Invest Like the 1%? What to Steal, What to Scale, and What to Skip (SB1836)

Summary

The Stacking Benjamins Show – Episode SB1836
Invest Like the 1%? What to Steal, What to Scale, and What to Skip
May 1, 2026 | Hosts: Joe Saul-Sehy & Josh “OG” Bannerman, with Jesse Kramer & Roxanne Duckles

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Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into the often-repeated advice: "invest like the 1%." Joe, OG, Jesse Kramer (Personal Finance for Long-Term Investors), and comedian/personal finance coach Roxanne Duckles (Finance Rocks) break down what wealthy individuals really do with their money, and discuss which behaviors, strategies, and habits are worth emulating for everyday investors. Using the playful format "Steal it, Scale it, or Skip it," the roundtable unpacks specific practices—like long-term thinking, tax obsession, alternative investments, leveraging advice, and more—to uncover what listeners should learn, copy, or avoid altogether.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Does It Pay To “Invest Like the 1%”?

Main Theme:
Is advice targeted at the ultra-rich applicable to regular investors? The panel plays a game of "Steal it" (definitely copy this), "Scale it" (try if it suits you), or "Skip it" (don’t bother).

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2. What Should You Steal?

Long-Term Thinking

• Unanimous agreement: This is the top habit of the wealthy that everyone should adopt.
  • Roxanne: “Absolutely thinking long term…even little things like buying the big bale of toilet paper, things like that. … The farther and farther you can [see ahead] just helps you get ahead that much faster.” (12:14)
  • Jesse: “Long term thinking is most of the time a wonderful thing. … The point is that … people who have more long term success financially are thinking beyond the next week … even the next year. … Thinking in decades.” (13:42)
  • OG: Describes the Strategic Coach “25-year framework” for planning. “If you set the plan for 25 years but then you break it down into what you have to do this quarter, it becomes a lot easier.” (14:13)
  • Joe: “The optimal move is the one that's great over the long term … but also the quickest one to move the needle short term.” (15:52)

Paying for Good Advice

• Should you? The panel weighs the surprising fact that many wealthy DIYers still pay for expert guidance.
  • Joe: “My wealthiest clients were super smart people … and yet they surrounded themselves with very smart people.” (23:20)
  • Jesse: “Probably the most common one is...‘I want someone involved now so that if I get hit by a bus tomorrow … my wife…is going to be OK.’ That’s more common than I thought it would be.” (24:48)
  • OG: “That’s probably the biggest tick mark…in the column of, like, do we hire professional people? … The more time you spend on things that are not your unique talent, that’s wasted time.” (26:41)
  • Roxanne: Mixed feelings; tried a financial advisor who couldn’t answer her questions. “You can become the smart person in some things and then get help in other things.” (24:20)

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3. Scale It: Proceed with Caution

Tax Strategy Obsession

• Is tax optimization something to focus on?
  • Jesse: “Tax optimization is one of those things … that's helpful, but it also sometimes can distract people from the more important things. ... It’s like number seven on the list of ten.” (17:46)
  • OG: “Don’t let the tax tail wag the dog…But don’t let that tax tail wag the decision.” (20:00)
  • Roxanne: “Tax strategy obsession, I’m going to say skip it… But tax strategy in general, I think is good—a little bit, to a point, a sprinkle.” (20:12)
  • Joe: “Higher up the wealth ladder you go, the more it all makes sense. … If you got a billion dollars, you probably have enough money…then tax, taxes matter.” (22:10)

Alternative Investments

• Does private equity, real estate syndication, or “alternative” mean better?
  • Jesse: “Any investment, no matter how good it is, can be made a bad investment with really high fees. … I’m definitely a scale it … there’s plenty of downside to go with the upside.” (40:40)
  • Roxanne: “I’m inclined to say skip it altogether … partly because a lot of people won’t have access to them anyway … and just keeping it simple.” Suggests start with small, simple investments to learn. (42:10)
  • OG: “Alternative investments should be banned for everyone all the time, period. … There is no benefit to it, especially when you look at it from the continuum of risk and return.” (43:23)
  • Joe: “Neither [alternative] company (named Masterworks, AcreTrader) are emphasizing do this because the 1% does it, which is that marketing just drives me crazy.” (45:23)

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4. Skip It: What the 1% Do That You Shouldn’t

Leverage

• Does using borrowed money to invest make sense?
  • Roxanne: “No, I don’t like it. … Never been for me. Skip it.” (47:32)
  • Jesse: “When you’re already in the top 1%, leverage is that thing. Right. You’re risking your wealth to just go get more of it. You don’t need more of it usually.” (48:01)
    • Drops a Warren Buffett quote: “Why would you sacrifice something that you have and need for something you don’t have and don’t need?” (48:01)
  • OG: Points out most people use leverage in real estate, but avoid it in the stock market, even though the risks could be higher with a single property. Ultimately advises against deep leverage for the average person. (48:44)

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5. Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On taxes:
  • OG: “Don’t let the tax tail wag the investment dog in the hunt or something like that.” (57:56 Doug’s wrap-up)
• On delegation:
  • OG: “The more time you spend on things that are not your unique talent, that's wasted time.” (26:41)
• On alternative investments:
  • OG: “Alternative investments should be banned for everyone all the time, period.” (43:23)
• On long-term vs. short-term:
  • OG: “…If you do your financial plan and say, ‘I need $3 million’ and you have $78,000…the reality is, all I have to do is think about the next 90 days.” (16:03)
• On getting started:
  • Roxanne: “I recommend people do is to just get started with like $20 and buy an individual stock … and being able to understand investing because really it’s no more difficult than ordering things on Amazon.” (43:07)

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6. Notable Segments & Timestamps

• [12:14] — Long-term thinking: Steal it or not?
• [17:46] — Tax Strategy: Order of importance
• [23:20] — Paying for advice: Do the wealthy have a secret?
• [40:40] — Alternative investments: Worth it?
• [47:32] — Leverage: Sensible for the average investor?
• [57:56] — Doug’s humorous wrap-up and lessons learned

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Additional Highlights

• Trivia Competition: Mid-show features the ongoing trivia battle between Jesse, OG, and Paula Pant (with Roxanne subbing in for Paula). The question: What year was the phrase “Mayday” proposed as an emergency signal? Answer: 1923. Jesse wins the round. (31:48–39:31)
• Lively Banter: The episode is laced with fun, friendly jabs, real-world examples, and Jesse’s recurring references to Warren Buffett and Munger (now a running drinking game among fans).
• Listener Engagement: The crew responds to live YouTube chat comments and encourages listener feedback via their Facebook group.

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Takeaway Lessons

• Do steal the right habits:
  • Develop long-term wealth-building strategies.
  • Don’t be afraid to pay for good advice, but know what you need.
• Scale with caution:
  • Tax efficiency matters, but don’t obsess at the cost of everything else.
  • Alternative investments are rarely a necessity; don’t get sold on “what the 1% are doing.”
• Skip outright:
  • High leverage and complex investments are usually a trap for non-experts.

