← The Bossticks
The Bossticks
William Gaunitz On Unexplained Hair Loss, Thinning Hair, Scalp Hygiene, & How To Regrow Healthy Hair
00:55:53
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A
The following podcast is a Dear Media Production. She's a lifestyle blogger extraordinaire.
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B
Fantastic.
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A
And he's a serial entrepreneur, a very smart cookie. And now, Lauren Everts and Michael Bostic are bringing you along for the ride.
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Get ready for some major realness.
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A
Welcome to the Skinny Confidential. Him and her. Hello, everybody. Welcome back to another episode of the Skinny Confidential, him and her show. Today we have William Gownitz on the podcast. And this one is for anyone that cares about hair. William Gownitz is a world renowned certified trichologist with over two decades of clinical experience, consumer product development, and global conference leadership. At age 17, his own unexplained hair loss and lack of regrowth sparked a deep curiosity that ultimately led him to pursue formal training in trichology. He's now a leader in the hair loss and regrowth space and has spent over 20 years doing extensive research. The culmination of his findings with there are three core reasons for hair loss. Hormonal, nutritional, and inflammatory. And on today's episode, we talk about all the ways you can keep your hair, potentially grow it more efficiently, make sure that you're not losing it, and general health as it's related to taking care of your hair in your body. We've actually never, on this podcast done a specific episode all around hair. I think this is going to land really well. We had a million questions for William and he answered all of them with that. William, welcome to Skinny Confidential, him and her show. This is the Skinny Confidential, him and her. I'm so glad you're here because I think I thought I was thinning just to go by a little tiny portion right there on the front. And so thank God you're here because if I lose this thing, I think it's over for me.
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C
I mean, you've got a killer head of hair.
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A
Thank you.
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C
Yeah.
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B
He tells me every single day he reminds me about the hair I got.
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A
The one thing going for me is the hair.
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B
I think the hair adds an inch too.
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A
Okay. So it does something. So. Okay.
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C
I guess you might be right.
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A
Yeah. To start, how would you describe what you do and maybe give a little bit of context on your background and how you got so interested in this subject in the first place?
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C
So I started losing my hair when I was about 17 and I was supposed to be an architect and that was like my whole thing, I want to build buildings and do all this. My hair. By the time I was 20, you could see right through the top and I'm like, I need to like, go find A wife. I need to go do all these things because I'm going to be, like, unattractive, and my hair is a really big deal. And so I ended up studying trichology and then up shifting my entire life. So I actually ended up resolving my own hair situation. And then I'm like, no one is doing this. Why is no one doing this? And so I opened a clinic and studied literally all over the world. And. And now, 24 years later, we have, you know, our brand, which is, you know, all over the world. And then we have. We're spinning off all this tech to help teach people how this is done properly. Properly, Selfishly, it's for my own self.
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A
So tons of people are immediately going to say, how did you resolve your hair issue?
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C
So back, you know, a lot of
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A
hair, like, when I'm looking at you.
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C
Yeah, I mean, I've got a lot of hair. So back in 2002, well, basically, like, we'll go 98, 99. There wasn't anything like the tech that's out there today to show you what you need to do. Like, no one's looking at your scalp under a microscope regularly. So really, when you're trying to understand how to manage this for yourself, you need somebody to assist. And so for me, it was basically learning this in France, so the scalp microscopy. And then in Perth, Western Australia, they were doing some really cool, innovative stuff, which now is standard, but that's kind of what worked for me.
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B
So the reason that I wanted you on the show is because I have discovered through my own hair journey that hair growth starts at the scalp. And if you don't take care of the scalp, your hair doesn't grow. This is my own Lauren Bostic theory.
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A
Yeah.
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B
So let's start with the scalp. What are people doing wrong when it comes to their scalp?
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C
I mean, where do we start?
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B
Yeah, let's pull it out.
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C
Yeah. So realistically, when you're washing your hair on a daily basis, so I don't think you should. If you're not losing your hair, you should not be washing your hair with some sort of caustic shampoo every single day. You should be probably washing every 48 hours or every 72 hours.
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B
I wash mine every two weeks.
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C
Okay. So as long as you get your scalp, it's gnarly. Yeah. Well, we can. We can take a look.
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B
It's doing fine.
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C
But so when you have a healthy scalp microbiome that then you're good, because, I mean, just like a healthy gut, all of that bacteria and fungus and parasites are basically in balance. And so if they're in balance, then you don't really need to wash your hair that often. But if it's out of balance and you have issues with seborrheic dermatitis, psoriasis, dandruff, if you're losing your hair, then you need to be washing daily. And the people, you know, they hear from their stylist, I shouldn't be washing my hair, and then they don't. And then if, when things go bad, then it gets worse and worse and worse.
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B
So the washing the hair situation is situational? Yeah.
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C
Oh, 100%.
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A
It's dependent on the health of your current scalp. So if you are going to wash your hair, what are ingredients that you want to lean into and what are ingredients that you want to avoid?
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C
So, I mean, there's standard ones. Obviously you don't want to use parabens, you don't want to use sulfates, you really, you know, propylene glycol, anything that's going to kill the microbiome. Like, you need something that's gentle. However, if you are losing hair, then your scalp microbiome is probably off anyway and you need to use tea tree oil and grapefruit seed extract. Things that are going to naturally manage the things that are out of balance.
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B
What are some brands that you really love?
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C
Well, I mean, obviously advanced trichology is, is my number one. There are some gentle brands that you could use that you can pick up at, like Whole Foods, like Giovanni. And then I just recently did an interview where I talked about Tea tree shampoo from Trader Joe's. It's a cheap alternative. It's actually, it's a pretty good shampoo. It works pretty well.
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B
I want to go back to the scalp question you mentioned. You mentioned the washing the hair thing, but what else are people doing wrong when it comes to their scalp?
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C
They're not handling their scalp like you're supposed to like to touch your scalp. So whether you're using a brush, so brush your hair, actually use a brush to move the sebum off the surface of the scalp and move it around. Traditional things people stop doing when they think they're losing their hair. They stop washing their hair, they stop brushing aggressively. Like, you need to stimulate your scalp. So by handling your scalp, massaging your scalp, these are things that are going to keep it healthy.
