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The Stacking Benjamins Show
When Borrowing Against Your House Is Smart (And When It Quietly Wrecks Your Plan) SB1861
01:01:46
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- [00:00]
Joe
In business, there's no room for guesswork. Every shipment matters. Every deadline counts. When you're trying to keep operations running smoothly, the last thing you need is uncertainty. That's why reliability is at the core of USPS Ground Advantage. Every package moves through a secure nationwide network tracked from door to door with affordable upfront pricing and delivery you can depend on. Because knowing your logistics are handled lets you focus on everything else. Visit USPS.com ground advantage to start shipping with confidence. USPS ground advantage. We mean business. It's a world of artificial intelligence, of
- [00:43]
Doug
limited character tweets, of mini clips on TikTok. My name's Mishke, and the Mishke podcast offers something wholly different.
- [00:52]
Joe
The lost art of of simple human storytelling.
- [00:56]
Doug
Whether humorous tales, absurd narratives, or real drama, telling stories is my stock in trade.
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Joe
So escape to the very human Mishki Podcast. Wherever you get your podcasts, it is Monday morning. The birds are chirping. The sun is out. Actually, thunderstorming. It is not the iconic day in Texas.
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Doug
All is right in podcast world. They don't need to know that it's
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Joe
a little scary at your house. That's right. Blue skies all the time. And it's like Lake Wobegon, where the kids are all above average and the world is better.
- [01:31]
Doug
Women are handsome.
- [01:32]
Joe
And what we do at the start of Lake Texarkana is we raise our mugs to our men and women service members, the veterans who served our country. Thank you for all you do on behalf of the men and women. Make a podcast in mom's basement. The men and women stacking Benjamins or Bordens or whatever you're stacking around the world. Thanks for all the overtime you put in.
- [01:57]
Doug
Thanks, everybody.
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OG
Okay, right here, it says right here
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Doug
in this account we have 400 $1,000 jackpot.
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OG
Nope, that says you have a 401k account. If you liquidate that right now, you'll have, you know, maybe $5,000. So what happened to the other $396,000? What is wrong with the two of you?
- [02:27]
Doug
Live from Joe's mom's basement, it's the Stacking Benjamin Show. I'm Joe's mom's neighbor, Doug, and don't you love summer? You look at your house and you think, you know, I could take out a little loan and fix this place up. Or even maybe my house is up in value. I'll just get these credit cards taken care of. That's right. Today we're talking about what to consider before you borrow. How do we think about Your options, we'll share strategies, tactics, and hopefully you'll come out with a better plan before going into debt. And Og and Anna continue their explanation exploration of the basics. Today, they're helping you dovetail all the parts of the plan so that they don't end up working against each other. And not only is your plan working for you, I'm gonna help you be the guy with the trivia your friends will brag about, because that's what friends do for each other. And now, two guys who used to be friends with bank of America, Citigroup and Chase before that messy divorce, it's Joe and O. Ch, ch, ch, ch.
- [03:46]
Joe
And happy Monday to you stackers. Welcome back to the Stacky Benjamin show, where we're going to help you control the controllables. And today, it is the equity inside of your house that we're going to
- [03:58]
OG
be talking to party like it's 1999,
- [04:01]
Joe
even if you're not a homeowner. I think this is important. Speaking of homeownership, we're going to talk about home equity loans and interest rates. And some sad news. About a week ago, guys, former longtime Fed chair alan Greenspan died 100 years old. He made it to the man who said the words irrational exuberance, which I think is the same thing Doug gets every time mom makes lasagna. Like there's this completely irrational.
- [04:28]
Doug
It is irrational because it's not, honestly, the best lasagna I've ever had. I mean, it's lasagna. So that's like saying bad pizza. There's no such thing as bad lasagna.
- [04:36]
Joe
I've had some pretty dry lasagna.
- [04:38]
OG
Yeah, it's just he has a double meat, double cheese type of family.
- [04:42]
Joe
Oh, I think you have to. Is that mandatory on a pizza or on lasagna?
- [04:46]
OG
Lasagna.
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Joe
All the above.
- [04:49]
Doug
Not double cheese meat. I mean, I want, like, regular cheese, but then double meat, double sauce, good
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OG
cheese, like ricotta cheese and.
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Doug
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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OG
Or you're going to go bag mozzarella.
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Doug
No, I want the ricotta and I want some mozzarella. And actually, I kind of like some parmesan in there, too.
- [05:06]
OG
Yeah, yeah, obviously.
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Joe
You guys know what I want? I want a discussion about home equity lines of credit because of the fact that the cost of home ownership. Doug, I think you. You were reading Morning Brew recently, and they had some stats on this.
- [05:20]
Doug
Yeah, they did. You know, and a lot of these stats, you think, well, duh. Of course, costs are rising between 2019 and 2025. Inflation that's going to happen. But you know, a number of these things have gone up a lot more than what you would expect. Inflation over that time. Emergency repair is up 175% according to a study by Wall Street Journal. Insurance. Home Insurance is up 72%. One that I found particularly interesting and probably related to discussion about HELOCs because of what people often do with heloc money. In 2019, homeowners spent an average of 9,000 a year on home improvement. But in 2025, it's now about 125 according to a survey from Angie. So you know, that's. I don't think a lot of people are putting an extra thousand dollars a month into their budget for home repairs.
- [06:09]
Joe
No. So we're going to raid the cookie jar as it were, taken out of home equity line of credit. Why are we doing that versus refinancing? We'll talk about that. What if we want money for a kids college? What if we want to pay off those credit cards? Is the home equity line of credit the way to go? We'll get into all of that after the break. But before we get to that, we got some on the home front. Doug, we got some other news.
- [06:29]
Doug
We do? Yeah. You know what? Scout. Scout has finally arrived. She's the new help desk worker who sits 247 with all the answers packed inside of our guides. We have three guides. There's workplace benefits, don't forget open enrollments coming up soon for most Americans, a tax planning guide and just in time for back to school college planning. In fact, that college planning guide is in collaboration with the college investor team. So you know it's good. Not only can Scout answer your direct questions, but each guide has a quick action checklist at the front. So, so within five minutes you know all of your blind spots and you can tweak accordingly. Then later dive into the charts, the graphs, the explanations that you need to know most. So if you need just in time knowledge on your benefits, taxes or college planning from Scout. Not sure where to start on any of these or you want to dive in deep. It's all there and Updated Monthly Stacking Benjamin.com guides Super Cool to not just
- [07:25]
Joe
get your questions answered right away but also to very quickly take that checklist and know where the blind spots are. We have a couple sponsors also help us keep on keeping on. We only have two ad breaks during the Stack of Benjamin show. We have a couple now and then during Doug's trivia and that is it. So we're going to hear from them. And then, oh gee, Doug and I, we're diving into home equity. Lines of credit in the crosshairs. You know, there's some things in life that we spend a lot of time thinking about. Our investments, our insurance coverage, quality of food we eat. Then there's things we barely think about at all. Like the air inside our homes. Which is kind of funny when you consider we're breathing it all day long. A lot of us notice the symptoms. Dust, allergies, odors, poor sleep. We never stopped to think that the air itself might be big part of the problem. That's why Cheryl and I were Interested in Air Doctor. Air Doctor uses a powerful three stage filtration system that captures extremely small particles about 100 times smaller than what many ordinary air purifiers can remove. Helps capture dust, pollen, mold spores, pet dander. Call that Cooper dander here. Wildfire smoke, bacteria, viruses, odor smoke, ozone and VOCs. What we really like is it's designed to be super easy. It's whisper quiet. It is an auto mode that adjusts 24, 7 based on air quality. It and even reminds you when it's time to change the filter. No guesswork required. Air Doctor isn't just liked by the two of us so we can continue to live with this. Cat Cooper, who consistently sheds it is loved by tons of people, was named Newsweek's reader's choice award winner for best air purifier. And 98% of customers, well, they feel like I do. They say their home's air feels cleaner, safer and healthier. So head to airdoctorpro.com use promo code stacking and you'll get 250 off select Air Doctor air purifiers including the 3500, the 4000 and the 5500 bottles. We're so confident that you'll love Air Doctor that every purchase is backed by a 30 day money back guarantee. That is an exclusive offer just for you stackers. It's exclusive to podcast only available now at airdoctorpro.com that's a I R-O C T-O-R P R O. Using promo code stacking in business, there is no room for guesswork. Every shipment matters, every deadline counts. And when you're trying to keep operations running smoothly, the last thing you need is uncertainty. That's why reliability is at the core of USPS ground advantage. For the moment your package is first scanned in, it moves through a secure nationwide network, aiding in a timely and accurate delivery. You get near real time tracking so you can keep up with your shipments and with affordable upfront pricing. There are no hidden fees or surprise surcharges to throw off your cost sheets. It all adds up to predictable deliveries you can depend on, because knowing your logistics are handled lets you focus on everything else. Your customers, your team, and the future you're building. Visit USPS.com ground advantage to start shipping with confidence. USPS ground advantage. We mean business.
