How Does a Money Nerd Think About "Romance"? (SB1644)

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Stacking Benjamins Show – "How Does a Money Nerd Think About 'Romance'?" (SB1644)
Release Date: February 14, 2025

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Introduction to Valentine's Day and Financial Stress

In this Valentine’s Day special episode, Joe Saul-Sehy and Doug (OG) delve into the financial dynamics of romance, exploring how money matters influence relationships. The hosts set a candid tone by addressing the often-overlooked financial pressures that accompany romantic gestures, particularly during holidays like Valentine’s Day.

Key Statistics on Valentine's Day Spending

The episode kicks off with a discussion on a recent study from lendingtree.com, authored by Maggie Davis, revealing that:

• Lovebirds plan to spend an average of $179 on Valentine’s Day.
• 56% of people would skip the holiday if they could to save money.

Joe Saul-Sehy reflects on the high average spending, questioning its feasibility for individuals with modest incomes. Sarah Catherine Gutierrez adds, "$170 seems like a lot of money... I feel like that's a lot of money for any income" (10:09).

Expanding Beyond Gifts: The Hidden Costs

The conversation broadens to include indirect expenses associated with Valentine's Day, such as:

• Dining Out Costs: A decent meal can quickly escalate into a three-figure expense.
• Babysitting Fees: Sarah Catherine mentions, "Did you know babysitters now charge 25 bucks an hour?" (10:22), highlighting the cumulative costs beyond just purchasing gifts.

Doug humorously shares an anecdote where he handed over a wad of cash to a babysitter, leading to unexpected financial strain: "She just handed the whole wad of cash to the babysitter... It was like three or four hundred bucks" (18:35).

Credit Card Debt and Financial Honesty in Relationships

A startling statistic catches the hosts' attention: a significant number of people incur credit card debt for Valentine’s Day without disclosing it to their partners.

Joe remarks, "The number of people that are going to go into debt for Valentine's Day and they're not going to tell the person they're romantically involved with that they're going into debt. That rubbed me there" (13:27).

Len Penzo emphasizes the importance of financial honesty: "If you think that's going to turn into some long term relationship, healthy relationship... that's not a very good way to get off" (13:27).

Managing Finances with Your Partner

The hosts and guests share strategies for maintaining financial harmony in relationships:

• Early Financial Conversations: Jesse Kramer notes, "We've been together seven years... when we first moved in, we really sat down and said, here's what I earn, here's what you earn..." (28:03).

• Segregating Finances: Len advises, "If you're separate spenders with different habits, you might need to segregate your finances to prevent overspending" (27:50).

• Acts of Service Over Expensive Gifts: Sarah Catherine shares, "There's nothing hotter or sexier than someone cleaning out the garage... We don't need gifts. We need acts of service like that" (15:00).

Creative and Budget-Friendly Valentine's Day Ideas

In the second half of the show, the team brainstorms romantic ideas tailored for "money nerds" seeking to celebrate without breaking the bank:

1. Handwritten Notes: Emphasizing the sentimental value, Len suggests, "A handwritten note... puts more thought..." (32:44).

2. Homemade Dinners and Picnics: Joe recounts a memorable, low-cost picnic: "We had a picnic behind our house on the golf course, just a bottle of wine..." (33:44).

3. Budget-Constrained Adventures: Jesse Kramer proposes activities like:

   • Cooking meals with ingredients on sale to foster creativity.
   • Planning local adventures with a set budget, e.g., "$50 or less" activities (41:08).

4. Spreading Out Surprises: Doug reminisces about surprising his partner with small gestures leading up to Valentine's Day, though he acknowledges the challenges in sustaining such efforts over the years (44:34).

Trivia Segment: Financial Stress in Relationships

The episode features a fun trivia segment where the hosts quiz their guests:

Question: What percentage of Americans in relationships cite finances as their primary source of stress?

• Len guesses 85%.
• Jesse Kramer opts for 40%.

Joe reveals the correct answer: 37%, demonstrating the high impact of financial issues on relationships.

Final Thoughts and Takeaways

The hosts wrap up with key takeaways emphasizing the importance of:

• Financial Transparency: Open discussions about money can prevent misunderstandings and financial strain.
• Thoughtful Gestures Over Costly Gifts: Meaningful, low-cost actions often hold more value than expensive presents.
• Creative Problem-Solving: Setting budgetary constraints can inspire unique and memorable romantic experiences.

Doug humorously concludes, "Valentine's Day is a day when you go into debt and lie to your partner about it all in the name of making them happy. Sounds about right. It's no wonder we're stressed out." (51:33)

Notable Quotes

• Doug (OG): "56% of people say they would skip the holiday if they could. I think when it comes to your wallet, can't you skip this holiday?" (09:47)

• Len Penzo: "Nothing's more romantic than somebody that starts a Roth IRA at age 18." (03:20)

• Sarah Catherine Gutierrez: "There's nothing hotter or sexier than someone cleaning out the garage... We don't need gifts. We need acts of service like that." (15:00)

• Jesse Kramer: "The key to another person's heart is an unexpected gift at an unexpected time." (35:37)

Conclusion

This episode of The Stacking Benjamins Show provides a humorous yet insightful exploration of how financial decisions intersect with romantic endeavors. Through candid conversations and practical advice, Joe and his guests encourage listeners to prioritize financial health and meaningful connections over extravagant spending, especially on occasions like Valentine's Day.

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For more episodes and financial tips, visit StackingBenjamins.com and follow them on their social media channels.

Transcript

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

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[Doug]

Joneses rules us all.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Where the voices from the merchants, restaurants and credit companies lord over the common man.

[Doug]

Out of the darkness, like a beacon.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Of hope, comes a new voice. A voice that's rich and creamy like.

[Doug]

Your favorite butter and delicious like cheeseburger pizza on your diet.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Cheat day it's the Stacking Benjamin Show.

[Doug]

Live from the basement of the YouTube headquarters, it's the Stacking Benjamin Show. Foreign I'm Joe's mom's neighbor, Doug, and on today's show, we're talking love what lights up a money geek more than Barry White and a nice crisp rose served next to a roaring romantic fire. We'll find out. And we'll also discuss a recent study on Valentine's Day spending that definitely does not light us up. How do you get out of Valentine's Day with your wallet intact? That's today's topic. But that's not all, because at the halfway point of today's discussion, I'll fire up my Valentine's Day trivia Love Shot. Who's going to win today's contest? We'll see. And now a guy who's a pro at the sexy talk. Like when he says the only thing more powerful than love is a Roth IRA. Started at the age of 18. Oh, Joe. Take me to bed or lose me forever. It's Joe. So.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

See.

[Doug]

Hi.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

I don't think there are things more romantic than somebody that starts a Roth IRA. Age 18. Hey, everybody. Welcome back to the Stacking Benjamin show. We're super happy you're here. Sit back and relax for another Friday roundtable. And look at this crew we have with us today. Let's meet them all. First of all, the guy who has a podcast that's in the middle of being renamed. Jesse Kramer's here. How are you? Is it still the best interest podcast today?