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Closing Quotes

• Roxanne Duckles (on the rich):
  “You should absolutely steal from the rich, especially their ideas about long term financial planning.” (57:21, paraphrased by Doug)
• Jesse Kramer (via Warren Buffett):
  “Why would you sacrifice something that you have and need for something that you don’t have and don’t need?” (48:01)

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For more from the panel:

• Roxanne Duckles: IG/YouTube @FinanceRox | Pursuing “the dirtiest accounting joke of all time”
• Jesse Kramer: Personal Finance for Long-Term Investors podcast
• OG: Stacking Benjamins co-host & CFP at Bannerman Wealth

Weekly trivia, smart laughs, and practical investing talk—find more at Stacking Benjamins.

Transcript

[A]

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[D]

Live from the basement of the YouTube headquarters, it's the Stacking Benjamin Show. I'm Joe's mom's neighbor, Doug. And you know, everyone says invest like the rich. So cool. Should I like start buying private islands or maybe give Warren Buffett a call again like I did last week? Today we're breaking down what the 1% actually does with their money, what you can copy and what will absolutely blow up your financial plan if you try it at Home plus, midway through today's show, we'll find out if OG will get another step closer to making history as he'll try yet again, again to beat Jesse and Paula in another installment of our year long trivia competition. And now a guy who's in the top 1% when it comes to helping stackers plan better for the future. It's Joe Sal.

[B]

Hey there. Thanks, Doug. I am Joe Salsihai. And Happy Friday to you and happy May Day to you. We've actually made it to the. Is it the unofficial start of summer? Like not the real thing, but I think no matter where you're at in North America anyway, you can, you can kind of rely on the fact that the weather is going to be a little, a little better. And the guy who it's always better weather when he's around. Mr. OG is here. How are you man?

[A]

What's up? Yep, great, fantastic. Just working on a little project here. Multitasking. But I'm going to shut that down and Doug can yell at me later for, for, for giving him some well needed education. But.

[B]

Oh good. Just What?

[A]

My. That project's over. So. So I'm good.

[B]

Excellent. Well, I'm glad you can multitask. He's got a.

[A]

Not anymore. I'm single tasking.

[B]

He's got an audience here, and he's doing two things at once. And a guy who can always do two things at once, generally change a diaper and talk about personal finance. Jesse Kramer from Personal Finance for Long Term Investors, or the Puff podcast is here.

[C]

I think pfly is what neighbor Doug settled on. But yeah, speaking of inside podcasting thing, so I'm drinking one of these polar seltzers right now. You know, doing two things at once, drinking and podcasting. But as you guys know, there are certain things in podcasting you're not really supposed to do, and one of them is belch into the microphone. So, you know, just put it out there. I might go on mute at some

[A]

point, and that's why strongly suggest you mute yourself. Yes.

[B]

I'm so glad, Doug, that he had to tell us that he wasn't going to belch on the microphone today. Like, that's the kind of quality work that Mr. Kramer does.

[C]

I care about the listeners.

[B]

And I met today's special guest at fincon last year, and I was super excited to meet her because not only is she somebody who's been diving into personal finance, she coaches a lot of people in personal finance, and she is a comedian from Finance Rocks. It is. I guess we can call her, since we've known each other for, like, seven months. My friend Roxanne Duckles here. How are you?

[E]

Yeah, good.

[A]

Hi.

[E]

How the hell are you?

[B]

I'm. I'm the hell good. How the hell are you?

[E]

I feel like I have to say that to honor my hometown, because everyone says that in Montana.

[B]

Do they really? So then after that, do you just flip each other off? Is that what happens?

[E]

No, you say good like a normal person. Oh, that is.

[B]

That is good. So that's a good greeting. That's a warm greeting. Yes, it's funny. You are in Montana. Two questions I had. I don't meet many people who are from Montana, you know, who have a career in comedy. How did you get involved in comedy?

[E]

I am in Colorado now. I just moved here a year ago, but grew up in Montana. Lived there my whole adult life. There's actually a quote. Jimmy Carr says, show me someone whose parents are depressed, and I'll show you someone who's funny. I asked my dad one time if he'd ever been depressed, and he said, I've never not been Depressed, like, wait a second.

[B]

Right, right.

[E]

Yeah. So I think a lot of people learn how to be funny just as, like a way to cope with social situations. And I. I like to think I'm just a natural, though.

[D]

Just.

[B]

Just naturally funny. Not. But you did have a great social media piece just recently where you were talking about how people think that you come up with stuff just standing there at the microphone, which I thought was pretty funny because I think your first line was. First of all, I'd have to be thinking of stuff at the. Thinking of anything at the microphone, which I would imagine is very difficult.

[E]

Yes, Definitely an introvert. And definitely. Yeah, have a hard time thinking in front of people, but don't be afraid. I'm prepared for this. So I've done plenty of thinking ahead of time. But, yeah, I love that people always give me the benefit of the doubt. And I used to crush in our accounting meetings, and so that was like, the old ladies love me.

[B]

Oh, this is perfect. All the accountants think you're funny. This is going to go great.

[C]

Jesse, I was going to say, Roxanne, if you need time today, just raise your hand. I'm going to rip a burp right into the microphone. It'll distract everybody, and you can think of your next line.

[E]

That'd be great. I don't intend to burp at all.

[B]

So is that, like, quality comedy writing now? So that's question number one. Question number two, though, Roxanne, is your interest in personal finance? Where does that come from?

[E]

Oh, I am a lifer. Since I was little, my parents struggled with money, so I always wanted to be good at money. Worked really hard in school so that I could go. I have my degree in accounting and quickly found out that accounting is boring as all heck. Sorry. Now I'm insulting the accountants that, you know, have my bag.

[B]

There go the ratings.

[E]

I know, but I was more of a financial analyst, so if any analysts are here, we're friends.

[B]

We're one of the few shows in America where you can dissect the two. And the accountants are like, no, no, no, we're the funny ones, not the analysts. And the analysts are like, no, we're the funny ones. Well, we're super glad that you're here. And by the way, people should follow your YouTube channel and also follow your Instagram because you're telling jokes on there and talking money like. Like, if you want the combo, do both.

[E]

Yeah, that would be great. I'm at Finance Rocks everywhere. It's one of my goals to write the dirtiest accounting joke of all time. So follow along on my journey.

[C]

There once was an accountant from Montana.

[B]

