EXCLUSIVE: Deciding Vote Blocking Epstein files tied to Ghislaine Maxwell

Summary

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Podcast Summary: The Tara Palmeri Show

Episode: EXCLUSIVE: Deciding Vote Blocking Epstein Files Tied to Ghislaine Maxwell
Date: September 30, 2025
Host: Tara Palmeri
Guest: Abby Baker (Researcher and reporter)

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Episode Overview

This episode dives into the behind-the-scenes connections between Alaska Senator Lisa Murkowski—the deciding vote on releasing Jeffrey Epstein’s files—and Ghislaine Maxwell’s inner circle. Host Tara Palmeri and reporter Abby Baker unravel a web of personal, political, and business ties linking Murkowski, Maxwell, her husband Scott Borgerson, and influential Alaskan donor Alice Rogoff. Throughout, they examine how these intersecting relationships may have influenced the Senate vote and broader efforts to block the Epstein files’ release, raising critical questions about transparency and the reach of elite networks.

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Key Discussion Points

1. How the Story Broke [00:02–01:50]

• Tara shares the surge of interest in her investigation published on The Red Letter newsletter.
• Abby Baker explains the genesis:
  • The story kicked off thanks to victim and survivor Marika Chartuni, who, "just because, you know, she and other victims have been...let down...by the DOJ, by Trump, by Congress," conducted her own digging and inspired the deeper investigation. (01:54)

2. Mapping the Connections: Murkowski & Maxwell’s Inner Circle [01:50–09:42]

• Initial Connection (2009):

  • Murkowski and Scott Borgerson (Maxwell’s future husband) met while testifying at a Senate Foreign Relations Committee hearing regarding the Law of the Sea Treaty, an issue vital to Alaska's interests.
  • Borgerson, a rising figure in Arctic maritime circles, shared overlapping business interests with Murkowski.
  • Tara notes, “They obviously clearly knew each other very well...they both stood to profit from these Arctic shipping routes.” (04:53)
  • Continued contact: They both appeared at Arctic-centered events (Arctic Imperative Summit, Council on Foreign Relations), including a notable 2016 panel, years after Maxwell’s Epstein ties were widely publicized.
  • Maxwell’s introduction to Borgerson and to Murkowski allegedly occurred via these elite Arctic events.

• Ghislaine Maxwell’s Reputation Rehab:

  • After public scandal and legal battles, Maxwell used her “TerraMar” foundation focused on the Arctic to "launder her name" and maintain access to elite circles. (06:06)

• Alice Rogoff’s Role:

  • Described by Abby as “the ringleader of these Arctic events...a very rich lady...close with Senator Murkowski.”
  • Rogoff—founder of the Arctic conferences and owner of the Alaska Dispatch—acted as a powerbroker, donor, media owner, and connector for Maxwell, Borgerson, and Murkowski.
  • Rogoff endorsed Maxwell’s TerraMar in the Dispatch, despite public knowledge of Maxwell's allegations.

3. The Importance and Implications of Timing [09:42–11:18]

• Tara highlights that the connections continued well past the point when Maxwell’s and Epstein’s scandals had become public knowledge.
  • “...it was 2016, long after people knew about Ghislaine Maxwell and Jeffrey Epstein.” (05:11)
• The hosts observe that Maxwell was not hiding; she continued high-profile appearances and networking.

4. Official Response from Murkowski [11:18–12:00]

• Statement from Murkowski’s spokesperson, Joseph Plesha:
  • The Senator only met Maxwell “in passing...never spending meaningful time with her or having any substantial conversation...was completely unaware of her crimes or her association with Jeffrey Epstein...to suggest otherwise is simply false.” (11:44)

5. More Evidence of Elite Proximity and Endorsement [12:00–18:20]

• Maxwell, Borgerson, Murkowski, and Rogoff repeatedly appeared at the same events, spoke on the same stages, and traveled together (including a 2014 private jet trip to the Iditarod, as confirmed in public reporting).
• Abby: “You have to be close with someone...to invite them on a trip when you only have like six seats on your plane.” (17:02)
• Tara: “...that is exactly how these relationships to power...are able to really hold onto these relationships to power and how it’s so insidious…” (13:00)

