F*ck Big Banks: How This Man is Flipping the Lending System | Tim Herriage

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Science of Flipping Episode Title: F*ck Big Banks: How This Man is Flipping the Lending System | Tim Herriage
Host: Justin Colby, Bleav
Release Date: April 4, 2025

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1. Introduction to Tim Herriage and Turnus

In this enlightening episode of The Science of Flipping, host Justin Colby welcomes his dear friend and innovative real estate investor, Tim Herriage. Tim, the founder of Turnus, shares his visionary approach to disrupting the traditional lending systems that have long dominated the real estate investment landscape.

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2. The Problem with Big Banks in Real Estate Lending

Tim begins by addressing the inherent issues within the traditional lending framework, particularly the reliance on Wall Street institutions. He highlights the inefficiencies and rigidity that big banks impose on real estate investors:

Tim Herriage [02:22]: "Now, almost 95% of the money flippers use comes from Wall Street... it's slow. It's hard to predict."

Tim criticizes the cumbersome processes, such as frequent credit checks and lengthy appraisal periods, that hinder real estate transactions:

Tim Herriage [02:55]: "They ding your credit every other week. Appraisals take two months, and now an appraisal is like $900."

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3. The Birth of Turnus and Its Mission

Driven by these challenges, Tim founded Turnus with the mission to bring flexibility and speed back to real estate financing. He recounts his journey from partnering with Blackstone to creating a company that reverses the very system he once helped build:

Tim Herriage [03:05]: "But no, I mean, we just started off with the concept of if I can buy a house with pictures and comps, why can't I make a loan on a house with pictures and comps?"

Justin adds context to their collaboration, emphasizing the mutual respect and shared vision that led to the establishment of Turnus.

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4. Crowdfunding and Democratizing Real Estate Finance

A significant portion of the discussion revolves around Turnus's innovative crowdfunding approach, designed to democratize access to real estate financing. Tim explains how Turnus allows everyday investors to own shares and participate in the company's growth:

Tim Herriage [07:26]: "Turnus is Latin for threefold... we have a three core pillars approach: making money, generating passive income, and building a legacy."

He elaborates on the strategic acquisition of the Turnus.com domain and the subsequent crowdfunding campaign, highlighting the company's commitment to inclusivity and transparency.

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5. Core Values of Turnus: STARS Acronym

Tim introduces Turnus's core values encapsulated in the STARS acronym—Speed, Transparency, Accountability, Respect, and Service—which guide every aspect of the company's operations:

Tim Herriage [17:16]: "We really live, eat, breathe and sleep our core values. SPEED, TRANSPARENCY, ACCOUNTABILITY, RESPECT, and SERVICE."

He emphasizes the importance of these values in building trust with clients and maintaining ethical standards in lending practices.

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6. Flexibility and Speed in Lending Processes

One of Turnus's standout features is its ability to provide swift and flexible financing solutions. Tim contrasts Turnus's streamlined processes with the rigid protocols of big banks:

Tim Herriage [38:17]: "We charge 12% interest and 2% origination, with a $2,000 closing fee. If you're in the Founders Club, that fee is reduced to $1,500."

He underscores the advantage of Turnus's approach, where decisions are made based on asset potential rather than stringent credit scores, allowing for faster deal closures:

Tim Herriage [40:45]: "It's that easy. If your pictures are just the exterior and back, we'll ask for more. Otherwise, it's a quick yes."

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7. Personal Stories and Relationship Building

The episode delves into the personal relationship between Justin and Tim, illustrating how genuine connections and networking have been pivotal in their success:

Justin Colby [25:23]: "I was invited to a Dallas meetup... a decade later, here we are. You on my podcast, and now business partners."

Tim shares anecdotes from industry events and his experiences speaking at major conferences, highlighting the importance of putting oneself out there to build meaningful relationships.

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8. Future Vision and Technology Integration

Looking ahead, Tim discusses Turnus's commitment to leveraging technology to enhance their services. He mentions the integration of machine learning and AI to streamline underwriting processes and improve customer interactions:

Tim Herriage [42:22]: "We're using AI and machine learning to underwrite deals online and answer customer questions efficiently."

This technological advancement aims to further reduce the time and complexity involved in real estate financing, aligning with Turnus's core value of speed.

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9. Opportunities for Investors and Conclusion

The conversation culminates with Tim inviting listeners to become part of Turnus's growth through their crowdfunding platform. He stresses the dual benefits of financial returns and active participation in shaping the future of real estate finance:

Tim Herriage [34:13]: "The value in this offering is twofold. First, you have ambassadors as shareholders. Second, our annual shareholder meeting fosters a community that holds us accountable."

Justin reinforces the credibility and reliability of Turnus, encouraging his audience to trust in the company's vision:

Justin Colby [44:43]: "If it's good enough for me, it's damn sure good enough for you."

Tim concludes with a reminder of the risks involved in any investment, advocating for informed and conscientious participation:

Tim Herriage [44:55]: "If you can't afford to lose that thousand dollars, don't invest. But if you want to support a company obsessed with customer experience, check us out."

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Key Takeaways:

• Disruption of Traditional Lending: Tim Herriage aims to dismantle the slow and rigid lending systems dominated by big banks, offering a more flexible and rapid alternative through Turnus.

• Crowdfunding for Inclusivity: Turnus's crowdfunding model democratizes real estate financing, allowing everyday investors to participate and benefit from the company's growth.

• Core Values Driving Operations: The STARS acronym—Speed, Transparency, Accountability, Respect, and Service—guides Turnus's approach, fostering trust and ethical practices.

• Technological Integration: Turnus leverages AI and machine learning to enhance underwriting processes and customer interactions, aligning with their commitment to speed and efficiency.

• Emphasis on Relationships: Building genuine relationships and networking has been crucial to the success and expansion of Turnus, as exemplified by Justin and Tim's partnership.

• Investor Opportunities with Accountability: Turnus invites investors to not only gain financial returns but also to actively participate in shaping the future of real estate finance through community engagement and accountability.

