A (2:58)

Yeah.

B (2:59)

Cool. So how I'm thinking about it now is basically everything that used to be the middle work that we would do. Like anything that I would do to touch the keyboard, I'm now passing it on to some type of agent harness, whether it's Claude code or it's Codex or any of these tools. And so my job suddenly turns into like, I have ideas, I pass them on to Claude code and then I'm basically polishing the end product. And it enables me to do like things at scale that, that were just previously impossible. And just to give you like a taste of like what I'm talking about, we're going to do this Today, like Build 100 Facebook ads, publish them to Facebook, build a dashboard to track that, analyze the data within Claude code, have it turn off the Facebook ads that are the low performers, have it bump up the Facebook ads or that are the best performers to a new ad set with its own dedicated budget. And everything that I just described that happening in like literally, you know, 30 minutes. Anyways, again, not really sleeping. So this is kind of where it's at now. And I'm going to talk through like this whole setup process and actually how to do this. And then I'm going to talk about where it's going, like how agents are the natural evolution from this. Basically as soon as you like start, you have this epiphany level like I can get this thing to do work for me. Then you suddenly have this like, you come to Jesus moment of like, oh, I can just deploy this onto a server. And now it's doing this task for me in the background and I'm building out this personal software for myself, for my job, for my tasks, et cetera. And this isn't some like hype thing of like go do Open Claw and give it access to everything. I'm talking about like specific, like jobs to be done, workflows that are custom made for how you want to operate in your day to day. So that's kind of the high level man. Any questions I can try to answer? Have to go deeper on anything?

A (4:53)

No, I'm. If you can teach Me this by the end of that episode. I mean that's sort of the, that's, I think the question that a lot of people have in their heads right now. Like, how do I, how can I do that? Right, because that's going to be an unfair advantage. So yeah, let's, let's go, let's go through it.

B (5:10)

