Interview Only: ICE needs money and Stephen A grills Trump's Border Czar Tom Homan.

Summary

The Stephen A. Smith Show: In-Depth Summary of "ICE Needs Money and Stephen A Grills Trump's Border Czar Tom Homan"

Release Date: March 16, 2025
Host: Stephen A. Smith
Guest: Tom Homan, Border Czar under President Donald Trump
Podcast Platform: iHeartPodcasts

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Introduction

In this pivotal episode of The Stephen A. Smith Show, host Stephen A. Smith engages in a comprehensive and candid interview with Tom Homan, the newly appointed Border Czar under former President Donald Trump. The discussion centers on critical issues surrounding border security, immigration policies, and the operational challenges faced by Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE). As immigration remains a hot-button topic in American politics, this episode offers listeners an insider’s perspective on the strategies and controversies shaping the nation’s approach to border control.

Guest Background

Tom Homan brings over three decades of experience in border security to the conversation. Beginning his career with the United States Border Patrol in 1984, Homan has held significant positions, including being appointed by President Barack Obama in 2013 as Immigration and Customs Enforcement's Executive Associate Director. In 2017, President Donald Trump named him Acting Director of ICE, a role he held until his brief retirement in 2018. His return to public service under the Trump administration underscores his commitment to reinforcing border security amidst evolving immigration challenges.

Contrasting Administrations: Obama vs. Trump

One of the central themes of the interview is the comparison between immigration enforcement under President Obama and President Trump. At [02:08], Homan elucidates his differing roles:

Tom Homan: "Under President Obama, I was the head of enforcement removal operations. When I was there, we oversaw the removal of just shy of 3 million illegal aliens. Now I'm the Border Czar under President Trump. I have a direct report to the president here. So I oversee what the president assigns me in this new role."

Homan outlines his primary objectives under the Trump administration: securing the borders, orchestrating a massive deportation operation, and locating missing children separated from their parents—a legacy of the administration’s stringent immigration policies.

Re-engagement with the Trump Administration

Addressing his decision to return from retirement, Homan shares personal and professional motivations at [03:12]:

Tom Homan: "Under the last four years, I wake up every day upset over the last administration because... President Biden took the most secure border in my lifetime and unsecured it on purpose."

He criticizes the Biden administration for policies he believes have led to increased sex trafficking, fentanyl overdoses, and national security threats due to what he terms an "open border."

Critique of Biden’s Immigration Policies

Stephen A. questions the stark reversal of immigration policies from Obama to Biden administrations. At [05:16], Homan offers his theory:

Tom Homan: "I surmise that this administration thought these millions of people are going to be future Democratic voters... They saw future political benefit from this."

He accuses the Biden administration of intentionally undermining effective border security measures established under Obama, leading to adverse outcomes such as increased illegal immigration and associated crimes.

Child Separations and the Zero Tolerance Policy

A highly contentious issue discussed is the separation of migrant children from their parents, stemming from the Trump administration's Zero Tolerance Policy. At [06:53], Homan delves into the complexities of reuniting these children:

Tom Homan: "That's going to be the hardest out of the three goals that I have. That is going to be the hardest... Many of the information is fraudulent. It's going to be a difficult job."

He defends the Zero Tolerance Policy, explaining its intent to protect children from exploitation and reduce incidents of sexual assault by prosecuting parents, albeit acknowledging the unintended hardship of family separations:

Tom Homan: "Zero tolerance... was to save lives with less sexual assaults on women and children."

Sanctuary Cities and Legal Accountability

The conversation shifts to the issue of sanctuary cities and their impact on immigration enforcement. At [15:05], Homan asserts:

Tom Homan: "Sanctuary cities are sanctuary criminals and we're going to hold them accountable."

He emphasizes ongoing legal actions against sanctuary cities, arguing that such policies jeopardize public safety by releasing potentially dangerous individuals back into communities without proper oversight.

Deportation Operations and Prioritization

Addressing the administration’s pledge to conduct the largest deportation effort in American history, Homan provides insight into the current state of operations at [17:58]:

Tom Homan: "We're deporting less people than Joe Biden because Biden had millions of people coming across the border... We're about three times higher than Joe Biden during the same period."

He explains that their focus is on deporting individuals who pose significant threats to national security and public safety, rather than the broader undocumented population, which he asserts has overwhelmed ICE’s resources.

