← The Tara Palmeri Show
The Tara Palmeri Show
Alex Pretti Shooting: The “Arsonist” Is Running the Investigation (Ex-FBI John Sullivan)
00:42:25
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Tara Palmeri
How about half?
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Tara Palmeri
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John Sullivan
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John Sullivan
You.
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Tara Palmeri
Welcome back to the Tara Palmeri Show. If everyone has seen the video, then why are we being told not to believe our lying eyes? The killing of Alex Preddy, a 37 year old ICU nurse at the VA hospital, has become a battle over framing what happened on the street, who gets to define it, and how quickly can power come in and cement the narrative before an investigation even starts. That's why I'm joined by John Sullivan, a former FBI intelligence defense section chief who says the first hours after an incident like this are everything. Securing evidence, identifying witnesses, and keeping leadership from contaminating the facts. But leadership already came out. Kristi Noem came out within hours saying that Preddy brandished a gun, which he didn't. Everyone can see it. There are pictures, if anything. He brandished a cell phone. He had a gun on him with a concealed carry weapon. The NRA is noting as they apply pressure on the White House, saying that you shouldn't be shot just for carrying a gun. And he was disarmed and yet was still shot. This is a tragedy, a horror, a massacre. And yet the dhs, they're the ones that are actually overseeing this investigation.
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John Sullivan
It's kind of like having the arsonist then come and help put out the fire.
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Tara Palmeri
So how are we ever supposed to get to the truth? We also get into a bigger shift inside of the FBI under Cash Patel. John worked in the FBI until April, and it has changed so much. 20% of the agents have now been pulled into immigration enforcement, meaning there are massive cases, investigations, domestic terror, all sorts of cases that have just been left open or to die so that we can focus on immigration raids. There's also now this leadership. Dan Bongino, Cash Patel, they're just obsessed with optics, caring very little about the actual details of a very important law enforcement agency. And it puts the Bureau at risk of losing the public's trust. So John and I get into all of it, all of the details, what it's like within the FBI right now and if we can even still trust this agency. Take a Listen here.
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Tara Palmeri
John, thank you for joining the show. I really found your contribution to that massive piece in the New York Times over the weekend about how Cash Patel has really changed the FBI in some serious, actually terrifying ways. I found your contribution to be really valuable, especially as a chief intelligence officer. And I know you're no longer working at the FBI, which is a loss for all of us because obviously intel is so important to preventing future crimes as well. But, you know, we, we booked this interview with you around the time of the Alex Preddy assassination. Like, I don't know what other word to use except assassination because he was killed in cold blood on the street, unarmed. And you know, this has become sort of like a time frame debate. I don't know how else to describe it because everybody has video footage of it and yet you hear the administration clinging to one, you know, one sort of frame in the shot. And you know, when you are someone who works in gathering intelligence and you're looking at verified video timeline, what are the three to five decision points you'd flag immediately for investigators and oversight?
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John Sullivan
Yeah, no. Well, thank you so much, Tara, for having me on. And you know, the world is just moving at such a rapid pace right now as a result of the policies of Donald Trump. And you know, I think what we are seeing in some of the lackluster leadership, to put it mildly, of the folks at DHS and the FBI, when you're looking at a shooting like this or an assassination murder, as you, as you mentioned, you know, you're looking at all vantage points. It's really important that investigators are on the ground pretty much immediately after the scene, after the action, and working closely with local law enforcement to secure the scene to identify all the potential evidence, the spent bullet casings, but also looking for, if there's body cam footage, as we've heard, there is also looking to identify folks who are witnesses and get their footage. You know, working in the FBI for the 17 years that I was there, whenever we had some sort of major incident, you were going door to door to businesses and homes looking for ring doorbell camera footage, you want to understand exactly what happened from every vantage point. And you know, unfortunately, in this state that we are in right now, in times we have citizens who have to videotape and record law enforcement actions because they often overstep the boundaries of what's legal and what's precedented. And so I think that if I were part of this investigation going forward, we'd be bringing all of that information together and putting it into a. With a team that is experts in forensics and also how to do officer related shooting investigations and then looking at all the different vantage points. And it's really important, too, to conduct interviews of those who are there, but also the officers themselves. And we've already heard from DHS that they've moved this officer out of the Minneapolis jurisdiction. He's already back on the job. According to them, which is highly unlikely and should not be happening. That officer should be on administrative leave pending the investigation. And they're also saying we will never know that person's name because of fears for their safety. And I think that now that this is such a public incident, it's really important they be as transparent as possible in the investigation.
