Becoming a Financial Badass with Jen Sincero (SB1678)

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Stacking Benjamins Show – “Becoming a Financial Badass with Jen Sincero” (SB1678)

Release Date: May 5, 2025
Hosts: Joe Saul-Sehy and OG
Guest: Jen Sincero, New York Times Bestselling Author

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Introduction

In Episode SB1678 of The Stacking Benjamins Show, hosts Joe Saul-Sehy and OG welcome renowned author and success coach Jen Sincero, best known for her transformative book You Are a Badass and its sequel, You Are a Badass at Making Money. This episode delves deep into the intersection of mindset and financial success, offering listeners actionable insights to become financial badasses in their own right.

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Jen Sincero's Journey to Financial Empowerment

Breaking Free from Financial Struggles

Jen Sincero opens up about her personal transformation from living in her garage and struggling financially in her 40s to becoming a successful author and coach. She shares, “I had my own version of a basement, sort of, which was my garage. I was living in my garage, totally broke, in my 40s. And then one day I made the decision to not be a broke ass loser anymore and make some money” (14:37).

The Power of Taking Action

Sincero emphasizes the importance of moving from overthinking to taking decisive actions. “Once you get sick of sitting there and doing that and you just start to take whatever action feels right, it'll lead you to the answers much more quickly than trying to figure it out in your head” (15:05).

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The Subconscious Mind and Financial Beliefs

Understanding Subconscious Influences

A significant portion of the discussion centers around how subconscious beliefs shape financial behavior. Jen explains, “We are ruled by our subconscious mind. So whatever you're raised believing, whatever your parents and society tell you when you're a little kid gets lodged in your subconscious mind as the truth” (22:11).

Impact of Language on Money Mindset

Through an anecdote about her mother’s misuse of the word “twat,” Jen illustrates how negative language can hinder financial success. “If you keep bad mouthing [money], it's going to be a hell of a lot harder” (25:09).

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Practical Steps to Financial Success

Adopting Positive Self-Talk

Jen advocates for replacing negative self-talk with empowering mantras. She transformed her mantra from “I can’t afford it” to “I live in an abundant universe and I receive money with great glee” (21:34), highlighting the shift in focus from scarcity to abundance.

Leveraging Mantras and Affirmations

The hosts discuss the scientific basis behind affirmations, emphasizing that verbalizing positive statements can rewire the subconscious mind. Jen notes, “Once you become aware of what's going on in your subconscious, you empower yourself to change it” (22:11).

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Listener Engagement: Questions and Advice

Health Savings Account (HSA) Investment Strategies

A listener named Hannah asks about investing her HSA funds, which are currently split between cash and a US Total Stock Market Fund. Steve Stewart advises, “If you look into the future and say, we've got another health plan or we've got another insurance option that makes it so we don't need this cash, then by all means, invest the money” (33:00).

Retirement Contributions vs. Taxable Accounts

Another listener, Bobby, inquires whether he should scale back his retirement contributions in favor of investing in a taxable account for a future home down payment. Steve cautions against reducing retirement savings, emphasizing the power of compounding: “The money that you're investing today is going to have the most opportunity for it to double” (36:56). OG adds, “I don't know that I would do that either... It doesn't matter” (40:44), reinforcing the importance of maintaining robust retirement contributions.

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Key Takeaways and Insights

Focus on What You Gain

Jen stresses shifting focus from what one fears losing to what they stand to gain through financial changes. “You basically have to focus on what you're gonna gain from the change, rather on what you fear losing from the change” (20:07).

Subconscious Beliefs as Growth Barriers

Understanding and altering subconscious beliefs are crucial steps in financial growth. Jen asserts, “If your subconscious mind thinks it's going to be no fun, or put you at risk of looking like a moron, or put you at risk of being abandoned, you won't let yourself do it” (22:11).

Positive Language Fuels Positive Outcomes

The language used to describe money can either empower or hinder financial progress. Jen’s story about her mother's misuse of words underscores the importance of clear and positive communication about finances (25:09).

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Conclusion

The Stacking Benjamins Show episode featuring Jen Sincero provides a compelling exploration of how mindset profoundly impacts financial success. Listeners are encouraged to identify and transform limiting beliefs, adopt empowering mantras, and take decisive actions towards their financial goals. Jen’s personal stories and practical advice serve as a roadmap for anyone aspiring to become a financial badass.

For more insights and to explore Jen Sincero's work, visit her website jensincero.com and check out her latest book, You Are a Badass at Making Money.

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Notable Quotes:

• Jen Sincero: “Once you get sick of sitting there and doing that and you just start to take whatever action feels right, it'll lead you to the answers much more quickly than trying to figure it out in your head.” (15:05)

• Jen Sincero: “We are ruled by our subconscious mind. So whatever you're raised believing, whatever your parents and society tell you when you're a little kid gets lodged in your subconscious mind as the truth.” (22:11)

• Jen Sincero: “I live in an abundant universe and I receive money with great glee.” (21:34)

• Steve Stewart: “The money that you're investing today is going to have the most opportunity for it to double.” (36:56)

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Note: Time stamps correspond to moments within the episode where the quotes were made.

Transcript

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

This message is brought to you by Navy Federal Credit Union. May is Military Appreciation Month and we're celebrating the military community that goes above and beyond every day along with Navy Federal Credit Union. For over 90 years, Navy Federal's mission has been to support and uplift all active duty veterans and members of military families and this May is no different. It's a special time to recognize the profound contributions they make. Learn more@navy federal.org Navy Federal Credit Union Our members are the mission Navy Federal is insured by NCUA Small Business Owners State Farms there with small business insurance to fit your specific needs. Whether you're starting a new venture or growing an existing one, State Farm helps you choose the right coverage to protect what matters most. Working with a local State Farm agent helps you understand your coverage options, offering local support to help you achieve your goals. Focused on turning your passion into a thriving business. Knowing your insurance can change as your business grows.

[OG]

Stay Farm here to help you succeed with your business like a good neighbor.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

State Farm is there hey Stackers.

