#739 - Sales Training, Scaling, and Breaking Objections: Tai Lopez with Johnny Mau

Summary

The Tai Lopez Show – Episode #739

Guest: Johnny Ma
Date: September 11, 2025

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Tai Lopez hosts Johnny Ma, a young entrepreneur and sales leader collecting over $1 million monthly on his sales floor. The discussion dives deep into sales team building, sales training, leveraging AI, personal branding for competitive advantage, and practical objection-handling strategies. Tai shares insights from top business books, personal stories, and the significance of building predictable, scalable, and resilient business systems. Johnny expands on actionable frameworks for sales success, team structure, tech, and building mental resilience in salespeople.

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Main Themes & Purpose

• Escaping Competition and Creating a “Monopoly”
  Tai emphasizes how to use personal brands and AI as the dominant strategies to ensure business success and lasting profit, inspired by Peter Thiel’s book Zero to One.

• Building High-Performing Sales Teams
  Johnny Ma details his approach to developing a sales floor, training new reps, and scaling from startup to seven-figure monthly revenues.

• Sales Techniques and Objection Handling
  Both share hard-hitting, tactical advice for effectively closing deals, managing objections, structuring calls, and maximizing sales conversions—especially for high-ticket offers.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Power of Personal Branding and AI

Tai’s Book Recommendations & Take:

• Peter Thiel’s Zero to One – Read yearly for strategy inspiration. Tai emphasizes, “You don’t want a level playing field. You want a monopoly. Competition eventually destroys all profits.” [04:10]
• Building Your Monopoly: Personal branding is the only “legal monopoly.” AI and personal branding are the only future-proof business models:

  "The only two things that'll make money long term is AI brands and personal brands." [08:55]

• Predictable future trends are demographics, AI, and tech. Get in early or be left behind.

2. Sales Floor Structure and Scaling Up

Johnny Ma’s Journey:

• Started following Tai at 18; now collects over $1 million/month on a 12-person sales floor. [19:02]
• Goal: Scale to $4 million/month managed revenue, split across multiple businesses/offers.
• Recommends spreading skills through training and “taking a piece out of every single person.” [19:37]
• Stress on clear commissions (5-20%), and supplementing with personal offers (e.g., 350k/month coaching).

Tai’s Philosophy:
“You can only sell so much alone. If you have 10, 20 people, you can scale.” [19:03]

3. Sales Training & Mental Resilience

• First lesson for new salespeople: "I want them to understand how difficult it's going to be... being told no consistently is one of the most important skills to have." – Johnny Ma [29:34]
• Kinetic Energy Transfer:
  “If you're on the phone and you don't sound energetic... that's transferring right through the phone... Humans don't make decisions logically.” – Tai Lopez [31:22]
• Conviction & congruency matter: Handle money objections only if you’re congruent in life (“If you can't keep promises to yourself, it's hard to persuade others”). [32:35]

4. Objection Handling Techniques

• On "Send me an email":
  “What are you looking for more information on? Because that's not the real objection.” – Johnny Ma [34:18]
• Tai’s direct approach: “Email is where deals go to die. You want help or not?” [34:28]
• On "Let me think about it":
  Johnny: “Do you feel like what we went over could get you where you want to go?”—leading to the core fear, usually fear of failure.
  Tai: "Would you still have to think if you KNEW you'd get success?" [36:37]
• Overcoming Price Objections:
  Johnny reframes the role of money, labels procrastination, and uses NLP to drive resourcefulness. “Does you not having the money or it being too tight mean you're not willing to find a way?” [39:52]

5. Sales Tech Stack and Process

• Uses Close CRM, custom-builds AI agent for call reviews and sales coaching. [43:04]
• Lead follow-up cadence: Call in first 5 minutes, and at scheduled intervals; use human DMs, WhatsApp, and iMessage for personalized touches.
• Triage and Qualification:
  A triage team calls within 3 minutes of booking, qualifies, builds anticipation, and group-chats prospect with a closer to increase show rates. [47:07]
• Show and Contact Rates:
  “The hardest thing in the modern world right now is just getting people that can answer. On first dial, only about 10% reach rate.” – Johnny [50:08]
  Good show rate: 70-80% for booked calls considered best-in-class. [49:38]

6. Scaling with Financing & Payment Plans

• Johnny prefers “Split It” and “Elective” for client financing—crucial for increasing conversions on high-ticket sales.
• Minimum down payments, interest-free installments, and creative solutions to lower financial barriers.

7. Remote vs. In-Person Sales Teams

• Johnny leans toward in-person sales floors for maximum energy and culture, specifically in Scottsdale, AZ due to talent density. [41:03]
• Tai agrees cities like Miami, San Diego, London, and Dubai are top picks for big sales team HQ.

8. Lead Generation & Outreach

• Johnny’s company started all-organic, went to $1M+ in 4 months. Now adding paid ads.
• DM voice memos favored over canned videos; highly personalize outreach and follow-up based on age and prospect profile.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Tai Lopez [04:10]:
  “Forget what everybody says. You don't want a level playing field, you want a monopoly. Competition eventually destroys all profits.”

• Tai Lopez [08:55]:
  “The only two things that’ll make money long term are AI brands and personal brands. If you’re not in one, you’ll get wrecked.”

• Johnny Ma [29:34]:
  “Being able to be told no consistently time after time after time is one of the most important skills to have, especially in sales.”

• Tai Lopez [31:22]:
  “Sales is kinetic energy transfer. If you don't sound energetic or confident, that's transferring right through the phone.”

• Johnny Ma [32:50]:
  “You can't handle money objections if you live in scarcity. People see that lack of conviction.”

• Tai Lopez [34:28]:
  “Email is where deals go to die. You want help or not? Let's talk real.”

• Johnny Ma [39:52]:
  “Does you not having the money or it being too tight mean you're not willing to find a way?” (on using NLP and identity to close)

• Tai Lopez [45:04]:
  “If you call in the first five minutes, you get like 100x chance of reaching them.”

• Johnny Ma [54:09]:
  “We did 350 [thousand] last month. Is that collected or cash? Yeah, I only count cash collected. Bird in the hand is better than two in the bush.”

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Important Timestamps

• 00:00 - Tai’s opening story about his student’s business transformation.
• 04:10 - Insights on Zero to One and escaping competition.
• 08:55 - The centrality of AI & Personal branding.
• 19:02 - Johnny’s journey: building a sales floor, hitting $1M/month.
• 29:34 - Johnny’s first lesson for new salespeople—embracing rejection.
• 31:22 - Tai on “kinetic energy transfer.”
• 34:18-36:08 - Live objection handling demonstrations (“Send me info,” “let me think”).
• 39:15-40:10 - Johnny’s frameworks for handling price and financial objections.
• 43:04 - Tech stack: custom AI, cadence, and rapid-fire follow-up systems.
• 45:04 - Tai’s principle: “Call leads in first five minutes.”
• 49:38 - Show rate benchmarking for booked sales calls.
• 54:09 - Johnny on cash collection and company growth metrics.