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Tara Palmeri
It doesn't really feel like there is an investigation when the administration comes out and they are so conclusive about what happened. Within hours, they decided. Kristi Noem puts out a statement saying he was brandishing a gun. He was not brandishing a gun. He had his phone. He was brandishing his phone. Is that a reason to be shot in America? And, you know, now you've got the NRA even coming out against the White House because Kash Patel says he shouldn't be having a concealed carry even though he has a permit for it.
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John Sullivan
Right.
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Tara Palmeri
And, you know, I personally don't understand the need for concealed carry, but my dad carries a concealed carry gun with him everywhere. I mean, I don't know why he needs it, but a lot of people feel like they want to carry a gun and, you know, does that mean that they should be shot?
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John Sullivan
Yeah. No, absolutely it does not. And Cash Patel's statements just this weekend on Fox News were completely disconnected from logic and law and the Constitution. I mean, whether or not people agree with the second Amendment or the ability to have a concealed carry weapon, this person, Alex Preddy, was legally allowed to have that firearm. And no point from the videos that I've seen did he brandish that weapon. In fact, it looks like after he was taken down to the ground, that weapon was removed from his control. And you're right, he was armed with a ph. He was armed with trying to help a citizen who was pushed by ICE who had fallen to the ground. And so right now, what we're witnessing from DHS leadership is the idea to make a judgment call on where this investigation will land. It's kind of like having the arsonist then come and help put out the fire. That is not how things should be working in our criminal justice system and in our investigative process. You would never. If you try to think back over the last 10, 15 years, when have you ever heard an FBI director or DHS secretary come out within minutes of an incident happening and identify sort of the conclusion of an investigation that is yet to start? It's really, really ridiculous because they're not.
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Tara Palmeri
Going to reject it. They're not going to go back and say.
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John Sullivan
Exactly.
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Tara Palmeri
They're not going to go back and say, oh, we made a. We were wrong in our first assessment. So essentially, this is a sham investigation. Unless.
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John Sullivan
Yeah, I don't see how it wouldn't be seen as a sham investigation, particularly since DHS is going it alone. They are not suited. The Homeland Security Group, the hsi, that conducts internal investigations, has come out and said that they don't have the resources or the training to actually do an investigation of this sort. But the FBI is abdicating its authority. Kash Patel is abdicating his authority and not inserting themselves and working with local law enforcement who may know the community, who may know the area and the situation with a little bit more context.
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Tara Palmeri
So why do you think they're blocking state and local law enforcement?
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John Sullivan
You know, it's. It's really hard to kind of get into the mindset of this administration and sort of their approach. I think that from a. From their perspective, they're trying to ensure that HSI or DHS as a whole is not seen as taking any sort of blame for the actions. I think we saw with Renee Goode, and now we're seeing it, unfortunately, with Alex Preddy.
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Tara Palmeri
Yeah. Do you think Kristi Noem should be impeached for this?
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John Sullivan
Kristi Noem should resign, and if she doesn't resign, she should be impeached.