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Notable Quotes:

• Tim Herriage [02:22]: "Now, almost 95% of the money flippers use comes from Wall Street... it's slow. It's hard to predict."

• Tim Herriage [07:26]: "Turnus is Latin for threefold... we have a three core pillars approach: making money, generating passive income, and building a legacy."

• Tim Herriage [17:16]: "We really live, eat, breathe and sleep our core values. SPEED, TRANSPARENCY, ACCOUNTABILITY, RESPECT, and SERVICE."

• Justin Colby [25:23]: "I was invited to a Dallas meetup... a decade later, here we are. You on my podcast, and now business partners."

• Tim Herriage [34:13]: "The value in this offering is twofold. First, you have ambassadors as shareholders. Second, our annual shareholder meeting fosters a community that holds us accountable."

• Justin Colby [44:43]: "If it's good enough for me, it's damn sure good enough for you."

• Tim Herriage [44:55]: "If you can't afford to lose that thousand dollars, don't invest. But if you want to support a company obsessed with customer experience, check us out."

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Conclusion

This episode serves as a comprehensive guide to understanding Tim Herriage's innovative approach to real estate financing. By challenging the status quo and implementing a customer-centric, technology-driven model, Tim and Turnus are paving the way for a more inclusive and efficient real estate investment landscape. Listeners are encouraged to explore Turnus's offerings and consider the unique investment opportunities presented.

Transcript

[A]

Every day, our world gets a little.

[B]

More connected, but a little further apart.

[A]

But then there are moments that remind us to be more human.

[B]

Thank you for calling Amica Insurance. Hey, I was just in an accident. Don't worry, we'll get you taken care of.

[A]

At Ameca, we understand that looking out for each other isn't new or groundbreaking. It's human. Amica. Empathy is our best policy.

[B]

I get goosebumps as I say this every time because I tell the team we make millionaires. You know, when I got out of the Marine Corps, I wanted to be a cop. I was going to be a cop, then a state trooper, then a Texas Ranger.

[A]

And I feel like you would have killed that also.

[B]

I would have, but I would not be flying around the way I fly around. That's right.

[A]

That's no doubt.

[B]

But I mean, that's what I wanted to do. In. In. In. I found real estate. I got in as a project manager. Then I was an acquisitions guy for a homevestors franchise. Then I partnered up with my partners. Then I met my wife. And then we went out on it together. And we have, you know, the Ed Mylett book. The one. And we have changed the course of our family with this business.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And the fact that we get to help others do makes me so happy. And that's why we will loan to a first time investor just like they're an experienced investor.

[A]

The science of flipping family. The big banks, decentralized financing. These are mottos that my next guest lives by. This man is a very dear friend of mine. But over 10 years ago, he brought Wall street to Main street. And now he's reversing the whole system he helped build and bringing back that money into Main Street. Tim Herridge is here with Turnus. What's up, dude?

[B]

Dude, just out of beer.

[A]

Yeah. This is gonna be fun. So you are your mottos, I call them like trigger words, but big banking. Right. Decentral finance. Decentralizing finance. This is now your new mission. But you're the. That basically went out and started the whole thing.

[B]

Yeah, I'm trying to undo the problem I created.

[A]

Yeah, I mean, yeah, I get it.

[B]

You know, it's part of my lesson in life has been everyone gets their money from somewhere. And during the Great Recession, I was an active flipper. And money dried up for investors. So 10 years ago, 11 years ago, I partnered with Blackstone to start a company called B2R Finance.

[A]

I know him well.

[B]

Which became Finance of America, which we took public in 2021. And in that 11 year, period. Now, investors don't realize. So in 0809, there was no Wall street money for flippers. Now, almost 95% of the money Flippers use comes from Wall Street. Yeah, you know, Kiavi and some of the big guys. I mean, it's all securitization. It's all Wall street money. And the problem is it's slow. It's hard to predict.

[A]

Dude, it's brutal to use.

[B]

They ding your credit every other week. They, you know, appraisals take two months, and all of a sudden, you know, now an appraisal is like, 900. I. I don't even know. I don't even know how that works.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

But no, I mean, we just. It started off with the concept of if I can, because I buy houses, you know, I've bought a couple thousand. Um, if I can buy a house with pictures and comps, why can't I make a loan on a house with pictures and comps?

[A]

That's right.

[B]

And that was kind of the entire beginning of the company. And here we are 13 months later, and it's working.

[A]

It's been fun. And a little background on that. Guys, about 13, maybe 15 months ago, him and I have a couple cocktails, jump on a private jet headed to Dallas, I believe, and he says, colby, I need you to poke holes into this business model because I think.

[B]

Tell me why this doesn't work.

[A]

That's right. Tell me why this doesn't work. And I couldn't. I couldn't think of one. I mean, I literally was like, okay, the challenge would be is, you know, you have a rookie investor. But to your point, if you are the one running this and running the ship and you're willing to buy on pictures and comps, why can't you lend? And I'm like, bro, if you have that much confidence and there's no reason, this doesn't work. And to your point, you know, I'm very still active after 18 years. You're still active. You are still buying deals. I called you the other day, and you're like, dude, I might want to buy this damn thing. Right? Like, you're not. You're not a lender in the way that we think of Kiavi or we think of some of these bigger, again, institutional funds. You are on the streets, in the trenches, teaching. And not just teaching, but, like, creating an opportunity for us, your client, to be a part of something really special at Turnus.

[B]

Well, I'm like, so many of the people listening to this. I mean, My wife and I still actively buy flip keep rentals. She still loves short term rentals, midterm rentals. And we just really know what it's like to be on the other side of the closing table. And I say it to my team all the time, like, never forget the people behind the paper. Because it's easy. You know, you get up in your office and you're looking at the paper and you start making these decisions and you forget about the realtor, the title agent, the investor, the contractors, their acquisitions people, their dispo people. Like all the people counting on us. You know, in, in a hundred loans, we were kind of just guessing, we probably impact two or three thousand families between all the contractors and the supply people and the realtors and the title agents and the insurance people. And I mean there's just a lot of people that real estate influences. So kind of that's one of our mantras is don't forget the people behind the paper.