[OG]

Happy Monday.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

We have a fantastic Monday guest, Jen Sincero. And if you have not heard Jen Sincero before, she had a huge book called you are a badass and then you are a badass with money. And Jen Sincero today is going to help you be a badass with money. She's just another in a great line of guests that we've had on the Stacking Benjamin show. I'm super happy Jen's been on a couple times. Of course this year has been phenomenal. We did two episodes around earning more money to begin the year. We had Jen and Jill from Frugal Friends on then to lock down your budget right, make more money, lock down your expenses. And we just spent a few weeks talking about having more drive with Molly Fletcher and then how not to invest with financial planner extraordinaire Barry Ritholtz. And then we went into career mode where we took more of a macro view, exploring the career of Taylor Swift and doing a case study. And then the next week getting very tactical with the amazing coach Loretta K. Lee. Well, this next eight weeks we are going to begin pivoting more toward investing. If there's a theme for the next eight weeks it's going to be investing in your portfolio. We're going to take a week and talk about international investing. We're going to take a week and talk about your spend down plan. And whether you're 25 or 55 or 75, you want to know what your spend down plan is going to be. They call it Decumulation Plan. We're going to, of course, mix it up with some other fun stuff. We're going to talk about good eating. We'll also talk to the amazing Robert Niles from Theme Park Insider, who always helps us kick off summer. So that begins today with this mindset shift with Jen Sincero. We're going to start with Investing mindset next week. This is our greatest hits week and that's the reason why we're playing that one today. I'll explain why we have the Wednesday and the Friday shows as a prelude to both of those coming up. But just a couple quick notes for the calendar. Number one is on Thursday, Thursday, May 15th. That's next Thursday. If you're listening to this on the day, it comes out on May 5, 2025. But May 15, 2025, we have a special event about why most retirement calculators suck. Now, we haven't had a YouTube live event in a long time. We've already had a lot of people sign up, which is awesome. But if you go to stackybenjamins.com bolden2025 and the reason we're calling it Bolden is because the creator, the Bolden Calculator, my fav it most professional calculator for money geeks, the Bolding calculator. Its creator, Steve Chen is joining us. He did this a few years ago. I think we had about 500 people join. It was really exciting. This is going to be great. OG and I will dig deep with Steve and show you why most of these calculators suck and how to get the most out of the retirement calculators that you use. It's right in the middle of our eight weeks of investing. So I can't wait for that. But to sign up stackybenjamins.com B O L D I N2025 I sent out an email and I said Wednesday, May 15th. And so it's Thursday, May 15th. All my days start running together, don't they? Speaking of running together. Well, what's running right after that is we've got that on May 15th and I turn around and then fly to Boston and we are doing a meetup at Idle Hands Craft Brewing in Malden. And that is going to be on May 20th. And the way to join me there is Stacky Benjamin.com meetup stacky benjamin.com meetup Boston friends and should be a great time at Idle Hands Craft Brewing. Looks like a really cool place and I can't wait to meet a bunch of our Stacker family in Boston. The Fun starts at 6:30pm so come join us. And by the way, that Bolden event, I don't know if I said it, 8:00 Eastern, 5:00 Pacific for the calculator event. All right, we're gonna get started now with all going all the way back to 2017. I'm gonna chop up this, this show just a little bit. There's a interview at the beginning with Jackson Hewitt that was it was the day that taxes were due. Texts were due that year on April 16th or 17th. And this is the April 16th episode from 2017. But the Jensen Chero piece, the everything else is phenomenal. So couple but before we get going, we've got a couple of sponsors that make sure this is free and you can keep on coming on. We're going to hear from them. And then let's hear our episode with Jen Sincero. This message is brought to you by Navy Federal Credit Union. May is Military Appreciation Month and we're celebrating the military community that goes above and beyond every day with Navy Federal Credit Union. Navy Federal was created for the military community. It is dedicated to ensuring that its members feel celebrated and honored every single day. For over 90 years, Navy Federal's mission has been to support and uplift the military community. And this May is no different. It's not just a credit union, it's also a partner dedicated to helping its members achieve their financial goals. All active duty veterans and members of the military families are eligible to join. Navy Federal is excited to celebrate Military Appreciation Month as a special time to recognize our troops and the profound contributions that they make. Learn more@navy federal.org Celebrate Navy Federal Credit Union. Our members are the mission. Navy Federal is insured by NCUA Small Business Owners State Farms there with small business insurance to fit your specific needs. Whether you're starting a new venture or growing an existing one, State Farm helps you choose the right coverage to protect what matters most. Working with a local State Farm agent helps you understand your coverage options. Offering local support to help you achieve your goals. Focused on turning your passion into a thriving business. Knowing your insurance can change as your business grows. Stay Farm here to help you succeed with your business like a good neighbor. State Farm is there.

[Doug]

So you'll pick me up tonight at 7:45?

[Steve Stewart]

Well, no, I got a few things to take care of first, but why don't we make it quarter to eight?

[OG]

Stop it.

[Steve Stewart]

Okay, 7:45.

[Jen Sincero]

You're listening to the Stacking Benjamin Show. Hey everyone, I'm Joe's Mom's neighbor, Doug. And welcome to my triumphant return driving this podcast. Look, I don't know what you heard on Friday. Something about me selling Joe's mom's rock collection or some bull story like that. Look, here's what really happened. I was in the front yard washing my rocks off when I come down to the basement and see that jerk face Steve Stewart sitting in my chair. Yeah, Steve. Last time I ever call you the amazing Steve Stewart. Kiss that goodbye. Anyway, it's your lucky day because I'm back. And on today's show, help us welcome the author of youf're a Badass at Making Money, Jen Sincero. Of course, we'll pile on some financial headlines, my amazing trivia answer a call on the Haven lifeline, and more. And here they are, two guys who should have never let that evil Steve Stewart take over Friday show. Joe and O. J, J, J, J.

[Hannah]

Steve.

[Jen Sincero]

That's how the pros do it. Just stay in the shallow end of the pool, dude.

[OG]

Hey, Happy Monday. We are back. And across the card table from me, it's the one and only. Other guys, we call him OG what's.

