The Worst Money Advice Ever (Episode 1800!)

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Worst Money Advice Ever

The Stacking Benjamins Show — Episode 1800 (February 6, 2026)
Host: Joe Saul-Sehy
Contributors: Paula Pant, Jesse Kramer, Sarah Catherine Gutierrez, Doug

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Episode Overview

Celebrating their 1800th episode, the Stacking Benjamins crew—minus OG, plus returning favorites Paula Pant, Jesse Kramer, and guest financial planner Sarah Catherine Gutierrez—gather to tackle the theme: “The Worst Money Advice Ever.” In classic SB style, they blend fun banter with myth-busting personal finance insights, sharing laughs, horror stories of financial wisdom gone wrong, and a healthy dose of listener trivia.

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Key Points & Discussion Highlights

1. Kicking Off: Milestones & Memories (02:13–06:18)

• Joe and Doug reminisce about 1800 episodes and Paula’s early role.
• Paula’s favorite memories included episodes with Greg McFarlane: “Mostly because he was so unpredictable in what he would say.” (03:51, Paula Pant)
• Sarah Catherine introduces her work at Aptus Financial: holistic, non-sales financial planning especially for early career professionals.

2. What’s the Worst Money Advice You’ve Heard? (07:20–10:33)

The central theme is set: Each panelist will compete in a game show guessing the worst, dumbest financial sayings or advice ever dispensed.

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3. Game Show: Guessing Bad Money Advice (Round 1)

a. Chasing the Latest Fad (12:57+)

• Paula’s guess: The dangers of following “hot” trends—stocks, products, vacation spots.
  • “Chasing a fad gets so many people in trouble so often.” (14:08, Joe)
  • Not on the official list, but strong panel consensus that fads (investing or spending) are costly.
• Jesse: Explains “mimetic desire”—people copy what others do, leading to wasting money chasing trends.

b. “Stop Throwing Away Money on Rent—You Have to Buy” (18:00+)

• Sarah Catherine’s guess: The pressure to buy real estate needlessly.
  • “It’s one of the big things I hear: swimming in student loans, big credit card debt, and parents say ‘you have to buy a house right now…stop throwing money away on rent.’” (18:47, Sarah Catherine)
  • Not on the official list but discussed at length as a widespread myth, especially harmful to young people.

c. More Income = Less Money (Brackets and Tax Myths) (23:25+)

• Jesse’s guess: Not taking a raise to “avoid” higher taxes.
  • “Don’t take that raise, Joe, because it’ll increase your taxes.” (23:25, Jesse Kramer)
  • ON the list.
  • Panel dissects the common misconception about progressive taxation:
    • “The tax obsession sets people back…They’ll start a business to save on taxes—well, that means you’ve lost money if you’re saving on taxes.” (25:54, Sarah Catherine)
    • “Don’t let the tax tail wag the more money dog.” (27:07, Joe quoting Paula)
  • Brief aside on real “subsidy cliffs” and rare cases where earning more may drop you off a benefits cliff (healthcare, etc.), but generally, earning more is always better after taxes.

d. Tax Write-Offs Comedy: Schitt's Creek Clip (28:58+)

• A humorous moment plays from Schitt’s Creek, mocking the misunderstanding that tax write-offs mean “the government pays you back.”
  • “It’s when you buy something for your business…and the government pays you back.” (29:31, Schitt’s Creek)

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4. Trivia Break: The Founding of Singapore (32:30–44:46)

• Classic SB trivia interlude related to Singapore—a nation known for saving and wealth building.
• The answer is 1819; guest Sarah Catherine wins the round.

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5. Game Show: More Bad Money Advice (Round 2)

a. Buy a New Car to “Save” on Repairs (45:40+)

• Paula’s guess: “Buy a new car—you’ll pay less in repairs.”
  • Widely believed but NOT on the official list.
  • Panel agrees it’s a flawed justification for expensive new car purchases, often trapping people in years of payments instead of making a one-time repair.

b. “Put Everything on a Credit Card for Reward Points” (50:14+)

• Sarah Catherine’s guess: Spending more to chase credit card rewards.
  • ON the list.
  • “If our goal is to spend less money and we decide to play their game, we will likely spend more money… credit cards are already enticing us to spend, and these rewards really tip us over the edge.” (52:06, Sarah Catherine)
  • Data cited: People spend ~30% more with credit cards than with debit.
  • Paula notes that redemption value for points is declining quickly: “The devaluation of miles is real.” (52:43, Paula)
  • Responsible credit card use requires system and discipline.

c. Always Avoid Debt, No Matter What (56:43+)

• Jesse’s guess: The notion that all debt is bad, always.
  • Not on the official list (despite being a nuanced misconception, e.g. for mortgages, student loans).
  • Sarah Catherine wins the two-point round for Team OG.

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Notable Quotes & Best Moments

• On rent vs. buy:
  “Psychologically, equity that you build in a home is visible, it’s tangible in a way your 401k is not…a certain ‘viscerality’—it feels more real than your 401k balance does.”
  (21:13, Paula Pant)

• On taxes and raises:
  “Don’t let the tax tail wag the decision dog. So many people make their decisions around taxes.”
  (27:07, Joe quoting Paula Pant)

• On credit card points:
  “If you have money, I spend it all. I love spending money. I’m very good at it. I have limits.”
  (54:42, Sarah Catherine)

• Comedy highlight:
  Schitt’s Creek clip on tax write-offs, Joe’s riff on “my favorite Abe Lincoln quote: ‘Don’t believe everything you read on the Internet.’” (54:12)

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Highlights from the "Official List" of Worst Money Advice (58:03 onwards)

Joe reveals some gems/duds from the internet's worst advice list, including:

• “Let the bank take it.” (Buy something big, let it be repossessed—at least enjoy it for a bit.)
• “Give your money to your mom or another relative to keep it safe.”
• “Get it at Rent-a-Center.” (Buy on rent-to-own terms, notoriously high-cost.)
• “Buy vehicles you can’t afford to motivate yourself to hustle.”
• “If you can’t afford things, just stop contributing to your retirement.”
• “Emergency funds are overrated.”
• “That neighborhood will never appreciate.”
• “Live in the moment / You only live once.”
• “Borrow now, declare bankruptcy later.”
• “Get a credit card so you learn discipline.”
• “Have kids, sort out the money later.”
• “Don’t let money hold back your dreams.”
• “Charge the vacation.” (Joe: “That was my honeymoon. Horrible trip, loved the marriage, regretted the spending.”)
• “Money is meant to make you happy.”

Panel quickly populates more, including:

• “Always buy lotto tickets, especially when the jackpot is high.”
• “Always carry a balance to build credit.”
• “If you need money, rob a convenience store.”
• “Making good money from sports betting and gambling online.”

Audience and Panel's Own Additions

• "Silence—never talk about money."
• "Buy a house with 28% of your gross income (bank rules)."
• "Invest in pet rocks."
• "Get a loan from the mafia."

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Funniest/Liveliest Tangents

• The panel’s riff on “mimetic desire” and fads, Paula’s Singapore trip-planning logic for trivia, debates about cars and used/new math, and the discussion of credit card points and their declining value.
• Paula’s 5-minute Singapore travel planning monologue while others wait for her trivia guess (37:19–40:36).
• Ongoing jabs at Joe’s questionable list and the podcast’s low-tech/“half-finished basement” roots.

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Important Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment | |:--|:--| | 02:13 | Reflections on 1800 episodes, panel greetings | | 07:20 | Main Topic Introduction: Bad Money Advice | | 12:57 | Round 1: “Chasing Fads” discussion | | 18:00 | “Stop throwing away money on rent” | | 23:25 | Tax bracket myth (“don’t take the raise”) | | 28:58 | Schitt's Creek clip on tax write-offs | | 32:30–44:46 | Singapore trivia break | | 45:40 | Buy a new car to save on repairs | | 50:14 | Put everything on a credit card for points | | 54:42 | How to responsibly use credit cards, discipline tips | | 56:43 | “Always avoid debt” myth | | 58:03 | Joe reveals the (unintentionally comical) official list of bad advice |

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Final Thoughts & Takeaways

• The worst financial advice is both subtle and overt: From deeply ingrained cultural scripts (“renting is throwing money away”) to wild internet myths (just let the bank repo your stuff), financial ignorance can show up almost anywhere.
• Tax, credit cards, and real estate myths dominate: The panel repeatedly returns to tax avoidance obsession, the rent-vs-buy debate, and chasing reward points as foundational errors.
• Culture and emotion drive most decisions: Tangibility bias (preferring things you can touch), status fads, and fear-of-missing-out regularly trick even savvy people.
• Silence about money is itself bad advice: Not talking about finances leads to shame, mistakes, and repeating cycles of poor management.

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Memorable Quotes (with Speaker Attribution & Timestamps)

• "People are so funny when it comes to feeling like they're getting cheated by the tax code. And I think that they make very detrimental decisions...it's more of a gut feeling than actual math." – Sarah Catherine Gutierrez (25:54)
• "The devaluation of miles is real." – Paula Pant (52:43)
• "Silence about money is the worst advice. We have made money taboo." – Sarah Catherine Gutierrez (63:59)
• "It’s one of the big things I hear…my parents really think I need to buy a house right now and stop throwing all my money away in rent." – Sarah Catherine Gutierrez (18:47)

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Show Plugs

• Sarah Catherine Gutierrez: AptusFinancial.com; financial planning and “Ladiesplaining Money”
• Paula Pant: Afford Anything podcast, monthly macroeconomic episodes (with a “special, awkward announcement” teased)
• Jesse Kramer: Personal Finance for Long Term Investors podcast — new episodes & AMA out now!

