← The Shit No One Tells You About Writing
The Shit No One Tells You About Writing
Making Context Feel Organic
01:07:19
Books with Hooks, Bianca, Carly and Cece
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- [00:00]
Bianca Murray
Did you know that your calendar age doesn't always match how old your body truly is? It's true. Your biological age, the age of your cells and organs is actually the number one predictor of your risk for serious diseases like heart disease, cancer, dementia, and more. That's why learning your biological age can be truly life changing. And that's what the true age test from True Diagnostic helps you do. With just a simple at home test, you can uncover your true biological age and get personal personalize insights into your true biological age and take control of your health like never before. No doctor's visits, no labs, just a quick finger prick from the comfort of your home. As you guys know, I care a lot about fitness and lifestyle because I do triathlons and it's really important for me to take care of my health. So here's the thing that really inspired me. Up to 90% of biological aging is driven by lifestyle. That means the way we eat, move, sleep and manage stress is a massive role in how fast or slow our bodies age. True Diagnostic just doesn't tell you your biological age. It gives you a personalized report of full, clear science back steps you can take to actually slow down aging and improve your health over time. I'm really excited to see the results.
- [01:08]
Carly Waters
And see what they have to say.
- [01:10]
Bianca Murray
About my health because as I said, I do take it variously very seriously. The test itself is super easy, just a quick painless finger prick. You send in your sample using a prepaid mailer and about two, three weeks you get detailed online reports with actionable insights that you can use. If you care about protecting your health and want to find out what your real age is, head over to TrueDiagnostic.com and use my code T Snotya to get 20% off your entire order or subscription.
- [01:38]
Carly Waters
That's true.
- [01:39]
Bianca Murray
Tru Diagnostic.com and use T Snotya at checkout to get 20% off your future.
- [01:44]
Cece Lira
Self will thank you Beta Reader Matchup time is happening again. It's been so gratifying over the summer to be tagged in so many posts about beta readers who've become writing besties and who are still going strong many years after they were first matched. Some even travel to meet up and do writing weekends together. Which sounds incredible. I can't guarantee any of that. That's entirely up to you. But what I can guarantee is that you'll be matched with a group of people working in your genre and or time zone who will critique 3,000 words of your work as you critique theirs. In return, you can sign up from now until the 31st of August with the matchup emails going on the 1st of September. Head to my website Biancamarae.com and look for the Beta Reader Matchup tab. Hi there and welcome to our show, the Shit no One tells you About Writing.
- [02:49]
Tali
I'm Bianca Murray and I'm joined by.
- [02:51]
Cece Lira
Carly Waters and Cece Lira from PS Literary Agency. Hi everyone and welcome back to another Books with Hooks. Today we have our author joining us.
- [03:02]
Tali
Which we're very excited about. Telly, welcome to the show.
- [03:06]
Telly
Thank you so much Bianca. I'm so excited to be here.
- [03:09]
Tali
We're excited to have you here. Will you please kick us off by reading your query letter?
- [03:14]
Unknown
Of course. I'd be delighted to dear CeCe, Carly.
- [03:19]
Telly
And Bianca, thank you for having me on Books With Hooks.
- [03:22]
Unknown
I'm a big fan of the podcast which has been an incredible resource throughout my writing journey. Query was tailored with cece in mind as her wish list mentions a desire for stories centered around social justice and feminist issues, core themes in my manuscript. I so appreciate the opportunity to share.
- [03:40]
Telly
My work with you.
- [03:41]
Unknown
I am seeking representation for the color of a 70,000 word coming of Rage Horromans the novel blends Latvian mythology and folklore with an examination of critical theory similar to Blood over Brighthaven, the Gothic horror and exploitation of Mexican Gothic, and the Eastern European setting of Juniper and thorn. In 1900 Latvia, women combine their blood with pigment to create magical art that comes to life. Stasi, an ambitious painter, is chosen to compete for a coveted art residency hosted by the von Nochtraaben family, Europe's most powerful paint magnate, but rumor has it a past competitor was terribly disfigured. Still, Stassi eagerly accepts. After all, the competition is a chance to elevate her social standing, earn her emotionally distant parents approval, and escape the brothel where she secretly works. At the von Nachtraben estate, Stassi is forced to share a room with Helmi, her art school rival. Even worse, the grisly rumor becomes all too real. A fellow competitor is gruesomely killed, forcing Stassi and Helmi to set aside their differences and uncover the dark truth behind the competition. When their investigation leads them to a toxic green pigment engineered to weaken women who paint, they suspect the purpose of the competition isn't to identify the strongest.
- [05:05]
Telly
Magical women, but to eliminate them as.
- [05:09]
Unknown
A forbidden Sapphic romance kindles between Stassi and Helmi, and more women perish. The rivals to lovers navigate deadly trials, backstabbing competitors and the Van Nachtraben's insidious web of control. Stasi will risk her love and her life to stop the elite intent on silencing women and upend the rarefied world she once longed to join. I'm a neurodivergent PhD candidate. I graduated summa cum laude with a degree in environmental studies and a minor in French, concentrating on French literature and linguistics. I later earned a J.D. mBA with distinction.
- [05:44]
Telly
But after several years practicing corporate law.
- [05:46]
Unknown
I found that drafting contracts and closing deals left little room for creative expression. Since then, my passion for storytelling has.
- [05:53]
Telly
Taken over my life, and I won.
- [05:55]
Unknown
My first writing contest, the Seven Stories Writing Competition. Thank you for your time and consideration. I'd be thrilled to share this story with you. And that comes in at 368 words without the personalization.
- [06:07]
Tali
Amazing, Tali. Thank you so much. Okay, Cece, we're going to throw it over to you.
- [06:13]
Carly Waters
This is such a brilliant query letter. You did such a good job reading it too. You know how to write and read a query letter. It's. It's really impressive. Truly. I read this query letter, and you'll see this in my notes in. Our substack supporters will, too. I really want a coming of age horror romance. The plot points were just killing me in the best way. You gave me exactly what I needed to know in terms of the journey, in terms of the escalation. Like, I literally wrote in the margins, you are killing me in the best way. It's perfect as is, and you should be very proud of it. If you want me to be super, super, super nitpicky, because on the show, and you're asking for advice, there could be potential to sharpen the why her angle. Like, right now, it could be any student's story. Like, why is she the one to fight the good fight? But truthfully, like, just saying, I don't actually need to know the answer to this, because if this had been in my query inbox, I would have been like, oh, my gosh, yes. Scrolling down to read this with urgency. With pleasure, with curiosity. Which is exactly the goal. So congratulations.
- [07:14]
Tali
Thank you, Cece. Okay, Carly, handing it across to you now.
- [07:17]
Unknown
All right, so my goal this summer is to help everybody work on their hooks. In our last episode where we did a query letter, I went through some examples of different ways to write your hook. And so for you, actually, I don't think you have a hook written down here. So do you want to unmute yourself and just say, like, what do you think your hook is?
- [07:37]
Telly
Okay, so by hook, do you mean my Pitch. Like that little elevator pitch.
- [07:42]
Unknown
I mean, your log line, your elevator pitch. Exactly. Yeah.