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A
And we were talking right before we started about the, the type of massage for the scalp, and you were saying you actually like, want to move the skin off the, off the Bone?
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C
Yeah, the scalp over skull. So, I mean, you want to basically compress your scalp and then move the scalp over skull. I have a video about that which is probably my most popular video. And legitimately, you get these little, like, calcium deposits between the fascia and the scalp itself. And you break that up when you're manipulating the scalp.
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B
I do that every morning. Like, I'll. I'll pull my. My, like, face up by massaging my scalp. Because my theory is it like, pulls the. Lifts your face while you're massaging your scalp.
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A
You push it?
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C
Yeah, why not?
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B
Like, I, like, put my fingers through it and like, massage what you're saying. I know exactly what you mean by the, like the scalp between the scalp. And I really do think it helps with hair growth.
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C
I mean, it certainly does.
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B
Okay. Yeah, I think so too.
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C
Absolutely.
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B
What about micro needling your scalp?
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C
Oh, man, this is a hot topic. So there's micro needling and then there's derma rolling. So derma rolling is what everybody does on the Internet. They get the little, you know, tiny little needle device and then they push that into their scalp and then they use a topical. That's, to me, not a great idea. Now, if you're going to traditionally use microneedling, like medical microneedling, and you go in, you see an esthetician, and you do this, you know, monthly for, say, four to six months. Phenomenal. So there's a lot of data that says when you penetrate the surface of the scalp by about 2 millimeters, which hurts, you bleed, you are going to stimulate recovery. So microneedling good, in my opinion, dermarolling bad.
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B
Why are so many guys bald?
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C
There are so, like, we live in a world that is a recipe for baldness.
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B
What's the recipe?
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C
The recipe is basically using the wrong products on your scalp. The just horrible dietary habits, like your gut plays a massive role in how your hair should be growing nutrients. People are not getting blood work. They're not getting their vitamin D tested. They're not getting their iron and fared and tested. They're going on crazy diets that negatively impair what's going on. Like, basically, you shouldn't be a vegan if you're an O blood type. If you are a B blood type, you're consuming tons of chicken. I can go down that rabbit hole.
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A
What are the vitamins that people are lacking or I guess the levels that people are lacking when that correlates directly with hair loss?
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C
Yeah, vitamin D is huge. I mean, we found out during COVID that Vitamin D is a big deal for your immune system. So when you are taking vitamin D, most people's vitamin D is suppressed. If your vitamin D is less than 30 nanograms per milliliter, you're most likely going to have some hair loss, even if it's diffused throughout your entire body. Beard, eyebrows, hair. I had a guy that came in with a, a situation. He, he could not grow hair well on his entire body. He had 30% of his hair left. His only problem, like literally did nothing else. We tested his vitamin D. His vitamin D was 2 nanograms per milliliter, lowest I've ever seen. We gave him some vitamin D, he doubled his hair, and in a month.
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B
Is this a supplement or is it an IV of vitamin D that you're giving him?
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C
No, it's a supplement. Sublingual.
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B
So just like a regular old supplement.
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C
Yeah, but in that situation, right, like he was one of those very rare people that had crazy low vitamin D. My lowest mine's ever been was like 12. So. But in that situation, that's what you need. Every person's an individual, obviously, and you need to test what's going on for you to correct me.
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A
So if you have these guys and they're rubbing their scalp and micro needing their scalp and their vitamin D is low, it's likely like they could just change the vitamin D and that would probably be all they need to do.
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C
Well, I mean, it just. Yeah, it depends. So I mean my philosophy, which is called the gone of psychology method, there's three primary reasons for hair loss. There's dht, there's nutrition, and then there's inflammation. Inflammation mostly stems from your gut. The nutrition issue is exactly what we're talking about. There's five key nutrients. Ferritin, obviously vitamin D. Then you've got zinc B12 and folate. And then if you've got genetics that your hair is going to fall out, you have to fight those genetics. Your body's at asking your whole physiology to lose hair. So DHT or dihydrotestosterone is the issue. You need to mitigate that. And you might have all three. And you're just, you might try one thing and it kind of works, or it doesn't work. You have to handle what's going to
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A
happen for you genetically, how are there things that you can look at? Like some people say, hey, if you look at your, is it your, your mother's father or. None of that matters. So how do you know genetically if you're predispositioned to Balding.
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C
So there's a test, there's a genetic test. So you can get the genetic test. Doesn't mean that you're going to lose your hair at 18. You might just have, you know, like 80% of men have some type of genetic hair loss pre programmed. But if you have all this like epigenetic factors and lifestyle factors that's causing you to potentially lose your hair, it may speed everything up. So whether you have it or not is kind of dictated by your pattern of loss. If you are losing hair on the top of the head, more so than the sides or the back, you probably have DHD or related loss.
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A
So why do women lose their hair? Is it the same as men or is different?
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C
Same as men. But the ecosystem, the female ecosystem has more variables. So the overall aspect of just, you know, menstruation, you're losing blood on a monthly basis. You require about three times the iron that a male does. You also have all these hormones with, you know, obviously giving birth. Your estrogen, when you go through pregnancy is actually anywhere from about 100 to 300 times normal. So it spikes during pregnancy and then dumps within three days after giving birth. There's so many of those things then birth control. So if you're using any hormonal birth control, it's probably changed your ecosystem. There's just so many different levels and then pressure on women for different diets, vegetarianism, veganism. That's going to impair the amount of iron that you're consuming. And that's going to be a problem. It's just, you know, so many things.
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B
So I added liver, iron.
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C
Yep.
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B
Tons of iron.
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C
Yep.
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B
I added a bunch of heart. And it's like a force of nature.
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Ancestral ancestry.
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B
Yeah. And I noticed my hair used to be to here used to be fried blonde. I noticed my hair started growing. However, I also did something else with that. I took three scoops, which is a lot of amino acids a day with creatine.
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C
Okay.
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B
And I noticed that my hair grew like faster, thicker, stronger, shinier.