Perfect. Let's jump into it, man. All right, so first off, what you need to do if you're watching right now is I want you to go and I need you to create a folder that you're going to start living out of. So the one I live out of is called Graft Graph Growth Agents. So everything I do now, where I start my work, it all exists within here. And the first thing that I'm going to have you do is you're going to set up an environment file. And this environment file, it just holds all of your API keys that you're basically going to be working with. So what I'm doing is I'm basically having. And I'm just not going to show this just because it has literally all of our API keys for everything. But it has, I can open up this example one. So it has like Intercom, it has our SendGrid API, my HubSpot API, my Cal.com API, my Perplexity API, my Facebook Ads API, million verifier instantly. Everything that I live on top of that is a part of my day to day growth stack. This is like what I'm working with basically. And so what this translates into or like why you start here is you're basically starting to interact with everything that you do on a daily basis via the APIs. And this is actually how I'm thinking about everything I do now and like how I buy software in particular and is how robust the API is. It's funny, I was talking to a friend recently and he's like, if you're Looking at Salesforce versus HubSpot right now, Salesforce, even though it's like historically a more clunk, like clunky CRM, it's actually the better product for this AI foundation because it has a more robust API. So you can do more with it basically. And this is what this like turns into is your all of the work that you're doing and we're going to do this together today is going to be happening for, from this, this like repository. When, when I say repo, all I mean is just this like folder that we're living in that has all of these files and I'm Going to be using Claude code like throughout the rest of the session to basically be building out this personal software and be building out, you know, actually doing work, if that makes sense. So that's kind of one component of it. The last piece is then I would strongly suggest getting something like a Super Whisper or any of these other transcription softwares because it enables you to just so go through the process of building out like what you're trying to do on the distribution side. And then optional is just installing the Claude code front end design skill. I've just found this to be like one of those things that it, you know, if we're going to generate a ui, it's nice to have it look pretty. So, all right, that is kind of the foundational pieces. Now let's actually like, great, that's cool. You've just built this. What do you actually do to go get started on this? So the first thing that I'm going to do to get started is I'm going to go and I'm going to have Claude code start responding to people on LinkedIn for me that have asked for an asset. So I've been doing all of these like giveaways basically. Here's one that's an email triage. I wrote this giveaway doc, you know, notion document. I'm now going to go in and I'm going to get this agent to start running for me in the background while I have other work going on. So I've got the Claude code or, sorry, I've got the Claude Chrome extension installed and I'm going to go, and I'm going to say, so I'm working out of this, that directory, right, that I've already been in and I already have built this basically skill and it's a piece of software that will go and comment on everybody that asked for this asset. So I'm gonna say this right now. I'm gonna say let's run or we're gonna transcribe it. So let's run the LinkedIn respond software. The keyword that you're looking for is triage. I'm gonna provide the Notion documents and the LinkedIn post URL and then I'm going to select the post URL and I'm going to put that in and then I'm also going to select the Notion document that I want it to do as well. So I'm going to give it that it's going to start running. So what it's going to do right now is it's going to basically open this up. I'm going to babysit it for a moment while it, while it starts this process and just make sure that it starts on the right path. And then once it's on the right path, then I'm going to go and basically start on the other things. And actually while it's thinking let's just go to these other places. So the next thing I'm going to do is I'm going to go or sorry, that just opened the LinkedIn profile. Let's bring that back over here. So this is now running perfect. And so this should now start commenting on those, responding back to those people. I'm just going to change this to most recent just so that it works backwards on this and then we're going to just let that run in the background. So while that's happening, what I'm going to do now is we're going to build a Facebook ads generator. So I've been doing this where it's basically a. And I'll show you an example of what this looks like. Let's just go over to LinkedIn and I can give you an example of the output that we're going to actually create today. So it's basically a bulk generator of ad creative. We're going to create this template and then I'm going to go and do research based off of Reddit and other social media posts for the pain points that people experience. And then we're going to go and bulk generate all these variations. So, so let's get that started right now. So I've got again, those API keys are stored within here and I've also made that that skill. So I'm going to tell it right now. I want you, I want you to create a bulk Facebook ad generator. It's going to be a 1080 by 1080 pixel image. What's going to happen is I'll give you an example of what one of these ads looks like and then we're going to go and build a template around that. And then I'll basically create a, or give you variations of text, both titles and paragraphs that I want to be generated. It'll be a zip file that we download for the beginning. Can you make this into a UI as well so that we can visually see the creative? The first thing I just want to be able to see is like what the actual creative will look like. For this you're going to use just react components. So I don't want you or like just purely build it with react components and then also to actually Change those react components into a PNG that's downloadable. We're going to use HTML to canvas. It's just a resource that you have available for you on that. Ask questions if you need. So I've just transcribed that. I'm now going to put Kalad into plan mode and I'm just going to let that start running in the background. All right, so while that's running in the background, let's come back here and let's see the work that it's doing. So it's going through these and I believe it's now commenting. So that's happening. So we'll just let that run in perpetuity. Respond back to them. All right, so next I'm just gonna just click through this quickly. I'll share it now. I'll share it. I'll share it after setup and then input method, form, base, ui. Let's do both. And then I'm going to hit submit. All right, so now that's working on that in the background. I'm going to open up another folder and I'm going to start Claude code again within an entirely another window. So I'm going to do documents, forward slash grafts. Let's go to agents and then demo. All right, so the next thing that I want to build as an example is I'm going to basically pull information. So I just, I, I just did this actually so we could like talk through and about what this ends up looking like. But basically scraped all of the podcasts that were within the marketing category and then built a workflow that goes in, cold, emails them and then an agent that responds back to book me on the podcast. This ends up turning into way better performing than I expected. Is what my week looks like.

A (13:24)

Crazy. Sorry, what is instantly.

B (13:26)

Yeah, so instantly is a cold email software. Um, and so this is just a part of my stack. So it's one of the things that like is within that environment file that allows for me to build on top of. And so what I'm like how, how I can think about this like on the is it's basically like my manual workflows that I would do previously. We're just like daisy chaining those to together like using this software. So I'm going to bring this into a new desktop and let's just rebuild that whole thing. I'm going to say you have the Refonic API key. I want you to build a software that scrapes podcast host emails from Refonic. It then sends it to Million Verifier to verify the Emails and then it also will then send it to an instantly campaign. I'll provide the instantly campaign that I want it to send to. All right, so I've got that now I'm going to put that into plan mode and let that run as well. And then we have that as its own window. And so while these two are working again in the background, we can then go and actually do like, some other work. So let me get this going and I'll just say, cool, so that's in plan. All right, so now this is my. We're in this folder. This is like my demo folder, which I just like, every time I give this presentation, I just nuke. This is kind of to show you, like, how to start it from 0 to 1. This folder that we're in now is my actual folder that I live out of. And I'm just going to show you some of the things that like, are like, capable with this. So for example, I have it attached to notion and I basically given it a. An example of like, how do we write a, like a notion, like giveaway. Right. So I'm going to go and we're going to create one of these together right now because I need to actually accomplish this. So I'm going to take this URL and then copy this over and I'm going to say, okay, write a. Or create a notion document based on.

A (15:37)

Look at you typing with your hands.

