Have we hit PEAK Re-imagination?

Summary

The Smoking Tire Podcast: "Have we hit PEAK Re-imagination?"

Hosts: Matt Farah & Zack Klapman
Release Date: May 12, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode centers on the exploding trend of restomods and "re-imagined" cars, with a deep dive into Matt and Zack’s recent drives of the Bora Motorworks Allen Mann Escort and the Evoluto 355 – a reimagined Ferrari 355. The hosts discuss the pros, cons, and market dynamics of this new wave of ultra-premium recreations and restorations, comparing them to originals and exploring whether we've hit a saturation point in automotive nostalgia. They touch on market price weirdness, driving dynamics, craftsmanship, and speculate about the future of the restomod scene. The episode also includes Q&A with patrons at the end.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Driving and Reviewing the Bora Motorworks Allen Mann Escort

[02:20 – 16:23]

• Borum Motorworks (UK) is building licensed continuation/replica Ford Escorts under modern methods, with a race-spec Allen Mann 88 limited edition and an upcoming road version. Unlike some restomods, these are entirely scratch-built and not based on original shells.
• Matt test-drove the race version at Willow Springs, describing it as a "1600 lbs, 208 hp right-hand-drive touring car" with manually operated everything:
  • "You hear and feel everything. I couldn't get out of this thing. This thing was so goddamn fun." – Matt [09:00]
• Despite the thrill, the price tag was a shock:
  • “It’s $470,000.” – Matt [14:43]
• Discussed how these cars blur the line between replica and original, often costing more than the actual vintage cars they're based on.
  • “Are recreations now costing more than the real thing?” – Matt [17:09]
• They debate the market logic behind these cars and whether buyers are really paying for driving experience, exclusivity, reliability, or simply nostalgia without the baggage of old-car headaches.

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Industry Trend: Peak Restomods & Reimaginings

[24:46 – 25:19]

• Zack recounts a conversation about whether we've reached "peak nostalgia" in car culture. Both hosts argue there’s no end in sight as people seek new-old cars “reimagined” for modern driving.
  • “All they’re doing is exactly what we just talked about. They’re finding a car from an era people loved and they’ll just keep making it.” – Zack [25:03]

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Next Up from Borum: RS200 & Market Philosophy

[29:52 – 32:21]

• RS200 Restomod: Borum’s next project will be a "103% scale" RS200, rear-drive only, and running a yet-to-be-announced but apparently wild powertrain.
  • "When they told me [the engine], I went, 'you're gonna kill people!'" – Matt [30:29]
• The challenge: balancing modernization with the soul (or danger) of original raw ‘80s machinery.

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In-Depth: Evoluto Ferrari 355 Resto-mod

[35:55 – 65:40]

• Evoluto is a new player aiming to do for the Ferrari 355 what Singer did for classic Porsche 911s: ground-up performance, style, and reliability upgrades.
• Key Upgrades:
  • Full carbon body, reinforced chassis, lighter by ~200 lbs
  • Modernized steering (2.0 turns lock-to-lock vs. 3.2 for stock)
  • Up-rated brakes, wider track and wheels, titanium/magnesium components
  • Reworked engine and drivetrain for response and reliability
• Driving Impressions:
  • "Handler is awesome, steering rack is amazing... it’s fantastic. It was just fantastic." – Zack [39:13]
  • "Dynamically, I really do not have a lot of notes about how that thing drives… pretty fucking bang on." – Matt [45:54]
• Comparing to the original 355: The Evoluto is sharper, more focused, and modern-feeling but less “tourable” than a perfectly sorted stock 355.
• Aesthetics & Interior Critique:
  • Mixed reviews on the Ian Callum styling: praised for some tasteful updates but nitpicked for wheel design, door handles, and the too-big, out-of-era seats.
  • “The seats look too big... they look like a project and you just shove this seat in there.” – Zack [50:04]
  • Dislike for the new steering wheel: “It looks a little Ring Brothers…not Ferrari.” – Matt [51:44]
  • Wished for more period-correct wheel and steering wheel options ala Singer or original Ferrari three-spoke.
• Value & Market Position:
  • At ~$770,000 (plus donor 355), it's 3-4x the best original 355—and (like Singer) promises "investment-grade" exclusivity and resale.
  • Hosts worry this discourages use: “It will encourage the customer to not drive the car. Because if it’s an investment, then lower miles bring more money.” – Matt [59:39]
  • Production capped at 55 coupes; some proprietary parts (like the quick rack) won’t be sold separately – a contrast to making the whole scene better.
  • “Capitalism almost always, always wins at this, at this price point. And that sort of sucks.” – Matt [60:02]
• Verdict: Dynamically outstanding—a new benchmark for Ferrari restomods, but the business model and usability tradeoffs are significant.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Are we building a nostalgia for a golden age that didn’t actually exist?” – (Paraphrased theme throughout)
• “Has Superformance been doing just that for years and yet their products are 5% the cost of the original cars… [but] this Escort is 10x the price of a real one?” – Matt [19:03]
• “You want an old car, but don’t even like the idea of any of the problems that could be associated with an old car.” – Matt [17:09]
• “All they’re doing is exactly what we just talked about… finding a car from an era people loved and making it for today.” – Zack [25:03]

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Q&A Segment: Patron Questions & Hosts’ Advice

[76:11 – End]

• Alpina vs. M Car: For most buyers, M cars are "racecar theater" while Alpina is for the high-speed autobahn. If you want comfort, get Alpina.
• When are you 'Advanced' at the Track?: Matt outlines that "advanced" means showing up at an unfamiliar track with a new group, knowing the routine, being safe, and a benefit to others, not lap times.
• Overpriced vs Underpriced Driving Experiences:
  • Overpriced: Classic AMG Hammers, late R35 GT-Rs at $200k+, super-rare exotics when the drive doesn't match cost.
  • Underpriced: Used C8 Z06s (“Sounds like Ferrari, feels like Ferrari, but $90,000.” – Matt [85:50]), GR86, some new affordable sports cars.
• Lemons Racing with a Beater Alfa 164: Hosts encourage – “If it’s ugly but fun to drive, do DWA or Overcrest Rallies, then hit the track once you’ve had your fun.”
• Annoying Air Fresheners: Clean your car, don’t mask it; air fresheners are additive, cleanliness is subtractive.
• Obscure, Long-Selling Cars: RC F still racing (and selling in tiny numbers), Fiat 500 EV, GMC Acadia—“Didn’t know they still made that!”

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Timestamps of Important Segments

• 02:20 — Matt sets up main topics: driving two very different "restomods"
• 04:02 — Borum Motorworks explained + scratch-built, Ford-licensed cars
• 09:00 — “I couldn't get out of this thing. This thing was so goddamn fun.” (Matt on Allen Mann Escort)
• 14:43 — $470,000 price shock for the Allen Mann Escort
• 17:09 — Discussion: replicas that cost more than originals
• 24:46–25:19 — Are we at peak re-imagination/restomod?
• 29:52 — Borum’s RS200 project & powertrain teaser
• 35:55 — Evoluto 355 overview: process, upgrades, philosophy
• 39:13 — Zack's first impressions: "It's fantastic. It was just fantastic."
• 45:54 — Matt on dynamics: "Pretty fucking bang on."
• 46:48–54:42 — Aesthetics, wheels, and interior: hits and misses
• 59:39 — On “investment-grade” restomods: potential for non-use
• 65:40 — What modern Ferrari do you get for $1m? Comparison talk
• 76:11–End — Patron Q&A: Alpina vs M, track expertise, price-per-drive, beater Alfas, and more

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Summary Verdict

Matt and Zack argue that the restomod/reimagined market is not near saturation. The search for nostalgia without headaches is fueling a golden age for ultra-high-end, manufacturer-blessed recreations—but with prices that sometimes outstrip originals’ value, and a risk of these cars becoming “investments” that rarely get used. The Evoluto 355 is a new benchmark in Ferrari restomods, driving brilliantly but facing challenges in market positioning and interior/exterior design details. The Allen Mann Escort is a perfect example of how rarity, modern quality, and licensing combine to create an exclusive (and expensive) halo product, even as originals can sometimes be found much cheaper. The hosts remain skeptical about the long-term implications—both for the culture and for car enthusiasts’ wallets and driving joy.

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Tone & Vibe

High-energy, irreverent, relentlessly opinionated, with plenty of technical expertise, combat humor, and first-hand experience with both driving and car culture economics. Adult language and insider references are common. Both hosts balance gearhead excitement with skepticism about industry trends and collector speculation.

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(For detailed driving impressions and visuals, check out The Smoking Tire’s YouTube coverage and Instagram posts referenced throughout the podcast.)

Transcript

[A]

What's up, everybody? Matt Farah here. Welcome to the Smoking Tire Podcast. Today's episode is brought to you by off the Record. You love off the Record just as much as I do based on the number of emails I get from people who tell me that off the Record absolutely took care of them when they got pulled over and accused of doing something bad in their car. That's right. If you get a ticket for anything big or small, don't plead guilty. Get off the Record. They will connect you with a qualified attorney in that jurisdiction who will fight that ticket, your behalf, and most of the time, get it reduced so you don't have points on your record. You don't have those problems with insurance premiums going up, problems with your employment, et cetera, et cetera. Go to offtherecord.com TST that's offtherecord.com Tst to get 10% off all legal services booked through off the Record, one more time, offtherecord.com TST TST. All right, folks, on this episode of the show, it's been a big week of driving for me, and I have driven two very cool resto mods, the Bora Motorworks, Allen Man Escort, and Zach and I review the Evoluto 355. I've brought along a stock one to compare to that actually takes up most of our show this week. And we've got a few questions from the patrons that give us some good other things to ponder. But let's get this Resto mod episode of the Smoking Podcast going right now. Excuse me. I speak jive. We live.

