Pastor Lorenzo Sewell | The Sage Steele Show

Summary

Podcast Summary: Pastor Lorenzo Sewell | The Sage Steele Show

Podcast Information:

• Title: The Sage Steele Show
• Host/Author: Sage Steele Productions
• Episode: Pastor Lorenzo Sewell
• Release Date: July 2, 2025
• Description: Hosted by former ESPN anchor Sage Steele, the show features deep, personal conversations with a diverse range of guests to enlighten, entertain, and engage listeners.

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Introduction to Pastor Lorenzo Sewell

[00:57 - 02:31]

Sage Steele introduces Pastor Lorenzo Sewell, highlighting his extraordinary transformation from a gang leader in Detroit to the head of a large, influential church. Lorenzo's unique journey culminated in delivering the invocation at President Donald Trump's inauguration in January 2025. Sage emphasizes Lorenzo's resilience in standing up for his beliefs despite racial prejudices.

Notable Quote:

"His story really, really is incredible. The way he chose to stand up for himself, his beliefs, despite being told that he couldn't think that because of the color of his skin."
— Sage Steele [00:57]

Hosting President Trump at His Church

[02:31 - 05:08]

Lorenzo recounts the unexpected turnout when President Trump visited his church in Detroit, a city historically dominated by Democratic voters. He was surprised to see a significant number of Black Americans passionately supporting Trump, contrary to what the media portrayed. Lorenzo attributes the turnout to Trump's genuine engagement with the community.

Notable Quote:

"I believe people showed up that day because he showed up."
— Pastor Lorenzo Sewell [03:56]

Additional Quote:

"Trump took the time to do it. He just wants me to be myself."
— Pastor Lorenzo Sewell [05:08]

Political Views and Black Community Engagement

[05:08 - 10:26]

Lorenzo expresses his critical stance toward the Democratic Party, accusing it of systemic corruption and election fraud that adversely affects Black communities, particularly in Detroit. He challenges the notion that Black Americans inherently support Democrats, advocating instead for a revival of Black support for the Republican Party based on historical affiliations and shared values.

Notable Quote:

"The Democratic Party is a demonic party. Anytime a person can say to an individual, you can celebrate what God hates. Anytime a person can say to an individual, you are a part of Margaret Singer's God of Moloch, you're worshiping the God of Moloch by sacrificing these babies."
— Pastor Lorenzo Sewell [21:59]

Additional Quote:

"So why do I need to not be myself to try to be accepted by a political party?"
— Pastor Lorenzo Sewell [09:12]

Personal Struggles and Past Life as a Gang Leader

[51:35 - 59:31]

Pastor Lorenzo shares his tumultuous past as a gang leader and drug dealer in Detroit. He vividly describes his descent into crime, the pressure to remain loyal to his gang despite the moral conflicts, and his eventual turning point through a transformative spiritual experience. This pivotal moment led him to abandon his life of crime for faith and community service.

Notable Quote:

"I was an evil man... I was a street pharmacist... I gave my life to Jesus."
— Pastor Lorenzo Sewell [53:30]

Additional Quote:

"I went from being a dope dealer to a hope dealer."
— Pastor Lorenzo Sewell [58:13]

Forgiveness and Family Challenges

[60:24 - 68:11]

Lorenzo delves into his painful relationship with his father, who was incarcerated for murder. He discusses the deep emotional scars left by his father's actions and his ongoing struggle with forgiveness. Despite the immense hurt, Lorenzo emphasizes the importance of faith in overcoming personal grievances and fostering reconciliation.

Notable Quote:

"I continuously forgive my dad. So now we're in a position where a state rep has allowed...I am in the process of seeing him."
— Pastor Lorenzo Sewell [66:10]

Additional Quote:

"I'm trying to get him to see me. And this is why I say you're not to see my dad. You know what? I need to be obedient to Jesus."
— Pastor Lorenzo Sewell [66:10]

Mental Health and Leadership

[68:11 - 79:18]

Lorenzo addresses the crucial topic of mental health, particularly within the Black community. He openly shares his own battles with suicidal thoughts and emphasizes the necessity of vulnerability and authenticity in leadership. Lorenzo advocates for breaking the taboo surrounding mental health, encouraging individuals to seek help and support.

Notable Quote:

"I have struggled with mental health, specifically suicidal thoughts. So I realized that people...that lead mental health organizations, it wasn't until they came out and began to talk about mental health...that I felt the authority to talk about the mental health issues that I've had in my own life."
— Pastor Lorenzo Sewell [75:32]

Additional Quote:

"I believe people want to be touched with our weaknesses...leaders that are vulnerable."
— Pastor Lorenzo Sewell [74:39]

Closing Remarks and Future Goals

[83:07 - 89:14]

In his final segments, Lorenzo reflects on his mission to uplift his community through faith and political activism. He underscores the importance of embracing one's vulnerabilities and remaining steadfast in one's beliefs. Lorenzo outlines his aspirations to run for political office to advocate for fair elections and greater representation of Black Republicans, aiming to shift the political landscape in favor of his community.

Notable Quote:

"This is about somebody who can change anybody because sometimes I feel like I'm just a nobody. That's what all this is about... the lamb of God who was slain, Jesus Christ."
— Pastor Lorenzo Sewell [83:07]

Additional Quote:

"If I can show you my humanity...I struggle with that too."
— Pastor Lorenzo Sewell [74:24]

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Key Themes and Insights

1. Transformation and Redemption: Lorenzo’s journey from gang leadership to pastoral work exemplifies profound personal transformation through faith.
2. Political Advocacy: He passionately advocates for Black Americans to reconsider their political affiliations, urging a return to Republican values based on historical context.
3. Faith and Mental Health: Emphasizing the intersection of faith and mental well-being, Lorenzo highlights the importance of addressing mental health openly within the community.
4. Forgiveness and Healing: His struggle with forgiving his father underscores the theme of personal healing and the role of faith in overcoming deep-seated pain.
5. Vulnerability in Leadership: Lorenzo champions the idea that authentic, vulnerable leadership fosters genuine connections and effective community engagement.

Conclusion

Pastor Lorenzo Sewell's appearance on The Sage Steele Show offers a compelling narrative of transformation, faith, and unwavering commitment to his community. Through his candid discussions, he challenges prevailing political norms, shares personal struggles, and advocates for mental health awareness, all while maintaining a steadfast dedication to his faith and leadership principles. This episode not only sheds light on Lorenzo's remarkable life story but also serves as a call to action for listeners to embrace authenticity, seek forgiveness, and actively engage in shaping a just and equitable society.

Transcript

[Sage Steele]

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[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

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[Sage Steele]

See for [e-mail] so for this episode of the Sage Deal show, wait till you meet Pastor Lorenzo Sewell. You might recognize him actually because he went from being the leader of a gang in Detroit to the leader of a massive church in the Motor City with thousands and thousands of followers, which then led him to the ultimate stage, giving the invocation at President Trump's inauguration back in January. His story really, really is incredible. The way he chose to stand up for himself, his beliefs, despite being told that he couldn't think that because of the color of his skin. Pastor Lorenzo Sewell, the focus of this week's episode of the Sage Deal show. Enjoy. Honestly, Pastor Lorenzo Sewell from 180 Church in Detroit, Michigan. Is it okay that I say Detroit? Absolutely it's Detroit. Yes, but it's Detroit. Oh heck no, we're not saying detoit fine for you. I want to start first with what I saw that day in Detroit. And yeah, you have soon to be President Trump at that time a year ago at the table with you and others and I was like, wow, he's in Detroit. I didn't know the statistics that there hadn't been a Republican go there since 1980 Ronald Reagan. What was the feeling in the room? Who else was in the audience that we couldn't see?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah, you know Sage, if we would have bet, if you would have said, okay, Pastor, President Trump's coming to your church. How many black People are going to be there. I'd say, okay, you have me. That's one. Now, my children are blazing. Right. Because my wife's Asians. But I still would have counted them.

[Sage Steele]

They're like Tiger woods, for those of you questioning. Yes.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

So, like, my three children, me, that's four. And that's it. Like, I would have never thought out of a sanctuary that sits about 600. But when you have the media there, they're moving stuff around. We had about 400 people there. If you would have told me over 70% of the people there would have been black Americans. If you would have told me that 50 black Americans would have been to his right. 50 black Americans would have been to his left yelling his name. Trump. Trump. Sage. I'm a pastor. I'm in a church. I'm thinking, look, we don't yell Jesus that way. Hold on for a second, guy. Like, we got a time out here.

[Sage Steele]

Yes.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Singing Happy Birthday to him. I would have never thought in a million years he had resonated with black Americans that way. But remember, he just went through that lawfare, those 34 felonies. Right. All that was going on. He hadn't been to Michigan.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

So for that to happen, I felt he has an effect on black Americans in a way that I just never would have thought.

[Sage Steele]

Why do you think they showed up that day?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

I believe people showed up that day because he showed up.

[Sage Steele]

He took the time to do it. Yeah.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Simple. I just believe people came because we were in the community. I mean, we're talking to people. We're walking down Grand River. I mean, people can't. In our context, 80% of the kids can read. We have the highest zip code where young people are coming out of homes because they're family, has mental illness. We have human trafficking literally right next door to our church. The only place in the city of Detroit where there's open human trafficking, where the cops come to us and actually ask us to partner with them to pray for street walkers. Right. Women that are being trafficked. So poverty. Are you kidding me? 3,500 foreclosures in the city of Detroit. We have an epidemic of poverty happening in our city. So for him to come. I was telling people President Trump would come. They were laughing at me. They're like, yeah, right. They just couldn't believe it. And they were sitting in the first couple of rows, just starstruck, like, he. He's really here. He was the antithesis of everything the media said he was.

