The Shit No One Tells You About Writing

Episode: Shooting the Shit Live From New York!

Hosts: Bianca Marais, Carly Watters, CeCe Lyra
Date: September 22, 2025

Episode Overview

In this special "Live from New York" episode, literary agents Carly Watters and CeCe Lyra (P.S. Literary Agency) reunite in NYC after attending the People of Publishing Conference (POPCON), meeting editors, and visiting clients. Broadcasting from their hotel room, they share fresh publishing insights, industry gossip, and personal highlights from their week. Topics covered include book industry trends, takeaways from panels on the creator economy and auctions, and the perennial realities of both the agent and aspiring writer's journey.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Podcast and Newsletter Updates

• Paid Newsletter Content: The team highlights new, actionable content exclusive to paid subscribers, featuring:

  • Example author questionnaires (by popular request)
  • "Five Jedi Mind Tricks for Surviving and Thriving in Publishing" by Sarah Ackerman, with her story of perseverance after hundreds of rejections ([04:12]).
  • Writing habits from Nick Medina, author of The Whistler ([04:51]).
  • Visual, practical feedback on query letters and first pages for subscribers ([05:01]).

• Why Support Through Paid Newsletter?

  • Carly emphasizes production costs: "In the beginning we were bleeding money, and I do mean bleeding." ([05:41])
  • Free previews are available, but paid support underpins the podcast and newsletter quality.

2. People of Publishing Conference (POPCON) Recap

a. CEO Panel: Looking Forward in Publishing

• Panelists: John Karp (Simon & Schuster), plus CEOs from Hachette and Macmillan.
• Takeaways:
  • Uplifting, more optimistic than expected.
  • John Karp’s charisma and love of editing: "He killed it on stage. He was so funny... He was born to do this" – Carly ([08:05]).
  • Discussion on book bans and literacy as industry priorities.
  • Diversity gap: "There are more CEOs named John than there are women CEOs in the world?... Those are all men is what I'm saying. Would have been nice to have at least one woman CEO." – Carly ([08:33]).
  • Future CEO speculation, with hopes for gender progress.

b. Creator Economy Panel

• Trends Discussed:
  • Substack, Kickstarter, and audio publishing’s increasing role.
  • Busting old advice—authors should not "go dark" before launching:
    "We're not telling anybody to go dark before the book launch. It's like steady chug, chug, chug." – Host ([10:26])
  • Substack as a platform to test book concepts, especially for sophomore authors with unproven track records ([11:13]).
  • Cultivating and measuring audience engagement prior to pitching.

c. Book Club Fiction Roundtable

• Popularity remains high—especially for titles that generate discussion.
• Success Beyond NYT Bestseller Lists:
  “Actually a really awesome metric of success for publishers and for savvy authors too are steady sales... they sell a good amount of copies every single week.” – Carly ([14:43])
• Intangibles of a “Book Club Book”:
  "A book club book needs to be a book that people want to talk about... Some warmth and some heart were some other things we talked about." – Host ([15:48])
• Acquisition Instincts:
  "She posited that for her, it was like informed gut... it's gut because to a degree, it's kind of like I'm tasting a dish." – Carly ([16:56])

d. Financial Markets Panel

• CFOs discuss publishing advances and profitability:
  • Advances rely on editor enthusiasm, track record, and comp titles ([20:15]).
  • "Every book is a unique product... you can't be too wedded to the data because each book is its own unique product." – Panelist, paraphrased by Carly ([21:39]).
  • Importance of backlist sales and comparable titles for financial decisions.

e. Auction Confidential

• Behind-the-scenes of book auctions:
  • House bidding rules at major publishers; only one editor per imprint bids.
  • Formats: Round-robin, “as best,” and run-offs.
  • Agents balance information carefully; auctions display their value.
  • Editor fatigue: "Editors really wanted clear rules and a sense of finality... They don't want it to potentially be able to go on forever and ever and ever." – Carly ([25:18])

3. Editor and Client Meetings in NYC

• In-person meetings rekindle energy post-pandemic:
  "It was such a good homecoming... seeing so many agent colleagues, editor colleagues, so many people just, like, out and about in a way that they hadn't really been in a long time." – Host ([31:49])
• Pitching Styles:
  CeCe loves pitching books face-to-face—even if the title won't be ready for a year or more.
• Book Recommendations from Editors:
  • Quicksilver series
  • The Correspondent
  • Frozen River
  • Broken Country, All Fours, Escola
  • The Bandit Queens discussed as a personal favorite and agenting "fan girl" moment ([30:07]).

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Substack Strategy:
  "You can maybe play around with your social media, with your substack, and see what kind of engagement you get, like what your audience is responding to more... it could be like a new thing." – Carly ([11:13])

• On the importance of steady sales:
  “However, they sell a good amount of copies every single week. Every single week. And they've been doing it since they came out. And that is so awesome for publishers, and it's awesome for authors because it means that... publishers are going to be like, yes, absolutely.” – Carly ([14:43])

• On the auction process:
  "Auctions... are a very clear, very explicit way to demonstrate [an agent's] value. Like, we got all these editors to be interested in your project, and it is... curating a submissions list." – Carly ([23:33])

• On industry gatherings post-pandemic:
  "If you give people a reason to come out and get together, they'll do it, as demonstrated by popcon." – Host ([13:32])

• On in-person pitching:
  "I love pitching in person... You sit down and you talk about books. Yes, sign me up." – CeCe ([28:00]–[28:55])

• On the enduring joy of the job:
  "I have never gotten over the fact that I can get books before they come out... Like, you don't get over it. Like, it's the best." – Carly ([27:09])

Timestamps for Key Segments

| Timestamp | Topic/Quote |
|---------------|----------------------------|
| 03:23 | Recording live from NYC—intro to the episode theme
| 04:30 | Sarah Ackerman’s "hundreds of rejections" story
| 06:43 | Beginning POPCON/People of Publishing discussion
| 07:10 | CEO panel reflections
| 08:33 | Gender diversity among publishing CEOs
| 10:26 | Mythbusting "going dark" before book launch
| 11:13 | Substack as proposal testing
| 13:32 | Value of in-person events post-pandemic
| 14:43 | Importance of steady sales over bestseller status
| 16:56 | "Informed gut" in book acquisitions
| 19:00 | Editor meetings anecdotes and book gossip
| 20:15 | Financials: advances, risk, and editor sway
| 23:33 | Auctions as an explicit agent value-add
| 25:18 | Editors' desire for auction process finality
| 28:00 | Preferences for pitching books in person
| 30:07 | Personal highlight: Bandit Queens fangirl moment
| 31:49 | "Homecoming" energy among publishing professionals

Conclusion

This episode offers a lively, insightful panorama of current trends in publishing from the literal front lines of the industry in New York. With candid talk about rejection and resilience, emerging strategies for book launches and career development, insider mechanics of agenting and acquisitions, and a reinvigorated sense of community, Carly and CeCe deliver actionable wisdom and camaraderie for every writer or industry insider.

As always, expect a blend of book recommendations, honest realities, and laughter—proving that even in the high-stakes world of publishing, a little gossip and a lot of heart still matter.