[B]

Yeah, that movie's so funny.

[A]

Hello, everybody. I got duped in the hotel the other night on the fucking guide. Said Airplane was on. Airplane was not on. But you know what is on the volume on our television on the wall.

[B]

No, it's not. I mean, yes, it is.

[A]

I mean, it was, but it's fixed. I mean, it was. I mean, by yes, I mean, by no, I mean yes.

[B]

When I hit. When I hit Go Live, it shows up on three different screens, and I have to, like, close them and mute them each individually. So it said airplane was on the. On the tv, but it wasn't.

[A]

But it wasn't. It was some other movie that was not a comedy. I don't remember what it was, but I just. The guy disappointed me.

[B]

Oh, that's. Yeah.

[A]

Oh, man, oh, man, oh, man. It's been. It's been a. It's been a couple of weeks. I mean, it's. It's been a week my seven days Monday was 3-55-evoluto versus stock 355.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Shout out to Austin, my WCCS client and friend who brought his stock 355 out. It wasn't quite stock. It had a fucking capristo on it. And frankly that gets you a lot of the way there. But I'm writing about that for Road and Track. So Zach also drove the 355 Evoluto, but he didn't appear in the video. So we're going to come back to that. That's going to be sort of our main topic today because there's a lot of debate about is it good? Is it not good? But some other items. The next day I go out to Willow Springs to a little members day, a little members play day. It's one of those things. They bring out the fucking race cars and shit. It was the day before, it was Sunday. The F1 race. Oh yeah, it was the F1 watch party. So they put up like a 20 foot screen in the chilling area outside the. In the street. At streets. Whoa. So like. Yeah, so there's like you're in the paddock jumping and out of race cars. But the race is just like. On the whole it was pretty cool actually.

[B]

It was very cool.

[A]

And I drove this Escort. So there's a company called Driven, D, R, V N. We now know they're from Scotland. And actually I have a very funny connection to the family that I randomly met the guy, the main guy from Driven.

[B]

Mr. Driven.

[A]

Mr. Driven. When I was in Scotland on vacation with my family, I offhandedly mentioned that I'm randomly in Scotland and run into Mr. JWW James Walker who was with someone he describes as a business partner. Well, that's the guy. That's the guy who is. So this company Driven does the Evoluto. They're also doing this thing which we have on the screen which is called the Borum Motorworks. And Borum Motorworks is going to be doing a run of continuation series Fords. Now unlike the Evoluto, which starts with you provide a 355 and they do their thing. These Borum cars are scratch built cars. So sort of like Revology. Okay. Because we also had to go in a revolution.

[B]

So they build the unibody or scrap.

[A]

Wow. And under license. So these Borum cars are actually licensed by Ford in the UK and you can buy them. So that. That silver one in the first row on the Instagram there. So this is going to be the road going version of I Didn't realize that was a real. I thought it was a static. But that's gonna be a road going version. This is the track version. It's called the Allen man edition escort. Allen Man 88 edition. So I got to drive it at the. At the old members day. They were bringing them out. I figured this out. This is. So this is actually the shit. This is. This is a. I found a loophole into a back door into the system by singing for my supper, as it were. With this, with this company. Like. Like the Evoluto was at the members track. Like if you're a member, you could drive it on the track.

[B]

Oh. Cause right. The same parent company, they were like, yeah, drive the Escort, drive the Evoluto

[A]

things out for members to try and maybe buy. And by the way, a couple it did. So it works. So this. So they're just. Yeah, it's like a quail. But you drive. Shit. It's fucking crazy. So I drove this Escort again. It's a scratch built car. But the road car is gonna be like revology modern manufacturing applied to this very specific shape. But just make a great car that looks like this. And Ford says you're allowed to. That's not this. What I drove is the race car. This is designed to be an exact replica of this Mark 1 escort. That was a British. They got so mad at me, I kept calling it a rally car. Cause us Americans only think of these as rally cars. This is a touring car.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So I didn't make a video. If I did, I would have said it wrong 100 times. But I said it wrong to them a bunch. And they were like, listen motherfucker, it's

[B]

fucking British touring car championship car.

[A]

So this thing weighs 1600 pounds and has the front suspension architecture is apparently copied from the Ford GT40. This is not exactly the same dimensions as the standard Escort. It's like one of those Holman Moody, like remember the Holman Moody NASCAR back in the day. Very famous story where they built like.

[B]

They built it to like 7/8 or something.

[A]

7/8 scale. Where it looked right but it was like smaller. This is that where it looks right, but it's different enough. And it won the Touring Car championship. And honestly, I don't care a lot about vintage touring cars. So the fact that I had never even heard of this dude Alan Mann, which maybe makes me a bad car fan, but like whatever. I looked at that and I went, can I drive that? Because it looks incredible. And they went, yes. And so I went out and the only thing that is not period correct is the carbon bucket seats, which, I mean the period seats would be like. If you had a crash, you would probably fucking just die.

[B]

Yeah. It would come up to like the middle of your back or something like that. Like no headrest. But this is very funny because the only padding on this carbon bucket is the headrest itself. The rest of it is shiny and black and hard.

[A]

Yeah, I would probably order mine with a padding in it if we were to get some. So like I said, it's 1,600 pounds at the curb. Okay. And has a 208 horsepower in house provided it's a quote BRM style. So it's a sort of copy of like you can't, you couldn't get the original engine that this raced with, so they've remade one. That's as close as you can get. It revs to like 8500rpm. It's four speed. This one is right hand drive. I think they're all right hand drive as a matter of fact. Great notchy four speed. The clutch is grabby like a race cars. But once you're moving out of a standstill, it's totally fine. Manual steering, manual brakes. And you just. You hear and feel everything. I couldn't get out of this thing. This thing was so goddamn fun. I took it out probably like four times. Wow. If it was there, I was like, can I go out?

[B]

And then again it's like 200 horsepower less.

[A]

208 horsepower, 1600 pounds. You know, and being on the right and Willow, you know, Streets of Willow is a clockwise corner. I'm on the inside of more, more corners. And I'm pretty like. I'm actually pretty good at like I can, I can drive 90% as fast as I could drive on the left, on the right. Pretty close. Like I don't know if I'd want to enter a race. But like they, you know, I guess because most people can't, they have a pro driver shout out to Simon who was fucking awesome. He was so cool. This guy OG Ford guy. He's been with, with was with Ford performance and racing forever. So he was like the driving coach. So he was like, you gonna be okay? I was like, I think so. And after like half a lap he was like, all right, let's fucking go. We were just going and it was so fun to kick the shit out of this car. Now the bad thing folks, taking a quick break today for fitbod. When you are working out, it is so Easy to get into a rut and just do the same thing with your workout every day. Like before I got on my proper fitness journey, I was working out. I was doing cardio like five days a week. But it wasn't until I added weight training and changing the workout each workout and changing weights, changing reps. Changing the exercises I'm doing with a trainer has helped my body get in much, much better shape, help me avoid boredom and help shrink those plateaus on my fitness journey. And fitbot is here to help you do the same. It is an app that is like a trainer in your pocket. It makes working out easier because it customizes workouts based on your goals and that could be recovery, weight loss, targeting a specific muscle group, et cetera, et cetera. The app then helps you stay focused to get a better workout. It ups the intensity as you work along and it really is like having that personal trainer pushing you along the way, right? Fitbod creates a personalized workout routine based on your goals, fitness level and the available equipment. The workouts then adapt to your growth, so each workout is challenging enough to push you to make progress. Fitbod then tracks your muscle recovery so you can avoid burnout and keep up that momentum. Fitbot is fine tuned by experienced, certified personal trainers to bring best practices and exercise science to you. You can level up your workouts with customized fitness plans that work for you and it's got over 1,000 demonstration videos. So level up your workout and join Fitbod today to get your personalized workout plan. You can get 25% off your subscription or try the app for free for seven days at fitbod. Me tire that's F F I T B O D metire F I T B O D Metire Support is also coming in hot today from bluechew. Once you got that fit bod, then you get the bluechew. Because the future of erectile function is here, underlined bold on the page. Not dysfunction. It's not about need, my friends. It's not about you need better boners. It's about wanting awesome boners. That's what it's about. The new arousal boosting formula combines passion and performance into one tablet that dissolves under your tongue for super fast onset. No more waiting for a pill to kick in. No more moments ruined by performance anxiety. Just the results. When you want, when you want them. Most ED meds only focus on blood flow, but bluechew Gold goes further by combining two ingredients for blood flow with two for mental arousal and connection. So you're not just physically ready. You're actually horny. You are truly mentally horny. Guys. This type of innovation is why bluechew Gold is the number one brand in erectile function. The process is simple and all online. Get started [e-mail] and go for gold and ladies, because mother's day was just this past weekend, if you're listening, send your man the link and make him a trophy husband with the bluechew Gold. There's like three ladies in here, so we have a potential. It's possible we could get 100% push through on this ad with women customers because there's probably four women listening to this ad. If all four of you get BlueChew, that we could have 100% penetration in women, which is a very funny way I have just phrased that for an ad about sex stuff. Discover your options at BlueChew. Special deal for our listeners right now. When you get two months of BlueChew Gold, you get the third for free with promo code tire. That's promo code tire. Visit bluechew.com for more details and important safety information. And thank BlueChew for sponsoring the podcast Promo code tire. The bad thing. It's $470,000.

[B]

What's the body made out of?

