. That's our rule in New York. I had a lot of scary situations happen to me in Phoenix as a kid and they were always because no one was around. And then one guy shows up and that started in kindergarten for me when I was followed to school by a guy exposing himself was a child molester in a nice neighborhood, you know, but there was no one else around. And that's where I get scared. I tell my. We were on the Lower east side the other day in a neighborhood that wasn't great and there was nobody around. And I told my kids, this is where you should be concerned. If you're in a neighborhood and you don't see people, get to where the people are. Like, that's what makes me feel safe here, is because my kids are in the neighborhood we live in. There's moms with kids everywhere. Like, we live at Central park where there's playgrounds all over and stroller to stroller on the sidewalks. Like, that's the stuff you don't see on the news, you know, like my kids do art class at the Met every week. You know, their history is at the Museum of Natural History. Like the stuff we get to. We go ice skating in the morning at Wollman Rink, like just on a random Tuesday. Like the things that they're getting to do. I do believe right now, and it may not be this way forever, but they outweigh any of those concerns that are legitimate. Like you do have to be smart and think things through and, and communicate to the kids so that they understand, but not in a fearful way. Like we're, we just refuse to live in fear. I think it might be the thing that's said in the Bible more than anything else consistently is do not fear. Like he knows we, we kind of tend to go that direction of anxiety and fear. And I do believe that there is a God in control. So I'm not going to live in fear and pass that on to my kids because that's not how I want them to live. I want them to experience life trusting that God's in control and using the brain that he gave them.

[Samantha Ponder]

What a great lesson or perspective for moms out there and the helicopter moms that we all know that live in suburban wherever in America and it's Pleasantville and it's white picket fences and there's no rats and crackheads, right? And we're still following our kids around and everything like that Takes some courage as a mom, doesn't it? To say, yeah, Scout, I trust you to take the subway in New York City by yourself to go to basketball practice or whatever it is.

[Sage Steele]

Well, and I've watched her, right, And I see her, her confidence. She was like, of course I can do it. Like what? You know, she was annoyed that I was even. I'm like, well you're 11, so you know. But those are the things she can do do here. She has so much freedom here that she wouldn't have if we live somewhere else. Cuz I would have to drive her everywhere. And I can't be in three places at once with all these kids. So like, you know, my kids start going to the corner store to get firewood on their own when they're eight or go to get milk. I love that when they're really little and we kind of subscribe to the Jonathan Height anxious generation mentality. He is a New Yorker and He said like 8 is the age where if they have any interest in independence, like give them even the level of independence that gives you a little discomfort as a parent and watch them thrive. I've seen that with all three of my kids. Give them even the tiniest bit and then they want more, and then they want more. And it's been really cool to watch. But here's what I'll say to your point about safety and, like, the mom helicopter parent thing. There was a time in the last year that we thought we were going to move and we had found a town in a safe place that we went and visited and we saw and we thought, like, okay, we found a school there that we seemed to like. And it looked on paper very picturesque and Americana. Everything okay. It's not a huge town. And I just found out recently that that school. School that we were going to send our three kids to where our son probably would have played football, the head football coach just got caught recording all the little boys naked in the locker room and had all sorts of child pornography on his phone and is now in jail. I'll take a drug addict that I can see has a problem where I know to avoid. Like, if somebody's shooting up on the train, like, this is the kind of stuff we see. I know we gotta get my kids off this train. We're getting on the next one. We're going to wait. Because that's the evil and the depravity. I can see what really scares me is the depravity. I can't see where it looks all clean cut and he looks like a guy you would. And I'm sure, you know, churchgoing and says all the right things and. And that's what's going on. No, thank you. And I'm not saying that doesn't happen in New York. Obviously. This level of depravity is everywhere. You think it's not in your town, you're wrong. It is everywhere. But the Internet has changed the game because you can sin in secret in a way that you never could before. And we've all got our own issues. This is not me being holier than thou, but that kind of issue. No, keep my kids away from that for whatever. Like, I'll have them here dealing with my rats in the backyard before I will put them in that environment. Because I don't know how you fix that one when your kid's been quite literally exposed in that way. So, yeah, there is no, like, safety is a myth. To think there is this, like, perfectly safe place since the dawn of the Internet. Like, there's no such thing. It's in your own home. Like, the enemy is within, you know, like, it's. It is all around us. And there is no, like, oh, well, you live in the scary city. I'm gonna be honest. I am more comfortable with, like, physical danger than I am with, like, the private Internet addiction. All that kind of danger that is really hard to spot because I don't know what you do with that.

[Samantha Ponder]

I have never heard it put that way. And that is brilliant. You are so right. We let our guard down, and that's when the crazy people take advantage.

[Sage Steele]

Sure.

[Samantha Ponder]

That's when they say, oh, look, this trusting mom who's good. I mean, by the way, it's not even that example. You're not even, you know, at an AAU camp in a different state for the summer. Like, this is in their school every.

[Sage Steele]

Day in the Lutheran school. No, no.

[Samantha Ponder]

Middle school.

[Sage Steele]

Middle school boys. They would have been my son.

[Samantha Ponder]

You are. Thank you for sharing that in particular. And because I think as. I mean, and my kids are like, I had to let go, right? They're gone. I try not to think about what they're doing. I'll check them on the map, by the way. Life360. And I'm like, oh, it's 1:00am and she's still at the bar downtown. Okay, so.

[Sage Steele]

And they're like, mom, where are you? Wow. Oh, that was for you, Quinn.

[Samantha Ponder]

She checks my location last night.

[Sage Steele]

She's like, okay, mom, we might have.

[Samantha Ponder]

Had a late night last night slash early morning. And I will admit, I'm sorry. And I will admit, like, it was a cool event. We went to special event day.