[Sage Steele]

Yes, yes. That's what I always Tell people when they ask as well. Is down to earth and curious and genuine. And he does not care about color.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Right.

[Sage Steele]

He doesn't. And people get mad. I don't see color. No. Actually that's not what I lead with. Sure, you see it literally. But it's about the human being that you are. And I believe that's how he is as well. And when you say that he didn't back off, you know, when people were kind of rushing him and wanting his autograph. I mean, he has New York City. He has been around black people his entire life. Hired thousands because they're good workers. Those people that he hired. Just like the white people he hired or the Asian people he hired.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Absolutely.

[Sage Steele]

He does not care. And I think that's what I struggle with so much. When people call him a racist, it's low hanging fruit. And it's what the media has put out there. That's not what he is. And him going there was genuine.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah. I will never forget how he asked for prayer.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

For me, I felt like will his team ask me not to be myself. And this is when he became the most authentic man that I know. This. This is by far when he became not only politically the greatest president of all time, but on a personal level, me just discerning what type of individual he is. Remember, I am in a Democratic stronghold, super majority until we flip the house. Actually, we flipped the house last. Like there is no other state of the union that flipped the house. We flipped the house to Republican. But think about this for a second. I have personal friends that pastor 40,000 people that the Democrats say, you can't say Jesus. So you got so you. So this is all in the back of my mind. And when I prayed in the name of Jesus and then go to the RNC with no speech prepared.

[Sage Steele]

What?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

No speech prepared.

[Sage Steele]

I didn't know that.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Remember he had the millimeter miracle a couple days.

[Sage Steele]

Well, yes, it was two days prior, but we prayed. But you had no speech prepared when you took that stage. I had no speech prepared in front of. I mean there were probably 50,000 right there.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Totally.

[Sage Steele]

And then 2.3 millions watching across the globe. But you didn't have a speech prepared.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

23.8 million people listen that Thursday night where he accepted his nomination and I didn't have a speech prepared. You know why I had to come. I was shaken. Right. It's not like I was. I didn't feel fear. It's not like I did. I wasn't. I didn't feel like some butterflies A little bit, right? I mean, you look out. I mean, it's your advisors and I mean, you see every media outlet and I didn't have any.

[Sage Steele]

That stage is.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

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[Sage Steele]

Massive.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Oh, it's huge. And I didn't have anything written down. Oh, my gosh. But I'm going to tell you why a lot of people don't know this part of it. When he came to my church and I felt the confidence to pray in the name of Jesus, no one on his team remember, I was all over the country praying at these different rallies, and no one ever pulled me aside and said, hey, by the way, tone, the Jesus thing now, I mean, can you, like, you know, I'm loud. You know, I'm loud. So it's like, can you calm down a little? So when I get up there and I literally preached for eight minutes, I preached about Jesus, Sage. I thought I was going to get arrested. And at that moment, it confirmed what I saw when he came to Detroit, that he just wants me to be myself. If I want to glorify Jesus, I can glorify Jesus. And for me, that's one of the reasons why, when I talk to black pastors who are Democrat, I ask them, why is it that when you are on a Democrat stage, they tell you not to use the name of Jesus? Why do you have to not be yourself?

[Sage Steele]

Yeah, what do they say?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Well, they say, well, you know, it's because it's all inclusive. It's supposed to be for everybody. And for me, I need to be authentically myself because I believe that's when Jesus presence and his power. I don't believe God makes copycats. Right. I believe that he makes us fearfully and wonderfully, all of us. Why do I need to not be myself to try to be accepted by a political party? And being in the Republican camp, I've never been told at one time, even when I've said very harsh things like the Republican Party started to free slaves, but yet they're like a father who forgot about their first child, how they have not come back, even when I've said things like that. I've never been told. You shouldn't have said that. You know, I was at the RNC yesterday in Washington very being very challenging about a court case that we have right now about election fraud. And the lawyers are just. They're just receiving what I had to say. What's the point? The point is President Donald Trump, being the leader of the free world and being the leader of the Republican Party allows people like me to be myself. And I feel like I have to code switch or I need to be this way because you want me to be that way. I can be authentically, Lorenzo.

[Sage Steele]

So you felt that pressure beforehand with other people throughout your life until, I mean, from the political perspective?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Totally. And not just that being. Being the only black man typically in the pwi, primarily white institution, being in church, you know, being a part of larger ministries where I would be asked to do certain things, certain ways. In terms of the way I present preach, you know, my preaching style is a little bit different. You know, I don't use notes. I preach with passion. And because of that, sometimes people would say, you know, you don't. You don't need to do that. Can you tone that down a little bit? So I have felt that pressure in different kinds context. Never with President Trump.

[Sage Steele]

So telling. It's so telling. You know, I have 16 different directions to go from here. You're giving me so much material right away, and I knew you wouldn't without a note. You know, when I have watched the Democrat Party, what they've done to your city, I mean, maybe the best slash, worst example is what has happened in the city of Detroit over the last 50 years since it's been blue. Right. Chicago, look at San Francisco, look at Los Angeles. Right now. New York, I mean, it is. It is devastating. Philadelphia, devastating to watch, and it makes me quite angry. And in the meantime, black people have continued to vote. The same people in that have helped destroy their cities and destroy their families.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Sure.

[Sage Steele]

Why?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

You know, Sage, before President Trump came to my church, I would have said black people vote Democrat because they're black. That's what I would have said when President Trump came to my church. I will never forget this moment. Actually, this is probably outside of me meeting Jesus, outside of marriage, my amazing children. This ranks as the next most powerful moment in my life, the moment I'm about to share with you right now, to answer your question. I mean, President Trump comes to your church, you got a line outside. I'm trying to organize everything. I get a tap on the shoulder. I turn around, Ramon Jackson says to me, I have proof the election was stolen. No, you got it. You just gotta. You're in the hood, Sage. I'm in the hood. Come on.

[Sage Steele]

Yes, you are.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Come on. In the hood. Hood. You, another black man, my contemporary, are telling me you have proof the election was stolen. And I'm like, how can you prove that? Come meet me at church. So we're sitting down the next day, which was Father's Day, Remember, President Trump came on the 15th. It's 16th. It's Father's Day. His birthday's on the 14th. We're sitting there. He said, pastor, I moved out of the city of Detroit. I moved to Ohio. When I moved to Ohio, I have proof that the state of Michigan voted for me illegally through a driver's license transaction. Because I was one of those guys that cried on January 6th. I was one of those guys who felt like, although our country. Four million people showed up. Although our country said the election was stolen, no one ever had any proof, right? You had 60 court cases. You had Dominion suing. Fox News just sued Mike Lindell. You had Rudy Giuliani lose his law license, get a lien for $140 million, literally begging for two rings, right? So, like, you had no proof. So now I have a poor black man looking me in my eyes, telling me, pastor, not only me, but I am going to bring you people from our community that are going to look you in the eye and tell you that the election was stolen. That's why our communities look the way they do. The Democrats cheat to steal. They steal our resources. They just stole $340 million of HUD dollars in Detroit. 108 loans, illegal municipal bonds over taxation. They tax our church. So, Sage, you can't make this up in the city of Detroit right now, if you have a church or a commercial building, the mayor and the city council, which is all Democrat, black, our mayor happens to be white. We believe he's cheated, and we have proof of that, that his votes were illegal. The people that never voted get voted for illegally. So he says, you know what, Pastor? You got a church. I can't text you, but this is what I am going to do. Every time it rains, wrap your mind around this. Every single time it rains, we're going to charge you. We're going to. We're going to charge you because your parking lot's too big. And you know what? That rain that falls down into the drain, It's a fee. What it's called. I'm not joking. It's called a water drainage fee. So black people, Democrats first said, Lt. Garland Gilchrist, when he ran for the clerk, he said that there was cheating. Democrats said it first before President Trump when he said there was cheating. When he lost in his election, guess what? He became the lieutenant governor. Can you imagine that? So he goes from losing second highest position in the state. Another instance where Victoria Harris, she ran for Wayne county prosecutor, she said, they're shitty. Guess what happened? They made her the assistant prosecutor in Washington county, which is one of the biggest counties in Michigan. So think about that, Sage. Think about that for a second. You lose politically, you say there's cheating. If you're a Democrat, they exalt you, you lose politically, you say there's cheating. President Trump, they shoot you. Look what happened in Butler.

[Sage Steele]

Yes.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

So they cheat to steal. That's what happens in our communities. So the reason why the Democrat communities look the way they do, it's because black people's votes don't even count. They're being voted for. We have the proof, we have the evidence. We have a case right now in the sixth Circuit Court of Appeals where people, yeah, right now we're in the 6th Circuit Court of Appeals where we're like, look, we want to go to oral argument. Let us go to oral argument. So the state of Michigan can explain, how can people become registered without them being there? Can you imagine that?

[Sage Steele]

Exactly.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Can you imagine in America where our birthright, we literally wake up presupposing that the beauty of our democracy is I can cast my vote. And it's true. But what happens when people vote for you are sweet. Your vote illegally. That's what's happening in the city of.

[Sage Steele]

Detroit and it has been for so long. I think I'm glad you're bringing this to light. And it's certainly making more and more headlines now.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Sure.

[Sage Steele]

People like me have always suspected cheating. Never to this level, though for me, in 2020, I saw enough videos online and then magically all the booths went down and the voting machines went down in Maricopa county and Phoenix, Arizona, and for hours and hours. And then, oh, sorry, it's closed now. Like, you gotta be an idiot, in my opinion, to not at least acknowledge that things didn't smell right. Didn't pass that smell test. Right.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah.