[A]

Now out of, out of the gates, people are like, all right, what's the company? So let's hit it out of the turnus and where can people go find fill out applications? I mean, obviously turn this is, is the name of the company, but what's the easiest way for them to start the process of getting in your world?

[B]

So it's kind of a funny origin story. I don't even know if I'd come up with it yet. When you and I were flying back from Austin, the name I was reading Simon Sinek's book Start with Wine for the second time. And it talked about kind of everything's in threes, everything's in threes. And I thought, okay, if I want this product to sell itself from the inside out, the product has to align with the customer's kind of core reasons. And I kind of worked on it. And I would imagine the 100,000 people that listen to this, the three things they'll all have in common is number one, they want to make money. Number two, they want to make passive income or cash flow, say it different, whatever. And then number three, they want to build a legacy or long term wealth for their family. Yeah, and that's really like the three most common denominators of everyone that ever gets in this business. And I anyway, that bounced around my head, bounced around my head. And I started looking for like threefold.com, like really just trying to align with the three core pillars that, and that wasn't available. Some other dude had it. And then I, I was playing with it. So I got On Chad GPT. And I'm like, what's Latin for threefold? Give me a bunch of different variations. And Turnus is actually Latin for threefold. So I go to, you know, GoDaddy. I'm gonna buy turnus.com. yeah. It wasn't available. Hire the domain broker. Because I now I'm sold on it. Like, I. And I'm like, you. Like, once I decide I'm gonna do something, like, you're on. Yeah, I'm done. I offer them three grand, they say, no. I offer like six grand. They said, no, Offer like eight grand, they said, no. I'm like, man, maybe I need to find a different name. Like, because don't have a company yet.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Like, but about a week later, the guy calls the domain broker, says, give me 15k and you can have it this week. So the broker calls me, I grab the Amex, I pay for it. My wife gets a text from Amex, you. Your husband just spent $15,000 at GoDaddy. She calls me like, what the are you doing, man? Like, I'm like, it's that new business idea. She goes, tim, you know, it's like an idea. So the answer is they can go to turnus.com. i wanted a short URL that meant something.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And not about capital, not about finance, because that's not what we do.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like, so turnus.com. they can get all the information. But yeah. So Turnus is Latin for threefold, because by our existence, the customer can do loans with us and make money on flips. They can buy rental property with us and build passive income and cash flow. And then now they can actually have shared ownership.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

In the company, which allows them to help me direct the future of finance for real estate investors.

[A]

So this gives me shivers a little bit because I'm one of those people that have now ownership in Turnus. And for all of you out there, you too can have ownership. This isn't just because he's my buddy. Like, quite literally, if you go to turnus.com, there's opportunities for anybody listening to this, watching this on Instagram, to be an owner and have shares of Turnus. And I think that's cool for. Here's the big takeaway for me. I'm out of control when it comes to the lending space. I'm not the lender. I can present you the deal and give you the comps, and you can say yes or you can say no, but I have no skin. Like, I'm not in any level of control. And I can't help you become a better lender to me, by the way. Not you, the Cavis of the world. I can't help them become better lenders. You are flipping that and saying, colby, specifically you. But then the rest of you make me the best lender that could possibly be lending to you. For all purposes, whether it's flipping long term rentals, short term, let make me the best by giving me the feedback and having ownership in the company. Yeah.

[B]

So the crazy thing is, man, I get excited about this still, even though, like, I've been dreaming of it for over two years now. And we just now launch the crowdfunding raise that allows us to let the everyday investor own part of it. So I got fed up a little bit. There's a ton of debt funds out there, like, I mean, DLP and all these other groups. I mean, you can invest in their debt fund if you're an accredited investor. And then the problem is you only own the loans they give to that fund. And if that fund goes belly up, they can walk away and just form a new fund, or they can use that fund to get where they're going and then get rid of the fund and you have no upside, no continued interest in it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I was looking at it, I was like, okay, I've never done a crowdfunding before. I was like, how can I make it where it's available to everyone, even my customers? Just getting started. How can I make it available to everyone and not just Wall Street? Like, I've made a lot of money with Wall Street.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And would be really easy to go raise 5 million from Wall Street. I mean, I had a guy at the conference I'm down here for on Tuesday offer me $20 million worth of buying loans. Yeah, we don't need money. The entire vision is to make. So the. With the crowdfunding, you don't have to be accredited. I mean, you can put it on a credit card.

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

And. And buy shares in Turnus. And it's Turnus Incorporated. It's like the real company. Yeah, right. I mean, it's the company that owns all the sub companies. And I mean, we're starting an insurance company, a servicing company. We will raise some debt funds because I've got some rich buddies that would love to drop, you know, a million bucks in and make a 10% cash flow type yield. But for now, before I did any of that, I had to make sure it was available to the masses. Like, Like, I would rather have a thousand shareholders own a thousand shares than three institutions, own 10 of my company and get to tell me what to do.

[A]

