A Sex Thing?; Pagani Utopia; THAT McLaren Crash

Summary

The Smoking Tire Podcast – Episode Summary: "A Sex Thing?; Pagani Utopia; THAT McLaren Crash"

Release Date: October 17, 2024
Hosts: Matt Farah and Zach Klapman

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1. Pagani Utopia: An In-Depth Review

Driving Experience and Specifications

Matt Farah and Zach Klapman delve into the intricacies of the Pagani Utopia, a hypercar priced at over $3 million. They discuss its impressive specifications, including a 6-liter Mercedes-AMG V12 engine producing approximately 850 horsepower and a curb weight of around 2,800 pounds. The Utopia features a single-clutch gearbox, which Matt notes is lighter than a dual-clutch system. Although initially disappointed to drive the automatic version—since a manual was available but slated for next year—they commend the sequential paddle shifters and smooth downshifts:

Matt Farah [16:48]: "Which, yes, disappointing."

Design and Engineering

The hosts appreciate the Utopia's carbon fiber body, inboard cantilevered suspension, and magnetic ride control. They highlight the car's unique design elements, such as visible engineering components on the steering wheel and gear indicators inspired by the Bugatti Tourbillon. Matt emphasizes the blend of artistry and functionality:

Matt Farah [24:55]: "It's all about, like, seeing the engineering."

Riding Comfort and Practicality

Despite its supercar status, the Pagani Utopia offers a comfortable ride suitable for long road trips. Matt drives the car for eight hours, noting its ability to handle both canyons and highways with ease. However, he points out minor flaws like the clunky stereo interface and the backup camera's overheating issue:

Matt Farah [29:39]: "The backup camera overheated and the screen turned just green."

2. Encounter with a Cop-Themed Biker

While filming the Pagani Utopia at Point Magoo in Malibu, Matt and Zach encounter a 17-year-old on a cop-adjacent motorcycle. The biker performs aggressive maneuvers, including two donuts, which frustrates the Pagani owners. Zach humorously reflects on the incident:

Zach Klapman [11:05]: "Yeah, that's a good spec."

Matt expresses his skepticism about the biker's motives, suggesting it might be a queer fetish or simply a display of disrespect towards the expensive vehicle:

Matt Farah [09:21]: "If it's like a queer fetish thing... have fun."

3. Hyundai Elantra N Facelift: What’s New?

The discussion shifts to the facelifted Hyundai Elantra N, which Zach has been testing recently. Key updates include new bushings, 33-pound lighter wheels per corner, and revised suspension software to accommodate the lighter wheels. Matt shares his experience with the heavier steering feel, which both find unusual:

Matt Farah [46:35]: "This was a heavy steering, it was odd. It seemed weird."
Zach Klapman [46:36]: "Yeah. And I was in, I was not in sport mode."

They debate whether the heavy steering is a design choice or a potential alignment issue, with Zach planning to consult Hyundai for clarification.

4. Maving RM1S Electric Motorcycle: A Mixed Review

Matt introduces the Maving RM1S, an electric motorcycle designed in a cafe racer style. While aesthetically pleasing, the motorcycle falls short in performance and practicality. Key points include:

• Battery Swapping: Users can hot-swap batteries priced at $1,500 each, though Matt questions the viability of this feature.
• Range and Speed: Advertised at 80 miles, Matt records a personal range of 52 miles with a top speed of 62-63 mph, likening it to a 150cc Vespa.
• Weight and Cost: Weighing 300 pounds with batteries totaling around 50 pounds, the motorcycle is priced at $9,000, making it less practical compared to traditional scooters like the Vespa.

Matt critiques the RM1S for being overpriced and underperforming, ultimately preferring his practical Vespa for commuting:

Matt Farah [60:37]: "The only thing it really delivers on for the money is the style."

5. THAT McLaren Crash: A Cautionary Tale

The hosts recount a McLaren crash involving a popular streamer who was distracted by his phone while driving in heavy rain. The accident highlights the dangers of distracted driving and the pitfalls of monetizing every moment for content creation. Zach and Matt express disappointment over the streamer's lack of responsibility:

Zach Klapman [65:15]: "But the reason the Internet really came after him, I mean, that's very dumb."

6. Honda’s Electric Vehicle Concept: Blending History with Innovation

Matt discusses Honda's new electric vehicle concept that emulates the sounds, looks, and driving dynamics of historic Honda models like the NSX and S2000. Features include:

• Selectable Engine Sounds: Allowing drivers to choose from various Honda-era engine sounds.
• Dashboard Emulation: Mimicking the aesthetic of classic models with modern technology.
• Unique Design Elements: Incorporating an 80s post-apocalyptic vibe with practical functionalities like the EQ dashboard emulator.

The hosts praise Honda’s initiative as a creative use of EV technology, though Matt suggests other brands like Porsche could adopt similar features.

Matt Farah [70:49]: "Go to Drive or someone they reported on the drive yesterday."

7. Listener Questions and Community Interaction

The episode includes responses to listener queries, such as ranking BMW M3 generations and identifying future classic cars. Matt and Zach offer their insights:

• BMW M3 Rankings: Matt prefers the E46 for its balance of performance and aesthetics, while Zach contests with higher rankings for newer models like the F80.

  Matt Farah [104:38]: "E46 [is] at the top."

• Future Classic Cars: Suggestions include the Lexus LC 500, Jaguar F-Type, Toyota GR86, and Ford GT500, emphasizing the blend of performance, design, and limited production runs as factors for future collectibility.

8. Societal Reflections: Income Inequality and Luxury Cars

Throughout the episode, Matt and Zach reflect on the societal implications of owning ultra-expensive cars like the Pagani Utopia amidst rising income inequality. They question whether such displays of wealth contribute negatively to societal dynamics:

Matt Farah [38:29]: "This might be a problem with society, that that is where we're at right now."

9. Final Thoughts and Next Episode Teasers

As the episode concludes, the hosts tease upcoming segments and express gratitude towards their patrons. They also remind listeners to engage with their Patreon for exclusive content and support.

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Notable Quotes:

• Matt Farah [16:48]: "Which, yes, disappointing."
• Matt Farah [24:55]: "It's all about, like, seeing the engineering."
• Matt Farah [46:35]: "This was a heavy steering, it was odd. It seemed weird."
• Matt Farah [60:37]: "The only thing it really delivers on for the money is the style."
• Zach Klapman [65:15]: "But the reason the Internet really came after him, I mean, that's very dumb."
• Matt Farah [38:29]: "This might be a problem with society, that that is where we're at right now."
• Matt Farah [104:38]: "E46 [is] at the top."

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This episode of The Smoking Tire offers a comprehensive exploration of high-end automotive experiences, practical vehicle reviews, and societal musings, all delivered with the hosts' characteristic candor and expertise. Whether you're an automotive enthusiast or simply curious about the latest trends, Matt and Zach provide valuable insights and engaging discussions.

Transcript

[Matt Farah]

No, I don't know. Like I've heard in the past that these guys who cosplay as sort of cop adjacent looking people on retired cop bikes, they dress just like cops. I know.

[Zach Klapman]

They get, they get a gold helmet.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

They get a black jacket. Like they are two badges away from impersonating an officer.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. Hello everybody. Welcome to the Smoking Tire Podcast. Today's episode is brought to you by off the Record. We love off the Record. You need off the Record, you gotta download that app and use code tstpod because if you get a ticket you want off the Record in your pocket, any moving violation, big or small, don't plead guilty, get off the record to fight that ticket for you. They have a fantastic winning percentage in the high 90s. And if they don't get those points off your record, you don't pay. Points on your driving record could affect your ability to drive legally, could affect your employment, could affect your insurance rates. All kinds of stuff you don't want to mess with. Off the Record is here for you. Download the off the Record app and use code tstpod to get 10% off all services with off the Record or go to offtherecord.com TST for the exact same discount. It's super easy. You just upload a photo or scan of your ticket, describe the incident in your own words and off the Record goes to work. Download that app, code TSTPOD or offtherecord. All right. On this episode of the podcast, I spent the day in the $3 million plus Pagani Utopia and we spend a lot of time talking about that. Plus I'm riding the maving RM1S electric motorcycle which is a very good looking thing. It's very pretty, cafe racer style and a really cool thing to be commuting around in. But there are of course some problems. Plus Zach and I discussed the facelifted Elantra n he has been driving for a few days. And Honda did the thing that I called by emulating cars from its past in a new EV concept. We got a bunch going on. It's Zach and I doing a cruise show. It's the Smoking Tire podcast. Let's go.

[Zach Klapman]

We are, yes, we are late folks. David says we're as consistent as assistantly on time as a Tesla product rollout. That is hyper hyperbole. We are not years late and I.

[Matt Farah]

Didn'T take your fucking money on the premise that this will be available and then not give you a product.

[Zach Klapman]

I mean, technically people do pay money to watch the show live, but we are only 30 minutes late. We're not four to nine years late. Yeah, like the Tesla Roadster. Yeah, the new one.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. I think. I mean.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, Robo Taxi announcement is today. Oh, yeah.

[Matt Farah]

I'm sure that'll be a very real product that'll work exactly as advertised. There's no possible way that Dark Maga won't be completely full of shit about this one.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. Sorry we're a few minutes late. I was on a call with Shop Monkey trying to upgrade our systems. We. I really believe that you should not, like, a lot of people like to rely on, like, software and things. And I've always hated companies that use, like, a lot of software for stuff. I just, like, don't like it. It's just me. Like, it's not. It's not that, like, software is necessarily, like, a bad thing, but it always seems like overcomplicating things that don't need to be that complicated. And so I always believe in, like, the most. The most simple thing first. Like, start with a piece of paper. And if a piece of paper does the thing that you need, great. Yeah, we do not need software. And so for, like, four years, there's been, like, a bunch of things where, like, pieces of paper. Google Calendar, you know, like, fucking the most. An iPad using icloud, like an Excel spreadsheet or whatever. The Google Excel. Google Sheets.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, Google Sheets.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. Yeah. Like, all of those very basic tools have gotten us, like, four years into a business without, like, problems. Pretty much.

[Zach Klapman]

Pretty good.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, it's pretty good. But, like, now that we have two full buildings, a lot of people are asking us to do stuff for them, like concierge stuff, which we do. But, like, it's a lot more than when we just had one building or 1.25 buildings or whatever. And so now we need something that, like, actually organizes a workflow of, like, 10 concierge services at a time. We've outgrown paper and Google.

[Zach Klapman]

It's a good problem to have.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, yeah, it is, it is. But, like, you know, and this, you know, Shop Monkey is what, like, a lot of, like, mechanic shops and tuning shops, like, use. But we have some, like, real specific needs that are not necessarily, like, cars that come in here. You know, when we check in a car, it's not to perform a service on it most of the time. It's just because it's, like, coming in. So it's like, there's a lot of very specific questions of, like, all right, well, how do I do this thing? That is like an iPhone and a piece of paper. How do I make that into this specific workflow? So it's like, it's a good piece of software, especially if you have like a mechanic shop. I'm not doing a fucking ad. There's no. This is not an ad. But for us, it's like we need to adapt it in certain ways and sort of like make it do things it might not have originally been designed to do.

[Zach Klapman]

Well, do they have to adapt it or do you guys have to.

[Matt Farah]

No, it's like this feature, but we'll.

[Zach Klapman]

Use it for this.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, kind of like it's a feature that might not be meant for what we're doing, but we can sort of like make it do that.

[Zach Klapman]

So I mean, hopefully it benefits. When we were at West Coast Tire Pros, I was talking to the guy and the delica was like, was not in their system. But most cars are in their system and they can just type in the car they're working on and it pulls up, like every part, number, everything they need. And it's just, you know, it speeds all that stuff up that someone used to have to go to a book and like, cross reference and, you know, how do we find the air filter for this vehicle? So stuff like that, I'm sure. Well, it took a lot of load off of, like, parts persons or whatever.

