Naomi Watts: What I Wish I Knew In My 30s

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Tamsen Show

Episode: Naomi Watts: What I Wish I Knew In My 30s
Host: Tamsen Fadal
Guest: Naomi Watts
Date: October 1, 2025

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Overview & Main Theme

This episode of The Tamsen Show features Emmy-winning journalist Tamsen Fadal in conversation with actor, entrepreneur, and menopause advocate Naomi Watts. The main purpose is to unpack Naomi’s personal and professional journey with midlife, early menopause, reinvention, and how she’s helping reshape the narrative around women’s aging—especially in Hollywood. Naomi discusses the founding of her brand Stripes, her new book “Dare I Say It,” and how conversations, community, and candor can transform women’s midlife experiences.

“What also makes Naomi Watts so powerful today is how she is literally changing the narrative around women and aging.”
— Tamsen Fadal [02:15]

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Early Career Struggles and Hollywood Ageism

• Naomi arrived in Hollywood in her mid-20s, having already acted in Australia, but faced years of rejection and uncertainty.
• She was told by an agent that her career would be over by 40 because “that’s when a woman becomes… done, finished, unfuckable” [01:00, 06:15].
• Naomi’s breakout role came with Mulholland Drive in her early 30s, shifting her career trajectory.
• Both Naomi and Tamsen discuss the broader industry pressure on women to stay young and the absence of similar limitations for men.

“They said, ‘well, you know, it’s sort of when a woman becomes, you know, kind of, you know, she’s done, she’s finished, she’s unfuckable.’ I’m like, unfuckable? Why? What, just because you don’t produce anymore? Like, that’s absurd.”
— Naomi Watts [01:00 / 06:15]

2. Personal Menopause Journey: Shock, Silence, and Stigma

• Naomi was told at 36 she was close to menopause while trying to start a family.
• She found herself isolated, with little information or support from society or the medical community.
• Her mother hadn’t discussed menopause’s realities with her, revealing a cycle of secrecy among generations of women [07:00].
• Medical advice was limited. Naomi describes piecemealing her knowledge, dietary changes, and trying various remedies. Eventually, she got pregnant naturally—twice.
• Naomi candidly discusses perimenopause symptoms post-birth, including anxiety, depression, insomnia, and “soldiering on in silence” because of the taboo [19:00].
• She emphasizes the importance of breaking that chain for future generations.

“It was just this message that somehow everyone agreed upon that we must suck it up in silence and soldier on.” — Naomi Watts [07:00]

3. Founding Stripes and Stepping into Advocacy

• The lack of resources inspired Naomi to co-found Stripes, a wellness brand for menopausal women [02:15, 25:00].
• She feared “career suicide” in going public about menopause but found the opposite—more opportunities, recognition, and support (e.g., working with Lena Dunham and Ryan Murphy) [27:40, 29:49].
• Stripes and her new book aim to rewrite what’s possible for women in midlife: fun, sexy, vital, and ambitious.
• The brand was about embracing and earning her “stripes,” not hiding symptoms or aging [25:00].

"I want a woman to feel empowered at this time. I want her to feel like she's earned her stripes, that she can... her experiences add up to something. She matters."
— Naomi Watts [25:00]

4. The Shift in Hollywood (and Real Life) Narratives

• Naomi describes a positive response in Hollywood, with colleagues, directors, and women both behind the scenes and on set expressing gratitude [27:40].
• Projects like Ryan Murphy’s new show All’s Fair center older women and real-life issues, including menopause [40:45].
• Naomi notes the significance of women coming up to her in public, not for selfies, but to thank her for advocacy, often leading to emotional conversations [29:02].

“It’s much more meaningful. Yeah. It gives me purpose. It gives me pride... and ends up with tears in her eyes and hugging perfect strangers. And I love that.”
— Naomi Watts [29:02]

5. Personal Reinvention and Midlife Relationships

• Both Naomi and Tamsen found new partners and got married in their 50s, challenging the “never too late” mindset [29:50].
• Naomi’s recent marriage came after years of personal growth, loss, and focusing on her children.
• She advocates that it’s never too late for new love, but also dislikes framing it with limitation at all [31:57].

"I hate ‘never too late.’ I hate those limits that society puts on us... you just never know."
— Naomi Watts [32:02]

6. Motherhood, Empty Nesting, and Post-Menopause Reflections

• Naomi talks about the bittersweet experience of dropping her son at college and the new phase it ushers in [33:19].
• She feels more even and stable after menopause, thanks in part to HRT, though symptoms arise intermittently (e.g., “frozen shoulder”) [34:58].
• Naomi and Tamsen discuss how openness around menopause is changing — it’s now normalized among peers, even on Hollywood sets [39:28].

"Women just own it straight away now on set — it’s their way of saying, I'm in the club."
— Naomi Watts [39:33]

7. The Power of Community and Storytelling

• Naomi sees community and candid storytelling as essential—so others don’t feel isolated as she once did [24:05, 40:17].
• She receives texts from celebrities and strangers alike with “behind the curtain” menopause confessions.
• Both Tamsen and Naomi agree on the need for diverse voices to shift the narrative for future generations.

