Interview Only: Stephen A is one-on-one with Black Conservative Royce White.

Summary

The Stephen A. Smith Show: In-Depth Interview with Black Conservative Royce White

Release Date: May 4, 2025

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Introduction

On this compelling episode of The Stephen A. Smith Show, host Stephen A. Smith engages in a one-on-one discussion with Royce White, a notable figure transitioning from a professional basketball career to the political arena. Selected as the 16th overall pick by the Houston Rockets in the 2012 NBA Draft, White has since become a GOP candidate for the U.S. Senate in Minnesota. This interview delves into his political journey, ideological stance, challenges within the Republican Party, and his perspectives on pressing national issues.

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Background and Political Aspirations

Stephen A. Smith (01:13): Introduces Royce White, highlighting his transition from the NBA to politics, noting White's recent 40% vote share in a previous election against Amy Klobuchar and his intent to run for Senate in 2026.

Royce White (02:03): Expresses gratitude for the platform and acknowledges influential figures like Steve Bannon, whom he refers to as the "Happy Warrior." White emphasizes his alignment with the "Young MAGA movement," positioning himself as a nationalist and populist voice within the Republican Party.

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Challenges Within the Republican Party

White discusses his frustration with the proto-globalist Republican establishment, led by figures like George Bush, which he believes has historically stifled grassroots movements within the party.

Royce White (03:30): Criticizes the Republican establishment for protecting the NBA despite his valid concerns about mental health policies, which he successfully influenced in 2016. He reflects on being labeled wrongly by the media, drawing parallels to his experiences and the broader struggles within the party.

Stephen A. Smith (05:16): Questions whether White's representation of a grassroots movement stems from disappointment with conventional Republicans or a belief that the party needs to evolve.

Royce White (05:36): Affirms both sentiments, linking his past struggles in the NBA with his current political battles, and underscores the need for a more honest and transparent Republican Party.

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Ideological Foundations and Policy Perspectives

White elaborates on his stance against globalism and his advocacy for national identity and citizenship.

Royce White (06:28): Explains his opposition to globalist policies, advocating for the preservation of national identity and citizenship. He critiques the influence of global finances and institutions like the Federal Reserve on American sovereignty.

Stephen A. Smith (10:11): Encourages White to discuss his experiences as a Black man leaning towards the GOP and the challenges faced within American politics.

Royce White (10:11): Highlights the schism in American politics post-World War II, criticizing both Democratic and Republican establishments for perpetuating a globalist agenda that undermines national interests.

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Critique of the MAGA Movement and Loyalty to Policy Over Personality

The conversation shifts to the nature of the MAGA movement and White's loyalty to policy rather than individual leaders.

Stephen A. Smith (13:00): Raises concerns about the perceived unwavering loyalty within the MAGA movement, advocating for a focus on policy rather than personalities.

Royce White (14:08): Agrees wholeheartedly, stating, "If you listen to my podcast, please call me crazy. ... We always talk about policy and politics in America being more policy-driven and idea-driven than they are personality and person-driven."

He clarifies that while he respects Donald Trump's courage to address uncomfortable truths, his loyalty lies with the principles of the MAGA movement rather than the individual.

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Evaluation of Donald Trump's Impact and Policies

White assesses Trump's first hundred days in office, emphasizing Trump's efforts to dismantle the post-World War II liberal order.

Royce White (16:24): Praises Trump's actions to "reorient the entire global landscape" towards prioritizing national identity and citizenship, critiquing the previous establishment for their role in global finance and politics.

Stephen A. Smith (17:48): Acknowledges agreement on immigration policies but expresses concerns about Trump's overreach, particularly in ignoring court rulings.

Royce White (19:39): Defends his stance on immigration and critiques the politicization of the judiciary, emphasizing the need for fair legal processes over party loyalty.

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Addressing Allegations and Establishment Opposition

The discussion turns to allegations against White and his confrontations with both the Republican establishment and mainstream media narratives.

Stephen A. Smith (29:03): Brings up controversies surrounding White, including alleged anti-Semitic remarks and financial discrepancies, seeking clarification.

Royce White (31:07): Refutes the allegations as fabrications by the Republican establishment intent on undermining his candidacy. He explains the challenges of fundraising against established GOP donors and addresses the misconception of his stance on globalism being anti-Semitic.

Royce White (35:47): Elaborates on his non-anti-Semitic stance, highlighting his personal relationships with Jewish individuals and criticizing the GOP's contradictory positions on issues related to Israel.

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Media Representation and Activism

White recounts his involvement in activism during the George Floyd protests, highlighting media misrepresentations.

Royce White (25:10): Describes leading peaceful protests and the media's failure to accurately represent his stance and collaboration with local activists, who distanced themselves due to his differing views on LGBTQ issues.

He emphasizes the importance of addressing systemic issues like the Federal Reserve and global finance, which he believes are at the root of many societal problems.

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Future Prospects and Closing Remarks

As the interview concludes, Stephen A. Smith reflects on the depth of the conversation and the importance of diverse political voices.

Stephen A. Smith (36:37): Acknowledges the unlikely yet meaningful dialogue, promising future discussions to further explore White's perspectives.

Royce White (37:00): Reiterates his commitment to challenging the status quo within both major political parties, advocating for transparency, policy-driven politics, and the inclusion of minority voices in the GOP.