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C
Yeah.
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B
That's again organ meat, I think worked for me.
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C
For you?
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B
Yeah.
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C
So you added 100% fuel.
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B
Right.
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C
So you added all the iron. So you added all these other natural amino acids in those organs and then you just really sort of pumped it up with extra amino acids and then the creatine. So your body is like, oh, thank you so much for all of this fuel and all these raw materials to turn my hair into growing longer. Cause your body's smart. It's regulating how much hair you're gonna grow. Cause it's the second most rapidly dividing cell in your body. If you are malnourished, in a sense, your body's gonna hold back those nutrients for what you need to live.
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A
How much does stress contribute to hair
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C
loss, depending on the person?
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B
A lot.
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A
Oh, a lot. Wow.
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C
Yeah. I mean, the amount of impact that stress has on our bodies, obviously just a slow burn of inflammation, but in a sense of, you know, losing hair, the stress can be a direct cause of hair loss. So there's only a handful of things. Genetics is one of them. But stress can cause telogen effluvium, which basically, a trauma, a stressful event, can make you shed anywhere from basically 33% to half of what you have within basically a year. There's other things, like alopecia areata, which a lymphocytic attack on your hair follicle, which is really, really common. It's those spots or when people lose, you know, full heads of hair and their eyebrows and the rest of their body that is directly caused by stress.
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A
You know, it's interesting because last year, in the middle of the year, we had our third child on the way. We have two small ones. And then I was in a bunch of. In the middle of a bunch of stuff. And I was a lot more stressed than I typically was. And I could tell, like, got a couple more grays than usual. Hair was, like, a little bit thinning. But I noticed when I got it under control, it kind of reversed a little bit. But in that period of time, I could tell that it was. That there was something going on.
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C
Yeah, well, I'm glad you got it under control.
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B
I mean, it's so. It's like someone with, like. Like.
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A
No, but I could tell.
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B
L. Of Dollars being like, I lost $1,000.
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A
Maybe if I had the billions, I wouldn't have been stressed.
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B
I call him Eddie Munster because the hairline is so far down and he really has so much hair. You do. So I don't think you should complain.
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A
No, no. But I agree. But I'm saying I could notice at that time that there was less of the hair. And I could tell. And I think during that period of time, I definitely kicked up some of my grays. And it was like. It was in an acute period of time. And I know that that's coming. That's normal part of aging. But I could tell in that condensed period of time, it, like, accelerated for a period and then kind of just probably went back to normal.
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C
Did you notice shedding a Little bit, yeah. Okay. So when did you notice it?
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A
I noticed. Remember I told you about this? I said, oh, I would go, like, put my hair back and be like, what's going on there? It would be more than usual. Yeah. And I was. And I was like, oh, shit, that's not good. And then I noticed, like, now, I mean, I have stuff in my hair now, but it's. There's. There's a lot more grays than there used to be. And it's, you know, you can see it in the beard and stuff, like. And it's coming.
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C
Yeah, I clearly know about gray.
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A
But it's, you know, it's. I think it's a normal thing for a lot of men, but I just realized in that period of time, it was like an accelerant of what the. What I would see as like a normal process of shedding and graying.
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C
Sure. Well, and then if you are not getting enough sleep, you know, if you're stressed, and then again, cortisol, hormonal shifts, these are all going to diminish the amount of stem cells actually activating your hair follicles, which can lead to more shedding and. And gray hair.
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B
Do you believe that red light helps stimulate your scalp?
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C
So there's a lot of different ways to use red light and. Absolutely, if used correctly. So I. That's what kind of saved my hair. So back before you could get red light anywhere, there were these sort of, you know, in clinic lasers that you could only get by going in clinic. And that's how I started. So I opened a laser. A red light laser facility clinic with lasers, not LEDs, back in 2002. And that was just, you know, rocket fuel for your hair too, because it stimulates blood flow, it stimulates ATP. But that will only work if you've mitigated the underlying reasons for the loss. If you were still super stressed, then that probably wouldn't do a whole lot. It could make you worse. If you weren't eating the organ meat, if you weren't correcting the underlying nutritional deficiency, that absolutely will make you worse. So you need to use it in the right circumstance. It accelerates what's going on internally. And if it's good internally, good shifts, then you're going to grow more hair. If it's bad, you're already deficient, then it's going to make you worse.
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A
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- [19:08]
B
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- [22:20]
A
break to talk about something that I think is so important to talk about and that is your cookware. Which is why we love talking about Caraway. We spend a lot of time on this podcast talking about how you can avoid chemicals, how you can avoid bad ingredients, how you can avoid bad fragrances. But do you know you also have vulnerability if you're cooking on cookware with pfas, these forever chemicals. We did a whole episode on this with the founder of Caraway. All you have to do is search Caraway Skinny Confidential for that episode, talking about all the vulnerabilities when it comes to modern cookware in the house. A lot of modern cookware comes with chemicals. They're leaking plastics, they're getting it into our food and ultimately harming our health. This is why we love Caraway and trust Caraway, because they have ceramic cookware that is going to get rid of all of these issues for you and make sure that you're cooking on things that are actually good for the body. A few years ago, Lauren and I switched all of our cookway to Caraway. That's the cooking utensils, that's the pots, the pans. Even the glassware that we store our food in is now all these glass containers. We got rid of all the plastic. The cutting boards are these beautiful wood cutting boards. We don't use plastic cutting boards. We don't have to worry about the plastic getting into our bodies. They say that you can ingest up to a credit card's worth of plastic. Plastic every year. That's disgusting. And again, with Caraway, you never have to worry about this. Don't just take it from me. Caraway is in over 2 million homes and over 150,000 people have rated 5 stars about their Caraway kitchen. Now it's time to try it for yourself. So check it out. Caraway's cookware set is a favorite for a reason. It can save you up to $230 versus buying the items individually. Plus, if you visit CarawayHome.com SkinnyPod 10 you can take an additional 10% off your next purchase. This deal is exclusive for our listeners, so visit carawayhome.com skinnypod10 or use code skinnypod10 at checkout. Caraway Non Toxic Kitchenware made Modern. What about that like $2,000 helmet that people are talking about online? No.