[Jesse Kramer]

I think after that intro, it might be the Love Shot podcast for like the next hour. And then we'll figure out the long term name after that.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

The money Love Shot.

[Doug]

Tm. I'm trademarking it right now.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Yeah, he wants a commission on that deal, Jesse. Yeah, absolutely. But we haven't announced the name yet.

[Jesse Kramer]

We don't have a name as of Valentine's Day. We'll have a new name. We will have a new name.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

It is Valentine's Day. But we're recording it early. And you can't tell us.

[Jesse Kramer]

I mean, I can, as long as you guys don't spoil it. Oh, the world premiere here in this recording?

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Well, we're only on YouTube, you know.

[Jesse Kramer]

Oh, we're keeping it hidden.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

So, so close. We almost got him. I shouldn't have said that, Doug. Why did I even tell him that we were live on YouTube? A woman who we've been trying to get back over and over and over on this here podcast. Sarah Catherine Gutierrez is back. How are you?

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Hi. Good. So wait, we're live?

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

What, we believe it or not? Oh, God, yes. Did you have any idea?

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

No, but. Hi.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Well, welcome. So what's going on at Aptis Financial up the road from me? Just two hours up the road in Little Rock.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

I know we're still trying to get you out here. Salsa dancing at our nightclub in Little Rock. So still have not successfully gotten you here, which I think is a real shame.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

I don't know. Did you see me dancing on that show video?

[Doug]

You really don't want to do that.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Sarah Catherine, we need you. No, we need you on the dance floor. It's a sad thing.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

I think Sarah Catherine's like, we need to teach that dude how to dance so we don't have to watch that anymore. The little white guy shuffle thing going on. Yeah, but what's going on in the world of financial planning in Little Rocks.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Eric, Catherine, you know, there's a lot of credit card debt. That's what we're seeing a lot of right now. And so I'm really eager to have this conversation. Conversation today about some Valentine spending. I think. I think there's a lot of digging out to do from inflation. So that's a real sad reality.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

I think so, too. I feel like we went back to spending the way that we used to after the pandemic ended. Inflation went through the roof and we didn't get a raise. We didn't ask for raises, by and large, and we should have. And we just let the credit card do the heavy lifting. And speaking of heavy lifting, the guy back doing the heavy lifting on this podcast. Because Squirrel Cam must have been over for the day. Mr. Len Penzo is here. How are you, man?

[Len Penzo]

I am great. Good to be back. Hello, everybody. And Valentine's Day.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

What's going on? The squirrels gone wild today?

[Len Penzo]

You know what? I'll have to check the cam. We've had some interesting. You know, we're getting a lot of group squirrels now on the squirrel cams. You know, hey, it's Valentine's Day, so, you know, get a little spicy. So, you know, you can always stop by and check out the squirrel cam. It's always there on lenpenzo.com.

[Doug]

Little polyamory happening in the rodent pop.

[Len Penzo]

Of course it is, Doug. Of course it is. And for all of you out there who I know who are alone, there's a lot of people out there who are alone on Valentine's Day, which, you know, that's always sad. But just remember this, folks, just to kind of make you feel a little better, is that nobody loves you on any other day either. So it's not just Valentine's Day. You have to feel bad.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

You are a helpless romantic, Mr. Penzo. Just this day's no different than the rest of them.

[Doug]

You're born alone, you're gonna die alone. Get over it.

[Len Penzo]

That's right. Just.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Yeah.

[Len Penzo]

So cheer up.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Absolutely horrible. Well, we're going to talk about some disturbing statistics. I have a survey that was recently released. Doug, you alluded to this earlier. We're going to talk about what lights up our money geeks on Valentine's Day. We'll do that in the second half of the show. But before any of that, we have some sponsors to make sure this thing goes and we're going to say hello to them and thank them and then we're talking all things Valentine's Day. So let's get with it. Small Business Owners State Farms there with small business insurance to fit your specific needs. Whether you're starting a new venture or growing an existing one, State Farm helps you choose the right coverage to protect what matters most. Working with a local State Farm agent helps you understand your coverage options, Offering local support to help you achieve your goals. Focused on turning your passion into a thriving business. Knowing your insurance can change as your business grows. Stay Farm here to help you succeed with your business. Like a good neighbor, State Farm is there this episode of Stacking Benjamin is brought to you by Navy Federal Credit Union. At Navy Federal, our mission is to help members of the military, veterans and their families achieve their financial goals. And that's why we offer great savings and investing options like our certificates. Certificates come with sky high rates and some even have the flexibility to have money anytime during your term. Whether you're saving for a home, new car, your future, our options could help you get there. Certificates. They're just the beginning. Navy Federal also provides financial advisors to help you manage your investment portfolio, along with online tools to guide your savings plan. With our support, you'll have everything you need to take charge of your finances. So don't wait. The sooner you start building your financial future with Navy Federal savings and investing options, the better off you could be in the long run. Sign up@navy federal.org Navy Federal Credit Union Our members are the mission Savings products insured by NCUA Investment products are not insured, not obligations to Navy Federal and may lose value. The piece that inspired today's episode comes to us from lendingtree.com and this is written by Maggie Davis. Lovebirds plan to spend $179 on average this Valentine's Day while 56% of people say they would skip the holiday if they could. And what's funny, Sarah Catherine, let's start with you. 56% of people say they'd skip the holiday if they could. I think in some ways, when it comes to your wallet, can't you skip this holiday?

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

A hundred percent? You can, but that is really crazy. $170. That seems like a lot of money. I also kind of want to know like the logistics of this study. Like how did they carry it out? Was this a what are you buying? I mean, are we capturing all of the spending that people are doing or just the gift? Because I feel like that's what this thing is not really getting at.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Yeah, I do think the spending, the. Like a restaurant. Now, if I go to a decent restaurant, not even a super nice restaurant, and we have a couple of drinks, I'm looking at three figures right there. Sarah, Catherine.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Oh, a hundred percent. You know, I've got young kids. Did you know babysitters now charge 25 bucks an hour?

[Jesse Kramer]

Wow.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

I'm in the wrong business.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Right. So, you know, we're gonna go to chipotle and spend 30 minutes there because that's about how much we can afford for dinner and a babysitter. But then what I think is a little crazy is the skewing of the spending towards men. It's like as if women don't do any of the spending. And again, I think that's where some of these expenses are not getting caught in this exact survey. So I have to question how the survey was done. What about the outfit? You know, are we spending 150 bucks on a new outfit? What about the mani pedi?

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Yeah, Doug gets those every Valentine. She gets those.

[Doug]

What I spend on lingerie alone is way more than the average.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

I wasn't going to bring that up. Or waxing.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

We're gonna dive in. I just threw up in my mouth. Of the 56% of respondents in relationships. Let's get into this piece. Because you, you brought this up. 82% will give their significant other a gift this Valentine's Day. Men, 89%, as you mentioned, are much more likely to do so than women, 76%. Jesse, does that surprise you? Are you and. And Mrs. Kramer going to be exchanging Valentine's Day gifts this year?