[Sage Steele]

And then I see. However, along with that, traditionally, I think it's safe to say most black Americans don't believe in abortion.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Sure.

[Sage Steele]

Traditionally based on religion, culture and the South. And from a moral perspective, why do you think so many have chosen to overlook that and to completely ignore. To me, it's almost like a genocide that has gone on, especially in these big cities where in New York City last year, I believe there are more black babies aborted than born. And in the meantime, if you're a black republican in a black community, the names you are called are disgusting. That's the nicest way to put it. So why are morals and values cast aside to stay true to this blue vote that has done nothing but hurt this community? Question for you. Do you have trouble staying focused? Are you easily distracted? Do you forget names sometimes? Do you suffer from brain fog? That used to be me. And it was frustrating and it was scary and I actually thought I was losing my mind. What I've learned is that brain fog is not based on how old you are or how little sleep you get. Brain fog does not start in your head. It starts with poor blood flow. That's why every day I take this vinia. So Vinnia is a nature based solution. I know you've heard about the Mediterranean diet and how red wine is good for your circulation, right? Yes, I love that rule. Well, Vinya gives you the same blood flow boosting benefits of a thousand grapes or a full bottle of wine, but without the sugar, the calories or the alcohol. Vinia is clinically proven to increase dilation of arteries for better blood flow. Better blood flow means what? More oxygen that reaches your brain. Goodbye brain fog. I started taking this and I've noticed really a huge difference in every aspect. My focus is the brain fog is almost all the way gone. As someone who interviews people for a living, I have to be sharp. I have to be present. The folks at Vinnie are offering a 90 day risk free trial. If you don't feel the difference in physical energy and mental sharpness, they're gonna refund every penny and even cover the return postage. Visit vinnia.com sage to get Vinnie a special. Buy two get one month free offer. Now for about a dollar a day, you too can experience Vinya's proven results. Plus get 10% off any Vinia purchase. When you click the link in the description, go to V I N I A.com sage improve your blood flow. Say goodbye to that brain fog forever. Try Vinya.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Today we got to go back to the 60s, right? We have to go back to when Dr. Martin Luther King, he was in prison and Kennedy called. Nixon didn't. So my grandmother would say, you must vote democrat because the democrats care about black people. Look what happened with our leader, Dr. King. Fast forward to who? We know one of the greatest racists of all time, London B. Johnson. His great war on poverty, he would say, look, we can't expect black people to want a hand up. They need a handout. So we see welfare manifesting, right? And now when we look at this great, I would say, migration of black people beginning to say, you know what, we're going to vote Democrat now. Because my allegiance to my grandmother, I'm not voting because I believe in abortion. I'm not voting because I believe in the LGBTQ community. I'm voting this way because I don't want to disappoint my grandmother. I've actually heard some of the most affluent black Americans say that to me, say they do not believe in the Republic, they do not believe in the Democratic Party, but they don't want to dishonor their grandmother. In terms of pastors, because I can't. I have a little bit of authority to speak on this subject. I've had pastors say to me, pastor, the reason why it's okay for a woman to have an abortion because God gave women free will. And then my rebuttal is, well, what about the child?

[Sage Steele]

Yeah, the people completely ignore the baby.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

What about the Bible? The Bible says we were knit in our mother's womb. The Bible says, from our mother's womb, he knew us. What about the Scriptures? Well, God also gives the mother free will over her own body. That's one of the arguments I hear. Another argument I hear is don't just care for the child in the womb. Care for the child outside of the womb. Sage, I do not know how you can be a pastor and be a Democrat. I believe that they are diametrically opposed together. There is nothing in scripture when you just look. Are you kidding me? How is it that you can celebrate what God hates? God hates pride. That's the reason why Lucifer got kicked out. That's the reason why we have Satan. He hates pride. Now, I'm a sinner. I fall short of the glory of God, but that doesn't mean I celebrate my sin. No, there's a big difference between the two. So I do not believe a person can be a black. You cannot be a black Christian and say you are a Democrat. The Democratic Party is a demonic party. Anytime a person can say to an individual, you can celebrate what God hates. Anytime a person can say to an individual, you are a part of Margaret Singer's God of Moloch, you're worshiping the God of Moloch by sacrificing these babies.

[Sage Steele]

No one pays attention to what Margaret Sanger said on camera, that there needed to be less brown babies, brown people on the face of this earth. She is the woman who founded Planned Parenthood. And people don't do their homework.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

But I talk about it from the pulpit.

[Sage Steele]

Okay, what about the conversations you have privately with these black pastors? It simply goes down to, well, you said, disappointing their grandma and money.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

The Democratic Party pays well. That's the first thing he said to me. Sage, how much is he paying you? Oh, that's what they do. They call me my friend. These are my friends. They call and say, how much did he pay you? How much did you get mortified? So you mean to tell me for me to stand up for the gospel of Jesus Christ? Forget about President Trump as the man. Think about his mission.

[Sage Steele]

Yes.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Think about the fact that I've proclaimed the gospel, I've preached the gospel in some of the biggest stages over the world. You mean to tell me because of that, you think I'm being paid? So you're telling me, I've had some people tell me, give me $2 million, I'll come out against Al Sharpton. I've had people say that. Can you imagine that?

[Sage Steele]

No. It breaks my heart.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Well, the Bible says it's the love of money that is the root of all types of evil.

[Sage Steele]

I, I, I, oh, yes, I agree, agree.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

So that, that's why I am very excited about the Republican Party. This is why. Because right now, the Republicans, like no other time, they have an opportunity to do what has never been done in the history of America. They can take the largest voting bloc, the most loyal voting block that the Democrats have. They have the ability to use a mouthpiece to go to that voting block in Philadelphia, in Atlanta, in Detroit, in Baltimore, in Memphis. Right? To go to that voting block and say, hey, by the way, did you know that the Republican Party actually started to free slaves? Did you know that after slavery, during Reconstruction, that 2,000 black Republicans were in public office? Whether it was congressionally, whether it was on the state and local level, did you know that black people, they have identified more historically with the Republican Party and that the Democrats have demonically stolen from you and they misrepresent you? I can do that. And we can take that and we can shift that number. The number is about 25%. Once 25% of black Americans start voting Republican, the Democrats will no longer be in power, and they should not be in power. Look at Gavin Newsom. Look at what he's doing to California.

[Sage Steele]

It's devastating.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Can you imagine me coming into your home, breaking into your home illegally, and you say, hey, Pastor Lorenzo, like, can you go? And I say, no, I'm going to burn it down. I use that same analogy to a democratic pastor. I said, what would you do? He said, you're going to meet Jesus a lot sooner than you expected. I said, exactly. So how can you tell me due process? How can you tell me. And we have people in our church, sage. We help them seek citizenship. One of the cities that we serve, Pontiac, is a third Latino. The Latinos in that community, they tell me that those that come in illegally, they don't want them there.

[Sage Steele]

Really?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

But those. Yes, but those that are in our church that seek citizenship, we've spent the money. We've spent thousands of dollars with immigrant immigration attorneys to be able to show that they're exceptional, because you have to prove that they're exceptional, kind of like an athlete to be able to get them to get their visas and them to be able to get citizenship. Our own community, Latinos in their own community said, pastor, that's wrong. You shouldn't do that. So people that we're looking to serve, yes. Their own community says, you got to go in the right way.

[Sage Steele]

Well, I do feel like that kind of accountability is one of the ways that we begin to. Well, not begin, because it's underway, but to continue to turn things around. It takes courage, though. And I know that you are led by God and that's truly what you believe. But it does take courage to do what you're doing, in particular where you're doing it. You told me once that you had lost a lot of people in your church.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Absolutely.

[Sage Steele]

People who walk out. And you've obviously gained probably thousands more, too. But what has that been like for you? To believe that you are spreading the word and doing good, but to have so many people vilify you, you know, it hurts because.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

No, Pastor, I don't care who you are. Right. If you're a pastor, you're a shepherd, right? Shepherd loved the sheep. Right. Jesus said, I am the good shepherd. I lay down my life for the sheep. Shepherdology, which we would see in the Gospel of St. John, chapter number 10. We would see, Jesus says that shepherds ought to know the sheep. They ought to lead the sheep, they ought to protect the sheep. Right. They have a rod for a reason. Right. Shepherds have a staff. The rod is to beat the wolf off. And that's what I'm doing. I'm beating the devil off. I will refuse to Allow Satan to lie to our community and believe in the demonic Democratic Party. But you also have to pull them in. So my wife and I have had some of our best friends who we love leave. We have had our biggest givers leave. But Jesus said, if you lose your life for my sake in the gospel, then you will get a hundredfold in this world and in the world to come. If you told me that people would threaten my life, threaten to burn my church down. And you know who the people are who do this? It's always affluent blacks that are in white context. So I never get somebody from the hood. You know, people in the hood, they're like, look, Pastor, whatever you gotta do to bring resources to us, we don't care. Right? It's always the affluent blacks or the liberal white. These are the people that hate me the most.

[Sage Steele]

Yes. It's so true. It's like a script every single time.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

So they call. When they call, they'll say, well, I can't believe it. You're this. I mean, you get every name right except for a child. So I'll let them go. I'll let them say everything they need to say. I say, okay, are you done? Let me ask you a question. Are you from Detroit? No, no, no. Where are you from? I'm from la. Ah. Do you know that California is ground zero in terms of the crack epidemic, in terms of negative black culture with the nwa and do look at California, it's ground zero. Look at what happened with mass incarceration of black people, de gentrification in Oakland and LA and so on. Look what's happening today with Gavin Newsom. So I, I explained to them context and then I let them know, do you think I should fight for my community or do you think I should just allow my community to continue to look the way it does? And when you explain to them the reasonable ones, because some people are blinded by the God of this world, Satan, and they're just going to believe whatever.