All right, maybe our, our friends hanging out with us here on YouTube can help you write the dirtiest accounting joke ever. We today guys are going to be talking about this line that always drives me crazy, and it's, you need to invest like the 1%. And every time I see this, I don't know about Roxanne, OG or Jesse or heck, even you, Doug. I, I think, what do you. Why do I want to invest like the 1%? Like, there's so many reasons why that's not sexy. And yet you see a lot of these investments, they, they grow for a reason because apparently that attracts people. So let's talk about investing like the 1%, and I'm going to set it up this way. I've thought of a few different things that the 1% do, and we're going to have this little game we're going to call Steal it, Scale it, or skip it. And by steal it, these are things I think that the 1% does really well so that we can steal these things and you guys can tell me if I'm wrong or if I'm right. So we'll ask our roundtable that and maybe our friends also on YouTube hanging out with us. The second is these things that are kind of yellow light, right? When I say scale it, I mean, maybe we want to go further with it, maybe we don't. Maybe we do want to throw it away. I'm not sure. But then the third, I've got these listed as things that the 1% does that we maybe want to skip. And I want to see if you guys agree with me or not. So steal it, scale it, skip it today with the 1%. But first, we have a few sponsors who help us keep on keeping on so that we can keep doing this, not just live on YouTube, but just do the Friday show at all. We have only two ad breaks during the entire show. First one's going to be now, second one in the middle of the show. So we're going to hear from a couple of those sponsors and then Roxanne, OG and Jesse getting into it with our little game about the 1%. Do we want to steal these, we want to scale them, or do we want to skip them? As you hear this, I just got back from keynoting the Millionaire Money Mentors Conference in Florida. I'm sure I had a great time, even though I haven't gone yet as I record this. But I know wherever any stacking Benjamin's people are. It's always a party, isn't it? But what makes it even better party is the fact that when you see pictures of me, those clothes came from quints. I've been getting intentional lately about what I wear during the day today and on stage and leaning in more into pieces that feel easy, that are comfortable, that I can travel with and still look put together. It just makes getting dressed simpler. Whether I'm at home or on the road, Quint has been my go to. The fabrics feel elevated. The fits are clean. Everything just works without needing to overthink it. Quince has all the wardrobe staples for spring. Think 100% European linen shorts and shirts from $34. Lightweight, breathable and comfortable, but still look put together and clean. 100% Pima cotton tees with a softness that has to be felt. Their pants also hit that same balance. Relaxed and comfortable, but still polished enough to wear pretty much anywhere. Everything's priced 50 to 80% less than what you'd find at similar brands. Quint works directly with ethical factories and cuts out the middlemen. So you're getting premium materials without the markup. Between the pants that feel so incredibly comfortable. And my favorite is still that first cashmere sweater that I got. It is so nice. It's great to feel good because you know that your wardrobe looks good and it didn't cost anywhere near what I thought clothing that looks like that would cost. It should be the same for you. Refresh your everyday with luxury you'll actually use. Head to quint.comsb and because you're a stacker, you'll get free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. That's qu I n c.comSB for free shipping. 365 day returns. Quint.comSB. Let's start off with what I think is the one thing that the 1% does really well. And we'll start with you, Roxanne, as our guest of honor. I think this idea of thinking long term is something that the 1% does really well. Like they're not interested in overnight results. Maybe sometimes they are, but I just get this feeling that they're not making those mistakes of jumping in and out of investments like the 99% often do.

[E]

Yeah, I love it. I'm going to say steal it.

[B]

Is that something that you've stole in your life?

[E]

Yeah. It's funny because starting out with not a lot of money, like, I completely went broke in college. I mean, like a lot of us. So I remember thinking like, you know what, I'm going to only fill my tank of gas all the way up and that'll be like kind of future investment. So, you know, starting with even little things like buying the big bale of toilet paper, things like that. So I think absolutely thinking long term and like longer and longer, the farther and farther you can just helps you get ahead that much faster.

[B]

Jesse, I brought this one to the table first because I think it's a steal it. Roxanne thinks it's a steal it. Long term thinking.

[C]

Yeah, I mean I'm a little biased. It's in the name of the, of the content I produce. But yeah, long term, weird. Long term thinking is most of the time a wonderful thing. And yeah, I would say on average, does the average person in the top 1% and actually saw a little side question someone was asking in the chat. Are we defining 1% as assets or as income?

[B]

I think we can call it either one. What I'm really disputing and that is by the way, Roxanne's new neighbor, Mark Troutman. Have you met Mark yet, Roxanne? He lives in Colorado.

[E]

Yeah, we're good friends. I know how the hell he is.

[B]

Yeah. Colorado's a small state. You Mark. I'm sure neighbors. Mark. What I'm really debating here is just the marketing around. We need to invest like the 1%. Everybody should invest like that. You want to get in this because this is what the 1% does. Well, long term thinking, Jesse, you're all about it.

[C]

Yeah, correct. So right. Rather someone actually has, you know, enough assets or enough income to qualify as the top 1%. I think the point is that generally people who are better off financially and people who have more long term success financially are thinking beyond the next week, the next month, even the next year. You know, it's that this idea of like thinking in decades, if you, if you had the choice. See, I'm, I'm all about it.

[B]

Perry. Joe, Jim Bob says maybe 1% of gas evaporates. Maybe that's it. I don't know. Oh gee. Thinking long term.

[A]

I love one of the concepts that we talk about in Strategic Coach. And Joe, you and I have talked a little bit about Strategic Coach over the years, but there's a concept called the 25 year framework that, that they talk about and it's really in conjunction with the 10x thinking and that sort of stuff. If you start evaluating like what you want things to look like 25 years from now, it seems like an impossible goal. Right. When you go I need X dollars or whatever. And then you can start breaking that down into these quarter size, bite size pieces and it becomes a lot easier to, you know, or a lot more likely to achieve those goals because you set the plan for 25 years but then you broke it down into what do I have to do this quarter? So yeah, I would, I would 100% agree with Long term. Long term thinking wins every time.

[B]

It is interesting because I love doing business case studies. What's funny is though, Roxanne, when businesses think just long term all the time, those businesses don't win because they meet their, they don't meet their short term obligations, they don't meet their short term needs. And then companies that think just short term, they don't win because they're never looking out at the horizon and building anything. I still think even though we're talking long term is great, like there's gotta be this balancing act.

[E]

Yeah, no, I agree. And I was actually just thinking about that since I recently hit my financial independence number, it can kind of shorten, right? Like oh, score time. So you're like my timeframe was long and now I'm like, oh wait a second, like oh yeah, I need the short term needs. So I suppose the time frame can change and maybe thinking about where you should be at time frame wise.

[B]

Well, and I remember this og. I feel like in those strategic coach meetings they talked about this like the optimal move is the one that's great over the long term because you're thinking long term, but also it's going to be the quickest one to move the needle short term.

[A]

It's just the process, right? It's deciding what you are going to point the boat at and then going, all right, what do we have to do over the next 90 days to move toward that versus looking at that long term number. And this is what I was saying before, it's like if you do your financial plan and you say, okay, I need $3 million and you have 78,000 in your brokerage account right now, you're like, okay, there's not a scenario that I get to 3 million. But there is. It's just going to take you 30 years to do it or it's going to take you 25 years to do it. So it's like all I have to do is just think about the next 90 days. It serves the purpose or it serves the long term goal. But I can focus on what's here now and then adjust every 90 days, which I think is kind of the Biggest missing piece of all of this. It's like, yeah, we have to have long term stuff, but we also have to have short term execution. But it's really the reevaluation of those things along the journey that makes you stay on track.

[B]

I like that. Think short term, but serve long term needs. The short term actions really serve the long term need. All right, that's the one I knew we were going to agree on. I wanted to start with one that I was fairly certain we were going to agree on. Now let's see if we can mix it up a little bit. How about this one for steal it that I think we could all maybe use. Jesse Kramer, we'll start with you first. A tech strategy obsession. I feel like the 1%, whenever we're selling 1% investments, they always talk about this is a tax preferential investment. You got to get in because of taxes, taxes, taxes, taxes. And I go, you know what? The average person out there maybe could be a little more obsessed with taxes than they are. Do you agree, steal it?