[Jesse Kramer]

I don't know if I know what I'm getting. I don't know What Kelly. What Mrs. Kramer is getting. But does the statistic surprise me? I mean, flatly, plainly speaking, it doesn't surprise me. Only because. And maybe this is some of what Sarah was getting at, which is like the societal standards and the expectations of who's buying what for whom. And if nothing else, I mean, I would think, isn't there some. Some stereotype, some standard of. Yeah. At the very least, you know, the guy's got to get his. His lady a bouquet of flowers. And so, you know. Well, what do you think the disturbing.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Part of that is? The next statistic, Jesse, which is that gen zers age 18 to 28 are the most likely age group to buy their significant others a gift. Gen Xers like me are the least likely. Is it. Are we jaded? Is that the deal? Like, yeah, I'm over it.

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah. Honestly, that's what I would say. Like, okay, let's. I'm gonna put myself in a Gen Z shoe where I'm Maybe in my mid-20s, I'm in a relationship that's still growing. Maybe I'm still in the wooing phase. Like, of course I'm gonna do something nice for Valentine's Day. I put myself in the Joe Salsihai shoes, the neighbor Doug shoes, the Len Penzo shoes. And at this point, like, aren't we just gonna look at each other and just kind of shrug and be like, it's just another day.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

What?

[Jesse Kramer]

You know, what's the difference? Why? Let's save it up. Let's save the money for this summer's vacation or something like that. I don't need any more chocolates. Right? That doesn't really surprise me either.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Oh, well, let's go to the one that does surprise everybody, Len. At least it surprised me. I don't know if it surprised you. And that is the number of people that are going to go into debt for Valentine's Day and they're not going to tell the person they're, they're romantically involved with that they're going into debt.

[Len Penzo]

They.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

That rubbed me there.

[Len Penzo]

Isn't that amazing? That is amazing. I mean, if you think that's going to turn into some long term relationship, healthy relationship, you know, doing, trying to do some deception that way, that's, that's not a very good way to get off. You know, as Gen Xer myself, Joe, I agree that I hardly spend anything, you know that. What is it, $179 you said basically is what?

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Yeah, $179.

[Len Penzo]

I mean, that's basically a card. Nowadays a Hallmark card is about $179, I think. And by the way, Sarah, Kathryn, here's a pro tip for you. As someone who's had instead of $25 an hour for a babysitter, 25 cents a tablespoon for cough syrup is much more cost effective.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Oh, no, that's brilliant. I'm going to come back to you for more tips on child rearing.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Love that pediatricians.

[Doug]

Send your Benadryl is a Wonder Drug at CPS.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

People. Please send your hate mail to lenveno.com.

[Doug]

CPS.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Leave them at home asleep alone. That's the type of high quality stuff you hear on Stacking Benjamins. But this Sarah, Catherine, back to you. This is not just about Valentine's Day, right? When I was a financial planner, I'm sure It's the same thing today. People just got done getting in over their head at the holiday season, right? We do it around people's birthdays. Why are we spending so much people? So much people. Why are we spending so much money trying to impress people by gifting them stuff we can't afford?

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

I know that I love my husband so much. If he bought me a gift, I know I bought me that gift. Right? Because we have a joint budget, like, so if I want something, I'm gonna go buy it. I don't find that particularly romantic. Although when you sent that article, I was like, oh, Valentine's Day, I. I hit send on the Mrs. C's Chocolates for him because he loves them and he will be happy that we both spent money on his gift. Right? But I mean, I'll tell you, like, he just cleaned out the garage this past weekend. I mean, there is nothing hotter or sexier than that. There you go, folks. We don't need gifts. We need acts of service like that. That's. That's what we need. So, yes, I think it's a lot of money. And actually looking at the article too, it's like, for an income of $30,000, that. That's, you know, that $179 is the typical expense. And I'm. I feel like that's a lot of money for any income. And then it goes higher as the income gets higher, and you start kind of doing the budget on that, and the numbers really don't add up that we can afford it. And seriously, we really have to look at the actual expenses. It's not just the $179. It's the dinner, it's all the things. And, you know, if I add it all up, a meal, if you pay 20 bucks for a valet, I don't know, get a babysitter and then a gift. I mean, there's almost $400 right there.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

And, oh, this is what you were saying earlier. You were saying that number's low. You think $179 doesn't even touch it, Joe.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

It's not like I have someone in front of me that's like, Yeah, I got $170 in credit card debt. Don't know what to do with it. That's not the way this works. It's the, hey, I'd like to talk to you about investing in stocks and bonds. And you have an hour long conversation, and then there's an, oh, by the way, I have $40,000 in credit card debt. What should I do? Man, we know this happened. People are getting shocked right now with how expensive things are. And so we've got to find some alternatives to this kind of spending and realize it's not the gift anymore that's expensive. Life is expensive. Going out to eat is now just an expensive thing to do. It's not what it used to be. And I think that's where people are getting tripped up on credit card debt.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Unfortunately, Jesse, with a young child at home. I didn't see you shake too much. When Sarah Catherine was talking about $25.

[Jesse Kramer]

An hour, our most recent babysitter. And this might be, you know, hearkening back to last week, there was this whole, you know, what do things cost In Upper Michigan vs New York City thing with neighbor Doug. I don't know if you remember that. I think $30 an hour for an assistant, like, just blew Doug's mind. I think he's still in the single digits. But here in upstate New York, they.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Get a solid $7.

[Jesse Kramer]

Pay them in nickels. Here in upstate New York, our babysitter, who we like very much, charges US$18 an hour. And because we like her a lot and we want her to come back, we pay her $20 an hour. So I think that's, like, the going rate here, you know, 18, 20 bucks an hour.

[Len Penzo]

So.

[Jesse Kramer]

Right. I mean, in Sarah Catherine's defense, our last date night was like a four and a half hour. Let's go get a little drink, let's get some dinner. Let's find a little bakery to have dessert afterwards. We were gone four and a half hours. So the babysitting portion of it was 90 bucks. Let alone, you know, the drink, the food, all that. It adds up. It's expensive. You know, being. Being social and fun is expensive, I guess.

[Doug]

Reminds me of a time when we were out and I probably had a couple more drinks than I needed to, and my wife drove the sitter home, and I just pulled the. The wad of cash out of my pocket and handed it to her and said, here, pay with this. She just handed the whole wad of cash to the babysitter. She was calling us, like, every three days. You need a sitter, you need a sitter.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Did you figure out how much was in there?

[Doug]

Yeah, it was like three or four hundred bucks.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

That's a. That's a hor. That's a horrible precedent.

[Doug]

And then my wife's trying to get me to go get it back. I'm like, I didn't F that up. You were the one who handed her the whole. Didn't it seem a little thick to you? Sweetheart, that's what you gave me.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Could you imagine knocking on a teenager's door? It's been a big misunderstanding. A big, big mistake. Len, what else did you find interesting in the study?