B (15:39)

I know the problem. We can do it in the transcription. So create a notion document based off of our, like, current or, you know, our structure. Look for the skill that has this. I'm going to provide context on what that should include. You should incorporate stuff that we have we haven't within the repo, like the documentation that I have in the repo on how to do this. All right, and so I'm going to copy this over, let that run. And now it's going to go and create me a notion document just like the one that we have being sent in the background here currently. All right, so in that folder, I've already created the bulk ad generator. So I'm just going to go in there just to show you, like, what you can do with this once that it's. It's like you've actually gone through this process of like zero to one making this. So this is the bulk, the creator as an example. So that's going to continue working on that bulk Facebook ad generator in the background. While that's happening, let's go to graphs, growth agents, and then I'm going to start cloud code within there. And now I'm going to start locally the bulk Facebook ad generator. I just want to bring that up within my local so that I can create some ads. So again, it's already created the software for me. I'm now coming back to it and I'm going to talk through the whole process of the actual creation of this because it'll just like make more sense moments. But the goal here is basically what we're trying to do is I'm trying to create as many different variations of these ads as possible. So how did I make this ad? This is entirely code and I think this is something to like double click on. Everything in here is just, it's just react components like that. This is, this is just a react component and entirely built by code. And so I can make an infinite amount of these at scale and I've done this already. So you can see this bulk forward slash or forward slash, Bulk forward slash HTML. So we're going to go through this together though. How do we actually do this process? So I would go and I would give it an example and we'll do this over here. While this one is like working on it, we'll come back to that. But I would give it an example of what like ad I'm trying to build. A way to do this is if you don't know where to start, go to Facebook Ads library and you can see what your competitors or other software companies are doing in your category. This is actually how I made this initial one was I found like this before and after format and then I basically had it build off of that before and after. But this whole thing like everything you see here is just code. It's entirely code. The other way you can do this is with something like nanobanana where you're like going and bulk generating these. Right. But once I found and I built that template, I can now make all those variations. So let's go back to Claude code and let's say, okay, I want you to use the Facebook Ads API and I want you to go and scrape the pain points that you see or sorry, actually let's restart that. I want you to use the Perplexity API and go and scrape Reddit for the pain points and the outcomes that growth marketers wish they could have from like something like a looker studio or any of these other business intelligence softwares that they're using. We be focusing on like the data analyst component of it, of how they can't get bandwidth or it's Too complicated to get started or they can't unify their data all into one location. You can also source from YouTube, you can also source from Twitter if necessary. So I'm going to have it go do research those pain points for the ad.

A (19:34)

Sorry, for the ad itself. Wouldn't we want to use Nana Banana Pro, like the best image model that exists? Like why are we using code when you know, when we could.

B (19:44)

Yeah, I'm just doing this purely like this was just a way I thought about doing it like. Absolutely. The Nana Banana thing, the. The only thing I've found with like Nano Banana is that I sometimes have trouble like getting it to stay on brand. And if I'm trying to just like figure out the messaging variations that I'm trying to go after, this can be a faster way to do that. Again, there's like a million different ways to do this exact same thing. I think if you're going to use Mana Nano and Banana, you should look at something like. I think it's like Kai AI, I believe Banana or yeah, Kai AI. And you can just. Basically it's one of these bulk buys, but we've been using that for these bulk generations. This that I'm doing costs me nothing. Like it's literally maybe a thousand tokens to do all of these generations. And so that's a reason for it. So it's like we could go and create a thousand ad variations right now. G. And this literally costs nothing. But again, well that's, that's a part

A (20:57)

of it too, right? Is like your goal is going to be come up with the best ad creative that's going to actually, you know, you put in a dollar, you get $3 out. Once you get that, you can make it. Well, there's, there's two schools of thought. One school of thought is you need the best creative so you need to send it to Nana Banana Pro to get get scroll Stopping creative. Another school of thought is like, well, you actually have some pretty quote unquote ugly ads that just speak to the ic the pain points that you can kind of get a good understanding of. This is going to bring you a dollar fifty when you put in a dollar and then you can get it from a dollar fifty to dollar three once you figure out the ad. So you're kind of saying maybe it's best to like get as many ads as possible, start using those, figure out the one or two or three creative that actually crushes and then go ahead and go crazy with spending tokens.