[C]

Well, I'm trying to think about the best way to answer this, so maybe I'll start my answer with this. I put together something I called the long term investors order of operations. And as he sent ideas that like, I think long term investors ought to think about and they're prioritized in an order because the thing I saw was that a lot of people, they see these shiny objects out there and then they forget about the stuff that's actually really important because they're so obsessed with this new shiny object. Tax optimization is one of those things that's like kind of in this gray area where it's helpful, but it also sometimes can distract people from the more important things. And I'm describing this because to me that tax optimization is like number seven on the list of 10. And so do people in the top 1% do like people who really have their financial plan together, do they think about tax optimization? Probably it's because they've already taken care of the other six things that I think are more important. And I think if you try to measure how much tax optimization will help your long term, say, portfolio performance over decades, there's a number there, but it's probably not as high of a number as most people would think.

[B]

Oh, gee, this kind of goes with what we were talking about Monday when we were talking about ETFs and about index investing and trying to get people to one on one there. It sounds like what Jesse's saying is it'll move the Needle, but not before a few other things.

[A]

The thing that I immediately thought of when you were talking about tax optimization was the story I heard recently about the person who was trying to defer a bunch of capital gains and so they put a bunch of money into an opportunity fund which is like this esoteric tax slash investment plan that you can put money away in a certain area of the economy. And all they did really was defer taxes and more specifically created this illiquidity problem of I had all this money that was mine and now is not mine because I have to pay tax. So we looked at it from the perspective of I got this tax problem and I'm going to optimize for taxes, but instead now I don't have any of my money. It's locked up in this thing that's really esoteric investment that I really don't have any access to. So I would put taxes a little higher up than Jesse apparently has. But don't let the tax tail wag the dog, so to speak.

[B]

As I say, it's interesting how far down the list it is. Roxanne, when it comes to taxes, I mean, you're the tax geek in our roundtable today. Where do you think taxes lie?

[E]

Well, since you said tax strategy obsession, I'm going to say skip it because I want to get an A and I want you guys to like me. But tax strategy in general I think is good, a little bit to a point, a sprinkle. But I don't get myself too worried about it because I'm frugal so I'm not going to have to pull a lot each year.

[B]

Mel Abraham guest earlier this year hanging out with us, said the sequence and the ingredients matter in any recipe need both. And you're definitely Jesse worried about the sequence here.

[C]

Yeah, exactly. I think, okay, we can prioritize it higher or lower, but like when someone is accumulating their wealth, we can say like there's only so many dials. You can really turn on the tax optimization front. And, and I think like Roxanne, you kind of hit it. It's like put money into tax advantaged accounts if you can. If you happen to be doing something on the side that allows you to do write offs, like just be aware of the different tax knobs you have to turn then in decumulation stages. Okay, maybe you can do some Roth conversions, tax gain harvesting, but like even then it's really, it's interesting. You can hear some really smart people out there. I was just listening to a guy, maybe Some of the listeners are familiar with him. John Luskin, he hosts the Bogleheads podcast.

[B]

Sure. Yeah.

[C]

And he made a pretty good point. I think it was him who had made this point where he's like, listen, there's so many assumptions that you're making about future tax rates and like future investment returns that, like, you know, you can make some guesses, but you don't really know what's going to happen. And it's really hard to measure the value of tax planning ahead of time prospectively. Like, you can only ever really measure it after the fact, looking backward and saying, oh, did that Roth conversion I did in 2012, like, did that pay off or not? So anyway, there's good value there, but I just. It's probably not as giant a dial to turn as, as maybe as maybe it might be if you have 20 million bucks. Like, maybe it is actually a really big dial for you to turn because so much of your asset base is either subject to higher tax rates or estate taxes. If you got a million dollars, maybe just the opportunity set isn't as big.

[B]

I think that's the key is, is the higher up that wealth ladder you go, the more it makes sense. And this is what changes the needle depending on. I mean, if you've got a billion dollars, the number one driver that most people fail is saving enough money. You got a billion dollars, you probably have enough money unless you're, unless you're, you're spending rate. It's just crazy. You have enough. And then tax, taxes matter. I got a third one here that is maybe the most controversial, which is back when I was a financial planner, what I noticed was my wealthiest clients, my wealthiest clients were super smart people. And what I heard was this straw man argument of when I first joined the personal finance media space, I heard in online forums everywhere the strawman argument of you shouldn't pay for advice because you're smart enough to do it yourself. And I look at all these fantastic people who are super smart that were clients of mine, people that were doing amazing things in their life and they knew how to do money, and yet they surrounded themselves with very smart people. So the idea, Roxanne, of paying for advice, I actually put in this first area of I think we should steal it.

[E]

So can I do a. Say do as I say, not as I do, I have a hard time paying for it. I did go and talk to a financial advisor one time, and I don't know, I asked him like two questions that he didn't know the answers to and I was like, oh, maybe. I see.

[B]

I think that's a different thing because I think you really got to be selective about who's on your team. You know, you can't just allow anybody on your team. You want your team to be rock stars. And what I didn't find was these people had sloppy advisors around them. They didn't have people that wouldn't be able to answer those questions. My super smart clients had very smart people around them. That's what I'm talking about.

[E]

Yeah, I mean, fair enough. I think it's great having a good tax attorney, you know, having a good accountant. So not me, you know, so I think, I mean, I. What does scale it? What is that supposed to mean?

[B]

Well, scale it is just I'm either going to maybe think about it a little or zero or I'm going to think about it a lot. So in that one, I want to talk about where we're going to be on the scale that's, that's coming up next.

[E]

So why don't I say scale it and. Because you can become the smart person in some things and then get help in other things.

[B]

Deal. Well, and I think that's fair. I mean, you know, we're going to talk to Jesse and Og, who are both people that, that get hired, I think, by smart people. So you got to kind of take the way you guys see it, knowing that, however, paying for advice. Jesse Kramer, you want me to go?

[C]

Yeah. Well, listen, I mean, of course I've got a dog in the fight, but also it's like I try to be pretty transparent and say that the more, you know, the sharper of a DIYer you are, like, it should be kind of obvious on its face. Probably the less value add you can get from an advisor. I think that's fair to say. At the same time, are there some sharp people who come to me and say, I mean, probably the most common One is I'm 67 years old. I've done all this hard work for 30 years. I know the ins and outs of every detail of my financial plan. My doctor says I'm probably going to be dead by 80 and I'd rather have someone involved now than later to make sure that if I get hit by a bus tomorrow or have a heart attack, that my wife, who has no idea what's going on, that she's going to be okay. That's more common than I thought it would be. Like, if you asked me three years ago how often I'd get that message, I'd be Like, I don't know, once a year. Yeah, it's like once a week. So anyway, that's a pretty common one. And then just. Yeah, sometimes people just say, I want a spot check. Like, okay, maybe I don't always engage with them if that's all they want, but at least the demand is there. There are different strokes for different folks. But anyway, I think a really common one is just, I know what's going on, but what's the backup plan if something happens to me?

[D]

If you've got a doctor that's telling you when you're going to die, he's on Cal Sheet, you need to get a new doctor.

[B]

I've got three to one odds you're dying.

[C]

I bet

[B]

that is not good.

[D]

But ulterior motives.

[B]

Oh, gee, I want to go back to Strategic Coach. Because the thing that I learned at Strategic Coach, and some people that are in Strategic Coach or financial planners, other people are attorneys, other people are. One guy ran a group of musicians that were nationwide that played like, weddings all over the nation. Pretty fascinating people. But the one thing they taught was that you have this unique talent. And the more time you spend on things that are not your unique talent, that's wasted time.

