Podcast Summary:

The Tara Palmeri Show

Episode: “Shrimp, Grape Soda, Pizza: The Disturbing Code Words Jeffrey Epstein Used for Girls”
Date: February 22, 2026
Host: Tara Palmeri
Guest: Michael Shellenberger

Episode Overview

This intense episode explores the latest revelations on Jeffrey Epstein’s connections to intelligence agencies, the disturbing coded language used in his communications, and the web of elite complicity surrounding his crimes. Tara Palmeri and journalist Michael Shellenberger dissect new files, discuss the blurred lines between conspiracy and fact, and debate the societal and political ramifications of elite impunity. The discussion then shifts to broader issues of censorship, the California gubernatorial race, homelessness and addiction policy, and the ongoing fallout from aggressive immigration enforcement.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

Epstein, Intelligence Agencies, and Elite Protection

• Ongoing Questions about Intelligence Ties

  • Tara and Michael address recent Substack posts on Epstein’s connections with the CIA, NSA, and his status as a possible “hyper fixer” (00:30).
  • Mention of Epstein’s bodyguard visiting CIA headquarters on his behalf while in jail (00:50).
  • The existence of 2.5 million unreleased files withheld due to national security is raised as a major concern (01:20).
  • “I think he was like a hyper fixer passing along information to multiple governments. And he provided a level of value in terms of…information. Like the same way that Whitey Bulger did…” — Tara Palmeri [00:52]

• Notable Elite Associations and Legal Maneuvering

  • Epstein’s ability to retain high-profile legal counsel like Katherine Rummler (former Obama White House Counsel), who boasted of high-level CIA honors (02:11).
  • His links to major political and intelligence figures—Bill Barr, Ehud Barak, Leon Panetta, and CIA Director William Burns (05:49).
  • The 2008 Palm Beach prosecution that “went all the way up to the Attorney General,” allegedly receiving extraordinary deference from DOJ leadership (17:21).

The Mechanics of Epstein’s Abuse, Code Words, and Blackmail

• Nature and Extent of Sexual Crimes

  • Tara rebuts Shellenberger’s suggestion that Epstein’s crimes weren’t a “pedophilia ring,” providing harrowing details from victim testimonies, police evidence, and the trafficking of minors (07:16).
    • “These were girls that showed up at his house with braces on their teeth, calling his penis a wee wee…these were kids.” – Tara Palmeri [07:52]
    • Michael concedes there’s credible evidence of underage trafficking, but urges against “MeToo-era guilt by association.” Tara pushes back, distinguishing between baseless tips and sworn testimony (10:15).

• The Use of Code Words: Shrimp, Pizza, and Grape Soda

  • The episode title refers to code words frequently used in Epstein’s emails, especially “shrimp,” which Shellenberger argues clearly referred to young women/girls, not just food (22:02).
    • Shellenberger notes the oddity of exchanges such as: “Take your [ED] pill…then let’s go out for pizza and grape soda” [23:14] – suggesting coded references to sexual activities with minors.
    • Tara adds survivor testimonies further confirm Epstein’s obsession with youthful, prepubescent girls (24:33).

• Grooming of the Elites

  • The hosts discuss how Epstein not only groomed young girls, but also powerful men and women in his orbit for protection, leveraging their reputations to launder his own (25:38).
    • “He was kind of grooming everybody. What’s so impressive…is he was just two steps ahead…” – Michael Shellenberger [25:38]
    • Discussion of lavish gifts to elite figures (e.g., raising money for Larry Summers’ wife’s poetry program), insider trading tips, and intelligence bartering.

Elite Accountability and Guilt by Association

• Societal Double Standards

  • Tara points out that only the wealthy and connected, like Epstein, could re-ingratiate themselves after criminal conviction (11:00).
    • “I don’t see a lot of electricians or plumbers on those lists…This is elite behavior. Only elite people can get back into society after committing crimes like that.” [12:21]
  • Both debate whether associates should be canceled/fired for associating with Epstein or whether guilt must be more directly proven.

• Calls for Real Legal Accountability

  • Tara advocates for genuine prosecutions and public hearings where elites must testify under oath about their relationships with Epstein (14:16).

Disturbing Evidence, Pizzagate Parallels, and Conspiracy

• Epstein’s Coded Language and the Pizzagate Connection

  • Tara and Michael discuss the similarity of Epstein’s code language to Pizzagate conspiracy theories, acknowledging the difficulty in disentangling fact from fiction given the bizarre facts of the case (21:19).
    • Shellenberger: “I’m not saying that all the pizza references…I just don’t know. But I did…list all the different instances where they talk about pizza and grape soda…In one of them, [the urologist] is prescribing Epstein a fast-acting erectile dysfunction drug. And then he says…go take your pill…then let’s go out for pizza and grape soda. That’s weird.” [23:26]

• Survivor Insight

  • Tara, relaying what survivors described, underscores how “hard not to know” what Epstein was about:
    • “When you went to Jeffrey’s house…it was hard to not know what this guy was about. There were just so many young girls, a lot of them, like, tanning naked…” [24:33]
  • The prevalence of Polaroids, and the open secret of Epstein’s predilections among the elite, is a running theme.