Stephen A. Smith (40:34): Asks White a final question about his political alignment in the absence of the MAGA movement, to which White responds by expressing his close ties to Steve Bannon and his difficulty in envisioning his position without the MAGA framework.

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Concluding Thoughts

This episode offers a profound exploration of Royce White's journey from sports to politics, his ideological battles within the Republican Party, and his critical views on globalism and national identity. Stephen A. Smith provides a platform for nuanced discussion, allowing listeners to gain insight into White's perspectives and the challenges he faces in reshaping American politics.

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Notable Quotes

• Royce White (02:03): "I'm more the young bull kind of fire-breathing, nationalist, populist, part of the MAGA movement."

• Stephen A. Smith (05:16): "Represent the more grassroots movement—is that your way of saying you've been disappointed in what conventional Republicans were doing?"

• Royce White (14:08): "If you listen to my podcast, please call me crazy. ... We always talk about policy and politics in America being more policy-driven and idea-driven than they are personality and person-driven."

• Steph A. Smith (29:03): "Is that stuff true? If it's false, say so."

• Royce White (31:58): "The establishment GOP who's more afraid of a young black man talking about the Federal Reserve than they are of AOC or Ilhan Omar."

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Conclusion

This in-depth interview sheds light on Royce White's determination to influence political discourse from a unique standpoint, challenging both party establishments and mainstream narratives. Stephen A. Smith facilitates a vital conversation that underscores the need for diverse voices and policy-focused politics in shaping the future of American governance.

Transcript

[Royce White]

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[Stephen A. Smith]

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[Stephen A. Smith]

My next guest was selected as the 16th overall pick by the Houston Rockets in the 2012 NBA Draft today. He's in a different arena now as a GOP candidate for the U.S. senate. From the state of Minnesota. Please welcome Mr. Royce White to the show to Stephen A. Smith Show. What's going on man? How you doing? How's everything?

[Royce White]

I'm good man. Thanks for having me on. I really appreciate it, man.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Please, the pleasure is all mine. I'm always interested in hearing what somebody like yourself has to say. So you ran in 2024 in Minnesota against Amy Klobuchar. You lost that election, but you got 40% of the vote this time. Now you're campaigning to run for the Senate in 2026. First of all, why and most importantly, do you think you can win this time?

[Royce White]

Well, again, I want to say thank you for having me on. I appreciate it a great deal. And I also appreciate you having the great Steve Bannon on recently. That's what, you know, got me to reach out to you and try and talk to you as well. Bannon is obviously a friend of mine and an even better mentor. We, we call him the Happy Warrior because he takes his scrutiny and his prosecution in some cases the, you know, witch hunt lawfare that's going on with a smile on his face. Me, I'm more the young bull kind of fire breathing, nationalist, populist, part of the MAGA movement, the Young MAGA movement. So I appreciate you even me giving me a platform. We know we've gone through a long Time in this country where people like me couldn't speak as far as the elections go, look, I think there are a lot of problems still with our elections, especially in Minnesota. I think letting illegal immigrants vote in elections is something that's an issue here in the state of Minnesota as well many other places in the country. Okay. Obviously, Donald Trump is fighting back against that, and hopefully he can get some, some legislation with some teeth to help out on that front in 2026. Ultimately, we know the machines are an issue, and I don't say that as a conspiracy. Although if you go to my Wikipedia just a month back, it said American conspiracy theorist in the first sentence. But actually Amy Klobuchar, both Amy Klobuchar and I think Kamala Harris at the time had a demonstration before a senatorial committee back in 2018 that demonstrated the machines have security issues. At that time, they were trying to say the Russians could hack our elections now or after. In 2020. Of course, the elections were completely safe. So what I'm doing it for and what Bannon sort of commissioned me to do is to be a younger voice that speaks to the growing wedge or divide in American politics and really politics all around the world, which a more proto globalist establishment, meaning a thought process that believes in global citizenship in a world without borders, for lack of, you know, more or less, versus a more nationalist mindset that says there is value in nationhood, there's value in the nation state, there's value in national identity and national citizenship. And that's what I've been doing since 2022. I tried to run against Ilhan in 2022. I lost the primary there. I came back in 24, won a statewide prime. Then it was only congressional district. 2024 was obviously statewide in a primary. And so we're moving the needle. And to be quite honest, the number one thing I want to say to you, Stephen A. Before we even get going, is what really drew me in to run as a Republican is how dishonest the narrative was about the Republican Party. If you remember Donald Trump coming down the escalator in 2015. 16, his number one enemy was not the Democrat Party who he had fundraised for and had many friends in. The number enemy was the proto globalist Republican establishment led by George Bush and the rest of his counterparts in that echelon of the Republican Party. And we're fighting the same thing here in Minnesota still to this day, that Republican establishment has a stronghold on the party. And I represent the more grassroots movement that's fighting Back when you say you.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Represent the more grassroots movement, is that your way of saying you've been disappointed in what conventional Republicans were doing up until the moment you decided to run in 2022 and then 2024? Or are you just simply saying these times call for a different kind of Republican and that's what you want to represent?