"We are normalizing it. We’re all collectively moving the narrative... so a woman feels seen, a woman feels understood." — Naomi Watts [38:44]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Ageism:
  “Can you imagine someone saying that to you today? …I would have to sit on my hands.”
  — Naomi Watts [01:12]

• On Menopause Silence:
  “These are the conversations I didn’t have with you because my mom didn’t have them with me.”
  — Naomi’s mother, relayed by Naomi [07:00]

• On Unexpected Love:
  “You know, we had…our kids were still young and…I think earning, building trust.”
  — Naomi Watts [31:20]

• On Normalizing Menopause:
  “I’m always there, I’m a shoulder to cry on and ear to listen. Whatever. You’re the menopause sister. That’s what it is.”
  — Naomi Watts [40:17]

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Timestamps of Major Segments

• 00:29–02:15: Opening & introduction to Naomi’s impact in Hollywood and menopause
• 04:10–06:21: Naomi’s first public conversation about menopause; the industry’s ageism
• 07:00–07:49: Lack of menopause education in her family; perpetuation of silence
• 11:26–16:16: The grind of acting in Hollywood, Mulholland Drive, and the gendered timeline
• 16:53–21:00: Naomi’s perimenopause diagnosis, secrecy, self-blame, getting pregnant
• 24:01–25:01: Inspiration to “write the book” and create Stripes
• 25:01–26:16: Hesitations, career risks, and the pivotal moment of going public
• 27:40–29:32: Hollywood and public response to Naomi's advocacy
• 29:49–32:02: Reinventing relationships; “Never too late” reflections
• 33:41–34:34: Navigating motherhood’s next chapter and empty nest feelings
• 34:58–36:45: What she wishes she knew, and the truth of postmenopause
• 39:28–40:17: Changing dialogue and normalization in the industry
• 40:45–42:10: New projects (All’s Fair), representation of midlife and menopause on screen

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Tone and Style

The conversation is raw, warm, deeply personal, and empowering—blending frank humor (especially around Hollywood’s euphemisms), honesty about tough moments, and a consistently uplifting call for women to embrace, rather than fear, midlife change.

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Conclusion

Naomi Watts’s journey—through late stardom, “career ending” predictions, early menopause, and midlife reinvention—becomes a universal call to action for women not to suffer in silence. Her willingness to be vulnerable has made her a touchstone for others forging a new narrative around age, power, and reinvention. Women everywhere are invited not only to “own their story,” but to claim their stripes, write their next act, and do it together.

“You just never know. You just don’t have that in your head. Otherwise it’s just going to close you down.”
— Naomi Watts [32:02]

Transcript

[A]

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[B]

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[A]

Can you imagine if someone said that to you today?

[B]

I would have to sit on my hands.

[A]

She's one of Hollywood's most powerful voices with a story bigger than the screen. Naomi Watts is rewriting the rules of midlife and she's proving it's never too late to start a new chapter.

[B]

I'd met the partner, the man that I wanted to create a family. I was 36 years old. I wasn't getting pregnant. So I went, got the blood drawn, and then he called me back into his office and he said, you, blood work is suggesting that you're close to menopause at 36. At 36, I was so shocked. The first person I called was my mom and said, why didn't you tell me more about this? I had only just separated from my ex and I had my head down with work and sort of grieving that and concentrating on my kids. Met Billy at work and created a really lovely friendship. And it took me by surprise. I hate never too late.

[A]

Me too.

[B]

I hate those limits that society puts on us. You just never know. You just don't have that in your head. Otherwise it's just gonna close you down.

[A]

Today I get to sit down with someone who I feel has been by my side since the very beginning of this menopause movement. She is a True Hollywood icon. But what also makes Naomi Watts so powerful today is how she is literally changing the narrative around women and aging. She built Stripes, a brand that put menopause front and center. She wrote, dare I say it, a book that's blowing the conversation wide open. And if you've ever wondered what is next for you, I think today's episode is going to give you the tools and the inspiration to step into this stage of life with more confidence than ever before. Naomi, it's good to see you.

[B]

Great to be here, Tamsyn.

[A]

Thanks for having me. I always love sitting down with you and just talking.

[B]

I know we're just missing the cocktail.

[A]

We should have done that. I'm sorry. You know what? Next time I'm excited about sitting down to talk. Cause we see each other at events and we whisper backstage or we sit down and talk at a dinner. But I don't think we've ever sat down and just really kind of shared all of that.

[B]

Focused. One on one.

[A]

Yeah, one on one.

[B]

And we've been doing this now how many years where we've been showing up to places together? It's at least three.