B (21:55)

Totally like this. I guess a Different like I'm just trying to find like the, the format or the angle that's going to be most receptive. I'm going to remix that a thousand times, you know, after it. The, this is like the big piece of this, especially with like how much we can do on the like anybody can go and generate as many of these as they want, right? Like it's literally infinite. But identifying those winners like you're talking about now becomes the challenge that you're going to face with all of this. And like we're going to get to that in a second. But the main thing I want to emphasize with it is like this is malleable and flexible and the spit the pace. Like just think about you manually having to go create 50 AD variations in figma and like you can just now make those and get those live and test those. And as soon as I find a winning like format from a language that's being said perspective, I can then go and remix that into all these other different templates. I can go and find like what are different winning ad formats that I can now port this too. But this is a way to just like start immediately and then get that basically out in public. I also think that like the same ideas can go into different formats. Like we're all, you know, already seeing this where it's like cool, I made you know, a static format. I'm now going to port that over to a UGC format and I'm sending that to the heygen API to pull in that, you know, like to make that creative, like pull in, pull it in as a video and then bulk upload that to Facebook, if that makes sense. So I, I like where I'm going with this or where I'm seeing this head personally is like I'm going to build these tools that an agent is going to have and then it's going to be able to run this process in the background where it's basically has the ability to make new creative. It can publish that creative to directly to Facebook, which I'm going to show you in a second. It's going to then analyze what is working and then it's going to like basically turn off what isn't and promote what is right. And this is everything I'm going to show you today is at like a small scale. Like this is literally like weeks of realization that's starting to happen like with this. But I just again I want to plant the seed of like what is possible using this tooling to like do your again that middle Work that historically like you wouldn't be able to do. So. Yeah. Is there questions about that I can try to answer?

A (24:23)

No, let's. So let's keep cooking.

B (24:27)

Awesome. All right, so this keeps like trying to scrape things. I'm just going to be like, instead, I want you to just brainstorm pain points that people have with data reporting, specifically the unification of the data into multiple locations. Cool. So we're going to do that. Once I have all those variations, I can then say, okay, now go bulk generate every one of those and then at that point I can download these as a CSV. And what I will do is just wait for that. While that's happening, we'll just get this to start downloading. And that Facebook ads API is going to allow for us to bulk upload all of those pieces of creative that we just downloaded. So here's all those variations I'm going to say now, okay, now use the bulk, or let's do the transcription. Okay, now use the bulk Facebook ads generator to go and create these variations. Put them in the forward slash bulk HTML page when you're done with this. So this is now happening. I'm going to go back over to see what the other things are going off of. All right, so let's see this notion document based off the current. We'll continue to let that happen. I want to build this. Perfect. We're going to let that go as well. So I'm looking at the scaffolding to build the bulk ad generator and we'll check in on this one to see where it's like basically adding its process of responding. And it might have completed and it did complete. So that's done. It ran for 15 minutes on its own in the background. These are coming back. So while these are all happening and I'm waiting on them or they're waiting on me, I can then open up another one of these. I'll just click through this to just kind of get it moving. But I would then open up another one of these tabs and I would start on the next project. So the next thing that I want to do is I want to build a LinkedIn engagement scraper. So I'm going. So basically, people that engage on the LinkedIn profile or the LinkedIn post, I want to pull them out and then send them to a. Basically add them into instantly. So we're going to go, we're going to find their LinkedIn profile using Phantom Buster. We're then going to, you know, do that whole flow. So I'll do That in a second. Let me just get this up. Give that its own section.

A (26:51)

By the end of this podcast, you have like a hundred.

B (26:54)

This is literally how I'm working now. This is like I'm just jockeying agents across and then if I can automate them and get them to do like, like, if I can figure out, okay, this is the specific lane that you can focus on, then I'm spinning that up onto a server on Railway and I'll talk about that in a second on, like, how you can on demand create databases and on demand create these servers so that this software starts running in perpetuity. So we're going to do this demo one. All right, So I want to make a workflow where it's a I basically within Slack, you'll do forward slash LinkedIn post and anybody in Slack will be able to just drop in a LinkedIn post that they think is a good fit. And then that's going to go and it's going to use the Phantom Buster API to extract all of the engagers. And then it's going to take those LinkedIn profiles, we're going to go and enrich those with the Apollo API. And then from there we're going to send it to the Million Verifier API and then finally we're going to add them to an instantly campaign. Ask me questions if you need. All right, so I'm going to turn on plan mode for that. Let that start running in the background as well. We'll come back to these, let them continue to cook, publish the landing page. Let me get context on what this one is again.

A (28:16)

This is the craziest part. When you're going from screen, like screen to screen and realizing that you're an agent jockey and that you're trying to get context on each one, you're like, okay, what was this one doing again? And I find that the context switching is actually difficult.

B (28:33)

I, I, I did as well. But now it's like, now it feels like I, I, like that has expanded. Like, and again, this is just how I've been working for the last, like six weeks and was like, maybe I could have like two or three of them in the beginning. And now it's like, I'm comfortable with like, we could have 15 windows open. I'm about to literally go buy a new computer because I'm like, I need more ram. I need more like, ability to do this in the background, which just sounds so totally.

A (29:02)

Yeah, like, like and comment this video so that, you know, I could send some YouTube AdSense revenue to Cody. We can get some more RAM.