Broader Topics: Censorship, California Politics, Immigration, and Homelessness

Censorship and Political Media

• FCC Censorship of Political Interviews

  • Tara and Michael discuss the suppression of a Stephen Colbert interview with Texas Senate candidate James Talarico over equal time rules, contrasting Republican (lion) and Democratic (fox) styles of censorship (28:33).

• Legal Action around Online Speech

  • Review of recent lawsuits and the Supreme Court’s acceptance of government “jawboning” (pressuring platforms behind closed doors), warning of the threats to free speech (32:53).

California Gubernatorial Politics and Homelessness

• Homelessness Crisis: Policy Critique

  • Shellenberger, a former candidate, explains his “shelter first, housing earned” philosophy, advocating mandatory, incentive-based recovery and shelter over “housing first” models (39:28).
    • “Everybody needs to come inside…once you pass a drug test, then you can get what most people want, which is a private room. And so housing is a reward…” [39:40]
    • Importance of balancing carrots (incentives) and sticks (consequences) in policy for addiction and mental illness.

• Addiction, Involuntary Commitment, and Ethics

  • Discussion of long-term inpatient care for severe addiction, referencing laws like Kendra’s Law and Laura’s Law to allow court-ordered treatment (42:54).
    • “Anybody that’s ever had an addicted family member or friend knows that addicts will lie, steal, and cheat in order to maintain their habit. And you have to have some way to make an intervention.” – Shellenberger [46:17]

Immigration, ICE Enforcement, and Political Fallout

• Sanctuary Cities and Drug Cartels

  • Shellenberger points out the unintended consequences of sanctuary laws in places like San Francisco, where cartels have exploited limits on cooperation with ICE (47:09).

• Critique of ICE Raids and Self-Deportation Policies

  • Tara questions why business owners who employ undocumented workers aren’t penalized, while the focus is on “random” ICE raids that often result in racial profiling and tear communities apart (49:22).
    • “Why aren’t the business owners the ones that pay the penalty…that’s a situation in which there are raids in the daylights, destroying communities…” – Tara Palmeri [49:22]

• Escalation and Tragedy in ICE Operations

  • Both discuss recent fatal incidents (deaths of Renee Goode, Alex Preddy), the backlash to aggressive enforcement in blue states, and the cynicism and inexperience of ICE officers involved in high-profile tragedies, with Shellenberger and Palmeri agreeing on the mishandling at multiple levels (55:58).

Memorable Quotes and Notable Moments

• On Elite Complicity:

  • “He used money to launder his reputation and stayed in these high circles and actually used a lot of prominent women to do that…” – Tara Palmeri [11:00]

• On Coded Language:

  • “I’m sorry, I’ve just never seen grown men show so much enthusiasm for pizza and grape soda.” – Michael Shellenberger [23:14]

• On Systemic Injustice:

  • “This is elite behavior. Only elite people can get back into society after committing crimes like that and have no problem.” – Tara Palmeri [12:21]

• On Public Response to Police Killings:

  • “We don’t like seeing the government murder citizens on the streets…That’s murder, but that’s, you know.” – Tara Palmeri [57:26]

Timestamps of Important Segments

• Epstein, CIA Ties & Legal Protections: 00:30–07:16
• Nature & Extent of Epstein’s Crimes: 07:16–10:43
• Guilt by Association Debate & Societal Double Standards: 10:43–14:16
• Coded Words, Code Language Evidence: 21:19–24:33
• Broader Censorship and Political Media: 28:33–32:53
• California Homelessness Policy: 39:28–46:42
• Immigration & ICE Enforcement: 47:09–56:48

Episode Tone

The episode is forthright, at times confrontational, and deeply investigative, reflecting a commitment to skepticism, nuance, and justice. Tara maintains a hard-nosed, unflinching approach—balancing empathy with critical interrogation, while Michael provides evidence-based skepticism and broad policy context. The conversation is colloquial but rigorous, engaging for listeners following both political intrigue and true crime.

Final Thoughts

This episode offers a dense, revealing examination of the complexities and continuing mysteries around Jeffrey Epstein, the disturbing nature of elite privilege, and the broader implications for justice, public policy, and political culture in the US. For those wanting to understand not just the news but its meaning and power structures, this is a must-listen conversation.