[Len Penzo]

Did you know 28% of people are cutting back on Valentine's Day spending?

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Did you see that?

[Len Penzo]

Yes. And frankly, if you think about that, that seems way low to me. I would think almost everybody would be cutting back on their Valentine's spending. Unless you're right in a fresh new relationship and you're really trying to score some brownie points. But that seems really, really low to me. 28%.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Well, and on that note, I like this one, len, which is 34 of all Americans say they've said a Valentine's Day spread spending limit with their partner in the past, with 11 saying they've done so every year. On the other hand, 34 having considerate and wouldn't. Why would you not. Why are you like. No, I'm not putting a spin. I'm not gonna put a spending cap in place.

[Len Penzo]

Holy smokes. I, you know, I don't know. Does that mean the brand new Lexus isn't just for Christmas anymore? Right. You can just. That's a great Valentine's gift, too. So who knows? I mean. Yeah, that seems absolutely ridiculous, you know, not putting some sort of limit on your. But you know what? I guess people who use credit cards, though, they might not think that way. You know, it's like, use that credit card and you're not really. A lot of people who are addicted to their credit cards aren't worried about limits because it's covered by the credit card in the first place. They deal with the consequences much later.

[Jesse Kramer]

Love. Love is priceless, Len. Love is priceless.

[Len Penzo]

Of course. Yes, yes, absolutely.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

I don't know. When it comes to money and relationships, Len, do you and the honeybee, do you guys. Around Valentine's Day, do you set limits on how much you're going to spend on each other? What do you do? No.

[Len Penzo]

Well, like Sarah Catherine was talking about, we don't buy anything because there's no secrets with the credit. I mean, they know what we're getting. Unless we specifically say, on the very record, don't look at the credit card statement for, you know, I got you something. And you just get. I mean, and that has happened on occasion, but I mean, once you get to my age, that kind of stuff just doesn't.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

I.

[Len Penzo]

We don't buy that stuff anymore. You know, the Only thing I've been really working on is getting a smoking hot body for the Honeybee. You know, that's my best. You know, that's the best thing you can do for somebody for Valentine's Day. When you get to be my age and, you know, when you get to be older, you know the best way to get a smoking hot body, right?

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

How's. How's that?

[Len Penzo]

It's cremation. Cremation is by far.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

No.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

My God.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

No, no, no, no.

[Doug]

I'm so glad to have Lynn back. You just see him winding up for that fastball, like, here comes. It's coming. I know. You still can't hit it.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

He's been. He's been planning that all day.

[Doug]

How do you.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Jesse, know. I've wondered this since the beginning, and I'm sure some of our stackers are wondering the same thing. How do you know what you're getting for Valentine's Day?

[Jesse Kramer]

What do you mean, how do I decide?

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

No, I said about Mrs. Kramer, and you guys give a gift, and you're like, I know what I'm getting, but I don't know what she's getting. So how do you know what you're getting?

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah. So. Yeah, how do I make the decision of what I'm gonna buy her? That's what you're asking, not what I'm receiving.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

You're getting for her. I thought you were saying.

[Jesse Kramer]

Sorry. No, no, no. I misspoke.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

What you were getting. Your.

[Jesse Kramer]

Your verbal recall was perfect. That's exactly what I said. But what I meant was what I'm purchasing on behalf of my wife to give her as a gift, because didn't.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

It, Doug, come across as the opposite of that? Yeah, I know what she's getting me, but I'm not sure if she's getting anything.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Yeah, but that is how I interpreted.

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah, that's totally my bad. But to go back and answer your question, I know what I'm buying for my wife because I get to decide that inside my own brain. So I think that. I think that's the answer.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

And you're very proud of that, too.

[Doug]

I have agency damage.

[Len Penzo]

Clearly, Jesse hasn't been married that long because eventually the time's going to come when she's going to tell you what you're going to be getting her.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

That's right. Yes. That comes with time. And you're thankful for it, too, by the way, because everybody knows exactly what's going on. Speaking of what's going on, I want to address this idea about lying. Right. And about Surprising people with expensive stuff. And the way we can go about that is. Let's start off with this wonderful clip that I found on Saturday Night Live.

[Jesse Kramer]

Hey, Matt, I think there might be be one more gift for your mom.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Right there.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

It hasn't been a normal year, so this Christmas, get her something extraordinary during the Lexus December to Remember sales event.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Nathan, you didn't.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

With flexible financing and 0% APR, there's.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Never been a better time to buy.

[Len Penzo]

Or lease a new Lexus. Merry Christmas, baby. Are you kidding me? Nathan?

[Jesse Kramer]

Did you seriously buy a car without asking me? Well, cause for Christmas this is a major purchase, right? But it was a December to remember.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

It's.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Alexis.

[Jesse Kramer]

We don't have the money for this, Nathan.

[Doug]

We don't?

[Jesse Kramer]

No, we don't.

[Doug]

Your father doesn't.

[Jesse Kramer]

Your father hasn't worked since last March. What? Yeah. Covid has hit a lot of people hard and I'm no exception.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Nathan, you got fired in March 2019.

[Jesse Kramer]

Covid had nothing to do with it. Hey, pal. I guess your old man's busted. It's beginning to look a lot like savings.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

So get to your local Lexus dealer today.

[Len Penzo]

How much did you spend on this ridiculous car, Nathan?

[Jesse Kramer]

It was only 39.99 to its signing. Four grand? It's not that much, babe. And how much is the monthly payment? The what?

[Len Penzo]

Did you think this entire car costs $4,000?

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Uh huh.

[Len Penzo]

There's a monthly payment?

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah, but with the 0% APR, I think it's all good.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

April.

[Jesse Kramer]

Do you mean APR? I'm pretty sure it's APR.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Wow. Just wow. And it gets dumber and dumber as you go. That's about Christmas. But Sarah. Catherine, I know that especially in financial planning. I had clients back in the day that would take me aside and go, don't tell my husband or don't tell my wife that I've got this $20,000 in credit card debt. You need to know. But. But I. But I've got that. Sarah Catherine clicked out, so she's apparently.

[Doug]

Hiding something as well.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Oh, damn. I don't want to talk about your credit card debt. Live.

[Doug]

I was hoping we weren't going to go here on this episode that hit.

[Len Penzo]

Too close to home, I guess live on YouTube.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Jesse. But this. This idea of. Of lying to your spouse. How do you broach in a relationship the fact that your. Your financial picture might not be what your significant other thinks it is?

[Jesse Kramer]

Boy. How do you come clean? Is that what the question is? How do you come.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

That is the question.

[Doug]

Yeah.