- [10:54]
OG
Hello, darlings. And now it's time for your favorite part of the show, our stacking.
- [10:59]
Anna
Benjamin's headlines, gents.
- [11:01]
Joe
Last week I was reading CNBC.com and I came across this piece by Greg Iacci that kind of stopped me. Greg reported that more and more Americans are borrowing against their home equity. And not because they're struggling necessarily, but because we're sitting as a country on a mountain of equity. And you don't want to give up those low, sometimes ultra low mortgage rates that people locked in a few years ago. So if you think about that for a second, millions of people have watched their home value soar. They built six figures worth of equity, in some cases even more than they have in their retirement savings. And now they're looking at that bunny, you know, the pep. You start to salivate a little like, oh, maybe I should.
- [11:47]
Doug
Weird little noise in the back of your throat like, I want that money. Give me that bag.
- [11:53]
Joe
Yeah, seriously. Mom made some cupcakes yesterday and I had that noise. It was the same thing. Which immediately raised a bigger question for me. So is home equity one of the most powerful financial tools available today, or is it one of the easiest ways to accidentally wreck what before this point was a pretty darn good financial plan? Let's start here. Let's be honest, Doug. If somebody told you there was a way to get $150,000 by just filling out a little bit of paperwork, I feel like you'd already be on Amazon.
- [12:26]
Doug
Well, we did that. I mean, I didn't use it for those purposes. We. We used it for what it's intended for, which is, or I would say 90% of it, of what we used for HELOC was to actually do some significant home improvements that over time paid off in terms of raising the value of our home exponentially. So that worked. But, yeah, it's hard to resist. If you think, I want to go hit Amazon because Amazon days are coming up or, you know, whatever, for stuff that's really not going to give you an roi, It's a lot of.
- [12:59]
Joe
That's what I was thinking. I was thinking Doug was getting A new boat, you know, Right.
- [13:03]
Doug
I remember is going way back, but I do remember that there were supposed to be some guard rails. I was a little bit worried that like somebody was going to be checking how we were using the money and they were going to make sure that it was only for home improvement stuff. I found out later, no, ain't nobody looking. You can pretty much buy whatever the heck you want with it. And that's unfortunate that a lot of people do choose to do that.
- [13:25]
Joe
Yeah, there is some. I remember back when I was a financial planner, people had refinanced their house over and over again and paid off credit cards and then just did the same thing over again, you know, use the credit cards again. Never really, really fixed the problem. So the weird thing about this story for me is that, you know, Last week with SpaceX, we talked about billionaires, hedge funds, endowments, making tons of money on the SpaceX thing. This isn't about any of that. This is, these are regular people, people who bought a house, they made payments, they watch prices rise and suddenly they find themselves sitting on this asset that's worth just a ton of money. So let's start with the basics. There might be some stackers, og who are just very much beginning, going, what is this home equity thing you speak of? Wait a minute, I have a house. What's this idea of tapping into my equity? Let's start at the very, very fundamental home equity. And this idea that I can tap the home equity. How does that all work?
- [14:19]
OG
Yeah, I mean, home equity is the value of your house minus the current loan obligation. And just because you have some equity, some amount there, the delta doesn't mean you can access all of it because it's still subject to loan requirements. And you know, in the state of Texas, for example, you can't have more than 80% equity. You know, in terms of a cash out, refinance type of thing. They do that to help stabilize the housing prices a little bit. Doesn't do much when the market's going up a whole bunch, but it does protect a little bit on the downside and any other state requirements that y' all have. So it's, you know, you have a hundred thousand dollar house, you owe 50 on your mortgage, you know your net worth, your balance sheet will show a positive 50k of that $50,000 that's positive. You can maybe, if you qualify for a loan, have access to some amount of that.
- [15:11]
Joe
Greg writes that more people are sitting on home equity than ever before. OG and which is funny because that Brings up that we're in this weird point in time, aren't we, where people are reticent to go after a total refinance like that. I think this might be the reason why people are sitting on so much, is that they're like, well, my mortgage is at 3%. I think I'm going to just let that sit.
- [15:38]
OG
Yeah, I think you're starting to see a little bit more of the thinking of, you know, I still have to make a change. Right. I got to move for this job and, you know, I just have to kind of move into a bigger house for the family or whatever. Just is what it is. But if it's just purely a cash out type of scenario. Yeah, I think the home equity line of credit or home equity loans are a lot more favorable to do outside of the primary because if you refinance when the OR purchased your house when the rates were really low, I mean, that is really, really attractive money.
- [16:09]
Joe
You look at a 3% rate, I was on bank rate the day that we're recording this. And rates may have changed between the time we record this and the time that you hear it. But According to Bankrate, 30 year fixed average was 6.58, more than double that 3% rate that some people may have had. 15 year fixed, 6.15. And then a 30 year VA, if you can get a VA loan, 6.17 FHA, by the way, in that same 6.17 range, home equity line of credit rate average is 7.47 OG. I saw them in the fours. Some that had fairly high fees were in the fours, some institutions, but generally you're seeing about 7.5% on a HELOC. So what you're saying is going after the home equity line of credit at seven a half is a better idea than changing the whole thing over to 6.58.
- [17:00]
OG
I mean, maybe. I think you have to do the math and find out. I think there's two components of this. One is the financial aspect of mapping it out and saying which one is going to be a lower cost. And then secondly, what are you more likely to do if you're going to draw this HELOC and pay interest only on it for the next 20 years, you probably be better off wrapping it all together. Even if that pulls your primary mortgage up to a crappier interest rate, but at least making progress on it. If 20 years from now you still have a line of credit that's still at $390,000 because that's what you took out you know, do the remodel 20 years ago and you've never made any progress on it, you know, that could be not good also.
- [17:40]
Joe
Well, as you said earlier, people are where they are now financially with this money inside their house because they have made progress because they had either a 15 or 30 year loan and they paid down some of the principal.
- [17:51]
OG
Do you think that was the reason or do you think it's because housing prices have gone up a whole bunch?
- [17:55]
Joe
Oh, I think both. Right, Okay. I mean, no, don't get me wrong. It's also housing prices, I think, going up a bunch as well. But let's say that my house, the equity in my house goes from $300,000 to, to $500,000.