[Sage Steele]

I didn't mean to call you out.

[Samantha Ponder]

I would get in bed here, and I was like, I'm gonna sleep as late as I can and I'm gonna tell. I'm gonna. Let me send Sam the address and, you know, reminder of timing, whatever. So when she wakes up this morning, looks, and she's like, should I read that text too?

[Sage Steele]

Oh, yeah.

[Samantha Ponder]

What did you say?

[Sage Steele]

No, I said, unless you were kidnapped, like, what possible reason do you have for being out at three in the morning?

[Samantha Ponder]

Three in the morning? I know.

[Sage Steele]

I'm impressed. She's a newlywed. She's living it up out in the street streets. See, New York can't be that dangerous. You're out in these streets at 3am.

[Samantha Ponder]

We'Re in a cute, safe little Irish pub around the corner. Okay, it's different. It's different. The American health care system is broken. Big Pharma charges an arm and a leg for their products, while insurance companies are focused on growing health care spending. So I'm always researching ways to take care of myself naturally. And one of the most overlooked factors I've learned about is improving your blood flow. That means more oxygen and nutrients to your brain, heart muscles, and even places that you Need a little extra help as you age? I use Blood Flow 7 from Juvinon. It works by boosting nitric oxide levels 230% and opening arteries up to 62% to improve blood flow with just one dose a day, it's helped improve my stamina, my energy, my focus, and supported my heart health. All without caffeine or stick stimulants. It's doctor formulated, scientifically backed with premium and natural ingredients. I swear I wouldn't share it with you if it didn't work for me. Head over to bloodflow7.com sage or click the link in the description below for 30% off your order and give yourself the gift of health today. That's bloodflow7.com sage I just want to.

[Sage Steele]

Know your newlywed marriage advice. I want to hear. I'm in year. Actually, next week will be year 13.

[Samantha Ponder]

Are you serious? It's been 13 years. Thirteen years since your shotgun wedding. Cowboy base.

[Sage Steele]

Maybe I didn't have. They were so disappointed.

[Samantha Ponder]

Yes, exactly.

[Sage Steele]

I still have that article in the newspaper in Minnesota where it was like.

[Samantha Ponder]

Because Christian was still playing.

[Sage Steele]

He was still playing. And it was like, she's pregnant for sure.

[Samantha Ponder]

That's why the family are so fast.

[Sage Steele]

I was like, oh, I hope they're good at math, because I did end up getting pregnant pretty soon after. And I'm like, no, but it wasn't.

[Samantha Ponder]

It wasn't. It wasn't the exact months.

[Sage Steele]

But yes, almost 13 years. And you are, what, on month four?

[Samantha Ponder]

We just started month four. Yes.

[Sage Steele]

And how's it going?

[Samantha Ponder]

She was there to witness the nuptial. Yes.

[Sage Steele]

So still to this day, no offense to myself and Christian, but prettiest, most gorgeous wedding pictures I've ever seen in my life. Literally, like, should have been the COVID of Vogue.

[Samantha Ponder]

Thank you.

[Sage Steele]

I know they're probably big fans of yours.

[Samantha Ponder]

Vogue. Absolutely not. Yep, exactly. Anytime I walk around New York City, I'm like, they hate me. They hate me. They hate me for sure. And then sometimes people come up and be like, I really like what you're doing.

[Sage Steele]

Yes.

[Samantha Ponder]

But don't say anything. And then don't come near me. This didn't happen. Yeah. Thank you. Jonathan Fosco with Munoz Photography. They're out of Fort Lauderdale. They actually do a lot of. A lot of political stuff down near Mar a Lago, but they go all over the country. And they actually did Evan's senior photos. It was a recommendation. It was a recommendation from someone in my condo in Florida. We were at the beach, and I wanted her to have her special senior photos on the beach. And the way he made my daughter feel, you know, at the time, 17 years old and like, oh, my gosh, awkward. And it's six o' clock in the morning because it had to be sunrise on the beach. And how he made her feel. I was like, if I ever am lucky enough to have God, bring me.

[Sage Steele]

A man, like a real one, please.

[Samantha Ponder]

A real man. Capital letters, not just capital. And I said to him at the end of the shoot, I was like, I don't know if I'll ever get married again, but if I do, you're my photographer.

[Sage Steele]

Wow.

[Samantha Ponder]

Women of her. I hadn't even seen the photos yet of that shoot that day, but I know how he made my kid feel. So, Dave, I was like, listen, we're going through all the vendors for the wedding and you know, this was almost a shotgun wedding. Although there was no chance of me getting knocked up because I'm in menopause.

[Sage Steele]

Why you called me and told me early on, like, we're close, but I'm convinced you knew that I couldn't be like, this is a little fast, Sage. I was like, well, good luck, my friend.

[Samantha Ponder]

Exactly. This is a judge free zone for sure. From sandponder. And I was like, listen, I know, like, this is expensive and this is expensive. And it was starting off as it was going to be this, like, you know, listen, second marriage. We're older. I don't need a white dress. We don't need 200 people. It's going to be really chill.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah, super chill.

[Samantha Ponder]

It was the opposite. But there are certainly good photographers in Nashville. Yeah, a lot of weddings in Nashville. Great people, great artists there that I could have. And I was like, babe, I need you to trust me on this. And he's like, excuse me? Or flying photographers for the wedding. And I'm like, just trust me and don't look at the bill.

[Sage Steele]

It was worth it.

[Samantha Ponder]

It's amazing. And he's a friend. He's a dear friend, so thank you. Wedding advice? Or are you just. Did you ask for advice?

[Sage Steele]

Yes, I'll take it.