[Steve Stewart]

Your favorite Easter candy that the Easter bunny brought you yesterday?

[OG]

Anything? Reese's Pieces. So those Reese's, those Reese's Eggs, you know, Mom's always like, joe, where are you going with all those Reese's eggs in your pocket?

[Steve Stewart]

Is that a Reese's Egg in your pocket or are you happy to see Easter?

[OG]

I'm like, it's like 27.

[Steve Stewart]

I like those commercials where the chocolate bunny is, like, hopping and they got the Barry White music, and then he, like, leans in and kisses the peanut butter and then poof. Then the. Then Reese's Egg is born and there's the egg, right? Yeah.

[OG]

Is that how it works Is that how mom describes the birds and the Beast to you?

[Steve Stewart]

Well, yeah, that's how it works, right?

[OG]

Jensen Churro is a badass, and she is going to be a badass at helping us finally figure out how to make some money. Fantastic book. And she's hilarious. So she's been a musician, a comedian. She's a success coach. Jen Sincero. Coming down to the basement. But first, we've got some headlines.

[Hannah]

Hello, darlings. And now it's time for your favorite part of the show, our stacking Benjamin's Headlines.

[OG]

This comes to us from NAPA-NET, the National association of Plan Advisors. People that handle 401ks and pension plans, that type of thing says retirement plans dominate TDF Holdings. I thought this was. This was really cool. A new report finds that 88% of target date fund mutual fund assets were held through deferred compensation plans. Report from the Investment Company Institute notes that as of the end of last year, new data out shows the Target Date mutual fund assets totaled 887 billion, up 1.5% in the fourth quarter and up 16% for the year. How about that?

[Steve Stewart]

Yeah. Target Date funds, my absolute favorite.

[OG]

But you know what, in all seriousness, I'm glad to see, because you and I used to see. What we used to see is somebody would come in and they're like, yeah, I have this 401k. Been saving in it for 5 or 6 years.

[Steve Stewart]

It's on the stable value fund.

[OG]

Right, Right. What did you pick? I didn't pick anything. And you know what's happening in most of these cases? The Target day fund is probably the new default option in the case. And the money's going there. So better than nothing.

[Steve Stewart]

Yeah. So Target Day funds a lot worse places you can put your money.

[OG]

Yeah. And. And still not the best place to put your money in most cases.

[Steve Stewart]

But I'd rather have that than a stable value fund, which is like a cash account or just some government bond fund or something.

[OG]

Said assets and IRAs totaled $7.9 trillion at the end of the fourth quarter 2016, an increase of 1.1% from the end of the third quarter. While government defined benefit plans, including federal, state and local government plans, held $5.5 trillion in assets as of the end of December, a 2.4% increase. So pension plan assets actually went up the highest of any of these.

[Hannah]

Which.

[OG]

Which is good. Maybe. Maybe pension fund managers are finally finding a way to get themselves out of trouble.

[Steve Stewart]

Yeah. Use target date funds instead of buying, you know, bridges and weird, weird investment products that they get pitched.

[OG]

Right. Crazy stuff. I'll have a link to this in our show notes@stacking benjamins.com I like to call people crazy. For me, it's a sign of endearment when you call people crazy. And I have to say that our next guest OG is definitely crazy. Jen Sincero is the number one New York Times bestselling author, success coach, and as she calls herself, motivational kettle prod. How do you like that?

[Steve Stewart]

Are there unmotivational cattle prods?

[OG]

I think a kettle prod in and of itself, yeah. She's helped countless people transform their personal and professional lives via seminars, public appearances, newsletters, products, and of course her book, which was called you are a badass, that wasn't her first Book. She in the early 90s worked for CBS Records and wrote a very funny semi autobiographical novel called don't sleep with your drummer. The book that really hit it though is that number one bestseller, which is you are a badass. How to stop doubting your greatness and start living an awesome life. And of course now she has a brand new book, you are a badass at making money. And we could all use a little of that OG So some badassery. It's awesome. Coming down to the basement, Jen Sincero and Jensen. Cheryl joins us in the basement. Welcome, badass.

[Hannah]

Thanks so much. It's great to be here.

[OG]

I don't get to just call somebody I just met badass right away, but everybody does that to you. I have to imagine.

[Hannah]

Yeah, it's kind of weird, but it's also kind of awesome.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

It is.

[OG]

It is awesome. There's nothing better than being a couple badasses sitting in my mom's basement.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Is that possible?

[OG]

Apparently so.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Well, let's talk about this because you weren't always a badass with money, were you?

[Hannah]

I wasn't. And actually I had my own version of a basement, sort of, which was my garage. I was living in my garage, totally broke, in my 40s. And then one day I made the decision to not be a broke ass loser anymore and make some money.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Well, and it's funny because you say in your book at the beginning you were wallowing, I'm going to quote here, you're wallowing in what you call the.

[OG]

I don't know what to do with myself Quagmire, age 40.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

How did you even end up there, Jen?

[Hannah]

I just, I think I just got too obsessed with figuring it out in my brain before taking any action. And it was, you know, because you can roll things around in your for the rest of your life pretty much. But once you get sick of sitting there and doing that and you just start to take whatever action feels right, it'll lead you to the answers much more quickly than trying to figure it out in your head.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

But it's funny, you talk about the actions a lot and I know that.

[OG]

You'Ve said in the past that you focused on some of the wrong things like free bread at the restaurant.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

I love your story about telling your.

[OG]

Friends you're not hungry, then the free.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Bread appears and it's all gone.

[Hannah]

Yeah, I know. You know, it's just that, like getting by attitude, like, where can I get a free meal? Where can I get free drinks? You know, that's what I was focusing on. Instead of focusing on how can I make some more money?

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Well, and I get the feeling from you too that it's about bandwidth, right? That you can only think about so many things, so why not train your brain to focus on the right things?

[OG]

Would that be true?