[Sage Steele]

They want to believe and whatever social media is preaching and network television, mainstream media and their low hanging fruit talking points, it is easy to believe it, especially if they're all saying the same thing. So then to be willing to hear another voice, your voice, I mean, that could be overwhelming for a lot of people.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah. And you know, it's fun because my, my conditions, Sage command me to preach and to be a Republican. It's my conditions. Look at what's happening. The Democrats have decimated our community. I don't care if you weren't independent. I Don't care if you were a libertarian. If you are throwing me a life preserver and I'm drowning, you think I'm going to look at you and care if you're a Republican? And that's what President Trump did when he came to our church.

[Sage Steele]

Yes.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

He said, you know what? Let me reach out. And not only that, we have access now. Right. We're bringing over 200 black Americans for Juneteenth.

[Sage Steele]

Oh, I did see that.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

We're bringing it.

[Sage Steele]

I saw that.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

You're doing it to Washington.

[Sage Steele]

You know, we're doing amazing.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

We're first going to the Department of Justice, and we're saying our civil rights have been violated. We're going to the DOJ and we're saying we have a case. 24, 2006. Here's the people. We're gonna let the people talk. We're gonna let. Melissa Love. Can you imagine being homeless? You're a homeless single mom black girl. Can you imagine your babies living in a cold car in the winter in Detroit? You're going to city council every. Every single week. Sage saying, help, help. And then Ramon Jackson, who was my political mentor, he's the greatest political mind that has ever crossed the bridge of time. He's the one that came to me and he told me they were cheating.

[Sage Steele]

Oh, he's the one.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah. Ramon Jackson coming to you and saying, hey, have you ever voted before? And she says, no. Melissa Love is her name. Great name, Melissa Love. The Democrats used her seven times.

[Sage Steele]

Are you serious?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

And you know how they registered her through the welfare program. Snap. They never tell you that. So when you register, See, this is how they're using the poor. Their largest voting block are poor black people who don't vote. Sage, I'm telling you. So you take this young woman who gets her SNAP benefits. You never told her you registered her to vote, and then you vote for her sick. She's gonna be there in front of the doj. Oh, yeah. She's gonna be talking.

[Sage Steele]

Awesome.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

And then from the DOJ, we're gonna go to HUD. They want to say, Mr. President, you came to our hood. Now we're coming to your hood. The reason why they cheat is because they steal our HUD resources. So we're gonna go to hud, and then we're gonna end up at the White House. We. We didn't need an invitation. Just like President Trump. He never asked me for an invitation. He said, I'm coming, and I said, you're welcome. He came to Detroit. So we're bringing Detroit to him. He came to the hood, so we're bringing the hood to him. You know what we're saying? We love you, Mr. President. You were right. They cheated. They cheat to steal. And here are the people in our community that say, please continue to help us stand up for fair elections.

[Sage Steele]

I feel like there is something special. I hadn't put two and two together about Michigan, about Detroit and the significance of him coming. That was obvious to me right away.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Sure.

[Sage Steele]

Also, the last stop of his campaign, all three times now is in Michigan. Grand Rapids.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Grand Rapids. Every time.

[Sage Steele]

Every time. I was with them on his plane in Pittsburgh.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Oh, cool.

[Sage Steele]

This is the last day, the Monday before the election. Pittsburgh Trump force won, baby. And then we flew from Pittsburgh to Grand Rapids. I don't think he started speaking till about 12:50am it was late. It was a long day of him jumping around. And he spoke till about 5, 10 after 2 in the morning. And then we, you know, hightailed it out of there. Wheels up at 2250-240-am land in Palm beach about 5:30am it was the most magical, coolest thing. And I kept going. Grand Rapids.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Why? Grand Rapids is a very interesting city. So many people don't know that Grand Rapids is a Democratic city. This is why my political mentor, Ramon Jackson said he knew President Trump would win. He said, pastor, if he was going to lose, he would be in places that he already knew he won because he knew he would. Was going to win. He's going to get more votes going to places that typically Republicans lose. For example, I had the honor of being with Vice President J.D. vance in Flint.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

The same day. So I was with him in Flint, praying. In Flint. Right. So he's in Flint, J.D. and President Trump's in Grand Rapids. Why is that? Because they were going after the people who they know they wanted to win. Where was Kamala Harris? She was in Detroit. Remember, Tim Walsh was in. Was in. He was in Detroit. They did that big event in Detroit and we were like, why would he come to Detroit when he. He's not getting more votes. You're not getting more votes.

[Sage Steele]

Right. I mean, no.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Out of Detroit. They're not doing it. It right. Why wouldn't he go? So my political mentor, Ramon Jackson, you know what he said, Pastor, Be afraid if he went to Brighton, Michigan. Be afraid if he went to somewhere where it was a democr. Where it was a Republican stronghold. President Trump went to a place that typically is a Democratic stronghold. Grand Rapids. That was a city. That city's only about 25 Republican. Now the county, Kent county is Republican, which they lost Kent county, you know, and went Democrat. But the point is he was going after people. He was reaching out to him, which literally is his gift. And my prayer and our hope is that the Republican Party will continue to maximize this moment and use this momentum to reach out to black Americans. That's why we're coming for Juneteenth, because we're saying, black America, you need to come back to the party that was started to free you.

[Sage Steele]

But it's a matter of education, too. People don't know that Martin Luther King was a Republican.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Absolutely not.

[Sage Steele]

People don't even know what it means to be a Republican, which is actually the party of freedom, honestly. And all of us owning what we want as a man, a woman, a family, you do you, I'll do me, sure. I'm not offended. I might disagree over here, but that's you, right? And lack of control, the patriotism that is so prevalent in our community, you know, and to me, we have to do what you're doing, continue doing what you're doing and to show people and to remind them of the origins of it in the history and then maybe it continues. I have so much that I want to talk about with you, but you know, I was so proud watching the inauguration. And I know you've heard this from 100 million people, but the fact that you said that at the rnc, you didn't have notes. I remember watching you today, and as someone who, you know, spent my life in front of cameras, I look for notes, sure. And I was like, that man has nothing on inauguration day. So when I played this, and this is about halfway through in the US Capitol, the day in the rotunda, the day of inauguration, I want to know what goes through your mind when you see this again.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Sweet land of liberty, of the Essene land of my father's day, Land where my fathers die. Land of the pilgrim's pride. From every mountainside let freedom ring. And because America is called to be a great nation, we believe that you will make this come true. So let freedom ring from the prodigious hilltops of New Hampshire, let freedom ring. Or from the mighty mountains of New York, let freedom ring from the heightening Alleghettis of Pennsylvania, Let freedom ring from the snow capped Rockies of Colorado, Let freedom ring from the curvaceous hilltops of California. But God, we're asking you, not only that, let freedom ring From Stone Mountain, Georgia, Let freedom ring from Lookout Mountain of Tennessee, let freedom ring from every hill and every molehill in Mississippi. From every state, every city, every village and every hamlet. And when we let freedom ring, we will be able to speed up that day. All of your children, black men and white men, Protestant and Catholic, Jew and Gentile, will be able to sing in the meaning of that old new Negro spiritual, free at last, Free at last. Thank you, God Almighty. We are free at last. If you believe what the spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. Come on, put your hands together and give your great God great glory.

[Sage Steele]

I get like. I know. I get chills all over again. And I was watching in D.C. at a friend's house, he had a big party. I'd never had an inauguration party before. Like, what is this? And I was watching, I was like. I mean, I knew you were talented, but I saw that, and I'm like, the Lord was speaking through you is what it felt like. And when you could see, when they showed the expressions of the faces now it continues here, the expression on the faces of the people that were right there in those chairs, that was a moment of unity. And you got to do that. You were put there first and foremost when you opened your eyes, during what was going through your mind, when you saw everybody's eyes on you. At one of the most important moments in American history, I looked up at.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

The Rotunda sage, and I never looked up. Typically, I'm walking from Speaker Johnson's office, running to the next meeting, praying with congressional leaders, because I was there a week before, but I never looked up. When I looked up, it was as if I seen the prayers of our forefathers. It was as if the Bible says that our prayers are caught in an incense. They're like incense that go up. It was like all of the prayers of the matriarchs and the patriarchs, all of the people that had prayed before me, I never looked up before. So when I looked up, I was like. And I felt like God was saying, I am not only going to use this prayer for our president, I'm going to use this for our nation. I didn't even know I was going to pray. The prayer Sage, how do you pray a dream? How do you pray the greatest speech that has ever been spoken in the English language? How do you pray that? He said, I'll show you. Okay. What do you mean, gonna show me? I'm gonna show you.

[Sage Steele]

Oh, he showed you what to do? Yes.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

The temptation was to tell President Trump, thank you for everything he's done for me. Our church, Black America. But God said, this isn't time to talk to man. This is a time to talk to me. I wanted to say, Mr. President, thank you for being a man of your word, but God said it's not time to do that, because your words to him won't be as powerful as your words to me about him. I said, okay. So I get up there. I mean, you can't make this up. Carrie Underwood, the man forgot to turn his mic on. She sang Acapella.