6. The Fallout and Ongoing Cover-Up [18:20–22:59]

• The hosts point out the irony of Murkowski's public support for anti-sex trafficking bills while blocking file release.
  • “...Senator Murkowski has sponsored so many bills to help stop sex trafficking, and yet she won’t release the files. It’s just a weird dissonance...” (22:18)
• Pressure from survivors is mounting; much of the continued stonewalling, Tara argues, “rings hollow.”
• Discussion widens to the propensity of the powerful to continue associating with Epstein and Maxwell even after public revelations.
  • Tara: “How many people continue to hang out...with Jeffrey Epstein after he went to jail?...Why Bill Gates...Peter Thiel...Steve Bannon?” (20:34)
• The episode closes with a call for whistleblowers and journalists to keep pushing for transparency.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “They both stood to profit from these Arctic shipping routes, and it’s an issue central to Murkowski’s constituencies.”
  —Tara Palmeri on why Murkowski and Borgerson’s interests aligned (05:47)

• “Her Terramar organization...trying to accomplish something so niche...which is why her being at these events makes a lot of sense and also why this connection to Senator Murkowski is, although still surprising, not as surprising because she’s the senator for Alaska.”
  —Abby Baker (07:46)

• “Alice Rogoff...coming at it in three different ways. She had a lot of clout in Alaska. Some could argue she might have been even more powerful than Lisa Murkowski herself.”
  —Tara Palmeri (10:39)

• “You have to be close with someone, close enough at least to invite them on a trip when you only have like six seats on your plane.”
  —Abby Baker on Rogoff and Maxwell’s private plane trip (17:02)

• “It’s a small plane.”
  —Tara Palmeri’s dry aside reinforcing the exclusivity of these associations (17:23)

• “Why didn’t Lisa Murkowski say before she took that vote, I know Ghislaine Maxwell’s husband. I’ve been on the stage with him at least five times. I know...Alice Rogoff is a prominent donor...”
  —Tara Palmeri, on transparency obligations (14:05)

• “Over and over again, these men and women in power...just thinking, why not spend time with a sex offender?”
  —Tara Palmeri on elite disregard for Epstein’s conviction (20:34)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• How the story broke: 00:02–01:50
• Mapping connections (Murkowski, Maxwell, Borgerson): 01:50–07:46
• Alice Rogoff’s role: 07:46–09:42
• Public scandal timeline and elite endorsement: 09:42–11:18
• Murkowski’s official response: 11:18–12:00
• Shared appearances, travel & events: 12:00–18:20
• Elite circles & power dynamics: 13:20–18:20
• Survivor advocacy and continued resistance: 18:20–20:34
• The wider web of elite impunity: 20:34–22:59

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Conclusion

Tara Palmeri and Abby Baker unspool a tangled web of connections tying political, business, and media elites in Alaska—centered around Senator Lisa Murkowski—to Ghislaine Maxwell and, by extension, Jeffrey Epstein. Their work highlights the insidious nature of social and financial networks, the persistence of power even in the wake of scandal, and the ongoing struggle for transparency. This episode leaves listeners with the chilling question: What more remains concealed, and will accountability ever prevail?

For ongoing coverage, Tara urges listeners to follow The Red Letter and submit tips to continue shining light on this tangled saga.

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Transcript

[A]

Welcome to the Tara Palmeri Show. As you can see behind me, I am on the road, but I felt that I needed to jump back on and come back in with a report because I just saw how much engagement we saw across the Internet and from people all over the place for the latest investigation that I broke on the Red Letter. It is my substack newsletter. You can go to tarapaul mary.com and you can see all of my investigations there. And as you'll see, I've got Abby Baker on the line with me. And Abby is my star researcher and reporter. And the two of us worked on this piece together where we explained how the deciding vote on the Jeffrey Epstein bill, the one that would release the files in the Senate, had a very close connection to Jeffrey Epstein through Glenn Maxwell. So Abby and I, since we did this reporting, we're going to break it all down. But I think for first, we should probably explain to everyone how we even came across this story and how we were even notified of these connections that Senator Murkowski, the deciding Vote, a Republican woman from Alaska, how we found out that she had these very close connections with Glenn Maxwell, her husband, and a very wealthy donor in Alaska and the publisher of the Alaska Dispatch. So, Abby, maybe you could take it away here and let everyone know how we. How we found out about all of this.