- [18:10]
OG
Okay.
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Joe
I want to start off psychologically. I was at a conference back in March in Florida and the money geeks there were really torn over this idea. Do we count the equity in the house? Do we go after the equity in the house for our goals? Do we not use the equity in their house psychologically? OG where should our average stacker, how should they think about equity inside their house? Should they not count it?
- [18:34]
Doug
Should they.
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Joe
And have that be, you know what, that's off the table. That's my primary living space. I don't want to get into trouble there. So, yeah, who cares if I have half a million dollars of equity there? Or is this a place where I can go and get done some of the short term stuff that I need done?
- [18:51]
OG
Honestly, I think that real life would say that it's option B. There's nothing wrong with strategically using debt to advance your goals in a faster term. Now you have to do it rationally and you have to do it in control because there's some pretty big downsides. But it's amazing to me how many people will drink the Kool Aid of saying, well, owning rental properties and other people's money and all that sort of stuff will look at that and say, that's a great use of money to, you know, go put 20% down, go buy an apartment building because Grant Cardone said that's the way to do it. And I can, you know, I have my tenants pay the rent. This is like super awesome and like leverage, you know, all that stuff. Yet they won't put the Deck edition on their house that has 20 years of personal utility because it's like, well, I don't, you know, I don't want to get into debt. It's like you're doing the same thing, you know, you're leveraging the asset that you have now, you're not using other people's money to pay the bill. But if you were committed to the goal, right? If you were committed to. I'm going to build up the reserves. You know, it's going to be a $100,000 project to do this backyard the way that I want it to be. I'm going to build it up $10,000 increments every year for the next 10 years. But guess what? In 10 years from now, it's not going to cost you 100 grand. It's going to cost you 140 grand because labor and materials have gone up
- [20:17]
Joe
or you can and you got to use it for 10 years less. You got to remember time's finite.
- [20:23]
OG
Well, yeah, so I was just going to say the other side of it, which is in combination with that, it's like. Or you just pay for it today and you pay $10,000 a year and you say, well, yeah, but I got to pay all that interest. It's like, which is the same thing you're saying. You just get the personal utility of it. For that 10 year period, you're going to still save $10,000 a year. You are still going to be $40,000 short because of materials going up. And so now you paid an interest instead of materials. That works. If you're disciplined, it doesn't work. And within reason, right? You're not going to max out your HELOC every time you can, but it doesn't work if you can't control that. If you're the person that's like gonna, you know, if you're, if you're refinancing your house or refinancing your line of credit because your credit card bills are out of control, that's a whole different thing going on than using the equity in your house for a remodel or, you know, know, an upgrade in your home or something like that. I think that it can be used for both. I don't necessarily like using the home equity value for retirement planning calculations. I think a lot of times people have this vision of like, well, when the kids are gone, I'll sell the house and then I'll, you know, we'll be able to like buy a condo and invest the money and it's like, okay, I mean, if that happens, that would be a nice little, little kicker bonus of 200 grand at the end. Like that's going to maybe pull forward a year of retirement that you could have got done or something. But I don't want to Build a plan that has to force you into a sale to make the plan work. You know what I mean? So I think it's an asset. I think it belongs in your net worth statement. I think it's fun to look at, you know, if you're one of these lucky people that has a million dollar equity in your house. Awesome. That's cool. Put that on paper. I don't think of it like a bank account, but I do think of it as a strategic tool that I could go out and say, well, you know, I can pull forward this goal that's going to provide some utility for me or my family, and I can do it at a relatively favorable interest rate to make this thing a reality. I wouldn't use it on a consumable. I wouldn't say, well, I can take this once in a lifetime vacation. Although some people would argue that that could be a good use of it. I wouldn't use my home equity loan necessarily to invest in businesses or something like that could. But that's.
- [22:29]
Joe
Yeah, let's get into some of that later because I got a whole laundry list of those that I want to ask you about.
- [22:33]
OG
All right.
- [22:33]
Joe
Yeah, no, I'm going to go into all those. So I'm glad that you brought that up. I'm watching Doug. Doug often nods off while we're. We're doing this. So, Steve, can you put on some game show music? Because right now we're going to quiz Doug and see how much of this he caught. All right, Doug, we're going to play a little game called equity or not equity. You're going to guess and. Well, let's see. You have a $500,000 house and you owe $450,000. How much equity is in that house?
- [23:02]
Doug
Well, so 50, but I can't use all 50 of it.
- [23:06]
Joe
Oh, oh, gee.
- [23:09]
OG
Well, I mean, maybe you can, but probably shouldn't.
- [23:12]
Doug
The bank's never going to let me use all 50 of it, but. Okay, next question.
- [23:16]
Joe
Have you seen Banks OG give you 100% of the value?
- [23:19]
OG
Yeah. I mean, it's doable. It's not going to be great terms, and it depends on what state you're in. You can't do it in Texas.
- [23:26]
Joe
Doug's in a state of denial. Let's say he's in that state. What does that mean? Number two, I own a $500,000 house free and clear. Doug, how much equity do you have?
- [23:37]
Doug
All of it.
- [23:38]
Joe
Well, except again, transaction fees, because you brought that up earlier. Right. Well, whatever the transaction fee would be,
- [23:43]
Doug
the academic sense of what's your equity in that asset, whether it's a house or anything else is going to be. If you own it free and clear, it's the. Whatever the full value is in the eyes of a lender or in the eyes of the market, whether or not they'll give it all to you is a whole different question.
- [23:59]
Joe
And none of that money. If you sold the property, OG, how much of that money is going to be taxable if it's your primary residence? Half a million bucks.
- [24:06]
OG
Well, I mean, that's a loaded question. It depends on if you're married, because two people can exclude half a million. If you're not, then it's 250 from capital gains. But if you're selling, that's the other piece. I guess on that, like, I'll sell the house and buy a condo thing, it's like, well, there could be some tax bills associated with that.
- [24:22]
Joe
Number three.
- [24:23]
Doug
God, I thought it was my home
- [24:25]
Joe
doubled in value, but I refinanced it twice. How much equity do you have?
- [24:30]
Doug
I don't think we have enough data to answer that question.
- [24:32]
Joe
That is so good. He is listening. He's.
- [24:35]
Doug
He's listening, or I'm just really freaking smart.
- [24:39]
Joe
This is a big one.
- [24:40]
Doug
Wasn't listening.
- [24:42]
Joe
Last Friday, we talked about the great wealth transfer. I inherited Grandma's house. How much of the equity from Grandma's house goes to you if you inherited the house?
- [24:53]
Doug
Are you asking me?
- [24:54]
Joe
Yeah.
- [24:55]
Doug
Okay. I don't think you just talked about this, so this was not a matter of me listening or not.
- [25:00]
Joe
We did not talk about this. Nice job.
- [25:05]
Doug
It's irrelevant whether or not it was Grandma's or not. If you inherited it, it's yours now, and it's just whatever is outstanding. If there is anything outstanding on that house. If Grandma was he locking the crap out of it to finance her poker game, then, you know, and it's just
- [25:23]
Joe
going to inherit Grandma's house. Yours, free and clear. OG if you inherit it.
- [25:28]
OG
Yeah.
- [25:28]
Doug
It's yours now. Yeah.
- [25:31]
Joe
Nice job. I'm so impressed. Good work.
- [25:34]
Doug
Impressed or surprised?
- [25:35]
OG
Why do I feel like some of those questions were questions that Joe didn't know the answer to and he was just asking,
- [25:42]
Doug
asking for a friend.