[Samantha Ponder]

The only advice I have. I mean, no, for those of you who are going to do it for a second time, like, you don't want that advice?

[Sage Steele]

No, no, I don't want that. I don't want. But just like keeping it alive and.

[Samantha Ponder]

Well, Well, I feel like I'm 16. Like, I do feel like, oh, wait, let me rephrase. Like, okay, maybe 26.

[Sage Steele]

He's a couple years older.

[Samantha Ponder]

No, let me tell you at 16. I was still like doing hopscotch and like I was the lamest kid ever. You can ask all my friends. Dave met my best friend. Julia, of course was at the wedding and he was like, from college. And she was like, no, Sage was the lamest, prudest friend I had. Trust me. So trying to make up for lost time, Sam. Yeah.

[Sage Steele]

Good for you.

[Samantha Ponder]

Your mom won't watch. It's fine.

[Sage Steele]

Keeping you in?

[Samantha Ponder]

No, I would. Do you see my glow? Okay, one. I will say this. Like, gosh, you never think you're going. Like you don't go into a marriage planning to get divorced. Sure, I didn't at least. And 20 years from age 20 to 47, all in all, but 20 years, married 27 together with my ex husband who's the father of my children. And I wouldn't change a thing. Like, I'm so grateful for all of it. I don't know if he is, but I'm so grateful. Probably not for every single moment because it led to today, literally. And so with that, like any experience, you have to take the good and the not so good. I don't wanna say bad. Even though there was, of course. And I think that one thing I did before and then in between divorce and meeting Dave, there was like one exclusive relationship that I had. And what I found as I reflected in the couple years since that ended was, man, I really kept a lot to myself, communication wise. And I just didn't want to upset anybody and I didn't want to potentially hurt his feelings. And I didn't want to go there. And it's like, just fix it and put a little band aid over here and just put it away. And you can't. And it sounds obvious, but I think as women, as mothers, as doers, as fixers, as employees, like all of it, you're just like, it's okay, it's okay. I'm tough, I'm strong, I can deal with. And I don't need to share that. He is an incredible. David's an incredible communicator. Sometimes too much because I'm like, I don't want to talk about this. I don't want to. And he's like. And then I cry and then it comes out. And it's nothing serious really, but it's just, you know, little things here or there, or maybe it's something that happened at work, on my job that I was frustrated about. But then you just, you don't want to inconvenience them because they're going through things too I keep pointing because he's there, but he makes me me feel safe enough to say whatever. And that is the thing. So I hope that before you say yes to somebody, like, answer that question, ladies and men, because I believe men absolutely need to feel safe too. We need to give our men that as well. As much as I am all for the traditional male role, protection, et cetera, but he has made me feel safe enough to say, say pretty much everything. And I've never felt that. And I'm not saying my ex husband didn't make me feel that way. Like, whatever. Even if they do, it's still on us to behave that way and say, you know, to allow someone to make you, that's on me. If I allowed that feeling to take over and then to therefore not communicate, which then leads to what? Buildup, resentment, et cetera. We talk about everything. Yeah. And some hard things. So that's the thing I would say to people coming into it, like, do you genuinely feel safe? And I didn't realize I never had in my life, like in any way. Even at work, even if you have a contract, right? If you have a signed contract, you still don't feel safe in any way. I think you get used to living that way, and that's a terrible way to live.

[Sage Steele]

What do you mean when you say safe? Like, what is that to you guys?

[Kimberly]

Thanks for helping me carry my Christmas tree, Zoe.

[Drew]

This thing weighs a ton.

[Sage Steele]

Drewski, lift with your legs, man.

[Samantha Ponder]

Santa.

[Sage Steele]

Santa, did you get my letter?

[Drew]

He's talking to you, Bridges.

[Sage Steele]

I'm not.

[Kimberly]

Of course he did.

[Sage Steele]

Right, Santa, you know my elf Drew here, he handles the nice list.

[Drew]

And elf. I'm six' three. What everyone wants is iPhone 17 and at T Mobile, you can get it on them. That center stage front camera is amazing for group selfies. Right, Mrs. Claus?

[Kimberly]

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[Sage Steele]

Or give it as a gift.

[Kimberly]

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[Sage Steele]

Nice.

[Drew]

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[Samantha Ponder]

That'S a great question. Did you, like, interview people in your past life? I don't know.

[Sage Steele]

My. My questions are like, how do you feel about your quarterback? That's the thing.

[Samantha Ponder]

That's what you and I did.

[Sage Steele]

Storing up all these.

[Samantha Ponder]

What do you mean?

[Sage Steele]

I hung out with Tom Rinaldi a lot, though, so I got a little bit of that.

[Samantha Ponder]

My first job in TV was in South Bend, Indiana. Tom Rinaldi was in South Bend when.

[Sage Steele]

I was in South Bend. As a guy, I did not know that.

[Samantha Ponder]

Yes. I always looked at him in awe, like, well, that'll never happen, that gift. What do I mean when I say feel safe?

[Sage Steele]

Yeah.

[Samantha Ponder]

That he would love me no matter what. That it didn't matter what my issue was or is remains and wouldn't leave. Even though I had no reason to feel that in the past. I just. I mean, when I was married before, like, I just. Yeah, I didn't feel. Safe enough that, like, if I said this, would he be mad at me? And then it would ruin dinner or it would ruin the vacation or ruin this for the kids? You know what I mean? And so you just swallow it. And that's on me, you know? Takes two for sure. But I have to take responsibility for how I allowed those fears and insecurities to guide the way I communicated. Our communication is incredible. Wow. And listen, it's. Yeah. It's not always easy, even if it's the absolute best possible relationship I could ever be in with adjusting lives, you know? Well.