[B]

Yeah. Who knew in Alaska there was. We were going to find all of this. Yeah, it was one of the victims of Jeffrey Epstein. Margie Marika. Yeah, Marika Church.

[A]

That's okay. She's got a hard name to pronounce. I know.

[B]

I know. She was doing her own research. I think just because, you know, she and other victims have been, you know, let down in a way by the doj, by Trump, by Congress. They were all in Washington the other week holding a press conference to express their distrust in the system and how things have gone so far. So, yeah, she did a little digging, and we were able to take that and kind of run with it. We found, obviously, pictures and lots of different connections with Dylan's husband, Scott Borgeson, which a lot of people don't even know that she had a husband or this partner. But, yeah, the Murkowski connection started, I believe, in 2009.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

We want to double check.

[A]

I will look at that right now. We're gonna. It's very convoluted. So we. I have all of the. The pictures and the story right here because we want to make sure we are relaying our story the right way because it is a very tangled Web of connections. But yes, the first time Borgeson and Murkowski that we know of, that they Met was in 2009 when they both testified at a Senate Foreign Relations Committee hearing. This was in favor of the Ratify the Law of the Sea Treaty, which would expand Alaskan territory. And it would, it would allow Alaska to have more territory in the Arctic region where Alaska is obviously based. And for every, for context, Scott Borgeson, who was not Glenn Maxwell's husband at the time, but he was a rising star in Arctic maritime investments. He has this company that, that does data on shipping and he had a lot of done a lot of research papers. He had a naval background and he had a big interest in the Arctic Circle. And we know for a fact that they spoke at this Senate Foreign Relations Committee hearing. The Senator then published an article about this on her website. I had an opportunity when Senator Clinton was before our committee at the beginning of the year for confirmation to bring up the issues of the Arctic, to bring up the issue of ratification of the Law of the Sea Treaty. We look at the Arctic up there and once you go offshore, there's no clear definition as to where those boundaries are. Lots of issues of priority, but one where I think the committee can really take leadership is ratification of the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea. There are also, I think, a lot of reasons to believe that the Arctic. And Sarah Murkowski, I think of part point out some of these, that there is cause for concern. There's unclear jurisdiction and blurred lines of sovereignty, not just in terms of potential continental shelf overlap, but also in terms of the application law of the Sea Treaty to Northwest Passage Northern Sea route. The article, the treaty that pertains to ice covered waters, Article 234, disputed maritime boundary lines, including with our neighbor and largest trading part of Canada and Russia, I think particularly leaves reason for concern. But then they continue to appear together at a number of different events. From 2011 to 2012, they appeared at the Arctic Imperative Summit, then the center for American Progress event. Scott Borgeson in 2016 moderated a conversation with Murkowski at the Council on Foreign Relations. It's very prestigious, by the way, and you can see the two of them on the screen together. And so they obviously clearly knew each other very well. And Scott Borgeson and Elisa Markowski had a lot of the same business interests because her interest is expanding the economy of her state, Alaska. That helps her constituents, Alaskans. So they both stood to profit from these Arctic shipping routes. And, and it's an issue central to Murkowski's constituencies. Now, the thing that is so crucial about these dates. Well, first of all, 2016 is long after people knew about Ghislaine Maxwell and Jeffrey Epstein and the fact that she was associated with Jeffrey Epstein and the horrors that happened. And she had gone through a really terrible defamation case with Virginia Giuffre. She lost that case. She was accused of perjury. She owed her millions and millions of dollars. She continued to stay in touch with Jeffrey Epstein through all this time, as we've seen through emails. But yet Ghislaine Maxwell at this time used her nonprofit, Terra Mar, you know, to. To launder her name. And, you know, that was her way of cleaning up her reputation after being so closely associated with Jeffrey Epstein. So she. She really needed the Circle, that she was a part of this Arctic Circle to do that. And she actually met her husband, Scott Borgeson, through this at one of the events, the Arctic. The inaugural Arctic Circle event, where her husband, Scott Borgeson was a speaker and where. And where Lisa Murkowski beamed in, as well as a speaker from via video. Abby, do you want to take it away with a little bit more? I know this is a lot to follow, so I feel like I'm probably missing something.