- [07:45]
Okay, so it's Stassi mixes her blood with paint to create magical art like youth restoring portraits. But when she discovers a plot to eradicate powerful female artists, she'll risk her forbidden Sapphic love and her life to rise against the powerful elite who would silence her.
- [08:01]
Okay, so why don't you have that in here?
- [08:06]
Telly
I currently do. This is a previous iteration, unfortunately.
- [08:10]
Unknown
Okay, good. Okay, good, good, good. I'm putting you on the spot. Okay. Because so for me, the way that I read this one is that where the hook should be. What you have is Latvian mythology and folklore with an examination of critical theory. Like, that's where your hook should go. And so you are coming off super academic here when what we need is, like, that's where the juicy part of the. Of the hook goes. So I'm glad to hear that you have a hook, that you have an elevator pitch. Do you want to hear some of my examples? I went through with my query formulas and put together some for you. So I'll run through them. So keep them, you know, leave them, whatever. This is also a good exercise for everybody listening because it just shows there's lots of different ways to write your hook in a way that, you know, can service your story in different ways. So last time I went through some examples of the character goal obstacle formula, the character situation complication formula, the character desire conflict formula, the what if question formula, and the irony or twist formula. So I'm going to kind of use those formulas. These are all from my author's publishing playbook, so everybody has access to them there. And if you're not in the playbook, you know where to go to find it. Okay, so let's go through some of your examples. I want to start with the In a World format. So this doesn't work for everybody, but because there's some world building here, I just wanted to run through some examples. I actually think In a World works here. So anyway, I'm going to run through them. In a world where magical art is born from women's blood and power is wielded by a sinister patriarchy, Stassy wants to elevate her social standing, improve her worth, only to discover she must risk everything to fight for the very women her society intends to silence. I kind of like it. Like, In a World One here, just throwing that out there. Another one. In a world where elite families exploit and disfigure magical women, Stassi wants to win a prestigious art residency, but she finds herself caught in a deadly conspiracy in a forbidden romance that forces her to choose between survival and revolution. So again, some more examples here all of our Substack subscribers will see. I've written out five different examples for everybody to check out. And just showing you there's different ways to write your hook in a way that can service the story, service the query letter. You also don't want to make your query letter too long by writing a hook that essentially like, summarizes the query letter in itself. But I'm glad to hear that your more recent edition has a hook in it because this is a very hooky story. And I think that you weren't, like, doing the pitch justice by just kind of running through the plot points as opposed to. Let's just start off with something that's really going to grab our attention. So, so glad to hear that. The word horromance. I am not familiar with the term horromance. It doesn't roll off the tongue especially. Great. I know on this show we, we read them aloud. So if it is something where, you know, TikTok is talking about horromance and it's a thing that we need to lean into, then that's fine. But it's again, doesn't roll off the tongue super, super easily. But, you know, not my business if that works here. My last question is kind of like.
- [10:58]
Is this YA or adult?
- [11:00]
Because you call this coming of rage. And I love the word coming of rage. It's awesome. But I'm not really clear on whether this is adult or ya. So I would probably find a way to signal to us which it is in a way that's a bit more clear. I kind of thought it was adult because coming of rage is upon a coming of age, which is generally more like an adult. An adultification. Look back on our childhood. We'll get to the pages later where I think it's definitely more ya, but I do think you should probably spell that out a bit more more. But other than that, you know, little notes for you here and there, which again, our Substack subscribers will see. But yeah, just my. Just my pro hook stance. As always, we need to leave with a hook.
- [11:40]
Tali
Thank you, Carly. Okay, Tali, we're going to hand it across to you now where you can either answer those questions or ask questions of your own.
- [11:48]
Telly
Fantastic. Thank you so much for that feedback.
- [11:51]
Unknown
That is super helpful. So, Carly, in terms of your point.
- [11:55]
Telly
Of what is the audience for this? So it's interesting, actually. I Was speaking with an editor at Macmillan on Monday, and she had mentioned that this is very much a crossover piece. So I had written it intending it to be adult, and that's how I.
- [12:10]
Unknown
Saw it with the themes.
- [12:12]
Telly
But it falls into young adult as well because of the writing and especially the first person and the voice, I think, could appeal to young adult. So this editor that I was talking.
- [12:24]
Unknown
To, I think she primarily focuses on.
- [12:26]
Telly
Young adult, and she said she'd be interested in seeing the project once it's represented. So that was really exciting. But anyway, so I think it does.
- [12:35]
Unknown
Have a crossover appeal.
- [12:36]
Telly
I would probably market it as adult, but is there an ability to play around with that? I know there's the new adult market that you can play to, but do.
- [12:47]
Unknown
I have to decide at this point.
- [12:49]
Telly
Who the audience is and stick with.
- [12:51]
Unknown
That, or how does that work?
- [12:53]
Yeah, it's a great question, I think. Something we've debated a lot on this show and the industry debates a lot. So there isn't one magical answer. I will say there is a level in which you have to commit to something, because with you pitching editors or, you know, your agents, again, and I know you had a conversation with an editor, but your eventual agent will pitch editors. These are completely different categories, often in different buildings, with teams that do not communicate with each other at all. Separate marketing departments with separate specialties between kids and adults. So they are very, very different in how they kind of function with their audiences. Often the market in terms of, like, whether library is a primary market for them, for example, or schools. So there's definitely a certain level of needing to commit very early on. There are select imprints that do crossover work, and that is their goal. And I have a feeling I know who you're talking about in terms of, you know, the imprints that you're talking to. But when you think about going out on submission with something, you know, sometimes the first round will be seven to 12 editors. And then again, if it doesn't sell, we go to, you know, another round and another round, like. So we. We need a basket of, like, 30 editors to be able to submit to. And so if you think, like, this is new adult or this is. Has to hit a crossover editor, all of a sudden we took, you know, if you could imagine, like, the diagram where it's, like, the two circles and they're crossing over. What diagram is that?
- [14:10]
Venn diagram.
- [14:11]
Telly
Venn diagram.
- [14:12]
Unknown
Venn diagram. Thank you. My literary background did not take me all the way to math class. So our Venn diagram. Right. Where it's like this is our adult circle, this is our kid lit circle. How close do these two do this? Like, barely. Right, they're touching. And so that's the little sliver in the middle where we're attacking that category. And it's just so small. And so I find in my experience, if something wants to be crossover, it has to be the best at what it is doing and therefore creates crossover momentum because it is then word of mouth and carries itself into the next category. So to me, crossover is. It's a lot of things and it's. I think a lot of people want to be crossover. So again, people can call themselves whatever they want, but it's a mix of audience, it's a mix of marketing, it's a mix of positioning, it's a mix of packaging. It's just so many things. So it's kind of a long winded way of saying, I think you need to pick. And I think it's why.
- [15:06]
Telly
Yeah, I think that I would agree. And that's really fascinating feedback in terms of the actual marketing the book to editors point of view. That's really interesting insight that I'm glad to glean here.
- [15:18]
Tali
Do you have any other questions, telly for Carly and Cece, or any other input based on the query letter before we go to what's in the pages?
- [15:26]
Unknown
I don't really believe. So I want to work my joke.
- [15:29]
Telly
About the bear in here.
- [15:32]
Tali
So Tally noticed that she. You can tell us what you noticed. And I said it was too late. They already have the pages.