[Sage Steele]

And you've had a lot of adjustment. I mean, not even the blending of two families and, like, that happening relatively quickly, but, like, the season of life you've been in. I know we've talked about this a ton, but, like, to go. I don't even fully understand it because I haven't gotten into that world. But, like, to go from talking about sports your whole adult life to all of a sudden you're on, like, primetime news, giving your opinions on issues of, like, utmost importance that actually affect people's lives outside of, like, who they're betting on on a Sunday, that's a lot. Like, that's a. To me, from the outside watching you, like, that's heavy. So anytime you ever call me and you're like, I'm feeling all these things. I'm like, yeah, I think so. How do you. Even within the context of a relationship, too, how do you carry that without it weighing you down, like, because it doesn't turn off at the end of the day. Like, these are issues that are happening 247 and you can be called at any time, I imagine. And hey, we need you on this to talk about this issue. How do you. You're like, you have to be on a lot. And even just from the sports world. I know that. And this isn't like a, oh, poor me, it's so hard. But being on a lot is exhausting.

[Samantha Ponder]

But I didn't realize it was exhausting until I stepped away. Yeah. Have you felt that too?

[Sage Steele]

Like, I didn't know I had turned out. I had anxiety. I didn't even know I did because I had never been like, you can't normal my whole life. It was just like, you know, I always say I, I could never sit down on the inside. Like, I was just running at attention on the inside at all times. And these, this last year and a half is the first time I feel like maybe I've gotten a little too comfortable, but, like I could sit down on the inside. How are you figuring that out as you still are running? Like, you're doing a ton.

[Samantha Ponder]

I'm actually, I think, doing a worse job of it right now than ever. Because it's different. Sure. Because at our former employer at espn, like, I mean, the pressure is just absolutely nonstop. And in order to get there first of all the decades plus that it could take to get there and then to maintain and stay there, like, you cannot get off the hamster wheel. And you, I mean, in your downtime too, you're constantly researching in stats and you gotta keep track of all the other stories so you are fully prepared. Enough context. If something crazy comes up on your three hour NFL Live show on Sunday with the guy, like, you have to stay up and. And it created such structure for me. Like the chaos was within some awesome structure of having to be on air at a certain time every single day. So what I did leading up to that moment was very structured and had to be. And then a very structured television show for two live hours and then afterwards and then kids and dinner. Like it had to be. And not having that structure has been the absolute hardest thing since I left espn. Nothing else. That people might think it's the lack of structure because it was a recovery requirement or you are literally, you're 10 seconds late to your show, you're fired, you don't have a job. And so that's where I struggle now because I'm trying to figure out this. Do your own show and Create your own. Be an entrepreneur. Like what your husband's doing. Like, oh, my gosh, never wanted to. And here we are.

[Sage Steele]

Because I think that's what a lot of people in sports, various industries right now are thinking about. Like, look, I want to be my own boss. Yeah, I want to do my own thing. Like, the media landscape has changed so quickly, and you see these, like, success stories of people who have either gotten fired or stepped away and had all this success. But I imagine you've experienced inside of that success that it's not all. It's not all easy, you know, like, that being on your own and not having, you know, a big B boss in charge of you comes with its own challenges.

[Samantha Ponder]

It does things I had never had to think of. And I thought eventually I'd land at another network or do something like that and have people kind of telling me what to do. Because if you tell me what to do, I'm not gonna. Like, you know, we're gonna have conversations about it, but, like, you know, then I can go home and I don't think about it after the show's over, you know, and, no, this is all. It's all up to me. And I'm like, oh, you know, I didn't get this post done. Oh, my gosh, this is gonna cost. And the timing of our posts for all the shows. Oh, like, it's a constant thing.

[Sage Steele]

Is it more stressful?

[Samantha Ponder]

Yeah, it is for me now. I hope that that changes. At the same time, I could never, ever go back to that kind of structure and control where you truly cannot be yourself if you think the way we do on certain topics, like, I don't know, boys don't belong in girls, sports, like, basic stuff or basic science stuff.

[Sage Steele]

No, you're anti science. Remember, I was told by a reputable source.

[Samantha Ponder]

Facts. Facts according to whom? I don't.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah, don't ask questions. You're anti science.

[Samantha Ponder]