That's right. As many of you know, I'm constantly on the move, juggling multiple businesses, traveling and ensuring I get my morning workouts in. Staying fresh isn't just a preference, it's a necessity. But let's face it, after back to back meetings, juggling two kids at home and the hustle and bustle of everyday life, body odor can become an issue. But here's the deal. Mando has revolutionized how I stay fresh. This isn't just another deodorant. It's clinically proven to control odor better than a shower alone with soap. My favorite scent? Bourbon Leather. It's fresh, is subtle and doesn't clash with my clone. And I was surprised by how well the solid stick works even after an intense morning workout. Mando Starter Pack is perfect for the new customer. It comes with a solid Stick Deodorant Cream Tube Deodorant, two free products of your choice like a mini body wash or a deodorant wipe, and free shipping as a special offer for listeners and new customers. You get $5 off a starter pack with our exclusive code that equates to over 40% of your starter pack. Use code [e-mail] that is s h o p m a n d o dot.com Please support our show and tell them we sent you Smell fresher, stay drier and boost your confidence from the head to the toe with Mando. Attention real estate enthusiasts and investors. Are you ready to transform your investment strategies and skyrocket your returns? Join Jason Hartman and his team at Empower Investor Live. This isn't just another conference is your gateway to mastering the art of property investment with insights and strategies from the industry's best, including our host Jason Hartman. Keynote speakers include Sharon Lecter, Mike Maloney, Tom Wheelwright, and more. There's no sales pitch, just real, innovated, actionable content and tools. Whether you're a seasoned investor or just starting out, you'll discover secrets to creating lasting wealth through real estate. Know what is coming next, learn market trends, innovative tools, and network with fellow investors. Secure your seat now and be a part of the movement that shapes the future of real estate. Empowered Investor Live is the opportunity to make 2025 the year you break all barriers to Success. Visit Empowered InvestorLive.com today for your ticket to financial freedom. Don't miss out because spaces are filling fast. Go To Empowered Investor live.com now. Empowered Investor live Invest Smarter. Grow faster Transform your future. Well, this is why it's like, so you are one of my bigger lenders. And so all you who want to know where I borrow money from, you're looking at him right now, Ternus. And so I'm not a loan officer. Yeah.

[B]

You don't want me working on your loan, Right? My team. Yeah, that's right.

[A]

Yeah. The company. The company. But I'll tell you, as a company, you guys are some of the fastest, easygoing, most flexible. I mean, we have a couple deals right now that like, KVI would not have been ideal. Right. Or I'm using Kavi because they're known as probably one of the largest.

[B]

Well, they're my target.

[A]

Right. And so, but if you keep that level of flexibility, you keep that level of like, you know, being adjustable and fluid, depending upon the asset, the borrower, the whatever, you will have more clients. You'll ever know that you will beat Kavi because they are so stringent, they are so by the book. They are so New York Wall street money. They have a box. If it's not in the box even an inch, it doesn't fly with them. And you have made my life and all of your borrowers, and I know you have 100 something loans current. Like, it's easy to work with you. It is just as easy to work with you as it is to give. Hey, here's the property, here's comps, here's pictures. Let's buy it. And in seven days, we have money type of idea.

[B]

Well, and don't forget, you put it on Instagram last year. We have a really small package. It was like the best, worst compliment ever. Ever. It's like Tim Aish has a small package. It's great. I'm like, thanks, I think, I guess.

[A]

Right.

[B]

But by doing, we don't have to securitize our loans.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I just have to make sure that if you don't pay me, I can foreclose so my loans can be more simple and straightforward. Much more like a traditional hard money. And, and, and, and it's great like that because I already have capital partners. Like, we will give you, you know, millions of dollars, but you're going to need to pull credit. I said, no, I don't. I don't. Because my part, my partners, Bill and Tom and I have enough money to not need Wall Street's money. But I also don't because I now have shareholders that understand that the credit, frankly, is your liquidity. The money you have in the bank. Do you have the Money to get the project started. Because I'm gonna loan you all the rehab and to pay the interest. That's it. That's your credit. And the asset is the collateral. And having bought thousands of houses, I'm still just an asset guy. I was talking to my mentor, Jeff Tennyson. He took Lima one from like 100 million a year to 3 billion a year. He's my CEO coach. And I was like, we haven't breakfast yesterday down here in Miami. And he was like, dude, you've got to make sure you don't lose that as you grow the company.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

Like you have to keep it. It's asset based lending.

[A]

Yeah. It's not true to asset based lending. And that's the difference right now.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Like I, that's why I would tell everybody to go to turnus.com because if you're buying any level of asset, fix and flip long term, hold shirt like it is the asset. They underwrite the asset for the asset's best potential and you lend on it. If it has good potential.

[B]

Well, it's also important. This is probably a good part to talk about. We really live, eat, breathe and sleep our core values. And I'm a Marine, so kind of dumb sometimes we need acronyms to figure shit out. So our core values is stars, speed, transparency, accountability, respect and service. And when I talk to my team about it, I've been on the other side of the table so many times. Tom kills deals. And if I yank you around or don't give you an answer quickly, even if the answer is no, I'm doing you a disservice. Right. And transparency, so many times lenders will collect that app or let you order that appraisal and they know it's going to be hard to get done. I would rather say, dude, you need to keep looking for money. And we'll do our best to figure it out. But like this is not a yes, it's a no. Yeah, but there may be something there. Let us go look at it. But for now, keep looking. It's funny, 13, 14 months into it, get so many people that just love our transparency because they're, they're like, they'll call you back, hey, real quick, can you tell me if this one will work for you? Because we already told them no twice, but they know that they can get a no from us so quick that they might as well bring us every deal and we'll just quickly tell them yes or no.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And if. And the other thing is, is if we say, yes. Funny story. Your second loan you did with us, you just text me on a Monday morning, nice and early, you're on the East Coast. I'm in Central time. You get up at like, 4am so then I think I woke up to your text at, like, 6, and it's like, heritage, what the fuck? Because we were supposed to close that day, and apparently, somewhere downstream, there was a problem. What it was was our capital partners, we have different pools of money that we pull from, and one of the partners that was going to fund that loan was like, wait a second. If we fund this loan for Colby, it'll put us where he is. Over 10% of the money we have outstanding with you, and that's a violation of your warehouse line. And I was like, well, why didn't we catch that? Well, we didn't catch it because it was the first time it had happened. That was in April of last year. We'd only been originating loans for two months. Right. Like, he hadn't had time to get to that point. But I quickly said, hey, we up? Yeah, give me a minute. Let me figure it out. We had to pull from our own cash to get the deal funded. But part of that is, you know, we don't retrade people, and we're gonna. We're gonna do what we say. We're gonna hold ourselves accountable.

[A]

You have stuck to that, and I will vouch for you. You have stuck to that. For every deal we've done, the ones that you say, colby, I don't love it. I mean, I. I see the numbers. I don't love it. You stuck by me when you were right and I was not. And I was like, bro, but look at these numbers. And, right? And sometimes you get like, oh, the numbers did make sense, but you didn't do X, Y, and Z, which made it not make sense. But you've stuck by me. That whole one terrible deal we're talking about, like, you do what you say you're going to do, you kind of.