Undocumented Workers and Economic Implications

When discussing the role of undocumented workers in the U.S. economy, Homan shares personal anecdotes to highlight the competition they pose to legal workers:

Tom Homan: "There's an ugly underbelly of that because when you overwhelm the Border Patrol with what people call innocent immigration... There's less agents on the border to the rest people smuggling fentanyl."

He argues that undocumented workers depress wages and undermine job security for U.S. citizens, advocating for the creation of legal avenues for workers to enter the country without resorting to criminal cartels.

ICE Operations: Addressing Misconceptions

In the final segment, Homan tackles public misconceptions about ICE operations. At [24:15], he clarifies:

Tom Homan: "Everybody that ICE arrests is based on a targeted enforcement operation. It means they know who they're going to arrest."

He refutes fears of indiscriminate raids on schools and churches, emphasizing that ICE’s actions are strategic and focused on individuals identified as significant threats, aligning ICE operations with standard law enforcement practices.

Conclusion

Throughout the interview, Tom Homan presents a staunchly pro-enforcement stance on immigration, emphasizing the need for robust border security to protect national interests and public safety. He critiques the Biden administration’s policies as counterproductive and advocates for legislative support to enhance ICE’s operational capacity. Stephen A. Smith facilitates a rigorous dialogue, probing into the effectiveness and ethical considerations of current immigration policies. This episode serves as a critical examination of the ongoing debates surrounding border security and immigration enforcement in the United States.

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Note: This summary excludes advertisements, intros, outros, and non-content sections to focus solely on the substantive discussion between Stephen A. Smith and Tom Homan.

Transcript

[Greg Rosenthal]

What's up, everyone? It's Greg Rosenthal, and I'm teaming up with the king of spring, Daniel Jeremiah. He requires me to say that we're going to be bringing you 40s and free agents, the only podcast you'll need this NFL draft season. From DJs, mock drafts to my top 101, free agents will have it covered for you with all new episodes every Thursday, keeping you up to date as we head to the NFL Draft. Listen to 40s and free agents starting on March 6th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Stephen A. Smith]

What's up, everyone? Julie Swerbinks here along with former NHL player Nate Thompson.

[Tom Homan]

We're doing a new podcast together. Here we go.

[Stephen A. Smith]

The name Energy Line with Nate and jsb.

[Tom Homan]

Each week we'll get together and talk about hockey life. All topics are fair game, right?

[Stephen A. Smith]

Exactly. And you'll never know who will drop by to join us.

[Tom Homan]

Julia's pretty well connected. She has text threads going that you wouldn't believe.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Listen to Energy Line with Nate and jsb on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts.

[Tom Homan]

Or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Stephen A. Smith]

My next guest has spent more than four decades monitoring America's border. He joined the United States border patrol in 1984. In 2013, he was appointed by then President Barack Obama as Immigration and Customs Enforcement's Executive Associate Director. He was charged with enforcement and removal operations under that administration. Then in 2017, he was appointed as the Acting Director of ICE by then President Donald Trump. However, he subsequently retired from the position in 2018. Now he's back with President Trump in this new administration as the border czar. Please welcome to the Stephen a. Smith show. Mr. Tom Homan. Mr. Holman, how are you, sir? How's everything? I'm doing great for being on the show. Let's get right to it. I wanted to remind our audience that you served under President Obama. He tapped you to lead the Immigration and Customs Enforcement deportation branch of 2013. How does your role different now between the Obama and the Trump administrations? How does it differ from what it was then to what it is now?

[Tom Homan]

Well, look, under President Obama, I was the head of enforcement removal operations. When I was there, we oversaw the removal of just shy 3 million illegal aliens. Now I'm the. I'm border czar under President Trump. I have a direct report to the president here. So I overlook what president assigned me on this new role. I oversee border operations. I got three goals. Secure the borders, run a deportation operation, a massive deportation operation, and Third, find missing children, children that were smuggling into the country, and the last administration lost track of them. We need to find these children because many of them will be in harm's way. Many aren't. But we need to find these children to make sure they're safe.

[Stephen A. Smith]

I mentioned that Donald Trump had appointed you as acting director of ISIS 2017, but you retired in 2018. What happened then and why are you back now? Because you stepped away, but obviously you came back. You served over 30 years. I mean, you. You've given your service and what have you, and you could have retired and went out into the sunset, but you came back. Why did you feel compelled to do so? So please share that with my audience.