[Hannah]

Totally. And also, you know what you focus on, you create more of. That's why when you're looking for a house to rent or something, suddenly for rent, signs seem to appear everywhere. But of course, they were always there. So what you focus on, you see all around you. So if you're focusing on being broke and finding the deals and your debt, everything, it just seems bigger. But when you start focusing on abundance and opportunity and things that you can do to change your life, you start to see those.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

It's funny because some people call this hocus pocus.

[OG]

And I know at one time, or a bunch of mumbo jumbo, whatever, I focus on it and it materializes. Yada yad. You were at that point once on a trip to Las Vegas. Tell me about that.

[Hannah]

Well, I was at a coaching seminar and this speaker just totally blew my mind. And I really wanted to work with him. He was a coach. And is this the story you're talking about?

[OG]

Yes. Yeah.

[Hannah]

By the way. Okay, good. I have other stories from Las Vegas. This may not be the one. Yeah.

[OG]

Should I tell the one I can tell on radio?

[Hannah]

Yeah, exactly. And anyway, it's kind of a long story, but I basically wanted to work with him. And he cost $85,000 to work with private. And I mean, that amount of money just seemed not only impossible, but completely irresponsible. Out of my league, 8 million things. But I had made the decision that I was changing my life. And I, instead of saying I can't afford it, which I would have done in the old days, I started thinking about, okay, how am I going to pull this off? And that was such a game changer, I forgot.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

You know what's funny? That wasn't the story, but I love that story. No, the other one was where they.

[OG]

Had you stand up and say something.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Like, there's no place like more money.

[OG]

Or there was.

[Steve Stewart]

Oh, right.

[Hannah]

Well, yes, that was probably the same seminar. But yeah, I think it was. I would do anything. Like, I was more sick of being broke than I was needing to be cool. You know what I mean? So even though I thought it was all hocus pocus, and even though I thought it was super cheesy, I went to all of these seminars and would stand on my chair with my little name tag on and scream I'm a wealth magnet. Like whatever I had to do, I showed up.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

But in your book, and not just.

[OG]

In your book, but now it seems like your mind has changed.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Like this is true. If you don't believe it yourself, you're never going to get there.

[Hannah]

Oh my gosh. I am the biggest loud mouth disciple of all this woo hooery because I've seen it work over and over in my life and I've been a coach for over 10 years and I see it work in my clients lives over and over.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

My dad for a long time collected Santa Clauses.

[OG]

We bought him Santa Clauses all the time. You have a friend with an owl collection. Can you tell me a little bit about her?

[Hannah]

Well, she mentioned in passing one day while shopping with her mother that she thought there was like a little owl figurine or something that she thought was kind of cool. And then her mother took that and ran with it. So for the next like five years, everybody gave her owl soap on a rope, an owl cross stitch, owl T shirts. It was just completely out of control. And I use this story in my book to show how important it is to stick up for what makes you happy. You know, everybody sort of accepts expected her to be this owl person and she was hates owls now. She was completely inundated with them and decided she didn't want them anymore. So much to the disappointment of her entire family and friend group. She was like, the next person who gives me an owl is getting their head chopped off. So you know, they didn't want to hear it. They identified her as a certain person and they were really disappointed when she changed. Which is often what happens to us when we decide to stop being the broke person or the single person or the overweight person and make a big change in our life. It disappoints the people around us and a lot of times that's what's stops us from doing it.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

It's like you feel this commitment to the past to continue to be the.

[OG]

Same person used to be.

[Hannah]

Exactly. Because the biggest human fear is the fear of abandonment. So if you change, you risk being abandoned by the people you love because you're going to be different. And that is a very driving force in us.

[OG]

But what do you have to do.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

To counter that though, Jen? You know, it seems to me that you have to leverage where you're going enough to get over that fear.

[Hannah]

Yeah, I mean, you basically have to focus on what you're gonna gain from the change, rather on what you fear losing from the change, it really. I mean, this is the thing that just I found to be so almost insulting that I wasted 40 years living in a converted garage, you know, that it wasn't that hard. Like, the great thing about this quote, unquote hocus pocus is the power of your focus and the power of paying really close attention to what makes you feel good and raising your energy and your emotional connection to what you're doing. That's how you change your life.

[OG]

It's so funny.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

As you're talking, I'm thinking I spent, you know, I've always been fairly successful, but I had a period during my financial planning career where there was maybe five years where my income didn't grow. I was really spinning my wheels. I wasn't sure what I wanted to focus on. I met this woman who was a coach. I thought that, okay, I'll try her out.

[OG]

But once again, I thought nothing was going to change.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

I think my income went up by 85 or 90,000 that year. Which for me at the time, I mean, that was just. And still to me today, that's a. It was a huge difference. Just because I changed my mindset and started thinking about where I wanted to be. And maybe it was also, Jen, the.

[OG]

Saying it out loud thing.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

And I know you talk about this in your book, but this idea of having a mantra and saying it out loud, like people think that's baloney, but. But I think that sometimes your ears have to hear it, you know?

[Hannah]

Absolutely. And then when you start looking at what you are saying out loud, like my mantra forever was, I can't afford it. I said, I can't afford it. It was kind of my answer to pretty much anything you asked me. And when I made the decision to make money, I stopped myself from saying that. Every time I was about to say it, I'd switch it to, I live in an abundant universe and I receive money with great glee or something like that to change my focus on looking to where the money could come from, looking to new opportunities, opening up my mindset. It's such a game changer.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

What's the science behind this, Jen? Because you've been doing this for a long time now.

[Hannah]

Yeah. And it is. It's a couple of things. It is. We are ruled by our subconscious mind. So for those of you who don't know this stuff, it's basically whatever you're raised believing, whatever your parents and society tell you when you're a little kid gets lodged in your subconscious mind as the truth. Because when you're A kid, you haven't developed that analytical part of your brain that can sort of question it. So if they tell you that money is hard to make, you're an idiot. You know, you never get to do fun things to make money. That's going to be your subconscious belief. So when you grow up to be an adult and you're trying to make money and you know you consciously would love some money, if your subconscious mind thinks it's going to be no fun, or put you at risk of looking like a moron, or put you at risk of being abandoned, you won't let yourself do it. So that's why becoming aware of your thoughts and beliefs is the very first and biggest, most important step to changing your life. Because once you become aware of what's going on in your subconscious, you empower yourself to change it.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

And I absolutely love stories. And you tell a story about this, I think very close, if not this.