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Tara Palmeri
It seems like already that they are making Tom Hammond, you know, sort of the new leader of ICE right now. This is just recent reporting. They want him on the front lines. They're sort of sidelining Kristi Noem. They're blaming Vivino, her lieutenant, her ICE lieutenant, and they're giving Haman a chance to sort of do cleanup on this. I mean, that suggests to me that she's in a precarious situation, which is interesting, because, you know, I Just had Mark Caputo of Axios on my show last week, and he was explaining that the White House is in a sort of Chinese finger trap situation where they know that public polling is against these ICE raids, but they are of the never back down mentality. So if they pull out, they look weak, and instead they've decided to charge forward. And then this is what happens one week later. And I can't see how he could continue to have confidence in Kristi Noem. But, you know, Mark reported that Kristie wants to run for president and Trump continues to have confidence in her. I just don't see how that happened, how we can continue to have confidence in her.
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John Sullivan
Yeah, I don't see how either. And I think to your point, bringing in Homan is kind of an indication that Trump is really watching a lot of this media coverage and recognizing the fallout of a lot of the actions that were taken by dhs. I think what's really important to note, though, is that Tom Homan is not some sort of arbiter of the truth. I mean, this is a guy who's been accused of taking a bribe. He's someone who has been using some of the most inflammatory rhetoric when it comes to immigration procedures. And so the idea that he's going to be some sort of mediator between walls and ICE is absolutely absurd. And I think that, to your point about Kristi Noem, if she wants to run for president, I feel like that's a campaign that any Democrat would be happy to take on, because obviously she's showing that she lacks the leadership and competence when it comes to running. I think ICE now, or DHS as a whole, is one of the 13th largest military organizations in the world. And she doesn't seem to have control or competence when it comes to leading that organization.
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Tara Palmeri
No, not at all. Just to be clear, Tom Homan accepted a $50,000 bribe before the election from a Kava bag, which is a salad chain.
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John Sullivan
Yes.
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Tara Palmeri
In exchange for access to future administration officials and contracts. So, you know, we're. This is the guy who's supposed to be all about transparency. And then the FBI drops the investigation, the ongoing investigation into it, which must have just been infuriating to your colleagues at the FBI. Just to be clear for our audience, when did you leave the FBI?
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John Sullivan
I left the FBI in early April of 2025.
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Tara Palmeri
Yeah.
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John Sullivan
And so that was after almost 17 and a half years being in the organization.
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Tara Palmeri
And that's about the time when Cash dropped the investigation as well, right?
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John Sullivan
Yeah, it's right around that time. I'm not exactly sure of the date when they dropped the investigation, but it's just one of many that we've seen where the FBI or DOJ has decided to unilaterally end investigations. And I think it's really important for folks to know that an investigation and then the eventual potential prosecution of that individual doesn't just happen by chance. You have to gather evidence and initially to really identify that there's something to investigate. And so when it comes to things like the January 6th insurrectionists who Donald Trump then pardoned, hours and really thousands of hours of manpower and research goes into identifying those investigations and then taking them through to prosecution. And what we've witnessed now with Tom Holman or other leadership like Eric Adams, is that DOJ and the FBI are willing to drop investigations and really be a arm of Donald Trump's personal attorney network to ensure that we're not going after folks who may or may not be closely tied to Donald Trump and his. His cabinet.
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Tara Palmeri
Yeah, they can just operate without impunity. I mean, with impunity. Excuse me. So let me talk to you about this whole idea that the FBI is becoming a part of ICE. Okay, because, you know, 20% of FBI's workforce has been assigned to immigration, immigration enforcement. What does this mean for the rest of the FBI, which handles public corruption, cyber terrorism, drugs, white collar? I mean, what happens when suddenly 20%, which is a huge amount of. Of resources, goes to immigration when you already have a Department of Homeland Security?
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John Sullivan
It's such an excellent question, because those areas, Those where those 20% were working, are no longer a focus. I think it was described in the New York Times piece that you mentioned that, you know, there were investigations that had to be shut down just because one person was leaving their position. Entire groups and networks that we may have been investigating. In the FBI, when you take the team that's doing that work and then you move them to immigration, which is not part of the FBI's charter or mission, you have to drop something because the resources are finite. And the idea that we have now an FBI that is unable to investigate some of the most serious crimes that are occurring, but also to prevent potential attacks and threats from the American people, makes all of us so much less safe. And it makes it so that the FBI is unable to do some of the key tenets of what it's put there to investigate, whether it's cyber, whether it's criminal or counterterrorism or counter espionage. You know, the FBI and the director now like to spout figures that they have seen an increase in their arrests. But a lot of those arrest figures are not the way in which the FBI would ever count arrests. In the past, that's we would count an arrest as an FBI led investigation. And now you have multiple agencies showing up to the same situation with local police and the FBI is counting that as an arrest, even though they may not have had anything to do with the arrest of that individual or the potential investigation.