[Matt Farah]

Sure, it might have been lightly embarrassing, but like, you know, the shop monkey shit has like a, like a license plate like database that it works with like the actual dmv. So in theory, you should be able to type in a car's license plate and it will say 2003 BMW M3 based on your license plate. I tried it with three of my cars. None of them came up.

[Zach Klapman]

It seems like the VIN would be the way to go.

[Matt Farah]

The VIN is probably the better way. I didn't. I don't have VINs, just like, handy. So I just. I tried license plates.

[Zach Klapman]

Or are your cars not registered? Are you actually in the CIA?

[Matt Farah]

Yes, I have ghost plates. I drive around, I ride dirty. I ride. Fake tags, straight up, no shame. Fake tags. We were shooting Pagani yesterday, and John, our photographer, rented a minivan. Like, rented a Pacifica, as one does when doing video production. Fucking. The reg was expired by two months. I fucking.

[Zach Klapman]

I go, turo.

[Matt Farah]

I go, dude, no, you got it from, like, a proper company.

[Zach Klapman]

What?

[Matt Farah]

I was like, did you. Is this your van or did you rent this? He's like, I rented. I was like, this reg expired in August. Like, what the fuck? He was like, oh, Shit, I'm riding dirty in a red.

[Zach Klapman]

If you got a ticket, you just hand it to Hertz.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Like, here you go.

[Matt Farah]

Not your problem. Like, damn, that's fucking shady. That is especially like rolling around Malibu with the hatch open, shooting out the back of it. No permits, fucking.

[Zach Klapman]

Well, I mean, that'll. You get more trouble for that probably. And then they would add on expired.

[Matt Farah]

We had a little panic attack because you know them guys that roll around on the ex cop bikes cosplaying as cops.

[Zach Klapman]

Yes.

[Matt Farah]

I don't know if it's like also tied into a sort of a queer thing. Like, I don't know if it's like a Village People vibe or it's a. If it's like a Blue Lives Matter.

[Zach Klapman]

Cosplaying mass statements do not represent the statements of the smoking tire.

[Matt Farah]

I'm just like, no, I don't know. Like I've heard in the past that these guys who cosplay as sort of cop adjacent looking people.

[Zach Klapman]

Right.

[Matt Farah]

On retired cop bikes, they dress just like cops. I know.

[Zach Klapman]

They get, they get a gold helmet.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

They get a black jacket. They are two badges away from impersonating an officer.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. And they'll put stickers on the bike that look like cop stickers but aren't.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

Now like, I don't know if it's like, what the, what is, what is the hard on about cosplaying a cop? I mean, maybe it's the same as driving an old Crown Vic around with a light. But like you're. You have to dress up too.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, I didn't have to dress up. That's a big advantage of the car, right?

[Matt Farah]

It is. Yeah. So. But, but I don't know if it's like a. If it's like a.

[Zach Klapman]

That's interesting.

[Matt Farah]

A gay fetish thing. I've heard from. People have told me there is a gay fetish element to it. I think I'm not lobbing accusations. And by the way, if it is, fuck each other dressed as cops. Like, have fun. Oh.

[Zach Klapman]

I mean, there's a fetish for anything. That's Rule 42. But all I'm saying is that panicked me.

[Matt Farah]

Cause we were driving around hatch up shooting a $3 million car and I'm like, oh boy, here's the motorcycle cop.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

But like he came around and passed us and I was like, that's a fucking faker. Yeah, that's a straight faker.

[Zach Klapman]

And sometimes they have. They'll have a utility belt on. There's no gun. But like they're really? To the knives.

[Matt Farah]

They're cosplaying full on.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. It is an interesting thing.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. So, like, I don't know if it's like, you know, super blue lives matter vibe or if it's like a gay vibe. They. Those two probably don't intersect very often, but.

[Zach Klapman]

But there's.

[Matt Farah]

There's.

[Zach Klapman]

I'm sure there's overlap prob. And they probably.

[Matt Farah]

And speaking of the fucking Crown Vic, you know, the Crown Vic is a cop car. We're down at Point Magoo. Scroll in the photos of the Pagani. We'll talk about. We'll just fucking dive in and talk about Pagani. Scroll to the right. Keep going. So I guess it's not a great photo of what I'm talking about, but this photo is taken at Point Magoo in Malibu. It's a very popular spot off pch. There's like big rock formations and crashing.

[Zach Klapman]

Big dirt turnout.

[Matt Farah]

Big dirt turnout. Popular for photos and whatever. We're in the big dirt turnout, shooting this car fucking. Some fucking homie rolls in in a fucking X cop car with the. With the side lights, spotlights. With the spotlights. And it has a mini bully bar on the front of it.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, that's a good spec.

[Matt Farah]

It's a good spec.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

Dives into the turnout, fucking rips two donuts and then dips fucking out. Dude, the Pagani guys were losing their mind because he was like. He basically sprayed gravel at the car and you couldn't. You could not possibly. I had seen it. I know. I see a fucking ex cop car and my fucking eyes are up. The dude did two passes on the road before coming in and doing.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, so he saw cool car. Then he saw cameras. And he's like, watch this.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

And he knew he gravel machine gun.

[Matt Farah]

This was his plan. He fucking gravel. And he was just far enough away from the car.

[Zach Klapman]

Was he 17?

[Matt Farah]

He was young.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, he was. That is a 17 year old.

[Matt Farah]

He was sure. Yeah. And he was just far enough away from the car that the gravel fucking settled right at the base of the car and didn't actually gravel cannon the car.

[Zach Klapman]

Wow. Maybe it was Jack Doherty in his new car since he crashed his McLaren.

[Matt Farah]

And we'll talk about it later. And the Pagani guys were like, losing because they don't fucking. They don't just, like, let this car out of their sight.

[Zach Klapman]

It wasn't like for people listening. This is a bare carbon Pagani utopia.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. So I had to have. I mean, they were nice people, but I had to have like a fucking Entourage like a caravan of cars everywhere. It was annoying, but they're nice people and you play by their rule. Whatever, Fine. Okay. But the Italians were fucking having a shit cuz. And.

[Zach Klapman]

And you had to explain dirt bags.

[Matt Farah]

Well, in our. Yeah. And our photographer, the Italians was like, this is America. I wish I had my gun. He's like, if I had my gun, I would have shot at this guy.

[Zach Klapman]

One of the Italians of that.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. I was like, all right, okay, cool. Glad you don't have your gun, because that's not worth it.

[Zach Klapman]

Right?

[Matt Farah]

And like, yeah, you can do 10 years for this car that you don't own.

[Zach Klapman]

Al Capone iii, who. Just Pagani.

[Matt Farah]

But then the photographer, John Quick with it, saw the dust cloud coming. He's like, clear out and got the shot of the dust cloud around the car. It looks awesome.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, my God.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, he got the shot.

[Zach Klapman]

After that, he turned it. Hey, lemon. Lemonade. Lemonade on that in the gold. Wow. Yeah, that's quick moving.

[Matt Farah]

But this, to this kid in this cop car was. I mean, that's a pretty dirt bag move.

[Zach Klapman]

It is. It is. Yeah. It really is.

[Matt Farah]

Like, and there's no way he could have been like, I'm going to do this donut. So just close enough to scare him, but not enough to have a gravel can in the car. Like, no, I think he was trying to gravel can in the car.

[Zach Klapman]

There's no way that that much thought went through this or it went into this. Because you're 17, you own a Crown Victoria, You're a fucking moron. I mean, how old do you have.

[Matt Farah]

To be to understand the concept of gravel cannon?

[Zach Klapman]

25.

[Matt Farah]

Really? Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

You need your frontal lobe done. Like, it has to be finished developing. When I was a kid, I pulled into, like, every dirt lot I saw, I would pull in and do something. I never did it next to an expensive car, and I probably wouldn't because I think. I know. Like, that probably costs a lot of money, and if I damage it, I'm getting sued. But this person didn't think about that. They just. Who knows, it could have been. They hate the expensive car, or they're like, I'm going to show off for the camera. I'm going to get hired as a stunt driver.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, I didn't put the I'm going to get hired as a stunt driver one there. I pretty much was like, oh, this person really doesn't like the idea that this expensive car is here maybe. Which part of me was like, you know, I guess when you drive a car around like this. You can't not be like, was this.

[Zach Klapman]

The automotive version of throwing soup at the da Vinci painting? Is that what happened?

[Matt Farah]

Throwing paint on someone in a fur? Right.

[Zach Klapman]

And it will do nothing. It will draw some attention, but it won't actually stop. The existence of a bunch of people.

[Matt Farah]

Were like, cool car, man. And one kid's like, fuck that guy.

[Zach Klapman]

Really?

[Matt Farah]

I mean.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, right. I mean, this. This car is amazing.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. Pagani Utopia. I drove it for Road and Track. So there's a story for the print magazine coming up and, and I, you know, I suppose I'm going to quote, scoop myself a little bit here, but I'll start this by saying, please subscribe to Road and Track. Please get a. Get a subscription to the print mag or the website and. Or go pick up the latest issue, which is on newsstands or airports and wherever. If you want back issues, you buy them on Amazon. It pains me to say, but you can just search, you know, Road and Track, June 2024, and you can buy all the back issues, which is kind of neat, actually. So the Utopia is their new car. It's all new. It's got the 6 liter Mercedes or AMG V12. AMG still builds the motor. They only build it for Pagani. It's not being used in any other cars. It's like 850 horsepower and the car weighs 2800 and change wet. What is the curb weight? Is 2800 the actual curb weight?

[Zach Klapman]

Not the Ferrari weight?

[Matt Farah]

I said three times. Dry or curb? Curb. Dry or curb? Curb.

[Zach Klapman]

Wow.

[Matt Farah]

No, I don't have a scale, so I can't verify it, but I think.

[Zach Klapman]

It makes sense to me. The body's carbon fiber. There's no hybrid system. Yeah, this is a traditional carbon carb.

[Matt Farah]

It's a single clutch gearbox, which is lighter than a dual clutch gearbox.

[Zach Klapman]

I thought this had a manual optional.

[Matt Farah]

So I was lightly disappointed to find out that this factory car has an automatic gearbox. And they said the manual. Although the take rate is 70% on the manual. The manual factory car won't be here until next year, so I had to drive the automatic.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay.

[Matt Farah]

Which, yes, disappointing.

[Zach Klapman]

A little bit.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

But look, they offer it 70% take, right? People who aren't taking it, whatever, they have their reasons.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

I feel I'm bummed for you, especially because the shift linkage still looks awesome.

[Matt Farah]

Even though it's actually shifting. Using the lever is pretty rewarding, really.

[Zach Klapman]

To have like a. Yeah, it's got a good.

[Matt Farah]

It's got a good, like a sequential Box. Yeah, yeah. You can. You can shift it like a sequential.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, all right, well, then that's awesome.

[Matt Farah]

Paddles as well, then.

[Zach Klapman]

That's awesome.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, Yeah. I mean, it's. It's still pretty cool, even though it's not manual. But I can tell you that in manual, it will be better.

[Zach Klapman]

What is the little nubbin in the seat? That is. It would be in front of your gentleman, that.

[Matt Farah]

So the seat is a fixed back. So you have a slider. Manual slider, and then that little button in between your balls there. If the seat is curved, it makes it.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, it's like the Porsche.

[Matt Farah]

Like the Porsche seat where you can change the angle of the curve.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay, cool.

