Building Cars is HARD w/ Oil Stain Lab

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Smoking Tire – "Building Cars is HARD w/ Oil Stain Lab"

Episode Information

• Title: Building Cars is HARD
• Guest: Nikita and Ilya Berdan of Oil Stain Lab
• Release Date: July 22, 2025
• Hosts: Zack Klapman, Matt Farah, and Christian James Hand

---

1. Introduction to Oil Stain Lab’s Evolution

The episode kicks off with hosts Zack Klapman, Matt Farah, and Christian James Hand welcoming Nikita and Ilya Berdan, the Ukrainian twins behind Oil Stain Lab. They reflect on the duo's previous success with their fictional Half 11 race car project on Instagram, which garnered significant attention and led them to pivot towards building a real vehicle.

Notable Quote:

• Zach Klapman [01:48]: “We're live. All right. Hello. I'm on the other side today...”
  Acknowledges the guest and sets the stage for their journey from concept to reality.

2. From Concept to Reality: Building the Half 11

Nikita and Ilya discuss how the innovative Half 11 started as a creative marketing tool—a "visual business card"—and evolved into a full-fledged project due to overwhelming interest from fans and potential buyers.

Key Points:

• Initial skepticism about selling a conceptual car.
• Transitioning from design consultancy to automotive manufacturing.
• Securing angel investment to support the shift.

Notable Quote:

• Ilya Berdan [04:40]: “We built that as kind of a little business visual... people started approaching us, and they really told us how much they loved the project.”

3. Design and Engineering Challenges

The discussion delves into the intricate process of designing the car, emphasizing the shift from tubular frames to CNC aluminum subframes to meet performance and aerodynamic requirements.

Key Points:

• Carbon Tub Design: Challenges in creating a carbon tub where every component must be predefined due to the immutability of carbon structures.
• Wide Tires Issue: Struggling with accommodating 275mm front tires without compromising occupant safety and vehicle aesthetics.

Notable Quote:

• Nikita Berdan [66:15]: “There's always a price, right?”
  Highlights the balance between customer customization requests and maintaining design integrity.

4. Innovative Powertrain Solutions: Combustion and Electric

A significant portion of the conversation centers on Oil Stain Lab’s dual powertrain approach. They are developing both combustion and electric variants of their car, aiming for swappable powertrains to offer flexibility and cater to diverse customer preferences.

Key Points:

• Combustion Engine: Utilizing a flat-six architecture inspired by Porsches, specifically mentioning the GT4 powertrain.
• Electric Option: Exploring lightweight EV technologies, including silicon anode pouches and lightweight inverters, to create a manageable 2,000-pound electric variant.
• Swappability: Designing the chassis to accommodate both powertrains without extensive modifications, driven by customer demand for flexibility.

Notable Quotes:

• Nikita Berdan [19:38]: “We genuinely hate EVs, right. And so when we started thinking about it...”
• Zach Klapman [21:52]: “If you buy one, you don't have to throw away the whole car if you don't like it.”

5. Aerodynamics and Performance Optimization

The Berdan twins elaborate on their aerodynamic philosophy, focusing on maintaining exposed tires while achieving low drag and adequate downforce. They discuss the innovative use of air curtains and low-speed air zones to manage airflow around the tires without compromising performance.

Key Points:

• Air Curtains: Aggressive side blades above the splitter to manage airflow.
• Low-Speed Zones: Creating bubbles around the rear tires to reduce direct high-speed air impact.
• CD and Downforce: Achieving competitive drag coefficients and downforce figures crucial for both combustion and electric models.

Notable Quote:

• Ilya Berdan [37:53]: “We didn’t want to give up the exposed tires, which is every aerodynamicist’s nightmare...”

6. Interior Design and Custom Features

The interior of the HF11 concept is discussed with admiration for its unique design elements, such as adjustable gauge clusters, slider seats, and customizable storage solutions tailored for helmets and other gear.

Key Points:

• Gauge Cluster: Initially adjustable but later set for optimal ergonomics.
• Storage Innovations: Customizable door pockets and under-dash storage for helmets and duffel bags.
• Comfort and Functionality: Slider-tilt seats and a modernized Porsche 917 vibe with minimal screen reliance.

Notable Quote:

• Nikita Berdan [54:34]: “And the steering wheel on that white one that looks like a...”

7. Collaboration and Industry Interaction

Nikita and Ilya touch upon their interactions with major automotive brands like Porsche, emphasizing respectful design inspiration without infringing on trademarks or proprietary designs. They discuss how Oil Stain Lab maintains a creative balance while navigating industry relationships.

Key Points:

• Porsche Inspiration: Drawing inspiration for design elements without direct copying.
• Legal Considerations: Ensuring no trademarked elements are used, such as avoiding Porsche badges.
• Brand Relations: Positive interactions with higher-ups at Porsche regarding their original concept.

Notable Quote:

• Nikita Berdan [62:08]: “The hazard button. Yeah.”

8. Future Plans and Upcoming Events

Looking ahead, the Berdan twins outline their roadmap, including the completion and testing of prototypes, participation in automotive events like the Quail, and ongoing development of both production and racing variants.

Key Points:

• Prototype Testing: First prototype set to start running in the fall, followed by thorough suspension and safety validations.
• Event Participation: Showcasing the HF11 at Motorlux Quail and Exotics on Broadway.
• Continuous Development: Plans for fully developed interiors and track-ready versions in the following year.

Notable Quote:

• Nikita Berdan [53:32]: “We're gonna develop this the same way we did with the original car...”

9. Audience Q&A: Insights and Future Possibilities

The episode concludes with a lively Q&A session where listeners pose questions about customization limitations, design inspirations, and potential future projects like boat designs. The Berdans share insights into maintaining quality while addressing unique customer requests and discuss the feasibility of expanding their product line.

Key Points:

• Customization Limits: Balancing customer desires with practical engineering constraints.
• Future Projects: Open to exploring boat designs inspired by their automotive expertise.
• Community Engagement: Encouraging fans to visit events and engage with their projects.

Notable Quote:

• Nikita Berdan [66:05]: “There’s always a price, right?”

---

Conclusion In this episode, Oil Stain Lab’s Nikita and Ilya Berdan offer an in-depth look into the challenges and triumphs of transforming a conceptual car project into a tangible, high-performance vehicle. From innovative powertrain solutions and aerodynamic design to unique interior features and future aspirations, the Berdan twins exemplify entrepreneurial spirit and automotive passion. Their journey underscores the complexities of car manufacturing and the relentless pursuit of automotive excellence.

Follow Oil Stain Lab:

• Website: oilstainlab.com
• Events: Participate in Motorlux Quail and Exotics on Broadway to see the HF11 concept in action.

---

This summary captures the essence of the podcast episode, highlighting the critical discussions and insights shared by the guests, while omitting promotional segments and advertisements as per the instructions.

Transcript

[Matt Farah]

What's up, everybody? Welcome to the Smoking Tire Podcast. Now, we are, as always, brought to you by off the Record, but I'm not talking about them today because TST is coming to Texas. That's right. This Thursday and Friday, July 23rd and 24th, we are in Houston and Dallas, respectively, doing live podcasts at the Shop Clubs. Come see us In Houston, Thursday, July 24th, with our pal Christian James, James Hand. And Friday, July 25th in Dallas. Tickets are going quick. It will sell out, so buy them now. The ticket link is in the show notes for this podcast as well as the Smoking Tire Instagram description link in bio. So get tickets, come see us this Thursday and Friday in Texas. And if it goes well, it's the the kind of thing we'll keep doing in coming to you other places throughout the country. So let's get to it. On this episode of the Smoking Tire Podcast, we've got a real special guest in town, the twins of Oil Stain Lab, Nikita and Ilya Berdan. These guys were here a couple of years ago with their insane half 11 conceptual historical revisionist project, and it was such a big hit that they're apparently now going to turn it into a real car. I went to their studio to see it and they're in studio telling us all about it now. So let's give a warm Smoking Tire welcome to Nikita and Ilya Burden of Oil Stain Labs. Let's go.

[Zach Klapman]

We're live. All right. Hello. I'm on the other side today. It's actually been a while since I've been on this side of the table. Since the 1000, I think. Yeah, 30 episodes since I've been on this side of the table. Nikita and Ilya. Nikita's that one. Ilya's that one. I'll have done that in the intro already, but just to be sure. Cause, like, I mean, listen, let's be honest. All white people look exactly the same. Am I right? When they're twins, you know, it helps, but otherwise, you know, still true. No. Someone did say to me, I can't tell white people apart. And my trainer, who is black and met it, like, dead serious. I was like, I was talking about the Lincoln Lawyer with him. And I was like, oh, you know that the TV show, it's based on a movie, but Matthew McConaughey is this. And William H. Macy does this, and he's like, I don't know those white people. All right, cool. I'll just drop it right there. So anyway, we have Ukrainian twins, which is about as white as People get, welcome, boys.

[Christian James Hand]

When you guys walked in, Matt's like, they're here. I was like, great. And I was like, which one did I meet last time?

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Christian James Hand]

It's good to see.

[Zach Klapman]

I was like, all right.

[Christian James Hand]

The kid is good to see. I've never met you. I felt like a fucking dick.

[Zach Klapman]

But, yeah. Warning. Yesterday, I got to go down and see your studio, which was very exciting. How many years ago were you here? Three years ago?

[Ilya Berdan]

Two or three.

[Zach Klapman]

It was a while ago. Right. So you told us the story of Oil Stain Lab to that point, and that was a fun and winding tale. So now we have, like. Like an actual. Well, it's not an actual car, but, like, it certainly looks much more like an actual car. You know, you guys started with this amazing, like, fictional history of a. Of a. Of a race car that never existed on Instagram, which is so fun. And we. Down at the studio, you're. The photos are blown up really big, and you can look at them really close. I'm like, these Photoshops aren't as good as I thought they were. 20, 21 on your phone, they look amazing. Really, really big. You're like, oh, yeah, that one wouldn't have got me at full stop.

[Christian James Hand]

It was brilliant. I mean, we were just talking about it before the show, but I thought it was brilliant marketing. It really did.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, it was really funny.

[Christian James Hand]

Noise and trick people like, is this car real?

[Zach Klapman]

Is that a thing I somehow missed?

[Christian James Hand]

But they're making it now. I don't get it. It was great.