- [25:44]
Joe
Doug, were you listening? He's like, wait, what? All right, let's get to the headline. If so many people are sitting on all this equity, why are so many of them borrowing against it right now? We already talked about, why not just refinance? Obviously, you want to keep that mortgage locked in, you Want to do the math? The HELOC Home equity loan. Let's talk about this. OG so borrowing on the house, using a home equity line of credit, generally, I see some fees affiliated with those to leave them open. You could open it up. You don't have to take them all at once. You don't have to use it. All right. Now you can use it almost like. Would you, would you compare it OG to using like a credit card?
- [26:30]
OG
Yes.
- [26:31]
Joe
So the cool thing here is this becomes this cash cushion against your house. So let's talk about the different areas that you were getting into. OG Home improvements, using that equity for home improvements. How do you feel about that?
- [26:48]
OG
Yeah, I think it's fine. And it, you know, I mean, here's the thing with, with home improvements, you're. You're not going to get the same value out as you put in. Right. If you put $50,000 into your new kitchen, your house doesn't go up by 50k. It might go up by some amount of it, you know, 30 or 35 or something like that. There's some ROI, but it's not a dollar for dollar. And some things are worse than others. But it's really not about that. I think it's fair to look at it as, I've got this money and I can access it. How do I make my life a little bit more pleasant for me? You know, within reason.
- [27:25]
Joe
Credit card consolidation. If I'm using home equity to pay off the credit cards, am I a genius or am I just moving money from one pocket to another one?
- [27:34]
OG
Well, I think it all depends on what you do with credit cards afterwards. If you do it more than once, you're an idiot.
- [27:42]
Joe
Next up is college cost. Kids going to college take out a loan, you know, like a plus loan or unsubsidized student loan or any other type of loan versus borrowing from your house.
- [27:56]
OG
Yeah, I mean, I'm not a fan of tying somebody else's outcomes to my personal responsibility now. I mean, parent plus loans are kind of doing that too. So I would want to fill up all the kids stuff first. Then if you have to do a parent plus loan now you're just going to debate what interest rate is better. I think the more reasonable answer is send your kid to a cheaper college.
- [28:24]
Joe
You're starting a new business yourself.
- [28:30]
OG
Not my favorite use of lines of credit. Understand the interest in terms of why you would do it. I would put this also in the same category as like 401k loans. This would be, this is where people would take 401k loans as well. Again, if you do it more than once, probably a bad idea.
- [28:47]
Joe
Borrowing it to invest in somebody else's business or put it into the market.
- [28:54]
OG
Well, firstly, it's against the law to have somebody recommend that you do that. Certainly it's your money and you can do with it as you can.
- [29:01]
Joe
So you're going to say no.
- [29:04]
OG
So I'm contractually obligated to say no. Legally obligated. I don't think that the juice is worth the squeeze there. I think the net result is the same.
- [29:14]
Doug
Well, isn't it? You just a second ago OG said you don't like the idea of relying on somebody else's outcome. That's the same thing. Investing in your friend's business is the same thing.
- [29:25]
Joe
It's still.
- [29:26]
OG
I thought he said the market.
- [29:28]
Joe
Well, or the market.
- [29:29]
Doug
Or the market.
- [29:30]
OG
Oh, you put both of these together. The friend's business one is dumber than
- [29:34]
Doug
the stock market, dumber than an ETF or an index or a mutual. Well, even if it's an individual stock in much better. That's. You're still super risky. That's the same risk as some. Your buddy's restaurant.
- [29:47]
OG
Not even close to the same risk as your buddy's restaurant.
- [29:49]
Joe
No, because they've already done enough due diligence to be public and be on the market to get to that point. Generally speaking, it is a proven concept enough that they got enough scale to be able to make it public.
- [30:04]
OG
Yeah. Still risky, Doug.
- [30:06]
Ad Voice
Yes.
- [30:06]
OG
Not nearly as risky as your buddy stuff.
- [30:09]
Joe
I've seen some financial planners, og, that have what they call the ice cream cone approach to emergency funds where they'll have first tier emergency fund is in cash, second tier and something maybe a little bit less liquid, Treasuries, cd, something like that. Third tier though is they'll have a home equity line of credit that they can just raid if push comes to shove and they really need it. Do you like that application of a home equity line of credit?
- [30:38]
OG
Absolutely not. Because the bank can take away the line of credit anytime they want. And then secondly, I don't know that I've ever seen anybody get that far into their line of credit or into their cash reserve needs ever. I think having a six months or 12 months worth of emergency funds is more than adequate until you get to retirement. And somewhere in that range and everything above that is you just being too sensitive to concerns that likely don't apply to you and you're probably giving up money that you should be investing.
- [31:09]
Joe
Well, speaking of concerns, it's interesting that some people will. They'll have a home equity line of credit because they're worried about danger and about what if I don't have access to enough money? To your point, not your money. They can take it away. We saw that in 2008. But I think we don't think enough about the risk of, what if I open this and then I can't make the payment? Like, I think, what happens if I lose my job? That's one of the things. What happens if home prices follow g. And now my home is worth less than the amount that I've bought. Borrowed. Did they make you put it back right away?
- [31:42]
OG
Well, no, because the bank's not doing a daily reconciliation of draw versus equity position value, which is why, to Doug's point earlier, it is very difficult to find a place that's going to let you go to 100% anyway without some pretty crappy terms, because you're more likely to walk. And it also is why in Texas, you can only do 80%, because if you've got a little skin in the game, you're more likely to, you know, move heaven and earth to make that payment, because you don't, you know, you owe 400 on a $500,000 house. You don't walk away from that $100,000 equity if you can do anything to avoid it. It's an interesting position because people say, well, I want to get the line of credit so that in case something bad happens, I have money to draw from. Right. Like, that's the argument.
- [32:26]
Joe
I'll just get it.
- [32:26]
OG
I won't even use it. I'll just hold on to it. Well, first of all, you know, that's like having, you know, a sleeve of Oreos just open on the countertop, like, just in case I. I know I'm not supposed to eat any Oreos, but in case I do want one, they're there. You know, it's like that sleeve Oreos ain't making it past 6.
- [32:42]
Doug
Were you in my kitchen last night at 10:45?
- [32:45]
OG
Yeah, exactly.
- [32:46]
Joe
That's the first thing my diet coach said, by the way. Just throw the stuff out. I'm like, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no. You need to throw that stuff out.
- [32:52]
OG
Yeah. I mean, like, what if we have friends over? You know, I don't mean the place that doesn't have chips. You know, I have a bag of chips and salsa just in case. Lissa made peach cobbler for Father's Day. It was frigging. 90% of it was gone. Like a fraking full on pan of it. And that was, I had it for breakfast the day after. It was delightful.
- [33:09]
Joe
Cheryl made cupcakes and I, I said I wasn't going to eat any of them and I had two.
- [33:13]
OG
Yeah, yeah. So you know, having it available is stupid unless you need it. And then secondly, so let me get this straight. You're worried about not having money if you lose your job. So what you're going to do is get into debt that requires you to have a job to pay it, and if you don't pay it, you're going to fraking lose your house because the banks are going to take all your stuff. Like that sounds like an ultra stupid way to do it. Like, you know, you know, like I got that squared away. You know, they're probably not going to come get it.
- [33:41]
Joe
These are 100% the things people don't think about is what if my house is upside down, what if I lose my job? What if, like all the what ifs, I take this thing out, what if I can't make the payment? That's a rough place to be. The question everybody asks is what is the interest rate on the home equity loan and how much can I borrow? Those are the two people ask, what are the other questions from a financial planning standpoint? Oh, gee. That people should be asking before they go after home equity.