[Matt Farah]

So I just set it to as far back as it would go. Decent amount of room, actually. I fit. Like, not only did I fit, I could. I drove that car. I drove this car for eight hours yesterday. I drove it a lot. I drove one and a quarter tanks of gas, and it was actually quite comfortable. I really understand why if you bought one of these, like. Like, it's not a race car. It doesn't feel like a race car. It's not supposed to be a race car. You know, they'll have a quote, track focused one. Paris Mullins, who is their factory driver, has done a lot of Lamborghini and McLaren stuff as well. He said, you know, it's okay on track. It's not like the greatest track car, but it's not. It's a road car. It's supposed to be a road car.

[Zach Klapman]

How did it feel if. I don't know if this comparison is possible, but, like, T50, not a track car. It's a GT super hypercar.

[Matt Farah]

Right?

[Zach Klapman]

Would this be kind of like that?

[Matt Farah]

Guys, we got to take a quick break from the action. For Delete Me, I signed up for DeleteMe, mainly because I've been getting so many spam and robocalls. I mean, the amount of spam in my email, like most of you, is probably just off the charts. But the robocalls, whether it's political research, real estate, car stuff, you could install solar on your home, it's just junk. I wanted to make it stop. But that's not all. Your personal data is out there, and anyone can find it more than you think. Your name, contact info, Social Security number, home address, and even information about your family members are all being compiled by data brokers and sold online. That's why I signed up and use Delete Me. It's a subscription service that removes your personal info from hundreds of data brokers. It's really easy. I signed up and I provided deleteme with exactly the information I want deleted, right? 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It's sort of hard to see, but there's this mechanism right on top of the steering wheel center above where the airbag is not at the very top of the wheel, atop of the hub. Right, right there. It's like a little. So it has the single sort of shifter paddle, like a McLaren. You can do either from either hand, but the spring mechanism that returns the rocker to the center is visible on top of the thing. So you can see it, like, doing its little thing like that, that kind of thing. Like, it's. It's all about, like, seeing the engineering. And there's like. There's like some sort of holes in the speedo, in the tack, because the needles are moved by gears and you can see the gears. It's like what Bugatti's done with the Tourbillon. It's sort of like that.

[Zach Klapman]

That's cool.

[Matt Farah]

So, like, Gordon Murray wouldn't do that. You know, Gordon Murray would make the. Would make it. So if you're driving it full speed, you can adjust the aircon without looking yeah, that's what Gordon Murray would do. This is more like. It's tactile. The buttons look and feel really nice. You can tell they're expensive, but making them as light as possible isn't the goal.

[Zach Klapman]

Right. But the ride in this and like the.

[Matt Farah]

Oh, sorry to go back. Like, it's a road car. It has a very nice ride. Cool. You could go on a very long road trip in this car and it would be cool.

[Zach Klapman]

Is it adaptive damper or is it just a mag ride?

[Matt Farah]

Has mag ride and it's cantilevered. So you can see on the. In the. It's in the. In the shot of the engine bay, you can see the inboard cantilevered suspension. It's also inboard cantilevered suspension in the front. It's also double wishbone and it's mag ride. So. And it has a super soft mode. It has comfort, sport and super soft. Sorry, Comfort, sport, race and super soft. I did not use sport once. Comfort is great for the canyons and super soft is great for the highways and for cities. The super soft, they told me, is designed specifically for Italian cobblestone.

[Zach Klapman]

Whoa. So it's very soft.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, because they do these. The redu. No. Which is the Pagani group road trips. Now, it's all about these lifestyle events. So. So many of these people who buy Paganis do it to do these trips. And it's. The trips are like. Apparently they're super fun because the people who buy Paganis are like, mad accept centric. You know, they're not the people who buy Ferraris. They're, like, kind of weird and fun and, you know, whatever. And so these road trips are like a big part of the whole thing. They ship the cars all over the world, you know, to do them. And so. So it's important they ride well. Same thing. The engine. You know the engine. It's a V12. The red lines at 6500.

[Zach Klapman]

You're right. It's kind of a low red line. It's like Corvette red line. Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

And it's. It's turbos. It's a shitload of power. But it's not often that you see a V12 hypercar that isn't all about revs. And basically, you know, they were saying that this is a. It's a road car. And when you're driving around on the road, you know, a big punch from three to six is way more valuable than having to rev it to fucking 12. You know, even though the T50, it obviously still made good power lower you didn't have to rev it all the way out there. But they weren't looking for this sort of screaming experience like the Zondas.

[Zach Klapman]

I mean, I assume that AMG could tailor the engine to those specs if they wanted to. I mean, or unless there's some sort of restriction with the size of the cylinder or the design, you know, I mean, they could make it a higher compression, higher revving thing, and maybe they go, all right. Most of our drivers and owners just, they do half throttle and they want to feel quick from three to six. They don't care about revving to nine because especially if you can buy one of these, you could also buy any Ferrari that revs to 10 or 9 or whatever.

[Matt Farah]

The impression that I got was that the customers of these cars were not actually looking for a 9,000 rpm screamer. They were looking for something that had great passing power on the highway and squirted out of a hairpin on the col da Torini nicely. And. And it's not like it doesn't sound good, it fucking sounds really cool. But. And I was never, like, sad that it didn't rev that high. I was like, you know, all right, if you fucking wind this thing to six, you are flying. It's really fast.

[Zach Klapman]

800, whatever horsepower.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, yeah, it's really fast.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. And there. I mean, there's so many options out there at this price point that do rev to 8, 9, 10, 11.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Like, it's nice to have a different option.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. But it is, because ultimately, despite how crazy it looks, despite, you know, that it looks like a race car in a lot of ways. Inspired by the Porsche 962 and stuff like that. You know, it looks like what a prototype race car might have looked like in the 80s or 90s almost. It is really a very nicely appointed touring car. Air conditioning, cranks, you know, the stereo's decent. The fucking interface with it is heinous. It's so clunky and shitty. I was thinking of starting my review with Road and Track with, like, the stereo stink. Like, the FM tuner, like, sucks, and.

[Zach Klapman]

Then you turn the car on and you don't care.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, I didn't really care. And it's a little awkward to get in and out of because it doesn't have cutouts in the roof with the doors. You kind of have to, like, squeeze a little bit. But once you're in it, I mean, you know, I could do a thousand miles in that car, like, no problem. It's awesome. Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

I've Never sat in one. I don't know if I've ever. I've seen what, like two Zondas we saw at Monterey Car Week behind me in traffic. It's as close as I've gotten.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

But it's nice to know the heroes are friendly.

[Matt Farah]

So like, despite what you might think on Instagram, these are really rare cars. Pagani's built less than 500 cars its entire existence. So there are more LaFerraris on the road right now than all Pagani's ever made.

[Zach Klapman]

Wow.

[Matt Farah]

Which is like a pretty stark, like, you know, there's basically as many Enzos.

[Zach Klapman]

Right.

[Matt Farah]

As Ferrari has. As Pagani's ever made.

[Zach Klapman]

Right. There's a single model that has almost more units than all of Pagani's output.

[Matt Farah]

40 of these a year, that's it. So it's very, very rare that you would see one on the. Right.

[Zach Klapman]

I'm sure a contributing factor to that small number is the fact that you couldn't buy a Pagani and drive it in the United States really. Until what? Huayra.

[Matt Farah]

Huayra.

[Zach Klapman]

Right.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

So that was the first one. So that part limited.

[Matt Farah]

But also the workshop has never really grown. I mean, it's grown a little bit, but it's not, they've never automated anything. You know, every single one of these is totally tailor made. You can do anything. I want you to paint this body panel and leave this one alone and, and do this one this, and do this and this material. And like, it's like it's infinite the number of ways you can customize the car. And the only way to do that is to hand make the car.

[Zach Klapman]

Right.

[Matt Farah]

So they just can't make that many. It's, you know, it, it is a very. I mean, for three and a half million dollars, shouldn't it be a very nice thing? Yes. But the fact is sometimes they're not. I mean, sometimes they go too far into race car that they're unhappy on the street. You know, this car is pretty happy on the street. I mean, it doesn't, it's very fast, but it doesn't ever feel like you're driving a race car. It's so weird because like at this price point, like, does it drive better than a McLaren 720? Not really, no. Does it drive better than, you know, what you might get for this sounds so silly, but 6 or 700,000, like, does it drive objectively drive better than like a 296 or a 911ST or something like that? Like. Not really, no. But it's just a level of artwork and engineering.

[Zach Klapman]

Right.

[Matt Farah]

That is not doable by any of those more mass produced cars. They just can't do it.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

Nor would they try. You know, it makes, it makes those cars seem very common and mass produced and pedestrian compared to, you know, this very clearly handmade and just fucking wild thing.

[Zach Klapman]

It's like this is what's possible.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

If you remove all of the restrictions of production cost basically. Because you can charge whatever you want for it and you don't need to make 3,000 in a year.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

You just go, we could. We're going to make you almost. It's almost like they go, we're going to make one for you.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

What would you want?

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

And then the next person gets the same exact treatment and everything is just turned up to 11. It's cool.

[Matt Farah]

But it is much more refined than the Huayra for a single clutch gearbox. It's. It's actually quite good. The downshifts are really smooth. I was very impressed with the downshifts. The upshifts are pretty good. There's definitely a, you know, but if you're controlling them yourself, it's not bad. It's. When you put it in auto, the auto programming is as good as it could be. And if you're putting around in traffic, the auto is okay. But if you're trying to drive at a medium speed in auto, those big, those big gear changes when you're not controlling them are very jarring. Yeah, yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Does it help if you do a little lift on the throttle?

[Matt Farah]

No, it doesn't make much difference. It's just, it's just at anything above 30 miles an hour, you really want to be shifting it yourself, you know, and then it's fine and then it's nice. In general, I would. I mean, again, this sounds corny. It's $3 million. Shouldn't I be blown away like I was. I was very impressed.

[Zach Klapman]

Well, I think this is not a car that blows you away in terms of performance. I mean it's very fast and all that stuff. But. But it can't, like you said, it can't really separate itself from a McLaren 750 from a performance standpoint. So you have to be into the construction, the story, the artistic creation of it. You can get a painting of a human being or you can get a painting of a human by a super famous person. Objectively, a Picasso is not a better representation of what a human being looks like. But it is, it's a Picasso.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. And you, you Know, you sit very low. The cockpit, the roof is low. So you. And you're. The fenders. The front fenders are big, exaggerated front bits. And so the view out of the front is pretty spectacular. Looking over those big fenders. And there's this very funny thing. Go back to the other photo you just had up of the front three quarter, but from the other way, keep going. So go back. Yeah. So this is actually sort of interesting. The radiators are in the front. Okay. The radiators blow out. The back of the radiator is that vent on top of the front fender.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, interesting.

[Matt Farah]

Okay. And so if you drive with the windows down, hot air is getting shot. That hot air goes right into the cabin. And so on a cold day, it would be amazing.

[Zach Klapman]

Cool.

[Matt Farah]

A cool morning, windows down. That fucking heat pumping in is great. But it was pretty hot yesterday. And so had the air conditioning just fully cranked and had the. And had the windows down. So it was like cold air here, hot air here. And if you put your hand out of the window, it was like. It was like cold, hot, cold. Like, the airflow is really, really weird. It was really weird.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

That's a very unique thing. Those side view mirrors are great. They look really strange, but the visibility for changing lanes and stuff, super good. Big, high.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, high mirrors.

[Matt Farah]

Just a really, a really nice thing. And I mean, look, it's got leather on the outside. See that leather front of the tire? Front of the front tire. That is a leather strap that holds that down. So they give you a bunch of spares when you get a car because they're wear items every couple of years, you got to change those out.

[Zach Klapman]

For people listening, this is like the lower front splitter.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Like if you're driving the range, it's.

[Matt Farah]

Just taking water direct. There's another one behind the door. You can kind of see right at the back of the door. That one. Yeah, there's another one there too.

[Zach Klapman]

That one. That's like the engine cover. So that seems fine. Decorative. This is like, you know, I guess. I mean, they've done the engineering. Like the downforce at 180 miles per hour doesn't tear the leather apart because there's probably other supports.