[Sage Steele]

Yes.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Can you imagine walking through and seeing all three branches of government? Can you imagine a tech giant single? Lee Greenwood just sang. Can you picture it? Sajak it up there. And I just say, God, thank you. Like, I start every prayer for our 45th and our 47th president. Thank you for giving him a millimeter miracle. Because, remember, 30 days before he was in Butler, he was in my church, and we prayed for protection, and God gave him a millimeter miracle. I said, lord, thank you that you called him for such a time as this. Thank you that you will use him to make America dream again. That you will use him. That we will fulfill the true meaning of our creed. We hold these truths to be self evident, that all men are created equal. Thank you, Jesus, that you will use our president. That we will live in a nation where we will not be judged by the color of our skin, but by the content of our character. Thank you, Jesus, that you will use him. So we will be free. So let freedom ring from the perditious hilltops of New Hampshire.

[Sage Steele]

You're going into it all over again.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

So, like. So for me, it was a prayer for my president, but also a proclamation. And also, what King died for in his assassination was for HUD. When King died in his assassination, HUD was manifested 120 days later. So I felt like it was a prayer for black Americans, but it was a prayer for all Americans.

[Sage Steele]

It felt like it was for everyone. And when you got done and the day ended, or I guess that moment ended, how did your life change?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

So all the other preachers didn't obey what we were told to do. We were told to walk straight down to, like, the other part. Like, we were just told to walk straight.

[Sage Steele]

Yes.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

So instead of going back to my seat, obviously, I did what was said. So I walked in. You're just waiting. You're just waiting. So, ran by Berman. Oh, no. Father Mans, he prayed. He's from New York. He prayed. And then I'm just back there waiting. So while I'm wa. While I'm waiting, President George Bush walks up to Me, boy, you prayed the damn house down.

[Sage Steele]

Did he?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

It was the funniest thing. So I said, thank you, Mr. President. Thank you so much. I'm so grateful. Thank you for saying that.

[Sage Steele]

He didn't have many other smiles on his face during the whole thing.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

He was so happy.

[Sage Steele]

I'm glad that he had a moment.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

He was so happy. Bill. President Bill Clinton, he just stares sage like this. I said, Mr. President, thank you so much. I'm so grateful. You know, Dr. Martin Luther King, his. Your inauguration was on his birthday as well. Secretary Clinton comes around the corner. Thank you for invoking Dr. King in your message. There was a gentleman about 6 foot 2, 6 foot 3, walks up to me. He said, man, that was a great prayer. I said, what's your name? He said, doug. I said, doug, what do you do? He says, I own Walmart.

[Sage Steele]

Oh, hello.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Another Asian man comes up to me. He says, man, that was a great prayer. I said, what do you do? He said, I started TikTok. So that entire day was a day where I felt like Two things happened. One, the legacy of Dr. King was resurrected. Because most people didn't know what I was doing. Most people that came up to me about my age, you know, 40ish, and, and younger, they were like, great prayer. I was like, that was Dr. King's speech. They were like, oh, it was. But everyone who was older.

[Sage Steele]

Yes.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

They came up to me and they knew exactly if you were like 60 ish, 65 ish. They came up to me and they were like, thank you so much for praying. Dr. King's dream. They knew exactly what it was. But for people who were younger, they had no idea.

[Sage Steele]

They didn't know me in your 60s to know that that's what you were saying. I am not there yet.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Okay. But people were like, they, like, didn't know it was about. So his. His niece, one of his nieces are. They were upset with me. They were like, you know, you shouldn' used. Dr. King's. My uncle or my dad's name was his daughter. I think it was Bernice. And I said, you know, my response. And it was one of the newspaper, one of the interviews. My response was a lot of people didn't even know it was about your. That that was your dad's speech. Like, we have to.

[Sage Steele]

Why would she not want that used?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Well, it's partisan politics. Right. And for me, it was about a prayer. Yeah. And I had other people, I had Republicans who were mad at me for the way I prayed. I was like, dude, I pray like, that way, that way all the time. I. Some black Americans who are podcasters, like, oh, that was a little dramatic. I'm like, you should come hear me preach on Sunday. You should come hear me pray on Sunday. I mean, that's just the way. That's the way I would pray regardless. And obviously you knew I knew the speech because I didn't have any notes.

[Sage Steele]

But, like, you were there. Like, you said, the rabbi was there, the priest was there.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Sure.

[Sage Steele]

This was very diverse, representative of America.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yes.

[Sage Steele]

Why would anyone not like that?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

I think Satan gets upset when we pray, and I just believe that the devil was using people and Islam. President Trump. Trump pulled me in. Can you imagine it twice? He said, you did such a great job. And he's always said this to me. When I've been able to pray with him in private, he's like, you're so special. Melania came in and gave me a hug. All of his children. The next day, I was at the National Cathedral. I sat with the entire family. When Bishop Bud talked about transgender children being afraid, all of his grandchildren looked over at me. Don's children looked over, and guess what I said? I shook my head. I said, don't believe that. So God has allowed me to. And my prayer is that one day I'll be able to baptize our president. That's what I'm praying for.

[Sage Steele]

Well, what do you mean he's never been baptized?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

I don't know. I never have been able to ask that question. I don't know if he's been baptized. That's my. That's my. That will be. My hope is that I would be able to baptize him, because I don't know about it. I never have.

[Sage Steele]

You talk a lot. I feel like you. You see him more than most normal people.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

You know, it's always in the context of prayer.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah, right.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

It's never in the context, but I.

[Sage Steele]

Know he gives you the time. He came to Detroit and sat at your church, and I know I want you to ask him that question.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

That's my goal.

[Sage Steele]

Like, to. What would you say? Can I.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Well, absolutely. I would just ask. Just like I would ask anybody. I would say, hey, because do you know how many people have come to my church and gotten baptized because he came? You know, I've had Jewish people get in their car, not even know when our church service was like, not even know. Get in and just drive. I've had people from Arizona get in the cartridge, not even know. People from all over the country said, we didn't even know you'd be here. We just needed to come to the church, and we want to know, can you baptize us? Literally that.

[Sage Steele]

I also think that we have seen a softer, gentler Donald Trump.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Absolutely.

[Sage Steele]

Since Butler, Pennsylvania, he's talked about it briefly a little bit. And those in his circle, of course, are like, oh, he has changed and talks more about his faith, God, and for so many people who like to call him all kinds of other names. Godless, Nazi, Hitler, blah, blah, blah. And you say, how can it not change you when you are a millimeter away from death in front of the world?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

I saw him at the rnc.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah. Two days later.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Millimeter miracle. He was a different man. And the way he spoke when he came to Michigan. 100 days. Right. He celebrated the Hundred Days of Michigan, had the honor of being able to be with him and to pray there. You can see that our president has become a man who's become a praying man, and that's what our country needs at the end of the day. The faith office Pastor Paula White had the honor of being at the faith commission yesterday talking about religious liberty. I think some people forget that's how our country started. Right. I mean, our country started to free those who were up under religious persecution. So puritans came over, our forefathers came over here, and their mindset was, this is one nation under God. Their mindset was the reason why we have inalienable rights, because God gave us freedom. We know the Bible says, where the spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. So I'm grateful that our country is at a place we're making godliness great again.

[Sage Steele]

Absolutely. I think one of the coolest things is along with those lessons that you teach us, the lesson that you are just by being based on how you grew up.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah.

[Sage Steele]

Based on your upbringing, based on how close you were to not being here for any number of reasons. Is it safe to say that in your previous life, you're a gang banger?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah. You know, Sage, I was an evil man. There's no way around it. I was mentored by murderers. Student of the streets. I remember the first time, when I was 11 years old, being shot at playing Atari. You remember Atari?

[Sage Steele]

I remember Atari. Space Invaders.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

That's my game. Come on now. Before there was Xbox, before there was PlayStation, there was Atari. And I remember the first time someone brought a gun to school. I remember being in seventh grade. And we fought. I know how to box. We fought. And I remember about to get into a fight with a guy and his brother pulled a gun. I was like, whoa. And I remember going back to my own community and the guys that we were in a gang called the Loco Boys. We were in a gang. He went. We went to his basement and he pulled out a gun and he's like, we're gonna go get those guys. And I'm like, whoa, wait, time out. Like, what do you mean? We're not shooting anybody. And it was a shift in terms of the culture. You know, you're Talking about the 80s, talking about the crack epidemic. So was a shift. And my mother moved us out to an all white community. Sage, I didn't know I was black until I was 17 years old. Can you imagine that? I grew up in a context. So I went from the hood. Hood. I mean, literally. And then my mother moved us out to an all white context. I walked into Ms. Shell's art class. I'll never forget it. I walked in seventh grade and eighth grade. I walked in. And when I walked in, I was the only black person. And my mother never told me. My mother never sat down with me. It was the. One of the greatest gifts she gave me. It wasn't Till I was 17 years old. I was a street pharmacist. I was a drug dealer. I would run drugs.

[Sage Steele]

Street pharmacist.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

So what I would do is I would. Would. You would. My friends would come to me and they would say, hey, why don't you go back to your old. This. I got in a drug dealer. Why would you. Why don't you go back into your old community and go get some drugs for us? And I was feeling like, I get to go see my friends. It wasn't like I didn't think I was breaking the law. I didn't feel like. I felt like, hey, you gave me money. We went down to meet some of my friends from my old community. I would get drugs, bring it back. You would be happy. You know, I had social credibility. I made some money. It was great, right? I mean, literally, that's how I feel. Then I begin to get larger amounts of drugs and I begin to get different types of drugs. Began to barbiturate, like ecstasy and acid, things like that. So my best friend comes out of the house crying. I mean, we're tough guys. And he says, my grandmother said, we can't be best friends anymore because you're black. Like, because I'm black. Like, what? So if you would have came to me and said, d E and I, I would have been like, I wouldn't have not there. Would have been zero connection with me being in an all white context. Girlfriends white, all white context, Best friends white. I would have never been able to get all the guys I played sports with, all my coaches, all my teachers. I never felt like I was treated different because I was black. Until that moment. So about a year later, I'm in Daytona beach, and I want you to picture a drug dealer renting out a resort. So I got a resort, a penthouse area. And I want you to picture me in a corner cutting myself with glass on ecstasy acid. Shrooms blew out of my mind. Sage. Can you imagine it?