[Jesse Kramer]

This isn't a money question. It's more of a, it's, it's a totally a relationship honesty question. I mean, personally, I would say that, you know, sunshine is the best disinfectant, as they say. And you just got to come clean and come out in the open. And what's the, there's some process out there about how to apologize, but, you know, admit to what you've done, describe why it was wrong, and tell them how you plan to not do it again going forward, but going back a step. JOE I just think about how to not get yourself in that position in the first place. I mean, that's what I think about, or at least more of the conversations I have are on that topic of when people are getting into relationships, how to be open and honest about their finances up front to begin with and get on the same page early on in a relationship to try to kind of nip that in the bud and avoid that big apology situation so that it never needs to come up in the first place.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Lynn when, when you and the Honeybee were first dating, or maybe it wasn't when you were dating, maybe it was after you're married. When did you guys kind of lay out both of your financial pictures? Like, I'm sure that wasn't date number one, but how long down the street, how far down the street were you? Before you go, you know what, let's talk about money.

[Len Penzo]

It was pretty early, actually. That's always been for my relationships. It's always money to me is the most important. It is, number one, it's more than sex or anything in a relationship. I think that's the, the one thing that will totally derail a relationship, a long term relationship, faster than anything. So we address that really quickly. I know a lot of people think it might not be compatible to have a big spender tied with somebody who's. And we're not both. Me and Honeybee are both very frugal with our money and we don't, we're not free spenders or anything like that. But I know a lot of people think, well, it's impossible to have a free spender with a, you know, not, you know, somebody who's more judicious with their spending. And I think that's not true. I think you can make it work. I think one of the most important things you have to do though, is somehow you're going to have to one, segregate your finances if you're separate like that, so you don't. Somebody doesn't get caught overspending for the other person. Otherwise, I think it'd be a big disaster. If you're separate spending habits are different and you have a joint account, somebody better be on that, like a bid, remonitoring that all the time, because I can see how, like, you get in some real trouble real fast that way. So that's how you manage things. I think you can always manage your way around things.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

I'm totally with you. I think that sometimes somebody who's a free spender with somebody who's. Who's tighter is a good check and balance.

[Len Penzo]

Yes.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

The problem I've seen is when the free spender has so much charisma that the person that wasn't a free spender all of a sudden becomes one, and then they become enablers. Jesse, in your relationship, when did you guys start talking about money?

[Jesse Kramer]

Pretty early on. I mean, we've been together now seven years, and I'd say probably in the first. Sometime in the first, like six to nine months we're at least having. It wasn't necessarily a conversation about, like, well, how do you spend your money? And like, should I be worried about that? But it was more of just feeling each other out to see if our goals were aligned and if our general kind of general philosophies were aligned.

[Len Penzo]

You can pay attention. You can pay attention. There's clues. You don't even have to ask if you're dating somebody. I mean, you can see if they're driving a real fancy car and they're living in some really nice digs and they've got a job that's paying, you know, relatively low amount. I mean, then, you know, well, something's not adding up here. You can kind of put two and two together if you just do a little detective work on your own.

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah, 100%. 100%. And probably let some of that was going on even if neither one of us knew it. I think after dating for like a year and three months or something is when we moved in together. And I think that might have been the first time where we really were like, open kimono. Like before then we were probably aware of like, oh, I still have this college loan hanging around. Or like, yeah, you know, I had already purchased a house. I was living in a starter home by myself. So she probably knew what the home was worth and what the mortgage was like. But when we first moved in, that's when we really sat down and said, here's what I earn, here's what you earn, here's what the household expenses are. Moving forward and we kind of took that first step into not fully combining, but at least the first step towards combining our finances.

[Doug]

You walk around in a kimono and she still stuck around.

[Jesse Kramer]

Oh, an open kimono. Happy Valentine's Day, buddy.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

No, no, no, no. All right. And on that wild note, I think normally here we break for the trivia, but Sarah Catherine wrote us. For those of you listening later, we took a wild pause because Sarah Catherine just dropped out and her Internet's gone. So we're going to bring back the trivia next week. Coming up in the second half, I ask people on social media for money geeks. For money geek friends, what is sexy, what is romantic? And how do we make Valentine's Day romantic for our money geek friends? We're going to hear from Len and from Jesse and from people on social media in just a minute.

[Doug]

How high is the interest rate for the new Laurel Road High Yield Savings account?

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

This high.

[Doug]

The air is really, really thin up here. The Laurel Road Very High Yield Savings.

[Len Penzo]

Account Variable annual percentage yield APY is subject to change at any time. No minimum balance required. Fees may reduce earnings on the account. For full terms and conditions, see laurelroad.com savings. Laurel Road is a brand of KeyBank member FDIC.

[Doug]

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[Jesse Kramer]

The Jack Welch Management Institute at Strayer.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

University helps you go from I know the way to I've arrived with our.

[Jesse Kramer]

Top 10 ranked online MBA. Gain skills you can learn today and apply tomorrow.

[Len Penzo]

Get ready to go from make it.

[Jesse Kramer]

Happen to made it happen and keep striving.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Visit strayer.

[Jesse Kramer]

Edu Jack Welchmba to learn more.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Strayer University is certified to operate in.

[Jesse Kramer]

Virginia by Chevinus many campuses, including at 2121 15th Street north in Arlington, Virginia. Hey, this is Andy Hill from the.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Marriage, Kids and Money podcast. And when I'm not singing Disney karaoke songs with my kids at home, I'm stacking Benjamin's. All right, Len, let's start with you, man. Valentine's Day. What's the Len Penzo money geek equivalent of Barry White dimmed lighting?

[Len Penzo]

Well, and keeping it within a budget of some sort is what you're talking about.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Len Penzo]

Anything homemade. It's joking about the Hallmark cards a while back. I mean, if you just do a simple card that you make yourself or a simple note for first, for the first thing in the morning as a greeting, put that down there where your significant other usually hangs out and gets her coffee or whatever, that means more than usually a regular card that's pre written for that. So I mean that's something you can do on your own. And even when it comes to dinner, don't go out to dinner. Go to the store, grab some nice fresh vegetables and a couple of nice steaks and cook dinner yourself. Put a couple candles on the table or whatever. I mean, there's so many ways you can do things on the cheap and it means so much more. And it's if you're fortunate enough to still have your parents around, the grandparents, take the kids to the grandparents, drop them off, and you'd have a really nice day on your own without spending a lot of money at all. And like I said, it's all done personally. And that to me, that goes the furthest of anything. Even better than going out to a fancy restaurant or what have you. It really is more memorable, I think.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Sheryl, one year we were having a nice warm February like we do from time to time here on Valentine's day at about 6:30 she just goes, come on. And I'm like, where are we going? And she has a picnic basket and grabs a bottle of wine and takes us. Behind our house there is a golf course. And on the green she spreads out, she spreads out this blanket and we got the stars above us and it was maybe, you know, 65 degrees and we sat out there and just had a picnic. And to your point, Len, that was one of the most memorable Valentine's Day gifts I've ever had. And it cost, we had to eat anyway. It cost the price of a grocery Store bottle of wine.

[Jesse Kramer]

Yep.

[Len Penzo]

I mean, and that shows thought. I mean, it just shows a lot more thought. It shows more level of caring and it just means more. It really does.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

You know, and there's something else too that you said early on about the card that I also don't want to dismiss or go past without taking a second and talking about it. The idea, even in a non romantic way. You know what I treasure? I treasure handwritten notes.