- [15:40]
Telly
Yeah, I was mortified. I was looking at the query letter as I was editing it, and I saw that I had written grizzly as in the bear, instead of grizzly as in scary. So I told Bianca I'd have to work a bear into the manuscript. So it was foreshadowing and not a typo, but that was just.
- [15:56]
Unknown
I didn't even notice, which tells you how much I know about that.
- [16:00]
Tali
Oh, my God.
- [16:00]
Carly Waters
We are not getting back to base.
- [16:02]
Tali
Love you again.
- [16:03]
Carly Waters
Bears love me. Bears love me. Bears love me. And they would be my friends. Guys, everybody knows this.
- [16:09]
Tali
Listen, bears, as in the gay men also love me, but not the wild bears. So, okay.
- [16:14]
Carly Waters
Talk about wild bears. Wild bears.
- [16:19]
Tali
Okay.
- [16:20]
Unknown
Right.
- [16:21]
Tali
We will move swiftly along from there. I would just like to stop here because we are having a word from our sponsor.
- [16:30]
Unknown
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- [20:04]
Tali
So, Tali, we are now moving to the pages. Can you please summarize for us what is in those opening pages?
- [20:10]
Telly
So we begin with Stassi in the.
- [20:12]
Unknown
Halls of her school, and she overhears.
- [20:15]
Telly
Other students talking about a rumor that.
- [20:18]
Unknown
Some girl was set ablaze. So that catches her attention and she starts thinking, oh, my goodness, what is going on? This must be about this competition that every artist wants to get into. And so she makes her way to her classroom. We learn a bit about Stassi. She's always late.
- [20:33]
Telly
She walks into her class and her.
- [20:36]
Unknown
Professor chastises her a little bit. And then we find out that Stassi.
- [20:40]
Telly
Has actually been chosen for this competition where somebody was set ablaze.
- [20:44]
Unknown
And her rival is also going to be joining her there.
- [20:48]
Telly
We learn a little bit about the magic system and how it works with.
- [20:51]
Unknown
Blood weaving, which essentially, artists mix their blood with paint.
- [20:56]
Telly
They paint subjects before them, and that.
- [20:59]
Unknown
Affects the natural subject that they see. And then at the end of these.
- [21:03]
Telly
First five pages, a big glob of green paint flies past Dasi's face and lands on her canvas.
- [21:10]
Tali
Wonderful, Tali. Thank you so much. Okay, Cece, we're gonna hand it across to you again.
- [21:15]
Carly Waters
I am making a face because I have a lot of notes, so I will not be able to share all the notes. But you can absolutely read my notes once you have them and let me know if you need me to elaborate on anything else. Unlike the query letter where I was like, I have no Notes. I have a lot of notes. My first note is there are some really beautiful lines. I really, really enjoyed the care that you put into this. I made sure to, like, highlight the moments where you were like, oh, my God, this is beautiful writing. Thank you. Thank you for writing this beautiful writing. I'm gonna read one for our listeners. The boom slicing our anticipation like a blade against bone. It's referring to a movement with a knife. It's simple, right? But it's so evocative, the imagery so powerful, and it's so baked into the scene. Like, this is in the middle of, like, dialogue. So you did a really good job there. And I could see the care that you put into this. So thank you. There were also really good moments of emotional calibration. There's one moment where the calibration's off, but all the other moments, it was perfectly in tune. And again, hard to do. So really want to congratulate you for that. I do have a lot of notes on how to improve this. The first is tone. So Carly mentioned horromance. Horror romance. I don't know how to say this either. It's very hard to pronounce. I totally agree. It does not roll off the tongue. I know it is a thing because I'm obsessed with Isabel Kagnas, specifically vampires of El Norte. But really, anything the woman writes, I will read. And it's 100% like a genre. People are obsessed with it. I'm obsessed with it. So I do think we should have picked a better word as a community. But we didn't, and that's fine. The tone isn't there. Like, we don't have a horror romance tone. A horror romance, whatever. The word is tone. I encourage you to read the genre to see how from the very first chapter, there's that eeriness, that. That sense of danger. Like, we have her eavesdropping. I thought, oh, there's gonna be danger because she's eavesdropping. But there isn't. Her interiority actually tells us, you know, no use being caught. I'm gonna be late for class. It's all very low stakes and safe. Like, you're keeping her safe, and you can't keep her safe. If this is your genre, it read like ya. When I read the query letter, I did not think it might be ya. I didn't catch that. That's on me. But when I read the pages, I was like, this. This reads like ya. You have to decide what it is, obviously. And I 100% agree with Carly. You have to make a decision. If you try to make your manuscript crossover, nine times out of ten, what happens is it's. It ends up being neither, you know, so you end up actually losing both markets as opposed to gaining both markets. It sounds unfair. It is unfair, but it's also life. So let's. Let's live in life. But the tone and the writing, I think you need to decide what you want it to be, and I can't make that decision for you. I would be more excited if it were adult, kind of like Isabel Kagnas. That's my preference as a reader. But this isn't my book when it comes to interiority. One note I have for you, and this is an easy fix, but you're going to have to go through your whole manuscript. You are clearly writing this for a non Latvian reader. Like, you're clearly writing this for a US reader, I imagine, right? Or. Or Canadian reader. My point is, like, she's saying things like, it's the highest honor, a Latvian artist. Like, she's saying things that you wouldn't think. Like, I grew up in Rio de Janeiro, Brazil. I wouldn't think this is the greatest honor that a Brazilian. I would just think this is the greatest honor. You don't think to the audience that you're writing for. The protagonist doesn't think for the audience they're writing for. The protagonist is in their own bubble. They might say things like, we're talking about a competition. But they might say things like, all of Europe recognizes this honor. Or, you know, it's a top honor in Europe or in the world or internationally recognized. They might think that. But you don't keep qualifying your location because it's just normal for her. That's. That's the only place she's ever lived, right? So that's really, really important to remember. And it's one of those tells where it's like, not authentic, you know? Like, I get that it's probably your background. I imagine it is anyway. But my point is, you're not thinking like somebody who grew up there. And you have to, because you have to inhabit her head. The other thing, and this is really the big note, Charlie, I am saying this with love. I am going to diagnose you. Are you ready for your diagnosis? Not if you are. Shake your head if you are not. Okay, you are. All right, here goes your diagnosis. Drum rolls. You are, my dear, an over explainer. It's what you are. You are explaining way too much, way too much. Like, you are going to be tired of reading my notes because in every page there's like three or four highlights with me going, why are you explaining this to me? Why are you explaining this to me? And even things like trying to think of a really good example. But when she's thinking about her friendship with her now rival, she thinks back to the little village where they grew up. And you explain where the village is.
- [26:07]
Telly
It's.
- [26:07]
Carly Waters
I'm not going to know how to pronounce the village's name, so I'm sorry, but it reads like this. Once Wilhelmina and I were friends. Two young girls gathering berries in the woods and bathing in sunlit streams near her family's home in Vek Pyabala, a quiet village in northern Latvia. Why would you say quiet village in northern Latvia? Like, why? Like why why? Why? Like, let us figure this out. I get why. Like, I know why. The why is you want the reader to know what's going on. You want to do a good job. You want to be a good student and show your work.
