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B (8:57)

Giuffre also writes graphic detail what she experienced at the hands of Epstein. I'll share just one thing that she said. She writes in session after session, he would play out various fantasies with me as the victim, she writes. She says the chains and contraptions he used on her caused so much pain that I prayed I would black out. When I did, I'd awaken to more abuse. Giuffre suffered through this for years and years. She did marry and have children of her own and died by suicide this past April at the age of 41. This book coming as calls to release all of the Epstein files, to find out all of the names of people who knew people who participated, are hitting roadblocks from the Trump DOJ and from the House Speaker, Mike Johnson. Out front now, Tara Palmieri, who is named in Duffrey's book because obviously you and Virginia Tara traveled together around the country to find people that she says were involved who worked for Epstein to corroborate her story. You spent so much time on this. Claire Howarth is the deputy editor at Vanity Fair, which obtained the first exclusive excerpt of Giuffre's memoir. And I know you've got it with you, and I know you've read the entire thing and done your own exhaustive reporting. So, Claire, when you've had a chance to read it, we're looking at it there and I think it's so interesting when you look at the COVID it's nobody's Girl. And she's sort of, she's fading out, right? As if she almost isn't visible to people. How much does she shed new light on, on these crucial questions of the who knew who participated? Who has not been held to account to this time?

C (10:29)

There are sort of two first of all, thanks for having me. It's nice to see you too, Tara. She writes very lovingly of her experience with Tara. There are two levels here of detail. One is the graphic nature of the detail itself. A lot of things we know are now illuminated in a way that only a survivor of these crimes could be able to detail them. And the other is how much we really don't know. She refers to a lot of these men as billionaires. One, two, and three. There's a prime minister, head of state, and you realize you kind of suspect, you know, who the characters are, but we still don't know this information publicly.

B (11:09)

And she talks about those individuals which she named specifically, but also says there were many more people who abused her. Right. So many more men, but she doesn't put a full number on. And then, of course, that we don't know.

C (11:20)

That's dozens, dozens.

B (11:21)

And then what about all the other women and the other. Right. I mean, it is unbelievable. Women that we see. That is. I mean, Taryn, in another excerpt that was published by the New York Post, she talks about the prime minister that Claire just referred to. She said she was raped by this man. She writes, he repeatedly choked me until I lost consciousness and took pleasure in seeing me in fear for my life. And then she said she begged Epstein not to send her back to this man, to the prime minister. I got down on my knees and pleaded with him. I don't know if Epstein feared the man or if he owed him a favor, but he wouldn't make any promises, saying coldly of the politician's brutality, you'll get that sometimes you knew her. So for you, there are things that are even more graphic and horrific than are put in this book. And yet for so many of us, this is just absolutely stunning graphic detail.

A (12:13)

I knew this was going to happen with her book. I had a feeling that it was going to be explosive because I don't think people understood the brutality of what she lived through. I remember when we were driving past the Palm beach airport. It was February 2020, and the Lolita Express, Epstein's private plane, was parked there. And we drove past it, and I watched her body just recoil. And she recounted the type of abuse she endured from the same prime minister up in the air and the way that she was just truly treated inhumanely. And I. I'm really proud of her that she's put that. She's put these details out there, and it's worse even than she writes. And it' sit's incredibly upsetting. And there was no one there to help. There was no one there to help her. She was nobody's girl. Nobody saw her as the daughter of somebody that was worth saving after two years of abuse. And these are the people that we look up to. These are the leaders.

B (13:18)

Well, I mean, this is the thing. Prime Minister, Billionaire 1, Billionaire 2, Billionaire 3, and many more. Where those individuals came from, Claire, who were rich and powerful and every time I say it, who have not been held to account and are right now being protected by people who don't want to put the Epstein files out there. In part, you know, I mean.