- [34:10]
OG
Like Doug at a golf course, where's the first T? And what's the course record?
- [34:13]
Doug
Yeah, yeah. It's all I need to know.
- [34:16]
OG
It's all he concerns himself with. But the rest of us are like, wait, where are the hot dogs?
- [34:21]
Doug
What's the highest score? I'll beat it.
- [34:24]
OG
Where are the hot dogs? And how much do Gatorades cost?
- [34:27]
Joe
So for mapping that over, what's the most anybody's ever borrowed and can I beat it?
- [34:33]
OG
And yeah, what are the questions you should ask about on a heloc? I want to know if the payment's interest only, which is probably the case. I want to figure out because they're not going to tell you their job is to keep you in debt forever. I want to have some sort of payment plan that I'm trying to pay this down on my terms, not the bank's terms. I want to know when the interest rate is adjustable because it's going to be and how often they make that decision. And I found out for ours, for example, you know, you just hear the news, hey, the interest rates went down, you go, sweet. So like next month then probably, right? Well, no, they do it 90 days after the adjustment in the wall and it's like, okay, I see what's up. But guess what? That only works in one direction. 90 days, it goes the other way. It's like tomorrow afternoon.
- [35:18]
Joe
No way.
- [35:20]
Ad Voice
Way.
- [35:20]
Joe
No way.
- [35:21]
OG
Way.
- [35:22]
Joe
I can't believe they play that game way.
- [35:25]
OG
Certainly fees and costs. You know, if you're getting bent over a barrel on having a fee like you apparently are at yours, Joe, you probably could ask them to waive that or what size of relationship do you need at the bank? Like, what else do I have to business do I have to do here so that this, you know, nuisance $50 a year fee goes away? There's probably some ways to avoid, avoid that. And then I want to know what the term is. A lot of times the terms on home equity lines, you know, you think they're forever. They're really not. They're a borrowing period. So they say, hey, years one through ten, you just treat this like a checkbook or like a credit card. You borrow some, you pay some, you borrow some, you pay some. Whatever you owe at about one month, 120 now becomes a fixed payment for the next 20 years. Like we just lock that in. No more draws. Now you're. Now, of course what happens in practicality is they call you and say, hey, your line of credit's up for renewal. Do you want to redo it? And then you, you know, you go to the bank and redo the paperwork and all that other sort of jazz. And then honestly, if I was doing a line of credit right now, I would want to find the simplest procedure. Like this isn't a full on mortgage. I don't need the full latex glove inspection. Like, this is just, you know, I'm borrowing. You just come by, do a drive by, do a drive by appraisal. Like, yeah, that thing's worth about a milli. You know, that's all I need you to do. Ish, cut me a check and let's get on with it. If you're going to make my life fairly miserable, then I better be getting something for the effort.
- [36:46]
Joe
On the financial planning side, before we say goodbye to this topic, because I think about like, what problem am I solving with this money and if I were going to write a check versus take out debt, would I still do it? Those are a couple that I have. I don't know if you have others.
- [37:05]
OG
Og say those again.
- [37:08]
Joe
What problem am I really solving with this money? And if I were going to write a check, would I use this money? Like if I Had the money to write a check, would I do it? Because sometimes you see people like, I don't know. When I was a financial planner, I came across this quite a bit to like, ooh, we really got to redo the pool, you know, well, there's this little tiny thing, and we just thought, we do it now versus wait five years. Well, okay, if you had to write a check for this instead of going into debt for it, would you do it? No, I don't think I would. Well, then why are you doing it with debt, you know?
- [37:41]
OG
Yeah, I mean, I go back and forth on this. You know, listen, at the end of the day, not owing anybody any money is a really cool thing. I strongly recommend it for everyone. But I also understand that real life is, like, a little bit different than the vision of what we hope to have happen. Right? I don't want to borrow money for the next car that I buy, but I don't know if you've shopped out cars before, but they're like 10 times as expensive as they used to be. Just like a routine SUV is like, frigging 60, 70, 80, $100,000. You know what I mean? And I get it. We should be able to pay cash for that. And like, in a perfect world, that's what you would do. But I also got two kids in college, you know, I mean, it's like, life is how life is. And so if I got to borrow the money at 2%, you know, now should I go get the most expensive thing and pay the biggest terms? Well, no, because if I'm shopping for utility, right? If I'm saying I need a vehicle because the one that I have have is run out, and I also want these for these particular reasons. Can I go through the process and say, well, there's a GM product and a Ford product and a Hyundai product and a Lexus product, and I'm. I'm going to be somewhat agnostic on brand and find the best terms. For me, that would be a good way to approach that if, you know you're not going to write a check. So the same thing is true when it comes to, like, housing projects or. It's like we painted our house. It was a bunch of money to paint it, but I'm glad we did it. It looks better, it provides us more sanity, and it's brighter and more open. And I think we're probably going to redo the windows because I think it'll help us with our heating and cooling bill a little bit. I think it'll Provide us a little bit more curbside appeal if and when we do decide to sell the house, like, is it going to be a dollar for dollar offset? No. But if I can look outside and the windows are brighter and it helps me with my AC bill and it's not like a million degrees in my office in the summertime to me, that's a good use of it if it's in the context of everything else going on in my plan. You know what I mean? Like, if you're sure, if you're using debt because you need to finance your lifestyle because you don't have your life under control, that's a really stupid way. But if you're like I talked about before, you're building the deck on the back porch or you're putting the pool in because the kids are 6 and 8 and you're like, hey, I can save money for the next 10 years and put the pool in, or is it going to cost me 40% more because of materials and then my kids are out of high school and not home ever again. Put the pool in now, but be disciplined in how you get through it. Don't put the pool in. And 10 years from now be like, now I don't have any money for college because I still have this $100,000 line of credit that I never paid off because, you know, I was a dummy.
- [40:17]
Joe
I like the comparison here. You know, you've got the CEO who's thinking about the company, which is, hey, the kids are going to appreciate the pool, the family's going to appreciate the pool. But the CFO goes, how do we structure these terms then, now that we've got the direction that the family wants to go to make sure that we're not mortgaging the future more than we need to. Just a, a great framework to think about this. We dive further into topics like this in the 201. That's our newsletter, always free. Comes out weekly. Stackingbenchments.com 201 gets you on the mailing list. We give you tactics, we share strategies. So if you really like to dig Even deeper, the 201 newsletter. But now we turn to Doug, who promised us in the open some of your best trivia ever.
- [41:04]
Doug
Sure did, Joe. And here it is. Hey there, stackers. I'm Joe's Bob's neighbor, Doug, and my favorite things are, in order, sending money to my friend who's a prince in Africa, B, making sure I have as many car warranties as it can get on the old El Camino and thirdly, talking to those nice people pretending to be Joe's mom on Facebook. They're so interesting but really do a horrible job. Doesn't everybody already know Joe's mom has 12 tattoos and have been kicked out of Fat Jacks twice. Put some effort in people pretending you're Joe's mom. Try again. Of course you know I do none of those things. My prince Buddy really is a duke. I only need three of those warranties on the El Camino. After that, you're just wasting your money. Am I right? And those people on Facebook, well that's just wrong. I bring all this up because on today's date in history Back in 2009 again, Guy was sentenced to 150 years in prison after he'd operated the biggest Ponzi scheme in history by far. Who was the man? I'll be back right after I go check the air in my tires. I just got a call to have it rotated again and I got to make sure there's it's actually getting a little stale in there. You never can trust those guys at the air store.