[Zach Klapman]

So what happened between then, when you had a roofless speedster car that was, like, real, you know, made of aluminum foil, basically, and now with this orange car. Ilya, you wanna start? Take. Take me. All right, so you had this. You had this speedster thing you built with the LS motor, and you were sort of like, parading it around to places, showing it to people.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah, I mean, we built that as kind of a little business visual. Visual business card for the brand, and then started to have fun with it, went to different events, did all sorts of stuff with it, and people started approaching us, and they really told us how much they loved the project, obviously. And then some people actually wanted to buy a car.

[Zach Klapman]

Yes. I want the fictional Le Mans car.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah. And we were very skeptical that they actually wanted to buy that car. The illusion of it is fantastic. Right. But the reality is sometimes, yeah, it's.

[Zach Klapman]

Did dealers make you offers for that one?

[Ilya Berdan]

Yes.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay.

[Ilya Berdan]

We got offers.

[Zach Klapman]

You should sell it, probably. I mean, look at you now. Have all the pictures of it ever need. You have seven lifetimes of photographs of it. And it's.

[Ilya Berdan]

It's a museum.

[Zach Klapman]

It learned a lot. It's a cool display at the studio, I'll admit that.

[Christian James Hand]

But, like, I think we know that a prototype will never be worth so much as in the beginning or at the very end, when the company celebrates its 40th anniversary.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure. Exactly. Yeah. Okay. So people wanted it.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah. And then. So I think. Yeah, last time you were here, we had already started kind of thinking what a production version would be. And, yeah, very early on, tried tube frame stuff, and then eventually went to a carbon tub, just because the performance targets that we needed to hit, aero packaging, everything.

[Zach Klapman]

But there's something in between that, which is that this thing was a business card for what was supposed to be theoretically, like Nikita told us a couple years ago, a sort of a design consultancy. Right. For all type of consumer products, car things and other things, including some of the furniture that you guys have and otherwise. But then when I went to the thing yesterday, I was like, so, what's up with the design consultancy, the thing? I mean, your studio? And you were like, yeah, we're just gonna, like, build the car now. And I was like, oh, okay. So that's like a pretty serious pivot.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Big financial pivot.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah, no, it is.

[Zach Klapman]

I mean. Cause building a car is, like, much harder than saying, look at this. Look at this backstory. We can create around a product and then bring a thing to life visually, which for a designer is an exceptional talent to have. But, like, building and selling, like, running cars is like a. That's like a big leap.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Christian James Hand]

Drawing is easier than building.

[Ilya Berdan]

I think it's definitely insane.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Ilya Berdan]

I think it happened a little bit slowly. I think at first we're like, oh, yeah, this. This will be no big deal.

[Nikita Berdan]

Like what?

[Ilya Berdan]

You know, but building cars is actually.

[Nikita Berdan]

Really, really hard, turns out.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Ilya Berdan]

And it takes a lot of time and building out every facet of the business and everything. So eventually, yeah, it just kind of started winding down with clients, and we were just like, we can't. We can't. You can't do this anymore.

[Zach Klapman]

So was it the sort of thing where, like, okay, one guy wants to buy the original and give you a bunch of money for it, and then maybe two or three guys want to buy the original and you've only got one? And so.

[Matt Farah]

Okay, but.

[Zach Klapman]

And then it's like, did another invest. Did you talk to someone and go, hey, we've got 10, 12 people want to buy, and they'll go, all right, I'll bankroll you, and we'll actually make this a business. Or did you guys go, we now want to. We want to put our name on a sellable car. There's no, like, right or wrong.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah, I'm just trying to remember. Yeah, I think, yeah. About two, three years ago. Yeah, we were. Like you said, we were getting all these inquiries, and we decided, okay, like, how would we do this? And then we built out a business model. We built out how the team would look and the structure and, you know, studied the market, the opportunity, the product, the fit, what. What we thought would resonate. And then we basically, yeah, got an angel, found an angel. And that led to the eventual progression that you've now seen.

[Ilya Berdan]

Right.

[Nikita Berdan]

So, yeah, it took a little bit of time. We slowly winded down our clients because it was just it. The project swallowed us pretty whole and the team pretty whole.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. Obviously, start car companies don't do it as a side hustle.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah. And so, yeah, I mean, I think we miss those days. But also, this is very cool because we get to build our own universe and we get to build other stuff. Like, that's why we do the chairs and the apparel and other stuff.

[Zach Klapman]

I really like the chairs. I don't know what it's called, but, like, the lounge chair that's out of the original.

[Ilya Berdan]

We call it the Maniac chair.

[Zach Klapman]

It's like a much better today version of an Eames chair, which I really, really like. And later, we're going to talk about the one that I'll be getting. Do you buy a chair? Huh?

[Christian James Hand]

You buy a chair?

[Zach Klapman]

I think I would like to buy a chair. It was incredibly comfortable and a beautiful piece of hardware. I really liked it. And I think with the right fabric choice, it could be an exceptionally, you know, stupid thing, in the way that only my shit can be exceptionally. You know, mine has to be. I have to have a thing of value and give it $0 resale value, make it just worthless. No one else gets the inside jokes. Like, nothing. I don't know if you saw my hot dog shift. Here's where we're headed. So from an aesthetics point of view, did you sort of put the original thing, the original car, like, into a CFD model and go, okay, what of this will work? And what if it has to immediately be changed because it will take off like that Mercedes?

[Matt Farah]

Folks, we gotta take a quick break from the action because this show is sponsored by Liquid iv. Look, you guys have heard about Liquid IV on other podcasts. You know what it is, right? Your summer can get hot and Liquid IV can help you get hydrated for the adventures ahead. Now that could mean you're doing a big hike or a big athletic activity and it's going to be hot out in the desert. And maybe you want to boost your hydration because maybe you had a night out partying the night before and you've gotta get things going quick this morning at work. Either scenario, Liquid IV is something you need to know about. If I'm out entertaining guests on our road and track experiences, have to lead a big drive group the next day. Liquid IV is there for me boosting that morning hydration first thing in the morning. I keep these packets in my backpack when I travel, particularly if I'm traveling and I know I'm going to be going out. Liquid IV comes in great flavors. It's easy to carry. You can fuel up for your athletic activities or for next day recovery. So many sugar free options too including white, peach, lemon, lime, rainbow sherbet and more. And you can find all the best selling hydration multipliers online. I'm all about that rainbow sherbet baby. Plus more fun flavors like cotton candy or popsicle Firecracker. And you can experience their newest flavor hydration multiplier arctic raspberry man. One stick and 16 ounces of water hydrates better than water alone. Empowered by live hydro science. An optimized ratio of electrolytes, essential vitamins and clinically tested nutrients that turn ordinary water into extraordinary hydration. Three times the electrolytes of the leading sports drink. Eight essential vitamins and nutrients. It's always non gmo, vegan, gluten free, dairy free and soy free. So squeeze the most out of your summer with Liquid IV Tear Pour Live more. Go to liquidiv.com and get 20% off your first order with code TIRE at checkout. That's 20% off your first order with Code [e-mail] we're also brought to you today by Cargurus. Look when you're buying a car, there's so many places to look. How do you narrow down which one to choose? It's easy. You just go straight to Cargurus because Cargurus is going to give you confidence, not confusion. Helping you cut through the noise. Showing you the best deals and in depth vehicle details so you can feel confident about your purchase. Because when it comes to your big deal, you deserve the best deal. Car shopping is designed to make you second guess yourself to Confuse you. Is this a good price? Am I making the right choice? You end up settling with just what's in front of you. But with Cargurus, you don't have to wonder. They have the most inventory of new and used cars so you can find the best deal. And with unbiased deal ratings, price drop alerts and in depth vehicle reviews, you'll make a decision you can feel great about. Because a big deal should never feel like, like a big risk. Cargurus will connect you with trusted dealers when you're ready, ensuring a transparent and hassle free buying process. With over 4 million listings, CarGurus has more car listings than any other major online automotive marketplace in the US So you can find the best deal. It gives you the control to shop how you want to shop. With the tools, information and data driven ratings that you need. It's no wonder similar web estimated traffic data shows Cargurus is the number one most visited car shopping site. Buy or sell your next car today with [e-mail] Go to CarGurus.com to make sure your big deal is the best deal. That's C A R G u r u s.com cargurus.com and now back to the show.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah, I mean, we ran the original car before we built it through CFT just to make sure there was nothing crazy. And it wasn't terrible. It wasn't great, but it wasn't terrible.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay. I mean, it stayed on the driveway at Goodwood mostly.

[Nikita Berdan]

It was fast.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, yeah. That was actually, you know, a running driving car for anyone brave enough to fucking get in.

[Nikita Berdan]

And Goodwood's amazing. I mean, that's the pinnacle for that car. Yeah, yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

And I don't think I ever told the story on the podcast, but I told Ilya the other day that I was walking through the paddock at some event before you put the roof on this thing with Ben Collins the stick, shout out to him, follow his YouTube channel, follow him on social media. He is the sweetest man and he's funny as hell. And he looks at, he goes, what is that? I go, oh, let me tell you about oil stain lab and this fucking thing. And I showed him the fake Lamar photos and everything. He's like, that's pretty awesome. You couldn't pay me enough money to get in that. He's like, Cause wherever the base of the windshield was basically a raz. He's like, you see that? No. And so I was like, yeah, man, I, I see where you're going with that. And then he heard somebody said someone was riding it at Goodwood. He texted me, goes, someone's running this thing up Goodwood. I'm like, dude, it's awesome. Shout out to bed. So it wasn't bad when you see it was okay.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah. I mean, obviously the original car, it was never designed to, you know, perform. It was like a tribute to the past. Right. So I think with the new car, what we did is we started with the driver because the old car, five foot six, like my height with a helmet, you're basically like, sitting like this. Right.

[Zach Klapman]

That's not a German car, that's an Italian car. You're going to have to redo the front end, make it a little more wedgy.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yes. So I think, yeah, we started with that and then we, you know, from our car design experience, we basically put in a 6 foot 4 mannequin and then put a helmet on the guy and we're like, okay, that's what we need to do.

[Ilya Berdan]

It's also when we hated life.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, shit. We have to make this concept car fit a human. Oh, it's gonna be so ugly.

[Nikita Berdan]

It's getting a lot longer. It's getting a lot taller. And then the engineering team came back with there's like a rollover angle. And Instead of meeting GT3 Spec, they went all the way to F1 Spec, which is an extra 25 millimeters on top of the line for clear. And we were just like, no, please, no. It's already so tall and ugly.

[Christian James Hand]

Well, it doesn't look tall because it's long, but, I mean, it looks.