[A]

Probably aluminum. What happened? Okay, it's. It's not carbon. It's. It's exact. It's. I think it's all aluminum. Yeah, it's just. There's nothing in it. It's just. It's tiny and there's nothing in it. But the way it takes curbs, you know, you can. When you go turns like 5, 6, 7, and those little S's at the. In the back, you can just ride way up on the curbs and those. And slides pretty good on the entry. Obviously, it's not quite enough power to just smash the throttle and get oversteer. So you really have to enter the bus stop super hot and you can do it. But it doesn't really want to just slide on the entrance to the front straight. It just doesn't have enough power flow.

[B]

Plus, with modern compound on the tires, it's got good grip.

[A]

You could probably set it up with different tires and alignment and stuff to make it slide better. But as a vehicle, vintage experience, like, it was not slow. Like, this thing kind of rips. Like.

[B]

I wonder if these will be permitted in something like Vara, you know, because it's a new car.

[A]

Yeah, they say it is.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

Yeah, because it. Because it's not. I mean, because it's Period.

[B]

Correct.

[A]

It's a new build, but it's, it's. Yeah, they say. And I also think, I think there's an open secret in vintage racing which is that they're happy to get anybody into vintage racing, even if it means the car is brand new and just looks like the old car. Like I'm pretty like these, you know, people who go to Goodwood are like, yeah, like all the cars are like the replica of the actual car.

[B]

But Goodwood is different price point than Varro. You know, like when I've gone to the Vara races, it's like that's where the, the 2002s are running and the alphas and stuff. And those can be expensive for most people, like you know, 40 to 80 grand but not 20 million for the Ferrari.

[A]

Sure. Yeah. I, from what I understand this is, will be eligible for like most vintage racing series if that's what you wanted to do with it. I think if you actually wanted to go racing, this is probably too expensive.

[B]

So are they building this? Because these are so beloved in the UK and there's just not many of them left anymore. Like our friend Efren, he's got one of these, but it's a left hand drive, you know, race car, track car. But like they're probably hard to find.

[A]

They are kind of hard to find. But also, I mean, I'm actually gonna write for Road and Track this month and my column just came out yesterday, by the way, about searching for the budget Bentley, which is I think kind of a fun piece. It came out better than I thought it would. But I'm writing next month about this and the revology, both of which have found themselves in a position where recreations replicas. I mean straight up, they don't like to use the word but like that's what it is. Are costing more the real thing. You talk about a GT40 or a Cobra. The reason a replica exists is because the real 250 GTOs and blah blah, blah, that's why fucking replicas exist. Why would you replicate a car where the original would be less than the replica? So it's an interesting shift in the market where people seem to prefer it to, to drive maybe better or something or they just, they don't. They want an old car, but don't want the. Don't even like the idea of any of the problems that could be associated with an old car.

[B]

I think that's exactly it. And when you have the money, yeah, as I said in the video, like much of your life is about removing problems that you don't like that are removable.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And so here you go. Well, I love the way the GTO looks or the Mustang looks, but what I always hated about them is, can you fix this? And someone's going to say yes because someone needs a paycheck. And like that just leads to where we are with Revology and all these other companies that are doing really, really high quality work and essentially going, all right, it's going to look like the thing you love, but it's not going to have any of the issues and it's going to drive better and it's going to use modern engineering and understanding of suspension. If we can move those pickup points a little bit or whatever. And then you end up with something that's great.

[A]

Yeah. I mean, which does beg the question, has Superformance been doing just that for many years? And yet their products sell for 5%, 10% of the cost of an original car, Whereas this Escort. And just pull up not cars and bids because it'll be too old. Pull up Batman. And look, let's see what recent Mark 1 Ford Escort like would. Has got. Maybe we'll look at maybe look on racing junk or whatever. Let's see. Yeah, there was. There was a subcategory for Mark one. Yeah. Here we go. What do we got? I mean, dude, the Go.

[B]

Look at.

[A]

Look at that one. The FIA tribute. Look at that.

[B]

Yeah. $37,000.

[A]

That's a 37. Pop that. Oh, bro, look at the rate. How about the race car? I mean, what's the most expensive one on here? That race car?

[B]

That one.

[A]

That's 68.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That's a no sale at 55. But it's not like this dude was

[B]

gonna be holding out for five, eight years ago.

[A]

Oh, wow. Let's go more Recent. More recent. 2025.

[B]

Geez. 2020.

[A]

Wow. The guy. So these don't sell very often.

[B]

I just think the United States didn't care as much.

[A]

Yeah. But in the US looks cool. Yeah. I mean, look, this one is $30,000, you know, and so that's. If there's a point against it's that this is. This car, as amazing as it was to drive and it was fucking amazing. Is like many multiples of what it would cost to get. Yeah, dude, you could have Richard Tuthill build you one of these things for fucking probably half this money.

[B]

Well, I bet he'd charge 470 unless you brought him the shell and he just tuned it. But like, if you were having him build the body, I mean.

[A]

Well, build a body from scratch. From scratch, yes. But I'm talking about the, you know, with. Let's Revology, a great museum grade turnkey GT 500 is probably what, 250 like a regular one is a real 67 probably. And Revology's 380. Right. So it's 50% more for a car that's like new replica drives better. But I think it's. I just think the math is a lot more off on an Escort. Now having said that, Borum has this license that's going to extend. Oh wow. We got. Look at that. Ex Carroll Shelby 67 GT500.

[B]

Oh, this is for sale now.

[A]

It's up right now. Well this, look, this one, this is comp. Carroll car isn't what I was talking about.

[B]

But the only comp we got up here. That's all. That's why I pulled it up. Everything else is like a replica. So this is it. So let's just say if it was not Carroll Shelby's car, it would sell for what it's at now. Maybe 210. 250.

[A]

Yeah. 250. 250. If it's somehow otherwise interesting or perfect or whatever. 350. But I doubt it would go for much more than the actual Revology, which is. It's just a thing when you're talking about an Escort that is a 30 to 50,000. Now I bet this, no disrespect, I bet the replica Allen Man Escorts individually, however many they make, I think it's 25 or something they're doing. I bet the real fucking race car would probably sell for that, you know, or something thereabouts. Or not, you know, or possibly more, but not like multiples more.

[B]

Here we go. This is RM Auctions.

[A]

Oh, this is the actual car.

[B]

This is the actual car.

[A]

And what was the hammer price that would actually be? I mean it's awesome. It does look at 210 horse.

[B]

Huh?

[A]

Is this. When was this from? No date on this fucking thing.

[B]

Oh, sold for £200,000.

[A]

So there you go.

[B]

What year was this post made?

[A]

Now these folks by the way probably bought this. They said they own the real car and they laser scanned it to. They took it apart and laser scanned it to build this one. So. But again, that's the real one. That's the one, the only one real one. My concern with this type of thing is that it runs risk of being a radford where they think. This thing is a lot more well known than it actually really is outside of their.

[B]

Well, it depends on how many. If they have to sell 25, I would say. I hope there are 24 people in Britain who absolutely love touring cars at this time. And you got one person in the US who's heard of it, because that's what you're.

[A]

One guy at Willow Springs. I can't be sure if he had any idea who the fuck Allen Mann was, but he drove it and was. I didn't watch him send a wire, but I'm 90% sure he's gonna buy it.

[B]

I mean, that's the other thing is you have people today that have so much money that they go, oh, $400,000 to have the fun fizz. I just had.

[A]

Sure, yeah.

[B]

And they just. Because then that's 0.02%. And then later they'll sell it for a loss of 200 maybe.

[A]

Well, what's very interesting, did you know, did you hear the. And we'll circle back to the Evoluto here.

[B]

Well, before go to that, this is actually. This whole escort thing is a really interesting discussion because I was on Tormenting Tarmac, that podcast you've been on with Jorge, Shout Out Jorge. But he said he asked, do you think we have hit the end of the, like, recreation, nostalgia?

[A]

No.

[B]

And I was like, I don't think so. Because all they're doing is doing exactly what we just talked about. They're finding a car from an era that people loved and they'll just keep making it.

[A]

Maybe someone's doing an Audi tt. Exactly.

[B]

Wow. I didn't know that.

[A]

No.

[B]

This is a perfect example.

[A]

Cars have become. Even the supercars have become such digital things that people are seeking the. Not the car they actually had in high school or wanted in high school as it existed, but the version of it they've created in their mind. Like the way you might remember that ex girlfriend in fucking high school that was great in bed, but a terrible human or whatever. And what part are you thinking about 30 years later? I want that. Why else would you be doing this to an Audi tt? You know what I mean?

[B]

I mean, they do it to movies, the reboots. It's like, hey, what if we made that movie with modern cgi? Especially if the movie previously was made with like early graphics and early computer generated stuff.