[Tom Homan]

Well, it's the second time I came back out of retirement for President Trump. Didn't make my wife real happy, but. No, how do you not come back? I mean, under the last four years, you know, I wake up every day upset over the last four years because we had this, the most secure border in my lifetime. I've done this since, as you said, 1984. It's the most secure border in my lifetime. The numbers proved it. And what the last administration did when you opened the border up, I knew every day when I woke up, more women and children are being sex trafficked across an open border. More Americans would die from fentanyl overdoses, poisonings because of an open border. Sex trafficking, women and children would increase on an open border and more. No inspector, terrorists and people on the watch list will get into the country through an open border. So I was insulted that President Biden took the most secure border in my lifetime and unsecured it on purpose. And I mean that. Look, I worked for six presidents, starting with Ronald Reagan. Every president I worked for, including Obama and Clinton, took steps to secure the border. They clearly understood you can't have national security if you don't have border security. President Biden, the first president history of this nation who came in unsecured border. So it upset me because I knew every day someone's going to die crossing that border. Women are going to be sexually assaulted crossing that border. So when President Trump called me, he said, you know, he asked me if I want to come back and help fix that border. I didn't hesitate. I came back because I think it's the right thing to do.

[Stephen A. Smith]

You've worked, obviously, doing what you've done. It spanned decades, so obviously, one could easily surmise you have a lot of intel, you have a lot of access to information that the average American citizen may not know or what have you. Let me ask you this, and I don't mean to ask it politically, but I'm asking it this way. Have you received any kind of explanation as to why former President Biden literally went against what former President Barack Obama did during his presidency?

[Tom Homan]

1.

[Stephen A. Smith]

And the numbers show he actually deported more immigrants out of this country than Trump did. Yet Biden comes into office in 2020 and he went completely against what Obama had done. You ever received intel explanation as to why he did that?

[Tom Homan]

You know, that's a great question. You're the first ones to ask me that question right now. I surmise, I have an opinion that I think this administration thought these millions of people are going to be future Democratic voters. But one of the things Biden also did, in addition to destroying all the programs we put in place to give us the most secure border, he overturned the Trump census rule, which means millions of people they release in sanctuary cities will be counted in the next census, which is going to result in what, more seats in house for the damage. So I truly believe they saw future political benefit from this. But you're exactly right and I've said this. Why do I think he did it on purpose? Because Joe Biden was vice president under Barack Obama when he had those record removals. Alejandro Mayorkas was a deputy secretary under Obama. When have those removals. And we had a families, we had thousands of families coming across the border every day. How did we stop it? We built family residential centers. We held them long enough to see a judge. 90% lost a case. 90%. So we put them in an airplane, send them home. Border numbers tank. So both those men knew how we solved that crisis. When they came back in as now the secretary and the president, what did they do? The complete opposite. They didn't detain, they released, they didn't make them see a judge and they weren't removing them. So they did a complete opposite of what they knew worked under President Obama.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Wow. Let me ask you this though, because you mentioned children on, on several of your answers already and I know you mentioned you're trying to find children that were separated from their parents. How does that process work actually? How do you go about the business of finding, you know, children that have been separated from their parents?

[Tom Homan]