[Royce White]

I'd say both. To take a step back. A lot of people who are watching the show will probably know my name from being drafted, like you said, in my problems or my fight with the NBA. And we don't have time to go into all those miscon exceptions, though they are many. But I think they're much more interesting and important things for us to talk about, especially along policy. But it is important because my story back in 2012 was a microcosm of what we face today. And that was a proto globalist establishment media who at the drop of a dime was willing to protect the NBA even though they knew that I had a categorical winning position in that. In that fight for mental health policy. As you very well know, when I came in the league, there was no mental health policy. Now there is one in the one they put in place in 2016 is one that I helped them develop.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Absolutely.

[Royce White]

I actually added language to that. So I had a huge political victory, but it cost me a lot of money.

[Stephen A. Smith]

And you were willing to go out front, in fairness to you, you were willing to go out front and center and bring attention to something that a lot of people, the NBA. I'm not going to accuse them of purposely ignoring it as if they knew how detrimental it was and then chose to ignore it. I don't think anybody at that particular moment in time took mental health as seriously as you were imploring all of us to do. So that's definitely. We saw Chris Bosh later, we saw Kevin Love later, we saw Litany demar derozan and stuff like that. So you definitely deserve a lot of credit for that. I'm not here to take that from you, that's for sure.

[Royce White]

Well, and my point is, well, I had some more behind the scenes conversations with the NBA higher ups. So I have a different experience with how much they knew and how much they didn't know. And I don't want to go into the details there. But for example, what I was fighting for back then was something simple like, okay, if we have a banned substance list in the collective bargaining agreement and on the band substance list you have Xanax, it would behoove the general managers, coaches, players, agents Refs and whoever else, team trainers, to understand or at least have some sort of, you know, baseline knowledge of why is Xanax so widely prescribed? Why is it so easy for people to get it on the street? Why is Xanax so addictive, which ties into mental health and mental health conditions? The NBA wanted no part of that conversation because at the time, yeah, it was going to change the power dynamic politically within the league. And so what the story became is, well, Royce White just want. He's a prima donna. He wants special treatment. He wants to be able to bust from Minneapolis to Chicago. And it's funny, now I see all these players sitting out a season and a half with injuries or load management, and I'm thinking to myself, I would have never missed one game busing to a game, because that's just not my mentality. I'm tough as nails. I'm built kind of Midwest, tough basketball.

[Stephen A. Smith]

That's. That's what we knew you to be.

[Royce White]

And I played like that. Right, Right. So I. I got that grit to me. So I would have never missed a game. But. So that was how the narrative was manipulated. And I only bring that up to say this was four years before Donald Trump ever came down the escalator, and stories like mine laid the groundwork, what, for what would be an easy movement for a lot of young men like myself, into what Donald Trump created. Right. So people go, well, why are you. How can you be maga? How are you Republican? I faced the fake news media firsthand, and it probably cost me more than $100 million well before Donald Trump ever added his name to the political arena.

[Stephen A. Smith]

So I listen to you, and let me be very, very clear. I'm not a Republican. I'm not a MAGA Republican, but I don't pride myself on being a liberal either. And when I saw you in the past being critical of some of the things that I said, I wasn't offended by it. It made me listen. I said, let me think about what he said, because I know the inclination on the left is for somebody to be so put off. Then all of a sudden, I don't want you around. I want you canceled. I don't want to listen to what you have to say. Hell with all of that. I think that's one of the problems that exist in this country, in my opinion, Royce, on both sides. Sides, meaning that I think two extremes where it doesn't encourage anybody to listen to one another and hopefully compromise. So when you brought up the fact that when you were a player, you Felt like you couldn't be yourself, like you couldn't be open, rather about where you stood politically, et cetera, et cetera. I want you to elaborate from a political perspective on what it was like for you as a black man being somebody that leans towards the GOP even before maga, what that has been like for you as a black man in America.

[Royce White]