[Zach Klapman]

But compared to the original thing, which, like, you know, humans don't fit in. Right. You know, like. Like that Alpine, like, we, you know, we drove a modern Alpine A110 recently, which is a lovely, lovely thing. And I just went to a car show that had one of the original Alpine A110s, and it looked like a fucking scale model. Humans got in this, like, what the what? Yeah, no, this is. This is. I mean, this is now the size of, like, McLaren P1. Maybe smaller. It's a little smaller, maybe.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah. So overall length, it's the same as a 718.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay.

[Nikita Berdan]

And then obviously much wider and lower, but lengthwise, it's the same length as the old car. So it's about 172 inches long.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay.

[Nikita Berdan]

Pretty compact.

[Zach Klapman]

And it does fit two people, allegedly.

[Nikita Berdan]

It does.

[Zach Klapman]

Six foot four. Yeah. Two tall people, maybe not. Are they fat people? Are your matt? Anakin's like a deuce and a Quarter.

[Nikita Berdan]

The chair you sat in is basically more or less what's going in the car. So it's based off that comfort curve and everything.

[Zach Klapman]

So you're gonna be up like that?

[Nikita Berdan]

Well, you're gonna be a lot lower. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay. So it will fit humans. Allegedly. Tell me about what makes it go.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah, so what makes it go? You know, I think we've stuck with sort of a flat six architecture for this one. The original car obviously had the LS the custom built for this one. Yeah, we decided to go back to sort of that original, I don't know, inspiration of the period or whatever. And we love Porsches. We've got a couple straight pipe 911s and stuff. So, yeah, first prototype, which will start running sometime in the fall, that's going to be powered by a GT4, Mr. Powertrain. And then we're building out a sort of a cup motor, a 991 cup motor derived motor. So it'll be the second one that goes in. And then the ever controversial.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, the electric thing, Right, Yeah. Well, Ilya told me about this and I mean, I don't think it's controversial, but I did, I did, I did question it. Yeah, there was. So go ahead, Nikita, tell us about what this, the EV option is.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yes.

[Nikita Berdan]

I mean, very early on we wanted to explore what would be sort of a powertrain agnostic approach. Right. And we genuinely hate EV.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, I saw the PowerPoint presentation. It's like the first slot.

[Nikita Berdan]

Like we hate EVs, right. And so when we started thinking about it, we knew basically, yeah, you have to get the weight out. So we run silicon anode pouches, basically. Ultra lightweight, obviously lightweight inverters. And the motors, you know, nowadays you can get, you know, 800 horsepower, it's 40 kilo, like it weighs nothing.

[Zach Klapman]

Electric motors are like.

[Nikita Berdan]

And so the more we did it, the more it sort of started to be appealing to us. Cause we were like, we can actually do a 2,000 pound EV. And then when we got to that point, we're like, let's make our life really hard and make it swappable.

[Zach Klapman]

Well, is it? Yeah, so that was the other part. And. And is it swappable? Just because it makes more sense as a small company to design a chassis that would easily work with either without modifications. And when you take that into account, it sort of just makes it swappable by default.

[Nikita Berdan]

So the idea came from one client when it was not swappable and we presented the two power plants and he was like, well, Maybe I'll buy one of each. And we're like, that seems wasteful. Yeah, why don't we make it swappable? So that was kind of the genesis of it. At that point, we had no idea if it was possible or not.

[Zach Klapman]

But it's an interesting idea. But I don't like who's gonna do that. People don't even want to swap their tires. Who that can afford this probably seven figure thing? He already demonstrated his willingness to buy two. He has enough money for two, enough space for two. That seems, even though it's, quote, wasteful, that seems less annoying than making it sw. I just don't know who's going to do it.

[Christian James Hand]

Put it another way, like you guys thought of this idea, it clearly excited you. Have you presented it to clients and they go, oh, cool. Or do they tell you, I'll just take one of the engines or one of the power plants?

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah, no, I think genuine, huge amount of interest in it. Yeah. So we call it Thunderbolt for obvious reasons. Thunder and Volt. Yeah. But I would say, Yeah, I think 70% of people are interested in the EV version, like genuinely interested.

[Christian James Hand]

Wow.

[Nikita Berdan]

A few people are rejecting combustion and saying, I'll just get the ev. And some people are interested in both. But I think what's interesting about both, what appeals to people is, I mean, there's all sorts of legislation that's happening. There's all sorts of like, regulations. One thing we're not sure about is like the use case, like, would you take the electric to the track because it would kind of be faster or would you take the combustion one to the track? Like, we're not really sure how people will use it.

[Zach Klapman]

I mean, the electric one, you'd set one fast lap, you know, unless you're at a track that has DC fast charging for it. But, you know, even the ones that do right now are pretty much only teslas in the U.S. now, in other countries, who knows, maybe they're, you know, in other parts of the world.

[Nikita Berdan]

I think.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah. To add on to his point, I think when, when you talk about the swap ability, the beauty is, you know, if you bought an electric and then you just hate it. You can get the powertrain, the, the combustion powertrain, just swap it in, you know, that's true.

[Zach Klapman]

If you buy one, you don't, you don't have to throw away the whole car if you don't like it. Okay, I'll buy that. Y. I just like, I went to here's. And it's not a question of like, Whether it's fun or not, or whether the EV1 drives well or not, or whether you can build an EV under 2000 pounds.

[Matt Farah]

Like all of those are interesting questions.

[Zach Klapman]

That I think are solvable. But like, four years ago, if you went to the Quail, you saw a whole bunch of EV hypercars, and if you went to the Quail last year, they're all gone. And what's there instead is these boutique sort of resto modi, but with modern technology, you know, variants on what a gas version of your car could be like. I'm talking about Tuttle's thing, the sort of GT1 influence, which is a gas thing, or, you know, Singer and Gunther and all these people. I mean, even the what Bugatti is doing, it's this real like sort of shift away from the electric hypercar. So I just wonder about if the costs of development for a small company combined with the cost of making it swappable is going to result in sales. Maybe you know something about trends that I don't know. Do you know something about trends that I don't know? Is the market for the evidence hypercar actually doing this?

[Nikita Berdan]

I think so. What's an EV hypercar way today, Folks.

[Matt Farah]

We got to take one more break from the action because support today coming in hot from Upside. It's one of the smartest apps you can have on your phone in 2025, giving you the power to earn more on the stuff that you buy all the time. Whether you're filling up your tank, going out to eat, or shopping for groceries, the Upside app app lets you earn cash back on every single purchase. To get started, just download the free Upside app, use my promo code tire and get an extra 25 cents back for every gallon on your first tank of gas. Next, claim an offer for whatever you're buying on Upside, then pay as usual with a credit or debit card. Follow the steps in the app and get paid. There are over 100,000 gas stations, grocery stores and restaurants on the Upside app, ensuring that cash back is always just around the corner. You can earn an average of 8% on restaurant and grocery purchases. And the best part, you can even stack your upside cash back on top of your credit and debit card rewards. Upside users are earning hundreds of dollars a year. That's probably why they have a 4.8 star rating on the app store. Download the free Upside app today and use promo code tire to get an extra 25 cent back for every gallon on your first tank of gas. That's an extra 25 cents back for every gallon on your first Tank of Gas using Promo Code Tire. I have been talking about Delete Me for a long time. Matter of fact, I just got my latest Delete Me checkup email. Deleteme is a service that helps scrub your personal data off of data broker websites. Data broker websites are how you end up with spam flagrants, flagrantly fake text message scams, phishing impersonation, and frankly, junk mail and fake phone calls. Delete Me does all the hard work of wiping you and your family's personal information from these data broker websites, helping to reduce or eliminate this problem. They know your privacy is worth protecting, so you sign up, you provide Deleteme with exactly what information you want deleted and their experts take it from there. DeleteMe sends you regular personal personalized privacy reports showing what info they found, where they found it and what they removed. And Delete Me is not just a one time service. Delete Me is always working for you. Constantly monitoring and removing the personal information you don't want on the Internet. I am on the Internet all the time. You guys can find examples of me all over the place. And this kind of stuff is really important to me. So when I signed up, I didn't have high expectations. But Delete Me sent me a personalized report showing some thousands of listings on data broker websites with my old addresses, phone numbers, stuff related to my family, etc. They went to work deleting that and now every month I get a report saying here's what we found and here's what we've deleted. Here's some stuff. Maybe you have to take a little bit of action and click a few boxes to get it to delete, but it works. And ever since I have noticeably reduced the amount of spam and garbage coming into my phone, you can do it too. Take control of your data. Keep your private life private by signing up for Delete Me now at a special discount for our listeners. Get 20% off your delete me plan when you go to JoinDeleteMe.com Tire and then use promo code Tire at checkout. The only way to get 20% off is to go to JoinDeleteMe.com Tire and then enter code Tire at checkout. That's JoinDeleteMe.com Tire code Tire. And now back to the show.

[Nikita Berdan]

What's an EV Hypercar weigh today?

[Zach Klapman]

I mean, they're heavy. Batteries are heavy.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah.

[Nikita Berdan]

So I mean, I think the lightest now is the Evijo, which isn't even legal in the US but it's £4,000. The Avera is 5,700.

[Zach Klapman]

Is that how you pronounce it? Evija? I pronounce it Eviya. Do I do it wrong? I don't know.

[Matt Farah]

They haven't made it.

[Nikita Berdan]

I'm Canadian, I have an accent.

[Zach Klapman]

They haven't made it easy for us, certainly. Yeah, no, true. So, like, go back, let's. Why would you. How are you the only people who would be able to do this?

[Nikita Berdan]

Well, I think it's really sad because it's, you know, we come from the OEM space and we saw the batteries being developed. I mean, we hadn't worked on any sort of production programs that were combustion powered since 2012. The technology exists. There's a number of reasons why the OEMs won't do it. Part of it is legislation, part of of it is warranties. Part of it's a number of things, right? Like what led to that is one.

[Zach Klapman]

Of them that it's like dangerous in a crash or likely to catch fire or something. Like, I mean, I mean, it's one thing if the lifespan of something is shorter, right? Like you buy a racing engine, such as what I have in my Porsche, and the guy who builds the racing engine says, well, this engine will be good for 100,000 miles, street use, and then it needs to be rebuilt. And you go, well, okay, at 3,000 miles a year, that's 35 years. Like, great, fine. But Porsche would go, oh, no, this is not a. The engine must be 250,000 miles. Even if this car will never in its whole life see that. And so it could be one. Is it one of those situations or is this riskier than that?

[Nikita Berdan]

Well, I mean, I just think the right product hasn't been made. I mean, as simply as that, right?

[Zach Klapman]

You guys making batteries?