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Tara Palmeri
Wow. So tally. Just a number. I saw on the piece also that ICE now wants to commingle with FBI teams. From an operational standpoint, how does that change your job at the FBI? And how is that?
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John Sullivan
Yeah, that was something that I talked about in the piece, particularly it was something that occurred while I was still in the FBI as the initial push for immigration enforcement was becoming part of the FBI's requirement. And that was obviously under Cash Patel, Dan Bongino and the Trump administration. From what I understand, Donald Trump was looking at media and seeing that there weren't any FBI raid jackets, which are pretty synonymous with law enforcement, and was pretty upset that they, they weren't there. And so there became this push that the FBI would somehow be involved in immigration enforcement. But then when they took the next step forward further. Excuse me. Which was when DHS and other agencies started talking about commingling with FBI operational teams, including some of the most trained teams that the FBI has. And what you learn, and what I've learned as somebody who led advanced training in the FBI, is that you, you have to ensure that agents who train together can operate together as a team to bring in another group or another set of individuals to co mingle with that team may not have the exact same training as the FBI may not have the same operating procedures.
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Tara Palmeri
And so it really just these nice guys, they can be trained in. What is it? How many days do they have before they're trained?
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John Sullivan
Yeah, I think it's something like six weeks now they're talking about. And if you bring in previous law enforcement experience, it can come cut it down even further, which is really terrifying because in the FBI for new special agents, it was always about six months of training, 18 to 20 weeks. And it goes through everything from constitutional law review and understanding and being tested on that to the operational procedures and tactics used in investigations. And so when you bring individuals in who are less qualified, less trained, less aware, then you end up having a situation where not only are the. Is the public put at risk, but you have FBI agents and ICE agents who are putting each other at risk just because of the idea that these are high stress environments.
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Tara Palmeri
Yeah, I'm sure. I can only imagine what that's like. Also, it's not like joining the FBI means you're going to be busting doors open. I mean, a big part of it actually is like just working on casework and interviewing and going through like files and footage and technology. Like it's not. They're not like cops. I mean, they, they kind of are, but they're not really. They're.
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John Sullivan
No, they're not. And it, you know, it was talked about in the New York Times piece that they're specifically not cops. We have a lot of former law enforcement and cops off cops who become FBI agents. But the FBI, the work to your point is exactly correct. It's conducting investigations, looking at information, analyzing that information, and then if needed, identifying the individual you need to make an arrest of. But a lot of times you're looking at large organizations. I worked in the transnational organized crime groups. I've worked on crimes against children and human trafficking and violent crime in the United States. And not everything ends in an arrest. And when it does, it's been investigated so thoroughly by the agents who are doing that work and the analysts who are synthesizing that information. And so sometimes the TV shows give folks a different idea of exactly what it means to work in the FBI. I've joked that there's a reason why you don't have a reality TV show inside the FBI, because it would be folks typing at their computers and reviewing information. It's not that action focused sort of idea. But now what we're witnessing with ICE and other agencies is that they're kind of taking that mentality of being GI Joe to an extreme and using that on our citizens and individuals just because of the color of their skin.
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Tara Palmeri
Yeah, it's true. Even in the military. I just was talking to another journalist about this at the Pentagon, where it's suddenly all about military brawn, when really a lot of that has been transferred over to technology. I mean, we kill probably more drone people with drones than anything else nowadays. And a lot of military is surveillance strategy, understanding the ground where you're actually like, it's just, there's assessing threats. There's just so much more to it than showing up with your, with your gun like infantry. I don't know, it just seems they're so simplistic in their, in their vision of, of all of these agencies and what they do.