[A]

Yeah. The very first event that you had, you know, that really where you were on stage and they told me. It's very funny. So I'm gonna tell you the story, and it's in my book, is that I got a phone call from a mutual friend of ours, Alisa, that said like, two nights before this first time I ever met Naomi. And she said, hey, can you come interview some people for a panel I'm having about menopause? And I said, yeah, sure. Who's gonna be on the panel? And she was like, Naomi Watts and Katie Couric. And I'm like, what? What are you talking about? I was in a full blown panic because I was like, I don't. What am I talking to them about? I don't know. It's like, highly intimidating. And I got there and you put me at such ease and like, it was such a great conversation. I put me at ease. No, I remember it so.

[B]

I remember it vividly, too, because it was my first real, like, sitting on a stage with a microphone in my hand, talking about menopause. That was really. Yeah, I'm pretty sure. I mean, obviously I'd been building the brand in the background. And that is no easy fe. That was probably a year's worth of work. We had product on the stage, but we weren't officially launched that day. So I'd been talking about it with all My colleagues and whatnot. But that was my also first day.

[A]

Oh, my gosh. Well, I'm so glad you. Well, thank you. I'm honored now. I'm super honored.

[B]

I'm sure a lot of things. Tam.

[A]

I was very nervous. I remember my heart was racing out of control. And I get up there and I interview for a living. That's what I did for years. But I think there's something, you know, really vulnerable about sitting up there and talking about another part of your life. And I know that you and I have talked about this off camera, but you've been really honest and raw and relatable and vocal. How does it feel now, you know, three years later?

[B]

It feels good. It really does. Very different today versus that day, I was filled with all kinds of panic, like you, and particularly because of the industry I'm in. And like, you also was nervous about how that would, you know, how people would react and would that mean, you know, I was no longer hireable in some ways. And I had been told much earlier that because I came into my industry quite late and launched in my early 30s, I was told I better get my skates on because Hollywood, you know, it's all over at a certain age. And I went, what do you mean? What age? And they said, well, this agent at the time said, oh, around 40. And I went, okay, why? I'm thinking, I know where this goes. And they said, well, you know, it's sort of when a woman becomes, you know, kind of, you know, she's done, she's finished, she's unfuckable. I'm like, unfuckable? Why are you unfuckable? What, just because you don't produce anymore? Like, that's absurd.

[A]

Isn't that unbelievable to think? Can you imagine if someone said that to you today, what your response would.

[B]

Be versus I mean, I would have to sit on my hands. Yeah, no, it's crazy to think that was the. I mean, it wasn't the fault of the agent. It was just the societal message that had been seeped in so deep and been working for a very long time. I mean, when I was told that I was going into menopause at 36, I was so shocked. And the first person I called was my mom and said, why didn't you tell me more about this? I did know that she went in early, like 45, but I didn't know that she had a multitude of symptoms. I didn't know that it went on for a long time. And I said, why didn't you tell me more about this. And she said, well, these are the conversations I didn't have with you because my mom didn't have them with me. And so no fault to her. It's just this message that somehow everyone agreed upon that we must suck it up in silence and soldier on.

[A]

And, you know, ageism, sexism.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then patriarchy. All of it, patriarchy. And I think that's interesting because, I mean, we both come from industries where youth is just revered. Right. Did you always know Hollywood was what you wanted to do, or acting was always what you wanted to do since a young age or where did that?

[B]

I did. I didn't know Hollywood. I knew that I wanted to act, but I didn't, you know, at a very young age. But I didn't know that it was a job. I thought it was like a hobby, like, you know, playing hockey or, you know.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Fun doing ceramics or something. You know, like something you do on the weekends for classes. And. Yeah, I saw my mom on stage at a very young age. I was like five, four or five. And I just remember she was gliding across the stage in all these beautiful costumes, talking in a funny voice with a wig on, and so professional. She was playing Eliza Doolittle in My Fair lady. And I was in the front row with my grandmother, waving, like, trying to get her attention. Of course, she was being focused and professional and not acknowledging me, but I kept persisting. And eventually, I suppose to put me at ease, she finally did a, you know, one of those. And in that moment, I felt transported into the world of make believe. And I sort of understood it. Like, that's something I want to do. I want the wig, I want the costume, I want the story. I want that lady's voice. And so I went on as a young person to become part of what was called the Shoreham Place, which was a small town I lived in. And every festive season, there was a skit or a play or a musical to join in on, and that was. That became my passion, my hobby, my favorite thing to do. I didn't know it was a job. I definitely didn't think it would be a career.

[A]

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[B]

In a way, yes. I mean I had been what's called a journeyman actor before. I was working on lots of different things.

[A]

What does that mean?

[B]

Job to job? Okay, yeah. Bit parts here and there and completely satisfied with that. As long as I could pay my rent, I was doing what I love to do.

[A]

And was this here in the US.

[B]

Or was this where was I moved from Australia to the US I had felt like I Wanted a change. I'd seen a handful of people come over to America and done well and I thought, oh, maybe I could, you know, took some meetings over here on a, on a trip through a worldwide trip, met a lot of people and they're like, yeah, come on, we love, love Australia. Come back, you know, a lot of positive reactions. And then I came back with my, you know, $1,200 in the bank and one suitcase and you know, a handful of credits but not recognizable to America and met with agents again and they were all like, oh yeah, we met you. That's right. Okay, good luck.