[A]

That's probably the biggest tick mark, if you will, in the column of, like, do we hire professional people to do things? And it is a continuum. Some weeks ago, I said this. I don't know if it was on the podcast or where I said it, but I read this thing that I thought was pretty funny on the Internet. It said, like, there's three stages of wealth, right? The first stage is you mow your own grass. The second stage is you hire somebody to mow your grass. And then the third stage is you mow your own grass. Again, certainly you have the unique. You know, you have the talent to get the lawnmower out and mow it, Right? But sometimes you don't do that. I don't do it at home, but I do it when we're on vacation up north at my wife's place, wife's family's place, because I just like sitting on the riding mower for like an hour. Like, it's just something to do when you're at the cottage. And I think it's a fun way to spend a little bit of time. By the same token, I absolutely do not do my own taxes, even though I certainly have the aptitude to do it. And now with technology, there's even more reason to do it yourself, because you can take your tax return and Dump it into some AI tool and go, what do you want? But like I talked about a couple weeks ago with that very confidently was like, oh, you missed this big deduction. Just check this box and you'll save yourself 20%. And I was like, but I'm not allowed to check the box. I'm in one of those businesses that are unbox checkable. They're like, yeah, but like, does anybody really going to know? You probably check it. I'm like, this is crazy. Or there was a post on LinkedIn the other day about somebody putting some commentary in chat GPT about their investment portfolio. Like hey, I think small caps are ripping. I should probably add 10%. Yeah, great idea. But I'm really concerned about the, the war. Shouldn't I get back into treasuries? Yeah, great idea. I saw on CNBC that things are pretty volatile. Maybe I should add gold. Yeah, great idea. Where's the balance there between finding your area of expertise and outsourcing, even at a cost? The other pieces of that, and I think all of those things kind of flow on a continuum of advice. Whether it's high risk, high return type of thing or low risk, low return. And it's an individual decision, whether it's a, you know, like Jesse's story about the person who shows up and says, I know what to do, but I, my family doesn't. I need somebody in my corner to help with that. I don't actually need somebody to do this day to day, but I'll take your advice. Or it's the person who goes, you know, my expertise is doing this other thing. I'm sure I could go learn that. Which by the way, no offense to anybody in the universe, but I got a 30 year head start. So I'm not saying that you can't catch up, but it's going to take a while to accumulate 30 years worth of, you know, story or history of like how to, how to think about this stuff. But if that's where your expertise lies, then get after it. But you probably also don't, you know, do your own taxes or you probably don't do something else that you outsource. So there's no right or wrong answer to that. Like Jesse said, we've got some dogs in the hunt, so to speak. Or what did you say? The dogs at the bowl or something? What was your, I think the phrase

[C]

is dogs and I don't know, dog in the fight.

[A]

Dog in the fight. Yeah. Interesting. Yeah, we'll have to fact check that, Doug. Check the IDIOM usage and see, see what we got there. But not everybody should be hiring people and not everybody who hires people should be. You know, it's. There's no right answer here.

[B]

Yeah. What I appreciated back in the day was when people knew what they were hiring me for. If somebody had no idea, they said, I sure, I should have a financial advisor. I'm like, great. I, I should hire like a chef. What do you want me to cook? I don't know. You know, it just. If you don't know what you are looking for, it's hard to get a great result. I think if you start with a result, it's a better way to move forward. Speaking of moving forward, we're going to move into the middle of our show because on Fridays we have this great competition that's going on all year long between OG Jesse and Paula Pant from Afford Anything. Well, Roxanne, you are Team Finance rocks is Team Paula Pant today, which means I've got some good news for you and some bad news. Which one do you want?

[E]

Only the good news, please.

[B]

Well, the good news is you get to guess last, which I know our guests always appreciate. But the reason you guess last is because Team Paula is in last place, which is a perennial thing, I think, here in mom's basement. So the score, Doug, is what we have.

[D]

Eight points for team OG Two points for, for double father, Double dad Jesse, and two points for Team Paula.

[B]

Eight to two to two last week, OG and the judges, by the way, in Wichita are digging through the year by year competition to see what the record is right now. But OG at 8 points is certainly making a run at the record. So hopefully here by next week's show, we'll be able to tell everyone what record. If he's, if he's on track, if he's behind, we'll be able to do the math. But for today regardless, we need a trivia question. Doug, what's on your mind, man?

[D]

Hey there, Stackers. I'm Joe's mom's neighbor, Doug. And it's May 1. That means it's Mayday. And today kicks off a slew of my favorite holidays. First, today is the unofficial start of the warm summer season. Then, you know, there's May 4th when I get to geek out on Star wars, followed quickly by Cinco de Mayo. Not sure what that phrase means, actually, but you know, it's May 5th. What a great week. But you think about Mayday. And I gotta admit, there have been days I wanted to scream Mayday from the basement. Like the time OG Decided to Dutch oven the entire place. Or the time Joe decided that it was Mario Kart Champion Championship Day and I hadn't practiced yet. So frustrating. So why do people in distress say Mayday at all? The phrase May Day was created initially by Frederick Stanley Mockford, a senior radio officer at Croydon Airport in London, who was asked to come up with a word to indicate distress that could be easily understood by all pilots and ground staff in an emergency. Mayday is a phrase that sounds a lot like the French madez. Pretty sure I said that just like a local. Which means help me. Not what I said. I'm sure. But if you said it correctly, you know that's what it means. Here's today's question. What year did Mockford propose using the phrase Mayday? I'll be back right after I set up the maypole with lightsabers on the back porch. Let the festivities begin.

[B]

It's definitely Doug's favorite favorite week of the year here in the basement, and we'll let him get ready. While OG you're taking your stab at it, the phrase mayday, what year?

[A]

Yeah, I feel like Doug is just. Just. It's like a volleyball match. It's just a bump set. And I just gotta spike this down because, like, last week, and I knew exactly when the last Woolworth store was closed.

[B]

But you did. But that's fine.

[A]

Is right in wheelhouse also because it has to do with flying. And they teach you this in pilot school. So everyone knows that this was started in 1951. It happened shortly after World War II because they didn't really have a phrase for that in World War II. And people were just saying all sorts of weird stuff, and nobody could discern actual radio communication. Jesse doesn't think I'm right, but this is. This is the true thing.

[C]

Thinking of all the pilots in World War II, just being like, oh, I'm going down.

[A]

Exactly.

[C]

I need something better to say.

[A]

What do I say? What do I do with my hands? There's so many emotions, but I don't

[D]

know what to say.

[A]

So, yeah. So they just all got together and it was in 1951. That's the moral of the story. It's like day one, lesson one of pilot school. So easy. Easy to remember 1951.

[C]

Jesse Kramer, he said it's Mayday is like, help me in French.

[B]

Or it's like, help me right, Doug?

[C]

It's funny. Made our older daughter, I mean, she's just learning English. It's hard language. And when she wants to Help. Like she's trying to figure out what order do I put the words in and where does the pronoun goes? When she wants to help, she says, help me. Like I'm going to come help you. But she says, help me, help me. I think it's cute. Anyway, the curse of being a parent. And 1920 is going to be my guess.

[B]

1920. So, Roxanne, here's what you got. You got 1951 and 1920. What are you thinking?

[E]

There's absolutely nothing going on in my head right now. Is that good? That's probably not good. Where am I?