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Conclusion

This episode offers a masterclass in scaling sales, handling objections, leveraging the latest tech, and building personal business moats. The interplay between Tai's macro-strategy perspective and Johnny's frontline tactics makes the conversation both inspiring and highly practical for entrepreneurs aiming to scale up sales teams or break into high-ticket sales.

For more, find the show notes and links at:

TaiLopez.com/johnny-podcast
Or text/WhatsApp [phone] with the keyword "JOHNNY".

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Transcript

[Tai Lopez]

One of my students, four years ago he was having to eat out of dumpsters. This year he's doing 44 million with 10 million profit. He's 26.

[Johnny Ma]

I was initially cold calling to realtors to sell the marketing. I had like $70 to my name.

[Tai Lopez]

Get what everybody says. You don't want a level playing field. You want a monopoly. Competition eventually destroys all profits. You're in sales, you got to be putting an AI angle to it and a personal brand.

[Johnny Ma]

You give someone like that and put them onto a sales floor, they I guarantee that they would see at least 20 to 30k a month within the next like 2 years here in my garage.

[Tai Lopez]

Welcome today to the Tai Lopez show. I have a special guest, Johnny Ma. We're talking sales teams how at 22 he's collecting a million a month. Welcome to the show.

[Johnny Ma]

What's going on?

[Tai Lopez]

Yeah, I'm going to talk about this book everybody should be reading. If you're not reading 0 to 1, what are you even doing? Are you even trying to make money? This book has the endorsement on the back of Elon Musk and Mark Zuckerberg. So two guys that made about as much money as any human ever. I read this every year, annually. Nassim Taleb says don't read any book unless you plan to read it multiple times. This is a book that I read once a year. So all you trying to make money. Peter Thiel is an absolute beast of a guy. He's really. He started PayPal and then Elon Musk merged he his ex company. So this is One of the OGs of the modern, you know, Internet make money venture capital. He started Founders fund with another guy named Ken Howery. A friend of mine, Ken who is one of the biggest VC fund they funded everything. They funded Uber, they Airbnb. So he's a multi billionaire. Some say he's the highest IQ entrepreneur in the world. I just wanted to give a shout out to this book because I'm, you know it's a new year so I read it every year. Look at the he's got good this if you write a book this is a good set of endorsements. Mark Zuckerberg and Elon Musk. Zuckerberg says this book delivers completely new and refreshing ideas on how to create value in the world. Zuckerberg's the only man to ever be worth 100 million under 37. Elon Musk wrote Peter Thiel has built multiple breakthrough companies and zero to one shows how. Nassim Taleb, author of the Black Swan when A risk taker writes a book, read it. In the case of Peter Thiel, read it twice or to be safe, three times. This is a classic. So every chapter. He's a very interesting thinker. One of the things is how to escape competition, right? His big thing is, forget what everybody says. You don't want a level playing field, you want a monopoly. Competition eventually destroys all profits. That's why you see big companies eventually disappear, like BlackBerry, you know, they disappeared. You see, Yahoo used to be worth 100, Bill, plus nothing. Now there's a lot of the companies that you see now will just disappear because they couldn't escape competition. So I tell people, the average entrepreneur, so I tell people, go all in on building your personal brand because legally you're not technically in the Western world allowed to have a monopoly, right? Bill Gates billed Microsoft, he got sued by the US government, antitrust fought them for 10 years, kind of won, kind of lost. You see, Mark Zuckerberg had all this antitrust stuff with Mark, with owning Facebook, Instagram and WhatsApp. Of course, Rockefeller had. It's named after antitrust, is named after Rockefeller. They broke up his big oil company and now you have companies. I forget the companies. It's like Shell Oil, Exxon, they all came out of this one huge empire. So the legal way that you can build a monopoly where actually the laws on your side is a personal brand. You're not allowed to take somebody's likeness and make money without their express permission or sharing the money with them. So if you can build a real personal brand. That's the reason I went all in on personal brand in 09. Even before I read this book, Zero to One, I was like, okay, how do we escape competition? Now, there's different theories on how to escape competition. One way you escape competition is through doing really hard things because the average person will not follow if you do something hard. I was talking to an entrepreneur yesterday and he's doing like 100 million. And he's like, okay, how can I crack this code? And he's like, what's the easy way to crack the code? I said, well, if it's easy, it won't make a lot of money in the long run. So number one, you escape by being excited about something that's super hard. Now the best is if it's super hard for the whole world, but super easy for you. That's a great way to escape competition if you're good at public speaking. There's a great one. The average human's biggest two fears are cancer Public speaking, which is mind blowing to me because for me, public speaking always came easy. So for me, that's why I went into the personal brand space, because I can escape competition through doing something that's easy for me but hard for most people. That, that's the dream. Sometimes you got to find something that's hard for others and hard for you. If you really want to make 10 billion net worth, you're gonna have to do something that's hard for everybody else and hard for you. But if you just want to make 10 million to a billion net worth, you can find things that are hard for others but easy for you. Number two way you escape competition is literally by forming a monopoly, which kind of is illegal, but you already see monopolies forming. Like Google is essentially a monopoly. How many people here go, oh, let me Bing it like nobody bings, right? How many people say, oh, let me lift. Grab a Lyft. Most people say, let's Uber. Uber's become a verb. So effectively, I think Uber controls 70% of the rideshare market. So if you, the thing about creating a legal monopoly, a, you're always under the potential chance the US government attacks you or European Union, wherever you are. All western countries have antitrust laws. But number two, it takes a lot of capital. So Uber was crazy capitalized. These are companies that had, you know, a bill, multiple billions every round. Rage. Chat TBT is trying to escape competition by doing really hard things and taking a lot of capital. Now they have competition, but not really the average person. When they think of AI, they don't think of Claude. They don't think of, you know, perplexity. They, they think of ChatGPT. So that's the third thing you can do to escape competition, is get in early and make a name for yourself. It just, that won't last forever. But the fourth one is the one I said at the beginning. Build a personal brand. Because the one legal thing that's hard for other people to do but easy for you to be yourself, you don't need a lot of capital for it, right? And you know, it's one of those ones you don't have to worry about. I mean, you are a first mover on yourself. So if you're not building your personal brand, like I'll put in the show notes tylerpuzzle.com podcast calendar. And if you're doing seven or eight figures already and you want me and my team to grow your personal brand and monetize it, that's, you know, ChatGPT says I'm number one or number two in history @ knowing how to do that, especially in the business space. So all you entrepreneurs, you want to learn how to build a legal monopoly that escapes competition, has huge profit margins. One of my students, I won't say who because you all know him, dude, he has 80% of profit margins. So if he does 40 million a year, he keeps 30 of it. That's rare. Why? Complete personal brand built around going viral. So you know, he's one of my students, he's like you. He started with me when he was a teenager and now he's just stacking tens of millions of cash every year. So that was, that was a classic example. Mr. Beast is the only billionaire under 30 who's self made. He's also somebody, Mr. Beast who's been through my programs when he was, you know, teenager and he escaped competition by just being Mr. Beast. By number two, he did all of them. Number number two, he built a competitive moat by raising capital to do his. Some of his YouTube videos cost three to six million dollars to produce. So that, that's. And he does hard things, that's easy for him. He understands the YouTube algorithm, thumbnails, how to write out a really compelling viral video. Most people, that's super hard. But if you look now and I told it's funny, I had a call with a guy in 2015, I said man, we should build a VC fund. Just get creators influencers to like sell us a part of their business. And they were like, no, you want to have faceless companies, you want to have corporations, they make all the money. I was like, yeah, that's 2015. You got to be thinking ahead for the future. What made you money? Like Warren Buffett said, what made him money in 1979 didn't work in 1980. What made him money in 1980 didn't work in 1981. He had to become a learning adapting machine. So I wish that it's a guy I know well. I feel like calling him and be like, you still think it's not a good idea to invest in influencers influencer based businesses. Logan Paul, he has, you know his drink company prime, he's also one of my students. He was in my SMMA program and learned social media marketing although he was already good at it. But he was, he was one of my first students when I launch smma. That's a billion valuation company he owns a piece of and just use his face. And the one thing no one else can be is Logan Paul. I think Jake Paul's made 3,400 million dollars not only in social media, but boxing. That's all boxing's personal brand. So personal brand. The only two things that'll make money long term is AI brands and personal brands. So if you're in a business, you've got to ask yourself right now if you're making money and you're not an AI tech company. Okay, I try to check both boxes. I have AI tech company.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Boom.