[A]

Good luck.

[B]

And I was like, wait, but I came here because you said, and yeah, then I entered into basically a 10 year slog of under the radar, you know, bit parts that would cover my debts and then, you know, I'd have a little bit more that would, you know, take me through to the next job and I would consider leaving multiple.

[A]

Times to go back to Australia.

[B]

To go back to Australia, pack my bags, metaphorically and physically. Didn't think I was going to be cut out for this. And then everything changed with Mulholland Drive. So I sort of think about my career in two parts.

[A]

Okay, I have one small favor to ask you. If the Tamsen show has ever made you feel seen, stronger, more informed, whatever it is, I'd really love your help. We have just been nominated for a Signal Listeners Choice Award in the self improvement and self help category. And you're vote would mean everything. You can just scroll down to the episode description, tap the link and cast your vote. I promise it takes less than a minute and it really helps us keep amplifying the voices and the stories that matter. Thank you, thank you, thank you for being a part of this community. I'm so excited to keep doing this together. That whole time where you were a working actor, right? Journeyman is how it's called. And then you start and what, what age was that then?

[B]

I probably came here in my mid-20s, early mid or early to mid. And then, yeah, I think I met with David lynch around for Mulholland Drive. I think I was like 29 because it started off as a TV series and we did a pilot, a two hour pilot. It was rejected by ABC for being too weird too David lynch, go figure. And then the French producers came back a couple years later or a year and a half later and said to David, can we make that into a movie? And he said, let me think if I can come up with some ideas. He wrote 20 extra pages and said Naomi, have you still got the costumes? Come up to the house. I've got some pages. And I said, yes, I'm available. I have the wardrobe right here. And went up and read the most incredible 20 pages that took my character into a whole new sphere and.

[A]

And life. Right.

[B]

And from that day forward, I haven't had to audition again, you know.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

That was a very big change because I was, you know, in those 10 years prior, I had been, you know, driving across town to pick up pages, you know, and then line up with 20, 30 people. They didn't fax you. They didn't. You know, sometimes they weren't even looking you in the eye or shaking your head. It was very demeaning time. And you were driving across town with no maps. You didn't have your maps.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Remember those?

[A]

Yes, of course.

[B]

Was it called Thomas Guide or Gregory's in la? I can't remember.

[A]

It's a guy's name. I know. I know exactly what you're talking about.

[B]

Anyway, and pages were missing and, you know, you'd figure it out though. Right.

[A]

Somehow we got there and being told that you were unfuckable, I guess that was at a young age. So what happened after that? I mean, not having to audition past that. I mean, David lynch, obviously, like, I mean, just how incredible. And for that to be kind of your first big breakout role and to go from there. But at an age where I have to imagine. And I get it because I was told in my first job and very different, but in news that, like, when I hit about 35 years old, I better start, you know, paying attention to what was going on. Cause I was gonna be sort of wrapped up and by 40 that would be done.

[B]

Yeah. I mean, I wonder if they. The same pep talk goes to men as well, though.

[A]

Can you imagine being a man being told that?

[B]

No, it doesn't even happen.

[A]

But it really is how we got to the conversation, where we are today. There's no question about that.

[B]

Absolutely.

[A]

So we've had a lot of parallels in our lives, I think. Right. But the one in particular that you have that's different than mine is that you did have a journey that started very young. And you referenced it a moment ago about perimenopause. Could you talk about that, that age and where you are, where you were in terms of wanting to be a mother and where you were in your life with relationships?

[B]

Yeah, I'd met the partner, the man that I wanted to create a family. And I was 36 years old. I wasn't Getting pregnant. And a friend of mine, an older girlfriend of mine, said, why don't you go to your doctor and get some blood drawn? I said, okay. Really? Why? I knew nothing. I was clueless. So I went, got the blood drawn, and then he called me back into his office, and he said, you, blood work is suggesting that you're close to menopause at 36. At 36. And that's when I just said to you. When I called my mom, you know, in a state of panic, then I just sort of tried to figure out, like, how to deal with that or how to get pregnant. I mean, that was my main focus. Can you get pregnant? And the Internet was barely active. It wasn't like I could find my way into chat rooms or anything. It was really.

[A]

Really. Or chat.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, exactly. So I was piecemealing together what I would learn from doctors here and there. And as you know, as we've learned, doctors at that time, now things have changed. Were very uneducated. They had no real understanding. My doctor, who ended up being my OB for my first baby as well, he was my gynecologist at the time. He told me a lot. And he knew about the study. He knew about a lot of things. You know, once I got pregnant, he talked me through the HRT thing very clearly. And that was very. Because I've been on HRT now for, I think, since 2013, which is more than 10 years. But, yeah, the menopause thing, I really just tried my best to conceal it. That's why that unfuckable term in my head, what was I. I wasn't gonna, like, brand myself as someone who's like, the menopause lady.

[A]

I mean, you must have had double fear, triple fears, the word unfuckable going around in your head. The word menopause being mentioned. Period.