B (29:12)

It's all ridiculous.

A (29:13)

This guy needs some RAM.

B (29:14)

No, man, we. It's like I'm just realizing, like, what this turns into. So, okay, we bet we made all those pieces of ad creative, right? Got those variations, and it's just text variations. All right, so now I'm going to go back to Claude and I'm going to be like, I want, now I want to buckle a bulk upload all of these ads as drafts into a Facebook ad set. Here is the. Or here's where the folder is locally for the creative. And I'm going to provide the Facebook ads ad set URL to you in a second. All right, so I'm now going to go back to finder and I'm going to copy this, paste that in, and then let's go back to Facebook and I have this ad set that I've already created for this demo that's basically just here. And I'm just going to paste in this URL. And so now here's that URL. It's going to basically bulk upload all of those pieces of creative into that ad set. So while that's happening, I'm now going to go and I'm going to create a dashboard about this. So let's just pull out the ad set id id. Let's do the ad set id and I'm going to go over to Graft and I'm going to be pull up Facebook ads as the data source. And then I'm going to be say, this is the ad set id. Make a dashboard showing clicks over time. Also have a scorecard that or, Sorry, I didn't do the transcription. Make a dashboard showing clicks over time as a line chart. Also within that line chart, can you include the cost and the CPC as lines as well? And then add a scorecard also that has total spend, total traffic or total clicks as another scorecard. So those are two separate ones. And then I want you to also show demographic data as a bar chart of showing the ages. So that's its own separate chart. That's a bar chart basically showing the impressions by the age categories. So I'm gonna let that run in the background. We'll come back to that in a second. But now that I have this campaign that's running and I'm trying to track what's happening within it, I can basically go and like build out a tracking dashboard for this. The other thing that I can do. So once it's got the ad set, what destination URL, would you like just put them as a draft? So while that's working, I can also analyze what is happening in that specific ad campaign and I can turn off the losers of that ad campaign. So I'm going to show you how to do that. So I do documents, forward slash graft, forward slash growth agents and then Claude. And then I'm going to get that URL again and I'm going to say use the graft MCP to pull in the data for this ad set that I'm about to provide from Facebook ads. I want to look at the CPM data to see which ones are the lowest performing, like the highest a CPM price. All right, and then let's provide the ad set URL again. Let's go ad set. And then while that's happening, we can come in and check on the other ones. All right, so it's now built that entire bulk Facebook ad generator or sorry, which one is this? This is the look one. Okay. So it's made the updates to these ads. These are an entirely new ad set that it's basically pulling in. I already did this. Of downloading these as a zip and bulk uploading them. So we won't go through that process again. But this is how easy it is to basically make those variations.

A (33:39)

And not just variations, these are variations based on pain points that people have said publicly.

B (33:45)