[Nikita Berdan]

We aren't developing batteries, but what we're doing is putting together an experience, right, that is. Is so different than anything that's ever existed, right? If you tell any car guy, 2,000 pounds, 600 horsepower, manual transmission, what's wrong with that, right?

[Christian James Hand]

His pants lift the table.

[Zach Klapman]

Of course, yes, in theory, I'm just like.

[Nikita Berdan]

So no one's built that.

[Christian James Hand]

I imagine there's OEM constraints to everything, because of course there is. And then there's technology out there that is either more experimental, can't be mass produced, whatever, or the cost is too high. But folks like you, you know, and your clients, they don't give a shit. So that's a great freedom.

[Ilya Berdan]

Of course it's cost. I think it's also like, you know, they have to put their purchase orders in so early. So it's like when you're developing an ev, you're buying your batteries, you know, three, four years before a car goes to production so that you have enough to actually make a factory.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay, so you're saying the stuff that maybe that you can get for this car we might see in five years.

[Ilya Berdan]

And we can use a lot more cutting edge stuff because were smaller, nimbler.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay.

[Nikita Berdan]

I think it's unlikely any OEM will use this technology for at least a decade. And I'll tell you why there's. In the us there's a warranty thing which is that your battery cannot Degrade More than 80% over 10 years.

[Zach Klapman]

More than 20%.

[Nikita Berdan]

Right.

[Zach Klapman]

You can't. Yeah.

[Nikita Berdan]

You can't go down 20% down over.

[Zach Klapman]

10 years, which like, you know, good consumer protection law if you ask me.

[Nikita Berdan]

I mean that combustion engine is seven years.

[Zach Klapman]

What, it can't degrade to 20%?

[Nikita Berdan]

Well, no, you only get seven year warranty on combustion.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, warranty, right.

[Nikita Berdan]

Sure, yeah, yeah, yeah. So there's a real imbalance there. And if you're a company that's making very profitable margins on old technology, why would you invest in something new that has really actually stringent warranties that may become an issue? It's a risk you wouldn't take. Right. So the only risk or people that would take this risk would be a startup, basically.

[Matt Farah]

Okay, all right, cool.

[Zach Klapman]

Look, I don't, I mean, I don't. We don't need to spend an hour with me fucking drilling you on this. I mean, look, I'll operate under the assumption that what you're talking about isn't completely made up. How about that? I was like, I'll just say that and like, I hope we don't find out I'm wrong about that later. But like, I don't think it's made up, but it's, it's the kind of thing where it's like, you know, you guys kind of coming out of nowhere and you're talking about a technology that fundamentally doesn't exist in cars right now. At least not ones you can buy.

[Ilya Berdan]

Right.

[Zach Klapman]

So. Okay, cool. I hope it's the first time I see it. Fine, sounds good. And I hope there's a market for it. I mean, I think a lightweight electric car is a good idea. I mean, to the degree that it's possible and maybe it'll make people go back to them. You know, I think it was crazy that there was this Everyone thought there was going to be this electric hypercar market. And it turned out that the people who bought. Who had enough money to buy the hypercar daily drive electric cars, they wanted some high revving, psycho death, you know, 911k revs to 11 kind of thing for the weekend. I mean, I guess if you can offer both. God bless.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah, yeah. No, I mean, it's. It's. Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Is the idea that the two cost roughly the same or would one be wildly more expensive than the other?

[Nikita Berdan]

No, they're. They're about the same. Yeah. Yeah. The base price is the same. So people get to choose and then, yeah, they can pay the extra fee to get the Thunderbolt package. So.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay.

[Christian James Hand]

Were there any, like, fun discoveries of benefits of being able to share the platform with two powertrains? Did you, like, you have to brace things differently or you get to slot that battery pack somewhere where there was already an empty space, or do you have to make accommodations for it?

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah, we had to make a bunch of accommodations. Yeah. So it was. It was actually a giant pain in the. Pain in the butt, I would say. Yeah. Do not recommend.

[Christian James Hand]

It's like you. It's like you, like, broke the wall to the levee and then the water starts filling up. You're like, now I'm gonna build a house. Now this seems like a challenge.

[Nikita Berdan]

Now we have a moat, right?

[Christian James Hand]

Yeah, right. Now we have built. Exactly. We have a moat. Now you did it the wrong way.

[Zach Klapman]

And I assume with the gas one, people will want a manual gearbox probably, right?

[Nikita Berdan]

We hope so.

[Zach Klapman]

I hope so.

[Ilya Berdan]

I hope so.

[Nikita Berdan]

Well, both. Yeah, we hope. Both as manual.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. Oh, the idea with the electric is that it's manual, right?

[Nikita Berdan]

Correct.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay. All right. That is. That has been done before. Electric paired with. There's guys with a couple Porsches that have. That seems to work. You know, it does seem to work. I don't think you have to rev match. I think it's just. You just put it in. You don't have to. You can just come to a stop. That's convenient. That's kind of nice.

[Christian James Hand]

I haven't tried it. Have you ever tried one? No.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, I tried one. It's like kind of what you think, but also you pretty much can't stall it. I mean, you can't. Not pretty much. You can't.

[Nikita Berdan]

Right?

[Zach Klapman]

You literally can't because. And then you can. You don't need to use the clutch in the last one I used after first gear. So.

[Matt Farah]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay.

[Christian James Hand]

It's kind of fun. It's like Race car.

[Zach Klapman]

It was sort of fun in its own way. I don't think it was like better than driving stick in a gas car, but like it was okay. Also, like the, the paddle shift way is pretty cool because, I mean, maybe, I don't know, maybe, maybe if someone else isn't going to do it, if Porsche is not going to do it themselves, maybe you guys can do it. The EV emulator thing where you can make it drive like anything. You could just somehow steal the fucking metrics from Forza or something.

[Nikita Berdan]

Right?

[Zach Klapman]

All right, so what else do we need to know about it? We've got two powertrains that you can theoretically swap £2,000 carbon tub. What are the other important, interesting things we need to know about this car?

[Nikita Berdan]

Geez, I don't know.

[Ilya Berdan]

I mean, aerodynamics.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, yeah. Aero.

[Christian James Hand]

Go for it.

[Ilya Berdan]

Sure, it's got aerodynamics, but it doesn't.

[Zach Klapman]

Have a big wing.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah, no. So I think early on when we started, like the early packaging on this thing, the tub, suspension, engine layout, how the occupants sit, it all drives aero. So again, started with the occupant. The occupant sits perfectly straight in the car. It's not tilted 7 degrees like a Valkyrie and like rotate in this and that, twist it in there. It's a very neutral, straightforward seating position. Steering wheel pedals fully in line. Nothing's crooked, nothing's weird. And then from there, basically work through the aero philosophy. The front obviously has a pretty aggressive kind of big splitter, big pass throughs on, on the sides.

[Zach Klapman]

Zach, can you click back?

[Ilya Berdan]

I can talk about the back.

[Zach Klapman]

He was managing things. No, he was just managing other things.

[Nikita Berdan]

There might be an underbody shot on the Instagram. Scroll down a little bit.

[Zach Klapman]

So, yeah, lower half of the car between the wheels, to me seems like it's doing a lot of work.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yes.

[Zach Klapman]

And it also most resembles a Valkyrie in that way where it's that sort of. You've draped a bit of a body over like a Formula one type of car.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah, it's very much, much more elegant up top for sure. Very clean, very simple. It's a ground effects car, but it's been designed to be very neutral, progressive. Ride height is pretty high, so it doesn't really. It's not gonna be super snappy for.

[Nikita Berdan]

A porpoise like a Formula one car, like, you know, with really low ride height.

[Ilya Berdan]

So ride height's about 105 millimeters.

[Zach Klapman]

It's designed to be a road car.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yes.

[Zach Klapman]

Right. It's not designed to be a track car. So you Know, it's not. You need a certain amount of aero and numbers and whatever to brag about, but at the end of the day, you actually kind of want it to like be fun and move around a.

[Nikita Berdan]

Little when you go car.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. You don't want it to pull 1.9 GS through corners. You want it to like be able to slide a little and not be like scary.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah. I think the, the most interesting thing about the aero philosophy was we didn't want to give up the exposed tires, which is, you know, every aerodynamicist nightmare. It's just those exposed rear tires, exposed front tires. Like, what are you guys doing? Can we put covers? Can we do this, this? And we, we honestly, we fought back and we're like, we need to figure out a clever way of doing this, you know. And so the front is basically managed through. Yeah, kind of. You can see it here, those, those side blades just above the splitter there. It's basically an air curtain. You know, very similar, probably more aggressive than an air curtain, but. And then on the back, what we do is we basically generate like a low, low speed zone essentially down the whole lower body side. And when you have low speed air, it's really hard to move it. So it becomes basically like, I don't know if you know about like pickup trucks on the back. Yeah, you just get this kind of bubble that generates. Right. And all the high speed air kind of goes to the outside. And so, yeah, our rear tires basically don't get hit with direct high speed air.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, so they're in the bubble.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah, essentially.

[Nikita Berdan]

Okay.

[Ilya Berdan]

So worked a lot on that. And it actually gets pretty good CD numbers and drag numbers and downforce figures.

[Nikita Berdan]

The CD is particularly important for the EV because. Yeah, aeroplay for sure. A big thing in range. So.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I've just recently been learning on electric motorcycles because let me tell you, those numbers range are not with Matt Farah riding.

[Nikita Berdan]

Okay.

[Zach Klapman]

That means a recalc.

[Christian James Hand]

Gotta say, the underside is gorgeous. And it'll only be seen if someone puts it on a lift or if they flip it. They'll go, wow, this is still really good looking.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, no, I mean, it looks very prototype race car, you know. And so what are you doing outside of the tub at the front and the rear in terms of like suspension and stuff like that?

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah, so I mean, double A arm at the front, double A arm at the rear.

[Zach Klapman]

Zach, can we look at the rear suspension? Maybe that overhead shot there? Can you see rear suspension? Yeah, we can see some cantilevered shocks.

[Nikita Berdan]

Exactly. Yeah. So, I mean, you know, kind of reminiscent of what we did on the first car. At the back, we work with Joe Scarbo on all the suspension kinematics and everything. So. Yeah, tubular rear. This is an older image, but at the front, actually, our whole subframe is now CNC aluminum. So no, no more of these tubular sections. But we are keeping tubular a arms because that's just the lightest, strongest, easiest way to modify stuff, especially when we're going through testing. Yeah. Ohms, shock absorbers or coilovers, I guess. And they're actually the same front and back, but different valving. So that's one way we can. Yeah.

[Christian James Hand]

Do you have a prototype tub like this yet that you guys. They're one built that you can tootle around in.