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B
Oh, I almost was gonna buy it.
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A
The good thing I didn't see you nodding your head.
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B
No.
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C
Never use more than 80 diodes ever.
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A
Okay.
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C
You know, the reason that you can buy those is it makes more money for the physicians or whomever is selling them.
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B
What about a red light bed?
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C
I love the red light bed. So the red light bed's different. So you're using LEDs, not lasers and that ATP production throughout your ent entire body. I think just as a mild stimulus versus an aggressive stimulus.
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A
So get rid of the helmet in the cart.
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C
I would just if use it for what it is. Like if you are dealing with normal scalp health, then start low, like use, I mean, get an 80 diode laser. Use it, you know, 10 minutes, twice a week. That's all you need.
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B
Okay, what's the one that you like the best? If someone wants to buy what you're talking about.
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C
All right, so obviously advanced trichology, we have an 80 diode laser. Shockingly enough, use it twice a week. So that's the one. I would never Recommend More than 80 diodes. There's other older devices that are, you know, maybe 36 lasers with 50 LEDs. There was an old school device called the IGROW laser. I still like that laser. I mean, it's still a good device. So know what you're getting. Do not use again anything more than 80 laser diodes.
- [25:13]
B
Send me the one that you like so I can put it linked in our show notes.
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C
100%.
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A
Okay. Just because it's such a popular medication right now. How have you seen GLP1s affect?
- [25:23]
C
I'm glad I thought about this. So we have research team that's looking specifically into GLP1s and why does it impact the scalp? The easy answer is it's modifying the way that you end up essentially absorbing nutrients. So that's the easy answer. When I'm looking under the scalp, I don't think that's the case. I think there's something with these peptides that are interfering with how the sugar is basically being absorbed and there's something there that's creating inflammation. So we'll just say that it's nutritional, but I think there's more to it.
- [26:00]
B
What do you think about COVID and people who lost hair from COVID What would you recommend that they do?
- [26:06]
C
So people who didn't think that this Covid hair loss was real, is 100 clinically proven? It is real. So 28 of people who Got Covid, ended up losing hair in some capacity. The problem is, is the inflammatory connection with COVID is an issue. I personally think that it's the change in the gut microbiome that was the biggest issue. We tried to tackle this with products in the clinic for probably three years till we hit the mark. There is a product that the only reason I brought it out of the clinics, it's called the hair stem serum. That product uses a lot of anti inflammatories topically. So we're using actually essential oils, which I always thought was super hoagie. But it helps bring down some of the inflammation on the scalp and that helps a lot. There's other things that you can do. Basically try to rehabilitate the gut because your gut microbiome probably shifted. So you want to look at things like, you know, Bacillus or Lactobacillus rootieri. There's plantarum, there's a handful of other ones that are going to be really beneficial there. We actually have some, some new products like a gut renewal collagen that is actually really helpful on that. But you need to deal with the gut and you need to deal with the inflammation.
- [27:14]
B
If I take tea tree oil, like an organic tea tree oil, and I put some drops in my shampoo in my conditioner and then I take a water, like a squirt water bottle and I put tea tree oil in there and spray it after. Is that helpful?
- [27:28]
C
If you have a fungal issue of the scalp, Absolutely.
- [27:31]
B
But what if you don't?
- [27:33]
C
No. Okay, so that's the thing. If you have an itchy, burning scalp, if you have tightness to the scalp or if you're losing hair, that might be a good addition. If you are using that to help your scalp microbiome don't. Because it's going to kill positive bacteria as well as probably kill some additional positive fungus and yeast.
- [27:51]
B
So how does someone come and test their scalp so they can figure out what they need?
- [27:55]
C
So really look, the way that we do it is we look at it under the microscope. So when we're looking at, at the scalp under the microscope, you can see if there's overgrowth, you can see if there's inflammation, you can see if there's parasites. So there's like these little tiny parasites called Demodex folliculorum that will literally feed off of your epithelial cells in the oil. Super gnarly, but they will, you can see them actually emerging. What do you do?
- [28:17]
A
Get rid of those.
- [28:18]
C
So tea tree actually is really helpful for those. But you need to be able to wash your hair on a daily basis. And there's a scalp serum that helps with that too. The hair stem serum.
- [28:28]
B
What can you test on my scalp today with that thing behind you?
- [28:32]
C
I can look at your scalp at 50 times magnification and see what's going on clinically.
- [28:38]
B
And you'll actually be able to tell right away everything that's going on?
- [28:41]
C
Yes. I mean, so this is our new, obviously home device. So I brought my laptop with my actual clinical device because I figured this was going to come up.
- [28:49]
B
Yeah, I do want you to test my scalp.
- [28:51]
C
And so we should do it on the laptop when we get towards the end.
- [28:54]
A
We'll do.
- [28:54]
B
No, yeah, we don't have to do it right now, but I just want to know.
- [28:56]
C
But that's, that's the best way because you can tell a perfectly healthy scalp by comparing the back of the scalp to the top front sides. And I can tell you where you're about to lose hair because of the way that the hair is growing as well as where hair is growing now that you don't know it's growing yet. So, like, if you're recovering from a situation, stress, or if you're using a new product, then you want to know if it's working. That's the best way to do it.
- [29:19]
A
What's the point of no return where someone comes to you and they're like, you're like, it's too late. I can't help.
- [29:24]
B
Like Mr. Clean. Is he past the point of no return?
- [29:27]
C
Probably. So dead hair follicles you will normally have. If the hair follicle is completely dormant and resting, so nothing is growing for approximately two to three years. It will most likely die, atrophy away like anything else that you're not using.
- [29:42]
B
What about babies and cradle cap? We see this a lot. What is that from and what can we do to prevent it?
- [29:49]
C
That's a great question. So cradle cap is essentially just an overgrowth of yeast on the skin scalp. So, you know, these are all things you need to talk to your pediatrician about. But there are little things like if you're giving the baby obviously breast milk and you are trying to then pass along something, you can make sure that your vitamin D is good, make sure your iron is good. If you want to do a little bit of a tea tree mist on the scalp, that will help take care of it. But obviously you just need to be really careful not to get it in baby's eyes. A variety of different Ways, it's it basically a yeast overgrowth.