[Len Penzo]

Yes.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

When somebody sends me a handwritten note and the fact that they took the time to put pen on paper and put it in an envelope and send it to me, like that's not lost on me. And I can't be the only one. I think if you really want to impress somebody, write them a handwritten note. It is amazing. I always say I'm going to do it. I never do. But when somebody sends me one, I'm always just, just wowed by that. Jesse, what lights you up as a money nerd on Valentine's Day?

[Jesse Kramer]

I was just thinking, I'll answer your question, but I was just thinking too. Finding Forrester. Have you guys seen this movie? Finding Forrester. Sean Connery is a reclusive writer. New York City befriends a young basketball playing high school student. Anyway, a great movie, very good movie. Highly, highly recommend it. Maybe if it's streaming or somewhere free online you can watch it for free on Valentine's Day.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Wait a minute. Doug is our movie guru. Have you seen Finding Forrester?

[Doug]

I'm the guru. I have seen it. It's been a lot of years, but I' seen that movie. Yeah.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

You are the movie guru. Yeah.

[Jesse Kramer]

There's a great line that you guys reminded me of where Sean Connery is giving some, some love advice to this, his young protege, if you will. And he says the key to another person's heart is an unexpected gift at an unexpected time. And to some extent now everyone's kind of expecting a gift on Valentine's Day. So I'm not sure you can get the unexpected time part down. But the whole idea of like what you guys were talking about, that handwritten note, for a lot of people, that is an unexpected gift and it just, it's, it's extra special. So kudos to you guys. I like it, it's funny.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

But hang on, Jesse, before you answer that because I want to, I want to keep on that train for just a second because my favorite part of this book I love called Never Eat Alone and about the value of relationships. Really, really good book. Highly recommend this. My favorite Meme, by the way, about never eat alone is a picture of a dude in the break room eating alone while he's reading the book. It's kind of funny, but Keith Farazi, the guy that wrote this, said, don't be ashamed, even if you have just a little tiny apartment, to have people over at your house. And also, don't be ashamed to make it a potluck. People love potlucks. Just have people over at your house. Even if you only have folding chairs, people love it. You're going to have a great time. And a potluck solves all the money issues with that. And he even said, he goes, but for a really special occasion. And I've done this a couple times. Find some local musician. Maybe it's high school kids that you know who are in the band and are pretty good. Have them come to your living room halfway through the party. Don't tell anybody they're coming. This is the key. The unexpected time part. Jesse was huge. Don't tell her. Coming. And at the halfway point, these three people with violins show up, these three high schoolers with violins, and they play a few songs for us. And I got to tell you, when I've done that at a couple parties, that is kick ass. It is so amazing.

[Jesse Kramer]

That's a good idea. And actually, I think our babysitter plays the flute. She only charges $18 an hour, so we might get her to come over and play some. Play some tooth. No, no one. Okay.

[Len Penzo]

Good boy, Doug. Good boy, good boy.

[Jesse Kramer]

Did I need to pick a different instrument? I mean, the drums.

[Doug]

Come on, man.

[Len Penzo]

Hey, can I bring something up? So now that this has gone off the rose, please. You were talking about. Jesse was talking about movies and stuff. I think Jesse was talking about the movies. There's another way to save money, is instead of going to the movies and spending a ton of money, you know, you can do a pay per view in your. At your house, right? Well, on a related note to that, me and the honeybee wanted to watch a movie and. And my son brought up that, hey, you know, instead of doing the pay per view, you can, you know, I've got a way you can see this movie for free. You know, I was like, oh, really? And he's like, oh, yeah. You know, there's a website and you can see almost any movie you want. You just go. It's like, oh, okay. So, yeah, sure, hook it up. So, you know, he got his computer and hooked up to our. To our tv, and he's like, okay, well, me and The Honeybee. We picked our movie, we started watching it and we were enjoying it. And it's near. And before it started too, I was asking myself like, how do they make money? You know, where does the money come in? How do people make money doing this? If you're just checking this online and, you know, some websites playing these, he's like, oh, they just sell ads or whatever. I was like, okay, well, we're watching the movie. I don't see any ads at all. We're about 75 through the movie and in the lower right corner of our TV now we're watching this on like a 70 inch television set right on the lower right corner of the screen. While we're watching the movie, out slides out a picture. There's, it's, it's a naked woman.

[Jesse Kramer]

No, basically.

[Len Penzo]

Oh yes, it's sitting there and there's, there's a little note there and it says, hey, I've got four pictures of me. Four pictures of me with nothing on and I'd really love you to, to come and visit my pictures gallery. And I mean, kind of embarrassing, but you know, I just laughed out of it. It was quite funny. So I did realize that's how, now I know how these, these companies make their money from, you know, because I can see all these, you know, teenage boys and 20 year olds absolutely forget the movie. And they start clicking on the, oh, hey, let's take a look. There goes the movie. Then they've made their.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

In a pirated video. Or do you think the video was there legitimately?

[Len Penzo]

I'm not saying anything about whether the video was pirated or not. I won't say. But I will say I definitely know now how they make their money.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

I can't imagine the Paramount Pictures like, hey, we got a new idea. Here's, here's, here's what we're gonna do. Yeah, Sony's like, this is the best thing ever. You often wonder what happens at the Penzo house. And now you know.

[Len Penzo]

Yeah, I'm just glad we didn't have like four, you know, our neighbors over for the movie too, at the same. That would have really been something.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

But Jesse, all of that and we still haven't heard. We still haven't heard what your, your. What lights you up for Valentine's Day?

[Jesse Kramer]

Well, and especially on a budget. You're asking Joe, right? Or like, you know, what the finance nerd would want to do on Valentine's Day. Well, I thought of some ideas and some of it comes down to what the individual people are interested in because it's like, you know what if you're foodies and you're personal finance nerds and you want to do something fun and creative. You know, here at Wegmans we have this Wegmans app and you can go on the app and you can see what's on sale in the store. It's okay, you know, take what Len was saying. You can make your own meal at the store, but do it on sale. Only use stuff that's on sale. They say restriction breeds creativity.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Well, great.

[Jesse Kramer]

The restrictions of only using things that are on sale is going to breed some kind of creative meal. And it'll be a fun little adventure for, for you and, and whoever your Valentine's partner is. Or maybe you like to travel or you just like adventures. So it's like, okay, for a Valentine's Day romantic activity, you, you each have to bring the other partner a local one day adventure that's going to cost, you know, 50 bucks or less or something like that. I think that's another really cool one that I could think about some road trips or just some, some cool things around greater Rochester that we've never done before. That I know that's something that my honeybee, I need to come up with a nickname for her, but that's something that she would really like. Is that kind of DIY frugal adventure. So I just think depending on who you are and who your partner is and the things they like, those could be some really fun, cheap Valentine's Day activities.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Those are great ideas. I really like the idea of putting those restrictions in place because when you do, your brain does always get creative. It's incredible what your brain does. I asked people on Bluesky what they thought and invest quietly said, I'm always a sucker for a well developed spreadsheet. So imagine sharing spreadsheets. Like put on some Barry White. No.