[A]

And, you know, so not everybody knows who the fuck Alan Mann is. Or maybe they do and I'm just an idiot, but I don't think they do. I think it's a little niche. Having said that, they're doing a road car version of this Escort which will be very cool. It'll have a normal clutch. It won't have the race motor that's in in this one. It will have a more modern powertrain that's designed to be used a lot. And then the next car they're doing is a fucking RS200. Folks, one more quick break from the action because support is coming in from Deleteme friends. The number of people who have come up to me recently and asked me do I know of any services to help them get their information off the Internet off of data broker sites. And I have like literally three or four, including Eric, my manager here at WCCS has asked me do I know one? And boy do I. Because I know about Delete Me. Because I haven't just read this ad a million times. I used DeleteMe. In the age of AI, we are more vulnerable than ever with scammers using your personal data floating around on the Internet against you. Have you ever googled yourself and found your home address, phone number or the name of a family member? That shit be creepy. But the good news is Delete me can help because Deleteme was named the top pick for data removal services by Wirecutter. And now it's never been more affordable because our listeners can get 20% off at www.joindeleteme.com tire with code tire. Here's what you do. You sign up for Delete Me, you give them a bunch of information. I know that seems kind of counterintuitive given that you want to get your information off the Internet. But they need to know what to look for. So you tell them and then they around and you don't hear from them for a couple days and they come back and they're like, we found your information on 10,000 websites. And then you go, oh my God. And they go, but it's only going to be like four clicks and a couple E signs for you to delete this stuff. So you do it, they go to work and like a month later they come back and they go, we found your data on 1,000 sites. And then you do it again and you keep it going for a couple months. Like you gotta keep it going. It's not a one time thing. DeleteMe works, does all the hard work, but you gotta let it go ongoing way. And you can get an individual plan for a little over eight bucks a month. And then you could see a reduction in phone calls, scam, text messages, garbage, emails, all those annoying things, plus genuinely much, much Less likely to have your personal information used for malicious and nefarious purposes. So take control of your data. Keep your private life private by signing up for Deleteme now at a special discount for our listeners. Get 20% off your DeleteMe plan when you go to www.joindeleteme.com tire and use promo code tire at checkout. The only way to get 20% off is to go to www.joindeleteme.com tire and enter code tire at checkout. That's www.joindelete code tire. And now back to the show. And then the next car they're doing is a fucking Rs200. Now, that goes back to. Maybe an original is too expensive to buy and therefore a replica isn't. But there's also. They're doing it at 103% scale.

[B]

Oh, so slightly bigger, hopefully for the pedal box.

[A]

It's also not going to have front drive. It's going to be a rear drive car.

[B]

Interesting.

[A]

And it is going to be built using modern manufacturing methods. It's not going to be built like the original, so it's going to look like it. And then I said, oh, what engine are you going to use? And I promised I would not say what they told me. But when they told me it, I went, you're gonna kill people. That's what I said. And they were like, no, no, it'll be cool. And I was like, I think you might kill people. Like, that sounds fucking sketch. And he went, just wait to try it. All right.

[B]

But removing the safety of all wheel drive. Interesting. I wonder why they're doing that. Some.

[A]

Oh, something weird has happened on bring a trailer. Why is. What happened there?

[B]

What where on.

[A]

What's with bring a trailer? What's with those two listings that are the same and also different?

[B]

And I remember they sold two weeks apart.

[A]

I don't know. It's fucking weird. I don't know. I don't. Anyway, I think a real, like, dude, wasn't Ken Block's RS200, like, half a million bucks probably.

[B]

It was also 700 horsepower. Like, it was built. I sat in that car and it was built one of the least comfortable cars I've ever sat in. I was shocked.

[A]

Well, that was why I asked. I said, you know, what are you gonna do about size? Cause, like, a lot of people are sized out of that particular car. And that was what they told me. So, you know, like, dude, I 100% want to try whatever the fuck they build. I mean, the rally car or. Excuse me. See, I Just did it again. Touring car was like, I realize it's insanely expensive and completely out of touch for 99.99% of people. But like, as a taste, fuck, was that a. That was a fizzy ass taste.

[B]

I think the question is in one that they probably wouldn't want answered is if you could do a comparo, find someone that has a track prepped, you know, track one.

[A]

Yeah, he sold it.

[B]

His was pretty rad.

[A]

And he didn't get $470,000.

[B]

His also wasn't period correct engine. I think.

[A]

I think it was turbo Cosworth in it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Fucking hydro handbrake.

[B]

But if you had someone that just had a normal kind of period correct one and you drove that next to this one, how much of the fizz do you get? Is it 80% or is it 92%? Because race car feels like race car. If they get that shift linkage right. And if everything else is period correct, they might get very close.

[A]

This felt like fucking race car, this thing. I mean, the clutch makes no mistake about it, but the lack the metallic rasp of all of it, but. And I wouldn't want to drive it on the street. It would be annoying on the street, like if you bought that and put a plate on it and drove it on the street. Cause after I drove it, I was like, I don't have my fucking camera gear with me, but I'd love to fucking do a video of this. And they said, well, maybe we can leave it with you and if you can get it back out to the. And I was like, I have a dealer plate. I'll wear a helmet. I'll just drive. And they're like, please don't do that. But also, you won't enjoy it.

[B]

I'll get seven views. Review of $500,000 obscure toy car.

[A]

No race car in the canyons would get a fucking million views. Probably.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But it was sick. It was a real treat. So this is. That's all. That's the same company that is running that is also Evoluto.

[B]

That's very cool.

[A]

Yeah. And so, you know, they supposedly have a license to make 10 products. I mean, imagine, you know, a who's who's list of sort of Ford motorsport greats.

[B]

So I Wonder if Ford GT will be there or GT40 would be like they're pinnacle.

[A]

All but certain. Yeah, I mean, I don't know what the other companies that make and have made GT40 replicas. Like, I'm not really sure like what their licensing agreement is exactly, but Like,

[B]

I don't know, 10 products. That's a lot.

[A]

10 products is a lot.

[B]

All from Ford.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Wow. Yeah. It's like what are the heroes through the years? Are there ten?

[A]

Oh, for sure. Especially if you go. If you. If. Because when he. He said streetcar and. And race car were two different products.

[B]

Oh yeah. Okay, then that makes it easier. So this Escort is two products.

[A]

This counts as two. Got it in their math.

[B]

Right. So you can make five cars two different ways.

[A]

Pretty much, yeah.

[B]

So no Edsel is what I'm thinking. When you said 10, I was like, ooh, did I.

[A]

Did we do the Edsel vs Cybertruck math on this show? Did I bring it? Have that?

[B]

What do you mean?

[A]

The Edsel is a car that's like a joke of what a failure it is. Like, it's like an early example of like almost like a meme. Right. Like if a car is a failure, it's like an Edsel is like the example of a bomb. A total bomb. Right. But they sold twice as many Ford Edsels to a population half the size we have now.

[B]

That's funny.

[A]

They have sold cybertrucks to our current population.

[B]

Let's see, Google AI says they sold about 120,000 total.

[A]

Edsels.

[B]

Edsel, Sorry, Edsels. The brand got discontinued in 59. It was a loss of about $3 billion in today's money.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. So anyway, let's circle Back to the 355 Evoluto. Yeah. Did you just go, wow? Because the math. Is that math?

[B]

Yeah, yeah. Cybertruck sold half as many and there's way more people.

[A]

There's twice as many people in the country.

[B]

Don't see them as much anymore. You really don't.

[A]

You know where I just saw a bunch? Seattle. I saw so many fucking cybertrucks in Seattle. So many. I don't know why, but there's way more than they are in la.

[B]

They're great in the snow maybe.

[A]

Yeah, maybe that's why. But like. But I'll come back to that at the end. But let's talk about the 355 by Evoluto, everybody. Man, they really ran a press launch with this thing, didn't they? Everybody got to have a go. So this is a Resto modded Ferrari 355. And unlike singer and Gunterwerks, which is where the price point is of this thing is in between those two, they haven't really like with Singer, at least in the beginning of the company, it was their classic. What's now Called their classic. Right. What was formerly just what they did was a highlight reel of Porsches from that entire era from the 60s through the 90s. Right. They highlight reel all that make everything better. And that was what their thing was. That was how they described what their process was. Right. The everything is important. Guntherwerks. I don't know why I said it with a German accent. They're from fucking Newport Beach.

[B]

But when you look at the words,

[A]

yeah, they, they go back to 1998 and they imagine Porsche had continued development of not just air cooled, but the 993 specifically until today. Right. And they want it to lap a racetrack the same pace as a modern GT3, but with an air cooled car. That's what they want to do, right? So it's race car shit in a veiled, thinly veiled, sort of streetcar livery, right? That's what they're doing. Evoluto didn't have a way to me to express what their vision was other than we want to modernize the 355. They never really had a deeper sort of. They have the story, a deeper story than that, which, like, maybe there's evidence that you actually don't need a deeper story than that or maybe there's evidence that you do. So why don't you start? Because I got to drive it in the video. So you at least heard my fucking baseline. Or most people did. But no one's heard from you yet on this thing, so why don't you start?

[B]

Well, I had also never driven a stock 355 before, so it's obviously been on the.

[A]

Well, that's an interesting perspective, my to

[B]

do list because I do think, as many people do, that it is one of the best looking cars ever built. And of course they have the unfortunate reliability record that they do, which keeps a lot of people away,

[A]

a lot

[B]

of good in this car. And again, I hadn't driven a regular one, but I have driven Ferraris that have slow steering. And so this thing, the steering rack is amazing.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, the handling is great. The turn in is really good. The suspension's not too stiff. The sound is obviously like, you know what you hear as you enter the gates of heaven, Basically, you know, small, small Ferrari V8s always sound amazing. And like I think I had been in the car for 12 seconds and I was like, I need to buy a Ferrari 3. Like I'm shifting and going, I should do the VIN and just buy a clapped out Ferrari 360 just to hear this sound when it works well.

[A]

360s do do work, by and large, pretty good.

[B]

But if you follow VIN and notch stories, the car's been down for a little bit.

[A]

So it, I mean, there's some ups and downs. Yeah. But he, he, he, he bought a particularly shot one and then started. He's taking that thing apart, putting it back together 50 times. It's a true project car.