[Matt Farah]

Oh, yeah. Literally the thing that it's not the.

[Zach Klapman]

Only thing, but it's very funny that that's there. Yeah, yeah.

[Matt Farah]

That's like. I don't know, maybe it's a fail safe for the. Or maybe it's just a bit of styling.

[Zach Klapman]

It might be styling.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. But they give you some extras because obviously that's a. That's taking a direct hit if you get caught in the rain, right?

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, it flutters at 150.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. Kind of a strange bit, but it's a, it's a really. I'm glad that stuff like this does exist. And I tell myself it's okay by saying that the people who design and build these are not. Can't afford them. You know what I mean? There's so much artistry here being done by true craftsmen that can't afford to buy one, you know, and so shouldn't they be able to build things the best they can? Like, yeah, they should. And Paris, their test driver was saying to me, like, I was like, it's kind of. I was like, man, I wish, I wish, like, I wish people weren't so insanely rich that just buying something, like, because he was saying, like, yeah, people have like a couple of these. And I'm like, that's just kind of. You know, you see a homeless guy in fucking Malibu, living on the beach, and you're like driving by in this car and you're like, this is. This feels wrong. And he's like, it's like humans, you know, go back to cavemen. You know, my rock is shinier than your rock. You know, like, you can't sort of stop that.

[Zach Klapman]

And I understand you can't. I mean, you can't turn off that part of our brain.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I sort of understand. But I'm also like, oh, this is. It's not great. The level of income inequality that we have that people are buying a whole bunch of these.

[Zach Klapman]

Well, I mean, I agree. I think those are just two different things. I think our brain will always want to try to signal our superiority for mating reasons. And then the income inequality is like a tax structure problem. And because of the problem, people that have all this money can signal 10 times more than they could before or something like that, right?

[Matt Farah]

This is 10 times the price of a McLaren 750. 10 times of a fucking car that's already insanely expensive. It's just wild. And the list is two years long. There's so many people that want this and can afford it that there's a two year waiting list. Like, wow, that might be a problem with society, that that is where we're at right now. But at the same time, very talented people are using their hands and machines to build this thing that is very beautiful, that works well. And, you know, these guys are fucking eating fish and drinking wine over in Italy. They're not, they're not driving around in Pagani.

[Zach Klapman]

What's cool though to me is that Pagani has been around doing this exact kind of work for like almost 30 years. I think 20 point, 20 years, early.

[Matt Farah]

99 I think was the first Pagani.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. Honda, they probably didn't have a two year waiting list then because now there's.

[Matt Farah]

A lot more rich people selling those cars.

[Zach Klapman]

But I mean they've always been works of art for sure.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

And very unique, I think both in their appearance, their execution, all of it. That's why Horatio's story is amazing.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, it's more about the art than about the driving. Although it's nice that the car drives as well as it does.

[Zach Klapman]

I think it's great that they didn't try to chase race car, they didn't try to chase track time, make it stiff, give you that experience. Because there's plenty of companies giving that experience and they go, okay, you want to enjoy driving it around at a medium speed and it's plenty fast. But like you don't need all the feedback, all the visceral stuff.

[Matt Farah]

Well, and those race cars like the Huayra R and the Zonda R, they're apparently engineered by HWA and just styled by Pagani. So they're not even really trying to build the race cars. It's like they've, they outsource the race cars too. And it's not like you can race those cars against anything.

[Zach Klapman]

I mean, right, yeah, of course. Private track day situation. But the chassis from somebody else else, it's all hwa. Whoa.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, the carbon tub might be the Pagani tub, but like everything else is hwa. Yeah. So yeah, it's, it's pretty, pretty sick. They're using these, these new Pirelli Trofeo R. That's like a smart tire that and the tire monitors not just the temperature and the pressure, but also the, I forget the term, the squeeze from impact. And it talks to the shocks. So if the tire detects a big bump, it softens the shock. Like the tire can tell the suspension what to do, which is a new thing.

[Zach Klapman]

Well, is it a sensor? I mean a lot of cars have had this where like the tire, it's the first line of information. So as soon as it starts to move at a certain rate, it tells the shock. Hey, I'm going up at X speed.

[Matt Farah]

No, no, no, that's like the tire, the wheel moving up. I'm talking about the tire, the actual rubber tire. If it compresses from a bump, it then tells the shock that's cool. How does it do that?

[Zach Klapman]

What's the system?

[Matt Farah]

It's like a smart tire. So there's sensors in the rubber of the tire.

[Zach Klapman]

Whoa.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, that's the good news. It's really cool. The bad news is it's a fucking Trofeo R, which on a road car, you don't. You know what happens if you get caught in the rain? I mean, you're doing one of these road trips through the Alps.

[Zach Klapman]

Like, everyone slows down.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

I mean, enjoy the scenery.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. Like, it's weird that they've chosen a racing tire.

[Zach Klapman]

That's a good point.

[Matt Farah]

Which it most certainly does not need or benefit from.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. If the suspension has such a wide breadth of skills and attributes, then, like, why not do that with a tire, too?

[Matt Farah]

Everything else about the car says road, but, like, it then has a Trofeo R tire. That. That's the one thing about it that did. Didn't make any sense because they were. They kept showing me. Yes. We drive all over the world, and here's a photo of it in Montana in the snow. And I said, what tire was on that car? Oh, it was trophy or. It was. No, you know. Well, you got. You know, you just proved my case.

[Zach Klapman]

It's like having an LMP1 car, like in an ad for watches, and they're like our mechanical hand wound. You're like, but the car is a spaceship. This doesn't make any sense.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. Yeah. So it was a very interesting experience. And what's really interesting is how quickly I was able to sort of forget I was in it. You know, we're driving up PCH and I'm talking about completely unrelated things, and it became a car. And I mean, maybe it's different if it's your $3 million car, but I was able to separate that pretty quickly and just be like, okay, just driving a car. I thought it would be more overwhelming, like, the whole time, but it actually becomes normalized quickly, which is sort of the danger of these ever, you know?

[Zach Klapman]

Well, do you think that's because it was comfortable and easy to use, or do you think that's because you're used to driving cars like this?

[Matt Farah]

I think it's. It's comfortable and easy to use. Yeah. It doesn't ask very much of you, actually. There's nothing you have to, like, watch out for. You know, it has nose lift. That works good. That's fast. There's nothing about it that's that weird. It's just. It just kind of works like a car, which is For Pagani, I think quite an accomplishment normally. I think in the past they have not sort of just work like a car. I think you've had to give a little more. Whereas this is like, other than like one little hiccup where the backup camera would overheat and stop working until it cooled down.

[Zach Klapman]

That's funny.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. The backup camera overheated and the screen turned just green.

[Zach Klapman]

So basically at the end of your drive when the engine's very hot and you go to park, that might not work.

[Matt Farah]

It's easy to pull out of your garage in the morning.

[Zach Klapman]

Easy.

[Matt Farah]

Hard to get in, hard to back it in.

[Zach Klapman]

That's ironic.

[Matt Farah]

The mirrors are pretty good, which does. Does help a lot. Yeah. But I liked it. I liked it. And I'm gonna have to figure out what the exact angle is for the road and track story. Yeah. The other end of the spectrum, you've got the new Elantra N. Very exciting.

[Zach Klapman]

Yes. Yes. Well, Mr. While you were driving around in your Pagani, I got a bowl of soup. I don't know what that was. Elantra N 2024, very similar to the last one. They didn't change a ton. They did. There's like new bushings in the. The wheels are 33 pounds lighter, total. So like seven pounds a corner, which is quite a lot.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

So they had to revise the suspension software to react to these lighter wheels. They revised the steering suspension. The big difference. I mean, it's literally the most visible one. Yeah. Let me pull this photo.

[Matt Farah]

They've got rid of the fish face.

[Zach Klapman]

They got rid of the fish face. So shout out to straight pipes for having this before and after. It is better looking. I don't think it's a great looking car, but before I really didn't like looking at the front of it. And now it almost reminds me of a Passat. It looks very Volkswagen with a kind of straight brow across. The whole thing looks a bit Volkswagen, but at least it's not offensive to my eyes. Otherwise, it remains an extremely usable but also very quick car. For the money, this is one of the best purchases you can make for a do everything vehicle.

[Matt Farah]

Did you figure out the steering thing?

[Zach Klapman]

No, I want to write to them.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. So I drove it as well, briefly. And the steering does feel heavier than it really needs to be.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

We wonder what that's about.

[Zach Klapman]

Well, so I, I thought it felt like heavy immediately off center. It feels oddly heavy and it feels like it's trying to push back to straight right away. And so I DM jack from Savage Geese because I know they've done a video on this. And I said, was this your experience? And he said no. So it's possible ours is out of alignment or something. I want to check with Hyundai before I say definitively like this is how it feels. But I mean we've driven plenty of front wheel drive cars.

[Matt Farah]

This was a heavy steering, it was odd. It seemed weird.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. And I was in, I was not in sport mode. It wasn't like it firmed up.

[Matt Farah]

Well, I don't think the weight of the steering changes in sport mode because I went into the N mode. And you can change the throttle, you can change the gearing, you can change the diff, the esc, but you can't change the steering feel in the Elantra.

[Zach Klapman]

So if it's fixed then, meaning it's, you know, one speed, one assistance for all modes, then I want to ask them if this is how it's supposed to feel because it just feels weird.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. But it does with the shocks and soft. It's a pretty nice car. The gearbox, the DCT is pretty solid.

[Zach Klapman]

Totally.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. It works good.

[Zach Klapman]

The seats are great. Seats are super comfortable.

[Matt Farah]

So you like them? They're a little narrow for me.

[Zach Klapman]

I could see that Hannah hates them. Okay.

[Matt Farah]

I don't know why, but she doesn't like them at all.

[Zach Klapman]

Well, she also said it sat too low, but I think, I don't think she found the handle where you have to like, you know, jack it up. Yeah, but you're right. I like them because they hug me really tightly.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

But you know, for anyone with a wider rib cage, wherever they'd be too.

[Matt Farah]

Tight, they're a little narrow. Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

But it's still, still a very nice car. Very mild updates.

[Zach Klapman]

Mild updates, but due for like what, 10 grand less than a Ctrl?

[Matt Farah]

Oh yeah. And it's the same speed.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

I mean it will lap a track at the same pace as a Civic Type R if you put the same tires on it.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, for sure. Ton of car.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. I'm also go back to my Instagram real quick because I'm riding this new electric motorcycle. It's called the Maving. I think that's how it's pronounced. M A E V I N G. The RM1S, which is a sort of a cafe racer style electric motorcycle. And it's interesting because it's very cool looking. I happen to really like how it looks. They've done that thing where they make the battery sort of look like a futuristic engine and they've got where the voltage cables go from the battery pack to the motor controller, They've got this sort of, what do you call that? The braided metal tube.

[Zach Klapman]

It's like a braided intercooler. Not intercooler. Looks like a braided hose.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, yeah. So that's the wires that connect the batteries.

[Zach Klapman]

That's cool.

[Matt Farah]

Batteries are actually swappable. So you can open that side panel, the vertical panel that you can see underneath the cable that opens and you can pull out the batteries which are, are, you know, maybe like a 8 by 8 square by maybe 10 inches long. And they're not super heavy. It's like probably half the weight of a car battery.

[Zach Klapman]

All right, so like 20 pounds, I think.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, maybe 25, 30 pounds each. There's two of them.

[Zach Klapman]

There's two in there.

[Matt Farah]

There's two in there.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, wow.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. This thing weighs 300 pounds. Well, yeah, the batteries, they're not like super light. They're big batteries, but less than a car battery. Battery.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay. So is the idea you'd have two at home. So hot swap, like a Tesla.