- [30:21]
A
What about coconut oil in the hair?
- [30:24]
C
Also a great question. So coconut oil is filled with caprylic acid. So caprylic acid is very anti yeast antifungal, and that is okay. It's the only oil that I would recommend that you put on your scalp, but I recommend that you put it on your scalp and then you wash it off Approximately, you know, 45 minutes later with a thorough shampoo.
- [30:43]
A
So, you know, when you get them, you go to get a massage, and they go, do you want a scalp massage? And they want to put the oil in. Would you decline and say no oil in the hair? Like, unless it's 100%?
- [30:51]
B
Okay, yes, I put castor oil in my eyebrows because the Egyptians used to use it for hair growth. What is your vibe on that?
- [30:58]
C
Okay, so castor oil is the one other one that may be. I mean, I would want to dilute it because obviously castor oil is, like, super thick. Your eyebrows, you know, they're short, so you can put a little bit in there. I'd say that that's fine.
- [31:10]
B
Good answer. Because I have a Skinny Confidential product.
- [31:13]
A
She's like, thank God.
- [31:14]
B
That is cast castor oil with a little bit of a peptide. And I put it in my eyebrows every day.
- [31:19]
C
That's awesome. So now, I mean, there's a lot of people injecting peptides.
- [31:22]
A
I was gonna ask you about peptides, certainly.
- [31:24]
C
So, I mean, they're injecting them directly into the scalp. You can actually physically, obviously inject them in systemically. There's a lot of good peptides that are very, very helpful for hair growth. So we actually have a new peptide shampoo that is also very supportive of obviously, hair health. So you want to treat the scalp. So if your castor oil and obviously peptides are helping support the skin and the scalp, scalp or the eyebrow area, you're going to obviously grow better hair.
- [31:48]
B
What peptides specifically help grow hair?
- [31:51]
C
So there's three that we've identified that are probably the best. And so basically, copper peptides. So copper tripeptide 1, and then there's the bitenanol tripeptide 1 as well as the acetyl terapeptide 3. So what? That's the kind of the outlier, the acetyl terapeptide 3. It's really for essentially building the hair follicle itself because it's supporting the matrix and the skin. So that really supports the other two. So you want to look for obviously all three of those.
- [32:19]
A
Yeah, some People are saying that the copper is also good for skin and like 100 Botox or whatever. Or you can counter Botox or support collagen building.
- [32:28]
B
So why, if someone's not on a GLP1, why wouldn't they also do the copper peptide?
- [32:32]
C
I don't know how you would mix them because obviously you might have to use separate injections, but you certainly could
- [32:37]
B
because it seems like if you're going to lose your hair on GLP1, you mix it with that.
- [32:41]
C
That would be helpful, but I don't think it would solve the inflammatory problem completely. It would just be mildly supportive.
- [32:46]
B
Got it.
- [32:47]
A
Okay, here's another tangent. Not controversial, but maybe somewhat in some frameworks. When should people consider potential hair replacement surgery and what do they need to be aware of? A lot of people going in and out. As you hear about turkey and places like this. I have a friend that's like gung ho, ready to go over there. I said, let's, let me get some research for you first, buddy. Yeah, what do people need to know?
- [33:07]
C
So I just interviewed basically the, considered the top hair restoration surgeon of the decade. And he actually introduced something about turkey that I didn't know about. He's like, look, if you fly all the way there, you know, you're getting mildly sleep deprived. You go through what is a very, very rigorous procedure where you're getting thousands of tiny slits into your scalp as well as removing endless amounts of little organs and then putting them in those slits. And then you get back on a plane and you're on a plane for, for 12 to 14 hours in the airport in a ultra dry environment that is not good for your scalp and the overall well being of that hair. And I didn't even consider that, let alone you just don't really don't know what you're getting. There are a handful of phenomenal surgeons in the US Seek them out because that's probably your best bet.
- [33:55]
A
Why did turkey get such a. And listen, I don't know a lot about this. Actually, you do. Why did they get such a strong reputation for hair restorative surgeries over there?
- [34:03]
C
Because it's three to five grand. It's a cost.
- [34:07]
A
And like a bunch of people, do
- [34:08]
B
you have to pay to go there?
- [34:10]
C
It's all included.
- [34:11]
B
And if, if you're my friend, you're going there, you're, you're, you're buying a couple bottles at the club. Oh, this friend is buying all different kinds of things. Who knows what you're gonna end up.
- [34:23]
A
So, but that's the only reason was there a bunch of doctors over there that jumped in and started doing that. Like, how did they get the reputation? Because I think a lot of men think that that's where you go for the.
- [34:32]
C
But so I've actually been reached out to through Instagram for me to be an influencer for some of these, you know, Turkish.
- [34:39]
B
They have influencers for Turkey.
- [34:41]
C
Oh, yeah. And the amount of money that they're willing to pay you to promote it is ridiculous.
- [34:46]
A
Well, they should just call me.
- [34:47]
C
Exactly. Be like, I went to Turkey. Look at my hairline. Yeah. It's unnecessary.
- [34:51]
A
I'm just kidding, people. They're not. I'm not, I'm not. I'm just kidding. Unless the price is right. All right, keep going.
- [34:55]
C
But so realistically, you don't put yourself through that. Go. I mean, again, there's really, really good surgeons here. If you are at the point of no return, you want that full head of hair, go get the 8,000 graphs. That's going to take two sessions here in the US rather than just one mega session there. And just do it gradually and just don't try to do something overnight that doesn't seem possible.
- [35:18]
A
What's a red flag if somebody is taking a consultation here or somewhere else that they should be aware of?
- [35:23]
B
That's a good question. Surgeon.
- [35:25]
C
So you want to meet with the surgeon. So the surgeon is hopefully the one doing the actual surgery itself. When you're doing a zoom call and they say you're a great candidate, we're going to have the best result for you possible. And then you get on a plane and you fly however long to Turkey, and you never meet the surgeon before they start actually knowing what you want done. That's a red flag. So you want to meet with that surgeon and make sure they're the best and make sure they're doing the procedure and they're going to be held accountable for the result.