[B]

He's, he's changing things on his own as an experience, you know. Holy crap. Like, it does all of the things we wish, I think, more new cars did. It doesn't feel heavy. The size is nice. The steering's good. The shifting's great. Power is totally fine. Like, it's, it's louder than it is fast, but it's still pretty fast. I mean, I just, I found the whole thing a joy. And then. And to look at it, to see what they've done and they've tastefully modified it versus the stock one. I think they did a fantastic job, color pops and all that stuff. But then there are a couple of things we'll get to, I'm sure, that were imperfect. And when you're talking at this price point and when you're comparing them, I think fairly to Singer, because this is the price point you're at. And also they've set the bar. If you want to reimagine something and improve on something old, well, you can do it this well and charge a million dollars. And if you're going to charge 800,000, essentially, you should get real close. But I think you should get closer than 80% of the way there. I found it to be. It's fantastic. It was just fantastic.

[A]

Yeah. So I have driven stock 355s and in fact drove another one side by side. One of the things you breezed over was the steering. They've done a lot with this car. I think it's important to talk about. For all this money, you get a lot. They strip a car down to nothing. They reinforce the chassis with strategically applied carbon fiber.

[B]

It's lighter by 200 pounds, 200 pounds kilograms, I think it's pounds 200 pounds lighter overall.

[A]

So it's about 3,000 pounds. The whole body is carbon. There's a lot of unsprung mass that's taken out of it. The hubs are titanium. There's a lot of titanium and magnesium bits and stuff. The track width is wider. It's 77 millimeter wider in the back, 66 millimeter in the front. Wider. Obviously the wheels are modern sizes with giant brakes, brembo brakes, they're not carbon ceramic, but it doesn't need it. They're motorsport grade brakes. And the car's not heavy. The steering, the stock car has a 3.2 turns lock to lock ratio. This is two 2.0 turns lock to lock. So when you talk about the steering mean change that. That's the thing. So I bitched a couple times that nobody made an updated steering rack for my Acura nsx. Same problem. Fucking you shut your shuffle steering through corners instead of what we really have in modern steering systems, which is a much more direct. And you can see it so clearly in the video because I haven't over the shoulder camera as I'm talking about it. You can see I'm steering this car like a modern car, not like an old car. And they really have not fucked that up. They've also done a lot with the engine. The net result is frankly not a car that goes all that much faster in acceleration, but it's a car that. And it doesn't actually sound different enough that I give a shit. You hear the difference. The change in sound is more the chattery fucking single mass flywheel than it is anything in the engine. You could take a stock car and make it sound almost just like this. In fact, the other one kind of did. But the response is very snappy. It revs up fast. The clutch engages more, much more firmly like a performance clutch. The stock clutch is a little mushy, which actually isn't such a bad thing. The stock car being as sort of soft as it is by comparison would be very nice to use as a car that you could put a ton of miles on. Like I'd want to buy a stock one and have it just made, have all the rubber freshened and all the fluids and just put like a sweet capristo on it and then go do fucking 20,000 miles. You know, like that would be just joyous. But this, the Evoluto is more focused. It's like a point a to point a kind of car more so than it is a road trip type car. But considering how sharp it has become in the corners, the ride isn't compromised. The lengthening of the control arms like they've done to this Ferrari. What you would do if you were building a really good rwb. If you're building a really good rwb, you have all your control arms lengthened.

[B]

Yeah. You don't just do it with wheel spacers and like offset.

[A]

Right, right. That's how you do a bad rwb. So if you see RWB where the wheel hubs are pushed all the way out and the wheels are almost flat faces, that car will probably drive really nice. If you see one that has a super deep dish rear wheel, it's gonna drive like garbage. And so they've done it right with this. It's pushed out, but it's pushed out from the control arm side. So you better shock control.

[B]

And I mean, it uses the same shocks as the T50 does. Same company R53. Granted the parts don't make the car, but the suspension setup, the way this felt in the canyons felt like T50. It was just compliant but stuck. It was amazing.

[A]

Yeah. And the brakes are a modern brake pedal feel and modern brake pedal performance. And so the stock car, I don't think we'll ever be more than like a 7/10 car. Like, it just can't be because the brakes are kind of mushy and the steering ratio's slow and the engine revs up a little slower and the clutch is a little mushier and the tires are a little squishier and all of that, it's a little heavier. But the stock card, be a fabulous tourer, a fabulous weekend toy. But if you want to hustle the Evoluto, fucking does it. Like, I really do not have a lot of notes dynamically about how that thing drives. Like, that's pretty fucking bang on.

[B]

And that's good because when you're. I mean, that's what you want. When the car is a supercar brand that has then been re engineered with modern knowledge, you go, okay, I hope you get it right. And you know, when we drove that Cyan Racing 1800, that didn't feel right. And you go, well, all this money and all these brain power and you get this wrong.

[A]

The steering was weird.

[B]

The steering was weird and the steering was an absolute like F. And after that you're like, well, I wouldn't buy this car, but this thing. The steering was ace.

[A]

Yeah. So. But that doesn't mean it's like perfect. So the. There's a couple things that like, I didn't love. I don't. I think so. Ian Callum did the styling and I respect Ian Callum, but I don't love the styling. I like it from certain angles. I think the rear three quarter looks fabulous. I do like the GTO gills on it.

[B]

I think they look great.

[A]

I like the rear grille, I like the rear diffuser. I don't love the new doors with the larger air inlets on the Side. Not because I don't like the inlets. I just think it's a worse door handle. You have to press that thing and then there's nothing to grab.

[B]

It is a weird door handle.

[A]

Whereas you actually reach into the scoop and just tug it in the original car. And that's just better. You know, the original car is a little cleaner and tighter in its proportions, but. And I think.

[B]

Well, because one of the prices for the wider track is that the fenders are a little bit flared on the new one. Right. And I think. I think from some angles they look amazing. But I wasn't there this day to see the car side by side.

[A]

Yeah. So the wheel design, I don't think they have. In fairness to them, they have like three or four different wheel choices. These gold ones that were on the car for everybody to drive it are the magnesium ones. So they're the lightest. I don't think a coffin shaped wheel spokes works well on a curvy Ferrari. I think a coffin shaped wheel spoke works well on a BMW R8 on a Lambo.

[B]

Angular.

[A]

Yeah. A coffin shaped wheel spoke is a real Lamborghini Gallardo type wheel. It's not a Ferrari type wheel. And I told them this and I said, look, they had a couple other wheel designs that looked like updated Momo designs from the 90s, one of which was kind of cool, but I wasn't in love with any. And I said, can you guys render out something that's like an updated Ferrari F40 wheel? Because that's really what everybody just kind of wants.

[B]

Totally.

[A]

Just the closest you get to f40, like, the better.

[B]

That's just a 550 wheel. Looks great.

[A]

That's a rule of Ferrari. So they went home and they fucking hit me up the next day with the updated F. And I go, that. That's the thing. Make that. And they're like, we're making a set. There's a set in production, so. Oh, yeah. But wheels are easy. And then. Do I have an interior shot from the previous post? I do. So the interior, some great things. And then a couple things I don't love. I love the metal center console and the buttons and scroll knobs there. That feels very done.

[B]

They look great. It looks special. Feels special. Doesn't seem too modern at all, which is really cool. But you can tell that they. They changed that.

[A]

I actually like the dashboard itself, the way the carbon and the leather works. The doors aren't fancy, but I don't hate them. Now, the seats. And if you go to Maybe the next. Do I have another? Maybe I didn't get a shot of it. The seats are, like, real high back. Like, they're the kind of seats you'd find in a modern Ferrari. And they go really close to the roof of the car.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And it takes me out of the era a bit.

[B]

They also look out of place. Wrong. Like, they look too big for the car. And it looks like we. It looks like they had this seat lying around, and you. It's like. It looks like a project, and you just shove this seat in there and you go, is that what you're gonna stay with? You're gonna go with, like, a lower Recaro or Sparco or something later? Because it almost looks like the seat you tested, just because the size is strange. It's huge.

[A]

And I drove it. The stock car. The stock seat. I also sit an inch lower. The stock.

[B]

Really?

[A]

I sit an inch lower in the stock car?

[B]

Yeah. Because this car, we both get in it, and you're taller than me. My hair was touching the roof, and I felt like I was really up high, which was unexpected.

[A]

Yeah. For me, after a couple months of driving this, it would look like the back of the couch and coming to America with the stain from the fucking sun. It would just be my sunscreen just rubbing into the. The suede. Whereas I had about an inch of room in the stock car. So the seats took me out of the era. And also, they sit high, and the backs are tight. And then the steering wheel, to me, I like using it. I like the shape of the rim. I wish it was round, but, I mean, but when I have my hands at nine and three and I'm steering the car with it, the position and angle and stuff, it feels nice. It looks to me it's a little Ring Brothers. And I don't mean that in disrespectful to Mike and Jim Ring. They have a very specific style, but, like, their style is like muscle cars at sema. And that's what this steering wheel says to me. It looks like if the Ring Brothers did a 69 Camaro, this is the steering wheel they would put in it. And it's not, if you look at. At, for instance, to go back to them, because it's the gold standard, a Singer wheel. We described it as the most perfect steering wheel ever put into a car. Why? Because it took what Porsche already got. Right. And then, like, if you look at that Singer wheel, I mean, the modern ones, the One of the DLs, Turbo is fine.

[B]

The regular Turbo.

[A]

Yeah, the regular that's fine. It is. It looks like they. Wow, what a fucking terrible photo set this is. But okay. It looks like a modernized version of that Porsche 3 spoke wheel.

[B]

Oh, that.

[A]

This one. Has you seen that? I've never seen these pads. Have you seen these pads in there?

[B]

No, but when we drove it. And this. I feel like this camera makes this rim look thicker than it is. Yeah, but what was so awesome about this is that it was this, like angled, flattened carbon rim on the inside. And your thumb landed there and you went, oh. This is how every steering wheel should be. It should be flat so that your thumb can press on that outwardly. And then, of course, the outside of the wheel is round. And it was like the right. The diameter was great. It was perfect.