[Sage Steele]

This is you doing that.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Dad's in prison for murder. I hate myself. Can you imagine it? In the Bible, false prophets would mutilate themselves because they wanted their gods to listen to them. Security guard. Hey, what are you doing? You got to go, master. What do you mean? This is my place. Who do you think you are? No, no, no, man, you got to go. Our insurance. If you hurt yourself or hurt somebody in this place, we're going to be liable. Man, you got to go, man. I need you to leave. So I start walking out and you know, I'm, you know, got muscles and all this type of stuff. So I think I'm tough. But he's like, you got to leave. We get to the out of the resort, I don't know, two, three o'clock in the morning. He says, can I pray for you? I said, man, who do you think you are? Don't you see how much money I have here? Do you realize everything that's going on in there is because of me? No, no, no, no, no, man. I'm not trying to offend you. I'm not trying to offend you. Can I pray for you? Daytona Beach. Is there any good thing that can come out of spring break? Spring break, Put my hands out. Sage. And he starts praying for. Never invited me to church, never told me what the nomination he was, but he prayed in the name of Jesus. And I remember just being like God, if you're real, come into my life. Literally a thought. I went up a week later to the only church I knew of. Straight gate church. Jesus says, enter into this straight gate because broad is the way and wide is the gate that leads to destruction. And there be many that enter therein. But straight is the gate and narrow is the way that leads to life. And there be few that find it. I walked in and there are thousands of people worshiping God. My driver drove me. I'm selling a drug called Special K, which was a Cat tranquilizer, bloody brow, broken heart. Bishop Merritt says, does anybody want to give their heart to Jesus? I'm crying. April 18, 1999. I'll never forget it. I walk down the aisle. He gives me the microphone. Why are you crying? I said, I just love Jesus. I go in the back, they baptized me. I look behind, my buddy follows me. He gets baptized. We go back home. I'm a drug dealer. I call all my buddies. I said, I'm done. I said, what do you mean? I tried to put in my two week resume, Sage, you understand? I tried to update my LinkedIn stylist. How many know it doesn't. Doesn't happen.

[Sage Steele]

As a street pharmacist.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

As a street pharmacist. They said, man, Larry, Larry's gonna kill you. Larry had bodies under his belt. Oh, he was a murderous man. He just started shooting steroids, his arms, tattoos. Murderous guy. I was afraid for my life. I go in all on the same day. April 18, 1999. We made a lot of money together my entire high school life. I was doing this since ninth grade. I wanted people to tell me, good job, even if I was doing the wrong thing. The power of a father. I miss my dad in prison for murder today. Sage. Can you imagine this? I give him all the drugs. I give him all the money. I said, I'm done. He said, done? What do you mean done? Are the cops on to you? I said, no. Are you sick? I said, no. I said, I gave my life to Jesus. I get up to leave, Sage. I'm thinking, this guy's gonna pound me. Best case scenario, worst case scenario, this guy's gonna take me out. I get to the door, he says, zo, he said, I respect you. Can you imagine that?

[Sage Steele]

No, I cannot.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

I go to school the next day.

[Sage Steele]

Senior in high school.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

I go from being a dope dealer to a hope dealer. People are like, what? Pastor my first church, when I was 21 years old, I became the first black pastor of an all white, multisite, multi million dollar church. And that was the first time that I realized racist ideas were real. I never knew it. I didn't know that there were people that believed that black people were cursed. Puritans. It was a puritan doctrine. I didn't know that people believe black people didn't have souls. In the Bible, Noah cursed his son Ham, burnt skin. So there are people that believe theologically that black people are cursed. I didn't even know that things like that exist, Sage. I didn't know that people felt that Way. I don't believe that everybody is racist, but I know that racism is real.

[Sage Steele]

Of course. Of course. And it is, and it always will be, because there's human beings walking this earth absolutely are imperfect.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

I.

[Sage Steele]

Was wondering. I thought a lot about this, and you're not the first person I've met who has had a parent who's incarcerated. But everybody's story is different. When did you lose your dad to prison?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

So my dad went to prison twice. The first time, I'll never forget this. I remember when, you know, you're a kid his age, I mean, this is what, 10, 11 years old. He takes me to Chandler park, which is a park in our community on the east side of Detroit. And he said, I killed a man, and I've actually killed a couple men, but I think the police are going to catch me. And I remember sitting there as a kid, you know, and I'm like, what's going to happen with my dad? So he's like, I'm going to move. I'm going to move to Kentucky. And he moved. And he said, I want you to come down because I was a basketball player, and that's all I did. And he said, I'm gonna bring you down with me so you can play in a prep school. So there was a prep school, fancy school in Kentucky that I was gonna go to play basketball. And I got a phone call. And my. It was. I was at school. My mom called. She said, you're not going to go live with your dad. I said, why? He's in prison for murder. So my dad murdered a man. He got himself off for self defense. Eight years later in Kentucky, Louisville, Kentucky, he comes home, and he and I went to a restaurant one day at that restaurant, he looks at a waitress. He says to that waitress, you seem pretty nice. Here's my son's card. That waitress was Molly, my wife.

[Sage Steele]

No way.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

It was my dad that introduced me to my wife.

[Sage Steele]

What's the odds after he got out of.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

After he got out of prison? So it's like how God works all things together for our good. How God can take a mess and do a miracle right? So this was in. This would have been. Okay, so Naomi is 14. So this would have been 14 years ago, when Naomi was 13, but she'll be 14. So this would have been 13 years ago when. Right before she was born. I get a phone call from my brother, my older brother. He says, dad's on his way over here to kill me because my dad had mental illness. So my dad was the type of person who we can be in a conversation, like we are now, and you can say something as small as, you know, I don't like this water. Like he's going in a car, getting a gun type of thing. Like, like. Like, so, like you cannot call. Like you cannot talk him down.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Like he will kill you. Like that's how he was. Like, no joke. If you go to the car, get the gun type of thing, right? So him. My brother had a discrepancy. So he is on his way to literally go kill my. My brother. On his way there, he's on the bus. This couple like brushed up against him and he goes off. While he's going off, a young man my brother's age said, sir, he can see these people are scared of you. Can you please stop? Stop. He pulls out a dagger. What? Stabs him three times.

[Sage Steele]

The guy that was standing up for the couple right there, three times. And that was it.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

That was it, the guy. Yet a young man died. So my dad ends up running, cutting himself, trying to say it was self defense. So I find this out. I go to the hospital. I just had the honor of being a chaplain in this hospital. I went to see my dad. So the chaplain says, listen, I know why you're here. I know you're a pastor. You can't see your dad. He's. He's up under custody right now. I can get a message to him for you. So I go to the trial. The bus driver's like. I looked in the back of the rearview mirror and I seen this gentleman stabbing this guy three times. And the last time I did not spoke. We spoke a few times over the phone. I haven't seen him yet. Trying to go see him. And I've had to forgive Sage. I struggle with unforgiveness. Can you imagine a preacher, the one that preaches about forgiveness?

[Sage Steele]

Well, because your dad made a decision that took him away from his son again.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah. And my dad and I were close. He gave me love for reading. I was very close to my dad. He taught me how to shoot with my left hand basketball. He introduced me to my wife. So it took me years. I'm still in the process every day trying to forgive him, Sage. Every day. Some days are harder than others. Trying to forgive him. Forgive the fact that he'll never walk his granddaughter down the aisle. Trying to forgive that, you know, and trying to somehow wrap my mind around. What were you thinking at that time? Why did you love murder more than me? But it was mental illness. You know. So last time I saw him, I was at the county jail, actually, the jail that's a replica of the Detroit Athletic Club. Albert Kahn built the same he built.

[Sage Steele]

The last time I saw this young man. We were at the Detroit Athletics Club. Yes.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

So. So big shout out. So.

[Sage Steele]

But he's been in prison for how many years now?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

14. And plus the eight. So he's done almost half his life.

[Sage Steele]

In prison and half of your life.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Totally 44. Exactly.

[Sage Steele]

Half your life. Yeah.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah.

[Sage Steele]

So do you. I mean, how often can you communicate with him?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Well. Well, I've tried to see him a couple different times, and it didn't work out. Okay. And I've used my newfound celebrity, so to speak, to give me access to see him, because he never put his name on my birth certificate. So you don't. You don't find those things out. So before. Before COVID being a pastor, I could just go into any jail, you know, I can go anywhere. I'm a pastor. Boom, bada boom, badda bam. But after Covid, things became more strenuous in terms of the process. So I've had to go through. I've had to jump hoops that I'm just, quite frankly, not in a position spiritually to jump in terms of the unforgiveness that I've had in my heart. So God has given me grace. I continuously forgive my dad. So now we're in a position where a state rep has allowed. A state rep has talked to our correction facility. Because in the state of Michigan, you got to think, you got to be able to be on your dad. You got to prove it. You got to prove that you are his son, which I've not been able to do because of the birth certificate, which is no excuse. I am in the process of seeing him. And this is why I say you're not to see my dad. You know what? I need to be obedient to Jesus. Jesus said, when I was in prison, you visited me. So on the day of judgment, one day we're going to stand before God and he's going to give us rewards for our good deeds. And although good deeds can't save us, only Jesus saves us because of our faith in him. But we do receive rewards for the good deeds that we do. And one of the good deeds is.