- [26:36]
Unknown
What?
- [26:37]
Carly Waters
Do not show your work. That is not your job. Your job is to seduce, not to explain. There are three Cs that go into every strong beginning, curiosity, context and connection. You need to tone down the context. Context needs to feel organic.
- [26:52]
Telly
A.
- [26:52]
Carly Waters
You have to trust that the reader doesn't have to know everything right away. That's part of it, but it's also like, it can't be a situation where you're explaining it to me. It needs to be a situation where it comes naturally, inorganically. A really good book for you to read for this line is the Bandit Queens by Parini Shroff. In the first chapter, we have her, the protagonist, letting the reader know that Saloni, the woman that Geeta is talking to, Geeta is the protagonist, was her childhood best friend. But she doesn't explain it. She weaves it in. She bakes it into the story in a way that feels really, really organic. And when it comes to the world building, especially because this requires so much world building over explanation can just kill the mood, you know, it removes the reader from the story. It reminds the reader someone is writing this for my benefit. My benefit being the reader. And the reader doesn't want that. So the best way to learn how to do this is to read another book. A book I highly recommend is gutter child by J.L. richardson. Take a look at the way the author wove in what the gutter system is like. We have references to the gutter system throughout the beginning of the novel. Had no idea what it was. I had theories. I had a notion that the gutter was a scary place and that the protagonist didn't want to go there and that as much as she was in the school, at least it wasn't the gutter. But I don't know what the gutter is. And when we finally learn what the gutter system is, it's in dialogue, it's super organic. It makes sense. It's not two characters talking about things they already know. It's so, so baked in and well done. So I highly recommend reading that book, too, so you can take a look at how to do that. It's going to elevate your craft so much. That, all being said, I'm not convinced that you're starting in the right place. There's not enough of disruption. I don't know if you meant for the disruption to be the eavesdropping, but that's low stakes because it's not a big deal. All she's doing is eavesdropping. There's no danger. I don't know if you meant for the disruption to be the fact that she gets. She gets the position, right? Her and her friend. But that's, like, good news, you know, so it's like, not super. I just, again, I think that if you're going for this genre blend, which is honestly one of my favorite genre blends, possibly my favorite, and it's so much fun to read a book that has both horror and romance. Did you notice how I avoided saying the word there, the hard word? I just think that it has to be a different place to start. And I don't know if you have other ideas of places to start. I just don't know. But you have the talent, and I think you should trust your talent and stop explaining, because I promise the reader will get it.
- [29:22]
Tali
Thank you, Cece. We'll have an opportunity to brainstorm with Tali and Telly. Like, as somebody who wrote her debut that was based in South Africa, I completely understand this need to contextualize and to explain and to orient the reader, especially if you've had beta readers. Because sometimes I remember when my debut was being beta read, people would be like, I don't know what this place looks like. I don't know where this place is. And so you tend to put those in to orient your beta readers as you're going along, and then that can take readers out of the story. So I totally get the struggle here and why it's so difficult. We're going to hand across to Carly and Then we'll come back to you, Tali, and then we can brainstorm potentially in terms of disruption.
- [30:03]
Unknown
So, Kali, I agree with Cece. I'm not going to sugarcoat it. I definitely think we're not starting in the right place. And you're writing this for the reader, not for the story. And I think those are some problems that I would. I would diagnose here. I would think. I'm trying to think back. I haven't read Mexican Gothic in a while, but doesn't that start with her in a carriage on the way to the house? I'm thinking that that might work here better, where it's like, she's already, you know, a finalist, and she's, like, on her way or something like that. I think that could work there, because then it's like. I think she kind of describes the landscape in the house, like, as. As she's driving up towards it. From what I remember, it's been a while. That could work here a bit better. I think the. The school setting feels young again. If you want it to be ya, it's ya. It is. Very clearly, she's in a school, so that definitely solidifies that. I also. I also kind of felt like this felt a bit more modern than, like, a 1900s setting. I don't know if that was a goal for it to read a little bit modern, which isn't a bad thing. I was just kind of curious about. Yeah. Your relationship with it as a historical. Because it's essentially, it's a horror romance, but it's also kind of a historical fantasy as well, because there's magical elements in a historical setting. So there's. There's lots of things to play with here. It's very interesting, and I think that's what Cece and I keep, like, circling around. We're like, this is fascinating. We're sold. Like, you sold us on this concept from the query, from the hook, like, you got us. And now we're thinking, okay, now we're worried that you're just not writing it in the right way to get the outcome that you want. And I think that's what we're coming up against. So it's always hard, again, for us to read five pages and feel like we're giving a full assessment or anything like that, because we're certainly not. But there is often a lot that we can see in the first five pages that dictates where we potentially think things might go. So you'll see all my notes in the margin, but to me, it almost Felt like she was breaking the fourth wall. Like, that's how much I thought that she was talking to the reader. And so if you want to break the fourth wall, that's a strategy. You lean into that.
- [31:58]
Cece Lira
You.
- [31:58]
Unknown
You. You carry the reader along and you talk to them, and they're your companion. Like, that's a. You know, again, that's a structural, stylistic thing that you can do. But if you're not trying to break the fourth wall, then there's a lot of work you have to do to think about what can I just, like, cut, delete, don't need. But I also agree that we're not starting in the right place. So. So I think we have to start closer to. I always say we have to start at the most interesting point in a character's life, starting at the regular day at school, even if the outcome is going to be surprising. You're starting at a regular day at school. And maybe she does or doesn't know that the announcement is going to be made today. Would she have been late if she knew the announcement was going to be made today? Like, I just don't think the interiority was focusing on the right things. You know, I don't want to be late today. Today's the day of the announcement. Right. Like, that's a different thing than. I got a little distracted wandering into school. Oh. All of a sudden, my life has changed. So I think what is the most. I mean, you know, better than me, it's your story. What is the most interesting point in this character's life? It's going to be the day she probably shows up at the state, in my opinion. So those are some things that I'm thinking about. You know, you'll see all my notes. But I definitely think it's ya. And I definitely think you have to think about who is the story serving. And as much as you, as a aspiring author, want to be serving the reader, which is, again, so much good intention, as Cece and I said, like, we could see all that good intention. You want to serve your future reader, which is incredible. You also have to serve the story, you know, and just like that purity of storytelling, which I think you're thinking about your future reader as opposed to, like, what's the purest version of the story that I can tell, because your hook is there, your story's there.
- [33:37]
Carly Waters
I just want to quickly say you will serve the reader by serving the story.
- [33:40]
Unknown
That's.
- [33:40]
Carly Waters
That's how it works. Like, it doesn't look like it, but just serve the story. And you'll serve the reader.
- [33:46]
Tali
Thank you, Cece. Okay, we're going to hand it across to Tali now. Perhaps you can tell us about a moment of disruption that comes later, and we can brainstorm to see if that might be a better entry point.
- [33:57]
Telly
Okay, so I think that there are two potential alternate starting points. So one is the evening of this day when she learns that she's going to be in this competition is when she goes to her brothel for the last time and tells her madam that she's not going to be working there anymore. And a man comes in, he has a raven masquerade mask on, and he warns her against something. It's very unclear what exactly it is.
- [34:26]
Unknown
But it has something to do with the competition.