[Matt Farah]

So it's, it's. You could buy extra batteries and hot swap. They said extra batteries are 1,500 bucks each. They said it's more like for people that don't have access to an outdoor plug to charge the thing overnight. You could bring the batteries inside and they have a dock so you could do that. It come. It. There's an optional dock. So this thing is 9,000 bucks, which. It's like a lot of these electric things.

[Zach Klapman]

A lot.

[Matt Farah]

Which. And then here's the problem. I have ridden it for two days now. And my range, the total range of this thing is for me. They say it's 80 miles new, it's 52. That's what I've gotten. And they say top speed of 70. It's an indicated 70. I think it's really more like 62, 63.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay.

[Matt Farah]

It basically has the performance of a 150 Vespa. So it's. It's probably about the. It's the equivalent of about 20 horsepower, maybe 17 to 20 horsepower. My Vespa 300 is 28 horsepower and is quicker. For sure. Is quicker and has a higher top speed.

[Zach Klapman]

Wow. Did you ever ride a zero those motorcycles?

[Matt Farah]

No, I never.

[Zach Klapman]

Curious if those felt fast as hell or not.

[Matt Farah]

Well, those are like. They're actual motorcycles. Like those are. Those will rip at highway speeds. Like no problem. Yeah. They'll do over 100, I think.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. I'm just curious what those weigh versus this. Like what is.

[Matt Farah]

I mean I rode a, I rode the live wire, which is heavy. That's like a 500 pound bike. Okay, but, but that, that thing had fucking torque like you wouldn't normally go full like pulling away from lights on this. I am full throttle every time. Flat on a live wire. You would not be riding like that.

[Zach Klapman]

All right, just for info, a 0srf street fighter range in the city is 176 miles, but it weighs 500 pounds.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. So it's, it's more batteries.

[Zach Klapman]

140 foot pounds of torque.

[Matt Farah]

That's a bunch. Okay, that's a, that's proper motorcycle stuff. In fact, that's more than most motorcycles making torque. So with this thing, it really sort of splits the difference between a fast E bike and a slow motorcycle. It all. It really feels more like a fast E bike than it does like any motorcycle. What did your eyes just get so wide?

[Zach Klapman]

Do you know how much a 0srf motorcycle costs?

[Matt Farah]

$24,000.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

Did I get that right?

[Zach Klapman]

23, 7, 9, 5. Wow.

[Matt Farah]

I got that exactly.

[Zach Klapman]

That is a lot of money, dude.

[Matt Farah]

Electric motorcycles are super expensive.

[Zach Klapman]

This is the problem.

[Matt Farah]

Why is this thing $9,000 when a Vespa 150 is 6? You know, this is sort of the. And to their credit, to mavings credit, this thing feels, it feels well made. It's comfortable to ride. It has linked brakes, meaning you can use the foot pedal brake to operate both brakes together. The quote fuel tank, which is not a fuel tank in this, there's the, you can sort of see the cutout a little bit on top. The top pops open.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

So you can either put the charge cable in there or if you don't need to bring the charge cable with you. Like you could fit things, a purse, you know, sort of like a satchel in there. It's not big, you're not getting groceries in it for sure, but you can fit some things in it. And it was great, great, great, great for lane splitting through traffic in la. I rode it to the Pagani thing yesterday. I had to ride to Beverly Hills right at rush hour. Had to ride home from Beverly Hills right at rush hour. And it was really, really good at lane splitting.

[Zach Klapman]

And it looks really cool. And I love all of these clever things. Like you've explained the way they've routed things, the way it's set up, it looks like a really good looking street fighter with kind of narrow tires. But that's probably for efficacy.

[Matt Farah]

No, no, the tires really are narrow. The tires are barely wider than my vintage electric E bike tires.

[Zach Klapman]

It looks a lot like the Vincent Black Knight kind of bike. Like, the seat is this floating leather brown seat. It's kind of narrow compared to the fuel tank is wider. It all just tapers to the back.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, And I wrote it to a Pagani show, and so, and I wrote it into the showroom, and it was not out of place in a Pagani showroom. I mean, I parked it in the showroom with a fucking two Paganis, a Bugatti, a LaFerrari, and a Guntherwerks parked there. And it did not look out of place in an aesthetic way. And the Pagani people like, oh, look at that. That's really. That's cool. I mean, there's definitely some real design, you know, to it.

[Zach Klapman]

Totally.

[Matt Farah]

But it's just at nine grand, that's a ton of money. You could get a Vespa 300, which is objectively a much better commuter. And it's. And Vespas still do have a little bit of that fashion element to them. If you, if you're a cool dresser, then you look cool on a Vespa. I don't look cool on it, but I certainly don't look cool on this either.

[Zach Klapman]

Well, Pagani is a good reference. So is this a situation? Because we've talked a lot about how these E scooters and E bikes, they all start at like $10,000.

[Matt Farah]

They're really expensive.

[Zach Klapman]

Now, I will say that this thing is much cooler looking than that prototype thing I was going to ride that they took away because it didn't work. That was also $10,000.

[Matt Farah]

This is way better than this.

[Zach Klapman]

This is way better. But is this where people need to be more into the art? Because the propulsion, the efficiency, that's not really what you're getting in terms of a utilitarian. You just go buy almost any motorcycle that will get 10 grand.

[Matt Farah]

I mean, if you're talking about something, you can get a fucking Ducati Monster for ten grand.

[Zach Klapman]

And for the price of a new zero, you can get a lightly used 20, 24 panigale. By the way, $24,000, granted, used versus new, but just saying, it's quite a difference.

[Matt Farah]

With motorcycles, used is a much more realistic option than with cars. Typically, they're very well cared for. They're almost always stored indoors. You know, they're ridden less with stuff like that. I feel better about buying a used motorcycle than I do about buying used car. They're simpler. But yeah, like you said, with these elect the electric Thing you have to wonder, who is this for? Because it's too expensive to be the kind of thing that someone who commutes on a scooter or something or a motorcycle. Those aren't typically very high net worth individuals that are commuting on two wheels. And I'm not trying to over generalize, but like the people I see on two wheels in a commuting fashion are not super rich executives. For the most part.

[Zach Klapman]

I think it's hard to tell. Like there's a guy in my building who rides a really nice clean white Triumph Bonneville. Maybe you see those people around la, they've got like the cafe racer style, the nice leather jacket. It's a bit fashion statement meets utility. So I don't know if we can really speculate on that. I mean there's motorcycles, you see where the guy has a T shirt on and he's riding used RR and splitting lanes. You're like, that dude probably doesn't have a ton of money.

[Matt Farah]

All right, yeah, fair. I mean there's going to be some tech bros on Bonnevilles that might find this.

[Zach Klapman]

But I think that's. I agree with your question. Who is this for? And if people are into these, please let us know because we are very curious. Like, is this where people have enough money, where they can have fashionable motorcycles that maybe aren't the most utilitarian or helpful, but they like it?

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. You know, the, the other thing is without the car, like the cargo box on my Vespa and the combined with the under seat storage makes it so practical. I would say 75% of the time that I ride my Vespa, something's going in the cargo box. It'll hold my backpack. Riding a motorcycle with a backpack fucking blows. People do. I get it. Some backpacks are better than others, but in general it's shitty compared to not having a backpack on. Right. Like, so if you can take things off of your back and put them in the cargo box, or you can have a backpack but also get groceries on the way home. Or you can store your helmet and your gloves in the cargo box. Like I can store my helmet, gloves and sunglasses in the cargo box and then take my motorcycle jacket, store it under the seat. So when I get to where I'm going, all my gear just stays on the bike.

[Zach Klapman]

That is true. But I think if you put a cargo box on this bike, it would look, look a lot worse.

[Matt Farah]

Of course it would. Of course it would. So it's, it doesn't even have the, the opportunity to be that practical. And it's like not fast enough to be a motorcycle. It's just not right. It's like, like I coming down and there's a little inside baseball. I didn't ride it on the freeway, but I rode it on La Cienega, which is like the coming down over the, over the hill is like almost a freeway.

[Zach Klapman]

It's like an artery. Yeah. It's an art.

[Matt Farah]

It's three lanes wide. It. Traffic basically moves at freeway speeds for a couple of miles. And I was pegged. Pegged the whole time down. And so I don't like having to mat to V max on an arterial road. So it's not really fast enough to be a motorcycle. Too fast to be an e bike. And you have to register and insure it. Like a motorcycle doesn't have the practicality of a Vespa. And is the cost of the most expensive Vespa you buy if you buy it brand new or a very nice used motorcycle.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

So it's like sort of like. I don't know if you just want it as a fashion statement and a toy. Like. Okay.

[Zach Klapman]

And I, I've enjoyed the electric propulsion is fun. Like on a motorcycle the sound can be good.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

But I've ridden motorcycles where they just sound like fine. They sound like four cylinder motorcycles. And so if you go, okay, I want to just hear the wind and you get to have the little and all that. Like it is a fun experience. But I totally get it. It's not fast enough. The range isn't great. The cost is expensive.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

So, you know, you're making a lot of sacrifices for the style and for electric propulsion.

[Matt Farah]

Like the only thing it really delivers on for the money is the style. And the substance of it isn't really there. Which for that price.

[Zach Klapman]

Right. I guess it's. It goes to the supercar thing though. Like the Pagani is expensive. How much stuff does it hold? You know, is it. It's not the most luggage. Right. Of course it does. Special luggage. So I think that with these things, with these things we go. Are they trying to sell as many as Royal Enfield sells, you know, cafe racers? Are they trying to compete with a monster Ducati or are they going where we want to sell 100? I don't know.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. I don't know. I. My immediate thought is that it was developed by tech bros that thought they were solving a problem that maybe they had, but the world at large does not have.

[Zach Klapman]

You know, that could be true. But given the number of people that live in some areas, work in tech. Like, all right, if their market is only 700,000 people in, you know, in the United States and they sell 1,000 of them to those people, like, all right, then business just depends on what.

[Matt Farah]

Their goal is, I guess, maybe. And it's, it's. It. I think it needs either. It might need 50% more power.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

If it, if it was fast enough where I'd be comfortable riding on the highway.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

Okay. And also the suspension, although it does have suspension, the suspension feels a little rudimentary, you know, and if I hit a pothole, if I hit, you know, and we have shitty tarmac here. Some of those harsh bumps in the road in La Cienega were pretty jarring on this thing in a way that they are not on a true motorcycle.

[Zach Klapman]

Right. The oversprung kind of thing.

[Matt Farah]

Like, it's too oversprung and under damped, but. But also they had to crank up the coils. They cranked them up almost to max because I'm 265 pounds. And when they brought it and I sat on it, it just sagged. So we cranked it up so it didn't sag. So it's now on like, super stiff, but, like, it is. It is definitely charming and it looks really cool. And if you just got on it and went for a ride, it would be pretty fun. But to ride it in a sea of cars that are all going pretty, like, normally I don't have that many cars, like flying by me when I'm on two wheels. And this time, my.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, it's not a good channel.

[Matt Farah]

I was like, for this much money, I need to be able to move through cars and not have cars moving around me.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

You know, so, you know, thank you to these guys for letting me borrow it. I hope I've been fair to what you're offering here. And if they have another one that goes fast, I wouldn't mind trying that. But I'm sticking with my Vespa. That is undefeated, dude, in, in commuting in Los Angeles. The Vespa is 8 million to zero. Just nothing. Nothing comes close to the practicality of that. Yeah, can't beat it. Especially when talking about used. Got that thing with 800 miles on it for 5,500. I could probably turn around and sell it for 5,005 hundo right now.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. I mean, that's the floor, right?

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. It's about to hit 4,000 miles, so I've done quite a lot of city miles on that thing. It is great.

[Zach Klapman]

Can we really Quickly. Talk about the dumbest car accident in the world.

[Matt Farah]

The McLaren one.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, yeah, because Ben Collins put it up on his Instagram, man, if the.