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John Sullivan
It's so true. And you know, I had the opportunity when I was in the FBI to work with the group in the Coast Guard who are monitoring transnational organized crime sort of shipments through the Caribbean, which has obviously become a more hot topic recently as a result of the actions of the current administration. And the reason why you never really heard about the work that was always going on there was because when they identified a shipment that could potentially be headed for the United States, many were not. They knew where they were coming from, they knew where they were going. And many, many of the ships that the Trump administration has blown out of the water, we can, we know we're not headed for the United States. They're headed for other Central American countries. But when I, when the Coast Guard or the FBI were working in this joint interagency format to identify those shipments, they always shut out the engine and then boarded the boat, arrested the individuals and took the payload on so we could then prosecute those individuals. The idea of the military kind of just doing these drone strikes and blowing them out of the water is something that really is not in the standard operating procedure, nor does it allow for us to actually go through the due process and rule of law and give those individuals their time in court and determine whether or not there was a crime being committed. And so I think that it's really important to mention that in the military or in the FBI or any other agency in the federal government, there is always sort of this intelligence sort of piece of the organization that's really important to identifying not only the information, but conducting the investigation to ensure that we are Actually following the law.
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Tara Palmeri
Right. I do want to get to this idea of First Amended Amendment protected activity and legitimate threat assessment. And Jill Field, she, I believe she is an FBI officer, said in the New York Times piece that she was ordered to have members of her team run a pre assessment of some anti ice protesters who allegedly had impeded an immigration arrest. And, you know, the FBI policy says that an investigation can't be opened based on First Amendment protected activity, but they wanted the video analyzed anyway to determine if they had done anything wrong. And, you know, obviously she faced some retribution. Retribution for not doing this. But, I mean, what did you make of this, of this idea of the line between First Amendment activity and assessing threats at these protests?
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John Sullivan
Yeah, the. The FBI that I was a part of for 17 years, we always talked about and were very careful of First Amendment protected activity. We had to ensure that when we were looking at a situation or some sort of activity that it was in any way investigating individuals or analyzing information just based on someone's First Amendment protected status and the activities that they're taking place, taking part in, like the right to protest, like the right to free speech. An investigation could not be predicated or started as a result of those activities. And so, you know, I know Jill a little bit from our time in the FBI. She's a courageous person. I really applaud her for standing up and calling out that example because it marks a change in how the FBI is being used under the system administration and under Patel and Damongino when he was still there. They obviously don't understand how the FBI works. They don't understand the Constitution, and they don't understand First Amendment protected activity. They're more than happy to be spouting off on cable news their thoughts about, you know, those on the left and individuals who are protesting, but then they're directing investigations as a result of that protected activity. It's something Americans should be concerned about, should be calling their members of Congress about and calling it out and saying, what are you going to do to rein this in? Because obviously what witnessing now is citizens recording what's happening on the streets, and we're seeing it. But if the FBI is investigating those individuals, just like, you know, we're hearing reports that Renee Good's partner is being investigated as potentially an agitator preceding that event, then you're missing the entire focus of what should be occurring. We should be looking at the officers who are conducting this activity. It's really important to note, I think, that in the killings that we've witnessed, in at no point was it the individual who was exercising their First Amendment right who started the incident, who fired on an officer. It was always the officers retaliating with extreme force and murdering individuals. And that's what ends up happening when you have these very divisive sort of heated situations that we're witnessing in Minneapolis. And the FBI should not be looking at individuals who are protesting or any way exercising their first amendment protected activities.