[A]

And if you look at a Gunterwerks, it also looks. It looks like Porsche could have made this wheel. I don't think Ferrari would have ever made the wheel that's in the Evoluto. And I think, like, the best Ferrari wheel is the non airbag 355 wheel. Like, you actually can't improve on that. So I would literally just remake that, but do what Singer did with that carbon inner bit on that wheel. Because the 355 airbag wheel sucks. It's the big, you know, big fat first gen airbags. But the non airbag wheel, I mean, it just doesn't get better. That looks like it came out of fucking Niki Lauda's F1 car. You know what I'm talking about?

[B]

Yeah, that's great. I mean, and it probably was an evolution of that wheel. I mean, it's, you know, it's not

[A]

too far from the dash, not too

[B]

far from Proto Tipo, but it's got a little bit of covering, you know, where the horn buttons are.

[A]

Perfect. Three spokes.

[B]

And I think that's what left out to me is, you know, on the Voluto one, the spokes, they. They made brushed aluminum for people listening with like a tan leather around it. And it does match the. The bright aluminum of the center console and a little accent on the door sill. Like they're connecting those bits and I get it. But the double spoke with the holes, it's like, then it's too much. And actually it's kind of like the coffin wheel. It's just.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And when you go back to the classic one each spoke, it's just one, you know, one solid spoke at those three ends. And this just looks, I don't know, it's just a little too aggressive.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. I Think so. So that's, you know, and look, making it drive great is very, very hard. I, I, I'm very impressed at how well this car drives, particularly for a, you know, kick the shit out of pre production car. A lot of people in the video commented about the window. They wrote an email to me and they were very apologetic about the window. They basically were like this is a rough prototype car and they just didn't service the stock window mechanisms. But customer cars are gonna have brand new window. They're supposed to go down when you. Whatever. Yeah, yeah. So you know, this is some of the, some of the stuff, the fit and finish on this actual car. There were a couple of rattles and stuff that you, that you would not want to find in customer deliveries. But this is a, this is a shit kicker car. So I mean mechanically it was rad. So nice to drive.

[B]

Did the guy that the fandom that brought his stock car, did he get to drive this?

[A]

First off, he did get to have, let me tell you something about Adam and his lovely wife Carolina. These folks are fucking winners. They're both like business people. They run a business together, they have this car, they travel internationally a lot. And when they come to la, they use this as their car. And they drove the Evoluto. They thought it was cool. They let not just me, but everybody who worked with Evoluto. It was like four guys and my two cameramen drive their 355. They let everybody drive it. They insisted everybody drive it. Neither of the camera guys had ever driven a Ferrari before. And dude, this is a 17,000 mile mint. One of the nicest ones I've ever seen. Mint. Couldn't find a better example of as delivered from Ferrari. Except for it had this capristo on it that just ripped. It was so loud and so fun. And so when you consider the fact that this example to replicate Adams car. Low mile, great service, great condition, you know, it's not cheap. Might be looking at 250 more if you want a better color than red tan. They happen to like red tan. No hate on red tan.

[B]

I mean there is no better color than red tan.

[A]

Resale red. Give me a non red Ferrari, please. But, but it's fine, you know, might be a little more. One just came across my way for 275. It was silver, but I could have bought Joe's.

[B]

It's like 80, right bro, I offered

[A]

him 68, he wanted 74 and we couldn't make a deal. Fuck.

[B]

That was how long ago? That was eight years.

[A]

That would have been 2018 maybe.

[B]

You know, I was gonna say, imagine how much you would have spent on maintenance, but you spent a lot on maintenance for.

[A]

Anyway. Spent a lot on maintenance, makes no difference. So. Yeah, no, if they're worth. If I kept it as nice, this is a car that would have paid for itself over that period of time. But it would be very difficult to justify if you don't have all the money. It's like, is it worth it? No. No, it's not. And also they said something to me that I didn't love, which was that they're making these parts to make the Evoluto do what it does. And they're also doing. They're making some parts like door seals and stuff. And they're making those parts available to. They're backwards compatible with regular cars, which is good. That's good. But the steering rack, they won't sell that to you, which. Okay. But they also were talking about wanting to maintain the investment grade. They wanted to control the secondary market, the gray market of these cars. Because I'm guessing it's hard to convince someone to spend this much money unless you can convince them they'll get more back on the other end. I just think we circle back with the replicas costing more than the originals. This thing costing probably four times what it would cost to get you a great original. It's a huge markup. And then you're promising the customers that they'll get more on the other end.

[B]

That's a really bold thing to do.

[A]

Which is wild. Which is a wild thing to say. And it's a sad thing because it will encourage the customer to not drive the car. Because if it's an investment, then lower miles will bring more money. No miles will bring. You know what I mean?

[B]

Do they have a production number for the evoluto? I forget.

[A]

55 coupes.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Whenever we find that capitalism intersects with car enthusiasm, capitalism almost always, always wins at this, at this price point. And that sort of sucks. And they're, they're doing like a 20,000 mile warranty, but they're also, they're also trying to say it'll be worth more on the other end. So it's not being treated as a throwaway money toy like, ah, burn the money on this just so I can rip a 3, 5, 5, you know, and like tuner cars used to devalue. I mean, he used to devalue.

[B]

Yeah. But I mean, that's different. Like, I don't think anyone like burning money on a Singer or burning like anyone at this price point is too careful. The guy who had a car here, you know who I'm talking about, never drove it because he was. Because he probably stretched a bit to buy it and he was afraid to drive it and damage it because it would hurt.

[A]

Just a bummer.

[B]

And it was priced around this one.

[A]

It's counterintuitive when you spent all the money to make it drive so good.

[B]

I agree. Yeah. Because. Because people, the person who buys the car, if they just bubble it, they're going to repeat the pitch that we've heard and that we have helped share, which is like, they're going to go, oh, the steering rack's great. And, oh, they fixed the reliability with all these new parts. And the wheels are so light. And the way it sounds is amazing. And you're like, when's the last time you experienced any of that? Oh, once.

[A]

How many tanks of gas have you

[B]

been through in this car? Well, I don't want to ruin the value. Sure, yeah. Keep being boring, but rich. Great. Right.

[A]

It's unfortunate when you pitch it both ways. You know, I understand why you have to do that, but it's also like, it just made me feel a little ick.

[B]

I wonder if, you know, I wonder if people in the beginning of Singer had that concern of resale or they were just excited about the cars and the resale kind of happened and then now it's just a known thing. If you're on the list and you pick one up, you could probably flip it for 50% to double because everyone else. To someone who doesn't want to wait.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But I wonder if their early customers gave a shit or if they were just happy to have the perfect driving machine.

[A]

No, I think they had a tough time. They had it. They hadn't. They. They had we. I mean, I don't know if we. Has Maz ever actually told the story of, like, the first 20 cars they did not hear?

[B]

No.

[A]

We should get him to do that.

[B]

Yeah. I think he would openly tell the story.

[A]

The story of the first 20 cars, I think would be very interesting. But I think it, you know, a few people saw Rob Dickinson's car, they wanted cars, but it wasn't like instant flip or waiting list. And the assumption for the first year or couple years was not that you would get more money on the other end.

[B]

Right. Because it was a new experiment. I think we're in this weird position where it's like we're looking at the evolutionary timeline of Homo sapiens or something, but we get to see the entire timeline in one moment. Because Singer has been doing this now for 15 years, 2010. Right. With first our exposure to them. So they're in this 16 years now and super successful. They're the example of what can happen if you do the recreation perfectly and the market comes to you. Or is there. But then you've got. Revology's been doing it a little while, have seemingly good success, they're expanding their portfolio. And then you've got Evoluto, like brand new, you know, and they're still whatever chimpanzees in my analogy. That's falling apart. So we're getting to. We're comparing a new company to an established company and we know that Evoluto would probably hope to become Singer for Ferrari and Ford and whatever, but we're kind of comparing like, you know, the future of the cars.

[A]

Well, look, for a first car, it could be a piece of shit. You know what I mean? It could drive like garbage. It could not work properly. Like there's all kinds of things that it could be that would be fucking terrible. Like be. You know, starting with a Ferrari does not guarantee greatness in any way. But it's, it's not that it drives beautifully. It really, it really does. It's, it's, it's dynamically quite excellent. And like, other than having less nvh, or I should say worse nvh, not less nvh, worse NVH than the stock car, you could drive it on a road trip. Like, I don't see why you couldn't. They're offering a fucking 20,000 mile warranty. So, you know, they, they're, they're doing development miles. They believe in the product. Okay. There's some things I cosmetically don't like. There's some things other people cosmetically don't like. But if you look at the comments on the Instagram or the video, like it's pretty split. It's not everybody feels the way you necessarily feel about this design.

[B]

Oh yeah, that's true.

[A]

You know.

[B]

Yeah. I think.

[A]

Not you. I meant the audience, not you, Zach. Also you.

[B]

I thought it looked rad. I think they both look great. I think the stock one is obviously just sexy as hell, but the new one, I think they, I think they did subtle enough changes where when I looked at it, I was like, oh, this is hot.

[A]

Yeah, no, it's definitely a fucking vibe. I mean. And you know what?

[B]

It's a 355 TF. That's what it looks like. Or with a TDF. Right. When they did that with the F12, little gills here, little more aggressive, but not too much.

[A]

Sure, yeah. Competizione kind of thing. I'd probably pop off the Evoluto badge, off the grill and put the fucking horse back on. I know they can't do that because legal things, but it's a fucking spicy meatball. They also. Oh, by the way, I forgot to mention, they remove the. They redo the whole wiring harness. They do a lot. The list of things they do is really very lengthy.