[Matt Farah]

Stig is shitting on you. Yeah, and he fucked up.

[Zach Klapman]

Exactly.

[Matt Farah]

Oh, my God, that's the kid's fucking face.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

Who bought that? A McLaren.

[Zach Klapman]

Well, he's a very, very, very popular streamer. He is, yes.

[Matt Farah]

With a face like that.

[Zach Klapman]

He plays. I think he plays video games, actually. I don't know.

[Matt Farah]

He's in the small window. Huh?

[Zach Klapman]

I don't think.

[Matt Farah]

Yikes.

[Zach Klapman]

I don't think.

[Matt Farah]

Well, that's a big yikes. With the wipers on, one handed texting, staring at the car.

[Zach Klapman]

It's raining. He's doing 63, he's doing 54 miles per hour. Oh, we need.

[Matt Farah]

Is it a whiteout? Oh, he's.

[Zach Klapman]

That's a lot of rain.

[Matt Farah]

And then playing trap music. He's got an aftermarket steering wheel on that car because McLaren doesn't offer shift lights on the wheel like that.

[Zach Klapman]

Accelerates hydroplane. Crunch, crunch.

[Matt Farah]

Out. Watch out. Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Is this the full thing?

[Matt Farah]

Open the door. Open the door. Open your door. We're locked in here. I shouldn't laugh at that. We're locked in. Is it getting smokey or is that airbag?

[Zach Klapman]

Airbag, Airbag stuff I want to see.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, it's not great.

[Zach Klapman]

So the hydroplane was bad. And is his other video still up? Did he take it down?

[Matt Farah]

Man, I, I don't recommend doing any of the things that he was doing there.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, he took it down. So I told you the other day. But the reason the Internet really came after him, I mean, that's very dumb. But then, as I explained to you, when he got out of the car, a bunch of bystanders stop on the highway because he crashed on like a three lane, four lane highway. So people come over to his window and they pull him out of the car because the door won't open. But when they do that, he's filming himself in selfie mode and he says, will you hold this? And someone holds his phone and he's looking at the camera and he gets pulled out of the car. Then he takes the phone and he's still doing selfie. Selfie content, going, bro, my car. Look at the car. Look at. Oh, my God, how did I do this? Look at the car. And his friend is in the passenger seat with like a broken wrist and has blood on his face and he's knocking and he's not helping his friend out of the car. The other people are like, Trying to help his friend. And they're like, dude, and it, it just. And they. People lit him up on the Internet. Totally valid. Good. I hope this guy like reflects on this whole situation. But it was, it was really just highlights. Like, if you're. I don't know, my glass half full is like, if your life is just content, this is how far that drug can go. You know, like car accident. And all you're thinking of is how do I turn this into content and show this to people? And that is so sad.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. Yeah. When you told me about it the other day, it made me think of that Vince McMahon documentary which I'm watching, where he just. Vince McMahon, who is clearly a piece of just his whole life, is blurring his own personal life with this WWE storyline to the point where he apparently proposed, you know, having his daughter's wedding be a pay per view event.

[Zach Klapman]

Right, Exactly. How do we monetize everything?

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. And I mean this. That's definitely a how to not drive or live your life situation.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

That's fucking dumb as rocks. I'm so glad I don't watch YouTube. Um, Honda did the thing that I said people should be doing now. I'm sure they were working on it before I said this, but Honda has come out with an electric car concept that mimics the sound, the look and the driving dynamics of cars from its history. They've got. They show this, the Zero series, which, I mean, fucking first off, I certainly hope that whatever they build looks like this because it looks pretty goddamn cool. I would say it's. It's sort of, it's. It does have that 80s, a little bit of the post apocalyptic vibe. But because it's Honda, they probably won't build it specifically to run over pedestrians and tear them to shreds. But. What? Yeah, it's not gonna fucking really look like that. But they had a demo of the dashboard which could mimic both generations of Acura NSX with sounds and gear ratios and torque curves. It could do the S2000, it could do a Honda Formula One car from the 80s and it could even do the Honda Jet, which I thought was a fun bit of whimsy. Go to there. Go to like the drive or someone they reported, I believe on the drive yesterday. And I think road and track also did pick it up. But go down.

[Zach Klapman]

Where are you?

[Matt Farah]

Keep going. Keep Matt. Get down. So there it is. Honda EVs will get selectable engine sounds, including the S2000, the F car and the Honda Jet. So they have a demo of the of the screen right there. That with a. An emulator for the S2000 dash. But you can also see the Civic Type R in the background. You can see the NSXs and then there's a. The locked. The. See, it's locked.

[Zach Klapman]

CRX.

[Matt Farah]

The CRX, the F1 car and the Honda Jet. So the. I suppose the lock means there will be some kind of a downloadable car pack.

[Zach Klapman]

All right, that's cool. I bet they are so relieved at the reception of the Ioniq5N. Yeah, they were like, I hope people like this.

[Matt Farah]

And you know, it's unclear if they were working on this before ionic5n came out or afterwards, but either way, I mean this is a pretty cool thing that we want to see them doing with EVs. Yeah, it's a great use of that technology and the platform and the fact that they already have the sound and the torque curve data from these other cars.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, I wonder if they have data on people that drive EVs that just turn off the spacey. Sounds like. I wonder if most EV owners just turn that stuff off and they went, all right. People don't really like the let's make a Jetson sound. So what can we give them that they might like? Yeah, cars from our history.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, it's fucking cool. And Porsche should be doing this as well. Imagine the exact same shit here, but it was 550 Spider RSK73RSR935. You know, that would be so fucking cool. They should be doing that. So shout out to Honda. A lot of people sent me this, like, yo, dude, you called this. And you know what? I fucking did. Don't know if I called it or I inspired it, but I'll fucking take either.

[Zach Klapman]

Well, you said companies should do this.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

You're like, why doesn't Porsche do this? Yeah, so.

[Matt Farah]

But Honda is another good one that I didn't think about. Mainly because I don't associate them with EVs yet. But like that's a company with a great bit of history and cool sounding engines and interesting cars that they've made that they could bring back.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, they should give us the Honda E here and then give us the cool sounds. Look how. I mean, even in this thumbnail, that car is so cool looking.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, I don't, I. God, it's a bummer they. They wouldn't give us that. I would rock one of those as a commuter car.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

I saw my first new Fiat 500e yesterday. Finally I saw that. I almost forgot they made a new one.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

We should get one.

[Zach Klapman]

Sure.

[Matt Farah]

The. The old 500E was the best.

[Zach Klapman]

It was the best of the five range. Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. It cost as much as a cell phone. It was great. Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

We should totally get.

[Matt Farah]

They have a press car. We should definitely get one.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

Italy. Yay. Let's go to the Patreon. Of course, if you want to ask us questions, if you want to watch the live stream, even if it's a half hour late, if you want to get the show before anybody else, if you want to get an extra podcast every month as a part pro driver and a whole lot more. Patreon.com the Smoking Tire podcast is where you do it. And let's go to those patrons who have sent us questions. Now, Tim, a. Share your takes on Chris Harris's new corduroy interior on his M5 wagon. Love it.

[Zach Klapman]

So good.

[Matt Farah]

10 out of 10, no notes.

[Zach Klapman]

Good idea.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, that's. It's exceptional, not only because it is exactly what he wants, and I think it looks great and is beautifully whimsical, but corduroy is a very good interior material. It holds you in. It's got a, like, a Velcro, like, grip to it that leather doesn't have. And it holds you in place. So you need less lateral bolstering in the car to hold yourself in place.

[Zach Klapman]

I mean, fabric in general is better. And the corduroy. Corduroy is even better.

[Matt Farah]

You know what I really like, too, is the color he chose kind of.

[Zach Klapman]

Like a burnt orange.

[Matt Farah]

Burnt orange. And the armrests in corduroy. That's the.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

I will 100 with that all day.

[Zach Klapman]

I saw that and I was like, oh, now I want to buy seats and do the inserts in corduroy.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, yeah. That would be rad.

[Zach Klapman]

I probably can't afford the whole interior, but it's pretty.

[Matt Farah]

But you could get, like, a Recaro.

[Zach Klapman]

But the center would be corduroy.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, you should do that. It wouldn't be that hard. No, that would pull out the centers and send them out and have them done.

[Zach Klapman]

Right?

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, that'd be great fun. Yes. I think 10 out of 10, no notes on Chris Harris's M5 interior. He is going to make me like V10 M5s.

[Zach Klapman]

He has that effect.

[Matt Farah]

He has that effect.

[Zach Klapman]

Well, because he drives them the way you're like, okay, that. That is cool. And they sound pretty good. Well.

[Matt Farah]

And the wagon is better. I mean, the v. The wagon is better than the sedan. Yeah. Jake Shores has 3,000 miles on my Michelin cup twos. That came on my GT for hard miles through the Alps and three laps of the Nurburgring. They have plenty of tread, but are seeming to slide around more and feel unsafe. Have you noticed the point of degradation on them at certain mileage? Well, plenty of, you know, those tires have wear bars. You can see where they're at. But if they've been heat cycled a whole bunch of times, you're going to lose some grip there.

[Zach Klapman]

Some tires get harder the more you heat cycle them. Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

And depending on your alignment, if you're just looking at the car, you may not really be able to see the insides which will wear faster than the outsides on that GT4, like my Dunlop tires on my Spyder, which I'm replacing, they look all right on the outside, but if you get under the car and look at the inside, they're pretty toasted.

[Zach Klapman]

Also, three laps of the Nurburgring is like 24 minute track session. So that's like a full hard track session. Yeah, you might have, I don't know, you might have cooked them.

[Matt Farah]

Three, I mean, 3,000 miles is like not that short for those tires. Cup twos go fucking quick.

[Zach Klapman]

Like how many you have how many miles on your Dunlops?

[Matt Farah]

I have 5,000, but that includes what I think probably 3,000 of those is long road trips. We went to San Francisco and back twice.

[Zach Klapman]

Right. So I think, I think Nurburgring laps wear out tires faster than road trips. So this, if Jake has harder miles, then if you're. Sorry, if you're running out of tread at 5,000, and that includes road trips.

[Matt Farah]

Yes.

[Zach Klapman]

If most of his stuff is harder miles, 3,000 is not that.

[Matt Farah]

I mean, I would say your ass isn't lying to you. If you are, if you're having less grip than you think you should be having, get rid of them. Yeah, I mean, just get rid of them. I, I don't like cup twos that much. I never have. They trade off not that much in terms of a lap time and they fucking. Once you heat cycle them a couple times, they're done.

[Zach Klapman]

PS4 is the way to go.

[Matt Farah]

PS4s is the way to go. Or maybe like a Pirelli Corsa, they make a nice tire also like other people make good tires. But like just as much as I love the Michelin, the Cup 2 specifically just never do.

[Zach Klapman]

I think if you pull back from the performance envelope slightly, a lot of companies make a tire that will last longer and you don't really lose that much performance.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, PS4s should last you 10 to 15,000. Miles on that car. Even if you do a track day, it's not even a question. And your lap time might. When I did it with the Lotus PS4s versus Cup 2, half a second. That was the difference. And who fucking cares, right?

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. And there's some performance tires or. Sorry, some racing classes where you have to run one tire for the weekend.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

And they'll last that long driving that.

[Matt Farah]

So one lap of America, you have to do eight track days on one set of tires. You have to run 10 laps at each track. Eight track days and then like a 6,000 mile highway transit, you have to do it on one set of tires. Fucking gnarly stuff. Tim A also says use Jag. F types seem like the sports car bargain of the century. If you want a street GT and not a track tool. I don't disagree. F types are very nice cars on the sports car GT scale, where Porsche Boxster and Mercedes SL are opposite ends of the spectrum. Where does the F type land? Does it split the difference as a GT and true sports car? I think it does. I would say the Boxster or the F Type is halfway between.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

And depending on what engine you get, it could be more or less hardcore. So like you get the F type SVR. It's pretty hardcore. It's, you know the V6s, that's your, that's your sporting GT sweet spot. The coupe has a lot more trunk for trunks and looks better.