[Tai Lopez]

I've been a tech company before. Click funnels existed in whatever 2014, I built my first. I built my own Click Funnels in 2007. 6 I started building it. So tech. I got that box checked. Personal brand. But you got to have one of those boxes or you're going to get wrecked. You'll see next 10 years, you'll. You'll be extinct just like a dinosaur. You got to check one of those two boxes, preferably both. If you look at, for example, Mark Zuckerberg, he's really going hard on his personal brand and he's going high on it. Hard on AI. Richest man in the world, Elon Musk. He just did a raise for his AI company at 80 billion valuation. Xai and he built his personal brand. He's posting every day. He's on podcasts, he's on. I mean, he's one of the most visible people in the world. So tech, he's. He checks both box tech. But you got to check one. So you got to have a hard audit of yourself because those. That's the only predictable things for the future. You know, it's hard is very. In general, there's another book, I don't have it here. You know, this Black swan book by Nassim Taleb. People suck at predicting the future. Every day out you try, it's easy to predict tomorrow. It's hard to hold. Much harder to predict one year from now. And it's really hard to predict 10 years. But the only predictions you can do reliably is demographics. That doesn't change quickly because babies take a long time to be born. So we can predict, you know, population effects. The world's getting older, for example, so if you're in home health care, you can make a lot of money because there can be a lot of senior citizens that don't have kids to take care of them. So you can predict demographic is easy. Tech, you can kind of predict because there's a thing called Moore's law, which means tech essentially grows on an exponential curve. So if you see chat GBT, chat GPT really AI really only got smart in like January, maybe December 2024, with agentic, agent, AI, that really the computing power wasn't there till December 2024, let's say hypothetically, so but we can predict now it's going to start growing. Like by December 2025, 26, it might be right now, I think AI's chat GBT's estimated IQ is 1100, which is insane, dude. Albert Einstein's 175 estimate. 180. When you read, by the way, when you read people. I see people on social media. This guy has a 200 IQ. No, he doesn't. No, that's not. Stanford Binet does not go to 200. It's bullshit. But Einstein was 175. There's maybe the only person maybe as smart as Einstein would be. Sir Isaac Newton was probably smart. I'm actually reading a book. I think it won the Pulitzer Prize on Sir Isaac Newton. He was freaking. You're talking 1500s. Dad died, mom deserted him, no special school. You know, he calculated the tides with the force of the moon, and he never went to the ocean in his life. He could simulate it in his own brain. So anyway, Einstein, Newton, together, though, maybe Newton was a 200 IQ. And AI already is 1000, maybe 1100 IQ. What will it be in two years, 10 years? I can kind of predict. Unless humans blow ourselves off the planet. Assuming humans and electricity still here and nuclear power still is working, it might have a 80,000 IQ, which basically means it'll cure cancer. It will figure out a way we can fly around the world in an hour. It's gonna figure out, I mean, theoretically, a lot. Most quantum physicists don't think we'll ever be able to go back in time, but 10,000 IQ would figure out a way to do a quantum leap, most likely. So anyway, bringing it back to reality here, you got a window here in the next year or two. You got to adapt to either personal brand or AI tech company. So whatever you're doing, like you're in sales. If you're in sales, you got to be putting an AI angle to it. And a personal brand, ideally, check both boxes. If you check both boxes, you have a chance to be worth, you know, a hundred million to ten billion. Really, you have no limit if you have checked both of those boxes. But if you only check one, you can be worth, let's say, 10 to 100 million, realistically so. And people that don't have those, I would bet against them, man. I bet that they're going to make money and then all of a sudden business is going to get too hard and like zero to one says the competition. Just think about ads right now. Think about Facebook ads. Okay, you can run Facebook ads. I'm good at Facebook ads and YouTube ads. And you can do it profitably. What happens when some AI comes in and can create 20,000 creatives in 20 seconds, run them and manage them all. It's gonna saturate out. I don't even know what will happen to the ad platform. That's why I double down on ads and organic personal brand. Same with personal brand. Now there's all these dudes running accounts with beautiful women that don't exist. They're just AI women. Drives them into only fans. There's tons of dudes making, you know, 10 to 50,000amonth with non real. So that's gonna saturate out social media too. That's why I don't just build my personal brand just on social media. I do live events, in person stuff just in my mastermind. So you really gotta go into AI and personal brand diversified because it'll everything gonna start saturating. I used to be able to buy Google clicks in 2001 on AdWords for 20 cents. And I remember saying to myself, this is expensive. I'm like, I gotta pay them a quarter essentially. What if the person doesn't buy, right? It was like not many people were doing ads. It was like the beta program of Google Ads. And now today I did a call with a guy who spent a million on 7 million on Google Ads for 1 million clicks. That's $7 a click. So it's going from 20 cents because of competition, it's gone up essentially 35x. So back then I could spend 20 cents a click. Cost me about $200 to acquire a customer that bought a $1,500 product for me. So with no skills, with no sales floor, with nothing, you could do seven roas. Very few people at scale, not a lot of people are doing seven roas anymore. This is very. If people tell you they're doing seven row as it's bullshit. They're gonna do it for like a month at low spend. So. But you used to be able to. So that's why I say get in early. It's still relatively early in AI is still relatively early in personal brand, not super early in personal brand. Like I said when I started my personal brand 2009, I rolled out a podcast. I don't know a year or two later. And I remember being like, oh, I think I'm too late, man. I told somebody, I was like, it's too late to launch a podcast. There was like three business podcasts. There was like, Tim Ferriss, Gary Vee, and me. And I was like, oh, I think it's too late now. There's 5 million podcasts with at least, let's say a hundred thousand business ones. So we're in the. You're. You're about to go into the second phase of personal AI is in phase one, though. So people. One of my. One of my students built an AI app nine months ago. He's doing 2 million a month. He's on 2.5 now, just in Wall Street Journal. So there's going to be this Rush gold mine for two years, you know. But I want to introduce my guest. That's enough for my monologue. That's my Johnny Carson monologue. What? That was 18 minutes. That's good timing. Tedx. Ted talks. I did one. I did a Tedx. You have to do exactly 18 minutes. So that was almost to the second. I got weston. I got second nature for 18 minutes. Actually, based on science, the average person, the longest they can pay attention to a rant is about 18 minutes. Right? So there you go. Okay, so I want to introduce my guest, Johnny Ma. He has a sales floor. He started following me when you were 18, right?