[B]

I think the. One of the most important things is her terramar organization is such a. Was trying to accomplish something so niche. It's not like she was trying to clear her name through, like, abroad, a children's charity or something. This is like a very niche part of the world trying to help the Arctic Circle, which is why her being at these events makes a lot of sense and also why this connection to Senator Murkowski is, although still surprising, not as surprising because she's the senator for Alaska. What's also interesting is in 2018, we haven't spoken about Alice Rogoff yet, but she is the kind of ringleader of these Arctic events. She founder. Yeah, yeah, she was the founder of the conferences. So that's why. That's another connection. She was a. Is a very rich lady and was close with Senator Murkowski. I'm sure she still is. And in 2018, she. Well, she's the one who also then is inviting Ghislaine and Scott and the senator to these events. So her connection and all of this is really. We get to 2018, this is post, as you were saying, 2016, when Ghislaine has been in the press for the things she was doing with Jeffrey Epstein. And her connections were very clearly out there. Terramar at the time was still up and running, although losing money rapidly, I believe. And Alice wrote in the Alaska Dispatch, which she was the owner, founder, basically just an article endorsing Terramar as a whole, which why, in that case, you know, after everything that had come out already, why would you endorse someone who, you know, is, you know, involved with Epstein and all that wrongdoing?

[A]

Yeah, I think the defamation case with Glenn Maxwell and Virginia giuffre started in 2015, and it was brutal and it was spilling out in the press. And if you remember this as well, Virginia Giuffrei came out for the first time in 2010 about Prince Andrew and how she was sexually abused by him. And she alleged that it was Ghislaine Maxwell who had introduced her to Prince Andrew. So the press goes all the way back to 2010, even way before 2015, and that's what really started the defamation case. And then you go into the real nitty gritty, and you see how Ghislaine Maxwell was grooming these girls and turned Virginia Giuffre into a number of others, into sex slaves. So, yes, this is Alice Rogoff, a prominent, prominent donor. And also, not only was she the founder of the Arctic Circle, a prominent donor to Lisa Murkowski, we found a number of times when she donated to her. She was also the owner of a newspaper, the Alaska Dispatch. I mean, being an owner of media, I mean, this woman is coming at it in three different ways. She had a lot of clout in. In Alaska. Some could argue she might have been even more powerful than Lisa Murkowski herself.

[B]

Yeah, I mean, not too uncommon now, owning a newspaper and vouching for candidates. But, yeah, I do think her connection and all of this is really important because, you know, whether it's the donations or her, you know, continuing to vouch for Maxwell, kind of shows her judgment is not obviously fully there either.

[A]