[Nikita Berdan]

This is going to be done in the fall. Like what you see in that image. Gotcha. So the first tub is being built currently in North Carolina with Crawford.

[Christian James Hand]

Cool.

[Nikita Berdan]

So that's in progress now. So. Yeah, it's coming soon.

[Christian James Hand]

I hope you guys get a. Like rent a Runway and just go drive around with the open tub. It would just be so sick.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Ilya Berdan]

Public road.

[Zach Klapman]

This would be like. Yeah, it would be like just a little go kart with 600 horsepower, but with more headroom. Yeah. Well, have you heard this engine run with this insane single collector exhaust on it? Six to one exhaust.

[Nikita Berdan]

Haven't heard this one. No, no, I've heard. Yeah. The first powertrain that's gonna go into it, which is the GT4. Mr. But it had. Yeah, just the race exhaust on it. This should sound. This should sound cool.

[Zach Klapman]

Yes. It's just a giant. Is that. Does that divider go the whole way or is it really six into one?

[Nikita Berdan]

It's six into one.

[Zach Klapman]

It's six into one. Yeah. That's just.

[Christian James Hand]

The divider is a really nice aesthetic choice though. That looks good.

[Zach Klapman]

Does that do anything? The divider in the center of the exhaust tape, or does it just look nice?

[Nikita Berdan]

It was inspired. I was working for a space company like a few years ago, and they were doing scramjet engines. And. Yeah. So it's pulled that detail from there.

[Zach Klapman]

That's a nice one. It's like shout out to our boy, Sasha Slipanov. His exhaust is inspired by space shuttle. The three space shuttle engines. And actually quite successful at that. Yeah, man, this thing looks awesome from above. I have heard that to have windshields made for cars like this is like staggeringly expensive. Is that accurate?

[Nikita Berdan]

Correct.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

What does it cost to get a windshield for something?

[Nikita Berdan]

So actually we use an off the shelf windshield.

[Matt Farah]

Oh, really?

[Nikita Berdan]

I'm not going to say who, but we do use an off the shelf windshield.

[Zach Klapman]

Really? Can you look at it again? Can you. Will you blink twice if I guess it right?

[Nikita Berdan]

I will neither confirm nor deny.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, man. Someone in the comments will get this. Now that we know this is gonna involve some sleuthing, can I get like a 45 degree angle maybe? Like.

[Ilya Berdan]

But to answer your question, initially when we started, our windshield was fully custom and it was about, I think it.

[Nikita Berdan]

Was like, what, 35, $35,000 with a 50% failure rate.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah. Wow.

[Zach Klapman]

Wait, and you have to pay for all of them? Oh, no way. That's so shitty.

[Nikita Berdan]

And for an extra 10 grand, it could be Gorilla Glass.

[Zach Klapman]

Those have 100% failure rate. Oh, who is this windshield? This is gonna take some work. We have to stare at this for a little while.

[Christian James Hand]

Is it a publicly available car?

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah. So that was the intent is like, you know, if people are using these and they do crack a windshield, we're not gonna wait too much to get another windshield or something. Right? So it's something you can get around the world and.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Doesn't mean it's cheap. It just means exists, you know, But. All right, we're gonna have to stare at that one. Some commenter is gonna have this in five seconds. If someone on the live chat doesn't, like, already have it, I'll be pretty disappointed. I don't want to put you guys in an awkward spot in a public forum, but does Porsche get mad when you do stuff like this? And, I mean, maybe not. I actually think Porsche probably liked your first bit of a concept. I bet they thought that was cool. But now you're selling a car that looks like it could have been potentially been something that they were selling, and do they get mad at you?

[Nikita Berdan]

I wouldn't know.

[Zach Klapman]

I guess we'll find out pretty soon.

[Nikita Berdan]

I mean, you're right. I mean, we had a conversation with them about the original car. You know, I think they like the idea. We know the higher ups like what we're doing. There's no Porsche in it, so.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, yeah. So whatever. Okay. That's a fair. I mean, that's a fair answer. There's no Porsche in it and there's no Porsche badge on it. And so I think if you change.

[Nikita Berdan]

The headlights, like, would it even be associated, you think?

[Zach Klapman]

I think that's probably accurate. If you change the headlights, it really wouldn't look much like a Porsche at all. And those are. I don't. Those aren't Porsche headlights. Are they? I don't think they are. They just happen to be round.

[Nikita Berdan]

I mean, but they're Mini Cooper. No, I'm just kidding.

[Zach Klapman]

Remember when. Remember when Morgan. My favorite repurposed headlights of all time, they flipped and inverted the mini headlights. Google Morgan Arrow 8 and. And look at the headlights. You'll never unsee that shit. Yeah, look at that. These are. Were they mini or they Volkswagen Beetle? They're mini.

[Ilya Berdan]

I think they're mini.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, they're mini. Did I just say Beetle before? I think they are. They're mini. Headlights flipped upside down and inverted, which is very fun and also very silly and you can't see it, but fuck me, do I want a Morgan Arrow super sports in my life.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah, the new three wheeler is great too.

[Zach Klapman]

The new three was okay. And the new plus four just arrived. We manage Morgan's press fleet at wccs and so we've got the new plus four, which is all aluminum, no more wood at all.

[Nikita Berdan]

Is that the Pininfarina Speedster or which one's the speedster thing? That thing's cool. The white one they unveiled Morgan, wasn't it? Those are just a concept.

[Zach Klapman]

Morgan pin. Can you look up a Morgan Pinfarina concept?

[Nikita Berdan]

Was it? Yeah, that thing.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, yeah. I mean, that's a winner.

[Nikita Berdan]

That's cool.

[Zach Klapman]

I like it. But you know, I liked Morgan's rally car thing. They did the plus four rally car was kick ass. I bet that thing wouldn't survive three days in the dirt, but God damn, did it look cool.

[Nikita Berdan]

It'd be like our Alpha.

[Zach Klapman]

Made me feel like Indiana Jones. If you guys are all like oil stain lab. That sounds familiar. They jumped their Alpha GTV on Hoonigan.

[Christian James Hand]

That's what you built. Two Alphas, right? One you jumped in and it water ballooned all of its fluids all over the ground. The other one was like the Authority one.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, the 80. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That one didn't. You didn't bend in half. I would roll this Morgan around Lake Como, which is where this photo was taken. The driving around Lake Como is not very good.

[Christian James Hand]

Of course not.

[Zach Klapman]

The boating is what it's about. If you guys ever designed a boat, would you do a boat?

[Nikita Berdan]

That'd be cool.

[Zach Klapman]

Cool. Yeah. I think you should. If you took the Half 11 concept to vintage boating, I bet that would be cool as. And you could find some other angel investor that's like, yo, it's way easier to build a boat than it is to build a car.

[Nikita Berdan]

Jet turbine, catamaran.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, whatever. Our. My Homie Philip has a boat that's like. Has like. It's like, from, like the 30s or something and has, like 4v16 Detroit Diesel, you know, and it's called, like, Tomahawk or something. And it, you know, it did, like, 70 knots in the 60s, and everyone's like, face flew off. It's a crazy thing. Yeah. This. Wait. All right, so this Morgan, what have they done with these headlights, though?

[Ilya Berdan]

I think that's a concept, so it's probably just unique, just some weird shit.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah, it looks like a Tuva proof projector, like an LED projector and then just a round surround.

[Zach Klapman]

Right. I do kind of dig the pairing of the flat face wheels and the full chrome surround on the bottom. I don't know why that. That has a. That really appeals to me.

[Nikita Berdan]

When I was a gm, we were trying so hard to put that back on Cadillac.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay, guys, guess what? The conversations happening in Cadillac boardrooms are exactly what you think they are. Someone's gonna call and go, listen, I need a black wing, the full chrome. And someone's gonna be like, yes, boss, I told you. They're all coming now.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yes.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, man. That's pretty cool, actually. Where were we? Speedster windshields. Are we for them?

[Nikita Berdan]

I don't like it in the Morgan three wheeler when I drove it because it's like a plexi and it's so scratched and you can't see anything. Not great, but that looks like it's almost below.

[Zach Klapman]

I liked it in the. I liked it in the McLaren Alva because I felt like I was flying. There's just nothing.

[Ilya Berdan]

Right?

[Nikita Berdan]

There's nothing.

[Zach Klapman]

Insanity.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, that's on the old three wheeler. I think it was better.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Glass on the new one. It's like Lexan or something.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah, that's the new one.

[Zach Klapman]

The new one is, like, objectively better, but also, like, worse because it's better.

[Nikita Berdan]

Right.

[Zach Klapman]

The Morgan three wheeler is supposed to be, like, halfway to being a piece of junk, but it's supposed to sound like a fucking spitfire. Right?

[Nikita Berdan]

And your expectations are so much lower when it looks like this.

[Christian James Hand]

Shook apart. You went, sure. Yeah, it makes sense.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, my. 20 minutes driving one of these, though, I was Baron von fucking something, you know what I mean? That was unbelievable. Your left arm, like, doesn't fit in the vehicle. But you're. But you're. Would you guys do a Speedster of the HF11?

[Nikita Berdan]

We can. Yeah. I mean, the tub's been designed to accommodate, basically, rollovers and everything without windshield, without the A pillars, so without the roof? Yeah, without the roof. So we can just pull that. We'd have to redesign the door hinge system because you'd eliminate the upper pivot.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, but. Yeah, but it can be done. Yeah, just reverse engineer a McLaren.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah, or you can make them jump in like the original car.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, dude, fix doors, just. Hell, yeah. No doors. Like a can am.

[Ilya Berdan]

Like a little baby door.

[Zach Klapman]

You know, the little flimsy. Yeah, that's. No, I like the. You have to just jump in this thing. You gotta like. I think you have to make people like. It has to be like a little uncomfortable. Like, you know, they need some like. It's like a. It's the opposite of Alex Roy. I mean, I'm sure this is. He didn't remotely make this up, but my friend, Alex Roy, it's the opposite of virtue. Signaling is vice signaling. And so it's like when you drive like a vintage car, it's like, well, you wouldn't believe what it cost. Like, you wouldn't believe what I have to deal with to have this special experience. That's like a vice signal. And so like. Yeah, no doors. So people can be like, it doesn't even have doors.

[Matt Farah]

You're.

[Zach Klapman]

You're pagan. He's got doors. Are you even like a car guy?

[Matt Farah]

Like, dude, that's it.

[Nikita Berdan]

We gotta do it now.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, now you have to do the Speedster. No windshield, no doors.

[Nikita Berdan]

Okay.