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah, yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

Lives in Miami. So he has a sales floor. He also trains people in sales. But his sales floor. You're collecting a million a month.

[Johnny Ma]

We are.

[Tai Lopez]

You know, I told people a couple years ago, I was like, you know, a good business, especially if you're extroverted. Build a fucking sales floor. Find 5, 10 good people who sell, train them a little bit, and take a piece of what they sell then. Cause in sales, you know, if it's just you alone, you can only sell. You can't work 24 hours a day. But if you have 10, 20 people. So how many people, by the way, welcome to the show.

[Johnny Ma]

Thank you.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

Good to be here.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

Good.

[Tai Lopez]

Four years after you start following me, you're here.

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah, yeah, exactly. So I think we have about 12 salespeople right now.

[Tai Lopez]

Nice.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

So just literally translating my skill set to every single one of them. And just like you said, just take a piece out of every single person.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

So what's your goal? What do you think you'll make this year? You going for seven figures, eight figures this year in.

[Johnny Ma]

Personally?

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

This year I'll probably make like 1.5.

[Tai Lopez]

That's good. And then 22 making 1.5. When I was 22, I was milking cows on an Amish farm and I was making. I had sold a business. My first business, I sold it when I was 19, and I made $10,000. So I had, like, saved up 17. I had 17 grand at your age. You're way ahead of me. 1.5 million. So that's good. It's good you're in Miami, so you don't have to pay state tax.

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah, I didn't even realize that, honestly, when I moved there. Yeah, it's great.

[Tai Lopez]

Hey, you're about to get an awakening when you have to pay.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

Your first tax bill. You haven't had to pay tax on.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

It yet, have you?

[Johnny Ma]

No, I have not. I'm. I'm.

[Tai Lopez]

Set some money aside.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

IRS is a scam of epic proportions. You know, American sales tax used to be. I read a book. The founder of Radio Shack, his dad rioted in the streets of Texas in the early 1900s. When tax went to 1% or 2%, it went up 1%. Income tax went from 1% to 2%. People out in the streets, we've been boiled like frogs. You know, you slowly cook them, and now people are like, oh, I don't only have to pay 39% tax anyway. You'll know. You'll know you rich when you got to write a seven figure check. I remember writing my first seven figure check to the IRS and be like, what the fuck this? I'm like, nobody helped me. Nobody deserves this much. Like, that's. That's B.S. elon Musk had to pay 11 billion in one year. How'd you like that tax bill? I have two guys your age in my private mentor program. They did over 300 million last year with over almost 50 million of profit. And they had to pay. They. They wired an eight figure wire to the irs. They didn't tax plan correctly. And I was like, dude, you paid an extra 10mil. But anyway, they still made a lot. They still walked with eight figures each, but. So that's. That's your new goal, man. Eight figures, 300 million.

[Johnny Ma]

Oh, my gosh, 50 million profit. I'm going for it. We'll see what we can do. This year we're trying to get to like 4 million under management by the end of the year.

[Tai Lopez]

There you go. So 4 million a month collected.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

And you take a cut of that, right?

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah. So the fee will start at 5% up to 20%. But then a part of that is also my own company.

[Tai Lopez]

Yes.

[Johnny Ma]

Where we'll do like 350k a month roughly. But the profit is high on that because it's like just like you said, personal brand.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

So you have two businesses. One is sales floors for other companies and one is your. Where you train. Because I have a sales training program too. I launched it in 2016. Used to be called the green belt program. I don't know why I called it green belt, but now it's called the black belt program. Green belt is lower than black belt. But anyway, so let me ask you this in your experience because a lot of entrepreneurs listening and watching, they realize they need a sales floor. Like I divide business in 14 divisions and division five is social media team, division six is the paid ads team and division seven is the sales team. Right. And a lot of businesses don't have a Division 7. And by the way, Division 7 is not just phone team. If you're doing high ticket sales. Million bucks. I got guys who go in person. I got one of my guys going to close a million dollar deal. He's going to go golf with the guy. So sales is at. There's a lot of business owners. What have you seen in some of the clients you have where you just transformed it by supercharging a team to sell? They sell high ticket stuff mostly. What's, what's the typical price?

[Johnny Ma]

Anywhere from 8 to 15,000. Typically.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

And what industries are you in? Are you selling for? Is it pretty wide variety?

[Johnny Ma]

So obviously we have our sales training. We have a business coaching one.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yep.

[Johnny Ma]

And then we have a content content coaching offer and then a trading offer as well.

[Tai Lopez]

So you're doing like forex or stock trading. What's your favorite thing? Let me ask you this question. You had to shut down. Hypothetical. You couldn't do anything else. You could only sell one product. That's very specific. At one price point you couldn't even have split levels, one price. What do you think? Wouldn't. What would you do? What would you choose? What industry and what price point?

[Johnny Ma]

I think I would still do sales coaching. Sales coaching plus like placement for probably like 5,000 or 6,000.

[Tai Lopez]

So you like that five to six?

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah, I like higher but if it's more, if it's more mass market then it's definitely gonna have to be lower.

[Tai Lopez]

Do you, what do you think of financing now? Because there's all these companies, klarna, affirm, so on and so forth that people can plug into. Do you, are you a big fan of financing stuff?

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah, I think it's amazing. I would love to Start a financing company. But I think, I don't know that. I saw this one stat the other day where it's like there's so many people who are in my age group and they put everything on Klarna, which is madness.

[Tai Lopez]

Yeah, but yeah, coachella. They said 60% of people bought their Coachella tickets they made on a payment. But I saw Chipotle. Now you can do buy now, pay later. I'm like, who the fuck? If you can't afford a burrito, go cook at home. Don't be putting payment plans on Chipotle. I hate Chipotle. Chipotle is bad for you anyway. Dude, they put the worst oils ever. I don't know how people like Chipotle. You can tell Chipotle is not a sponsor of my podcast. If you say I hate something so you like. So anyone you like specifically. Are you a Klarna guy? A firm? Which ones?

[Johnny Ma]

Split it. Split it. For sure.

[Tai Lopez]

You like that one?

[Johnny Ma]

Split it. And elective. Elective, yeah, electives. A different one. So they can. It really helps because we can get people on. When they have above a 650 credit score, we can usually split their payments up between like 3, 6, 9 or 12 months.