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Approachable, funny, and loaded with valuable reminders: This anniversary episode of Stacking Benjamins is essential listening for anyone who's ever wondered, “Wait…should I really do that with my money?”

Transcript

[Joe Salsihai]

On February 13, Crime 101 hits theaters.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

What is it that you do?

[Joe Salsihai]

I take high value items and make them disappear.

[Jesse Kramer]

So you're a thief.

[Joe Salsihai]

One crime connects them all. I'm getting close.

[Jesse Kramer]

I know it.

[Joe Salsihai]

But only one will walk away.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

I underestimated you.

[Joe Salsihai]

Chris Hemsworth, Mark Ruffalo, Barry Keoghan and Halle Berry.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

We're good at this.

[Joe Salsihai]

Yeah. Crime 101. Directed by Bart Layton. Rated R. Under 17, animated without Parad. Special sneak previews Monday. Everywhere. February 13th.

[Jesse Kramer]

BJ's Wholesale Club has everything you need to throw the perfect big game party. Now through February 8th. Get a $15 digital coupon. When you spend $1.50 in one transaction. BJ's has deals on everything from appetizers and snacks to giant party subs to TVs even bigger than the giant party subs.

[Joe Salsihai]

Plus, you can pick up the supplies you'll need to clean up after. Go to BJ's.com biggame for details and make your place the place to watch the big game. Ladies and gentlemen, we have a big show. A real big shoe.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Live from the basement of the YouTube headquarters, it's the 1800th episode of the Stacking Benjamin Show. I'm Joe's mom's neighbor, Doug. And you heard that, right? We've done this 1799 times already, and yet somehow they have not kicked us off any of the major platforms. Which, you know, honestly, is kind of disappointing. What else is disappointing? When someone gives you terrible money advice. What's the worst advice we've heard over the time it took us to make 1800 of these? Our team of top podcasters, researchers and planners will weigh in. And of course, halfway through today's show, we'll pause to see which of our contributors can win this installment of our year long trivia challenge. And now, a guy who thrives on helping you avoid bad money advice, It's Joe Sal Sehi.

[Joe Salsihai]

Hey there, stackers. And happy Friday to you. I am Joe Salsihai. And can you believe that this is episode 1800? Doug. And my, how has the time gone? Because it feels like, like hanging out with you. It only feels like we've done like 707,998 of these seven bajillion.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

I have that effect on people. I definitely. I wear people thin. I understand.

[Joe Salsihai]

It is wild because it does seem like we haven't been doing that that long. And then you hear that this is 1800. So congratulations. Nice work.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Congratulations to you.

[Joe Salsihai]

Well, thank you. And for episode 1800, we beat OG to the curb. We just said, nope, no OG today. He can't handle celebrating anyway. He celebrates.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Spread our wings and fly without that dead weight.

[Joe Salsihai]

Absolutely. But the woman who's been carrying this show for many of those 1800 shows that we've done is this woman from New York City. Paula Pant is here. How are you? Can you believe 1800 episodes, Paula?

[Paula Pant]

1800. I feel like. I feel like I should get you a cake with 1800 candles.

[Joe Salsihai]

And we would burn mom's house down.

[Paula Pant]

Call that a fire hazard.

[Joe Salsihai]

It would be a super fire hazard.

[Paula Pant]

Can you imagine the time it would take to put all those. It's like 1600, 644, 1645.

[Joe Salsihai]

And then I'd lose count. We'd have to blow them out and start all over again. Yeah. And then the cake's just a mess. But is there a. Is there a time that stood out to you during those 1800s or, like, one memory? I should have asked you this before. Before we were live. Is there a memory, Paula, that you remember making the show?

[Paula Pant]

You know, I. I cherish the episodes that we did with Greg McFarlane, going way back in the past. Those were always hilarious. Mostly because he was so unpredictable in what he would say.

[Joe Salsihai]

It's so funny because today's topic, Paula, we're going to sing off Greg McFarland song sheet because we're doing a topic that was near and dear to his heart, which I'll get to in just a moment.

[Paula Pant]

Amazing.

[Joe Salsihai]

Yes. But somebody who can be as Saucy as Greg McFarlane up there in upstate New York, Jesse Kramer is here. How are you, man?

[Jesse Kramer]

I'm doing well. I mean, I really like being described as saucy. I'm not sure I've ever been described as saucy. I was thinking about it. All my favorite phone numbers start with 1800. You know, 1, 800. I'm a big fan of just random 1, 800 calls. So this is a really cool episode. Congratulations, guys.

[Joe Salsihai]

1800 episodes. And Jesse's like, yeah. And the ones like the last, roughly year and a half, have been the best ones.

[Jesse Kramer]

They've been my favorites personally.

[Paula Pant]

Yeah.

[Joe Salsihai]

Absolutely brilliant. And we're super happy I mentioned that we upgraded from OG for episode 1800. She is the queen of Aptis Financial. And my friend who's just. Just up the road, like two hours, but we live in Texarkana. Two hours away is like, we're practically neighbors. Sarah, Catherine Gutierrez is here. How are you?

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Hi. Doing great. Congratulations on the huge milestone.

[Joe Salsihai]

Can you believe you would have never thought we would have made it that long. Sarah. Catherine.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Oh, I've always known. I can't wait for the 18,000 episode.

[Joe Salsihai]

18,000 when I have completely no hair. Everything's gone then. So for the people that don't know the powerful work that you do with Aptos Financial, can you tell everybody? Because you really empower a lot of people to get saving.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Oh, thank you. Yes. We do it in two ways. So we're financial planners. We're advice only financial planners. We help folks at the beginning of their career to create financial plans and make sure that they're hitting their savings rate right, getting all the basics down. But then we have all these financial wellness programs and we put financial planners in front of average, everyday middle income earning Americans in, you know, large hospitals and different companies and we make sure that we're getting these folks access to great financial planning and not the kind of financial planning that we see a lot. So sold to people. So yeah, that's what we do.

[Joe Salsihai]

You may not know this, Sarah, I don't know if you know this or not, but do you know that that's the way back when I was a financial planner, that's how I built my career was going in and, and talking at places like hospitals or Chrysler or Microsoft or different companies. That's how I built my financial planning practice.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

I did not know that. That's great to know.

[Joe Salsihai]

Isn't it super fun though when somebody gets that aha. Like you're sitting there and you're explaining how their 401k works and they get this incredible aha. It is such. It was the reason I love doing it.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

And then you know that, you know, the research shows once someone chooses a savings rate, you know, they have a 90 chance of leaving it. That if you can take a young person and get them from the default of 5% to a 10% savings rate, you know you've changed their lives. Just in that moment, I thought you.

[Joe Salsihai]

Were going to say like, you know, some of our friends who are in the financial independence retire early. You're like, no, not a five. Put a zero behind that. Let's go 50. Come on 50. Save half.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Hey, we all know here it's a gateway drug. You, you start at 10 and then you start getting real greedy for more.

[Joe Salsihai]

And what I love about having you here, Sarah, Katherine for episode 1800 is this topic because you're out among people that don't know any better. And I have spent a lot of time around people that don't know any better. Heck, Jesse, Paula, Doug, you guys have been around people that don't know any better. And I was thinking about the other day, what are some of the dumbest financial concepts that you have ever heard somebody say? Like, people say this dumb stuff and sometimes they're giving it as advice and sometimes they're just saying, hey, you know what, you should blank. And you're like, are you nuts? So I thought we would do that. But before that, we've got a couple sponsors who help us keep on keeping on. We're going to hear from them. So you don't pay a dime for any of this. Goodness. And then Sarah, Catherine, Paula, Jesse. Well, they're going to hopefully help you avoid some really, really not great financial moves. I've worked in so many different fields. University development, water treatment, financial planning, podcasting. While there might not be much of a through line between any of those jobs, you know what you always need is the right person for the job. Getting hiring. Right. That is a skill that you want to master quickly and that you need good partners around you to help you. Do you want to match the right candidate with the right job with Indeed sponsored Jobs? If you're hiring well, indeed is all you need. Stop struggling to get your job post even seen on other sites. You'll match with quality candidates with Indeed sponsored jobs. Get matched with and hire quality candidates that can drive those results you need regardless of the type of business you're in. Target your post to candidates that meet your specific criteria like your skills, certifications, the location sponsored jobs. Boost your job post for quality candidates so you can reach the people that can help your business thrive. Plus, with Indeed sponsored jobs, you only pay for results. That is a boost whenever you need to find quality talent. And if you learn anything from Stacking Benjamin's headlines, you know we need data to support our argument. Well, how about this piece of data? Sponsored jobs posted directly on Indeed. 95% more likely to report a hire than non sponsored jobs. Spend less time searching and more time actually interviewing candidates who check all the boxes. Less stress, less time, and more results. Now with Indeed sponsored Jobs and because you're a stacker, you're going to get a $75 sponsored job credit to help get your job the premium status it deserves. Indeed.com podcast. Just go to Indeed.com podcast right now and support Stacking Benjamin by saying you heard about Indeed right here. Indeed.com podcast terms and conditions apply. Hiring. Do it the right way with Indeed. We heard you. Nine years of bring back the snack wrap and you've won but maybe you.