Well, look, it's, that's, and I'll be honest with you, I've been honest from day one. That's just that is going to be the hardest out of the three goals that I have. That is going to be the hardest. And for obvious reasons Half a million children, more than half a million children were smuggled in the country, separated from their parents, put in the hands of criminal cartels to be brought in this country legally. And you know, you and I, we leave our child in a car in the middle of summer, we'll get arrested. But these 500,000 children were put in the hands of criminal cartels, released into the country by the last administration. Last administration was concerned about one thing, optics. So the instructions to orr, which is division hhs, was to process release as quickly as you can. Because if there's no overcrowding, we can say the board secured nothing to see here. Right. Even the secretary of HHS Becerra on stage several times, he was bragging how quickly they released these children, so called sponsors. Here's a problem, they didn't vet these sponsors appropriately under, under Trump administration we did DNA testing. We not only sponsored, we not only vetted the sponsor, we vetted everybody in that household to make sure there wasn't a child predator in that household, make sure there wasn't a gang member of the household. We took a lot of steps to make sure these children gonna be safe when they're sent to the sponsors under this administration, the whistleblowers. HHS has made it clear many of these sponsors weren't fingerprinted. Many, many of them, they weren't run through record checks. And many of the identification they provided was not assured that it was legitimate identification. So here's the issue now. We got 300,000 children we need to find. And there's a way to find you and me, Stephen. We have a footprint. We have a digital footprint. We own homes, we own cars, we pay bills, we got loans and we got utility bills, whatever they can find us. But a child don't have that digital footprint, which means we gotta use the digital footprint of the sponsors and what information they provided. And we know a lot of the information is fraudulent. So it's going to be a difficult job. I can tell you right now, we'll, we'll find some of these children. And not every one of these children are in harm's way. Many of them won't find their, with their parents, but many of them are not. Based on my four decades of doing this, many children will be in forced labor. We already found many in forced labor. Some are going to be in sexual slavery. And so we need to find these children, save them. But that's the hardest part about this job because of the data that we, we have is not the best data in the world. But we're not gonna give up. President Trump's committed do everything we can to find these children.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Let me get back to you with this question, too, though. You're considered one of the masterminds of the first Trump administration's infamous zero tolerance policy, which led to the separation of thousands of migrant children from their parents, in the eyes of many, at the very least, the idea led to the separation of more than, I think, 4,000 children from their parents. And some were lamenting that some of them were put in cages. How do you answer these questions? For those that don't know, how do you answer questions like that, like I just posed to you, in terms of 4,000 children being separated from their parents?

[Tom Homan]

Absolutely. So where does zero tolerance come from? Zero tolerance came from this. 31% of women in the med journey get raped by the criminal cartels. Children were dying on that border every day. Dying either drowning a river, dying, making that journey. Children were sexually assaulted and children were dying in the desert. You know, they made that journey. And a lot of women and children not only died men, many of them are sexually assaulted. So we said, look, how can we save lives? How can we stop the sexual assault of children? So we said, look, let's prosecute them because it's a crime, dangerous country legally. So if we prosecute them and put them in jail, maybe the numbers go down, maybe less will come. And it worked. Zero tolerance, that the numbers of families putting themselves in harm's way and putting themselves in hands of criminal cartels dropped significantly. However, the sad part about it, the unfortunate part about it, is that when you prosecute a parent and put them in jail, the child won't go with them. And I'll say this. I started as a police officer in New York. Police agencies across this country separate families a thousand times a day across this country because a child doesn't go to deal with a parent. And I've said during my testimony, one time I was testifying at Hill when I was a cop in New York, when I went to domestic violence call and I arrested a father, I separated that family. Child can't go to jail with them. When I arrested DUI and had a child in the car, I separated that family. It's an unfortunate and sad, saddest part of law enforcement. Families get separated when the parents get arrested. So we do let the families a thousand times a day in this country with Americans, but they want a different set of rules for illegal aliens. But the whole intent of doing this was to save lives with less sexual assaults. On women and children. That was, that was whole purpose for it. But they keep harping on that Trump's family separation policy. But In Detroit, about 4,000. But they don't talk about the 500,000, a half the million separations that this administration responsible for because they sent a message to the whole world. If you're a child and across this country illegally, you're not going to be deported. We'll deliver you to the very same people who paid a criminal cartel to smuggling in this country. So, you know, we did, what we did was try to save lives and decrease sexual assaults. What they did was send a message to the whole world. Dollar can cross the border. We'll get them to the final destination at government expense and reward the people who pay the criminal cartels bring. And that's why the numbers exploded, because there's no consequence. We had a consequence. They didn't.

[Stephen A. Smith]

That's an incredible, incredibly compelling answer that you just gave. I can't refute it. No one should as far as I'm concerned, sir. But I would ask you this because whether it's optics or it's a reality, listening to what you said, how sensitive you are to these issues, what one would argue diametrically opposes that is when we see one story, and granted it's one individual, but it's still a 10 year old in Texas who's a US citizen being deported to Mexico, you know, suffering from brain cancer. You've seen that story plastered all over the news wires over the last couple of days. How do you explain your mode of thinking and your explanation about why you do what you do and why you're committed to doing what you're doing, which is pretty damn close to irrefutable, I might add. But then we see a case like that happening, how do you just.