- [34:29]
Telly
So I think that could be a starting point. And then the next morning is when she actually leaves her home and goes to the competition. So I think that could be a starting point. So I'm a bit torn between those two.
- [34:41]
Unknown
Does the brothel come back at all? Like, is this a recurring theme or do we leave the brothel behind for the whole story?
- [34:49]
It's a recurring theme in that the brothel represents her position in society right now.
- [34:54]
Telly
And at the beginning of the book, she really thinks that she wants to be on this higher rung on the social ladder. Then she learns that the brothel is kind of another way of keeping her stagnant.
- [35:07]
Unknown
Is she a sex worker or is she like a receptionist? Like, what's her job?
- [35:10]
Telly
She's a sex worker, so she's a courtesan.
- [35:13]
Unknown
Okay, so I have a lot of thoughts now because I don't think that is the right spot. But also, marrying what you have on the page with the fact that she's a sex worker or part time or whatever, capacity is very complicating. Cece, is this blowing your mind a little bit too?
- [35:29]
Carly Waters
No, I have an idea.
- [35:31]
Unknown
Oh, you have an idea? Oh, I love ideas. Okay, go, Cece.
- [35:33]
Carly Waters
Okay, this is what you do. This is going to be a very good idea. Get prepared. Your brain's gonna explode. She is walking to the brothel. We don't know this as the reader. Okay. But we see the anticipation. She has to get work done. She wants to go in and go out and do what she has to do and live this life. She runs into someone from the school. Okay? The someone from the school talks to her, and through dialogue, we understand she's a student. And so we, the reader, are assuming, oh, the place she's going is something to do with the school. That's the anticipation. That's the urgency. But she doesn't like school, clearly, because she just wants to, you know, get in and get out. And she lies to this person because it's a secret, right, that she's a sex worker. So she lies to this person. Very important to lie. And she tells this person, you know, oh, I'm just going to go, I don't know, buy a book or something. Like you're going to figure out what the thing is. But something inoffensive and the person gets suspicious and goes, you wouldn't be here to buy a book. You're clearly trying to get an edge in the competition by going to so and so's house. House or something. Like, they have a theory that has nothing to do with a brothel. And so the reader's thinking, oh, my God, is that what she's actually going to do? And so the reader now thinks that this person's theory is correct. And because we see her get nervous, she can't find out. But there's actually something more. She gets to the brothel, but again, we don't know it's actually a brothel yet. And then we are surprised, we the reader, by her doing something like, I don't know, taking her clothes off or something, because it's like, oh, that's not a magical student. Job description. So now the reader is surprised. The reader has been surprised many times now, but then, then bam, there's a second surprise. The person she actually takes her clothes off for or whatever is it that she's going to do. Maybe that's not her style. Goes, no, no, I'm not here for that. I am actually here to deliver you news. I'm just pretending to be a customer. And then they deliver her the news that you just shared. As you were going through your options of where to start, you were focused on information, on conveying information, not what you have to focus on. I have to grab your brain and like, pull this urge out of your brain right now. The urge to explain. You're focused on kickstarting the chain of events in a way that honors the information. And that's not your job. You have to focus on a place that's going to surprise the reader with character development and in a way that unlocks layers of surprise. And so I love the idea of her going to the brothel because that's her secret life. That's what she's had to do. We have a hint of that in the pages where she says, you know, this would ruin me if people found out and stuff like that. Have that Urgency, have that really, really emotionally charged scene, but make us think it's something else. And then, bam, when we finally have a surprise, we think, now I know everything there is to know about her. But then she is surprised. The reader has been surprised, but now she is surprised by the customer not actually being the customer. That's what I think you should do, Kali.
- [38:17]
Unknown
I'm just saying I like the customer not being the customer. I think that's great. It's very magical. I'm just kind of wondering also where the horror elements are going to come in. Because, you know, Cece and I have been talking about, like, the atmosphere, the eeriness. You have to think about that, too. And so maybe, again, this happens at night. It's foggy, you know, Again, get the atmosphere, what Cece said, but atmosphere.
- [38:38]
Telly
So thinking back to Mexican Gothic, I have to go over and read it again as well to get the actual atmosphere and to see how that was built in there. But that starts with the main character being this socialite, essentially, and talking about how she likes to go to parties and she likes to spend time with boys and, you know, her father wants her to settle down, and she doesn't want that. And I think that she probably gets into this spooky atmosphere quicker than I do. I think that's probably something that I need to rush into a little bit more here. But essentially, that's kind of what I was going for. I was going for starting with, you know, the. The art scene, and she's a student. And then when we get to the estate, that's really when everything kicks into high gear and becomes scary and atmospheric. But I do. I do think I probably need to get into that faster.
- [39:28]
Carly Waters
It needs to be faster. Carly's point about night and foggy really helps. Notice that in thrillers, even though the danger begins, I don't know, in chapter three. In chapter one, you have her, like, cutting her finger. You have blood. You have something like, we need something. Mexican Gothic's beginning. Part of the reason why it works is it's a costume party. It's not just her being a socialite. The costume gives it the eeriness. Go read Vampires of El Norte. Go read that. Chapter one. All they're doing is meeting outside, like her and Nestor. It's so spooky. Like, the tone is so spooky. So you have to find that spooky tone. It cannot come later. There's no such thing as. Oh, it'll come later. Forget later. Your job is to do it now.
- [40:13]
Unknown
What if she Accidentally cuts herself before the reader knows that she cuts herself to combine with the paint for magic. And there's something about, like, her not wanting to waste it or it's too early. I don't know. Some. I'd play around with that a little bit. Right. Because blood is such a huge theme. And I. I didn't say this, but I love your title for this book. But, yeah, since the blood is such a big theme, I don't know, something about that could maybe. Could also be a little bit eerie. We're like, oh, why is she so abnormally worried about a cut when, like, everybody else feel like we'll throw a band aid on it or. I mean, I don't know if band aids were around in 1900, but my science. My science background as well as my math background aren't great.
- [40:48]
Telly
Yeah, I think that's a fantastic idea, actually working the blood in super early because it is definitely a theme that keeps coming back over and over. And I just have to say, cece, I love that suggestion for the beginning. I'm so excited to write this. It's going to be really good.
- [41:06]
Tali
Just as an author Tally, especially considering my last book was sort of Gothic. Dark and stormy night vibes, you know, from the outset, you've got to. And I'm just going to read this just to give you an idea, because in terms of setting the tone so it says Destiny Whip wearily eyes her bedside table, which could easily be mistaken for a miniature graveyard, what with all the little pills neatly lined in staggered rows, positioned upright like tiny headstones. So do you see in the opening line, we've got a reference to symmetry, to headstones and things. So it's already setting that tone so that the reader understands this is Gothic. This is kind of creepy. There's this underlying stuff. So you really have to. It's not just introducing the horror elements in terms of blood. You also need to be building that tone in terms of the language you choose in terms of everything. Things, you know, so that the reader starts to get those. Those creepy vibes.