Well, again, you know, Donald, the advent of Donald Trump and the MAGA movement is the split or the schism in modern day American politics, global politics, that is two things on the left are the Democrats and the liberals. And I come from a culturally Democrat Black community in St. Paul, Minnesota, you know, working class, blue collar. So I'm very familiar with why black people continue to vote Democrat with the thought process. But the, the thinking is something like, is the left, is the left, let's say even the far left, which some people call extremely radical, but let's say the AOC Bernie Sanders wing of the party, are they a genuine anti establishment economic populist movement or are they a radical sexual identity politics movement? And so where, even before Donald Trump, where I was critical of the NBA and saying, hey, this, this institution is the, the watering hole for global corporate community and their morals and ethics and standards and their business practices have implications downstream from the institution. There were a lot of people who were traditionally liberal or Democrat that were all in support, they were fans, they were saying, hey, yeah, we support this guy. He's saying the right things, asking good questions. But the establishment that controls the media was not going to let that be the prominent or dominant story. So, and I bring that up because again, if you fast forward, what Donald Trump and the MAGA movement really represents is a rejection of the institutions and the establishments that have had control of this country for the last 70 years, since World War II. I love when Eric Weinstein, Eric Weinstein is the brother of Bret Weinstein. And he's not a far right wing Republican by any means. He's like nominally a Democrat. Democrat, okay. He's, I think he was the co managing director of Teal Capital and he's, he's a brilliant mathematician and he said it best. He goes, you know, the democracy that they mentioned for the people, by the people and of the people is not the democracy they mean when they talk about it today. What they're talking about when they say democracy is being threatened are the democratic institutions that were erected after World War II and serve as the load bearing walls for this globalist vision of the world. And I was already pushing back on that in 2012 without even realizing it, without being able to give a name to it. And I didn't understand as being on the side with liberals and Democrats why I was facing such a, you know, a difference of reaction to fighting with the NBA. Later on, I would real. As soon as Donald Trump came down the escalator and then later in 2020, when George Floyd died and I was on the ground, I was in the streets, I knew exactly what had happened. It clicked for me. And after that, it wasn't even a question of whether it was the Republican Party or not.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Allow me to interject by saying this, I want to be very respectful when I ask this question because I'm not pointing to you specifically, but I'm pointing to the MAGA movement per se and one of the issues that I have with it. This seems to be this fealty, this undying, unwavering loyalty to Donald Trump. And my attitude is, is that not. And I'm not saying again, you feel that way. You can answer that question yourself. I wouldn't disrespect you like that, bro. But what I'm saying is, is that it comes across when you listen to a lot of people talk about MAGA in that regard, is that a safe kind of mentality to have? Because my attitude is, okay, let's say, for example, you feel that way for the Donald Trump. Let's say it's completely justified. Let's not even debate that, right? He's still supposed to be going to 2028. Where does that leave this country if everybody is feeling that way about him as opposed to policy? I would like us to focus more on policy than people. I'm talking about as a nation, and I don't think we do enough of that. To that you say what?

[Royce White]

That I say I 1000% agree. If you listen to my podcast, please call me crazy. Myself and the other co hosts who I have as a part of the, the the crew, we always talk about policy and politics in America being more policy driven and idea driven than they are personality and person driven. Okay? However, Donald Trump just. And look, if Donald Trump does something I don't agree with, I'm the first one to criticize him. There is no undying loyalty to Donald Trump. The person. What I do have a loyalty to is his courage to step up and say things that are inconvenient because I, it resonates with me because I did it.

[Stephen A. Smith]

That's what you do.

[Royce White]

Yeah, that's what you. So I have. I just have to respect that on, on GP on general principle. But if he waivers and if he starts to not be America first or what I think is MAGA and actually, you know, representing the nationalist populist movement that needs to happen in this country, I'll criticize him. And in fairness to him, I don't think he's going to do everything right, because who can? I certainly can. If I was president, I would want people to say, hey, is he doing a good job overall? Because he can't do everything right? That's impossible. But, but I. I will say going forward, the. One of the main reasons I'm doing this and one of.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Doing what?

[Royce White]

Royce? Doing what office. Running for office. Being involved in the political conversation. Sure. And the reason I appreciate you having me on is I do believe that even in the MAGA movement, even in the Republican Party or conservative movement, there needs to be a deeper dive into the intellectual foundation, framework of the ideas that we're calling our platform. Because there's a lot of contradictions in there. And where those contradictions lie is where I still have to fight with the Republican Party inside. It's where Donald Trump has to often fight with the Republican Party inside. So, yes, I agree with you a thousand percent. It needs to be more about ideas and less about the person. But Donald Trump did. He did stand up when we needed him to, and he was touched by God. In my opinion, him not being assassinated that day, three bullets going by his face, can't be anything other than an act of God. If you deny that, then I don't want to stand next to you because the bolt of lightning may become. I'm being facetious, but you know what I'm saying.

[Stephen A. Smith]

How do you feel Donald Trump has done in his first hundred days in office?

[Royce White]

I think he's brought a wrecking ball to what I was just mentioning. What it's called is the post World War II Democrat liberal order. And when I realized what it was and what it intended to do, it became clear to me why the Democrat Party or the liberal establishment has had such a stronghold on the media and the narrative and politics in this country. And by that, I also mean George Bush and the mainstream establishment Republicans. He is trying to reorient the entire global, the entire global landscape, to have America stand up for what you would call national identity. And not just identity, because identity is a fickle thing, but more so citizenship. You know, it was not a benign phenomenon or, or, or, or, you know, creation to come up with borders. Many people think of borders as, you know, powerful people dividing land on A map to be able to conquer and. And, you know, pillage whatever natural resources or wealth that they can. And in many cases in history, that is the case. But borders also have a much deeper spiritual meaning that we have to acknowledge, and that is a man without boundaries, a man without limits is a man who believes that he's God. And.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Yeah, okay, I don't disagree, but let me. Let me push back on you with this, okay? You'll get no argument from me about the job he's done at the border. There was no excuse for us to have open borders in this nation.

[Royce White]

Wait, which. Wait, wait. Which part don't you agree with? Let me. I want to try. I want to.