[Jesse Kramer]

Oh, what if you gave somebody a rose?

[Doug]

Oh boy.

[Jesse Kramer]

R O W S.

[Len Penzo]

Leave the bad jokes to me, Jesse. Okay.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Oh, did I tell you guys, by the way? Cheryl has been just a pain lately. She's been horrible. She told me she's sick of me pretending I'm a flamingo. And that's when I put my foot down. Miranda says, I mean, I do love it when somebody wants to talk investing with me or splitting the cost of a cruise. As a single person, a cruise buddy is a nice clutch. So I do like the idea of splitting something. Let's do something that we would normally do and let's split it. That's nice. Ute in Oregon said compound interest calculations. That's some whisper. Compound interest calculations in somebody's ear I'm hearing romance.

[Len Penzo]

Here's something on a related note. You know, The Rule of 72 is actually the Rule of 69. Did you know that?

[Doug]

Oh, boy.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

No, it's true.

[Len Penzo]

It's absolutely true. It's. They just say the rule of 72. It's. It's truly 69. What's the problem there, Doug? You look uncomfortable.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

I'm just waiting for the other shoe to drop. Lead.

[Len Penzo]

There's no other shoe.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

We're waiting for the end of that. And we're all afraid. We're very afraid.

[Doug]

Joe, can I throw an idea out there to get this back on Main street instead of the red light district where Len's taking us? When we were just getting started and didn't have a lot of money, I came up with what I thought was a genius idea. But also it became very difficult to keep going. But I would do Valentine's week and for the seven days leading up to Valentine's Day, would do little, little things, but try to do a surprise. So it might just be a bag of Hershey's Kisses with a note, a nice note. And I would put that on her car seat. So when she wanted to go out to work in the morning, she would see this little surprise thing and that would be it. That would be day three or, you know, whatever it was. But it was just small stuff like that. It was the little note. But holy cow, that is hard to sustain over a marriage. I think I made it like 10 or 12 years and it just became more and more because you can only go back to the Hershey's bag of Hershey's Kisses so many times before. It just looks like you're mailing it in. So it got really tough to do a week of little things. But. But it did work for a while and it certainly saved a lot of money. And. And like the seventh day was never like, maybe I'd make dinner. It wasn't the big night out, super expensive thing. It was.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Well, I do like Sarah Catherine's idea of access service. You know, clean out the garage. Like, that's a great. So great thing. I wish Cheryl would do that. She start cleaning out the garage. Be so romantic. Those are pretty good ones. Thanks everybody. That contributed those on my burgeoning Blue sky, my new social media platform that I'm spending a little time on having fun, experimenting with new places. I think that's going to do it for today, guys. Thank you so much for contributing to a phenomenal Valentine's Day and early birthday present for Mr. Penzo and I. Jesse.

[Jesse Kramer]

I was just curious. Can we do the trivia question for fun or are you going to save it for a future episode?

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Doug, what do you think, man?

[Doug]

I think it's pretty apropos for this episode. I say we just run it just for fun. No points. No points for the yearly total.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Maybe. Maybe. You know what? I'm gonna shut that down. We're not doing it. We are not doing it. We're gonna end the episode. Jesse, what's going on at the. Whatever the heck you're calling it podcast.

[Jesse Kramer]

My podcast that used to be known as the best interest podcast and as of you hearing this in your ears now has a new name that you have to go and find out for yourself. We just released episode 100 in which we announced the name change and we playback some of our favorite bits and bites from the first 99 episodes. And coming up soon, I think next episode we have Coach Carson, Chad Carson, terrific mind in the residential real estate investing world, coming on to share some of his wisdom with us.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

It's funny, the longer I know Chad, it's weird how much we're alike. You know, in my hometown in Texarkana, I'm part of a non profit group that builds walking trails around town, works with the city. And so is he.

[Jesse Kramer]

Exactly.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

I think we have like the same non profit stuff. We do. It's crazy. Totally.

[Jesse Kramer]

And I mean, having spent time with you at Fincon, Joe, I know that you're also like a 6 foot 4, 240 pound former collegiate linebacker. You guys have that common too.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

We are very, very much.

[Jesse Kramer]

We're, we're crazy.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

We were both college athletes. However, his was a little bit, a little bit bigger stage than mine was. I would say Clemson football, little better than Citadel cross country.

[Jesse Kramer]

No, I've watched enough ESPN to know that that's not true. Citadel cross country.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Citadel cross country is where it's at. Yeah, it's huge. That's right. And they're still running. And look at that, they're running.

[Doug]

One guy passed the other guy I got.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

It was left foot, right foot, left foot, right foot that time, Bob, it was incredible. Mr. Penzo, what's going [e-mail], my friend?

[Len Penzo]

Oh, I don't know. It's the same old crap over here. You know, it really doesn't matter. All I care about is you come over and click on the ads and that's all I care you don't even have to stay. Just click the ad and leave. That's lenpenzo.com Saturdays is kind of fun, though. I do the. The squirrel cams are on Saturdays on our black coffee, which is a lot of fun because I highlight the best tweets and financial. Financial news of the. Of the week. So it's a fun little thing. But if you want to do that, come on by and if not, just stop on by and like I said, click the ads and then you can leave and take you five seconds and I'd appreciate it. So thanks, Len.

[Jesse Kramer]

I'm. I'm on the site now and the ads. She's not wearing many clothes and she's talking about her pictures. Is that the ad to click on?

[Len Penzo]

That's the. You got it, my friend. Those pay the most. The ones. Those. If it has an XXX and those.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Happening, I don't know what's happening.

[Len Penzo]

Thanks, Jesse. Thanks for bringing that up. Yeah, checks in the mail, but that's great. Believe me, if you click on that one, there's enough for both me and you. So we'll.

[Doug]

February 15th is about to be the busiest day in lenpenzo.com history, by the way.

[Len Penzo]

It is our birthdays coming. Our birthday is coming up. Both of us. So you know, we're both getting old.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Bald guys birthday.

[Len Penzo]

I mean, that's the bad news. The bad news, we're both getting old. But you know what the good news is? Old age doesn't last very long. So that's.

[Jesse Kramer]

We got that to look forward to.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

On that note, on that inspiring note. Doug, get us out of here. Ma'am, what should we have learned today?

[Doug]

I can't imagine a lot, but I'll give it a shot. Joe, first, I can't believe when Jesse said that thing about giving an unexpected gift like an open kimono. Jesse, can you summarize that for us again?

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah, if you're less graphically. If you're gonna buy your partner if you're gonna buy your partner something special for Valentine's Day, see if it qualifies as an HSA expense.

[Doug]

Oh, it's fantastic. Joe doesn't get it yet. Second, as usual, Len really brought the heat today. Hey, Len, as someone who's been married 74 years, what advice would you give to the youngins? Nothing.

[Len Penzo]

Len, isn't that where you put the cricket sound effect in after that?

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Because you've got nothing.