C (13:35)

Well, it's, as you say, it's not, not just that there were so many men who abused her. There was a network of people who really helped him make his abuse possible, whether it was the finance, you know, involved in the sex trafficking, the people on the periphery watching the abuse take place. It's just, it's really shocking that the level of detail that she describes is falling.

B (13:58)

Ghislaine Maxwell, who was convicted of being his accomplice, was central to Virginia Giuffre's expression and to many others. And I'm just going to say after her meeting with a number two at the doj, right, she gets moved to this minimum security prison in a residential neighborhood where no one convicted her of her crimes would ordinarily be. That's where she is now after her meeting with the Trump doj. In the, in excerpt you publish at the Vanity Fair, right, she talks about when she met Ghislaine Maxwell and she talks about she's been recruited by Maxwell. One of the first times she. She goes into Jeffrey Epstein's home, Tara. And the excerpt that Claire has says walking, I tried not to stare at the walls which were crowded with photos and paintings of nude women. Maybe this was how wealthy people with sophisticated tastes decorated their homes. Be cool, I thought. We made a U turn around a king sized bed, then entered an adjoining room with a turquoise green massage table. A naked man lay face down on top of it, his head resting on his folded arms. Say hello to Mr. Jeffrey Epstein, Maxwell instructed. Before I could do so, the man spoke to me. You can just call me Jeffrey. Yeah. This is a woman who recently showered Trump with praise in the hopes of a pardon.

A (15:09)

Yeah. No, this is a. I think when people read this book, they will have zero mercy for Ghislaine Maxwell. I think when people read this book, they will scream louder for the files. She has a harrowing tale and I think the thing about Virginia and T.O. and I hope that you can see this in the book, but she was a hopeful person, she was a great person. But she was abused throughout her life from as a child, you know, she writes that her father molested her. Then she goes on to Being, you know, trafficked on the streets, homeless by 11, and then. And then retrafficed again, just as she's trying to build her life back together. You just see her as this person who has just been so abused and neglected her entire life. I mean, the title Nobody's Girl is perfect and in so many ways. And I just think that you can't not read Virginia's story, know Virginia, and not feel compassion for her for so. And I'm so happy that the narrative is finally changing because for so long, Epstein's defense attorney, Alan Dershowitz, called her a child, a teen prostitute, as if a teenager could be a prostitute. You know, the tabloids were ruthless to her when she accused Prince Andrew of abuse. She has been dragged through the mud, maligned for a decade. It took almost a decade for the crown to finally acknowledge her.

B (16:34)

And now, of course, he's been stripped of his titles, although not the title of Prince.

A (16:38)

Right.

B (16:38)

You know, which Virginia's brother was expressing his frustration in me the other day about. But again, Claire, just to make the point of how many more women there are who suffered and how many men there are who are walking around right now thinking that this won't come for them.

C (16:54)

This won't come for them. That's right. And she details her allegations again against Prince Andrew. Three encounters. And she, you know, of course he denies them, but yeah, like you say, Maxwell was very deeply rooted in the abuse. And the insidious thing about her is that she kind of capitalized on this vulnerability of Virginia's and this person who Maxwell spotted as being broken, she sought her out, she picked her. And that was very much the way that Epstein and Maxwell worked together to find these 150 plus girls and women who they abused.

B (17:33)

Clara and Tara, thank you very much. I'm so grateful to talk to you and to hear all of your reporting and of course, I hope everyone's going to read this.

A (17:40)

That was another episode of the Tara Palmieri Show. Thank you again for tuning in. Please rate, subscribe, Share this with your friends. If you like my reporting, please go to tarapaumari.com that's T A R A P A L M E-R-I.com with just one eye. And sign up for the Red letter. It's how you get my exclusive reporting straight to your inbox. And it's how you can support my independent journalism. No billionaires involved here, no establishment propping me up. This is just me doing independent journalism, following the leads when they come. I want to thank my producer Eric Abenate. I want to thank Abby Baker, who does research and social media. And I want to thank Adam Stewart, who does my graphics. See you again tomorrow.