The Startup Ideas Podcast

Episode: Meet the AI Meme Millionaire

Host: Greg Isenberg (featuring guest Ben, founder of Wombo)
Date: September 3, 2025

Overview

In this engaging episode, Greg Isenberg (sometimes joined by Sam Parr for context) interviews Ben, the creator of one of the most viral AI-powered mobile apps, Wombo. The discussion dives deep into how Ben leveraged open source AI models and meme culture to achieve over 250 million installs—and later, how he pivoted to launching new AI ventures backed by prominent investors like Nvidia. The episode is packed with insights on how to identify viral startup ideas, details behind app growth strategies, and real talk about the monetization rollercoaster that follows explosive app success. Aspiring founders will learn actionable steps to create stupid-simple but wildly viral apps—and hear a candid founder journey full of hard-earned lessons, meme magic, and bold predictions for the future of AI-powered mobile startups.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Power of Copying (“Mimesis”) and Remixing

• [00:45] Ben introduces his core strategy: “If something is working, then probably you can copy it and put your own spin on it and it'll continue to work.”
• This principle, inspired by his time as a competitive gamer, underpins his entire entrepreneurial philosophy.

2. spotting Viral Trends and Lowering Friction

• [02:00] Ben discusses identifying early signals from apps like Reface and viral AI memes—memes use open source AI models but require technical skill.
• Seeing technical tools trend on platforms like Discord or with creators can indicate mainstream opportunity if you remove complexity.

3. Building Wombo: From Idea to 100M+ Downloads

• [04:05] Ben: "Why doesn’t someone just make an app, like, where anyone can do this, where it’s simple?”
• He and his team noticed that AI-powered meme tools were inaccessible to average users; by simplifying into a 4-screen mobile app, they engineered something anyone could use, fueling explosive growth.
• Song selection was key: “We selected 15 songs... some of the most recognizable and iconic... or meme songs... you don’t need to know English to vibe with it.” ([08:46])

4. Simplicity & Virality in Design

• “Stupid simple, stupid. You can give this to a 5-year-old and they'll know what to do.” ([09:40] Sam/Ben)
• Simplicity in UI and clear viral content loops (create → share → attract new users) are essential.
• “I find the best way to... get someone’s attention for the first time is to do something stupid and... funny. Not try to explain Socrates... but just tell a small joke. Give them a small piece of candy as opposed to a steak.” ([11:06] Ben)

5. Content-first Product Development (& Monetization)

• Focus on creating shareable outputs that thrive on algorithmic feeds (TikTok, Instagram Reels, Shorts, etc.).
• If a product enables users to easily create content that the algorithms reward, it’s primed for virality.
• “If something is going viral inside of like some technical circle, but it's still difficult for a layperson to use, then if you can help the layperson... that’s a really good sign that something might go viral.” ([14:41] Ben)

6. From Virality to Monetization, Mistakes to Profitability

• Ben candidly shares the challenge of ballooning infrastructure costs following viral growth:
  “Dream went viral again. We had a million-dollar server bill on Amazon for that month for all the inference... Money is fake, let’s just make an amazing product... Did not work at that point.” ([20:29] Ben)
• Entered 'cockroach mode' for profitability: focused on subscriptions (“you could generate four images at a time... premium styles...”), ads, and studied monetization leaders like Nikita Bier. ([22:13], [21:43])
• “At our peak Dream was doing over $500,000 a month.” ([22:41] Ben)
• “To get millions of downloads, 98%... use them for free. You make all your money on the 2% who don’t.” ([35:52])

7. The Next Wave: Peer-to-peer Inference & Decentralized Compute

• With Nvidia’s backing, Ben shifted focus toward infrastructure:
  “If there’s someone in my user base with an iPhone 16 Pro or... a computer with a 4090... what if they could run workloads for other users?” ([24:04] Ben)
• Rolling out W AI: lets users ‘rent out’ their device’s idle compute, earning points/tokens as reward. ([28:12])

8. Advice for Aspiring AI Founders

• Document viral trends; productize meme formats before they saturate.
• “If you want to brain rot, then you must be brain rotted first.” ([32:06] Ben) – scroll, save, and catalog.
• Speed matters—Ben describes churning out “stupid shit” (like celebrity pregnant cat memes) that repeatedly go viral with only small tweaks. ([33:17])
• One viral app can be a “nine figure opportunity... giving someone a bite-sized version of a movie ticket that they paid $3 for instead of $50.” ([35:52] Ben)

9. Do You Need VC? (Nope)

• “Do they need to raise venture capital for it? — Fuck no.” ([37:26])
• High-potential apps can be bootstrapped to millions in revenue with enough traction and sharp execution.