[Zach Klapman]

It's. It's. I think it's very pretty. The orange car, or. It's orange today, certainly very pretty. So what are. Give me the next steps between. You're gonna have that sort of running mule in the fall, and you've got this one to one model, basically roller. So what do. When do those two things start to become one thing?

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah, I mean, I think towards the end of the year. That's when you sort of get a more of an aesthetic driving car. We're gonna develop this the same way we did with the original car, where we were driving it with no bodywork, around racetracks and, you know. Yeah. Having a good time.

[Zach Klapman]

I would like to come try it.

[Nikita Berdan]

Sure.

[Zach Klapman]

I'm happy. No body work doesn't bother me at all.

[Nikita Berdan]

There'll be a windscreen to start, but no doors.

[Zach Klapman]

It's okay.

[Nikita Berdan]

You can touch the pavement. You can do that. But yeah, no, I mean, I think for us we just need to validate a lot of the suspension, steering, braking system, make sure that's good. And it's obviously a lot less risky without damaging bodywork. If something does happen, then basically Bodywork goes on. You need to validate some suspension travel. Obviously, it's been done digitally, but tires do deform at speed, and there's all this stuff that you need to slowly work your way through to make sure it's safe. And then, yeah, by the end of the year, fully developed interior next year.

[Zach Klapman]

I saw the. Are there renderings of the interior on here? I saw them on your thing. Yeah.

[Nikita Berdan]

If you click Asylum, that's what we call it.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, that's good for SEO.

[Nikita Berdan]

And then the little plus sign, the.

[Zach Klapman]

Interior, I think, is it gives me a very modernized sort of Porsche 917 vibe, which. With this sort of gauge, cluster of five pods. It's beautiful. And some toggle switches next to the steering wheel. I do see the milled wood on top of that shift knob there. I like the center key right above the console there. Lots of knobs and switches. I see no screens.

[Christian James Hand]

Door is so deep, you can tuck a helmet into it.

[Zach Klapman]

That's a Lancio Stratos move right there. Correct. I like that very much. Although I seriously question if that is possible in reality.

[Nikita Berdan]

It is possible. Seriously, it is possible. We scanned the biggest helmet we could find to package protect.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay, well, if you can fit a helmet, you can fit a whole helmet.

[Ilya Berdan]

So I was going to find a bigger helmet.

[Zach Klapman]

Is that the only storage in the car? In the doors?

[Nikita Berdan]

So, yeah, if you don't put a helmet in there, obviously you can put a duffel bag. We had one client ask for a cup holder, so we were like. We could do, like, a cool gyroscopic one. So when you open the door, it doesn't spill the drink.

[Zach Klapman]

That is cool.

[Matt Farah]

But I think with this, I mean.

[Zach Klapman]

It'S an open pocket, so anything you put in there is gonna fall out when you open. So do you have, like, a mesh covering you can put on there to hold the stuff?

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah, there could be a strapper. You know, there's different. Basically, that inner pocket can be highly, highly customized with patterns or storage.

[Zach Klapman]

What your supercar was, that has vertical doors and door pockets. And I kept putting shit in there and opening the doors, they didn't fall out. And I went, who decided. Who designed the thing where this could just happen all the time? It's crazy. It drops your phone. It's like a thousand dollars.

[Ilya Berdan]

I mean, as our doors open, it'll just keep falling into the bucket.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, it'll go.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

So it goes that.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah, because of butterflies.

[Zach Klapman]

It's butterflies. Oh, all right. Yeah. So it goes that way. Okay, cool.

[Nikita Berdan]

And then We've also cleared out recently, actually. We moved a lot of stuff from the front hood area underneath the dashboard. So now we have. You could put a carry on in the front.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, that's cool. I liked. I saw some knurled knobs. Knurling is good. And I really like that the gauge pod sits on that. Those sort of stanchions off the deck.

[Christian James Hand]

Yeah, that's cool.

[Zach Klapman]

It gives you a nice bit of sort of air there, right?

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah. Yeah. And actually, the dashboard's really pushed away from you, so it's gonna be really unique. And also gives you a bit more room, Sort of feel like a roomy feeling in there by kind of pushing those things away from you.

[Christian James Hand]

How many, if any, of these ideas have been in your heads, either of you, since you were, like, kids or students? I mean, is this stuff that's, like. That's just been in the back of your head or. And you couldn't do it in ODM because of the cost, or did you think it all up by after looking at the market and seeing, you know, what do we wish was. It was around.

[Nikita Berdan]

That's a tough question. I mean, I don't think anything comes, really from kids, But, I mean, we've been doing this project, what the original half 11 started with. 20. 2019, something like that. So we've had a lot of ideas in those six years. But, I mean, for the gauge cluster, the original idea on the car was we didn't know where to position it. So we had four rods with heims that were adjustable so that we could lower it, raise it, tilt it. Because we just had no idea ergonomically what we wanted to do on that car. And so that that feature carried over. But now it's not adjustable. It's just. It's set.

[Zach Klapman]

You know, it would actually be sort of cool not to give you guys more challenges if you could, like, just spin the rods. And it would, you know, tilt a little bit to maybe adjust for height. Not that you need more work, but, like, that would be a way to, like, carry on the functionality of that in a way that could make a difference.

[Nikita Berdan]

The original half 11, it just.

[Zach Klapman]

It wobbled so much.

[Nikita Berdan]

We were just like, we gotta fix this thing.

[Zach Klapman]

Sure. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Christian James Hand]

Unless you're using actual end links or something.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, right. Or, like, hydraulic.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah. But, you know, I think, yeah, we get inspired from the past. I mean. Yeah, like, you picked up on the Stratos. Like, we love stratos. And it's like, yeah, wouldn't. Wouldn't that be cool to do? It's not a mistake.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, no, yeah. That is a good detail. Yeah. Are there other little details from, like, inspired by other cars? Oh, that's a really good look at the back of that gauge pod with the stanchions that it's sitting on. It's really. It's a few. A few inches of clearance off the dash. Right.

[Ilya Berdan]

Completely free floating.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. Yeah, that's a really cool detail. And the seats are fixed, I assume the pedals slide.

[Nikita Berdan]

Seats are not fixed. They're on a slider. Yeah, they're on a slider.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, they're not actually touching, are they? I thought for a second they were touching, so, yeah.

[Nikita Berdan]

Seat slide, tilt, telescope, steering column pedals are four point or four location.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay.

[Nikita Berdan]

So you can set them in four locations, but they're fixed once they're set. So, yeah, from a comfort point of view, it should be decent.

[Zach Klapman]

And what is that, like, sort of tumbler stalk coming off the. I mean, is it the wiper stalk? Is that. Yeah. What is that stalk?

[Christian James Hand]

It's a grab handle for when you're terrified.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, wait, no, that's the back of the button panel.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah. Correct.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, okay.

[Christian James Hand]

Oh, the button panel.

[Zach Klapman]

The button panel floats. Too cool.

[Christian James Hand]

This is fucking cool.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, the interior is kind of where they get me.

[Christian James Hand]

Not bad, guys. Not bad.

[Zach Klapman]

There is very nice. And that steering wheel on that white one that looks like a. That. That looks very squishy, like the Wilson headband I wear to Pilates on Saturdays.

[Nikita Berdan]

So that we should do an homage to that.

[Zach Klapman]

Put some Wilson and some striping on it. That would be sick. Yo, nobody does a terry cloth interior anymore. Let's go.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yes.

[Zach Klapman]

I could have done it on the Manx. That would have been.

[Matt Farah]

Been something terry cloth.

[Zach Klapman]

Maybe I can get a terry cloth cover made. That would be pretty cool.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah.

[Christian James Hand]

I think terry cloth would probably endure the sun not quite as well as your automotive. Sick. It looks good.

[Zach Klapman]

No, I have no regrets. I can't wait to be driving that motherfucker. I got to see if they started it today. They were supposed to start the fucking thing today for the first time. All right. Are there any bits in this car that are. Were cribbed from other cars that we should.

[Nikita Berdan]

Of course, yeah. Okay.

[Zach Klapman]

Is it a challenge to find them? No, not ones that we see or touch, though. Right.

[Nikita Berdan]

So the air vents.

[Zach Klapman]

The air vents.

[Nikita Berdan]

That's something that you're gonna see, you're gonna touch. But for a small company to engineer? Impossible.

[Zach Klapman]

You took Aston. How many years did it take Aston? Martin. To use to make their own air vents. All right, so just tell me. Give it to me straight. What are they out of?

[Nikita Berdan]

I'm not telling you.

[Zach Klapman]

Fuck you tell me.

[Nikita Berdan]

No, that's like a fun Internet game.

[Zach Klapman]

Find Discover. That's your assignment audience. Windshield and air vents. Let's go. The air vents to me look like Honda Civic.

[Nikita Berdan]

They're not.

[Zach Klapman]

They're not. Okay. They do look like. Right. The new Civic SI vents were very nice.

[Christian James Hand]

Well, like the brushing work. But very narrow, which I think is very specific.

[Nikita Berdan]

Our favorite was the Volvo. Some of the Volvo ones, but they just wouldn't fit.

[Zach Klapman]

That was Aston Martin's favorite too.

[Ilya Berdan]

I will say that the opening shape and all. That is not carryover.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh.

[Nikita Berdan]

It's just the actual mechanism behind that.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, okay, cool.

[Ilya Berdan]

So it's the little knob thing and how it rotates and slides. That's carryover.

[Nikita Berdan]

The hazard button. Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

We can't possibly be expecting to make a triangle.

[Nikita Berdan]

Just the turn signal switch. Right. The internal of the turn sign.

[Zach Klapman]

Sure.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. Okay.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Well, I mean if you don't see much, someone will tell us what that windshield is. But other than that, I don't. It's all. It's all.

[Nikita Berdan]

And the steering column, that's not bespoke.

[Christian James Hand]

But it seems like the goal is like everything you touch, everything someone touches. You guys have made.

[Nikita Berdan]

That's. Yeah. I mean, genuinely. You know, I think a lot of companies will, you know, take. Even for keys or whatever. Right? They'll take a key like machine something.

[Zach Klapman]

Bugatti. You're talking about Bugatti.

[Nikita Berdan]

It's not great.

[Zach Klapman]

Volkswagen Golf key. And put a new cover on it.

[Nikita Berdan]

So we try and do better than. Than that.

[Zach Klapman]

Man. I was just bro. And the car was fabulous and I get it. But I reviewed the Pagani Utopia for road and track and inside that motherfucking kilogram key, they give you like a kilogram of pewter or whatever the fuck that is. To distract from the fact that if you open is a Mercedes fob about 12 years ago inside of. Yes. It's really. It's so funny.