Exactly. The stories for the next show, we're just gonna just throw it all out there. I could never go back because I get to do. Oh, my gosh, we could never have done this. Like, this is where I'll get choked up again. Like, the ability to do this and be like, hey, I'm in New York. Can you come over? It's like, sure. Like, we've never been able to live the lives like that. And it doesn't. It's not knocking how it was because it was perfect for that time in our lives. We learned so much from it. But I could never go back. And frankly, like, My parents are having some health issues right now. Like, it is scary. You've dealt with so much. Your parents are sometimes in this country, sometimes not. Like, all over the place. I get to say, you know what? We're gonna cancel our shoot for tomorrow, which we did, so I could go home to. No, it's not home. Their home in Jacksonville, Florida. Tonight, my dad's in the hospital, and we're gonna. Damn it. We're gonna go stay, sit with him, and we're gonna be with him, and my kids are gonna join. We're gonna go to the hostel and see him. And, like, I'd be begging for vacation time at the last second. And again, this is a blessing, and I'm not ripping on that. I just could never go back, despite this being so hard and so scary, because there's no safety net. There's no parachute that's gonna come out. And to. Yeah. To feel. To know that it is literally up to me. And I also feel so blessed that I get to do it and think all the time. I think all the time about this, about meeting Dave, about being able to learn and be part of a presidential campaign. Something I never, ever wanted. I didn't think. And it just happens to. None of that would have happened if not for the good at espn. And there was mostly good. Yeah. And the bad at the end and the unfairness and choosing to stand up for myself. Yeah. And I remember thinking, I might have told you this, being on, you know, Trump Force One the night before and the morning of the election, you know, just over a year ago, and looking around as I'm sitting this close across from Donald Trump after his last rally on the way back to Palm beach, and I got choked up and my new friend Tulsi Gabbiter sitting back over here, and I thought, what if. What if I had stayed silent? None of this would be happening. There's just so many gifts in taking a chance on yourself and standing up and so many gifts. And when it's thrown and forced to you as well, I'm just like, Dave's the biggest part of it. So as we figure out this, you know, second marriage thing and some sensitivities around it, man, it's not happening. If I. If what happened in Dave's game had not gone, if. The bad stuff. The bad. All of it. The good, the bad. Can I tell you this real quick? I want this on record because I know how much you'll appreciate this. And there's certain things I'll tell you privately, because I Don't want to hurt or offend other people. But the fact that you and Christian made such an effort to come to our wedding was everything. There's been a lot of years on the phone talking about, you know, personal things and tears and all, but, like, I got to walk up the aisle again for a second time, again, thinking this might never happen. And an advantage of doing that a second time, too, is that when you're really young, maybe you don't. You're a young bride, and you're, like, all trying to make it all perfect. And I knew when I had my dad on my arm and I walked around the corner, I was like, oh, my gosh, everyone's standing. I forgot that that happened. But I knew before that I wanted to be very intentional and look around the crowd and to appreciate all these people who stood by me during crappy, scary, embarrassing, wonderful times. And you chose to be there. And I felt it, and I want to relive it, but I can't afford it. It was just so great. From the photographer to 8,000 roses, I can't do. But Sam, like to see my kids standing right behind me usually. And I think ideally, when you have kids, that's after you're married, usually, you know? And so this time, okay. My kids were there after a tough journey for them, too. And to have them standing behind me, to hear me take those vows to Dave, but most importantly, to hear Dave say what he said to their mother.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah.

[Samantha Ponder]

I'll never get over that blessing for them and for my parents to be part of that. So that's why I feel like I'll. I hope I'll always feel like I'm on my honeymoon and continue to learn and communicate. And this is the last thing I think I've learned and would advise. Gosh, we hug. Like, just hugs, you know, sounds so silly and cheesy, but, like, you're going through a stressful moment or a fear or frustration or happy. And, like, we just hug a lot.

[Sage Steele]

Did you grow up doing that? Because I didn't grow up. There were no hugs in my house. I'm new to the hugging life, Eric.

[Samantha Ponder]

I don't know if I believe that. Yeah, like, yes, but, like, from your partner.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah.

[Samantha Ponder]

And it's harder as life goes on, and especially if you're younger and you're having kids. This chaos. I remember. I've been there, and that's why, man, just hug. And I go back to that safe feeling where I just let down, and I didn't. Yeah, I didn't Ever realize the importance of. It's not sexual. It's literally like a teammate, and I can relax for the first time in my life.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah.

[Samantha Ponder]

I'm crazy, but I'm.

[Sage Steele]

We'll always be that. I love that feeling of, like, being allowed to be weak.

[Samantha Ponder]

Yes.

[Sage Steele]

You know, like. Cause God tells us that, like, when we're weak, he is strong. Like, that feeling of, like, almost like a little kid in their dad's arms. Like that. That feeling of weakness is actually where you get strength. Like, the ability to not have to. Especially, like, our generation of women coming up who were always. We were like the you go girl generation, you know? And, like, you can do this. You don't need a man, you know? And so everyone's, like, trying to pretend like, I don't need a man, you know? And I do think there is, like, something in that vulnerability that is really freeing when you can trust that, like, it's okay for me to be weak right now. I don't have to, like, keep it all together and, like, clinch jaw at all times like that. That's actually who I really am, is I am both weak and strong, and I don't have to just be one. But I wanted to say, before I forget, one of my favorite things about your wedding was that room of people you're talking about, like, looking around. The most interesting conversations were had that night because everyone, and I truly mean everyone in that room, was battle tested. Like, there wasn't anybody in there who hadn't been through some stuff. And I mean, like, serious. I mean, I remember looking over and seeing Tulsi Gabbard and thinking, like, if I would have told Sage a year ago, we're gonna be sitting at her wedding in Nashville to this amazing man. You know, there's the Director of National Intelligence over there. There's, you know, sports broadcasting people, people from all over.

[Samantha Ponder]

Riley Gaines. Yeah, Riley Gaines, who inspired us to be stronger and to speak up. And she was about to have little Margot. She was like, you know, due in a week. And you're so right. I didn't think of it that way.

[Sage Steele]

It was like the island of misfit toys. We all gathered together. Everyone was saying to it, like, I get it. I understand. Because everybody had said things that you're not supposed to say or you're not allowed to. Like. I think there's never been a larger group of people who have experienced viewpoint discrimination, to use a legal term, like that. That really was a incredible group of people that you brought together, which isn't surprising because Everywhere I go with you, I'm like, my friends.

[Samantha Ponder]

It was just such a blessing.

[Sage Steele]

It was really cool.