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Tara Palmeri
Yeah. You know, it's interesting you brought up Dan Bongino and Cash Patel and they are obviously obsessed with optics. So is Kristi Noem doing the FBI ride along for a video? You know we found out that they were pitching a reality show about her time at dhs. They are obsessed with wearing FBI raid jackets. They want these TV moments. I was, my mind was blown when I read that, that account in the New York Times of senior leaders having to script a series of tweets about the Charlie Kirk assassination before they even knew what happened. And that there's just such an obsession with responding, with tweeting, with maintaining this like I hate to say it but like podcaster role that they had. They're, they don't see themselves as leader. There's another line where he said Cash Patel tells someone who's preparing his briefing, I don't read and listen. We know Trump doesn't read. Right. And he wants everything on graphs or in a Fox News like briefing. You know, he watched, he wants to watch it like it's a TV report, whatever briefing he's getting. But this is, this is kind of, this is crazy.
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John Sullivan
Yeah, yeah, that's, that's the word. That's the word for it. It's crazy. I think that it's important to note that the FBI is 38, 000 people and there of great and brave men and women who go to work every day who actually do the work of the FBI. But it's important to have your leadership in a situation where they understand sort of what is happening in the day to day sort of operations of the organization, understanding the high level challenges that are being faced. And in Charlie Kirk's murder, for example, I think that you have to understand too that there's a lot of information coming in. It is rapid sort of triage inside of an FBI command post, many of which I've run in the past. And you have to have the ability to talk about the fact facts that you're finding. Some of the information is less vetted, some of it's more strongly proven and you need to be able to Identify the key pieces of information and talk with your bosses and superiors and say, this is where we're leading. It looks like it could be one of these three people or it could be this individual. But what. But Dan Bongino, and in his example that was in the New York Times, and Cash Patel with Charlie Kirker, they're talking about how they're going to sort of get information out and tweet about it and how they're going to respond to one another in such an artificial way about information that wasn't yet vetted. And I think we saw the. The challenges of that. Right. Cash Patel put out a statement saying that they had the suspect in custody. And then it turns out an hour later, he had to say, no, that was not the right suspect. Well, what that does is a couple things. One, it makes the people on the ground less safe because they think that the perpetrator has been captured. And then what ends up happening is you then start to lose trust in the FBI and the information you're receiving from the FBI, and that's why it's so important that it's vetted before it's released to the public, because you just want to make sure that you're right. And then you have Cash Patel who goes in front of Congress, and they all call him out for doing it and say, did you make a mistake? And he refuses to admit he did. When it came to Charlie Kirk's murder, the individual who confessed was actually turned in by his father days later. So the idea that the FBI was in the sort of triage respond sort of mode, trying to identify the key pieces of information, get local law enforcement cooperation, working with Secret Service, and then you have Kash Patel, who gets out in front of that. It's just so irresponsible, and it's crazy, and it's unqualifying to be the FBI director.
- [29:40]
Tara Palmeri
How far gone is the institution? Can we even trust it to protect us and work for us at this point? With that kind of leadership and the fact that so many people who have spent decades learning the craft and becoming seasoned investigators and really earning their place in the ranking are gone. And I don't know how you replace them.
- [29:59]
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Tara Palmeri
See terms 1 who spent 20 years in the FBI.
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John Sullivan
Yeah, it's going to be really hard to rebuild the FBI and sort of reform and update the FBI to make it going forward, to make it sure that it's still one of the leading law enforcement agencies in the United States. But I think that under Cash Patel and other senior leaders that he's brought in, they've done a great harm to the FBI. They've made it where the public is not trusting the FBI, where folks like yourself should be asking that question. And that's not something that ever happened before. I have to put my faith and hope in the folks that are still inside the FBI that are doing the work every day, that are speaking out. There were a number of unnamed sources in that New York Times report, which I think shows that there are people still doing the work who have concerns and pushing back in their own way against things that they see as unlawful. But I have to understand too and be realistic that we have three more years of Donald Trump and his administration and letting Cash Patel stay at the helm of that organization is going to do some irreparable harm. And I want to want folks in the FBI to feel protected and you don't get to go to work every day and feel that you are in a safe space to do your job. When Cash Patel is going out in the media and criticizing actions of his own agency, or when he's criticizing individuals inside the FBI and former folks inside the FBI as individuals who he does not see as trustworthy or in any way reputable. So I think that folks should still trust in the FBI because it is 38,000 people who are doing that work every day. But the FBI is going to have a lot of building to do when we move into a new era where Donald Trump is not in leadership, Cash Patel is not the director, and we can actually start rebuilding the FBI to make sure it's following the rule of law, following the facts and gaining the intelligence from allies and on adversaries around the world to make sure we're protecting the American people.