[Sage Steele]

Visiting people in prison, especially your father.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Totally.

[Sage Steele]

And I hope that you can forgive yourself for not being able to forgive.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah.

[Sage Steele]

Because first of all, to share that, thank you. Because I think we beat ourselves up. Many people, millions of people beat yourselves up for holding on to things and not being ready to forgive. So we have to see the humanity in you.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Absolutely.

[Sage Steele]

Like, we need that vulnerability, or else we're gonna worship you in the wrong way.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Totally.

[Sage Steele]

And that's not, you know. So my question is, how do you continue to challenge yourself to get there?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

So this is what you know, Sage. This is so interesting. I remember when my uncle. I'm named after my uncle Lorenzo. He's the youngest of. So I have Uncle Jackie, Simeon, Uncle Lorenzo, my dad. So he's the youngest of four boys. And I'll never forget the day. I remember it like it was yesterday when he told me I had unforgiveness in my heart toward my dad. And I stopped talking to my uncle for a while because of that. Because I couldn't accept it. I couldn't accept was in Nashville. It was here. It was in this city. I was preaching. I was in the state. I was preaching a prayer breakfast in Johnson City, but I prayed in the General assembly here in Nashville. A few months ago, I had the opportunity to go into Andrew Jackson's office and see his trapdoor, just in case the union came. It was pretty cool being in the governor's office and spending time. We love Nashville. We love Tennessee. And it was amazing. Woman. I believe in women preachers. I believe in women pastors. She was preaching at this prayer preface, and she said these words. She said, forgiveness is choosing to forget how much they hurt you. I was like, wow. There are two things that God does not allow me to escape, which allows the door to always be open for seeing. With three things. The first thing is the point I just made. Choosing to do what Jesus did for me. He chose to forgive me and not remember my sins. The Bible says our sins get cast into the depth of the sea, not to be remembered anymore. The Bible says it is finished. Right? Jesus is on the cross saying, I've paid their debt in full. The Bible says, just as the east never touches the west, so it is our sins before God never comes before him. So it's like, okay. Choosing decisional love.

[Sage Steele]

Yes.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Agape love, the God type of love. Choosing to not remember how much my dad hurt me. Number one. Here's the second thing, and it's probably the biggest in terms of the feeling of it.

[Sage Steele]

Okay.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Every single time someone asked me how I met my wife, I have to mention my dad.

[Sage Steele]

Yes.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

I can't run from it. And then the third day on the day of Judgment, I want Jesus to be able to say of me, you visited me it wasn't just you visiting your dad, Lorenzo. You came to see me. That Jesus would say that to me. So those three things helped me in the process, helped me get to that place. And I remember the day before the inauguration, I was crying. I'll never forget it. I was at the hotel that the RNC put us up in. And by the way, I've never taken any money from President Trump.

[Sage Steele]

I just want to put that out there right now.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Nor have I ever given any money. I haven't never gave money to the campaign, by the way. So, anyway, I'm sitting there, and my wife and I are. The power of a father. We just had Father's Day. The power of a father. I'm sitting there, about to be on the biggest stage of my life. Can you imagine that? Can you imagine how many millions and millions of people all over the world. 1RAP, the Council of Israel. They told me I prayed over billions. I mean, can you imagine praying over that many people? And I'm sitting there and I start crying because I just wanted my dad to be there.

[Sage Steele]

As you should. I mean, I feel like that's okay. And it's probably a lifelong process that will never be complete. That chapter in the book will never be fully closed. It's okay. You had a loss. It's not just your loss. Your wife, your kids.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Sure.

[Sage Steele]

They didn't get to experience the good in him.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah.

[Sage Steele]

Either. So I. I hope you don't beat yourself up about it too much, because that. It's legitimate, I can't imagine. And it's different if you hate him.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Sure.

[Sage Steele]

Do you hate your father?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

No. Exactly.

[Sage Steele]

There's hatred in your heart. This is hurt, not hatred.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

There were times where I felt like even my wife and I were celebrating our 19 years together. 17 years. Married last week. A couple weeks ago. And there was one point in our conversation, Sage, where I said to my wife, there were days I wish I did not know him because of how good he was to me. And our. You know, we were very close. You know, so it's almost like that part of you where it's like, wow, if I never knew you, then I wouldn't feel.

[Sage Steele]

You wouldn't have this to deal with the pain.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Totally correct. But it's like he was such a good dad. It wasn't like he was a bad dad. He just was a bad. He just was in a bad. Wrong place at the wrong time. You struggle with mental illness just like any one of us. Right. There are issues in my life. I think all of us have a degree of illness that needs to be covered, just like some of us have a degree of physical illness. Right. So I believe mental illness is a thing. So one of the missions of our church is transportation, housing, education, healing, medical, mental and dental illnesses. T H e m them. Jesus said, whatever you do for the least of these, whatever you do for them, you do for him. So we believe that that's the way to take people out of poverty. So my dad will always be a part of our mission.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah. No, I thank you for sharing that to the depth again. I read a little bit about it.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah.

[Sage Steele]

But it's proof that no matter what, people see you now and see this.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Sure, sure.

[Sage Steele]

And see what has come with, you know, the celebrity, I guess, that side of it.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Sure.

[Sage Steele]

But you still have daily struggles.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Absolutely.

[Sage Steele]

And that's okay.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Absolutely.

[Sage Steele]

And that's okay for others to know about. I do think we put on these pedestals and certainly social media does. And then it's like people forget where they came from.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Absolutely.

[Sage Steele]

And we hide it and we try to mask it. And why.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

I preach out of my pain.

[Sage Steele]

Yes.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

I pray out of my pain.

[Sage Steele]

Yes.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

I believe if you know Jacob, he was a man who wrestled with God. I believe that if you don't have a limp, if you don't have something in your life that people can look at and say that humanizes you.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

And if I'm not willing to share that, I believe that's why. I believe that's why people follow leaders. I believe people follow leaders that are vulnerable. All the research shows it all. All the research shows the leader of that is transparent. I believe that's why Jesus is the greatest leader of all time. Right. Because if I can show you my humanity. Yes. I can hide behind my giftedness. Yes. You can hide behind, you know, what people, what you appear to be the people. But when I can look at you and say, I struggle with that too. Right. In Jesus, the Bible says that although he's all God and all man, the Bible says he was touched with the feelings of our infirmities.

[Sage Steele]

Yes.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Do you know what happens when a baby doesn't get touched? Do you know that there is a scientific and a biological way that those babies actually begin to die because of the lack of being touched. So I believe people want to be touched with our weaknesses.

[Sage Steele]

I do, too. I'm so glad you said that. It's. I feel like we're getting there.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Sure.

[Sage Steele]

Because of the discussions about mental health.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yes.

[Sage Steele]

More than ever.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Absolutely.

[Sage Steele]

And I did a panel recently in cabo. For a wonderful company. And I hosted the panel, moderated the panel on mental health. And the doctor on stage said when you speak badly to yourself, of yourself, your own thoughts, it affects you at a cellular level.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Sure.

[Sage Steele]

And in ways that you never dreamt of.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah.

[Sage Steele]

Certainly mentally. But physically.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Sure.

[Sage Steele]

It changes almost what's inside. And that obviously then is connected to our mental health.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah.

[Sage Steele]

And the fact that we now have so many people and leaders talking about it, whether it's with themselves or with loved ones, I feel like that's the only way that that healing continues.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah.

[Sage Steele]

You know, especially for men.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah.

[Sage Steele]

For you men in the black community, totally. It's taboo.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

You don't touch that. Yeah. You know, it's interesting we're talking about this. You know, I've struggled with mental health, specifically suicidal thoughts. So I realized that people, my context specifically, that lead mental health organizations, it wasn't until they came out and began to talk about mental health and people that I became close to that I felt the authority to talk about the mental health issues that I've had in my own life. And, you know, working out, being outside, drinking water, things that God made us to. The Bible says actually, believe it or not, the wisest and the richest man of all time, Solomon. So if you took Henry Ford, Jeff Bezos, Carnegie Zuckerberg, and you combine all their wealth together, they couldn't touch King Solomon. Economists said they couldn't even equate his wealth in terms of what he had with gold imports and exports. He said it was billions, trillions, just. Just in the imports of gold and silver and diamonds. I mean, this is raw materials. These are real assets. Right. He said, as a man thinks in their heart. To your point. Right. Self talk.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

As a person thinks in their heart. So they are. And I believe when we think in our. I tell myself every morning I'm the greatest leader of all time. I begin to watch my. Watch my thoughts the way I think. Right. Because if not, then you can find yourself in thinking, suicidal, thinking that things are never going to get better, thinking that you don't deserve it, you're not worthy or you're not worth it. So we definitely need to battle against some of those mindsets and those strongholds that Satan puts in our minds.

[Sage Steele]

How do you balance that from saying I'm the greatest leader there is with the humility that you have to have because God wants us to have that too.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Absolutely. You know, sageable, edgy. Said that I believe making yourself available to people and sharing your humanity with them, that Keeps you humble. Being where we are being. The fact that we're on the west side of Detroit, the fact that I'm from the east side of Detroit, the fact that my dad's in prison for murder. Right. Those. It's almost. Humility is almost built in. Right. The fact that like for me, always being accessible. I don't. My phone number is on my website, my personal cell phone number.