[Stephen A. Smith]

No, no, no, no. I'm not saying any part that you said that I disagree with. I'm talking about pushing back in terms of some of the. Some of the things that I wanted to bring up about him, not. You got it. I have no problem with him on immigration. I think he's done an outstanding job on immigration. I think it was necessary. Do. I think it's a bit extreme sometimes when you're taking somebody, if it's a student protesting and you're deporting him and what have you, when the courts are telling you no, don't do it, I got a problem with that, because I'm care. I'm. I'm. I'm concerned that you could ignore the courts and you can act of your own accord, because that's not what this nation of laws is built on, in my estimation, however, I'm looking at the economy. Ooh, I don't know. I mean, he's saying it's doing better. That's not what I'm hearing. I'm looking at the tariffs. I have no problem with him going after China. But you going after allies, too, at least initially. And you had the allies, you know, commingling and talking with China because they were thinking they were going to be allies with China. Now because they were turning against you, I'm worried about that. I'm thinking about dei, and I'm like, I don't like. And Royce, oh, I hope you're with me on this one. Diversity, equity, and inclusion. Here's the argument that I have made. Didn't earn it. That's what DEI stands for, for me. Didn't earn it. Right. And I'm like, why does DEI automatically have to be associated with merit? Who's to say some of those people didn't have the merit warranting them to get hired as a black man in America? I'm quite sure you've seen, as I have seen, plenty of qualified black folks that weren't getting opportunities because of the white establishment. But they seem to be ignoring that right now. To all of that floor is yours.

[Royce White]

Okay, well, let me take it piece by piece. I'll start from the, the end and work my way back.

[Stephen A. Smith]

No problem.

[Royce White]

Number one, you will never hear me pander to this right wing narrative that racism in this country doesn't exist. That's ridiculous. It's absurd. It's, it's, it's something that is cheap kind of WWE politics. It's, it's what they serve you on Fox News and cnn. That's the, that's the, you know, conventional and proverbial battle of, of political clash in America. Is it racist or is it not? Right? There's racism in America. There's no doubt about it. There's been racism in the past. The question is, what is the answer? What's the solution? And I do believe that there are people who may have benefited from DEI programs or let's say affirmative action, to take it back to something that has real teeth, who, who did have the merit and got in with those programs. The question becomes, and, and this is what really opened my eyes when George Floyd died. I was as appalled and shocked as anybody. And now I do think that Derek Chalvin's prosecution was political. Okay, okay. They prosecuted him because they wanted the, the riots to stop in the streets. They didn't want to have to have any more conversations or riots or. Right. So the prosecution was political. But I'm always, I am not, quote, unquote, loyal to a thin blue line and police backing at any and all, or any and all circumstances. Not my deal. My deal is something more biblical like when Paul said to the centurion guard, I'm a Roman citizen. Do you have the right to bind and beat a Roman citizen who has not yet seen court? And I think Donald Trump in the, in the MAGA movement is now more privy to the dangers of a police state and a security state and letting the courts have more power or let's say the justice system, for lack of a better be more all encompassing the justice system to have more power than they're supposed to. And so we're still working out that Gordian knot. Now, to back up to what you said about the border and the immigrants, here's the thing. The courts have long been politicized. They've long been politically weaponized. And we got into that when we started letting presidents who are party loyal, appoint judges. And it happened on both sides. And there started to be this game of who has the political power in the judiciary with judge appointments. I'll say this. When a country is in the place that our country was at, it is very difficult for me to continue to believe in the rule of law, even though my Republican counterparts have such a dying loyalty to the concept. They all say rule of law, rule of law, democracy. Listen, your rule of law is only as good as the lawmakers who uphold it. That's true. If your lawmakers aren't righteous, then there is no rule of law. Right. And what we saw the, the Democrat establishment that also includes some very rhino we call them or racks, I call them Republicans against Trump. Republicans that have more loyalty to the liberal order than they do to the Republican ideas or the Republican Party. We have seen some very dangerous things happen in this country in the legal system. Steve banished prosecution was one of them. Obviously, we don't have to go into detail, but Merrick Garland and, and you know, Eric Holder and all these guys also denied being subpoenaed and speaking of before the Congress and they didn't serve a day in jail. They give Steve Bannon four months. Why? Because he's powerful, because he speaks the truth, and because he represents a change of the brand of the Republican Party that neither the Republican Party or Democrat Party want to see. So I have to support Donald Trump in some sort, in some instance in, in playing a hardball and smash mouth with the courts and saying, wait a minute, we're not going to play this game and pretend like the courts are level. And guess what? As a black man, and for many young black men who are leaning towards the Republican Party and Donald Trump, we know the courts to be unjust. We just didn't understand the depths of it. We didn't realize it could happen to the white Republicans who we have as boogeymen in our heads. And that's why when Donald Trump was arraigned and, and they, they, they booked him, it was a brilliant move by him. As soon as they booked him, there were blacks and Hispanics and Asians and all kinds of minorities across this country that said, damn, damn that corrupt system. When George Floyd died, they chanted, the whole system is guilty. Damn, that system is, is really guilty. And guess what? Now some white folks are starting to feel it too. And praise be to God for that, because now we're starting to cross the Rubicon where we see the real danger and threat to freedom getting back to.

[Stephen A. Smith]

George Floyd and I know you keep bringing up Steve Banning and how. And how he was wrong and how, you know, how you feel about him. I have to confess to you, I'm not comfortable with a lot of things that Steve Bannon said. But that, brother, that man is smart as hell. He knows what he's talking about. And you better bring the rain information wise, if you going to deal with him. Because I say this, he means what he says, all right? And he has information to back it up. So he. I had to go back and watch his show like two or three times and listen to everybody. I'm like, damn, I gotta watch this guy right here because he's not a joke and he's not playing around. But I'll get back to you, Royce, with George Floyd, because when he was killed by police officer Derek Chauvin, you led what you called a peaceful protest, but said the mainstream media misrepresented those efforts. How did they do that?