[Nikita Berdan]

One other thing.

[Ilya Berdan]

The door mirrors. The mechanism of that is carryable.

[Zach Klapman]

The motor.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah, the motor. And they're heated as well. Very fancy.

[Zach Klapman]

Look, I mean, sometimes you just gotta call Bosch. Like, what are you gonna do? Like, everybody does it. Like, no shame in that game. Sometimes we need fuel filters.

[Nikita Berdan]

We use Bosch's motorsport windshield wiper motor. Yes. Now we're talking high speed adjustable. Ready for Lamar.

[Zach Klapman]

Wow. That's a. That's a thing I didn't know I could call Bosch for.

[Nikita Berdan]

It's very expensive.

[Zach Klapman]

I've never. But is there, like a. Is there, like, an online catalog of their racing you can just buy?

[Matt Farah]

Really?

[Zach Klapman]

Yo, send me that link. I want to see what kind of stupid I could buy for my regular car. People are like, yo, I got. I got a tune. I got 80 horsepower. Like, yo, you should see my windshield wiper. I have. I can. I can. I can fling eggs 100 yards just by fucking cleaning my windshield.

[Nikita Berdan]

There's one company that makes wipers for, like, the 24 hour of Nurburgring, and it's $9,000 just for the wiper motor.

[Zach Klapman]

Whoa.

[Nikita Berdan]

I'm sure it's amazing.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. Sickest wiper motor ever.

[Nikita Berdan]

We didn't use that. We used the Bosch one.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, yeah. Theirs is probably okay, too. Yeah. But they also sell that one in, like, an Aston Martin Valkyrie package, and it's, like, $35,000 sick. All right, well, this is awesome. Do we have some questions from the people? All right, before we get to that, remember, Zach and I and our buddy Christian James Hand are coming to Houston and Dallas July 24th 25th. Smoking Tire Live. Get your tickets in our Instagram bio or in the show notes of this podcast. Dallas is going to sell out for sure. Houston's on its way, but come see me and Zach have a couple beers, let us roast your car, and it's gonna be a good time out at the Shop Club in Dallas and Houston. And, of course, if you want to ask us questions for the show, get the show live. Get the show before everybody else. Have an ad, free listening experience, exclusive access to collabs and new merch before anybody else. Patreon.com oh, plus extra podcasts. I forgot about that. Patreon.com the Smoking Tire podcast. The best website in the world. It lets you take care of your boys over here without an oligarch deciding if you find us or not. That's what I'm talking about. Let's go to the people. Zach, help me out here. There we go. Oh, okay. Our fans have some. Our patrons have some pretty good usernames. Audemars, Piaget is Audi, Morris, and Peugeot. I'll give it to you. Okay. Says, since oil stain has a theme of craziness, are there customer requests that you would deny to preserve the quality of the car?

[Matt Farah]

Cars.

[Zach Klapman]

Any color you won't paint a car. Anything you won't do to a car.

[Nikita Berdan]

There's always a price, right?

[Zach Klapman]

I mean, look, I don't know. Some People would outright say no other people. There is always a price.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah, we've had some pretty interesting ones already. I feel like I can't reveal the craziest one, but. Yeah, like a texture all over the car. Exterior, exterior texture.

[Zach Klapman]

It's velvet, isn't it? They wanted, they wanted velvet. It was.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah. It was something where we genuinely had to think about like how would we did Ralph Lauren.

[Christian James Hand]

Yeah, yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

King Ranch Rawhide. It's gonna be the oil stain rodeo.

[Matt Farah]

Remember when they did that roof, did that.

[Zach Klapman]

Remember the roof rodeo? I swore that was for Ralph Lauren. But Alois. Alois was like, I swear it was not for Ralph.

[Christian James Hand]

Ali said that's his favorite one.

[Zach Klapman]

I was like, I mean it's not, not my favorite. It's not the. There's but like it has leather on the outside. That's crazy. Chris from Colorado. What process during development was the most hurdle to cross?

[Nikita Berdan]

Oh, that is so easy. I mean the, the carbon tub. Anything involved with the carbon tub. He's put what, 8 million cars on the road through programs and stuff, but no carbon tubs. Carbon tubs are really unique in that everything needs to be defined before you go to production. So even your door shock, you need to know the stroke and where it mounts because you can't really bond stuff. You can't weld stuff. You can't do anything.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, once it's made, it's made.

[Nikita Berdan]

That's it exactly.

[Zach Klapman]

If something doesn't fit, you have to go make another one.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah, I mean that was two and a half years. And then the hardest part on the tub is like the front wheel area. Because we have extremely wide tires. What are they?

[Ilya Berdan]

275.

[Nikita Berdan]

275 on the front. And you've got to get them to spin, not hit the occupants legs. You've got the crash structures, you've got the aero pass throughs, you've got the suspension kinematics. That area was probably eight months of just, just rebuilding, rebuilding, moving, rebuilding. Just nightmare.

[Zach Klapman]

I can't argue with the aesthetic of the tires. It seems to me that 275 fronts is a lot of front tire for a 2,000 pound car. It probably would make do just fine with like 235 fronts. Wouldn't look as cool, but it would probably work, right?

[Nikita Berdan]

Well, you'd get a. Yeah, I mean, I mean you'd get a. You know, I think modern cars are moving towards a more 50, 50 split. I think you can do some interesting things with the kinematics. So we always struggle with warming up the tires. Even on our old car, because it's light. It's not like an EV that weighs, you know, 5,000 pounds.

[Zach Klapman]

But who did we just talk to that had to get. Who are we talking to that had to get new tire? Oh, Gordon Murray. He wasn't talking about. No. Who are we talking about that had to have different tire compounds made because the car was so light that regular tires were designed for whatever weight, and it was so much below it that they couldn't get heat in the tires. I feel like that was Gordon Murray, but I don't know. But is that what you're talking about? It's too light to get heat in the tires?

[Nikita Berdan]

Exactly. Yeah, exactly. And so. But we also wanted a really different driving experience. Right. And so, you know, I think the Gordon Murray, I mean, in many ways is kind of a spiritual sort of similar vehicle.

[Zach Klapman]

Gordon would like it.

[Nikita Berdan]

Exactly.

[Zach Klapman]

That's his cutoff.

[Nikita Berdan]

But they. They use much narrower tires on T50 front and back than we do. And, you know, we're not gonna, like, go do compete the same. Like, you can't.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, Gordon Murray.

[Nikita Berdan]

Gordon Murray. You just put your hands on, like.

[Zach Klapman]

Ah. You win, Gordon. No, no.

[Christian James Hand]

Welcome, gentlemen.

[Zach Klapman]

Well, you just said the boat. The hard, hardest part was that front wheel area. And I'm just curious if it really does need that tire, if that tire is an aesthetic choice, which is fine, or if there's maybe something I don't know, and that car really needs more tire than I think it needs for £2,000.

[Nikita Berdan]

We like mechanical grip. Right.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah, there's that. There's also the track package that has the crazy slicks. Oh, those are a lot wider than this, actually.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, good. I was gonna say this actually isn't enough tire.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Anymore.

[Ilya Berdan]

This is. Yeah. The. The baby version.

[Christian James Hand]

Okay.

[Nikita Berdan]

What's the track on the back? Or the track version has, what, three? It's like 95.

[Ilya Berdan]

It's.

[Nikita Berdan]

It's a group. It's a group C395.

[Zach Klapman]

That's a tire that exists. I've never seen.

[Ilya Berdan]

It's a slick. It's a slick.

[Zach Klapman]

Oh, so it's like what would be on a 962 or something like a Saber C9?

[Ilya Berdan]

Something like that.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. Cool. Yeah, we need that.

[Ilya Berdan]

And so, yeah, I think another important thing is, like, the car is really designed. The tub, the strength of it. It's so overbuilt for the base car, because there's obviously, later on, you're gonna do a track pack. Okay.

[Zach Klapman]

Chelsea Debo Fidees says how many clients have Asked for other motors, if any. And what have they asked for?

[Nikita Berdan]

I mean, so far, not really a ton of choices.

[Zach Klapman]

I mean, you're offering.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah, yeah. I think people are fairly happy with that. Of course, there's the occasional request for, like, a V8. There's obviously not. Not necessarily for this car, but, you know, there's talks of a flat 12, let's say, so.

[Zach Klapman]

Okay. Yes, that makes total sense. And you should get one. Yeah. I think too loud for Laguna means well, but might have missed the assignment here for Matt's Katz. For everybody. What is the single biggest limiting factor to road car performance at this time? I often hear tires. Dude, the road. Every medium sports car is so fast. The road is the performance. The world is the limiting factor.

[Christian James Hand]

Right. Like, what performance are we continuing to seek? They're very fast. They handle amazing. They have crazy grip. Everything stops really well. I mean, it'd be nice if cars were lighter, but in terms of, like, outright speed and performance, I'm pretty sure it worked good.

[Zach Klapman]

If you're. Yeah, if you're talking about driving a road car on the track, then, sure, that would be the limit.

[Christian James Hand]

But then you throw aero into it, and then there's the limit goes up.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. And slicks and whatever. But. Yeah, I mean.

[Christian James Hand]

Yeah, that seems like.

[Zach Klapman]

Dude, the car all. Dude, every car is way too fast, fast for the road. Every.

[Christian James Hand]

What's keeping us from going fast? Really fast, though.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, there is. Absolutely.

[Christian James Hand]

That's what's keeping us.

[Zach Klapman]

My own desire to not die is the only thing that keeps me from going faster up Angeles Crest. Because if I go any faster, I probably would.

[Nikita Berdan]

People are way too fast up there.

[Zach Klapman]

It's not that they're fast. It's that they cross the double yellow. Like.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yes.

[Zach Klapman]

Going fast isn't the problem. It's going on the wrong side of the road around blind corners, and people do it all the time. And that's how you die or kill somebody.

[Christian James Hand]

I'm going up there tomorrow in the morning, and I'm like, I'm genuinely nervous now about someone else fucking up. If someone crashes into me and we don't die, I'm gonna beat the shit out of.

[Nikita Berdan]

Throw them off the cliff.

[Zach Klapman]

Do you have to take your car?

[Christian James Hand]

I want to. Yeah. It's like, I want to take it and show off the interior and stuff.

[Zach Klapman]

You have so many press cars right now.

[Christian James Hand]

Yeah, but I have to choose between my car and Mazda 3.

[Zach Klapman]

No, no. We also have the M5 touring outside.