[B]

Yeah. And being barren, like, I wasn't gonna be able to reproduce children, I was told.

[A]

And who could you talk to about that? I can't imagine. You went on set and were like, oh, well, you know this. Did you have anybody that you.

[B]

No. I mean, I obviously talked to my. He's now my ex. But I probably, you know, it was a very panicky, scary, lonely time. I wished there was a book. I wished there was your book or someone else's book. There was nothing then. Nothing. Zero. I do remember finding a book by Julia Indochiver. I think I'm gonna get that name slightly wrong, but it was called inconceivable. And that helped me understanding what was going on with My body. And she talked about altering your diet. And I was told that I had to do like an anti inflammatory diet, cut out sugars and wheat and dairy and things like that. And of course I was just latching onto anything at that time. It seemed like it all made sense. And I was churning up wheat grass. She told me to do that. And yeah, lo and behold, I managed to get pregnant. Whether it was that or Chinese herbs that I trucked back from China from doing a movie there, or acupuncture, or just my body working itself out, who knows? And I'm not someone to instruct what to do and how to do it. Everybody has a very unique system. But it worked for me. And I got, I got not one, but two babies naturally. And then my symptoms started to become hardcore after my second baby, after I stopped nursing. And that's when the sleep, you know, the disturbed sleep was really affecting my lifestyle. Depression, anxiety, you know, the nights while.

[A]

Raising two babies, two young children.

[B]

Yeah. By the way, I'll just mention, and I say it in the book, I had been ticking in all of those medical lists for years, night sweats. And I was chalking it up to or doctors were saying probably an allergy, maybe one too many glasses of wine, who knows? I was so quick to blame myself for doing something rather than something wrong, rather than something that was quite natural, even though it was on an advanced timeline. A Mochi moment from Sadie, who writes.

[A]

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[B]

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[A]

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[B]

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[A]

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[B]

Stayed for the empathy. Thanks, Sadie. I'm Mayra ammis, founder of Most Mochi Health. To find your Mochi moment, visit joinmochi.com.

[A]

Sadie is a Mochi member, compensated for her story. This show is sponsored by Midi Health. Are you a midlife and feeling dismissed, unheard, or just plain tired of being ignored by the health care system? You're not alone. So many of us have been told our symptoms aren't serious or that we just have to deal with it. From brain fog to anxiety to weight changes, women's midlife health concerns are too often overlooked. In fact, listen to this. 75% of women seeking care for menopause or perimenopause go untreated. That is not acceptable. There's some good news though. It's time for a change. It's time for midi. Midi Health is the only virtual women's clinic that's fully focused on midlife, offering personalized insurance covered care from world class clinicians. Whether you need hormone therapy, weight support, or just someone to actually listen, this is a care we've been waiting for. Ready to feel your best and write your second act script? Visit joinmitty.com today to book your personalized insurance covered virtual visit. That's joinmitty.com MIDI the Care Women deserve, I think what's so remarkable, I mean, a lot of women don't even realize that during that time in perimenopause you can get pregnant, but to hear that you might not be able to, and you were much closer to menopause than most women are, obviously at that age. And then also to be working and being that industry and the stress of a job and trying to balance it all, I just have to say, like, you know, I've known your story and I know your story, but as we're just sitting here and being able to like, unfold it a little bit slower than we usually do when we're running, you know, running around doing something, when I just think about that stress on top of stress on top of stress and nobody to talk to about it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And the fact that you're so vocal about it now, it just makes me have even more respect for what you're doing because you're really changing the lives of Naomi, who might be listening to this right now and might be going through something really similar.

[B]

And ultimately that's why we're here, right?

[A]

100%.

[B]

We needed help ourselves. We needed community. The conversation being as shut down as it was, we needed greater support and treatment from our doctors. And that required us to say, I need help. And is there anyone else out there? Because guess what? Half the population, we're living longer. They're gonna need it. Chances are they're gonna want the help that we needed. And like I said, I had a friend. I was saying to her, I wish there was a book. I wish there was a book that told us it's not the end. There's ways to manage this time. How do we manage it? I need information. I need to be told that I can still be fun and sexy and vibrant and alive and dignified and carry on with my career and owning this story. And she was like, why don't you write that? And I was like, well, I'm not a writer and I'm obviously not gonna do this and tell now I have.

[A]

To write a book.

[B]

Yeah, tell Hollywood the AEGIS industry that I know about, that would be career suicide. No way. So, you know, I sat on that. But then I guess I got to being past 50, the average age where you're allowed to be in menopause, and we were all stuck home with COVID and ideas were percolating. And so that's when I cold pitched the idea to start my brand, Stripes Beauty, and reached out to a biotech company and I said, I've had all these problems with myself skin and I'm on camera and we lose estrogen all over our body. It creates dehydration from scalp to vag. And I want a woman to feel empowered at this time. I want her to feel like she's earned her stripes, that she can, you know, her experiences add up to something. She matters.

[A]

Because you didn't feel like that for a very, very long time.

[B]

Yeah, I didn't.