[B]

They said a lot of the engine parts they've changed will help the reliability because these cars. I think the 355 had a higher ownership cost than like a 512.

[A]

It did. In terms of most expensive to own and drive, you have the F50 is the most. The F40 after that, and then the 355.

[B]

That's insane.

[A]

That is the most.

[B]

That's hypercar. Hypercarp, supercar or maybe. Yeah, supercar. And they're priced similarly.

[A]

They're more expensive to run than even, like, to run. Not to buy and sell, just to run than like a 60s V12 car. Those ain't shit compared to a 355.

[B]

The fact that Testarossa is below 355.

[A]

Yeah, Testarossa is only just. They're the next one down still.

[B]

You know, it's older and it's a more complicated engine or it's a V12 engine, so you'd think 50% more cylinders.

[A]

So you need 50% more of almost everything. But they're like, here's the final thing about the evoluto. It costs $770,000 plus a 355. And it can be a shitter. It doesn't have to be a good. But it can't be crashed. You know, you're not buying like a. Yeah, it can't be crashed or burned, but it can be fucked. So, like, the worst 355, and it's got to be a GTB. The worst one has got to be 100 grand. Like, the worst one. It'll have, like a salvage title, maybe because it was, like, flooded. You know, not crashed, but, like, otherwise.

[B]

Yeah, you're not wrong. I'm looking through for listings on bat,

[A]

but yeah, 100k is going to get. To get you. The shitter is shitter that barely runs, basically, and has all kinds of paperwork problems that you may have to explain to somebody down the road or probably not. I don't know. I guess nobody ever. I can't say for certain. But I have to guess that once you buy secondhand a Singer or a Gunther or something like that, you're not asking any questions about what the donor car's life was like beforehand. That shit's washed away in the fucking waves, huh?

[B]

Yeah, I don't think it would matter. You just, just. I would assume that Singer has gone through every piece of it anyway.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So it doesn't really matter how it lived before. If it had rust, I'm sure they fixed it. It's. It's essentially in my eyes, it's a brand new car.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. So the, the lingering. Yeah, the, the man.

[B]

Huh?

[A]

What was I just gonna say? I had a. I did have a lingering thought on this car and

[B]

maybe

[A]

it'll come back to me. I don't know. I mean, it's cool, it's neat. I really enjoyed driving it.

[B]

I mean, the question is always, do the people shopping at this level, will they see enough of a difference between this and the regular car? And I think you could ask the same question with the Porsches.

[A]

There is a difference. But here's actually the thought that escaped me and just came back for this amount of money, 770 plus a car, call it a million dollars.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

What modern Ferrari are you going to buy that's better for the same amount of money? Now, it's an interesting amount of money because there's a lot that's less than that. A lot, but not a lot that's like, close. There's not a lot of modern Ferraris that are like 800 or 900,000 that are worth it. Like, there's some, like a couple, like very low mileage, like 430 scuderias. Like, fuck out of here. 900k for that thing. No, absolutely.

[B]

It's awesome.

[A]

But $900,000? No, that's the most fabulous $125,000 driving experience you can have for 900.

[B]

But if you, you know, if you close your eyes with this thing, is this a million dollar driving experience?

[A]

Well, no. I mean, yeah. The question is, what Ferrari, what original Ferrari can you buy for a million dollars? That's better. That's a better driving experience. And you have to look pretty hard for the same amount of money. You could spend like $5 million, right?

[B]

And then you can get F50 or

[A]

you could spend 500 and you could have something great as well. But for 1 million, what stock Ferrari is better. Weird place you found yourself there.

[B]

I guess I'd have to drive a Scud back with this to, you know, Scuds are cool.

[A]

They ain't that. They're. They're not all that. That's. That's 150 to 200 driving experience. Pure driving experience. The reason they're fucking 900 is because someone somewhere thinks their investment grade, right?

[B]

Well, someone probably bought their own car and pumped it.

[A]

Some assholes cornering the fucking market. Yeah. I want to do a few questions, and I want to. So I'll save my report from the. From my Pacific Northwest trip, which will. Which is actually pretty fun. But I did want to tell you a funny story before we get to questions. I was flying to Portland to start my road trip, and I was. My camera case. I'm sorry. It wasn't Portland. Where did I just fly the Nismo launch? Excuse me? I was coming back from SFO from Sonoma, where I drove the Nismo Z, which I can talk about on the 18th or something. Yeah. So next week. And I had my camera case. Cause I was filming got stopped, you know, pulled aside, as I do pretty frequently with that case. And they go, what's in here? And I go, cameras and camera mounts. And they go, okay, we found a potential weapon in there. And I go, huh? And I open it, and he pulls out the Leatherman that you gave me.

[B]

TSA approved my birthday.

[A]

TSA approved.

[B]

According to their website. Now.

[A]

Now, I'm sorry. Cause I have a bit of a marijuana problem. Did you give me that for this past birthday or a year ago? Was it this past December or a year ago? December.

[B]

I don't think it was a year ago. I think you've had it long. You had it longer than five months? I think so.

[A]

I've had it for 18 months.

[B]

I think so, yeah.

[A]

17 months.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah.

[A]

Okay. When you first got it to me, I put it in that case.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I've been carrying that code for over one world for 18 months. I have not been stopped until now for having a thing that looks. First off, I was stoked because I got to say, TSA approved. Buddy. No blade. And he, like. He was like, wow, that's pretty cool. Put it back in. Sent me on my way. But it looks just like one that does have a blade. You can't tell from the outside that it doesn't have a blade. You have to take it out and show it to someone. It looks exactly like a regular Leatherman with a blade. I forgot it was even in the camera case. This whole time, I thought I had taken it out, but it turns out I have been flying all over the goddamn Globe security in many nations, mainly Spain and America. But, like, for 18 months, I've been carrying this fucking thing all over the world, and nobody has stopped me to ask a question about it until last week.

[B]

I wonder if.

[A]

Isn't that crazy if the.

[B]

The fidelity of the X ray machine is good enough. They can see blades or they just don't.

[A]

Oh, out of here. No, they cannot.

[B]

You know what they see when we go through those? They see the suction cups on video look like a cartoon bomb. They look like something from a 50s cartoon. It's a round circle with a thing sticking out.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And they look at that and they go, oh, it's not a cartoon bomb from Acme. Great. And then they just send you on your way.

[A]

Yeah. So, I mean, I've probably flown 60 segments carrying.

[B]

I'm glad. I'm glad it's that they acknowledged.

[A]

Oh, right.

[B]

There's no blade that does pass the rules. Here you go. Have a nice day. Because I think the very first time you flew with it, you got stopped and you had to, like, show. And I was, like, texting you the Leatherman website, you know, here, show them this thing. But now. Then they figured it out, but.

[A]

So anyway, they didn't find this thing for a year and a half. Where am I going with this? They're not finding your weed. You can comfortably fly with weed. They're not. You're.

[B]

Okay, okay. Not legal advice.

[A]

Almost not legal advice. It won't hold up in court. But, like, for all. For all practical purposes, if they're not finding this, they're not finding your weed.

[B]

They're looking for lithium batteries and things

[A]

that explode and only big ones. I was told I had taken all the GoPro batteries out of that case. And they asked about lithium batteries, and I said, oh, no, I took them all out of the case. And they're like, can you show me them? And I was like, I have. And they were like, oh, we don't care about those. We just care about the ones that, like, go on drills, like, bigger or, like, power banks and stuff like that. And I was like, well, I'm just gonna take them out anyway. You know, I've been doing that.

[B]

Fires of Fire.

[A]

I don't mind. I mean, continuing to do it.

[B]

Also, it's good practice because I know we've told you this many times, but the audience, a lot of other countries, do care about the small bag.

[A]

All right, let's do a few questions from the Patreon. Also, shout out to Rugarbage for putting on A great live show in LA last week. They fucking rule. Go see them. They're on tour. Where was I? Patreon.com the Smokingtirepodcast is how you get in on the fun. Ask questions for the show, listen to the live stream, watch the livestream, get the show the day it's recorded, right, rather than at the scheduled Tuesday, Thursday. Get exclusive early access to merch, collabs, things like that. And of course, get an extra podcast every month just for [e-mail] the smokingtirepodcast b5s4 I can fixer says Would the average M car buyer actually be better served by an Alpena version? The older I get, the more I want fast and comfy and less race car theater. Well, the second part I can certainly relate to. I mean that's the target of Alpina. Alpina is for people who want to drive the autobahn across Germany to commute 150 miles a day at 150 miles an hour. And the M car is for racetracks. So I think if your vibe is I'm old now, I want a fast ass couch, then yes. Now would the average M car buyer.

[B]

That's the question. Because I think what I see, the new M's in this town seem to be bought by people in their late 20s to early to mid-30s. I'd say for the most part they're still going to want the race car thing. They're not going to want the more comfortable high speed. Also, where we live, you don't commute fast on the highway most of the time.

[A]

Yeah, but I do love me an Alpena.

[B]

Me too.

[A]

Open wide. Open throttle. DDS. DDS. I'm going to the dentist at one o' clock today. I've put my tuned 992s on the local track here in Houston and I've been to a good number of instructed lessons at the track. At what point did you guys say, hey, I am advanced at this?

[B]

This is a good question. I wanted to. I was trying to figure out like, what does HPDE consider? Like what is their advanced criteria? I know they allow open passing usually. It usually means you haven't had a bunch of offs, you're confident around other traffic, you're not so distracted by driving the car on the track that you can't be aware of what's happening around you. But I wonder if there's a specific rule for that.