- [42:05]
Unknown
This is. I don't know if you're a swifty, but going back to a Taylor Swift album, Midnights, right, where, like, the color red and it's crimson and it's. It's like all the different ways to say red or say blood. You know what I mean? It's like, this is crimson. This is that. Like Yonka's saying. It's like she's not saying, oh, dead. She's saying cemetery and headstones. I'm trying to say so, like, figure out all of your word. Do a big word map about, like, what are all the ways that you can. Can say blood or think about blood. And we're weaving. We're infusing for a blood pun. We are infusing the story, like, with all those references.
- [42:38]
Tali
Tally.
- [42:39]
Telly
Yeah, that's a fantastic point.
- [42:41]
Unknown
Thank you.
- [42:43]
Tali
Yeah. And it's just. It's just as you begin writing, you know, for me, it helps to have the vision board as I'm imagining things, imagining it kind of dark. And as opposed to the reader having that picture that you're looking at, you've got to paint that picture for them so that they know it's kind of got that dark filter on everything or that foggy filter, et cetera, et cetera. So as you writing this new chapter, focus as well on the tone so that you can really try and capture that as well. All right. So, Telly, was there anything else you wanted to ask Carly and CeCe? Anything else you wanted to brainstorm before we finish up in a few minutes?
- [43:21]
Telly
So, I guess two questions. So my first would be that one of my writer friends just a approached me, and this is unrelated to the query letter and the pages, but I'm wondering in terms of marketing, what your thoughts are. And she asked if I would be interested in doing a race to an agent with her. And so essentially, we would publicize this on social media, and both of us would compete to see who could get an agent first. And I'm torn about this because on one hand, I think it's a fun idea that would get people following us, that might improve our reach and get interest. On the other, I wonder if it's gamifying something that's, you know, not. Not necessarily appropriate to look at in that sense. So I just wanted to get your thoughts on this.
- [44:09]
Unknown
I have very strong thoughts about this. I think your instincts are right, which is this is not a good idea. And aside from the fact of, like, the race to the age and the gamification, here's something that everybody listening to this needs to think about. When you are trying to build a platform and a brand and followers, what you are trying to do is attract querying writer followers. Because the like, if you were to create that content, the people that would follow you'd be other aspiring authors querying authors, not the eventual readers of your book. And this is something that Leigh Stein talks about a lot, who's a great author and marketing expert. She always talks about how am I creating content on socials that serves my goals to attract future readers and the word of mouth that I need. We don't want your word of mouth as an author brand to be the author who did the race to an agent. We want the author brand to be the author of Color Blood. You know what I mean? So, again, all that other messiness aside, really think about, like, what is my content serving? Who is it serving and why?
- [45:03]
Carly Waters
I also wouldn't do it because it's going to be, like, probably the slowest race of all of mankind. It's going to be so boring. It's going to take so long because it takes so long to hear back from agents. Agents are the worst guys. And it's just going to be like, you know, picture that really slow mo race. Like, so boring. Like, don't do it, man. Like, don't do it.
- [45:23]
Cece Lira
Like slots.
- [45:24]
Telly
Yeah, that's good to know. So my next question was actually going back to the editor interest. So she had mentioned, you know, I can't endorse you to agents because I haven't read the full manuscript, but you can tell agents that I'm interested. And so I'm wondering how much information to divulge. She's from Macmillan. Do I put that in the query letter? Do I put her name in? Or do I say an editor at McMillan? How do I kind of phrase that in a way that's. That's appropriate, essentially.
- [45:54]
Carly Waters
Was this at a conference?
- [45:55]
Telly
Oh, yeah. No, it was on a zoom call, actually.
- [45:58]
Carly Waters
But, like, how did you get on a zoom call with her? Like, through a conference, Through a.
- [46:03]
Unknown
Like a contest. See, she's just wondering, like, the frame of which, like, you went into the conversation.
- [46:08]
Carly Waters
Yeah, I reached out to her through.
- [46:10]
Telly
Manuscript Academy and booked a call with her. And so we had a zoom call, and she mentioned that, you know, she liked it and was interested.
- [46:17]
Carly Waters
Yeah, you can write through a consultation with an editor from Macmillan via Manuscript Academy. I was told that she would be interested in this once I have representation. I have to be honest with you, and I'm saying this because I don't like false hope. Okay. Every conference I go to, I meet with editors who are also taking pitches. And the thing they tell me is, I always tell writers that once they have representation, they should send things to me if the thing is in the scope they represent. It doesn't mean she didn't like your pages. I'm not suggesting that. I am saying that a smart editor always says, keep me in mind once you have an agent, because the job of knowing when it's ready is the agent's job. That's not their job. A smart editor's job is to keep those doors open. Like, they want to keep those doors open, because it's the agent's job to figure out when your story's ready to submit. Like, they don't have to worry about quality control at all. It's kind of a dreamy thing, actually, now that I think about it. Agents have to worry about that. Agents have floodgates open where we have to sift through the stuff that's ready and the stuff that's not, and then everything that's ready we send to editor. So it's important to write that because that happened. But I get. I don't even know. Like. Like, that happens so often in query letters. I get that line. It's. It's really common.
- [47:32]
Unknown
And if you're wondering where to put it, you put it in the author bio. You don't lead with it because again, Cece and I see this all the time. Again, it's not a bad thing. It's just tuck it in the author bio. It probably won't get you an agent faster, but to me, it suggest this person paid for Manuscript academy. Like, they took the extra steps to be serious about your career. So that's why it goes in the author bio paragraph.
- [47:50]
Tali
Thank you, Carly. All right, so we've reached the end of our episode. Tali, thank you so much for joining us. Thank you so much for making yourself vulnerable and for sharing your work. You know, it's. It's always very difficult, and I think we brainstormed some really great beginnings for you, and it's just a case of going through your work and seeing where you put in context, where you're explaining, and it's just taking that out. So for the first draft, it's just going through and taking out all of that and see what remains and then building on that. So, you know, definitely doable. I hope we were useful. Tali.
- [48:24]
Telly
Yes.
- [48:24]
Unknown
This was fantastic.
- [48:25]
Telly
It was such an honor to speak with all of you. Thank you so much for having me on. This has been a wonderful experience. Terrifying, but wonderful.
- [48:33]
Tali
Well, yeah, it is always terrifying because you care about your work. And I always say if you're not making yourself vulnerable, you're not afraid. And if you're not afraid, then that means you don't care about it. So thank you so much for joining us, Tali.
- [48:44]
Telly
Bye, Carly.
- [48:47]
Carly Waters
I think it's time for the thing.
- [48:49]
Unknown
Bianca, we have a fun surprise for.
- [48:51]
Carly Waters
You, A most puzzling surprise.
- [48:55]
Unknown
A Most Puzzling Murder Surprise.
- [49:00]
Tali
Okay, what are the two of you up to?
- [49:03]
Carly Waters
So we're going to play an excerpt from your latest novel, A Most Puzzling Murder, right now on our show. That's right, listeners. You'll get to listen to the first few chapters of this locked room mystery featuring an unforgettable protagonist, Destiny Whip, and more twists and turns than you can count. So if you've already enjoyed the book in print, you'll love digesting it with your ears. And if you haven't read it yet, this is the perfect amuse bouche to get you into it. Thank you to the publisher for making this available and for giving us permission to play it. So without further ado, it's time to tune in to your next favorite novel, A Most Puzzling Murder by Bianca Mouret.
- [49:42]
Tali
Yay. This is so cool, guys.