[B]

Welcome to Stacking Benjamin's. Roxanne, she gets along perfectly with the rest of us.

[E]

Among good company, huh? Also, people with nothing in their heads. I mean, I feel inclined to split the difference. I know it's closest. There's no going over anything. Can I split the difference mathematically in my head while being on this call? That's a good question. Oh, okay. Oh, gosh, it almost came to me. No, I lost it. 50%. Okay. But let's see. Can I give a more educated answer than this? 1920 seems maybe a little bit too early, but I don't know why. I think that I'm just great today. I'm just doing fan. I'm just so happy to be here with you guys. You're so wonderful.

[B]

I'm so happy you're here.

[D]

The most awesome thing you could do as a thank you is to give us an answer.

[E]

Okay,

[B]

now, like everybody else on this show, she's stalling. Doug. Now she's stalling.

[E]

Mayday, Mayday. I'm stalling. How about 1935? I'm going to split the difference. Ish.

[B]

1935. So we got 1920, 1935, and 1951. Who's closest is OG get to get one step closer to maybe the best score ever? Or are Jesse or Roxanne going to stand in his way today? We'll find out in a minute. Oh, gee. You kicked it off with 1951. And I think both Roxanne and Jesse said mayday on that answer because, man, they didn't like it.

[A]

Well, I mean, they didn't even start flying airplanes till 1947, so I don't know why they would have a thing for 1920s, but whatever.

[B]

Or in 1962, the year Columbus sailed the ocean blue.

[A]

I mean, it's a. I mean, that's another one to consider.

[B]

It's. It's a rhyme. Jesse. 1920, how you feeling?

[C]

I had that moment of fear. I Was like, when were the Wright brothers. Which I think was a question. Which I think was a question on

[A]

here before I almost said that just to have you freak out for a quick minute. Like, they didn't even have. Like, the Wright brothers didn't even start till 23. And you'd have been like, oh, crap.

[B]

I thought about. You were really having fun. You would have called the wrong brothers today.

[C]

I figured it was a World War I ish, maybe right after World War I ish thing.

[B]

But you won 1920. Anyway.

[A]

1920 was after.

[E]

Well, it could have been a thing before flying was popular. And maybe it just, you know, kind of got picked up from.

[C]

Exactly.

[E]

So.

[C]

Exactly.

[B]

What if it was an aviation? What if it wasn't aviation? What if it was boats? Even though I know we said we created. They created the airport.

[D]

I was gonna say. Pretty much spelled it out.

[A]

Jokes on you guys. This guy created it while he was a ship captain.

[D]

What if it was the candy making industry? And that's why they came up with the payday candy bar.

[B]

Right, Doug, who's taking this home?

[D]

Thank God. Hey, there, stackers. I'm May lover, but now that I think about it, guy who's a lover, not a fighter, no matter what the month is. Joe's mom's neighbor Doug. Today is May Day. And while that means celebrations, here in the basement, it means bad things if you hear it on a radio, because it's a distress call. So two of our contestants today will end up in a distress and one will go home happy. What date did Frederick Stanley Mockford propose this phrase initially used for flights over the English Channel? Well, I'll tell you this. It was 28 years before the year OG guessed, 3 years after what Jesse guessed, and 12 years years before what Roxanne guessed. Because the correct answer is 1923, making

[B]

Jesse our winner initially for flying over the English Channel. Imagine how scary that would have been the 1920s. Just that body of water.

[D]

20. 20 miles of it or so.

[B]

Yeah, tough time. Nice job, Mr. Kramer.

[C]

Thank you. Thank you.

[B]

You're only now five away. Yeah, just working on it from OG but you also held him back from scoring the record, which is what we're maybe looking for. Or is there still history in the making?

[C]

This is how comebacks begin.

[B]

This is it. You got to start somewhere.

[E]

I'm gonna need Paula's address so I can send her some flowers.

[C]

No, no, you came in second, Roxanne. That's good. Better than average.

[B]

Better than Paula normally does. Let's get on to the Middle and the end of our discussion about the 1%, because I want to spend a little time on what I call scale it, which is for some people this might be important, for others it's not. You know, I think this is really the debate zone, right. Is it something that means a lot or is it something that doesn't mean anything? I want to start with you, Jesse. Let's talk about alternative investments and what I'm not. And by the way, it's in the world of alternative investments that we see people say be part of the 1%. Get into this alternative investment. But I'm not thinking as much. Private Equity is like REITs and some of these, maybe real estate syndications, you know, some of the better known private investments. Invest like the 1% or not.

[C]

Yeah, I mean, definitely scale it. That's definitely my answer. I know enough to kind of know what I'm doing. And yet some of these esoteric alternatives, like I don't know what I'm doing there, candidly. And some of them too are like, even if it's an investment that seems good on its face, helps you maybe diversify more. Like when we think alternative, the thing I think of is like university endowments, right? The whole. What's the fella's name from Yale who passed away starts with an S. S.W. not Swinford, anybody? David.

[A]

David, David Swanson. Swenson, Swenson, Samsonite.

[C]

Swenson says right here the Swenson model, like he was famous for alternatives. But the big takeaway that I have is any investment, no matter how good it is, can be made a bad investment with really high fees. And if you look at the alternative space like that's something you kind of see is you see some pretty interesting looking investments that might have a decent return on them and provide pretty good diversification, but they come with like 4% per year fees attached to it. So everything needs to be kind of properly evaluated there. And I'm definitely a scale it because there's, there's plenty of downside to go with some of the upside.

[B]

Roxanne.

[E]

So I as a recently divorced, as close as possible to 40 without going over. I recently lost my accredited saying that

[B]

for the next 15 years, by the way.

[E]

Just FYI, get used to it. Yeah, yeah. So I recently lost my accredited investor status thanks to divorcing. There are some protections for people to not be able to do a lot of the investments. And maybe I'm biased. My answers are kind of towards my actual clients and audience that I have right now where Mostly it's people that are kind of early in their investing journeys or maybe even still paying off debt. So I'm inclined to say skip it altogether for alternative investments, partly because a lot of people won't have access to them anyway. And then, yeah, the fees that are involved and just keeping it simple. Like one of the things I actually recommend people do is to just get started with like $20 and buy an individual stock. Something that they already know, like a company they like and know. And being able to understand investing because really it's no more difficult than ordering things on Amazon or online.

[B]

But then you get to kind of feel the heartbeat a little bit too.

[E]

Yeah.

[B]

And the emotions.

[E]

Yeah. I think that it makes it a lot easier to get started with that. So yeah, I'm going to say skip it for alternative.

[B]

I think Roxanne's way. Oh gee, is a lot better than going and taking your first 20 bucks and buying a non traded REIT.

[A]

Alternative investments should be banned for everyone all the time, period.

[B]

The hot take there it is scaling it.

[C]

You're scaling it.