[Tai Lopez]

Do they have to put anything down?

[Johnny Ma]

Usually they have to put down. So it's all interest free. So if I sell them for 8,000, they're going to put down something like 700.

[Tai Lopez]

Gotcha. So I got to put like 10%.

[Johnny Ma]

Down and then we'll get basically the painful amount minus a percent.

[Tai Lopez]

Yeah, that's a great. I mean, I think my main thing is you got to be careful with debt. Like I said, using debt for a burrito, bad idea. Because you have alternatives. Right? But using debt for training, to learn how to make money, even though a lot of the world thinks it's a scam, I think I just had one of them. I just post on my Instagram story this weekend at my mastermind, one of my students, four years ago he was having to eat out of dumpsters. He's from Argentina to supplement his food. He was effect. He wasn't quite homeless. But if you're dumpster diving, you're not doing that well. This year he's doing 44 million with an engraving pen business with 10 million profit. He's 26. So I tell people, if you can invest money into training some kind of business skill, whether it's you. You train in sales. I do that too. Learning marketing, learning AI automations, learning simple businesses too. There's other building sales floors. So with 10. So with 10 people selling, you take on how many businesses? Three, four.

[Johnny Ma]

Four, including mine.

[Tai Lopez]

Do they. Do you split the team up and like two guys just sell for this offer?

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah, yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

We initially experimented with. We just had a rotating sales floor. So it's like we had all 10 people and they would just kind of get on different accounts and rotate through. But that was a terrible idea. So we ended up just having certain people on certain accounts and they'll stay there. And we almost just like. I'm trying to get to the point where it's building an insurance model inside of those different companies. Like there's this one company I know that's doing that right now for fitness coaching. So they do like quite a few. Quite a few millions. And they, they do like a whole. The front end sales supplements and then they have insurance style sales teams. So they'll have obviously like someone with their downline, someone's above them and they're just ripping dials to people who buy supplements and are upselling them onto fitness coaching programs. And they have a full insurance downline on it and they have.

[Tai Lopez]

So like a marketing kind of thing. They put an angle.

[Johnny Ma]

It's almost like it's current buyers of the supplement.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

Obviously when someone wants supplements, they're probably looking to take health more seriously.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

So they have an entire sales floor, like insurance style. Hundred sales managers. Because you can't manage a team that big with one person.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah, yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

So they're all just ripping dials to these people and upselling them onto fitness programs.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

So it's pretty nice.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah, yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

That's a V shred does that company. I mean, it's crazy. I got a friend of mine in Puerto Rico and moved to Puerto Rico. He's making so much money, I think he's gonna make 350 million this year. And he's in the supplements, but he also has an education angle, so. Okay, so for now let's switch gears for something from business owners. I also have people watching me that want to learn. I have a very broad audience. I have people that are doing. Today I was on the phone with two, two guys. One was doing 95 million a year and one was doing. I don't even remember. But then I have people that are like, hey Ty, I'm living India and I'm homeless or whatever. So for the people I remember what it's like to have no money. I tell people if you're remotely extroverted and you're broke, best thing is to learn high ticket sales so what is, what do you think if I brought you a brand new person? They're extroverted, they have energy, they're ready to go. What do you train them? What's the first one lesson you're like, I want you to know, I, I'll tell you mine, I'll share mine, but I want to hear yours. What do you train is like kind of lesson number one.

[Johnny Ma]

I want, I want them to understand how difficult it's going to be because I think being able to be told no consistently time after time after time.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

Is one of the most important skills to have, especially in sales. Because at the beginning you're terrible. I remember when I started I had like $70 to my name and I was, I was getting just slapped around on the phones and without the resilience, I was initially cold calling to realtors to sell the marketing.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Okay.

[Johnny Ma]

Full cycle to closing. It was the worst job of my life.

[Tai Lopez]

And do you make any money in it?

[Interviewer/Assistant]

No.

[Johnny Ma]

Oh God no. No, I was, it was right when I dropped out of college and so it was, it was a really rough six months so I was doing that. But yeah, I think the resilience to be able to handle. No. And continue to persevere when you're not seeing results.

[Tai Lopez]

Right.

[Johnny Ma]

You give someone like that and put them onto a sales floor, I guarantee that they would see at least 20 to 30k a month within the next like 2 years.

[Tai Lopez]

Yeah, you're saying. So you're saying if they persist, they're resilient. Within a year or two they should be doing 20 plus a month, 1000%. Yeah, but not in the first month and not in the second month and not in the third. You got to build that skill. And you also like at my company, salespeople, the longer you sell for me and work for me, the bigger your book of business gets. Because a lot of people who buy my products, they keep buying stuff. So I got guys, the guy been selling for me more than 10 years and he gets sales from somebody he sold six years ago. So yeah, success builds. I would say my number one thing in my black belt sales training that I teach is. And that's a good one too, that's a valid one. You know, be thorough, thick skinned. But the one thing I teach is sales is kinetic energy transfer. Right. So kinetic energy is like a rock rolling down a hill. And so if you're on the phone and you don't sound energetic about the product, you don't sound confident, you don't sound certain that's Transferring right through the phone or in person. And they're going to pick up on that energy. Because humans don't make decisions logically. And trust me, whatever friends of mine think they're the most logical, turns out they are the most emotional. Always. I got a guy who swears he takes my personality quizzes and gets high emotions, but he swears he's like, dude, I'm the least emotional guy. I'm like, you're. Every single person in my company knows you're high on emotion. So if you can move people's emotional states, if you really believe in a product, that's why I think the most important thing is sell something you really believe, believe in. Because then you can do kinetic energy transfer over the phone. Like, listen, I see the results. Like, I. People who have sell for me, I share all the testimonials so they can see when they come sell for me that they're not selling junky stuff. I show them the videos of this Santi guy from homeless four years later doing 44 billion. They saw him, he was here, they talked to him, they realized, oh, this guy's not fake. He's an actor. He's not an actor. You know, so, okay, so that's a good lesson. What's your second most as you take.

[Johnny Ma]

People through training, I think congruency also. So with conviction. There's conviction in the product and there's conviction in yourself. So I don't think it's possible for someone to get on the phone and, for example, handle money objections when you live in scarcity.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

So I think that's one thing is like, you're gonna have to do what you be who you say you are and do what you say you're gonna do. Because that's the first step. If you say you're gonna wake up at 6am and you sleep in and you wake up at 7:30, and then you have to go and handle people's objections all day long. They can see it in your eyes that you're not who you say you are. And people are not gonna buy from that because of congruency and because of conviction. Like, you can't have conviction in yourself when you don't listen to yourself.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

And I see, I see your Instagram, you do a lot of simulations of objection handling. So let's, let's do. I've got some of the new salespeople, Ellison. What's a common objection? Ellison's done really good. She's just about to get her purple belt. I do belts. So White belt. You can't work for me. That's beginner. I have a training program. Then you come through and you're a blue belt. And then after that there's three stripes. Then you get purple belt. So she's about to get her purple belt very fast. Usually it takes six months, but. How long have you been here, Allison? Two months. Okay. But she's doing her. She's working on a team with the senior closer, Tony, and she's kind of the qualifier setter, and she closes a little bit herself. So what's the most common objection? I want you to run it by us too. And we're going to give our response. Just anything. Don't. Don't overthink it. Okay. Can you send me an email with more info? What's your. What do you train your people to say?