[Jesse Kramer]

Should have asked for more. Say hello to the hot honey snack wrap.

[Joe Salsihai]

Now you've really won. Go to McDonald's and get it while you can. I went looking and I found a list. I found a list with 19 of the dumbest financial things people say. Which means whenever I find a list that we have to. We have to dance. No, we have to make this a game show. So I'm super happy we're doing the stacking Benjamin's game show Friday. Which means that all three of you are now our competitors in round one, the first half of today's show. You're going to guess and your guess, if it's on this list of 19 of the dumbest things people say about money that sound like financial advice, you'll get a point. Then we'll stop for our usual game inside the game. Today we'll stop for Doug's normal trivia. And then in the second half, two points for the right answer. And we'll award then two points for our year long competition between Paula, Jesse and OG So Sarah, Catherine, you are team OG today. Which means good news and bad news. You want the good news, the bad news.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

I always take the bad news first. Hit me.

[Joe Salsihai]

Well the bad news is, is that OG was a champion. Doug. Paula, was it two years in a row? Two years running? Maybe.

[Paula Pant]

I think at least two years running. Yeah.

[Joe Salsihai]

Yeah. Until this guy, Jesse Kramer this year showed up and now Jesse took the crown away from him. And this year, Doug, what's the score so far this year?

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

One moment. Joe was not prepared for that challenge.

[Joe Salsihai]

One question I would ask Doug.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

I've got OG with two points, Jesse with one point and Paula really, really close with zero points.

[Paula Pant]

I have a question. Is it possible to get negative points?

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Yes, it is. Yes.

[Joe Salsihai]

Yeah. And we'll talk more about that before we get to the the finish later. But for now we're gonna take your first guess in our super super super competition here. And because he is in. Well, wait a minute. I want the person in the last place to have the most choices. So Paul Pant, you're going to go first. I've got this list of 19 of the dumbest financial things people talk about in front of me. What is on this list of the worst?

[Paula Pant]

I'm guessing it's chasing whatever is the latest hot fad. I don't know if you need me to be more specific than that. Like to name any specific hot fads, neighbor. Doug.

[Joe Salsihai]

Just saying that's a fad with.

[Jesse Kramer]

A F not a D. Is Chasing.

[Joe Salsihai]

Is chasing the latest fad on the list. It is not on the list. And what's surprising, Paula, is, like, we see that all the time. Oh, you got to do this thing. You got to do the. The next hot thing. You got to buy the pet rock, which is in your, you know, or the Beanie Baby, or those gigantic. What are those called? The Stanley. They cost, like, a bajillion dollars.

[Paula Pant]

Oh, yeah, the Stanley cups. I. I have a. I have a Odwalla thermos, which is also very popular among Gen Z. Yeah, yeah.

[Joe Salsihai]

So. But I got to buy the most expensive one because I got to be at the top of the fad.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Pokemon cards.

[Joe Salsihai]

Pokemon cards. There's one.

[Paula Pant]

Yeah.

[Jesse Kramer]

Paula, you just took one for the team, though, because I had that written down.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Same.

[Paula Pant]

Wow.

[Joe Salsihai]

It is surprising. And part of what I love about our game show is the number of great ones that you guys always have. And. And frankly, how often does chasing a fad get you in trouble? I mean, it gets so many people in trouble so often from vacations, like vacationing at the hot place where everybody goes to. Vacationing at the. The hotel. I got to stay at the hotel and pay more. I got to go to the restaurant and pay more. So chasing the fad. Jesse.

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah.

[Joe Salsihai]

Are you a fad chaser?

[Jesse Kramer]

I try not to be, but it's very human. What they call it mimetic desire. Right.

[Joe Salsihai]

Like.

[Jesse Kramer]

Like a mime. Like, they're a copycat. We, as humans, we just want to copy what we see. And we don't want to be part of the out group. Right. We want to be part of the in group. And so if the in group is all doing one thing, if they're all, you know, buying silver. Silver's been in the news recently, or buying Gamestop or. Right. Taking that trip to Italy, like, we want to do the same thing. And. Well, especially in investing, it's almost never the right thing to do.

[Joe Salsihai]

It's funny. There are some fads. Like, if we're serious with ourselves, there are some fads, I think that, like, I chase. I think about a couple of them. Number one, when a movie is in the movie theater, I'd much rather see the movie in the movie theater than see it at home. I'm too distracted at home. I have too much add, and so I will pay a bunch more money to see the movie in the movie theater. So that might be. Is that a fad or is that. I don't know. But then the second thing is, like, the hot board game, like, if everybody has the hot new board game, like I find myself chasing, I'm like, ooh, man, I should buy that game. Because that's the game everybody's talking about. And by everybody, I mean all the nerds.

[Jesse Kramer]

Jesse yeah, I don't know the first one, especially the movie theater. Like, to me, that's just more of a preference than anything else. It's like, all right, if you're paying extra for something you prefer, Joe, like, more power to you. The fad stuff. I mean, I'm interested to hear what Paula and Sarah Catherine think. But to me, there are these things that become really, really popular for a short period of time. And yes, they might cost you money, and then all of a sudden, they're not popular anymore.

[Joe Salsihai]

Where movies have been around forever.

[Jesse Kramer]

Where movies have been around forever. And, like, we all know that you're a giant board game nerd. Joe so it's like, you do you, man. You do you.

[Joe Salsihai]

Sarah Catherine, are there any things that when they first come out, you got to have, like, right today, I think.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Besides produce, I'll speak for, like, kind of a gendered piece. But I think, like, the beauty industry is a really good one to describe this. So I'll never Forget, like, turned 40 and then I immediately felt like it was my duty to buy $300 worth of creams for my face. And I took them to my dermatologist and she said, I kid you not, this $8 vanicream is the exact same thing as all. And that is just, that's a huge fad, I think, for aging. There's this, like, very big fear of aging. And so a lot of people are on these pretty unreal fads. I mean, even like just the biohacking, it's a very expensive fad that a lot of people go on. And even if you don't have the money, why wouldn't you want to go after longevity if you think that red light box is going to make you live longer? And so I, I think that right now, beauty, biohacking, all those is a very expensive fad.

[Joe Salsihai]

Sarah Catherine, when Katie Getty Tassen from Money with Katie was on, she just ripped into that industry saying that, you know, it's disguised as girl power. You go girl, you deserve it. And she described it, I'm not going to describe it, but she described as women stealing from women.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

That's it.

[Joe Salsihai]

Like, this is women stealing from women.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Yeah, that treat yourself kind of mentality. And yeah, it's a big thing that you're trying to do to Say, look, true self care. True self care is having a pile of money set aside somewhere that if something happens you can get your hands on it. And so if all this beauty and biohacking is at that expense, it is too expensive.

[Joe Salsihai]

100%. Well, you are up next. The score is still zero, so you could be the first one on the board. Sarah Catherine, what's One of the 19 worst financial things people say that's on my list?

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Stop throwing away money and rent.

[Joe Salsihai]

Stop throwing away money and rent. Is that on my list?

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Are you, where did you get this list? Joe? Is this, by the way, an annuity guy? That's where it came from.

[Joe Salsihai]

Doug, is this like, is this like every list we've had where the guesses that, the two guesses we've had so far are probably better than anything I've got on this list?

[Jesse Kramer]

That's awesome.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

It's got a close tie with a third grade class in Texarkana that he has draft all of the articles that we referenced.

[Joe Salsihai]

It is the reason why these are bad is third graders came up with them? No, but these are advice that I think somebody that didn't know better would think. But tell me this, this idea. So don't waste money. Buy versus rent.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Yeah, so the reason I this was top of my list is it's like one of the big things I hear from people coming into these meetings, these financial wellness meetings, and they're like swimming in student loan debt, huge credit card bills, $0 saved in emergency fund. And they're like, yeah, my parents really think I need to buy a house right now and stop throwing all my money away in rent. And when you are trying to build a financial life, your goal is to fix as many expenses as possible. Because as we all know, when you're a homeowner, I mean, I just had to replace a roof that was $23,000. I mean like, so even if it's a good deal and it's, you know, the mortgage fits and all the numbers sketch out, you can't pray away your air conditioner breaking in the summer. Right. And having to replace that, like, there's, there's no way to get around that. And so it can really set people back who are trying to build a financial foundation. So it's one of the, the worst pieces of advice I think that, that people give, especially to young people.

[Joe Salsihai]

Paula, while Sarah Catherine's talking, I'm thinking to myself, this is almost like a fad in reverse, like we're chasing the way people used to live. And these Ideas that were great. If you were going to work the same job for 30 years, it might be much better to own a house. Today. Things are a lot different, right?

[Paula Pant]

I think there are two things going on. One is, as you said, people used to be less mobile, whereas now people move much more frequently. Every time that you move, if you're buying and selling homes, you have big transaction costs on the buy and sell that can eat into the equity. I think the other piece of it is that psychologically equity that you build in a home, it's visible, it's tangible in a way that your 401k balance is not. And if you actually look at the numbers on a spreadsheet, your 401k can build you. Depending on what home you buy, and depending on the buy versus rent ratio in your area, your 401k could build you a lot more wealth. There are many areas of the country in which it makes more sense to pay rent. Take the delta in what you would be spending and put that into an index fund and, and let that compound and grow. But the problem is, like, with a house, you see it, you touch it, you smell it, you feel it. So there's a certain, like, viscerality to it. I don't know if that's a real word. Visceralness.

[Joe Salsihai]

You made one up. Viscerality.