Yes, exactly. So it has pulled in basically the social dialogue that's happened. So the best ads that I'm seeing perform right now are basically you're selling outcomes or you're talking to the pain points. Right. So I'm just guiding it to focus on those things, pull me that information and then build the ad sets around those. So while that just happens this in the background just used the graft MCP to pull in all of the low performers. So these are the. Let's look at the ones that have the highest cpm. So these all have high cpm. So I'm just going to tell it, turn these off. I'm going to say use the Facebook Ads API to turn off these ads with this ad name. And so now it's just pulled in this live data from my data warehouse. And this isn't an MCP that's interacting with the Facebook Ads API. I just want to emphasize this so it's not have you're not running into rate limits. Like again, go and publish like a thousand ads and are running those variations. There is literally no way, like if you're spending enough, like there is literally no way that you're going to be able to analyze this data without a data pipeline and a data warehouse. And so this is like what we've built right at graft. So anyways, the, just to get back to the MCP thing, there's like this Page nation problem. So like, we see this all the time where people are like, yeah, I plugged in a Facebook ads m cpm interacting with it. And then I realized that I'm only seeing like 5% of the data that I think I'm actually seeing. Right. But so coming back to this, I've now said, hey, turn these off. So it went and it paused those ads for me. And so it's just. Just to walk through what we just did, just kind of reiterate this. We just did ideation, we just did bulk ad creation. We just analyze the data for the performers. We just turn those off and on based on that. And at this point you're probably starting to have the epiphany like, oh, I can just turn this into a repeatable process. And this is where I see all of this going basically is you're going to. Going to have these agents that are running on top of your live data. They're analyzing it, making decisions based off of like the model. So like, for example, how I would run this is I would have a test campaign where I'm basically testing new creative constantly. I would have a cron job that's on a daily basis basically going and turning off the low performers. And then the high performers, they get bumped up into their own ad sets with their own dedicated ad budget for a CPA action. And then that whole thing could just run automatically in the background. And then to track that, I'd build out a dashboard that basically is showing me, you know, that information so I can come back to that like later on and see what's occurring there. And then the other thing that I would then go do is like potentially have a conversation in the morning. Say, for example, so I've got the graft MCP in my cloud, like chat. So this is also technically on my phone. So like in the morning I'll wake up and be like, how much traffic? Let's just do this. How much traffic went to the. Or how many new users went to the homepage of the website yesterday. And I'll just say use the graphed MCP and Google Analytics 4 and we'll let that run. And so I can basically get a brief each morning, whatever those KPI metrics are that I care about, and have a conversation like with my data that's live and being synced continuously within the background. And you can give this to your whole team as well so that everybody on your team also has access to this both from within cloud code, within their like whatever their harnesses that they use, whether that's chat, CBT or cloud. And then also the ability to like do that tracking within like dashboardings or conversations. Now coming back to all of this, right? We've just built out basically this whole like cycle of Funnel. How would I now go deploy this? So this is where it gets like the most interesting. So what I'm doing right now say I wanted to turn this into an agent. I'm using Railway for this and the only reason is just because I saw a tutorial and that's how I figured out how to do this. So Railway has a really robust API key. And say I wanted to spin up for example this bulk ad generator so that my other team members could use this, right? They could come back and basically like use this software that I've created. Created. I can just tell Railway via Claude code, hey, spin this up into a like a server that I can access or I can just deploy this directly to Vercel or any of these workflows that I have. So say for example, we were talking about that LinkedIn funnel. Let's go see which one of this it is. All right, so this is the podcast software, this is the image generator, this is the LinkedIn. So say I want this to be accessible in perpetuity in the background. I can then take the software that I co work on with Claude and I say, okay, deploy this to a server on Railway so that my whole team can basically use this action or always be adding like whenever they come across a LinkedIn post as an example, they could be adding that into the queue so that it just automatically goes into the email like filtering or sorry, the email, like cold email process and this even goes further. So like how I'm starting to use this G and I'm curious like to get your thoughts on this. So basically like I had to do some data analysis work the other day. Historically I would have like downloaded the information, put it into Explanation Excel and then I do a bunch of pivot tables. Now instead what I did was I went directly to the URL. I had it push it into a postgres database that I on the fly created using the Railway API. It just pumped everything in there. I then did the analysis together with Claude and then at that point I basically pushed from that postgres database the outputs to the location that I wanted. What have used it would have. It would have taken me probably five hours historically to like clean the data appropriately. And I smashed that out in like probably 20 to 30 minutes. And then as soon as I got done with that database I just spun it down and this was the most like interesting part of this was that like it was basically like on the fly UI on the fly or the epiphany I had was like on the fly uis on the fly databases, like on the fly software. Software is going to become the standard for these people that are like, you know, working at the forefront of this. So yeah, man, we could probably, you know, sit here and watch me work for hours if you wanted. But that's kind of everything I had that I wanted to show you today. The only other thing I'm just like keep getting asked like, how do I do this? How like show me more technical details. I bought the domain gtmengineeringcourse.com I'm going to give this thing away for free. Free to everybody who wants it. It'll be entirely public. We've already got a wait list of a hundred. But basically I'm just in the process of building this out with like step by step and it's everything that I do I'm just going to document into one place. But anyways just throwing that out there thing. But any I'd be curious on like okay, you see, you just watch this and you're in like a role at some company. Like how do you defend against this? Like with your job or do you. Is it just like you need to learn this now and like I want to hear your thoughts because you're seeing way more than I am with everything.

A (41:46)

I'll tell you my. I'll answer your question but I want to start by saying like my biggest takeaway from all of this.

B (41:51)

Yeah.

A (41:52)

So my biggest takeaway of all this is when you connected it with Railway and I. It's a glimpse into the future of autonomous marketing. So marketing, you know, all you basically what you've done, like all those sort of jobs to be done were jobs to be done that were literally done by human beings. Right. And then you kind of stitch it together. You know, if you've ever run ad campaigns before, you know how painful some of these things are.

B (42:26)

Like just uploading the ads alone, I was like, I have literally spent like I. I mean I'm just imagining uploading a thousand ad variations.

A (42:37)

Like, dude,

B (42:39)

like it just don't give

A (42:40)

me ptsd on the pod straight, like

B (42:44)

I did this early in my career was absolutely painful.