[A]

Like, I wish we could delete it. There is no benefit to it, especially when you look at it from the continuum of like risk and return. If you're going to lock my money up and you're going to charge me a bunch of money, I better be getting an awesome expected return. You know, when people are like, oh, this is really great, here's a great real estate investment or here's a great private equity thing, it's going to average 10% a year. It's like the frigging S and P does 10%. It's going to average 12% small caps $13 and they're liquid and I can sell it tomorrow in a frigging instant. So like, why in the heck would I try to lock money up? And like you said, Jesse, pay a bunch of costs or potentially a bunch of costs, have tons of illiquidity. And while the accredited investor thing is nice as a protection, the reality is it's just a box to check. Nobody checks that. To double check to make sure that you really are. If you're filling out the form, you just check the box. And if you lie, then you lie. There's no penalty for lying. It's useless area on the paperwork. So the reality is, is that the vast majority of people have no business investing in anything other than publicly traded equities because you get all the return you need and you have ton, you know, immediate liquidity and all transparent pricing. Like there's $800 billion traded every single day. So you know that the price of your ETF is legitimate. When, when you lock your money up in an alternative investment, you have no idea what that price is.

[B]

Right.

[A]

There's no transparency.

[B]

I'm not quite as far as you are, og, But Roxanne, I definitely like the part where you and OG agree with you don't need it. And it's certainly not a place to start. And if you're trying to Invest like the 1% with your first dollar, this is a huge mistake. This is where they get you. But there's a few things that I've liked in the alternative investment universe just because they're fun. Masterworks, Buying art. I like art. Do I?

[A]

Terrible return on investment.

[B]

Yeah. Do I think it's a great investment? Nope. I don't. I really like supporting it. I like art. I think it's a lot of fun. But I'm doing it because it's fun, not because it's a great investment. Acre Trader has had nice returns buying farmland. You're locked up. A lot of people don't understand how that works. Don't need it. Definitely don't need a piece of. Of Acre Trader. I think it's a good time. But again, listen to the emphasis. I like them, but neither of those companies, and I mentioned them specifically, are emphasizing do this because the 1% does it, which is that marketing just drives me crazy. Chris over at Heavy Metal Money says we should go all in on crypto. There we go. Just, just put it all on.

[A]

I'd rather go all in on crypto than something like Acre Trader Masterworks. Any trade, non traded reit. At least it's liquid.

[B]

I'd be the opposite in a heartbeat. In a hundred percent heartbeat. I feel like I know a little bit about art. I understand what moves the needle. I have no idea what moves the needle on Bitcoin. I have zero. Even when I owned Ethereum, I had no idea. Farmland. I grew up in farm country. Totally get that.

[C]

Jesse, we're talking about liquid investments here. Let's bring it full circle back to gas. But it might evaporate on you. So just put the cap on evaporation. Evaporation.

[A]

Speaking of gas, I saw an investor did a, an option trade, you know, or a futures trade on oil and gas and didn't close their position out. Just thought it was like a normal option trade. Like it just closed. And they got a letter from the CBOE that said, where would you like your 80,000 barrels of oil?

[B]

Oh my God.

[C]

Gotta take delivery. On it, baby.

[A]

Time to figure out where that's coming. I don't know if it's true. It was on the Internet, so it gave me a little chuckle because I'm sure that exists in real life. I'm sure somebody was like, oh, this just ended on Friday. Like a position closes out. Like an option trade, right? No. Nope, it closes out. All right. You now own 80,000 barrels of oil.

[B]

Where would you like literally holding the barrel at the. You are literally holding the barrel. Let's talk about one more before we say goodbye. Leverage. Roxanne, where do you stand on leverage? You going to leverage, like, the 1%?

[E]

No, no, I don't like it. I know that some people use it. I've just never. It's not for me. Never been for me. Skip it.

[C]

Jesse, I think it's kind of funny because it's almost like once you're in the 1%, your need for leverage is probably less than it was 20 years ago.

[B]

But I think your comfort for riding out liquidity squeezes. Yeah. Is much easier.

[C]

Sure.

[B]

The thing that kills leverage for the vast majority of people is you end up with this liquidity crunch and now you can't pay the bill.

[C]

Yeah, yeah. I. I just go back. There's a Warren Buffett quote. I know, I know. Warren Buffett, Charlie Munger, by the way, someone on the. On the basement Facebook group, I think, had that as like their. Their drink every time Jesse does this thing. That was a recent post. It was drink every time Jesse mentions Munger and Buffett. But Buffett has a quote, which is, why would you sacrifice something that you have and need for something that you don't have and don't need? And like, to me, when you're already in the top 1%, leverage is that thing. Right. You're risking your wealth to just go get more of it. You don't need more of it usually. So, yeah, I'm going to drop. What was my scale?

[E]

Skip.

[C]

I'm going to skip. Going to skip. Leverage.

[B]

Yeah. That's the leverage one is absolutely crazy. OG you got the last word.

[A]

I think it's funny that people would have this opinion about leverage and yet try to do it as much as possible on real estate. And the whole community of real estate investing is built on the concept of I'm going to buy this thing for as cheap as possible in terms of my cash outlay. I'm going to lever it as much as possible, and then I'm going to try to, like, manipulate it so that people are renting it. And then that rent payment pays my leverage payment. And then someday in the future, I make a bajillion dollars. I just have to make a little bit on each deal and do that 74,000 times. But when you say to somebody, you can do the same leverage with the 500 biggest companies in America, most well capitalized, most well run companies in the universe, they go, that's crazy. I would never do that. Like, that's risky. I go, well, you're doing it with your stupid rental property right now. And Anytown usa, what's a higher risk proposal? Having the executives at Coca Cola in charge of your money and the leverage or your one single family rental property in anywhere usa. I would prefer that most people skip, you know, deep amounts of leverage altogether because, you know, it's like Jesse said, risking what you don't have. Need something. He said something smart. I'm not exactly sure what it was, but I think the reality is, is that people will do it and lull themselves to sleep saying that it's what the 1% does.

[C]

Well.

[B]

And I think that what we learned today, hopefully what our stackers learned today was that, you know, rich habits are different than, quote, what the 1% do. Right? We hear about what the 1% do, and all of you, I think, practice rich habits. And those are a whole different thing when it comes to us. Whole different thing. If you have comments, I would love to hear them. Either write me joe@Stacky Benjamin.com or join our Facebook group, the Basement. Stacky Benjamin.com Basement. Tell us how many times you drank when Jesse said was what said Warren Buffett.

[A]

That would be a fun game too.

[B]

Yes. We got to sign Roxanne1 so that we can get people drunk on her behalf. We'll, we'll have our guest of honor go last. Let's find out what everybody's doing. Oh, gee, you're celebrating Mayday. How?

[A]

How? Oh, tomorrow we are going to College Station. We're going to catch a baseball game and then the Bananas in Kyle Field. Oh, that's largely going to be the, I think the biggest baseball game ever attended or something. They're trying to do 100 and something.

[B]

Have you seen a Savannah Bananas game yet?

[A]

No, but we went to the Cosmic somebody or another's the other day and it was glow in the dark baseball, which was pretty fun. Got kind of long in the tooth. Like I was like, okay, let's wrap this thing up. We're. Yeah, we get it. It's very loud and there's A lot of. Yeah.

[B]

It just seemed like baseball with add.

[A]

Yeah. Which again, it was fine for like a few innings. And I'm like, okay, this is fun. And like playing baseball backwards. And they had a. They had a rule where any, any ball in. Anywhere was in play. So this guy hit like a huge foul ball, like in the concession stands and he's still running the bases because now, like, the fans have to get the ball to a player who throws it.

[D]

Wow.