[Paula Pant]

Yeah, exactly. We'll make that a word. And because it's so visceral, it feels more real than your 401k balance does. And I think that that adds to the emotional appeal of it, but not the mathematical appeal.

[Joe Salsihai]

Jesse, you referenced this earlier. Gold and silver having a moment right now as we record this, and not in a great way. Is it the same Paula talks about, hey, you can see it, you can touch it. Isn't that what we hear about gold and silver all the time and precious metals? Hey, you can see it. So it must be a good investment because you can hang on to it, right?

[Jesse Kramer]

I mean, speaking of intangible property, I think, Paula, you need to trademark viscerality before Mark Zuckerberg steals it from you and renames his company, because he's been known to do that. You know, it's. It's a new. It's not the metaverse now we're talking about viscerality. You want to wear your viscerality goggles. I mean, he's going to name. You heard it here first. He's going to name his company that.

[Joe Salsihai]

Because he's a big fan of the show. He listens to every episode. Yeah, yeah.

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah, no, I would wager there's some sort of, like, tangibility bias out there where, like, there are definitely some people who. They want to be able to hold something in their hands and put their eyes on it. And. Yeah. You know, logging into your Schwab account and seeing that your IRA is up 3% is not nearly as tangible as building equity in a house. When you compare this apartment, this small unit I rent out in this big building that I don't own versus this structure that I can show you the deed, and I own it, and it's mine. I get the appeal. And going back to what Sarah Catherine was saying, I mean, the American dream, right. Part of the American dream involves homeownership. It's part of our fabric. Which doesn't mean it's right. Of course. It doesn't mean that the math bears that out. I'm just saying, like, it's part of this culture that a lot of us have kind of been stewing in, seeped in for years. And so no wonder people come to us in circumstances when, like, they really shouldn't be thinking about home ownership. But to them, it's a really high priority. So, anyway, I guess my bigger point is, Joe, your list stinks.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

We all agree on that.

[Joe Salsihai]

I could have told you that before we started because I love picking out these lists where I'm like, oh, they're not going to get half of these. They're going to have much better ones. Jesse, let's keep you in the hot seat here. Okay, Score. Still zeros. Even though we've had two awesome ones. Give me one that's on our list. I got 19 of them.

[Jesse Kramer]

Guys, I can't wait to be wrong. I can't wait to be wrong. Don't take that raise, Joe, because it's only going to increase your taxes.

[Joe Salsihai]

Is don't take that raise on this list. It is on this list. Not in those same words, but it is. More money equals less money. More income equals less money. Hey, I'm not going to make more money or, you know, one member of my family's not going to go to work because we did the math, and I'm going to have less money. And you know what? Those people, Jesse, don't understand how the tax system works.

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah, I still remember my first ever summer job. Shout out to Fairhaven Beach State Park. A maintenance guy who I was working with, who I'll. I'll remain. He'll. He'll remain anonymous for this story. Basically told me that version of his circumstances. And it's like yeah, they, they want to make me a, you know, a level 17 state employee now, but that's going to push me into the next highest tax bracket. And I did the math and I'm going to walk home with less money. And I remember, you know, my 16 year old self being like, I don't know how taxes work but like it just kind of surprised me just thinking like, huh, it's kind of a weird system that the US government would have set up so that blue collar guys like Bob here simply cannot accept raises for fear of actually losing out money. And sure enough, Bob was wrong. And yeah, so that, that was, maybe in some ways that was the seeds of my financial journey. But we hear it a lot, right? You hear it a lot. And it's almost always, I will say there are these weird quarter cases where the tax system doesn't work the way you expect but like 99% of the time it's put together in a relatively common sense way. And this is one really common example of that.

[Joe Salsihai]

But there might be people, Sarah, Catherine, listening to this that don't understand, which I love that they're here because that's why you listen to a show like ours. How does this thing work and why is that wrong? Because we have not explained that at all. Why is this more money equals less money. Wrong.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

People understand that making marginal income, they hear that you pay more in taxes, but you're paying potentially more in taxes on those additional dollars but as a percentage of those dollars, you're not paying more in taxes that negates those dollars. So we do have a marginal tax brackets and a progressive tax system where you pay more and more as a percentage as you make incremental dollars. And you know, I totally. This is fantastic. I wish I had thought of this one. It's a really good one.

[Joe Salsihai]

Did you just say something on my list was actually good?

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

It is a really good one because the tax obsession really sets people people back. And there's lots of examples of this. There's, you know, people that are so scared of taxes that they make kind of these bizarre elections in their S corps. Like when they own a business of how much income versus distribution not realize they can save more. You know, it's like lower taxes at all expenses. You know, they'll start a business to save on taxes. Well, that means you've lost money if you're saving on taxes, right? Like people are so funny when it comes to feeling like they're getting cheated by the tax code. And I think that they make Very detrimental decisions by this. And this is probably something very deep and cultural because, you know, I did the math. What math? Because, Jesse, you're right. People say I did the math. You're like, where, where are you not math? Doesn't math? I mean, where are you doing the math? I think it's, it's more of a gut feeling than actual math.

[Joe Salsihai]

Yeah. And what's so frustrating about that, Paula, is that, you know, when you and I answer questions on Afford anything. Oh, gee. And I answer questions here on Stacky Benjamin's. We always hear these people obsessing over the tax. Right. Which is why I think you and I have said this line a hundred times. Don't let the tax tail wag the more money dog.

[Paula Pant]

Exactly. Yeah. Or don't let the tax tail wag the decision dog. Because so many people make their decisions around taxes.

[Joe Salsihai]

We're live on YouTube as we record this. You want to join this? It's always Meta talking about Friday because we actually record this on Mondays, but come join us Monday afternoons. And B. Wayne hanging out with us says, this is another one. And I'll just tell you, this is not on the list, but does the, you know, the zero tax refund, people think that means I didn't own any tax. It just means that you withheld the appropriate amount. It has nothing to do with the amount of tax. That's not one of our 18 that are left. But B. Wayne, that's a, that's real quick.

[Jesse Kramer]

I just. Only because I saw it. I see there's another comment from Nemesis NXT who says subsidy cliffs. That is one of those corner cases where. And I'll explain in a second, but right there are these corner cases where, ooh, actually if you earn more money, maybe you would. When I see subsidy cliffs, I think of, maybe they're referring to like IRMAA in retirement where. Oh, right. If you're above this next threshold, you will owe more suddenly in this Medicare surcharge. And so, yes, it is definitely worth being aware of those things. But what we're talking about here usually is just federal income tax. Just that normal Federal income tax. 10, 12, 22, 24, 32, 35, 37.

[Joe Salsihai]

That's it.

[Paula Pant]

Yeah.

[Jesse Kramer]

And, and, and those things don't exist there. Go. Sorry, go ahead, Paula.

[Paula Pant]

Oh, just with health insurance as well, if you buy your own individual health insurance, there are subsidy cliffs as well. So that's the other thing to look out for. That is a case in which the tax code does not make sense. And you do actually get punished if you go above a certain threshold, if you're at the edge.

[Joe Salsihai]

Case what's fascinating to me is how much this tax game has showed up in modern culture. And of course, that maybe the most famous one that we've heard the last few years has been this clip from Schitt's Creek. Let's give a listen to David from Schitt's Creek as he explains tax write offs.

[Jesse Kramer]

What's.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

What's this? Looks expensive.

[Joe Salsihai]

This is some new bedding.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

David, did. Didn't I just tell you to save your money?

[Joe Salsihai]

Yeah.

[Jesse Kramer]

I am testing this out for the store.

[Joe Salsihai]

So work is paying for it.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Work is paying for your bedding.

[Paula Pant]

I was going to leave, but now.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

I don't want to.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

What is that? Is that a new lamp?

[Joe Salsihai]

Yeah. I'm thinking of bringing homeware into the store. So that's a write off.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

That's a write off, yeah. Do you even know what a write off is?

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah, it's when you buy something for.

[Joe Salsihai]

Your business and the government pays you back for it.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Oh, and who pays for it?

[Joe Salsihai]

Nobody.

[Jesse Kramer]

You write it off.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Who writes it off?

[Joe Salsihai]

I don't know. The government, the write off people.

[Jesse Kramer]

What? Why are we having this conversation?

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

So if I need booze to get.

[Paula Pant]

Through my day, I can just write that off?

[Jesse Kramer]

That's a stretch.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

But the skincare products you got this morning, those are a write off.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

What skincare products? You purchase skin care products.

[Jesse Kramer]

Okay.

[Joe Salsihai]

I am the face of the company. He needed to write it off.

[Jesse Kramer]

There you go. Sarah. Catherine, I mean, there's your answer to the beauty industry. It's just a write off.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

It's all a write off. That was classic. That is one of my favorite moments in tv. I'm so glad you brought that.

[Joe Salsihai]

It's a good day to play that too. Just after Katherine o' Hara passes away. And what a brilliant actor and comedian she was. That's going to wrap up the first half of our game show. Doug, what's the score so far in our game show?

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Well, Joe, we really only have one competitor in today's game show so far. The gentleman from New York has one point, whereas our two representatives from Arkansas and New York City have zero points.

[Joe Salsihai]

Man, and my money was on Arkansas, so. But we.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

I even wore shoes for this episode.