[B]

Wish I hadn't funded it now, huh?

[A]

Oh, yeah, I do, because I wouldn't have been able to get it, and I would have given up on it. But I say all that just to give you the kudos, that this is who your company is, is who you are. It's what you stand by. And so that STARS acronym is true for you.

[B]

Yeah. So that's speed, transparency, and accountability. The next is respect. And I talk a lot about this. It's an internal core value and an external core value. I Mean, and it's not this woke bullshit. It's actually like something I super believe in. You know, you're going to get up every morning, you're going to respect yourself. You're going to show up manic, you know, with. You're going to be shaved and your shirt's tucked in and that's just how we do it at Turnus. You're gonna, you know, answer the phone politely. You're gonna treat your teammates with respect. You're not gonna allow a shitty deal into the pipeline that our, then our ops team has to clean up. You're gonna respect that. When Justin Colby buys a house, there's a realtor title agent. And you know, oftentimes in this business, a little old lady that ends up at the title company on Friday and all, everything she's ever owned is in a U Haul. And if we don't close, it's like the most disrespectful thing you can do in the world. And we've all gotten those calls from the little old lady. It's a metaphor, but it actually happens. And then the last is service. And when I say service, I get goosebumps as I say this every time because I tell the team we make millionaires. And you know, when I got out of the Marine Corps, I wanted to be a cop. I was going to be a cop, then a state trooper, then a Texas Ranger.

[A]

And I feel like you would have killed that also.

[B]

I would have, but I would not be flying around the way I fly around. That's right.

[A]

That's no doubt.

[B]

But I mean, that's what I wanted to do. And I found real estate. I got in IT as a project manager. Then I was an acquisitions guy for a HomeVestors franchise. Then I partnered up with my partners. Then I met my wife and then we went out on it together. And we have. You know the Ed Mylett book? The one. And we have changed the course of our family with this business.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And the fact that we get to help others do makes me so happy. And that's why we will loan to a first time investor just like they're an experienced investor.

[A]

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[B]

Was it the REI Expo or. Yeah, the biggest one of those was 1800 people, right?

[A]

And you're up there, and I don't know who Tim Herridge is, but everyone's like, dude, the guy who runs this thing is. He's the man. Yeah.

[B]

You never told me this.

[A]

I'm telling you now. So you're in a suit, no tie, you're up there, you're kind of giving your thing and I forget what you're talking about, but you got a slide deck, the whole thing. And I intentionally sat in the back because I was invited by one of my private clients who lived in Dallas. So I would fly to my private clients once a month. I would work with them. So we lined it up to go to this because one of the points I always make to everyone for the over a decade is the more hands you shake, the more money you make.

[B]

Amen.

[A]

And I said, you need to get intentional with going to every damn meetup. I don't care if there's 10 people in the room or if there's a thousand at this Dallas Expo, get in the room. And so I went with them. Now, I intentionally sat in the back because I wanted to kind of see what you guys were doing as. As a speaker myself. But it was an incredible point of like, you need to get in these rooms, you need to meet people, you need to shake hands. Because a decade later, here we are. You on my podcast, you didn't know this story, I'm telling you. But this is a very real reason that you always want to put yourself out there, because you never know when that paycheck comes. Right? My first mentor in real estate said, take every meeting, even if it doesn't lead to a paycheck in your pocket right now. You never know where that meeting takes you in a decade. And it's just true because we've done a lot of deals now together. We're now business partners together with Turnus. Like, it's just a cool transition to see. Everyone needs to go follow Tim. First of all, go to his social media page. He's putting a lot of effort in right now, so I'm watching it. But go check out Turnus. But then connect with him. Right? He's a real guy. He really does deals. He's very active. And I just wanted people to hear that because it tr. It truly is. I've made more money from people knowing people, relationship capital than I've ever made from direct mail, ppc, Facebook ads, etc.

[B]

So two points on that one. The REI Expo started out as just I. I'd been a homevestors franchisee for a long time, and I missed the annual convention because I just missed getting in the room with people. And this is like really pre Facebook and message boards and Instagram and there was just no real way to connect other than being in a room with someone back then.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And so I started the Expos. It was supposed to be just a Dallas trade show. And a couple of people showed up. They're like, man, you need to take this national. I was like, no. And we had 200 the first year. We had 400 the second year. Then I agreed to take it national. We went to Baltimore, Chicago and LA. And by the time we got through our fourth year, we had 1800 people at the Gaylord in Dallas for our kind of January event. And, man, through that, I got invited to speak at the Five Star Conference. And the Five Star Conference, if you don't know, is big default servicing Mortgage REO conference in Dallas. And the conference organizer happened to sit in the room and he was like, hey, we would love you to come share the path of the individual investor with these corporate finance executives and all that. I've got the picture still. I almost didn't go. I was fish out of water. Felt like the audience was gonna see right through me. I'm just a pretender. Yeah, yeah. I'm not, you know, not a college graduate. And how am I going to talk to these Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac executives? And I was, I, I have the picture. I'm in my, my closet. I've got my suit and tie on and I'll grab my Marine Corps Challenge coin. And I'm just like, you made, I'm like, you made the commitment.

[A]

I meant to bring that coin.

[B]

I have mine. Don't worry. I was like, you made the commitment. You will go. I spoke afterwards, got a line of people to talk to me. One of them is this billionaire from England. He was the founder of Invitation Homes, you know, the company that is the largest home owner in the world. And he's a British man. And he actually has already bought shares in Turnus.

[A]

Nice.

[B]

I'll buy this money for luck, Tim. Good job. But he's in line and he's like, so we're working on a project and we need your help. And I'm like, okay, who is we? And he pulls out his card, you know, chairman and founder of Imitation homes. And you're like, got it. Yeah. The next day I'm in his Dallas office. The next week they fly me to New York. I'm at the Blackstone headquarters in these 20 foot mahogany walls on the 50 something floor looking at Central Park. Same building as the, the NFL.