[Tom Homan]

You and I are on the same page. Actually, I've been on travel the last couple of days. I saw that story on my way to work this morning. I read that story and what did I do? I immediately contacted the Office of the Board of Children. I said I want facts in this case because many times the facts are different what you read in the media. But I've already inquired about it, what happened here, what's a ground truth here? So I, so I'm looking into it. I just, I read that story this morning. I know I'm a day behind, but I get hundreds of phone calls, hundred texts, I have a lot of meetings, I'm on an airplane all the time. But I've asked this morning because we Want to make sure, look, I've been, I've been honest from the beginning. We want to be transparent American people. If we screw up, we didn't know we screw up if we do something. So I've already asked that question. I don't have the facts on it yet. I've asked for fact, ground, truth on that and I'll deal with it once I get the facts up on the ground from what actually happened. Because many times what you read in the media, they leave half the story out. Sometimes they don't, but I'm going to find out.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Well, I appreciate that answer and that's very honest to stand up for you. Thank you for saying that. Are you saying that you don't know all the facts yet and if you do find out that this 10 year old child was indeed a United States citizen, that you will make sure that child is not deported?

[Tom Homan]

I'll make sure I get all the facts and make decision based on the facts. I can't tell you what I'm going to do. Yeah, the facts could be a thousand different ways. Right? But are the parents a public safety threat? Are they national security? They can't be here. And so we got to find out what the facts are. But we'll make a, we'll make a decision that is the most humanitarian thing we can do.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Let me switch to sanctuary cities because obviously I've seen you and I must, I shouldn't say this is actually bad for me to say this on camera, but I haven't minded you at all. You know, going at elected officials and law enforcement officials and letting them know that they were going to be accountable if they didn't follow the law. Didn't bother me at all to see that from you. But I am wondering what are your future plans for sanctuary cities and do you see a legal solution to sanctuary cities in this country?

[Tom Homan]

I actually do. We're working on some things right now. I don't want to share it here on this podcast because it's law enforcement sensitive. We're working on some things now. But I can say this. Sanctuary cities are sanctuary criminals and we're going to hold them accountable. And Pam Bondi, now that she's the attorney general, she's already filed lawsuits and we're going to continue filing lawsuits because we think knowingly releasing a public safety threat back into the public is just dumb. There's no reason that when you release a public safety threat back in the public, it puts our officers at great risk because rather than arresting somebody in the safety and Security of county jail. Now we got to go to the neighborhood and find them, which is dangerous for the officer, dangerous for the alien, because anything can happen on a street arrest, and it's certainly dangerous for the community. So we want to make in sanctuary cities, they don't understand they're hurting themselves. Because when you don't give us access to the bad guy locked in a jail so which is safe for everybody, you release them to the community, you're going to get exactly what you don't want. You're going to put the public at greater risk of crime because many will commit another crime. And what, you're going to force ICE in the community and we'll find the bad guy. But when we find him, he's probably with others, others that aren't a criminal threat, but they're in the country illegally. Well, they're going to go too, because we're not going to turn our back on illegal animals once we we find it. We're gonna let ICE do their job and enforce immigration law. So what you get being a sanctuary city is exactly what you don't want. More officers in the community and more collateral rest because we found them while we're looking for the bad guy. So we want the sanctuary cities to do one thing. Let us end the jail. Let us talk to the person that you locked in a jail cell. Cause obviously the public safety threat, give us access to that person. It's safer for everybody. It's the right thing to do. And the message from sanctuary cities is this, which is a bunch of crap. Well, we're a sanctuary city. We're welcome in jurisdiction because we want illegal aliens to feel safe when they want to report crimes or the victim of crime to come to us for help without the fear of working with ice. That is just. That is so false. Because number one, we don't want to talk to the victim witness. We want to talk to the guy you locked in a jail cell. And if you go talk to the victim and witness and ask them do you want the bad guy released back in your neighborhood? The victim and witness don't want them back either. So let us get access to the person locked in that taxpayer front of jail to help drive crime down the neighborhood and make it safe for officers alien in the community. It just makes sense to me as a career cop. I don't understand why any elected officials whose number one responsibility is protection their community, why would you not work with us to remove a child rapist from the community rather than release them back in the community.

[Stephen A. Smith]

I got about three more questions for you because I know your time is precious and I really appreciate you giving me this time. Prior to the election, you pledged to conduct the largest deportation in American history. Now there's more than 11 million undocumented immigrants living in the United States. Where do we stand today in terms of identifying those individuals and deporting them out of the country?