- [35:54]
B
When you decided to grow your own hair and you said you were losing hair, what did the tangible steps that you took to get this head of hair? Because if you guys are watching YouTube, you have a great head of hair.
- [36:06]
C
Yeah, it's been a real pain in the ass, honestly. So keeping a full head of hair and my situation, I have an underlying genetic predisposition. I have two different types of hair loss. I have diffuse alopecia areata and I have androgenetic alopecia. I didn't know that I had these first starting out, but I was experimenting with so many different things. And so I ended up using laser. I ended up obviously using different supplements and finding out sort of through trial and error what worked for me. But when I was applying this to my clients, like after I obviously grew my hair back and then I opened a clinic, like I found out real fast that there is no one size fits all. And what we did back in the day is we would give everybody a full supplement line, anti dht, basically full sort of a hair, skin and nails, but on steroids and then also efa, so essential fatty acids, great for your hair. And then we would use scalp massages and we'd use laser. And then we were using minoxidil and azylic acid and retinoic acid. It was a great combination of things. So that worked for about 80%. 20% had mild to no results. Some people got worse. So then I had to figure that out over the last, you know, 15 plus years to invent new things to fix them.
- [37:21]
B
If someone's hairline is receding, male or female, what can they do on the hairline to fix that?
- [37:29]
C
So if your hairline is receding, the highest probability is it's DHT related. So you want to suppress dht, so you want to use something that is going to control that. Conversion of testosterone to dihydrotestosterone. There are medications out there like finasteride, so that's one option. Could come along with side effects. There's other items that you can use. Like we have a DHT blocker max, which essentially has a clinically proven version of saw PA meto, which helps control that without the side effects. You need something topically like minoxidil if you don't want to use minoxidil because that can have side effects effects as well. You want to control the environment by decreasing inflammation. So you want to do an internal like again, whatever it is, you know, DHT blocker max or finasteride and then a topical application direct to the area. And then also if you want to really pump up results, that's when you use laser.
- [38:19]
A
Quick break to talk about Caldera Lab. It is no secret that I take my skincare rather seriously.
- [38:24]
B
Lauren, thank you. Thank God.
- [38:25]
A
Well, here's the thing. After years of doing this show and talking to so many experts, realizing the skin is a massive organization, you'd kind of have to be a dummy to not take care of your skin, even if you're a man.
- [38:35]
B
You also would kind of have to be a dummy to not take care of your skin after having me as a wife. So enter Caldera. Lab. This is specifically designed for men's thicker skin, which is super interesting. There's only four simple products, so it takes a couple minutes morning to night. I think this is a really nice way to ease your significant other seamlessly into a skincare routine.
- [38:56]
A
Here's the thing, ladies. Don't overwhelm the men in your lives. If you hand them 18 different products with 18 different steps, they're not going to know what to do. What I love about this brand is a man is just four simple products. Clean, non toxic ingredients. You don't have to worry about all that. In clinical trials, 97% of people agreed their skin looked more youthful in just four weeks. Look at me, I'm glowing. You can see me on camera. What do you think?
- [39:15]
B
I think you look great. The hydro layer was named best for anti aging by Men's health magazine. You can try Caldera Lab riscree for 60 days.
- [39:24]
A
And what I've specifically noticed is when I'm in public, when I'm talking to people, when I see my friends, they tell me that my skin looks good. It's shining, it's radiant, it looks more youthful. My lines are decreasing a little bit and it just feels good to have that feedback because obviously you want to have an impact and you want to look good. I don't care what any man says. Nobody wants to age like an old weathered saddle. So make sure you check it out.
- [39:42]
B
If you're looking for a gift he'll actually use every single day, this is it. Go to calderalab.com skinny and use code skinny for 20 off your first order. Go to calderalab dot com skinny and use code skinny for 20 OFF your first order. I rebrand everything for my kids, so it should not surprise you that I've rebranded a dessert called cookie crunch granola. And I use Purely Elizabeth's granola. They have this cookie granola that my kids are obsessed with. They think it's such a treat. But the best part is is there's no artificial flavors in it. How I like my bowl is I do a bunch of Greek yogurt. I'll do the original ancient green granola and then I'll also put honey on it. But sometimes I put bee pollen and pomegranate seeds. I really make it fun. I love Purely Elizabeth granola for the signature salty, sweet, crunchy custards and the delicious taste. It's certified USDA organic, gluten free, vegan and non GMO, project verified. I like this as a mom because it's baked with coconut oil. And it's simply sweetened with coconut sugar. It's an unrefined sugar. So if you're looking for something or a way that's creative to get your kids to eat healthy, here's what I do. I do Greek yogurt. For a lot of protein, I have, I pack the Greek yogurt on the plate. Then I will sprinkle purely Elizabeth's cookie granola on top. For myself, I'll use the original ancient green granola. And then I'll do a little bit of raw honey from the farmer's market. And here's the real trick. Are you ready? I do some non toxic sprinkles on top. Okay. And they think they are having the biggest treat in the world. So if you want to do my kid rebrand try it out. Visit PurelyElizabeth.com and use code Skinny at checkout for 20 off to taste the Obsession session yourself. PurelyElizabeth.com code skinny. How many times have you guys left a doctor's appointment feeling like you got nothing useful? Maybe they said you're just fine or they told you to drink more water. That's happened to me. They said drink more water. There's no real data. There's no game plan. Just like a pat on the back, I'm sure this has happened to a lot of you. Enter Superpower. Superpower sends a licensed professional to your home, or you can visit a lab nearby. There's one simple blood draw with over a hundred biomarkers, which is way more than what you usually get. And it unlocks a real understanding of your body as you head into a new year. So they have this app and it details information on your heart, your liver, your thyroids, your hormones, metabolism, vitamins, mineral levels, even environmental toxins. So you can get all of these biomarkers done in one simple blood draw. Okay, so, so it's not like crazy amount of