[A]

Rich like mahogany.

[B]

Yeah, man, like. And you talk about, I didn't belong in that room.

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

And I sit down at the head of the table. Nick is his name. He positions me and I'm like his puppet that day. And they bring in all these analysts, 20something people. Sitting around the table is, okay, tell him this, like, because he had memorized my speech and he knew exactly how I was going to help him sell the B2R idea to Blackstone. And I'm like, he's okay, enough of that. Now tell him this. And then like he, I okay, enough of that. Tell him this. Ten minutes into the meeting, the senior managing director guy that has like a $20 billion authority. Okay, good to meet you, man. Got a bounce. He gets up, leaves. I'm like, that's weird. Just got here. Yeah, you flew me up, you know, and then, you know, 10 minutes later, the next senior guy. Okay, man, good to meet you. I got to bounce on. I must be tanking this. Ten minutes later, Nick's like, okay, that'll do. Let's go, Tim. And he walks me to the elevator. I'm thinking, like, maybe we'll grab lunch, talk. Elevators closed. And he's like, okay, be in touch. And he stays on the floor. And I'm going down. I get in the car, go back to the airport, call my wife. I'm like, I'm done. She's like, well, what did you do wrong?

[A]

I don't know, right.

[B]

A couple months later, I'm the managing director of a multi billion dollar company and I learned all this institutional stuff and I mean, I'm got an office in Manhattan, an apartment, and it's just these rooms. When you're really there for non transactional purpose, if you're really just there to expand your universe and add value to people, you are one phone call.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

One hand shake away from changing the entire trajectory of your life, of your family. I mean, even my partners, Tom and Bill at Turnus, we started hanging out two years ago at Boardroom and we just became friends.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So much that one night in Tampa last year. We're dragging back in from the casino at 4:30 in the morning. And here goes Casey Quinn and all the hard chargers out for their morning run. Yeah, it's just like you're passing in the lobby, like, oh, good luck, buddy. See you in a couple hours. But I didn't. I never knew we'd be partners. Yeah, I just knew we were friends. And then my original founding partners, Charlie and Taylor, internas. I wanted to take the company in this direction of the crowdfunding. They felt like it was too risky. We parted very amicably. They still buy most of our loans from us. They wanted to be more of a loan buyer. I wanted to be more of an originator and crowdfunder. So it worked out perfect. Yeah, well, I made the Offer to Charlie. We're at lunch in October, and I'm like, hey, you know, what if. What if I just gave you all your money back? And, you know, d. He's like, we take it. I was like, oh, thought my wife afterwards, like, yeah, we got to come up with a couple million bucks. Couple text messages.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Tom and Bill are like, dude, we're in. We'll do the whole thing. Next thing you know, we buy them out. It's. And it's just me, Tom, and Bill. But it's a friendship that turned into business because it was never intended to be business. It wasn't transactional. So you can get in these rooms and do it wrong. If you're walking around only thinking about, what can I get from you?

[A]

What's in it for me? What's in it for me? What? Ken talks a lot about that, Right? So I tell people all the time, every conversation that is not an enlightened person. So when you talk to Tim Herridge, he's very enlightened. He's not thinking, what's in it for me? 99% of the human race will be thinking, what am I going to get out of Tim Herridge? What am I going to get out of Justin Colby? And that's how people think. And it's. And it's kind of natural human condition at this point. But if you go into it, even if you might be thinking it, and you actually say, okay, how can I genuinely start a relationship? Build a relationship with no agenda? The agenda becomes clear down the road. And this is why I talk a lot about giving yourself Runway if you give yourself enough Runway. Tim didn't know me 10 years ago, I didn't know Tim. I saw him speaking at his own event. I was forcing my client to go kind of engage in what we're talking about. Now, 10 years later, we become very close friends. Now we are business partners. You are my main lender. And all these different synergistic shareholder Internet. I'm a shareholder internist, which is so fun to say. Right.

[B]

Well, I got to interrupt, because that is so much the idea behind Turnus.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I do not need the money I'm going to get from the crowdfunding. As a matter of fact, we have this thing called the Founders Club for this round of investors where they get 500 bucks off of any loan they do. So if the minimum investment's a thousand dollars and you do two loans, you got shares for nothing?

[A]

Essentially, yes. I mean, literally dollar for dollar, yes.

[B]

The value in this offering is Going to come twofold. One, obviously now you have these ambassadors that are shareholders throughout the nation telling people about Turners. But two, when we have the annual shareholder meeting, we want a community of people to tell us what we're doing wrong. I don't want a community people to blow smoke up my ass or tell me that we need to focus on. Southwest Airlines made the world's worst mistake this week. Yeah. They bags no longer fly free and now legal and now they are reorganizing their workforce in the airports. And a CEO when explaining it on the news, he led with the word profit.

[A]

Not ideal.

[B]

And the minute, if you've ever read Jim Collins, good to great.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

The minute you start talking about profit first versus how do I serve my customer? How do I get better? What am I doing wrong? It means you're going in the wrong direction. I would almost guarantee you Southwest Airlines out of business the next 10 years and merge with someone else.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Because now it's all about profit. And if it's all about profit and.

[A]

Shareholder value, at that point it's come monetized.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And you're not actually caring about the people. And what they did so well for so long was they cared about the people. They became very inexpensive flights with great value ads that were quick, cheap, fast flights. I used to fly living on the west coast, I'd fly them all the time.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

From Dallas to Phoenix, Phoenix to Vegas, Vegas to la. Like all the time.

[B]

But now they're more expensive than American flights are ridiculous.

[A]

That's another. I looked at a flight today to go to Tampa. $400 each way. Not first class. Just like to Tampa is a 40 minute.

[B]

You might as well get an Uber and just work from the back and get to ski skip.

[A]

You think I'm not considering it? Yeah, like I'm legit. Like why don't I take a bright line which is a train down here. It's a three hour to Orlando, an hour Uber to Tampa. I'm just working the whole time like I'm on the phone. I can actually use it versus. Anyway, sorry, we're, we're digressing people. This is what I was.