- [32:21]
Tara Palmeri
Yeah, I mean, also, there's just so many details in this story. He's heading to the Five Eyes op se. It's the, it's an, it's like an annual Retreat. Right, The Five Eyes retreat. Correct. And it involves our allies. If you could just brief everyone on who the Five Eyes are.
- [32:44]
John Sullivan
Yeah, the Five Eyes are sort of the most trusted group across the world of countries. So it's New Zealand, Australia, the United States, Canada, and England. And so it is working closely with those agencies, whether it's MI5 and MI6 or the Australian services. And there's a lot of sharing that occurs kind of just at a automatic level because of the agreements we have where it really does protect the American people, both here and abroad, but also protects the citizens of the Five Eyes, because we're able to share information so rapidly. You have places inside the federal government where you have officers from those other agencies sitting with our officers to make sure that information is flowing freely. And we obviously have great relationships with authorities around the world. I actually spent time overseas in Africa as well as in the Middle east, sharing information to protect the American people. But what Cash Patel has done is kind of made this into a juvenile sort of arrangement, because when I was overseas in the Middle East, I had Chris Wray come in, and he sat down for a bilateral meeting with his counterpart. And I sat in the room as they discussed challenges both of our nations were facing and ways in which we could improve collaboration and coordination and highlighting successes that they had had working together. But Kash Patel says he doesn't want to meet in conference rooms. He doesn't want to meet in a normal sort of business setting. He wants to ride jets, skis, or do other activities with these leaders, which is so completely outside of the norm for an FBI director. But you have to remember, we're working with individuals who are from other countries who have other protocols and standards. And if they see the FBI director is just wanting to be this guy who flies around on planes and parties on jet skis and, you know, provides security protection to his girlfriend, then that limits the willingness that they may have to share information with that individual, because he's showing himself to be completely unserious.
- [34:38]
Tara Palmeri
I mean, he wanted to go to Premier League. He wanted a photo at the Windsor Palace. Well, his girlfriend, the country singer, wanted. Who, by the way, gets a SWAT team for security. They're flying around on the FBI's private jet to go to her concerts. And then when they get the picture, the Five Eyes, which they're supposed to be, you know, the partners are supposed to be com. Be. Be letting confidence. Right. The members of the Five Eyes. And can you kind of explain to the audience what happened when he wanted to post a Picture of himself with these members of the Five Eyes. Like, this is just absurd. I can't even do it justice.
- [35:21]
John Sullivan
Yeah. Yeah. So to your point earlier about them being so focused on social media and tweets and likes and reposts, Kash Patel wants everything that is him being the FBI director is some sort of cosplaying as this sort of GI Joe figure. And so anytime he does something that he would probably consider cool, he wants to share it with all of his Twitter followers. And what's really concerning about this story that was talked about when it comes to reposting a photo that was taken? You have to understand that those meetings do have principal figures who are known to the public, like Kash Patel. But there's also a number of individuals in those photos whose identity and information and face may want to be hidden from public view just because it would impede their ability and safety to do their work. And so Kash Patel wanted to post this picture that had many faces and individuals in it and was trying to work back and forth with the Five Eye members to get clearance to do this, because the FBI quickly realized that we have never posted information like that. The Five Eyes never post that this meeting has occurred or who was in the meetings. And Cash Patel was more focused on showing that he did something that was interesting and he thought might get some likes. And that's just so deeply concerning and undermines trust and the willing to collaborate, coordinate, and speak frankly with the director of the FBI, who, in times of crisis, needs to be able to have someone pick up the phone and give him a call or vice versa, and know that the information is going to be going towards protecting the American people or the citizens of another country and not somebody who's going to tweet about it or try to make some sort of viral moment because of the work he's doing.