[Royce White]

Well, I mean, this is a very important note in my own journey, both. Both as a young man in general, but. But certainly politically. You got to remember, I fought against the NBA. I got blackballed. Later on, I would go to live in Canada for two years and play in Canada. This was 2015, 16, and 17. I was living in London, Ontario, and it was around the time that Jordan Peterson encountered his troubles with the government there, around B6B Bill C16, which was A. An argument about gender identity in. In legislation, essentially. And I remember watching. Look, I grew up in Minneapolis, Minnesota. It's one of the more gay communities in the country. My mom was an esthetician. My whole life. She worked to pay bills our rent with her tips. Okay. So I grew up in the hair salon and in the spa world and in the beauty business. And I knew and grew up knowing gay men. And it was very different back in the 90s than it is today, I'll say that. But I wasn't unfamiliar with the gay community. Also, playing basketball, you meet a lot of female basketball players who are lesbian, and that's fine. That's their choice. All good point I'm making is I wasn't familiar with this transgender pronoun thing. And I was in Canada, and I remember watching the news like, man, this guy Jordan Peterson sounds logical, saying, reasonable, actually really smart, to be honest. And I don't understand why they're attacking them. But I was playing basketball, and we won two national championships in Canada back to back. So you know how you watch things. Yeah, you know, kind of. But you're. It's in passing. Okay. I come back to the States in 2018-19. I joined the big three. And I'm talking about all these political issues in the big Three. Edward Snowden and Julian Assange and the Federal Reserve and so on and so forth, and the Uyghurs, okay, the Uyghurs in China that their. Their persecution. And so when 2020 hit and George Floyd died, I. I was like, I know what's going to happen here. This is going to be one of the biggest. I could just feel it. This is going to be one of the biggest things in American history. And it's right here in my backyard where I grew up. I mean, 36, 38th in Chicago, on the south side of Minneapolis. I used to run the streets and play at the parks and, you know, my whole life. So it's home, home. So I went to the front line because there were all of these people organizing these protests who I didn't know from being from the city. I didn't know them from any weights. I didn't know them from any weddings. I didn't know them from any barbecues. I didn't know them from any of the grade schools or the after school programs or the basketball team. I didn't know them. And so it was odd to me. And then when I researched them, I realized a lot of these community activists were in ports from colleges, you know, in California or somewhere else that were given a position by politicians who had been elected. Okay? So I'm. I'm out on the streets and I'm saying, listen, we're gonna go to the front door of the Federal Reserve. You all believe that the problem in this country is policing. The problem is not policing. The problem is how the money works. And. And if we want to talk about follow the money or the whole system being guilty, I can show you just how guilty it is. The Federal Reserve is the epitome of corruption in America, and it has a downstream effect on every working class citizen, including blacks, Latinos, and everybody else up and down in between. So when I did that, naturally people were excited to see me lead. And they're like, oh, Royce White's out here and look at. There's 10,000 people with him. How did he do that? And they even wrote stories about me in Washington Post and whatnot. And they were like, hey, he's a rising young activist. When I was out there, I heard something that just blew my mind. Black, trans lives matter. I didn't even know what trans meant at the time, to be honest. Stephen A. I had no clue. And I didn't push back on it right away because I didn't know what it meant to push back.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Right.

[Royce White]

But when I. When it. When they explained to me that I needed to organize these demonstrations and who spoke at these demonstrations based on people's sexual identity and sexual preference, boom, me and the local community activists in Minnesota were at odds. And I didn't back down because, you know, there's no back down in me. Right? And that. And I said, that's the story. So when George Floyd died, I led these protests. And the local activists who had already been here as an extension of blm, they didn't want to, you know, have anything to do with me because I wasn't pro LGBTQ pronounced. And so there was another instance where the. The bubbling up of the black men in this country who have come to reject the lunacy on the far left happened right there in 2020 in the streets of Minneapolis. And the mainstream media never covered it that way. They don't want you to know that a young black man who didn't graduate college, came from a single mother household in a blue collar community, can tell you how global finance works.

[Stephen A. Smith]

As a member of the media for decades, I can't even disagree with you. There is no doubt that there was stuff that folks did not want to discuss. I was covering sports, so it was different for me. But I'm just saying there was no doubt that you're absolutely right that there was so much stuff being covered. And I got to get a little bit uncomfortable with you for a second here. During the 2024 campaign, you raised controversy with what they labeled as anti Semitic remarks. I don't know what you said. I didn't know anything about that. Civil judgments for unpaid child support and a finance report that showed more than 1 million of donor money went to credit card fees, which was nearly 70% of your 1.43 million in operating expenses. First of all, is that stuff true? If it's false, say so. And number two, to Minnesotans out there who would use that information, obviously emanating from the left about you to decide how they're going to vote, why should they vote for you at this moment in time? Floor is yours.

[Royce White]

Okay, well, number one, I hope I get a little bit of time to explain the three of those thoroughly, because they're very important.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Please.