[Sage Steele]

Wow.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Because I want, I never want to feel like you. I don't have bodyguards, I don't have people around me that protect me from people. I believe that you should be able to access me anytime now. Somebody will say, oh well, what about this? What about that? I believe that I have angels that excel in strength. I believe I have warring angels and ministering angels. I believe that. Right, right. And I believe that if, if it's my time to go, it's my time to go.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

But I believe I should be able to access you and you should be able to come up to me and say, hey, Pastor, I had a question about this. The moment that I feel like I'm too good to sit down and just have a conversation with someone else, that's where arrogance comes in. I believe that's where pride comes in.

[Sage Steele]

And I, and I agree. I also think that as a father of three and a husband, people are crazy out there. Crazy. But also you need a break.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Totally.

[Sage Steele]

When you come down.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yes.

[Sage Steele]

When you take this beautiful suit, you know, like what do you do? How do you take that time for yourself? Well, you don't have to feel like, to take care of the world.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

I love. So one of the things is just a newfound tradition. I love shopping with my children. And I'm going to tell you why not for stuff. Right. Because my wife's always like you buying them stuff. I said no, it's not for that. It's the fact that I can sit down with my 16 year old son and talk to him about girls. I can sit down with my 18 year old, she'll be 18, she's 17. I'm a 17 year old daughter, Isabella. I can sit down and talk to her about how beautiful she is. And a man should love you for your mind and not just your body. I can sit down with my 13 year old daughter and feel like we can have fun together. So. So being able to be with them, shopping, obviously the shopping. So they get, they get stuff out of it.

[Sage Steele]

That's how you get them in.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Totally. It's bait, you know, it's great. You know, I love it. You Know I'm a fisherman. Right. Jesus said you should be fishers of men. That's the bait I use. Right. Are you shopping? And that has become something that in the midst of our hectic schedule, in the midst of everything we do, when I get home, that's the way I can be able to sit down with them and have that one on one time and then be able to have that time with my wife. Life where sometimes she comes with me, most of the time she's with me, and then there are times where, where she's not. But when we're together, she's not always feeling like I need to be somewhere. Right. She and I can be together. We just spent a week together in Traverse City, Michigan. So it's up north, Michigan. And so, yeah, spending that time and then being intentional, I, I, I believe for me, rest is a discipline. Because oftentimes being a high capacity leader, oftentimes you feel guilty. Or at least for me, I feel guilty for resting. So taking a discipline arrest, it's hard to do. Totally.

[Sage Steele]

But you must. And also because you are an example.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Thank you.

[Sage Steele]

You are an example, too. More than you ever dreamt of, probably. What would you tell people who are watching you and admiring you from afar?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Sure.

[Sage Steele]

But still have fear to speak up, speak their truth, whatever that is. To vote the way that they want to vote, to be vulnerable as a man, as a black man. What do you tell people who are on the verge, who know what they are but are afraid to let anyone see it?

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah. Sage. Dr. King left us a mantle. And I feel like I picked it up. And I feel like I picked that mantle up. Not for me. I feel like I picked it up for another kid that's on the east side of Detroit, another kid who has drugs in his pocket, Dad's in prison. I feel like I picked it up for the mantle for the little girl who doesn't have a dad there. I feel like I picked up the mantle for the dad who's made the decision to do wrong, but yet he needs to reconcile with his children. I feel like the mantle's picked up, that maybe I'll say something, maybe I'll do something, maybe I'll make the right decision for that person to motivate them to be everything that God has called them to be. That's what this is about. This is not about Lorenzo. This isn't about my relationship with President Trump. This isn't about a donkey or elephant.

[Sage Steele]

Right.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

This is about the lamb of God who was slain, Jesus Christ, who's all God, but was willing to become man, to humble himself, to talk to a woman who was at a well, who had a lot of boyfriends, to talk to a woman who had an issue of blood, who shouldn't even touch him, to be willing to reach out to a fisherman who would curse people out and cut people's arrows off, to reach out to a man who was on his way to kill Christians, but yet he knocked him off his beast and said, I'm the one who actually is Lord of all. That's what this is about. It's about telling everybody about somebody that can save anybody. Because I feel like I'm.

[Sage Steele]

Say that again. Say that again.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

I feel like this is about somebody who can change anybody because sometimes I feel like that I'm just a nobody body. That's what all this is about at the end of the day and, and the moment, that changes. And I have a great wife who keeps me humble, by the way. Oh, yes, she does.

[Sage Steele]

She does well, Team Molly over here.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

She does that well. And I have children who, who, who, who do well at, you know, saying that we don't need to, you know, say hi to anybody else or somebody else that comes up to them, you need to tell them I'm eating with my family type of thing. You know, you get to a place where you realize that if it isn't about Jesus, then what is it about? You know, I'm just a charlatan, right? If it's just about the next speaking engagement that I can have or how much money or this and that, you just become a prostitute in the pim, you're not really real. If it's ever about me and it's not about lifting up Jesus, then you're prostituting the gospel, right? So that's that. And it was. And it's interesting because, you know, when I'm on a plane, like even in this is security today, the security guy looks at me, he's like, you know, so, so, you know, you get that look, and I know you get the look a lot. You get that look, right? You're like, I, you know, where I know you from? He's like, you, you, you prayed at the inauguration. You know, President Trump came to your church type of thing. And then right after, he has to. He has to pat me down because, you know, I go through this again, right? He has to pack me down in an awkward way. So it's like, you know, God always allows that ebb and flow to remind you, humility, stay humble, stay meek. It's not about you. It's about others.

[Sage Steele]

Yeah. I hope you take this the right way, but I'm so proud of you.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Thank you.

[Sage Steele]

And the decisions that you made.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Thank you so much.

[Sage Steele]

Choices.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Thank you. Yes.

[Sage Steele]

That you made, including on spring break in Daytona beach as a 17, 18 year old kid.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Yeah.

[Sage Steele]

I mean, a day that it could have gone either direction. Yeah.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Thank you so much.

[Sage Steele]

The key is, are you, are you, are you ever satisfied? I feel like you're not. I feel like to the day your heart stops beating, you'll be pushing, you know, if.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

So let me tell you, if I think if there was one thing that happened, if you said, if President Trump and I were talking right now and we were able to have fair elections one day, paper ballot, I. That would be the day where I felt like I really, really was. I became the greatest leader of all time because I think he's the greatest president of all time because he talked about the thing that matters to us the most, that's for elections. The moment that we get to the place where we have a national holiday one day, paper ballots, IDs. At that moment, I would feel like in telling that story and kind of how we got there, I feel like, you know what? Now in terms of pastoring, I do have a deadline. You know, I've talked to my wife about this. I feel like 55 is the time I'm supposed to say, you know what? It's time for us to pray about another pastor, stay on with he or she four or five years and then retire officially from pastoring. I believe, you know, in our community, it's 90 years old, it's 100 years old pastors, and then you're not at the. Even now. You know, my daughter, a lot of times she's like, dad, you know, you got to do this this way on TikTok. And I'm like, you know, you feel, you know, you just, you got to reach another generation. And I feel like, like pastoring specifically, you need to have a deadline. But in terms of politics, I do feel like I would like running to run for office, you know, Senate one day because I feel like I'm doing the work of a senator now. I'm here in Washington, I'm in all the committees. I'll be with Senator Rick Scott tomorrow. I'm always working on the Senate side. So I do feel like I would like to see in my lifetime a all black Republican congressional district, a majority black congressional district, because there's not one out of a thousand majority black cities. 57 congressional districts. Districts. There's not one majority. So that's one of my main goals. So. So if you. So if you say, okay, and I'm always pushing, like, I'm always. That's just the way I am. If you say, when would you. When would you feel like you can let off just a little bit one day? Paper ballots, IDs. I'll actually take a day off when that happens.

[Sage Steele]

Okay, fair enough. I'll hold you to that. And I agree. And anyone who wants fair election, even if it ends up going with a different candidate than the one you voted for, should not have a problem with those rules. Anyone who has a problem how you've exposed yourself.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Sage, right? It's so bad. I mean, they're cheating.

[Sage Steele]

It's so blatant. Please keep preaching this word in Detroit. The fact that you're making such inroads is beautiful. It is. Stay warm. I don't know how you do it in the winter. That's the one thing I'm like, you have fun. I'll see you there in June. Otherwise, don't call me. Okay.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

It frees. It's like, cold all the time.

[Sage Steele]

I live in Florida now for a reason. I'm out. When you're my age, you'll do that. You'll be the snowbird.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

So, like, when the inauguration, how cold it was, I was like, what do you mean, cold?

[Sage Steele]

That was stupid cold.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Like, what do you mean?

[Sage Steele]

Don't lie. That was another level.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

I'm like, come on. I'm like, what? What do you mean?

[Sage Steele]

It was four, not including the wind chill. I was like, I love President Trump. I'm so glad that this is not worth it.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Like. Like outside.

[Sage Steele]

And it was worth it. I'm just saying, like. And, you know, it was a tough life, having to get to the parties in heels. I know it sounds obnoxious. It was a thing. It was.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

It was cold.

[Sage Steele]

Dangerously cold.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

And that's Detroit. I mean, that's like, Detroit.

[Sage Steele]

I know. And the sun doesn't shine either. Except you.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Oh, thank you.

[Sage Steele]

On that note, mic drop. Thank you, and God bless you.

[Pastor Lorenzo Sewell]

Thank you, Honor. Thank you so much. It's been an honor.

[Sage Steele]

It was so stupid cold there. I said things I should have been saying or thinking.