[Len Penzo]

Don't get old, kids. When has this changed since I've been gone? What is it that you're Asking questions in the closing. Now you're supposed to just say what you learned and then I'm. This is the part where I kind of cruise.

[Doug]

You just take a nap.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Doug's getting lazy. Yes.

[Len Penzo]

I didn't know you're making me do homework in the clothes.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Actually, we like it better. I do like it better when we have people say what the thing was.

[Len Penzo]

Ask me again. What was the question? I don't even remember what the question was.

[Doug]

You know what I was thinking of when I wrote it, Len, was when you said that money's more important to a happy marriage and being in line, aligned with was more important than sex or anything else. So, yeah, that's what I was thinking of. So. 3, 2, 1. As usual, Len really brought the heat today. Hey, Len, as someone who's been married for 74 years, what advice would you give to the youngins listening?

[Len Penzo]

I don't know. I can't give you a witty answer for that. I'm sorry.

[Doug]

I literally just told you what the answer was.

[Jesse Kramer]

I don't know.

[Len Penzo]

Look, I'm a little rusty at this roundtable stuff, so you can spell it out for him.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Doug again. Okay, Doug, what's the big lesson? What's the big lesson, Doug?

[Doug]

You mean besides that one? Well, Joe, the big lesson. I think today's discussion proves that love is like Joe's mom's basement. Ignore the cracks too long and it's going to cost you big time. Thanks to Len Penzo for joining us today. You'll find more of len's [e-mail] or squirrels after dark.com. we'll also include links in our show [e-mail]. thanks to Sarah Catherine Gutierrez for hanging out with us today for like 15 minutes. You'll find her fabulous financial planning work at. Shit was like when the popular girl comes over to your table at lunch and realizes, oh, yeah, these guys are nerds. I'm out.

[Len Penzo]

Yeah, no thanks to her Internet service.

[Doug]

Yeah, it was her Internet service. You'll find her fabulous financial planning [e-mail] maybe my favorite website name ever. And thanks also to Jesse Kramer for joining us today. You'll find his podcast somehow. Like, just go out and search the Internet. You'll figure it out somehow. You know, you'll find his best interest podcast or whatever the kids are calling it these days, wherever you're listening to us right now. So go subscribe if you can solve the riddle. This show is the property of SB Podcasts, LLC. Copyright 2025 and is created by Joe Saul Sehive. Joe gets help from a few of our neighborhoods friends. You'll find out about our awesome [e-mail] along with the show notes and how you can find us on YouTube and all the usual social media spots. Come say hello.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Oh, yeah.

[Doug]

And before I go, not only should you not take advice from these nerds, don't take advice from people you don't know. This show is for entertainment purposes only. Before making any financial decisions, speak with a real financial financial advisor. I'm Joe's mom's neighbor, Doug, and we'll see you next time back here at the Stacking Benjamin show.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Welcome to the after show. This is the part of the show that doesn't exist.

[Len Penzo]

Thank God.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Doug, Doug, what's our trivia qu. We got trivia head to head between Len and Jesse today.

[Doug]

All right. Okay. It's a cage match. You want me to, like, do the actual script or just read the question?

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Let's do the script, man. Let's do it.

[Doug]

Okay. Because you worked so long on this one. Me too. Hey there, stackers. I'm Joe's mom's neighbor, Doug, and happy Valentine's Day, everyone. You know what I love for Valentine's Day? A nice, crisp, mercifully short trivia question. That's what. Here's today's what percentage of Americans in relationships cite finances as their primary source of stress? I'll be back right after I help Joe's mom by taking out the garbage because that will quickly relieve some stress, guaranteed.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

All right, Len, you brought this up, by the way. That money bigger stress than anything else. What. What percentage of people agree with you that money's the number one stressor?

[Len Penzo]

I think it's super high. I. I'd be shocked if it's not. I would say at least four out of five. At least four out of five people. I'd say four and a half. I'll say 85%.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

85%, Jesse.

[Jesse Kramer]

So I feel like because it's a one on one, it would be unfair of me simply to take the under and say 84%.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

84.

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah. I feel like that's, like that's a rookie move.

[Doug]

Yeah. For person game, I agree.

[Jesse Kramer]

But I'll say, I think my first instinct, you know, what you should have.

[Len Penzo]

Had us do is write the answer.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Down and put it in front of the we know.

[Jesse Kramer]

Now, I'll try to be an honest broker here because as you were reading the question, and I just want to make sure it's what percentage of people listed it as their number one stressor?

[Doug]

Yeah, that's the spirit of the question.

[Jesse Kramer]

Yes. Yeah, I was going to say, like somewhere between a third and half. So I'll just say 40% was going to be my. If you had made me go first, I would have said 40%.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

All right, 85% and 40%. Doug, what's our answer? Who's going to win this?

[Len Penzo]

Jesse, thank you for being such a upstanding, high character individual.

[Jesse Kramer]

I googled it, Len, so I didn't want to say 84. I would have looked stupid.

[Doug]

No, I'm kidding.

[Jesse Kramer]

But I've written about it before and I just. Something about that stat, I wanted to think, like, I think it's a plurality, like it might be the most common answer, but for some reason I didn't think it's above 50% because there are all these other reasons that it could be too.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Well, let's see, Doug, who's going to take home the win?

[Doug]

Hey there, stackers. I'm stress reducer and guy who can't seem to find any lessons for the language of love on Duolingo. Joe's mom's neighbor, Doug. Valentine's Day. Based on this discussion, it's apparently a day when you go into debt and lie to your partner about it all in the name of making them happy. Sounds about right. It's no wonder we're stressed out. Well, here was the question, what percentage of Americans and relationships cite finances as their primary source of stress? The answer? Well, it was 48% less than what OG guessed and just 3% less than what Jesse guessed. Well, yeah, because we want OG to be wrong, right?

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Yeah, because I was throwing it for OG.

[Doug]

Yeah, Len was playing for OG So it's important that everybody takes away from this that OG sucked canal water on this one.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Even without being here.

[Doug]

Even without being here, it was 48% less than what OG slash Len guessed and just 3% less than what Jesse guessed. Because the answer is 37%, making most importantly, not OG our winner.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

But you know, it is funny when you dive into that where it would lend to your point, when finance isn't number one, it's a close number two. I don't know if you remember that, Jesse, from looking at that before, but. But clearly very, very, very close.

[Jesse Kramer]

What's number one?

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

That is number one. I'm saying in people's stresses, people that don't have it listed as number one. Because our question was, what's the number one stressor? They have it listed as the number two stressor.

[Jesse Kramer]

I see.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

So finance, yeah, is a huge stressor for everybody. Just some people have, you know, problem families, jobs, whatever other stuff going on.

[Len Penzo]

So I'm just sorry this wasn't official because then it would have officially counted against og, but.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Oh, well, I know.

[Len Penzo]

So that's too bad.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Well, that's just your warm up, man. That's just the warm up.

[Len Penzo]

Next time.

[Joe Saul-Sehy]

Next time.