Memorable Quotes and Notable Moments

| Timestamp | Quote | Speaker | |-----------|-------|---------| | 00:45 | “If something is working, then probably you can copy it and put your own spin on it and it'll continue to work.” | Ben | | 04:05 | “Why doesn't someone just make an app... where it's simple?” | Ben | | 08:46 | “We really deliberately picked those 15 songs and then we really deliberately made the 15 driving videos for those songs. And that was, I think, key.” | Ben | | 09:40 | “Stupid simple, stupid.” | Ben | | 11:06 | “Best way to get someone's attention... is to do something stupid and funny. Not try to explain Socrates... just tell a small joke.” | Ben | | 12:01 | “There’s always been some kind of viral content creation loop...” | Ben | | 14:41 | “If something is going viral inside of some technical circle, but it's still difficult for a layperson to use... that’s a good sign.” | Ben | | 20:29 | “We had a million-dollar server bill... Money is fake. Let’s just make an amazing product... Did not work at that point.” | Ben | | 22:41 | “At our peak Dream was doing over $500,000 a month.” | Ben | | 32:06 | “If you want to brain rot, then you must be brain rotted first.” | Ben | | 35:52 | “One viral app... That’s a potential nine figure opportunity... giving someone a bite-sized version of a movie ticket.” | Ben | | 37:26 | “Do they need to raise venture capital? Fuck no.” | Ben |
| 38:09 | “Good luck to everyone. I hope you make it. It's a fucking crazy time to be alive.” | Ben |

Step-by-step Playbook for Viral AI App Creation

1. Study What’s Working:
   • Meticulously analyze top apps (UI, content, engagement mechanisms).
   • Identify viral meme and content formats trending in niche and technical circles.
2. Lower the Barrier:
   • Make complex AI tech accessible and “stupid simple” to use.
   • Optimize UX for five-year-olds.
3. Engineer for Virality:
   • Create a content output instantly shareable on viral channels (TikTok, IG, etc.).
   • Content must be algorithm- and peer-share friendly; watermark it.
4. Monetize the Right Way:
   • Patterns: subscriptions, ads, upsells for premium features/styles.
   • Let 98% use free, monetize the 2% ‘super-users’.
   • Study monetization leaders in your niche.
5. Stay Adaptive:
   • Track/inventory trends (“brain rot” required).
   • Update rapidly; don’t be afraid to push out more of what’s working.
6. Don’t Overbuild or Overthink:
   • Launch simple; iterate fast; avoid overcomplexity.
   • You don’t need VC to play.

Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:45–01:43: Mimesis principle and Ben’s approach
• 02:00–07:13: Spotting models and meme formats, Wombo’s first steps
• 09:25–12:01: Product simplicity and the virality loop
• 13:16–14:41: Content/algorithm approach and adapting for B2B
• 16:15–18:38: Building Dream, leveraging new AI models
• 20:25–23:10: Monetization, war stories, subscription tactics
• 24:04–28:12: Moving to AI compute economy, peer-to-peer inference, and crypto x AI
• 29:31–35:52: Trend tracking, meme format productization, virality math
• 37:12–38:09: Final advice—opportunity, VC myths, scaling, mindset

Wrap‑Up

Ben’s story is both playbook and cautionary tale: viral AI-powered mobile apps can go from joke to 100M downloads almost overnight, but you’ll face server bills, monetization puzzles, vicious licensing headaches, and team churn. The gold remains in accessible design, relentless trend-tracking, and keeping it “stupid simple.”
No VC needed—just meme sense, fast execution, and relentless appetite for trial and error. Or as Ben puts it, “Infinite opportunity, yeah. Yes... People are glued to their fucking phones and they want to be entertained and they want utility. So if you can be useful or entertaining, then you can make an app.” ([37:16])

“Good luck to everyone. I hope you make it. It's a fucking crazy time to be alive.”
— Ben, [38:09]