[Samantha Ponder]

Such a blessing that I got to do that, to have them in a room. And yes, we always say this, but never again. Like, with the ages of people and just life, we will never have those people in a room together again. And there's so much God. There was so much God that was part of that day. And, like, when you were on my show over the summer, like, what you shared and biblical things and what has gotten you through, you've inspired me in that way with your faith. And you and I grew up very different in that way. Like, we went to church and was Catholic, and I'm proud Catholic, et cetera. But, like, we never knew the Bible. We never knew Scriptures. It's just different. It's something I'm actually struggling with and trying to learn more about. But, like, you are so wise in that way and shared it. And that is how you really explained how you've been able to handle what happened to you at espn, et cetera. We were very intentional in trying to make sure that faith was a part of the ceremony and the day and the weekend. And it was super cool to, like, just say, this is who we are. And I knew everybody in that room obviously, like, was happy for that part of it. You know, it's interesting. Chris Harrison, who, another amazing former Bachelor host, the officiant of our wedding, and it's like he was canceled by ABC and thrown off the Bachelor, and he's the one that said, I have an attorney for you to call. Like, this whole. He's the reason why. Oh, my gosh, so many things. And it was amazing that he said right before the wedding, he's like, you know, of all the hundreds of weddings I've done, you are the first couple that has asked me to implement faith into the ceremony. Wow. And that hit me hard. And I was like, oh, that's so cool. I'm like, how?

[Sage Steele]

Yeah, I don't know if that's cool, actually.

[Samantha Ponder]

Yeah. Yeah. And, you know, we would have gotten married in the Catholic Church, but they don't want you if you don't get your marriage annulled. And that's a whole other conversation for another day. I hate about the Catholic Church, that part of it. But it led to this blessing where Chris could also use his beliefs and faith, which he has kept private. You know, so there's just so many gifts and so many things, because the.

[Sage Steele]

Good stuff comes out of the hard stuff.

[Samantha Ponder]

Stuff.

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[Sage Steele]

Yes, I. I look at my life and I'm like, basically, anything good that ever happened to me came out of something hard. And yet we spend our whole lives trying to avo avoid the hard stuff. Like, it actually doesn't make sense, you know, that's the perspective. Change I've had over the last couple years is like teaching my kids to like, for lack of a better phrase, like, embrace the suck. Because something good is coming after that and not like in a cheesy Oprah, like, everything's going to be amazing. Like, no, really, when you're tested in whatever. Even if, like, for me, I know a lot of the testing I've experienced have been from my own bad decisions. Not like, somebody did something terrible to me, like, no, I got myself in a mess. Like, now what? But the dependence I've learned that I can have on God in those moments. Like, that's when I really see it. It's not when you're doing well and you're on SportsCenter and everybody's telling you how awesome you are. Like, that's, I think, why the Bible talks about how hard it is for a rich man to get into heaven. Because you're so distracted. Like, you're so distracted by all the good stuff. And you start thinking, like, I did something to get here. And when it's stripped away, you actually get to see reality. Like, we are dust, we are nothing. Like, every breath is a gift. And when your perspective on that changes and you start seeing, like, man, I'm so grateful. Like, I can genuinely say I'm so grateful I was fired. I'm so grateful that I'm just homeschooling my kids, you know, and being grateful for the lessons you learn through all the hard stuff. Because that's where the good stuff comes. I've seen it in your life, I know, from a distance, and I've definitely seen it in mine and yours.

[Samantha Ponder]

But that's the thing is also whether it's, you know, the devastation initially of being canceled slash fired slash all the hate that Comes or a new beginning and a beautiful start and a marriage like, our kids are watching all of it.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah, it's terrifying.

[Samantha Ponder]

And it is terrifying. However, there's so many gifts in that as well. Because not only do my kids like, they are getting to see a better mom, a better me, and the way I'm being loved is doing what is teaching them.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah, sure.

[Samantha Ponder]

What it's absolutely supposed to be. And their bar is rising. You know, divorce, all that stuff sucks. But, like, now they're 19, 21 and 23. His kids are 17 and 19. And for them to get to see, you know. Yeah. The journey to get here and then the love, like, and the joy and the hugs, they get to see that. They also get to see, like, what we were talking about earlier and their mom saying, no, Scout, I trust you. You can do this. I've given you the tools, I've given you the examples. I've shown you. This is good, this is bad. Run, stay, whatever it is. That's why all this crap. I shouldn't say it's all such a gift because they are going to be much better. That's what I'm most excited about, is for them to get to witness all that. Just with you and I have gone through as their mothers, I am so confident that they're gonna be so much better off. Did I tell you this? I said to Quinn once, and then I was like, that's kind of clever. I'm gonna use it on all of them. Not sure if it'll work, but talking about some deep things. And I said to her, please don't waste my pain. And it isn't a woe is me. It's not that. It's just like, please take this example. And although yours might not be exactly the same, use it and choose differently or take a breath, whatever it is, like, don't waste it. Be better because of my mistake or experience. And that's why I know that you wouldn't change a thing either. None of it.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah, I mean, I would probably change some of my own personal screw ups and decisions, but I definitely wouldn't change the things that I see as God still working on me through discipline, through things falling away. I just trust that that's all a part of the plan. But the scary thing about parenting is that you can say anything to your kid. You could say all the right things. I mean, I think about this in homeschooling all the time. I can prepare everything just right to say it a certain way. And at the end of the Day, what they remember is how you lived. I don't really care what that person said to me. I watched how my mom handled when my siblings were annoying and got super impatient, or how my mom talked about other people when her friends were over, or how my mom wasn't kind to my dad that night, or all those little things that they're observing day in and day out, that's what forms their worldview. It's not me being like, read this verse. That's good. And you still do that. But they're really just watching to see how you live and the accountability that that creates. Especially now, because my kids are with me 24 7. There's no hiding, right? Like, I can't. Good days, bad days, there's. There's just no way to hide who you really are. But that accountability has been so good because to your point, I think they are able to see, like, okay, that was why it was important to me even when I was fired. Like, how do my kids see me handling losing my job?

[Samantha Ponder]

Yeah.