A (42:47)

It was painful, right? It was painful. And. And it's not fun. It's not fun at all. Removing and figuring out low performers at a creative. Not fun. Not fun. And you need to be on it. So the idea that you can, you know, make this an agent that's working 247 and that's managing all these different things is the dream. It is absolutely the dream. Autonomous marketing, the dream, I think. Who are the winners and who are the losers of this? The winners are going to be, you know, one person businesses, small teams. And then maybe you're, you're head of marketing that currently you're getting paid a hundred thousand dollars a year. Now all of a sudden, if you can figure out how to do all these things, and this is where I'm answering your question, if you can figure out how to do all these things, you know, you could make the case like, hey, triple, you know, triple my salary easily, right? Like from a value perspective, like, if you can do all these jobs to be done, you're one person instead of 10. There is a case to be made that you've made. You know, you've added a tremendous amount of value to your role. So I think. And then the unfortunate thing is, I think a lot of, a lot of these jobs to be done, and this is where I disagree with a lot of people is I think that there is going to be a lot of job loss, real job loss. Like it just who, anyone.

B (44:18)

I think it's going to be extremely rapid job loss. And then like, I'm just thinking about like the early days of like what we saw, you know, in the Industrial Revolution and like the United Kingdom, like they, I mean, you basically have this displacement and then new roles get created. But like in that interim, still a lot of turmoil.

A (44:38)

It's gonna be chaos.

B (44:39)

It's gonna be chaos. And I, yeah, like, I have a friend who runs a startup and he texted me yesterday and he's like, I think I'm gonna 50 people and that's like 70 of his team, right? And I'm just over here and I'm like, how? Why? What? You know, tell me the reason. He's like, I think I can automate all of their jobs right now with like agent swarms. And I'm like, okay, what's an agent swarm? You know, because that's just this like throw like term that gets thrown around right now and is like, oh, it's just an agent that does like, A specific thing. And then there's an agent that manages, like, that whole system. And then, like, imagine, like, five pillars under, like, another agent. And I'm like, oh, I've built that. That's what an agent swarm is. And I think that this is the thing that, like, people are real, because now it just runs in the background. Like, I have one that's just, like, crawling LinkedIn, like, as we speak. And it's, like, looking for, like, icp and then it enriches them. It writes a personalized email and cold emails.

A (45:35)

Yeah.

B (45:36)

And, like, I don't think people understand, like, what's about to happen in, like, the next 12 months. So. And I'm excited about it because I think there's, like, again, if you can build, like, it is incredible. Like, you're so capable right now, especially if you have domain knowledge is the other thing that I'm finding is, like, just because you can, like, it can be built doesn't mean that you can build it because you don't have the vocabulary. Like, when I look at, like, my co founder, Max, right, And his technical vocabulary, how he can describe the problem to a coding agent, is so much more sophisticated than I'll ever be able to do it. And so the output quality that he can get from this is at, like, a level that's in the top 10, top 1%. So if we translate that to something else, like, say you studied graphic design for 20 years and, like, you've been working in the industry for 20 years, the vocabulary you have to describe something is going to be so much more sophisticated than what I have. So I'm like, this happened the other day where I'm like, I wanted to put texture on the back of an ad, and I was like, how the fuck do I do that? In the background, I kept Tripp trying to describe it. It came out terrible. And then I found this, like, person giving a description of, like, how do you make it have a TV type, texture, right? And it was like all of these, you know, specific. Like, it was like a specific lexicon to describe the quality. Literally one shots. It, you know, immediately, like, what I was looking for after that. And I had you have that realization that this actually becomes, like, the superpower. If you can incorporate these tools into what you're doing for work and have that domain expertise, that knowledge, that's, like, on top of that. That actually is what makes you, like, incredible. And so it's the same thing that we've always seen where it's like, oh, you have one or Two skills with like a deep T and then you like that, what makes you valuable. This is like that, but like, you know, times a thousand where it's like if you have the vocabulary, you know, and six things and you come to this tooling and can basically express and explain like what you're needing or what you're looking for, it changes the entire system in my mind. But again, I'd love to hear your thoughts on like where you like and also just like what you're seeing within your own companies that you own and all like, you know, within the market as well.

A (47:43)

Well, I think the reality is there's a lot of people, even if they have a ton of domain expertise, they don't know the tools and how to use the tools optimally yet. Now I think that the tools are going to get so good that the UX is going to be so easy at some point. But for right now, like for example, if we, if we counted off all the tools that you mentioned in this, in this podcast, you probably mention 17, no more 20 tools. I'll include some of those in the show notes.

B (48:16)

Yeah, I'll give you a list of them so that you can pass them on.