[A]

Advanced. I would say advanced is you are comfortable showing up to a track that you've never been to. Let's say you go out with Chin or you go out with Speed Ventures. You go out with one of these track day companies and they've got a track day somewhere. You've never been into like. Or it's a track day company at a track day that you've never like. You're comfortable not just getting your car around the racetrack safely, but like, you're comfortable showing up at a track day put on by a company you don't know at a racetrack you don't know. And you can rock up and know what to do from the moment you arrive. You go, okay, well, I'm here now. I have to tech my car. I have to register, I have to get a wristband. The driver's meeting is at this time. These are the questions I might have about the track. I know what the flags mean. I know that I can go out. I'm gonna be at the pit at my assigned time. I know what my assigned times are. My car will be ready when I'm on the track. I'm looking at my mirrors, and as faster traffic approaches me from behind, I'm giving those people point buys in a way that doesn't impede their speed. Or I'm driving predictably. It doesn't necessarily mean I get below a 140 at Laguna or something.

[B]

That could be a hardware thing.

[A]

Yeah, it means that like, you become like a net, even to net positive of the track day experience for others around you. That's when you're advanced.

[B]

You're fluid in the. Fluid fluent in the language.

[A]

Yeah. Of like. Yeah, you're also fluid.

[B]

You're fluid in the language. An example of me still learning English.

[A]

You're a mumble rapper. Yeah, yeah.

[B]

Like

[A]

you understand the track day experience in a way that, you know, you can rock up knowing to a new place and just be comfortable. Yeah, I think that's probably it. And also in and around that you know your car's not going off, you're fucking.

[B]

Well, part of that is that you can go out on the track and you know how to learn the track at a safe ability level. Sorry. Safe speed. You okay? I'm gonna first 10 laps. I'm gonna figure out where things go if you've never been there before. And then you do that safely.

[A]

Yeah. Sigs inside says I keep getting complaints about the smell in my car due to fresh black ice, little trees. Jeez, what air fresheners do you recommend, if any? Oh, man. I mean, look, based on the username, you're ripping heaters in the car. Right. If you're ripping heaters in the car, like, there's not much you can do other than, like, just get it washed all the fucking time.

[B]

Yeah. Because anything you put in there is just adding. It's mixing with that smell. So it could. Sandalwood, whatever. It doesn't care. There's cigarette mixed in there.

[A]

Yeah. Air fresheners are additive. You need to be thinking subtractive.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

That's like, I don't put. My cars always smell fine. I clean them all the time. And so, like, if you clean your car all the time, you don't need an air freshener.

[B]

Yeah, it's true. I haven't had an air freshener in my car in, like, years. And it's fine. Yeah.

[A]

And if you do clean your car all the time and you need an air freshener, do you clean yourself enough?

[B]

That's a good question. Or, you know, is there flossed food under a seat somewhere?

[A]

I can relate to ripping heaters in cars, but I think, like, I don't know. And granted, I was smoking cigarettes at the time, but you were in my cars a lot. Like, when I wasn't actively smoking a cigarette, I didn't have smelly cars. Did.

[B]

I'm pausing because I don't know, because I think I was exposed to it so much that it's possible. I can't remember if I would get in the car and it would still smell like cigarettes. I will say that when I would go home to Santa Cruz, my mom would accuse me of smoking cigarettes.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because my clothing.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. For sure.

[B]

So I think the car. The truck probably did smell a little bit like cigarettes, but once you get in, your nose gets used to it, maybe. Yeah.

[A]

But I was like, it's California. So I always. I was like, you're a.

[B]

Windows down.

[A]

Windows down and all that kind of stuff. It probably did. But I also think I made efforts to keep it pretty minimal. I wash my vehicles a lot.

[B]

True.

[A]

Johnny. Ev Gierberman says the Lexus RC F has been doing well racing this year, which is great when you realize they still make that car. They actually. Are there any other cars you forgot exist? Because they've been around for 15 years and sell six of a year. I just was like. I just randomly. The other night was like, do they sell the Fiat 500 still in America? And they do the electric one. And I think I would like to maybe try one as a press car. It might be kind of fun.

[B]

We should. I feel like I don't see them as Much as I used to when they were kind of new. Because I also wonder if they have held value and been reliable the way other hatchbacks from that era have been.

[A]

Yeah, let's see. Other cars that we forgot exist because they sell so few of them. I mean I probably would forget they exist right now, to be honest with you.

[B]

We'd have to go to like the Lex. Like I'm sure Lexus sells cars we forget they even make.

[A]

They just came out with a new car called New tz I think it's called, it's like a three row. It's like the Lexus version of the Grand Highlander, I think. What, what I mean I just rented and I'll have a review of it next week. I did this road trip in a GMC Acadia. Like I couldn't have told you that that was still a thing they made.

[B]

I would, I see them around a lot. They've very distinctive backside.

[A]

They do. And you'll have my review of that car next year. Tame Impala ss. You often talk about cars being a X price point driving experience. What are some examples of the most overpriced and underpriced driving experiences you can think of in today's market fair? Overpriced. If you were to go to an auction and buy a, a Mercedes AMG wide body 6 liter hammer from 1986. Looks unbelievable. One of the most badass looking cars ever made. Driving it. 380 horsepower, V8, four speed slush box, 80s Mercedes steering would not be exciting. And you're talking about $800,000, $700,000 for something like that. That, so that's, you know, that's up there.

[B]

I also think the newer GTRs, when they were still selling them new and it was $200,000 effectively and it felt more like $120,000. It felt like the old cars with the same transmission, all that stuff. Like it felt like they had just priced it up. They'd adjusted the pricing but not adjusted the car.

[A]

Sure. So those are some overpriced ones. Underpriced driving experiences. Hmm. There's not a lot of budget. There's not a lot of them.

[B]

I mean the GR twins, like the GR86 is a wonderful car to drive and it's pretty affordable still. Like. But does it, does it punch above its weight? It's very slow. But everything else about it feels great. I mean turning, shift, like if you put that steering or turning or balance into other cars that were more expensive, we'd all go, oh yeah.

[A]

This is great, right? And they're in that vein. There's another one. I can't really say because it may break an embargo. But like there's another one that I think is a competitively priced to underpriced driving experience.

[B]

I think the M20Cs is an overpriced driving experience because its direct competitor is itself without the CS and it's 30 grand less.

[A]

Honestly, I think the ZR1 Corvette is potentially an underpriced driving experience. If you put, if you blindfolded somebody and put them in the passenger seat of that car versus in a McLaren 750. I don't think most people could tell you which of those cars is more expensive. I think a very well trained person might be able to. But most people would say that these are basically the same car.

[B]

That's a good point.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

So same with Z06.

[A]

Dude. A secondhand Z06 is probably the most underpriced driving experience.

[B]

Sounds like Ferrari. Feels like Ferrari.

[A]

Yeah. But 90,000 Corvettes. Yeah, all day. Grandma Gears says I impulsively bought a 1991 Alfa Romeo164. Mostly to hear the Busso V6 it runs, but cosmetically is in terrible shape. I'm thinking of racing it in lemons. Good idea. Or should I try to keep it a street car? I never see these in the wild and I doubt it will go up in value. You're correct about both of those last things. I never see them in the wild either and I doubt it will go up in value. My guess is if you really get that motor serviced properly with good stuff, like I bet you it'll be great on a racetrack.

[B]

Maybe.

[A]

Alfa Romeos are not terrible when you zing the shit out the of of them all the time actually. Like, it will probably break a bunch.

[B]

Right?

[A]

But it'll probably be a lot of fun.

[B]

It would sound great. It'd be tons of fun. I'm sure other people have raced Alphas and Lemons. I'm sure they have amazing stories. It's funny because this is very much like a damned if you do and damned if you don't. Like if you drive it on the street. It's in terrible shape. It might break down. If you race it. It might break down, but you'd have more fun.

[A]

Maybe like, maybe you do like, I don't know, DWA rallies with it or something.

[B]

That's a good idea.

[A]

If it's an ugly car that's fun to drive and weird looking is perfect for DWA rallies.

[B]

Do that or the Overcrest Rally. I would do like. I would do one of those. Spend a year doing rallies with it in. Rallies, meaning like group drives, not like stage rally. And then take it to the racetrack. Because the racetrack, by the way, for, you know, grandma gear is like, you have to put a cage in it. Fire suppression. Yeah, that shit costs you lots of money, by the way, so. So keep that in mind.

[A]

Oh, wow. I have last one and then I have to call this show. Apologize. We'll save all the extra questions for next show. But I have a heart out at 10 o'.

[B]

Clock.

[A]

My bad. Gila Monster. Greg says if you had to buy each other a daily driver for 50 to 100k with the goal of sabotaging the other person, what the fuck kind of sabotage are you doing to someone buying them like a $75,000 car? Like a terrible 70,000. I mean. All right, so I'll buy. I'll buy you, Zach, for $75,000. I'll buy you the burned out husk of a 1967 Ferrari 250, you know, whatever the fuck, right? Like, I'll buy you a VIN number surrounded by rust and say, that's pretty bad. Good luck turning that into a car.

[B]

For $75,000, I would buy you like. Like a front wheel drive, street legal. Like cup, not cup. Yeah, like a polo cup.

[A]

That would probably work.

[B]

No, no, I want it to be stiffer than shit with no interior. So it would be uncomfortable, slow, tiny and. Yeah, all those things. Or you know what? I just get you. We saw it before. I would get you an Rs200. Yeah, I'll get you an Rs200.

[A]

Perfect. Thanks, everybody. Thank you to our patrons for writing such good questions today. We'll save the rest of them for next show. Show which will be Thursday or Wednesday. For Wednesday. And I'll see you guys later. Thanks so much. Bye.