[B]

So the, the, that's the fun part about this share offering is it is not about the $5 million that we're going to raise. It is not about the valuation that we attached to the offering. It's not about the perks. The reason I wanted Bill, people like Bill and Tom to be my partners and not Wall street is they get it. You know, Tom has built a very large, almost a thousand unit portfolio in Yuma, Arizona, by himself. Scrappy. Over the last 15 years, Bill and his family turned being dairy farmers into one of the most impressive business operations I've ever seen in his. In my life. The amount that they sell bull semen for is just crazy. Can't even say what they call that business. The point is they buy commercial properties. They buy. They're scrappy. I want to be surrounded by people that get what it's like to be belly to belly at a closing table.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Not the Wall street elite that only care about how can we make more profit off of the person that walks in the door.

[A]

So. Because I don't want people to get lost on this. Can you, can you explain terms for Turnus just because people are like, well, dude, what does a normal loan look like?

[B]

Yeah. So on our fix and flip, it's 100 financing up to 70 LT, 100.

[A]

Rewind that 100 financing up to 70 of LTV of end value of your ARV.

[B]

It doesn't matter if you've done 10 deals or 0 deals. We charge 12% interest and we charge 2% origination, and we have a $2,000 closing fee. If you're in the founders club, that fee is reduced to 1500. If somebody calls and says you're not competitive, I say, great, call someone else. Oftentimes they call us back because that someone else wants an appraisal and a credit score and, you know, a proctology exam and all that. And for us, someone, us pictures, send us your bank statements. Would you like to close tomorrow?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

It's that easy.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Now, if your pictures are just the exterior picture and the back picture and there's no inside pictures, we, we, we're going to have to ask for some more pictures. Right? I mean, and we'll send you a link and you can do all that. And probably the thing I'm most proud of, Justin, is we pay draws in 24 hours.

[A]

It's fast.

[B]

And, and having been the flipper that, you know, Friday payroll sneaks up on you and it's hard. It's hard out there. And you need to pay your people quickly because we ask people to work kind of on the cheap and fast and so that you need to pay them. And so I'm really happy with our draw process. It's, it's. You fill out some form online and we text you a link and you can even text that link. I think you guys do it. You text it to your general Contractor down in San Antonio. They run over to the house, they take pictures. It tells me that they were actually at the house on that date. And it gets emailed to my draw inspector in house, which is actually my brother, which is another superpower we have right now that we're trying to, you know, as we get to scale, we have to figure out. My brother jamin is. He's probably bought 800, 900 houses for me that I made every decision based off of what he told me.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So to have him kind of in that draw department and on the front end, diligence side is helpful. We're looking at hiring some other people, maybe some people that were. If you're out there, say you were an acquisitions manager somewhere and volume slowed down. We want to talk to them. If they worked at Open Door Zillow, we want to talk to them because we've got to make sure we're staffed with asset guys and gals. Right. People that really understand real estate. I can figure the rest out.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

With finance people. I just need to make sure we're making good loans on good houses and good neighborhoods.

[A]

Yeah, it's. Guys, first of all, 100 lending is incredible. Buy it right. Like understand how to comp the property. Understand what the actual ARV is. Just buy it right. And they're going to give you a hundred percent of the money you need. They do it very fast. You, yesterday you text me, you said, you need to be able to cut the check by today.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You said, hey, you got to solve for this thing that my team meets. Literally, my general manager replies, hey, that's on the deal. And then you're like, great, I can't send the wire until you guys give us that thing. That wire will hit today. And literally. You brought it up yesterday. We're talking about one day. And we have.

[B]

I brought it up last night.

[A]

Last night. Right.

[B]

And so that's one of the reasons, Justin, that we're selling shares is I am in sight, insanely obsessed with technology.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

We are implementing machine learning into everything we do from even sizing or. Or reconfiguring loan offers. Offers. So if you're a new person and you're buying a heavy rehab and you've never done a deal, and you're. You're borrowing money from your dad to get it done. We will do that. Loan that.

[A]

No doubt.

[B]

But you're going to prepay six months of interest and we may lower your loan to 65%.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Well, we've now for six months. We've been building and testing this automatic little robot that takes in those data points and says and will give the customer a quicker answer to those what we call exceptions.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Right. If you're just buying a normal 322 brick house and needs paint and carpet and you have money in the bank.

[A]

Like here's the money.

[B]

Super easy.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

We've got to be able to say yes to some other things. Yeah. And. And we're using AI and machine learning to do it. One thing that I'm super excited about is we download all call transcripts every night and we load it into the machine learning engine.

[A]

I love that.

[B]

And then my IT guy, my VP of technology, has figured out a way to wait towards our top producing salespeople in those call transcripts to. Because we want to. We're designing a chat bot that basically can underwrite your deals online and answer your questions. But we want to wait towards the guy or gal that's actually getting stuff closed.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Not the maybe dip that's going to get fired. That's right.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

We're using VAs for a lot of stuff. So we're just like the customer, you mean? It's like VAS and this and that. But we're downloading their inbox every day. Like what questions are they getting asked? How are they being answered? Are there common threads? Does it point to a pro partner process that needs to be fixed? Is there. Is there a if. If 80% of the customers ask the same question, you've got a massive problem on the front end.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And massive is not massive, but for me it's massive because again, my core values, speed and transparency. Right. I need to be able to tell you everything as fast as possible so you can make an educated decision for your business and your family.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

So part of this fundraise, if they go to invest.turners.com it breaks down the use of proceeds. Know we're going to spend two and a half million on funding loans and there's like, I don't know, half a million. You have to reference the thing on just pure technology development. Like we're trying to. So fun to build something on new technology and not be stuck on old technology. Yeah. So. So that's. That's another reason that we decided to raise the capital when we did is, is to improve in every way we can as fast as possible.