- [42:18]
Joe
Back in my early days of financial planning, buying life insurance was so difficult. And frankly, for a lot of people it still is difficult. But the funny thing is, and not funny haha, but just, I guess, ironic. We all know that we need life insurance and we don't want to overpay for it. We want to get on with our life. We want it to protect us. And then we want to do other things well. Ethos makes getting life insurance fast and easy. It's 100% online. You get a quote in seconds, you apply in minutes. And get this, you get same day coverage. No medical exam. You just answer a few simple health questions. You can get up to $3 million in coverage. Some policies are as low as $30 a month. As of March 2025, Business Insider named Ethos the number one no medical exam instant life insurance provider Ethos says 4.8 out of 5 stars on Trustpilot with over 3,000 reviews. If you're hearing my voice, you know who you are when I tell you you need life insurance. Protect your family with life insurance from Ethos now by going to ethos.comsb it is little as 10 minutes. You can get your free quote and up to $3 million in coverage@ethos.comsb you'll then get on with your life. But then your protected stackers. This is ethan os.comsb ethos.com sb application times and rates may vary as you know I love living in Texarkana, but you know what I really don't like a lot is the heat. Except when it comes to how I get dressed. I want pieces that feel lighter, more breathable. Things that are easy but still put together. And that's why I keep coming back to Quint. They focus on high quality essentials that feel and look amazing. They think breathable linen, soft organic cotton, well made basics, but without the luxury markup. It's that rare balance where everything feels elevated but still effortless. Quint's European linen pants and shirts, the perfect warm weather upgrade to add to your rotation. Starting at just $34. Their tees are soft and easy to wear and their lightweight cotton sweaters are perfect for cooler summer nights when we head north. Everything at Quint is priced 50 to 80% less than similar brands. They work directly with. Ethical factories. Cut out the middleman. So you're paying for quality, not brand markup. Quince goes way beyond clothing. Custom upholstered sofas, ceramic cookware, premium bedding. It's kind of brand new to recommending to everyone for everything. You've heard me talk about quints so much. Somebody on Spotify even said all I want to hear is you. Talk more about your pants, Joe about how much you like your quince pants. On my recent trip to New York City, just so I don't talk about the pants, you know what? It's the cashmere sweater that I absolutely loved and got to support that thing not only to a Yankee game but also a nice dinner out with our friend Crystal Hammond and the whole South SE High clan. Elevate your summer wardrobe. Go to quince.com/sb for free shipping on your order and 365 day returns. Now available in Canada too. That's Q U I n c e.com sb and you'll get free shipping and 365 day returns. Quints.com sp ever notice how life's best
- [45:48]
OG
stories don't happen in your living room? They happen on the open road, out on the water or parked under the stars. At Progressive, they get that you want to focus on the experience, not worry about the what ifs. That's why they offer quality insurance designed for your ride and whether That's a boat, RV or motorcycle adventure with confidence. Visit progressive.com and see how easy it is to protect your favorite way to get away. Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates not available in D.C. prices vary based on how you buy.
- [46:23]
Doug
Hey there stackers. I'm auto lover and guy who never falls For a scale. Damn. Joe's mom's neighbor Doug, the biggest scammer in history, was sentenced to 150 years in prison on today's date back in 2009. They're planning on that guy living a long time, aren't they? How much did he steal? Well, the amount is in the eye of the beholder because his investors thought they had, according to fictitious statements, about $65 billion. In truth, they'd handed him just less than 18 billion. I mean, pick a number. If it's a huge one, you're probably right. But who was this supposed investment guru who stole the biggest amount in history? That's right. It was Bernie Madoff. And now here come two people who want to help you understand your plan so you don't fall for the big returns guaranteed. It's OG and Anna.
- [47:15]
OG
All right, Anna, we're back for episode. I guess this is eight, right? This is the final one of season two.
- [47:21]
Anna
Yep.
- [47:21]
OG
Today I just wanted to spend some time dotting some I's and crossing some T's and then talking a little bit with you about financial planning from a process standpoint and some of the fun that we've had over the last, I don't know, 16, 18 weeks of doing this. So the first thing is for you that are following along. If you get to the end of your season two workbook, there's a little bit of a follow up and you can read through this. It's just kind of transposing your grades and how you grade yourself and finding the leverage decisions and the 90 day action plan. I think the most important piece out of all of this is to spend the time going back and reviewing what you've learned and writing down what you're going to take action on. When it comes to goals in general, there's a lot of studies that say people that write the stuff down are more likely to achieve it. The people that use those other senses, if you're writing stuff like literally writing it versus typing it, if you say it to yourself out loud, the more senses, smell, touch, taste, you know, feel the kinesthetic learning and stuff like that that goes into that, the more likely it is to achieve your goals. So I do think it's important to actually spend the time, write it down, and say, here's where I am, here's the progress that I've made. So give yourself some atta boys or atta girls for making some progress. And here's the next thing that will propel me forward over the next 90 days and I think doing those things set you up really well for success, and it kind of models a little bit how we think about financial planning in the financial planning process as well. Right.
- [48:53]
Anna
Yeah. And I think what's important with this exercise is prioritizing what's next. Because I talk about this with my clients a lot. When we first onboard someone, it can be really overwhelming.
- [49:07]
OG
It's a ton of stuff.
- [49:08]
Anna
Yeah.
- [49:08]
OG
It's like all these things.
- [49:10]
Anna
There's a lot of stuff that they need to do that just affects their individual plan. And then there's so much stuff where they need to go out and talk to other professionals and talk to an estate attorney, talk to an insurance broker, talk to life insurance versus property and casualty. Like, there are so many different avenues and next steps that happen that it does take a while. Like, I would say we don't really feel fully onboarded with a client until almost a year into that relationship. And there's a purpose to that. I don't want to overwhelm them. It's too much stuff at one time. So I think it's important to know thyself and use that last piece of the final exercise and prioritize what's important. If you want to. If your next step is estate planning, know that that's going to be a lot of heavy decisions. It's going to be time consuming. You know, maybe that's the only thing that you're going to do over the next three months. So it doesn't have to be three things total. But just know that this is a lot of work and it's not just the education part of it, but it's the actions that you also have to do involving it.
- [50:14]
OG
For me, I've always thought about financial planning as an ongoing activity. It's funny, sometimes we'll talk to people and they'll say, I want a financial plan. And I'm somewhat particular about the words that we use. And, you know, this kind of backstage with me, like, it kind of matters how we say different things. Maybe that's just my other activities that I do. It's really important, the language that we use, because we mean we're all on the same page. But a lot of people use the word plan or planning as kind of synonymous. And. And really there are two different things. Really. A plan is a thing. I got my plan. It's a book or it's a sheet of paper that has some actions on it. But planning is the activity of doing the thing that really is the most important piece is you can have A great plan, but then going back to it as we believe, as, you know, going back to it on a frequent basis and making little adjustments. So we've worked through this over the last 16 weeks, give or take. What kind of jumped out at you as we were going through this? I know some of this lines up with some of the work that we do from a planning standpoint. You know, maybe it's a little shallower than what we would cover. What's an observation that you can share with everybody about from a planning standpoint or as you work through this, what jumps out at you?