[Joe Salsihai]

Well, you still got the second half, Sarah. Katherine, we still got the second half, but we take a break halfway through this game. For our normal year long game, we have a Friday competition between our three frequent contributors. Paula Pant from Afford Anything, Jesse Kramer from the Pity Podcast and OG from Team Stacking. Benjamin Sarah Katherine playing on Team OG the score as we mentioned earlier, Jesse has two and OG has one. Now, if you've missed the last few episodes, we have a new rule in 2026, which is that our frequent contributors can hit their button. And by hit the button, we just mean, say out loud, say margin call. And you can only margin call somebody that has points. When you margin call someone, that means that they have to be the closest answer. So they have to be the person that's going to win the point. But if they aren't the person that wins the point, they actually lose a point instead of winning the point. And if you are the person who is closest and you were the person who got margin called, you force the person who margin called you to lose a point. So that's the way it works. Could I explain that anymore?

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Weirdly, what I would really appreciate it if some really studious, diligent stacker out there would go back and listen to all the times Joe has explained this to to see if it's the same every time.

[Joe Salsihai]

I think I should write it down instead of trying to do it from memory is what we should do. But one thing we don't do from memory, because it's new every time. We have to have a question from Doug to kick this off. So, Doug, what's today's trivia question?

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

That's right, Joe. Hey there, Stackers. I'm Joe's mom's neighbor, Doug, and have you ever watched Joe eat pizza? I'm amazed Joey isn't twice as wide as he is tall. Just like today Spotlight country, which is just over 31 miles wide, but only 17 miles tall. I'm talking about Singapore.

[Joe Salsihai]

Just compare me to Singapore.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

I mean, you can't look in a mirror. Singapore citizens on average are the 10th wealthiest in the world, mostly because of the culture of saving and investing. While the US economy focuses on debt, the Singapore economy is based on wealth. But just like we 1800 episodes ago started this podcast with microphones balanced on some books at the rickety card table, Singapore's beginnings were also pretty sketchy. And it was during the 1800s that it was founded as a dusty, dirty outpost for the British Empire. In what year I'll be back right after I go public. A few pennies in my piggy bank. All this talk about being wealthy, it's got me inspired.

[Joe Salsihai]

Singapore concept of saving and really how it's bled into the culture is really interesting. And also what's funny, talking to our friend Amy Minley, who runs the five Freedom retreat in Bali. Not, you know, it's probably far away there, but sitting here in the United States, it feels like it's like right next door. Bali and Singapore. When she was visiting us last week, she was talking about how in Singapore talk about FOMO and people that really want stuff because of the fact that also the rat race very apparent there, according to Amy. So just fascinating to see Singapore's economy. But we start with the person in first place, that is Mr. Jesse Kramer. Jesse, is it what year during the 1800s we gave you a hint, we gave you 100 years to choose from. Was Singapore created?

[Jesse Kramer]

I'm happy to go first. Am I in first place? I thought OG had two.

[Joe Salsihai]

Does OG have two? Oh gee has two.

[Jesse Kramer]

I mean I will take Og's point and go first if that would help the flow.

[Joe Salsihai]

I had that.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Jesse is right.

[Joe Salsihai]

I had that wrong. Which means, and I hate this when the guest has to go first.

[Jesse Kramer]

Well, I'll go first. Just give me the point.

[Joe Salsihai]

Sarah, Catherine, you've got first guest. When in the 1800s was Singapore created?

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Oh my God, this is like guessing the gumballs. So I'm just gonna go. I don't know if this is good strategy but I'm gonna go with 1850.

[Joe Salsihai]

1850. I think 1850s as good as any year. Any thought around why 1850?

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Oh, I have no idea. I'm just trying to figure out how to gamify being closest to the pin.

[Joe Salsihai]

Well, you'll see it gamified. If OG were here, Jesse would say 1849 and Paul would say 1851. Y. Yeah, that's exactly what they do. But I think they'll be nicer to you. So definitely, Jesse, Singapore, what year was it created?

[Jesse Kramer]

All I know is I wish I knew more. I know that the history of Singapore is really, really interesting because this one like prime minister slash kind of like long term autocrat but in a good way, like turned the country around in some really amazing ways from like the, I don't know, 40s through the 80s or something like that. It's it obviously I know nothing about what I'm talking about. You can tell by the way I'm describing it. Except for some loose.

[Joe Salsihai]

But it is fascinating. No, it is fascinating to see how Singapore just changed. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Jesse Kramer]

But yes, I'm not going to play dirty but at the same time I think I'm going to take the over and I'm going to say 1875. I'll split the difference on the upper and I'll still give a pretty good amount of Runway to Sarah Catherine there, which I'll later regret when when she wins and OG actually takes the crown.

[Joe Salsihai]

Paula, pant in our Facebook group Mom's Basement if you want to hang out with us. By the way, there, it's stacking. Benjamins.com Basement is the quick way. We made a little link for you there to come join us. Somebody today was saying we need to change the rules because Paula always loses our trivia but loses it and finishes second. So they wanted you to get like one point per second. Like, what's the point of that? We don't need to do that.

[Paula Pant]

Oh, so it's like ranked choice voting.

[Joe Salsihai]

Yeah, like two points, one point and zero points. We're not doing that. No, but nice, nice sentiment.

[Paula Pant]

Okay, I have many thoughts on the Singapore question. The first thought that came into my head is that given that this is episode 1800, it would make sense that you chose 1800, that the answer would be 1800 or close to 1800. Because what would be your motivation for choosing this question for this episode?

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

That's brilliant.

[Paula Pant]

So that was my first thought. However, my second thought was Joe's too.

[Joe Salsihai]

Stupid to do that.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

This is where stuff gets good.

[Paula Pant]

However. So, Jesse, what you were talking about the benevolent autocrat. So I think, and please fact check me on this. His name was Lee Kuan Yew.

[Jesse Kramer]

Sounds right.

[Paula Pant]

And he ruled Singapore in the mid-1900s. And yes, he was a benevolent dictator who used his autocracy to really improve the lives of the everyday average working person and bring Singapore into prosperity. And by virtue of being a dictator, he was able to do that without the mess of like congress and democracy and all of that. Or parliament.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

What's weird is that is that is almost verbatim what's on Wikipedia right now that I'm reading.

[Joe Salsihai]

It's an amazing right below the year it was established.

[Paula Pant]

You can see my hands have been in the frame this whole time. I very intentionally keep hands in frame when this is going on.

[Joe Salsihai]

If Paul was going to cheat, she would have done it by now. Like, my goodness.

[Paula Pant]

So part of the reason that I know this is because I'm going to Singapore at the end of February because my friend Megan lives there. She is an editor at Business Insider, which is now called Insider. I'm going there. I'm missing my friend's wedding because my friend didn't tell me about her wedding until after I bought the ticket. And I'm also missing a free Michelin star dinner in New York, which I just got an invite to today, so I'm missing several things to go spend a week in Singapore.

[Joe Salsihai]

Wait a minute. Hold on one sec. I just have one quick question.

[Paula Pant]

Yes?

[Joe Salsihai]

Is there a guest coming at some point?

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

At any point? Can you just say a year?

[Joe Salsihai]

I had to reschedule a teeth cleaning. I was going to have the air of my tires rotated.

[Paula Pant]

I did have to reschedule a teeth cleaning. Okay, so I'm thinking about, like, the Gilded Age. I. Okay. Because I've been planning this trip to Singapore. I've been looking up what I want to do there. And this is there's a particular hotel called the Raffles Hotel, which I believe was established in the 1880s, and that was where they have a bar where the Singapore Sling was invented. And that's one of the places that I want to go to on my trip to Singapore. And so given that the Raffles Hotel was established in the 1880s, it kind of makes me want to take the over because it kind of inclines me to think that maybe the country was formed right around Gilded Age era. Like, I'm associating the formation of Singapore with the formation of the Raffles Hotel and subsequently the drink Singapore sling. So either 1880s or 1800, because why else would you choose it for this episode? And this is where life gets hard.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

That was like a whole podcast episode in itself right there.

[Jesse Kramer]

Can you let her take both answers and just see if she gets it right?

[Joe Salsihai]

You know she's still going to be wrong.

[Paula Pant]

That's probably true.

[Jesse Kramer]

1800 and 1880.

[Paula Pant]

Jesse, what was your guess? Yours was 1875.

[Jesse Kramer]

1875.

[Paula Pant]

I'm going to take the narrow under at 1874.

[Joe Salsihai]

Take the middle.

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah, I hope it's the 1880s. Give me 1880s.

[Paula Pant]

Because I'm thinking the country must have been established at least a decade or so before The Raffles Hotel.

[Joe Salsihai]

1800 episodes of failure can't be wrong. Paula, we've got, in fact, Andrea hanging out with us. Says, I always assume Paul has all the answers in her Mensa brain, but is contractually obligated to keep losing just for the fun of the game. All right, will Paula finally get a point? We're gonna find out in just a minute. Mic drop.

[Jesse Kramer]

You ready?

[Paula Pant]

Let's do it.

[Joe Salsihai]

Hosted by former Navy SEAL Mike Ritland. It's unfiltered. You know, when you go to the sound of the gun, bam, you're gone.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

It's weird.

[Joe Salsihai]

I mean, I've had so many near death experiences, it's raw. I love this country. I offered my life to serve this.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Nation and protect its people.

[Joe Salsihai]

Question, what's the meaning of life? And to me, it just boils down to one single word, which is purpose, mic drop, follow, and listen on your favorite platform. All right, Sarah Katherine, you opened up with 1850, and the good news is that means you've got everything between 1800 and 1850 on your side because Paula decided to take the narrow middle. Feeling good?