[A]

Guys, if you aren't getting the gist here, Turnis is the company. Tim Herridge is the man. There's opportunities not just to get Loans that are relatively fair market. Right. Like, may not be the total cheapest, but is the easiest, the fastest. Coming from a true operator, yourself, your wife. Like, guys, I. I don't know how else to sell what I'm saying right now. Besides, if you're following me and watching this, you got to trust that Turnus is the company that I use. And if it's good enough for me, it's damn sure good enough for you. Right.

[B]

And all investments involve risk. I've had some really good friends in the industry call like, hey, what do you think the projected return is? I'm like, look, I can't say that.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like, you should. If you can't afford this, you should just expect. You shouldn't do it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And you should expect that. I think the minimum investment's like a thousand bucks. If you can't afford to lose that thousand dollars, don't buy, don't invest. Yeah, but if you want to be supportive of a company that is insanely obsessed in the customer experience, you should definitely check us out.

[A]

Yeah. I think everyone understands who always wins in every transaction.

[B]

The lender.

[A]

The lender, the bank. Right. I mean, and you and I were just talking about this off camera. I don't want to go be a bank, but if I can just cut a check to Turnus and own shares and be your partner in that, I'm effectively getting the win I want without having to go build what you are building. And that's what everyone wants. They don't want to do the work. They want the. They don't want to have the. The labor. They want the baby. And I just want the damn baby, Tim. And so if you guys are out there, I want more babies. I don't want that. I mean, either. But if you don't want the labor of like building a lending business in knowing that that's a great space because it is. Right. And getting 10, 12, 15% and great. But if you don't want the labor of doing what Tim has to do, then take a strategy like me, like, be an investor.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Get shares. Because now I can just have the baby with the payoff and not have to go through the labor.

[B]

Well, and Google has an awesome saying. It says no one knows everything and everyone knows something. And probably the most thing, the thing I'm most excited about is the first shareholder meeting that's going to be in September where we bring together, you know.

[A]

We do it somewhere really cool.

[B]

Yeah, I got it planned. You know, you bring together 500, 1,000 people that have all invested in the successful outcome of something. And the board and I are just super excited about bringing them together and hearing them.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And doing little focus groups, doing surveys. Like, I don't want to just have people invest. I want people. People to hold us accountable and be a part of the next evolution of financing for investors. Like I said 10 years ago, these DSCR loans we B2R finance. My. I ran the sales and marketing team there. We originated the first ever DSCR loan almost 10 years ago. Is in April, may have been March. Actually, it may have been exactly 10 years ago. Until that, it was only DSCR portfolio at B2R. And I went to the board at Blackstone. I said, Look, 89% of the people that call us, even though like our website straight up says, don't call unless you have five freaking houses, 89% of the people that call say, I only have one. Can you help me? I can't get money anywhere. And so Blackstone's like, fine, you can do $10 million worth of single asset loans. I'm a nerd. I'm a finance nerd. Now in the securitizations, it's still called the slp, which me. Which we came up with on the fly. It means single loan product. There you go. Because we had the entrepreneurial loan product, which was the five house portfolio. And I had to call it something for the sales team. I was like, ah, Brendan, what are we gonna call it? He's my VP of sales time. He goes, slp. I was like, there you go. Still called that in securitization documents. Kind of funny, but yeah, man. Brian Partridge, who you've met, was kind of our number one sales guy, B2R back then. He sold the first couple dozen of them and we sold out in like three days. And you're like, oh, that's something. Yeah. And so we do DSCR as well. Long term rental loans. That is not a Turnus product yet. That is just a. It's a. Since those have to be sold to life insurance companies or hedge funds or whatever, because nobody has money to tie up for 30 years like that. That's still conforming to kind of the pain of normal. You know, you got to have credit and appraisal and all that. But, you know, we're closing them in two weeks and that's kind of unheard of. Yeah, but we're doing that because my team is just. I mean, the. The reason speed is the first letter in stars and not the last is not only does time kill deals but time will get you deals. So like today is the 20th of March. No way. Most lenders could close a DSCR by March 31st.

[A]

No way.

[B]

No way. We could.

[A]

How?

[B]

Because we would be really transparent with you up front. We'd say, listen, we can do it.

[A]

We'll find.

[B]

I need all of your bank statements today. I need your insurance today. I need you to pay for the appraisal today. And you need to make call and follow up with the appraiser tomorrow and make sure the report is done tomorrow. Tomorrow's a Friday, so then I'd have it in by Monday and I'd have full seven days. Once I have the appraisal, the credit report, the lease, the bank statements, I can get you into underwriting. Underwriting can clear in 48 hours. It can be done. The problem is most of our customers, we are unorganized and slow because we like to about the lenders, not about ourselves. I talked about this yesterday and I'm saying we because I'm one of them. I bitch about lenders too.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

We are radically obsessed with changing the way business is done. And eventually we'll have our own DSCR product. I mean I see a world where we can do a DSCR product without credit.

[A]

I mean, have we done a DSCR through you yet? I think, I think we have one, yeah.

[B]

I don't know any.

[A]

I didn't force you to do it in seven days.

[B]

It's. It probably the point is it's not ideal, but we close them in two weeks.

[A]

All the time it's guys, I want to see you guys watching this and listening to this at the shareholder meeting in September. That's what I want because I want you and me to be able to help this man create a product that is needed in this space because it doesn't exist. What you've done at Turnus and what you're building in the direction you're going with your thesis is a product that doesn't currently exist. That makes my life, your life as an investor and your guys life as an investor way easier, faster and smoother. So my encouragement find Turnus, go to their website. But also I want you guys to, to join me in helping this man on the journeys on. And we can do that as shareholders. That's how we make an actual dent in how lending is, is done moving forward.

[B]

Take it back.

[A]

And so I appreciate you joining me too today. And we have a long journey, but it's gonna be fun man.

[B]

I appreciate you having me.

[A]

Yeah, man. All right if this was pretty cool. And you think there's two people that need to know more about Turnus Hard money, lending the space we're in, or just need money. Then make sure you share this with those two friends and we'll see you on the next episode.

[B]

Peace.