[A]

Really threw him out at home. It was great because they got the ball to, like, the guy and he threw it over the fence and then they threw to the catcher and got him out at home. But so, like fun, kind of exciting things like that. But yeah, that's our weekend. We're gonna go down to College Station and hang out. It's the last weekend at school for Alex, so. And help him kind of pack.

[B]

And then he's got a successful freshman year.

[A]

Mrs. OG's birthday on Monday or Tuesday. Some. Somewhere in there.

[B]

Oh, boy. You better learn which day that is.

[A]

I'm gonna err on the side of Monday. I'll be ready on Monday. In case it's Monday. Don't worry.

[B]

You're early. I'm not early. I. I need you to have two days of fun.

[A]

And with your permission, I'm going to go because I am a single dad today, so I'm going to dip and do my dad's stuff.

[B]

We will see you later, my friend.

[A]

Adios, amigos. Nice to meet you, Roxanne.

[E]

Nice to meet you.

[A]

Tolerable as always.

[C]

Likewise.

[B]

Jesse, what's happened at Personal Finance for long term investors?

[C]

Well, in celebration of May Day, I'm finishing up my pilot's license. I got one more flight to take London to Paris. Wish me well. No, I'm. I'm dropping an episode coming up. Pretty excited for it. It's an ask me anything episode inspired by Einstein, who had this quote where he said everything should be as simple as possible, but no simpler. It's like, man, what a great quote to kind of use as a lens to look at retirement planning. It almost echoes with some of what we were saying today with the top 1%, which is there's some ideas out there that aren't simple at all, but maybe they're worthwhile. And then there's some ideas where people go like, too simple and kind of. They've kind of lost the plot with how simple they want to make it. So anyway, that's what's going on over on the podcast.

[B]

I owe you a thank you too. You helped us by taking over our 201 newsletter last week which was fantastic. It was a cage match between brokerage accounts or UPMA accounts. Up my Ugma for kids. Do you save into these kids accounts or do you save into a trump account? So you had to get in a cage and fight it out.

[C]

That's true. And I think. I don't know if it made the final edit or not, Joe, but I think we included some WWE photos in the newsletter which I self selected. I thought they were pretty good. I procured them.

[B]

You could say you did procure some hilarious photos. Not sure about copyrights.

[C]

That's fair.

[B]

But you did. But are they going to sue because you're making it more famous?

[C]

I think they owe me royalties. I think is how it works.

[B]

Yes.

[C]

I put them straight into my utma.

[B]

Send Jesse, Jesse, Jesse and Stacky Benjamin some money. Roxanne, I'm super happy you agreed to come on. It's about time. I remember saying to you when we met at fincon many, many months ago. I'm like you got to come on Stacky Benjamin's. But we finally did it.

[E]

Yeah, I know. It was really fun to be here. I think filling in for Paula is the like the next. It's as good as possible except for being on with Paula. So that would be amazing.

[B]

That'll be next time. Next time we'll have Roxanne and Paula and we can, we can. You can see for yourself just how bad Paula really is. Trivia challenge.

[E]

Well, Jesse just pointed out keeping things simple. I think that maybe that's where I've been going wrong because it seems like I'm making things as difficult as possible all the time.

[B]

Yes.

[E]

But yeah, coming up. Oh, go ahead.

[B]

No, I was going to ask exactly where you're going. What's going on at Finance Rocks.

[E]

So a long awaited interview with Nick Johnson from Everyday Money Heroes had him on my channel and I've been sitting on that episode for a while and then I'm trying to come up with ways to celebrate hitting my fi number. So if your audience has any suggestions right now I'm, I have it some ideas like doing a donut crawl, going and getting donuts at a bunch of places. Maybe a tattoo. So looking for fun ways to celebrate

[B]

tattoo of a donut.

[E]

Maybe like a piggy bank or something.

[B]

Maybe or yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That's get your tattoo for meeting your. Your Phi number. Jesse, it sounds like something that you would do.

[C]

Yeah, I'd consider it. I would go chase that down.

[D]

Tattoos can be expensive. It might cause you to dip below your phi number. Just the cost of getting the tattoo. Well, better give it some time.

[C]

I'm more of a discount tattoo guy. There's certain things I skimp on. By the way, going back, I think Roxanne used the noun. You called it a bale of toilet paper really early on. Love that, love that. The things I skimp on. Toilet paper, tattoos.

[B]

Nope.

[C]

And then tattoo removal is the third one. Both the tattoo and the removal. I'm looking for the low cost provider.

[B]

I think the two words, Roxanne, that don't go together are discount and tattoo. I just don't don't know that those two words actually work.

[E]

Well, I don't really have much choice. I got the unfortunate combo of being both frugal and cheap. So I think I might be in that camp as well.

[B]

You have to. She finds that word incredibly attractive. At this point your career, we will link to Finance Rocks on our show notes page as well@stacking benjamin.com but find her on Instagram and on her YouTube page, which is both hilarious and you're going to learn about money, which is awesome. Thank you. By the way, to everybody who hung out with us today on YouTube. If you want to hang out with us, we're reliable here on Mondays. We actually started a little early but generally it's about 3:30 Eastern Time. Do the math on where you're at on Mondays and we'd love to have you hang out with us. And we've been kind of showing the different things, hilarious things often that people are saying that hang out with us. It is really a good time making the show here live on Mondays. All right, you know what else is a good time? Hearing from Doug, exactly how he translated today's show. Let's see how correct he was. Doug, what should we have learned today?

[D]

It's always a bit of an adventure, right, Joe? Well, Joe, first take some advice from Roxanne and I think this is a direct quote show. She said you should absolutely steal from the rich, especially their ideas about long term financial planning. Plus they're the ones that leave that big bucket of full size candy bars out on Halloween. Take those too. They could buy more. They're the 1%.

[B]

Is her name Roxanne or is it Robin Hood? I mean, and I'm not talking about the the brokerage company which is Rob from the rich or rob from you and put in their own pocket. I'm talking about the character.

[E]

I'll answer to either.

[D]

Second Take some advice from a guy who definitely is not a dog lover. OG says don't let the tax tail wag the investment dog in the hunt or something like that. But the big lesson don't let Joe's mom stress out about all the early May holidays. She just told me she's calling Mayday on Mayday. Don't do it yet, Ma. I got a whole five laps to do around the Maypole. Thanks to Roxanne Duckles for joining us today. Are you one of those weird people who like money and laughing? Check out Roxanne's YouTube channel and Instagram. Both are easily found if you search for finance Rox and this is hilarious. She spells rox wrong. She spells it Rox. We'll also include links in our show notes@stacking benjamin's.com thanks to Jesse Kramer for hanging out with us today. You'll find his aggressively named podcast Personal Finance for Long Term Investors wherever you listen to finer podcasts. And finally, thanks to OG for joining us. Looking for good financial planning help? Head to stacking benjamin's.comog for his calendar. This show is the property of SP Podcast, LLC, copyright2026 and is created by Josal Sehai. You'll find out about our awesome [e-mail] along with the show notes and how you can find us on YouTube and all the usual social media spots. Come say hello and oh yeah, before I go, not only should you not take advice from these nerds, don't take advice from people you don't know. This show is for entertainment purposes only. Before making any financial decisions, speak with a real financial advisor. I'm Joe's mom's neighbor, Doug, and we'll see you next time back here at the Stacking Benjamin Show.