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah, what. What are you looking for? For more information on. Because that's not the real objection.

[Tai Lopez]

Right, right.

[Johnny Ma]

It's a smokescreen.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

So you just kind of keep going. Let's keep.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

You know what I tell people now? It's different over time as you build authority. I have a little more authority because most people know me. I'll be like, I hate email and I hate sending email to people because. Just tell me the truth, are you interested? Because if I said email is where deals go to die, you want me to help you? I don't really feel like sending you email now. I can't train all my salespeople to do that, but that's what I personally do. Like, fuck that. I'm like, hey, man, you on the phone. You want to make real money? Like, let's talk real talk. I know people now. What I also train them is there's four types of people. P, A, S, E. It's a system I trademark called the PACE system. The one exception to what I said, if they're a practical piece. It stands for practical action. Social, emotional. So we were on a call actually with a million dollar deal that Tony and I are working on making a lot millions. Nothing for this guy. He needs to scale his business. And I. And that guy asked for stuff in writing. And I'm like, tony, send it in.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Right.

[Tai Lopez]

Because he's a P. So there are. There's about 25% of the population actually is not procrastinating. 75% is. So, like, your line is good for 75% of people. Like, let's just. Let's just keep talking. But to 25. I do send them stuff. Ellison, Kiara, What's Another objection that you are getting. Let me think about it. Can I call you back? What would you say?

[Johnny Ma]

Do you feel like what we went over could get you where you want to go? Yes. So what do you feel like you want to go over in your mind?

[Tai Lopez]

Gotcha. So you're just kind of pushing them.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

It's sort of like, I think of it like a. If you've ever done like mma, it's like a lat drop. So you take whatever words they're using and you just flow them into where you want to go.

[Tai Lopez]

Right.

[Johnny Ma]

So I want to think about it. Okay. Do you feel like what we do can get you where you want to go?

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

So what do you think about? And you just lat drop them almost into the answer or into the real objection.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

So you're trying to always find the real objection.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Oh, yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

What do you find to be usually the real objections?

[Johnny Ma]

Fear. Fear of failure. Usually with that. Because there's one question you can ask anyone. If you knew that for 100% fact you would get in here and you would see success, would you still have to. Objection.

[Tai Lopez]

Right. Would you still have to think?

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

Would you still need the email?

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

And it voids everything because it's like, well, no, I would do it. Okay, so is it fair to say what you're looking for is certainty? So then that's it goes straight to fear.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

Yeah. I always teach people there's only two ways to close a deal when it's getting stuck. Demonstrate more value, which basically eliminates fear. Because you're like, no, I am like, I tell people like this guy that he's trying to find people to help him with his paid ads. And I'm like, okay, let's go to ChatGPT. Say, who's the top 10 humans in history at doing paid social media ads? I show them on the zoom or I'll send it to them and it says Tai Lopez number one. So I'm like, okay, I'm eliminating the fear that they're talking to the wrong person. And the second thing I teach my team is lower the financial risk. Sometimes the reason people are saying no is you're trying to sell a $50,000 product to a guy who only has 49,000 in the bank account. You can't. He can't even send it to you if he wanted to. So sometimes you got to downsell into a lower priced product or split it up or finance it, you know. So I teach people when something's stuck, always be demonstrating value. So I teach my team, don't nag. I hate that sales people text follow ups like, hey, you ready to talk? That's nagging. Everybody knows what you're doing. I say send them. Let's say they're in the industry. Like this guy I talked to is in the travel industry. Send them an Instagram video that went crazy viral. Be like, man, this dude right here in your same travel Space just did 5 million views on a video. We got to blow up your personal brand. Demonstrate. Send the screenshot, 5 million views. People start going, oh, wow, I do need that. So what, how do you handle price objections? Somebody says, oh man, I don't know if I'm going to pay 10k for this.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

So isolate the fact that they see the value in it. Then I want to. It depends what we're selling. I sell a lot of make money offers.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

So I like to reframe them on how they view money because people are having negative associations with money, which is why they're saying no. So when they say when they view money, they think about that as the reason why they shouldn't do something as opposed to the reason why they should. So what I want to do is first put them into results based thinking, which is. Would you do it if money didn't exist? Yes. Why would you? Because I want to retire my parents. So now they're back into where they want to be at. Then I like putting them into cause based thinking, which is. Yeah, because like, let's think about why are we even on the phone right now? What are you lacking? You're lacking the skills to make more?

[Tai Lopez]

What?

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah. So is it fair to say the reason you're on the phone right now is because you don't have the skill set to go make money?

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yes.

[Johnny Ma]

Now they're in agreement that they know what they want, they know why they don't have it. And then I like doing identity labels are a big part of the way I like to sell. So I like doing like binary Personas. So I'll do.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

Because there's going to be a person who comes to me and says, I really love this, but you know, it's going to be too expensive. I'm just not going to do anything about it. And there's going to be the person who gets resourceful and does whatever it takes to get where they want to go. In your opinion, which one do you feel like is in a better position to get desired state that they want?

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

They're going to say, number two, pin their procrastination Exactly.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

And then at that point it's just like, then I go into. I do a lot of nlp, which is neuro linguistic programming. And so at that point, after I've put the identity label on them, then I'd go, so does you not having the money or it being too tight mean you're not willing to find a way? No, I'm willing to find a way. And then it's easy going to payment plans and they're.

[Tai Lopez]

They're done. Good. So what's your take? Like, my friend Grant Cardone, he loves all those salespeople in one place, right? Or at least the majority, they're down there in Miami. Big sales floor. One of my private clients, Garrett White, he's like, oh, I'm so excited. I moved everybody into one room where I can oversee him. Jordan Belford, Wolf of Wall Street, I remember he came on my podcast years ago and he's like, we had this big room in Manhattan with just a couple. You've seen the movie Wolf, Wall street, right. It's just like big room, but now there's other big sales floors and sales teams that are completely remote. What's your take? Do you think the advantages of one outweigh the other?

[Johnny Ma]

I think there's a massive advantage to. In person, for sure, yeah. When I get to that point, when it makes sense, I will definitely be going down that road.

[Tai Lopez]

But what city would you put it in?

[Johnny Ma]

Arizona? Scottsdale.

[Tai Lopez]

You like Scottsdale?

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah, love Scottsdale.

[Tai Lopez]

Tony gonna be happy to hear that. Why Scottsdale?

[Johnny Ma]

I just think it's amazing and there's competition.

[Tai Lopez]

But is that because of the sales team there or do you just like Arizona?