[Tom Homan]

Great question, because I read a media story this morning. We're deporting less people than Joe Biden. Yeah. Because Joe Biden had millions of people coming across the border every year and a lot of border patrols are removing a lot of them. So you can't compare. The administration isn't how many removed, it's number one, how many did you release into the country legally? And Biden administration is in the millions. And the more important question is how many interior arrests people in the interior country do arrest. If you look at those numbers, we're about three times higher than Joe Biden was during the same time period. We got about 36,000 arrests so far. Vast majority of criminals because President Trump has promised American people on this mass deportation operation. The worst first the criminals first, because they're the biggest danger to our communities. National security threats, public safety threats, that's what we're concentrating on. But that aperture will open to the 1.4 million that had due process, a great taxpayer expense were order removed. But instead of leaving, they became a fugitive. That aperture opened up. You can see the rest increased in the very near future. But the problem is sanctuary cities. Sanctuary cities are making us less efficient. Well, rather than one agent arresting one bad guy in the jail, now we got to send a whole team into the neighborhood for offshore safety reasons to find somebody that want to be found. So that's that. That's slowing us up. But what we'll do, we'll double demand forceful sanctuary cities will double the things. We're not going to be stopped. And we'll overcome all the roadblocks we're putting in, but we're going to get it done.

[Stephen A. Smith]

But you're talking about in Guantanamo Bay, for example, there's tens of thousands of available space, but there are millions of immigrants in this country illegally. So I'm saying if you're successful from a deportation standpoint in terms of locating who those individuals are, there's only but so much room in Guantanamo Bay. Where else are they going to go? What are you going to do with them?

[Tom Homan]

Another great question. I've been on media for the last two weeks. Congress needs to fund this operation. We need money. Because you're right, every illegal we rest, we need a bed for. Our beds are almost full right now. So we need money so we can do what the American people voted for. The number one issue was illegal immigration, removing criminal aliens. So Congress needs to come and give us the funding to do this. We need to buy more beds. We need to have more out of country planes. We need more contracts to have more contract people come in and do the work that doesn't require law enforcement. Law enforcement is currently doing. So you're exactly right. Congress needs to come through. I'm hoping they sign a bill today or hopefully tonight. We need a bill right now, but we need reconciliation. We need money to be successful, because if. If we more money we have, the more successful we're going to be.

[Stephen A. Smith]

I got to admit, Mr. Oman, that should be the easiest part of your job. I mean, the president has all three branches of government in his favor. I mean, the GOP has that. The White House, the Sen. The House. I mean, it shouldn't be difficult at this particular moment in time for them to give you what you want since they assigned you to do this job. But I want to transition real quick to undocumented workers. So a lot of people argue, you know, they've had a massive economic benefit. They've been a massive economic benefit to this country. They pay taxes, are important to the workforce, are less violent than some naturalized citizens. That's. That's the things that you keep hearing people say. What role does that play in your thinking when it comes to issues of deportation?

[Tom Homan]

Look, if you're in the country illegally, you got a problem. It's not okay to be here legally, but as you know, we're prioritizing worse than the worst fugitives. And here's the issue. I'll use one example, and this is a true example. I had a new roof put on my house two years ago. I had to call six companies before I got a company that guaranteed me legal workforce. And one person that showed up was a father and son. Father and son used to have 20 United States citizen employees. But him and his son came by and said, can I just repair the roof? Do we need to replace the roof? Because him and his son can't replace the whole roof. Here's a story. He told me he had to fire 20 US employees because he was competing against all these companies, had illegal aliens paying them, you know, seven bucks an hour get on the roof. Well, he was paying us 20 bucks to get on the roof. People need to understand that no one Hires an illegal alien on the goodness or harsh the harder can pay them less work them further work them harder and undercut their competition as US citizen employees. Now I'll say this. If we need, we need that type of staff to become this country and work, then it's up to Congress to make the changes. But we can't condone hiring illegal analysts because that's what drives everything else. When you overwhelm the border patrol with what people call innocent immigration, just people coming here for a better life, people coming for a job. But what they need to understand, there's an ugly underbelly of that because when you overwhelm the Borgatory, you type Borbatrol, what they call innocent immigration, it overwhelms the border to which means there's less agents on the border to the rest people smuggling fentanyl. There's less people agents on the board to stop the sex trafficking. What happened to Joe Biden? Joe Biden caused such a huge surge in illegal immigration. 70% of agents were pulled off the line to deal with humanitarian crisis and deal this so called innocent illegal immigration. And when they did that, what happened, Steve? 600% increase in sex trafficking. We had a quarter million Americans dead from fentanyl. We got a record number of people on terrorist watch across the border. So there's, we gotta do this legally. There are millions of people standing in line right now taking their tests, paying their fees, doing the background investigation. Come to the country the right way. They're sitting in the backseat because CIS is overwhelmed with fraudulent asylum claims. So I get it. If we need a workforce, need more workforce in the country, they can create a legal program. They can come with a visa so they don't have to pay a criminal cartel. They don't have to give their whole life savings to put themselves at risk for the criminal cartel and swim across the river and drown. So there's the Congress needs to do some work. But we can't condone illegal immigration. We can't condone go ahead and enter the country legally and we're not going to be looking for it. We got to send a message to the whole world. There's a, there's a set of rules, there's a right way and a wrong way to come to the greatest nation on earth. Let's do things the right way. Well, I got, I got to look at legislative branch, Congress to do that. But in the meantime, we can't okay illegal immigration. Result, more people dying, more women being raped, more cartels, you know, making more money to Come to the blood of this country was poisonous fentanyl.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Very last question to you sir. I give you the floor. You want America to know what about ice Right now, today and moving forward.