[Sage Steele]

Like, do they see everything crumble? Because if everything crumbles, what does that tell them? I actually believe it's like, God's not in control. It's really about me and how much money I make and what other people think of me and, you know, so I had to think about that stuff. Like, they're watching this. Like, how can I be authentic but still model for them? Like, God is not thrown off by someone calling you up and ending your job. Like, this is not. He's not like, oh, no, what's happening? Or by whatever challenges you're facing and trying to model that for kids while you're still trying to fit. I mean, sometimes I feel like a kid myself. I know I don't look it when I look in the mirror, but I still feel like it.

[Samantha Ponder]

I say that all the time.

[Sage Steele]

I'm like, so immature.

[Samantha Ponder]

How is this not.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah, no, you look really old. That's what I was thinking when I see you. I was like, that lady.

[Samantha Ponder]

Girlfriend. Girlfriend.

[Sage Steele]

Don't even start with everybody thinks when lazy.

[Samantha Ponder]

Don't even start with me. Okay, I'm gonna. We need to do this weekly because I need more Samantha Ponder time. I'm going to. I'm gonna yell at you as we end.

[Sage Steele]

Oh, no. See, I don't hear anybody. Since I'm not on social media now, I don't hear old people yelling at me.

[Samantha Ponder]

Quit social media. Is this a permanent thing?

[Sage Steele]

I don't know. You wanna hear what happened Shortly? I'll say it quickly. I was at a Knicks game the other day with a friend who was really nice to invite me to come with her. And she's, like, fabulous in every way. Okay. Has an amazing life, amazing family, and she has, like, a lightness about her that I just really love. And you can tell when you're around someone that's not just, like, caring. I'm not saying she doesn't have stress and stuff, but super pleasant to be around and friendly. And I don't know how it came up. I said something social media related, and she was like, it was the best thing I did. I got off it. I think she said, like, three years ago. And she said. What I realized was, I have this amazing life. Why am I feeling, you know, less than about my life or something like that? Because I'm comparing all day long, and I had this realization. The problem isn't that I'm comparing my life to one person's, you know, kind of all naturally do that growing up to the kid in your class who's smarter than you or the kid who's faster than you. You compare on social media, I was comparing my life to a conglomerate of hundreds, sometimes thousands of people. Like the girl living the single life in Paris and the mom, you know, baking bread every morning somewhere in Texas. And, you know, just all these lives combined into one, which is not a real person. That's like an AI version of life.

[Samantha Ponder]

Yes.

[Sage Steele]

And so constantly feeling like I wasn't doing enough, I wasn't measuring up. I. So I've only been off it for a few weeks now.

[Samantha Ponder]

This is not like, how does it feel? Amazing.

[Sage Steele]

I told Christian the other day, like, now that I'm just comparing myself to real people, I'm really grateful for my life. I'm feeling good about. It's like, back to what's real. Especially with all the AI stuff happening right now. If you can come back to real people, get my life kind of felt. And I know it wasn't actually in the grand scheme of things, but my. My life felt, like, big and heavy for most of my 20s and 30s. And now I'm like, I want. I want my life to feel small. Like, I just want my people. I want to know these people well. I want to work on my family, my sin, my struggles, my issues, and stop worrying about everybody else's, you know, stuff and telling other people what to do. And, oh, no, what will these people say when I post this?

[Samantha Ponder]

Or what?

[Sage Steele]

I just. I don't know. I wasn't good at managing it. So good for You. I'm new. I'm still trying to figure it out, but so far, so good.

[Samantha Ponder]

No, that's.

[Sage Steele]

So the only people that yell at me are my children. And now you. What did you.

[Samantha Ponder]

What did you want to say? I'm not going. I'm gonna ask a question before I yell, and maybe I won't have to yell. We'll see what the answer is. Oh, no.

[Sage Steele]

I'm scared.

[Samantha Ponder]

What's the last thing you did for you? Oh, besides go to a Knicks game? Like, literally, Samantha time for me.

[Sage Steele]

You know what I did for me? My kids were involved, but just because they were there. We were doing school the other day, and it was one of those days where, like, everybody's butt was allergic to a seat, and, like, no one would sit down. Everybody's walking all around, and it was like, you know, you're getting those moments in terms of modeling where I'm like, I'm gonna lose it. Like, I just. I was getting close, and I had this. And you'll understand this because you know how I grew up. But I was like, you know what I need right now? And I went, and I was like, alexa, play rapper's Delight. And all of a sudden, my kid's like a hip a hop. No way. All of us, get up.

[Samantha Ponder]

Alexa, stop. Oh, sorry.

[Sage Steele]

I told you that we were about to see you dance right now, my son. We were so. I mean, thank God. No, actually, our neighbors probably saw. They definitely heard. We said, that song is, what, like, 17 minutes long?

[Samantha Ponder]

Yeah.

[Sage Steele]

So long. My kids had never heard that song before. And we danced in our kitchen slash living room for that and then played it again. It was. This sounds so dumb, but it was, like, the most fun I've had in years. These kids, I looked over and I was like, oh, they dance like their dad. But just kidding. I'm really meant to.

[Samantha Ponder]

Amazing.

[Sage Steele]

But it was so. It was just, like, pure fun.

[Samantha Ponder]

Yes.