[A]

When did you finally feel like it was safe for you to talk about age in Hollywood? Or were you always a little bit hesitant, even as you were making that call and even as you were saying.

[B]

Oh, I was hesitant all the way. I mean, I was really oscillating between, is this a good idea or a terrible career ending idea all the way through? Well, like, each sort of milestone moment. Yeah, like the pitching of it. You know, I remember getting it on a zoom call with mostly men, and I'm like, I was, you know, sweating bullets, like, thinking, are they even gonna know? What are they gonna be like, get us off this call quickly? You know, but they seem engaged. And, you know, I threw together a pitch deck on my own, like, pulling pictures off Instagram. And, you know, with the help of my assistant at the time, and, you know, we just, like, churned it out, and I think we made it interesting enough that the conversation was gonna be furthered. And then it led to, yes, we're gonna take brand and we're going to spend this much money and this much time and do this many products. And we were just, you know, thinking about it and in sort of a think tank way for a good six months. And then we launched very, very quickly. And then, you know, the launch became another new set of nerves, like actually letting the story out in public. And, yeah, I didn't know how Hollywood would take it, but I. In the back of my mind, I just thought I needed help. Chances are other women would too.

[A]

How has Hollywood responded? How do people that you walk onto a set with, I mean, I see one show after another that you're doing. How do they respond? How Has Hollywood responded?

[B]

I mean, it's been really great. I mean, nothing but positive. You know, if the negative stuff has happened, it hasn't reached me.

[A]

Good.

[B]

I feel like, you know, maybe someone's gone, oh, no, she's the menopause. Or, you know, maybe. But I don't know. I still feel like the phone is still ringing. I've even got directors calling, like, Lena Dunham, saying, I've got this bit, you know, in my TV series, and, you know, I want you to talk about menopause. How does that sound? I was like, oh, my God, I just want to be in a room with Lena Dunham. She's such an incredible writer, someone I've always wanted to work with. So, yeah, it's worked in my favor. Ryan Murphy has created a lot of great work for women of a certain age and, you know, teams of women in one project, whereas usually it's just you and a bunch of men. So it's been pretty great. And I've had, like, a bunch of people stop me in the street and say thank you for helping me understand and giving me the dialogue to talk to my partner, my husband, my family, my people at work. I'm sure you've had the same reaction.

[A]

Does it feel different to you, though? Because I'm sure that they're like, take a picture with me now you want. And now they're like, thank. It's a deeper level. Right.

[B]

It's much more meaningful. Yeah. It gives me purpose. It gives me pride. And, yeah. I mean, I've been stopped on the street and I think, oh, God, I don't have my lipstick on. I'm out with the dog. I'm holding a poop bag, and, you know, and they want to talk about something really personal and meaningful and ends up with tears in her eyes and hugging perfect strangers. And I love that. I really love that.

[A]

I do, too. And I love that you love that. And I think that that's really important. I mean, you're not somebody that said, like, okay, I'm gonna take my name and put it on this product. It's something that you needed years ago. It's something that is a bold move. Right. In an industry. We've talked about that. Which is ridiculous, that it's gotta be a bold move, but it is.

[B]

But the bold risks pay.

[A]

The bold risks. They do pay off. And I don't even think you realize it when it comes from a place that's of necessity and need and purpose. Right. And when it comes from a place of that relationships, you and I are on a parallel path of we both got married in our 50s. Right. I was 50 years old. And when did you get married?

[B]

One at City Hall. And we also did, like, a more celebratory, you know, invited lots of friends. So we've just. I mean, if we're going with the City hall one, which is the official. Yeah, it's. It's just over two years.

[A]

That's amazing. Congratulations.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

It's different, right? It's like 15 years old. You know who you are. I don't know what it is. I don't know what the answer is.

[B]

It feels far more intentional because you know yourself, you know, you've done the work, you've had the good experiences, the bad experiences. You've recovered, you've succeeded, you've failed, you've done all of it, and you've got this much time left. What do you want to do with that time? And, yeah, I met someone by surprise. I really wasn't even looking. I had only just separated from my ex, and I had my head down with work and, you know, sort of grieving that and concentrating on my kids and everything. And. Yeah. Met Billy at work and created a really lovely friendship. And it took me by surprise. And then it slow. Like, the slowest build, which I think was. I don't know how it went with you and Ira, but.

[A]

Too slow for Ira.

[B]

He said it was very slow. I wanted it to go slow. Me, too. And I think it made sense to both of us because, you know, we had. Our kids were still young and. Yeah. And I think earning, building trust.

[A]

I always say, like, Ira is a person I want to walk the world with now, you know, And I think that. And I don't mean it like in a goofy, like, oh, I want to walk the world, but in a way that, like, I enjoy our time, I enjoy our. I enjoy him. And it's easy. And it's very different from other relationships that I've been in. And I. I hear from a lot of women that say, oh, is it. It's too late. It's too late for me to find love.

[B]

Never too late.

[A]

What do you say to people? Because I feel like that's another part of your story that's really inspiring to women. It has to be.