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Feeling good? Yeah, we'll see.

[Joe Salsihai]

Jesse. Paula took 1874 and this iconic hotel, which could have been around the same time that Singapore was created. You feeling good?

[Jesse Kramer]

I'm feeling curious. I feel like. So if my math is right, Paula intentionally opted in for 12 of the 100 years.

[Joe Salsihai]

She took a smaller slice.

[Jesse Kramer]

She took a smaller slice, but with some education, and that's a dangerous thing. So I don't like my odds.

[Joe Salsihai]

And, Paula, are you proud of the fact that you actually formulated a number at the end of that soliloquy?

[Paula Pant]

Well, my gut said either 1800 or 1880, so I decided to violate both and just go with 1874.

[Jesse Kramer]

We're screwed.

[Joe Salsihai]

I'm going to say the scariest words in the English language right now. Only Doug knows, so let's find out.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Hey there, stackers. I'm world traveler and guy who stacks. Still can't believe there's a butterfly house in the Singapore airport. Oh, it's not there on purpose. They just moved in. Joe's mom's neighbor, Doug. Ah, Singapore. The place created as a trading post for the British Empire, now trades in great foods, wealthy people, world class shipping, finance, and more. If only we'd become as wealthy over 1800 episodes as Singapore has become since the 1800s. Why did we choose podcasting again? I told you.

[Paula Pant]

You.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

We should have gone with my idea of bouncy house rentals. Joe.

[Jesse Kramer]

Jeez.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Here was today's question. What date was Singapore created as a British outpost? The answer? Well, you know how we do this here? I will tell you. It was 56 fewer years than what Jesse guessed, 55 fewer than Paula guessed, and just 31 fewer than what Sarah Gather guessed is. The correct answer is 1819. Making Sarah, Catherine.

[Paula Pant]

And really, OG our winner should have gone with 1800.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Unreal.

[Joe Salsihai]

Nice job, Sarah Catherine.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

I was worried what was going to happen with OG Like, I don't know, was he gonna, like, come beat me up if I got got it wrong? Like, I feel a sense of relief right now.

[Joe Salsihai]

Sarah, Catherine. He's far more of a lover than he lets on. I swear to God he is. He's a puppy dog underneath that rough exterior. But the miracle there, Sarah. Catherine was listening to Paula talk herself again out of the right answer.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Yeah, Paula, I have to say, like, that 1800 did seem like a really good choice.

[Paula Pant]

Thank you. Thank you. And the irony is that it was the right choice, but for the wrong reasons, because it sounds like 1800 episodes didn't factor into their decision at all.

[Joe Salsihai]

That's why I thought you were gonna say, well, I've known Doug and Joe for a long time, and they wouldn't have thought of that because that is 100% tr.

[Jesse Kramer]

True.

[Joe Salsihai]

All right, we need to get back to the real important thing, which is teaching people what's bad on the Internet. And not just on the Internet. A lot of the time, people say these things just in passing. Like, Jesse, you were talking about a guy talking about the tax code and how he didn't understand that. I have people tell me that that's a crazy one. But the good news is we got 18 more. You get two points for the win this time if you get it right. So Paula to take the lead. There's 18 left. What's on this list of 19 of the worst pieces of financial advice? Really? Financial sayings more than advice.

[Paula Pant]

Financial sayings more than advice. Oh, man. Sorry. My brain was so attuned to Singapore, I haven't been able to.

[Joe Salsihai]

Okay, no extra fee for the sound effect.

[Paula Pant]

What was the one that we established in the first half? It was renting.

[Joe Salsihai]

More income equals less money was the way the piece put it.

[Paula Pant]

Right.

[Joe Salsihai]

The piece put more income equals less money because of the tax code.

[Paula Pant]

Okay, did we do the renting? Is throwing your money? We did. Sarah Catherine did that.

[Joe Salsihai]

Sarah Catherine had that one great one, albeit wrong.

[Paula Pant]

I feel like this is. There's got to be something related to cars. Buy a new car because you'll pay less in repairs.

[Joe Salsihai]

Is that your guess?

[Paula Pant]

Yes, that's my guess.

[Joe Salsihai]

Buy a new car because you'll pay less in repairs. Is that on the list?

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

People totally do that, right?

[Joe Salsihai]

People 100 do that. Doug does that.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Yeah. What's your point?

[Joe Salsihai]

We've had this discussion on the show. Doug does that. OG does that. I don't do that, but they do that. We've. We've fought this fight on this podcast, but lots of people think buy the new car. And maybe, maybe, though, Sarah, Katherine, in defense of Doug, maybe it's just the freedom from worry more than the financial aspect.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Okay, well, let me be more specific about what I think actually happens with a lot of folks. You Have a car and you don't have a car fund to make car repairs. And so you're facing a $2,500 car repair. And instead of fixing the car, you get a new car that has a 700 car payment.

[Joe Salsihai]

Yeah, because I can handle a 700 car payment. But not thinking about the fact that I'm doing that now for. What's the newest car loan? Like a 10 year car loan or some ridiculousness.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

I thought it was 8, but is it going to 10?

[Joe Salsihai]

It could be. I don't know if it's a 10 yet. It feels like they get longer and longer. It used to be five, then it was seven. Then. Yeah, craziness. But 700. 700amonth. And I agree. I think for a lot of people it is freedom from worry. But I think that that's the, I think that's the bigger one. I'm like, I can't afford 2,500 bucks. What am I going to do? Oh, I've got decent credit, so I'm going to go ahead and take out a car loan. No money down, Jesse. Nobody down.

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah, I know. Cars and car expenses. It's a, it's one of those, like, we go back to the well to talk about the different ways to finance a car. I dove in the numbers once and I actually walked away not entirely convinced that there was that much of a difference between used and new when you account for. Okay, so I see, I see Doug's. I, I've won over Doug, which, you know, surprise, surprise there. When you account for like, you know, fuel and maintenance and insurance and all those things and depreciation costs. I, I didn't see a big difference. Granted, that was like four or five years ago before. The car market has gone kind of crazy in recent years, but yeah, I mean, I don't know. At the end of the day, cars are an expense more than anything else. Right. There's no investment aspect to cars, in my opinion. Any way that you can, like responsibly keep your expenses down when it comes to cars, I would think is probably a good choice.

[Joe Salsihai]

I went used car to get payments out of my life. That's why I went used car was so that I could finally build a car fund so that I could. Jesse, to your point, realizing it's just an expense that I could then never have a car payment. And the cool thing is, is what was amazing about not having a car payment was I then started keeping cars longer because I love not having a car payment. And I would see then and I would gamify it then, like, how many. How many months in a row can I go without a car payment? And how long can this car last? We generally, in our household, because of freedom from worry, Cheryl drives a new car, which we pay cash for, which has become increasingly difficult, is the price of cars goes up and up, and I drive a car that we can't drive outside Texarkana because it probably won't make it. There is very little chance my car will make it on i30 more than Hope, Arkansas, like just half a mile, half an hour up the road. But what's interesting was we were hunting for Cheryl's last car, which was just recently. Every single salesperson we talked to started with Sarah Catherine, to your point. So what payment are you looking at? And I said, we'll take care of the payment later. Let's talk about the price of the car. They did not want to talk about the price of the car, but that's what we ended up talking about. And I was able to get a great deal by pitting. I didn't have to talk anybody, you know, shame anybody or yell at anybody to negotiate. I just put dealers against each other. And I said, hey, this dealer will give me this much less than you did. What do you got? It was amazing. I ended up getting $8,000 off of the salesperson's original price. $8,000 less just by pitting dealers against each other. Not as hard as you would think. All right, next up, who is next? Oh, Sarah Catherine is next. Sarah Catherine, an opportunity to take the lead and put some heat on Mr. Kramer. Let's put some heat on Jesse.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

If this is not on the list, I quit.

[Joe Salsihai]

She's like, this is the last question I'm going to answer on this episode.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Yeah, okay, so I have lots of answers. I'm just going to spew off after this just to make sure that whoever wrote this list can hear an actual correct list. Yes, I will say spend more money to get more reward points. Like credit card points.

[Jesse Kramer]

Good one.

[Joe Salsihai]

Spend more money to get more reward points. Is that on the list? It is on the list. And specifically, thank goodness, their exact phrasing, Sarah Catherine was put everything on a credit card for points. And they're like, how ridiculous is this? This is. This is incredible. Why is that ridiculous, though? For people that might have thought that's because their friends are telling them that.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Well, who designed reward points? Credit card companies. What do credit card companies want you to do? They want you to spend. And so if our goal is to spend Less money and we decide to play their game, we will likely spend more money. I think I saw research once that we spend 30% more when we use a credit card than if we use a debit card. And there's a lot of psychology that goes into that because the balance is going up versus with a debit card, your balance is going down. But I think then there's this thing in the back of people's heads. Like, I'll hear people all the time say, wow, I just got, you know, I just booked this whole vacation for free on points. And then you're thinking, well, how incentivized were you to spend more money so that you could get those points to get the hotel room? So it's this double whammy that credit cards are already enticing us to spend. These rewards really tip us over the edge to spend more.

[Joe Salsihai]

What's amazing to me, and I don't know, Paula, do you have a good number of reward points?

[Paula Pant]

I do, yeah.