Right. So, like we said, Galen Maxwell is not lurking in the shadows, despite Virginia Giuffre being out there with her allegations and other women coming forward. In 2014, she gave a speech at one of the Arctic Circle forums in Reykjavik. And as you can see from our pictures on the red at the red letter, you can find [e-mail] that's T A R A P A L M E R I dot com. You can see pictures of Glenn Maxwell on the stage and Murkowski on the stage. Now, they're not on at the exact same time, but they are both featured speakers. So is her husband, Scott Borgeson. So these women, you know, I'm sorry, but I've been directing that before. There's not a lot going on over there. These circles are very close, very tight knit. You know, you come to these sort of events and there's a lot of mingling and spending time together. And, you know, you have to think to yourself, you know, is this something where, oh, the staff just didn't tell, you know, Murkowski about Maxwell, But Maxwell was really being introduced to her by one of, you know, one of the most influential people in Alaska. And that is exactly how these relationships to power, the way that Epstein and, sorry, Maxwell were able to really hold onto these relationships to power and how it's so insidious, their relationships to donors, to politicians all throughout Washington. And why, frankly, I think the Epstein files have been sealed for so long and so many refuse to do the right thing. But I do want to include a statement from Murkowski spokesperson, just because I think it's fair at this moment. And we'll include the rest of it at the end of our report. But Joseph Plesha, who works for Senator Murkowski, said that the senator met Maxwell in passing an international conference more than 10 years ago, never spending meaningful time with her or having any substantial conversation with her, and was completely unaware of her crimes or her association with Jeffrey Epstein. There is no further connection between them. And to suggest otherwise is simply false. All right, I think we need to also keep going with this. So Maxwell's husband, Scott, continues to work very closely with Murkowski on Arctic policy. Okay. He's in the same circuit as. As Murkowski. And they. They move in these elite circles. And it's just, you know, it's just a reminder to me of how these calls for transparency, they ring hollow. Right? I mean, it just feels like, why didn't Lisa Murkowski say before she took that vote? I know Ghislaine Maxwell's husband. I've been on the stage with him at least five times. I've worked on policy with him. I know whether it's, you know, outright where they sat down together and actually worked on the policy, but they were certainly discussing it at very high levels at the Council of Foreign Relations, the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. She should have mentioned that she was on stage at events that Glenn Maxwell was also speaking at, and that she should have mentioned that they have this connection through Alice Rogoff. I think as a public person, she needed to explain to people that she had. That she had a connection to Ghislaine Maxwell that they had even Just met in passing, if that's all she's going to say. I mean, and I think that that is what is so striking about all of this.

[B]

Yeah, I mean the 2018 timeline as well. She, Rogoff is endorsing Terramar in her publication and also in the same year is doing a one on one interview with Murkowski. So you know, if at that point 2018 everybody knew about the Jeffrey Epstein scandal, I mean that was. You've been reporting on this for I don't even know how many years, but it was definitely out there. So to still associate yourself with someone who is jet setting around with Gilla. And we also have the story of them going on that Rogoff's private plane, her and Ghislaine. But yeah, to still be associating yourself with someone and going to these conferences is not something that she can really shy away from.

[A]

Yeah, I think. Please tell everyone about this story about Glenn Maxwell on the Cessna. By the way, Alaska. According to Marika Chartuni, who is the survivor who really got on this, the reason that she felt so impassioned about this and really felt that there was a reason behind it is because she knows how small Alaska is having grown up there and how small these circles are. So we're going to share some reporting from an independent journalist that Abby found about when Ghislaine Maxwell came to Alaska and spent time with Alice Rogoff. This is also reported in the New York Post based on actually Ghislaine Maxwell's telling of this at a party.

[B]

Yeah, so she went to the Iditarod race in Alaska. This is like a very again all the elite circles, people, you know, a very high class and well means are able to attend these events. Alice Roboff had a private plane and Ghislaine was invited to go with them. I believe they had two planes with them and I don't have it in front of me. But Ghislaine, yeah. Was on the plane and went to this event with her. What was the year again, Tara?

[A]

I believe it was 2014. Yeah, 2014. Yeah.

[B]

So 2014 they're in Alaska together from the two were very chummy. From what we've heard they got along very well and you know, clearly you have to be close with someone close enough at least to invite them on a trip when you're only have like six seats on your plane. So. Yeah, I mean it says a lot about.

[A]

It's a small plane. Yeah, yeah.

[B]

I mean I've never been on one, but yeah, yeah. I mean it it goes to show. And again, we'll include the reporting from one of the passengers on the plane. But, yeah, I mean, it's. They're all caught up with each other. I mean, Alaska, small, Washington, smaller, I think one could argue. I mean, the fact that this story has been out for so long and people are now just finding out about it, you know, begs the question, like, how much more is there that we haven't found out yet? So I think, you know, Murkowski saying she did say get the files out there and just be done with it. And she said that in an interview, you know, a few months ago. But, you know, there's a cost to that. And, you know, she clearly didn't want them out. If she wanted them out, she would have voted yes. And then she tried to blame it on Schumer and the Democrats and things like that. But, yeah, I mean, it's. That's something that, you know, we have to deal with going forward.