[B]

I. I hate never too late. I hate that. I hate those limits that society puts on us. That said, I know it's hard out there. I've got a lot of women our age who have come out of marriages or whatever, and they're looking to Partner up. And it's not easy, but you just never know. You just don't have that in your head. Otherwise it's just going to close you down. And you have to have an open heart, an open mind, so the signal is there. And it's. I know, you know, attracting good vibes.

[A]

I really believe that I met Ira in a hotel at an elevator bank. Like, that was like, you know, and I was like, oh, no, no, no, no, no. I'm never doing. I got married before. No, thank you. And that was really. And it wasn't even to be like a funny chase. It was just. Cause that wasn't where my head was. And so it was a really, like you said, surprise. Long, you know, long road.

[B]

Yeah. But I think that that's the way it. It probably should go at this point in our lives, like, because we've seen and experienced a lot of things and where do you want to go? You kind of want to figure that out. Like, is this my person? Do we have common goals? Do we have the same values and things like that?

[A]

Do you feel like when you look at everything now and you look at career and relationships and empty nest. In some ways I know that you were, you know, taking a trip to school. Every mom I know has been doing like, the college, you know, drop off. The college, drop off. How are you feeling about it all? I know that's not easy.

[B]

Yeah. Bittersweet. And I'm put at ease by my son's absolute joy about the whole experience. Like, he. This was his first choice. I mean, he. He's on the other side of the country. He's a bit far away from my liking. But, you know, I get to Los Angeles a lot for work, so. And, you know, we'll. We'll go as often as possible. But yeah, the anticipation was, you know, scary. But he was just there and just soaking it in and, you know, beaming ear to ear smiles and he's. He's. I think he's doing really well. And he's very communicative as well. I thought, oh, God, is he gonna be bad? Cause actually when they're here, I couldn't get him to respond to phone calls or text messages at all. But now he does.

[A]

Oh, that's good.

[B]

So that's. I like that.

[A]

That's promising for the first year, right? Yeah, that's promising. When I look at where we all are now, and we're in this, you know, the space of talking about menopause and perimenopause and, you know, there's the hormonal households, and all of that happens during this time and. And empty nest and age. How do you feel now? Do you feel if you go back and look at Naomi, at, you know, in your 30s or 40s, how do you feel now compared to that?

[B]

This is the thing that is great about menopause, because we all fear it. Like, it's, oh, it's over, it's done. Oh, my God, I'll never get myself back. Well, exactly. If you even understand what it is. But I think the perimenopause stages are the most awful time a. Because you don't know what's going on with your body. Now we have the beauty of the conversation being slightly open or much more open than when we were dealing with it. I think the fear of that is now dissipated because we have the education and the open conversation. But I was really flailing. I didn't know if I'd ever sleep again. I didn't know if my anxiety would go away. I thought that my memory would never come back. I thought, you know, all of these things were just who I was going to be from now on and here out. But now post menopause, which, you know, sounds like an ugly term, but, you know, it's fine. It's actually much more even. I've got my dosage under control. My HRT is working. Occasionally I'll have a sweaty night or I'll forget the meds and, you know. And yes, I still look for words. I'm like, oh, God, I forgot the name and what is it? Or what am I looking for? You know, where are my keys? Oh, they're in my hand. You know, all of that, those things are. Are still, you know, there, but they're not as crazy all at once. I do occasionally get surprised. Like, the frozen shoulder that crept up on me a couple of years ago and stayed with me for a good amount of time. And that was painful, aggravating, and no one seemed to know what it was.

[A]

I first heard about it from you because we were standing there and you said something, and I was like, I don't know what that is. I don't have that. And lo and behold, about a year ago, I got it.

[B]

Yeah, isn't that crazy? I know. And I even spoke to doctors, and I said, it's frozen shoulder. And they're like, that's a cute name, but what. And I said, yeah, it's caused by menopause, Lack of estrogen, you know, all the receptors all over your body. And he was like, that's cute. I'm like, I'm not being funny here. I'm just saying that I know 12 people who have got the exact same thing, but they just, you know, haven't joined the dots yet.

[A]

If you've ever caught yourself wondering, am I in perimenopause? What is going on? I've made something for you. It's my free guide called how to perimenopause. It's 18 pages. Inside, you're going to find insights from some of the top experts I've interviewed, the doctors, the specialists who are leading the conversation on women's health. Inside, you'll find the most common early symptoms to wash for the exact test. You should be asking your doctor about lifestyle shifts that actually make a difference from nutrition to movement to stress and clear next steps so you don't get stuck or feel dismissed by your doctor. You can download this for free right [e-mail] howtoperimenopause. It's also linked in the description. Because you don't have to figure this out alone. You deserve real answers backed by real expertise. Expertise I get interviewed often about, like, why do you think that this is a big conversation right now? And, you know, and I always bring up your name in that. Because I do really think that. Because women say, oh, Naomi Watts went through something like that. Well, maybe it's okay for me to talk about in terms of normalizing. I don't. I mean, I'm sure you realize, you know, your voice carries a bit. A lot of weight. And I think it's a really beautiful thing. And I don't know if you feel pressure on that or not, but I think it's important that we have voices like yours out there talking about it to make women say, because they might not hear a doctor's voice. They might not hear my voice. They might not.

