The Tara Palmeri Show

Episode: The End of MAGA? MTG Leaves Sinking Ship
Date: November 25, 2025
Host: Tara Palmeri
Guests: Rick Wilson (Co-founder of The Lincoln Project), Burgess Everett (Semaphore Congressional Bureau Chief)

Episode Overview

This episode examines the future of the MAGA movement as Donald Trump’s influence appears to wane and leading personalities like Marjorie Taylor Greene break from the fold. Tara Palmeri brings together veteran anti-Trump strategist Rick Wilson and congressional reporter Burgess Everett to discuss whether MAGA ends with Trump, how the movement might mutate, and what could replace it in the conservative political landscape.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Does MAGA Die with Trump, or Mutate?

• Rick Wilson’s Thesis: The belief that MAGA disappears when Trump is gone is wishful thinking; the movement will mutate rather than end.
  • “It is a comforting bedtime story for people who do not understand Donald Trump, the movement he built or the way power works when an authoritarian personality starts hearing the clock tick. MAGA ... does not end when Donald Trump does, it mutates.” (00:20, Rick Wilson quoted by Tara Palmeri)
  • Trump operates outside of typical political norms, ignoring tradition and law, and may remain dangerous even as his power wanes.
    • “Donald Trump is thinking about how he can keep burning things down, how he can keep profiting from the presidency, how he can keep the spotlight on him until the last possible minute.” (01:25, Rick Wilson)
• The Scorpion Analogy: Trump’s nature is unchanging—even as he loses power, he remains a threat.
  • “It’s Donald Trump, it’s the scorpion on the back of the frog. It is the behavior that’s wired into his character and his personality.” (01:44, Rick Wilson)

2. The Money Power & Project 2025

• Who Keeps MAGA Alive?
  • Powerful interests in finance and tech have benefited from MAGA’s policies and have incentives to perpetuate its style of governance.
    • “Folks in the money world, in the Silicon Valley world, in the private equity world ... want to see the continuation of the sort of Project 2025-infected policies that serve the top end of the MAGA food chain, not as much as the base.” (02:04, Rick Wilson)
  • The appeal of wielding executive power like a weapon will persist among elites even as Trump fades.

3. Could Trump Try to Cling to Power Beyond His Term?

• Rick Wilson’s Warning:
  • “I think there will be a part of [Trump] that wants to say, sometime in 2027, ‘Nope, I’m going to run again.’ Whether it’s legal or not doesn’t matter. ... He’s got an ability to cause chaos that’s unparalleled in American political history.” (03:23, Rick Wilson)
  • American institutions and courts may not be reliable bulwarks given Trump’s willingness to cross lines.
  • Precedents for his unpredictability are plenty—he already refused to accept the 2020 results.

4. What’s Next: Mutation of MAGA?

• Tara Palmeri:
  • The energy and coalition behind MAGA may fragment or transfer to figures like Marjorie Taylor Greene or other “America First” extremists.
  • The movement is complicated by the presence of white nationalism, antisemitism, and racism, which Palmeri sees as unsustainable for a party courting minority voters.
    • “They have white nationalism basically infecting their party, antisemitism, racism, extreme sexism. ... I don’t know how you can sell that for so long to a party that relies on a coalition of immigrants.” (05:17, Tara Palmeri)
  • Trump’s celebrity status enabled him to unite disparate groups within the party—a feat future leaders may not repeat.
    • “People take for granted the fact that President Trump had such high name ID ... I just don’t know who that next person is on the right that could lead in the way that he did.” (05:44, Tara Palmeri)

5. Congressional Perspectives & Internal GOP Tensions

• Burgess Everett:
  • The Republican coalition remains fractured: populists, Tea Party holdovers, and establishment conservatives still jostle for control.
    • “The Republican Party is kind of this tapestry of the last 20 to 30 years ... Trump has been able to cobble those folks together ... but ... he doesn’t quite have that tight iron grip that he had over his party.” (07:03, Burgess Everett)
  • Proposed populist measures (e.g., “$2,000 tariff dividend checks”) still meet resistance from fiscal conservatives, indicating conflicting impulses within the party.
• Marjorie Taylor Greene’s Departure:
  • Seen as emblematic of intra-party fissures and how the MAGA mutation might play out in Congress.

6. The Looming Danger of a Lame Duck Trump

• Rick Wilson’s Final Warning:
  • Trump’s propensity to cross red lines—especially with executive power—remains deeply concerning, particularly regarding civil liberties and foreign affairs.
    • “Donald Trump has repeatedly shown us that if you say the line is right here, don’t cross it, he will cross it... I’m deeply concerned about that, especially on the civil liberties front ... and on the foreign affairs front as well.” (08:05, Rick Wilson)

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Rick Wilson:

  • “MAGA does not end when Donald Trump does—it mutates.” (00:20, quoted by Tara Palmeri)
  • “He may be losing power, but it doesn’t mean he can’t be dangerous with the power he continues to have.” (01:50)
  • “The Republican Party is kind of this tapestry of the last 20 to 30 years ... Trump has been able to cobble those folks together ... but ... [now] he doesn’t quite have that tight iron grip.” (07:03, Burgess Everett)

• Tara Palmeri:

  • “They have white nationalism basically infecting their party ... I just don’t know who that next person is on the right that could lead in the way that [Trump] did.” (05:17, 05:44)

Important Timestamps

• 00:20 – Tara Palmeri introduces Rick Wilson’s thesis about the future of MAGA.
• 01:25 – Wilson describes Trump’s uniquely transgressive presidency.
• 02:04 – Discussion of elites’ investment in keeping MAGA’s power structures.
• 03:05 – Wilson speculates on Trump’s motives post-presidency.
• 05:17 – Palmeri on MAGA’s toxic elements and Republican coalition challenges.
• 07:03 – Everett on the persistence of Tea Party, MAGA, and establishment factions in Congress.
• 08:05 – Wilson’s warning about Trump escalating aggression as a lame duck.

Tone & Language

The conversation is frank and urgent, with a clear sense of concern—especially from Rick Wilson—about the unpredictability and potential destructiveness of Trump and the post-Trump MAGA movement. Palmeri brings her signature incisiveness, pressing guests on the practical political realities and the unsustainable contradictions within the GOP’s new coalition. Everett offers a measured, analytic perspective on the shifting congressional dynamics.

Summary

This episode of The Tara Palmeri Show presents a sobering look at what becomes of MAGA and the Republican Party as Trump’s hold weakens. Far from fading, the forces and incentives that created MAGA appear poised to mutate, possibly taking on new—and perhaps darker—forms as establishment, populist, and extremist strands vie for dominance. The episode underscores how both elite interests and white nationalist currents may shape whatever comes next, and warns that Donald Trump, even as a “lame duck,” remains unpredictable and potentially destabilizing.