[A]

Apparently, Maxwell on the plane was flirting with pilots and bragging about her Mossad linked X. Wonder who that was.

[B]

Yeah, just another normal day. Normal day in Alaska, right?

[A]

Yeah. So we shall see what happens. I just think it really exposes a grave misjudgment by Lisa Murkowski that she may have made in the name of economic development for her state. And we, you know, either more will come out based on this, or the senator will decide to vote how she said she would have voted originally to get the files out there. Only time will tell. But, of course, the Tara Palmeri show, the red letter, which you can continue [e-mail] where Abby and I are going to continue investigating, because as survivors say, they're not done yet. We have a series called the Reckoning. This is part one. And they really want to hold these members to account that refused to release the files and show their connections to Jeffrey Epstein. And this is just part one. And, you know, they're doing what they do in Washington, opposition research. This all started really because Marika Chartuni, the survivor that we were talking about from Alaska, she walked up to Harriet Hageman, the congresswoman, and she asked her if she voted, if she would vote for the bill. Because at the time, Congressman Massie said he only needed two more votes, Republican votes, and she thought she could. And Harriet said to her, I did. And Marika burst into tears believing that she had gotten the votes. And then she called me to tell me this, and I said, oh, no, she voted for the bill. The countermeasure that Speaker Johnson put forward that is just basically kicking it back to the House Oversight Committee, which is, you know, all happening behind closed doors.

[B]

And, you know, by the way, government shut down probably. So who knows when this is going to, you know, come to a vote again.

[A]

I know. I mean, if there's one thing Abby, though, I just keep seeing, which is so shocking to me, it's like how many people continue to hang out with, hang out, spend time with Jeffrey Epstein after he spent went to jail for being a sex offender. And not just for any old sex offender. Not that you should want to hang out with sex offenders, but for some. But for procuring a minor for prostitution. We saw Steve Bannon, who was a White House advisor, spending time with him after getting out of the White House just a month or two before Epstein's arrest. You saw Elon Musk tbd, going to Epstein's Island. He was even considering it. Why Bill Gates going to a party with Jeffrey Epstein after he spent time in jail and Peter Thiel going to breakfast with him. He is a big GOP donor, mega donor to Trump. To J.D. vance and J.D.

[B]

Vance. Yeah.

[A]

All of these people just thinking, why not spend time with a sex vendor? And, and everybody knew that Glenn Maxwell was close with Jeffrey Epstein and that she was a part of this whole depraved circle. So, yeah, I think there's a lot of questions about morality right now. Yeah.

[B]

And hopefully we'll get them answered. I mean, Trump, like, more than half the country wants the files released. That's a fact. And I, you know, I don't know how much longer he can keep running from this. And I mean, Ghislaine, today they had in the Supreme Court the closed door hearing about whether or not they were going to take her plea. And, you know, Netanyahu was here. Trump didn't take any questions after the press conference. You know, he can kind of weave, the famous weave. He can do that and. But at some point it'll catch up to him.

[A]

Yeah, I think you're right. It is interesting, though, that Senator Murkowski has sponsored so many bills to help to stop sex trafficking, and yet she won't release the files. It's just, it's a weird dissonance that we don't understand. But again, you know, leave us tips. You can always reach out to us. We are constantly working and trying to get down to the bottom of this because I do believe that it will be whistleblowers and it will be journalists who get these Epstein files out, because clearly, Department of justice, the president are lawmakers. They just don't want it out there.

[B]

Yeah, I agree.

[A]

Thank you, Abby for your excellent work. Abby is a star and researcher and she's on her way to a very bright career and we're really proud to have her on the team and I always give her a shout when I'm finishing up the the show. But now you get to meet her in person and I hope you'll meet the others on the team again soon. But thank you and check out the red letter@tarapaul Mary.com Please Rate Review subscribe share this show with your friends. Tell everyone about it. That's how we keep going here and we'll be back again soon. But yeah, first I have to thank the other people on the team who aren't here, like Eric Abenate, our producer, and Adam Stewart, who does the thumbnails. See you soon.