[OG]

Very topic in the book.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

When you went to Italy a lot.

[OG]

As a kid, by the way, that would suck, having to go to Italy all the time, man.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

But how does that figure into your bunny story?

[OG]

Can you tell the Italy story?

[Hannah]

So my dad grew up in Naples, and we were, you know, having some gigantic Italian feast at some restaurant, and this plate of deep fried circles showed up in front of me. And my father was like, you know.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Go ahead, eat one.

[Hannah]

I was terrified to eat it because I didn't know what it was and he wouldn't tell me what it was. And of course, in my mind, I was like, what could you deep fry that would turn into a circle? And I was like, it's gotta be worms. You know, there's nothing else on earth that could look like that. And I was so terrified and so grossed out, but my entire. We had a million relatives over there, and they're all watching me and waiting for me to eat this thing. And so out of pride, I made myself eat it. And I'm gagging and waiting for it to explode in my mouth, and I'm so grossed out. And it ended up not being that bad at all. And it ended up being calamari. It was the first time I had calamari. But, you know, because in my mind I had made it worms. I was gagging like my whole body reacted as if that's what it was and that's how powerful our thoughts are. You know, if you keep telling yourself something over and over, you will create that reality, be it a great reality or a crappy reality.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Do you speak with your hands a.

[OG]

Lot like most Italian people.

[Hannah]

Oh, my gosh. I have to hold the microphone on my headset with one hand, but the other one is flying all around the room.

[OG]

I think it's a prerequisite.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

When I went to Italy, I had.

[OG]

To start speaking with my hands, like.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Just to fit in, you know.

[Hannah]

Well, they don't understand you. They can't hear you if you don't.

[OG]

That's so great.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

I would like you, if you don't.

[OG]

Mind, Jen, because it looks like we're running out of time, but you had an incident with your mother. One morning. She had an empty coffee cup. Do you mind telling us about that? Because I thought this was another.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Your book is so full of wonderful.

[OG]

Analogies, and this is just another of 50 bajillion of them.

[Hannah]

Oh, thank you. Well, so my mother, one day she was on the board of trustees of her little suburban town, you know, all sort of, well to do, upstanding people, and discovered that she was misusing a word. She thought the word twat meant twit. So in front of her entire committee, she was saying things, you know, like, what stupid twat put a stop sign at the end of Elm Road? Or what stupid twat thought it would be a good idea to plant roses in the meeting. So everybody in town was a stupid twat. And she had no idea what she was saying until finally one of the members pulled her aside and told her to clean up her act. Much to her extreme horror. She was completely humiliated. But I use this in the book as an example of the power of our words and how often we misuse words, especially the word money. You know, we call money the root of all evil when it's actually greed that is the root of all evil. And if you want to make some money, if you keep bad mouthing it, it's going to be a hell of a lot harder. So getting very clear on how you speak about money and, you know, getting clear about what you're saying is super important.

[OG]

That's such a great story. And I felt so. I felt so horrified for your mom. She must have been.

[Jen Sincero]

Oh, my gosh.

[Hannah]

Well, thank God she has an excellent sense of humor. But it was. It was rough, I'm not gonna lie.

[OG]

Well, I know where you got it from then, Chen. The book is, you're a badass at making money.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

The book's out tomorrow.

[Hannah]

Available whereat, everywhere, in bookstores, indie bookstores, online, my website, which is jensincero.com, and that's J E N and then sincero is spelled like sincere with an o on the end. So J-E N S I N C E D R O.com we'll have a.

[OG]

Link also on our show [e-mail] to Jensono.com Jen, it was great hanging out with you. Thanks for spending a little time with us.

[Hannah]

Oh my pleasure. This was super fun. Thanks so much.

[Jen Sincero]

Hi everyone. I'm Joe's mom's neighbor Doug and I got an announcement. There's sunshine coming in through those little windows along the top of the basement today. You know, maybe it's time for a much needed vacation to the beach. Or maybe I could even see if Gertrude down at the Sizzler will pony up the big money so we can visit the world's biggest ball of twine together. That's not for the faint of heart. I'm talking about Gertrude, not the ball of twine. Anyway, here's a vacation oriented question for you. What continental state has more shoreline than the entire Eastern seaboard? I'll be back with your answer right after this.

[Ryan Reynolds]

You know that feeling when someone shows up for you just when you need it most? That's what Uber is all about. Not just a ride or dinner at your door. It's how Uber helps you show up for the moments that matter. Because showing up can turn a tough day around or make a good one even better. Whatever it is, big or small, Uber is on the way. So you can be on yours. Uber On Our Way.

[Doug]

At Capella University, you can learn at your own pace with our flexpath learning format. Take one or two courses at a time and complete as many as you can in a 12 week billing session. With Flexpath, you can even finish the Bachelor's degree you started in 22 months for $20,000. A different future is closer than you think with Capella University. Learn more at capella.edu. fastest 25% of students cost varies by pace, Transfer credits and other factors. Fees apply.

[Hannah]

Ryan Reynolds here for Mint Mobile. I don't know if you knew this, but anyone can get the same Premium Wireless for $15 a month plan that I've been enjoying. It's not just for celebrities. So do like I did and have one of your assistant's assistants switch you to Mint Mobile today. I'm told it's super easy to [e-mail].

[OG]

Switch upfront payment of $45 for three equivalent to $15 per month required intro.

[Hannah]

Rate first three months only, then full.

[OG]

Price plan options available, taxes and fees extra. See full terms at Mint Mobile Dot com.

[Jen Sincero]

Hi, everyone. Joe's mom's neighbor, Doug.

[OG]

Welcome back.