[Johnny Ma]

I think Scottsdale is a great mix of everything. There's a lot of. There's a lot of wealth there. There's a lot of really great connections. You take a look at every single top Cardone, Jeremy, Cole, Gordon, all three of those are centralized in like a 20 mile radius.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

So although that's new for Grant. That's more Brandon, that's more Cardone Ventures. Because Cardone, you know, Cardone Capital has been in Miami.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

Andy Elliot, another one.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

He's in Dubai now.

[Tai Lopez]

But Manhattan, though, I always tell people the biggest sales floor was out of Manhattan because Wolf of Wall Street, I think he told me he was doing 300 million a month. How'd you like to get million a month, Manhattan? I mean, I know guys in finance that have sales floors like these MCA lenders and stuff. Shit, they got 600 dudes and maybe not 600, but let's say 300 people selling. These guys are collecting billion. I mean more than 300 million a month. Some of these big MCA, you know, merchant advance lenders and stuff. So yeah, I think, I think Eric, I mean I had a good sales floor. I think it's easier to build a sales floor where a place people want to live. Right. If you open a sales floor in Saskatchewan, Canada, where it's three degrees in summer, like it's tougher. But Miami, you can recruit too. There's a lot of talent that wants to live in Miami. Even big cities. San Diego is a great place, easy to recruit to. London has a lot of good sales floors too. Dubai has Salesforce now for me, you know. So tech, what's your current preferred tech stack? Some people are using, you know, this or that. I kind of build my own. But what do you use?

[Johnny Ma]

We just use close the CRM and then we've built out like our own sort of things too. Like we have our own AI agent that we use for call reviews and to help out with sales managing and data tracking and things like that. So trying to venture into that and create maybe like a SaaS for that type of thing.

[Tai Lopez]

So what's the AI do? It reviews, the phone call, the recorded calls. Yeah, like that too. It'll listen and be like ah, it's persons off. Off script, you know.

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah, it's really cool. So we'll have a grade for like five different, five different categories. Every sales rep will submit their. Every sales rep will submit their. Like let's. We use Fathom. So they'll submit their fathom and then their call notes, objections faced and then the outcome of the call. Yeah, and it'll transfer into like an entire vault of every single one of their sales calls. The outcome of it, it'll pull agents.

[Tai Lopez]

Doing it all for.

[Johnny Ma]

It'll do every single thing.

[Tai Lopez]

What'd you build the agent on?

[Johnny Ma]

N8N.

[Tai Lopez]

Yeah, N8N.

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah, my operations guy did that.

[Tai Lopez]

So you like Fathom for recording as the AI? Yeah, we use Fathom. What's the other one? We use Otter. There's a lot of those.

[Johnny Ma]

None of them are that great though. Like they're really good for getting transcripts but the, the AI part of it is never works so I just wanted to build my own.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

So then what about do power dial? Do robo dial, Smart dial, AI dial? We started AI dialing. It's very interesting.

[Johnny Ma]

That sounds interesting. Yeah, we use a. We have a certain. We use this thing called Dialer, which. It's a dialer, but it's called Dialer.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

And what should we call our dialer? Yeah, I'm open a restaurant called Food.

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah, but they're really good though. So it'll have, it'll have leads coming in and there's a certain cadence that you have to be calling leads. Something like once in the first five minutes.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

Again, 10 minutes later. Again the next day. Again the next day. Later in the day. There's a cadence for it.

[Tai Lopez]

Yeah, we built that in our software. I just finished up a new cadence so you can set. That way people don't have to think, they just go in and it's called. We try to call. If you call in the first five minutes, you get like 100x chance of reaching them. So you call hardcore. First five minutes. What autoresponders do you like them to get an SMS in the first five minutes? An email, what's kind of that? And are you doing book calls?

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah, we do. We do booked calls. So like our main funnel that we use for everyone is basically just like free resource on the front end and then we're hitting them from all angles.

[Tai Lopez]

So you hit them with like a free lead magnet.

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah, I love doing that.

[Tai Lopez]

So you'll do an Instagram. It says if you want to learn sales reply with the word sale.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

Then you'll hit them on AI in your DMs.

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah. So we'll have, we have a few different things. So it'll be the. As soon as they opt in for the free resource, my DM setter is hitting them. The phone setter is hitting human or AI. It's a human. It's a human.

[Tai Lopez]

So you like humans. You let them use like many chat or something.

[Johnny Ma]

I think they got to be an A player. But yeah, I like humans right now for a DM setting. But then the phone setter will also be calling them and then they also get prompted to book in what we call an implementation call. So I like doing like three.

[Tai Lopez]

So you're calling them even before the book call? Oh, yeah, that's what we do.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

I see people waiting for a boom. We're fast. We had a guy go, I want to hire you guys just because I've never had somebody be that fast. What was that guy last week? Remember that Tony? He's got a huge sales floor. He's like, man, we're not fast like you. He's like, I got three calls in the first five minutes till I answered one.

[Johnny Ma]

You have to the show up rate will go up, the quality of the call will go up. You send them specific resources geared towards their situation.

[Tai Lopez]

It's do you have set or closer system or one call close. Just teach each people.

[Johnny Ma]

So yeah, everyone does one call closes. But we'll have triagers that will call every single booked appointment and then just those also serve as outbound setters and then the DM setters.

[Tai Lopez]

So let's say I go to your funnel, I book in for tomorrow at 2, tomorrow at 3pm Will you call.

[Johnny Ma]

Me before you'll be getting a call within three minutes?

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

Okay, so I get a call three minutes. That is. Is it going to be the same person that's going to be on that 3:00'?

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Clock?

[Tai Lopez]

No, that's the triage team.

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah. So we'll position the closer as a. Like a head trainer.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yes.

[Johnny Ma]

And so then the triager will call, do their whole confirmation sequence, find.

[Tai Lopez]

So they're asking the qualifications if they really have money.

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah, they're qualifying them on that. They're building more, more like pain with them. And then we'll group chat them with the closer because that'll increase our show show rates too and we do everything.

[Tai Lopez]

So you dial them in or this or like WhatsApp.

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah, we'll do WhatsApp or iMessage for group chats.

[Tai Lopez]

Gotcha. So you get them. That's a good idea. Yeah, I get. We build a ton. My phone probably has 10,000 WhatsApp groups from leads that they book in. I don't answer all, but it's good to be like, oh, Ty's in the group now. If it's a high level person.

[Johnny Ma]

Oh, it's amazing.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

So then, so the triage person is trained and they're talking five to 15 minutes kind of thing, they're building anticipation. Do you send some videos, watch this video before you show up?

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

So that's why I really like the triage calls because every prospect comes in in a different frame of mind and a different situation. Like people think just send a testimonial that's like maybe the highest earner. I don't think that at all. I would rather send someone. Someone's coming to me brand new, never done sales before.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

I would rather send them someone who went from 0 to 7k a month than someone who makes 50 grand a month because it seems just out of reach. So I like sending specific scenario case studies to them.

[Tai Lopez]

So wait, you're saying. So if you're selling phone sales training and you match them up with the closer that way. Is that what you mean?

[Johnny Ma]

I mean all of my closers are trained, have been through the program so that does help because I can match them with that. But yeah, I want to do everything in my power to get them on the phone and with someone who feels familiar. So I have a young closer and I have an older closer.