- [36:59]
Tara Palmeri
Yeah, it's. It's crazy. I wanted to also, you know, ask you about your run for Congress. I know you're running in New York 17, and you're trying to take on Mike Lawler, who is a Republican who flipped a Democratic seat, the Hudson Valley region of New York. And he did this during the red wave, you could say during the Biden year. Second. Second. First midterm of the Biden years. And, you know, why did you decide that you wanted to run? Why do you think that? I mean, he's obviously a vulnerable seat. There's no doubt about it. So what is it about his leadership? Is that that you think he needs to be changed? Because he's often like the, the, the first one to sort of say, hold, hold the phone. Let's, let's wait a minute. Because he knows that his, his district is not that conservative.
- [37:55]
John Sullivan
Yeah, no, it's, it's a great question. Look, I jumped in the race. It was not sort of my plan a year ago to be in this race. I was still in the FBI doing my work. But when I saw that Mike Lawlor was supporting and defending Donald Trump's decisions to make us less safe, backing a lot of his policies that were putting a bigger pressure on folks of the district, including whether it's the big ugly bill or the rescission package that he voted for that's ratcheting up prices. And now he supports the actions that ICE is taking, including here in Peekskill and Brewster and Ossining, where we have had agents arrest individuals, including a four year old, from their front porch. Mike Lawler has shown that he doesn't have the leadership capability. What he had was two years in the Biden administration where a lot of his ideas in his first term in Congress couldn't really come to fruition because Joe Biden was still the president. But now in the last year, what we've witnessed is sort of the worst ideas coming to fruition because he has Donald Trump in the White House and he's trying to protect himself. He's kind of doing a center pivot at the moment, but that's after doing everything and voting with Donald Trump 100% of the time. He just co sponsored the Make Greenland Great Again Act. He wants us to go in and take Greenland. So Mike Lawler is not a serious politician. Yeah, he is Someone that, you know, to your point, is in a swing district. It is a purple district and it's a district uniquely impacted by the terrible decisions he's made. He would much rather spend time on cable news and talking about mom dummy than he would actually spends the time governing and coming up with common sense responses and answers to the challenges we face.
- [39:38]
Tara Palmeri
Well, we'll see what happens in that race. So thank you for your time. I think all eyes will be on you if you end up being the nominee, because it will be a tight. It'll be a close one. Whoever, whoever wins. As the Democrats.
- [39:49]
John Sullivan
It will be. It will be. And as a Democrat, we need to bring solutions, not just frustration and outrage, but we need to tell folks what we're for, not just what we're against. So I look forward to continuing the conversation.
- [40:01]
Tara Palmeri
Okay, thanks so much for your time, John. I appreciate it. Any last thoughts on what happened in Minnesota that you think that maybe we're missing? That may come.
- [40:09]
John Sullivan
It's an absolute travesty and Donald Trump needs to make the decision to pull the ICE folks out and allow Minnesota to actually conduct the investigations needed and lower the temperature.
- [40:21]
Tara Palmeri
Yeah, I don't think that's happening anytime soon. Looks like ICE is going to be doing its own investigation into a murder that it has concluded it has no fault in.
- [40:30]
John Sullivan
So. Yeah, Right. Right.
- [40:32]
Tara Palmeri
All right. Thank you. That was another episode of the Tara Palmeri Show. Thank you so much for tuning in. If you like this show, please follow subscribe Rate It Share it with all your friends. If you like my reporting, go to tarapaul mary.com Sign up for my newsletter, the Red Letter. It's where you can get my independent journalism straight to your inbox and you can support it by becoming a paid subscriber and you'll get those exclusives. I want to thank my producer, Eric Abenate. I want to thank Abby Baker for booking this interview. She does my social media and research too. Adam Stewart on the graphics and Dan Rosen, my manager. See you again soon.
- [41:12]
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