- [49:45]
Unknown
Enjoy.
- [49:55]
Chapter 1 Destiny Sunday, 9:57am Destiny Whip warily eyes her bedside table, which could easily be mistaken for a miniature graveyard, what with all the little pills neatly lined in staggered rows, positioned upright like tiny headstones. It certainly feels as though she's regarding the burial ground of her hopes and dreams, haunted by the specter of the enormous potential she so dismally failed to live up to. When you're declared a child prodigy, everyone expects you to go far in life. But all Destiny has managed today is a slow shuffle to and from the bathroom. Even that required Herculean reserves of energy. Balancing her laptop on her knees, she reaches to the farthest side of the bed for her emotional support urn, pulling it close and tucking it into her armpit as though cuddling a teddy bear. She kisses the top of the teardrop shape, the metal cold against her chapped lips. Bex appears in Destiny's doorway, leaning her head against the frame. Morning, sunshine. Her best friend is still too scrawny, but not nearly as emaciated as she was a year ago when all she feasted on was beauty magazines and models, Instagram pages rather than anything resembling food. Bex looks mostly healthy again, her long chestnut hair gleaming, the hollows of her cheeks no longer reminiscent of sinkholes. You okay? Bex asks, the corners of her mouth turned down. It's the anniversary of the accident today. One year somehow crawling by on scraped knees. Some people act like severe depression is a tarnish that can be polished off with the application of enough elbow grease. Luckily, Bex isn't one of them. Destiny tries to speak, but a knot of regret is so tangled up in her throat that the words don't stand a chance. Her laptop suddenly squawks with an incoming video call. In the months since Destiny has been seeing Dr. Shepherd, they've never had a virtual consultation over a weekend. But today is going to be a tough one. Which is why the psychiatrist insisted on the appointment. As the ringing continues, Destiny gently places the urn beside her and reaches for her notebook. She pages to the list of tasks the doctor suggested last month. Bex sidles up, reading over her shoulder. 1. Leave the apartment once a day to go for a walk or grab a coffee. 2. Reach out to an old friend or colleague to suggest a meetup. 3. Replace all the dead plants. 4. Keep a dream journal about the white haired ghost woman. 5. Email the council expressing my wish to return. 6. Accept one of the consultancies I've been offered, one that doesn't require travel. 7. Work on forgiving Nate. 8. Limit my interactions with Bex. Bex side eyes the last item on the list. Rude, she huffs. You'd think I was a bad influence or something. Rather than answering Bex or the incoming call, Destiny thinks of how she's never flunked an assignment in her entire life, always top of her class, and despite being admitted to University as a 12 year old, Destiny cannot fathom this degree of failure. She's ticked nothing off the list, not even throwing away the plants whose shriveled corpses goad her, their untimely deaths undoubtedly due to the curtains constantly being drawn tight. That and Destiny forgetting to water them. The laptop's ringing grates on Destiny's nerves, but she can't force herself to answer and face Dr. Shepard's disappointment. It will be carefully concealed, of course, with the psychiatrist gently pointing out there's always next week or the week after that to achieve these seemingly simple goals. But it doesn't matter how much of an extension Destiny is given, it's no use. For how can she possibly cut ties with Bex, who's her dearest, not to mention only friend? Plus, there's no way the Council of Enigmatologists will take her back after she's been AWOL for so long. Each time an envelope drops through the mail slot, Destiny fully expects it to be a letter informing her that they've revoked her membership. It hurts to remember how thrilled she was to be appointed president of the prestigious group just 13 months ago, and how she, Bex, and Nate all splurged on a fancy dinner to celebrate when the call finally dropped. Bex exhales a long whoosh of defeat. I know I shouldn't enable you with all the talking, but it's not like I can call anyone on your behalf. They both look down at the image on the home screen of Destiny's laptop. It's a photo that was taken 13 years ago, when Destiny was eight. In it, her mother's arm is flung across Annie's shoulders, happiness radiating from the two best friends in waves. Destiny's eyes fill with tears as she studies her mother's straight black hair and pale skin and those enormous glasses obscuring most of her face. Jutting her chin at Liz, Bex murmurs, I wish I'd known her. Destiny nods before turning her attention to Annie, with her striking Afro and beaded shoulder duster earrings and her smile as bright as the sun. The image was captured two weeks before Liz died, and a year before the paperwork would go through to officially make Annie Destiny's second adoptive mother. Their deaths were wrenching losses, tearings in the fabric of Destiny's being that she never quite stitched back together. There were times in the before when Destiny experienced the sting of loneliness, that awful yearning of the one forever stuck outside, nose and palms pressed against the cold glass, gazing in at what belonging looked like, foreheads bent together, raucous laughter elicited by inside jokes, sentences finished by those who knew you best. But this is not loneliness, in the same way that a drop of water is not a deluge, the way a sigh is not a hurricane. I'm so sorry that you're having such a rough time of it, beck says, reaching out to tuck a flaming red curl behind Destiny's ear. She freezes upon seeing Destiny's expression, her hand hovering like a ghost between them. A year is a long time, though, and Dr. Shepard is right, despite the fact that she clearly has it in for me. You need to move on. God, that Bex is apologizing to her of all people, when everything that happened was Destiny's fault. No, I'm sorry, destiny says, her voice pulled so taut that it snaps, seeing the pills all standing to attention, no longer a cemetery full of headstones but rather an army ready to fight the last battle. Destiny reaches for the urn again, stroking it like a security blanket. If you stop talking to me, Bex, I don't know what I'll do. Not gonna happen, bex replies breezily. And then, more firmly, she says, okay, it's tough love time. You seriously need to shower because you're stinking up the place. Plus the kitchen needs cleaning. Those takeout containers have grown thumbs. I swear I caught them trying to hitch a ride to the nearest primordial swamp. Destiny laughs at how incredibly bossy Bex is, especially for a dead person. Still, it's reassuring that no matter how much has changed, some things stay exactly the same. Chapter 2 Destiny Sunday, 10:15am Destiny flinches at the unmistakable sound of the mail slot creaking open and a letter fluttering through. If she was waiting for a sign, then the arrival of a letter from the Council would surely be it. Ignore it, bex pleads as Destiny pushes her laptop aside to get out of bed. Who needs those losers anyway? Bex has never understood Destiny's affinity for the Council, but then, why would she? Even before she died, Bex always managed to fit in. Near the end, when her eating disorder began devouring her whole. Most people didn't even notice because she constantly surrounded herself with similarly emaciated women in an industry that normalized her illness. But until the Council, Destiny never knew what it was like to have peers. When other children her age were being invited to birthday parties or endlessly obsessing over their first crushes, Destiny was attending lectures at Yale, not only thoroughly annoying her professors who felt they were above babysitting duties, but also the other students who saw her as a precocious pain in the ass whose presence made them all look bad. Nerd. Geek. Dork. Dweeb. Freak. Brown nose. Boffin Propeller. Head. Prodigy. Wonk. They called her everything but her name, making Destiny feel like a lone pelican in a flamboyance of flamingos so bumbling and awkward that she'd never fit in even if she doused herself with pink paint and walked on stilts. But the day she got the Council's invitation, those hallowed hallways opening for her, Destiny found a squadron of other pelicans with their shoulders hunched and giant beaks agape, devouring knowledge as