A (48:20)

Phantom Blaster instantly. Like, I'm not even talking about like Claude code and stuff like that. You, you, like, you've done your research, you found the tools and, you know, I think that's why a lot of people listen to this podcast. They try to, you know, it's a way to, for them to learn a lot of that stuff. But the point is I have a lot of respect for the people that understand they have domain knowledge, know that that domain knowledge is super valuable and who are going out there and trying things. But yeah, the other sort of takeaway I have from this podcast is your insight around APIs, which I thought was really interesting. So in the old way of SaaS tools and stuff like that, you didn't, I mean, it was nice. An API was a nice to have. It was about how good is the software that you're using, how good is the ux, how good is the brand, how good is, you know, when you press this feature, how quick is it, how instant is it? But now when you're living in a terminal, for example, and you're using MCPS to talk to LLMs, you kind of, you know, the nice to have is actually the UI. The nice to have is the SaaS. The nice to have is going to this website and look pretty. Ultimately what you care about is the output. And the thing is Running. The agents are running 24 7. They aren't hogging tokens. The output is high quality. It's doing the thing that it says it should do. And I think Sam Altman said recently something about APIs. I think he said every company is going to be an API company.

B (50:02)

Totally. I align with this now doing this. I. There's a software like I just won't put them on blast cause I know how big your audience is. But like, like there's a thing you can do in their UI I can't do in their API. And I'm literally about to churn because I'm just like, this is critical for me. And now it feels archaic for me to go and interact with your fucking like UI to do this outcome like output that I'm, that I'm like, I need. And I think that this is going to be like, I think there's going to be companies that are entirely just like, like what it. I mean we literally had this conversation internally, like, do we build an ap, Like a.

A (50:37)

Why?

B (50:38)

Because that even a thing that we do or do, we just build the tooling that enables you to see like where we see the puck going. And I think that like, you know, we had to come, you know, have a come to Jesus moment of like, oh, this is like where we know the puck is going is entirely different than like where the normie like is right now. And like the adoption cycle of this and so like having to like meet there to ride this. But like, I mean it's very clear, right? Like for example, like with the graph mcp, that's a live data feed. So I may, I'm like, when I'm like, show me my Google Ads and Facebook ads, paid ad spend, right? That's a live data feed that's happening underneath the hood. It's like a, it's like an endpoint that I'm hitting. It's literally on the fly generating a live data endpoint that I can pull from my data warehouse from. So with that I can basically build whatever I want on top of that. And I'm like, okay, well let's just go build a custom dashboard like for what we need. But what we're finding is that like there's like kind of different use cases. Like the. I guess what I'm trying to say is like you're basically making your agent so that or whatever it is you're tooling is so that it fits into any harness. So whether you're working from Cloud, iOS or Chat, GPT, Desktop or Claude code, you know, in your terminal or, like, cursor or, you know, even the ui, it's unified across that. And people can basically take that wherever they want and get the same outputs. And so from a product standpoint, this is how we're, like, you know, focused on it and kind of moving forward. And I think it. Again, what it comes down to, though, is like, everything that, like, we're talking about this tooling piece, like, unless you know what to do, it's very hard to get it to, like, if I. If I didn't know these exact tool sets to use to, like, go and do these actions, like, here's how to do this LinkedIn thing as an example, there would be, like, a very low chance that it would be able to figure this out. It's totally possible. It can. It's just, like, gonna take longer. And you can do this now with, like, Claude and with perplexity, where you're like, I'm trying to do x list 5 APIs that can help me do that. But I think this is how people are gonna start building this. And, like, I'm finding myself doing this where I'm like, I have this, like, vision of a workflow and I'm starting with the final product and then I'm, like, working back and, like, you know, basically piecing together how does this work and then having the agent go and build that for me. And so then this comes back to, like, how do agents discover the necessary infrastructure for. And, like, how do you be the thing that it picks when it's going to build? You know, X, Y, Z thing. And, like, again, these are the things I'm losing sleep over now as we're, like, getting deeper and deeper into this.

A (53:13)

Well, Cody, I appreciate you being so saucy with sharing all this stuff with us. We do appreciate it. I need, you know, it's been too long. It's been too long. You need to come back on again and. And share some ideas and stuff like that. So I would love to have you and have a ton of them.

B (53:32)

Man, you can go for days about Chrome Extensions right now. You can literally have Claude code one shot them and just turn on Facebook ads in the background automatically. I also had an agent that was running an Etsy shop for a little bit. That was crazy. It just got banned two days days ago, which was hilarious.

A (53:47)

So, people, please, let's beg Cody to come back on the POD and have him on soon. This is an open invite, Cody. You can come on whenever you'd like, share ideas, you definitely get my creative juices following. So I appreciate you so much.

B (54:01)

Appreciate it, G. Thanks for your time as always, man. I always love coming on.

A (54:05)

Thank you.