[Zach Klapman]

Yes. Yeah, definitely.

[Matt Farah]

You can find a V6S with a manual and a coupe. That is the real banger. Can you look on cars and bids and see if any. Jaguar F type manual because these were so good. Oh, time machine replicas on cars. Bids not bad. Looks pretty good. Let's see. Jaguar F type manual. Oof. Nothing recently. Absolutely nothing recently. That's a shame.

[Zach Klapman]

These are two and three year old listings.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. What about just, just search, search for F type. Maybe, maybe somehow they've changed their. Their search. Which it would say manual. Oh, here, right there. Red. 2017 F type convertible, manual. Sold for 31 grand.

[Zach Klapman]

That's a lot of fun cars.

[Matt Farah]

Oh, here, the one on the right, look. 2016 F type coupe, manual, white. Sold for 32 grand. How many miles around that one? Because if it was like 46K. Now that's a great buy. Yeah, that's a fucking. That's a buy right there. You put a nice set of wheels on that. I don't like those stock wheels but.

[Zach Klapman]

And Clarkson show that they're quite reliable. He kept his, he kept the white One for.

[Matt Farah]

He kept the white one.

[Zach Klapman]

Final thing.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, he kept it. But man. 2016, 2017 V6S Manor.

[Zach Klapman]

30,000 bucks, Coop.

[Matt Farah]

That's a fucking car. That's a nice car.

[Zach Klapman]

You get a new GR86.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Or. That's pretty. That's a fun game.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. I wonder what if you could. I wonder if there is an aftermarket for the F type. I don't know if I've ever seen a really performance modified FD type. You don't really need to do anything. I would. I'd leave the engine alone. I'd do a nice set of wheels, good set of tires and maybe look to like to see if KW did something or maybe now I'm not talking about lowering it. I'm talking about shock.

[Zach Klapman]

Right. Improving rides. But man, look at the shape of this is great. Near perfect.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. And the gearbox is the same one that they use for the F80 M3. So the shifter feel is exactly the same as the BMW. Very nice.

[Zach Klapman]

So you could get a shifter kit that might improve the fuel. That. That would be an aftermarket thing maybe.

[Matt Farah]

It felt fine for me. But that's a banger right there at 32 grand.

[Zach Klapman]

32 all day.

[Matt Farah]

All day. There's your. There's your sports GT Chris Navio, what cars currently on sale would you consider to be future classics? I'm thinking LC 500 or CT5 Blackwing. Both great choices. Both are correct. What else that's on sale could be a future classic? I would say 911 Carrera T with a manual. I mean it's a bit of a cop out to say nine to say a 911 because you know many 911s are collectible but not necessarily all.

[Zach Klapman]

I mean it's for a classic, but that's really expensive.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. Cars are already eliminate cars that are over 200 grand.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay.

[Matt Farah]

Cars on sale today that could be future classics. I mean, I mean look, GR86 is.

[Zach Klapman]

M2S, M2 manual or even M2DCT. But manual both be appreciated more quickly.

[Matt Farah]

Possibly like dark horse Mustangs. Probably those variants of Hellcats. Even though technically they're not on sale anymore.

[Zach Klapman]

Find the right variant. Yeah, like I think GT500. Maybe it's not on sale anymore but.

[Matt Farah]

But yeah it's just such a pants pack whatever the they call the Mach.

[Zach Klapman]

I don't know how many Mach ones they made but that is a great Mustang. Yeah, that is maybe the. Maybe. I think it's my favorite Mustang of recent years.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, that's a good one, bronco. Raptors.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

Will probably be collectible.

[Zach Klapman]

I wonder if the Raptor V8 will be Raptor R. Yeah, Raptor R probably made.

[Matt Farah]

I think it's a dumb car. But Escalade V, it will probably be collectible.

[Zach Klapman]

That'll really depend on the price of gas. Yeah, I think a couple of these will actually.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Because that's such a specific. Like it has, you know, CT5V engine and sounds, but the dynamics of a Suburban.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, they're dumb.

[Zach Klapman]

Right. So I don't know if that will attract as many people, but who knows? I could be wrong.

[Matt Farah]

Historically, SUVs with big engines are collectible. If you look at the, like track, the Trackhawks. If you look at Grand Cherokee five nines to go back to go, you know, old school. The, the Chevy SS454s, you know, Ford, Ford Lightnings, you know, trucks and SUVs with big engines are. Are collectible. Yeah. Lotus Amir will be probably collectible. Yeah. Some good ones.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. I was curious how many Lightnings they made of the last. The good one. But when I search Lightning production numbers.

[Matt Farah]

I get all the hardcore search. Yeah, that guy has a watch question. Looking at a Zenith Chronomaster revival, I like the design and the history. Doesn't seem to get as much appreciation as other similar watches. Is it a quality issue or poor marketing? It's not a quality issue because Zenith makes nice watches. Zenith watches really do not have much hype behind them. They're not like cool on Instagram. Their. Their designs are not always something that's inspiring. I've never been like, you know, I'm gonna go get a Zenith. I don't think, I don't think they have the juice in terms of brand. But there are people that are hardcore Zenith collectors that like them. And if you show up to a watch meet and you're wearing a Zenith, you will get, you will get watch guy points. So I mean it's. They're definitely. They're very high quality items. They are expensive.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

But they, yeah, they've never been able to be seen as a cool sort of hype piece. Michael Cosgrove says the half 11 or the Tuthill GT one should say, I.

[Zach Klapman]

Haven'T driven either one of them. My instinct is to go to Tuttle, but I think that's probably because I've seen it driven in videos, in anger. And also it seems subtle, slightly more practical.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

But the Half Eleven is definitely a more unique experience. And I mean, if you walk through a parking lot, like, that's going to get more attention then you know, the tunnel could fly way under the radar, which some people like, but also some people don't.

[Matt Farah]

Interesting that the Oil Stain lab guys have said that there will be either an electric engine or a gas engine for that car. And the gas one, the specs were awfully familiar. Did you see that?

[Zach Klapman]

I saw flat six. I didn't read.

[Matt Farah]

4.5 liter flat six, 600 horse.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, you think?

[Matt Farah]

I wonder where that's coming from.

[Zach Klapman]

You think Ricky built it?

[Matt Farah]

I don't know. Well, I don't, I don't know if they have one yet. I think, I don't know if they have a real car yet. But I would say if I was spending millions of dollars and with respect to the Oil Stain lab guys design talents because I think that car is very cool looking and I, and I like the idea of this. The Half eleven concept. Tuthill builds race cars and for that kind of money I would prefer to buy a car from someone who builds race cars.

[Zach Klapman]

I think, I think, I think I get what you're saying. We don't know who's doing the engineering on the half 11. So it's, you know, if they get a race engineer also like I know that on I think Scarborough Performance did some of the work on the prototype but you know, Tuttle's got a long reputation of building race cars.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

So out of Porsches, right?

[Matt Farah]

True, bud. 215 wants to remind everyone to register and vote. Yes, please register and vote. And if you check if you can vote by mail and if so, make your life easy. I vote by mail.

[Zach Klapman]

That's way I vote.

[Matt Farah]

I vote by mail. Ballot comes to the house. Dude. There has been a run of incredibly deceptive ads and lawn signs going on in my area.

[Zach Klapman]

Really?

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. Prop 33 and Prop 34 and the signs that are being posted all over say, you know, say no to Prop 34, save affordable housing. That's the sign. Okay. Pretty straightforward message. Makes you feel like Prop 34 will somehow mess up affordable housing. Well, I started looking it up of course, and who's behind it, of course. The association of Landlords, California association of Landlords, Apartment renters, Realtors, basically. Basically it's a bunch of landlords got together and have a fucking pack. And they're saying, and this Prop 34, or excuse me, Prop 33 was to keep existing rent control laws. So they want to get rid of rent control and they're saying that if we keep these existing rent control laws nobody will want to build new buildings. No one will ever want to build more housing because with rent control we can't make money. Look around the city, are they not building any fucking apartment buildings right now? No one's building housing. There's fucking construction all over the place.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

And so it's this whole thing about save affordable housing by making housing more expensive now so that we could build. It was like this. And there was another TV ad that kept coming up that was like. It was about Prop 34 and it showed like a nurse in a hospital. And it was like this. Prop 34 could really make medical costs, you know, could make it so regular people can't afford medical costs. And I looked up and that's where.

[Zach Klapman]

We'Re at now anyway.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, right. I looked it up. It's also by the fucking California association of Landlords and Realtors. It has nothing to do with medical. And it's all about like housing shit.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh. It's like if housing gets more expensive, then you can't afford metal. That's clever and evil.

[Matt Farah]

It's fucking way, way out.

[Zach Klapman]

I started getting a lot of ads for no on Prop 33 on YouTube and I am immediately suspicious when there's a campaign why voting. Webmail is great because you really need to look up everything on there and you can find a lot of impartial web websites that will just tell you who funds this act.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Who supports it, who doesn't support it. And then like. And you can be. Go into more detail about what it's going to do because all the things when you're in the booth and you're like under the pressure and there's a line and you got to read these things and they get 200 words for each description. It's really hard.

[Matt Farah]

And it's all. It's not necessarily true. Like the first thing I did with Prop 33, and this is California only. And please, if you're in California, it might even be LA only. But please read this shit is. I went to California's website, to the voting website and it's like you said, it's the 200 words, right? Prop 33. Okay. Proponents say this, people against say this, this, this dude. And then it said like, who, what organizations support it? And it, it did give me kind of just the fact of it. But when I next time I was walking around my neighborhood, I saw the sign and I saw at the bottom, paid for by. And it was some. Paid for by aacl, pac, whatever. I'm making up the letters. But it was something like that. And I looked up what it was. And it was like, this is literally an association of landlords. And their whole website was a. About how we can keep regulation down in order to make it easier to build more apartments.

[Zach Klapman]

Right. My favorite website, I think, is Ballotpedia and it works for the whole country. You just go to your state, your area, it will have every proposition. Whenever it's like the last local election, we're voting for judges. You're voting for all these different people besides presidential. And you can look at each one of those and they link out to all of their sites. Ballotpedia is really helpful.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, that's a. That is a good resource. Paolo Pazuki. Which Hyundai vehicle would be the most interesting to get an N variant with the Veloster and Kona N discontinued? What other ones are there? The Elantra and the Ionic. Already have them.

[Zach Klapman]

I don't really. I don't really want a Sonata and. I don't want a Sonata and Telluride and.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, I mean, I don't want. I think they're already doing the thing, bro.

[Zach Klapman]

A Genesis N. That would be M. Right? I mean, which is very silly. BMW is like, what?

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. Paul says, can you help me make sense of the G Wagon lineup? They now have the 500 and 580 as base models. Are they replacing the 63 with the full EV? I don't think they are. I think they're keeping the 63 and they're adding the EV. I don't think they're replacing the 63 with the EV. The 63 has so much fucking profit in it. I don't know why they would. I've never heard anything about eliminating the 63. So I think it's both. Right. Am I wrong on this?

[Zach Klapman]

Go to models.

[Matt Farah]

G550. Pull down the menu, select another model. So there's the 550 and the 580 electric. And do they not have a 63?

[Zach Klapman]

I guess that's it right now.

[Matt Farah]

Oh, well, they're not going to completely get rid of the 63. There's so much profit in that. They might have held off on it for a year. Wait, go into vehicles and go into amg. Maybe separately is amg separate. Go to Mercedes am. And maybe it's just, oh, we have to go through all this bullshit. It's just hidden separately on the website.