- [51:27]
Anna
Yeah, I think as we even developed the workbooks and developed what we were going to talk about, there was so much that, you know, I would go back to you, oh, gee, this is. This is like, we can't talk about this until we talk about this. They're not going to understand this until we talk about this. Because it all meshes together and at some point we have to find a starting point and work through it. But it showed during that process. It just shows how much all of this is so integrated with each other and how these decisions affect. You know, we have the. The grading area where there's. It's broken out into like, I think, eight different categories, but really, when we think about financial planning, it's six different categories. You talk about one and it flows into the next one. And so when you think about one as a silo, it's really, really hard to make the best decision for you without also fully understanding a whole nother silo of financial planning or another section of financial planning. So that's what's been really challenging for me over these last, like 16 weeks now is coming up with how do we just make this shallow and scratch the surface with everyone so that they understand it, but still be making sure that they're all making the right decision. Because from our perspective, like, we look at this as holistic. We're not just looking at it as one individual section at a time. Everything affects each different section.
- [53:01]
OG
Everything ties together. And that's, I think, really the biggest piece is a lot of times we'll talk to people initially and they've got one area particularly well covered and haven't spent any time considering the other impacts of it.
- [53:14]
Ad Voice
Right.
- [53:14]
OG
I've got a great investment account, but I don't know how to get the money out because I don't know how to deal with the tax situation or I've got a great giving plan through my estate plan. I've really got that thought out But I don't know how that ties into my lifetime giving early on in my retirement and whether or not I can pull forward some of those things in advance. Like we talked about the housing stuff here earlier in the show. Last couple of things in the guidebook, there's one little section that says, I've got one question that's still open, and I would encourage you to think through that. If there's something that we didn't answer, you know, let us know if there's something that you want to hear about. We have some ideas for what season three is going to look like, but we're not committed to it yet. We're going to take the vast majority of the summer off. We're developing that. So if there's something that you'd like us to cover, this is a great time of the year for you to send us a note. You can just send it to me ogstackingbenjamins.com you know, we can add it to the list. The other thing that I would say is, as you work through this, if you are a little shameless. Plug for. I can, for just a quick second, you know, if you've worked through this and you go, yeah, this is kind of complicated. And you know, I got a good handle on this, but I don't have a handle on how this all works together or something. This is also a great time for us, for new relationships. We generally bring on somewhere in the neighborhood of 15 or 20 new clients a year. They are clustered around different free times that we have because we do most of our client reviews in the fall, most of them again in the spring. And so we have this kind of summer winter season, if you will, of working with new families. So if you've kicked it around and you think that it might be a good opportunity to have a conversation, you can just go to stackingbenchments.com OG and that'll give you the link to the calendar and you can find a time through there. So happy to talk to anybody that wants to do that. So two pieces of homework. Make sure you get through your season eight or I'm sorry, episode eight, Season two section around reviewing and writing down some action items for you. If you've got an open question that we didn't answer or there's something you'd like us to cover, please send it to me so we can incorporate it into season three or four as we kind of build out the rest of the year and make it valuable for you guys. And if there's something that we can do personally to help you. Just head to stackingmanagements.com OG and get a link to the calendar there. Any last words for everybody, Anna, before we ship them back to Joe, I mean, or Doug or whoever's going to take it from here?
- [55:37]
Doug
No.
- [55:37]
Anna
Enjoy your summer. Don't think about this too hard if it's getting in the way of your summer plans.
- [55:44]
OG
Anna, it's been great with you. I'm thankful that you were able to participate in this with me and I think everybody else would say the same thing as well. So thank you and thanks to everybody who listened. We will be back in 8ish weeks or 9ish weeks, give or take, and be off with season three.
- [56:01]
Anna
See ya.
- [56:02]
Joe
Big thanks to OG and Anna putting a button on another successful season. Thank you so much, man.
- [56:09]
OG
Yeah, we're going to take a little bit of hiatus for the rest of the summer as we, you know, have our normal summer plans and then we'll be back with season three and wrapping up season four before the holidays. So you'll get eight great weeks and our normal week off and then whatever we can stuff in the end of the year. I think it's, you know, penciling in maybe five or six weeks. We've got a cool idea for the third season, so stick around for it. We'll see if we can pull it off.
- [56:36]
Doug
Do you have any, like cliffhangers? Does anybody get a new puppy? Like, what major plot lines should we be? New characters coming into this story?
- [56:45]
OG
There is a storyline. Yeah. There is a little more to come. I can't say anything, but there is something coming.
- [56:51]
Joe
This is also during the next eight weeks Stackers, a great time to go to the videos because not only do we have these in order on our YouTube page, but also our amazing graphics team has put in all of the stuff to make sure that these lessons are as easy as possible for you to get.
- [57:17]
OG
Yeah. And you can get the guidebooks and follow along.
- [57:19]
Joe
It's a great time to go back and if you're new to the Stacking Benjamin show, you're like, oh, I came in right now. Well, you can take all the lessons individually, but you can also go back to the beginning of season one and throughout the rest of the summer we'll be catching up while OG and Anna here on the podcast going to take a little break and we'll do a headline segment for the rest of the summer because we got plenty of headlines, plenty of stuff going on for a summertime. I've had more headlines this year Hit than I can remember anytime recently. That's going to wrap up the educational part of the show. We talked about home equity, how that works. We talked about HELOCs home equity line of credits versus refinancing, debt consolidation, the risks that are out there, and really hopefully gave you a much better framework of how to think about a home equity line of credit if you're going to take one in the future. This is where we pivot then over to the back porch where instead of what to do, we talk about the people that are doing the things. And Doug, we got some. Got some pretty cool stuff going on.
- [58:19]
Doug
Well, Joe, let's start off with what the people here in the basement are doing because they're updating our guides. They're coming soon. New college guide, new loan options to student loan borrowers. But for all three of the guides, Scout is now integrated a lot more strongly so you can quickly get, you know, specific questions answered. Kevin's putting together a 200 one to walk you through how Scout works. He put it through the paces, so if you missed that one, make sure you go get it.
- [58:48]
Joe
Also, speaking of things happening in the basement, guess what? I got my hand.
- [58:54]
Doug
Oh, no. Here comes the music.
- [58:56]
Joe
We just got a letter. We just got a letter. We just got a letter. Wonder who it's from.
- [59:03]
Doug
We just got a letter. Yeah, well, we just got a letter from Mark. He says, longtime listener, first time emailer, just wanted to say thanks for everything you do. So great to hear Chris Hill on the show. Keep up the great work. Chris Hill. I believe that was episode 1857 just recently.
- [59:22]
Joe
Yeah. A couple Fridays ago, he joined our roundtable discussion. Not only did we get to have Paula out in the lobby of her. Of her building again, but the amazing Chris Hill. If you don't know Chris Hill, he was the longtime host of Motley Fool Money. It was a really fun roundtable with.
- [59:39]
Doug
With Chris, a couple things.
- [59:41]
Joe
Yeah, we discussed. Chris, a very smart guy, of course. Paula, very smart woman. OG smart most of the time, smart adjacent. All three of them have made mistakes. And we talk about financial lessons you had to unlearn and some really great discussions around some of the things that we think are truths out there in the world and they might not be. All right, big thanks to you for lending us your ears for roughly the last hour. We really appreciate your time. If you know somebody who is wondering about that equity in their house, you might be at a barbecue and they're like, you know what I'm thinking? You're like, I'm thinking you should go listen to this Decman episode because your home equity line of credit is not a piggy bank and you want to make sure you got a great strategy.
- [60:29]
Doug
So.
- [60:30]
Joe
So please share it with those people. Coming up on Wednesday, a lot of people think I think this. There is a coffee shop that was built in the middle of a strip mall parking lot right in the middle of Texarkana called Seven Brew.
- [60:48]
Doug
Oh, turns out those are getting huge.