[Royce White]

But I will say that it's not the left. It's not emanating from the left. Those stories, those lies and rumors are emanating from the establishment. Gop who's more afraid of a young black man talking about the Federal Reserve than they are in AOC or Ilhan Omar. In fact, a lot of the establishment GOP loves Ilhan Omar because they raise a lot of money off of her. They're more afraid of me being in office than they are keeping Ilhan Omar in. And they're afraid of me saying that. They're afraid of me being on your show and saying it to your audience. Because this is, this is the real politic of America. Okay, okay, let me go back. Number one. You asked me about the, the, the, the credit card processing fees. That's, that's from this campaign, not the 2024 campaign. That's from 2026.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Okay.

[Royce White]

And, and how that works, in short, is the establishment Republicans like Tom EMMER Or Mitch McConnell or used to be Kevin McCarthy, now probably Mike Johnson and many of the others who have a lot of power there in D.C. when you go to run and you run under a certain political party affiliation, they have access to the Republican Party donor data, and they are usually unwilling to give that data, give open access to that data to candidates who they think are a threat to their established power base. That would be me. Me and Tom Emmer. We don't get along. We're adversaries. We're both Republicans, but we don't like each other. And I don't make any qualms about it. I think he's a globalist just like Hakeem Jeffries. And that's why, if you go to Apex landing page, I'll get to your anti Semitic question in a moment.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Okay.

[Royce White]

If you go to Apex landing page, you'll find there are politicians represented on that landing page. Mike Johnson, Scalise, Tom Emmer, Hakeem Jeffries, Katherine Clark and Aguilar. There's no better example of what we call the Uni Party than those six politicians. One of them happens to be here in Minnesota. So they don't give you access to those lists. So we as candidates who are kind of rogue, kind of, you know, out there in the wilderness on our own, have to do third party deals with bundlers. And these bundlers charge a high commission. Now, they charge a high commission on the first donation. So let's say Stephen A. Smith supports Royce White. You get an email from these bundlers, you send me a hundred dollars, they'll take 85 the first time. Now, your name is on my list. When I send you the next email, I get 100 or 95 of the, of the donation. Okay? So that the. So the credit card processing fees are. Because on first pass I was able to raise that much money with the people we came into contact with, but they took a big piece of it. Now to go back to your question about anti Semitism, because I think it might be the most important one. When I, when I announced my campaign in 2022, I did it in front of the Federal Reserve. I was trying to run against ilhan Omar for CD5 congressional district 5, basically greater Minneapolis. And that's actually where the Fed is located, downtown Minneapolis on Hennepin. So. So when I announced my campaign, my run for Congress, I did it in front of the Fed and the Star Tribune, which is the local newspaper record here in Minneapolis, asked me about globalism and my. And you can go look this up for anybody who wants to fact check me. The. The article's still up. They asked me what I meant by globalism and I said it's an economic attack on the nation state and its citizens, mostly the working class. They wrote that globalism, to even say globalism is a dog whistle for antisemitism. And that just blew my mind. I mean it just, it blew my mind. And it's something that's carried on alongside of me because the Republican Party has this strange obsession with Israel in which they are unable to see the very obvious contradiction in how they talk about all other issues except this one. And I just won't do that with them. Now do I recognize the biblical significance of Israel? Absolutely. Do I have Jewish friends? Yes. One of my business partners and my co host on Please Call Me Crazy Sometimes is David Penn. Professor Penny has a great podcast too. He's a Ukrainian Jew. He's like family to me. So I have a bunch of people in my life who are Jewish who are like family to me, really. So I'm not anti Semitic at all. But it is an example of how they. And I don't mean they as in the liberal left media, they'll piggyback off of it. But this was that. That was more intended to disenfranchise me to the. The Republican evangelical voter out there who hears anything anti Semitic and they automatically turn the channel.

[Stephen A. Smith]

So essentially because I got to get ready to get on out of here. But that's the bad news. The good news is that, my brother, this will not be the last time you will be on this show. I don't play that mess. I'm fair minded. What I don't understand, I don't understand. I'm open about it. I admit It. And I'm open to learning from both sides of the aisle. That's me. And by the way, ain't nobody gonna silence your voice on this show. Everything you said is gonna go. It's gonna be over the airwaves. Trust me on that. All right, let me end this by asking you this question, though. You just talked about the GOP establishment, essentially, and to some degree, that's against you. You know how the left would feel about you, because you're on the opposite aisle. All right. When you consider the climate that we're living in, how are you gonna get it done? How are you gonna win this election in Minnesota?

[Royce White]

Well, brother, I appreciate you having me on, and I'll come back on anytime. I love what you're doing. I love that you're starting to have, you know, descending voices on the, on the platform and show. I can't tell you how important it is, and I can't tell you how grateful I really am, because it's not about me. It's about the entire conversation being opened up to some things that people need to hear. And this is probably most important. Royce.

[Stephen A. Smith]

I never had this platform before when I was doing sports. You know, I mean, if you, if you look at, if you look at the diversity that comes on espn, I got a lot to do with that. I have this platform that I own and operate, and I'm getting into politics. I never had to do it before. So this, I've always been this guy. I've always been willing to listen to both sides.