[Joe Salsihai]

I don't know if you found this to be the case. I have found over the past, like, three years, it's getting more difficult to find a good deal for my reward points. My reward points aren't piling up because of the fact that I don't want to use them or I'm trying. Trying to put everything on a. On a reward card. They're piling up because I truly like. I go to book a flight and they make it almost impossible for me to find a flight worth booking using my reward points.

[Paula Pant]

Yeah. The devaluation of miles is real.

[Joe Salsihai]

Yeah, sure feels like it.

[Paula Pant]

Yeah. There are a handful of good websites. Point Me is one of them that help you figure out good redemption strategies. Like what I often do if I'm booking, if I'm trying to book a rewards flight is. I will. I will decide where to go based on where the best redemption is. For example, Singapore, I just paid cash for that because I had a specific destination and because of my schedule, I had specific dates. And with that level of restriction, I couldn't get a good deal with miles. So even though I have a bunch of miles, I just paid cash. Whereas if I'm going to use my miles to get the best redemption, I just kind of say, all right, where can I go? That's how I ended up in Mongolia. Yeah.

[Joe Salsihai]

Was just points.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Yeah.

[Paula Pant]

I got a great deal to Ulaanbaatar.

[Jesse Kramer]

And I was like, ulaanbaatar, baby.

[Paula Pant]

Yes. I'm going to Mongolia because, believe it.

[Joe Salsihai]

Or not, all those reward seats weren't taken.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Yeah, Our next trip to Sudan in the summer.

[Joe Salsihai]

In the summer. Yeah.

[Jesse Kramer]

I'm on the Wikipedia page right now. So, Sarah, Catherine asked, who invented the credit card repoint? Wikipedia says Abe Lincoln. And then when it says, why was it invented? It does say, so that you can stay at the Raffles Hotel in Singapore. So that's my answer to the quiz. Joe, can that be my answer for the next question?

[Joe Salsihai]

Well, my favorite is the other Abe Lincoln quote, which is Abe Lincoln said, don't believe everything you read on the Internet.

[Jesse Kramer]

That's true.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

I've always loved that quote.

[Joe Salsihai]

My favorite Abe quote. Scott and B. Wayne hanging out with us talk about the reason why people do use credit cards. Scott says, if you don't spend differently, there's many reasons to use a credit card instead of debit. And B. Wayne says, no protection when using a debit card. I think for me, though, Sarah, Catherine, like, when I read this, these are people that are ostensibly, I would think, responsible with money. I think you got to get used to having zero balance for quite a while before you migrate over to credit cards versus your debit card.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

I think, I think intellectual honesty, you know, you're right. Probably someone who's listening to this podcast probably has a better propensity to having a budget and having good spending controls. I am one of those people. I have a really healthy functioning basal ganglia in my limbic system. And so if I have money, I spend it all. I love spending money. I'm very good at it. I have limits. Like I use a debit card so that I have a pile of money, and that's the finite pile I have to spend. When you don't have those natural limits, then, you know, a credit card offers a lot of opportunities to overspend, especially if you don't have a careful budget. So I personally, I. I use a debit card. I use it for all of my variable spending. Now for big ticket items where I have a savings account that I save ahead for items like car repairs, home repairs, vacations, pet visits, things like that, I'll use a credit card on those things. I'll use a credit card on my bills. I'm not going to send Verizon more money than they charged me for. So that's a pretty safe bet. You just have to create your own system for using a credit card so that it doesn't use you.

[Joe Salsihai]

You and I have talked about this before, but I'm also a spender, which is how I created the weekly meeting. Cheryl and I, I know that we're going to talk about every dollar I spend. It's amazing how when I have to say it out loud with my spouse, how I probably won't buy that next board game or whatever it might be, I'll just put it away. Because like you, Sir Catherine, I am love spending, love spending money. That dopamine hit is real. Let's go to the final one, man. This is it. Jesse Kramer, you've got the last guess. You get it right, you take home the crown with three points. You get it wrong, Sarah, Catherine is winning the entire day. She would have won both parts of this.

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah, it's a lot of pressure. My basil ganglia is on fire right now. My limbic system is erupting.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

There's an ointment for that.

[Jesse Kramer]

I need some of Doug's, you know, facial creams to help my limbic system. I'm going to go with. So this is right, this is bad, or this is, like, bad advice that we see online. I'm gonna say, always avoid debt. Always avoid debt.

[Joe Salsihai]

Always avoid debt. This is making me nervous. Is it on the list or is it not on the list?

[Jesse Kramer]

That's rough.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

I don't know. That was a good one.

[Joe Salsihai]

Well, Sarah, Catherine, you had a good one earlier. Paul, is that good ones?

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah, but my good one was worth two points.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

There are.

[Joe Salsihai]

There are a lot of good ones that did make the list. Sir Catherine's our winner. The crowd goes wild. Sorry I didn't hit the button quick enough. That is incredible. Sir Catherine, I like that it's you. I dislike the fact that OG just took home two points because of you, but I want to take the last few minutes. I want to have a little bit longer finish today's episode because I really want to go over some of the ones that made the list because you got to be thinking, what are some of the things Number one on the list was? Let the bank take it.

[Jesse Kramer]

What?

[Joe Salsihai]

Don't. Don't worry about. Don't worry about it. Let the bank take it. Go ahead and buy the thing. If it's repossessed, it gets repossessed. Big deal.

[Paula Pant]

What?

[Joe Salsihai]

That was number one.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Literally. I've never heard.

[Paula Pant]

Yeah.

[Joe Salsihai]

Who says Jeff Foxworthy actually wrote about this in his book? Which is hilarious. When he was writing his memoir, he said that in the days he was a copier salesman, he's broke all the time. And one day a repo guy came to take his Firebird and said, hey, unless you have a check for the next payment, which is like 220 way back in the day, I gotta take your car. And he goes, 220, I don't have that kind of money. And the repo guy goes, well, don't you have a check? And Jeff looks at him and goes, I'm sorry, I thought you wanted money. Let me just pay the whole thing off. I'll go ahead and write you a check for the entire car. He kept his car that day. And then he talks about how he had it hidden. But we have TikTok minutes about this. People going, go ahead and buy the thing. Enjoy it for X number of months. You're going to get to drive that Lamborghini, Paula, for the next like four or five months before the bank takes it.

[Jesse Kramer]

That is bad advice.

[Joe Salsihai]

I mean, yeah, that is bad advice.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

No, that was a thing.

[Joe Salsihai]

Number two, let your mom or another relative keep your money safe. Give it to a well meaning relative to keep your money safe. Never, never, never have another person never keep money in your house. The point was, don't keep money in your house. Don't think money under your mattress is safe. You would have said keep your money under your mattress to keep it safe. That would have qualified for this one. Do not keep physical money around your house. Dumb piece of advice. Number three, get it at rent a center.

[Paula Pant]

That's good.

[Joe Salsihai]

Number four, I actually had a financial planner that Og and I worked with way back in the day when we worked closely together. Number four, buy vehicles you can't afford. This financial planner, the way to motivate himself was he bought a Porsche. It had a huge monthly payment and he needed to get out there and get new clients as fast as he could so he could make his car payment. And that was the way he kept himself motivated to be good at what he did was buy a car you can't afford.

[Paula Pant]

Dang.

[Joe Salsihai]

Number five, you can't afford stuff. Just stop putting money in your retirement accounts. Stop putting money in your retirement accounts. That's for later. You got problems today.

[Jesse Kramer]

I see. So one of us should have guessed. Take a suitcase full of money and light it on fire. That's probably number 17, right? Like that's bad advice.

[Joe Salsihai]

Well, when you guys were talking about, you know, these are smart things that are on the list, I'm like, these are not smart things. These are truly the dumbest things people say.

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah.

[Joe Salsihai]

About money. Next one. Emergency funds. Overrated. I've had fights with money geeks about this one.

[Jesse Kramer]

Okay, yeah.

[Joe Salsihai]

Money geeks tell you, do not keep an emergency fund. That's a waste of interest. So frustrating.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Yeah. They'll say, like, your HELOC is your emergency fund. Right. Or a credit card. It's not its limit, it's an emergency fund.

[Joe Salsihai]

And then, Sarah Catherine, 2008 hits again when they're slashing credit that you're not using, and all of a sudden you don't have that credit anymore. Very scary. Number eight, that neighborhood will never appreciate. Paula, I thought you might appreciate that one, but I'm, I was actually talked out of a house here in Texarkana. We first moved to town because our real estate guy said that neighborhood will never appreciate. And what's sad is I really still like that neighborhood. And I don't think of my. I don't think of the house that I live in as an investment. And I think that's part of the problem is that I wanted to live here because it was a really cool older neighborhood, not because it was going to be this huge investment. My investment properties, investment property. This was separate. Number 10 and number 11, very similar. Number 10, live in the moment. And number 11, you only live once. The whole YOLO thing, just absolutely stupid. Yeah. Number 12, very similar to number one, borrow now, declare bankruptcy later. How many people do you talk to, though? Sarah Catherine, I'm looking at the look on your face. Do you see, though, and you see this advice all over social media. You know what? Bankruptcy is your number one. And these are bankruptcy lawyers, by the way, that are telling you just go ahead and declare bankruptcy.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

That's really interesting. So, like, I'm not on social media anymore. Like, I quit in 2020. Things must have changed a lot since then. Like the thing with this advice is it's like so obviously bad advice that you don't. I don't, I don't encounter people repeating this kind of advice. I think we were trying to think of advice that we see people actually thinking is reasonable.