- [60:50]
Joe
Turns out Seven Brews are making money hand over fist.
- [60:53]
Doug
Yeah. Yeah.
- [60:54]
Joe
And so even me, I sit here and I go, maybe I should try to open up a Seven Brew. So we are talking to a gentleman who is an expert at franchises. What should you look at? What should you avoid? How do you avoid the hype? What do you make sure the terms are? He's going to walk through franchises on Wednesday. Super excited to introduce all of you to Alex Smack on Wednesday. But we can talk about Wednesday on Wednesday. Doug, we. What do we need to know from today? What are our takeaways?
- [61:26]
Doug
Well, Joe, first, take some advice from you and OG home equity. Sure, that's your money. But unless you plan on sleeping somewhere else at night, be careful with your planning before accessing that money. A little planning now can help you avoid some cold nights later. Second, your financial questions. They'll depend on how the pieces of your financial plan plan work together. So whether you're asking your advisor or scout a question, don't be surprised if the answer is another question back at you. Because everything in the plan matters. Determining how you handle debt, insurances, your budget, retirement plans, your workplace benefits, whatever. It will all depend on wide ranging data from somewhere else in your financial plan. But the big lesson, don't let Joe's mom talk you into the if you run to the store for me, I'll buy you that ice cream trick. That is the scam of the century. Not that there is an ice cream. I mean there is she just as this little issue with being lactose intolerant and what happens later definitely is not funny. Heads up, stacker. Yeah, I'm talking to you. We're building another Q and A episode with Anna and we we'd love to help you with your financial issue. Want us to help you unravel your next big money move? Need some help with your tax or benefits plan? What about that loan you're considering? Call it in. Head to stackingbenjamins.com yeldownstairs and leave a voice message on Joe's mom's answering machine. If you're one of the first to get there. We'll answer your question on the next Q and A show with Anna. Who knows, we might even and send you some swag for calling in. Stackingbenjamins.com Yeldownstairs gets your question one step closer to being answered. This show is the property of SB Podcast, LLC, Copyright 2026 and is created by Josal Sehi. You'll find out about our awesome team@stackingbenjamins.com along with the show notes and how you can find us on YouTube and also all the usual social media spots. Come say hello and oh yeah, before I go. Not only should you not take advice from these nerds, don't take advice from people you don't know. This show is for entertainment purposes only. Before making any financial decisions, speak with a real financial advisor. I'm Joe's mom's neighbor, Doug, and we'll see you next time back here at the Stacking Benjamin Show. Foreign
- [64:01]
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- [65:17]
Joe
Foreign. The after show this is the part of the show that doesn't exist. If you're new here, what happens in the after show stays in the after show. It's been a while since we've talked guys about television and there is a show, Doug, that I think initially you gave up on it during season one. But season two I thought was so much better in season one. And now season three's out. That's on Netflix. It's the Night Agent. Remember? The guy in the basement?
- [65:52]
Doug
We gave up on that. Yeah.
- [65:53]
Joe
Did you ever watch season two?
- [65:55]
Doug
Nope.
- [65:56]
Joe
Oh, season two is so good. And I watched episode one of season three. Like where they're going. I think you. I think you're missing out.
- [66:04]
OG
I'm saying I watched the first like two episodes of season one and I was like, yaw. Wow. Boring. Acting sucked. No suspense.
- [66:15]
Joe
I thought season one was good. Season two Was better. Season three, who knows? But I'm in. I'm in the first episode.
- [66:21]
Doug
Is that the one where Season one cliffhanger, like the. The last episode. Like, he's in this major battle and his mom is in the battle. No, wrong show.
- [66:33]
Joe
I don't remember. I don't remember how season one ended.
- [66:36]
OG
That's Battle scar. Galactica, Doug.
- [66:38]
Doug
Oh, okay. Was that just a therapy session I had?
- [66:43]
Joe
Cheryl's been watching all these historical series. Notice that Netflix has also just been shoveling all these historical shows. Jefferson Grant, there's a Washington Theodore Roosevelt I just saw came out, but she seems to like them. I haven't been watching them. I've watched little pieces of it. Just, you know, back and forth, a bunch of historians, kind of Ken Burnsy style stuff. Doug, you're always watching something interesting. Anything to recommend to stack our nation?
- [67:12]
Doug
Not. Not anything new. I rewatched a movie that was actually better than I recall. We've mentioned it briefly on this show before and other after shows, but I just recently rewatched Heller High Water. That writing, I mean, we talk about all the time. The. The grumpy, gritty old woman who's a waitress who asks, what don't you.
- [67:34]
Joe
What don't you want?
- [67:35]
Doug
That's OG's, you know, grandmother to a
- [67:38]
Joe
T. It's not one of the most famous scenes in it's such a great any movie.
- [67:42]
Doug
But the rest of that movie, the writing is so great and it's not overstated. It's not overwritten. There are a lot of very brief conversations that just hit really well. And I just. I was so impressed with that movie. I'd forgotten how good I watch Wind River. Feels like. Know, like as often as I watch A Few Good Men, if it shows up, I'm gonna stop changing channels and finish. Finish it. But hell or High Water, that one I hadn't seen in a long time, and I was very impressed.
- [68:11]
Joe
On that note, another series I. I know that you and I are getting excited to get back to is the next season of Dark winds comes out July 4th.
- [68:20]
Doug
Oh, I can't wait. Joe. That show is garbage.
- [68:23]
Joe
Joe's great. I love the Tony Hillerman novels and they're so good at them. Okay, OG One from you. Anything good you've seen lately on the telly?
- [68:34]
OG
The thing that I've watched the most recently was college World Series baseball, a little bit of World Cup U.S. open golf a week ago. And then I think from a show standpoint, your friends and neighbors, which actually, by the way, if you Watch the US Open the Sunday. You know, they always have like the. At the top of each hour for the first couple hours, they have like a little intro. Yeah. Because, you know, whatever. And so they had like a little segment that Jon Hamm wrote about being out in Long island and basically a nod to all the your friends and neighbors stuff going on. So that. I thought that was pretty well written. So your friends and neighbors. Although season two kind of ends a little funky. You can see where season three is going to pick up. Lys and I are watching Presumed Innocent. It's kind of an older show that was on Apple.
- [69:26]
Joe
Wait a minute. Would you recommend Friends and Neighbors? Because I haven't even started it and. And I've watched a couple of reviews and I can't figure out if I like it or not.
- [69:33]
OG
I love it.
- [69:33]
Doug
Yeah, he loves it. I liked it. I haven't started season two. I liked it, but not so much that I couldn't wait to get to season two.
- [69:40]
OG
I think the writing is really good. There's one particular scene in there that kind of landed really well for me, which kind of sealed the deal. And then. And then, you know, there's a little. Some. There's some twists and little who does it.
- [69:53]
Doug
Big shock. Joe OG likes shows about rich people.
- [69:58]
Joe
Billions.
- [69:58]
Doug
And who could have seen that coming?
- [70:00]
OG
I just think the writing is really good. That's all the. The dialogue parts.
- [70:04]
Joe
It gets accolades from the critics because of the writing.
- [70:07]
OG
Yeah.
- [70:08]
Joe
That it's.
- [70:09]
OG
Season two is a little. A little differenter, to be sure.
- [70:13]
Joe
That's on Apple tv. I will save people some time. A series that I thought was fun but was so off and on and off and on and off and on was loot. It went with my Rudolph. It was either the dumbest show on TV or the humor was really brilliant. I would not waste my time watching loot.
- [70:35]
Doug
Agree.
- [70:37]
Joe
There's the hot take.
- [70:41]
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