[B]

But I think. Thank you for saying that. And I think I bring you along with that. We are normalizing it. We're all of us collectively moving the narrative and doctors as well. And the doctors write their books and give us all the hard facts that we need. And we are able to get on panels with them and be in rooms and learn from them. But also, yes, they need the collective experience to be reflective, whether it's your story, my story, or the women that we include in our stories in our books. Your book over there. So that a woman feels seen, a woman feels understood. And, yeah, I'm very proud, as I'm sure you are, to be part of that shift.

[A]

Are you Having more women in Hollywood that are talking to you directly about it on sets. On what?

[B]

Totally. Everyone just owns it straight away. Now they'll go, oh, I'm having one. You know, like, just. It's their way of saying, I'm in the club. I'm in the club.

[A]

That's what I think, too.

[B]

And I get random text messages from celebrities I've not met before. People connect us, and I mention it in the book. Like, it's like behind the curtain confession thing or, you know, Aunt Tag or something. Yeah. Just. People want to tell their stories and they want to share it. Yeah. They want to know that they're not losing their minds or is this normal? And. Yeah, so I just. I'm always there. I'm a shoulder to cry on and ear to listen. Whatever.

[A]

You're the menopause sister.

[B]

That's what it is.

[A]

Okay, so we know that the calls didn't stop at. They ramped up. You've got a lot of projects out there. I know that you're working constantly. I just saw the trailer to All's Fair and I can't wait. And by the way, it had the soundtrack of Chicago.

[B]

Oh, yes.

[A]

I love it.

[B]

I got that connection. Another one, Tamsen. We are joined at the hip.

[A]

We are joined at the hip. How fun was that? Was that.

[B]

It was so fun. Such a great group of powerhouse women who've done remarkable things with their lives in different ways. And. And yeah, Ryan called me and I was taken by surprise again. And, yeah, he told me the logline of what the story was about, which is a bunch of divorce lawyers, female divorce lawyers in Los Angeles. And already I just thought right there, oh, my God, that is leaning towards highly juicy material.

[A]

And he mentioned on menopause. Can you tell me that part for sure.

[B]

I sent them all a box. You know, of course. I said, if you're not there yet, that's fine. It's there waiting for when you're ready. And everyone was kind enough to post about it and stuff like that. And yeah, we all shared our stories. I remember that first night that Ryan bought us together, and we had a dinner, a party, and we went around the table and talked about lube and things like that.

[A]

I love that. I love what you bring to a set, Naomi. That's very nice. The conversation, the product, the. All of it. And this is Kim Kardashian's first. Is that her first?

[B]

No, she had done something else. She'd done American Horror Story with Ryan before.

[A]

Okay. I didn't know if you'd like if she went to you for advice. And I mean, I would be going to you for advice.

[B]

Oh, for, for menopause or for acting?

[A]

Oh, I don't know. Yeah, for acting. I was thinking. But I guess both.

[B]

Yeah. No, I think she's.

[A]

She's still young, right?

[B]

She's still young, but you never know. I mean, let's say we don't want to put limits. We don't put.

[A]

We have no limits.

[B]

So, no, she's, she's a powerhouse. She knows what she's doing. And she works so hard. She's so focused, so disciplined. Shows up on time, full respect to her, and look what she's achieved.

[A]

I know.

[B]

And that comes from, you know, dedicating hard work.

[A]

It does, it does. And it's. And it's what you do every single day. I saw you last week at an event. I was like, wait a minute. I just, I saw her at this, I saw her doing this. I saw her on the street. Acting. I mean, just really, I mean, for everything that you're doing, but really what you're doing for real women out there is making all the difference. So I hope, I know that I got you. I hope you know that.

[B]

I hope you know that.

[A]

Thank you. Really, it's so special. Thank you for taking the time out to do this. I really appreciate it.

[B]

Thanks, Tamsen.

[A]

A big thank you to Naomi. And by the way, to hear more of her story, check out her book, dare I say it, and her brand stripe. Actually, I should have done the full Monty. Cause it's my favorite too. It is game changing when it comes to how to care for ourselves at this stage of life. And I'm not saying it because she's sitting here, but she knows this. I use resting clean face. I love Full Monty every single day. You see him on my counter all the time. Thank you so much for listening to the Tamsen Show. If you have a moment, leave a review wherever you are listening from and follow us at the Tamsen show. See you next week. Hey everybody. I want you to know today's episode was sponsored by Midi Health. If you're ready to feel your best and write that second act script, visit. Join MIDI Join MIDI.com today to book your personalized insurance covered virtual visit. That's join midi.com midi the care that women deserve.

[B]

Monday Sidekick. The AI agent that knows you and your business, thinks ahead and takes action task at anything seriously. Monday Sidekick AI you'll love to use. Start a free trial today on Monday.com.