[Royce White]

Thank you, and I appreciate it greatly. And look, this GOP thing is probably the most important. The, the mainstream media for. For so long has created a WWE politics narrative where you have Republicans and Democrats and they hate each other. They fight mostly the uni party of Republicans and Democrats who protect the Post World War II Democrat liberal order, or what they call the International Rules Based Order, work together behind the scenes to create legislation that destroy the value of American citizenship. I stand against that unit party. And so what the GOP has functioned as is a. And Donald Trump has changed this. He took it over. He punched him in the gut, and now they have to eat crow and bend the knee. And I kind of enjoy watching it because they all tried to take him out. And this was Christie and Romney and Cheney. I mean, how did the Democrats ever side with Dick Cheney? The guy is a convicted. He's. He should be a convicted war criminal, and he's definitely a warmonger.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Iraq.

[Royce White]

But anyway, the, the point is that what they functioned as is a vanguard to keep minorities out of the Republican Party. They are the outer bastion of New world order. The. The Minnesota gop. This is what they tell you. We got to get new voters, we got to get new Republicans. But they don't want to go down into the Twin Cities. And then they'll say, well, Royce has too many Twin Cities roots. We can't trust that he's actually Republican. And then the white, rural Republicans who are Christian or whatever else the case may be, libertarian, whatever, when they try and come into the party after being motivated by Donald Trump's, you know, movement, they try and keep them out. So what are they actually functioning as? They are functioning as the controlled opposition intended to make sure black people, young black men specifically, never find their way into the party. They should have rightfully always been in and had a very, very important influence in. And guess what? I'm not here to fight that battle with the entirety of American politics. All I can do in Minnesota and on your show and anywhere else, tell people the truth, give you the facts, the history, Post World War II Democrat, liberal order. This was the. The restructuring of the global finance system, Bretton woods conference, the World bank, the dollar, and all of the other stuff in between. Right. Mostly predicated on national security and foreign policy. You know, and this was when you said allies early. I don't want to go back to that. We'll talk about another time. But when you said our allies, I'm not so sure they're our allies. Okay, Europe. The European Union has to. Has to decide the fate of the European Union, and it can't be on the backs of the American working class, because the Europeans have a working class that need to pay up as well. So that's what we're fighting against. That's what I'm fighting against. I appreciate the time. I don't know if I can win in Minnesota, but I'm 34 years old. I started early for a reason. I'm going to keep going until my heart stops beating and I tell the truth. And guess what? The people get to decide. If. If you want to vote for another Amy Klobuchar, then I tell people, hey, you get the government you deserve. I guarantee you this. I would represent people in a much more honest way than maybe any politician that I could. That I could name.

[Stephen A. Smith]

I can respect that. I have to listen to that. I can't ignore that. Last question. Very last question. I need a quick answer here, Royce. I'm gonna put you on the spot. There is no MAGA movement. There is no Donald Trump, which side would you fall on? Considering what you said about the left and what you said about the gop, if there were no Donald Trump, Steve Bannon, MAGA movement, which side would you. Would you favor?

[Royce White]

I mean, I'm so close to Steve Bannon, it's hard for me to say that.

[Stephen A. Smith]

No, no, I'm saying if you. I say if you take. I say if you take him away, take him out of the mix, take Trump out of the mix, take MAGA out of the mix, is just a conventional GOP that you decried. And the left, who you rolling with?

[Royce White]

Well, without Donald Trump, I'd have to say I'd run independent, or I would have tried to fight my way up to the top of the Democrat Party and been smacked down the way I think you may run into, actually. In fact, if you run on the Democrat side, but I'd have to say independent. And I probably would have had a very tough time winning as an independent in any office all across the country, because the party or the independent just doesn't have that political power and machine and sort of tribalness to it. But without a Donald Trump, the Republican Party is the Republican Party of George Bush. And there is no greater threat to freedom and American stability than the neocon warmongering of the George Bush types in the Republican Party.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Wow. Royce White, candidate for senator for the state of Minnesota. Man, listen, I didn't expect this kind of conversation. I wanted to introduce you to my audience as a potential senator in 2026. I can't tell you how much I enjoy talking to you. We'll get into what you've been critical about me with next time and all when we got more time. But I'm all good with you. I mean, I think that what you're saying is you've given us a lot of food for thought, man, and I sincerely thank you for that. And this will not be the last time I will have you on, because I think America needs to hear more of what you have to say, especially before the election. As we look forward to picking our politicians, electing them, holding them accountable, et cetera. We need to hear from people like you more. So you always have a home on this show. My brother, thank you so much for being on the show, and I'll talk to you soon.

[Royce White]

Thank you, brother. Godspeed to you. Appreciate it. Amen.

[Stephen A. Smith]

Talk to you soon. One and only Royce White, right here with Stephen A. Smith at AND T has a new guarantee, because most things in life are not guaranteed, like getting through self checkout by yourself. Not guaranteed In a world where nothing is guaranteed, AT T is bringing something new to the table. AT T is introducing a guarantee with connectivity you can depend on, deals you want and service you deserve or they make it right. Learn [e-mail] guarantee@t connecting changes everything. Terms and conditions apply. Visit att.com guarantee for detail.

[Royce White]

Welcome to AutoZone. What are you working on today?

[Stephen A. Smith]

My car is making this noise. Sometimes it's like and sometimes it's like.

[Royce White]

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[Stephen A. Smith]

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[Royce White]

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