blood. You'll know more about what supplements to take or how much sleep you need or what your diet should focus on. I personally think this is genius because the less blood, the better for me. And I like that I can get all my biomarkers done quickly and efficiently. You can make lifestyle and behavior adjustments, and you can even get your true biological age that you can track over time. Make this the year you stop guessing about your health with superpower. Not only did superpower reduce their price to just $199, but for a limited time, our listeners get an additional $20. Off with code skinny. Head to superpower.com and use code skinny at checkout for 20% off your membership. After you sign up, they'll ask you about how you heard about them, so make sure to mention this podcast to support the show. Introducing the Skinny Confidential ice roller. Reimagined. Think sleeker lines, a softer pink, a custom buttery dust bag, and a silver roller. Not pink anymore. That is ice cold. I wanted to do a zhuzh on the iconic ice roller. I wanted to update it. This ice roller for me has always been more than just a tool. It's about helping us de puff and sculpt and calm the skin in a way that feels intentional. And I wanted the ice roller to feel evolved. It's changed. You've changed. So, yes, the new gorgeous, stunning, beautiful ice roller is still going to do the same things. It reduces puffiness and redness in your face. I used it this morning before I put on my makeup. It definitely helps with the under eye bags. Of course, it helps boost circulation and radiance. I just feel like it really helps stimulate blood flow and gives me that tighter, more radiant skin. And then it also is known to give you smoother, tighter layers looking skin. So what I like to do is I like to combine facial massage with cold therapy. And this really helps give you a really nice foundation before you even apply your skin care. This ice roller for me is a full circle moment. I think that a lot of you bought the ice roller, you know, five, six years ago when we launched it. And now I am launching something that feels more in alignment with where you're at. It's so beautiful. You guys like, it's just softer and more effortless in every way. And I really put my own touches on every single little step, from the packaging to the colors to how it feels to even the roller. It's all been elevated just for you. So the ritual, the Lauren ritual, is you do cold therapy to help fight inflammation. You roll it it, you glide it across your face. I put it on my jawline, my neck, I roll it down. Your skin is just going to appear smoother and tighter before you go in for the kill. With the skincare and the makeup, don't skip the cold therapy. The new ice roller is an upgrade designed to meet the standards of today. And I hope you guys love it as much as I do. This is the beauty tool that started it all redesigned to evolve with you. I'm showing it on YouTube too. If you're on YouTube, if you're seeing me visually get it, why it's hot@shopskinnyconfidential.com. that's shopskinnyconfidential.com. what is this thing that everyone's using? You just mentioned it. It starts with an M A Minoxidil. Everyone's using this. What is. Explain this to me.
- [45:42]
C
Okay, so minoxidil has been around forever. So now what's happening is your people are consuming oral minoxidil. So minoxidil. Do you guys remember Rogaine?
- [45:50]
B
Yeah.
- [45:51]
C
Yeah. Okay, so Rogain. So, so that's what minoxidil is. Rogaine is 5% minoxidil. And you apply that directly to the scalp. Well, that came from a blood pressure drug that was accidentally growing people's hair during the clinical trial back in like the late 70s and early 80s. So now people go, well, why don't we just go back and do that? Even though I don't have a blood pressure issue. So they're basically microdosing minoxidil. So rather than using 10 milligrams or 20 milligrams, they're using 1.25 or, or basically 2.5 max. Problem is that it only stimulates, whether you're using it topically or internally, the acceleration of basically the hair follicle itself. But if you still have dht, if you still have nutritional problems, it's not gonna do anything for you. It's a great stack. So if you do, you minimize all the things going on internally, and then you use minoxidil topically or orally. That's a great enhancement. You can actually, actually use that alongside laser. You can use it alongside peptides. So but it, it has its place kind of like cardio and weight training. Like, what's your goal? So it's just an enhancement to help rehabilitate your hair.
- [46:58]
B
What's the side effects of it?
- [47:00]
C
So the side effects, if you're using it orally, heart palpitations, lightheadedness, low, low blood pressure. So you can have obviously swelling of the ankles, swelling of the hands. You know, sometimes the. If you're using it topically, they use propylene glycol a lot because it's a great solvent that will end up creating contact dermatitis, sometimes dandruff.
- [47:20]
B
So it's like.
- [47:22]
C
Yeah, I know. I mean, there's trade offs to everything. So I'd get a wig, I mean, but then you gotta go and get the wig done.
- [47:30]
A
Speaking of weightlifting and working out, what are your thoughts on creatine as it relates to hair loss? Is that true? Is it not True. Is it situational?
- [47:38]
C
So back in the day I don't know if you guys, I, I, when I went to an all guys military school, did a lot of working out. You know that was back when you did you 25 grams to load 10 grams daily thereafter. Back then it was more of a problem. Now obviously it's more concentrated, it's cleaner. I think it really depends on the person. You need to obviously make sure that you're getting the right nutrients so that the creatine does not interfere with, you know, any kidney function or something along those lines. So as long as you're healthy, I think it's fine.
- [48:08]
B
Someone told me that you have to use creatine from Germany instead of China. Jenna from agent nator, she said that it's better to use it from Germany because it's sourced differently.
- [48:19]
C
I would agree with that 100%. The Germans have actually a phenomenal standard for yeah, making all types of nutritional supplements. It's extremely expensive to manufacture, manufacture there and their standards even to get basically you know, selling in that environment have to meet, you know, all these standards.
- [48:37]
B
Live Momentous is from Germany and I just ordered the creatine so use code skinny.
- [48:43]
A
So but this is a real tangent but I'm glad you brought it up. I think creatine gets a bad name because of the way that guys like ourselves used to abuse it back in the day. Because I was saying same camp, you'd be taking like 30, 35 grams of creatine a day and you get the bloating and the hair and all that. But now like you know, because she was asking, listen, you're taking 5 grams of creatine a day, like it's, yeah, it's not going to have any.
- [49:07]
C
It's cleaner and more concentrated now.
- [49:08]
A
Gray hair, graying people.
- [49:11]
C
I can't fix that.