[Tai Lopez]

So the does young. Do you ask age to know who to call, who to connect them with?

[Johnny Ma]

It's pretty obvious when we see them. But no, we don't put like a.

[Tai Lopez]

Huge focus on they're coming in through DMs.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

So you can look and say I'll give this to the young closer because this kid's 18. And if they're 60 you connect them with an older.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah, yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

People buy from who they relate to.

[Tai Lopez]

Yeah, yeah, for sure.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yep.

[Tai Lopez]

And then let's say they. What's a show rate you think is acceptable and not acceptable for the book calls?

[Johnny Ma]

50-60% is really hard to run a sales team up with but like 80%. 70 to 80% I think at scale is pretty, is pretty doable.

[Tai Lopez]

So you're saying if it's below 50 too hard.

[Johnny Ma]

50 to 60% I think there's really hard.

[Tai Lopez]

What's though the triage rate, Pickup rate. The hardest thing in the modern world right now is just getting people that can answer. So when you if, if 10 leads come in the triage, I'll call them within five minutes. What percentage of them actually reach the person on the first couple dials?

[Johnny Ma]

I think we have something like a 17% contact rate. Yeah, but the first dial is 10%.

[Tai Lopez]

Yeah, but is that 17% and it takes you like three days or whatever?

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah, it'll take us, it'll take us like two days usually.

[Tai Lopez]

So let's say 20% of the lead you actually reach out of those 20%. You want 80% to show up to a booked call. Yeah, gotcha. So of all the leads you're getting 20%, you're getting 80% of 20, which is about 15%. 15, 16.

[Johnny Ma]

Oh no. So we'll have. It'll still be an 80% show rate throughout every single call that gets booked. It's just we have higher close rates naturally with the people that we reach on a triage.

[Tai Lopez]

But I'm saying there's still people you just to need. Never can get a hold.

[Johnny Ma]

Oh yeah, Never. Yeah, sometimes they'll show up some. Most times they don't though.

[Tai Lopez]

Do you hit them with a couple emails and SMS saying yo, meetings in five minutes, meetings In.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah, yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

We do that all manually though. So we have all the closers. I think messaging from blue bubbles is one of the most important things.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yes.

[Tai Lopez]

So imessage, you know, we, we built iMessage into our CRM.

[Johnny Ma]

Really.

[Tai Lopez]

We can do autoresponders with iMessage and WhatsApp if they're outside. So. But you. So you're not. You're saying you don't really love autoresponders.

[Johnny Ma]

I would if there was one that I could do with blue messages, which I know there's a few companies out there, but I haven't until myself.

[Tai Lopez]

Green messages is like too much like spam.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

No one responds. It's all about trust nowadays and just green messages. No one wants to respond.

[Tai Lopez]

Do you have. I have my people send a video, quick video like oh, Bob, saw you especially on whale leads. You know I have female setters. Females always get great responses. I have a woman who works for me when she DMs somebody, she gets a cold DM. She gets a 98% reply rate.

[Johnny Ma]

That's.

[Tai Lopez]

We tested it once. It's like DM100 business owners, as long as our males, like she's like blonde Russian guys can't resist replying to her like, hey, how are ya? Men always assume they're in. She's in love with them. I'm like, she ain't in love with you, but she got you to call back.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

So what do you always do videos or. Not necessarily.

[Johnny Ma]

We do voice memos. So our cadence would be like, hey, is that name question mark said just curiosity and then just the voice memo. And then just dropped you a voice memo. Did you get that?

[Tai Lopez]

So you'll text them that?

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

What's the. How long is the voice memo?

[Johnny Ma]

Like 15 to 20 seconds. It's the same script every time. She's like, hey, took.

[Tai Lopez]

But they actually say it. They re record it every time.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

What about. Do you leave voice memos? You do voice memo drops?

[Johnny Ma]

No. Yeah, that'd be. That's interesting though. The voicemail drops.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

Andy Elliot we. I like to look voice memos work on me. I think it depends on the person. Like if you're selling to my mom. If you're selling to somebody above 50, they listen to voice memos. They're like used to voicemail answering machines. If you're selling to 18 year olds, a lot of 18 year olds just texting. So I think you got to know your age. But a good voicemail. I have a guy who's like the king of saves, saving refunds. He calls everybody. He goes, it's Joe for Tai Lopez. Call me back. He sounds like there's something wrong. People call back. He doesn't actually say anything. He doesn't trick them. He just goes, it's important. Call me back. And people are like, oh, fuck, I got a call. So there's a lot of scripts like that work. You know what I mean?

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

It's all about the tone. Like, even in a cold call or something, if you use familiar tones, they're like, I got to know this guy. Like, what's his name again?

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yes.

[Johnny Ma]

Things like that matter so much for sure.

[Tai Lopez]

Are you generate. Are you doing any paid ads to generate your leads or all organic?

[Johnny Ma]

We just started paid ads.

[Tai Lopez]

Yeah, but in the past, you've been just.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah, yeah.

[Johnny Ma]

Like, we've been organic the entire time. Yeah, but my company, my training company's only been open for four months.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

And you're doing how much a month?

[Johnny Ma]

We just hit a million total for.

[Tai Lopez]

The four months, so averaging 250.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

That's good.

[Johnny Ma]

We did 350 last month.

[Tai Lopez]

Nice. Is that collected or cash collected? Yeah, I only count cash collected. Yeah, I mean, we track payment plans, but bird in the hands. Better than two in the bush, man.

[Interviewer/Assistant]

Yeah.

[Tai Lopez]

Well, Johnny, we're gonna have to do this again, my friend.

[Johnny Ma]

Absolutely.

[Tai Lopez]

This was good. So if people want show notes, want links to Johnny's Instagram and some of his training, I'll put it all in the show notes. So you just go to tai lopez.com johnny podcast. It's with an H N Y. So just go to tylopez.com j o h n n y podcast. Then we'll put the podcast note. We'll put links to his social media training, stuff that I talked about. Stuff he talked about. I'll put links to the books. We hit you with a lot of stuff. But for those of you listening, remember, and you'll put a link to the trainings you have too, right?

[Johnny Ma]

Yeah, I can give it.

[Tai Lopez]

Give us all that. We'll put it all there in the show notes. So people listening on audio, depending on where you're listening to this, you can get all the info and connect with them. So for those of you. You can text me. I've got a 786 Miami number. Just text me the word Johnny if you came that way. If you don't want to go to the show notes on my site, we can text you the link and we can talk there. Tylopa.comJohnny podcast or text or WhatsApp me at [phone] that's +1,786 7308374. Just text or WhatsApp me the keyword Johnny. We'll send you the show notes, links to his stuff. My stuff. That was awesome. I appreciate everybody listening in. I'm listening. My video vlog releases Monday, Wednesday, Friday. My audio podcast Tuesday, Thursday, Saturday. I take Sunday off. Amish taught me that. So take a day off and then get back to work. So I appreciate everybody. Talk soon.