[Zach Klapman]

We are engine performance, design models.

[Matt Farah]

Bottom. They do not make it easy. SUV's up top. Here we go. GLA. You can keep scrolling across to the bottom here. GLC. Is this it? Keep going GLC GLC GLC. There is a lot of them. EQE GLE keep going that it goes back around.

[Zach Klapman]

Hmm.

[Matt Farah]

Well, it's. I would be surprised if they discontinue the AMG because it's just printing money, but I would be happy if they did because it's stupid. There is absolutely no reason for an AMG G wagon to excellent exist. And so if they got rid of it, that would be fine.

[Zach Klapman]

AI says. AI Google says that they just, they just, they ended the production run of the current one. The new 2025 one will come out second half of this year. So that's now ish. So it sounds like. Yeah, it's. It's one of those things where they say production is ending but it doesn't mean the model is ending.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

It's a trick.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. I'd be very surprised if they got rid of it because the margins are extraordinary on that car.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

Free. Toby Sundays thoughts on AliExpress watches I do not want fake clones, but a budget mechanical collection. Or do I buy one decent watch for 1500? AliExpress sells junk. I mean that's a, that's a place to buy junk. So if you want a bunch of cheap junk, that's okay, buy it at AliExpress, but that's what you're getting. So you don't have to spend fifteen hundred dollars to get a decent watch. You can get a lot of decent watches for three figures under a thousand bucks. Micro brands are all over the place and you can go on any number of watch forums I use. WatchCrunch.com is the watch forum I like and people are posting up their micro brand stuff and their vintage stuff that they're buying all the time. That, what that forum has much more content on affordable watches than it does content on very expensive luxury watches. And there are people who buy AliExpress stuff and they like it. But you came to me and I'm telling you that's junk. Ryan says, what do you think of apr? Gts turbo swaps and tunes on Porsche with a 991.2 Carrera available at 75. Is it a cheaper path to a hell of a car? I don't know what that is. Are they putting the GTS turbos on Carreras?

[Zach Klapman]

Maybe.

[Matt Farah]

If so, that's a pretty like standard thing that BBI does this, right?

[Zach Klapman]

You can remove APR from this and basically is like, is buying a used car and then getting a turbo swap and a tune from a reputable company a cheaper path to a really Fast car. Yes. I mean you can get, we've talked about this with the 911T. I mean you can get Carrera do mods to it and you can have GTS power for less than a brand new gts.

[Matt Farah]

Right.

[Zach Klapman]

So, yeah, I mean, especially if you get a used car, sure you can get the power numbers, but I think there's a lot more that goes into the price of a new car in a new generation than just horsepower. But you can get real close, especially if you do suspension mods and alignment. I mean you can, a used car can chase a new car on a racetrack with some mods.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. But the thing is you, you definitely a Carrera comes with is a pretty decontented car like you probably want, like a Carrera S at least. And then do the turbos because you might get the diff, you might get brakes, you might get like Carreras. Regular Carreras are pretty basic. Like oftentimes don't have LSD and stuff like that. So. And then also like when you go to sell that car, you're going to get less money for it than if it was stock, so. Whereas if you spend up front for the gts, you're going to get more. Remember with John the accountant did the math. The enthusiast oriented models have better depreciation than the base model.

[Zach Klapman]

Better. Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

And then, not to mention you modify the base model, you never see that money.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

So both sides of the math. Old Rusty Bimmer says, my brother is in the market for an ev. They're looking at the Nissan Ariya, Hyundai Ioniq and Chevy Blazer.

[Zach Klapman]

They basically his question is, we live in an old town area. The garages tend to be small.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Is, you know, is this a, gonna be a widening problem, no pun intended, where, you know, big new EVs can't fit in normal garages?

[Matt Farah]

Yes. I mean the, well, first things first. The EVs that they're talking, that he's talking about here, the Ariya, Ioniq and Blazer are not bigger than regular cars. They're the same size as regular cars. So those, those vehicles should not have a problem fitting in a regular sized garage or a regular sized driveway. And there are plenty of EVs that are regular size.

[Zach Klapman]

But if the age of the building is X, like I was looking for a garage to rent years ago in la, just a garage separate from my apartment building and I found one for rent and it was a couple hundred bucks, but it was like built in the 50s and I probably would have had three inches on each side. Of my car, my E46. Not a very big vehicle. And it was like this garage was meant for Volkswagen Beetles of the time.

[Matt Farah]

Probably wasn't easy because the cars would have been big. It. It might have been. It might have been.

[Zach Klapman]

It might have been older than that.

[Matt Farah]

Older than that. It was small or early 80s.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, like early Civics and stuff.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. When cars were maybe smaller.

[Zach Klapman]

Good point. So either way, it was meant for cars of a different age when they were much smaller. So that might be the situation they're dealing with.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, but his question is, given the point of EVs is to charge at home, shouldn't these cars easily fit in normal garages? I mean, yes, although you can have an EV charger outside your house and park in the driveway and many people are doing that as well. But yeah, I. Cars are too big in general. But I don't think the very specific examples that you have chosen are egregious examples of car bloat.

[Zach Klapman]

Right. It's not like every EV is a Hummer.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Also, I saw a video of a Chinese EV Crab walking into a parking spot while Teslas have dance mode and make fart noises. Are we ever going to make. Make functional vehicles that make sense or is the American consumer generally the strange. I mean, the Chinese are way ahead of us on EV tech. Way ahead of us. That's why fucking Biden administration has all these crazy tariffs and shit, because they're afraid we're just going to get fucking run over by this stuff. I mean, and we would, right? Absolutely would.

[Zach Klapman]

That's true. Also, just for him, the Hummer in their promo videos also crab walked into parking spots. It didn't have the 90 degree angle, but it like we've had that kind of stuff to.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, I mean, and we have plenty of functional vehicles that make sense. It's not like 95% of all the cars on the road are pretty functional and make sense. And it's not exclusive. There's nothing wrong with fart noises and there's nothing wrong with doing the little light dance shit. Like you can put some whimsy in your car. Like, why not? Like that's, that's, that's fine. And Teslas do things that are practical also.

[Zach Klapman]

Like, I think, I think I've seen the video they're talking about, like where all the drive wheels rotate almost 90 degrees. Yeah, that's very cool.

[Matt Farah]

It's very cool. But that's a very concept car thing. Like, I don't think they're actually selling a car that is doing that right now.

[Zach Klapman]

Well, it's also a very complicated mechanism. I imagine rear steer that goes that far. I would be curious how long that would last over tens of thousands of miles and years and years and years.

[Matt Farah]

I agree. I think, I think yeah, it's, that's tough. But yeah, we're getting fucking rolled on by the Chinese and their EVs. Their fucking EVs are dope and they cost nothing. Brian says, do you believe Mazda's sentiment that they're too mature for a Mazda speed? If they ever said that they ever said they're too mature for a Mazda speed. I don't. It might have been that they, their customers don't want that. I mean it's not like the Mazda Speed 3 was ever like a super volume seller. It's not like any Mazda speed car has ever been a super volume seller.

[Zach Klapman]

So they said that in 2020. Oh, I think you, but I think your point is correct. Like people are moving away from cars. People are moving towards hybrids and EVs. Like mass markets are. So for them to be like, well now we have some niche performance cars like Miatas and we're gonna go even further niche and go Mazdaspeed. I mean they probably just didn't have the customer base. They don't sell a ton of cars.

[Matt Farah]

Mazda is a very small company.

[Zach Klapman]

Right.

[Matt Farah]

So I'm, it's too bad because I like Mazda speed, but I the. Yeah, the math just can't be there. Mr. Nailhead says for a daily driver in a 2020 Ford Explorer, is it still worth it to get the Michelins or is that overkill for the usage? I would say probably you don't need Michelins. I mean don't buy some like, you know, some like garbage ass, no name brand tire. You should get a decent tire. But you don't need a super sporty tire to definitely not Explorer around.

[Zach Klapman]

No, I would get something that's quiet, lasts a long time and depending on where you live, works in all climates. Especially for an Explorer.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. Colin asks, what rental car do you typically go for if you have the choice? Well, we rent a lot of minivans. Yeah, minivans. Pacifica is a very useful rental cars. They're great lot minivans. If it's just me traveling by myself, I usually could try to go for like a compact to mid size crossover like a RAV4 or a Hyundai Santa Fe or something like that.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, those are the most usable. We're also traveling. I mean usually it's you and I or You. So we don't need a lot of car. If I was going to rent a car to drive, you know, across three states like V6 Charger, Long Wheelbase, comfy, soft like I like those things. But usually it's just, it's a car, it gets us from one place to another.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, I usually just. I. I usually just want something that will comfortably hold my stuff and be. Have enough space where the seat will be comfortable for whatever like that. Beyond that I really don't care.

[Zach Klapman]

Speaking of rental cars, remember we drove that Cherokee 4xE y suck. They just recalled like 200,000 4x E for fires.

[Matt Farah]

That thing was trash.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

I can't believe how bad they burned the Grand Cherokee name to the ground with that car. That thing sucked.

[Zach Klapman]

I mean it's just the integration of their hybrid systems.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, I think wranglers too, right?

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. Well, I think 4x. I believe all 4xes were recalled.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

I'll look it up real fast.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. Do not, do not plug in. Right. Park them outside and don't plug them in.

[Zach Klapman]

Wasn't that the directive Jeep is recalling? 154,000 Wrangler for XE models and Grand Cherokee models. High issue stems from the high voltage battery internally failing. Could possibly cause a fire while the SUV is driving or parked.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, that sounds, that was from October.

[Zach Klapman]

To eight days ago.

[Matt Farah]

Sounds real bad.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. Last one Darian Lux. Rank every generation BMW M3. Okay, I could do that. E46 at the top.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

E92 below that. E30 below that. F80 below that.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, you're so disrespectful.

[Matt Farah]

G36 below that. E36 at the bottom.

[Zach Klapman]

You put G80 above E36. What's wrong with you?

[Matt Farah]

It's actually fast.

[Zach Klapman]

I mean that's doesn't smell like crayon and the ergonomics are far better.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

And it's a better road trip car.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

But still E36S is built. I know. I saw a red one today. I was like, oh. Like I turned and out loud in my car I was like God, they look good but the steering wheel is in the wrong place.

[Matt Farah]

The quality of them is so poor.

[Zach Klapman]

I know.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

It's unfortunate.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. Do you disagree with my assessment? E46?

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

E92.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

E30. F80.

[Zach Klapman]

I go F80.

[Matt Farah]

F80. E46.

[Zach Klapman]

I would put F80 above E30. I know that's disrespectful to history, but the four cylinder engine in that thing, like that car needs more engine.

[Matt Farah]

It not good I was just talking on Spike's podcast from Luft with Paul Zuckerman, who is on quite a run with BMWs right now.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, he's got good taste.

[Matt Farah]

He just bought a Imola Yellow E39M5, one of, I think two in America. It had 600 miles on it.

[Zach Klapman]

Whoa.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. But we were talking about E30s and we both agree the 325 is. Is the better car than the E30 M3.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. I mean, I've never driven an E30 in anger. That might change things, but I still don't like the engine.

[Matt Farah]

E30 M3s are great above 50 miles an hour.

[Zach Klapman]

It's a Momentum car. Right. It's a BMW Miata.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, yeah. But in most driving situations, the 325is will feel faster than the E30.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah. Thank you to our patrons for such good questions today. Thank you to everybody else for listening. We. I guess we're gonna have to do some more radio because I'm going to Spain Monday to Thursday next week. Yeah, we're gonna have to fucking sneak some more shows in there, aren't we? Maybe we'll just keep the slot for tomorrow that. We were going to have Simon Kidston on the show, but he had to bump it for some sort of English reason. Don't really know why, but yeah, we love you all. See you later. Bye.