[Paula Pant]

Right.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

That's actually bad advice.

[Paula Pant]

Right.

[Joe Salsihai]

Number 14 on the list, get a credit card so you learn discipline. Bad advice. Number 15, have kids, sort out the money later. Number 16, don't let money hold back your dreams. How many times have we heard that? No, I got this big dream. I'm just going to do this. I don't have any money for it, but I'm just going to go do it. Number 18, go ahead and charge the vacation. That was my honeymoon, by the way, and I've written about this all over the place. Horrible trip, Beautiful time of my life. Fantastic. Newly married, and we put it all on credit cards. And I regretted that forever and ever and ever it was a. It was a vacation full of regret. And then number 19 is. Money is meant to make you happy. Those are the worst of the worst guys. Which other ones did you have? Did you have any other good ones that didn't make the list? Sarah, Catherine, you're nodding.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

I do. So the rule of 28, that you can borrow 28% of your monthly gross, pay for a house.

[Joe Salsihai]

It drives me crazy. Banks are always happy to get you into trouble. Using any bank number that says going to a bank calculator and how much can I afford? And going with their top number is. Is gonna really be trouble.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

You know, my favorite one is silence.

[Joe Salsihai]

What do you mean?

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

I don't think we talk about money enough? Oh, I think that we have made money taboo. And so it's the lack of talking about money that I think is the worst advice.

[Joe Salsihai]

We got some good ones from the people hanging out with us on YouTube. Jay Greg says, get along for the mafia. If we're talking about really bad ones, invest in pet rocks. B. Wayne. Andrea says. Lisa. Fancy car. Just some absolutely bad ones. Jesse, Paula, you guys have any other ones?

[Jesse Kramer]

I can rattle off a few real quick. Buy lotto tickets, especially when the jackpot is high. It's gotta be exotic or complicated if it's gonna work in your favor. That's good. Always carry a balance on your credit card.

[Joe Salsihai]

And always carry a balance. When I think, is this level stupid?

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Yeah.

[Joe Salsihai]

Right.

[Jesse Kramer]

Well, my last one was, if you need money, go hold up a convenience store that belongs on your list. That's number 20. That's gotta be number 20. That. It must have been the first one cut, because that's got to be on there.

[Joe Salsihai]

I won't play the clip, but did you guys see Raising Arizona? They go hold up the convenience store because diapers are expensive.

[Paula Pant]

Yeah.

[Joe Salsihai]

Which speaks a lot, by the way, because I remember with our twins, diapers were so expensive, so incredibly expensive. Nicholas Cage and another guy go hold up a convenience store to get steel diapers.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

I'll be taking these here Huggies and everything you got in the tip.

[Joe Salsihai]

Some of the best lines.

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

That is one of the best Coen Brothers movies there is.

[Joe Salsihai]

Yeah. Yeah. Paula, Any others?

[Paula Pant]

Anyone who thinks that they can make good money through sports betting or other forms of online gambling? Like the whole gambling gaming. And it's not just sports. It's. Now, you can bet on whatever. You can bet on politics, you can bet on the news. But all of that, the online gambling, which has really blown up in the last couple of years.

[Joe Salsihai]

I Got a guy I'm following on TikTok right now who bets $100 a day on that Kalshee site. Kelshi. Is that how you pronounce it? That's a hundred dollars a day. He just bet on New York City. We. Wow. Bet on New York City weather.

[Paula Pant]

You can, of course you can bet on the weather. Why am I surprised?

[Joe Salsihai]

But imagine if you took a hundred dollars a day.

[Paula Pant]

Yeah.

[Joe Salsihai]

And put it into a good etf, put it into the Vanguard Total Stock Market index. Or.

[Paula Pant]

Yeah, well, yeah. That's three grand a month. That's 36, 000 a year.

[Jesse Kramer]

Crazy.

[Paula Pant]

That is your entire 401k plus IRA almost.

[Joe Salsihai]

Scott with us on YouTube says he has a system, though, with his gambling. So it's good he has a system. That's what you hear all the time, isn't it? No, no, no, I have a system.

[Paula Pant]

Yeah.

[Joe Salsihai]

Thanks to all of you for hanging out with us on YouTube and as I mentioned, Monday afternoons, if you want to hang out with us, watch us make the show, let's find out what these brilliant people are doing when they're not hanging out with us. Sarah, Catherine, thank you so much for hanging out with us and for stealing today's show. You got the whole show. Two points for Sarah Catherine. Yes. What's going on with you and where can people find out more about the good work you're doing?

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Great. I am still engaged in financial planning and salsa dancing. Still waiting for you to accept my invitation to come to our salsa dancing nightclub.

[Joe Salsihai]

We gotta do it tomorrow.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Every Friday here in Little Rock, Arkansas. Anybody is welcome. That's where you'll find me on a Friday. But you can find all the work we [e-mail] and we'll link to it.

[Joe Salsihai]

On our show notes [e-mail] Jesse Kramer, what's happening at the Personal Finance for Long Term Investors podcast?

[Jesse Kramer]

Well, Sarah Catherine, always good to spend time with you and you're never invited back. Well, last week I. Speaking of interesting financial opinions, last week I released an episode called Some Dumb financial moves. I'm 100% fine with very little overlap with your list, but that's probably a good thing. Just, you know, more dumb moves. Who doesn't want to hear about more dumb moves?

[Joe Salsihai]

If you're fine with any of the ones on my list, by the way, you might have a problem.

[Jesse Kramer]

And then a couple days ago I released my latest Ask Me Anything episode, which I'm. I'm anticipating will be well received. So that's what's going on over in my neck of the woods.

[Joe Salsihai]

I called in and asked Jesse on that one because I love these ask me anythings. Is a hundred pound dog a big dog? And Jesse, your answer was, that's true.

[Jesse Kramer]

Well, it's an expensive dog because if you after the conversion, that's like $150.

[Joe Salsihai]

Yeah.

[Jesse Kramer]

And you can go get a dog for free at a pound. So 100 pound dog. I just used the word pound twice. It didn't even mean that. But anyway, that's my thought there.

[Joe Salsihai]

You're killing me.

[Paula Pant]

Paula Payett, by the way, on the topic of dogs, Doug, you know what the automatic AI transcription of these episodes often say? I'm Joe's mom's neighbor's dog.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Awesome.

[Sarah Catherine Gutierrez]

Awesome.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Dogs are better than people. So I'm good with that.

[Joe Salsihai]

Paula, what's going on at Afford Anything?

[Paula Pant]

So it is the first Friday of the month and the first Friday of every month, including this one, we have an episode in which we talk about the macroeconomic situation.

[Joe Salsihai]

But this is a special one. You've got a special topic this time that I won't reveal. But you and I talked about it earlier. You want to listen to this episode?

[Paula Pant]

Yeah, yeah, exactly. There's some. Some sensitive information that's coming out in this one. That's all I will say.

[Joe Salsihai]

Yeah.

[Paula Pant]

This is going to be kind of an awkward one, actually.

[Joe Salsihai]

100% awkward.

[Paula Pant]

Yeah, this is going to be an awkward one.

[Joe Salsihai]

If you want more awkward in your life, go to Afford Anything. Awesome. And we will link to all of these on our show notes page. Jesse, were you going to say something?

[Jesse Kramer]

No, I was. The suspense is killing me. I want to know what's going on.

[Joe Salsihai]

Oh, we'll have to tell you backstage when we're done, guys.

[Jesse Kramer]

Yeah, I'm going to go listen. I'm going to go listen or go listen.

[Joe Salsihai]

That's probably even better. Right now we're going to listen to Doug tell us what we should have learned on today's show.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Well, Joe, here's what's stacked up on our to do list for today. First, take some advice from our special guest, Sarah Catherine. The best ROI you're gonna get are the reward points from your credit cards.

[Joe Salsihai]

Nope.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Buy that combination massage chair and neti pot. They're practically paying you to do self care.

[Joe Salsihai]

Might have been misinterpreted.

[Doug (Joe's mom's neighbor)]

Like I nailed it. Second, remember Jesse's advice. Don't get tricked into getting a raise at work. They're just going to take it all back in taxes. You're better off just doing as little as possible to keep your job. Or as he always says, hey man, C's get degrees. But the big lesson? Don't try establishing an outpost in the dirty dusty frontier of Joe's mom's backyard. She'll make you tear down your trading post and bath house before you even get the red velvet curtains up. Thanks to Sarah Catherine Gutierrez for joining us today. Be sure to check out her book but first save 10 and her website ladiesplainingmoney.com best URL in the business right there. We'll also include links at our show [e-mail] thanks to Paula Pant for hanging out with us today. You'll find her fabulous podcast Afford Anything wherever you listen to the finest podcasts and he's pretty pretty fly for a white guy. Thanks to the Jesse Kramer for joining us today. Listen to his Personal Finance for Long Term Investors podcast wherever you're hearing us now. We'll also include links in our show [e-mail] this show is the property of SB Podcast, LLC, Copyright 2026 and is created by Joe Salsihai. You'll find out about our awesome team at Stacking Benjamin's D along with the show notes and how you can find us on YouTube and all the usual social media spots. Come say hello and oh yeah, before I go, not only should you not take advice from these nerds, don't take advice from people you don't know. This show is for entertainment purposes only. Before making any financial decisions, speak with a real financial advisor. I'm Joe's mom's neighbor, Doug and we'll see you next time back here at the Stacking Benjamin Show. What are you still doing here? The show is over. Go home.