[Jen Sincero]

I've been looking at photos online of the world's biggest ball of twine. And man, I'll just say that this is probably the third biggest gift to mankind behind cheese grits and those little trees you put in your best shoes. Who thought of those? Well, let's get back to vacations because before the break, I asked you this question. What continental state has more shoreline than the entire eastern seaboard? The answer, Michigan. Now that information comes directly from the state of Michigan's website, so I would be a little skeptical. Those folks are sketchy. Yeah, that's like the Chicago Cubs bragging about supposedly what in the World Series last year. Whatever. Find that in a reputable publication and I'll believe it. See?

[OG]

Big thanks again to Jen Sincero for coming down to the basement. Oh, gee. She and I spent a lot of time talking about how a lot of these, you know, the mantra thing and the telling yourself there's no place. It all seems kind of woo woo. But there's. There's truth in it.

[Steve Stewart]

There's power, and you can't fool yourself. That's one of the greatest things that I got out of, I don't know, Tony Robbins or Wayne Dyer or somebody like that. It was basically, you are the most trustworthy person that you know of.

[OG]

That self talk is so important.

[Steve Stewart]

And if you tell yourself, I'm a dummy, I'm a dummy. I'm a dummy, your brain goes, yeah, I guess you're a dummy.

[OG]

I can't tell you the number of times that I worked with people that had massive debt who. Their self talk was so horrible. I knew I wasn't gonna help them.

[Steve Stewart]

Oh, yeah. They're like, well, I'm just this big spender. Yeah, I just overspend on things. I can't keep it under control. And you're gone.

[OG]

You keep. You keep telling yourself that. It's never gonna get better.

[Steve Stewart]

It's like my. It's like Mrs. OG playing golf. I'm the world's worst putter. I'm like, no, don't say that.

[OG]

Right, right before she putts.

[Steve Stewart]

Right before your putt. I'm like, no, no, don't like, I'm gonna make this. I'm gonna make it. I'm gonna make it. I'm gonna make it. I'm gonna make it. I'm a great putter. I'm a great putter. Yeah, Putting in money. Don't you always make money putting? Isn't that what they Say driving's for show, putting for dough.

[OG]

Absolutely. I don't know that I have anything.

[Steve Stewart]

I'm trying to put those things together. See, that's my segue, right?

[OG]

Good work. How about this segue? Let's throw out David lifeline, some of life's most important questions. Let's right now throw out the life.

[Steve Stewart]

That's what she said.

[OG]

Let's right now throw out the. The Haven lifeline to our friend Hannah. Hello, Hannah.

[H]

Hi, Joe and Og. This is Hannah. Question about health savings accounts. My husband and I have $18,000 in health savings account. About half is in cash and the other half is invested in a US Total stock market fund. We can't contribute to our HSA for at least the next year, and we also don't expect to need the money unless I get mauled by a bear or something equally catastrophic. Shouldn't we invest the money like it's a retirement account? Should we keep a bunch of money in cash? We don't really do bonds anywhere else, but the bond funds seem pretty good, so we could allocate money to lower volatility options. I'm just not sure how we should think about this, given that it used to be something that we needed cash for, but now probably isn't so much a part of our immediate cash needs. Thanks.

[OG]

Thank you, Hannah.

[Steve Stewart]

Smartest thing she said there was, we don't do bond funds.

[OG]

So Og her hsa.

[Steve Stewart]

This comes up from time to time when you might change jobs and you get a different health plan and you've got this hsa, but now you've got different health insurance that makes it so you don't need an HSA anymore. Maybe they just cover more options or whatever the case may be. Investing in an HSA is very similar to investing anywhere else. You want to make sure that the money that you might need, the short term, is liquid in cash, and the rest of it is fair game for investing. Got to be aware of a couple of things. Firstly, if the HSA provider requires a minimum amount in cash without charging a fee, some of them have, you know, you got to keep 3,000 in cash or we charge you $5 a month, that sort of thing, you want to be aware of that. But if you look into the future and say, we've got another health plan or we've got another insurance option that makes it so we don't need this cash, then by all means, invest the money. Usually the rule of thumb is that's kind of the way that I think about it anyway, is you want to have your maximum out of pocket money in cash for the year. So if your plan says, hey, we're going to need to spend $6,000 out of pocket before the insurance kicks in, then you might want to keep about 6,000 in cash and the rest can get invested. And, or if you're regularly contributing to it, you can kind of account for those monthly deposits as well. But. But yeah, if you don't need the money, you don't think you're gonna need the money. You don't live by any bears. Off you go.

[OG]

I like that I don't have anything, dad. How's that? Thanks for the question, Hannah.

[Steve Stewart]

First time in a long time.

[OG]

If you've got a question for the Haven lifeline, send those to stacking benjamin.com forward/voicemail and see how easy it was. Hannah stepped up to the plate, asked her question and OG knocked it out of the park for and we saved Hannah from the bears. That's good. Good.

[Steve Stewart]

Duh. Bears.

[OG]

We also get letters to the show and Doug just brought down the mail. Let's see, we have today. This comes to us from Bobby. Bobby says, hey Joe and OG and everyone. Long time listener, first time writer. You're my 14th favorite movie recommendation podcast. Congratulations. Yeah, that's not our strong suit, as Bobby very well points out. He goes, though I read, haven't heard it myself firsthand, that you also answer personal finance questions. My question deals with whether I should invest money into a taxable account instead of my retirement account. I'm a 25 year old unmarried man who is a public school teacher. Within the next five to seven years, I'd like to purchase a home, condo, townhouse, et cetera. I'm happy with my job at present, will receive a full pension when I'm eligible to retire, which will be at age 57. While it's always possible I'll decide to change jobs or careers, I'll still qualify for a partial pension, even if it's not the full amount. The pension system I'm enrolled in would pay me 60% of the average salary. My highest grossing 5 years each year until I die, currently make about 70,000 a year and will earn moderate raises moving forward. Because I'll receive a pension and Social Security benefits, I'm wondering whether it makes sense for me to scale back my retirement contributions and instead put the money into a taxable account, which should be used for a larger down payment on a future house. Currently I'm putting 6,000 into my taxable account every year. Max out my 403 plan that's 403B. A lot like a 401K and my Roth IRA and contribute $500 a month into the taxable account. My total expenditures each month is about $2,000 inclusive of rent, food fund money. I have no student debt, credit card debt or car payment. Currently my net worth consists of 29,000, the Roth IRA, 28,000, the 403, 84,000 in the taxable accounts, 10,000 in cash. Any advice you have to offer would be sincerely appreciated. Bobby. Great letter, Bobby. Congratulations on doing a lot of stuff right, you know, pension and Social Security. So should he scale back that 403?