[Tom Homan]

Last question. I'm sick and tired of reading stories that ICE is going to raid your school, they're going to raid your churches, they're doing neighborhood suites. People need to understand everybody that ICE arrests is based on a targeted enforcement operation. Which means they know who they're going to arrest. They have a pretty good idea where they're going. They have to drop an operational plan. So it's not neighborhood sweeps. We're not going through neighborhood looking for people different than us. And when we got way sense of location policy, we ended it. Why? Because we haven't. We have to go to a high school, arrested Ms. 13 member we know there right now he's a public safety threat. We need to go in that high school along with the local authorities and arrest that public safety threat. It doesn't mean we're going to raid the school. We're going to arrest the bad guy that's in the high school. The same as every other federal law enforcement, law enforcement agency, state law enforcement agency, local, they all do it. And I should not have a different set of rules. We're going to school as the rest of public safety threat. Significant public safety threat. Churches. We'll never raid a church. But if we know there's a national security threat we know is in a church right now that we're looking for, we know he's sitting there right now. We're going to arrest that person. Doesn't mean we're raiding school. It doesn't mean we're raiding churches. We're not raiding hospital, which I saw. I see lots of left media saying it. They're scaring the immigrant community. I want people to go to school. We want people to go see their doctor and go to hospital, go to church. We got to straighten that narrative out. It's a left that are putting fear in immigrant community. We are basing our operations right now on the worst of the worst criminals. So go to church, go get your medical care, send your children to school. We're not raiding those places. We're doing the same thing every law enforcement agency does. It's not sweeps targeting enforcement operation. A lot of planning. We do this carefully. The agents are very, very professional. So I just wish the left would just state the truth and what we're exactly doing. Look at the data. As I just said, 36,000 arrests, vast majority of criminals. Will be doing exactly what President Trump said we would do and that I said we would do. We're concentrating on worse. Worse.

[Stephen A. Smith]

First, there's no left or right here. I'm Senna. I care about the damn truth and as far as I'm concerned, I want you to know first of all, you're welcome back on the show anytime. I would love to have you back on to get a more intensive convers about this, even more so than we just did over this last 20 plus minutes. I thank you for your time and please feel free. Anytime you've got something to say and you want to come back and you want to have a conversation, please know that you're welcome to come back on the show, sir. I really appreciate it. Thank you very much.

[Tom Homan]

Thank you, sir. I appreciate you.

[Stephen A. Smith]

All right, the one and only Tom Holman, AKA the Borders are he oversees the southern border, the northern border, all maritime, and of course, aviation security. Mr. Tom Holman right here on the Stephen A. Smith Show. Really, really happy that he came on.

[Tom Homan]

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[Greg Rosenthal]

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[Tom Homan]

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[Greg Rosenthal]

It's Greg Rosenthal and I'm teaming up with the King of Spring, Daniel Jeremiah. He requires me to say that we're going to be bringing you 40s and free agents, the only podcast you'll need this NFL draft season. From DJs mock drafts to my top 101, free agents will have it covered for you with all new episodes every Thursday keeping you up to date as we head to the NFL Draft. Listen to 40s and free agents starting on March 6th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.