[Christian James Hand]

Oh, that's ours.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah. And we also have the flat six motorsports. 715 horsepower, Carrera T, manual transmission right there. All right, you can take any of them. I don't care. Matter of fact, I do care. I'm taking the M5 to my doctor's appointment and you can take the Porsche up the hill.

[Christian James Hand]

All right, I'll do that. I'll show my seats until next week.

[Zach Klapman]

I thought you might like.

[Christian James Hand]

I didn't know we had four press.

[Zach Klapman]

Cars, three Prescott 3s cars. Right now it's actually sort of problematic. Okay. Jerry was a steak F1 team, kick sour driver. Love it. Any and all Primus references immediately move to the top of the list next time. Thank you very much for this PSA. What would be the feasibility of offering an HF11 in Center Drive? Anyone? Anyone? Did you guys ever think of a three seat or center drive?

[Nikita Berdan]

We did, yeah. I mean originally we thought about it.

[Zach Klapman]

It.

[Nikita Berdan]

There's actually an interesting. Speaking to a couple T50 owners, there's an interesting thing with center drive is that they actually have to relearn when they get in the car because you're used to having this much space always. Right. And so they're like, yeah, man, I'm nervous. I'm going to hit things. It's cool. It's less social, you know, if you're.

[Zach Klapman]

Like, I don't know, we're more.

[Nikita Berdan]

I think we're maybe more traditional of like just the two seats.

[Zach Klapman]

And yeah, I drove. We got. We went out with dario in the T50. I agree that it is a little less social. And if, man, if you didn't want to with Gordon with the tires, I think maybe going with a three seater might be a bridge too far. I don't know. But. But I do agree it is not quite as social. Although as a passenger it is a fun and unique experience. Of course I drove A Center Drive 911. This customer of ours had one done and it was a three seater. It was really. I mean, it was fucking cool, actually. It was cool. Like it for all intents and purposes, like worked like stuff. And you'd get in from the left and the seat was on a slider side to side.

[Nikita Berdan]

Oh, wow.

[Zach Klapman]

So you'd get in on like you'd get in on a regular car.

[Nikita Berdan]

What generation?

[Zach Klapman]

997.

[Nikita Berdan]

997.

[Zach Klapman]

And then you'd fucking pull the handle up and go. And you'd slide to the middle. And the normal car center console was now on your right. Okay, so the shifter and all the buttons. Yeah, we're here.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah. On an old 911. You can do it because the car is down the middle.

[Zach Klapman]

You know, this is the car. This is literally the car. And it's.

[Nikita Berdan]

How did it do? A lot.

[Zach Klapman]

You know, actually, not bad. They did a pretty good job. The fit and finish was pretty decent. They sort of made this carbon dash, and then they took the left side of the stock dash and sort of shoved it to the middle.

[Nikita Berdan]

Okay.

[Zach Klapman]

I'll give them like. Like an 8. But the moving of the shifter introduced some kind of slight slop in the linkage, and it wasn't like you'd want from a Porsche. And also, moving the steering wheel added an additional sort of knuckle or something. And so there. Yeah, there's the console. And so, honestly, it was neat and a fun and interesting novelty.

[Christian James Hand]

It's done very cleanly.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Nikita Berdan]

Were there rear seats or. No, there were.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, there was the standard Porsche back seats, and you could kind of like, oh, they're folded down there, but they exist. And, yeah, you could. You could sort of sit. Yeah. Zach, the photo on the right has the Shows the back seats. I swear to God, dude, when the guy dropped his car off, there were two girls in the back. One was his girlfriend. And he. He goes, and this is my girlfriend. Friend's girlfriend. I'm like, all right, homie, have fun in Ibiza.

[Nikita Berdan]

Someone's living the dream.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. This guy. This is. This guy was a. This is a character, this one. But it was neat. It was. It was kind of neat and funky. Christian says, will the Ferrari F80 be the first Ferrari Halo car flop? I think it's already sold out, dude. It doesn't matter what it looks like, how it sounds. Have you seen it?

[Nikita Berdan]

I haven't seen it in person. No.

[Zach Klapman]

I've seen photos. I don't think it's particularly pretty. I mean, sure, it goes fast, but didn't do it for me. Oh, wow. Okay, that's way too many words. We need to study that. But we'll save the ones that are not for oil stain for the next one. Mansory, Wrong number. That's pretty good.

[Christian James Hand]

That's great.

[Zach Klapman]

The Maniac chair looks amazing. But as a fan, fat guy. Will I be able to get out of it once I get in? I could. I found it to be very, very comfortable. I think you probably can, unless you're, like, really fat. But it was really, really comfy. I want one. Is it possible to make one with.

[Matt Farah]

A headrest that's slightly taller for me?

[Zach Klapman]

Okay, cool. Yeah, cool. Chappie says, bring back the 917 style wheels on the HF11.

[Ilya Berdan]

Yeah. So the. The slicks that are at the shop.

[Nikita Berdan]

They already have those. We have an updated version.

[Zach Klapman]

That's the track wheels. Yes. Bub Rub. Shout out to Bub Rub. Remember Bub Rub. That's one of the original. The whistle tips video from back in the day. It was like one of the oldest viral videos. Fucking go watch that. It's still funny. Bub Rose says. Yo, is Manx selling the radial engine as a standalone? It would be awesome in a boat bug. I'm sure that they will sell you an engine. I don't see why not. What is the standalone price? I want to say it's something like 40 to $50,000. It's very expensive, but it's fucking cool and it will fit in a bug. The original prototype in Australia went in a bug and they also put one in a 356. Okay. Bad gardener says. How is the McLaren F1 so fast? Rather, how is it that so few modern cars are going as fast as it did? 500 horsepower per ton is a lot. But there are several cars that can do that now and most seem to tap out at 220ish. Despite the tech.

[Nikita Berdan]

The McLaren F1 made no downforce, no drag. They took the mirrors off everything.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, it was a neutral car, really.

[Nikita Berdan]

And Andy said it was the scariest thing he's ever driven. So.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, just because something can go 241 doesn't mean it's recommended or that it's.

[Christian James Hand]

Stable and comfortable at that speed.

[Nikita Berdan]

It's not a sheer off.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, yeah. And I know, and I think there's probably other cars that would go faster than that, but are limited by tires, limited by all, all. All kind of reasons, gearing or whatever. Yeah. But I do remember where Andy was like. Yeah, once was enough of that.

[Christian James Hand]

It is impressive. It has a drag coefficient of 0.32, which is basically the same as a Ferrari 488.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah.

[Christian James Hand]

But the Ferrari probably has much wider tires and I don't know, Ferrari could.

[Nikita Berdan]

Be playing with that number.

[Zach Klapman]

The McLaren's at like 17s. I think the front tires are like two 215s on the flare in F1.

[Christian James Hand]

Yeah. You got basically a drag.

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. All right. We can. The rest of these we can say for our crew show. Thank you very much. Okay. Jesus Christ. Luda's legend, he will end on this one. Ludus Legend said. Do you think proposed roundabouts in Malibu will actually reduce accidents? They finished construction one in my area. Two Days ago. And so far we've seen people going backwards around it and one person driving straight through it like it was a four way. I realize this is anecdotal. I think you will have some very stupid people in the first few days of changing any. It's not just roundabouts. They changed the light over here by our shop, the big one. Sentinels, Polveda, they made a bike lane, A proper fucking bike lane. And they changed the timing of the signals so that the bike lane. So that people wouldn't turn right across the fucking bike lane. Of course, for the first three weeks, nobody had any idea how to operate this lane. And the stupidity I saw was crazy. Now it's great. So Luda's legend should hold the fuck on for just a little bit and be happy that somebody went through the middle of it. That's very funny. And that nobody died. If people are going backwards around it, maybe they're British. Have you considered that?

[Nikita Berdan]

That was me during Goodwin. I was like, I'm sorry.

[Zach Klapman]

How many people have drifted it. Has anyone drifted? Let's see. Let's just. But places where there are roundabouts, even in America, the traffic is moving beautifully. Boys, thank you for coming. Really appreciate it. I assume we're gonna see you at the Quail.

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Aren't you gonna be showing your car?

[Nikita Berdan]

Yeah, we'll be Motorlux Quail, Exotics and somewhere else.

[Zach Klapman]

All the things. All the things at Pebble. Okay, so if you're going to Exotics on Broadway, if you're going to car week. Exotics on Broadway is free. You do not need a ticket to get in. It's mostly hypercars, but I think there's going to be some concepts as well. I think the nilou will also be at that. And yeah, Zach and I will be at all the things also. We'll see what Motorlux. I'll have them. I'll have the radio Manx.

[Nikita Berdan]

Nice.

[Zach Klapman]

Be very fun. Maybe we put a radial in one of these. Call Phillips, see how that goes. Maybe you can fucking slow it down. What if you could do like. What if you treated radials like rotaries where you had multiple radios on a connected crankshaft and it was like. What would you call a T? If it was like a T12, where it was like four radials in a row.

[Nikita Berdan]

I think you can do. You know Michael, you know Michael at Mayorsnank?

[Zach Klapman]

Yeah, I think Michael Rice. Yeah, yeah, the gm.

[Nikita Berdan]

No, not Michael. What's his name? He lives in San Diego. But he was telling me that I think you can stack them.

[Zach Klapman]

Whoa. Jonathan, the British guy, is their radial specialist. He's the guy who installed. Was doing my power trip. Yeah.

[Nikita Berdan]

Okay.

[Christian James Hand]

It seems like you could. I mean, if they stacked V6s for Aston Martin V12 motors, you know. Yeah, yeah.

[Zach Klapman]

Now. Now I think we're talking. This is that.

[Christian James Hand]

I think you need a engine, right?

[Zach Klapman]

A three by three and nine. Like you could. You'd put the.

[Nikita Berdan]

That.

[Zach Klapman]

What would you put that in?

[Christian James Hand]

A 9 11, bro.

[Zach Klapman]

I'd want that in a boat. I think that's a. To me, that's a. That's. I put that in a Donzi, you know, like. Or like one of those boats that. Where like a. You know, like a lake speedboat where you've got just the motor sitting behind you and the. It's got a gas pedal instead of like a throttle to just put. Yeah, one of them shits. Okay, so go see the HF11 concept at Exotics on Broadway or, or. Or any of the other ticketed things they just mentioned. And oilstainlab.com for pictures, videos, images, and some dope ass merch. That's right. And the maniac chairs. And we're gonna talk about how I can get one from my house now. We'll see you guys next week. Get tickets to our show. Come see us in Texas. If it goes well, we'll do more. And thanks, everybody. Bye.