hungrily and indiscriminately as she did. They welcomed her as a contemporary, someone to be consulted rather than avoided, allowing Destiny, for the very first time in her life, to embrace her very pelicanness. And now here she is, about to be booted out of the only club she's ever cared about. Shuffling to the front door, she spots a dove gray envelope that's landed face up on the bamboo flooring, her name written across it in antiquated script. Destiny Whip. There's no address or stamp, which Destiny thinks is strange until she remembers that it's a Sunday and that no postal workers will be delivering mail today. She peers out through the peephole, spotting a cloak so black that it's almost blue. It disappears into the elevator with a swoosh, a matador challenging a bull before the doors ding closed. A heaviness gathers and settles in Destiny's stomach. Apparently the Council is so desperate to take her name off their letterheads that they've sent an emissary on the weekend. She wonders which one drew the short stick. Her money's on poor Dodkins, a delightfully eccentric little man whose area of specialty is 19th century puzzle box boxes from the Hakone region of Japan. Sighing, Destiny trudges back to bed. Her laptop rings again, Dr. Shepard calling once more, but Destiny slams it closed, not wanting any witnesses to this humiliation. Beck sits next to Destiny, ineffectually trying to fluff the pillows. The envelope doesn't have the pretentious wax seal, so it can't be from the Council. Maybe you've been nominated for another award, she exclaims, ever the optimist. But no, that can't be it. All of Destiny's work correspondence occurs over email. Her inbox full of hundreds of unread emails can attest to that. After slicing the envelope open with the lone jagged fingernail she hasn't gnawed off yet, Destiny withdraws the page. Dearest Ms. Whip, I hereby acknowledge receipt of your application to replace Ms. Leroux as the Scruffmore family historian. I'm sure you know how coveted the position is. It's no secret that ours is a most illustrious and mysterious lineage, and so I congratulate you on your compelling application and for making the shortlist of two approved applicants. Our family history has been a rather fascinating one, with most of the information required to unlocking it hidden within the Scrufmore vault, safe from prying eyes. Were you to be successful, you would be one of the rare outsiders granted access to those thousands of records that have come from all over the world, wherever a Scrufmore has lived in the past 2000 years. Come via the last ferry on the 27th of February, and then make your way to the Grimshaw Inn and Tavern for the night. Tell them arrangements have been made and all expenses will be taken care of. Be at the castle on the morning of the 28th ahead of your interview at 12pm should you be awarded the position, the secrets of the vault will be yours to be revealed. Until then, Mordecai Scruffmore Scroughmoor Castle, Erie Island P.S. your ferry tickets have been purchased. The ticket Number for the 27th is L 234 - 5778891212141414164 - 7 and that of the return is W 1710242451121112459819 the original read through is confusing. Told you it would be something interesting, Bex crows. But I'm not a historian, destiny replies, brow furrowed. And I never applied for this position. Weird, beck says, tapping her French manicure against her chin. Have you ever heard of the Scruffmore family? Destiny mulls it over. No, the name is unusual enough that she'd remember it. Google them, Bex instructs, her answer to everything. Destiny opens her laptop again with a pang of guilt over Dr. Shepard's two missed calls. She makes a mental note to pay for the consultation and email an apology. Googling the Scruffmore family gets zero hits. Same goes for Mordecai Scruffmore. Nor is there mention anywhere of the job listing. Erie island comes up as a vague blip on the map, about 30 miles offshore from the town of Gwillimbury. While the ferry terminal is listed as being a three hour train trip away, there isn't any mention of the island's castle or the Grimshaw Inn and Tavern. There are no pictures of the island at all, not even satellite images on Google Earth.
- [69:01]
Tali
What the hell?
- [69:03]
Unknown
Destiny mutters. Her mind begins to fizz like it's being carbonated. She welcomes the old familiar sensation. How alive it makes her feel. Doing a deeper dive, Destiny scrolls through dozens of search engine result pages before finally being rewarded with one grainy photograph of Mordecai Scrufmore. It's listed with no explanation beyond being captioned with his name on a defunct website that was designed before Destiny was even born. Well, isn't he delightful. Bex murmurs, studying all the star tattoos inked across Mordecai Scruffmore's forehead. While Destiny can believe some kind of administrative error resulted in the letter being sent to her, she can't understand why there's barely any mention of the Scrufmores or their island anywhere on the Internet. Especially not if the family is as prestigious as they claim. Picking up the page, she reads it again, noting that today is the 27th of February, the day on which she's meant to arrive. She wonders if this is some kind of prank, but something about the letter niggles as she studies it more closely. Destiny's jaw drops when she spots the key to unlocking the hidden message. You now have all the information you require to figure out the key to unlocking the hidden message. You can find the letter in the accompanying booklet. Pause your audio to solve the puzzle now. Or if you're unable to do so at this time, but would still like the opportunity to do so later, continue listening. If you aren't interested in solving this puzzle, go to Answers Puzzle one the Hidden Message Chapter two Destiny Continued Once the secret has revealed itself, Destiny's hands begin to shake so violently that she puts the page down so she won't rip it. This is the letter she's been waiting her entire life for, the one she never dared believe would actually arrive. She feels lightheaded, sick with expectation. The last time she felt this way was when she found the other letter, the one that arrived mere days before her mother's death. That one was signed Yours, Kai. Mordecai and Kai, two mysterious letters arriving 13 years apart, signed with similar names. That can't be a coincidence, surely. Destiny's heartbeat stomps out a rapturous percussion of something she hasn't felt in a long time. It takes her a moment to identify it as hope.
- [72:22]
A reminder that this is an unscripted program and our conversations have been edited and condensed and is not a full picture of our feedback or conversation directly with each author. As always, refer back to our written notes for the Folsom picture. Carly Waters and Cece Lira are agents at PS Literate Agency, but their work on this podcast is not affiliated with the agency, and the views expressed by Carly and Cece on this podcast are solely that of them as podcast co hosts do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, policies, or position of PS Literary Agency. A reminder about all the ways that you can support us as a show. Rate us five stars on Apple Podcasts. Tell your writing friends about us. We'd love to help as many writers as possible and follow us on our Substack newsletter. Get our stacked newsletter on a weekly basis. Bonus videos, articles, essays, advice, and more. You can find it at TheShitAboutWriting.substack.com that's TheShitAboutWriting.Substack.com and that's it for today's episode.
- [73:17]
Tali
I hope you'll join us for next week's show.
- [73:19]
Cece Lira
In the meantime, keep at it. Remember, it just takes one.
- [73:23]
Carly Waters
Yes.
- [73:28]
Cece Lira
Beta reader matchup time is happening again. It's been so gratifying over the summer to be tagged in. So many posts about beta readers who've become writing besties and who are still going strong many years after they were first matched. Some even travel to meet up and do writing weekends together. Which sounds incredible. I can't guarantee any of that. That's entirely up to you, but what I can guarantee is that you'll be matched with a group of people working in your genre and or time zone who will critique 3,000 words of your work as you critique theirs. In return, you can sign up from now until the 31st of August. With the matchup emails going out on the 1st of September, head to my website Biancamarae.com and look for the Beta Reader Matchup tab.