[Sage Steele]

I love that. That kind of stuff where I'm like, oh, this is the good stuff. You know that. Is it Kenny Chesney or Tim McGraw? I can't remember. Kenny's gonna hate me for this. But that sings that the Good Stuff song. Do you know what I'm talking about? And it keeps talking about, like, how that's the good stuff is the. Like he says, first long kiss on the second date. Your mom is all worried when you get up, get home late like that, Dropping the ring and the spaghetti plate. Like, the basic stuff of life. The, like, dancing with your kids, going on a bike ride. Like, it it sounds so, so cheesy. And I understand that people are like, okay, cool. But now that my life has simplified and, like, really gotten down to, like, we're down to the studs, you know? And it's so good. Like, those are the things I think of when you think, like, that was for me. I get to sit and watch my kids have, like, the best time looking insane. And I'm sure I did, too. It was. That's the stuff that I'm gonna miss when they're. When they're out of the house.

[Samantha Ponder]

Absolutely, you will. And I can't yell at you then because that's. And those silly moments. My kids remember that now, too, and crush me for my dancing. It's like, wait, aren't you half black? Like, what has happened? I'm like, dad, his fault. Very weak, black jeans, apparently. I don't know. My mom was the voted best dancer in high school. So, like, I don't know what. All right, yeah, but the fun moments, the simple moments. Yes. I also think you do a great job because you walk. You walk every day. I love when you post your pictures, or you used to post pictures on social media while walking through Central park and appreciating the beauty. Like, those little things are for you to clear your mind, et cetera. I only say that because, once again, with the kids watching, it took until I was 50 for my kids to see me taking time for me. And when it goes back to we hope they're better than us, it doesn't mean I need to be, you know, getting massages and mani pedis three times a week or, like, can I just.

[Sage Steele]

Say, I hate that? Do you like getting a manicure?

[Samantha Ponder]

I hate it. It's a waste of my time.

[Sage Steele]

You can't use your hands. You're stuck like this for so long. You cannot do anything for hours. And I never once, not one time, have gotten out of there and been like, great.

[Samantha Ponder]

And I have to tip you anyway.

[Sage Steele]

No disrespect to the people who work in that industry. I'm sure there's no.

[Samantha Ponder]

They don't like me. They don't like me either. They're talking trash about me when I'm sitting there anyway. I just can't understand it.

[Sage Steele]

This is like a gift to future husbands for my girls. I've been teaching them to paint their nails really well when they're young. I'm like, do you know the money you're gonna save for yourself and your future family doing this at a so much.

[Samantha Ponder]

Sorry, that was an aside. No, I'm so glad you did. And look, this is, like, I look so trashy right now. I tried to do gold for holidays, and now I'm hiding my hands. It's what it is. But they see if we don't take that walk that you do, if we don't take that time, if, you know. And I've been threatening to make her meet me down in Florida, and then I'm never there, so it's kind of hard to do. So now I'm like a total hypocrite here. But at the day, end of the. The day, like, I want them to see mom, your kids, because they're incredible doing that, too. And hopefully Christian does it, too. I think it's super important. I just didn't realize it until. And then at the end, do you know? And I'll talk after this. The other day, Quinn, she's like, mom, I have a birthday surprise for you. And I'm like, what? Like, usually my gifts, Christmas, birthday, Mother's Day, whatever are, you know, from the allowance money I have given them, right? So I'm like, thank you for letting. It was a total surprise. And it was a massage at this incredible spa outside of Nashville. And she didn't give me anything except the address. And she's like, be there at this time. And I walked in like, what are you here for? I'm like, I don't know.

[Sage Steele]

I don't. I do not know.

[Samantha Ponder]

And it was the best moment. Not because the massage was awesome, but because my little girl thought about that. She's like, mom, you never take time for yourself.

[Sage Steele]

Oh, wow.

[Samantha Ponder]

So, like, they want us to do that. Sure. And I didn't realize that either, because go, go, go. Do take care of them and the husband and the bosses and the neighbors and the dog and the puking kids, apparently in our house and not ourselves.

[Sage Steele]

Because you're modeling for them their future. Like, this is. I've used this so many times, and this is maybe a bad way to live, but I've thought, like, what. When I'm making a decision, I think, what would I want my daughter to do? Like, when she's an adult, what I want her to do? And that's been, like, a good guide up until this point.

[Samantha Ponder]

So, so true. And you are crushing it. I said this before. The most special kids at that age in particular that I've ever met. And when Quinn. When we got to hang out on the Fourth of July, when Quinn hung out with your kids, she was like, mom, I go, I know. That's goals for you, Honey, it is. No.

[Sage Steele]

When they were like, can. Can auntie Sage be our mom and Quinn be our big sister? I'm like, I don't know how we would make that work. I'm gonna try not to be offended right now.

[Samantha Ponder]

But when would she want them? She's like, mom, I wanna have kids now.

[Sage Steele]

Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.

[Samantha Ponder]

Back to the conversation about the order that we hope things go in. You're crushing it. And we need. We do need more of this, though. Yes. Because every time, like, you speak to my heart.

[Sage Steele]

Well, you know, I'm very busy, and I am not. I'm not able to fit you in my schedule. She's like, can you come now? I'm like, yeah, I'm there.

[Samantha Ponder]

Right there.

[Sage Steele]

I'm walking there right now. A part of me was like, is she kind of hoping that I'm going to be like, oh, sorry. And I just wrote back immediately, yes.

[Samantha Ponder]

Through rocks and crops.

[Sage Steele]

Oh, my gosh. I can't text you stuff anymore.

[Samantha Ponder]

No. I'm gonna blow you up.

[Sage Steele]

You're not safe for me, Sid. To take this full circle.

[Samantha Ponder]

Oh, so full circle. I love you.

[Sage Steele]

I love you.

[Samantha Ponder]

And I'm gonna be back and stalk you soon.

[Sage Steele]

Yes. And steal your children in these scary streets. Come on back.

[Samantha Ponder]

Come on back.

[Sage Steele]

We'll be here, I think.

[Samantha Ponder]

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[Drew]

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