[Steve Stewart]

Not in a million years. Yeah, that doesn't make me very comfortable. We talk about a lot on the show here about the effect of compounding. And the money that you're investing today is going to have the most opportunity for it to double. And the money that you contribute when you're 55, of course, right before you retire will have the least opportunity. So you want to get as much of those most opportunities as you can. I don't know what size house you're looking for. You didn't give that away. But with 84,000. Did you say 84,000 or 8,400 in a regular account? It says 84,000, 84,000 in a regular account. That's a pretty healthy investment account for a 25 year old, let alone a down payment fund. If you're counting that as your down payment fund. I don't know where you live or what kind of size house you're looking for, but if you're shopping in the $300,000 house range, which is, I would say, pretty nice house, that's already 20% and then some. So I'd be comfortable with that. I think that you got to plan for what happens if that pension gets cut in half. A lot of the news these days, especially around municipal pensions, state pensions, is around the fact that those pensions aren't funded very well. And what that means is that they assumed that they were going to get 10% a year return, but they're really getting seven or six or five. And so they've got lots of money coming out and not a lot of money going in because they're using faulty assumptions and that's causing a lot of problems. So my concern would be if that pension value or if your benefit value got cut in half, would you still be able to make it, you know, 60% of your income in retirement plus Social Security might get you pretty close right now, but I'd rather err on the side of flexibility.

[OG]

Well, and I'd also err on the side of safety. And there's a good documentary out there called Broken Eggs. It's a film about the looming retirement crisis. You can find it@broken eggsfilm.com we had the creators on, if you remember, a couple of years ago, some years ago.

[Steve Stewart]

Yeah.

[OG]

And just talks about retirement. You know, they talk about retirement as a three legged stool. Right. You have government benefits. That's the Social Security part of Bobby's question. He says he has Social Security and then the second one is pensions and then the third one is your own savings. Right. So. So they call that the three legged stool. Well, in this film they talk about how broken two of those legs really are, about how the pension, I mean, how many times have you and I talked about pensions and all the bad things that could still happen to pensions? We don't know. And it at Bobby's age, who knows what's going to go on with pensions.

[Steve Stewart]

35 years from now or 32 years from now. That's a long time.

[OG]

Yeah. So betting on that, number one is sketchy. We've, we're hearing again as we talk about lots of reforms in, in Washington and having to do things, knocking on the Social Security door again, which personally I think they should. I, I mean there's no way that ball continues the way that is now. But so between now, I think if.

[Steve Stewart]

They change it, if they change it now and give people 30, 40 years to figure it out. Yeah, you know, you're okay.

[OG]

Right, right. But, but once again, for Bobby, Social Security is not going to be the way that it is now if it's got to be different if the expected stuff happens. So what his question to me says is I have this three legged stool. Should I take the one that I control and put less money away? Because I have the two that are sketchy left. And I'd say no, don't rely on the other two, rely on it to some degree.

[Steve Stewart]

But now, arguably his question isn't whether he should stop saving, but rather he should he save into a different place.

[OG]

Right.

[Steve Stewart]

And I don't know that I would do that either. You know, you're getting some tax benefits by the increased contributions in your 403B. You've got the Roth IRA that you're maxing out.

[OG]

But still a lot of this is behavioral. If he saves into the 403B, he knows that's retirement money in his mind. It's funny, recently I was reading a Piece that I tweeted out a couple weeks ago that, that was fascinating about dividends. And it was, stocks make money a couple ways. Number one is they appreciate in value and number two is they pay a dividend. Right. Those are two ways they make money. And they asked a bunch of investors, if you had an expense today and all you have is the stock, would you rather take the dividend and spend it or sell some of the stock? And every person listening to the show should know it doesn't matter. Right? I mean, if you, if you're reinvesting the dividend, it doesn't matter. It's all growth. And yet which one did people pick? They always pick that they would feel horrible if they sold off shares of the stock. They would much rather take the dividend. And people are much more likely to spend the dividend on stuff that doesn't matter versus sell stock on stuff that doesn't matter. What's their point? I think the 403 versus the taxable accounts kind of the same way you're going to spend the 403B on retirement. If it's in the taxable account. You're, you're going to go, oh, well.

[Steve Stewart]

Maybe your mind says that there's more options available for you.

[OG]

Yeah, yeah. So the 403B kind of hides money there too.

[Steve Stewart]

So I wouldn't change your plan. I like it so far.

[OG]

Yeah.

[Steve Stewart]

Buy a reasonable house and I don't know that you need to wait five years, buy it, be done with it, get the darn thing paid off and.

[OG]

Move on, become a homeowner. Bobby, just what is that?

[Steve Stewart]

Yeah, if you want to, if you want to spend a whole bunch of money on different things, just go buy a house. You got all sorts of stuff you get to spend money on. Then I'm thinking, blow down windows break with hail, you get all sorts of stuff.

[OG]

Thinking of that old, that commercial of the guy in his riding lawnmower and he's got the beautiful house. The family's like, how do I afford all this? This. I'm in debt up to my eyeballs. Remember that. There you go. That's good stuff. Thanks, Bobby. If you've got a question, a letter for us. All right, that is a wrap, my friend. Thank you to everybody who's left us a review. We OG are sitting at 341 reviews of this year podcast and I would love it if before the break we could set a challenge of getting to 350. And we know how many people out there have left us reviews think about the people that haven't left A review the show that helps us so much find new listeners. It helps new listeners know what they're getting into with the show. So thank you very much for everybody who's done that. But if we get to 350, do the big push. That's great. Let me tell you about a review going on. Mom's Fridge Apps Rules 0000 says, 5 stars. Really enjoyable podcast. I do look forward to listening to this podcast. Well, we do look forward to making it Absorule. It is my favorite personal finance podcast and I've tried many before this one came along has a lot of variety and will appeal to a wide range of listeners because it's very entertaining and there's always a small chance I might learn something. I like the different formats from OG to the Roundtable Crew. Thanks a ton for that. And Mom's popping that baby on the fridge. All right, everybody, have a fantastic week. Happy Monday. We'll see you back here on Wednesday. Stacking More Benjamins.