- [49:12]
A
You can't fix that. Okay, what, what is the cause? Is it genetic? I see mine coming in. I know and I, you know, I don't think I can fix it either. But what do we, what do you do? Huberman just did an episode that said potentially you can reverse some of it.
- [49:25]
C
Yeah. So there, you definitely can reverse some of it. It in there's these little pockets of melanin stem cells right at the bulge of the hair follicle. When those get reduced and they start to just withdraw then if you do something, copper peptides are a great one. So you can do it systemically, you can do it topically that will help, you know, moderately reverse it. Demodex Folliculorum the little tiny parasite, will actually feed off of that stem cell bulge and will minimize the amount of stem cells being pushed into the, basically the melanin. And that itself can be minimized by killing the Demodex and having good scalp hygiene. So I'd say scalp hygiene, copper peptides, those are the only things that I actually see work.
- [50:10]
A
Why do some people gray earlier than others?
- [50:13]
C
Stress. Stress and genetics. Yeah. Again, I have an underlying condition. I ended up having a variety of health, health issues in the last, like 18 months. My hair probably doubled in, in gray because of it. But, you know, you, you earn your gray sometimes.
- [50:29]
B
Yeah. Postpartum.
- [50:32]
C
Yes.
- [50:33]
B
Talk to us about postpartum hair loss and what we can do to combat it.
- [50:38]
C
So I, I have helped many, many women with postpartum hair loss. You want to go into basically being pregnant and making sure that you have all of the right nutrients. Scientifically, with blood work, make sure that you have the five key nutrients in your blood. Very, very abundant. Which are, which are so zinc, vitamin D3, ferritin, folate, B12. You want to have the proper levels. So my app, actually, you can take a picture of your blood tests and it will tell you if your levels are proper or not.
- [51:12]
A
Ferritin.
- [51:13]
C
So ferritin is your iron storage protein.
- [51:15]
A
Okay. Okay.
- [51:16]
C
So if you. Again, I mean, even if I, I have a lot of women who are postmenopausal or perimenopausal, and they're, they're, you know, their menstruation is off, they're, they're having more frequent cycles, they're losing more blood, and they're doing a lot of working out. So your body's breaking down your muscular tissue, it needs more iron, plus you're losing more blood. Your ferritin depletes. Young women who are basically limiting animal protein and they are having a period for the first time, they are going to lose hair. So if you have young women who are losing hair, it's most likely due to ferritin. So you want to make sure that nutrient's good. You have to protect yourself from the telogen effluvium shed. That happens immediately following childbirth. Your body just grew a human. Right. Like, I mean, this is a crazy task to undergo. And then as soon as you have this baby, your hormones shed, shift within days. So you have to minimize that. You can protect yourself topically. You can use something like a black cohosh tincture topically, which will help mask the estrogen receptors. Obviously, you don't want to handle your child immediately after handling the liquid. But that can help prevent that. But also making sure your D3 and ferritin are extremely important because your body is nutrient deficient after giving birth and growing a human.
- [52:35]
B
You keep saying ferritin. Why are you calling iron ferritin? What is.
- [52:39]
A
It's the store.
- [52:40]
C
Yeah. Iron storage protein. So there's serum iron.
- [52:42]
B
Okay.
- [52:43]
C
So that's the iron floating around in your blood that's basically like building tissue.
- [52:48]
B
Right.
- [52:48]
C
It's building hemoglobin. The ferritin is your iron reserves. So it's a little protein that basically activates when your iron gets low. Your body knows when your ferritin is getting low and it will start going, I don't have enough serum iron or enough savings to pay my bills, so I'm going to start decreasing my spending. The easy way to do that is by not obviously making a ton of hair.
- [53:13]
B
Is there a brand that you like or do you just not. Do you not have a specific brand?
- [53:17]
C
There's a product called derma iron. So Derma iron, specifically formulated for this particular situation. It has marine collagen in it. It also has ferrous by glycanate. And this is a highly absorbable form of iron that is not going to leave you constipated.
- [53:32]
B
And what about. That's what's annoying about it. What about the dha you keep, you keep saying, Is there dht? Dht, dht, yes. And what's that brand?
- [53:41]
C
So DHT again, Advanced trichology. There's two forms of this. There's one that's more of a DHT blocker with immune support. And then there's a DHT blocker, maximum strength, which is a single soft gel. A lot of clinical backing. That's what you do to just minimize the DHC conversion is there.
- [53:56]
B
But is there a brand that you like?
- [53:58]
C
Advanced trichology.
- [53:59]
B
So it's your brand?
- [54:00]
C
It's my brand.
- [54:01]
B
Oh.
- [54:01]
C
The reason I do what I do is I spent 17 years literally across the desk from somebody helping them grow hair back, watching their, their hair grow under the microscope every six weeks with thousands and thousands of people. A list celebrities that we see all the time. I've worked with them to help get their hair back because no one was able to fix this. And I had to develop. Develop new products to support holes in the marketplace that just didn't have products to fill.
- [54:28]
B
Okay, so if someone's listening and all they wanna do is grow more hair and fix their scalp, what are the three things that you suggest that they
- [54:38]
C
do right now, today, if they genetically have been the same and there's essentially no change in their hair from when they went through puberty to now, low level laser therapy, just a little bit, 10 minutes once a week would be great. No more than 80 diodes. Using a little bit of a peptide shampoo. So like the hair stem peptide shampoo, that's going to be supportive and that will help most people who have no underlying condition. But if there is some reduction in overall volume, get your blood tests, go ahead and get your vitamin D3 tested and your ferritin at the very least. And if you have any gut issues, issues, constipation, diarrhea, acid reflux, you need to probably get on some probiotics and you need to probably treat that.
- [55:23]
B
Wow. I learned a lot in this episode. Where can everyone find you to work with you and to say hello?
- [55:33]
C
I'm all over YouTube and Instagram. So William gone at Trichologist that handle you can find me pretty much anywhere. I have a podcast, so the Trichologist podcast, which also has a website where you can go to thetricologist.com I can do your consultation. But and obviously my brand is advanced trichology products.
- [55:52]
B
Thank you, William.