[Jen Sincero]

So what did we learn today? First, Jen Sincero had it right. Making money is about knowledge and numbers, but it's also about mindset. You can be a badass at making money. Get your subconscious mind working, then go on the attack and don't give up. Second, tax day is tomorrow, so get those taxes filed. As Mark Steber from Jackson Hewitt said, while maybe you can't pay, there are huge fines if you don't file, so at least file your taxes. In the words of a great philosopher, get er done. But the big lesson if you work with a guy named Steve, don't let him near your microphone. That guy's trying to take over the place and we gotta rise up and protest. Who's with me? A big thank you to Jen Sincero. You'll find a link to her site, jensincero.com and her new book, you are a Badass at Making Money on our show. [e-mail] this show is the property of SB Podcasts, LLC. The show is created by Joe Sal Sehei, produced by Richie Rutter Reese and engineered by Steve Stewart. SB Podcasts may receive payment on the show from sponsorship, sponsors and guests in the form of books, giveaway items, discounts, or other remuneration. There's no way you would take advice from these dorks, but like Joe's mom always says, don't take advice from people you don't know. This show is for entertainment purposes only, and before making any financial moves, consult with A real financial advisor. I'm Joe's mom's neighbor Doug and I just brought this podcast in for a landing. Hashtag superstar. Hashtag. Yeah, I just said that.

[OG]

It time for some what I thought was pretty hilarious news. This comes to us from Esquire. What if you were a contestant on a year long season of Survivor? Would you do that by the way?

[Steve Stewart]

Survivor or a year long version of it?

[OG]

A year long version of Survivor?

[Steve Stewart]

No, no.

[OG]

But would you do Survivor? Would you be on Survivor?

[Steve Stewart]

Probably not that either.

[OG]

It wouldn't.

[Steve Stewart]

I did real life Survivor. I'm good. I've done the real life version of that game show. I like the people that write us and tell us that they were on camping trips for courtesy of the U.S. government.

[OG]

Isn't that great? U.S. government sponsored camping trip. What if you were a contestant on a one year long season of Survivor except the season got canceled and nobody told you that's what happened to contestants on the Scottish reality show Eden. They spent a year in the wilderness.

[Steve Stewart]

Sounds way better than Survivor.

[OG]

They spent a year in the wilderness's survivalist. Even though the show stopped airing in August 2016, got cut after only four episodes. It was a show that sought to answer the question, what would happen if humans had to form a society from scratch? The show filmed 23 contestants living in the Scottish wilderness for a year with no contact with or help from the modern world. Although 13 of the contestants quit the show before the end, much like the show's viewers. The remaining 10, however, stuck it out and lived off the land of the. I'm not gonna be able to pronounce that. Ardna Merchant peninsula for the entire year as a society. Here's a. Here's the trailer from the show at the beginning.

[Steve Stewart]

23 total strangers. Hello. Alone and cut off from civilization for an entire year.

[OG]

So this is it.

[H]

Home.

[Hannah]

This is brilliant. I think you're exaggerating there.

[Steve Stewart]

I used to live in a house. Will the combination of their individual skills and experience be enough to survive? The people that don't get stuck in.

[Hannah]

Are the ones that are going to struggle.

[OG]

This is a place that we're going.

[Hannah]

To need to put some work and effort into.

[Steve Stewart]

Come on, fella, let's go. Cameron, what if we could start again?

[Hannah]

Where did you wake up this morning, Steve?

[OG]

Next to quite a lot of these, actually.

[Steve Stewart]

We have done so, so well and absolutely smashed expectations. What we've got is amazing. Eden starts Monday 18th July on 4.

[OG]

Eden ends August four weeks later. But how bad would that be?

[Steve Stewart]

Well, but See, the thing is, is that, you know, it's not like they were filming it live, right? I mean, they probably filmed the show.

[OG]

They must have cameras out there the entire time.

[Steve Stewart]

Yeah, but they film the show, right? It's like they don't film Survivor in real time. When you watch it on tv, it's already happened.

[OG]

Now this apparently was.

[Steve Stewart]

Maybe they're just a couple weeks ahead or something. Basically, yes.

[OG]

As participants allegedly had no contact with the outside world, were unaware of current events took place during their absence, like for the Brexit and the election of Donald Trump as president of the United States. Channel 4 explained the bizarre choice to continue filming after the show is canceled in a statement to the Guardians, quote, the appeal of Eden is that it was a real experiment. And when filming began, we had no idea what the results would be and how those taking part would react to being isolated for months in a remote part of the British Isles. That's why we did it. And the story of their time, including the highs and the lows, will be shown later this year. So they're going to turn some of the participants left. Show early criticized it. Contestant Tom Wall called the show out on Twitter for being a load of rubbish. And another word that we can't say.

[Steve Stewart]

So I used to want to do. Do you remember Eco Challenge? The show Eco Challenges on Discovery? It was like Mark Burnett's first deal.

[OG]

Yeah, I saw one episode.

[Steve Stewart]

I mean, it was a long time ago, right? I saw one 20 years ago. It was like that 3,000 mile race or 300 mile race or something like that. And it would be always these weird places. You'd get your team together and, gosh, that seemed really fun at the time. But then I did it in real life, like Eco Challenge. I did real life Eco Challenge, and it wasn't as fun.

[OG]

It's not nearly the hilarity you thought it would be. Yeah, that's pretty wild, right? All right, everybody, we'll see you Wednesday.

[Steve Stewart]

I got to go eat some Easter candy.